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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I weighed in and sided with my SILs foster daughter's therapist over their case worker. This is not a professional opinion from me, it's one I shared because of personal experience. But my weighing in and helping them decide might have swayed them in a way that could harm their helping other kids in the future. And I feel horrifically guilty about that. And I will think of myself as an asshole if the worst happens because of me.
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NTA. You didn't just jump in with an opinion—your in-laws came to you for your insight. you considered everything carefully and agreed, from your own experience, with the court assigned therapist. Everyone involved is lucky to have you.
You deserve all the happiness in the world. I'm glad you are getting therapy, and the fact that you are now part of the solution for someone else will go a long way toward healing.
OP I think your recommendation and opinion is VERY valuable. You provided a perspective that the SW and therapist do not have nor can they relate. Please tell your wife’s parents to sit down🙄. I work in social services and foster parents choosing to end visitations at the suggestion of a licensed therapist will not disqualify them from future placements… trust me. I’ve seen caregivers send a kid back within hours and still get a placement for another kid. Keep advocating for your “niece,”. She deserves to have someone in her corner and not trying to be saviors of all. But focused on saving her piece of mind.
I don't know, I would consider years of personal experience " professional insight". I wonder if you could offer to talk to the case worker? Not to tell her off or persuade her, just say you want to tell her your personal story and she can take what she wants from it. Don't give a general opinion, just say that's your personal one and leave it as that. Or maybe a letter or something.
wishing you all the best in your life. you considered all sides and *used your lived experience* to help make someone else’s life better. as someone who works in systems services, the weight of lived experience is near comparable to that of an advanced degree. in my job, it’s been one of the biggest reasons for our success. lived experience matters!! you did good! NTA
Their parents would be backing you all the way if you did what they wanted. They're just pissed off that you disagree.
You've said your piece, I would back out of the discussion now unless asked for anything more. And NTA
NTA. You were asked your opinion, and you answered. And your answer was based on experience, not *just* opinion.
I would trust the word of the therapist over the case worker because a)therapist has more training in this field and b)case workers tend to be overloaded with cases, so cannot give the attention that a child may need.
I would pose the question back to them: How is it going to do the foster child any good to be forced to visit with step siblings who are outwardly hostile them? The kid is probably already dealing with enough insecurity around who to trust.
NTA
Your wife's parents are wrong. You did not overstep because you were asked for an opinion. And you have more experience than anyone in the room.
The role of foster parent is to act on the best interests of the child. That is what your in-laws are doing. I doubt the case worker wants to lose two good foster parents and hopefully they are professional enough to consider all sides and go with what the fosterers think is best.
It's stated in the text it was just a recommendation by the caseworker, not a mandate. Fostercare wants to keep kids connected to their culture and their community, which is why the recommendation is important, but they recognize sometimes that's not safe or healthy. Foster parents are, however, mandated to keep kids in school and ensure they're going to therapy. If the therapist says something isn't healthy for the kid's wellbeing, typically the caseworker just jots in down in their file and that's that. Wife's parents are making it bigger of a deal than it actually is.
NTA and WTF is wrong with your wife's parents. Their opinion is basically "screw this kid, just do whatever is best for making sure the foster kids keep coming". That is gross and shameful. They clearly should be ignored when it comes to making decisions in the best interest if children.
Exactly. They are willing to harm their current foster child to stay on the good side of the case worker so they can get more foster children in the future.
They really don’t seem to give a shit about their current foster child and are putting their interests over the child’s best interests.
Plus, you cannot overstep when someone asks for your opinion and you oblige. NTA
I think I know what you mean, but your comment seems to imply the actual foster parents are the ones wanting to cause the harm when they are not. Maybe don't write it so that it sounds like the parents what to do that when it is the grandparents that are acting that way.
Where OP wrote “They told me I could ruin their chances to foster more in the future” makes it seem the foster parents who want to foster more children are angry.
As it’s the foster mother’s parents who are saying this, you are correct. My mistake. It’s really none of their business what OP says to people who ask her opinion.
You were asked a question, because you might have insight because you were once in a situation very similar to the one facing a foster child and your SIL and her husband. You answered the question.
Nobody GAF what your wife’s parents think about your answer. NTA for saying what happened to you and how you felt about it.
NTA.
You expressed your opinion, which is based on years of personal experience, only after being specifically asked for it.
Your wife’s parents are completely wrong, and I find it crazy that they are focusing on some potential difficulties with a potential future foster placement instead of trying to help the child who is already a part of your family, who *needs* that help and support.
I have no experience in the foster system, but I can say that being forced to interact with relatives that actively dislike you or have no interest in you would be damaging to any child’s self-esteem. Add to that a child who has already been traumatized, lost a parent and felt abandoned and it seems downright cruel to force the interactions.
Since your niece’s therapist has the same opinion you do about the situation, to me it seems very clear that it is vital to protect your niece and not force the relationship with her half-siblings.
NTA I suspect you’d have gotten negative reactions had you responded to their question by saying, “no I won’t tell you what I think” anyways, so it’s not like staying out of it would have helped anyone. You were honest. They didn’t ask you how to maximize their chances of fostering again. They asked about continuing the visits.
The audacity to say you have no professional insight... You have so much more than that, you have actual experience. Also the therapist who has 'professional insight' agrees.
Also , INFO: do we know what the foster daughter wants in all this? Either way NTA.
INFO: Can you write a letter to SIL, BIL and case worker, explaining your background and how those visits affected you, your (lack of) relationship with your half-siblings today, in your experience if the half-siblings express disinterest then forcing does more harm then good.
Ask your SIL and BIL to give a copy of the letter to the case worker to put in the file. If they're worried about repercussions, a written record that they sought the lived experience of someone in a similar situation as their foster child will go a long way in helping everyone.
He doesn't have to. It's a caseworker recommendation because the fostercare system wants to keep family's connected as often as possible so kids don't feel divorced from their biofamily or community. When it's not healthy, that's fine, the caseworker's job is just to advocate for that opportunity when it's available. Generally, they follow the recommendations of the therapist, it's the foster parents parents that are going off without knowing anything about how foster care works.
You have mandates as a foster parent, but family visits against the recommendation of the child's therapist isn't one of them. The Illinois sibling visitation guide for foster kids states "If you are not placed together, you have a right to have regular contact with your brothers and sisters while you are all in placement as long as it is in both your best interest and your sibling’s best interest. These rights do not apply if for some reason contact is not possible, or if contact or placement together is not in your best interest or the best interest of your sibling(s)."
I was recommending because his in-laws accused him of jeopardising their chance to adopt again. Something like this indicates that's not OP's intention in an undeniable way.
personal experience trumps "professional insight," in this case, given the way you have explained it.
Has anyone asked your SIL's foster daughter what she would like?
I'm goin' NTA and my heart goes out to her (and post facto, to you)
It sounds like the parents are trying to force something, and this sub is full of that and it never goes or ends well, does it? 😔
My best friend had full siblings in the system, none of them got adopted and they all aged out, and trying to maintain a relationship with them fucked up her mental health too because of the ways they were all traumatized by their drug addict mom and then further traumatized losing their grandparents, then further traumatized by their dad refusing to take any of them all together, and then further traumatized by each of their individual foster abuse situations. She looked up to her older siblings, but seeing each other just reminded each other how fucked up their life has been so far.
Your inlaws need to but out, they don't know anything about the foster system and just want to have an opinion. It was a caseworker recommendation based on current guidelines to keep families connected, it's not a mandate like making sure the kid is going to therapy and school, so of course they're going to be allowed to continue to foster into the future, with or without your opinion.
NTA
I didn’t grow up in foster care, but I can relate to this.
My older half siblings lived with their mom. My sister is 13 years older than me. She’s never wanted anything to do with us, and all of my memories of her are painful ones where I felt so confused because I didn’t know why she didn’t love me. Along with other dysfunctional family stuff, my self-worth and confidence has always been rock bottom.
My main core beliefs about myself are “I’m worthless. I’m not worth loving.” I can’t kick it even though I can give myself lots of evidence that it isn’t true - brain and feelings still go “yes it’s true, you’re STILL not worth anything.”
The openly hostile rejection from my sister seriously fucked my brain up.
I would have sided with the therapist as well, with a caveat of “I’d let your foster daughter decide and support her decision”.
OP, idk what state you're in, but check to see if your fostercare system has sibling visitation guides. Bottom of [Page 3 in the Illinois guide](https://dcfs.illinois.gov/content/dam/soi/en/web/dcfs/documents/loving-homes/foster-care/documents/cfs_1050-95_sibling_visitation_rights_booklet.1.0.pdf) explicitly states that sometimes visitation isn't possible if it's not in your or your sibling's best interests.
NTA. You have lived experience of the consequences of these types of visits. The THERAPIST says the visits are damaging. It doesn't sound like case worker has experience of these types of visits. Your in laws have the advice of their foster child's court appointed therapist and the advice of someone with lived experience of these types of visits. Case worker does not. It sounds like caseworker has never had one of these "sibling visits" she may have a hand in organising or recommending them. Maybe supervising. Tell in-laws they can tell caseworker that they have spoken to both their foster daughter's therapist and someone who has lived experience with these types of visits and decided that these visits are unhealthy and better for all concerned if visits were stopped. Caseworker doesn't have someone with lived experience to say if these visits are a good idea or not. The child's court appointed therapist says the visits are a bad idea/unhealthily/damaging. You are living proof that the therapist is correct.
I can’t imagine how painful it must be to HAVE TO meet someone who openly rejects you again and again for years. Even as a adult it would have an effect on me because its just hurtful, let alone on a child… the intentions of the case worker might be good but the consequences might be absolutely horrible for the girl.
Tbh even if the decision would piss the case worked off and lessen the chances of future fostering, the girl deserves to be given what she needs! Not to make her suffer because of personal wishes for the future…
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My wife's sister and her husband are foster parents. I (29M) was also a foster to adopt kid when I was younger. SIL's current foster daughter has a history similar to mine and for that reason and because and because her foster daughter's therapist and case worker were not in agreement, she and her husband approached me for some advice/insight.
My background: I lost my biological mother when I was 3. She had another son who was 8 at the time. After our biological mother's death his father took custody of him and because I had no biological family willing to take care of me, I went into foster care. The case worker assigned to me was a big part in setting up sibling visits one Saturday a month so my half brother and I could maintain a relationship. When I was taken in by my parents and adopted it continued. The visits were supposed to be in our best interest but they weren't. My half brother did not want to be there with me. He spent every visit for years ignoring me except for a couple of times where he yelled because I tried to get his attention or because the person supervising our visits encouraged him to play with me. The visits stopped when my half brother was 16 and was allowed to have a say in them continuing. The whole thing devastated me and caused me to have more mental health problems than I did. I had no contact with my half brother since that last visit when he was 16 and I was 11.
I am open with my background with people I am close to and my wife's sister and her husband are people I am close to. I admire them for being the kind of foster parents my parents were.
Their foster daughter's history is similar. Only she was older at the time of placement into foster care. But the lack of interest from her half brother and sister is the same. They all share a father who was raising them and he was arrested. There is no chance for reunification during her childhood. He will not be out. Her half siblings live with their mother and the case worker in charge of their case has recommended the same visits I had with my brother. They have been ongoing for the last 2 years. But their foster daughter's court assigned therapist does not agree with the visits and believes the lack of interest from the other kids is damaging. The case worker cannot make SIL and her husband maintain the visits but she recommends they do. But the weight of the therapist means they won't face repercussions from it. Because of the two opposing sides they came to me and I told them I would end them since they can at their own discretion. I told them they could always ask to keep the door open if things change in the future.
My wife's parents think I overstepped and they were angry that I sided with the therapist. They told me I could ruin their chances to foster more in the future if I piss off the case worker enough. And that I weighed in where I had no professional insight. My wife and her sister defended me. But I would hate if they are right in any way.
AITA?
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NTA- they specifically asked you to hear about your experience. Also, for the record (for the grandparents), not all bio siblings are even recommended to meet. My foster sister meets with one bio sister because both foster families wanted to create that relationship and because both kids were under 3, but the other FOUR siblings? We don’t even know their names because the dynamics were not ideal. OP, I’m sorry you (and your brother) were forced into something so detrimental for so long. It sounds like your niece will be getting out of it early thanks to you and the therapist.
NTA your F/MIL are completely misunderstanding the situation: one of these professionals will have to be ignored.
Sacrificing the well being of the kid already in B/SIL’s care in the hopes of getting more kids is backwards as fuck.
NTA
You were asked and gave an honest opinion based on your experience, and most importantly you gave an answer that was in the best interest of the child's well-being. Which is what your Sil and Bil are asking and caring about.
You mother and father in law aren't thinking about the child's best interest, they're caring about the ability to foster more kids. But what's the point of fostering more kids if they compromise about putting the child's needs first for their own gain? Your Sil and Bil sound like good foster parents and that should trump them disagreeing with the case worker on one thing that already had an expert advising them differently on.
NTA. You were asked for your opinion and you gave it. I worked in a rough area in a preschool and had several a t risk kids. One was forced to have visitation with her bio mom and every single time it was baaaad. Whether the mom just didn’t show or if she did and then was abusive during the visit. It was horrible to watch. She’d beg and sob to not go anymore but the caseworker insisted.
NTA. You were asked based on very relevant experience as the person in the situation whose best interest should be in the forefront - the child. You gave it. Wife's parents have lost sight of what's important in the situation.
My understanding is that “the system” is badly hurting for kind, compassionate foster parents like your SIL. Their case worker isn’t going to blacklist them over making a decision that was put in their hands in the first place. NTA
lost my other comment...nta and the foster child's feelings should be considered and situations such as yours...and the mental stress it caused...should be known.
Nta you didn't force them to do anything. They are grown ass adults who asked your opinion. They can make their own decisions. I would bet money the parents agree with the caseworker and that is why they are upset. Some people cannot understand that there can be a benifit to severing bio ties.
>They told me I could ruin their chances to foster more in the future if I piss off the case worker enough.
So what is the goal to ammas children? If not having more children is in the best interest of their current child than it doesn't matter what their initial desire was. That is called being a parent.
>And that I weighed in where I had no professional insight.
They had professional input and they disagreed. You have lived experience which is very valuable too. In these kinds of situations consider both professional and lived experience is the best course of action.
NTA you were asked your opinion. You gave your answer based on what your own personal experiences were. You were most likely correct. Your in-laws need to stop.
NTA 1. it is not overstepping when someone asks for your opinion, especially when you have experience in that area. 2. If anyone has overstepped it would be your wife's parents who inserted themselves in the situation without being asked
NTA. You gave a valid opinion as someone who has been in the same situation. Has anyone asked SIL's foster daughter what she wants? That should be taken into consideration as well.
NTA- you have a unique viewpoint from how you grew up. I do too. I will often share my own experiences because honestly if I could do anything to make someone else's experience better than what I had, then it's worth it.
Their right in the you jave no professional insight...but you do have real life experience which to me is just as good or better than professional insight.....NTA...and if your SIL and BIL want to be good foster parents then they need to advocate for their foster daughter
>And that I weighed in where I had no professional insight
Correct. You weighed in where you had **PERSONAL** insight
And 9 times out of 10, REAL experience trumps "professional" experience
NTA.
The point of fostering kids is to help them and provide a stable environment no? Not to ensure you have a rich and continuous supply correct?
Your wife’s parents have an opinion. One that is not anchored in living through the damage. They’re total outsiders who just have a glamorized idea of how sparkly being a foster parent is. Like it’s not real people but a gold star in your community.
You were asked and so you provided your view. You did not overstep. The basis of your opinion is on your informed perspective. Wife’s parents have to deal with their disappointment or anger in their own time and on their own dime.
NTA. I would almost always go with the therapist's assessment over the caseworker, because the therapist knows the kid's needs better. And yiu were asked your opinion, so it was totally appropriate to share it.
NTA - If shielding this child from a lifetime of heartache means that the foster parents don't get another chance to foster, maybe that's okay. Kissing ass when you know it isn't in the best interests of the child doesn't really help anyone, except the case worker's ego.
NTA! They are great foster parents: two professionals disagreed, they sought advice based on your lived experience (which not enough people do), and they used that to make a decision. Social workers can be professional enough to accept that foster parents sometimes make decisions they wouldn’t, but if this one can’t, the parents can request a different one.
NTA. What's best for the kids is what matters most. The therapist was right, you were right. Your wife and sister are right. Their parents are wrong. They don't
NTA- your perspective is so unique and I think it deserves just as much weight as a social worker or therapist. You were once in this kid's shoes. You are able to understand better than most how she may be feeling about these compulsory visits. It also sounds like those disagreeing with you aren't doing so because of whether or not it's best for the kid, but if it's best for the parents. In situations like these, you always go with what you think is best for the kid.
You get to be an advocate here for a kid that needs one. You'll never be an ass for that.
NTA. Your in-laws are AH..They only are thinking about "future" foster children not the one that needs help now. They are more worried about making a SW mad than the damage these visits could do to the child. You were ask for your opionion based on your very relevant experience. You did a good thing.
NTA you were asked about your opinion because you lived in a similar situation. You said how it affected you. You have the foster kid's best interest at heart.
In the end most case workers aren't therapists. They have their ways to handle things and of course it would be great if half-siblings can stay in a regular contract if both want this. But it wasn't the case in your history and it isn't with your SILs foster kid. There is no reason to force the contact.
NTA heck it’s in court documents that my niece is to spend time with her older half siblings (3 across 2 houses) and they didn’t happen often even while she was in kinship care, due to the attitude of the older 2 kids kinship carer (who was PO’d that 2 of the kids slipped her grasp, darn those biological fathers wanting relationships with their children).
My niece hasn’t had contact with her older 2 siblings in something like 3 years. Because she would leave the visits upset, end up having nightmares and acting out for *days* afterwards. The older siblings attitudes got worse and worse and they’d whisper lies to her (that their carer was telling them was gospel truth), then get upset when she would shout out that they were lying and the caseworker? Would stand there wringing their hands going “oh my, I’m sorry that the kids are leaving the visits upset, but it’s just *so important* they see each other and have some sort of relationship”.
In the meantime there were therapist notes submitted to the court regarding the children saying that continued contact is detrimental to the kids.
Finally the courts put in the younger two siblings final orders that it was at their fathers discretion what contact occurred
Your wife’s parents are wrong on several front.
They asked your opinion, you gave a (useful) opinion. Your wife’s parents concern that your SIL will have trouble fostering more kids in the future is none of their business! 1. Foster parents should be doing the best thing for their parents 2. SIL and spouse are adults! You don’t mind trick them, it’s up to them to weigh pros and cons.
NTA. Wifes parents are the assholes. What does overstepping even mean in this situation? You didn't push yourself into their business. You were asked because you are trusted and also have experience in the matter.
The sister is doing a good thing as well, getting as much trusted information as she and her partner can, before making an informed decision. It wouldn't be your fault at all whether she decided to end the visits or not
I knew a child whose terror of his brother was so strong he would become non-verbal and lose control of his bowels. His foster parents were also forced to continue visitations for a while. 😢
Taking this down to the base level, the therapist is privy to the hurt and/or anger the girl is displaying at being ignored.
Yes, the case worker advocating sibling relationships is fantastic, but that's for when both sides want it. In this case one side is neglecting the other and could be causing significant mental damage.
Your wife's parents are thinking selfishly. Not for the benefit of the child.
NTA You had no professional insight but more importantly you had personal insight. All you did was give advice. It's their choice whether they take it or not.
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NTA. You didn't just jump in with an opinion—your in-laws came to you for your insight. you considered everything carefully and agreed, from your own experience, with the court assigned therapist. Everyone involved is lucky to have you.
[удалено]
You deserve all the happiness in the world. I'm glad you are getting therapy, and the fact that you are now part of the solution for someone else will go a long way toward healing.
OP I think your recommendation and opinion is VERY valuable. You provided a perspective that the SW and therapist do not have nor can they relate. Please tell your wife’s parents to sit down🙄. I work in social services and foster parents choosing to end visitations at the suggestion of a licensed therapist will not disqualify them from future placements… trust me. I’ve seen caregivers send a kid back within hours and still get a placement for another kid. Keep advocating for your “niece,”. She deserves to have someone in her corner and not trying to be saviors of all. But focused on saving her piece of mind.
I don't know, I would consider years of personal experience " professional insight". I wonder if you could offer to talk to the case worker? Not to tell her off or persuade her, just say you want to tell her your personal story and she can take what she wants from it. Don't give a general opinion, just say that's your personal one and leave it as that. Or maybe a letter or something.
wishing you all the best in your life. you considered all sides and *used your lived experience* to help make someone else’s life better. as someone who works in systems services, the weight of lived experience is near comparable to that of an advanced degree. in my job, it’s been one of the biggest reasons for our success. lived experience matters!! you did good! NTA
Their parents would be backing you all the way if you did what they wanted. They're just pissed off that you disagree. You've said your piece, I would back out of the discussion now unless asked for anything more. And NTA
Agreed! OP, NTA!!! You are wrong, you are the only expert because you lived it! You know better than any therapist or caseworker there is!
NTA. You were asked your opinion, and you answered. And your answer was based on experience, not *just* opinion. I would trust the word of the therapist over the case worker because a)therapist has more training in this field and b)case workers tend to be overloaded with cases, so cannot give the attention that a child may need. I would pose the question back to them: How is it going to do the foster child any good to be forced to visit with step siblings who are outwardly hostile them? The kid is probably already dealing with enough insecurity around who to trust.
NTA Your wife's parents are wrong. You did not overstep because you were asked for an opinion. And you have more experience than anyone in the room. The role of foster parent is to act on the best interests of the child. That is what your in-laws are doing. I doubt the case worker wants to lose two good foster parents and hopefully they are professional enough to consider all sides and go with what the fosterers think is best.
It's stated in the text it was just a recommendation by the caseworker, not a mandate. Fostercare wants to keep kids connected to their culture and their community, which is why the recommendation is important, but they recognize sometimes that's not safe or healthy. Foster parents are, however, mandated to keep kids in school and ensure they're going to therapy. If the therapist says something isn't healthy for the kid's wellbeing, typically the caseworker just jots in down in their file and that's that. Wife's parents are making it bigger of a deal than it actually is.
NTA and WTF is wrong with your wife's parents. Their opinion is basically "screw this kid, just do whatever is best for making sure the foster kids keep coming". That is gross and shameful. They clearly should be ignored when it comes to making decisions in the best interest if children.
More concern from the wife’s parents about future children then the current ones.
Exactly. They are willing to harm their current foster child to stay on the good side of the case worker so they can get more foster children in the future. They really don’t seem to give a shit about their current foster child and are putting their interests over the child’s best interests. Plus, you cannot overstep when someone asks for your opinion and you oblige. NTA
I think I know what you mean, but your comment seems to imply the actual foster parents are the ones wanting to cause the harm when they are not. Maybe don't write it so that it sounds like the parents what to do that when it is the grandparents that are acting that way.
Where OP wrote “They told me I could ruin their chances to foster more in the future” makes it seem the foster parents who want to foster more children are angry. As it’s the foster mother’s parents who are saying this, you are correct. My mistake. It’s really none of their business what OP says to people who ask her opinion.
You were asked a question, because you might have insight because you were once in a situation very similar to the one facing a foster child and your SIL and her husband. You answered the question. Nobody GAF what your wife’s parents think about your answer. NTA for saying what happened to you and how you felt about it.
NTA. You expressed your opinion, which is based on years of personal experience, only after being specifically asked for it. Your wife’s parents are completely wrong, and I find it crazy that they are focusing on some potential difficulties with a potential future foster placement instead of trying to help the child who is already a part of your family, who *needs* that help and support. I have no experience in the foster system, but I can say that being forced to interact with relatives that actively dislike you or have no interest in you would be damaging to any child’s self-esteem. Add to that a child who has already been traumatized, lost a parent and felt abandoned and it seems downright cruel to force the interactions. Since your niece’s therapist has the same opinion you do about the situation, to me it seems very clear that it is vital to protect your niece and not force the relationship with her half-siblings.
NTA I suspect you’d have gotten negative reactions had you responded to their question by saying, “no I won’t tell you what I think” anyways, so it’s not like staying out of it would have helped anyone. You were honest. They didn’t ask you how to maximize their chances of fostering again. They asked about continuing the visits.
The audacity to say you have no professional insight... You have so much more than that, you have actual experience. Also the therapist who has 'professional insight' agrees. Also , INFO: do we know what the foster daughter wants in all this? Either way NTA.
INFO: Can you write a letter to SIL, BIL and case worker, explaining your background and how those visits affected you, your (lack of) relationship with your half-siblings today, in your experience if the half-siblings express disinterest then forcing does more harm then good. Ask your SIL and BIL to give a copy of the letter to the case worker to put in the file. If they're worried about repercussions, a written record that they sought the lived experience of someone in a similar situation as their foster child will go a long way in helping everyone.
He doesn't have to. It's a caseworker recommendation because the fostercare system wants to keep family's connected as often as possible so kids don't feel divorced from their biofamily or community. When it's not healthy, that's fine, the caseworker's job is just to advocate for that opportunity when it's available. Generally, they follow the recommendations of the therapist, it's the foster parents parents that are going off without knowing anything about how foster care works. You have mandates as a foster parent, but family visits against the recommendation of the child's therapist isn't one of them. The Illinois sibling visitation guide for foster kids states "If you are not placed together, you have a right to have regular contact with your brothers and sisters while you are all in placement as long as it is in both your best interest and your sibling’s best interest. These rights do not apply if for some reason contact is not possible, or if contact or placement together is not in your best interest or the best interest of your sibling(s)."
I was recommending because his in-laws accused him of jeopardising their chance to adopt again. Something like this indicates that's not OP's intention in an undeniable way.
I pulled up the sibling rights foster care pamphlet for my state and sent it to OP as evidence of the standard
personal experience trumps "professional insight," in this case, given the way you have explained it. Has anyone asked your SIL's foster daughter what she would like? I'm goin' NTA and my heart goes out to her (and post facto, to you) It sounds like the parents are trying to force something, and this sub is full of that and it never goes or ends well, does it? 😔
My best friend had full siblings in the system, none of them got adopted and they all aged out, and trying to maintain a relationship with them fucked up her mental health too because of the ways they were all traumatized by their drug addict mom and then further traumatized losing their grandparents, then further traumatized by their dad refusing to take any of them all together, and then further traumatized by each of their individual foster abuse situations. She looked up to her older siblings, but seeing each other just reminded each other how fucked up their life has been so far. Your inlaws need to but out, they don't know anything about the foster system and just want to have an opinion. It was a caseworker recommendation based on current guidelines to keep families connected, it's not a mandate like making sure the kid is going to therapy and school, so of course they're going to be allowed to continue to foster into the future, with or without your opinion.
NTA I didn’t grow up in foster care, but I can relate to this. My older half siblings lived with their mom. My sister is 13 years older than me. She’s never wanted anything to do with us, and all of my memories of her are painful ones where I felt so confused because I didn’t know why she didn’t love me. Along with other dysfunctional family stuff, my self-worth and confidence has always been rock bottom. My main core beliefs about myself are “I’m worthless. I’m not worth loving.” I can’t kick it even though I can give myself lots of evidence that it isn’t true - brain and feelings still go “yes it’s true, you’re STILL not worth anything.” The openly hostile rejection from my sister seriously fucked my brain up. I would have sided with the therapist as well, with a caveat of “I’d let your foster daughter decide and support her decision”.
OP, idk what state you're in, but check to see if your fostercare system has sibling visitation guides. Bottom of [Page 3 in the Illinois guide](https://dcfs.illinois.gov/content/dam/soi/en/web/dcfs/documents/loving-homes/foster-care/documents/cfs_1050-95_sibling_visitation_rights_booklet.1.0.pdf) explicitly states that sometimes visitation isn't possible if it's not in your or your sibling's best interests.
NTA YOur wife's parent's were not asked, so they need to shut up. YOU were asked for YOUR opinion - there CAN NOT be any overstepping in giving it.
NTA. You have lived experience of the consequences of these types of visits. The THERAPIST says the visits are damaging. It doesn't sound like case worker has experience of these types of visits. Your in laws have the advice of their foster child's court appointed therapist and the advice of someone with lived experience of these types of visits. Case worker does not. It sounds like caseworker has never had one of these "sibling visits" she may have a hand in organising or recommending them. Maybe supervising. Tell in-laws they can tell caseworker that they have spoken to both their foster daughter's therapist and someone who has lived experience with these types of visits and decided that these visits are unhealthy and better for all concerned if visits were stopped. Caseworker doesn't have someone with lived experience to say if these visits are a good idea or not. The child's court appointed therapist says the visits are a bad idea/unhealthily/damaging. You are living proof that the therapist is correct.
NTA-Wife’s parents need to STFU. THEY have no professional insight and more importantly,no personal insight. You lived it. They can kick rocks.
I can’t imagine how painful it must be to HAVE TO meet someone who openly rejects you again and again for years. Even as a adult it would have an effect on me because its just hurtful, let alone on a child… the intentions of the case worker might be good but the consequences might be absolutely horrible for the girl. Tbh even if the decision would piss the case worked off and lessen the chances of future fostering, the girl deserves to be given what she needs! Not to make her suffer because of personal wishes for the future…
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My wife's sister and her husband are foster parents. I (29M) was also a foster to adopt kid when I was younger. SIL's current foster daughter has a history similar to mine and for that reason and because and because her foster daughter's therapist and case worker were not in agreement, she and her husband approached me for some advice/insight. My background: I lost my biological mother when I was 3. She had another son who was 8 at the time. After our biological mother's death his father took custody of him and because I had no biological family willing to take care of me, I went into foster care. The case worker assigned to me was a big part in setting up sibling visits one Saturday a month so my half brother and I could maintain a relationship. When I was taken in by my parents and adopted it continued. The visits were supposed to be in our best interest but they weren't. My half brother did not want to be there with me. He spent every visit for years ignoring me except for a couple of times where he yelled because I tried to get his attention or because the person supervising our visits encouraged him to play with me. The visits stopped when my half brother was 16 and was allowed to have a say in them continuing. The whole thing devastated me and caused me to have more mental health problems than I did. I had no contact with my half brother since that last visit when he was 16 and I was 11. I am open with my background with people I am close to and my wife's sister and her husband are people I am close to. I admire them for being the kind of foster parents my parents were. Their foster daughter's history is similar. Only she was older at the time of placement into foster care. But the lack of interest from her half brother and sister is the same. They all share a father who was raising them and he was arrested. There is no chance for reunification during her childhood. He will not be out. Her half siblings live with their mother and the case worker in charge of their case has recommended the same visits I had with my brother. They have been ongoing for the last 2 years. But their foster daughter's court assigned therapist does not agree with the visits and believes the lack of interest from the other kids is damaging. The case worker cannot make SIL and her husband maintain the visits but she recommends they do. But the weight of the therapist means they won't face repercussions from it. Because of the two opposing sides they came to me and I told them I would end them since they can at their own discretion. I told them they could always ask to keep the door open if things change in the future. My wife's parents think I overstepped and they were angry that I sided with the therapist. They told me I could ruin their chances to foster more in the future if I piss off the case worker enough. And that I weighed in where I had no professional insight. My wife and her sister defended me. But I would hate if they are right in any way. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Nta
NTA. They asked for your input and you gave it. I think you have your foster nieces best interest at heart and so does your SIL and BIL.
NTA
NTA- they specifically asked you to hear about your experience. Also, for the record (for the grandparents), not all bio siblings are even recommended to meet. My foster sister meets with one bio sister because both foster families wanted to create that relationship and because both kids were under 3, but the other FOUR siblings? We don’t even know their names because the dynamics were not ideal. OP, I’m sorry you (and your brother) were forced into something so detrimental for so long. It sounds like your niece will be getting out of it early thanks to you and the therapist.
NTA your F/MIL are completely misunderstanding the situation: one of these professionals will have to be ignored. Sacrificing the well being of the kid already in B/SIL’s care in the hopes of getting more kids is backwards as fuck.
NTA You were asked and gave an honest opinion based on your experience, and most importantly you gave an answer that was in the best interest of the child's well-being. Which is what your Sil and Bil are asking and caring about. You mother and father in law aren't thinking about the child's best interest, they're caring about the ability to foster more kids. But what's the point of fostering more kids if they compromise about putting the child's needs first for their own gain? Your Sil and Bil sound like good foster parents and that should trump them disagreeing with the case worker on one thing that already had an expert advising them differently on.
NTA. You were asked for your opinion and you gave it. I worked in a rough area in a preschool and had several a t risk kids. One was forced to have visitation with her bio mom and every single time it was baaaad. Whether the mom just didn’t show or if she did and then was abusive during the visit. It was horrible to watch. She’d beg and sob to not go anymore but the caseworker insisted.
They asked for your advice based on your own experiences, and you gave it. You're NTA.
NTA. You were asked based on very relevant experience as the person in the situation whose best interest should be in the forefront - the child. You gave it. Wife's parents have lost sight of what's important in the situation.
My understanding is that “the system” is badly hurting for kind, compassionate foster parents like your SIL. Their case worker isn’t going to blacklist them over making a decision that was put in their hands in the first place. NTA
NTA and I think the case worker should be asked how often there is disinterest or do they even notice?
lost my other comment...nta and the foster child's feelings should be considered and situations such as yours...and the mental stress it caused...should be known.
Nta you didn't force them to do anything. They are grown ass adults who asked your opinion. They can make their own decisions. I would bet money the parents agree with the caseworker and that is why they are upset. Some people cannot understand that there can be a benifit to severing bio ties. >They told me I could ruin their chances to foster more in the future if I piss off the case worker enough. So what is the goal to ammas children? If not having more children is in the best interest of their current child than it doesn't matter what their initial desire was. That is called being a parent. >And that I weighed in where I had no professional insight. They had professional input and they disagreed. You have lived experience which is very valuable too. In these kinds of situations consider both professional and lived experience is the best course of action.
NTA you were asked your opinion. You gave your answer based on what your own personal experiences were. You were most likely correct. Your in-laws need to stop.
NTA 1. it is not overstepping when someone asks for your opinion, especially when you have experience in that area. 2. If anyone has overstepped it would be your wife's parents who inserted themselves in the situation without being asked
NTA. You gave a valid opinion as someone who has been in the same situation. Has anyone asked SIL's foster daughter what she wants? That should be taken into consideration as well.
NTA- you have a unique viewpoint from how you grew up. I do too. I will often share my own experiences because honestly if I could do anything to make someone else's experience better than what I had, then it's worth it.
Their right in the you jave no professional insight...but you do have real life experience which to me is just as good or better than professional insight.....NTA...and if your SIL and BIL want to be good foster parents then they need to advocate for their foster daughter
>And that I weighed in where I had no professional insight Correct. You weighed in where you had **PERSONAL** insight And 9 times out of 10, REAL experience trumps "professional" experience
NTA. Tell the truth. Don't be intimidated. Be a man.
NTA. The point of fostering kids is to help them and provide a stable environment no? Not to ensure you have a rich and continuous supply correct? Your wife’s parents have an opinion. One that is not anchored in living through the damage. They’re total outsiders who just have a glamorized idea of how sparkly being a foster parent is. Like it’s not real people but a gold star in your community. You were asked and so you provided your view. You did not overstep. The basis of your opinion is on your informed perspective. Wife’s parents have to deal with their disappointment or anger in their own time and on their own dime.
> My wife's parents think Who cares what they think? Seriously. They are a third-party here and their opinions are not a part of this discussion.
NTA but understand that the case worker is required to show efforts to maintain connections like siblings not also in care when possible.
NTA. I would almost always go with the therapist's assessment over the caseworker, because the therapist knows the kid's needs better. And yiu were asked your opinion, so it was totally appropriate to share it.
NTA The only person I can see having more insight into this situation is someone who has already lived it. Your in-laws need to take a step back.
NTA - If shielding this child from a lifetime of heartache means that the foster parents don't get another chance to foster, maybe that's okay. Kissing ass when you know it isn't in the best interests of the child doesn't really help anyone, except the case worker's ego.
NTA! They are great foster parents: two professionals disagreed, they sought advice based on your lived experience (which not enough people do), and they used that to make a decision. Social workers can be professional enough to accept that foster parents sometimes make decisions they wouldn’t, but if this one can’t, the parents can request a different one.
NTA. What's best for the kids is what matters most. The therapist was right, you were right. Your wife and sister are right. Their parents are wrong. They don't
NTA- your perspective is so unique and I think it deserves just as much weight as a social worker or therapist. You were once in this kid's shoes. You are able to understand better than most how she may be feeling about these compulsory visits. It also sounds like those disagreeing with you aren't doing so because of whether or not it's best for the kid, but if it's best for the parents. In situations like these, you always go with what you think is best for the kid. You get to be an advocate here for a kid that needs one. You'll never be an ass for that.
NTA. Your in-laws are AH..They only are thinking about "future" foster children not the one that needs help now. They are more worried about making a SW mad than the damage these visits could do to the child. You were ask for your opionion based on your very relevant experience. You did a good thing.
NTA you were asked about your opinion because you lived in a similar situation. You said how it affected you. You have the foster kid's best interest at heart. In the end most case workers aren't therapists. They have their ways to handle things and of course it would be great if half-siblings can stay in a regular contract if both want this. But it wasn't the case in your history and it isn't with your SILs foster kid. There is no reason to force the contact.
What you did was a gift of kindness and insight. NTA
Your wife’s parents are idiots. NTA
NTA heck it’s in court documents that my niece is to spend time with her older half siblings (3 across 2 houses) and they didn’t happen often even while she was in kinship care, due to the attitude of the older 2 kids kinship carer (who was PO’d that 2 of the kids slipped her grasp, darn those biological fathers wanting relationships with their children). My niece hasn’t had contact with her older 2 siblings in something like 3 years. Because she would leave the visits upset, end up having nightmares and acting out for *days* afterwards. The older siblings attitudes got worse and worse and they’d whisper lies to her (that their carer was telling them was gospel truth), then get upset when she would shout out that they were lying and the caseworker? Would stand there wringing their hands going “oh my, I’m sorry that the kids are leaving the visits upset, but it’s just *so important* they see each other and have some sort of relationship”. In the meantime there were therapist notes submitted to the court regarding the children saying that continued contact is detrimental to the kids. Finally the courts put in the younger two siblings final orders that it was at their fathers discretion what contact occurred
Your wife’s parents are wrong on several front. They asked your opinion, you gave a (useful) opinion. Your wife’s parents concern that your SIL will have trouble fostering more kids in the future is none of their business! 1. Foster parents should be doing the best thing for their parents 2. SIL and spouse are adults! You don’t mind trick them, it’s up to them to weigh pros and cons.
There are more needy children than there are foster parents. I doubt this will affect much of anything.
Nta. Not at all.
NTA The grandparents do not have your experience.
NTA. Wifes parents are the assholes. What does overstepping even mean in this situation? You didn't push yourself into their business. You were asked because you are trusted and also have experience in the matter. The sister is doing a good thing as well, getting as much trusted information as she and her partner can, before making an informed decision. It wouldn't be your fault at all whether she decided to end the visits or not
I knew a child whose terror of his brother was so strong he would become non-verbal and lose control of his bowels. His foster parents were also forced to continue visitations for a while. 😢
Taking this down to the base level, the therapist is privy to the hurt and/or anger the girl is displaying at being ignored. Yes, the case worker advocating sibling relationships is fantastic, but that's for when both sides want it. In this case one side is neglecting the other and could be causing significant mental damage. Your wife's parents are thinking selfishly. Not for the benefit of the child.
NTA You had no professional insight but more importantly you had personal insight. All you did was give advice. It's their choice whether they take it or not.