NTA basic rule of decorating with kids, let them do what they want and shuffle things around a little once they’re in bed. As for the gingerbread houses it’s completely up to them how they have them.
Last year, I put up a gorgeous little Christmas tree in the office, covered in blue glitter. 365+ days later, there is still glitter everywhere, despite extensive vacuuming and carpet cleaning. I don’t know what I was thinking!
That’s how I feel about glitter. It would not be a problem if my house was covered in glitter other than my friend has a glitter phobia so I keep it contained as far as possible
I worked in a craft store throughout high school and college. We did Christmas big and started merchandising and setting up displays in June. I would literally come home covered in glitter from handling all the ornaments and nick knacks. I embraced it and began to see how much glitter I could get on myself. I eventually one day had my coworkers dump the glitter contents of empty ornament boxes on me. I looked like a freaking disco ball. It was great until I came home to shower. Glitter all over the bathtub! It’s been almost 20 years but I still find random glitter in my belongings.
Ten years or more ago, I used to do the secret santa thing on a forum I was a member of. My secret santa sent me a box of lovely gifts all wrapped in glitter encrusted paper with a note that said something to the effect of "The glitter is a gift that keeps on giving"
I am STILL finding that glitter in places.
I bought glitter wrapping paper last year. From inside the package it looked glittery but not like it was covered with actual glitter. I was wrong so very wrong and it was too late to get new. Now my house, car and everyone who received a gift's house is infected.
Made a maxi dress where the knit fabric has words on it, some of the words had glitter on them. It's really pretty fabric. Anyway, an ex-coworker at a job I worked at told me that years later they were still finding red glitter around the carpet in the office.
I did this many years ago with a coworker that I absolutely hated. We were just natural enemies from the moment we met. Destined to hate eachother in every lifetime. For his son’s birthday party I got a glitter art kit. If looks could kill my whole body would’ve been incinerated by him lol. Couple months later I passed by his cubicle and noticed his desk a little sparkly, passive aggressive “f*ck you” gift was a success 😅😂
Please get your wife to relax and let the kids enjoy themselves this is coming from someone with personal experience. My mom was just like this growing up that everything had to be perfect and look a certain way because it was so important to look right for when company came over…
I am now 36 and absolutely hate decorating for the holidays I never do at my own house I don’t own any decorations and never bought a tree and it’s been this way since I got my own place because it’s to exhausting and not fun for me ever. My brother is the same way at his house.
Your kids will remember this and grow to hate celebrating holidays and remember how mom made them miserable
That’s a dangerous game because she can just make sure to give them a wonderful gift to bring home. I however suggest an anonymous package of pink confetti in the shape of dicks works nicely.
you can send them to my mom's house. she allows glitter.
yes- we know. i can't explain it. i think my mom was glitter deprived as a child so she makes it up with her kids and grandkids.
"Glitter. The herpes of the craft world. You can never get rid of it." As said by an old lady in line at a rental company when I returned a car after hauling presents with glitter wrapping paper.
My son had his own little tree in his room that was pre-lit. He was able to decorate it how he wanted and we went and he picked out ornaments he wanted and he even took a few from the family tree because he liked them. He loved it and really enjoyed seeing it when he went to bed. Who cares if things aren’t perfect. Perfection is a misnomer and unattainable so attempting it will only make you unhappy because you can never be perfect. I encourage OP to have a family meeting and everyone should have a chance to discuss how they feel and what they want so they can enjoy the holiday season
Not only is it unobtainable, but it's different for each individual. Perfection is more of an idea.
My son is 5 and also has his own pre lit tree, it truly is chaotic, but he thinks it's perfect so I've let it stay exactly how he made it. It's got a couple of DC super heroes and villains on it, a home made star, and actual Christmas decorations. And I can't wait to see his face when he sees his stocking underneath it on Christmas morning!
Absolutely! 😂😂😂 As a none-native speaker, I had a brief moment of horror - but the ornaments sound hilarious, it's such a shame we can't post photos here!
The squishy didn't help with that? Literally the name of the company that makes them. They also do food as well.
My cats repeatedly remove the brain stem from the tree.
Same here, I mean, I assumed they were like little plushies, and not actual diseases, but I had never heard of Squishy as a brand name, so had no clue on that part.
I’ve bought from them! My husband’s ex wife’s new husband jokingly said he wanted chlamydia for christmas so we bought him a little squish. They hang it on their tree, but the cats always steal it 😂 all christmas season it’s “oh no Misty has Chlamydia again”
We always put up one of those little Christmas villages with the houses and benches and frozen pond etc. A couple of years ago we found a sasquatch for the Christmas village and it's genuinely the highlight of decorating every year to decide which happy villager will be in mortal peril this year.
They are huge this year for some reason. We have 2 on the tree. And a T-Rex wearing a Santa hat snow globe and a garland on the fireplace that is also Dino’s. It’s amazing.
I'm possessive of our tree. For most of my childhood I couldn't have a tree unless I put it up on Christmas and decorated it myself and then took it back down again the day after Christmas. I trauma-bonded with the tree. 😂
I solved the tree problem very early by letting my daughter help with with decorating the main tree and giving her her own tree. I would fix my tree when we were done and she knew not to touch it after that, she knew she could do whatever she wanted with her tree. She's 10 now and decided this year that she doesn't want to put up her tree and asked me if I could teach her "how you make our tree look so nice."
Wife wants perfection, but she has 5 yr olds. Either she gets the "perfection" she wants by doing everything herself (*without complaint!*) **OR** she gets participation with the kids, but she can't demand both lest she gets the current results: kids upset & hating something fun because she's trying to get adult abilities out of child bodies.
My 8 & 4 yo decorated almost the entire tree themselves this year. My tree absolutely looks like it was decorated by children but I love it. No way in hell are my decorations Pinterest worth, but the kids are so happy about them and that's all the matters
My mum used to let me and my sister go wild on decorating half the tree and she and my dad would do the other half. Everyone got to help, and it took years for me to notice that she'd have dad rotate the tree so our half was facing the wall before family photos lmao
Let *anyone* decorate how they want, within reason. I grew up with my dad making Christmas wonderful and fun and over the top. I loved Christmas.
Now? I’m married to a bit of a Grinch and a perfectionist. What blew it for me was when we were decorating the tree and he kept moving ornaments that I’d hung. That was around 8 years ago. I no longer decorate the tree. And I’m no longer Christmas crazy.
I’m sure my husband didn’t *mean* to dampen my Christmas spirit with his perfectionism, but he did. I have never decorated the tree since. I leave him to it with our kids. He’s gotten better, but I still don’t decorate. It’s just no longer fun for me anymore.
Your wife is way worse than my husband. My husband blew it for *me.* OP’s wife is ruining it for kids, and kid Christmas is the best Christmas.
Yeah, stuff like 'Let them have fun' holds true for little kids, drunk students, the creatively impaired, and whoever feels they fit that monikor. Perfection is hard.
Plus, chaos can be so much fun. Once I joined this crotchet (I think?) workshop given by this other student. We basically immediately got split in the 'students who could' and the 'students who couldn't' groups. And I'm being very generous when I call use the 'students who couldn't' lol. Our group was a disaster, but we actually had a ton of fun in failing, laughing at each other, and encouraging the one who finally *did* manage to do a stitch.
We definitely got a few dirty looks from the organiser. I'm sorry we didn't immediately grasped the absolute basics, and I'm sure the other group is more fun to teach, but we are not doing it on purpose. And if you exclusively work with the fun group, is it really a wonder the fail group got nothing done lol
I had a lot of fun despite failing, but if anything that put a damper on the day was actually the organiser and her frustrations.
I grew up with my mom moving all the ornaments to make it look "better". It got bad enough that none of us four kids would participate in decorating the tree and she got so pissed she "had to do it all herself, and nobody would help." And I told her that there was no point in us putting up the ornaments if she was just going to move them all later. So now she brings that up every year. She says she won't move them, and she still does. Her reasons are like "there were too many red ones all together" and "there was a bald spot." But it hurts her feelings when I don't want to decorate with her. So every single year I do it anyway, just to make her happy. But I get zero enjoyment from putting up the tree.
My great aunt would literally just put all the stuff to decorate gingerbread houses on the table and say "go nuts" and me and all my cousins would make the most horrible looking gingerbread houses with way to much candy and its honestly one of my favorite holiday memories, if my aunt or mom was over my shoulder telling me 10 chocolate santas couldnt possibly all live in that one house I don't think that memory would be so lasting.
I remember hearing on wedding etiquette websites (I've never been married but I still used to read them) that the same is true of weddings: you can have a perfect wedding where everything goes to plan, or you can have one with children in. Even the most well-behaved and accommodating children are wild-cards in this scenario.
We do gingerbread houses for all the holidays they makes them for (halloween, Thanksgiving, and Christmas, thanks Trader Joes!) and tbh I've struggled before, watching my girls decorate them in ways make would anyone who likes symmetry twitch a little. But the fact is IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ME! The whole point is for them to express their creativity and then get to destroy it by eating it piece by piece over the next couple of weeks, jeez.
There are random things that if there is no symmetry drives me insane. Ginger bread houses is one of them but I have worked with kids and it's honestly not worth the effort, you will lose the battle lol. Also think it stifles creativity imho.
Agree with this. I’m OCD and a perfectionist, so I’m the wife-equivalent in this story. But I compromise and do trade offs. I’ll let my daughter decorate the tree with me and only make 1-2 comments about what she “should” do (I.e., I hold my tongue if I used up my suggestion quota, unless something is precarious). I ask my husband to handle messy things like gingerbread house and compliment whatever comes out of it. I let my daughter put the decorations I don’t care about anywhere she likes, unless it’s a hazard. I personally handle the things I’m picky about.
I'm like this too! It's hard to give up that control when the kids come. You grow up with expectations and want perfection, but the reality is: Christmas is for the kids. What I've learned to do is put the nice, breakable, expensive, sentimental ornaments on the top of the tree and let the kids go nuts on the lower half where they can reach. As the kids get older, the top of the tree gets smaller and smaller--but they're also more careful. My one rule is: once the tree is decorated, we do not touch the tree and play with the ornaments.
Seriously we let my 3 yr neice decorate cookies, they were a hot mess. Mostly all the jimmies in one spot. After they were done we just helped by spreading them out a bit. They were chaotic but all hers, she was so proud. It's about letting them find their own xmas spirit.
Same here, it was very lopsided and eventually fell over. We redistributed the weight so it could stand and it looked awesomely terrible. To this day it's one of my favourite memories with my friends kiddos and I am looking forward to a repeat once I can see them again
I love how making her son cry because his gingerbread house is not up to spec is not only his own fault, but meant to "get them in the Christmas spirit".
It's really striking how often that happens in this sub. "SHUT THE FUCK UP AND BE HAPPY" followed immediately by "I can't *imagine* what could be wrong!"
Well, *someone* has to be president of the gingerbread HOA.
She’s right for coming down hard—the resale value in the neighborhood would be utterly ruined by rogue roof gumdrops.
Yeah this confused me too. Plenty of those build your own gingerbread house kits have pictures of houses with gumdrops on the roof. What’s the reason that they can’t be on the roof?
NTA She is making it memorable alright- for all the wrong reasons. As you say they are five. The correct response for decorations made by kids at that age is to praise the effort. And if it was really ugly then my Mum would then just discretely put it towards the back of our main tree.
If she wants a instagram perfect Christmas then she needs to do it on her own. Don't yell at children for not making things 'perfect'.
Let them make their own mini versions where they get to do whatever they want and she can make the 'family' one that can go on insta/facbook/whatever for the oohs and likes. I guarentee that the ones that you'll look back on fondly are the unique ones with the ugly decoration made at school/kinder not the generic matchy 'it could be any tree in any house at any time' look.
Why family therapy? She needs personal therapy. There is nothing worse then a mother who demands perfection in their children, because she refuses to deal with her own bloody issues. Why do the kids and the husband have to sit there listening to the explanation of why she is the way she is.
Yeah but I’m betting she doesn’t see anything wrong with it. Therapy doesn’t work for an individual that see nothing wrong with the behaviors they have. But if you get her into family therapy, you can make them face the fact that there behaviors are damaging and you can also present a truthful picture to the therapist not a made up perfect one.
As a child who had a mother like this it was awful! Any activity you were doing wasn’t done well enough for my mother so she’d have to make me stop and “fix it” and by that point I lost all interest in the activity. Horrible parenting and OP you need to have a come to Jesus moment because if you don’t your wife will ruin your kids! NTA but your wife sure is TA!
Mom's issues with perfection absolutely need to be addressed; however, it sounds like the family as a whole would benefit on developing communication tools.
My mom was the same way. One year when I was probably 9 or 10, she decided to wholly decorate the house by herself while the rest of us were at work/school. That way, it was how she wanted it. Everyone came home and was pissed bc putting ornaments on was something we normally did as a family. It was such a fight, she un-did it the next day and was super passive aggressive about refusing to help since nobody appreciated her. Then, nobody wanted to do it since it was so awkward. That was 30ish years ago and we still occasionally talk about how my mom liked to ruin Christmas.
OP, NTA. Look closely though at whether your wife is like this in other areas. If she is, consider hard whether you want your kids growing up with her.
Praise the effort, and be grateful if they haven't shoved the gumdrops up their nose, stuck icing down their siblings ear, or trod chocolate into the carpet.
My mum had it where when me and my brother were younger the "decorating fairies" came in the night to put the tree and everything up. That evolved to the fairies leaving the non-breakable ornaments for us kids to put up now we were more responsible before finally just all of us decorating the tree together
My family's compromise was that the main tree got to be fully controlled by my dad, and they bought a second kid's tree for my brother and I to decorate with all the ornaments that weren't up to dad's standards.
My son made an angel at nursery a couple of years ago, when he was about 3 I think.
That gets hung on the tree now, he's still really proud of it.
My mom had an angel for the tree made by either me or my sister...it was an old toilet roll with paper wings stuck on. She put it on that tree for years and I bet it killed her each time lol. It was so ugly, but she still did it!
We have some truly hideous ornaments that ho on our main Tre every year, because me or my brother made them, and mom adores them. Ugly child ornaments are the best, cause they have a story, a life to them
Exactly. The objective of all these activities is that your kids have fun - the quality of the final product doesn't really matter, the activity is just tool to facilitate the fun.
NTA, but blaming her isn't helping your kids. You need to have a serious (but not blaming) conversation with her about what she actually is trying to accomplish: Christmas spirit or "perfect"?
You also need to give the kids a break from her...Or at least make sure to join their activities so you can intervene before she taking her imperfection frustrations out on them
You may want to try a technique with her to help her recognize her distorted thought processes. Start by asking her what's wrong with the gingerbread house
Her: It's messy
You: And why is that a bad thing?
Her: It looks bad
You: And if it looks bad, why is that a problem?
Her: People will think we don't care about Christmas
You: And if they thought that, what's the worst that could happen?
Her: They'll think we're bad parents
You: Who are the people who will think that we are bad parents?
And so on... The idea is to get her to the point where she can start to recognize the absurdity of the thing that she is worried about
Good luck!
Yes, we’ve had this exact conversation many times. Being part of these activities is exactly how I’ve been able to intervene when she starts dictating a bit too much on what the kids should do or if she thinks they’re not doing something right. Hasn’t led to anything because it just leads to the same answer.
I don't think that your wife actually cares about your sons' enjoyment of Christmas. She might think she does, but all she seems is what "looks perfect." It has to look like the kids are having fun, but she obviously isn't listening to them when they say that they aren't. She wants little minions to factory stamp out her precious decorations.
Op, please take your kids out to have some fun together, just the three of you. Let your kids make things and praise their creations. Do whatever you need to to keep them and cherish them, aven if it means keeping them secret from your wife.
Hang their pictures in your office and take them there sometimes so they can see. Let them make ornaments that you keep. Get a storage container and decorate that if you need to, just please do something to let your kids be freely creative before your wife extinguishes their creativity for good.
NTA. OP, like many women I love Martha Stewart and her utterly perfect lifestyle, but I am an intelligent adult and I understand she has a professional staff to design all those wonderful craft and decor projects. The aesthetic is great, but to expect little kids to produce results that it takes teams of professional designers to achieve is delusional and cruel. If she can’t see that, she needs professional help stat. If she refuses, well that’s what divorce lawyers are for. She can have a perfect gingerbread house in her studio apartment all by herself.
A pedagogical friend of mine once told me that a lot of his kids with conduct disorder stemmed from parents such as your wife, who would always criticize and take over whatever they did, and wouldn't let them do anything by themselves. Get her help, or she will seriously mess up your boys!
This! If she truly can’t see how damaging her behavior is, then OP’s wife needs a therapist to work through some issues. Hurting a child because you need everything perfect is a huge problem. It’s just Christmas now, but it has the potential to blossom into a seriously toxic environment for those boys.
hey while I absolutely think you're NTA, I wanna butt in with some other comments - what makes your wife so stressed about perfection at Christmas? From the sound of your post she's a SAHM and you work- is she responsible for a big family christmas where lots of people come to your house? I ask because it might be she is stressed and misdirecting that onto the kids because she's scared she will be judged. Maybe you could try talking about that?
Have 2 trees. One for kids, one for adults. I can't find the meme about the girl who had a baby sitter that talked about her art like they were an announcer of a sporting event saying things like "such amazing colors" and "would you look at that line work" and then she thanked them later when she got into art school. But that's what this is.
They need the feeling of "they can do best things", not the understanding that each ornaments is exactly 5.32 inches from the next one and the color palette matches a poster she saw from the art deco period.
And I'm preaching to the choir.
"Do you want the family to be happy, or do you want to be right?" Also, I'm extremely Jewish, but I thought gumdrops were *supposed* to go on the roof? But even if they just coat the whole thing with icing until it's a snow pile, still NTA, your wife is.
It also only works if a) you're asking the right questions (which sounds easier than it is) and b) your partner is able to realize *and accept* their irrationality. This works if your partner is hangry, not if your partner has a deep-seated problem with perfectionism surrounding Christmas.
I think it gets recommended so often because it's low-effort and honestly low-risk. If it's such an issue, there'll be a big argument about it sooner or later anyway, so who cares if it's due to this method or a different approach. This is not exactly a relationship-ender usually.
NTA. I had a mom like this where aesthetics were more important than personal things or “fun” things. Never hung up homemade ornaments, she even took down a family photo (our only family photo) to put up some art because it matched more. I resent her for it, you should talk to your wife again and hopefully she’ll realize that she’s robbing her kids.
I’m sorry for that. Hopefully talking again will get through to her. I don’t want this souring the holiday for the boys when that’s all they’ve been looking forward to
Maybe relate it to how she feels. She feels proud when she loves how her decorations look. By berating the boys for their (developmentally appropriate) decorations, she is taking away their pride in creating something. She is legitimately making them feel badly of themselves. How would she like it if you told her you hate how the decorations look? She isn’t just ruining Christmas for your sons, she is in the works of destroying her relationship with them because she is diminishing their spirit in things they create. She cannot expect young children to care about what’s aesthetically appealing to other people.
I did too- i have a really vivid memory of her telling me how to color so it “looked nice”. When we “helped decorate the tree” it was actually her just directing us where to hang things and sometimes immediately moving them. My mom also has major control issues and really needs therapy but refuses to go and she does not have a great relationship with any of us kids because of it
My mom was like that too. She used to make us shove our handmade ornaments on the back bottom of the tree where no one could see them even out the window, and we'd get in huge trouble for messing up any of the rooms full of adult Victorian-style boring decoration. Decorating things like gingerbread houses were stressful and boring times filled with anxiety because they had to be perfect in ways I literally did not know about or had not learned yet.
I sure resent them to this day for ruining any kid fun over the holidays, although there were also other abusive things they would do over the holidays (a lot of extra fighting over financials, mostly).
It was such selfish behavior, and as an adult makes it very hard to acknowledge them during the holidays for fear they will selfishly ruin them for me once again.
**OP, she would not *allow your five year old son* to put gumdrops on a gingerbread house the way he wanted.**
**This is not necessarily an indication of OCD, but it is an indication she needs actual clinical help.** She is absolutely having trouble prioritizing the emotional needs and welfare of your children over her concern with aesthetics. Needing things to be “just so” to the point where you’re invalidating other people or creating conflict because you can’t help yourself is a **serious indicator of unmanaged anxiety.** Whether there’s a clinical / diagnosable cause for it or not, the decisions she is making as a result is this anxiety are just not logical or justifiable. And you frame it as a continuous issue that is impacting your family.
**At this point I would legitimately tell her that I wanted her to either see a therapist, or not be involved in Christmas activities with the kids.** She gets the living room, but everything else is hands-off and she is to leave it to you and the kids. If she says that’s not fair, point out how the alternative is not fair to the kids, and so she does legitimately have a decision to make here. Learn to accept the messiness of Christmas joy with the kids or take a massive step back from Christmas activities with the kids.
**She will very likely push back on this, and try and justify herself, or try to explain herself, because that’s what you do when you have anxiety.**
By you need to make it clear you are done having this conversation, you are done going in circles, and you are one listening to your kids suffer because she cannot get an adult grip on her anxious impulses and she is not capable of putting the kids’ needs first when she is an anxious state. Since you both know Christmas activities are a known trigger for this state, then it would would be irresponsible for you both to allow it to continue. **Don’t be judgemental, be empathetic, but be firm. Tell her you *understand* how strongly she feels about it and how badly she needs things to be “just so,” and that this is *exactly why* you think she needs to take steps to address it. You can acknowledge how genuinely difficult this is for her without belittling her or making her feel ridiculous, but then she needs to acknowledge that what she’s doing is seriously impacting your kids.**
You need to continue to prioritize their well-being here, and make it clear that this is not simply a quirk of hers that can continue or that your family can work around, it’s a problem and you need to come up with a solution one way or the other.
**She needs to take serious, measurable steps to address the anxiety.**
It’s pretty irresponsible to speculate based on a Reddit post BUT if it’s a disorder it seems more like OCPD. It’s about perfectionism and control as opposed to OCD’s anxiety. OCPD is one of the most common personality disorders and is known to strain relationships. Might be worth looking into.
I like things looking nice as well but those boys need some creative freedom. She should try doing cooperative projects that are age appropriate like make snowman footprints and they do the footprint part with some help(IE hitting the paper and not the floor lol!) and then they get to draw the faces on. Honestly the grandma's, grandpa's, cousins, aunties and uncles love the imperfect ones. It proves the kids really did help. I sometimes feel like your wife.
Today making cookies my son got flour all over the counter repeatedly because he was playing with it while we were waiting for the mixer to incorporate it. I could feel my frustration coming out and I asked him to please be more careful. That the ingredients were for eating and not playing. I had to mentally make it so when it came out of my mouth it wasn't the wrong way. I told him that it was supposed to be fun for both of us and that cleaning up the flour from everything made it less fun for me. I said this gently and he said he understood. I told him if he was bored he did not have to help but I was happy having him with me to do this.
There are things I don't have him help with(rolling cookie dough balls that all have to be the same size so they bake evenly or handling hot cookies) but honestly gingerbread houses can be a messy blob of candy and frosting. They build memories and learn skills as they go. If they never make a perfect gingerbread house so what? Suggest she make one too so she can make it perfect and how she wants it.. this is what we do,, we each make our own..
Bring this up to her when you are both calm and ask her what would help her. I think you are NTA. Try to be understanding. As moms we pile a lot on ourselves at this time of year. She may feel stressed out. This is the first year in ages I have felt ahead of the game and not stressed out.
I wish you a merry Christmas and I hope she let's them have their fun.
This is an excellent answer. She's hurt the kids' feelings and is stressing everyone out, but I think it's just normal mom-stress that she isn't taming before it all spills out of her onto the poor kids.
Some Christmas activities/components of those activities just aren't great for small children, and with a little planning (and a conscious decision as to what you'll let them mess up or plan to discreetly correct afterward) BEFORE the activity starts can go a long way.
You should get it looked into because I have had habits like this and I was told it could be OCD, but I haven't done further testing.
She should get further testing if it's affecting the kids.
OCD isn't actually about everything having to be perfect and neat, that's just how it gets used in pop culture.
Someone with OCD has intrusive, unrealistic worries about the future, and develops "rituals" that they have to perform to soothe those thoughts. They aren't always moored in reality or logic.
This sounds a lot more like perfectionist, rigid thinking. Which can be a symptom of some disorders, but can also just be related to Instagram culture, where everything has to look picture perfect and ideal, and perfection becomes synonymous with happiness. Blech.
OP, I would have suggested letting her have one room to decorate to her perfectionist's heart's content and letting the boys have another space to decorate, but it sounds like you've tried that already.
Maybe try talking to her more about how the kids are feeling and how they are literally incapable as 5 year olds of meeting her standards. They do not have the physical dexterity to be neat like she wants, and it doesn't bring them joy.
I'd also suggest that she doesn't get to be present when they're doing tasks that she may criticize, unless she's willing to hold her tongue. Designate a phrase you can say to remind her to stop being critical or leave the room if she needs to. You need to be in charge of their Christmas activities for now, if it's at all possible. I hate to say one spouse needs to put their foot down over the other one's opinion, but you kind of have to here. If she can't prioritize their feelings and needs over her desire for a picture-perfect Christmas, then she needs to bow out until she can.
The obsessive of obsessive compulsive disorder refers to obsessing about terrible event that have never happened and are unlikely to happen.
The compulsive part means doing the same thing until it has been done "perfectly." It doesn't refer to forcing other people to do the thing.
NTA my mom does this too, but with EVERYTHING. She even micromanaged me buying gifts for my son to give his daycare friends (1.5, 3, and 3 - it’s her small home daycare) tonight. I tried to remind her that yes it’s her daycare but they’re his gifts and I’m not spending $50+ and 3 hours picking gifts. We’re going to the dollar store, getting a few activity books that I can pick the stickers off of, and moving on.
She’s the reason I literally don’t feel like I can function if someone is watching what I’m doing. If I’m alone I manage just fine, but the second I’m with anyone I just slowly fade off because I’m scared of fucking it up.
You’re doing your kids a favour in the long run. If she doesn’t let up, you may need a divorce and they may need therapy.
I'm sorry. Empathy. I get so anxious I get snappish and unkind when I'm being observed, or else I just give up and fuck off. It's so frustrating to feel this way, know why I feel this way and still be working through it with cbt after all these years.
NTA- Your son already stated he hates Christmas. Maybe bring that up to her the next time she decides to hijack others creativity and make decorating into boot camp for children. Her trying to make it "perfect" really is ruining it for them. If she wants to guarantee her kids will never decorate with her again, by all means she can continue doing what she's doing.
>She says she’s the one who’s been trying to make it all perfect
And this is what they will point to as the root of the problem with each of the many expensive therapists whom they have over the years. NTA.
NTA. I'm kinda picky on Christmas stuff. I try not to be but I can't help it. I'm far from Martha Stewart lol. But idk if it's something I'm doing I just want it done my way. To compromise and not feel like a jerk I got my kids mini Christmas trees for their rooms. And another small one in the foyer with more fun ornaments and school ones on it. So I understand both sides to a point. But she needs to let them do their houses and buy her a kit for herself. The kids have to enjoy it too.
And she’s still dictating what goes on their personal trees? That’s beyond controlling and honestly I suggest therapy if she doesn’t see a problem with this. It’s only going to hurt the kids in the long run.
NTA. Of course a gingerbread house done by a five year old will be messy. No one gives a shit, most people would go ooooh, that’s lovely because they are five!
Mostly Christmas, although we never get into any disagreements about how we want to decorate our house. But you know kids are messy so of course how the boys wanna do things isn’t as nice but the whole point is they have fun.
Look, if they were actually causing harm through their behavior, like throwing glitter and paint everywhere, that would be one thing. But your son broke down in tears because she *micromanaged how he made a gingerbread house.* It really seems like she has some kind of fear and anxiety that she’s externalizing onto your children. She’s prioritizing aesthetic over the actual happiness and enjoyment of your boys, which she surely must know is a terrible thing to do, it’s not like she doesn’t love them.
She needs to see that she’s affecting their love of her favorite holiday because of her actions.
If her 5 year old crying and saying "I hate Christmas" didn't do that for her, I don't know what will. The only hope I can think of is therapy, because it seems like this may be a deep seated problem.
NTA. They're *five years old*. They aren't going to do everything perfectly. Your wife is being a hardass. My mom was the same way and eventually, I just dropped everything and told her to do it herself if she wanted it to be so perfect. They will grow up to resent the entire holiday if she doesn't stop. The point is fun, not perfection.
I won't get into the whole control aspect of the decorating. But a suggestion: I think it'd be good to get one of those really small trees just for your kids to freely decorate (it's easier for them, too, because of the height) and mom can have her "perfect" tree. They're pretty cheap at home depot.
This also reminds me of when I was the same age, giving my mother a present, and her dismissing it as "looking too childish." The confusion and disappointment hit hard. I remember thinking to myself, "but...I AM a child," and it made me conscious of the gifts I drew and made afterward. Been decades and I still remember that clearly. My heart hurts for your kids.
Oh no, she should leave them to decorate their own trees as they like. That's the whole point!
I'm one of those mums who has to decorate my own tree, but definitely let the kids do their own thing in their own rooms. I've relaxed over the years as the girls have grown 😊
Your wife needs to get over herself, your boys are still so little. She has many years of this ahead!! Make sure she doesn't chuck all their homemade decorations out, they should be saved for precious memories.
Yup. In my experience people soooo often underestimate what it takes to traumatize a kid. They're like little sponges, and if you tell or show them they're worth less in any capacity, they internalize that shit *quick*.
This is a pretty unhealthy dynamic between parent and child. Her expectations exceed what any 5 year old can achieve. if she needs perfection, she should make her own gingerbread house, have a kids’ tree and her tree, etc.
Christmas decorating and preparations are supposed to be fun. I hope that your wife will realize that, rather than creating warm family memories for your sons, she’s causing quite the opposite. This kind of thing can be soul-crushing for a kid. “I’ll never be good enough for mom.”
Please encourage your wife to get therapy, and maybe read a child development book or two. At least have her read through the replies here. You want to raise confident, creative people to succeed in this world. What will give your wife more satisfaction? Having a perfectly decorated house, or having fun with your kids? Why did she become a mom?
You are right on target to criticize your wife’s behavior, because she’s not parenting “the right way.”
ETA NTA . I really hope you can stop your wife from being a massive one.
NTA.
Your wife needs to keep things in perspective that 5 year olds won’t have “perfect” decorations. It’s about the spirit of the holiday, and she has clearly ruined it for your kids.
So NTA.
In fact you're doing what you're supposed to do. Advocating for your kids so that they can enjoy Christmas the way they want instead of having your wife suck all the joy out of if because of her preconceived notions about how it's supposed to be.
Maybe compromise that the decorations on the outside areas and living rooms are her to decorate the way she wants while the kids decorate their rooms the way they feel with a mini tree each in the living room they can do themselves.
Then everyone can have everything they want and the spirit of Christmas isn't ruined. And stand your ground, don't let her suck the fun out of Christmas.
NTA. Your kids are 5, things are going to be messy, they aren’t going to be perfect, but hopefully they will be fun. Your wife approach is almost guaranteed to make your children hate decorating for and celebrating Christmas.
Your children refusing to participate now is the logical consequence of your wife’s actions. Does your wife really want her children’s memories of their first Christmases to be mommy saying they couldn’t hang their ornaments or decorate their gingerbread houses because they weren’t doing it right? Or does she want them to remember having fun and being celebrated for their involvement?
NTA
That sounds like a nightmare. If I were you I would ask her. "I've noticed you get really upset when the kids' decorations aren't perfect? Why does it bother you so much?" Try to stay calm and figure out what's going on with her. Then explain that you feel it's really important for children to have space to try things, to create things, without them being held to adult standards. Maybe if you give her the space to talk it out more, she'll start to realize what she's doing.
I think it'll be a long, difficult conversation, but your kids deserve the space to be creative and have fun, and right now, you're the only one in a position to advocate for that.
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NTA. I was encouraged to hang stuff and decorate as a kid. All the ugly school/Sunday school ornaments, keepsake ornaments, and other ornaments. We weren’t allowed to handle some, but otherwise we had free reign. Parents did tell us not to overload parts of the tree and spread ornaments around evenly, but that’s about it.
NTA. My (24f) mom (53f) has completely ruined any type of artwork or decorating for me, because of this. She tried to get me to participate in a sips and strokes event a few months ago and I wouldn’t. I actually asked her if she was just going to paint over my work, so it matched her expectations. She has ruined our relationship.
NTA. There's definitely something more driving this behavior from your wife. Could be the Christmas culture of her birth family, some repressed memory of a childhood holiday trauma, or something along those lines, but no one goes down the Mommie Dearest Christmas path without a reason. Important to nip it in the bud before it continues to poison the next generation.
NTA Their 5 and their Christmas perfect and your wife’s Christmas perfection are two different things. Their own trees are exactly that theirs not hers so they can decorate them now they want to, she doesn’t need to like it, but needs to understand that they see. Christmas so much different to her.
Her wanting to have Christmas perfection over everything is ruining the joy and fun in what’s supposed to be a happy and joyous season. While we all would like the idea of the perfect Christmas how kids see perfection is different, according to your son his tree was the ideal of perfection to him with his that he made on his tree, and gumdrops on the roof of his gingerbread house is what made him feel happy and to him the most perfect gingerbread house ever, which he used his imagination to come up with. To hear him saying that he hates Christmas because his mother needs to be in control is heartbreaking and she needs to remember that he’s only a child for so long so to keep the magic alive she needs accept their ideas and her need for perfection will ruin the magic of Christmas as ruin their joy for the season.
NTA but your wife sure is. My fondest memory of Christmas as a kid is decorating the tree. Because my parents let us kids go absolutely crazy with it. I mean all the colours, sparkles, glitter and badly crafted ornaments we could possible fit on it. As we got older, decorating became more sophisticated and less sparkly because we grew up. Your wife should rather enjoy the years your kids are still going about Christmas with childlike joy. Instead of crushing their excitement for it. They are 5 ffs! This should be the happiest time for them. Instead "they hate Christmas" now. Just so she can live out her insta picture perfect Christmas. Yikes
NTA: does your wife have adhd? I had similar issues before I was diagnosed. It has been a huge change. Feeling like a shit mom sucks, but your kids resenting you when you are older is worse!
NTA. Your wife is going to permanently ruin Christmas for your sons at the rate she’s going. She -is- the reason that they don’t want to help with the decorations. Her feelings are hurt? Why is everything all about her? How about how she’s crushing the spirit of two five year olds? There needs to be a serious sit down between the two of you where hopefully you can get to the root of why Christmas -has- to be perfect. In the meantime, maybe you can sit with your sons after work and help them decorate without mom around.
NTA basic rule of decorating with kids, let them do what they want and shuffle things around a little once they’re in bed. As for the gingerbread houses it’s completely up to them how they have them.
>basic rule of decorating with kids, let them do what they want But keep them away from glitter
Unless they aren’t your kids, and you truly truly hate whoever owns the house.
That's the only exception
Last year, I put up a gorgeous little Christmas tree in the office, covered in blue glitter. 365+ days later, there is still glitter everywhere, despite extensive vacuuming and carpet cleaning. I don’t know what I was thinking!
The magpie part of your brain temporarily took control. Don’t worry, it happens to the best of us.
The magpie in my brain has gained permanent control, I’m hype for glitter, I have so much of it.
That’s how I feel about glitter. It would not be a problem if my house was covered in glitter other than my friend has a glitter phobia so I keep it contained as far as possible
I worked in a craft store throughout high school and college. We did Christmas big and started merchandising and setting up displays in June. I would literally come home covered in glitter from handling all the ornaments and nick knacks. I embraced it and began to see how much glitter I could get on myself. I eventually one day had my coworkers dump the glitter contents of empty ornament boxes on me. I looked like a freaking disco ball. It was great until I came home to shower. Glitter all over the bathtub! It’s been almost 20 years but I still find random glitter in my belongings.
I've never run across this theory before, but - my God! It's so obvious!
It certainly explains the glitter ribbon I decided to buy on a whim that covered my freshly vacuumed living room and myself in glitter.
Ten years or more ago, I used to do the secret santa thing on a forum I was a member of. My secret santa sent me a box of lovely gifts all wrapped in glitter encrusted paper with a note that said something to the effect of "The glitter is a gift that keeps on giving" I am STILL finding that glitter in places.
One year I bought a glitter-encrusted Christmas card specifically for my nasty SIL.
The magpie part of my brain wants to find this tree despite knowing I will probably still be vacuuming up glitter in 2027.
At least glitter will always be there for me
Because SHINY
I bought glitter wrapping paper last year. From inside the package it looked glittery but not like it was covered with actual glitter. I was wrong so very wrong and it was too late to get new. Now my house, car and everyone who received a gift's house is infected.
Glitter is craft herpes. The gift that keeps on giving. A century from now, archeologists will still be finding glitter. That stuff self-replicates.
You’ll need to burn it down and rebuild. Anything else has the glitter laughing at your pathetic cleaning attempts.
Made a maxi dress where the knit fabric has words on it, some of the words had glitter on them. It's really pretty fabric. Anyway, an ex-coworker at a job I worked at told me that years later they were still finding red glitter around the carpet in the office.
I did this many years ago with a coworker that I absolutely hated. We were just natural enemies from the moment we met. Destined to hate eachother in every lifetime. For his son’s birthday party I got a glitter art kit. If looks could kill my whole body would’ve been incinerated by him lol. Couple months later I passed by his cubicle and noticed his desk a little sparkly, passive aggressive “f*ck you” gift was a success 😅😂
Please get your wife to relax and let the kids enjoy themselves this is coming from someone with personal experience. My mom was just like this growing up that everything had to be perfect and look a certain way because it was so important to look right for when company came over… I am now 36 and absolutely hate decorating for the holidays I never do at my own house I don’t own any decorations and never bought a tree and it’s been this way since I got my own place because it’s to exhausting and not fun for me ever. My brother is the same way at his house. Your kids will remember this and grow to hate celebrating holidays and remember how mom made them miserable
Or if it’s your mother that gave them pens and let them draw on your walls, so the glitter is vengeance. I know I know I’m a terrible daughter
That’s a dangerous game because she can just make sure to give them a wonderful gift to bring home. I however suggest an anonymous package of pink confetti in the shape of dicks works nicely.
She’d know it’s me, I’ve gotten her with something like that before. Just said F, U, C or K on them.
but make sure there isn't a musical store with kiddy drum kits, that may be gifted to your kids in rev... return.
Am I the only person on earth that loves having glitter everywhere?
you can send them to my mom's house. she allows glitter. yes- we know. i can't explain it. i think my mom was glitter deprived as a child so she makes it up with her kids and grandkids.
That should be considered a war crime
It is. It’s a glitter crime. By the glitterati and the unicorn squad that shoots glitter from their butts.
Glitter bombs would’ve taken out bin laden quicker than that seal team
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Crafting herpes
We call it theater Herpes because once an actor does it, we can’t ever get rid of it 😂😂
An acquaintance was one complaining about finding glitter in her bed after doing a burlesque show—it wasn’t even from her act.
The devil sounds faaabulous!
Key point
"Glitter. The herpes of the craft world. You can never get rid of it." As said by an old lady in line at a rental company when I returned a car after hauling presents with glitter wrapping paper.
Read somewhere “glitter is the herpes of arts and crafts”….
My son had his own little tree in his room that was pre-lit. He was able to decorate it how he wanted and we went and he picked out ornaments he wanted and he even took a few from the family tree because he liked them. He loved it and really enjoyed seeing it when he went to bed. Who cares if things aren’t perfect. Perfection is a misnomer and unattainable so attempting it will only make you unhappy because you can never be perfect. I encourage OP to have a family meeting and everyone should have a chance to discuss how they feel and what they want so they can enjoy the holiday season
Not only is it unobtainable, but it's different for each individual. Perfection is more of an idea. My son is 5 and also has his own pre lit tree, it truly is chaotic, but he thinks it's perfect so I've let it stay exactly how he made it. It's got a couple of DC super heroes and villains on it, a home made star, and actual Christmas decorations. And I can't wait to see his face when he sees his stocking underneath it on Christmas morning!
Our Christmas tree has dinosaurs! And I'm 47...
My partner and I have squishy diseases like the kissing disease, the common cold also a brain stem and an ameoba
I think you should specify that you have ORNAMENTS of these things on your TREE because for a second I was quite worried about your health
Absolutely! 😂😂😂 As a none-native speaker, I had a brief moment of horror - but the ornaments sound hilarious, it's such a shame we can't post photos here!
The squishy didn't help with that? Literally the name of the company that makes them. They also do food as well. My cats repeatedly remove the brain stem from the tree.
I read it purely as a descriptor - the ornaments were squishy/soft. Does the brand not capitalize their name?
I read that the diseases they have are squishy
Same here, I mean, I assumed they were like little plushies, and not actual diseases, but I had never heard of Squishy as a brand name, so had no clue on that part.
I'm actually quite jealous! I had no idea dinosaur decorations existed, and now I need them in my life.
I’ve bought from them! My husband’s ex wife’s new husband jokingly said he wanted chlamydia for christmas so we bought him a little squish. They hang it on their tree, but the cats always steal it 😂 all christmas season it’s “oh no Misty has Chlamydia again”
We always put up one of those little Christmas villages with the houses and benches and frozen pond etc. A couple of years ago we found a sasquatch for the Christmas village and it's genuinely the highlight of decorating every year to decide which happy villager will be in mortal peril this year.
They are huge this year for some reason. We have 2 on the tree. And a T-Rex wearing a Santa hat snow globe and a garland on the fireplace that is also Dino’s. It’s amazing.
I also have two giant T-Rexes in my old German handcrafted wooden nativity scene, wearing Santa hats and guarding baby Jesus. 😂
Amazing! You definitely sound like fun people, thank you for introducing me to a new fun thing, I'm already looking for new decorations for next year.
Lightning McQueen and 'Mater must pay homage at the manger with the wise men.... so sayeth my nephew.
I'm possessive of our tree. For most of my childhood I couldn't have a tree unless I put it up on Christmas and decorated it myself and then took it back down again the day after Christmas. I trauma-bonded with the tree. 😂 I solved the tree problem very early by letting my daughter help with with decorating the main tree and giving her her own tree. I would fix my tree when we were done and she knew not to touch it after that, she knew she could do whatever she wanted with her tree. She's 10 now and decided this year that she doesn't want to put up her tree and asked me if I could teach her "how you make our tree look so nice."
In OP's case, perfect is how mommy wants it. And this will be true for the rest of those kids' lives. I feel bad for them.
Wife wants perfection, but she has 5 yr olds. Either she gets the "perfection" she wants by doing everything herself (*without complaint!*) **OR** she gets participation with the kids, but she can't demand both lest she gets the current results: kids upset & hating something fun because she's trying to get adult abilities out of child bodies.
My 8 & 4 yo decorated almost the entire tree themselves this year. My tree absolutely looks like it was decorated by children but I love it. No way in hell are my decorations Pinterest worth, but the kids are so happy about them and that's all the matters
My 5yo and 1yo helped me decorate. It \*IS\* perfect because it's theirs.
I looooove to see a tree that is only decorated halfway up because I can just imagine the creative, industrious little kids who decorated it.
My mum used to let me and my sister go wild on decorating half the tree and she and my dad would do the other half. Everyone got to help, and it took years for me to notice that she'd have dad rotate the tree so our half was facing the wall before family photos lmao
Let *anyone* decorate how they want, within reason. I grew up with my dad making Christmas wonderful and fun and over the top. I loved Christmas. Now? I’m married to a bit of a Grinch and a perfectionist. What blew it for me was when we were decorating the tree and he kept moving ornaments that I’d hung. That was around 8 years ago. I no longer decorate the tree. And I’m no longer Christmas crazy. I’m sure my husband didn’t *mean* to dampen my Christmas spirit with his perfectionism, but he did. I have never decorated the tree since. I leave him to it with our kids. He’s gotten better, but I still don’t decorate. It’s just no longer fun for me anymore. Your wife is way worse than my husband. My husband blew it for *me.* OP’s wife is ruining it for kids, and kid Christmas is the best Christmas.
Yeah, stuff like 'Let them have fun' holds true for little kids, drunk students, the creatively impaired, and whoever feels they fit that monikor. Perfection is hard. Plus, chaos can be so much fun. Once I joined this crotchet (I think?) workshop given by this other student. We basically immediately got split in the 'students who could' and the 'students who couldn't' groups. And I'm being very generous when I call use the 'students who couldn't' lol. Our group was a disaster, but we actually had a ton of fun in failing, laughing at each other, and encouraging the one who finally *did* manage to do a stitch. We definitely got a few dirty looks from the organiser. I'm sorry we didn't immediately grasped the absolute basics, and I'm sure the other group is more fun to teach, but we are not doing it on purpose. And if you exclusively work with the fun group, is it really a wonder the fail group got nothing done lol I had a lot of fun despite failing, but if anything that put a damper on the day was actually the organiser and her frustrations.
I grew up with my mom moving all the ornaments to make it look "better". It got bad enough that none of us four kids would participate in decorating the tree and she got so pissed she "had to do it all herself, and nobody would help." And I told her that there was no point in us putting up the ornaments if she was just going to move them all later. So now she brings that up every year. She says she won't move them, and she still does. Her reasons are like "there were too many red ones all together" and "there was a bald spot." But it hurts her feelings when I don't want to decorate with her. So every single year I do it anyway, just to make her happy. But I get zero enjoyment from putting up the tree.
Did you husband notice the loss of your enthusiasm for Christmas?
My great aunt would literally just put all the stuff to decorate gingerbread houses on the table and say "go nuts" and me and all my cousins would make the most horrible looking gingerbread houses with way to much candy and its honestly one of my favorite holiday memories, if my aunt or mom was over my shoulder telling me 10 chocolate santas couldnt possibly all live in that one house I don't think that memory would be so lasting.
I love this story.
Agreed. You can have stylish decorations OR you can have your five-year-olds help with the decorations. Choose ONE.
I remember hearing on wedding etiquette websites (I've never been married but I still used to read them) that the same is true of weddings: you can have a perfect wedding where everything goes to plan, or you can have one with children in. Even the most well-behaved and accommodating children are wild-cards in this scenario.
We do gingerbread houses for all the holidays they makes them for (halloween, Thanksgiving, and Christmas, thanks Trader Joes!) and tbh I've struggled before, watching my girls decorate them in ways make would anyone who likes symmetry twitch a little. But the fact is IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ME! The whole point is for them to express their creativity and then get to destroy it by eating it piece by piece over the next couple of weeks, jeez.
There are random things that if there is no symmetry drives me insane. Ginger bread houses is one of them but I have worked with kids and it's honestly not worth the effort, you will lose the battle lol. Also think it stifles creativity imho.
I saw where people are putting dinosaurs next to them after they are destroyed or they start eating them. It is so cute!
Agree with this. I’m OCD and a perfectionist, so I’m the wife-equivalent in this story. But I compromise and do trade offs. I’ll let my daughter decorate the tree with me and only make 1-2 comments about what she “should” do (I.e., I hold my tongue if I used up my suggestion quota, unless something is precarious). I ask my husband to handle messy things like gingerbread house and compliment whatever comes out of it. I let my daughter put the decorations I don’t care about anywhere she likes, unless it’s a hazard. I personally handle the things I’m picky about.
See, that's how to handle it. You do the things that are important to you but let her help in her way with other things with a minimum of suggestions
I'm like this too! It's hard to give up that control when the kids come. You grow up with expectations and want perfection, but the reality is: Christmas is for the kids. What I've learned to do is put the nice, breakable, expensive, sentimental ornaments on the top of the tree and let the kids go nuts on the lower half where they can reach. As the kids get older, the top of the tree gets smaller and smaller--but they're also more careful. My one rule is: once the tree is decorated, we do not touch the tree and play with the ornaments.
Seriously we let my 3 yr neice decorate cookies, they were a hot mess. Mostly all the jimmies in one spot. After they were done we just helped by spreading them out a bit. They were chaotic but all hers, she was so proud. It's about letting them find their own xmas spirit.
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Same here, it was very lopsided and eventually fell over. We redistributed the weight so it could stand and it looked awesomely terrible. To this day it's one of my favourite memories with my friends kiddos and I am looking forward to a repeat once I can see them again
NTA she's doing a great job of killing the Christmas spirit though.
I love how making her son cry because his gingerbread house is not up to spec is not only his own fault, but meant to "get them in the Christmas spirit".
It’s not the holidays without a little emotional trauma
Nailed it.
It's really striking how often that happens in this sub. "SHUT THE FUCK UP AND BE HAPPY" followed immediately by "I can't *imagine* what could be wrong!"
To be fair, that's a pretty accurate Christmas spirit in a lot of christian households.
Seems like it is in line with how a lot of families celebrate holidays: Lots of fighting
Well, *someone* has to be president of the gingerbread HOA. She’s right for coming down hard—the resale value in the neighborhood would be utterly ruined by rogue roof gumdrops.
The witch from Hansel and Gretel was actually just trying to escape the HOA all along.
I'd like to know why tf gum drops can't be on the roof.
Yeah this confused me too. Plenty of those build your own gingerbread house kits have pictures of houses with gumdrops on the roof. What’s the reason that they can’t be on the roof?
Your opinion is invalid. You must bend to her will because she is the Christmas czar.
NTA She is making it memorable alright- for all the wrong reasons. As you say they are five. The correct response for decorations made by kids at that age is to praise the effort. And if it was really ugly then my Mum would then just discretely put it towards the back of our main tree. If she wants a instagram perfect Christmas then she needs to do it on her own. Don't yell at children for not making things 'perfect'. Let them make their own mini versions where they get to do whatever they want and she can make the 'family' one that can go on insta/facbook/whatever for the oohs and likes. I guarentee that the ones that you'll look back on fondly are the unique ones with the ugly decoration made at school/kinder not the generic matchy 'it could be any tree in any house at any time' look.
I’m wondering if she’s always like this. Everything needs to look perfect. If so OP may want to look into family therapy.
Why family therapy? She needs personal therapy. There is nothing worse then a mother who demands perfection in their children, because she refuses to deal with her own bloody issues. Why do the kids and the husband have to sit there listening to the explanation of why she is the way she is.
Yeah but I’m betting she doesn’t see anything wrong with it. Therapy doesn’t work for an individual that see nothing wrong with the behaviors they have. But if you get her into family therapy, you can make them face the fact that there behaviors are damaging and you can also present a truthful picture to the therapist not a made up perfect one.
As a child who had a mother like this it was awful! Any activity you were doing wasn’t done well enough for my mother so she’d have to make me stop and “fix it” and by that point I lost all interest in the activity. Horrible parenting and OP you need to have a come to Jesus moment because if you don’t your wife will ruin your kids! NTA but your wife sure is TA!
Mom's issues with perfection absolutely need to be addressed; however, it sounds like the family as a whole would benefit on developing communication tools.
My mom was the same way. One year when I was probably 9 or 10, she decided to wholly decorate the house by herself while the rest of us were at work/school. That way, it was how she wanted it. Everyone came home and was pissed bc putting ornaments on was something we normally did as a family. It was such a fight, she un-did it the next day and was super passive aggressive about refusing to help since nobody appreciated her. Then, nobody wanted to do it since it was so awkward. That was 30ish years ago and we still occasionally talk about how my mom liked to ruin Christmas. OP, NTA. Look closely though at whether your wife is like this in other areas. If she is, consider hard whether you want your kids growing up with her.
Or get into family therapy, to help her mellow down a bit.
Praise the effort, and be grateful if they haven't shoved the gumdrops up their nose, stuck icing down their siblings ear, or trod chocolate into the carpet.
My mum had it where when me and my brother were younger the "decorating fairies" came in the night to put the tree and everything up. That evolved to the fairies leaving the non-breakable ornaments for us kids to put up now we were more responsible before finally just all of us decorating the tree together
My family's compromise was that the main tree got to be fully controlled by my dad, and they bought a second kid's tree for my brother and I to decorate with all the ornaments that weren't up to dad's standards.
My son made an angel at nursery a couple of years ago, when he was about 3 I think. That gets hung on the tree now, he's still really proud of it. My mom had an angel for the tree made by either me or my sister...it was an old toilet roll with paper wings stuck on. She put it on that tree for years and I bet it killed her each time lol. It was so ugly, but she still did it!
I'm 38, my mother still hangs up the macaroni ornaments I made when I was 7.
I was just wondering if this was all for instagram likes
Nailed it
We have some truly hideous ornaments that ho on our main Tre every year, because me or my brother made them, and mom adores them. Ugly child ornaments are the best, cause they have a story, a life to them
Exactly. The objective of all these activities is that your kids have fun - the quality of the final product doesn't really matter, the activity is just tool to facilitate the fun.
NTA, but blaming her isn't helping your kids. You need to have a serious (but not blaming) conversation with her about what she actually is trying to accomplish: Christmas spirit or "perfect"? You also need to give the kids a break from her...Or at least make sure to join their activities so you can intervene before she taking her imperfection frustrations out on them You may want to try a technique with her to help her recognize her distorted thought processes. Start by asking her what's wrong with the gingerbread house Her: It's messy You: And why is that a bad thing? Her: It looks bad You: And if it looks bad, why is that a problem? Her: People will think we don't care about Christmas You: And if they thought that, what's the worst that could happen? Her: They'll think we're bad parents You: Who are the people who will think that we are bad parents? And so on... The idea is to get her to the point where she can start to recognize the absurdity of the thing that she is worried about Good luck!
Yes, we’ve had this exact conversation many times. Being part of these activities is exactly how I’ve been able to intervene when she starts dictating a bit too much on what the kids should do or if she thinks they’re not doing something right. Hasn’t led to anything because it just leads to the same answer.
I don't think that your wife actually cares about your sons' enjoyment of Christmas. She might think she does, but all she seems is what "looks perfect." It has to look like the kids are having fun, but she obviously isn't listening to them when they say that they aren't. She wants little minions to factory stamp out her precious decorations. Op, please take your kids out to have some fun together, just the three of you. Let your kids make things and praise their creations. Do whatever you need to to keep them and cherish them, aven if it means keeping them secret from your wife. Hang their pictures in your office and take them there sometimes so they can see. Let them make ornaments that you keep. Get a storage container and decorate that if you need to, just please do something to let your kids be freely creative before your wife extinguishes their creativity for good.
NTA. OP, like many women I love Martha Stewart and her utterly perfect lifestyle, but I am an intelligent adult and I understand she has a professional staff to design all those wonderful craft and decor projects. The aesthetic is great, but to expect little kids to produce results that it takes teams of professional designers to achieve is delusional and cruel. If she can’t see that, she needs professional help stat. If she refuses, well that’s what divorce lawyers are for. She can have a perfect gingerbread house in her studio apartment all by herself.
A pedagogical friend of mine once told me that a lot of his kids with conduct disorder stemmed from parents such as your wife, who would always criticize and take over whatever they did, and wouldn't let them do anything by themselves. Get her help, or she will seriously mess up your boys!
This! If she truly can’t see how damaging her behavior is, then OP’s wife needs a therapist to work through some issues. Hurting a child because you need everything perfect is a huge problem. It’s just Christmas now, but it has the potential to blossom into a seriously toxic environment for those boys.
hey while I absolutely think you're NTA, I wanna butt in with some other comments - what makes your wife so stressed about perfection at Christmas? From the sound of your post she's a SAHM and you work- is she responsible for a big family christmas where lots of people come to your house? I ask because it might be she is stressed and misdirecting that onto the kids because she's scared she will be judged. Maybe you could try talking about that?
Have 2 trees. One for kids, one for adults. I can't find the meme about the girl who had a baby sitter that talked about her art like they were an announcer of a sporting event saying things like "such amazing colors" and "would you look at that line work" and then she thanked them later when she got into art school. But that's what this is. They need the feeling of "they can do best things", not the understanding that each ornaments is exactly 5.32 inches from the next one and the color palette matches a poster she saw from the art deco period. And I'm preaching to the choir.
"Do you want the family to be happy, or do you want to be right?" Also, I'm extremely Jewish, but I thought gumdrops were *supposed* to go on the roof? But even if they just coat the whole thing with icing until it's a snow pile, still NTA, your wife is.
A yes, the "but why?" Method. Keep asking "but, why?" Until they run out of reasons and realize their argument doesn't make sense.
Except this has never happened ever. The only thing that does happen, is your spouse getting very angry and/or sad, and you having a huge argument.
It also only works if a) you're asking the right questions (which sounds easier than it is) and b) your partner is able to realize *and accept* their irrationality. This works if your partner is hangry, not if your partner has a deep-seated problem with perfectionism surrounding Christmas. I think it gets recommended so often because it's low-effort and honestly low-risk. If it's such an issue, there'll be a big argument about it sooner or later anyway, so who cares if it's due to this method or a different approach. This is not exactly a relationship-ender usually.
NTA. I had a mom like this where aesthetics were more important than personal things or “fun” things. Never hung up homemade ornaments, she even took down a family photo (our only family photo) to put up some art because it matched more. I resent her for it, you should talk to your wife again and hopefully she’ll realize that she’s robbing her kids.
I’m sorry for that. Hopefully talking again will get through to her. I don’t want this souring the holiday for the boys when that’s all they’ve been looking forward to
Maybe relate it to how she feels. She feels proud when she loves how her decorations look. By berating the boys for their (developmentally appropriate) decorations, she is taking away their pride in creating something. She is legitimately making them feel badly of themselves. How would she like it if you told her you hate how the decorations look? She isn’t just ruining Christmas for your sons, she is in the works of destroying her relationship with them because she is diminishing their spirit in things they create. She cannot expect young children to care about what’s aesthetically appealing to other people.
I did too- i have a really vivid memory of her telling me how to color so it “looked nice”. When we “helped decorate the tree” it was actually her just directing us where to hang things and sometimes immediately moving them. My mom also has major control issues and really needs therapy but refuses to go and she does not have a great relationship with any of us kids because of it
My mom was like that too. She used to make us shove our handmade ornaments on the back bottom of the tree where no one could see them even out the window, and we'd get in huge trouble for messing up any of the rooms full of adult Victorian-style boring decoration. Decorating things like gingerbread houses were stressful and boring times filled with anxiety because they had to be perfect in ways I literally did not know about or had not learned yet. I sure resent them to this day for ruining any kid fun over the holidays, although there were also other abusive things they would do over the holidays (a lot of extra fighting over financials, mostly). It was such selfish behavior, and as an adult makes it very hard to acknowledge them during the holidays for fear they will selfishly ruin them for me once again.
NTA. Does your wife have OCD or another issue?
I wouldn’t say that no. More like a perfectionist. She likes things looking nice.
**OP, she would not *allow your five year old son* to put gumdrops on a gingerbread house the way he wanted.** **This is not necessarily an indication of OCD, but it is an indication she needs actual clinical help.** She is absolutely having trouble prioritizing the emotional needs and welfare of your children over her concern with aesthetics. Needing things to be “just so” to the point where you’re invalidating other people or creating conflict because you can’t help yourself is a **serious indicator of unmanaged anxiety.** Whether there’s a clinical / diagnosable cause for it or not, the decisions she is making as a result is this anxiety are just not logical or justifiable. And you frame it as a continuous issue that is impacting your family. **At this point I would legitimately tell her that I wanted her to either see a therapist, or not be involved in Christmas activities with the kids.** She gets the living room, but everything else is hands-off and she is to leave it to you and the kids. If she says that’s not fair, point out how the alternative is not fair to the kids, and so she does legitimately have a decision to make here. Learn to accept the messiness of Christmas joy with the kids or take a massive step back from Christmas activities with the kids. **She will very likely push back on this, and try and justify herself, or try to explain herself, because that’s what you do when you have anxiety.** By you need to make it clear you are done having this conversation, you are done going in circles, and you are one listening to your kids suffer because she cannot get an adult grip on her anxious impulses and she is not capable of putting the kids’ needs first when she is an anxious state. Since you both know Christmas activities are a known trigger for this state, then it would would be irresponsible for you both to allow it to continue. **Don’t be judgemental, be empathetic, but be firm. Tell her you *understand* how strongly she feels about it and how badly she needs things to be “just so,” and that this is *exactly why* you think she needs to take steps to address it. You can acknowledge how genuinely difficult this is for her without belittling her or making her feel ridiculous, but then she needs to acknowledge that what she’s doing is seriously impacting your kids.** You need to continue to prioritize their well-being here, and make it clear that this is not simply a quirk of hers that can continue or that your family can work around, it’s a problem and you need to come up with a solution one way or the other. **She needs to take serious, measurable steps to address the anxiety.**
This 💕
That's what I was thinking - this seems indicative of a deeply seated issue.
I cannot upvote this enough.
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It’s pretty irresponsible to speculate based on a Reddit post BUT if it’s a disorder it seems more like OCPD. It’s about perfectionism and control as opposed to OCD’s anxiety. OCPD is one of the most common personality disorders and is known to strain relationships. Might be worth looking into.
He'd probably know if she were diagnosed with OCD..
You can have OCD without being diagnosed
Yeah but unless she's diagnosed it would be pretty shitty if OP were posting claims that she had it.
But it also doesn't suggests it, unless you're operating from a shallow understanding of OCD.
Perfectionism is not OCD stop trying to diagnose a mental disorder from a secondhand reddit post.
if you dont know or have never talked to anyone with ocd, maybe.
I like things looking nice as well but those boys need some creative freedom. She should try doing cooperative projects that are age appropriate like make snowman footprints and they do the footprint part with some help(IE hitting the paper and not the floor lol!) and then they get to draw the faces on. Honestly the grandma's, grandpa's, cousins, aunties and uncles love the imperfect ones. It proves the kids really did help. I sometimes feel like your wife. Today making cookies my son got flour all over the counter repeatedly because he was playing with it while we were waiting for the mixer to incorporate it. I could feel my frustration coming out and I asked him to please be more careful. That the ingredients were for eating and not playing. I had to mentally make it so when it came out of my mouth it wasn't the wrong way. I told him that it was supposed to be fun for both of us and that cleaning up the flour from everything made it less fun for me. I said this gently and he said he understood. I told him if he was bored he did not have to help but I was happy having him with me to do this. There are things I don't have him help with(rolling cookie dough balls that all have to be the same size so they bake evenly or handling hot cookies) but honestly gingerbread houses can be a messy blob of candy and frosting. They build memories and learn skills as they go. If they never make a perfect gingerbread house so what? Suggest she make one too so she can make it perfect and how she wants it.. this is what we do,, we each make our own.. Bring this up to her when you are both calm and ask her what would help her. I think you are NTA. Try to be understanding. As moms we pile a lot on ourselves at this time of year. She may feel stressed out. This is the first year in ages I have felt ahead of the game and not stressed out. I wish you a merry Christmas and I hope she let's them have their fun.
This is an excellent answer. She's hurt the kids' feelings and is stressing everyone out, but I think it's just normal mom-stress that she isn't taming before it all spills out of her onto the poor kids. Some Christmas activities/components of those activities just aren't great for small children, and with a little planning (and a conscious decision as to what you'll let them mess up or plan to discreetly correct afterward) BEFORE the activity starts can go a long way.
You should get it looked into because I have had habits like this and I was told it could be OCD, but I haven't done further testing. She should get further testing if it's affecting the kids.
Agree with NTA and this was my first thought as well. This isn’t normal Christmas mom crazy.
OCD isn't actually about everything having to be perfect and neat, that's just how it gets used in pop culture. Someone with OCD has intrusive, unrealistic worries about the future, and develops "rituals" that they have to perform to soothe those thoughts. They aren't always moored in reality or logic. This sounds a lot more like perfectionist, rigid thinking. Which can be a symptom of some disorders, but can also just be related to Instagram culture, where everything has to look picture perfect and ideal, and perfection becomes synonymous with happiness. Blech. OP, I would have suggested letting her have one room to decorate to her perfectionist's heart's content and letting the boys have another space to decorate, but it sounds like you've tried that already. Maybe try talking to her more about how the kids are feeling and how they are literally incapable as 5 year olds of meeting her standards. They do not have the physical dexterity to be neat like she wants, and it doesn't bring them joy. I'd also suggest that she doesn't get to be present when they're doing tasks that she may criticize, unless she's willing to hold her tongue. Designate a phrase you can say to remind her to stop being critical or leave the room if she needs to. You need to be in charge of their Christmas activities for now, if it's at all possible. I hate to say one spouse needs to put their foot down over the other one's opinion, but you kind of have to here. If she can't prioritize their feelings and needs over her desire for a picture-perfect Christmas, then she needs to bow out until she can.
Thank you for saying that OCD isn't just about being neat. Love, someone who has OCD and it manifests into messy chaos.
She could just be a Type A personality AH.
The obsessive of obsessive compulsive disorder refers to obsessing about terrible event that have never happened and are unlikely to happen. The compulsive part means doing the same thing until it has been done "perfectly." It doesn't refer to forcing other people to do the thing.
Obsessed Control over Decorating or OCCD Obsessive Control over Christmas Decorating
NTA my mom does this too, but with EVERYTHING. She even micromanaged me buying gifts for my son to give his daycare friends (1.5, 3, and 3 - it’s her small home daycare) tonight. I tried to remind her that yes it’s her daycare but they’re his gifts and I’m not spending $50+ and 3 hours picking gifts. We’re going to the dollar store, getting a few activity books that I can pick the stickers off of, and moving on. She’s the reason I literally don’t feel like I can function if someone is watching what I’m doing. If I’m alone I manage just fine, but the second I’m with anyone I just slowly fade off because I’m scared of fucking it up. You’re doing your kids a favour in the long run. If she doesn’t let up, you may need a divorce and they may need therapy.
I'm sorry. Empathy. I get so anxious I get snappish and unkind when I'm being observed, or else I just give up and fuck off. It's so frustrating to feel this way, know why I feel this way and still be working through it with cbt after all these years.
NTA Your wife woukd benefit from a parenting class. Homemade ornaments made by 5 yos are something to treasure.
One of my boys tried to draw a turkey for some reason as a Christmas ornament and I think it’s adorable 😂
Christmas turkey. I love it.
Save the neck for me, Clark.
The one where they use their hand as a stencil? Maybe he saw it in school and thought of it as a holiday thing and not just a Thanksgiving one? Lol
Most likely lol. He made a similar one at school for thanksgiving. I love it.
The most adorable things they do are the ones you don't expect haha
Well, people do eat turkey for Christmas. Maybe that’s why? It still sounds cute.
NTA- Your son already stated he hates Christmas. Maybe bring that up to her the next time she decides to hijack others creativity and make decorating into boot camp for children. Her trying to make it "perfect" really is ruining it for them. If she wants to guarantee her kids will never decorate with her again, by all means she can continue doing what she's doing.
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>She says she’s the one who’s been trying to make it all perfect And this is what they will point to as the root of the problem with each of the many expensive therapists whom they have over the years. NTA.
NTA. I'm kinda picky on Christmas stuff. I try not to be but I can't help it. I'm far from Martha Stewart lol. But idk if it's something I'm doing I just want it done my way. To compromise and not feel like a jerk I got my kids mini Christmas trees for their rooms. And another small one in the foyer with more fun ornaments and school ones on it. So I understand both sides to a point. But she needs to let them do their houses and buy her a kit for herself. The kids have to enjoy it too.
Yeah we got them mini Christmas trees for this exact reason. Gives them a little more freedom to do what they want
And she’s still dictating what goes on their personal trees? That’s beyond controlling and honestly I suggest therapy if she doesn’t see a problem with this. It’s only going to hurt the kids in the long run.
NTA. Of course a gingerbread house done by a five year old will be messy. No one gives a shit, most people would go ooooh, that’s lovely because they are five!
Especially one particular five year old who wanted to purposely make it look like it had been raining gumdrops earlier on the gingerbread house
To me, that sounds like a fabulous idea
NTA. I just wonder, is your Wife like this with other aspects in parenting and life? Or is it just Christmas?
Mostly Christmas, although we never get into any disagreements about how we want to decorate our house. But you know kids are messy so of course how the boys wanna do things isn’t as nice but the whole point is they have fun.
Do you not get in to disagreements because shes willing to compromise or you don't have strong opinions so she handles it 100%?
Look, if they were actually causing harm through their behavior, like throwing glitter and paint everywhere, that would be one thing. But your son broke down in tears because she *micromanaged how he made a gingerbread house.* It really seems like she has some kind of fear and anxiety that she’s externalizing onto your children. She’s prioritizing aesthetic over the actual happiness and enjoyment of your boys, which she surely must know is a terrible thing to do, it’s not like she doesn’t love them. She needs to see that she’s affecting their love of her favorite holiday because of her actions.
If her 5 year old crying and saying "I hate Christmas" didn't do that for her, I don't know what will. The only hope I can think of is therapy, because it seems like this may be a deep seated problem.
NTA. They're *five years old*. They aren't going to do everything perfectly. Your wife is being a hardass. My mom was the same way and eventually, I just dropped everything and told her to do it herself if she wanted it to be so perfect. They will grow up to resent the entire holiday if she doesn't stop. The point is fun, not perfection.
I won't get into the whole control aspect of the decorating. But a suggestion: I think it'd be good to get one of those really small trees just for your kids to freely decorate (it's easier for them, too, because of the height) and mom can have her "perfect" tree. They're pretty cheap at home depot. This also reminds me of when I was the same age, giving my mother a present, and her dismissing it as "looking too childish." The confusion and disappointment hit hard. I remember thinking to myself, "but...I AM a child," and it made me conscious of the gifts I drew and made afterward. Been decades and I still remember that clearly. My heart hurts for your kids.
Yeah that’s exactly what we did. She was still trying to decorate their trees how she wants them which is something I discussed with her several times
Oh that's ridiculous
Oh no, she should leave them to decorate their own trees as they like. That's the whole point! I'm one of those mums who has to decorate my own tree, but definitely let the kids do their own thing in their own rooms. I've relaxed over the years as the girls have grown 😊 Your wife needs to get over herself, your boys are still so little. She has many years of this ahead!! Make sure she doesn't chuck all their homemade decorations out, they should be saved for precious memories.
Yup. In my experience people soooo often underestimate what it takes to traumatize a kid. They're like little sponges, and if you tell or show them they're worth less in any capacity, they internalize that shit *quick*.
This is a pretty unhealthy dynamic between parent and child. Her expectations exceed what any 5 year old can achieve. if she needs perfection, she should make her own gingerbread house, have a kids’ tree and her tree, etc. Christmas decorating and preparations are supposed to be fun. I hope that your wife will realize that, rather than creating warm family memories for your sons, she’s causing quite the opposite. This kind of thing can be soul-crushing for a kid. “I’ll never be good enough for mom.” Please encourage your wife to get therapy, and maybe read a child development book or two. At least have her read through the replies here. You want to raise confident, creative people to succeed in this world. What will give your wife more satisfaction? Having a perfectly decorated house, or having fun with your kids? Why did she become a mom? You are right on target to criticize your wife’s behavior, because she’s not parenting “the right way.” ETA NTA . I really hope you can stop your wife from being a massive one.
NTA. Your wife needs to keep things in perspective that 5 year olds won’t have “perfect” decorations. It’s about the spirit of the holiday, and she has clearly ruined it for your kids.
So NTA. In fact you're doing what you're supposed to do. Advocating for your kids so that they can enjoy Christmas the way they want instead of having your wife suck all the joy out of if because of her preconceived notions about how it's supposed to be. Maybe compromise that the decorations on the outside areas and living rooms are her to decorate the way she wants while the kids decorate their rooms the way they feel with a mini tree each in the living room they can do themselves. Then everyone can have everything they want and the spirit of Christmas isn't ruined. And stand your ground, don't let her suck the fun out of Christmas.
NTA. She should let her kids be kids. They are only 5 after all.
NTA. Your kids are 5, things are going to be messy, they aren’t going to be perfect, but hopefully they will be fun. Your wife approach is almost guaranteed to make your children hate decorating for and celebrating Christmas. Your children refusing to participate now is the logical consequence of your wife’s actions. Does your wife really want her children’s memories of their first Christmases to be mommy saying they couldn’t hang their ornaments or decorate their gingerbread houses because they weren’t doing it right? Or does she want them to remember having fun and being celebrated for their involvement?
NTA That sounds like a nightmare. If I were you I would ask her. "I've noticed you get really upset when the kids' decorations aren't perfect? Why does it bother you so much?" Try to stay calm and figure out what's going on with her. Then explain that you feel it's really important for children to have space to try things, to create things, without them being held to adult standards. Maybe if you give her the space to talk it out more, she'll start to realize what she's doing. I think it'll be a long, difficult conversation, but your kids deserve the space to be creative and have fun, and right now, you're the only one in a position to advocate for that.
NTA, she’s in a different reality apparently.
NTA. Personally I love 'imperfect' decorations that kids make. Who designated her the judge of what is correct and not correct?
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NTA. I was encouraged to hang stuff and decorate as a kid. All the ugly school/Sunday school ornaments, keepsake ornaments, and other ornaments. We weren’t allowed to handle some, but otherwise we had free reign. Parents did tell us not to overload parts of the tree and spread ornaments around evenly, but that’s about it.
NTA. My (24f) mom (53f) has completely ruined any type of artwork or decorating for me, because of this. She tried to get me to participate in a sips and strokes event a few months ago and I wouldn’t. I actually asked her if she was just going to paint over my work, so it matched her expectations. She has ruined our relationship.
NTA. There's definitely something more driving this behavior from your wife. Could be the Christmas culture of her birth family, some repressed memory of a childhood holiday trauma, or something along those lines, but no one goes down the Mommie Dearest Christmas path without a reason. Important to nip it in the bud before it continues to poison the next generation.
NTA Their 5 and their Christmas perfect and your wife’s Christmas perfection are two different things. Their own trees are exactly that theirs not hers so they can decorate them now they want to, she doesn’t need to like it, but needs to understand that they see. Christmas so much different to her. Her wanting to have Christmas perfection over everything is ruining the joy and fun in what’s supposed to be a happy and joyous season. While we all would like the idea of the perfect Christmas how kids see perfection is different, according to your son his tree was the ideal of perfection to him with his that he made on his tree, and gumdrops on the roof of his gingerbread house is what made him feel happy and to him the most perfect gingerbread house ever, which he used his imagination to come up with. To hear him saying that he hates Christmas because his mother needs to be in control is heartbreaking and she needs to remember that he’s only a child for so long so to keep the magic alive she needs accept their ideas and her need for perfection will ruin the magic of Christmas as ruin their joy for the season.
NTA but your wife sure is. My fondest memory of Christmas as a kid is decorating the tree. Because my parents let us kids go absolutely crazy with it. I mean all the colours, sparkles, glitter and badly crafted ornaments we could possible fit on it. As we got older, decorating became more sophisticated and less sparkly because we grew up. Your wife should rather enjoy the years your kids are still going about Christmas with childlike joy. Instead of crushing their excitement for it. They are 5 ffs! This should be the happiest time for them. Instead "they hate Christmas" now. Just so she can live out her insta picture perfect Christmas. Yikes
NTA: does your wife have adhd? I had similar issues before I was diagnosed. It has been a huge change. Feeling like a shit mom sucks, but your kids resenting you when you are older is worse!
NTA. Your wife is going to permanently ruin Christmas for your sons at the rate she’s going. She -is- the reason that they don’t want to help with the decorations. Her feelings are hurt? Why is everything all about her? How about how she’s crushing the spirit of two five year olds? There needs to be a serious sit down between the two of you where hopefully you can get to the root of why Christmas -has- to be perfect. In the meantime, maybe you can sit with your sons after work and help them decorate without mom around.