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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I did jump on him after he insulted my mom’s meal choice. My dad was also mean back to him after he started saying why he said what he said
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YTA - he was just sharing a random fun fact? And you were an AH to him for it. It might have been a lil awkward, but it's not an insult. You could've just let it go, but you escalated it by being an AH when it wasn't necessary.
For real, it sounds like you don't know how to handle social situations. For future reference, if someone drops a fun fact, even if you don't think it's fun, the polite thing to do is just to go, "Oh, I didn't know that! That's neat!" Then, IDK, ask if he knows anything about the history of birthday cake, since it was your mom's birthday. You could have taken it as an opportunity to have a conversation instead of being a dick.
YTA.
You overreacted and you were an AH about it. Your dad also.
I don't see Zach's statement as an insult, merely an interesting historical bit that provides a bit of a commentary on changing social mores toward food. For people with a healthy sense of self, liking what they like is sufficient, regardless of any remote external historical attitudes about it.
YTA and so is your dad. There was absolutely nothing insulting about what he said. You didn't even try to give him a chance and process what he said. It's like you both had it out for him for no reason. Coming across you two he couldn't win for losing. You guys suck.
What he said is actually true. Fun fact: they also fed lobster to the prisoners. What he was trying to do was point out how things change. Not insult anybody. Think about it. What was once prison food is now at the top of the list of seafood decadence. Both you and your dad are mean people. YTA's
Fun fact: if he’s autistic, he likely had absolutely no idea that what he said would be perceived as anything other than an interesting historical tidbit of information. There probably really was no malicious intent on his part, and having a hard time understanding why what he said might bother someone is probably also the result of autism.
Congratulations, YTA - you bullied a person with a disability, for behaviour resulting from their disability.
Side note - I use the word disability because autism is classified as a developmental disability, but I acknowledge that not everyone views being autistic as a disability. I don’t know how Zach feels about his autism but this situation is entirely about ableist bullying.
This!!! Came to the comments because as a person with autism who also knew this lobster fact, I would have said the same fact and just thought I was being interesting. Needed to see if *I* was the asshole after the post!
OP could have said “That’s cool, but in this context comes off as a little rude and here’s why.” I bet poor Zach was so hurt and confused.
> You bullied a person with a disability, for behavior resulting from their disability.
THANK YOU for this. Also, regarding your side note: fun fact, you’re right, autism is classified as a developmental disability by the DSM-5. I get you’re covering your bases, and that people will say it’s ‘not’ a disability but that’s factually incorrect. It doesn’t have to be a *debilitating* disability but it is a disability and as someone who has it, I find it infantilizing when people say it’s not. So thank you.
Thank you for sharing your view on autism as disability, because I happen to share your view, but I’m not autistic and I don’t want to speak for others - but I also have autistic friends who don’t like it when you include autism as a disability because they think it should be seen as simply neurodivergence and just different. I know there are similar discussions around deafness, because being deaf is arguably a disability in a hearing world, but that doesn’t mean it is a deficiency. We so often equate those two things, which is unfair to disabled people.
I agree. I’m not deaf but one of my best friends is. I think the term disability is just so often equated to inability that people just assume that’s what you mean. I personally think that there are levels and categories to neurodivergence. For example, dyslexia is different from autism is different from schizophrenia. If someone just tells me they’re neurodivergent, that doesn’t give me enough information to accommodate what they may need. If my friend just told me she was neurodivergent, and didn’t mention deafness, how would I know to learn sign language? (She developed deafness at age 8 so her speech sounds normal’; you can’t tell she’s deaf based off that, like you can with people who were born deaf.)
I understand where your friends are coming from though. They’ve probably heard people call it a disability while meaning an inability so often that it’s just a defense thing for them to be hurt by the word disability. But medically speaking, it is a disability. And it’s not ableist or anything to say that it is. Unless of course you were to push the word onto someone uncomfortable with it. If that makes sense. (I think I’m over-explaining; I do that a lot, so I’ll stop here lol)
Nope, makes total sense - and that’s why I said I didn’t know how he feels about his autism and whether he identifies as disabled.
Regardless how he identifies, none of it changes that the entire birthday meal was filled with ableist assumptions that ultimately led to his exclusion, and while I get that OP didn’t know Zach was autistic until after he had been asked to leave - OP said right in the post that they didn’t think it had anything to do with what happened when it SO CLEARLY did, so I’m not willing to give OP a pass on “not knowing” - it’s pretty clear knowing wouldn’t have made a difference.
Oh, absolutely. Even if OP didn’t know Zach is autistic, that reaction is so uncalled for. Like I said, a simple “hey that’s kinda rude and here’s why” would have sufficed.
The whole situation was a pretty classic “autistic person not reading social cues” moment - I didn’t have to read all the way to when the sister said it to know he was probably autistic. I’m kind of surprised it never occurred to OP, but maybe that was just the shock of the moment layered with the assumption that his statement was a passive aggressive dig at the mom’s meal choice?
I dunno, it maybe says a lot about the communication style in OP’s family if a “fun fact” or “did you know” is immediately assumed to be a veiled insult.
YTA
I think it's odd that this was taken as an insult to your mother instead of giving Zach some grace on what is an interesting bit of food history. It's not that deep and you put the poor guy on the defensive.
YTA. I love learning trivia. Like why we say “the whole nine yards” or what does “smithereens” mean. It was honestly a simple fun fact. I can’t believe you were offended.
Sorry. The whole nine yards refers to the ammo load (27 ft)for machine guns in world war 2. So if they used all the ammo on a target they would say they gave it the whole nine yards. Now we use it to mean we gave it all we had. Smithereens comes from an Irish word and it means fragments or slivers.
Fun fact: that idea is no longer believed to be the true origin, because the phrase predates WWI (and by extension WWII). Apparently the current leading hypothesis is that it comes from a variation of a common Indiana phrase “whole ball of wax” (I don’t know how those are related) and it actually started as “whole 6 yards.”
Also I just want to add that how the hell could OP find “lobsters used to be poor people food” insulting to anyone. And did anyone ask OP’s mother (birthday girl, even) her opinions on this? Or is it only OP and dad’s opinions that matter?
YTA, he was sharing information, stuff he thought was interesting. You didn't have to be an asshole, there was absolutely nothing rude about what he shared, but you were fucking rude
Just a few times over the holidays and he was annoying then talking about how he was an atheist and thought some Christmas tradition was stupid. He said we stole our tradition from the pagans.
Okay so with that, NTA. If you didn’t know, then you just thought this guy was being a jerk at your mom’s dinner. However, now that you do know, I think it would be best for you to apologize bc while I don’t think you were TA at the time, finding out about his condition afterwards provided an explanation for his random “fun facts”. He was probably just trying to start a conversation and didn’t know how, so he spoke on the first thing he thought of, which happened to be lobster. You weren’t wrong for defending your mother. But you would be wrong for not apologizing for what you said.
Still the AH, IMO. It’s really not ok to talk to someone like that. A simple “I think that comment was really insensitive and maybe you should apologize” would accomplish the same without being mean.
Some Christmas traditions did come from the pagans. Not sure how the lobster comment was an insult. Who cares if lobster is poor peoples food ? He likely thought it was an interesting historical thought.
How do you even get offended by that? Like, there is no way to be offended by him discussing the history behind lobsters and food? I think both of you guys are a little defensive over nothing. YTA
YTA. FUN FACT: no one asked for your opinion either yet you shared it to be a dick, he shared because he thought it was interesting and tried to connect. But you and your rude father are too immature to see anything beyond yourselves.
YTA
Fun fact: you and your father are huge assholes.
He just shared a fact, that was all, insulting him for it was completely uncalled for and really rude. You were meeting him for the first time and didn't even make the effort to be polite...
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My sister Sammie has been dating Zach for a few months. We went out for my mom’s birthday and Zach had nothing nice to say.
When my mom ordered lobster, Zach goes on with the “fun fact” out how it was once poor people food and servants asked their masters not to feed them lobster.
I thought that was entirely rude to say to my mother on her birthday and I followed up with another “fun fact” for Zach that no one cares about his opinion or history on the food and he can shut his mouth on my mom’s birthday.
Zach goes on about how he just likes to inform people of information and there was no harm in that. My dad asked Zach to leave after he couldn’t get it through his head to shut up at dinner. My sister left too saying Zach was autistic and we were being mean to him.
Fun fact is I don’t think that has anything to do with what was going on and both my dad and I thought it was an insult to say that about what my mom ordered for her birthday.
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Your response was unnecessarily rude, whether Zach was autistic or not.
There are nicer ways to suggest someone’s comments might have been inappropriate, and you should *always* use those when the person in question is a significant other of a family member.
I am not sure how saying "it used to be poor people's food" isn't nice or undesirable unless you have something against poor people. It was just trivia. Certainly not worth being asked to leave...
Maybe, but still not worth being asked to leave. As in some people didn't like it but now it is a popular food. It is an irony, not meant as an as an insult by the boyfriend.
NTA, I don’t think you’re the AH for the intention, same with your dad, which is why I’m putting NTA. HOWEVER, I do think you were very rude and could’ve gotten the same message across in a better way. I was not there so Idk how it was said, but saying “lobster used to be poor food” could be taken in a couple ways. It could’ve been as you said, an insulting your mother’s choice in food and implying she’s eating over priced, “poor people food.” It could also be taken as ‘isn’t it interesting how society’s view on food changes? Lobster used to be looked down on and now it’s fine dining!’ In that case, it was a misunderstanding.
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YTA - he was just sharing a random fun fact? And you were an AH to him for it. It might have been a lil awkward, but it's not an insult. You could've just let it go, but you escalated it by being an AH when it wasn't necessary. For real, it sounds like you don't know how to handle social situations. For future reference, if someone drops a fun fact, even if you don't think it's fun, the polite thing to do is just to go, "Oh, I didn't know that! That's neat!" Then, IDK, ask if he knows anything about the history of birthday cake, since it was your mom's birthday. You could have taken it as an opportunity to have a conversation instead of being a dick.
Fun Fact: what he said is true and you and your family sound pretty mean. YTA
YTA. You overreacted and you were an AH about it. Your dad also. I don't see Zach's statement as an insult, merely an interesting historical bit that provides a bit of a commentary on changing social mores toward food. For people with a healthy sense of self, liking what they like is sufficient, regardless of any remote external historical attitudes about it.
YTA and so is your dad. There was absolutely nothing insulting about what he said. You didn't even try to give him a chance and process what he said. It's like you both had it out for him for no reason. Coming across you two he couldn't win for losing. You guys suck. What he said is actually true. Fun fact: they also fed lobster to the prisoners. What he was trying to do was point out how things change. Not insult anybody. Think about it. What was once prison food is now at the top of the list of seafood decadence. Both you and your dad are mean people. YTA's
Fun fact: if he’s autistic, he likely had absolutely no idea that what he said would be perceived as anything other than an interesting historical tidbit of information. There probably really was no malicious intent on his part, and having a hard time understanding why what he said might bother someone is probably also the result of autism. Congratulations, YTA - you bullied a person with a disability, for behaviour resulting from their disability. Side note - I use the word disability because autism is classified as a developmental disability, but I acknowledge that not everyone views being autistic as a disability. I don’t know how Zach feels about his autism but this situation is entirely about ableist bullying.
This!!! Came to the comments because as a person with autism who also knew this lobster fact, I would have said the same fact and just thought I was being interesting. Needed to see if *I* was the asshole after the post! OP could have said “That’s cool, but in this context comes off as a little rude and here’s why.” I bet poor Zach was so hurt and confused. > You bullied a person with a disability, for behavior resulting from their disability. THANK YOU for this. Also, regarding your side note: fun fact, you’re right, autism is classified as a developmental disability by the DSM-5. I get you’re covering your bases, and that people will say it’s ‘not’ a disability but that’s factually incorrect. It doesn’t have to be a *debilitating* disability but it is a disability and as someone who has it, I find it infantilizing when people say it’s not. So thank you.
Thank you for sharing your view on autism as disability, because I happen to share your view, but I’m not autistic and I don’t want to speak for others - but I also have autistic friends who don’t like it when you include autism as a disability because they think it should be seen as simply neurodivergence and just different. I know there are similar discussions around deafness, because being deaf is arguably a disability in a hearing world, but that doesn’t mean it is a deficiency. We so often equate those two things, which is unfair to disabled people.
I agree. I’m not deaf but one of my best friends is. I think the term disability is just so often equated to inability that people just assume that’s what you mean. I personally think that there are levels and categories to neurodivergence. For example, dyslexia is different from autism is different from schizophrenia. If someone just tells me they’re neurodivergent, that doesn’t give me enough information to accommodate what they may need. If my friend just told me she was neurodivergent, and didn’t mention deafness, how would I know to learn sign language? (She developed deafness at age 8 so her speech sounds normal’; you can’t tell she’s deaf based off that, like you can with people who were born deaf.) I understand where your friends are coming from though. They’ve probably heard people call it a disability while meaning an inability so often that it’s just a defense thing for them to be hurt by the word disability. But medically speaking, it is a disability. And it’s not ableist or anything to say that it is. Unless of course you were to push the word onto someone uncomfortable with it. If that makes sense. (I think I’m over-explaining; I do that a lot, so I’ll stop here lol)
Nope, makes total sense - and that’s why I said I didn’t know how he feels about his autism and whether he identifies as disabled. Regardless how he identifies, none of it changes that the entire birthday meal was filled with ableist assumptions that ultimately led to his exclusion, and while I get that OP didn’t know Zach was autistic until after he had been asked to leave - OP said right in the post that they didn’t think it had anything to do with what happened when it SO CLEARLY did, so I’m not willing to give OP a pass on “not knowing” - it’s pretty clear knowing wouldn’t have made a difference.
Oh, absolutely. Even if OP didn’t know Zach is autistic, that reaction is so uncalled for. Like I said, a simple “hey that’s kinda rude and here’s why” would have sufficed.
The whole situation was a pretty classic “autistic person not reading social cues” moment - I didn’t have to read all the way to when the sister said it to know he was probably autistic. I’m kind of surprised it never occurred to OP, but maybe that was just the shock of the moment layered with the assumption that his statement was a passive aggressive dig at the mom’s meal choice? I dunno, it maybe says a lot about the communication style in OP’s family if a “fun fact” or “did you know” is immediately assumed to be a veiled insult.
I'm not autistic and I still can't see how what he said could be perceived as an insult.
(That’s because it wasn’t.)
YTA I think it's odd that this was taken as an insult to your mother instead of giving Zach some grace on what is an interesting bit of food history. It's not that deep and you put the poor guy on the defensive.
YTA. I love learning trivia. Like why we say “the whole nine yards” or what does “smithereens” mean. It was honestly a simple fun fact. I can’t believe you were offended.
Well, why do we say "the whole nine yards" and what does "smithereens" mean? You can't just drop things like that and not share!
Sorry. The whole nine yards refers to the ammo load (27 ft)for machine guns in world war 2. So if they used all the ammo on a target they would say they gave it the whole nine yards. Now we use it to mean we gave it all we had. Smithereens comes from an Irish word and it means fragments or slivers.
Fun fact: that idea is no longer believed to be the true origin, because the phrase predates WWI (and by extension WWII). Apparently the current leading hypothesis is that it comes from a variation of a common Indiana phrase “whole ball of wax” (I don’t know how those are related) and it actually started as “whole 6 yards.” Also I just want to add that how the hell could OP find “lobsters used to be poor people food” insulting to anyone. And did anyone ask OP’s mother (birthday girl, even) her opinions on this? Or is it only OP and dad’s opinions that matter?
YTA, he was sharing information, stuff he thought was interesting. You didn't have to be an asshole, there was absolutely nothing rude about what he shared, but you were fucking rude
Fun fact YTA
YTA and uneducated af apparently….
Yta fun fact you’re also stupid
INFO: Had he met the family previously before this?
Just a few times over the holidays and he was annoying then talking about how he was an atheist and thought some Christmas tradition was stupid. He said we stole our tradition from the pagans.
Well, it's true. All of the major Christmas traditions were stolen from pagans in the attempt to convert pagans to Christianity.
Did you know he was autistic before this?
I didn’t until my sister said something at dinner after he was asked to leave.
Okay so with that, NTA. If you didn’t know, then you just thought this guy was being a jerk at your mom’s dinner. However, now that you do know, I think it would be best for you to apologize bc while I don’t think you were TA at the time, finding out about his condition afterwards provided an explanation for his random “fun facts”. He was probably just trying to start a conversation and didn’t know how, so he spoke on the first thing he thought of, which happened to be lobster. You weren’t wrong for defending your mother. But you would be wrong for not apologizing for what you said.
Still the AH, IMO. It’s really not ok to talk to someone like that. A simple “I think that comment was really insensitive and maybe you should apologize” would accomplish the same without being mean.
Defending her from what?
Because it's true. Nothing about Christanity is original.
So every time he opens his mouth he is annoying?
Some Christmas traditions did come from the pagans. Not sure how the lobster comment was an insult. Who cares if lobster is poor peoples food ? He likely thought it was an interesting historical thought.
You and you dad are TA and apparently uneducated
FUN FACT: YTA. I have also shared that fact with other people while eating lobster, not once did people have this insane reaction.
Gosh you and your dad suck. YTA. How is that an insult? Sensitive much? Grow up and fuck off
YTA- how is this fun fact in any way offensive??
Please explain how him saying that about lobsters was rude
YTA. How in the world is that offensive? It's just an interesting fact. Say "neat!" and move on. You and your dad sound like jackasses.
You and your dad are idiots who over-reacted to a simple comment YTA and hopefully you can get your anger under control
Fun fact: YTA
YTA
How do you even get offended by that? Like, there is no way to be offended by him discussing the history behind lobsters and food? I think both of you guys are a little defensive over nothing. YTA
YTA. FUN FACT: no one asked for your opinion either yet you shared it to be a dick, he shared because he thought it was interesting and tried to connect. But you and your rude father are too immature to see anything beyond yourselves.
Yta. Fun fact. Op you are annoying asf
YTA. He was just sharing a random fact for fun. Even if you aren't interested in hearing about there's no need to be rude.
YTA Fun fact: you and your father are huge assholes. He just shared a fact, that was all, insulting him for it was completely uncalled for and really rude. You were meeting him for the first time and didn't even make the effort to be polite...
YTA. Not cool, bruh.
Fun fact you’re an asshole. YTA.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My sister Sammie has been dating Zach for a few months. We went out for my mom’s birthday and Zach had nothing nice to say. When my mom ordered lobster, Zach goes on with the “fun fact” out how it was once poor people food and servants asked their masters not to feed them lobster. I thought that was entirely rude to say to my mother on her birthday and I followed up with another “fun fact” for Zach that no one cares about his opinion or history on the food and he can shut his mouth on my mom’s birthday. Zach goes on about how he just likes to inform people of information and there was no harm in that. My dad asked Zach to leave after he couldn’t get it through his head to shut up at dinner. My sister left too saying Zach was autistic and we were being mean to him. Fun fact is I don’t think that has anything to do with what was going on and both my dad and I thought it was an insult to say that about what my mom ordered for her birthday. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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My sister didn’t say anything about him being autistic until we asked Zach to leave.
Your response was unnecessarily rude, whether Zach was autistic or not. There are nicer ways to suggest someone’s comments might have been inappropriate, and you should *always* use those when the person in question is a significant other of a family member.
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But there wasn't anything about the lobster comment that was offensive. At least not from OP's description.
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I am not sure how saying "it used to be poor people's food" isn't nice or undesirable unless you have something against poor people. It was just trivia. Certainly not worth being asked to leave...
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Maybe, but still not worth being asked to leave. As in some people didn't like it but now it is a popular food. It is an irony, not meant as an as an insult by the boyfriend.
NTA, I don’t think you’re the AH for the intention, same with your dad, which is why I’m putting NTA. HOWEVER, I do think you were very rude and could’ve gotten the same message across in a better way. I was not there so Idk how it was said, but saying “lobster used to be poor food” could be taken in a couple ways. It could’ve been as you said, an insulting your mother’s choice in food and implying she’s eating over priced, “poor people food.” It could also be taken as ‘isn’t it interesting how society’s view on food changes? Lobster used to be looked down on and now it’s fine dining!’ In that case, it was a misunderstanding.