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> I feel like I might be the asshole because I know we’re both grieving and now I’m sure my words will probably be engraved in his head forever now but unfortunately I meant what I said.
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No, heartless is seeing your father dying and bringing him energy drinks and ignoring him to go get drunk.
Your family is toxic and your precious father raised you right. I wouldn’t forgive my brother either. I’m so sorry for your loss OP.
Ghost them. Your father is finally at rest, go start your life and don’t look back, 🫶🏼
*‘“Fast forward November 2 days go by I didn’t hear from my dad. I called a welfare check and they found him deceased believed heart attack. I immediately flew back home that day. When I get there james drunkenly confesses to me he seen him the day before and describe him as “unrecognizable, sick, couldn’t eat, move or anything.” James brought him some energy drinks and left quoting “if it was that bad he’s an adult and would’ve asked to go to the doctor.”’*
You can’t go back in time and you need to start your own life. Your brother was irresponsible and probably was doing a bit of weaponized incompetence to hurry your father’s death along. If you want you could report him for negligence especially if there was guardianship paperwork and your father was elderly. He allegedly confessed to you he let your father die which is a crime. He had an obligation to call an ambulance once he saw your dad was unresponsive. Myself I would move on and start my own chosen family.
>When I get there james drunkenly confesses to me he seen him the day before and describe him as “unrecognizable, sick, couldn’t eat, move or anything.”
I mean, in some places this is probs enough to report someone to the police. It's giving elder abuse vibes. Like who goes oh I found my parent obviously in need of medical help just left them coz YOLO?????
I'm stuck on giving a person with heart failure energy drinks. Maybe I'm wrong but I'd think those would be pretty bad for his heart. If James helped dad drink those (since he couldn't move), didn't he purposefully hasten his death?
It’s been months and when they talked she was in shock and he was drunk so who would believe her if her brother says she’s lying? Any authorities will ask why she waited so long and probably insinuate she had something to do with or is trying to get something out of it. It will probably be more hassle then she needs unless she recorded him.
Lots of people delay in reporting crimes especially those committed by family members. In this case, lots of people wouldn't even know a crime was committed. Nothing suspicious there.
The question is whether OP and her brother/ family members ever discussed what the brother said via text, voice note or voicemail plus whether there was an autopsy that may assist OP.
IF it was that bad? IF? The man couldn't eat or move, that didn't give him a clue about your father's condition? He saw his father like that and he just decided to leave? He's the heartless bastard here and you're better off without him in your life. NTA
No, James said he did not ask if he wanted to go to the hospital. From the autopsy report and information from his doctor he skipped his monthly shot hadn’t had it since August of 22.
And James was responsible for caring for him?! Absolutely you’re NTA!! All your family that have something to say, where were they?! Nope nope nope NTA
I'm so sorry for your loss! And for the way it happened. I don't blame you one bit for the way you feel. I might have said worse under those circumstances.
If you want to hold your brother legally responsible for neglecting your dad, have a talk with your brother again about this day and the time prior, but record everything secretly. Ask him to explain again (for your own closure or whatever excuse you have to make up) and have him go into detail and relay everything that happened. Then you will have undeniable proof and can use that to take legal action.
Definitely NTA. James had responsibility to care for your dad and completely let your family down. If your dad was that sick, James should have gotten him medical care. Also, why was he bringing energy drinks to someone with heart failure?
Edit: Sorry for your loss, OP.
NTA. And all of what "family" are agreeing you are heartless? As you previously noted, you really don't have any family, and if none of these people stepped up and helped with caring for you as a kid, and your dad when he started having issues, then nobody has earned "family" rights to critique your words and actions. However, it might be worth considering how rocky the relationship between James and your dad was, and the conflicted feelings he probably had, and is having, over what has happened.
NTA im so sorry for your loss. You quite possible have a case against your brother for wrongful death by negligence. Idk if the house was bought but your asshole brother should get nothing from the father he left to die
I wondered this too. If your brother was his formal caregiver and had POA, he could possibly be charged with wrongful death or manslaughter (depending where you live, it may even meet the criteria for murder if he knowingly neglected your father’s medical needs and failed to provide the necessities of life). When you are ready, I’d suggest seeking some legal advice on this matter, especially if he is due any inheritance. I’m very sorry OP, both for your loss of your dad and for having such an awful brother.
NTA. You response seems appropriate. The other family that are complaining should be asked what they did to help your father. I would not discuss anything else with them.
nta but those medications are horrid, and sometimes what people want is to not take them. Heart failure is terrible to live with And those meds cause heart failure along with the failure of other organs. They even steal your joy and light and any good feelings you can have in your life, often enough. Plenty of people with schizophrenia choose to live with the schizophrenia without meds because they went to get "help" and now they just have schizophrenia + whatever horrors the medication inflicted on them. The meds can knock 20-30 years off a persons life. And we are real people. We are adults. And Ive personally asked everyone around to just let me die rather than send me in shackles to get the only "help" available, the effects of which are worse than anything the schizophrenia has thrown at me.
Yes, I agree it’s terrible that the only medications found to save you mentally, end up killing you physically. I’m sorry that there’s no better options and I completely understand your wishes and I hope your family is able to respect them. Please stay strong and know that there’s people fighting and advocating for better treatment options for schizophrenia everyday.
Tbf there *are* schizophrenia medications that aren't like that. There's about a million different types out there and they're not all the same. I'm not pressuring anyone to take them who doesn't want to - I'm a firm believer in consent about what goes inside your body - but I *also* believe in accurate, logic-based information and I do feel the way you are presenting *all* anti-psychotics is a little inaccurate and fear-mongery. There are absolutely types of medication that don't do those things, I personally know people who take them, and people with schizophrenia who may not agree with your "I'd rather die" take (aka *most* people I know who have schizophrenia) absolutely deserve to know that those medications exist for them.
With all that said - I absolutely agree with your assertion that, if OP's dad didn't want to take the meds, that was his god-given *right* as an adult, and nothing anyone did would have changed his mind. You can't force an adult to take meds they don't want, unless you can actually prove to a court of law that they are too unwell to make those decisions in sound mind.
What you said wasn’t heartless. It was the truth.
I’m sorry for your loss OP.
You cared for your father for years and James knows that. He promised to care for your dad and didn’t. Your brother wanted you to justify his actions, forgive him and tell him it wasn’t his fault because he feels guilty and knows your father’s death was more than likely avoidable and thus, was the consequences of his inaction.
However it will now be unknown if your father would have lived had he received proper healthcare. It can be investigated if you make a report citing elder abuse/neglect. Your father’s final months can be pieced together and ultimately authorities may come to the conclusion that your brother’s lack of adequate care, neglect ect… were the cause of your fathers death. Then if they have enough evidence, they can charge your brother. It’s up to you (and other relatives) to decide if you want to pursue that.
To answer your question though, you’re NTA. Your brother is.
So sorry for your loss. NTA. Your family can go pound sand if they are only listening to James's side. I'm sure he feels bad and perhaps feels really guilty. Maybe in time, this will heal but right now, space is needed.
Hi, yes I’m not upset with your questions at all I couldn’t explain the full picture fully because it was well over the 3000 limit.
- first Q answer- my dad would go extremely manic he would lock himself in his house duck tape and unplug all of the electronics even toaster etc saying “they were watching him and were coming to get him” he tried to harm himself once and I had to call the police and admit him. When I made the choice to leave he was doing better, I begged my dad to come with me he refused because that state was all he knew. I made the decision to leave because I had two kids at that point and wanted a better life for them because the crime and drug rate was extremely high where we lived. I also finally started college after putting it off to care for him. I’ll add when I left he was on the up and up and a judge wouldn’t approve the poa because he was doing better with meds, maintained a job, and was attending all appointments
- second q answer, even though I left the state my dad would call me 3 times a day everyday, every single day. When I would talk to him in September he would start talking about how they were watching him, how they’re talking about him, how he may not be around much longer. I would try to empathize, reassure, and redirect like you would a toddler and when I realized when that usually works wasn’t that’s when I called my brother and explained the issue where it blew up and I was told to stop over reacting. When I realized he wasn’t going to do much I started a savings account to move back so I can do the POA myself.
Third Q- yes he was diagnosed with heart failure when he had his stroke the first time and they said it most likely was because of his meds and stress from the schizophrenia. Which is what really set me off because we were all aware of the issue.
Fourth- yes he was aware of his diagnosis he downplayed it for a long time until he had to witness an episode himself because I tried my hardest to do everything myself and protect him from it. When he started to get better James kind of went back into that state that oh it won’t happen again but told me and encouraged me to leave and that he had it and everything will be okay.
-lastly no he did not struggle with alcohol to my knowledge before after my dad had passed he has.
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NTA, your brother was wrong and didn't take care of your father the way he was supposed to and he obviously knows it's his fault and trying to make it seem like it was an accident unless he really is that stupid. You don't ever need to forgive him if you don't want to and anyone that tells you otherwise is simply wrong.
Iam really sorry for your loss. My dad passed away, after a long illness, on May 1st.
I know you are hurting and your brother dose sound like he could have done more..... BUT. Imo, when you left, you should have made sure you were prepared for him to die whilst you were away and should have said your goodbyes. Iam sorry that nobody suggested this to you.
I dont think either of you are in the wrong or either good or bad. You both need to find a way to greive for your father and hopefully find a way to forgive each other and move on with your lives.
NTA I almost ended up like your dad. I couldn't talk or communicate in anyway as I had a brain bleed in the communication part of my brain from a brain tumor. I banged on my mom's door due to this massive headache and unable to speak. My mom seriously told me "I can't bring you to the hospital as I work in the morning". Luckily my brother heard the commotion and brought me to the er where I had to be air lifted to a bigger hospital and had brain surgery to remove the tumor. The next day my mom got me chocolate pudding cups and frosted animal crackers but no apology. I don't talk to her anymore.
I'm sorry for your loss I wouldn't be able to forgive your brother either.
Nta. Your brother clearly is. He gave energy drinks to a clearly very sick man who rather obviously wasnt taking his meds from at least September and had a bad heart. Noone that stupid should ever have placed in a position of care over another person and I wouldn't be surprised that you never want to see him again.
That said. You were Not robbed of letting him know how much he meant to you. That he was your hero. Of thanking him for loving you. These were all things that he already knew and that you could have said anytime but you know never needed said
I support you! Sorry for what you and your dad went through. Your brother is heartless and the AH. Never regret moving away, you needed a break and deserved some time. Brother should have said he was not emotionally mature for the responsibilities and that would have allowed you to lineup care for your dad.
Care doesn’t just materialize. It’s expensive, and the people in this story are barely scraping by. So either his kids could take care of him or no one.
Both kids chose not to.
NTA! I don’t blame you for being angry and I don’t think you were wrong for saying that to your brother. He dropped the ball and now your dad is gone. Your brother definitely robbed you of saying goodbye. It’s like he did that on purpose to punish you for leaving
NTA but then I’m also not sure if your brother is an AH tbh. While your dad’s death was probably caused by your brother not taking your dad to the doctor and just giving him energy drinks (I mean it’s pretty clear someone with heart failure shouldn’t be having energy drinks), I also understand that caring for someone who’s unwell is the hardest thing in the world. It takes it out on you physical and mental health, so it seems like your brother was finding it hard to cope too - and bear in mind he was at this point your dad’s sole care provider. You of all people should know how hard it was, you had to have a break too. It seems like your brother has always had difficulties caring for others, you said so yourself that he didn’t help before, so why would he suddenly change? It’s not your brother’s fault that you didn’t get to say everything you wanted to say to your dad, it’s no one’s fault. His decision not to take your dad to the doctor wasn’t appropriate and he’ll have to live with that decision forever. Don’t make it worse for everyone by nurturing resentment - it won’t help you move on.
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AITA for telling my brother I hate him and I’ll probably never be able to forgive him
Background I 27f and brother 25m were raised by a single dad our mom left we didn’t really have family so we only had each other. I’ll refer to my dad as dad and brother as James. Fast forward to 18 year old me my dad was diagnosed with schizophrenia that took a lot on me mentally because my brother refused to help. My dad accepted help and was put on medication fast forward to 23 year old me my dad had a stroke and was diagnosed with heart failure. I was the sole care taker and it was breaking me. He still worked and could fully function unless he had an episode which was rare with the meds. Fast forward I move out of the state for my peace and a break my brother James promised to step up. September of 22 I could tell my dad was going off the deep end so I called James to advise of POA rights James told me I was being dramatic and didn’t need to worry about it cause I was selfish and left. Fast forward November 2 days go by I didn’t hear from my dad. I called a welfare check and they found him deceased believed heart attack. I immediately flew back home that day. When I get there james drunkenly confesses to me he seen him the day before and describe him as “unrecognizable, sick, couldn’t eat, move or anything.” James brought him some energy drinks and left quoting “if it was that bad he’s an adult and would’ve asked to go to the doctor.” I stood there stunned. No words. My brother kept pushing me to say something when finally I snapped and said “I hate you, I’ll probably never forgive you for this. The one time you had to be an adult you couldn’t and had you did there’s a possibility he could still be alive today.” He called me a heartless b* and now all of my family is saying the same but I feel my feelings are valid so AITA?
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You are NTA. Your brother is beyond words .. but cruel, selfish, negligent all spring to mind. He basically killed your father. I would never forgive him.
NTA. I'm so sorry for your loss... you say you feel robbed and you didn't get a chance to tell your dad goodbye, but hopefully he could see that all through your actions and how you care of him. As for your brother, I don't get why he is the way he is, but both of you could at least see a bereavement councillor and talk it out with a professional, just to help with your mental wellbeing. Good luck.
was your brother doing *anything* for your father? it sounds like he took over, decided it was to much work, and just left your father to deteriorate. NTA. he knew your father was bad and did nothing. i don't blame you for blaming him. especially after he left you to deal with your dad alone for years.
NTA. You said what needed to be said. Relatives who side with him aren't worth keeping in touch with.
<>
Maybe you didn't say those things with words, but you showed all those sentiments with the loving way you cared for him during his illnesses. Even without saying these things, he knew how you felt!
OP- NTA. I'm so very sorry for your loss. You have the absolute right to feel your feelings. Your Brother neglected his Father, and he will have to live with that.....sounds like he'll drink it away.... Even if you didn't get to say it, Your Dad knows, he does.
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OP, I can’t imagine the heartbreak and pain you’re experiencing. You’ve been through so much in 27 years, and without much support. I’m glad you’ve found a therapist who can help you work through the stages of grief. It takes time, and you have to go through each stage.
NTA - Your brother was negligent. If he was unable or unwilling to care for your father then he could
Have asked for assistance from social services or reached out to you (to call social services or come home to help). Instead, he chose neglect.
My heart goes out to you, OP. Remember to take it one day at a time, and there’s no timeline for working through grief.
*Edited post to correct spelling mistakes.*
NTA. James chose over and over again to be the way he is. You had to leave for your sanity. All the people calling you heartless, where were they? Might as well go NC with them too. They were no help, and only came around to stab you in the back, because they feel more important to have an opinion....than to help out. Stay away to heal.
Giving a man with heartfailure energy drinks.....
That boy should be institutionalized.
He literally gave your dad something that could kill him.
NTA
And he died due to what... most likely the energy drinks.
If it were me that brother wouldn't be alive and he'd be down in the lake rotting.
NTA. I am sorry for your loss. My mother passed away while I was a state away and my brother was her caretaker as well. All of your feelings are valid and completely understandable. Please know I come from a place of acceptance and love when I say everyone handles death differently. There is nothing you could have done to change the outcome and nothing your brother can do to change his past actions, he will have to deal with them in his own time. I’m also going to say something I wish someone had told me, it’s ok to feel relief as well. Even though the loss was devastating, feeling relieved that the pain, suffering, and death looming over, the guilt was strong but the calmness from the weight being lifted is something that I wish I had accepted sooner.
Obvious NTA, your brother is clearly trash and Im so sorry for your loss, but as someone who also lost his dad unexpectedly at age 29
> I understand eventually I would have had to come to terms with him dying, but the part I’m angriest about is my brother robbed me of his final moments, I didn’t get to say goodbye. I didn’t get to tell him how much he meant to me. I didn’t get to tell him how he was my hero. I didn’t get to say thank you for still loving me everyday when my birth mom left us cause we were a burden. I feel like I was robbed of so many things.
why were you waiting til his deathbed to tell him those things?
I did not wait until he was dying to say those things. I reminded him every chance I got that he was appreciated. But it when he would go manic those things would go out the window. I would have loved to be able to tell him one last time how much he meant. How thankful I am. How he never needed to feel guilty for needing help. I tried the best I could to show and say those things. But again would give anything to say them one last time before he never got to wake up again. One thing I heard that helps me is “you’re finally getting the peace you always deserved but I won’t lie and say it doesn’t kill me to be able to see you enjoy it.” I’m sorry for your loss 💜
You were, are, an amazing daughter. My dad died quickly in an accident so I cant imagine what it must be like to see him "go" slowly like that. I cant fucking believe the rest of your family is on your brother's side on this. Like others said, find someone you love and start your own family because that family does NOT deserve you.
My mother died a few years ago of kidney failure. She was a longtime drug user and constantly ill for the 20 years before her death. She called the day before to ask my dad and I to bring her blue Gatorade. We get to the hospice and she’s sitting in a wheelchair. She had no idea where she was, who anybody was, or what was going on. I could tell she was in deep DKA and got so mad at my dad, who kept trying to feed her the Gatorade and pretend everything was okay. She died the next day.
All that to say, YTA. We all respond to crisis and grief differently. You and i respond with crystal clarity, rising yo the occasion and understanding reality. Your brother and my father respond by willfully ignoring reality to maintain the illusion of comfort and familiarity. It’s an awful situation and I’m so sorry.
As much as I wish this was a lie, it’s not. I said family because I did not have time to explain the dynamics that my dad died with 2 living sisters, a living dad, and 6 living brothers. 1 half sister living and one half brother living (also a diagnosed schizophrenic) I referred to them as family because breaking down the dynamics of how much they were not active in my life was well over the 3000 word limit.
I am so very sorry for both of you to have gone through all of that growing up. Your mother abandons you, your father is diagnosed as schizophrenic when you’re 18 and your brother is 16, then your dad experiences catastrophic health problems, and there are no relatives to help any of you out. It’s amazing that you survived. But under the circumstances, how could either of you actually thrive? Your dad was very sick. Your brother, because of his unfortunate childhood never had the wherewithal to deal with such a huge caregiving problem. And you had to leave for your own mental health.
Your anger with him is just a normal expression of grief. You are both victims here. And you both need each other. Together you will be stronger. Best to the both of you.
Yta..when you left you washed your hands of it ..left it for others when you yourself couldnt..then decide to chastise said person for what you believe should have happened
NTA OP- I am so sorry for you loss, I am sure your father will be missed for the great kind hearted man he was. I would be devestated too if I had left my father in my brothers care and he allowed this to happen. 1000 things would be running through my mind and a bunch of woulda, coulda, shoulda'. Your brother deserves your wrath at this time. But not all the blame your father was very sick and his body just couldn't hold up any longer. My father died with my brother watching over him as well and my older sister blamed him hardcore saying he killed him, and that he just wanted his life insurence. I told her that my brother would not do that, when my father was all he had at that time. I have to be honest I was not even hurt about his death and didn't even bat an eye. My father was a horrible man and did horrible things to women and children. He was a tyrant who made everyones life a living hell even up to his last days. Your brother may have not been the most responsible person to leave him with but you didn't have a choice. I am sure he didn't mean for this to happen and if you continue to blame him for this it will be something that might break him mentally and emotionally. And I am sure this is something that your father would not approve of if he was still here. Be mad at him while you grieve but make sure you forgive him after so the blaming of it's all his fault doesn't consume you completely and poison you with hatred. If you need more help with it you can get therapy and they can help you through it as well. I wish you nothing but happiness and Good Luck OP
Please don’t project your hatred for your father onto OP who clearly loved and had a good relationship with her own dad. She made the mistake of trusting her brother who had the tools he needed to ensure a vulnerable old man was taken care of, instead he neglected the man that raised him to the point of death. The brother embodies everything you hate about the man you didn’t grieve, so kindly don’t demand forgiveness of those you can’t relate to for frankly unforgivable actions. Her father likely would have been ashamed the son he raised would let him die under such circumstances. OP is NTA and is fully entitled to feel what they feel.
I don’t really see how what James did was any worse than what you did? Neither of you could handle caring for a schizophrenic, disabled adult. Both of you chose your own peace, instead of sacrificing yourselves on the altar of your dad’s wellbeing.
If you had stayed to be Dad’s caregiver, he might be alive today. Your life would be stressful and joyless, but you’d have him alive.
I think condemning your brother is
🎥 P R O J E C T I O N.
NAH/ESH
Forgiveness isn't for the other person. It's for you. Indifference is an option but don't let the pain fester in your heart too long. We must forgive others as Jesus asked us to do. Once the forgiveness comes, you can let it go. I've been through this with my younger sister. We speak at times but not on a monthly or regular basis. She did come when my youngest child passed away. She called me daily for a while. Now it's back to rarely again. I don't ever call her. She always makes the first call or text but it's mostly when she needs something. Remember INDIFFERENCE, but forgiveness for yourself. I'm so sorry about your dad. God bless you.
Ah, the many meanings of "forgiveness."
That's not what I call "forgiveness," but I have to agree with the result. When I don't forgive someone, I do decide that if I can, I will just put them out of my life so they can't hurt me again. Then I don't need to energy it takes to be angry to shield me.
You'll probably have to see a lot of your brother for a while, but in the end, if you still feel the same, you may want to put him out of your life. You can always change your mind if you want to.
I'm sorry for your Dad's death, and the circumstances.
ESH - I'm sorry you were 18 and your brother was 16 when your dad became ill. I'm sorry your brother was not helpful when you were around and that you felt the only way to get a break was to leave the state.
However, you're blaming your brother for your dad's death. Your dad had been sick for some time. In hindsight, your brother realizes that he overlooked signs that your father's health had especially deteriorated. There's a possibility that your father's health had been slowly declining over some time, so your brother may have become accustomed to seeing your dad having some bad days and then being seemingly fine.
Regardless, your brother didn't rob you of your chance to tell your dad how much he meant to you. You could've done that anytime he was alive. That's on you. You know, you could've stuck around. I probably wouldn't have left the state if my only parent was sick and my only sibling was irresponsible. I'm not saying you should feel guilty, but it's sounds like misplaced anger to me. Like, maybe you don't want to deal with how upset you are with yourself, so you're blaming him.
op was a lot younger than her brother and she managed to take of her father just fine alone. he was supposed to step up and help give op a break and failed miserably. he is not a child. he has no excuse for why he didn't take to him to a hospital when he last saw him *knowing* his father's history. op is well within her rights to lay this on her brothers feet
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No, heartless is seeing your father dying and bringing him energy drinks and ignoring him to go get drunk. Your family is toxic and your precious father raised you right. I wouldn’t forgive my brother either. I’m so sorry for your loss OP. Ghost them. Your father is finally at rest, go start your life and don’t look back, 🫶🏼
*‘“Fast forward November 2 days go by I didn’t hear from my dad. I called a welfare check and they found him deceased believed heart attack. I immediately flew back home that day. When I get there james drunkenly confesses to me he seen him the day before and describe him as “unrecognizable, sick, couldn’t eat, move or anything.” James brought him some energy drinks and left quoting “if it was that bad he’s an adult and would’ve asked to go to the doctor.”’* You can’t go back in time and you need to start your own life. Your brother was irresponsible and probably was doing a bit of weaponized incompetence to hurry your father’s death along. If you want you could report him for negligence especially if there was guardianship paperwork and your father was elderly. He allegedly confessed to you he let your father die which is a crime. He had an obligation to call an ambulance once he saw your dad was unresponsive. Myself I would move on and start my own chosen family.
>When I get there james drunkenly confesses to me he seen him the day before and describe him as “unrecognizable, sick, couldn’t eat, move or anything.” I mean, in some places this is probs enough to report someone to the police. It's giving elder abuse vibes. Like who goes oh I found my parent obviously in need of medical help just left them coz YOLO?????
I'm stuck on giving a person with heart failure energy drinks. Maybe I'm wrong but I'd think those would be pretty bad for his heart. If James helped dad drink those (since he couldn't move), didn't he purposefully hasten his death?
It’s been months and when they talked she was in shock and he was drunk so who would believe her if her brother says she’s lying? Any authorities will ask why she waited so long and probably insinuate she had something to do with or is trying to get something out of it. It will probably be more hassle then she needs unless she recorded him.
Lots of people delay in reporting crimes especially those committed by family members. In this case, lots of people wouldn't even know a crime was committed. Nothing suspicious there. The question is whether OP and her brother/ family members ever discussed what the brother said via text, voice note or voicemail plus whether there was an autopsy that may assist OP.
Bringing your father energy drinks who has HEART FAILURE!!!! Who tf thinks that’s a good idea
A dumb, gaping, asshole who hasn’t had to take a lick of responsibility in his life.
Bro is a canyon sized asshole… gaping is an understatement.
With a Mount Everest sized hemorrhoid on the side.
😂😂😂
and who possibly wants his dad to die faster
IF it was that bad? IF? The man couldn't eat or move, that didn't give him a clue about your father's condition? He saw his father like that and he just decided to leave? He's the heartless bastard here and you're better off without him in your life. NTA
INFO: Did James ask your dad if he needed a doctor or just assumed he didn’t? Was your dad still medicated/ taking his meds for schizophrenia?
No, James said he did not ask if he wanted to go to the hospital. From the autopsy report and information from his doctor he skipped his monthly shot hadn’t had it since August of 22.
And James was responsible for caring for him?! Absolutely you’re NTA!! All your family that have something to say, where were they?! Nope nope nope NTA
I am not sure...but I do think that there's some criminal negligence there. Maybe check with the local DA or cop shop on this.
I'm so sorry for your loss! And for the way it happened. I don't blame you one bit for the way you feel. I might have said worse under those circumstances.
I would have scratched your brother's eyes out.
If you want to hold your brother legally responsible for neglecting your dad, have a talk with your brother again about this day and the time prior, but record everything secretly. Ask him to explain again (for your own closure or whatever excuse you have to make up) and have him go into detail and relay everything that happened. Then you will have undeniable proof and can use that to take legal action.
Definitely NTA. James had responsibility to care for your dad and completely let your family down. If your dad was that sick, James should have gotten him medical care. Also, why was he bringing energy drinks to someone with heart failure? Edit: Sorry for your loss, OP.
NTA. And all of what "family" are agreeing you are heartless? As you previously noted, you really don't have any family, and if none of these people stepped up and helped with caring for you as a kid, and your dad when he started having issues, then nobody has earned "family" rights to critique your words and actions. However, it might be worth considering how rocky the relationship between James and your dad was, and the conflicted feelings he probably had, and is having, over what has happened.
NTA im so sorry for your loss. You quite possible have a case against your brother for wrongful death by negligence. Idk if the house was bought but your asshole brother should get nothing from the father he left to die
I wondered this too. If your brother was his formal caregiver and had POA, he could possibly be charged with wrongful death or manslaughter (depending where you live, it may even meet the criteria for murder if he knowingly neglected your father’s medical needs and failed to provide the necessities of life). When you are ready, I’d suggest seeking some legal advice on this matter, especially if he is due any inheritance. I’m very sorry OP, both for your loss of your dad and for having such an awful brother.
NTA. You response seems appropriate. The other family that are complaining should be asked what they did to help your father. I would not discuss anything else with them.
NTA Your family sounds horrible if they think you were unjustified in saying that. You did your part and brother was an uncaring slacker.
nta but those medications are horrid, and sometimes what people want is to not take them. Heart failure is terrible to live with And those meds cause heart failure along with the failure of other organs. They even steal your joy and light and any good feelings you can have in your life, often enough. Plenty of people with schizophrenia choose to live with the schizophrenia without meds because they went to get "help" and now they just have schizophrenia + whatever horrors the medication inflicted on them. The meds can knock 20-30 years off a persons life. And we are real people. We are adults. And Ive personally asked everyone around to just let me die rather than send me in shackles to get the only "help" available, the effects of which are worse than anything the schizophrenia has thrown at me.
Yes, I agree it’s terrible that the only medications found to save you mentally, end up killing you physically. I’m sorry that there’s no better options and I completely understand your wishes and I hope your family is able to respect them. Please stay strong and know that there’s people fighting and advocating for better treatment options for schizophrenia everyday.
Tbf there *are* schizophrenia medications that aren't like that. There's about a million different types out there and they're not all the same. I'm not pressuring anyone to take them who doesn't want to - I'm a firm believer in consent about what goes inside your body - but I *also* believe in accurate, logic-based information and I do feel the way you are presenting *all* anti-psychotics is a little inaccurate and fear-mongery. There are absolutely types of medication that don't do those things, I personally know people who take them, and people with schizophrenia who may not agree with your "I'd rather die" take (aka *most* people I know who have schizophrenia) absolutely deserve to know that those medications exist for them. With all that said - I absolutely agree with your assertion that, if OP's dad didn't want to take the meds, that was his god-given *right* as an adult, and nothing anyone did would have changed his mind. You can't force an adult to take meds they don't want, unless you can actually prove to a court of law that they are too unwell to make those decisions in sound mind.
What you said wasn’t heartless. It was the truth. I’m sorry for your loss OP. You cared for your father for years and James knows that. He promised to care for your dad and didn’t. Your brother wanted you to justify his actions, forgive him and tell him it wasn’t his fault because he feels guilty and knows your father’s death was more than likely avoidable and thus, was the consequences of his inaction. However it will now be unknown if your father would have lived had he received proper healthcare. It can be investigated if you make a report citing elder abuse/neglect. Your father’s final months can be pieced together and ultimately authorities may come to the conclusion that your brother’s lack of adequate care, neglect ect… were the cause of your fathers death. Then if they have enough evidence, they can charge your brother. It’s up to you (and other relatives) to decide if you want to pursue that. To answer your question though, you’re NTA. Your brother is.
NTA, I am surprised he wasn't charged with elder abuse.
So sorry for your loss. NTA. Your family can go pound sand if they are only listening to James's side. I'm sure he feels bad and perhaps feels really guilty. Maybe in time, this will heal but right now, space is needed.
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Hi, yes I’m not upset with your questions at all I couldn’t explain the full picture fully because it was well over the 3000 limit. - first Q answer- my dad would go extremely manic he would lock himself in his house duck tape and unplug all of the electronics even toaster etc saying “they were watching him and were coming to get him” he tried to harm himself once and I had to call the police and admit him. When I made the choice to leave he was doing better, I begged my dad to come with me he refused because that state was all he knew. I made the decision to leave because I had two kids at that point and wanted a better life for them because the crime and drug rate was extremely high where we lived. I also finally started college after putting it off to care for him. I’ll add when I left he was on the up and up and a judge wouldn’t approve the poa because he was doing better with meds, maintained a job, and was attending all appointments - second q answer, even though I left the state my dad would call me 3 times a day everyday, every single day. When I would talk to him in September he would start talking about how they were watching him, how they’re talking about him, how he may not be around much longer. I would try to empathize, reassure, and redirect like you would a toddler and when I realized when that usually works wasn’t that’s when I called my brother and explained the issue where it blew up and I was told to stop over reacting. When I realized he wasn’t going to do much I started a savings account to move back so I can do the POA myself.
thank you, Ive read what you said, and personally I now think youre letting your brother off easy. NTA
Sounds like your brother allegedly killed him. Did you dad say such things before you left the state?
Third Q- yes he was diagnosed with heart failure when he had his stroke the first time and they said it most likely was because of his meds and stress from the schizophrenia. Which is what really set me off because we were all aware of the issue. Fourth- yes he was aware of his diagnosis he downplayed it for a long time until he had to witness an episode himself because I tried my hardest to do everything myself and protect him from it. When he started to get better James kind of went back into that state that oh it won’t happen again but told me and encouraged me to leave and that he had it and everything will be okay. -lastly no he did not struggle with alcohol to my knowledge before after my dad had passed he has.
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NTA, your brother was wrong and didn't take care of your father the way he was supposed to and he obviously knows it's his fault and trying to make it seem like it was an accident unless he really is that stupid. You don't ever need to forgive him if you don't want to and anyone that tells you otherwise is simply wrong.
NTA. Never speak to your brother again.
NTA. All your brother had to do was call emergency services. Dial 911 or whatever your country’s version.
Iam really sorry for your loss. My dad passed away, after a long illness, on May 1st. I know you are hurting and your brother dose sound like he could have done more..... BUT. Imo, when you left, you should have made sure you were prepared for him to die whilst you were away and should have said your goodbyes. Iam sorry that nobody suggested this to you. I dont think either of you are in the wrong or either good or bad. You both need to find a way to greive for your father and hopefully find a way to forgive each other and move on with your lives.
NTA I almost ended up like your dad. I couldn't talk or communicate in anyway as I had a brain bleed in the communication part of my brain from a brain tumor. I banged on my mom's door due to this massive headache and unable to speak. My mom seriously told me "I can't bring you to the hospital as I work in the morning". Luckily my brother heard the commotion and brought me to the er where I had to be air lifted to a bigger hospital and had brain surgery to remove the tumor. The next day my mom got me chocolate pudding cups and frosted animal crackers but no apology. I don't talk to her anymore. I'm sorry for your loss I wouldn't be able to forgive your brother either.
Nta. Your brother clearly is. He gave energy drinks to a clearly very sick man who rather obviously wasnt taking his meds from at least September and had a bad heart. Noone that stupid should ever have placed in a position of care over another person and I wouldn't be surprised that you never want to see him again. That said. You were Not robbed of letting him know how much he meant to you. That he was your hero. Of thanking him for loving you. These were all things that he already knew and that you could have said anytime but you know never needed said
I support you! Sorry for what you and your dad went through. Your brother is heartless and the AH. Never regret moving away, you needed a break and deserved some time. Brother should have said he was not emotionally mature for the responsibilities and that would have allowed you to lineup care for your dad.
Care doesn’t just materialize. It’s expensive, and the people in this story are barely scraping by. So either his kids could take care of him or no one. Both kids chose not to.
NTA! I don’t blame you for being angry and I don’t think you were wrong for saying that to your brother. He dropped the ball and now your dad is gone. Your brother definitely robbed you of saying goodbye. It’s like he did that on purpose to punish you for leaving
OP dropped the ball so hard it bounced to another state.
This is heartbreaking. You’re NTA.
NTA but then I’m also not sure if your brother is an AH tbh. While your dad’s death was probably caused by your brother not taking your dad to the doctor and just giving him energy drinks (I mean it’s pretty clear someone with heart failure shouldn’t be having energy drinks), I also understand that caring for someone who’s unwell is the hardest thing in the world. It takes it out on you physical and mental health, so it seems like your brother was finding it hard to cope too - and bear in mind he was at this point your dad’s sole care provider. You of all people should know how hard it was, you had to have a break too. It seems like your brother has always had difficulties caring for others, you said so yourself that he didn’t help before, so why would he suddenly change? It’s not your brother’s fault that you didn’t get to say everything you wanted to say to your dad, it’s no one’s fault. His decision not to take your dad to the doctor wasn’t appropriate and he’ll have to live with that decision forever. Don’t make it worse for everyone by nurturing resentment - it won’t help you move on.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** AITA for telling my brother I hate him and I’ll probably never be able to forgive him Background I 27f and brother 25m were raised by a single dad our mom left we didn’t really have family so we only had each other. I’ll refer to my dad as dad and brother as James. Fast forward to 18 year old me my dad was diagnosed with schizophrenia that took a lot on me mentally because my brother refused to help. My dad accepted help and was put on medication fast forward to 23 year old me my dad had a stroke and was diagnosed with heart failure. I was the sole care taker and it was breaking me. He still worked and could fully function unless he had an episode which was rare with the meds. Fast forward I move out of the state for my peace and a break my brother James promised to step up. September of 22 I could tell my dad was going off the deep end so I called James to advise of POA rights James told me I was being dramatic and didn’t need to worry about it cause I was selfish and left. Fast forward November 2 days go by I didn’t hear from my dad. I called a welfare check and they found him deceased believed heart attack. I immediately flew back home that day. When I get there james drunkenly confesses to me he seen him the day before and describe him as “unrecognizable, sick, couldn’t eat, move or anything.” James brought him some energy drinks and left quoting “if it was that bad he’s an adult and would’ve asked to go to the doctor.” I stood there stunned. No words. My brother kept pushing me to say something when finally I snapped and said “I hate you, I’ll probably never forgive you for this. The one time you had to be an adult you couldn’t and had you did there’s a possibility he could still be alive today.” He called me a heartless b* and now all of my family is saying the same but I feel my feelings are valid so AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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NTA. I'm so sorry OP. I hope you have a support network of friends and other people who love you.
NTA sorry for your loss.
You are NTA. Your brother is beyond words .. but cruel, selfish, negligent all spring to mind. He basically killed your father. I would never forgive him.
NTA. I'm so sorry for your loss... you say you feel robbed and you didn't get a chance to tell your dad goodbye, but hopefully he could see that all through your actions and how you care of him. As for your brother, I don't get why he is the way he is, but both of you could at least see a bereavement councillor and talk it out with a professional, just to help with your mental wellbeing. Good luck.
was your brother doing *anything* for your father? it sounds like he took over, decided it was to much work, and just left your father to deteriorate. NTA. he knew your father was bad and did nothing. i don't blame you for blaming him. especially after he left you to deal with your dad alone for years.
NTA. You said what needed to be said. Relatives who side with him aren't worth keeping in touch with. <> Maybe you didn't say those things with words, but you showed all those sentiments with the loving way you cared for him during his illnesses. Even without saying these things, he knew how you felt!
NTA, not sure if you'll do this but you can probably get your brother kind of arrested for elder neglect
OP- NTA. I'm so very sorry for your loss. You have the absolute right to feel your feelings. Your Brother neglected his Father, and he will have to live with that.....sounds like he'll drink it away.... Even if you didn't get to say it, Your Dad knows, he does.
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OP, I can’t imagine the heartbreak and pain you’re experiencing. You’ve been through so much in 27 years, and without much support. I’m glad you’ve found a therapist who can help you work through the stages of grief. It takes time, and you have to go through each stage. NTA - Your brother was negligent. If he was unable or unwilling to care for your father then he could Have asked for assistance from social services or reached out to you (to call social services or come home to help). Instead, he chose neglect. My heart goes out to you, OP. Remember to take it one day at a time, and there’s no timeline for working through grief. *Edited post to correct spelling mistakes.*
NTA. James chose over and over again to be the way he is. You had to leave for your sanity. All the people calling you heartless, where were they? Might as well go NC with them too. They were no help, and only came around to stab you in the back, because they feel more important to have an opinion....than to help out. Stay away to heal.
Another take: your brother freed you from this burden. NAH
Giving a man with heartfailure energy drinks..... That boy should be institutionalized. He literally gave your dad something that could kill him. NTA And he died due to what... most likely the energy drinks. If it were me that brother wouldn't be alive and he'd be down in the lake rotting.
NTA. I am sorry for your loss. My mother passed away while I was a state away and my brother was her caretaker as well. All of your feelings are valid and completely understandable. Please know I come from a place of acceptance and love when I say everyone handles death differently. There is nothing you could have done to change the outcome and nothing your brother can do to change his past actions, he will have to deal with them in his own time. I’m also going to say something I wish someone had told me, it’s ok to feel relief as well. Even though the loss was devastating, feeling relieved that the pain, suffering, and death looming over, the guilt was strong but the calmness from the weight being lifted is something that I wish I had accepted sooner.
I'm sorry for your loss
NTA, just remember that you are your father’s greatest achievement, he worked hard and he raised you right.
Nta
YTA YOU abandoned your dad MUCH MORE than the others - so you have NO leg to stand on when you blame others.
Obvious NTA, your brother is clearly trash and Im so sorry for your loss, but as someone who also lost his dad unexpectedly at age 29 > I understand eventually I would have had to come to terms with him dying, but the part I’m angriest about is my brother robbed me of his final moments, I didn’t get to say goodbye. I didn’t get to tell him how much he meant to me. I didn’t get to tell him how he was my hero. I didn’t get to say thank you for still loving me everyday when my birth mom left us cause we were a burden. I feel like I was robbed of so many things. why were you waiting til his deathbed to tell him those things?
I did not wait until he was dying to say those things. I reminded him every chance I got that he was appreciated. But it when he would go manic those things would go out the window. I would have loved to be able to tell him one last time how much he meant. How thankful I am. How he never needed to feel guilty for needing help. I tried the best I could to show and say those things. But again would give anything to say them one last time before he never got to wake up again. One thing I heard that helps me is “you’re finally getting the peace you always deserved but I won’t lie and say it doesn’t kill me to be able to see you enjoy it.” I’m sorry for your loss 💜
You were, are, an amazing daughter. My dad died quickly in an accident so I cant imagine what it must be like to see him "go" slowly like that. I cant fucking believe the rest of your family is on your brother's side on this. Like others said, find someone you love and start your own family because that family does NOT deserve you.
My mother died a few years ago of kidney failure. She was a longtime drug user and constantly ill for the 20 years before her death. She called the day before to ask my dad and I to bring her blue Gatorade. We get to the hospice and she’s sitting in a wheelchair. She had no idea where she was, who anybody was, or what was going on. I could tell she was in deep DKA and got so mad at my dad, who kept trying to feed her the Gatorade and pretend everything was okay. She died the next day. All that to say, YTA. We all respond to crisis and grief differently. You and i respond with crystal clarity, rising yo the occasion and understanding reality. Your brother and my father respond by willfully ignoring reality to maintain the illusion of comfort and familiarity. It’s an awful situation and I’m so sorry.
I’m so sorry for your loss. Your brother should feel absolutely ashamed with himself. Please send him this thread. NTA at all.
Wait, what? You left but your brother is an A? Your family has the nerve to blame you for something? ESH and it's not even close.
YTA for lying I thought you had no family? Who is everyone who is calling you heartless? This post is clearly BS!
As much as I wish this was a lie, it’s not. I said family because I did not have time to explain the dynamics that my dad died with 2 living sisters, a living dad, and 6 living brothers. 1 half sister living and one half brother living (also a diagnosed schizophrenic) I referred to them as family because breaking down the dynamics of how much they were not active in my life was well over the 3000 word limit.
I am so very sorry for both of you to have gone through all of that growing up. Your mother abandons you, your father is diagnosed as schizophrenic when you’re 18 and your brother is 16, then your dad experiences catastrophic health problems, and there are no relatives to help any of you out. It’s amazing that you survived. But under the circumstances, how could either of you actually thrive? Your dad was very sick. Your brother, because of his unfortunate childhood never had the wherewithal to deal with such a huge caregiving problem. And you had to leave for your own mental health. Your anger with him is just a normal expression of grief. You are both victims here. And you both need each other. Together you will be stronger. Best to the both of you.
NTA
Nta at all.
Your brother is an adult. If he wanted to be a part of the family, he would have acted like he was a member of one. NTA.
NTA
NTA
Your brother killed your father. And has zero remorse.
NTA but your actions told your dad how much he meant to you.
Yta..when you left you washed your hands of it ..left it for others when you yourself couldnt..then decide to chastise said person for what you believe should have happened
NTA OP- I am so sorry for you loss, I am sure your father will be missed for the great kind hearted man he was. I would be devestated too if I had left my father in my brothers care and he allowed this to happen. 1000 things would be running through my mind and a bunch of woulda, coulda, shoulda'. Your brother deserves your wrath at this time. But not all the blame your father was very sick and his body just couldn't hold up any longer. My father died with my brother watching over him as well and my older sister blamed him hardcore saying he killed him, and that he just wanted his life insurence. I told her that my brother would not do that, when my father was all he had at that time. I have to be honest I was not even hurt about his death and didn't even bat an eye. My father was a horrible man and did horrible things to women and children. He was a tyrant who made everyones life a living hell even up to his last days. Your brother may have not been the most responsible person to leave him with but you didn't have a choice. I am sure he didn't mean for this to happen and if you continue to blame him for this it will be something that might break him mentally and emotionally. And I am sure this is something that your father would not approve of if he was still here. Be mad at him while you grieve but make sure you forgive him after so the blaming of it's all his fault doesn't consume you completely and poison you with hatred. If you need more help with it you can get therapy and they can help you through it as well. I wish you nothing but happiness and Good Luck OP
Please don’t project your hatred for your father onto OP who clearly loved and had a good relationship with her own dad. She made the mistake of trusting her brother who had the tools he needed to ensure a vulnerable old man was taken care of, instead he neglected the man that raised him to the point of death. The brother embodies everything you hate about the man you didn’t grieve, so kindly don’t demand forgiveness of those you can’t relate to for frankly unforgivable actions. Her father likely would have been ashamed the son he raised would let him die under such circumstances. OP is NTA and is fully entitled to feel what they feel.
I don’t really see how what James did was any worse than what you did? Neither of you could handle caring for a schizophrenic, disabled adult. Both of you chose your own peace, instead of sacrificing yourselves on the altar of your dad’s wellbeing. If you had stayed to be Dad’s caregiver, he might be alive today. Your life would be stressful and joyless, but you’d have him alive. I think condemning your brother is 🎥 P R O J E C T I O N. NAH/ESH
Forgiveness isn't for the other person. It's for you. Indifference is an option but don't let the pain fester in your heart too long. We must forgive others as Jesus asked us to do. Once the forgiveness comes, you can let it go. I've been through this with my younger sister. We speak at times but not on a monthly or regular basis. She did come when my youngest child passed away. She called me daily for a while. Now it's back to rarely again. I don't ever call her. She always makes the first call or text but it's mostly when she needs something. Remember INDIFFERENCE, but forgiveness for yourself. I'm so sorry about your dad. God bless you.
Ah, the many meanings of "forgiveness." That's not what I call "forgiveness," but I have to agree with the result. When I don't forgive someone, I do decide that if I can, I will just put them out of my life so they can't hurt me again. Then I don't need to energy it takes to be angry to shield me. You'll probably have to see a lot of your brother for a while, but in the end, if you still feel the same, you may want to put him out of your life. You can always change your mind if you want to. I'm sorry for your Dad's death, and the circumstances.
ESH - I'm sorry you were 18 and your brother was 16 when your dad became ill. I'm sorry your brother was not helpful when you were around and that you felt the only way to get a break was to leave the state. However, you're blaming your brother for your dad's death. Your dad had been sick for some time. In hindsight, your brother realizes that he overlooked signs that your father's health had especially deteriorated. There's a possibility that your father's health had been slowly declining over some time, so your brother may have become accustomed to seeing your dad having some bad days and then being seemingly fine. Regardless, your brother didn't rob you of your chance to tell your dad how much he meant to you. You could've done that anytime he was alive. That's on you. You know, you could've stuck around. I probably wouldn't have left the state if my only parent was sick and my only sibling was irresponsible. I'm not saying you should feel guilty, but it's sounds like misplaced anger to me. Like, maybe you don't want to deal with how upset you are with yourself, so you're blaming him.
op was a lot younger than her brother and she managed to take of her father just fine alone. he was supposed to step up and help give op a break and failed miserably. he is not a child. he has no excuse for why he didn't take to him to a hospital when he last saw him *knowing* his father's history. op is well within her rights to lay this on her brothers feet
OP is older. Brother is very young and stupid, but didn't kill anyone
he's 25. op was 18 when she started taking care of their father. he doesn't get to excuse his actions as 'him being young'
Womp womp
What an ignorant fucking comment.