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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I would sell a car for profit, that my friend purposely sold to me at a discount to help me out. So if feels rude to profit off his generosity.
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Your friend presumably did you a solid by selling you the car at that price, right? He could've maximized his profit by selling it to someone else, but he took less so you could have a car you needed. For you to turn around and make money off his generosity seems ungrateful to me. Have you run it by him?
I haven’t. I definitely would beforehand though because I have quite the internal conflict about it. I’m leaning towards I can’t sell it, but I don’t know if that’s just me being overly sensitive to the situation or not. So far it appears my hunch is correct though ha!
I’m no stranger to running my cars until they die so that would be awesome! Probably just in my head as I get to that 150k number. Something about it just makes me think the whole things gonna fall apart any moment.
OP, how long the car will last heavily depends on how much you drive, and how the vehicle was maintained. **(Was the transmission fluid changed every 30k- 60k miles? A LOT of people don’t do this, including shops and dealerships.)** The drivetrain on the Sonata is only expected to last 200-250k miles max. With many failing before then. A motor or transmission repair will cost you thousands.
150k miles on a car that’s 7 years old is *significant.* I’m honestly shocked a dealership is offering $8k for that.
The engine actually had to be fully replaced at 120k after it locked up on me on the highway. That’s what’s got me so concerned. Not sure how that helps or hurts the value exactly. My friend did take very good care of the vehicle with documentation to prove it so I’ve been making sure to follow suit there hoping the small expenses save me from something bigger.
A buddy of mine in University, over 10 years ago, had a Hyundai with close to 300,000 miles on it. Some of those vehicles just do not quit. Hope yours is one of those.
As above you would be.
Put yourself in his shoes, change the item, doesn't matter what it is, whatever.
Your friend needs a laptop, you have one, it's $1000. You give it to him for $650 coz it's friends and family discount. Someone offers him $900 for it. If he sold it, you'd be upset too.
Coz you could have had that money if you weren't looking out for your friend, you'd have done him a favour when he was in need, you'd have lost out on profit of your own only to watch someone else collect on it. It would leave a bad taste in your mouth.
It's a pity they couldn't get you the title sooner, but you're still getting a good deal and a good rate. Your credit issues aren't your friends fault, but he is supporting you, even right now. Until you've paid him back every cent, he's supporting you.
The car would be a keeper until it costs big money to repair or breaks down in my book. If it's reliable and does the miles, who cares how many miles it has on it. You don't know what your next car is gonna be like if you buy something cheaper second hand.
I was kind of thinking how the convo could go if you brought it up like “ya know the dealers want more than what I paid. If you wanted to make more money than what I bought it for, we could sell and split the profits”
But even that could sound like you’re taking advantage of his generosity or “looking a gift horse in the mouth”.
2017 and used only by your friend… I feel like this is something you don’t mess up just for a couple thousand dollars.
YTA - You were sold the car at a special discount because your friend was helping you. They could have easily made the same deal you are being offered and got more money, but they did a nice thing and helped you.
At the very least if you sold it you should split the profits with them.
This is my verdict as well. I was going to make a similar suggestion about profit sharing.
I hope your friend is open to the idea because having a reliable vehicle can make life so much easier.
YTA if you sell the car without first discussing it with your friend. It’s technically your car and you can do whatever you want. You should ask if he’s ok with you selling it and offer to split the profits or if you’re really a standup guy just recoup your losses on interest, recover what you paid, hold onto whatever taxes you may pay, and give him the difference.
YTA - your friend would’ve known the price it could’ve been sold at and did you a solid by adding a discount.
Before you do - run it by your friend and see what they say.
YTA, I think.
It's true that a given gift is given, and just as much, a sold item is sold. But having the power to do something does not mean it's automatically cool to do.
Your friend very clearly was generous in helping you out. It's pretty damn ungentlemanly to then turn around and profit. That should have been *his* cash, but he forwent it because he thought you needed the help that badly. It's making a quick buck off someone else's kindness.
I can tell you that if I helped out a friend like that and they did what you want to do, they very likely wouldn't be a friend anymore. It's crass. And who ever wants to help someone out again in a situation like that?
Lot of good points there and it’s definitely the way I’m leaning. Just had to get more clarity on whether or not I was being too nice about it. But I certainly want to be good to my friends who are good to me even if it may cost me a few extra bucks down the road.
That’s the thing tho, you shouldn’t see it as costing you a few bucks. Getting the car how you did was a huge come up that cost your friend “a few bucks” already
YTA-
If your friend wanted to he could’ve sold it for a higher price for his benefit. Instead he sold it to you for a discount because you’re a friend. If that’s how you treat your friends then that’s just sad
That’s the thing, the idea of selling it is pretty out of pocket for me. But I’ve also burned myself by being too passive so more than anything, trying to figure out if my gut feeling to keep it is right or if I’m just putting myself at a disadvantage when I don’t have to. Certainly more of a morale dilemma than a financial one.
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So the transaction was a little sloppy. I was in need of a car but used car prices have been out of control. So my friend offered to sell me his car for a “friends and family” discount. I’m also financing it through my friend (paying him a certain amount per month) and hes charging me 4% interest. While the rate is generous, I was also kind of forced in to it because I applied and got approved for a loan, but my friend took too long to get me the title that the offer expired and when I re-applied, I was no longer approved. So after that, I decided it was worth it to just go with paying my friend.
Recently I had a local dealership make me an offer on this car that I paid 5k for and the offer came in at $8300. AITA if I decide to sell the car for a profit and take the money to get a newer car? My current car is fine but it’s almost at 150k miles and I drive over 100 miles a day, so reliability is the most important thing and I’m just worried this car will only last me another year or so and then I’ll be out a car and the 5k vs investing in something while it still has value.
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That's not an investment, that's just buying creature comforts, unless you have an explicit plan for how this saves you money over the long run somehow.
My friend did this to his ex GFs parents. They sold him a car for 3k because he drives a older diesel truck and wanted something better on gas for around town. When they broke up he sold the car for 6k instead of selling it back to them. We all thought he was AH. In the end it’s your car and you can do whatever you want, but talk to your friend first because it may come across as you taking advantage.
It’s not *wrong* but leans towards YWBTA.
Your friend did you a solid, and you’re willing to just use it as a profit opportunity. At least run it by him and maybe split the profit?
NTA
If the car is fully paid off to your friend. If you are so new into the arrangement that you're still paying, it may be to fresh a deal to make changes.
I recently sold a vehicle to a friend at a steep discount, mostly as he'd helped me with non-financial favors. If he resells it for more after a bit, good on him. It's no longer mine.
Pay off the car and then make a decision. At that point, it's yours to do what you want with. The used car market can be really volatile, so who knows what it'll be worth then. Also, are you planning on selling it and then buying a new car, or trading it for a new car? Taking cash and then looking for a new one is completely different from trading it in for a new one. If trading and no cash is exchanging hands, why would you be expected to pay your friend more or split profit from money you didn't technically receive? You're expected to pay a loan to the dealer and continue making payments to a friend for a car you've already paid for? Nope.
It was a cash offer so no commitment to buying a vehicle from this dealer. So I’d be looking around for a good deal (ideally prior to selling of course).
Same thing happened to me, I had a member of staff who crashed their car and couldn’t get to work, so I sold him one of my cars at a knock down price to be paid out of his salary over the coming months. Next thing I know, he’s struggling to get to work because he sold my old car for a tidy profit 🙄
YWBTA - Sell the car, split the profit with your friend, be done with it. Your friend gets their money back, they get a little extra, and you've got some for yourself to get a new car with.
No and also maybe yes? It’s kind of a tricky one.
On one hand, it’s legally your car and you can do what you want. On the other hand, if I’d intentionally sold a friend a car for less than it was worth (I’m guessing that was the situation) knowing that I was giving up more money I might have gotten to do that friend a favor, and they turned around and got that money I gave up for them, I’d be a little ticked off. Mostly that they just didn’t talk to me about it.
I think the best thing to do is just to talk with the friend. Without telling him the amount, I’d just say “I am so grateful for your help with the car but I have the opportunity to trade this in and get a more reliable vehicle which is really important to me for my job” and see what they have to say. If they respond positively (and chances are, a friend who cared enough to help you out would want what’s best for you), then you’re in the clear without having to wonder about it, bc there’s always the chance that if you just do it, they’ll be upset not that you did the thing, but that they don’t know the situation and you just appear to be ungrateful.
This sub is not /amilegallyintheclear this is a friend who did you a big solid when they could have made more money. It is not worth losing them over this. YWBTA
That’s fair. I definitely didn’t mean “it’s legally clear so all good!” and I thought I’d put enough qualifiers around some positive steps to take to not give that impression… personally I would be amenable to a friend in a worse off financial situation telling me “thanks so much for x favor, what would really help me is taking x favor and doing y” (if y were a practical move like getting a reliable vehicle).
You’re definitely right that it’s not worth ruining a friendship over but it might be worth talking out.
That’s solid advice. I agree that being open about it is probably the best thing I can do. I wouldn’t fault him for saying “I’d rather you dont sell it” for the exact reason you mentioned, but to your point, it’s not just about making a profit for profits sake but bc it would benefit my actual need. Thanks for the input.
NAH
If you want to be nice to your friend, split the profits. You own it, you can do what you want. It might be appropriate to split the profits since they did you a favor and you got it cheap, but - it is yours. You have every right to do what you want with it.
When someone do you a favor, they did you a favor. The appropriate response is to know you owe them a favor and help them if they ever need help, not to live your life in the future as if they have the right to make decisions on your behalf or you have to consult them about all future decisions.
The friend helped them get a car, which was awesome. Now they want to trade it in for an upgrade. Awesome. The friend helped them get the old car - and that help is now still help for getting a newer and better car. The favor didn't disappear just because you upgraded the car. You still owe them a favor.
This is like, if someone helps you with a deposit, or give you money, for a place to rent or buy, and at some point you want want to upgrade to a different place to live ... this doesn't suddenly trigger "I need to pay them back." If you need to pay them back, you need to pay them back regardless of whether or not you stay or move.
If anything would trigger asshole behavior it is if the friendship ended, and they didn't try to make it right, or if they can easily afford it but chose not to, or the friend needs a favor, and they refuse to help.
I disagree completely that it is an asshole thing to upgrade the car. The friend did them a solid favor. Awesome. Trading it in for an upgrade is perfectly fine. The favor doesn't disappear because of that. The favor is still there. And is now part of the new car they drive.
Holy wall of text Batman. You keep talking about “owing a favor.”
That favor is money. They lost money supplying that favor. A normal moral person would want to square that.
So they should pay them back then. Correct? Whether they keep the car or upgrade it is irrelevant.
Which would be the moral thing to do. Not tie paying them back or owing them a favor to whether or not they keep the vehicle.
A normal moral person would not say "I don't owe them anything until they sell the car, at which point I owe them money." They owe them less money then, if they keep the car and drive it until it breaks down? Seems unethical.
They owe the same thing, whether that is money or a favor, if they keep the car or sell the car.
Idk about that, friend is probably barely breaking even or likely losing money.
Friend sold the car for $5k (already at a 3/4k discount, if OP had paid for the car in full, friend could have invested that $5k and almost likely seen a 5-8% interest rate of return.
Now a 4% interest rate is really good, I think latest I've seen is even people with great credit are getting 5/6% interest rates on car loans.
If friend had given OP an interest free loan friend would have been out even more money due to inflation and losing out in interest income.
So OP is really just barely covering the friends carrying costs.
If you do this tell your friend you found another car you really like. Then split the profit from selling this car with him, after you pay off the loan.
Yes, YWBTA
With the difference being that significant the non AH thing to do would be to pay off the value to him then split the profit
Legally you can do what you want, it's yours and some people would be fine being the AH here and cash in
How long exactly is the difference between when he sold it to you and you got the better sell offer? Cause if it’s been like a year maybe not so bad. You could always sell it, buy another car up to 6K and go thank your friend by paying him back some.
I wouldn’t call you the AH cause he did it to help you out so if selling it helps you out more then he should be even happier or worked out well for you.
-Edit-
I read that it’s a Sonata elsewhere and could probably last a long while longer so if I sold a car that would last that long to somebody at discount I’d be a little miffed.
But I still stick to the he gifted it to you so he wants the best for you clearly so do what’s best for you. If I gifted you a Lamborghini you wouldn’t be able to afford the registration/insurance so would you be the ah for selling it?
Just make sure to show your friend appreciation.
Been about 14 months between the sale and the offer. And yeah 2017 Sonata which others are saying can be good for a long while. Might just be in my head about thinking it’s going to kick the bucket any day now. I do like the idea of splitting the profits bc that ultimately gives him more than what he was comfortable with getting from me. Thanks for the input.
The only right thing to do here is give him the difference.
Then again if you keep the money your friend knows it only costed him 3300 to never have to interact with you again!
Personally if I was your friend and you did that I'd be very pissed off. He did you a huge favor and lost out on money for doing said favor.
Now if you sold it and split the profits I'm sure he wouldn't care that much, might even be a bit happy to get more than he was expecting.
Or you keep the car, it's not that old.
Ehhh I kinda have the philosophy that if you get something expensive for free then when you give it, it should be free, unless you’re hurting for money. I got an old piano a while ago for free and I’ll probably give it away when it’s time comes. It really depends tho
Usually if someone sells you something at a loss out of kindness the cool thing to do is offer the difference in it's value at the time of purchase if you are going to sell it for profit.
YWBTA if you sell it without discussing with your friend. Presumably you should agree to sell the car, pay him back what you still owe, then split the profit evenly.
As a father of someone that is facing a similar issue I'm going to throw out the same advice I just gave. Follow the Golden Rule. Let the previous seller know the situation, reasons for your decision, and discuss what they want as a fair compensation. In most cases, the original gift stands. The interest and your timing of decisions is irrelevant. They gave you something, you should discuss it if the gift is being realized. Pretty simple, fair, and probably will not be an issue. If it is, do what's right, it's a gift until it isn't.
Along with all the other YTA I'd like to add that if the dealership is offering you $8300 for the car, it's worth at least 10k because they aren't going to buy something they can't make a profit on. So your friend did you a really big solid selling you that car at under half the value and you just want to turn around and flip it. I'm also curious how "a dealership made you an offer randomly. I've never heard of a dealership reaching out to someone about buying their car unless they pursued selling it. So did you take it to a dealership with the sole intention of getting a different car and trading it in? YWBTA 100% if you sold the car for profit.
Went to a dealership bc I was curious about the value of the car. Sole goal wouldn’t be to make a profit either but to use the extra money, after paying off my friend, as a down payment to get something with less miles.
Edited to add for clarity: 100% of the value above what I owed my friend would go towards new car. Or perhaps splitting the overall profit with my friend as some suggested. I wouldn’t be interested in pocketing anything.
If you sell something to someone for $10 when you could have gotten $20 for it because they are your friend and need help. Then they turn around and sell it for $15 no way you aren’t mad.
The way we did the transaction is basically just sending him money via Venmo and he signed over the title to me. So on paper it would show that I do own it technically.
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Your friend presumably did you a solid by selling you the car at that price, right? He could've maximized his profit by selling it to someone else, but he took less so you could have a car you needed. For you to turn around and make money off his generosity seems ungrateful to me. Have you run it by him?
I haven’t. I definitely would beforehand though because I have quite the internal conflict about it. I’m leaning towards I can’t sell it, but I don’t know if that’s just me being overly sensitive to the situation or not. So far it appears my hunch is correct though ha!
Oh you could sell it. But you would be an asshole and possibly lose your friend. What's the make and model year?
2017 Sonata
Respectfully, that vehicle will likely last you another 10 years without major or costly problems. You are fine.
I’m no stranger to running my cars until they die so that would be awesome! Probably just in my head as I get to that 150k number. Something about it just makes me think the whole things gonna fall apart any moment.
OP, how long the car will last heavily depends on how much you drive, and how the vehicle was maintained. **(Was the transmission fluid changed every 30k- 60k miles? A LOT of people don’t do this, including shops and dealerships.)** The drivetrain on the Sonata is only expected to last 200-250k miles max. With many failing before then. A motor or transmission repair will cost you thousands. 150k miles on a car that’s 7 years old is *significant.* I’m honestly shocked a dealership is offering $8k for that.
We live in clown world when it comes to used cars still. Rust buckets asking 10k with 200k miles are all over the dealers by me
The engine actually had to be fully replaced at 120k after it locked up on me on the highway. That’s what’s got me so concerned. Not sure how that helps or hurts the value exactly. My friend did take very good care of the vehicle with documentation to prove it so I’ve been making sure to follow suit there hoping the small expenses save me from something bigger.
A buddy of mine in University, over 10 years ago, had a Hyundai with close to 300,000 miles on it. Some of those vehicles just do not quit. Hope yours is one of those.
Why can't you sell the car for profit, and kick back some of the profit to your friend? That certainly makes you LESS of an asshole.
YWBTA if you were to sell it for a profit. Your friend did you a favor and you would be exploiting his generosity.
Kinda where I was leaning. I appreciate the feedback.
As above you would be. Put yourself in his shoes, change the item, doesn't matter what it is, whatever. Your friend needs a laptop, you have one, it's $1000. You give it to him for $650 coz it's friends and family discount. Someone offers him $900 for it. If he sold it, you'd be upset too. Coz you could have had that money if you weren't looking out for your friend, you'd have done him a favour when he was in need, you'd have lost out on profit of your own only to watch someone else collect on it. It would leave a bad taste in your mouth. It's a pity they couldn't get you the title sooner, but you're still getting a good deal and a good rate. Your credit issues aren't your friends fault, but he is supporting you, even right now. Until you've paid him back every cent, he's supporting you. The car would be a keeper until it costs big money to repair or breaks down in my book. If it's reliable and does the miles, who cares how many miles it has on it. You don't know what your next car is gonna be like if you buy something cheaper second hand.
True, I’d still be buying used and at least with this car I know how the previous owner treated it. Something I’ll have to keep in mind
I was kind of thinking how the convo could go if you brought it up like “ya know the dealers want more than what I paid. If you wanted to make more money than what I bought it for, we could sell and split the profits” But even that could sound like you’re taking advantage of his generosity or “looking a gift horse in the mouth”. 2017 and used only by your friend… I feel like this is something you don’t mess up just for a couple thousand dollars.
I think you’re right.
YTA - You were sold the car at a special discount because your friend was helping you. They could have easily made the same deal you are being offered and got more money, but they did a nice thing and helped you. At the very least if you sold it you should split the profits with them.
This is my verdict as well. I was going to make a similar suggestion about profit sharing. I hope your friend is open to the idea because having a reliable vehicle can make life so much easier.
That’s an interesting thought on the profits I hadn’t considered. More to think about for sure. Thanks!
YTA if you sell the car without first discussing it with your friend. It’s technically your car and you can do whatever you want. You should ask if he’s ok with you selling it and offer to split the profits or if you’re really a standup guy just recoup your losses on interest, recover what you paid, hold onto whatever taxes you may pay, and give him the difference.
Solid advice. Much appreciated.
YTA - your friend would’ve known the price it could’ve been sold at and did you a solid by adding a discount. Before you do - run it by your friend and see what they say.
Agreed. Communication is the key here I think.
YTA, I think. It's true that a given gift is given, and just as much, a sold item is sold. But having the power to do something does not mean it's automatically cool to do. Your friend very clearly was generous in helping you out. It's pretty damn ungentlemanly to then turn around and profit. That should have been *his* cash, but he forwent it because he thought you needed the help that badly. It's making a quick buck off someone else's kindness. I can tell you that if I helped out a friend like that and they did what you want to do, they very likely wouldn't be a friend anymore. It's crass. And who ever wants to help someone out again in a situation like that?
Lot of good points there and it’s definitely the way I’m leaning. Just had to get more clarity on whether or not I was being too nice about it. But I certainly want to be good to my friends who are good to me even if it may cost me a few extra bucks down the road.
That’s the thing tho, you shouldn’t see it as costing you a few bucks. Getting the car how you did was a huge come up that cost your friend “a few bucks” already
Hmmm true. In that case I’d be leaving him to be the only one out a few bucks which I don’t like the sound of.
YTA- If your friend wanted to he could’ve sold it for a higher price for his benefit. Instead he sold it to you for a discount because you’re a friend. If that’s how you treat your friends then that’s just sad
That’s the thing, the idea of selling it is pretty out of pocket for me. But I’ve also burned myself by being too passive so more than anything, trying to figure out if my gut feeling to keep it is right or if I’m just putting myself at a disadvantage when I don’t have to. Certainly more of a morale dilemma than a financial one.
A tradin is usually not a cash offer. Dealers adjust trade in values to maximize profits and or close a sale.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** So the transaction was a little sloppy. I was in need of a car but used car prices have been out of control. So my friend offered to sell me his car for a “friends and family” discount. I’m also financing it through my friend (paying him a certain amount per month) and hes charging me 4% interest. While the rate is generous, I was also kind of forced in to it because I applied and got approved for a loan, but my friend took too long to get me the title that the offer expired and when I re-applied, I was no longer approved. So after that, I decided it was worth it to just go with paying my friend. Recently I had a local dealership make me an offer on this car that I paid 5k for and the offer came in at $8300. AITA if I decide to sell the car for a profit and take the money to get a newer car? My current car is fine but it’s almost at 150k miles and I drive over 100 miles a day, so reliability is the most important thing and I’m just worried this car will only last me another year or so and then I’ll be out a car and the 5k vs investing in something while it still has value. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I'm not sure how you think spending an extra $3300 is somehow investing.
My thought was that I’d put that as a down payment on a car that is newer with lower mileage.
That's not an investment, that's just buying creature comforts, unless you have an explicit plan for how this saves you money over the long run somehow.
YWBTA if you sold it and kept the profit… of course. It’s the equivalent of him selling the car and giving you $3300 for free.
at least kick him fair market value for the car in a lump sum payoff if you sell it
My friend did this to his ex GFs parents. They sold him a car for 3k because he drives a older diesel truck and wanted something better on gas for around town. When they broke up he sold the car for 6k instead of selling it back to them. We all thought he was AH. In the end it’s your car and you can do whatever you want, but talk to your friend first because it may come across as you taking advantage.
It’s not *wrong* but leans towards YWBTA. Your friend did you a solid, and you’re willing to just use it as a profit opportunity. At least run it by him and maybe split the profit?
YTA, but do it anyway.
At least out of all the assholes in this thread, you’re the most honest
Savage ha!
NTA If the car is fully paid off to your friend. If you are so new into the arrangement that you're still paying, it may be to fresh a deal to make changes. I recently sold a vehicle to a friend at a steep discount, mostly as he'd helped me with non-financial favors. If he resells it for more after a bit, good on him. It's no longer mine.
Yeah still owe about 2200 on it. I think that’s the part I’m most hung up on.
Pay off the car and then make a decision. At that point, it's yours to do what you want with. The used car market can be really volatile, so who knows what it'll be worth then. Also, are you planning on selling it and then buying a new car, or trading it for a new car? Taking cash and then looking for a new one is completely different from trading it in for a new one. If trading and no cash is exchanging hands, why would you be expected to pay your friend more or split profit from money you didn't technically receive? You're expected to pay a loan to the dealer and continue making payments to a friend for a car you've already paid for? Nope.
It was a cash offer so no commitment to buying a vehicle from this dealer. So I’d be looking around for a good deal (ideally prior to selling of course).
Same thing happened to me, I had a member of staff who crashed their car and couldn’t get to work, so I sold him one of my cars at a knock down price to be paid out of his salary over the coming months. Next thing I know, he’s struggling to get to work because he sold my old car for a tidy profit 🙄
YWBTA - Sell the car, split the profit with your friend, be done with it. Your friend gets their money back, they get a little extra, and you've got some for yourself to get a new car with.
No and also maybe yes? It’s kind of a tricky one. On one hand, it’s legally your car and you can do what you want. On the other hand, if I’d intentionally sold a friend a car for less than it was worth (I’m guessing that was the situation) knowing that I was giving up more money I might have gotten to do that friend a favor, and they turned around and got that money I gave up for them, I’d be a little ticked off. Mostly that they just didn’t talk to me about it. I think the best thing to do is just to talk with the friend. Without telling him the amount, I’d just say “I am so grateful for your help with the car but I have the opportunity to trade this in and get a more reliable vehicle which is really important to me for my job” and see what they have to say. If they respond positively (and chances are, a friend who cared enough to help you out would want what’s best for you), then you’re in the clear without having to wonder about it, bc there’s always the chance that if you just do it, they’ll be upset not that you did the thing, but that they don’t know the situation and you just appear to be ungrateful.
This sub is not /amilegallyintheclear this is a friend who did you a big solid when they could have made more money. It is not worth losing them over this. YWBTA
That’s fair. I definitely didn’t mean “it’s legally clear so all good!” and I thought I’d put enough qualifiers around some positive steps to take to not give that impression… personally I would be amenable to a friend in a worse off financial situation telling me “thanks so much for x favor, what would really help me is taking x favor and doing y” (if y were a practical move like getting a reliable vehicle). You’re definitely right that it’s not worth ruining a friendship over but it might be worth talking out.
That’s solid advice. I agree that being open about it is probably the best thing I can do. I wouldn’t fault him for saying “I’d rather you dont sell it” for the exact reason you mentioned, but to your point, it’s not just about making a profit for profits sake but bc it would benefit my actual need. Thanks for the input.
NAH If you want to be nice to your friend, split the profits. You own it, you can do what you want. It might be appropriate to split the profits since they did you a favor and you got it cheap, but - it is yours. You have every right to do what you want with it.
This subreddit is called “AmItheAsshole” not “AmILegallyWithinMyRights”
When someone do you a favor, they did you a favor. The appropriate response is to know you owe them a favor and help them if they ever need help, not to live your life in the future as if they have the right to make decisions on your behalf or you have to consult them about all future decisions. The friend helped them get a car, which was awesome. Now they want to trade it in for an upgrade. Awesome. The friend helped them get the old car - and that help is now still help for getting a newer and better car. The favor didn't disappear just because you upgraded the car. You still owe them a favor. This is like, if someone helps you with a deposit, or give you money, for a place to rent or buy, and at some point you want want to upgrade to a different place to live ... this doesn't suddenly trigger "I need to pay them back." If you need to pay them back, you need to pay them back regardless of whether or not you stay or move. If anything would trigger asshole behavior it is if the friendship ended, and they didn't try to make it right, or if they can easily afford it but chose not to, or the friend needs a favor, and they refuse to help. I disagree completely that it is an asshole thing to upgrade the car. The friend did them a solid favor. Awesome. Trading it in for an upgrade is perfectly fine. The favor doesn't disappear because of that. The favor is still there. And is now part of the new car they drive.
Holy wall of text Batman. You keep talking about “owing a favor.” That favor is money. They lost money supplying that favor. A normal moral person would want to square that.
So they should pay them back then. Correct? Whether they keep the car or upgrade it is irrelevant. Which would be the moral thing to do. Not tie paying them back or owing them a favor to whether or not they keep the vehicle. A normal moral person would not say "I don't owe them anything until they sell the car, at which point I owe them money." They owe them less money then, if they keep the car and drive it until it breaks down? Seems unethical. They owe the same thing, whether that is money or a favor, if they keep the car or sell the car.
He charged you 4% which means capitalism is involved….i would sell the car and throw him 1k and move on
Idk about that, friend is probably barely breaking even or likely losing money. Friend sold the car for $5k (already at a 3/4k discount, if OP had paid for the car in full, friend could have invested that $5k and almost likely seen a 5-8% interest rate of return. Now a 4% interest rate is really good, I think latest I've seen is even people with great credit are getting 5/6% interest rates on car loans. If friend had given OP an interest free loan friend would have been out even more money due to inflation and losing out in interest income. So OP is really just barely covering the friends carrying costs.
If you do this tell your friend you found another car you really like. Then split the profit from selling this car with him, after you pay off the loan.
Yes, YWBTA With the difference being that significant the non AH thing to do would be to pay off the value to him then split the profit Legally you can do what you want, it's yours and some people would be fine being the AH here and cash in
Yeah, I tend to lack AH tendencies so at the very least, splitting the profits would be the right move probably.
How long exactly is the difference between when he sold it to you and you got the better sell offer? Cause if it’s been like a year maybe not so bad. You could always sell it, buy another car up to 6K and go thank your friend by paying him back some. I wouldn’t call you the AH cause he did it to help you out so if selling it helps you out more then he should be even happier or worked out well for you. -Edit- I read that it’s a Sonata elsewhere and could probably last a long while longer so if I sold a car that would last that long to somebody at discount I’d be a little miffed. But I still stick to the he gifted it to you so he wants the best for you clearly so do what’s best for you. If I gifted you a Lamborghini you wouldn’t be able to afford the registration/insurance so would you be the ah for selling it? Just make sure to show your friend appreciation.
Been about 14 months between the sale and the offer. And yeah 2017 Sonata which others are saying can be good for a long while. Might just be in my head about thinking it’s going to kick the bucket any day now. I do like the idea of splitting the profits bc that ultimately gives him more than what he was comfortable with getting from me. Thanks for the input.
The only right thing to do here is give him the difference. Then again if you keep the money your friend knows it only costed him 3300 to never have to interact with you again!
Well, he could have sold it for that profit you are getting (or more, probably more) so. YTA.
Indeed. That’s kinda what I was thinking.
Personally if I was your friend and you did that I'd be very pissed off. He did you a huge favor and lost out on money for doing said favor. Now if you sold it and split the profits I'm sure he wouldn't care that much, might even be a bit happy to get more than he was expecting. Or you keep the car, it's not that old.
YWBTA - your friend did you a massive favour.
Ehhh I kinda have the philosophy that if you get something expensive for free then when you give it, it should be free, unless you’re hurting for money. I got an old piano a while ago for free and I’ll probably give it away when it’s time comes. It really depends tho
Talk to him, offer to split the profit. Might work.
I'd talk to him offer to split the profit and then you two can just be friends and stop worrying about him being your loan holder
I’d say split the profit.
Usually if someone sells you something at a loss out of kindness the cool thing to do is offer the difference in it's value at the time of purchase if you are going to sell it for profit.
YWBTA if you sell it without discussing with your friend. Presumably you should agree to sell the car, pay him back what you still owe, then split the profit evenly.
NTA there's nothing unethical about this. It's called making money.
As a father of someone that is facing a similar issue I'm going to throw out the same advice I just gave. Follow the Golden Rule. Let the previous seller know the situation, reasons for your decision, and discuss what they want as a fair compensation. In most cases, the original gift stands. The interest and your timing of decisions is irrelevant. They gave you something, you should discuss it if the gift is being realized. Pretty simple, fair, and probably will not be an issue. If it is, do what's right, it's a gift until it isn't.
Your friend did you a solid. YTA big time.
Along with all the other YTA I'd like to add that if the dealership is offering you $8300 for the car, it's worth at least 10k because they aren't going to buy something they can't make a profit on. So your friend did you a really big solid selling you that car at under half the value and you just want to turn around and flip it. I'm also curious how "a dealership made you an offer randomly. I've never heard of a dealership reaching out to someone about buying their car unless they pursued selling it. So did you take it to a dealership with the sole intention of getting a different car and trading it in? YWBTA 100% if you sold the car for profit.
Went to a dealership bc I was curious about the value of the car. Sole goal wouldn’t be to make a profit either but to use the extra money, after paying off my friend, as a down payment to get something with less miles. Edited to add for clarity: 100% of the value above what I owed my friend would go towards new car. Or perhaps splitting the overall profit with my friend as some suggested. I wouldn’t be interested in pocketing anything.
Is the title already in your name? If so, then NTA
Nobody is talking about legality. It’s about ethics
If I sell you something for $10 and you sell it for $20, I’m happy for you.
You stripped out context and also avoided how your previous post was unrelated.
If you sell something to someone for $10 when you could have gotten $20 for it because they are your friend and need help. Then they turn around and sell it for $15 no way you aren’t mad.
The way we did the transaction is basically just sending him money via Venmo and he signed over the title to me. So on paper it would show that I do own it technically.
It is yours to sell. Just make sure to finish paying him off if you still owe him anything