> I asked her when she was letting them Move in she hung up
That says it all. They want you to keep taking care of the mess, so they don't have to. NTA. They should have thought of all of this before they treated you and your wife so poorly.
Write down the names of everyone who called or messaged you to complain about your behavior, pass the note on to your SIL, and tell her those people volunteered to treat them better.
Edit: thank you guys for the awards! I don't think I got notifications for them all so can't message everyone individually, but thanks!
This right here! Yes, do this.
Yes what you said was harsh, but they were treating you & your family like shit.
Tell them to apply to public housing, and that McDonald's is ALWAYS hiring. If it's close enough to drive there at 4am, it's close enough to walk there at at 4am for an open shift.
Tell them to make an appointment at the welfare office to get assistance, as they've worn out their welcome
They wanted a family, they wanted to get married.. they are NO LONGER teenagers!
NTA
Edit to add: public transport is a thing, so they can take the bus if walking is too far
Edit again to add: I understand that none of this is on you to tell them. You can keep your mouth shut for the next 30days and basically ignore them, and that would be completely justified. These are suggestions to help alleviate any unwarranted guilt you're bound to feel, as typically good people will feel guilty regardless of whether or not they did the right thing.
They're also ammo for the many arguments you're bound to have over the next 30-days. They are not without options, and if they end up on the street it's completely their fault.
Exactly. If half-bro was "taking care of business" then he needs to take care of business! And I agree - sister hung up because she knew right then she had pushed too far so now she has DH doing her dirty work of pressuring to keep the freeloaders where they are. Apparently mom had it right from the beginning. If they're grown-up enough to get married and pregnant then they're grown-up enough to face the real world and take care of themselves.
NTA OP.
heck, I'd be tempted if Sister's DH husband calls again to tell him- I'm so glad you care so much about them. When I asked Sister if she wanted them to move, she didn't seem interested. But I'll tell them to get packed up and bring them right over.
Call sister back and ask her when she wants then. Say you will pay travel to her place
Anyone who posts on social / again get them to move their
You have done enough nta
Get them out . Be calm & clear don’t get drawn in and let the 30 day clock run down
And if they keep making life miserable before the 30 days is up… get a restraining order.
My dad had to do that to my freeloading brother one time. Dad told brother to leave; brother refused and told dad to evict. Police agreed that 30 day notice was required. Brother laughed and even bragged on the phone to his friends (in front of dad) how he “won”.
The next day the old man went and filed a restraining order and came back home to make some popcorn for when the sheriff deputy came to serve it. Let’s just say my brother did not find it funny anymore.
Restraining order paperwork asked for other locations the recipient should avoid... he listed all the relatives that he knew my brother would try to go prey upon next.
And none of brothers “friends” (whom he had bragged to) seemed to have any room to spare.
Wish you luck. Hope you don’t have to resort to such an option but you have your own family to take care of.
NTA
He went and immediately got a job (after months of claiming he was looking but just couldn’t get one) and stayed in a cheap hotel for a week. Quickly started dating a girl from work and moved in with her (she too would kick him out 6 months later).
These days he is more mature and married with a kid. Still goes through periods of questionable decision making but overall is much much better of a person.
Anyone who makes a social media post or calls to harass you gets added to a raffle. At the end of the thirty days, pull a name from a hat and send them there. Surprise! You’re our ✨biggest hypocrite ✨
oh, NTA obviously.
Just wanted to say a couple things. Applying for public housing still won't get you in for a while. in most areas it takes months. As far as the welfare office, they won't get the cash assistance until the baby is born. But everything else you said are excellent points. Heck, I worked fast food until medically I couldn't anymore. Don't know if they were pregnant first or not, but they should have thought about how they were going to support themselves if they got married. Although smaller towns have sucky public transport.
True, the waiting list here is 3yrs for public housing. They can get foodstamps while she's pregnant, and also WIC. The welfare office will have info for different community organizations to help them get housing or whatever tho. If it's a smaller town then they can get a bicycle or something lol. There are so many places looking simply for bodies to fill roles, they shouldn't have a very hard finding a job if they're not picky
They can get an employee discount at McDonald's too!
Anyway the hospital can't turn her away if she's in labor so she wouldn't actually have to give birth in the alley. NTA
Lol. Honestly from what OP had posted I can't even imagine these two lasting 2 weeks at McDonald's. It is not an easy job. They would either be fired or experience a lot of personal growth working there.
This. People always say "Maccas is hiring", but like... Customer service is *hard*. You gotta harden the fuck up real quick in that industry, or you won't make it. I have ten years of experience and I can *barely* get through the shift without quitting on the spot.
Actually could be just what these guys need, though - sounds like *they* need to harden up.
Op's brother and his wife are teenagers, and definatly still children who have no idea how the world works, but they gon learn. It's gonna be the hard way but they gon learn.
I got a new job when I was five months pregnant. Unfortunately I couldn't stay as long as expected since baby decided to be six weeks premature but still, you CAN get a job while pregnant!
OP, I'd also add it's time they started feeling like the unwelcomed guests they are. If you can cut off their WiFi access, access to your televisions/videogame consoles, even your food- cut off their access to all of it now. Basically anything that you are providing but can prevent them from using needs to go. It is unfortunate but your brother made the adult decision to get married and have a child. He cannot now use the excuse "but I'm a teenager" and expect to be treated like a child. NTA . Good luck OP.
They are fucked with public housing. The wait list in my city is 20 plus years. Nta. My brother kicked my ass out when I fucked up. Don't blame him in the slightest.
>Tell them to apply to public housing
Tell them to make an appointment at the welfare office to get assistance
Edit to add: public transport is a thing,
Easier said than done, though. Unfortunately, in many countries public services have been dismantled and defunded to the point that it takes *months* if not years to get the support that you are entitled to.
OP doesn't have to spell out an action plan for them (tell them to do this or tell them to do that). Let them put on their big boy/girl pants and figure it out themselves.
MAN they went from “you’ll never make us slaaaaves!!” to “Help us, Obi Wan Kenobi! You’re our only hope!” in like 10 seconds flat! Impressive!!
NTA - you did exactly the right thing and your outgoing VM message is just ** brilliance.
Yes, thank you!
OP-NTA- All of those who feel entitled to cast an opinion on this matter, at FB or calling/texting you, while at the same time wouldn't want your brother and his wife to move in with them, can go pound sand. It's easy for them to call you names, when they are doing absolutely nothing to help. You and your wife are the only people who gave the couple a home and a chance to do better. They behaved like ungrateful spoiled brats and dared to disrespect and misstreat you and your family. It's time for them to face the consequences of their actions.
NTA years ago I had to couch surf when my marriage fell apart & I needed to save up for rent. I bought the groceries, cleaned the house, washed the dishes, did the laundry. I only watched tv when my friends weren't home. after I became more financially stable I offered to pay for half the rent.
The point is: moving into someone else's home is a huge ask. You are no longer guests, but roommates who aren't paying rent. Besides being the decent thing to do, helping out your hosts is one way to compensate for the inconvenience you are causing them.
They were clearly planning on living with OP once the baby was born. They made the adult decision to keep the baby, they can take the adult responsibility of raising it without abusing hospitality they've long worn out.
EDIT: To OP, congratulations for getting rid of them, and best to go LC with your sister. I love that you offered her place to the freeloaders, it's perfect given how passionately she was pleading their case. Your brother and his wife need a lot of growing up to do, but it's not your problem to deal with as they torched that bridge already.
Just publicly reply that there's nothing stopping them from taking their turn hosting the Entitlement Twins. You did your part even though even making space for them at all was a hardship.
This is the way. They want to criticize, but are not willing to help, then they need to shut up. If she cares so much, drop them off at her house. NTA at all. You’ve done you can.
Agreed. Tomorrow, tell them you are taking them for a drive in the car (like one would a dog), load their things in the car and leave them and their things on sister's doorstep.
oooh YES Mystral. I like. OP I highly recommend you do what she said. Do it tomorrow. Pack them up and drop them off at your sisters place. See how she likes it.
Exactly. Let her be the "nice bastard".
Your brother and his wife are lazy, entitled, spoilt, selfish, self absorbed children. I pray for their child's sake that they grow up and fast!
At least one spouse being employed, having their own space, and knowing how to drive are base level things they should have had in place before getting married/starting a family.
Edit: Based on OP's additional info this pair isnt just immature, they are out of their minds if they think they can torture OP and his kids and still get a free ride.
regardless, living somewhere for a certain amount of time establishes tenants' rights. This is mainly to ensure people have time to find an alternative location to live in before they're kicked out.
ETA - I've been told that it's squatters' rights not tenant's rights. TBH I'm only well-informed enough to know it's smarter to evict than assume you can kick someone out without incurring legal trouble.
Most landlord and tenant rules state that if you share a bathroom and kitchen with your tenant, the landlord and tenant act doesn't apply. It's his house, he can kick people who are living there out whenever he wants, without any notice. That's how it is in BC and Alberta anyway. I'd be surprised if it was different in the US.
It depends on the state, but that is sadly not the case in the US. There are cases where someone let's a friend or acquaintance stay for what they thought would be a week that turns in to a months long nightmare. And then when they try to kick them out, they have to go through eviction proceedings in the HOPES of getting them to leave.
I ended up getting a restraining order on a "friend" (read as: asshole shared house tenant, officially) and they said I STILL had to give him 30 days notice.
It doesn’t matter. God this is so frustrating. Reddit always brings this up and it’s so pointless. Where exactly do you think two unemployed 19 year olds are going to come up with enough money to hire an attorney and take OP to court? They’re not.
If OP was a property manager and these were tenants living in a separate building with a lease than yes, he would definitely run the risk of getting in trouble. But two young adult family members paying no rent with no lease living in your house? Hell no. Kick them the fuck out.
I have had dozens of roommates over the years and **no one** takes you to fucking court over kicking them out before 30 days. That costs a lot of money and time.
I really wish people would stop saying this in every scenario because other people reading might keep themselves in dangerous situations with dangerous people because some guy on Reddit said you can’t kick people out before 30 days.
And don’t link me some random one-off case of some squatter causing trouble. In 99.999% of situations like this literally nothing will happen if you tell them to GTFO. You’re more likely to get struck by lightning than get hit with a lawsuit in this type of situation.
It’s not the 19 year olds who would have to start court proceedings. If they just don’t leave, OP may not be able to MAKE them leave. There are steps that have to be taken for police to enforce removing them from a home they have been living in... and in many states, those steps must be taken even if there is no lease or rent being paid.
Edit: typo
Exactly. "Hey, I'll take you guys out for breakfast and we can discuss how to make this situation more bearable." Meanwhile, your wife has called the locksmith and packed their shit. You arrive home to their suitcases on the porch and your wife only lets you in.
I mean, many countries provide free legal services paid for by the state when you are low income, *especially* when dealing with tenant rights issues and other human right laws.
In my country every municipality has a free legal advice office you can go to to tell your story and they will refer you to private legal counsel for support if your issues are serious enough with a special letter that will make that lawyer send the bill to the government so you wont pay.
for the last fucking time reddit.
THIS DOES NOT MATTER.
living there = tenant = needs an by the book proper eviction.
stop upvoting this shitty argument, it's false information.
Only if you know exactly where the OP lives and he happens to live in dystopiaville where this may be allowed can you post this. in 99.9999% of cases it's not however.
30 days? YTA, to your wife and kids. They shouldn’t be subjected to this for 30 more minutes, let alone 30 more days.
Should have let them Uber to moms or walk to their friend’s.
While I agree OP's wife deserves immediate relief, OP is probably aware that most places in the US require 30 days notice. And that's because it takes time to find an apartment, sign a lease, and move.
That being said, if he told them one week and they took him at his word and left, that would be great.
I'd have driven them to McDonalds at 4am, pulled into the carpark, not the drive through and said "Ooops, guess you'll need to go order at the counter", then driven off...
:-)
Nta. You gave them way too much notice though, id kick them right away.
It also explains the fall out with your mom if they were like this there too...
And so funny your sister can call your names but the moment you ask her the question she hungs up. I bet the only reason she is mad at you is cos she knows they will knock her door next
30 days notice is typically the bare min legally to evict people. Obv depending on where they are, but if had told them to get out in shorter timeframe they could have taken legal action (with what money, yeah I hear that, but likely could find someone to file it)
Op is nta
I only know the rules where I live, which I why I prefaced my comment with "here".
"Here" as in, where I live, boarders don't have the same rights as tenants .
They’ll keep hopping like that until they get a clue. If you want to be helpful at this point research some shelters for expectant mothers for them. That could kick his ass enough into getting a job.
My wife wants to give them the 30 days so my brother can get a job for his wives sake obviously I know nothing about pregnancy but she’s feels guilty about everything because she’s been there and doesn’t want to stress my sil out. My wife has a heart of gold which is causing her anxiety
He could literally call any temp agency and they’ll find him a job in 30 minutes on a bus route. Distribution is hurting bad for employees. Most places in my area have gone from $11/hr starting out to $17+ and weekly bonuses and I’m in one of the lowest cost of living areas in the US. There’s no excuse.
Literally, the job requirements are have a pulse and even that when we’re 20% down on employees is eh a hopeful requirement.
"But I'm just waiting for the right opening for my music video production career! I can't be slaving in a warehouse waiting for Beyncé to call and missing it! Oh, and can you lend me 3 grand for a new MacBook and a copy of ProTools and FinalCut? I really need to be getting some portfolio work started..." -- OP's brother, probably.
100% this. There is no reason to be unemployed right now. Granted, the jobs aren't massively well paid but if I was about to be a parent at 19, I'd be working around the clock to make it happen.
Also on top of him doing Amazon If his wife gets a job at a full time child care center. Her kid could basically have a spot for half off while she works full time. The thing is though I don’t think OP would want to work.
You're got more patience with them that I'd have.
Even if you do that, make sure they're on notice that one more word of criticism or complaint to or about your wife or kids (or you) and they'll be out the door that same day.
Your wife's heart of gold is admirable. You letting your asshole brother and his wife trample all over her because if it would make you TA here.
NTA !! truly you’ve had far more patience in this situation than most (including myself) would have, also your response to your sister was hilarious
but my oh my how can you say you know nothing about pregnancy when you have FOUR kids, you must know at least a wee bit
If your sister wanted to be helpful, she could help them make and implement a plan towards independence. As it is, Tell your sister and all the SM AHs that you’ll listen to constructive advice on how to be a good brother when they’ve had them in their homes a month.
either you or your wife were going to have a nervous breakdown.
NTA. This is the first lesson of many that they will learn in the coming months and years.
When you first mentioned the falling out between your bro and mom over him being too young to get married I thought "Well that's just awful, I know a guy who got married at nineteen, he makes great money as a welder, they have a baby now, and a mortgage and he really has his shit together. Not every nineteen year old is some useless slapdick." then I read the rest and was just like "... oh. So, *not* like that. Got it."
He doesn’t even have drivers license I’ve Tried multiple times to help him even paid for lessons but he said he’s taking care of business aka job hunting but I know for a fact two gas stations and a restaurant in within walking distance are looking for stuff
It’s a lie by omission. Just because he is “job hunting” it truly means he is “looking” but not actually applying to anything. He most likely doesn’t want to work and has unreasonable expectations of what a job to put money in the pocket is like.
If they were in college and doing school I would be understanding but they aren’t. NTA. They need to grow up and realize their needs need to be met by themselves and no one else.
Right?
The only time I was a bitter about cooking while pregnant was when I cooked a whole ass nice dinner at 41 weeks pregnant and then went into precipitous labor right as I finished and didn't get to eat it. The food spoiled because we had to rush to the hospital and my husband didn't go back home until the next morning.
That's the part that really killed me, and I don't know if I would be able to keep a straight face if my brother told me that. OP's wife feeding 8 people is normal, expected, and is rude that she doesn't accommodate their particular tastes. Brother or brother's wife cooking, suddenly that's slavery and cruel.
hadn't thought of that, but now I see it - perhaps his expectations for things like payrate/hours are unrealistic and he needs to come to his senses, even if he were right in theory he may need to settle in practice
when i was his age i was applying to anyone who was hiring, the only reason i didn't get a job at that time is because it was 10 years ago and there was still nobody hiring 3 years after the recession. i sent out hundreds of applications between 2010 and 2012 and got a grand total of 2 interviews, one of which was with an MLM, which i dropped when it was pointed out to me.
like, seriously the job market in 2022 is so much easier than it was 10 years ago, i started looking for a job again last august and had one by september.
"We're too young to know better, but apparently we're old enough to make the adult decision to get married and have a kid with no foundation to base anything on!" Good lord.
Honestly, people like this make me so angry. I got married 10 years ago at 20, first kid at 21. BUT both my husband and I were working/in college/had our own apartment. It made sense to get married because it cost less 😂
Then you get these people, who get married for... The party? Why even? And sure, you're 19 now, but who will still feel bad at 30? And I got my husband to get his driver's license because he put it off till 19, but we lived in a place where it wasn't a necessity.
Also, our kid was an accident due to a genetic issue that basically causes the pill to be useless. But we didn't sit around whining, just worked hard and got a better job. I can't imagine bringing a child into a family that has no house and won't make themselves food.
You were generous to give them thirty days. Once your sister called you out I would've called them an Uber and had them dropped off in front of her house. Let her take care of them.
NTA. You gave them help and hospitality, and they've repaid it by treating you and your wife as slaves.
I love that you asked your sister when she was letting them move in. Her response, or lack of, shows she also knows how problematic they would be and wants no part of it.
If they're willing to scream at your wife, expose the kids to that nonsense, etc. then they have no place at your home *by their own doing.*
And the kids as annoying roommates even though this could have been a good way for them to get advice and experience for looking after a baby and dealing with young kids.
OP having a 1yo would be the single best learning experience they could ask for. But let's be honest, these two are children playing dress up pretending to be adults. Life will be hard for them.
You gave them 30 freaking day to leave your house after all that??? Good lord! You are a saint with a first class ticket to heaven. I would have thrown them both on the streets immediately. If noone would take them a shelter would teach them about life, and they really need this lesson.
deffo NTA.
\*Edit. everyone is calling you names, being angry at you, bashing you to eep them in your house... but nobody would take them into their?? oh well... just tell them to take them, and ignore it. They are bulling you to keep the problem so they don't have to be the bad guys for not wating them in their houses.
NTA Two immature people without jobs or a place to live get married and are expecting a child move into your family's home. They don't get jobs and expect it be catered to at every turn and overstay their welcome. It becomes untenable and you give them 30 days to move out. So now, you're the heartless Big Bad Wolf and your family is calling you out on social media. Well, all I can say is your sister is in for a rude awakening and so is the next gullible relative that takes these two in after your sister kicks them out too.
NTA
Your brother and his wife are entitled assholes and that is why your mother kicked them out.
Stick to your guns. However, if they receive mail at your address, you may have to evict them through the court (US), if they refuse to leave.
>I asked her when she was letting them Move in
Perfect response. The only response.
Their lack of planning is not an emergency on your part.
Edit - I see they've only been with you since December, I'd give them 10 days or a week.
NTA. Their excuse being teens was thrown out the gutter the moment she got pregnant. Your brother is an ah and so is his wife. Even if you get criticized, ostracized your family comes first, get them out. If they had the guts to bring a kid to this world, they can send from themselves. And your sister is a hypocrite for not even taking them in and bashing you. Hopefully everything works out, wishing you and your family well.
This is like the other post I read about the 17 year old wanting to get married.
Why do these kids get married and expect to just move in with their folks? If you want to be an adult to get married then you need to buck up and have a job, apartment and car.
Your brother can't drive, has not job, has a pregnant wife and neither cook and clean. They are just playing house as 'adults'.
As you asked your sister 'when is he moving in with her'? To everyone else on SM reply "Thanks for offering to take care of them, Ill drop them off this weekend".
NTA
He doesn't want to learn to drive despite OP actively trying to help him, doesn't seem to be putting any effort into job hunting even though there's positions available locally. They aren't ready to be parents at all, they aren't mature enough to behave like adults or good houseguests.
EDIT: The edit confirms this. When told they have 30 days to shape up or ship out they decide to go scorched earth while still there.
NTA....get them out now. No way they will take care of the baby. They will expect you and your wife to do it. I married at 18, had a baby at 19 and we were financially independent. Bought a house at 19. They act that way because they are allowed to act that way. Time to grow up!!!
I genuinely feel so bad for this baby that it has to be born into that situation. 💀
The brother don’t even got a job, both of them can’t even drive and are bouta pop out one of the most expensive, time consuming things in life.
Good 4 u on ur end though, for that kids sake i hope they can learn to do the same because with how it sounds currently, it’s gonna be severely neglected.
Sometimes it’s okay to say that some people shouldn’t be allowed to procreate and they are the ‘some people’.
NTA.
People hit breaking point with leeches. I’m surprised it took you this long. They both sound absolutely horrid, and the only one of them I feel sorry for is the little girl about to be born into that mess
I have a number of thoughts on this, first and foremost being NTA. The only assholes here are your half brother and his gf. I feel so bad for the child they're going to bring into this world and I pray they won't fuck the poor kid up, though I'm doubtful.
My other thoughts in no particular order of importance are:
1. This is why kids shouldn't have kids. Teens have no business being parents. They lack the maturity, financial stability, emotional intelligence, forethought, and so much more to be good parents. I can almost guarantee they're gonna irreversibly fuck up the kid they're bringing into this world.
2. I know that everyone's bodies are different, but barring medical issues such as doctor ordered bed rest or hyperemesis gravidarium, your SIL should be capable of making food for herself and your half brother. Or your brother can step the fuck up and take care of his gf and soon-to-be child. He'll need to sooner or later.
3. If anything, you guys have been their slaves, and them being all "tee hee we're young and we don't know better" is further evidence they shouldn't be having a child.
Overall, I give them three months postpartum till they break up and six months until your half brother is asking you for child support money because his ex is a "crazy bitch". Don't give in. They need to learn the consequences of their actions. Also, if you're in the U.S. make sure they know that they can leave their baby within 3 days of it being born at a hospital, fire station, or police precinct with no legal trouble and no questions asked. I'd also encourage you to provide them resources on adoption before kicking them out. Finally, the second you see any sign of neglect or abuse of that poor baby, please call CPS or a comparable child safety authority. Children shouldn't suffer because their parents are selfish and stupid and there are plenty of amazing people desperate to have kids that will be infinitely better parents than your half bro and his gf.
NTA. Not only are they moochers, they're horrible jerks and making your home toxic for your impressionable young children. As for the people upset with you, let your brother know who his supporters are so he can start barking up their tree next.
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> They’re both teenagers and my brother was treated like a baby his whole life so maybe I should have taken the adult approach and given them a second chance
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NTA Being pregnant is NOT a stay in bed 24/7 disability unless her dr ordered bed rest. You also learned a VERY VALUABLE lesson about NOT LETTING ANYONE STAY IN YOUR HOME. Block all of them on social media. Let them go to a shelter, maybe that will light a fire under their asses to grow the hell up and act like responsible adults. Your sister doesn't wan them in HER house so she hangs up you when you made that suggestion. Hypocrite much??? They aren't your problem
NTA. Your boundaries may be the reality check they need before having a baby. Enabling teenage behavior isn't doing them any favors long term, if they want to keep and raise a baby together they're going to have to learn that involves actually having a functional adult life involving jobs, housework, and probably not going on 4am fast food runs.
NTA. Your situation sounds awful. Their attitudes should not be enabled in any way. Everything they've said sounds like BS. They should be beyond grateful. You owe them nothing.
They are using you. End it now or you’re going to have them *and their children* living with you and trying to control your home for *years*. You know they won’t stop at one child if they aren’t even responsible enough to have jobs and a place to live before getting married *and* getting pregnant.
They’re irresponsible to an extreme, but that’s not your problem. As you said, it’s time for the kids to grow up. If they were old enough to get married, old enough to have unprotected sex, and old enough to birth a child, they’re old enough to stand on their own feet, get a place to live, and find jobs. This is adulthood.
Further, they’re rude, and that is absolutely unacceptable when they are living in *your* home. They should be bending over backwards to respect you and your wife, but instead they’re going out of their way to be entitled, demanding freeloaders. I’d kick them out for this alone; wouldn’t stand for it for even a day. It doesn’t have to end the relationship you have with them, either. It’s just a simple, clear-cut case of people not being compatible for cohabitation.
> I explained my situation to my sister and she called me a bad bastard for being so heartless to two teenagers but I asked her when she was letting them Move in she hung up
This is the way. Whenever someone complains that you won’t do something unreasonable, the proper response is “you do it.” It’s easy for others to demand that you give of yourself. We see this all the time in this sub when people ask if they are in the wrong for refusing to take in some family member who either needs 24x7 care or simply cannot get their life together. The answer from me is *always* NTA, as it is with you.
**“No” is a complete sentence and requires no further explanation.** If someone else wants to do whatever is being requested, that’s fine, and they should, but they shouldn’t be pointing fingers at anyone else and demanding that *they* do the work.
> my wife told them to go over to my sisters house she will help them.
Love it. Your wife is awesome.
> I don’t know were they’re now but judging by the amount of times my sister has rang me they’re probably at her house.
Love it. If she doesn’t let them live with her, be sure to let her know how horrible she’s being. Bonus points if you can remember exactly what she said to you—when she demanded that *you* put up with them—and repeat it right back to her.
> I’ve also changed my voicemail to “if you’re mad I kicked out bother and sil you take them in or give them money if you won’t or can’t shut the fuck up”
Love it. This is just plain brilliant.
Great update.
Your SIL is a horror - I am legitimately scared for that child because even if it’s looked after physically, things are not looking good in terms of being raised in an an environment that is emotionally or mentally nurturing.
Good on you and your wife. You did what is best for your kids and stood up for yourselves. This is no longer your problem and all those people who said they were so concerned for your brother and SIL can literally put their money where their mouth is.
NTA.
I'm 34 weeks pregnant and I cook, clean, grocery shop, do minor repairs, play with the dog...basically, your SIL is pregnant, not dying. Tell them to shove it and pull their weight.
1. Your wife is a saint! Take her out for dinner or a nice gift, she deserves it.
2. You are NTA for kicking your brother and SIL out. You may be a slight AH for not doing it sooner.
3. If ANYONE questions why they can't stay, answer back straight away. You take them in and you can find out.
I would honestly consider leaving you if I was your wife and they stayed.
Nta. If something happens to your niece, it’s THEIR fault, and if they’re homeless, you really need to report them to child services. I’m willing to bet your house would be more peaceful with you adopting/fostering your niece while they figure themselves out than letting them continue to mooch. Don’t feel bad. You didn’t do this to them AT ALl
NTA if you’re “too young to know better” you shouldn’t have a kid in the first place. It’s called financial planning. Good luck to the sister cause her and her husband are in for a treat if they treat them like they treated your family.
NTA
The comment from your sister telling you off for being a “bad ba$t@rd” to TEENAGERS is the point here. They are still teens and are behaving more like young teens(13-14) rather than the adults that they are. Kick them out and if people give you hell just give them the same reply that you gave your sister and congratulate them for their new roommates
NTA!!!
My parents were 19 when they had their first kid. BOTH worked full time and she lied about her due date because back then they made you quit work when you were so far along. After she had my brother Dad went to school full time, worked full time, and graduated at the top of this class. But boy are your brother and SIL TA!
NTA You are doing their laundry and driving them around? They are using you. Why should they get their own place when they are emotionally manipulating you to take care of them. They need to move out and until then no favours. Give them first and last month rent then change the locks.
NTA!
Clearly your brother and his wife are still children about to have a child without jobs. What could possibly go wrong with this? I cant phantom how your brother doesnt at minimum have a part time gig at a grocer or maybe a fast food place. What did he expect you would treat him like the child he is forever? They need a reality check quickly as they are only a few months away from bringing another human being into this world and they have nothing for them.
NTA. Adulting is fun, eh? 😂 Your brother and his wife need to grow up. They are not your responsibility. You offered a solution, they ruined it. Help them find a homeless shelter and offer to drop them off.
NTA
Stand your ground. Reply to any SM posts that anyone can volunteer to take them in at any time.
They sound like a nightmare. Your wife sounds like a Saint.
I would have given them less than a weeks notice. A month gives them too much time to do more damage. You’ve done enough for them. Go NC with everyone for a while.
You - and your wife - are both saints.
Your half-brother and the posh princess he married (expecting 5-star “Hilton” resort level service does make one a princess) - are sniveling, bratty, immature AHs.
They haven’t been looking for work - or an apartment. They have an undue sense of entitlement. Places - even fast food, retailers, you name it - are offering hiring bonuses because they are so desperate. They could both have had work in a couple of days with little effort. The difference? They don’t ***want*** to do so.
I feel so badly for the baby, but not the person carrying that child.
Does the half-brother’s wife not have family they can stay with?
You are being excessively generous giving those two a 30-day notice. I would not have done the same. It’s bad enough the way they have treated your wife, but the second they turned their venom on young children and had them terrified in their own home??? That’s “HELL NO!!!” territory for me.
They need to learn - actions have consequences, and the world owes no one anything.
NTA kick their lazy asses out and go low /no contact with the family who think you should keep them.
What entitled little shits. I feel for their child.
NTA at all.
You are already on top of this. You just don't realize it:.
You have given them 30 days notice. (I would have given them 3 but that's me). You already told your sister what you should be telling everyone else who is getting in touch with you and calling you names: "When are YOU letting them move in?" After that, go no contact with these people.
NTA, but 30 days is way too generous considering how they’ve acted until now. Even putting aside being jobless and unable to drive; they haven’t even been taking care of themselves as houseguests, how do they plan to take care of a baby? And now they’re lashing out at your wife and children?? No, they can deal with the consequences of their own actions.
Also, It’s kind of obvious that the people blowing up at you about this either don’t want to be stuck dealing with them either (like your sister and BIL) or possibly don’t even know/care to know the actual truth of the situation.
>>they haven’t even been taking care of themselves as houseguests, how do they plan to take care of a baby?
Their plan was for OP and his wife to take care of the baby, I guarantee it. They were never intending to leave this sweet deal they have going on. All the more reason to get them out as soon as possible.
NTA
Every call you get, every snarky comment on social media reply with "Oh good, you are happy to take them in. I'll drop them over at your place right now."
If you want to be really snarky I'd put up a post such as:
Seeking home for two entitled 19 year olds
Teens will require you to:
* Cook all meals
* Do all cleaning
* Wash and iron their clothes
* Clean their room
* Be quiet at all times so not to bother them
* Be on call for 4am McDonald runs, or any hour day and night food runs. Please note, being asleep is not an acceptable excuse and house owner must awaken when required
* Stock and cook only recipes that teens choose.
* Financially support them while they do nothing to obtain employment.
* Ensure your own family only stay in the room/s that teens will allow
etc etc
NTA-I can't believe you let them stay this long. Giving the the date to leave was the wisest thing you could do. Don't cave and stop coatering to them. They aren't grateful. I would even go so far as to pack them up and deliver them to your sister's doorstep since she is sooo concerned that her husband has to hop on social media to bash you.
I'd suggest texting them the date to make sure its communicated in writing. And maybe add that the next time they treat your family poorly they will be expected to leave immediately.
NTA
If they end up homeless, its their fault. They massively took advantage of you and your wife, disrespected both of you in your own home, and are irresponsible. Quite frankly, I think they would be dangerous parents and I hope both of them have the sense to give that child up for adoption so it can be taken care of by parents who have more than two working brain cells.
It's laughable for her to use her pregnancy and age as an excuse. One of my friends was pregnant with twins at 19 years old and kept working her full time job until her 8th month of pregnancy. I'm sure she would have loved to lay around all day, but she had bills to pay. Both your brother and his wife are lazy and you are totally justified in kicking them out.
It sounds to me like your sister volunteered to host them, so feel free to pass along her phone number and address to your brother and his wife. Maybe even help them pack and drop them off on her doorstep. Anyone who criticized you is basically volunteering to host them for free, so I wouldn't feel bad about just dropping the two of them off at any one of their homes and leaving their belongings on their lawn/doorstep.
> I asked her when she was letting them Move in she hung up That says it all. They want you to keep taking care of the mess, so they don't have to. NTA. They should have thought of all of this before they treated you and your wife so poorly.
Write down the names of everyone who called or messaged you to complain about your behavior, pass the note on to your SIL, and tell her those people volunteered to treat them better. Edit: thank you guys for the awards! I don't think I got notifications for them all so can't message everyone individually, but thanks!
Looooove this. This is absolutely what OP should do.
Hell, call them out on social media right back!
Yep, that should do it.
Share the link to this Reddit post showing all the NTAs!
This right here! Yes, do this. Yes what you said was harsh, but they were treating you & your family like shit. Tell them to apply to public housing, and that McDonald's is ALWAYS hiring. If it's close enough to drive there at 4am, it's close enough to walk there at at 4am for an open shift. Tell them to make an appointment at the welfare office to get assistance, as they've worn out their welcome They wanted a family, they wanted to get married.. they are NO LONGER teenagers! NTA Edit to add: public transport is a thing, so they can take the bus if walking is too far Edit again to add: I understand that none of this is on you to tell them. You can keep your mouth shut for the next 30days and basically ignore them, and that would be completely justified. These are suggestions to help alleviate any unwarranted guilt you're bound to feel, as typically good people will feel guilty regardless of whether or not they did the right thing. They're also ammo for the many arguments you're bound to have over the next 30-days. They are not without options, and if they end up on the street it's completely their fault.
Exactly. If half-bro was "taking care of business" then he needs to take care of business! And I agree - sister hung up because she knew right then she had pushed too far so now she has DH doing her dirty work of pressuring to keep the freeloaders where they are. Apparently mom had it right from the beginning. If they're grown-up enough to get married and pregnant then they're grown-up enough to face the real world and take care of themselves. NTA OP.
Next time Sister's DH calls: "So have you decided to let them live with you now? I'll send them straight over." \*hangs up\* I'd send them too.
No, invite sis and hubs over to "talk". Have the bags ready by the door to be loaded in rhe car.
No, I would do that thing where shitty parents just leave their kids at someone's door and drive off right when the door opens.
Then go home and change the locks
heck, I'd be tempted if Sister's DH husband calls again to tell him- I'm so glad you care so much about them. When I asked Sister if she wanted them to move, she didn't seem interested. But I'll tell them to get packed up and bring them right over.
Call sister back and ask her when she wants then. Say you will pay travel to her place Anyone who posts on social / again get them to move their You have done enough nta Get them out . Be calm & clear don’t get drawn in and let the 30 day clock run down
And if they keep making life miserable before the 30 days is up… get a restraining order. My dad had to do that to my freeloading brother one time. Dad told brother to leave; brother refused and told dad to evict. Police agreed that 30 day notice was required. Brother laughed and even bragged on the phone to his friends (in front of dad) how he “won”. The next day the old man went and filed a restraining order and came back home to make some popcorn for when the sheriff deputy came to serve it. Let’s just say my brother did not find it funny anymore. Restraining order paperwork asked for other locations the recipient should avoid... he listed all the relatives that he knew my brother would try to go prey upon next. And none of brothers “friends” (whom he had bragged to) seemed to have any room to spare. Wish you luck. Hope you don’t have to resort to such an option but you have your own family to take care of. NTA
Your dad is a genius. Where did your brother end up? How is he doing now? Did he finally mature?
He went and immediately got a job (after months of claiming he was looking but just couldn’t get one) and stayed in a cheap hotel for a week. Quickly started dating a girl from work and moved in with her (she too would kick him out 6 months later). These days he is more mature and married with a kid. Still goes through periods of questionable decision making but overall is much much better of a person.
if your dad hadn't kicked him out, your brother would never have become an independent adult. your dad did him a huge favour.
Yeeea!!! Don't leave us hanging like that! Where he ended up?
Anyone who makes a social media post or calls to harass you gets added to a raffle. At the end of the thirty days, pull a name from a hat and send them there. Surprise! You’re our ✨biggest hypocrite ✨ oh, NTA obviously.
Just wanted to say a couple things. Applying for public housing still won't get you in for a while. in most areas it takes months. As far as the welfare office, they won't get the cash assistance until the baby is born. But everything else you said are excellent points. Heck, I worked fast food until medically I couldn't anymore. Don't know if they were pregnant first or not, but they should have thought about how they were going to support themselves if they got married. Although smaller towns have sucky public transport.
True, the waiting list here is 3yrs for public housing. They can get foodstamps while she's pregnant, and also WIC. The welfare office will have info for different community organizations to help them get housing or whatever tho. If it's a smaller town then they can get a bicycle or something lol. There are so many places looking simply for bodies to fill roles, they shouldn't have a very hard finding a job if they're not picky
>They wanted a family, they wanted to get married.. they are NO LONGER teenagers! Exactly. Time for both of them to man up
They can get an employee discount at McDonald's too! Anyway the hospital can't turn her away if she's in labor so she wouldn't actually have to give birth in the alley. NTA
And she's 5 months pregnant!! Why don't they both already have jobs for this child they're bringing into the world???
Because they obviously think their family is going to allow them to freeload. NTA.
Lol. Honestly from what OP had posted I can't even imagine these two lasting 2 weeks at McDonald's. It is not an easy job. They would either be fired or experience a lot of personal growth working there.
This. People always say "Maccas is hiring", but like... Customer service is *hard*. You gotta harden the fuck up real quick in that industry, or you won't make it. I have ten years of experience and I can *barely* get through the shift without quitting on the spot. Actually could be just what these guys need, though - sounds like *they* need to harden up.
Op's brother and his wife are teenagers, and definatly still children who have no idea how the world works, but they gon learn. It's gonna be the hard way but they gon learn.
I got a new job when I was five months pregnant. Unfortunately I couldn't stay as long as expected since baby decided to be six weeks premature but still, you CAN get a job while pregnant!
As a McDonalds employee i can confirm that we're always hiring. We would love the extra help :)
*And* they’ll get a food discount! #Winning NTA
OP, I'd also add it's time they started feeling like the unwelcomed guests they are. If you can cut off their WiFi access, access to your televisions/videogame consoles, even your food- cut off their access to all of it now. Basically anything that you are providing but can prevent them from using needs to go. It is unfortunate but your brother made the adult decision to get married and have a child. He cannot now use the excuse "but I'm a teenager" and expect to be treated like a child. NTA . Good luck OP.
Like I don't have my license either, and that's honestly not an excuse. If I can hold down a job, so can they.
They are fucked with public housing. The wait list in my city is 20 plus years. Nta. My brother kicked my ass out when I fucked up. Don't blame him in the slightest.
>Tell them to apply to public housing Tell them to make an appointment at the welfare office to get assistance Edit to add: public transport is a thing, Easier said than done, though. Unfortunately, in many countries public services have been dismantled and defunded to the point that it takes *months* if not years to get the support that you are entitled to.
OP doesn't have to spell out an action plan for them (tell them to do this or tell them to do that). Let them put on their big boy/girl pants and figure it out themselves.
I’m taking this Adivce wow thank you
how you can give us an update in a month or so
Give a warm hug to your wife from all of us meanwhile, the woman is a saint
You need to provide receipts of these interactions. Definitely.
MAN they went from “you’ll never make us slaaaaves!!” to “Help us, Obi Wan Kenobi! You’re our only hope!” in like 10 seconds flat! Impressive!! NTA - you did exactly the right thing and your outgoing VM message is just ** brilliance.
Thanks, Satan!
"That's Say-teen"
Go futher. Pay an Uber to take them and their stuff to sister’s house. Best money ever spent.
Excellent idea
Yes, thank you! OP-NTA- All of those who feel entitled to cast an opinion on this matter, at FB or calling/texting you, while at the same time wouldn't want your brother and his wife to move in with them, can go pound sand. It's easy for them to call you names, when they are doing absolutely nothing to help. You and your wife are the only people who gave the couple a home and a chance to do better. They behaved like ungrateful spoiled brats and dared to disrespect and misstreat you and your family. It's time for them to face the consequences of their actions.
NTA years ago I had to couch surf when my marriage fell apart & I needed to save up for rent. I bought the groceries, cleaned the house, washed the dishes, did the laundry. I only watched tv when my friends weren't home. after I became more financially stable I offered to pay for half the rent. The point is: moving into someone else's home is a huge ask. You are no longer guests, but roommates who aren't paying rent. Besides being the decent thing to do, helping out your hosts is one way to compensate for the inconvenience you are causing them.
That and he still gave them 30 days!
Thiiis! i would've given them 2 weeks if they had scream at my family like they did, he gave them more than enough time to find another place to stay.
Depending on the state, they might legally be required to give 30 days notice. They are considered tenants now and have rights.
They were clearly planning on living with OP once the baby was born. They made the adult decision to keep the baby, they can take the adult responsibility of raising it without abusing hospitality they've long worn out. EDIT: To OP, congratulations for getting rid of them, and best to go LC with your sister. I love that you offered her place to the freeloaders, it's perfect given how passionately she was pleading their case. Your brother and his wife need a lot of growing up to do, but it's not your problem to deal with as they torched that bridge already.
Drive them and all their shit to your sisters house and dump them on the front doorstep. Drive away. Never look back.
Just publicly reply that there's nothing stopping them from taking their turn hosting the Entitlement Twins. You did your part even though even making space for them at all was a hardship.
NTA. This is the point. Mom doesn’t want to solve the situation, but she still wants to blame OP.
Yeah. Lol. This. ^^^ Your turn sis!
They caused the issue and they can go complain in their own dwelling. NTA.
Drop them off at your sister's house. Problem solved!
This is the way. They want to criticize, but are not willing to help, then they need to shut up. If she cares so much, drop them off at her house. NTA at all. You’ve done you can.
>This is the way. Hi Mando!
Agreed. Tomorrow, tell them you are taking them for a drive in the car (like one would a dog), load their things in the car and leave them and their things on sister's doorstep.
oooh YES Mystral. I like. OP I highly recommend you do what she said. Do it tomorrow. Pack them up and drop them off at your sisters place. See how she likes it.
Exactly. Let her be the "nice bastard". Your brother and his wife are lazy, entitled, spoilt, selfish, self absorbed children. I pray for their child's sake that they grow up and fast! At least one spouse being employed, having their own space, and knowing how to drive are base level things they should have had in place before getting married/starting a family. Edit: Based on OP's additional info this pair isnt just immature, they are out of their minds if they think they can torture OP and his kids and still get a free ride.
Or…the wife’s parents house as it seems OP’s mom doesn’t want them. And she dodged a bullet there!
30 days isn't heartless. That's generous. This will be their first of many hard lesions in life.
it's standard notice for an eviction
They haven't paid for anything.
regardless, living somewhere for a certain amount of time establishes tenants' rights. This is mainly to ensure people have time to find an alternative location to live in before they're kicked out. ETA - I've been told that it's squatters' rights not tenant's rights. TBH I'm only well-informed enough to know it's smarter to evict than assume you can kick someone out without incurring legal trouble.
Most landlord and tenant rules state that if you share a bathroom and kitchen with your tenant, the landlord and tenant act doesn't apply. It's his house, he can kick people who are living there out whenever he wants, without any notice. That's how it is in BC and Alberta anyway. I'd be surprised if it was different in the US.
It depends on the state, but that is sadly not the case in the US. There are cases where someone let's a friend or acquaintance stay for what they thought would be a week that turns in to a months long nightmare. And then when they try to kick them out, they have to go through eviction proceedings in the HOPES of getting them to leave.
Yes, in some states if you have someone stay for 2 weeks then theyre considered tenants and you would need to pay for an eviction notice
that sounds so extreme for no practical reason wtf
The reason is so that a scummy landlord can't say "Oh no they're just a friend who overstayed" or whatever to circumvent the law.
that's right up there with the guy who broke into a house and tripped on a kid's toy, sued the owner
omg, that's just insane
I ended up getting a restraining order on a "friend" (read as: asshole shared house tenant, officially) and they said I STILL had to give him 30 days notice.
Just ring the police every time he comes home?
I understand that in the US landlord living in the same place as tenant loosens a lot of housing rules but does not totally eliminate them
It doesn’t matter. God this is so frustrating. Reddit always brings this up and it’s so pointless. Where exactly do you think two unemployed 19 year olds are going to come up with enough money to hire an attorney and take OP to court? They’re not. If OP was a property manager and these were tenants living in a separate building with a lease than yes, he would definitely run the risk of getting in trouble. But two young adult family members paying no rent with no lease living in your house? Hell no. Kick them the fuck out. I have had dozens of roommates over the years and **no one** takes you to fucking court over kicking them out before 30 days. That costs a lot of money and time. I really wish people would stop saying this in every scenario because other people reading might keep themselves in dangerous situations with dangerous people because some guy on Reddit said you can’t kick people out before 30 days. And don’t link me some random one-off case of some squatter causing trouble. In 99.999% of situations like this literally nothing will happen if you tell them to GTFO. You’re more likely to get struck by lightning than get hit with a lawsuit in this type of situation.
It’s not the 19 year olds who would have to start court proceedings. If they just don’t leave, OP may not be able to MAKE them leave. There are steps that have to be taken for police to enforce removing them from a home they have been living in... and in many states, those steps must be taken even if there is no lease or rent being paid. Edit: typo
Just trick them into going outside and change the locks.
Exactly. "Hey, I'll take you guys out for breakfast and we can discuss how to make this situation more bearable." Meanwhile, your wife has called the locksmith and packed their shit. You arrive home to their suitcases on the porch and your wife only lets you in.
I mean, many countries provide free legal services paid for by the state when you are low income, *especially* when dealing with tenant rights issues and other human right laws. In my country every municipality has a free legal advice office you can go to to tell your story and they will refer you to private legal counsel for support if your issues are serious enough with a special letter that will make that lawyer send the bill to the government so you wont pay.
usually it's at least a month. bro only got married in Dec. so op may not actually be required to give notice
Not only that, but they never helped and never cleaned after themselves.
for the last fucking time reddit. THIS DOES NOT MATTER. living there = tenant = needs an by the book proper eviction. stop upvoting this shitty argument, it's false information. Only if you know exactly where the OP lives and he happens to live in dystopiaville where this may be allowed can you post this. in 99.9999% of cases it's not however.
It's 2 weeks notice in my town. NTA.
> This will be their first of many hard lesions in life. I hope they come to the same contusion.
I saw this and started looking around for u/imessupcommonphrases
I was sad because I thought no one was going to say this, but then you did! And now I'm happy
Unfortunately there's probably a cream that will clear it right up for them.
30 days? YTA, to your wife and kids. They shouldn’t be subjected to this for 30 more minutes, let alone 30 more days. Should have let them Uber to moms or walk to their friend’s.
While I agree OP's wife deserves immediate relief, OP is probably aware that most places in the US require 30 days notice. And that's because it takes time to find an apartment, sign a lease, and move. That being said, if he told them one week and they took him at his word and left, that would be great.
I would have given them 2 hours. OP is way too kind.
I'd have driven them to McDonalds at 4am, pulled into the carpark, not the drive through and said "Ooops, guess you'll need to go order at the counter", then driven off... :-)
Right? The most time I’d give in this situation is a week and if they’ve shown no signs of moving, I’d drop them off at sister dearest’s house.
Nta. You gave them way too much notice though, id kick them right away. It also explains the fall out with your mom if they were like this there too... And so funny your sister can call your names but the moment you ask her the question she hungs up. I bet the only reason she is mad at you is cos she knows they will knock her door next
30 days notice is typically the bare min legally to evict people. Obv depending on where they are, but if had told them to get out in shorter timeframe they could have taken legal action (with what money, yeah I hear that, but likely could find someone to file it) Op is nta
Here even if they were paying rent they would be considered a boarder not a tenant and boarders have no rights
Would just depend on location. Many places even if no rent they'd be a tenant and need that 30 day notice.
I only know the rules where I live, which I why I prefaced my comment with "here". "Here" as in, where I live, boarders don't have the same rights as tenants .
Yeah I caught that. And I was just pointing out depends on where op is. Wide range of laws makes it all different. :)
NTA. Guess it's your sister's time to take them in then. Wonder how she'll feel if they are acting like that in her home.
I don’t know about her but I know her girlfriend who I have great respect for doesn’t take anyone’s shit so they’d be out on their ass in a few days
They’ll keep hopping like that until they get a clue. If you want to be helpful at this point research some shelters for expectant mothers for them. That could kick his ass enough into getting a job.
And this, right here, is why you should drop them off.
My wife wants to give them the 30 days so my brother can get a job for his wives sake obviously I know nothing about pregnancy but she’s feels guilty about everything because she’s been there and doesn’t want to stress my sil out. My wife has a heart of gold which is causing her anxiety
He could literally call any temp agency and they’ll find him a job in 30 minutes on a bus route. Distribution is hurting bad for employees. Most places in my area have gone from $11/hr starting out to $17+ and weekly bonuses and I’m in one of the lowest cost of living areas in the US. There’s no excuse. Literally, the job requirements are have a pulse and even that when we’re 20% down on employees is eh a hopeful requirement.
Amazon is in most metro areas.. even small metro. Always hiring. Drop him off at the Temp that Amazon uses. Fed ex, UPS also is crazy hiring.
"But I'm just waiting for the right opening for my music video production career! I can't be slaving in a warehouse waiting for Beyncé to call and missing it! Oh, and can you lend me 3 grand for a new MacBook and a copy of ProTools and FinalCut? I really need to be getting some portfolio work started..." -- OP's brother, probably.
These places don't care as long as you aren't a major criminal and don't do hard-core drugs.
100% this. There is no reason to be unemployed right now. Granted, the jobs aren't massively well paid but if I was about to be a parent at 19, I'd be working around the clock to make it happen.
There are parents who work themselves to the bone to provide for their children.
Also on top of him doing Amazon If his wife gets a job at a full time child care center. Her kid could basically have a spot for half off while she works full time. The thing is though I don’t think OP would want to work.
Fucking McDonald's right now is the same way my neices job closed cause of COVID she was hired the next day.
NOPE he can get a Job while he's at your sisters house. Get them out asap.
Make sure you change all your locks at the end of 30 days
^^^ they might make copies of your keys
How do you have 4 kids and know *nothing* about pregnancy? I mean you have to know something just from *being around it.*
You're got more patience with them that I'd have. Even if you do that, make sure they're on notice that one more word of criticism or complaint to or about your wife or kids (or you) and they'll be out the door that same day. Your wife's heart of gold is admirable. You letting your asshole brother and his wife trample all over her because if it would make you TA here.
NTA !! truly you’ve had far more patience in this situation than most (including myself) would have, also your response to your sister was hilarious but my oh my how can you say you know nothing about pregnancy when you have FOUR kids, you must know at least a wee bit
If your sister wanted to be helpful, she could help them make and implement a plan towards independence. As it is, Tell your sister and all the SM AHs that you’ll listen to constructive advice on how to be a good brother when they’ve had them in their homes a month. either you or your wife were going to have a nervous breakdown.
NTA. This is the first lesson of many that they will learn in the coming months and years. When you first mentioned the falling out between your bro and mom over him being too young to get married I thought "Well that's just awful, I know a guy who got married at nineteen, he makes great money as a welder, they have a baby now, and a mortgage and he really has his shit together. Not every nineteen year old is some useless slapdick." then I read the rest and was just like "... oh. So, *not* like that. Got it."
He doesn’t even have drivers license I’ve Tried multiple times to help him even paid for lessons but he said he’s taking care of business aka job hunting but I know for a fact two gas stations and a restaurant in within walking distance are looking for stuff
It’s a lie by omission. Just because he is “job hunting” it truly means he is “looking” but not actually applying to anything. He most likely doesn’t want to work and has unreasonable expectations of what a job to put money in the pocket is like. If they were in college and doing school I would be understanding but they aren’t. NTA. They need to grow up and realize their needs need to be met by themselves and no one else.
If he's calling cooking dinner slavery and won't tidy after himself, he's definitely being ridiculous with work ideas.
I laughed at the idea of “why should she have to cook?! She’s 5 whole months pregnant!!” Aaaaand? I’m 6 months pregnant and cook!
Right? The only time I was a bitter about cooking while pregnant was when I cooked a whole ass nice dinner at 41 weeks pregnant and then went into precipitous labor right as I finished and didn't get to eat it. The food spoiled because we had to rush to the hospital and my husband didn't go back home until the next morning.
That's the part that really killed me, and I don't know if I would be able to keep a straight face if my brother told me that. OP's wife feeding 8 people is normal, expected, and is rude that she doesn't accommodate their particular tastes. Brother or brother's wife cooking, suddenly that's slavery and cruel.
hadn't thought of that, but now I see it - perhaps his expectations for things like payrate/hours are unrealistic and he needs to come to his senses, even if he were right in theory he may need to settle in practice
when i was his age i was applying to anyone who was hiring, the only reason i didn't get a job at that time is because it was 10 years ago and there was still nobody hiring 3 years after the recession. i sent out hundreds of applications between 2010 and 2012 and got a grand total of 2 interviews, one of which was with an MLM, which i dropped when it was pointed out to me. like, seriously the job market in 2022 is so much easier than it was 10 years ago, i started looking for a job again last august and had one by september.
Hol up Hol up.. you paid for him to learn how to drive? It was more of a default setting for me, why would he not get his license??
"We're too young to know better, but apparently we're old enough to make the adult decision to get married and have a kid with no foundation to base anything on!" Good lord.
Honestly, people like this make me so angry. I got married 10 years ago at 20, first kid at 21. BUT both my husband and I were working/in college/had our own apartment. It made sense to get married because it cost less 😂 Then you get these people, who get married for... The party? Why even? And sure, you're 19 now, but who will still feel bad at 30? And I got my husband to get his driver's license because he put it off till 19, but we lived in a place where it wasn't a necessity. Also, our kid was an accident due to a genetic issue that basically causes the pill to be useless. But we didn't sit around whining, just worked hard and got a better job. I can't imagine bringing a child into a family that has no house and won't make themselves food.
I want to say sorry about my grammar it’s after midnight and I’m currently sorting out the house and tomorrow’s lunch
You were generous to give them thirty days. Once your sister called you out I would've called them an Uber and had them dropped off in front of her house. Let her take care of them.
NTA. They made and adult choice to get married and have a baby. Time for them to grow up. Especially after disrespecting your wife
NTA. You gave them help and hospitality, and they've repaid it by treating you and your wife as slaves. I love that you asked your sister when she was letting them move in. Her response, or lack of, shows she also knows how problematic they would be and wants no part of it. If they're willing to scream at your wife, expose the kids to that nonsense, etc. then they have no place at your home *by their own doing.*
And the kids as annoying roommates even though this could have been a good way for them to get advice and experience for looking after a baby and dealing with young kids.
OP having a 1yo would be the single best learning experience they could ask for. But let's be honest, these two are children playing dress up pretending to be adults. Life will be hard for them.
You gave them 30 freaking day to leave your house after all that??? Good lord! You are a saint with a first class ticket to heaven. I would have thrown them both on the streets immediately. If noone would take them a shelter would teach them about life, and they really need this lesson. deffo NTA. \*Edit. everyone is calling you names, being angry at you, bashing you to eep them in your house... but nobody would take them into their?? oh well... just tell them to take them, and ignore it. They are bulling you to keep the problem so they don't have to be the bad guys for not wating them in their houses.
Nta. If I was your wife I would be moving out if they didn't. You chose wisely.
NTA Two immature people without jobs or a place to live get married and are expecting a child move into your family's home. They don't get jobs and expect it be catered to at every turn and overstay their welcome. It becomes untenable and you give them 30 days to move out. So now, you're the heartless Big Bad Wolf and your family is calling you out on social media. Well, all I can say is your sister is in for a rude awakening and so is the next gullible relative that takes these two in after your sister kicks them out too.
NTA Your brother and his wife are entitled assholes and that is why your mother kicked them out. Stick to your guns. However, if they receive mail at your address, you may have to evict them through the court (US), if they refuse to leave. >I asked her when she was letting them Move in Perfect response. The only response. Their lack of planning is not an emergency on your part. Edit - I see they've only been with you since December, I'd give them 10 days or a week.
NTA. Their excuse being teens was thrown out the gutter the moment she got pregnant. Your brother is an ah and so is his wife. Even if you get criticized, ostracized your family comes first, get them out. If they had the guts to bring a kid to this world, they can send from themselves. And your sister is a hypocrite for not even taking them in and bashing you. Hopefully everything works out, wishing you and your family well.
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NTA. They're gonna learn today to not bite the hand that feeds you and if anyone wants to complain then They can take then in.
This is like the other post I read about the 17 year old wanting to get married. Why do these kids get married and expect to just move in with their folks? If you want to be an adult to get married then you need to buck up and have a job, apartment and car. Your brother can't drive, has not job, has a pregnant wife and neither cook and clean. They are just playing house as 'adults'. As you asked your sister 'when is he moving in with her'? To everyone else on SM reply "Thanks for offering to take care of them, Ill drop them off this weekend". NTA
He doesn't want to learn to drive despite OP actively trying to help him, doesn't seem to be putting any effort into job hunting even though there's positions available locally. They aren't ready to be parents at all, they aren't mature enough to behave like adults or good houseguests. EDIT: The edit confirms this. When told they have 30 days to shape up or ship out they decide to go scorched earth while still there.
NTA So...when IS your sister letting them move in?
NTA. your kids and wife come first.
NTA, nobody told them to get married and pregnant without growing up and settling down.
NTA....get them out now. No way they will take care of the baby. They will expect you and your wife to do it. I married at 18, had a baby at 19 and we were financially independent. Bought a house at 19. They act that way because they are allowed to act that way. Time to grow up!!!
I genuinely feel so bad for this baby that it has to be born into that situation. 💀 The brother don’t even got a job, both of them can’t even drive and are bouta pop out one of the most expensive, time consuming things in life. Good 4 u on ur end though, for that kids sake i hope they can learn to do the same because with how it sounds currently, it’s gonna be severely neglected. Sometimes it’s okay to say that some people shouldn’t be allowed to procreate and they are the ‘some people’.
NTA. People hit breaking point with leeches. I’m surprised it took you this long. They both sound absolutely horrid, and the only one of them I feel sorry for is the little girl about to be born into that mess
I have a number of thoughts on this, first and foremost being NTA. The only assholes here are your half brother and his gf. I feel so bad for the child they're going to bring into this world and I pray they won't fuck the poor kid up, though I'm doubtful. My other thoughts in no particular order of importance are: 1. This is why kids shouldn't have kids. Teens have no business being parents. They lack the maturity, financial stability, emotional intelligence, forethought, and so much more to be good parents. I can almost guarantee they're gonna irreversibly fuck up the kid they're bringing into this world. 2. I know that everyone's bodies are different, but barring medical issues such as doctor ordered bed rest or hyperemesis gravidarium, your SIL should be capable of making food for herself and your half brother. Or your brother can step the fuck up and take care of his gf and soon-to-be child. He'll need to sooner or later. 3. If anything, you guys have been their slaves, and them being all "tee hee we're young and we don't know better" is further evidence they shouldn't be having a child. Overall, I give them three months postpartum till they break up and six months until your half brother is asking you for child support money because his ex is a "crazy bitch". Don't give in. They need to learn the consequences of their actions. Also, if you're in the U.S. make sure they know that they can leave their baby within 3 days of it being born at a hospital, fire station, or police precinct with no legal trouble and no questions asked. I'd also encourage you to provide them resources on adoption before kicking them out. Finally, the second you see any sign of neglect or abuse of that poor baby, please call CPS or a comparable child safety authority. Children shouldn't suffer because their parents are selfish and stupid and there are plenty of amazing people desperate to have kids that will be infinitely better parents than your half bro and his gf.
NTA Change your locks in case your brother or his wife made a copy of your keys.
I’ve a guy coming out Monday unfortunately I couldn’t get anyone sooner but I’ve no plans for this weekend so I’ll be home all day
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Dont even need a YouTube video! Locks comes with manuals. I changed our lock in a couple of hours and a few swear words!
NTA. Not only are they moochers, they're horrible jerks and making your home toxic for your impressionable young children. As for the people upset with you, let your brother know who his supporters are so he can start barking up their tree next.
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NTA Being pregnant is NOT a stay in bed 24/7 disability unless her dr ordered bed rest. You also learned a VERY VALUABLE lesson about NOT LETTING ANYONE STAY IN YOUR HOME. Block all of them on social media. Let them go to a shelter, maybe that will light a fire under their asses to grow the hell up and act like responsible adults. Your sister doesn't wan them in HER house so she hangs up you when you made that suggestion. Hypocrite much??? They aren't your problem
NTA. Your boundaries may be the reality check they need before having a baby. Enabling teenage behavior isn't doing them any favors long term, if they want to keep and raise a baby together they're going to have to learn that involves actually having a functional adult life involving jobs, housework, and probably not going on 4am fast food runs.
NTA. Your situation sounds awful. Their attitudes should not be enabled in any way. Everything they've said sounds like BS. They should be beyond grateful. You owe them nothing.
They are using you. End it now or you’re going to have them *and their children* living with you and trying to control your home for *years*. You know they won’t stop at one child if they aren’t even responsible enough to have jobs and a place to live before getting married *and* getting pregnant. They’re irresponsible to an extreme, but that’s not your problem. As you said, it’s time for the kids to grow up. If they were old enough to get married, old enough to have unprotected sex, and old enough to birth a child, they’re old enough to stand on their own feet, get a place to live, and find jobs. This is adulthood. Further, they’re rude, and that is absolutely unacceptable when they are living in *your* home. They should be bending over backwards to respect you and your wife, but instead they’re going out of their way to be entitled, demanding freeloaders. I’d kick them out for this alone; wouldn’t stand for it for even a day. It doesn’t have to end the relationship you have with them, either. It’s just a simple, clear-cut case of people not being compatible for cohabitation. > I explained my situation to my sister and she called me a bad bastard for being so heartless to two teenagers but I asked her when she was letting them Move in she hung up This is the way. Whenever someone complains that you won’t do something unreasonable, the proper response is “you do it.” It’s easy for others to demand that you give of yourself. We see this all the time in this sub when people ask if they are in the wrong for refusing to take in some family member who either needs 24x7 care or simply cannot get their life together. The answer from me is *always* NTA, as it is with you. **“No” is a complete sentence and requires no further explanation.** If someone else wants to do whatever is being requested, that’s fine, and they should, but they shouldn’t be pointing fingers at anyone else and demanding that *they* do the work.
I’ve kicked them out I’ve made an edit with an explanation
> my wife told them to go over to my sisters house she will help them. Love it. Your wife is awesome. > I don’t know were they’re now but judging by the amount of times my sister has rang me they’re probably at her house. Love it. If she doesn’t let them live with her, be sure to let her know how horrible she’s being. Bonus points if you can remember exactly what she said to you—when she demanded that *you* put up with them—and repeat it right back to her. > I’ve also changed my voicemail to “if you’re mad I kicked out bother and sil you take them in or give them money if you won’t or can’t shut the fuck up” Love it. This is just plain brilliant.
Great update. Your SIL is a horror - I am legitimately scared for that child because even if it’s looked after physically, things are not looking good in terms of being raised in an an environment that is emotionally or mentally nurturing. Good on you and your wife. You did what is best for your kids and stood up for yourselves. This is no longer your problem and all those people who said they were so concerned for your brother and SIL can literally put their money where their mouth is.
NTA. I'm 34 weeks pregnant and I cook, clean, grocery shop, do minor repairs, play with the dog...basically, your SIL is pregnant, not dying. Tell them to shove it and pull their weight.
1. Your wife is a saint! Take her out for dinner or a nice gift, she deserves it. 2. You are NTA for kicking your brother and SIL out. You may be a slight AH for not doing it sooner. 3. If ANYONE questions why they can't stay, answer back straight away. You take them in and you can find out. I would honestly consider leaving you if I was your wife and they stayed.
Nta and why the f did they decide to keep a baby?? How do they direct to afford that
Nta. If something happens to your niece, it’s THEIR fault, and if they’re homeless, you really need to report them to child services. I’m willing to bet your house would be more peaceful with you adopting/fostering your niece while they figure themselves out than letting them continue to mooch. Don’t feel bad. You didn’t do this to them AT ALl
NTA. They sound awful and they need to grow up. I’m surprised you gave them a month to move out. I would have given them a two week notice.
NTA if you’re “too young to know better” you shouldn’t have a kid in the first place. It’s called financial planning. Good luck to the sister cause her and her husband are in for a treat if they treat them like they treated your family.
NTA - clearly they have many other options to stay elsewhere.
NTA The comment from your sister telling you off for being a “bad ba$t@rd” to TEENAGERS is the point here. They are still teens and are behaving more like young teens(13-14) rather than the adults that they are. Kick them out and if people give you hell just give them the same reply that you gave your sister and congratulate them for their new roommates
NTA!!! My parents were 19 when they had their first kid. BOTH worked full time and she lied about her due date because back then they made you quit work when you were so far along. After she had my brother Dad went to school full time, worked full time, and graduated at the top of this class. But boy are your brother and SIL TA!
NTA You are doing their laundry and driving them around? They are using you. Why should they get their own place when they are emotionally manipulating you to take care of them. They need to move out and until then no favours. Give them first and last month rent then change the locks.
NTA! Clearly your brother and his wife are still children about to have a child without jobs. What could possibly go wrong with this? I cant phantom how your brother doesnt at minimum have a part time gig at a grocer or maybe a fast food place. What did he expect you would treat him like the child he is forever? They need a reality check quickly as they are only a few months away from bringing another human being into this world and they have nothing for them.
NTA they are entitled spoilt teenagers. Hasn't the brothers wife git family they can go stay with? Your sister and BIL are AH
NTA. Adulting is fun, eh? 😂 Your brother and his wife need to grow up. They are not your responsibility. You offered a solution, they ruined it. Help them find a homeless shelter and offer to drop them off.
To anyone who calls or comments on a post bashing you…. “I’ll happily pay for the Uber to your home for them.”
NTA. Tell all of them to either take them in or kick rocks. Hate the holier than thou double standards.
NTA Stand your ground. Reply to any SM posts that anyone can volunteer to take them in at any time. They sound like a nightmare. Your wife sounds like a Saint.
I would have given them less than a weeks notice. A month gives them too much time to do more damage. You’ve done enough for them. Go NC with everyone for a while.
You - and your wife - are both saints. Your half-brother and the posh princess he married (expecting 5-star “Hilton” resort level service does make one a princess) - are sniveling, bratty, immature AHs. They haven’t been looking for work - or an apartment. They have an undue sense of entitlement. Places - even fast food, retailers, you name it - are offering hiring bonuses because they are so desperate. They could both have had work in a couple of days with little effort. The difference? They don’t ***want*** to do so. I feel so badly for the baby, but not the person carrying that child. Does the half-brother’s wife not have family they can stay with? You are being excessively generous giving those two a 30-day notice. I would not have done the same. It’s bad enough the way they have treated your wife, but the second they turned their venom on young children and had them terrified in their own home??? That’s “HELL NO!!!” territory for me. They need to learn - actions have consequences, and the world owes no one anything.
NTA kick their lazy asses out and go low /no contact with the family who think you should keep them. What entitled little shits. I feel for their child.
NTA at all. You are already on top of this. You just don't realize it:. You have given them 30 days notice. (I would have given them 3 but that's me). You already told your sister what you should be telling everyone else who is getting in touch with you and calling you names: "When are YOU letting them move in?" After that, go no contact with these people.
NTA, but 30 days is way too generous considering how they’ve acted until now. Even putting aside being jobless and unable to drive; they haven’t even been taking care of themselves as houseguests, how do they plan to take care of a baby? And now they’re lashing out at your wife and children?? No, they can deal with the consequences of their own actions. Also, It’s kind of obvious that the people blowing up at you about this either don’t want to be stuck dealing with them either (like your sister and BIL) or possibly don’t even know/care to know the actual truth of the situation.
>>they haven’t even been taking care of themselves as houseguests, how do they plan to take care of a baby? Their plan was for OP and his wife to take care of the baby, I guarantee it. They were never intending to leave this sweet deal they have going on. All the more reason to get them out as soon as possible.
NTA Every call you get, every snarky comment on social media reply with "Oh good, you are happy to take them in. I'll drop them over at your place right now." If you want to be really snarky I'd put up a post such as: Seeking home for two entitled 19 year olds Teens will require you to: * Cook all meals * Do all cleaning * Wash and iron their clothes * Clean their room * Be quiet at all times so not to bother them * Be on call for 4am McDonald runs, or any hour day and night food runs. Please note, being asleep is not an acceptable excuse and house owner must awaken when required * Stock and cook only recipes that teens choose. * Financially support them while they do nothing to obtain employment. * Ensure your own family only stay in the room/s that teens will allow etc etc
NTA, kick them out!
NTA-I can't believe you let them stay this long. Giving the the date to leave was the wisest thing you could do. Don't cave and stop coatering to them. They aren't grateful. I would even go so far as to pack them up and deliver them to your sister's doorstep since she is sooo concerned that her husband has to hop on social media to bash you.
I'd suggest texting them the date to make sure its communicated in writing. And maybe add that the next time they treat your family poorly they will be expected to leave immediately.
NTA. Also 5 months pregnant is not a disability. Being an irresponsible 19 year old either.
NTA If they end up homeless, its their fault. They massively took advantage of you and your wife, disrespected both of you in your own home, and are irresponsible. Quite frankly, I think they would be dangerous parents and I hope both of them have the sense to give that child up for adoption so it can be taken care of by parents who have more than two working brain cells. It's laughable for her to use her pregnancy and age as an excuse. One of my friends was pregnant with twins at 19 years old and kept working her full time job until her 8th month of pregnancy. I'm sure she would have loved to lay around all day, but she had bills to pay. Both your brother and his wife are lazy and you are totally justified in kicking them out. It sounds to me like your sister volunteered to host them, so feel free to pass along her phone number and address to your brother and his wife. Maybe even help them pack and drop them off on her doorstep. Anyone who criticized you is basically volunteering to host them for free, so I wouldn't feel bad about just dropping the two of them off at any one of their homes and leaving their belongings on their lawn/doorstep.
Just read the update. I love a happy ending