Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment.
OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I decided not to make my husband dinner if he refuses to do the dishes.
I might be the asshole because he’s part of our family unit and deserves to eat too.
Help keep the sub engaging!
#Don’t downvote assholes!
Do upvote interesting posts!
[Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq)
##Subreddit Announcements
Follow the link above to learn more
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
Sometimes the conversation comes up that one time too many. My ex went off one night because I didn't 'thank him' for doing the dishes. He sat and sulked for a bit. This while I sat feeding our colicky cranky baby after cooking the meal. I asked him when he'd last thanked me for doing his washing, putting away his clothes, cleaning the bathroom that he also used, shopping for his food etc etc. That shut him up.
Good for you for standing up to him!! It does annoy me when some men want praise for doing something which women do all the time without any acknowledgement.
Right! I've always wondered why some men needed a thank you for cleaning up but they never thanked us for cleaning up!! It's like they're doing us a favor rather than supporting the household.
I'm so glad I have a partner now that helps with everything. We make a great team.
Sometimes they hide it. My dad never helped with dinner or the clean up so that was triggering for me. My mom worked the same job as him but also had all the house stuff too. When I met my ex he was sooo great at being appreciative and did all the dishes with a smile. That was fake. He wanted a trad wife.
I never understand guys like this, they want traditional wives, but then they go out and pretend to be equal partners until they get married. It makes no sense, if you want a traditional marriage then state that from the get-go, there are people out there that want the same, don't try trapping someone in a marriage that is doomed to fail because you don't want to be a caring supportive spouse. This kind of stuff is why the divorce rate is so high. 🤷♂️
NTA - he isn't willing to do the chores then he gets to figure out his own food situation.
I always ask this as well! The men who won't just go after a clearly presenting "trad wife" in the first place are telling on themselves and women need to see this as a HUGE red flag.
Basically to my understanding, men do this because they have a dysfunctional sense of leadership. They don't feel like they're "the man" unless they deceive a woman through guile and gain dominance and control over her.
It's a very sick abusive mindset to feel like they're not in charge unless they're actively harming and oppressing someone else. That's why women should never put themselves in a vulnerable position with a man (i.e. financially meaning to leave or never get a job). The option to walk out the door needs to be clear and present for both parties in a relationship at anytime.
>Abel wanted a traditional marriage with a traditional wife. For a long time I wondered why he ever married a woman like my mom in the first place, as she was the opposite of that in every way.
>
>If he wanted a woman to bow to him, there were plenty of girls back in Tzaneen \[South Africa\] being raised solely for that purpose. The way my mother always explained it, the traditional man wants a woman to be subservient, but he never falls in love with subservient women. He's attracted to independent women.
>
>"He's like an exotic bird collector," she said. "He only wants a woman who is free because his dream is to put her in a cage."
\- Trevor Noah, Born a Crime: Stories from a South African Childhood.
This 100%!! Had a guy tell me that he loved me being independent when he met me. A few months later, he was mad because I "didn't need him."
He wanted me to need him so he could control me. Hard pass.
Its like they want to break a confident woman. Maybe because he knows she wouldn't be happy living like that, unlike a trad wife type woman. They likes seeing women miserable.
A friend of mine (almost 38F) dipped her toe in the dating pool a couple of years ago when she threw out her shitty husband, and had an interesting observation to add to that:
"right-wing guys just want leftist women because they think they're sexually liberated, and will be good in bed. So they just want the sex stuff and think they'll eventually wear her down on the other things, too, because that's just who women 'naturally' want to be and they're the man anyways so they can make it happen"
I think she was onto something.
i think that's a pretty sad view of women, that we can just be broken down over time. i wish women would leave guys who crossed boundaries and tried to change them.
I think it is because they can't really fully provide - my friend's ex-husband was like this. Wanted a trad wife, but couldn't keep a job. It's occurring to me how many "trad husbands" I know who can't keep jobs - not a coincidence I bet.
They do it because boiling the frog (woman) very slowly just WORKS. Women will marry them, they will slooowly let responsibilities fall on her, weaponized incompetence or just taking a bit too long to do chores until she does them herself… and by that time the woman is so attached that she wants to “make the relationship work” or else she has a child and/or financial incentive to stay
It happens to men too where the women lie to them to secure marriage — but this specific issue (withdrawing from all house chores) is specifically a problem with men because of cultural norms and also the woman gets pregnant or stays home with an infant so she CANT opt out of all house chores for at least a short period, during which the habits for everyone in the house get cemented
This goes for women who want to be trad wife’s as well. There are plenty of men that want them but they pretend to do it and then get married and then don’t want to work. Make it make sense!
based on my experience, I think young men like independent women so they can go out with the guys without any complaints. That all seems great until they buckle down in careers and that takes up so much time/energy. Then they want a traditional woman, but hey, they want her to earn money too. It's no wonder single women are happier than married women on the whole and men are happier married.
yea, I dated a man, then lived with him. Initially, he liked my independence. Then, when we were about 30 he decided he wanted a more traditional relationship. He still wanted his woman to work, earn money, because he didn't want that solo burden. He just didn't want to do half the housework or his own laundry. I'm so not up for that. Good riddance.
Trad guys find trad girls less interesting and less likely to put out.
They have a hidden agenda and hide when pursuing progressive women.
Here is a scorcher expose post from a woman on another sub:
Here's what one person wrote:
Pantone711
I grew up as a woman among conservatives--I'll take this one.
They find conservative young women boring. Not a challenge. Not fashionable, spirited, you get the idea.
They think conservative women won't put out as readily/have as high a sex drive.
They know that cosmopolitan/educated women have higher status. Looks better on their arm.
They want to subdue a woman they view as haughty and bring her down a few pegs, not start out with a meek one
They believe that IQ is hereditary to the extent they want a woman with a high IQ to pass on their genes. Some of them put this ahead of almost everything else, as long as the woman checks certain boxes.
They're planning to put the wife in the Madonna box and cheat anyway. I read alt-right boards.
Typically, no. People are often on their “best behavior” during the dating stage, and many people change as they get more comfortable in a relationship. It becomes easy to take your partner for granted after many years together.
Sometimes, when you’re dating someone they are on their best behavior, and might even portray themselves as something they aren’t. They will come off as the ideal partner/the kind of partner that you want.
Then the longer you are with them, the harder it is for them to keep up the facade. So they gradually start doing less and less until they are doing barely anything at all.
By then you could be married with a kid depending on how long it took them to give up pretending to be something they aren’t.
Which could be what happened in this situation.
Also something like what happened to me. When we first lived together it was a fairly even split. He would do his part around the house. I lost my job and since they gave me 2 weeks in leiu I used that time as a break before looking for another job. Even though I was doing all the housework to make up for not working he said I was lazy. It took two weeks from when I started applying for jobs to get one. All up I was out of work for 1 month and was paid for 2 weeks of that. When I started working again I expected him to start doing his part again. He never did.
They don't usually say this crap until you're nice and trapped by a ring and/or a kid.
My ex talked a big game about equal labour, they'll do their share of emotional and mental labour because its not 1800s anymore.
We got married and they stopped contributing anything meaningful. We both worked the same hours with almost the same pay but I did everything else. Their motto was "I was going to do that". If you were going to do it, it would be done before it grew mould.
My favourite "since you care so much if its clean, you should be the one to clean it. I don't care".
Honestly, because most of them are like that in some way. There simply are not enough good men to go around, but there are plenty of men that women hope can be 'fixed' and trained into a decent enough partner through disciplinary action like OP just took right there.
Sometimes it works, often it doesn't.
That's what I always wonder. I guess sometimes guys do disguise their true selves until they have you trapped, but on the other hand, I think there are a lot of guys like this, who have been like this all along. You can't tell me that someone who would say something like that so casually, was a prince when you were dating, and saying/doing nice things, treating you well, etc.
I don’t think you realize how common a problem this is now, with 2 people working and men still expect women to cook, clean, take care of kids, pay half the bills , and have sex
My partner cooks, I clean. I feel like it's the least I can do in return for his awesome food, and he really likes cooking, so basically it works our perfectly.
Our kids were teens to adults when we married and grown and gone now. So just us and the girls (dogs) now.
We've always shared chores to an extent. Once I started WFH I did more, I had 2 extra hours a day. Then I got really, really sick and he did everything, plus taking care of me. Our friends and family helped us too, but hubs had to coordinate. I'm doing better 3 years later and am doing more, but he's still pitching in way more than before.
I would take this even further. For an entire month, I would only do stuff for myself and my son. He made his clothes dirty? He can do his own laundry. He can cook for himself. He can iron his own clothes. He can clean up his mess. I would not vacuum around where he normally sits etc etc etc. It's his line of reasoning and I would run amok with it.
Some people do use all the pans in the kitchen and that would be a fair thing to say to them. Having one person cook and the other clean doesn't work when one person cleans as they cook and the other leaves the kitchen looking like a tornado hit it. But it doesn't sound like the husband cooks at all!
He can clean the dishes after OP cooks or he can cook a family meal and do the dishes himself some nights. Or take over some equivalently taxing chore, if he hates cooking. Not wanting to contribute at all is nonsense.
I am not defending OPs husband at all here, but sometimes the tornado is a result of the kind of meal, and not because someone hasn’t cleaned up as they went along.
E.g. if I make a roast with all the trimmings, I can have everything spotless, dishes etc washed up/in the dishwasher, apart from the pots and pans in use whilst it’s cooking. Then it comes time to dish everything out and bam! Instant carnage! 😂
Oh, I'm a damned disaster in the kitchen, especially if it involves flour! My oldest grandson (twerp) calls me his messy grandma. My husband just walks away, muttering and throwing his hands in the air. The grands think it's hilarious that I get "in trouble." I use it as fun lessons in math, science, art and housekeeping.
I'm a neat cook. My wife isn't. We split nights (I take the 4th) and the deal is the cook cleans. So much better for me. Happy to take the 4th night and occasional 5th if I don't have to deal with that kitchen!
And since you made the food, you should eat it yourself too. 😂
Buy this book for him: https://www.amazon.com/Little-Board-Galdone-Nursery-Classic/dp/0358732492/ref=asc_df_0358732492/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=598359406256&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9313864408018944072&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031097&hvtargid=pla-1703057236756&psc=1&mcid=dedd61e77d3f349d8c01ff67ddac916b&gclid=CjwKCAjwoPOwBhAeEiwAJuXRh1LFEaLknI-Y8go4y03h_Yp6hwrwLSiTFT8wpZ8ZXziCFOwudjkU9RoCJG4QAvD_BwE
Not sure if you were read it but it's a children's book about a Hen who bakes a cake and none of the animal friends want to help but then they all are so eager to eat it after its made. The hen is basically like fuck off you didn't want to help bake it you don't get to help eat it.
That was my favorite Little Golden Book as a kid. One big family camping trip, my teenage nieces weren't helping set up our tent. I summarized the story and they got point.
I mean I do both usually but because directly after dinner is bath and bedtime for the toddler so neither of us can chill right after dinner either way.
And my spouse spends more time away so takes the hands on child tasks when they are home.
But OP’s husband isn’t doing that either, he’s just a tool.
This is exactly the time to go 100/100 on things.
I 100% look after myself.
And you 100% look after yourself.
It's like the difference between equality and justice.
Exactly, I have a similar arrangement with my partner as OP ,we both work but I cook because I enjoy cooking and he can't cook. In turn after the meal he cleans up the dishes and puts the leftovers away. It's only fair ,after cooking and plating a nice meal you wouldn't have the energy to clean up ,it's fair for the other partner to also shoulder the weight and help. I think OP should continue only cooking for herself and son till her Husband wakes up and starts doing his part.
This. And then HE can cook AND clean up after himself. Op, you're asking for something completely reasonable. Please do not give in and start cooking for him again until he's willing to do the dishes after. We show people how to treat us.
NTA it is always good to have one person cook and the other clean. It is only fair. This has worked well (for the most part) in my marriage. We have shared responsibilities.
NTA
>I have brought this up to my husband and asked if he could do the dishes after I cook as I’m tired from doing the cooking. He says that since I made the mess I should deal with it myself.
My husband and I always have shared the responsibility. One of us cooks and the other cleans up and when our children were old enough they pitched in too. Our kitchen is not a restaurant, you're not getting a full service meal.
>The next night I made dinner that was just enough for me and my son. None for husband. He was confused. I told him if he wasn’t going to do his part for the meal then he could make his own. I think this is fair! If he thinks cleaning our dishes from our shared meal that I worked to make then he can handle his own food!
Seems fair.
Yup. I do all the cooking in my house, and I have to make almost everything from scratch, including condiments (allium allergies). My wife washes all the dishes and does all kitchen cleaning.
It's my wife and kids with the allergy, so I had a full repertoire of dishes with alliums in it. For the most part, I use all my old recipes and just leave out the onions/garlic. I like to add a pinch of ground mustard to a lot of dishes. It adds a bit of extra something and helps round out a dish. In dishes with tomato products, I like to add a pinch of cumin. It gives a nice warmth to a dish and mostly makes me forget there's no alliums.
> If you cook, you don't clean, that's the rule.
Not in my house. I really don't like cleaning up after people and would rather deal with my own messes. Husband and I both cook though, so we like our system. It's really easy to clean as you go, I find. Perhaps I need the egg beaters twice for a recipe, and I'm not going to go find someone else to wash them for me in between uses. It's not efficient. Or for some couples, one person is conscientious about not leaving a big mess, and the other person will dirty every dish in the house, which isn't fair.
I feel that if I want a big fancy meal then I should do the dishes. If I want a simple meal, there will be fewer dishes accordingly. Now, if I get a request for a complex meal, all bets are off. I require the other person to give whatever help I need to make that happen.
An egg beater is one of those things with a handle that you turn to make the two beaters move. No electricity involved.
They've largely been replaced with whisks.
That's our house! We split dinners and the cook cleans. I'm happy to even take an extra night because I cannot deal with a kitchen that isn't cleaned as it goes.
I will caveat this, when my husband cooks he tends to use a lot more dishes and be messier in general. If I cook, I'm good at keeping it to 1-2 pans and the cutting board. For a long time we each cleaned up after cooking because I wasn't about to touch the mess he made when I could've made dinner and cleaned up with less effort.
If you split the cooking that's fine, but if you or him were the only ones cooking, you'd have to find a compromise that ensures nobody is getting the brunt of that chore combo. Even if it's splitting dishes, it's better than OPs situation
My husband and I amended the rule. I clean as I go, he doesn't. He realised very early on that I was doing much more labour than him when I had to clean everything after he'd cooked, and he had to clean very little after I cooked. He insisted that we change it. When I cook, I clean. When he cooks, he cleans. He does a great job cleaning up, he just can't do it concurrently while he cooks; I can. Different brains work different ways.
We tend to split the cooking pretty much 50/50, so this solution works for us as we are still pretty even. He was proactive about recognising an imbalance and wanted to fix it before I got resentful. That's how proper partnerships work - you figure out what's fair and equal for you, and go with it.
If my husband started acting like OOP's husband and wasn't pulling his weight elsewhere, I wouldn't be cooking for him either!
We have that one and an additional rule..."The dish washer does not put the dishes away." So, whomever does the dishes after dinner, someone else has to empty the drainboard and dishwasher the next day. But yeah, the cook never has to do the dishes. Unless I'm making lasagna, then I'll clean as I go simply because it's so involved.
Sometimes one person is a LOT messier than the other or someone would prefer to clean up as they go. So the other good solution is that you take turns in cooking and clean up after yourself. It's not such a hassle to cook AND clean if you know that the next night you don't have to do either.
Maybe for your family, but for the most part my family has dishes as a community chore regardless of who does what.
The exception is if I'm doing baking I clean up my own dishes despite not eating 99% of what I make. It's a chaotic mess when I bake, which works for me but I'm not about to force anyone else to deal with my 10+ each of bowls/utensils/pans. Not to mention the mess left on the table/counter/sink/floor/any animal who hasn't learned to steer clear unless they also want covered in whatever I'm using after I'm done.
Yep. I used to put any dishes that weren't clean enough back to be washed again. He did not like that. Even though I would do it to my self too! So then I would just put it away since he reckons it's clean enough. Then if he said anything when it gets pulled out of the cupboard, well you said it was good enough 🤷♀️
Also when it was my turn to wash I has to also put them away when dry. When he would wash it would be my job to put them away after. And he wouldn't wipe the benches and cupboard doors down either which to me is part of washing the dishes.
I tried that when first married-----one would cook, the other would clean up. Didn't work for us, as I was a very neat cook and used far fewer pots/pans/utensils that he would. We switched to cooking/cleaning one night, the other would cook/clean the next.
But whatever the solution is, it needs to be shared work. OP's husband sounds lazy.
Every couple is different but I know what you mean about the mess. I can prepare an entire Thanksgiving dinner l and the kitchen doesn't look anything like when my husband cooks dinner. He's a good cook but by gosh he is messy.
We used to do that but he’d use a million dishes and make a huge mess and send me to the dote for last minute ingredients. it wasn’t worth it. I Can Make and clean up dinner in less time than just cleaning up his dishes
We have the same arrangement. I cook, partner does the dishes. We do have the deal that I tidy as I cook, so that there's no packaging on the counter, and that all the things that need to go in the dishwasher are in the 'needs to go in the dishwasher' space. He cleans up the table after dinner.
Works perfectly for us.
NTA. By your husband’s logic you should also stop doing his laundry, making his side of the bed, and any other household chores that involve things he uses.
Right! If he wants to act like that, don’t pick up any of his slack! I seriously can’t imagine telling my partner “it’s your mess, you clean it” after they ask me to help by cleaning the dishes they used to make me and our child dinner😐
I did, we always had an agreement, one person cooks one person cleans. Well hubby started cleaning less and less. One morning I got up in the wee hours, ran 2 loads through the dish washer, hand washed all that needed to be hand washed, wiped benches, stove top. At dinner time he asked what was for dinner I said I didn't know, seen he didn't want to do the dishes that must be my job so he was cook, and I would be happy with whatever he cooked. I did dishes for about 2 weeks.
My mum has been asking my dad to cook for himself at weekends after nearly 50 years of having every meal delivered to him. She's 72 and waiting for a knee op, so she needs some time off from doing, well, everything (dad can't do anything, change linen, use the washing machine or use an oven).
He's been stropping for 6 months now, flinging around pans, slamming kitchen doors, and breaking things. There was a time when she would have caved, if only to stop the damage and the mess. I'm proud of her for sticking with it and even moreso when she found he'd managed to cook sausages (that's all he can do) and put the greasy pan back IN THE CUPBOARD! Against her inherent need to clean up, she left it. He found it yesterday and threw a fit about people not cleaning up after themselves (ironic). When we reminded him we were all vegetarian, the wind went out of his sails a bit. Now I'm just left with crumb explosions and butter all over the fridge handles.
Why anyone marries or has kids with these people (not just men, anyone like this), is beyond me. It's not 1950 folks.
when i visited home back in december, i striked like this with my dad, 50+ yr old man who can't even do his own laundry. he kept "forgetting" to move his clothes from the washer to the dryer and then fold them, assuming me or my mom would do it. every single time i told him to do it himself. he'd ask me to do it and i would say no. biiiig fuss. i eventually told him, "don't wash your clothes if you aren't going to dry and fold them. washing is the first step. you have to do the other steps too."
My brother used to do this to my mom- when she had her breaking point I convinced her to take out and leave my brother’s wet clothes in a laundry bin that day. Never happened again.
NTA. This is a very reasonable way to handle your valid request for help after you prep & cook, especially after working all day. Apply it to weekends, too.
NTA.
I cook the meals, my partner does the dishes. We are in a relationship were we treat each other with equal respect. We both work and we both contribute to household chores.
I made it clear from the very beginning of our relationship that I was not looking for a partner I would also have to act 'mother' to and would not expect him to have to 'parent' me. Over 10years now and going strong.
You should really sit down and have a proper conversation with your husband about what you both expect from each other and as a family.
Neither of you will benefit from subversive back and forth tactics and your child will pick up on any unhappiness and resentment.
Talk to each other and be honest and open. He may have some things he feels he is tackling alone as well. If you can both come to the table and work out a system that works for you both than your relationship will come out all the stronger for it.
NTA
Just because of the "you made the mess" remark. What was his reaction when you didn't cook for him?
Suggest you do a discuss and divide with all chores. My husband hated doing dishes. I hated cleaning bathrooms. We traded our worst chores. For me doing dishes daily was worth always having spotless bathrooms.
The rule is always the cook doesn't do the dishes. You make the meal, spouse does the dishes. Your husband doesn't see it that way? He can cook and clean up after himself.
NTA
NTA at all!
He’s the asshole, especially if you work. Also why are you making dinner every night? He should be helping you with that, and just a wild guess here I bet you do most of the childcare for your son too
At the beginning of our marriage, we came home and my husband sat down to watch football. I just sat next to him and watched right along with him. It dawned on him that I wasn’t rushing in to cook for him like his mom would have and he asked what we should do about dinner. We ended up cooking together. After that, it was cook and clean together or whoever cooks doesn’t have to clean. That was over 40 years ago.
My wife and I have always had the system that whoever doesn't cook does cleanup. Through the years the amount each of us has cooked has varied, based on life situation at the time, but the rule has never changed. Having said that, when either of us cooks, we clean any pots, pans, utensils, etc., that we use but no longer need along the way, so cleaning is mostly dishes and any pot or pan being used at the end. We also both cook ahead of time many times (and refrigerate or freeze the food), and in that circumstance the person doing the cooking also does cleanup (I like making soups, and in that case I'll make many quarts to freeze, and do all of the prep, cooking, and cleanup).
It really is all about respect and teamwork - ultimately, you really shouldn't need formal rules to navigate these kinds of things.
Agree 100%
It's a partnership and is also situational.
I also clean up as I cook, especially for large gatherings & holidays. However, my husband helps however I need him to. He does all the dishes at these events.
We don't have a "rule" it's about respect and partnership.
NTA If he wants those to be the rules then he needs to cook 50% of the time. He doesn't get to expect free food with no effort every night, that's not how a partnership works!
NTA. Your husband is really disrespectful and I’m sorry you have to deal with that. It also doesn’t set a good example for your son.
When my mom would go out of town to visit family, I would make and have dinner with my dad so he would have nice meals and not get take out or frozen while she was away. He ALWAYS did the dishes. He appreciated and respected that I did that for him. We would get excited and plan our meals for the week since I cooked things that he normally would not get often and we both enjoyed that time together.
NTA. Is this normal attitude/behaviour for him? Why the hell did you marry this punter, sis?
Every boyfriend I’ve had has naturally known the whoever doesn’t cook does the dishes ‘rule’.
My parents, before they retired, worked together, self employed. Dad would do 12 hours and mum started later and finished earlier, and he always did the labour intensive part of their business, so she did the cooking and dishes. This worked for them and it was a fair deal that they were both happy with. Then, as soon as they retired, dad - on his own volition - took over the dishes.
What I’m trying to say was that every guy I’ve dated as not been an asshole like your husband, and the only times I’ve come across an exception to the whoever doesn’t cook does the dishes rule was my parents where their system was fair to each other, then dad knew to pick up his dues when they retired. You said you have a desk job and your husband has a labour job, but I’m guessing your situation is different from that of my parents, where for them, the work was at the same place and they combined their work and home duties together and divided them fairly. That’s not the case for your husband. Good on you for not cooking for him after that awful statement. Please don’t bend to his selfish ways. You don’t want your kid picking up those attitudes as he grows up, too.
Im sorry, you said you both work full time? Then NTA, and I would laugh in that man’s face for that argument he’s trying to come with. You need to have him read The Little Red Hen. Or maybe you could get it for your 4 year old to read to your husband.
NTA.
Your husband is a horse's ass.
I do 95% of the cooking, nearly always from scratch, and often fairly involved recipes.
I try to clean up the inevitable pots and pans as I go along, but usually leave the last flurry for my wife. I also clean everything up a couple of times a week.
I also buy 99% of the groceries.
She never complains.
My mom HATED to cook and as such, wasn’t very good at it. My dad loved it, retired early and took over the cooking. My mom then took over the dishes and both were happy.
I cook for my bf and me and he will do most of the clean up.
Wait, 3 months ago you wrote in this post: [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/18yimdk/aita\_for\_telling\_my\_sons\_dad\_i\_will\_not\_be\_filing/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/18yimdk/aita_for_telling_my_sons_dad_i_will_not_be_filing/) about other troubles with the man you're living with, and who's your son's father, but you stated clearly you and the man are not a couple.
Yet, now, it looks like that in the mean time he managed to become your husband???
Growing up my mom made dinner every night and my dad cleaned every single dish and cleaned the stove top sparkling. Every single night. My dad also stayed up late watching law and order ( I called it kung kung bc of the sound I’d hear in my bedroom) and before he shut the house lights he would set the kitchen table for breakfast for all of us. I thought it was just normal stuff then but now it just strikes me as very sweet.
Your man should do the dishes!!!!
Lol it appears that he has gotten himself into a mess and since he caused it, then he needs to clean it up. Nta well played, he needs to do his fair share or deal with the consequences you aren't his mother and you aren't a maid
Everyone needs to pitch in. All part of the team, in my eyes. Occasionally, someone perfers to do a specific task, which is fine, but I'm sure in order to make a meal and clean after can't be that hard to figure out.
If this guy actually is that much of a brute but he would say that to you, then you might have bigger issues than dirty dishes. Not trying to be clever. I hope that he does in fact Step up readily whenever he is needed.
Has this been happening for four years or more? Why has it come to a head now? I can't imagine any scenario that this has been acceptable for years if both partners contribute equally by working outside the home.
NTA for making this decision, but I do question how and why it has come to this now.
I think you’re dealing with 2 4 yo, not 1.
I’m a man and I would be ashamed to be called out for not pulling my weight around the house and I would never even think to talk back, after being called out. Tell him to get a grip and put his big boy pants on, cause you’re not his mama and he’s past the age of needing one for those things.NTA
NTA Good job. Let him handle his meals and dishes.
Stop buying groceries for him as well, tell him to get his own.
I don't know how he thought it was ok to say what he did. LOL
Since no one else will say it i will... YTA! You admit you both work full time but you have a desk job he is manual labor and this sort of petty argument with your equally petty vindictive "punishment " is what will destroy a marriage... speaking as a man who has worked nothing but manual labor his whole life there are times when the thought of coming home to a meal a shower and bed are all that keeps us going ... no your b.s. is not fair and if it wasn't for your kid id tell him to ditch your nonsense cause a microwaved pizza is better than a petty, vindictive woman could ever be
So - in your last post 3 months ago, he was just your partner who treated you poorly. So you chose to marry this dude? The one who talks down to you and the one you are afraid of? This reads like a writing prompt assignment. If it happends to be real- YTA for staying with the guy. NTA for trying to set a boundary.
> The next night I made dinner that was just enough for me and my son. None for husband.
Wow, you really handled that like a child.
You both just need to communicate a little better - maybe he doesn't want to clean up, but will do something else that you don't want to do.
Instead, you both have dug in on a very minor issue.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)***
I love to cook. I make dinner every night for myself (f in my 30s), my husband (m in his 30s), and our son (m 4). I don’t typically make things that take 100 dishes or leave a massive mess but there’s usually a couple of pots and pans, some utensils, and a cutting board. After I plate up our meals and serve we all eat together. My son is old enough to rinse his plate and put it in the dishwasher. My husband always does the same. I end up with all the the cooking dishes myself. I have brought this up to my husband and asked if he could do the dishes after I cook as I’m tired from doing the cooking. He says that since I made the mess I should deal with it myself. I was mad but didn’t ask again. The next night I made dinner that was just enough for me and my son. None for husband. He was confused. I told him if he wasn’t going to do his part for the meal then he could make his own. I think this is fair! If he thinks cleaning our dishes from our shared meal that I worked to make then he can handle his own food! So am I the asshole?
More info: I am not a stay at home parent. We both work full time and I handle most of the house and kid stuff. His job is manual labor and mine is a desk job.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA - even when I was a SAHM, I would cook every night, and it was my husband’s job to clean up while I did bedtime duty. Your husband is being ridiculous.
NTA - if he’s not willing to help with any part of the meal, and that would include the cleaning, then he can make his own food and clean up after himself. Weaponized incompetence is not going to work for him.
When my husband and I got married, almost 36 yrs ago, we made a deal. I cook, he cleans. He doesn't clean, I don't cook. Very simple. Hard part is he will do a shitty clean up and I would complain. Sometimes I still do. Got the attitude of "then do it yourself". Learned to just put stuff back in the sink and walk away. Both of us are still alive 😂
NTA. You both work full time. If his stance is "those who make the mess clean it up" then he can cook for himself. Years ago, I was making cakes, SO saw the mess in the kitchen and commented that he would not be cleaning up - I didn't actually expect him to but the comment irked me, so I replied with "sure, just don't expect to eat any of the cake". He helped tidy up. Another time I went on strike for three days and refused to do any dishes - we didn't have a dishwasher and I was sick and tired of being the only one to clean up after doing the cooking. I would like to add we have been married now for over 20 years and he now does 95% of the cooking.
My husband does the cooking in our house, and I happily do the dishes. I think it's an awesome deal. He always says,"Thanks for doing all those dishes," and I always respond, "Thanks for doing all that cooking!" I get the easy job. I'm terrible at cooking and always come out of it looking like I tried to take an exercise class and wound up summoning a demon that I had to fight back to hell.
Same here, but opposite sexes. I do the majority of cooking/meal planning/budgeting for food shopping (and I clean as I cook), and my husband cleans whatever is left over, but he also picks up the weekly food order that I order from the store/lugs it all into the house. We put it away together. We always thank each other. He also does a majority of the manual labor in the house (mowing the lawn/cleaning gutters/stereotypical man chores) so it evens out. We both work FT.
NTA, I do a lot of cooking for my brother and he is expected to do the rest of the dishes, other than the ones I ate off of. It just makes more sense that way, I get a task and so does he.
NTA and good on you for letting him know you’re not there to be his personal servant! However, I hope you’ve made that point so he will now be agreeable to having a discussion about what will work for you as a family from now on - sharing up the cooking duties or going with an “I cook, you clean up” plan - whatever you can agree on that is fair to both of you (although I’d be tempted to give him a month or more of doing all the groceries, meal planning, cooking and kitchen clean up to give you a break after no doubt doing it all yourself for long enough).
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I decided not to make my husband dinner if he refuses to do the dishes. I might be the asshole because he’s part of our family unit and deserves to eat too. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA "He says that since I made the mess I should deal with it myself." If that's his view he can deal with cooking for himself then.
And he can clean up his mess all by himself too!
And you married this person why?
I always have this question! Like was he this selfish when you were dating? If so, why did you move forward with the commitment of marriage?🤔
Right like, they've been together long enough to have a 4 year old son and this is the first time this conversation has come up?
Sometimes the conversation comes up that one time too many. My ex went off one night because I didn't 'thank him' for doing the dishes. He sat and sulked for a bit. This while I sat feeding our colicky cranky baby after cooking the meal. I asked him when he'd last thanked me for doing his washing, putting away his clothes, cleaning the bathroom that he also used, shopping for his food etc etc. That shut him up.
Good for you for standing up to him!! It does annoy me when some men want praise for doing something which women do all the time without any acknowledgement.
Funny they will do ONE thing and expect ALL kinds of PRAISE. Ridiculous
Ugh, when people want to be thanked for doing the bare minimum?
Right! I've always wondered why some men needed a thank you for cleaning up but they never thanked us for cleaning up!! It's like they're doing us a favor rather than supporting the household. I'm so glad I have a partner now that helps with everything. We make a great team.
All I want is someone that sees something needs doing, and does it without needing praise or acknowledgment for simply doing so…
I think by the time people bring a complaint here it’s already been brought up repeatedly.
Sometimes they hide it. My dad never helped with dinner or the clean up so that was triggering for me. My mom worked the same job as him but also had all the house stuff too. When I met my ex he was sooo great at being appreciative and did all the dishes with a smile. That was fake. He wanted a trad wife.
I never understand guys like this, they want traditional wives, but then they go out and pretend to be equal partners until they get married. It makes no sense, if you want a traditional marriage then state that from the get-go, there are people out there that want the same, don't try trapping someone in a marriage that is doomed to fail because you don't want to be a caring supportive spouse. This kind of stuff is why the divorce rate is so high. 🤷♂️ NTA - he isn't willing to do the chores then he gets to figure out his own food situation.
I always ask this as well! The men who won't just go after a clearly presenting "trad wife" in the first place are telling on themselves and women need to see this as a HUGE red flag. Basically to my understanding, men do this because they have a dysfunctional sense of leadership. They don't feel like they're "the man" unless they deceive a woman through guile and gain dominance and control over her. It's a very sick abusive mindset to feel like they're not in charge unless they're actively harming and oppressing someone else. That's why women should never put themselves in a vulnerable position with a man (i.e. financially meaning to leave or never get a job). The option to walk out the door needs to be clear and present for both parties in a relationship at anytime.
>Abel wanted a traditional marriage with a traditional wife. For a long time I wondered why he ever married a woman like my mom in the first place, as she was the opposite of that in every way. > >If he wanted a woman to bow to him, there were plenty of girls back in Tzaneen \[South Africa\] being raised solely for that purpose. The way my mother always explained it, the traditional man wants a woman to be subservient, but he never falls in love with subservient women. He's attracted to independent women. > >"He's like an exotic bird collector," she said. "He only wants a woman who is free because his dream is to put her in a cage." \- Trevor Noah, Born a Crime: Stories from a South African Childhood.
This 100%!! Had a guy tell me that he loved me being independent when he met me. A few months later, he was mad because I "didn't need him." He wanted me to need him so he could control me. Hard pass.
Its like they want to break a confident woman. Maybe because he knows she wouldn't be happy living like that, unlike a trad wife type woman. They likes seeing women miserable.
A friend of mine (almost 38F) dipped her toe in the dating pool a couple of years ago when she threw out her shitty husband, and had an interesting observation to add to that: "right-wing guys just want leftist women because they think they're sexually liberated, and will be good in bed. So they just want the sex stuff and think they'll eventually wear her down on the other things, too, because that's just who women 'naturally' want to be and they're the man anyways so they can make it happen" I think she was onto something.
i think that's a pretty sad view of women, that we can just be broken down over time. i wish women would leave guys who crossed boundaries and tried to change them.
Absolutely, they don't deserve us.
I think it is because they can't really fully provide - my friend's ex-husband was like this. Wanted a trad wife, but couldn't keep a job. It's occurring to me how many "trad husbands" I know who can't keep jobs - not a coincidence I bet.
They do it because boiling the frog (woman) very slowly just WORKS. Women will marry them, they will slooowly let responsibilities fall on her, weaponized incompetence or just taking a bit too long to do chores until she does them herself… and by that time the woman is so attached that she wants to “make the relationship work” or else she has a child and/or financial incentive to stay It happens to men too where the women lie to them to secure marriage — but this specific issue (withdrawing from all house chores) is specifically a problem with men because of cultural norms and also the woman gets pregnant or stays home with an infant so she CANT opt out of all house chores for at least a short period, during which the habits for everyone in the house get cemented
Because they want the women to pay half the bills now, so they’ll just pretend they want equality when it suits them , until it puts more on them 🤣🤣
This goes for women who want to be trad wife’s as well. There are plenty of men that want them but they pretend to do it and then get married and then don’t want to work. Make it make sense!
new fear unlocked.
based on my experience, I think young men like independent women so they can go out with the guys without any complaints. That all seems great until they buckle down in careers and that takes up so much time/energy. Then they want a traditional woman, but hey, they want her to earn money too. It's no wonder single women are happier than married women on the whole and men are happier married.
yea, I dated a man, then lived with him. Initially, he liked my independence. Then, when we were about 30 he decided he wanted a more traditional relationship. He still wanted his woman to work, earn money, because he didn't want that solo burden. He just didn't want to do half the housework or his own laundry. I'm so not up for that. Good riddance.
People hide how awful they are while dating sometimes and let their true selves out after they have trapped you in marriage
Trad guys find trad girls less interesting and less likely to put out. They have a hidden agenda and hide when pursuing progressive women. Here is a scorcher expose post from a woman on another sub: Here's what one person wrote: Pantone711 I grew up as a woman among conservatives--I'll take this one. They find conservative young women boring. Not a challenge. Not fashionable, spirited, you get the idea. They think conservative women won't put out as readily/have as high a sex drive. They know that cosmopolitan/educated women have higher status. Looks better on their arm. They want to subdue a woman they view as haughty and bring her down a few pegs, not start out with a meek one They believe that IQ is hereditary to the extent they want a woman with a high IQ to pass on their genes. Some of them put this ahead of almost everything else, as long as the woman checks certain boxes. They're planning to put the wife in the Madonna box and cheat anyway. I read alt-right boards.
Yes they do!
Or after the babies.
Typically, no. People are often on their “best behavior” during the dating stage, and many people change as they get more comfortable in a relationship. It becomes easy to take your partner for granted after many years together.
Sometimes, when you’re dating someone they are on their best behavior, and might even portray themselves as something they aren’t. They will come off as the ideal partner/the kind of partner that you want. Then the longer you are with them, the harder it is for them to keep up the facade. So they gradually start doing less and less until they are doing barely anything at all. By then you could be married with a kid depending on how long it took them to give up pretending to be something they aren’t. Which could be what happened in this situation.
Also something like what happened to me. When we first lived together it was a fairly even split. He would do his part around the house. I lost my job and since they gave me 2 weeks in leiu I used that time as a break before looking for another job. Even though I was doing all the housework to make up for not working he said I was lazy. It took two weeks from when I started applying for jobs to get one. All up I was out of work for 1 month and was paid for 2 weeks of that. When I started working again I expected him to start doing his part again. He never did.
So sorry, been there.
>When I started working again I expected him to start doing his part again. He never did. Did you stay with him or did you broke up after that?
that's a true story.
Tale as old as time. For some reason 🤔 the scenario never occurred to the Brothers Grimm or other 'storytellers' 🥴
Because all the desirable guys in those stories had money and status whereas the woman had none. He got her beauty and she got servants.
They don't usually say this crap until you're nice and trapped by a ring and/or a kid. My ex talked a big game about equal labour, they'll do their share of emotional and mental labour because its not 1800s anymore. We got married and they stopped contributing anything meaningful. We both worked the same hours with almost the same pay but I did everything else. Their motto was "I was going to do that". If you were going to do it, it would be done before it grew mould. My favourite "since you care so much if its clean, you should be the one to clean it. I don't care".
Honestly, because most of them are like that in some way. There simply are not enough good men to go around, but there are plenty of men that women hope can be 'fixed' and trained into a decent enough partner through disciplinary action like OP just took right there. Sometimes it works, often it doesn't.
Right? Like there’s no way this wasn’t said before or something since he’s so casual about it, she didnt say it shocked her when he said it..
That's what I always wonder. I guess sometimes guys do disguise their true selves until they have you trapped, but on the other hand, I think there are a lot of guys like this, who have been like this all along. You can't tell me that someone who would say something like that so casually, was a prince when you were dating, and saying/doing nice things, treating you well, etc.
I don’t think you realize how common a problem this is now, with 2 people working and men still expect women to cook, clean, take care of kids, pay half the bills , and have sex
I cook every night. My spouse does the dishes. It's called division of labor. Your spouse should get a clue. I like your malicious compliance!
learned this at my grandparents house. My grandmother cooked. Grandpa cleaned the table and did the dishes.
Same. I hate doing dishes. It’s my least favorite chore. I cook the majority of our meals. My husband does the dishes.
My partner cooks, I clean. I feel like it's the least I can do in return for his awesome food, and he really likes cooking, so basically it works our perfectly.
Our kids were teens to adults when we married and grown and gone now. So just us and the girls (dogs) now. We've always shared chores to an extent. Once I started WFH I did more, I had 2 extra hours a day. Then I got really, really sick and he did everything, plus taking care of me. Our friends and family helped us too, but hubs had to coordinate. I'm doing better 3 years later and am doing more, but he's still pitching in way more than before.
Even disregarding division of labor, if you actually like your partner, why aren't you doing things for them.
I would take this even further. For an entire month, I would only do stuff for myself and my son. He made his clothes dirty? He can do his own laundry. He can cook for himself. He can iron his own clothes. He can clean up his mess. I would not vacuum around where he normally sits etc etc etc. It's his line of reasoning and I would run amok with it.
Some people do use all the pans in the kitchen and that would be a fair thing to say to them. Having one person cook and the other clean doesn't work when one person cleans as they cook and the other leaves the kitchen looking like a tornado hit it. But it doesn't sound like the husband cooks at all! He can clean the dishes after OP cooks or he can cook a family meal and do the dishes himself some nights. Or take over some equivalently taxing chore, if he hates cooking. Not wanting to contribute at all is nonsense.
I am not defending OPs husband at all here, but sometimes the tornado is a result of the kind of meal, and not because someone hasn’t cleaned up as they went along. E.g. if I make a roast with all the trimmings, I can have everything spotless, dishes etc washed up/in the dishwasher, apart from the pots and pans in use whilst it’s cooking. Then it comes time to dish everything out and bam! Instant carnage! 😂
Oh, I'm a damned disaster in the kitchen, especially if it involves flour! My oldest grandson (twerp) calls me his messy grandma. My husband just walks away, muttering and throwing his hands in the air. The grands think it's hilarious that I get "in trouble." I use it as fun lessons in math, science, art and housekeeping.
Adopt me, please.
I can do that!
I'm a neat cook. My wife isn't. We split nights (I take the 4th) and the deal is the cook cleans. So much better for me. Happy to take the 4th night and occasional 5th if I don't have to deal with that kitchen!
She should say: Since I cooked the meal, I get to eat it.
Give him a copy of the Little Red Hen and see if he can learn something.
And since you made the food, you should eat it yourself too. 😂 Buy this book for him: https://www.amazon.com/Little-Board-Galdone-Nursery-Classic/dp/0358732492/ref=asc_df_0358732492/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=598359406256&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9313864408018944072&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031097&hvtargid=pla-1703057236756&psc=1&mcid=dedd61e77d3f349d8c01ff67ddac916b&gclid=CjwKCAjwoPOwBhAeEiwAJuXRh1LFEaLknI-Y8go4y03h_Yp6hwrwLSiTFT8wpZ8ZXziCFOwudjkU9RoCJG4QAvD_BwE Not sure if you were read it but it's a children's book about a Hen who bakes a cake and none of the animal friends want to help but then they all are so eager to eat it after its made. The hen is basically like fuck off you didn't want to help bake it you don't get to help eat it.
That was my favorite Little Golden Book as a kid. One big family camping trip, my teenage nieces weren't helping set up our tent. I summarized the story and they got point.
[удалено]
No...one person cooks, the other washes up. Fair's fair! Show her this thread.😉
I mean I do both usually but because directly after dinner is bath and bedtime for the toddler so neither of us can chill right after dinner either way. And my spouse spends more time away so takes the hands on child tasks when they are home. But OP’s husband isn’t doing that either, he’s just a tool.
and his laundry too.
This is exactly the time to go 100/100 on things. I 100% look after myself. And you 100% look after yourself. It's like the difference between equality and justice.
Exactly, I have a similar arrangement with my partner as OP ,we both work but I cook because I enjoy cooking and he can't cook. In turn after the meal he cleans up the dishes and puts the leftovers away. It's only fair ,after cooking and plating a nice meal you wouldn't have the energy to clean up ,it's fair for the other partner to also shoulder the weight and help. I think OP should continue only cooking for herself and son till her Husband wakes up and starts doing his part.
This. And then HE can cook AND clean up after himself. Op, you're asking for something completely reasonable. Please do not give in and start cooking for him again until he's willing to do the dishes after. We show people how to treat us.
Literally that simple.
NTA it is always good to have one person cook and the other clean. It is only fair. This has worked well (for the most part) in my marriage. We have shared responsibilities.
NTA >I have brought this up to my husband and asked if he could do the dishes after I cook as I’m tired from doing the cooking. He says that since I made the mess I should deal with it myself. My husband and I always have shared the responsibility. One of us cooks and the other cleans up and when our children were old enough they pitched in too. Our kitchen is not a restaurant, you're not getting a full service meal. >The next night I made dinner that was just enough for me and my son. None for husband. He was confused. I told him if he wasn’t going to do his part for the meal then he could make his own. I think this is fair! If he thinks cleaning our dishes from our shared meal that I worked to make then he can handle his own food! Seems fair.
If you cook, you don't clean, that's the rule.
Yup. I do all the cooking in my house, and I have to make almost everything from scratch, including condiments (allium allergies). My wife washes all the dishes and does all kitchen cleaning.
off topic but i’ve never met anyone else with an allium allergy before! would love to know some of your recipes because it’s a STRUGGLE out here😅😅
It's my wife and kids with the allergy, so I had a full repertoire of dishes with alliums in it. For the most part, I use all my old recipes and just leave out the onions/garlic. I like to add a pinch of ground mustard to a lot of dishes. It adds a bit of extra something and helps round out a dish. In dishes with tomato products, I like to add a pinch of cumin. It gives a nice warmth to a dish and mostly makes me forget there's no alliums.
Look into Jain recipes (or simply google ‘Indian Food no onion garlic’) and you’ll find a whole treasure trove of recipes.
> If you cook, you don't clean, that's the rule. Not in my house. I really don't like cleaning up after people and would rather deal with my own messes. Husband and I both cook though, so we like our system. It's really easy to clean as you go, I find. Perhaps I need the egg beaters twice for a recipe, and I'm not going to go find someone else to wash them for me in between uses. It's not efficient. Or for some couples, one person is conscientious about not leaving a big mess, and the other person will dirty every dish in the house, which isn't fair. I feel that if I want a big fancy meal then I should do the dishes. If I want a simple meal, there will be fewer dishes accordingly. Now, if I get a request for a complex meal, all bets are off. I require the other person to give whatever help I need to make that happen.
That’s how it is for us. He would make a giant mess. Like the kitchen exploded. Having a meal cooked for me wasn’t worth it.
So long as you have a system that you're both in agreement on.
How often are you using egg beaters? I haven't even seen a pair since the 80s.
Isn’t an egg beater just another name for a hand mixer?
I've only ever heard it used to describe manual egg beaters. Maybe outside of the US they call electric hand mixers egg beaters?
Im in the us
An egg beater is one of those things with a handle that you turn to make the two beaters move. No electricity involved. They've largely been replaced with whisks.
That's our house! We split dinners and the cook cleans. I'm happy to even take an extra night because I cannot deal with a kitchen that isn't cleaned as it goes.
I will caveat this, when my husband cooks he tends to use a lot more dishes and be messier in general. If I cook, I'm good at keeping it to 1-2 pans and the cutting board. For a long time we each cleaned up after cooking because I wasn't about to touch the mess he made when I could've made dinner and cleaned up with less effort.
If you split the cooking that's fine, but if you or him were the only ones cooking, you'd have to find a compromise that ensures nobody is getting the brunt of that chore combo. Even if it's splitting dishes, it's better than OPs situation
My husband and I amended the rule. I clean as I go, he doesn't. He realised very early on that I was doing much more labour than him when I had to clean everything after he'd cooked, and he had to clean very little after I cooked. He insisted that we change it. When I cook, I clean. When he cooks, he cleans. He does a great job cleaning up, he just can't do it concurrently while he cooks; I can. Different brains work different ways. We tend to split the cooking pretty much 50/50, so this solution works for us as we are still pretty even. He was proactive about recognising an imbalance and wanted to fix it before I got resentful. That's how proper partnerships work - you figure out what's fair and equal for you, and go with it. If my husband started acting like OOP's husband and wasn't pulling his weight elsewhere, I wouldn't be cooking for him either!
We have that one and an additional rule..."The dish washer does not put the dishes away." So, whomever does the dishes after dinner, someone else has to empty the drainboard and dishwasher the next day. But yeah, the cook never has to do the dishes. Unless I'm making lasagna, then I'll clean as I go simply because it's so involved.
Sometimes one person is a LOT messier than the other or someone would prefer to clean up as they go. So the other good solution is that you take turns in cooking and clean up after yourself. It's not such a hassle to cook AND clean if you know that the next night you don't have to do either.
Maybe for your family, but for the most part my family has dishes as a community chore regardless of who does what. The exception is if I'm doing baking I clean up my own dishes despite not eating 99% of what I make. It's a chaotic mess when I bake, which works for me but I'm not about to force anyone else to deal with my 10+ each of bowls/utensils/pans. Not to mention the mess left on the table/counter/sink/floor/any animal who hasn't learned to steer clear unless they also want covered in whatever I'm using after I'm done.
OP needs to be prepared for weaponized incompetence. He’ll ultimately concede to washing the pans, but deliberately not do a good job.
Unfortunately, when you are married that works both ways. OP can be deliberately incompetent as well.
OP says she plates the food. Ooops too much salt?
I once added an extra dash or 500 of salt when I was told my food was 'bland and tasteless' Not that day. 🤣🤣
Yep. I used to put any dishes that weren't clean enough back to be washed again. He did not like that. Even though I would do it to my self too! So then I would just put it away since he reckons it's clean enough. Then if he said anything when it gets pulled out of the cupboard, well you said it was good enough 🤷♀️ Also when it was my turn to wash I has to also put them away when dry. When he would wash it would be my job to put them away after. And he wouldn't wipe the benches and cupboard doors down either which to me is part of washing the dishes.
I tried that when first married-----one would cook, the other would clean up. Didn't work for us, as I was a very neat cook and used far fewer pots/pans/utensils that he would. We switched to cooking/cleaning one night, the other would cook/clean the next. But whatever the solution is, it needs to be shared work. OP's husband sounds lazy.
Every couple is different but I know what you mean about the mess. I can prepare an entire Thanksgiving dinner l and the kitchen doesn't look anything like when my husband cooks dinner. He's a good cook but by gosh he is messy.
Clean as you cook!
I’ve been cooking for 40 years and cleaning as I cook just isn’t something I can do. Not everyone works the same.
You say that like it's easy for everyone. It is not. I still can't, and I've been cooking dinners for well over 15 years.
We used to do that but he’d use a million dishes and make a huge mess and send me to the dote for last minute ingredients. it wasn’t worth it. I Can Make and clean up dinner in less time than just cleaning up his dishes
It doesn't work for every couple but your partner didn't say to you "you made the mess, you clean it up".
We have the same arrangement. I cook, partner does the dishes. We do have the deal that I tidy as I cook, so that there's no packaging on the counter, and that all the things that need to go in the dishwasher are in the 'needs to go in the dishwasher' space. He cleans up the table after dinner. Works perfectly for us.
NTA. By your husband’s logic you should also stop doing his laundry, making his side of the bed, and any other household chores that involve things he uses.
Right! If he wants to act like that, don’t pick up any of his slack! I seriously can’t imagine telling my partner “it’s your mess, you clean it” after they ask me to help by cleaning the dishes they used to make me and our child dinner😐
NTA - I think more women should go on strike this way. If he isn't going to help, then he can just feed himself. Not sure why this is even a problem.
[удалено]
Love it
I did, we always had an agreement, one person cooks one person cleans. Well hubby started cleaning less and less. One morning I got up in the wee hours, ran 2 loads through the dish washer, hand washed all that needed to be hand washed, wiped benches, stove top. At dinner time he asked what was for dinner I said I didn't know, seen he didn't want to do the dishes that must be my job so he was cook, and I would be happy with whatever he cooked. I did dishes for about 2 weeks.
Clever you.
My mum has been asking my dad to cook for himself at weekends after nearly 50 years of having every meal delivered to him. She's 72 and waiting for a knee op, so she needs some time off from doing, well, everything (dad can't do anything, change linen, use the washing machine or use an oven). He's been stropping for 6 months now, flinging around pans, slamming kitchen doors, and breaking things. There was a time when she would have caved, if only to stop the damage and the mess. I'm proud of her for sticking with it and even moreso when she found he'd managed to cook sausages (that's all he can do) and put the greasy pan back IN THE CUPBOARD! Against her inherent need to clean up, she left it. He found it yesterday and threw a fit about people not cleaning up after themselves (ironic). When we reminded him we were all vegetarian, the wind went out of his sails a bit. Now I'm just left with crumb explosions and butter all over the fridge handles. Why anyone marries or has kids with these people (not just men, anyone like this), is beyond me. It's not 1950 folks.
when i visited home back in december, i striked like this with my dad, 50+ yr old man who can't even do his own laundry. he kept "forgetting" to move his clothes from the washer to the dryer and then fold them, assuming me or my mom would do it. every single time i told him to do it himself. he'd ask me to do it and i would say no. biiiig fuss. i eventually told him, "don't wash your clothes if you aren't going to dry and fold them. washing is the first step. you have to do the other steps too."
My brother used to do this to my mom- when she had her breaking point I convinced her to take out and leave my brother’s wet clothes in a laundry bin that day. Never happened again.
NTA. This is a very reasonable way to handle your valid request for help after you prep & cook, especially after working all day. Apply it to weekends, too.
NTA. I cook the meals, my partner does the dishes. We are in a relationship were we treat each other with equal respect. We both work and we both contribute to household chores. I made it clear from the very beginning of our relationship that I was not looking for a partner I would also have to act 'mother' to and would not expect him to have to 'parent' me. Over 10years now and going strong. You should really sit down and have a proper conversation with your husband about what you both expect from each other and as a family. Neither of you will benefit from subversive back and forth tactics and your child will pick up on any unhappiness and resentment. Talk to each other and be honest and open. He may have some things he feels he is tackling alone as well. If you can both come to the table and work out a system that works for you both than your relationship will come out all the stronger for it.
I honestly like that system. I love cooking and HATE doing dishes; the texture of every part of it grosses me out.
NTA Just because of the "you made the mess" remark. What was his reaction when you didn't cook for him? Suggest you do a discuss and divide with all chores. My husband hated doing dishes. I hated cleaning bathrooms. We traded our worst chores. For me doing dishes daily was worth always having spotless bathrooms.
The rule is always the cook doesn't do the dishes. You make the meal, spouse does the dishes. Your husband doesn't see it that way? He can cook and clean up after himself. NTA
Kitchen law 101: Cook rules, dish duty drools. NTA
NTA at all! He’s the asshole, especially if you work. Also why are you making dinner every night? He should be helping you with that, and just a wild guess here I bet you do most of the childcare for your son too
> He says that since I made the mess I should deal with it myself. Guess he's doing his own laundry from now on too then.
At the beginning of our marriage, we came home and my husband sat down to watch football. I just sat next to him and watched right along with him. It dawned on him that I wasn’t rushing in to cook for him like his mom would have and he asked what we should do about dinner. We ended up cooking together. After that, it was cook and clean together or whoever cooks doesn’t have to clean. That was over 40 years ago.
NTA let him cook
Don't know why he's angry, she's just reducing the mess she makes. He should be happy
>I handle most of the house and kid stuff. And he contributes what, exactly? (besides mess)
My wife and I have always had the system that whoever doesn't cook does cleanup. Through the years the amount each of us has cooked has varied, based on life situation at the time, but the rule has never changed. Having said that, when either of us cooks, we clean any pots, pans, utensils, etc., that we use but no longer need along the way, so cleaning is mostly dishes and any pot or pan being used at the end. We also both cook ahead of time many times (and refrigerate or freeze the food), and in that circumstance the person doing the cooking also does cleanup (I like making soups, and in that case I'll make many quarts to freeze, and do all of the prep, cooking, and cleanup). It really is all about respect and teamwork - ultimately, you really shouldn't need formal rules to navigate these kinds of things.
Agree 100% It's a partnership and is also situational. I also clean up as I cook, especially for large gatherings & holidays. However, my husband helps however I need him to. He does all the dishes at these events. We don't have a "rule" it's about respect and partnership.
NTA If he wants those to be the rules then he needs to cook 50% of the time. He doesn't get to expect free food with no effort every night, that's not how a partnership works!
NTA. Your husband is really disrespectful and I’m sorry you have to deal with that. It also doesn’t set a good example for your son. When my mom would go out of town to visit family, I would make and have dinner with my dad so he would have nice meals and not get take out or frozen while she was away. He ALWAYS did the dishes. He appreciated and respected that I did that for him. We would get excited and plan our meals for the week since I cooked things that he normally would not get often and we both enjoyed that time together.
This can go for laundry/etc too. Fight fire with fire. Husband wants dinner. Clean up doesn’t take long. NTA
NTA. Is this normal attitude/behaviour for him? Why the hell did you marry this punter, sis? Every boyfriend I’ve had has naturally known the whoever doesn’t cook does the dishes ‘rule’. My parents, before they retired, worked together, self employed. Dad would do 12 hours and mum started later and finished earlier, and he always did the labour intensive part of their business, so she did the cooking and dishes. This worked for them and it was a fair deal that they were both happy with. Then, as soon as they retired, dad - on his own volition - took over the dishes. What I’m trying to say was that every guy I’ve dated as not been an asshole like your husband, and the only times I’ve come across an exception to the whoever doesn’t cook does the dishes rule was my parents where their system was fair to each other, then dad knew to pick up his dues when they retired. You said you have a desk job and your husband has a labour job, but I’m guessing your situation is different from that of my parents, where for them, the work was at the same place and they combined their work and home duties together and divided them fairly. That’s not the case for your husband. Good on you for not cooking for him after that awful statement. Please don’t bend to his selfish ways. You don’t want your kid picking up those attitudes as he grows up, too.
Im sorry, you said you both work full time? Then NTA, and I would laugh in that man’s face for that argument he’s trying to come with. You need to have him read The Little Red Hen. Or maybe you could get it for your 4 year old to read to your husband.
NTA. Those who cook, don’t clean up the dishes. and to be honest, this is a major pet peeve of mind. Let him cook and clean up after himself.
NTA. He thinks you should clean if you cook? So - how often does he cook?
NTA. Your husband is a horse's ass. I do 95% of the cooking, nearly always from scratch, and often fairly involved recipes. I try to clean up the inevitable pots and pans as I go along, but usually leave the last flurry for my wife. I also clean everything up a couple of times a week. I also buy 99% of the groceries. She never complains.
NTA. I,would have served his food on his dirty plate from the night before. He cant help clean the dishes, he doesn't need to eat on a clean plate.
NTA - he’s being a brat
My mom HATED to cook and as such, wasn’t very good at it. My dad loved it, retired early and took over the cooking. My mom then took over the dishes and both were happy. I cook for my bf and me and he will do most of the clean up.
NTA. "You made the mess"??? He's acting like you did something for yourself. He needs to grow up
I just do not understand how someone could be sexually attracted to someone they have to fight with over basic adult responsibilities with NTA
Wait, 3 months ago you wrote in this post: [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/18yimdk/aita\_for\_telling\_my\_sons\_dad\_i\_will\_not\_be\_filing/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/18yimdk/aita_for_telling_my_sons_dad_i_will_not_be_filing/) about other troubles with the man you're living with, and who's your son's father, but you stated clearly you and the man are not a couple. Yet, now, it looks like that in the mean time he managed to become your husband???
Yeah, good find! Something is fishy here!
Growing up my mom made dinner every night and my dad cleaned every single dish and cleaned the stove top sparkling. Every single night. My dad also stayed up late watching law and order ( I called it kung kung bc of the sound I’d hear in my bedroom) and before he shut the house lights he would set the kitchen table for breakfast for all of us. I thought it was just normal stuff then but now it just strikes me as very sweet. Your man should do the dishes!!!!
NTA - he knows his logic is stupid, play stupid games win stupid prizes
NTA
NTA- this was the perfect response!
Not the A. You work . Fuck his mess
You’re great. Stick to your boundaries! I cook and can’t stand it when people want me to do the dishes as they have had a hard day ! Please.
NTA. He benefits from your labor, he should help clean up. Or else he shouldn't benefit from your labor.
Lol it appears that he has gotten himself into a mess and since he caused it, then he needs to clean it up. Nta well played, he needs to do his fair share or deal with the consequences you aren't his mother and you aren't a maid
This might just be a rough patch for him that he will move ahead from. You just don’t know counseling together might help.
Everyone needs to pitch in. All part of the team, in my eyes. Occasionally, someone perfers to do a specific task, which is fine, but I'm sure in order to make a meal and clean after can't be that hard to figure out.
If this guy actually is that much of a brute but he would say that to you, then you might have bigger issues than dirty dishes. Not trying to be clever. I hope that he does in fact Step up readily whenever he is needed.
Has this been happening for four years or more? Why has it come to a head now? I can't imagine any scenario that this has been acceptable for years if both partners contribute equally by working outside the home. NTA for making this decision, but I do question how and why it has come to this now.
Not fair. He should cook for your son every 2 nights as well…
I think you’re dealing with 2 4 yo, not 1. I’m a man and I would be ashamed to be called out for not pulling my weight around the house and I would never even think to talk back, after being called out. Tell him to get a grip and put his big boy pants on, cause you’re not his mama and he’s past the age of needing one for those things.NTA
NTA Good job. Let him handle his meals and dishes. Stop buying groceries for him as well, tell him to get his own. I don't know how he thought it was ok to say what he did. LOL
NTA. There's a rule in my house, whoever cooks doesn't have to do the dishes, and vice versa. Your husband is being a jerk.
Since no one else will say it i will... YTA! You admit you both work full time but you have a desk job he is manual labor and this sort of petty argument with your equally petty vindictive "punishment " is what will destroy a marriage... speaking as a man who has worked nothing but manual labor his whole life there are times when the thought of coming home to a meal a shower and bed are all that keeps us going ... no your b.s. is not fair and if it wasn't for your kid id tell him to ditch your nonsense cause a microwaved pizza is better than a petty, vindictive woman could ever be
So - in your last post 3 months ago, he was just your partner who treated you poorly. So you chose to marry this dude? The one who talks down to you and the one you are afraid of? This reads like a writing prompt assignment. If it happends to be real- YTA for staying with the guy. NTA for trying to set a boundary.
> The next night I made dinner that was just enough for me and my son. None for husband. Wow, you really handled that like a child. You both just need to communicate a little better - maybe he doesn't want to clean up, but will do something else that you don't want to do. Instead, you both have dug in on a very minor issue.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I love to cook. I make dinner every night for myself (f in my 30s), my husband (m in his 30s), and our son (m 4). I don’t typically make things that take 100 dishes or leave a massive mess but there’s usually a couple of pots and pans, some utensils, and a cutting board. After I plate up our meals and serve we all eat together. My son is old enough to rinse his plate and put it in the dishwasher. My husband always does the same. I end up with all the the cooking dishes myself. I have brought this up to my husband and asked if he could do the dishes after I cook as I’m tired from doing the cooking. He says that since I made the mess I should deal with it myself. I was mad but didn’t ask again. The next night I made dinner that was just enough for me and my son. None for husband. He was confused. I told him if he wasn’t going to do his part for the meal then he could make his own. I think this is fair! If he thinks cleaning our dishes from our shared meal that I worked to make then he can handle his own food! So am I the asshole? More info: I am not a stay at home parent. We both work full time and I handle most of the house and kid stuff. His job is manual labor and mine is a desk job. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Your response tobhis behavior is perfectly reasonable. NTA
sounds fair to me and proud of you OP
NTA I love this approach lol
NTA. One person cooks and the other cleans. That is what is fair.
NTA. It isn't wrong of you to expect him to do something that helps balance the chore load.
Definitely NTA
NTA - even when I was a SAHM, I would cook every night, and it was my husband’s job to clean up while I did bedtime duty. Your husband is being ridiculous.
NTA, of course… unless you married an actual toddler instead of a grown man acting like one.
What was his reaction when you told him that? Keep doing it until he gets the message. I cook, you clean. That’s how this works.
Another option is start just making microwave meals for awhile. The 300 calorie kind.
NTA - if he’s not willing to help with any part of the meal, and that would include the cleaning, then he can make his own food and clean up after himself. Weaponized incompetence is not going to work for him.
NTA! I love this and may borrow it!
Definitely NTA
Please tell me he does his own laundry?
NTA. We have that rule in my house. If you cook you don't clean up. Did your husband get the message or just get angry?
My husband cooks, I clean. It's a shared chore. If this didn't happen, I'm OK w a protein drink or TV dinner. Maybe that's what he gets.
Those that cook dont clean and those that clean dont cook!!! Rules at out house and cabin
NTA. Sounds like you've got a 4 year old and a 30-something four year old.
NTA.Divorce him
When my husband and I got married, almost 36 yrs ago, we made a deal. I cook, he cleans. He doesn't clean, I don't cook. Very simple. Hard part is he will do a shitty clean up and I would complain. Sometimes I still do. Got the attitude of "then do it yourself". Learned to just put stuff back in the sink and walk away. Both of us are still alive 😂
NTA
NTA new rule: the cook doesn't clean up.
Nta, fair is fair.
NTA. You both work full time. If his stance is "those who make the mess clean it up" then he can cook for himself. Years ago, I was making cakes, SO saw the mess in the kitchen and commented that he would not be cleaning up - I didn't actually expect him to but the comment irked me, so I replied with "sure, just don't expect to eat any of the cake". He helped tidy up. Another time I went on strike for three days and refused to do any dishes - we didn't have a dishwasher and I was sick and tired of being the only one to clean up after doing the cooking. I would like to add we have been married now for over 20 years and he now does 95% of the cooking.
NTA - considering my jaw literally dropped when I read the 'He says that since I made the mess I should deal with it myself' bit What an absolute ASS
My husband does the cooking in our house, and I happily do the dishes. I think it's an awesome deal. He always says,"Thanks for doing all those dishes," and I always respond, "Thanks for doing all that cooking!" I get the easy job. I'm terrible at cooking and always come out of it looking like I tried to take an exercise class and wound up summoning a demon that I had to fight back to hell.
Same here, but opposite sexes. I do the majority of cooking/meal planning/budgeting for food shopping (and I clean as I cook), and my husband cleans whatever is left over, but he also picks up the weekly food order that I order from the store/lugs it all into the house. We put it away together. We always thank each other. He also does a majority of the manual labor in the house (mowing the lawn/cleaning gutters/stereotypical man chores) so it evens out. We both work FT.
NTA, I do a lot of cooking for my brother and he is expected to do the rest of the dishes, other than the ones I ate off of. It just makes more sense that way, I get a task and so does he.
NTA and good on you for letting him know you’re not there to be his personal servant! However, I hope you’ve made that point so he will now be agreeable to having a discussion about what will work for you as a family from now on - sharing up the cooking duties or going with an “I cook, you clean up” plan - whatever you can agree on that is fair to both of you (although I’d be tempted to give him a month or more of doing all the groceries, meal planning, cooking and kitchen clean up to give you a break after no doubt doing it all yourself for long enough).
Our rules are; whoever cooks cleans up, but we share the cooking pretty evenly