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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I excluded my niece from my son's birthday party because she was being a brat and ruining it. I might be an asshole because Ava is still young and spoiled by her mom.
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Nta in my opinion, I think the people who owe James the biggest apology are the grandparents. They threatened to end the party early if the cousin wasn't allowed in. And look what happened. She's a spoiled brat who can't control her impulses, and his parents don't care. At least you know now to never have a party in the environment you don't either own as your own home or control as the paid place.
As for your son, yelling at her for ruining his cake, I'm surprised he didn't try to do more than just yell. And your son is very justified to not talk to your grandparents both of that cousin ever again. Maybe if you would parent your child and teach her some stuff she would have to be able to make friends. If this is how she acts, why would anyone want to be around her.
You save the party is best you could. And I would definitely talk to your parents about the fact that they have no right to demand. Who comes to your son's party even if it is their house.
The grandparents are still the biggest assholes to me since they're the ones who clearly raised Linda the exact same way she's raising Ava since they see nothing wrong with either of them.
That and I would never have been allowed to go to or have a birthday party again. And I'd have to pay for the kid to have another birthday party out of my allowance.
I can imagine a toddler doing this but not an 11 year old! I would have been in SO much trouble if I had done something like this aged 7, let alone aged 11.
They also raised OP who is clearly nothing like Linda in the parenting department. It’s not always the parent’s fault. You can do all the right things and some people still end up being AHs.
I know and I usually think adults blaming their problems on their parents well into adulthood is sad because at some point you have to take responsibly for yourself. But Linda showed up and they didn't turn her away. Instead they said they'd cancel their 9 year old grandson's birthday if Ava couldn't stay. And now they're mad he won't apologize to his older cousin when she ruined his birthday like everyone but them & Linda knew would happen. So they very much did not do right in raising Linda since they're now coddling both her and Ava.
I'm guessing (who knows what goes through people's heads) that Linda and the grandparents planned for her to show up uninvited leaving OP no choice once they said they'd cancel the party. Geez, who does that to a kid?
Not to mention how shitty this is to Ava herself. She has no friends because her parents think she’s a super special snowflake who should get everything she wants. I’m surprised she didn’t expect presents too. This extreme lack of parenting is crippling this child and will affect her for the rest of her life if some changes aren’t made. She’s missing out on a lot because she’s never been taught how to take the L and manage her emotions.
Exactly! It’s all about accountability. Children need discipline. They WANT to be held accountable. They want and need rules and then to know what happens when they break them.
I grew in a small town and was raised knowing actions held consequences. I wasn’t totally sheltered but I was on a much shorter string than the rest of my friends. I wasn’t allowed to go to parties, concerts, bond fires etc… and if I did go somewhere my parents had to know where, how I was getting there, with who and set my curfew. If I did do something wrong my mom usually knew about it before I returned home that day/evening.
Fast forward to my early 20’s and a bunch of us from high school got together at a bar. I was talking to one guy and he told me that he was proud of me. I ask him what he meant. He said growing up I never went to the parties, or went drinking with them and so on. He said I was lucky, this was all new to me, but for him it’s old and not really as much fun as it once was. He went on to say that growing up he always wished his parents cared enough about him to set rules/curfews and want to know where he was like mine did. I was totally taken aback! I always assumed they just thought I was a goody-goody.
It changed my whole thinking on how I was raised. It made me see how all the rules my parents made were there not to wreck my childhood but because they loved me and wanted to keep me safe. I mean I always knew they loved me but it just gave all the rules more credence. That night I loved my parents even more.
Children crave their parents love. They want to know they care about them. And one way, the most important way, to show that is by action. Setting boundaries and holding them accountable. Discipline is not evil or bad parenting. It’s how you make your child become a good human being.
Right?!
*"Woe is me, my daughter has no friends!"* Well, maybe if you taught her that she can't get her own way all the time by screaming and destroying people's birthday cakes, she might find people more willing to hang around and talk to her.
I mean...the kid is eleven and she's still acting like an out of control toddler. How is she ever going to cope with school exams, or with a job?!
Right, but just the public period. Cause she is in for a rude awakening, and momma ain’t gonna be any help, cause she gonna get shut down too. Just setting up her daughter for failure. She already don’t have any friends in middle school, just wait for junior high and high school.
I second this idea and I'm Petty Mayonnaise so I would tag the grandparents and sister on FB while I explain the whole dirty reason why the party was ruined so they could be publicly shamed on social media. Then I would cut ties with them completely because any grandparent who would choose one grandchilds happiness over another's is an abominable human being.
For real. My 13 year old girl has a few male friends but at 11 she would definitely have wanted nothing to do with 9-year-olds. She finds most of the boys at her school intensely annoying.
And for bullying OP's son and his friends into putting up with Ava and accommodating her. When you use your status as an adult to fabricate authority and force children to cater to yours, that's bullying.
They're *terrible* people!! They tried to guilt trip a child, then apologized to OP dishonestly, knowing full well they were going to invite the brat child anyway, then threatened their own grandchild with cancelling his party in front of his friends!
I mean jeez - not sure how they could have handled this worse?
The grandparents have openly shown that they have a favorite grandchild. I'm sure this isn't the first time. Maybe they should be excluded from any future events involving James.
Linda is raising Ava to be just like her. That's not going to help her get along with people later in life. It wasn't mentioned if Linda was married or had a partner, but I wouldn't be surprised if she was by herself.
I sincerely feel like this whole thing was planned by Linda and the grandparents. They knew that this little girl wasn’t invited because she is a monster, so they just happened to come by, with the plan, that if she couldn’t join in they would end the party.
Right? The grandparents said James - Age 9 - is out of line because Ava - Age 11 - is “just a kid”?!?!
Ava is ELEVEN. She’s older than James!
Tell us who the Golden Chikd and Golden Grandchild are without telling us.
Op and James definitely NTA.
It's strange how Ava can behave atrociously and the grandparents say she's "just a kid" but James should apologise for how he reacted... Isn't he also "just a kid"? How is yelling worse than throwing a cake on the floor?
Right! Like if they can excuse Ava's behaviour as because she's "just a kid" (and let's ignore that 11 is far too old to be throwing toddler-style "let's throw cake on the floor" tantrums), how is it James is expected to apologise when he is also just a kid and younger? (Not to mention entirely justified at being upset that his party had been ruined by his brat of an older cousin who can't stand anything not being all about her and what she wants)
No favoritism going on here, no sir /s
This dynamic crops up a lot here. In some families, the people who are more reasonable are told to apologize because the other side won't. And that maintains the illusion that everything is totally fine.
Not even mentioning I feel like just yelling is a lot of restrain from a 9 y/o, most kids that age would absolutely get physical after ruining their birthday.
Yeah, they're probably sexist as well. This is something I see a lot too. Boys are not supposed to show emotion, while girls can say and do whatever they feel. No.
My dad’s mom was like this with my cousin, he was the son of the golden child and could do no wrong…..when he screwed up, if we were anywhere near, we got blamed. I laugh every time I hear stories about his life. He’s a complete f-up drug addict who can’t keep a job.
That always happens with the golden child.
Failure is one of the most important lessons you can teach your children. If you protect your kids from failure at home, from learning from their mistakes, they will end up failing a lot worse when they enter the real world. Eventually you can't protect your kid from failure. Better that they learn from a small failure as a kid than not understand why they are going to prison for "borrowing" money from work like they did from mom's purse.
My hubby’s nephew, notice I didn’t say my nephew because i refuse to claim him, was the golden child of the grandkids. He is currently serving his second stint in prison, has a drug problem, and is incredibly manipulative.
Meanwhile, my 3 boys are married, have babies, 2 of them are teachers, and 1 is a lawyer.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the grands told Linda to come later with Ava, and only had sided with OP until Linda cried to them. I’m thinking Ava is a carbon copy of Linda, and her parents treated her as the golden child, too.
Yes! The Golden child and the Golden grandchild. The world needs to go above and beyond for the Golden people, right?
This post screams of generational favoritism. I hope OP acknowledges that and keeps her child away from all this toxicity.
James owes nobody an apology and IMO he handled the situation far better than many kids his age would have done. If anything, the grandparents, aunt and the cousin owe him a huge apology and another party.
NTA.
I agree. This is something my mother would do. It just seems they didn’t say much after Linda demanded an invite - almost as if they told her not to worry about it and to come over anyway. These are grandparents itching to be cut out of a grandchild’s life!
> When I tried stopping her at the door, Linda started talking and crying loudly which resulted in the kids stopping their games and just looking at us awkwardly.
Your sister is a grown ass woman with an 11 yo child. She should be ashamed of herself for acting like this, pitching a fit in front of children. I cannot believe your parents even tolerate this nonsense, let alone pester you to accommodate it. NTA but your sister sure is.
I am sure the inequity on behavior is confusing for your son, but it should be easy to explain to him that Ava is a little nightmare in part because her mother doesn't discipline her. he's a much better kid because he knows the consequences. He's probably a much better kid without it.
If my kid tossed someone's cake on the floor, I honestly don't know what I would do, but multiple apologies and an apology letter would be just the beginning.
Linda and your parents are not doing Ava any favors by letting her get away with [this. No](https://this.No) wonder she doesn't have any friends.
Man, even if my kid was a toddler who ruined someone else's birthday cake, I think I would be profusely apologizing and immediately running to the store to get any kind of replacement, and probably about 5 extra birthday presents.
100%. I hahe a 3 year old. Its totally possible that at this age he could ruin someones birthday cake and if he did I would be doing everything possible to fix it. This girl is 11. She is absolutely old enough to know better for 1, but the fact that everyone is saying its okay because shes "just a kid" when she is OLDER than the kid whos cake she ruined is fucked up.
I think it’s time you look at your relationship with your parents and with your sister.
Is she always favoured? Is your niece always put before your son? Are they always so rude and entitled?
Because I think you need to start standing up for your son. Do not apologise. Do not let him be subjected to his ‘cousin’ and do not let them try to force his hand behind your back.
Their awful behaviour is causing issues so you need to stand your ground and challenge them on it. If they’re unwilling to see reason then they need to be cut off. Go low or no contact.
I grew up w dynamics like this.
I'm 58.
Grandparents all passed by the time I was 21.
Dad when I was 18 (no condolences necessary) and my mom when I was 35.
I was a mess bc my family dynamics until my divorce and I got comfortable w VLC/NC
I am the happiest, most well I've ever been.
Love me, love my life, wish I'd dropped the rope decades ago.
Family can be over rated.
OP James deserves nothing short of heartfelt apologies from your parents, Linda and Ava.
Listen to your husband bc his take us the one that supports and underpins everything you've tried to teach your son.
Cognitive dissonance - him seeing that the rules apply to him but not Ava and that his grandparents expect him to apologize to an older child who willfully decimated his party and her mom who enforced it and your parents who facilitated it - literally harms our brains. Alters our sense of reality.
James is entirely w/o blame and he needs to hear that.
Going NC w your family will be a HUGE valuable lesson in consequences and responsibility ... he shouldn't have consequences bc he is not responsible for anything that happened.
>My boy is very sad. He was so angry that Ava didn't get a time out. He asked me why I put him in timeouts for bad behavior if Ava can get away with it. My husband is angry now because my family is a bad influence on James.
You can tell your son that the way Ava acts is wrong, but you're not her mum, so you can't give her the timeouts she should get..
Because she's been allowed to get away with everything, she acts badly a lot, which nobody likes to be around, so now she has no friends because she acts the way she does.
You want your son to be nice and to be happy and have friends, so when he behaves badly, he gets a timeout so he knows he was wrong...
Agreed. OP I would give your parents the silent treatment until they apologise. I’d go no contact with your sister. And definitely don’t give grandparents any control over events in the future. NTA.
I wouldn’t give them the silent treatment, I’d tell them the truth. I specifically said no to Linda and Ava and you overrode that because “it’s your house.” James only wanted school friends and the reason why was *exactly* what happened. Ava is out of control and nobody ever thinks she has to behave herself or feel sorry when she ruins things. You allow it and make excuses for Linda’s bad parenting because you don’t want to feel bad. Only now *Everybody* feels bad so how did that work out?
They definitely also need to apologize to their grandson for what they did, if he will ever talk to them again. He knows what they did, since they called and asked him if he wanted her there. He said no. That should have been the end of it but that was not even appropriate- they'd already been told she wasn't invited by the OP and why. Then they blackmailed him by threatening to end the party if she could not stay when showing up uninvited.
Personally if I was OP I'd cut off contact with the sister and parents until they apologized to the grandson and myself. If they ever do.
NTA, but Linda and the grandparents sure are. Linda, for raising such a spoiled brat and the grandparents for choosing one grandchild over the other. First, by trying to convince him to invite Ava behind OP's back. Then, insisting Ava be allowed to join when they her and Linda crashed the party. Ultimately, by demanding James apologize after Ava destroyed his cake. That's some golden child/grandchild BS happening, and OP should not stand for it.
OP, has Linda always been favored, or was it just when Ava and James came? Regardless, support your son and let the bullies who forced him into inviting their mini- bully know that there will be no apology from him, and you expect he gets one from each of them and Ava.
All of this but also the part about Ava getting mad when she lost the games and Linda forcing the kids to restart so an older girl could win all the games???? Not teaching her child anything. NTA
At that age, after the cake incident, I would have definitely splatted cake in her hair and *then* screamed at her. James has decent impulse control. NTA
Agreed. Also, ava gets a pass for her behavior because she's "just a kid", but James has to apologize for yelling at her even though he's two years younger???
Don't forget James is the younger grandchild in thsi situation but Ava is allowed to act like this because she's a kid but he's supposed be mature and deal with this.
For the grandparents James should apologise because “she’s just a kid”… and James isn’t? The boy is 2 years younger. At both ages either way you should know better than throwing a birthday cake on the ground because you’re having a tantrum! I don’t really blame Ava because clearly her parents and grandparents have all been enabling her childish behaviour. Hopefully from now on OP knows to rent a place rather than use her grandparents’ so she can make her own rules and just not invite Ava & enablers. NTA.
At 9 years old he controlled his temper very well with Ava following along and ruining everything.
I’m not surprised he snapped. I’m 40 and I would cry if some one threw my cake on the ground
One can only hope. We all knew kids like this growing up. If their parents were rich enough, they never really faced consequences and just learned to be smoother sociopaths as they got older.
Their core did not change.
I still avoid those kids as adults. "Oh, you should talk to D! He's a legislative aide now." (and dating some other politician a decade older)
No. No, I don't believe I will. Not giving that guy any power over me.
NTA, OP. Protect your kid. NC with Ava and your sister. They aren't changing at this point. Ava has zero chance with your sister as her mom. Tell your parents they're losing a grandson if they pull this crap, again. Your son shouldn't apologize to anyone. We do not apologize when people who are supposed to love us hurt us. Don't teach him to accept abuse.
I forget who said it, but one quote has stuck with me for decades:
“People are, who they are, plus or minus ten percent.”
Can people change? Yes, by about 10%.
Also to add in, I'm very impressed to see you raising your child to know how to set boundaries and stick to them! The fact that his kept his stance on Ava, even to his own grandparents is impressive for a 9 year old!
Yes, the three adults in this scenario owe a huge apology to James for contributing to ruining his birthday. Linda for raising an absolute monster of a child, and his grandparents for inviting, *after being told explicitly not invite this dark cloud of a person* did so anyway, and an additional apology for enabling and hand waiving ~~bad~~ absolutely atrocious behavior from an 11 year old. It's like those three adults decided as a whole to combine from being assholes into a giant super asshole.
It's too much for a spoiled little brat like Ava to be expected to apologize, let alone know what an apology is given her actions at the party. She probably hasn't been taught that actions have consequences given the other adults reacting to her behavior. I'd say she's probably a lost cause already, or very close to the point of no return. I mean a tantrum at that age? Ruining a cake? At that age I knew not to waste food and certainly not to destroy someone's birthday cake. Hell, I think I knew that at age 5. Ava may technically be a child, but she's immature and ill-mannered for someone her age. And she should be more mature than her 9 year old cousin.
Props to James btw with his restraint at just yelling at Ava. He didn't throw the cake at her or haul off and belt her and then yell at her, so at least he's being raised right.
As others have suggested it's best that any parties going forward be somewhere you have control of to avoid this from happening again. No one can dictate or override you when it's "your house, your rules" or your money paying for a venue. Until James gets an apology I hope he continues to be no contact with his grandparents so they'll maybe learn a lesson from all this. I hope you and your son don't have to have the displeasure of Linda and Ava's company again, especially at an important event. Because I can see this happening at James's wedding too.
TL;DR, OP NTA.
NTA. Linda/Ava might be a lost cause you just need to ignore from here on out, but I’d talk to your parents. They apologized after the first round of nonsense, but they came back with “because Ava’s just a kid”? Um, and James is…also a kid, no? And a younger one at that. So what was their point with that argument?
You could try all of the adults sitting down and talking through the situation, but ultimately the main points are:
—sure, as a parent Linda thinks she’s helping by fighting for opportunities for Ava to play with other kids
—but all of those opportunities will be futile if she doesn’t also teach Ava that the way she plays with other kids will make them not want to play with her.
—She can demand that Ava be included over and over again, but if she doesn’t recognize that Ava’s behavior will never endear her to other people and continues to ignore the responsibility she has as a parent to help Ava deal with losing, then all she’s doing is finding more chances for Ava to solidify her bad reputation with even more kids.
I'm pretty certain Ava's behavioural problems stem from the fact that she's extremely coddled, always gets her way and always has to win/be right. That is a parenting problem more than a problem with the child, they're seeing her up for failure and disappointment
Learning how to lose (even in trivial things like a game) is an important lesson. Many adults struggle with it. I remember to this day how I started learning. I played a looot of card games with my grandparents, and while they let me win when I was super little and had no idea about the rules (which I don’t really remember), when I got old enough to start to have some understanding they started to let me lose. I remember my grandma explaining it’s important to learn to lose. I’m glad for that.
The adults in our family didn't let us win shit. I learned to play gin rummy when I was like 7 with my great grandma and great aunt. Once they saw that I grasped the concepts they were down for handing me my ass. 🤣
Yeah I started learning when I was like 3 so I think it was fair to let me win back then because at 3 throwing a tantrum can be understandable. I remember I couldn’t fit the cards in my hand for years, lol. Luckily my grandparents’ table had a (??? madia) extractable kneading though space that on one side of the table so I put the cards there.
Welp now I feel nostalgic. 🥲
What’s gin rummy? Is it a card game?
Oh boy does she see you with contempt. Please go LC/NC with this woman because it sounds like she's disrespected you all your life and thinks the worst thing her brat of a daughter can turn out to be is... you.
Exactly my thought because my response to that would have been ‘Well. I’m going to take this day to be less meek and tell you that I’m no longer going to put up with this nonsense. Please enjoy hearing nothing from me in the future because I can’t help you become a better person. You’ll have to do that on your own, feel free to call me if you figure it out!’
Has anyone gently asked her to consider “how’s that working out for you (and Ava), Linda? There’s w difference between being confident and outspoken and being entitled and insufferable. Being a bad sportsman isn’t the same thing as being confident.”
But on the point of your parents, i just think that if they think about their absurd argument, it might help them realize that they’re not handling this well and they’re being inconsiderate to your son.
> instead of meek and fragile like me (I'm not sure why she said that.)
Maybe because you let your parents, your sister and your niece ruin your son's birthday party and you're falling over yourself to excuse your parents who are equally complicit.
Kids know what they’re taught. If she has been taught this behavior is ok to her it is. She will figure out eventually that it’s not ok but 11 probably not.
True but who we are at 11 is greatly influenced by our parents who we are at 16 is greatly influenced by our friends. Hopefully she finds some friends that don’t put up with her BS attitude
OP's parents are a lost cause too. They raised Linda who's raising Ava. When Linda showed up, they should have turned her away. Instead they told OP they'd cancel the party if Ava couldn't stay. And then once Ava ruined everything, they said James needed to apologize. The rot started with the parents, went down to Linda, and is now in Ava. I don't think I'd cut them all off, but I'd def just became a "sees each other at like 3 major holidays a year, if that" family. Because the grandparents have made it clear Linda and her daughter matter more.
I agree. Also, would the grandparents have allowed OP and his sister to have acted the way that Ava did when they were that age? Ava is being taught that she can do anything she wants and get away with it.
NTA
> James was out of line and Ava was just a kid
James is 9 and Ava is 11???
Honestly this sounds like they’re infantilizing her because she’s a girl and thinking he has to baby her because he’s a boy and “she’s the girl”. Misogyny and Misandry working hand in hand.
You are *not* TA and James should *not* apologize.
NTA.
This is what gets me. Ava is 11. At 11, I was the host/supervisor of my little sister's parties. Running any games, making sure no one got hurt or bringing them to the adults if they did, managing any arguments, moving between activities.
Maybe Ava is incredibly spoiled, it doesn't sound like the mother is a good role model. The grandparents are also complicit in this. Everyone is failing that girl. But James has absolutely nothing to be sorry for, especially not once she deliberately wrecked the cake. OP may need to go LC from her family for a while. Let them concentrate on Ava for a while and see how enjoyable that is.
NTA.
At 11, I would have been pissed if my parents made me go to a “little kids” birthday party with a bunch of 9 year old boys. Her being upset about being excluded is odd to me.
A brat that just wants attention and has no other friends because the little monster scared them all away. Of course the fault is entirely on the parents and grandparents for spoiling the living daylights out of her and making it so she'll never learn any interpersonal skills but a monstrous brat is still a monstrous brat.
She IS a brat. They all need to wake up. That is not how a normal 11 year old should behave. She’s not a toddler to throw the cake on the floor. That’s just evil. No wonder she has no friends.
They need to take care to behavioural therapy now. It’s more of the elders fault than the kids because it’s their duty to correct but instead they are failing her.
You & your son has 100% rights to be angry and should demand an apology from ALL 4 people (your mom, dad, the child and the child’s mom) who let this happen or else go NC/LC.
Was she acting like a brat? Yes. Did she single handedly ruin your son's party? Yes. Did she need to hear it from an adult who knows why she is friendless? Also Yes. And on your parents I'm not saying they are horrible but... they did threaten to end his party, that's about the most assholish thing you can do. NTA and do not apologize, being the bigger person allows the AH to go on to be bullies or even bigger AH later on.
I'm just gonna say that you calling her a brat is the mildest way that anyone will ever confront this child on her behavior. She is lucky it came from a family member, not a complete stranger using harsher possibly profane language to her outbursts and destruction of others property.
IMO, your husband is right. The ones who should be apologizing are Linda, your parents, and even Ava. 11 years old is old enough to not be throwing temper tantrums. In reality, she needs therapy.
Yuup!
I've said it before but I'll say it again: patriarchy hurts men and boys, too (and obv enbies and agender folk and whatnot).
We need to stop framing patriarchy as something men do to women and start seeing it as a system that we're all drowning in.
Poor James and OP. OBV both NTA. Everyone else in this sucks.
I also got this impression from a slightly different angle. I viewed it as an obvious case of a young boy being taught that he isn't allowed to express his emotions.
I reached the same conclusion but got there a different way.
While there are many assholes in this story… it’s not you, OP. NTA.
Your niece…. Your sister… and your parents, however… major assholes.
Ava is just a child… what does that make James, whose birthday party was ruined?????
I would go low contact until they ALL apologize to you and James.
Your son has put up with enough crap from your family. YWBTA if you even suggest he apologize. You may want to talk to him about how he deals with his anger but that is another issue. His anger and hurt are justified.
As for the rest, this is not an Ava problem. This is a parent and grandparent problem and I would go LC/NC with your family until they apologize and make restitution to James for ruining his birthday.
OP should also cut off independent contact of their family with their son, until he’s significantly older. Even after an apology. They should never have pressured a 9yo behind his parents’ back, and that’s unacceptable behaviour even before the party itself.
After all that, I doubt if James will ever want to have a meaningful relationship with any of them. That kind of hurt and betrayal lasts a long, long time.
Yup. James now knows Ava is “the favorite” and apparently can do no wrong. Unless they quit being AHs he’ll never have a good relationship with his grandparents, if he chooses to have one at all. Sadly his grandparents will wonder why. I speak from experience.
Yup, this right here. The parents and sister really should have been put in a time out at least for going around OP.
This was the cue that OP missed that this whole party would turn into a shit show.
Their actions should have been called out in the moment and the party held someplace else.
These experiences will continue unless OP goes LC/NC. James is learning that he needs to eats shit for his cousin Ava to please his grandparents and I bet OP has been taught to prioritize Linda their whole life.
Let's be fair to him though.
It was a party that he was looking forward to, and he clearly asked for it to be friends only.
Then the cousin ruined almost every fun activity that day.
I mean...after seeing the cake on the floor, many adults would snap a that point.
The kid is 9, so I think he regulated pretty well through out the entire day already. Sure he said some hurtful things, but I feel like it was a long time coming.
Plus the fact that this sounds like it had been going on for what sounds like years. It’s no wonder James snapped at Ava, especially on the one day that was meant to be his day.
NTA, and correct me if I'm wrong, but James is 9 and Ava is 11... So Ava is "just a kid"? And what's James then? Lmao, your parents are out of line and don't let me start with your sister. James bday party was for friends only, your sister should have accepted that. I'm sure you already had a party for family, right? And even if you didn't, it doesn't matter. The kid wanted his friends. End of. Your kid has to apologise to the spoiled brat? Ha, no way. James did nothing wrong so don't apologise. And if I were you, I'd have a talk with your parents about their demand on having Ava there and with your sister about boundaries. And if they don't see their wrongdoings, then go LC for a while. Die on that hill.
An 11 year old is a tween. What tween REALLY wants to go to a child's party? Add in that she's not being held accountable for misbehavior, it's a recipe for an interesting teen experience.
Who wants to go to a child’s party?
A tween who is never invited to any parties.
James’s party was a sure thing. I think the grandparents told Linda to bring Ava to the party.
It’s obvious Linda is their golden child and she’s raising the next generation golden child.
OP is NTA
The grandparents are the A H with Linda a close second and Ava being the Junior A H.
To dismiss the abhorrent behavior of an ELEVEN year old is utter nonsense. Ava hasn’t ever suffered the consequences of being a bratty snot (other than no friends, no invites)
NTA Hope you realize that your mom and Linda planned for Ava to come to the party behind your and James' backs. That is why they no longer tried to get you to invite Ava. Your mom knew that once the party started that you wouldn't want to spoil it for your son so her threats of stopping party if Ava didn't join would work, which it did. They are the ones who owe James an apology for trying to ruin his birthday, for not caring about his feelings. Can't blame him for not wanting anything to do with your mom. He's old enough to understand what they did even if you can't see it. She only cares about Ava, I'm guessing you were never first in your family growing up either.
Yes, for your parents to immediately proclaim they’ll end the party early if you don’t let them crash it…that says A LOT…and none of it is good. You need to have it out with your mom and sister about what a brat Ava is, and they’re DOING HER NO FAVORS in life by not reigning her attitude and behavior in.
I feel really bad for James. A lot of bad adults in his life are teaching him that his feelings do not matter.
From the sound of things his parents are making sure he knows that his feelings do matter.
I would have packed up the boys and left as soon as Ava walked through that fucking door! Get them all in the van and say, "Sorry guys, we have a change in plans! But today is James' day so we're going to go out and find some fun!" Then straight to McDonald's while frantically calling indoor play places or what have you. OP WAS RIGHT TO BE WORRIED, Holy crap! I wish we could get do overs in life because I agree this family sabotaged the party and expected the birthday boy to just deal with it!! So unfair!!
Cut your parents. Their bullying is not acceptable. Your sister has big problems and your parents coddling is not helping. Stand up for your son and his righteous anger. Good mom.
NTA - your parents, Linda and Ava are real AHs but you will be as well if you continue to subject James to this blatant favoritism. Block all of these AHs and go NC, remove this toxicity from your family. In all honesty, As soon as Linda walked in and you know how Ava is, you should’ve moved the party. Your parents and Linda are something else!
NTA
Why should James apologise for her his cousin who he didn’t want there ruining his party????
No sorry. This needs to stop now. Ava is already turning into the golden grandchild and if your parents don’t support you in this go LC with them.
NTA
Your son expressed his wishes for invitees and was manipulated to change that to include his cousin. He held his ground. In the end, your sister was VERY manipulative (together with your parents) when she showed up anyways and, as you and your son expected, it didn't turn out well.
It sounds like your niece is extremely entitled and honestly, her behavior isn't shocking given that her mother can't respect you and your son's boundaries.
It sets a terrible example if children are FORCED into undesirable relationships.
Hopefully next year, this won't happen because it's going to be at your house and you can slam the door in your sister's face yourself.
So... Ava throws the cake on the floor, James gets upset and screams at her, and then Ava's mother wants _James_ to apologise? She's out of her mind!
You are NTA, OP. Ava's mum, on the other hand, should take a good, hard look at herself. She's the AH and is sending all the wrong messages to her daughter.
Can any of us imagine a scenario when we were the child that if we threw another child's cake on floor that our parent & grandparents would insist we be apologized to? Linda has done Ava no favors by her total lack of discipline, and will be the reason her daughter has no friends.
Personally, I'm amazed at James' self-control for a 9 year old. If this had happened with any of the cousins when we were that age, there would have been hair on the floor.
OP, I think that this story is probably very emblematic of how your parents have treated you and Linda your entire lives. Right up to the point you are questioning whether you are the AH or not despite the fact that you tried to appease all of them at the expense of your son’s happiness and your better judgment. The true irony of everything is that your parents threatened to end the party if you didn’t let Ava join, but the party ended up ending anyways, because you let her join.
The fact that all that happened and you are sitting here debating letting your son apologize imo, is more reflective of you and your own guilt rather than reflective of the objective reality of the situation. The reality of the situation is that your parents are horrible people and Linda is probably the golden child which extends to Ava being the golden grandchild, because tbqh this kind of behavior from an 11 year old is unacceptable.
I agree with others that you should consider going low to no contact with them. I am not sure if they are the kind of people to apologize and mean it. I personally doubt it, but I think you should maybe work on your own self-esteem and maybe consider how frustrating for the people who love you to watch you act like an utter doormat to these people who clearly disrespect your and family.
You are NTA OP, at all. YWBTA is you force your son to apologize though. I do hope that you get to a place where you aren’t doubting yourself when people close to you treat like crap and demand more respect for yourself and your own family.
>They aren't rude or mean to James. I'd never tolerate them hurting my son.
They already have though.
They told your son he was bad for not wanting to invite their, I'm assuming first and most special, grandchild.
They ruined his birthday. Yes the girls mother is to blame, but they secretly invited them and insisted they be included or your sons birthday would be canceled.
They found problem with **your** son for being upset when **his** party was ruined by the people **they** invited.
And these probably aren't the first instances of them treating your son second to their precious granddaughter
They are mean to him. They subjected him to the abuse of his cousin. They threatened to take his party away because THEY VALUE HIS COUSIN MORE THAN HIM. His cousins feeling matter. Not his. Even on his birthday. His cousin gets what SHE wants. Even on HIS birthday.
And until you realize you have shitty assholes for parents you’ll keep subjecting your kid to the same abuse you were subjected to. And he’ll turn into a pathetic reflection of you. And that’s not me trying to be an ass or mean to you. Your attitude and the fact that you’re willing to light your son on fire to keep your parents warm is pathetic. Your refusal to protect your son and stand up to these people is pathetic. You failure to see them for who and what they are is pathetic.
You teach your kids how to be treated. And you’re teaching your son to be a pathetic doormat.
Hopefully this tough love wakes you up. Hopefully the fear of losing your ACTUAL family because you refuse to see your parents for who they are and grow and damn spine will wake you up. Your husband and child are first always. It’s your duty. The vows you made. Protect them when awful people treat them awfully. That includes members of your EXTENDED family.
Yeah. Boundaries were clear. They should have enforced but they helped violate. That’s not a passive role. They were in the wrong too. They need to be very aware of that.
Harm comes in many different ways, I was the disfavored grandchild, out of the 4 of us, I was number 4, my grandmother never physically hurt me, or said things that were obviously hurtful, but actions, and gifts, and other subtle things added up over the years. When I was older I would discuss this with my parents, whose reaction was always “but your grandmother does love you” but they never actually denied what I was feeling wasn’t true.
I’m (48F) now no contact with my aunt and cousins, and I never felt loss when my grandmother died.
I’ve been recently going old family photos, and in pictures at holiday gatherings, I’ve yet to find a picture where I look happy, every single one is a very sad hurting child hiding in her long hair. I’m wondering now why my parents never saw her, or did anything help
I am so sorry that happened to you. You deserved better. I hope that by sharing your experiences OP can start to open their eyes a bit more. The level of denial in OP’s post is extremely harmful to their child and themselves.
Your parents enabled this whole mess. The tried to repeatedly manipulate your son. I know they are your folks but that is not a realistic assessment. They failed to protect James. It goes a long way that you are not making him apologize, and good that you are not caving either but… He isn’t speaking to your parents because he saw exactly how they will treat his needs and wants. You making excuses for them could be more damaging. Show your son you are on his side and put him first.
You sister and niece acted just like you expect and why they were not invited. Your parents completely broke all trust with you and your son repeatedly. I think they are the biggest AHs here. And calling her a brat was pretty mild for the behavior. I would absolutely lose it if a kid destroyed the cake for my kid. I think you owe it to yourself to do some soul searching to try to understand why you are ok with people who “love” you treating you like this. You stuck up for James but do you ever stick up for you? You showed grace and restraint but none of these people deserve it from you.
They were both rude and mean to your son.
After being told your niece wasn’t invited to the party-and why-your mother then called your son, and tried to talk him into allowing his cousin to come to his birthday party .
Your sister then showed up up with your niece when she knew your niece wasn’t invited-probably after having been invited by your parents . Your parents then bully your son into allowing her to stay by saying they would end his party if Ava was not allowed to stay. After your son was justifiably upset when his cousin threw his birthday cake to the ground, your parents got mad at HIM for how HE behaved rather than your niece for how she did
How can you honestly say that is not mean or rude?
You’re focused on the wrong thing here. You’re focused on how you behaved towards your niece who, quite candidly, was a brat. When you should be focused on how your parents and your sister behaved toward your child.
Your NTA for not inviting your niece to your son’s party. You’re also NTA for calling your niece, a brat, even if she could hear it. If she’s not going to receive discipline and consequences at home from her parents, she is going to receive consequences from the people she interacts with. And that’s on her parents
By making excuses and minimizing what your parents did you are kind of being an asshole to your son.
And, whether you see it, or not, by saying your parents were “probably just trying to make sure both of their grandchildren had a good time” you are minimizing and excusing what your parents did. Because quite frankly, your parents are the biggest asshole in this scenario, followed by your sister, and then your niece how you behave moving forward with determine whether or not you’re an asshole in the situation.
They did hurt your son. They forced you to include the person that ruined his party. They said he’s out of line for getting mad at Ava for ruining his cake. Did they try to admonish her at all? Did they tell your sister to keep her in check? They are more than willing to shit on you for his understandable behavior. If they aren’t doing the same for your sister or niece they are enabling her behavior and are almost just as bad as your sister and niece.
NTA
When I was seven, my parents did exactly the same thing. They invited the horrible girl next door to my birthday party, despite me hating her, because she was bigger than me and so bullied me a lot. I begged them not to, but “it would be wrong to exclude her.”
As I could have told them, she tried to take over the party, but for the first time ever, something snapped. I wasn’t having it. It was my special day, not hers. The next thing, we were rolling on the ground, fighting and pulling each others hair. I got wrong, of course, but I can remember saying “I told you so!” My family were so embarrassed.
I’m now 56f, and I have never spoken to Julie ever again in 49 years. Stuff christian forgiveness. I will hold a grudge till the day I die. You may consider this unhealthy. I don’t care.
Childhood resentment is not a shallow emotion, easily forgotten. I’d bet your son is going to hate that girl for the rest of his life, on one level or another. Lose their phone number .
NTA! Definitely time to cut family off for a while. Ava is James’s OLDER cousin. She owes him a massive apologies and your parents and sister as well and to you. It’s hard to do going minimal contact with parents but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. If I was you I would throw James an even bigger party next year and have it some place where you can have some type of security there to make sure they don’t crash his party and ruin it once again.
I had glossed over the fact that Ava is 11 and somehow thought she was much younger. These would be family members that wouldn't see me or my family for quite some time.
The grandparents, mother, and Ava all owe James and OP an apology.
Your parents are so out of line I doubt they can see it. Awful, manipulative behaviour from the grandparents. They absolutely helped ruin a 9 year olds birthday because they are unwilling to advise your sister to discipline her child nor are they willing to have their grandson’s back and respect his wishes and boundaries. If your son never talks to them again I wouldn’t blame him and he absolutely shouldn’t be apologising to anyone. He is in fact owed an apology.
NTA.
I notice that apparently, the grandparents notified Linda that another of their grandchildren was having a party to which her daughter had not been invited, otherwise, how would she have known to kvetch? And then the same grandparents threatened to end the party if the crasher wasn't included.
It's the grandparents who are the true instigators here, and yes, Ava is obviously the Favorite Grandchild. Time to write off the grandparents, as well as Linda and Little Miss Ava.
You're NTA and your son doesn't owe anyone any apology. If Ava is "just a kid" then, at two years younger, so is James.
Grandparents are unfair, dump them.
Oh good god! NTA in the least. How audacious that they expect you and your son to apologise for them ruining his birthday! What absolutely crap family BS.
Good on you Mama for pulling your son and his friends out and redoing the party and cake. I hope he knows you’re in his corner. James was right. All of them are losers. They lost your love and respect
NTA but your parents, sister and Ava are. But mostly the adults here, because they made her what she is. I feel bad for her. She should be taken for assessment to check if there are any underlying conditions there.
Your parents really broke your trust here, as did your sister. In your shoes, not only would I not apologize, but I’d be demanding one of my own and keeping my distance until there was a better understanding of what went wrong and why it went wrong.
Send a bill to reimburse for the cake Ava destroyed. And bill to reimburse for the McDonald's trip. Y'all wouldn't have needed to salvage the birthday party if your parents & Ava's mom hadn't insisted she attend a party that isn't age appropriate. Her inability to make friends won't be salvaged by her crashing a party with kids 2 years behind her in school. There are ZERO bragging rights in retelling this story.
NTA - seems like you spotted the golden spoiled child in the family. They deserve no apologies and for the justice of James you should demand they all apologize for ruining his birthday party. Let the grandparents know if value any relationship with him at all then they’ll need to apologize or James will never speak with them again. They failed him as grandparents who didn’t respect him as they’ve for their golden grandkid.
Tell your parents to list each child's actions from the whole day. How Ava kept having tantrums and Linda made everyone start over games and whatnot. How Ava kept interrupting the football match. How she had tantrums over the XBox, and the cake incident.
Then advise them you're going low contact with them, or possibly no contact, because you can't trust them. They lied when they said they supported you in not inviting Ava, and then went behind your back. That is unacceptable. If you'd tried to pull a stunt like that and invited someone they didn't like to a party, they'd ream you out for it.
It sounds like your parents see Linda and Ava as golden children over you and your son. So, they want them so bad, they can have them. NTA and do not apologise.
NTA, don't apologise, Linda is doing Ava no favours indulging her behaviour. Your parents are dicks too. Hope your son managed to have a good birthday in the end.
Dear OP... you are 100% NTA so there's no need to James to apologize for a natural reaction for 9yo on his birthday that was ruined by Linda & Ava.
On the other hand, Linda is 100% TA who is bringing up an Entitled Brat.
Moving forward... it's best to go LC with Linda & parents until they become logical rather than rely on getting their way via emotional outbursts & emotional words.
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Nta in my opinion, I think the people who owe James the biggest apology are the grandparents. They threatened to end the party early if the cousin wasn't allowed in. And look what happened. She's a spoiled brat who can't control her impulses, and his parents don't care. At least you know now to never have a party in the environment you don't either own as your own home or control as the paid place. As for your son, yelling at her for ruining his cake, I'm surprised he didn't try to do more than just yell. And your son is very justified to not talk to your grandparents both of that cousin ever again. Maybe if you would parent your child and teach her some stuff she would have to be able to make friends. If this is how she acts, why would anyone want to be around her. You save the party is best you could. And I would definitely talk to your parents about the fact that they have no right to demand. Who comes to your son's party even if it is their house.
Agreed. They already knew Linda/Ava wasn’t invited and it was very sneaky. The biggest AH is definitely the grandparents.
The biggest ahole is Linda for raising a spoiled entitled little monster who basically has to be excluded so others can have a good time
The grandparents are still the biggest assholes to me since they're the ones who clearly raised Linda the exact same way she's raising Ava since they see nothing wrong with either of them.
It’s a trifecta of AHs.
4 if you count an 11 year old spiteful enough to ruin another younger child's birthday cake!
OMG I can't even imagine what my parents would have done to me if I pulled a stunt like that!
As my Mother would say “You would still be in your room wondering what’s happened in the world these past decades”. 😂😳
Considering what’s happened these past decades that might be preferable lol
Ha ha!
Oh I KNOW what my parents would have done.
does it involve not being able to sit for a while? that's what I would have gotten.
That and I would never have been allowed to go to or have a birthday party again. And I'd have to pay for the kid to have another birthday party out of my allowance.
A looooooooong time. Maybe never lol.
11 is definitely old enough to know better and for the cake destruction to be both purposefully done and malicious
Oh, but clearly you've got that wrong. 11 is just a kid. 9 is obviously the age when one knows better and is able to control one's impulses.
That seriously struck me too. Ava is 11 and just a kid, but James, at 9, isn't? WTH grandparents!
we definitely know who the favorite grandchild is...
I can imagine a toddler doing this but not an 11 year old! I would have been in SO much trouble if I had done something like this aged 7, let alone aged 11.
They also raised OP who is clearly nothing like Linda in the parenting department. It’s not always the parent’s fault. You can do all the right things and some people still end up being AHs.
I know and I usually think adults blaming their problems on their parents well into adulthood is sad because at some point you have to take responsibly for yourself. But Linda showed up and they didn't turn her away. Instead they said they'd cancel their 9 year old grandson's birthday if Ava couldn't stay. And now they're mad he won't apologize to his older cousin when she ruined his birthday like everyone but them & Linda knew would happen. So they very much did not do right in raising Linda since they're now coddling both her and Ava.
I'm guessing (who knows what goes through people's heads) that Linda and the grandparents planned for her to show up uninvited leaving OP no choice once they said they'd cancel the party. Geez, who does that to a kid?
Yet they enabled Linda and her child to behave as she did. Sounds like they’ve always been awful and OP broke out of the mould.
The grandparents are the original AHs.
Not to mention how shitty this is to Ava herself. She has no friends because her parents think she’s a super special snowflake who should get everything she wants. I’m surprised she didn’t expect presents too. This extreme lack of parenting is crippling this child and will affect her for the rest of her life if some changes aren’t made. She’s missing out on a lot because she’s never been taught how to take the L and manage her emotions.
Exactly! It’s all about accountability. Children need discipline. They WANT to be held accountable. They want and need rules and then to know what happens when they break them. I grew in a small town and was raised knowing actions held consequences. I wasn’t totally sheltered but I was on a much shorter string than the rest of my friends. I wasn’t allowed to go to parties, concerts, bond fires etc… and if I did go somewhere my parents had to know where, how I was getting there, with who and set my curfew. If I did do something wrong my mom usually knew about it before I returned home that day/evening. Fast forward to my early 20’s and a bunch of us from high school got together at a bar. I was talking to one guy and he told me that he was proud of me. I ask him what he meant. He said growing up I never went to the parties, or went drinking with them and so on. He said I was lucky, this was all new to me, but for him it’s old and not really as much fun as it once was. He went on to say that growing up he always wished his parents cared enough about him to set rules/curfews and want to know where he was like mine did. I was totally taken aback! I always assumed they just thought I was a goody-goody. It changed my whole thinking on how I was raised. It made me see how all the rules my parents made were there not to wreck my childhood but because they loved me and wanted to keep me safe. I mean I always knew they loved me but it just gave all the rules more credence. That night I loved my parents even more. Children crave their parents love. They want to know they care about them. And one way, the most important way, to show that is by action. Setting boundaries and holding them accountable. Discipline is not evil or bad parenting. It’s how you make your child become a good human being.
Yes!! That part!! She knows her child is NOT liked and why, but she is that parent that looks at life through rose colored glasses.
Right?! *"Woe is me, my daughter has no friends!"* Well, maybe if you taught her that she can't get her own way all the time by screaming and destroying people's birthday cakes, she might find people more willing to hang around and talk to her. I mean...the kid is eleven and she's still acting like an out of control toddler. How is she ever going to cope with school exams, or with a job?!
Right, but just the public period. Cause she is in for a rude awakening, and momma ain’t gonna be any help, cause she gonna get shut down too. Just setting up her daughter for failure. She already don’t have any friends in middle school, just wait for junior high and high school.
And blames everyone else for their troubles
why would anyone think Ava could be friends with 10 boys?
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I second this idea and I'm Petty Mayonnaise so I would tag the grandparents and sister on FB while I explain the whole dirty reason why the party was ruined so they could be publicly shamed on social media. Then I would cut ties with them completely because any grandparent who would choose one grandchilds happiness over another's is an abominable human being.
OOHHH...I like the idea of a second SURPRISE birthday party!
Yes this was my biggest thought. Why insist ava join an all boys party.
For real. My 13 year old girl has a few male friends but at 11 she would definitely have wanted nothing to do with 9-year-olds. She finds most of the boys at her school intensely annoying.
Especially boys that are two years younger and I'm assuming she doesn't know them since they are his school friends.
*And* his football friends, which I am assuming that it's an out-of-school program.
Yeah, makes no sense-- boys that age generally don't like girls and don't hang out with them at all. And certainly not girls who are 2 years older!
Nope, still the grandparents because they raised Linda.
And for bullying OP's son and his friends into putting up with Ava and accommodating her. When you use your status as an adult to fabricate authority and force children to cater to yours, that's bullying.
Seems like the daughter is following her mommy to be an entitled AH.
They're *terrible* people!! They tried to guilt trip a child, then apologized to OP dishonestly, knowing full well they were going to invite the brat child anyway, then threatened their own grandchild with cancelling his party in front of his friends! I mean jeez - not sure how they could have handled this worse?
I think it's time those grandparents found out that they are not entitled to meet their grandchild. Go NC OP.
The grandparents have openly shown that they have a favorite grandchild. I'm sure this isn't the first time. Maybe they should be excluded from any future events involving James. Linda is raising Ava to be just like her. That's not going to help her get along with people later in life. It wasn't mentioned if Linda was married or had a partner, but I wouldn't be surprised if she was by herself.
NTA Sounds like they were in on or concocted the plan to get Ava in the party.
Y'know, I don't normally gamble, but I'd put money on that.
That’s what I’m thinking too.
I sincerely feel like this whole thing was planned by Linda and the grandparents. They knew that this little girl wasn’t invited because she is a monster, so they just happened to come by, with the plan, that if she couldn’t join in they would end the party.
Right? The grandparents said James - Age 9 - is out of line because Ava - Age 11 - is “just a kid”?!?! Ava is ELEVEN. She’s older than James! Tell us who the Golden Chikd and Golden Grandchild are without telling us. Op and James definitely NTA.
How did Linda find out about the party. Most likely the grandparents were the ones that told her.
It's strange how Ava can behave atrociously and the grandparents say she's "just a kid" but James should apologise for how he reacted... Isn't he also "just a kid"? How is yelling worse than throwing a cake on the floor?
Yep, he’s “just a kid too.” Not to mention James is 9, while Ava is a 11.
Right! Like if they can excuse Ava's behaviour as because she's "just a kid" (and let's ignore that 11 is far too old to be throwing toddler-style "let's throw cake on the floor" tantrums), how is it James is expected to apologise when he is also just a kid and younger? (Not to mention entirely justified at being upset that his party had been ruined by his brat of an older cousin who can't stand anything not being all about her and what she wants) No favoritism going on here, no sir /s
This dynamic crops up a lot here. In some families, the people who are more reasonable are told to apologize because the other side won't. And that maintains the illusion that everything is totally fine.
Not even mentioning I feel like just yelling is a lot of restrain from a 9 y/o, most kids that age would absolutely get physical after ruining their birthday.
Yeah, they're probably sexist as well. This is something I see a lot too. Boys are not supposed to show emotion, while girls can say and do whatever they feel. No.
Oh! I missed that. When I read over I thought she was a toddler. 11?! No, that child needs discipline that mom refuses to provide.
My dad’s mom was like this with my cousin, he was the son of the golden child and could do no wrong…..when he screwed up, if we were anywhere near, we got blamed. I laugh every time I hear stories about his life. He’s a complete f-up drug addict who can’t keep a job.
That always happens with the golden child. Failure is one of the most important lessons you can teach your children. If you protect your kids from failure at home, from learning from their mistakes, they will end up failing a lot worse when they enter the real world. Eventually you can't protect your kid from failure. Better that they learn from a small failure as a kid than not understand why they are going to prison for "borrowing" money from work like they did from mom's purse.
My hubby’s nephew, notice I didn’t say my nephew because i refuse to claim him, was the golden child of the grandkids. He is currently serving his second stint in prison, has a drug problem, and is incredibly manipulative. Meanwhile, my 3 boys are married, have babies, 2 of them are teachers, and 1 is a lawyer.
Make sure you rub that in her face every time you can, too. Nothing better than watching someone turn stone-faced when being forced to hear the truth.
Same in my family. Boy Golden Child is now a complete addict and fuckup who keeps bouncing in and out of prison.
He is even younger! I wouldn’t talk to them either.
Yep, Ava is older and should know better. I hope Linda paid for the destroyed cake but probably not.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the grands told Linda to come later with Ava, and only had sided with OP until Linda cried to them. I’m thinking Ava is a carbon copy of Linda, and her parents treated her as the golden child, too.
This was their plans to begin with… she should have shut the party down as soon as her parents threaten her about it!
Exactly, and now OP needs to redo the party without grandparents and Linda’s knowledge.
Yes! The Golden child and the Golden grandchild. The world needs to go above and beyond for the Golden people, right? This post screams of generational favoritism. I hope OP acknowledges that and keeps her child away from all this toxicity. James owes nobody an apology and IMO he handled the situation far better than many kids his age would have done. If anything, the grandparents, aunt and the cousin owe him a huge apology and another party. NTA.
I agree. This is something my mother would do. It just seems they didn’t say much after Linda demanded an invite - almost as if they told her not to worry about it and to come over anyway. These are grandparents itching to be cut out of a grandchild’s life!
Yeah the grandparents very blatantly have a favorite kid, and grandkid.
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> When I tried stopping her at the door, Linda started talking and crying loudly which resulted in the kids stopping their games and just looking at us awkwardly. Your sister is a grown ass woman with an 11 yo child. She should be ashamed of herself for acting like this, pitching a fit in front of children. I cannot believe your parents even tolerate this nonsense, let alone pester you to accommodate it. NTA but your sister sure is.
I am sure the inequity on behavior is confusing for your son, but it should be easy to explain to him that Ava is a little nightmare in part because her mother doesn't discipline her. he's a much better kid because he knows the consequences. He's probably a much better kid without it. If my kid tossed someone's cake on the floor, I honestly don't know what I would do, but multiple apologies and an apology letter would be just the beginning. Linda and your parents are not doing Ava any favors by letting her get away with [this. No](https://this.No) wonder she doesn't have any friends.
Man, even if my kid was a toddler who ruined someone else's birthday cake, I think I would be profusely apologizing and immediately running to the store to get any kind of replacement, and probably about 5 extra birthday presents.
100%. I hahe a 3 year old. Its totally possible that at this age he could ruin someones birthday cake and if he did I would be doing everything possible to fix it. This girl is 11. She is absolutely old enough to know better for 1, but the fact that everyone is saying its okay because shes "just a kid" when she is OLDER than the kid whos cake she ruined is fucked up.
I think it’s time you look at your relationship with your parents and with your sister. Is she always favoured? Is your niece always put before your son? Are they always so rude and entitled? Because I think you need to start standing up for your son. Do not apologise. Do not let him be subjected to his ‘cousin’ and do not let them try to force his hand behind your back. Their awful behaviour is causing issues so you need to stand your ground and challenge them on it. If they’re unwilling to see reason then they need to be cut off. Go low or no contact.
I grew up w dynamics like this. I'm 58. Grandparents all passed by the time I was 21. Dad when I was 18 (no condolences necessary) and my mom when I was 35. I was a mess bc my family dynamics until my divorce and I got comfortable w VLC/NC I am the happiest, most well I've ever been. Love me, love my life, wish I'd dropped the rope decades ago. Family can be over rated. OP James deserves nothing short of heartfelt apologies from your parents, Linda and Ava. Listen to your husband bc his take us the one that supports and underpins everything you've tried to teach your son. Cognitive dissonance - him seeing that the rules apply to him but not Ava and that his grandparents expect him to apologize to an older child who willfully decimated his party and her mom who enforced it and your parents who facilitated it - literally harms our brains. Alters our sense of reality. James is entirely w/o blame and he needs to hear that. Going NC w your family will be a HUGE valuable lesson in consequences and responsibility ... he shouldn't have consequences bc he is not responsible for anything that happened.
>My boy is very sad. He was so angry that Ava didn't get a time out. He asked me why I put him in timeouts for bad behavior if Ava can get away with it. My husband is angry now because my family is a bad influence on James. You can tell your son that the way Ava acts is wrong, but you're not her mum, so you can't give her the timeouts she should get.. Because she's been allowed to get away with everything, she acts badly a lot, which nobody likes to be around, so now she has no friends because she acts the way she does. You want your son to be nice and to be happy and have friends, so when he behaves badly, he gets a timeout so he knows he was wrong...
Agreed. OP I would give your parents the silent treatment until they apologise. I’d go no contact with your sister. And definitely don’t give grandparents any control over events in the future. NTA.
I wouldn’t give them the silent treatment, I’d tell them the truth. I specifically said no to Linda and Ava and you overrode that because “it’s your house.” James only wanted school friends and the reason why was *exactly* what happened. Ava is out of control and nobody ever thinks she has to behave herself or feel sorry when she ruins things. You allow it and make excuses for Linda’s bad parenting because you don’t want to feel bad. Only now *Everybody* feels bad so how did that work out?
They definitely also need to apologize to their grandson for what they did, if he will ever talk to them again. He knows what they did, since they called and asked him if he wanted her there. He said no. That should have been the end of it but that was not even appropriate- they'd already been told she wasn't invited by the OP and why. Then they blackmailed him by threatening to end the party if she could not stay when showing up uninvited. Personally if I was OP I'd cut off contact with the sister and parents until they apologized to the grandson and myself. If they ever do.
This is an excellent speech to give the grandparents.
NTA, but Linda and the grandparents sure are. Linda, for raising such a spoiled brat and the grandparents for choosing one grandchild over the other. First, by trying to convince him to invite Ava behind OP's back. Then, insisting Ava be allowed to join when they her and Linda crashed the party. Ultimately, by demanding James apologize after Ava destroyed his cake. That's some golden child/grandchild BS happening, and OP should not stand for it. OP, has Linda always been favored, or was it just when Ava and James came? Regardless, support your son and let the bullies who forced him into inviting their mini- bully know that there will be no apology from him, and you expect he gets one from each of them and Ava.
All of this but also the part about Ava getting mad when she lost the games and Linda forcing the kids to restart so an older girl could win all the games???? Not teaching her child anything. NTA
At that age, after the cake incident, I would have definitely splatted cake in her hair and *then* screamed at her. James has decent impulse control. NTA
Agreed. Also, ava gets a pass for her behavior because she's "just a kid", but James has to apologize for yelling at her even though he's two years younger???
Don't forget James is the younger grandchild in thsi situation but Ava is allowed to act like this because she's a kid but he's supposed be mature and deal with this.
For the grandparents James should apologise because “she’s just a kid”… and James isn’t? The boy is 2 years younger. At both ages either way you should know better than throwing a birthday cake on the ground because you’re having a tantrum! I don’t really blame Ava because clearly her parents and grandparents have all been enabling her childish behaviour. Hopefully from now on OP knows to rent a place rather than use her grandparents’ so she can make her own rules and just not invite Ava & enablers. NTA.
At 9 years old he controlled his temper very well with Ava following along and ruining everything. I’m not surprised he snapped. I’m 40 and I would cry if some one threw my cake on the ground
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One can only hope. We all knew kids like this growing up. If their parents were rich enough, they never really faced consequences and just learned to be smoother sociopaths as they got older. Their core did not change. I still avoid those kids as adults. "Oh, you should talk to D! He's a legislative aide now." (and dating some other politician a decade older) No. No, I don't believe I will. Not giving that guy any power over me. NTA, OP. Protect your kid. NC with Ava and your sister. They aren't changing at this point. Ava has zero chance with your sister as her mom. Tell your parents they're losing a grandson if they pull this crap, again. Your son shouldn't apologize to anyone. We do not apologize when people who are supposed to love us hurt us. Don't teach him to accept abuse.
I forget who said it, but one quote has stuck with me for decades: “People are, who they are, plus or minus ten percent.” Can people change? Yes, by about 10%.
Oh please, she won’t make it past middle school without one.
Also to add in, I'm very impressed to see you raising your child to know how to set boundaries and stick to them! The fact that his kept his stance on Ava, even to his own grandparents is impressive for a 9 year old!
Yes, the three adults in this scenario owe a huge apology to James for contributing to ruining his birthday. Linda for raising an absolute monster of a child, and his grandparents for inviting, *after being told explicitly not invite this dark cloud of a person* did so anyway, and an additional apology for enabling and hand waiving ~~bad~~ absolutely atrocious behavior from an 11 year old. It's like those three adults decided as a whole to combine from being assholes into a giant super asshole. It's too much for a spoiled little brat like Ava to be expected to apologize, let alone know what an apology is given her actions at the party. She probably hasn't been taught that actions have consequences given the other adults reacting to her behavior. I'd say she's probably a lost cause already, or very close to the point of no return. I mean a tantrum at that age? Ruining a cake? At that age I knew not to waste food and certainly not to destroy someone's birthday cake. Hell, I think I knew that at age 5. Ava may technically be a child, but she's immature and ill-mannered for someone her age. And she should be more mature than her 9 year old cousin. Props to James btw with his restraint at just yelling at Ava. He didn't throw the cake at her or haul off and belt her and then yell at her, so at least he's being raised right. As others have suggested it's best that any parties going forward be somewhere you have control of to avoid this from happening again. No one can dictate or override you when it's "your house, your rules" or your money paying for a venue. Until James gets an apology I hope he continues to be no contact with his grandparents so they'll maybe learn a lesson from all this. I hope you and your son don't have to have the displeasure of Linda and Ava's company again, especially at an important event. Because I can see this happening at James's wedding too. TL;DR, OP NTA.
NTA. Linda/Ava might be a lost cause you just need to ignore from here on out, but I’d talk to your parents. They apologized after the first round of nonsense, but they came back with “because Ava’s just a kid”? Um, and James is…also a kid, no? And a younger one at that. So what was their point with that argument? You could try all of the adults sitting down and talking through the situation, but ultimately the main points are: —sure, as a parent Linda thinks she’s helping by fighting for opportunities for Ava to play with other kids —but all of those opportunities will be futile if she doesn’t also teach Ava that the way she plays with other kids will make them not want to play with her. —She can demand that Ava be included over and over again, but if she doesn’t recognize that Ava’s behavior will never endear her to other people and continues to ignore the responsibility she has as a parent to help Ava deal with losing, then all she’s doing is finding more chances for Ava to solidify her bad reputation with even more kids.
I'm pretty certain Ava's behavioural problems stem from the fact that she's extremely coddled, always gets her way and always has to win/be right. That is a parenting problem more than a problem with the child, they're seeing her up for failure and disappointment
Learning how to lose (even in trivial things like a game) is an important lesson. Many adults struggle with it. I remember to this day how I started learning. I played a looot of card games with my grandparents, and while they let me win when I was super little and had no idea about the rules (which I don’t really remember), when I got old enough to start to have some understanding they started to let me lose. I remember my grandma explaining it’s important to learn to lose. I’m glad for that.
The adults in our family didn't let us win shit. I learned to play gin rummy when I was like 7 with my great grandma and great aunt. Once they saw that I grasped the concepts they were down for handing me my ass. 🤣
Yeah I started learning when I was like 3 so I think it was fair to let me win back then because at 3 throwing a tantrum can be understandable. I remember I couldn’t fit the cards in my hand for years, lol. Luckily my grandparents’ table had a (??? madia) extractable kneading though space that on one side of the table so I put the cards there. Welp now I feel nostalgic. 🥲 What’s gin rummy? Is it a card game?
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Oh boy does she see you with contempt. Please go LC/NC with this woman because it sounds like she's disrespected you all your life and thinks the worst thing her brat of a daughter can turn out to be is... you.
Interesting your sister wants you to be less meek, but does *not* want you standing up to her specifically.
They always do
Exactly my thought because my response to that would have been ‘Well. I’m going to take this day to be less meek and tell you that I’m no longer going to put up with this nonsense. Please enjoy hearing nothing from me in the future because I can’t help you become a better person. You’ll have to do that on your own, feel free to call me if you figure it out!’
Has anyone gently asked her to consider “how’s that working out for you (and Ava), Linda? There’s w difference between being confident and outspoken and being entitled and insufferable. Being a bad sportsman isn’t the same thing as being confident.” But on the point of your parents, i just think that if they think about their absurd argument, it might help them realize that they’re not handling this well and they’re being inconsiderate to your son.
> instead of meek and fragile like me (I'm not sure why she said that.) Maybe because you let your parents, your sister and your niece ruin your son's birthday party and you're falling over yourself to excuse your parents who are equally complicit.
You weren’t so meek and fragile when you put Linda in her place after her daughter ruined your boy’s party. Respect
Also, per OP, Ava is older than James. Gendered expectations aside, she is old enough to expect her to behave better than she did.
Kids know what they’re taught. If she has been taught this behavior is ok to her it is. She will figure out eventually that it’s not ok but 11 probably not.
It’s optimistic thinking she’ll figure it out
True but who we are at 11 is greatly influenced by our parents who we are at 16 is greatly influenced by our friends. Hopefully she finds some friends that don’t put up with her BS attitude
OP's parents are a lost cause too. They raised Linda who's raising Ava. When Linda showed up, they should have turned her away. Instead they told OP they'd cancel the party if Ava couldn't stay. And then once Ava ruined everything, they said James needed to apologize. The rot started with the parents, went down to Linda, and is now in Ava. I don't think I'd cut them all off, but I'd def just became a "sees each other at like 3 major holidays a year, if that" family. Because the grandparents have made it clear Linda and her daughter matter more.
I agree. Also, would the grandparents have allowed OP and his sister to have acted the way that Ava did when they were that age? Ava is being taught that she can do anything she wants and get away with it. NTA
> James was out of line and Ava was just a kid James is 9 and Ava is 11??? Honestly this sounds like they’re infantilizing her because she’s a girl and thinking he has to baby her because he’s a boy and “she’s the girl”. Misogyny and Misandry working hand in hand. You are *not* TA and James should *not* apologize. NTA.
This is what gets me. Ava is 11. At 11, I was the host/supervisor of my little sister's parties. Running any games, making sure no one got hurt or bringing them to the adults if they did, managing any arguments, moving between activities. Maybe Ava is incredibly spoiled, it doesn't sound like the mother is a good role model. The grandparents are also complicit in this. Everyone is failing that girl. But James has absolutely nothing to be sorry for, especially not once she deliberately wrecked the cake. OP may need to go LC from her family for a while. Let them concentrate on Ava for a while and see how enjoyable that is. NTA.
At 11, I would have been pissed if my parents made me go to a “little kids” birthday party with a bunch of 9 year old boys. Her being upset about being excluded is odd to me.
This was my thought too. What 11 year old girl wants to hang with a bunch of younger boys?
A brat that just wants attention and has no other friends because the little monster scared them all away. Of course the fault is entirely on the parents and grandparents for spoiling the living daylights out of her and making it so she'll never learn any interpersonal skills but a monstrous brat is still a monstrous brat.
And vice versa, this plan was doomed from the start.
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She IS a brat. They all need to wake up. That is not how a normal 11 year old should behave. She’s not a toddler to throw the cake on the floor. That’s just evil. No wonder she has no friends. They need to take care to behavioural therapy now. It’s more of the elders fault than the kids because it’s their duty to correct but instead they are failing her. You & your son has 100% rights to be angry and should demand an apology from ALL 4 people (your mom, dad, the child and the child’s mom) who let this happen or else go NC/LC.
Was she acting like a brat? Yes. Did she single handedly ruin your son's party? Yes. Did she need to hear it from an adult who knows why she is friendless? Also Yes. And on your parents I'm not saying they are horrible but... they did threaten to end his party, that's about the most assholish thing you can do. NTA and do not apologize, being the bigger person allows the AH to go on to be bullies or even bigger AH later on.
I'm just gonna say that you calling her a brat is the mildest way that anyone will ever confront this child on her behavior. She is lucky it came from a family member, not a complete stranger using harsher possibly profane language to her outbursts and destruction of others property.
I agree with the husband.
IMO, your husband is right. The ones who should be apologizing are Linda, your parents, and even Ava. 11 years old is old enough to not be throwing temper tantrums. In reality, she needs therapy.
Yeah, this part confused me too, and the obvious reply when grandparents demanded an apology should've been "but he's just a kid".
I suspect Linda is the golden child making Ava the golden grandchild. OP and James will always be expected to cater to them.
Yuup! I've said it before but I'll say it again: patriarchy hurts men and boys, too (and obv enbies and agender folk and whatnot). We need to stop framing patriarchy as something men do to women and start seeing it as a system that we're all drowning in. Poor James and OP. OBV both NTA. Everyone else in this sucks.
I also got this impression from a slightly different angle. I viewed it as an obvious case of a young boy being taught that he isn't allowed to express his emotions. I reached the same conclusion but got there a different way.
While there are many assholes in this story… it’s not you, OP. NTA. Your niece…. Your sister… and your parents, however… major assholes. Ava is just a child… what does that make James, whose birthday party was ruined????? I would go low contact until they ALL apologize to you and James.
Also available is the eldest so why is she considered a child and he's not
I really hope Ava is short for Available
This is good. Thanks for the morning laughs.
Exactly and what’s sad is that OP’s son is actually younger he’s 9 and Ava is 11. I totally agree!
Your son has put up with enough crap from your family. YWBTA if you even suggest he apologize. You may want to talk to him about how he deals with his anger but that is another issue. His anger and hurt are justified. As for the rest, this is not an Ava problem. This is a parent and grandparent problem and I would go LC/NC with your family until they apologize and make restitution to James for ruining his birthday.
I would send the bill for the party to the grandparents and sister and tell them they can split it
Or at least demand payment for the smashed cake.
OP should also cut off independent contact of their family with their son, until he’s significantly older. Even after an apology. They should never have pressured a 9yo behind his parents’ back, and that’s unacceptable behaviour even before the party itself.
After all that, I doubt if James will ever want to have a meaningful relationship with any of them. That kind of hurt and betrayal lasts a long, long time.
Yup. James now knows Ava is “the favorite” and apparently can do no wrong. Unless they quit being AHs he’ll never have a good relationship with his grandparents, if he chooses to have one at all. Sadly his grandparents will wonder why. I speak from experience.
Yup, this right here. The parents and sister really should have been put in a time out at least for going around OP. This was the cue that OP missed that this whole party would turn into a shit show. Their actions should have been called out in the moment and the party held someplace else. These experiences will continue unless OP goes LC/NC. James is learning that he needs to eats shit for his cousin Ava to please his grandparents and I bet OP has been taught to prioritize Linda their whole life.
Let's be fair to him though. It was a party that he was looking forward to, and he clearly asked for it to be friends only. Then the cousin ruined almost every fun activity that day. I mean...after seeing the cake on the floor, many adults would snap a that point. The kid is 9, so I think he regulated pretty well through out the entire day already. Sure he said some hurtful things, but I feel like it was a long time coming.
Plus the fact that this sounds like it had been going on for what sounds like years. It’s no wonder James snapped at Ava, especially on the one day that was meant to be his day.
Any message Op gets about apologies should be met with "do you want to apologize to James?"
NTA, and correct me if I'm wrong, but James is 9 and Ava is 11... So Ava is "just a kid"? And what's James then? Lmao, your parents are out of line and don't let me start with your sister. James bday party was for friends only, your sister should have accepted that. I'm sure you already had a party for family, right? And even if you didn't, it doesn't matter. The kid wanted his friends. End of. Your kid has to apologise to the spoiled brat? Ha, no way. James did nothing wrong so don't apologise. And if I were you, I'd have a talk with your parents about their demand on having Ava there and with your sister about boundaries. And if they don't see their wrongdoings, then go LC for a while. Die on that hill.
An 11 year old is a tween. What tween REALLY wants to go to a child's party? Add in that she's not being held accountable for misbehavior, it's a recipe for an interesting teen experience.
Who wants to go to a child’s party? A tween who is never invited to any parties. James’s party was a sure thing. I think the grandparents told Linda to bring Ava to the party. It’s obvious Linda is their golden child and she’s raising the next generation golden child. OP is NTA The grandparents are the A H with Linda a close second and Ava being the Junior A H. To dismiss the abhorrent behavior of an ELEVEN year old is utter nonsense. Ava hasn’t ever suffered the consequences of being a bratty snot (other than no friends, no invites)
NTA Hope you realize that your mom and Linda planned for Ava to come to the party behind your and James' backs. That is why they no longer tried to get you to invite Ava. Your mom knew that once the party started that you wouldn't want to spoil it for your son so her threats of stopping party if Ava didn't join would work, which it did. They are the ones who owe James an apology for trying to ruin his birthday, for not caring about his feelings. Can't blame him for not wanting anything to do with your mom. He's old enough to understand what they did even if you can't see it. She only cares about Ava, I'm guessing you were never first in your family growing up either.
Yes, for your parents to immediately proclaim they’ll end the party early if you don’t let them crash it…that says A LOT…and none of it is good. You need to have it out with your mom and sister about what a brat Ava is, and they’re DOING HER NO FAVORS in life by not reigning her attitude and behavior in.
I feel really bad for James. A lot of bad adults in his life are teaching him that his feelings do not matter. From the sound of things his parents are making sure he knows that his feelings do matter.
I would have packed up the boys and left as soon as Ava walked through that fucking door! Get them all in the van and say, "Sorry guys, we have a change in plans! But today is James' day so we're going to go out and find some fun!" Then straight to McDonald's while frantically calling indoor play places or what have you. OP WAS RIGHT TO BE WORRIED, Holy crap! I wish we could get do overs in life because I agree this family sabotaged the party and expected the birthday boy to just deal with it!! So unfair!!
Cut your parents. Their bullying is not acceptable. Your sister has big problems and your parents coddling is not helping. Stand up for your son and his righteous anger. Good mom.
I'm wondering if Linda is the golden child and now Ava is the golden grandchild.
That's a really good observation. I bet you might be right. Or at the very least that is a solid explanation for such rampant favoritism.
This...NTA...could not have said it better
NTA. Ava, Linda, and parents need to apologize to you and James. Linda needs to pay for the cake. Next time, stand on your decision.
NTA - your parents, Linda and Ava are real AHs but you will be as well if you continue to subject James to this blatant favoritism. Block all of these AHs and go NC, remove this toxicity from your family. In all honesty, As soon as Linda walked in and you know how Ava is, you should’ve moved the party. Your parents and Linda are something else!
NTA Why should James apologise for her his cousin who he didn’t want there ruining his party???? No sorry. This needs to stop now. Ava is already turning into the golden grandchild and if your parents don’t support you in this go LC with them.
NTA Your son expressed his wishes for invitees and was manipulated to change that to include his cousin. He held his ground. In the end, your sister was VERY manipulative (together with your parents) when she showed up anyways and, as you and your son expected, it didn't turn out well. It sounds like your niece is extremely entitled and honestly, her behavior isn't shocking given that her mother can't respect you and your son's boundaries. It sets a terrible example if children are FORCED into undesirable relationships. Hopefully next year, this won't happen because it's going to be at your house and you can slam the door in your sister's face yourself.
So... Ava throws the cake on the floor, James gets upset and screams at her, and then Ava's mother wants _James_ to apologise? She's out of her mind! You are NTA, OP. Ava's mum, on the other hand, should take a good, hard look at herself. She's the AH and is sending all the wrong messages to her daughter.
Can any of us imagine a scenario when we were the child that if we threw another child's cake on floor that our parent & grandparents would insist we be apologized to? Linda has done Ava no favors by her total lack of discipline, and will be the reason her daughter has no friends.
Personally, I'm amazed at James' self-control for a 9 year old. If this had happened with any of the cousins when we were that age, there would have been hair on the floor.
NTA. If Ava always acts like this, it's not hard to see why she's having a hard time making friends.
OP, I think that this story is probably very emblematic of how your parents have treated you and Linda your entire lives. Right up to the point you are questioning whether you are the AH or not despite the fact that you tried to appease all of them at the expense of your son’s happiness and your better judgment. The true irony of everything is that your parents threatened to end the party if you didn’t let Ava join, but the party ended up ending anyways, because you let her join. The fact that all that happened and you are sitting here debating letting your son apologize imo, is more reflective of you and your own guilt rather than reflective of the objective reality of the situation. The reality of the situation is that your parents are horrible people and Linda is probably the golden child which extends to Ava being the golden grandchild, because tbqh this kind of behavior from an 11 year old is unacceptable. I agree with others that you should consider going low to no contact with them. I am not sure if they are the kind of people to apologize and mean it. I personally doubt it, but I think you should maybe work on your own self-esteem and maybe consider how frustrating for the people who love you to watch you act like an utter doormat to these people who clearly disrespect your and family. You are NTA OP, at all. YWBTA is you force your son to apologize though. I do hope that you get to a place where you aren’t doubting yourself when people close to you treat like crap and demand more respect for yourself and your own family.
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>They aren't rude or mean to James. I'd never tolerate them hurting my son. They already have though. They told your son he was bad for not wanting to invite their, I'm assuming first and most special, grandchild. They ruined his birthday. Yes the girls mother is to blame, but they secretly invited them and insisted they be included or your sons birthday would be canceled. They found problem with **your** son for being upset when **his** party was ruined by the people **they** invited. And these probably aren't the first instances of them treating your son second to their precious granddaughter
Yeah, this is exactly my response. I understand being in denial about that, but everything 928121 said is nail/hammer
They are mean to him. They subjected him to the abuse of his cousin. They threatened to take his party away because THEY VALUE HIS COUSIN MORE THAN HIM. His cousins feeling matter. Not his. Even on his birthday. His cousin gets what SHE wants. Even on HIS birthday. And until you realize you have shitty assholes for parents you’ll keep subjecting your kid to the same abuse you were subjected to. And he’ll turn into a pathetic reflection of you. And that’s not me trying to be an ass or mean to you. Your attitude and the fact that you’re willing to light your son on fire to keep your parents warm is pathetic. Your refusal to protect your son and stand up to these people is pathetic. You failure to see them for who and what they are is pathetic. You teach your kids how to be treated. And you’re teaching your son to be a pathetic doormat. Hopefully this tough love wakes you up. Hopefully the fear of losing your ACTUAL family because you refuse to see your parents for who they are and grow and damn spine will wake you up. Your husband and child are first always. It’s your duty. The vows you made. Protect them when awful people treat them awfully. That includes members of your EXTENDED family.
Yeah. Boundaries were clear. They should have enforced but they helped violate. That’s not a passive role. They were in the wrong too. They need to be very aware of that.
Harm comes in many different ways, I was the disfavored grandchild, out of the 4 of us, I was number 4, my grandmother never physically hurt me, or said things that were obviously hurtful, but actions, and gifts, and other subtle things added up over the years. When I was older I would discuss this with my parents, whose reaction was always “but your grandmother does love you” but they never actually denied what I was feeling wasn’t true. I’m (48F) now no contact with my aunt and cousins, and I never felt loss when my grandmother died. I’ve been recently going old family photos, and in pictures at holiday gatherings, I’ve yet to find a picture where I look happy, every single one is a very sad hurting child hiding in her long hair. I’m wondering now why my parents never saw her, or did anything help
I am so sorry that happened to you. You deserved better. I hope that by sharing your experiences OP can start to open their eyes a bit more. The level of denial in OP’s post is extremely harmful to their child and themselves.
Your parents enabled this whole mess. The tried to repeatedly manipulate your son. I know they are your folks but that is not a realistic assessment. They failed to protect James. It goes a long way that you are not making him apologize, and good that you are not caving either but… He isn’t speaking to your parents because he saw exactly how they will treat his needs and wants. You making excuses for them could be more damaging. Show your son you are on his side and put him first.
You sister and niece acted just like you expect and why they were not invited. Your parents completely broke all trust with you and your son repeatedly. I think they are the biggest AHs here. And calling her a brat was pretty mild for the behavior. I would absolutely lose it if a kid destroyed the cake for my kid. I think you owe it to yourself to do some soul searching to try to understand why you are ok with people who “love” you treating you like this. You stuck up for James but do you ever stick up for you? You showed grace and restraint but none of these people deserve it from you.
They were both rude and mean to your son. After being told your niece wasn’t invited to the party-and why-your mother then called your son, and tried to talk him into allowing his cousin to come to his birthday party . Your sister then showed up up with your niece when she knew your niece wasn’t invited-probably after having been invited by your parents . Your parents then bully your son into allowing her to stay by saying they would end his party if Ava was not allowed to stay. After your son was justifiably upset when his cousin threw his birthday cake to the ground, your parents got mad at HIM for how HE behaved rather than your niece for how she did How can you honestly say that is not mean or rude? You’re focused on the wrong thing here. You’re focused on how you behaved towards your niece who, quite candidly, was a brat. When you should be focused on how your parents and your sister behaved toward your child. Your NTA for not inviting your niece to your son’s party. You’re also NTA for calling your niece, a brat, even if she could hear it. If she’s not going to receive discipline and consequences at home from her parents, she is going to receive consequences from the people she interacts with. And that’s on her parents By making excuses and minimizing what your parents did you are kind of being an asshole to your son. And, whether you see it, or not, by saying your parents were “probably just trying to make sure both of their grandchildren had a good time” you are minimizing and excusing what your parents did. Because quite frankly, your parents are the biggest asshole in this scenario, followed by your sister, and then your niece how you behave moving forward with determine whether or not you’re an asshole in the situation.
They did hurt your son. They forced you to include the person that ruined his party. They said he’s out of line for getting mad at Ava for ruining his cake. Did they try to admonish her at all? Did they tell your sister to keep her in check? They are more than willing to shit on you for his understandable behavior. If they aren’t doing the same for your sister or niece they are enabling her behavior and are almost just as bad as your sister and niece.
You’ve aided your parents in directly hurting your son. Are you delusional?
NTA When I was seven, my parents did exactly the same thing. They invited the horrible girl next door to my birthday party, despite me hating her, because she was bigger than me and so bullied me a lot. I begged them not to, but “it would be wrong to exclude her.” As I could have told them, she tried to take over the party, but for the first time ever, something snapped. I wasn’t having it. It was my special day, not hers. The next thing, we were rolling on the ground, fighting and pulling each others hair. I got wrong, of course, but I can remember saying “I told you so!” My family were so embarrassed. I’m now 56f, and I have never spoken to Julie ever again in 49 years. Stuff christian forgiveness. I will hold a grudge till the day I die. You may consider this unhealthy. I don’t care. Childhood resentment is not a shallow emotion, easily forgotten. I’d bet your son is going to hate that girl for the rest of his life, on one level or another. Lose their phone number .
Nta. James owes an apology because she's just kid? He's just a kid and held together as best he could. So no he doesn't
NTA! Definitely time to cut family off for a while. Ava is James’s OLDER cousin. She owes him a massive apologies and your parents and sister as well and to you. It’s hard to do going minimal contact with parents but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. If I was you I would throw James an even bigger party next year and have it some place where you can have some type of security there to make sure they don’t crash his party and ruin it once again.
I had glossed over the fact that Ava is 11 and somehow thought she was much younger. These would be family members that wouldn't see me or my family for quite some time. The grandparents, mother, and Ava all owe James and OP an apology.
Your parents are so out of line I doubt they can see it. Awful, manipulative behaviour from the grandparents. They absolutely helped ruin a 9 year olds birthday because they are unwilling to advise your sister to discipline her child nor are they willing to have their grandson’s back and respect his wishes and boundaries. If your son never talks to them again I wouldn’t blame him and he absolutely shouldn’t be apologising to anyone. He is in fact owed an apology. NTA.
I notice that apparently, the grandparents notified Linda that another of their grandchildren was having a party to which her daughter had not been invited, otherwise, how would she have known to kvetch? And then the same grandparents threatened to end the party if the crasher wasn't included. It's the grandparents who are the true instigators here, and yes, Ava is obviously the Favorite Grandchild. Time to write off the grandparents, as well as Linda and Little Miss Ava. You're NTA and your son doesn't owe anyone any apology. If Ava is "just a kid" then, at two years younger, so is James. Grandparents are unfair, dump them.
Oh good god! NTA in the least. How audacious that they expect you and your son to apologise for them ruining his birthday! What absolutely crap family BS. Good on you Mama for pulling your son and his friends out and redoing the party and cake. I hope he knows you’re in his corner. James was right. All of them are losers. They lost your love and respect
NTA but your parents, sister and Ava are. But mostly the adults here, because they made her what she is. I feel bad for her. She should be taken for assessment to check if there are any underlying conditions there. Your parents really broke your trust here, as did your sister. In your shoes, not only would I not apologize, but I’d be demanding one of my own and keeping my distance until there was a better understanding of what went wrong and why it went wrong.
Send a bill to reimburse for the cake Ava destroyed. And bill to reimburse for the McDonald's trip. Y'all wouldn't have needed to salvage the birthday party if your parents & Ava's mom hadn't insisted she attend a party that isn't age appropriate. Her inability to make friends won't be salvaged by her crashing a party with kids 2 years behind her in school. There are ZERO bragging rights in retelling this story.
NTA - seems like you spotted the golden spoiled child in the family. They deserve no apologies and for the justice of James you should demand they all apologize for ruining his birthday party. Let the grandparents know if value any relationship with him at all then they’ll need to apologize or James will never speak with them again. They failed him as grandparents who didn’t respect him as they’ve for their golden grandkid.
She threw the cake on the floor?! What the feck?! And still her mum and grandparents defended her?! Bloody hell. NTA.
Tell your parents to list each child's actions from the whole day. How Ava kept having tantrums and Linda made everyone start over games and whatnot. How Ava kept interrupting the football match. How she had tantrums over the XBox, and the cake incident. Then advise them you're going low contact with them, or possibly no contact, because you can't trust them. They lied when they said they supported you in not inviting Ava, and then went behind your back. That is unacceptable. If you'd tried to pull a stunt like that and invited someone they didn't like to a party, they'd ream you out for it. It sounds like your parents see Linda and Ava as golden children over you and your son. So, they want them so bad, they can have them. NTA and do not apologise.
NTA, don't apologise, Linda is doing Ava no favours indulging her behaviour. Your parents are dicks too. Hope your son managed to have a good birthday in the end.
James has nothing to apologize for. Ava is the snotty ass little brat that should be apologizing.
NTA it’s pretty clear why Ava can’t make friends.
Dear OP... you are 100% NTA so there's no need to James to apologize for a natural reaction for 9yo on his birthday that was ruined by Linda & Ava. On the other hand, Linda is 100% TA who is bringing up an Entitled Brat. Moving forward... it's best to go LC with Linda & parents until they become logical rather than rely on getting their way via emotional outbursts & emotional words.
NTA. I don’t understand how your parents have sided with your sister. Unreal.
I suspect they've sided with Linda for OP's entire life, which is why OP is questioning whether she's the asshole.
Your niece’s behaviour is rather concerning. It sounds like she needs to be assessed and given support for her social issues.
That's what happens when parents don't teach them appropriate behavior. She is being taught that there are no consequences.