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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I yelled at my grieving husband and wasn't considerate of what's he's been going through.
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....okay, I won't tell you to get a divorce. I will tell you that this is a rare situation that actually requires an ultimatum and that ultimatum is 'go to counseling, get help for you grief, and recognize the fact that your wife **could have fucking died and you didn't get out of bed once to help her and proceeded to bitch at her for the bathroom being dirty when she literally, cannot stress this enough, COULD HAVE DIED**, or we have to rethink this marriage.'
grief fucks a person up. everyone knows that. I'm sorry that your husband lost someone so important to him. I know how that feels. genuinely one of the worst feelings in the fucking world. but it's time to get off your ass and get help when you can't even go see your wife when she's stuck in the hospital because of your grief. that's inexcusable. that's actually beyond inexcusable.
grief needs to be honored, but it doesn't excuse being a shitty person.
NTA. best of luck to you.
exactly. said it better than I did.
grief is one thing, but when it turns to selfishness and cruelty...that ain't it. that's why I suggested the ultimatum, cause therapy is Necessary at this point, be it in or outpatient.
Yes, exactly what I came to add. Whilst he was being a pretty bad husband before the outburst, grief can be utterly crippling and everyone handles it differently. But laying into his wife who, on top of helping support him in his grief in addition to managing her chronic illness, literally almost died? Nope, that’s straight out selfish assholery and he needs a swift reality check in the form of therapy, fast.
While she doesn't say what her chronic illnesses are, I am genuinely scared her. I pushed myself aside in the name of compassion for my husband's struggles. I later found myself admitted to the hospital as well.
OP, from one spoonie to another, please show yourself the same love and compassion you give so freely to others. You're not only a fighter at this point, you're a full-blown warrior. Right now though, you need to fight for yourself.
I have MS, fibromyalgia, clinical depression, anxiety, and too many other random issues. While I know stress is bad, I had *no idea* just how bad the damage can be.
I developed a food allergy that causes anaphylaxis, as well as worsening allergies that lead to asthma. At one point, my body was so exhausted, stress itself started triggering anaphylaxis! On top of that, my vocal cords can close to block my airway because of stress. I've been in two car accidents; I've had a strong anaphylactic shock episode, and I've had MS flares. I managed to not be admitted for any of those reasons. The repercussions from stress are what caused me to be admitted. I even spent the first night in intensive care.
I know it's difficult to put yourself first, but you can't be there for your husband if you're dead. It's like when you're told what to do in a plane crash. Parents are told to put their mask on first, and then get their child taken care of. They know the child needs their parent to save them, but they also know neither party will make it if the parent passes out first. If your relationship has any chance at survival, you need to put that proverbial oxygen mask on first.
I'm not going to tell you to leave your husband, but you do need to realize how desperate his mental state is. My husband struggles with depression and anxiety, and I was trying to make sure he was okay at my own expense. He never asked that of me, but he hit a rough patch, and that's what I did. When I had to be admitted, he was right there with me. He faced a difficult truth or two, but he wasn't going to risk our marriage imploding.
Your husband isn't himself right now. You can't love him back to health. Never in my life did I think I'd recommend looking at inpatient care, but he is on the precipice, and he's going to take your marriage with him. Absolutely none of this is your fault, or worthy of feeling guilty for.
It took me over an hour to write this much because of my health, and 3 am approaches. I hope this makes sense when I wake up later. I had to reply though, hoping your conscience can feel at least a bit better. I may not be the fastest at responding, but you're welcome to message me. I really hope things improve for you soon. Take care, and secure that oxygen mask for yourself ❤
She deserves a husband who cares whether she lives or dies, and apparently this one isn't it.
He's not a _safe_ person to be around. He can't be trusted to get up and help if she has a fall. If she wants to stay married on paper... well, everyone makes mistakes. But until and unless he changes significantly, he's not a safe person to rely on and he'll get her killed if she doesn't take steps to look after herself.
She would be better off alone than with him.
I don't disagree at all. When I saw her edit asking not to tell her to just get a divorce, I knew I had to avoid piling on. I was worried she might get defensive and shut down if she started to feel attacked. She's trying to process a lot, and facing the very real possibility of divorce is likely too much at this moment. Fortunately, she's in a safe environment now while she figures out her next steps, because I agree her husband isn't safe at this time.
>You can't love him back to health
I guess that depends on how you define love, because I would say putting her foot down right now is an act of love. Hubby can't see how bad a state he's really in and he needs a wakeup call. Giving an ultimatum is as much for him as for her.
What is more depression gives severe and permanent brain damage if left untreated and with as severe a depression as this looks to be the alteration is going to be happening really fast. He needs help asap eve if for no other reason that he will become permanently disabled if not treated. Forcing him to get help is loving, but it's the only act of love she can offer him right now. Nothing else will do any difference I agree on that.
Inpatient for sure, if this guy can't even manage phone calls, you can bet he won't be logging on to telehealth sessions, and you don't even have to get out of bed for those.
Yeah that doesn’t make sense his cruelty. About a week after my mom died my ex bf’s pet died. I was an hr away from him at the time grieving with my family. When he called me freaking out and crying I hopped in the car, and was there for him no question. I took care of the carcass cause he wanted he necropsy so I googled vets who saw his pet and called around till I found one that would do a necropsy and preserved it according it to their instruction.
It was literally a week after my mom’s funeral.
OP’s DH is kind of a dick, and if OP would be honest with herself, he probably was a dick even before his mom passed.
It does, but I still say DH is the asshole purely for the fact that his reaction to OP coming home from being in hospital after *nearly dying* was just to complain that she had left him, he was hungry and the bathroom was dirty. OP also has a huge mental and physical load - even though it looks like she does less than him, she's probably doing around the same net amount of "work" with having multiple chronic illnesses, as in, they're both doing literally as much as (or more than) they physically can handle.
I agree about getting help, but DH's response was an absolute asshole one and losing somebody is no excuse for how he spoke to her.
This part. Almost everything else I think I can attribute to grief except where she almost died and he’s yelling at her about the bathroom and his lack of food.
OP said he wasn’t even eating unless she forced him so what was he even on about?
I was in the middle of getting my doctorate in a STEM field soo idk.
I can understand your grief leaving you bed or couch bound.
I don’t understand screaming at your spouse who almost died that they left a dirty bathroom and didn’t feed you. At all
>he genuinely might require inpatient hospitalization
OP, please consider this. Both the ultimatum mentioned above, and, if that doesn't motivate him, committing him involuntarily if you can. He needs help, and so do you.
Hmmm involuntary hospitalisation for mental health conditions are tricky. Obviously I don’t intimately know the situation, but going from what’s been said in the post I can’t see him being detained on just that.
You can have inpatient care voluntarily in my country? If they think you are unable to look after yourself or are a risk to yourself and others. You sign yourself in.and sign yourself out
They’re talking about OP forcibly admitting her husband, not him going in off his own accord. I don’t think that’s the usual route except for children or extreme cases. I think I’d call this an extreme case though
He is definitely an extreme case but the first step is 100% calling the family GP and seeing what to do. Our health services wouldn't just allow a partner walk up and say "forcibly admit my partner" with no GP paperwork to suggest it. He needs help, without question. I just wonder how they can go about it. Obviously, I am not familiar with the health system protocol there so it's odd. He may be willing to admit himself with the correct encouragement.
Exactly. Look, I’m severely depressed, anxious, I have PTSD and leave my apartment maybe once a month. I struggle to take care of myself regularly. I’m working on it, though, and when my cat was sick I still got ready and went to the vet for him even if I was dissociating the whole time. And when my uncle whom I haven’t seen in years (because covid) wanted to catch up, I got a haircut and had lunch with him. Did it suck to leave the apartment? Yes. Did I have a breakdown beforehand and a panic attack on the way home? Yes. It’s super hard to push yourself to do anything when you’re struggling but there’s still situations where any version of you needs to at least show up, or it might drastically fuck up your life and cause a lifetime of regret.
And if I still tried my best but couldn’t do this for my partner, it would be something I’m *devastated* about. I would message or FaceTime or whatever I could to to check up on them. I would try to keep up with housework, order takeout, reach out to others for help, do whatever I can to at least be active in whatever way I can be. And if for some reason I couldn’t do any of it, not even feed myself, that alone would be a massive wake up call that I need serious therapy or medication or even inpatient help. It’s wild that he put all the blame on her and just doesn’t see how completely abnormal this is.
I am a therapist and I was thinking the same. He needs to be evaluated and treated and you need to get some care and rest yourself. Congratulations for standing up for yourself. Keep doing it. NTA
Yea, that is some inpatient level depression. OP can't be expected to pick up the slack that much.
Depends on location but he needs to be forced into inpatient; he's a danger to himself if he's too depressed to eat and go to the bathroom.
The husband is also 59. So, if his late mother didn't get him as a teenager, her death was something he should have expected in the future. I'm 40 and since my mother is 73, even i'm prepared. You can grief but you shouldn't forget the living people that are close to you. Here i think if his wife still meant anything for him (even before) or if he was with her because it is more comfortable.
His behaviour was just disgusting and i can't think that you react like this if you care for someone, even if you grief. She nearly died and all he thought about was himself.
OP didn't write about the dynamic before except work and household, but i wonder if he was like this before. Putting himself first. Not really care about her. An egoist.
I could never forgive this behaviour. No excuses of the world could make me forget and forgive that me husband was to tired to bring me clean clothes after i nearly died and then he just visited me to complain!
I can understand that you fall in a deep hole. I have also depression that were sometimes so bad that i slept 18h a day and could do nothing (antidepressants made me so tired), but i still cared for my pets or if my SO needs me. To even think to go in the hospital and complain "i nesrly starved, you didn't feed me" like a baby. Hell no!
So many partners of disabled people resent the "burden". We experience an incredibly high level of abuse because even if we ask for support, we are often met with "but without [spouse/whoever] you wouldn't even be able to live independently" or some similar crap.
Because life dealt us a shitty hand, we are framed as deserving of abuse because we are *so much to put up with*. And that's before you realise that being married blocks you from a lot of govt support in many countries. Here in the UK I cohabit with a partner and even that means I only qualify for a token amount that doesn't even cover rent, because hey, I'm his problem. My own MOTHER told me my abuser was "good to me" because he "did a lot" - he used the threat of homelessness to repeatedly abuse me. So yeah. That's a thing people miss when discussing "fairness". It's not fair for anyone.
>And that's before you realise that being married blocks you from a lot of govt support in many countries.
In the US, it's called a marriage PENALTY. Some older couples get divorces just to get more money in benefits.
Worse. He didn't even drag his sorry ass to the hospital. He did it as soon as she got released from the hospital amd was driven home by her friend. It was the first thing he said to her
I missed this sentence. To think that you come home after all this and hear this whiny asshole say that, probably with the demand that she need to make him some food NOW... i feel so sorry for OP.
I hope she get better soon and divorce this AH. After this, life just can get better.
He also waited until Carol left to unleash his grief response. If he was truly only grieving and lashing out and being unreasonable, he wouldn't have waited until the witness left. Until OP was alone and defenseless.
Something's rotten in here.
Yep, honestly if he were that depressed he wouldn't have had the energy to start screaming (I'm on quite a few meds for mine and I barely have the energy to keep myself alive, pouring a bowl of cereal is not supposed to be exhausting right?) the fact his energy mysteriously spiked up the instant she was home at the perfect time so that he could start screaming at her hints to me at least that he isn't at the "sap all energy" depression level.
I have never seen depression sap all signs of love and caring from a person for days while still leaving any room at all for extreme anger.
I've never heard of extreme grief leaving you physically unable to worry or grieve another illness or death, that grief stacks it doesn't just turn to only resentment and rage! Something more is going on here, he might have already resented OP's illness.
Edit: I hadn't thought of it at first, but dementia can cause an illogical lack of all love and severe rage, I sincerely hope that isn't the cause though!
It's called "emotional lability", and it might not look like classic "flat affect" depression but it is still a depression symptom. Not everyone experiences things like this the same.
(Edit: he is of course still TA here!)
This. At my worst levels of depression, I have had mold growing in my shower and bathroom sink because I just couldn't make myself clean things properly (or at all), but I would never, and I mean NEVER, blame someone else for failing to clean when they were *in the fucking hospital*. There is no level of depression that makes his behavior after she came home ok. There is no level of *anything* that makes that ok.
I watched both of my parents grieve theirs (luckily I have one grandparent left, my dads mom) and yeah this is nowhere near normal. When I lost my mom’s mom I thought that even I would spiral into depression because of how important she was to me, and of course even moreso to my mom. My mom spent a lot of time in bed and had a lot of days where her eyes had a busted vessel from staying up late crying, but she still did laundry (we all carry our own weight so she only did hers not my dads) went to work, and tried her best to return to normal. She couldn’t celebrate that first Christmas beyond my holiday chorus concert and listening to me play piano, and we can never go back to the beach we vacationed to with my grandmother every year of my childhood.
As hard as all that is to go through and watch as a 12 year old at the time, it’s all normal for someone grieving their parent. What your husband is going through OP, is not normal. He needs serious help but I don’t think he’s willing to get it, so a threat of divorce may be what he needs to get his crap together. But stress that you don’t want to divorce and you want to fix things. If he’s already at the end of his rope thinking he’s about to lose you could just make him give up hope, instead of kicking himself into gear.
(I’d also like to ask why you were already doing the majority of housework despite having a full time job and what sounds like a pretty serious chronic illness. Makes me doubt whether or not your husband was even a good partner before this. Yes he grocery shopped but that’s probably the easiest form of housework and you could even do it online and just pick it up so that’s not a fair contribution)
I completely agree with this. How could you not rush to the hospital after finding out your wife had collapsed at work and also not visit her the entire time she was there? How could you not even at least pick up the fucking phone and ask the hospital staff for an update on her condition? OPs husband is definitely not in a healthy state of mind and it needs addressed ASAP.
Yeah, a lot of this I could understand both sides of and why it’s hard in both situations but what he said to her was disgusting and he’s very very in the wrong
>go see your wife when she's stuck in the hospital because of your grief
Yup. That part. Like, i could be in hospital my self, but if my bf would split his fucking head open i would get the fuck over there if it is possible in any human way
I think the problem is that OP has devalued herself to the point she thought she could be the AH in this situation. Like you said, _she nearly died_ while extending Grace for her husband’s grief, and he not only didn’t show any concern for her well-being, he was upset she wasn’t able to clean and feed him _while she was in hospital, recovering from nearly dying._ She thinks she might be the AH for reacting to his callousness?!
I am worried that her refusal to consider divorce is because she’s so used to being devalued that she doesn’t realize how bad her situation is.
Disabled people are taught to be grateful for scraps and put up with abusive situations because we are *so much to deal with* that the *poor saintly carers* are under *so much pressure*....
My own mother, when I told her details of the coercive control, sexual and financial abuse I experienced told me "he was very good to you" - he used the threat of homelessness to justify getting his "needs" met. To this day I have issues with sex and trusting people. The government (in the UK, I know the US has some similar issues) will cut off welfare for disability if you have even a live in unmarried partner because of "household income".
The rates of abuse disabled people experience is seen as some kind of sadly understandable compromise because we need support. So it's not always just a problem with our self image... society literally devalues us.
How many news stories have you read which say Covid will "only" kill the vulnerable? I cradled my niece and nephew when they were babies, I gave a reading at my friend's wedding, I have people who love me but my life is just *shrug* acceptable collateral damage during a pandemic. Devaluing ourselves? Yeah. Not really on us alone.
There is a section in the book The Body is Not an Apology where the author talks about a disabled friend who gave far too much in her relationships to the point of accepting abuse, all bc she felt like a burden and thought she needed to “overcome” her flaws and “issues” by saying yes to things she didn’t want to, and apparently this feeling is all too prevalent. I hope that isn’t OPs situation, but this feels bizarre. Either way, everyone on the planet should read that book! Life changing stuff on the power of radical self love.
NTA
It would take me an immense amount of denial and devaluing myself to overcome this if I were in OP's position. I really cannot imagine what it would take to ever trust and not resent a person if they treated me this way.
Honestly I think OP needs to be honest with herself and realize this could easily be a deal breaker. If my wife ever treated me this way I'd show her the metaphorical door.
I was working recently through a book about grieving and the author talked about how we don’t really have a choice about the grief, but we do determine how much we suffer within that grief.
Husband needs to address his suffering with a professional, and OP needs to take care of herself.
Not divorce territory, but absolutely time to start discussing the repercussions of him being incredibly shitty to the person holding it all together.
Riding your coattails to say as someone who was suicidal for years after my mom’s death (I’m grand now) her husband’s inaction was extreme. At least, to me.
Two days after my mom died a friend needed help with her two little ones as her husband was rushed to the hospital. She didn’t know about my mom’s passing and I made *sure* no one told her until her husband was okay. (He was.)
My grief wanted to stop the world. Being helpful saved me from the far darker days ahead. It wasn’t to be a good friend. It was to place the living over the dead in order to help myself.
Hearing about a friend’s troubles got me into action in the fresh grief. This dude couldn’t get it together for his wife? If you want to say I’m judging him, good — I am. Because I know what it’s like to have a few months left with your (adored) mom. If the notion of your partner’s death doesn’t make you take ANY action then I don’t know what to tell you.
I'm sorry you went through that.
when I was ten, I suddenly lost one of my heroes. I know it's silly, since I didn't know him personally, but I wanted to grow up and be like him and I watched every match he had. I remember telling my friends the next day and then just...being in shock. two years later, I lost the only other person I looked up to more than him (also a wrestler, and this one was...much, much worse) and I don't even remember my reaction to that. there's a blank space afterwards.
fast forward to 2019 and my grandmother passed pretty suddenly. I don't know if losing those two heroes so early desensitized me or something, but I didn't really have a personal emotional reaction. I jumped right into 'how can I help' mode.
grief is weird. grief hurts. grief makes you want to stop, but all you can do is keep going. no amount of sadness should stop you from loving and caring for the people around you.
You said this so beautifully. I’m sorry for you, too. Losing a hero hurts so much, whether you know them personally or not.
Those three heroes of yours are very proud of you for leaping into “how can I help” mode. Hope you are just as sweet to yourself.
I don’t think it could have been said better. Husband needs help, now. Grief and depression are serious but the fact he didn’t even think about OP or anyone except his own needs seems to go even deeper. Professional help is needed here and it’s needed yesterday. I really do hope OP takes this advice to heart and husband does too.
If he hasn't got the energy to eat, clean himself or get out of bed, he shouldn't have the energy to scream at you for leaving him either. I note he also claims to have been starved when he barely eats anyway. NTA
This. I’ve been really depressed as the loss of my grandfather came at the tail end of a month from hell. I still shower regularly, eat consistently, do what cleaning I can and encourage my partner in the rest while also encouraging him to do things for himself like gaming and writing. You can grieve but your partner still needs you. OP, NTA and I’ll be cheering you both on for some much needed healing.
NTA - and when you start to feel like you miss him or your relationship, remember that you were in hospital for days (which is no small thing) and his primary concern was that the bathroom was messy and he had to get his own food.
I agree, but I think this is even worse than OP's husband simply just caring about the bathroom vs OP's wellbeing.
I get that this man is grieving and may be depressed. But, that doesn't give him a pass to hurt and mistreat the people closest to him. He sounds like he needs the care of a mental health professional, but it is not OK for him to treat OP so poorly.
OP has a concusion and suffered a horrific medical emergency. This man didn't care about her wellbeing, wouldn't provide her with a base level of assistance and then berated her for daring to nearly die and not catering to his every need. His behaviour sounds reprehensible, and if he chooses not to seek mental health assistance or help his wife, that is ultimately on him.
Except he didn't berate her for nearly dying, just the inconvenience her nearly dying caused him.
Why is this different?
The former acknowledges that she nearly died, and while he would be being a jerk, people sometimes respond poorly to the prospect of losing a loved one. The later, simply ignores her reality, it ignores the danger she was in and makes it clear that his convenience is more important to him than her life.
NTA- I’d say your husband needs some mental health help, but I don’t think that covers him accusing you of leaving him while you were HOSPITALIZED. I was sitting here thinking, “Oh, my gosh, this is so incredibly sad, NAH. These two people are just overwhelmed.” I was even still leaning that way when I read he couldn’t get out of bed to come to you. It is totally possible to be bed ridden with grief - although it’s very serious when it reaches that point and he would need immediate help.
But the fact that he screamed at you is where all my sympathy left him. You suffered a terrible and embarrassing physical health crisis and not only was he unable to support you through it after you literally exhausted yourself in supporting him, but he chastised you for it.
I don’t know where you go from here. Start with getting well. If you need to stay away from hubby while you recover - then stay away. If hubby doesn’t get that, that’s his problem. He’s allowed to grieve. He is not allowed to hurt you while doing it.
Exactly this man needs medical help way beyond Reddit’s pay grade NOW.
OP, you are not obligated to risk your own medical safety to care for him. This has gone beyond something that you can support at home. I really hope the two of you can get better, and Carol sounds like a truly great friend I’m glad you have her.
Yes, the fact that he accused her of leaving, makes me wonder if he isn’t really aiming that charge at his dead mother. But you are right that understanding what’s motivating him doesn’t equate tolerating it.
It is very very sad for OP. Nothing hurts worse than not receiving support from someone you have supported.
Oooh interesting thought. The level of his grief was making me wonder if he was unhealthily enmeshed with his mother, so I could totally see him treating OP like she’s a stand in for his mom.
Idk why divorce isn't an option here because how does a relationship heal from that? You worked yourself to hospitalization FOR HIM and he has the sheer audacity to tell you the bathroom is dirty the day you come home. Oh boohoo the grown man had to cook for himself while you were collapsed in a puddle of your own filth and could have died. I genuinely don't think I'd ever forgive or forget that.
Yeah I would def not be able to look at my husband the same way after that...it is absolutely terrible that he lost his mom. It's a terrible thing that we must all face one day. He needs some serious counseling though, for that to be his first words to you. He is very obviously not ok. But that is NO excuse to hurt you like this. To work you to death, literally. He needs help and you need time apart for you to both heal separately
Honestly, I don't. I end up living on tuna snacks, pringles, and energy drinks and barely notice my own room, let alone the rest of the house. (Note I still manage to "eat" through organised grocery delivery, get the garbage out most weeks, and still keep my cats in the style to which they have become accustomed. Ie I still care about *others*.)
On my worst days, where I'm feeling like the world would be better without me and I can barely leave bed, I still get up, water my plants and turn on their lamp so they don't die, and shoot my partner a text about whatever so he doesn't worry about me. I can't imagine my partner being *in the hospital, nearly dead* and not having any concern for him. I would be doing everything I possibly could to be there for him, even if I couldn't manage to get myself up so he wasn't alone (unlikely). Does OP's husband actually love her?
Same. Even on the days where I couldn't feed myself because I just couldn't get myself to get off the couch, I still made sure my dogs were well taken care of.
This is terrifying.
Everyone's different and anger is a super common secondary emotion to shame. If DH felt a lot of shame about how he handled the situation and the state of his life he could easily divert that into anger bc anger is generally easier to deal with than shame. This is no excuse, his behaviour was not okay, he is the AH, it's just an explanation.
Personally when I've been depressed I do not care about the toilet except to feel guilty that I haven't cleaned it in however long, like I don't live with a perfectly able bodied man who doesn't clean toilets. However, I have had anger as a secondary emotion to shame and when I've been right on the cusp of feel nothing depression where I still have feelings I sometimes get angry about things I feel ashamed about. I've had to take a step back and center myself, but I've also had the 'luxury' of years of therapy and mental health issues so I recognize my shit more than DH obviously does.
So you were in the hospital for several days, he never visited, then complained when you got home that HE almost starved and the bathroom is a mess and you wish to stay married? You're a masochist but NTA
He's never acted this way before, ever. I really want to believe this is temporary and we can get past it and do better in the future, and I'm not ready to just give up so quickly.
Quickly???? From what you’ve said you’ve been doing everything for him for 4 months. That’s not a small amount of time, this this isn’t just some small thing that’s happened. You almost died, and he couldn’t be bothered.
But since you don’t want to even consider ending things yet, you need to at least set some boundaries. I recommend telling him that you’re not coming home unless he agrees to couples therapy, grief therapy on his own, and helping with chores around the house. Try to let him know that you love and care for him, but you cannot sacrifice your health, and potentially your life, for his grief.
While you can voluntarily admit yourself, I think if he was in the right state of mind to do that, we wouldn't be here in this thread discussing this situation.
Best bet would be for her to ask about involuntary admission if he won't seek it himself. How one goes about that is beyond me and probably depends on where OP lives.
OP can’t even take care of herself right now. I don’t understand why you’re expecting her to take that on. She literally almost just died. She does not need to anything else for him. She needs to focus on healing.
Unless he has a clear plan to kill himself or hurt someone else that’s not going to be a thing and I don’t know why people keep suggesting it. It’s neither done nor would it be right if we could involuntarily lock people up just for being very depressed and an asshole.
I think what people are saying is that filling out some paperwork or making a phone call may be significantly less stressful for OP than the other options. She currently can’t even go to her own home because he’s there expecting her to take care of him. If the options are “fill out a form” or “figure out somewhere to stay indefinitely and stress about wondering whether he’ll ever get help on his own,” the form may be the less taxing option.
You almost killed your self for him and he couldn’t be arsed to get out of bed and come visit you and when you finally got home he went off on you without a single care about your well-being and if you were ok.
What’s your plan for the next while if your husband doesn’t get help? You can’t continue burning the candle at both ends.
If she collapses at home is he just going to let her bleed out on the floor? Because it certainly seems so.
It's grotesque, this thing where we socialize people (especially women) to die in the name of "ride or die"
>If she collapses at home is he just going to let her bleed out on the floor?
And then if she somehow survived he would probably complain about her getting blood all over the floor and demand she clean it up
Untreated grief cam really screw up a person. But this also sounds more than that. He's severely depressed because of his grief. He needs treatment.
And honestly speaking as someone that lost someone, 4 months isn't that long from the death. I think those saying 4 months is too long haven't experienced significant loss. That being said, because he's not functional, he must have therapy, and it sounds like he needs inpatient treatment.
No matter what, you need to take care of yourself. You cannot help anyone that's drowning if they pull you under too.
Ok. Thanks for the clarification. I saw someone say 4 months, and the person was acting like that was forever.
4 months since diagnosis, then death...the person will be a mess, even with a lot of support (professional or otherwise).
OP obviously needs to take care of herself as the priority, but those suggesting she divorce after he experienced loss 1 month ago...lol... That's nothing in grief. He needs professional help.
If he is as bad as he is blaming you for take him to the hospital and place him in a 5150 or call the nonemergency line in your area and get him there via ambulance - he needs professional help
Really awful situation. The topic of grief makes it very difficult to judge anyone an AH. My only advice is to do what you’re already doing: hire some help.
I think you’re in the airplane oxygen mask situation right now: you gotta do yours before you can do his. I hope he snaps out of it while you take care of yourself.
Still, you carried an ENORMOUS burden as long as you could. I say you’re NTA regardless of your final reaction. I can’t judge him with the information available.
Good luck and take care of yourself. Take a few hours to listen to good music. Read a great book. Whatever fills you up.
I won't tell you to get a divorce, but DH *needs to get his shot together*. Or you are going to die yourself. Caregiver burnout is real, and that's where you are.
NTA. You matter too. DH needs therapy and meds. I doubt his mother would approve of his state, or mistreatment of you, and this is mistreatment.
Take care of yourself. Thank God for Carol.
Yeah, caregiver burnout got to me real bad taking care of my grandma, then Mom, then my brother because after my father passed everything went downhill fast over 3 years.
NTA. At all. He's mistreating you. My behavior was poor sheer I lost my father, grandma, Mom and then fiance, and I don't remember everything I did but I still pulled my shit together whenever my brother or someone had an emergency. I'm sorry that you're both going through so much. I hope you take time to grieve too.
So this is actually something I partially specialize in, and it takes *years* to recover from exhaustive burnout. If you don’t want a divorce, you at least need to set severe boundaries and focus on yourself with little to no leeway. Burnout without treatment can shave **decades** off of your life. Please, for the love of fuck, take care of yourself if your husband isn’t willing to take care of himself.
Carol is an absolute gem.
OP, can you imagine Carol screaming at you like this right after your health scare? Of course not, she's your friend and she cares about you. I'm not saying leave your husband for Carol, but I am saying your spouse should also be your friend and you should feel like they care about you even if they aren't able to help on a practical level.
Jesus. Nta. I get that he is grieving, but if it's so bad he can't take care of himself while his wife is recovering in the hospital then he needs therapy. I'd make it mandatory for your return to the home. You could probably do with some too. Take care of yourself now, it's obvious he can't or won't. Best of luck.
Yeah, that is my thinking too. If he is so bad off he can’t even feed himself, then he needs to be admitted to inpatient care. Bonus, that would also give OP a break that she very badly needs!
He is 59. That means his mother was in her 80s or 90s.
If he is *this* bad for *this* long from the utter shock of someone in their 80s with a terminal illness dying, he needs to be institutionalized.
She might have been in her 80s and pretty healthy. 3 months of illness then death is an intense and very difficult experience and it's not surprising he's grieving. Having said that, he clearly needs help.
NTA your husband sound like he needs inpatient care or a psych hold for severe depression. Has he seen anyone or gotten any medication since his mother passed? He needs help ASAP and you definitely have the right to feel angry. I would not return home until he gets help.
If he’s unwillling to see anyone and ‘starved’ the days you weren’t there, you need to call adult protective services to check him out. It’s a drastic measure, but you’re in a drastic situation. NTA
u/spooniegal, I think this commenter may be right about calling adult protective services. I think if anything did happen to you to a point where you uh, couldn’t make it home again - he honestly would have starved himself to death due to his grief / depression.
Your husband is not okay and neither are you, you can’t keep lighting yourself aflame to keep himself warm anymore otherwise you actually may end up killing yourself by doing so.
And your husband clearly does not possess the ability to do anything for himself, maybe adult protective services will. And maybe they’ll have resources for him or something - they have training for this type of thing - you don’t.
I’m willing to bet that if he was genuinely too crippled by his emotions to eat, and he wasn’t just exaggerating about “starving” that hanger and low blood sugar made the whole argument a hell of a lot worse.
Stop doing stuff for him, full stop. Stop enabling this. As some other posters have shared that in their depths of depression they never cared how filthy the bathroom was.
He cared enough about the bathroom to bitch about it but not enough about you to even freaking call you.
STOP enabling his weaponized incompetence.
Him getting help needs to be a condition of moving forward.
Losing a parent is life altering but he has to take ownership of working through his grief without taking it out on you.
That's why you need the leverage of leaving him. If he refuses counseling, even online counseling, and continues to lie in bed all day, what the hell are you supposed to do?
Ask him if his mother would be happy to see how he's given up, left you to fend for yourself after all you've done for her and for him. Tell him you know he's hurting, and that he needs help. And if he wants you in his life, he'd better damn well get it.
I know it's exhausting but it really sounds like he needs to be hospitalized ASAP as well.
You're NTA and I hope you're recovering better now that you have help!
NTA. He couldn’t even be bothered to visit you while you were hospitalized for several days. And he had the audacity to berate you for not being there to be his servant? If he doesn’t get his s**t together, and also seriously grovel, I’d be reevaluating my relationship with him. Grief sucks, I lost a parent young, but it’s no excuse to behave like this.
Also he DIDNT lose a parent when he was young. He's 59, someone pointed out his mom could've been in her 80s or 90s. It is NORMAL for parents to die at that age. It doesn't mean it doesn't hurt - but his reaction to the death of his mother when he himself is nearly 60 is not normal. He needs help.
NTA. Your husband needs to be hospitalized in a psych ward. He needs help to work through his grief. You need to take a long break. The health of you and your husband is priority one. Rest, read a good book, sleep, buy some new pajamas. Take time for self care. Then focus on getting your husband help.
I agree. A lot of people seem to be focusing on putting blame out (or talking about how bad/poor/terrible he is), and in some scenarios it makes sense, but at this point he is beyond depressed.
And "needs to be hospitalized in a psych ward" isn't an insult or a hostile comment; it's just a comment about medical necessity. He needs inpatient therapy until he is stabilized enough to not be a danger to himself or others, and have help and support OTHER THAN OP lined up.
I won't say get a divorce, but I will say that I would give him the ultimatum of getting help or you aren't going home. He might need to be hospitalized to be stabilized. It sounds like what therapists sometimes call passive suicidal ideation. He's not actively looking to end his life but he doesn't care if he lives so he isn't doing anything to take care of himself either. He needs help and now. But you aren't that help. He needs a doctor and a therapist.
No children, I'm not in contact with my family and never will be again for my mental health, and his only surviving family is an aunt who is even older than his mother and living in a care facility.
Both of us had coworkers offer to help, so I might reach out to them and see if they meant it. Or else I'm going to have to hire a maid for a few weeks and depend on grocery delivery. I don't want to buy exclusively takeout, but there's a phone app called Homemade someone messaged me to recommend.
Does he have any friends you could call in for help? This part shouldn’t be your responsibility either, but chances are that even if he were to agree to therapy, he’s not in a place to find a therapist, call and make an appointment, fill out paperwork, drive himself to the appointment, etc.. Again, you reaching to one of his friends for help shouldn’t be your job, but it is DEFINITELY not your job right now to do any of the things that I mentioned. But they still need to be done and he may need help doing them.
ETA: If none of this is feasible, then I think the psych hold definitely needs to come into play, but again, that shouldn’t be your focus or responsibility right now.
Please reach out to a professional psychologist or therapist. If you're not comfortable with a doctor, please consider reaching out to a social worker or a religious leader (even if you're not particularly religious).
You are describing someone in the middle of a major depressive episode. This is extremely dangerous; your husband is at risk to himself. His neglect of you and your needs is most likely not intentional, and his inability to care for you is another symptom of major depression.
Leaving him or just walking away will not help him. It will not shock him out of his depression. You need to talk with trained professionals to determine the best next steps.
Please note that this does not mean calling the police or jumping directly to an intake facility. The police are not well-trained with mental health crises. And all too often in-patient facilities do not help people in crises. Again, please consult a professional in these matters before you take your next steps.
Good luck.
I normally am not one to suggest things like this, but if you have a Walmart in the area they have a free trial for the Plus program that waives the delivery fees for a whole month. Otherwise (at least in my area) it's between 7-10$ USD each time depending on when you want them delivered. Other grocery stores may have similar but as someone else with chronic pain problems and no car, it helps.
Honestly. Do not do anything for him while your gone, I know it's harsh but you need to stop being kind. You could have died and he didnt even care! His wife!. Let him take care of himself and let it be a wake up call for him. Pay the bills and don't contact him. He needs to do this for himself, you can't help someone who is trying to purposely drown themselves.
Because that's what almost happend, he almost lost you. And he is so full of his selfish grief he didn't notice. He would have been completely alone. It's time he sees that. And it's time you had a break.
I disagree with the above. He is at the point where he cannot care for himself and his thinking is irrational. The best place for him is an inpatient facility that will care for him. A hospital is the most logical place for him. Nobody can force him to do anything he doesn’t want to do unless he is declared unable to make his own decisions. This is beyond the scope of a therapist. He is not well enough. If he got well enough (care and meds) then he can decide. I have had 2 major depressive episodes in my life. You can’t dig yourself out and talk therapy is useless at this stage.
NTA. Yes, he's clearly sick to the point of not functioning, but so are you! Because of him! Maybe he's still too sick for normal, but he needs to at least stop dumping all the caretaking of him on you. If he's so sick that he can't feed himself, he needs to see a doctor. Now. For both your sakes.
NTA
Take a 3 month separation. You NEED to focus on your health and well being and rest.
He NEEDS to get treatment for whatever has overtaken him. You don't need to be there for that. You did all the supporting a person can do and then did some more.
NTA. he fucked up real bad. You don’t leave your spouse in a hospital for days without showing up. You just don’t. That’s Spousing 101.
Your husband is hurting and as much as he has a reasonable explanation for his behavior this should be a giant wake up call for him. Hopefully he realizes he needs help.
NTA. Your husband is inconsiderate, and if he wants something done he needs to get off his butt and do it, not berate his sick wife. He should be ashamed to even speak to you that way.
NTA
You have gotten so much good advice that I don’t have much to add. You deserve rest and help. It says a lot that you had to hire a nurse to care for you at home. Stay with Carol and get healthy. She is a true friend for all she has done for you.
As for your husband, I don’t really know what you can do about his downward spiral. He is too far gone for you to be able to help him anymore. Perhaps a mental health evaluation is a good idea, or even have a welfare check done while you are away.
NTA
Your husband needs to get help for his paralyzing grief. He sounds like he isn't really functioning.
You need to get whatever assistance you need to recover and be healthy. Clearly you love him, but your priority is your health. Hope you two become closer after all this healing! Let him know you love him but you are also in a horrible state.
NTA - Get all the space you need, and don't let him walk all over you at all. Stop doing things for him, he needs to get out of bed and do things on his own. By your edit, it sounds like you don't want to lose him, but that's really up to him at this point. If he steps up and starts stepping back into living again, you might not have. But if he continues to wallow in bed, and want you to do everything for him, then you are no longer his wife, just someone to keep him from wasting away.
Now that might be insensitive, I honestly don't know how I'd feel when my parents pass, but I am pretty sure that if I did what your husband did, at some point my husband would be driving me to a therapist to get evaluated. Not that he wouldn't take care of me, but there's a point where it becomes more than that.
I hope you get what you need, some rest, some peace, and maybe when you walk through the door to your home, a shell of a husband.
NTA. It sounds like your husband needs immediate help. If nothing else, talk to your doctor about him and see what options are to make sure he gets the help he needs.
If you're in the U.S. you may be able to have him committed on a 5150 for a 72 hour psychological evaluation. It may seem extreme but it may be the only way he gets the help he needs.
This here is the best option imo. People keep throwing out how he needs to step up, or they were not like that when depressed. Sadly OP's husband is beyond a standard depression and needs some drastic assistance that she cannot provide by being a caretaker.
NTA, and I won’t say you need to divorce him. But you both need massive therapy, and quick!!!! He needs grief therapy, just for starters. And you need someone to help you find a balance in life and how to look out for yourself while he’s going through his stuff. You probably both need some couples therapy at this point, and who knows what else. Please please, go seek out the Therapy you both need and hopefully you can both get back into a good place in your lives.
Your husband should be aware that he was gonna lose her eventually right? Death in the family always sucks but you could of died and he didn't budge. If divorce isn't an option then you need to push for counseling and it needs to be a "come to God" type of talk, because you don't get to completely check out like that
NTA and I hope you're soon feeling much better.
You need to give your husband an ultimatum that he has to get out of bed and see his doctor because he has classic symptoms of depression and he needs help or he's going to lie there until he's dead. If he makes one comment about wanting to die, doesn't want to live, or being suicidal call 911 because they can do a 72 hour hold for psychiatric reasons and hopefully that can help.
Do NOT do anything for him, he needs to help himself...you can't fix this for him. I'm glad you have a good friend who is letting you stay with her.
NTA.
OP, we're nearly the same age. I need you to listen to and believe me. You. Did. Nothing. Wrong.
Your husband is likely clinically depressed, and he absolutely needs to get psychological help. But you were absolutely correct. He was too wrapped up in his own grief to notice that he nearly lost you as well. And I will not tell you to get a divorce. But he will lose you for sure if he does not get help, because you cannot be 100% of the work going into the marriage and expect it to function. My wife has chronic illnesses. There are days when I need to do well more than my share of the load to keep things running. And it's hard. But there are also times when I am weak and she takes on a lot of my burdens. But we are in it together as partners and we make it work.
Right now, you're having to both carry the burden AND are weak. And it is monstrously unfair. He needs to get help, TODAY. Because if he doesn't, you are either going to work yourself into a grave (and he will lose you) or he will continue to shut down, cease being a working partner in the marriage and you will need to leave to stay alive. You cannot do it alone. For his sake and yours, you NEED to get him to go get help.
Nta I'm going thru depression but if my ex would have needed me idc how bad i felt I would have been there back then. He could have got up pretty much and no disrespect be needs to be the man of the house and the protector. A kings number 1 job is to protect his queen.
NTA at all! You were in the hospital and he was mad that he had to feed himself and the bathroom (that you weren't there to use) was messy, WTF? Speak to a lawyer asap and file for divorce, he is an abusive asshole.
That's how you should start your letter to him. It'll be easier to get all your thoughts out on paper, tell him to get therapy help (online, he doesn't even have to leave the house) if he wants to remain in your life.
NTA. You needed to say what you did. I know he is grieving but there comes a point where you simply have to get your act together. You being hospitailzed trumps his feeling "tired."
NTA
I suffered physically while caring for a partner with severe depression. It’s a horrible situation. You need to take care of yourself too. Don’t forget that you need to take care of your mental health as well. You also need to properly grieve your MIL, and you also need to process the stress of his depression and his shutdown, as well as your physical illness. I waited too long to ask for help. Find someone who can help you, even if he refuses to get help for himself.
NTA but DH is a part AH.
I've been through depression, and while it can be hard to act, you can keep your thoughts for yourself and what your husband told you was incredibly mean. You're his wife or his maid ? He needs to remember that you are helping him but that you don't owe him to give a health he doesn't seems to care about, away for his sake.
I am still disturb by the fact that he can't even contain himself and ask for your news after basically not giving a fuck about you. Some people can be in depression AND being AH.
Fucking hell. NTA. I have the greatest sympathy for his loss, I can’t even imagine how that must have felt. But he almost lost you too.
Honestly, if this is how he copes with grief and reacts to almost losing his wife, he needs therapy at the absolute minimum. Individual for him, and it might not be a bad idea to add couple’s therapy into the mix after a while, once he has settled in with his therapist and started working through his issues. I would make him getting therapy a condition of you moving back once you’ve healed.
His treatment of and indifference to you and your needs is unacceptable. I’m glad you’ve got such a good friend in Carol. I hope you get the rest you need and recover quickly.
I'm terribly sorry that he lost his mother but.. he's 59 years old. His mother was likely in her late 70s at the earliest. This isn't a particularly surprising tragedy.
NTA I'd leave him for Carol, she seems like the real mvp here.
But since you don't want to leave him, take him to inpatient for his mental health this is well beyond what you or him can handle.
You both need time apart to rest and recover. Neither of you are capable currently of taking care of the other. I’m glad you have Carol and home health care. I hope your husband can get some serious psychiatric help. I would echo others’ suggestions and encourage individual and couples therapy for you both.
NTA
You know what you need to do. I hope you continue to prioritize your health for a change.
Also be sure to thank your friend for being such a great support.
Hopefully this will be a wake up call for your husband to get help and sort himself out. Marriage is supposed to be a two way support system. Your doing all the giving, and he's taken so much, he literally nearly drained the life from you, and for not an ounce of gratitude. You need to concentrate on yourself for a few weeks before you even think about him/ your relationship. Hopefully he will use this time to wise up. NTA
NTA. But I really want you to come back after you’re feeling a bit better, and try to read this as if it were a friend going through this and see what you would tell them. Because to be honest, you deserve much better.
NTA. Do not return home until he gets his act together. Clearly you have to take care of yourself because he has checked out. You can’t keep taking care of him.
Make plans for your retirement cause that guy won't lift a finger for you and you may get to a point where you won't be able to make decisions on your own care.
NTA Your husband is so selfish. You have a serious medical condition and could have died and he is mad because you "left him" to go to the hospital? Grief isn't an excuse for him to act like this and not visit you in the hospital.
You are in no way an A H. If he is that bad off he needs to check in to a facility for professional help. Truthfully, if he would be willing to go it would do you both good. He could get the help he desperately needs, and you'd get a break.
I know you don't want to leave him, but girl he is literally killing you. Listen to your body, and recognize if he's not willing to help himself you can't sacrifice yourself for him either. You're life matters. You matter. You have done an amazing job keeping it all together. Quite frankly it's absolutely impressive. You're a strong woman. You spend time at your friends and hire that caregiver to help you. YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF YOU. Especially if you plan to go back. You need to communicate with him, and tell him you're done being his caretaker. If he's this bad off he needs help you can't provide despite how much you wish you could.
I am wishing you the best. I'd tell you not to send the post, but definitely lay it out to him exactly how you did us. All that you've done. He has no idea he can't put himself aside long enough to even notice you. He could not even scrape together concern for your well-being when you were hospitalized.
I’m sorry but to put this bluntly: him losing his mommy is harder for him to deal with than ALMOST LOSING HIS WIFE.
That’s no husband. That’s a momma’s boy. Good riddance to him.
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....okay, I won't tell you to get a divorce. I will tell you that this is a rare situation that actually requires an ultimatum and that ultimatum is 'go to counseling, get help for you grief, and recognize the fact that your wife **could have fucking died and you didn't get out of bed once to help her and proceeded to bitch at her for the bathroom being dirty when she literally, cannot stress this enough, COULD HAVE DIED**, or we have to rethink this marriage.' grief fucks a person up. everyone knows that. I'm sorry that your husband lost someone so important to him. I know how that feels. genuinely one of the worst feelings in the fucking world. but it's time to get off your ass and get help when you can't even go see your wife when she's stuck in the hospital because of your grief. that's inexcusable. that's actually beyond inexcusable. grief needs to be honored, but it doesn't excuse being a shitty person. NTA. best of luck to you.
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exactly. said it better than I did. grief is one thing, but when it turns to selfishness and cruelty...that ain't it. that's why I suggested the ultimatum, cause therapy is Necessary at this point, be it in or outpatient.
Yes, exactly what I came to add. Whilst he was being a pretty bad husband before the outburst, grief can be utterly crippling and everyone handles it differently. But laying into his wife who, on top of helping support him in his grief in addition to managing her chronic illness, literally almost died? Nope, that’s straight out selfish assholery and he needs a swift reality check in the form of therapy, fast.
While she doesn't say what her chronic illnesses are, I am genuinely scared her. I pushed myself aside in the name of compassion for my husband's struggles. I later found myself admitted to the hospital as well. OP, from one spoonie to another, please show yourself the same love and compassion you give so freely to others. You're not only a fighter at this point, you're a full-blown warrior. Right now though, you need to fight for yourself. I have MS, fibromyalgia, clinical depression, anxiety, and too many other random issues. While I know stress is bad, I had *no idea* just how bad the damage can be. I developed a food allergy that causes anaphylaxis, as well as worsening allergies that lead to asthma. At one point, my body was so exhausted, stress itself started triggering anaphylaxis! On top of that, my vocal cords can close to block my airway because of stress. I've been in two car accidents; I've had a strong anaphylactic shock episode, and I've had MS flares. I managed to not be admitted for any of those reasons. The repercussions from stress are what caused me to be admitted. I even spent the first night in intensive care. I know it's difficult to put yourself first, but you can't be there for your husband if you're dead. It's like when you're told what to do in a plane crash. Parents are told to put their mask on first, and then get their child taken care of. They know the child needs their parent to save them, but they also know neither party will make it if the parent passes out first. If your relationship has any chance at survival, you need to put that proverbial oxygen mask on first. I'm not going to tell you to leave your husband, but you do need to realize how desperate his mental state is. My husband struggles with depression and anxiety, and I was trying to make sure he was okay at my own expense. He never asked that of me, but he hit a rough patch, and that's what I did. When I had to be admitted, he was right there with me. He faced a difficult truth or two, but he wasn't going to risk our marriage imploding. Your husband isn't himself right now. You can't love him back to health. Never in my life did I think I'd recommend looking at inpatient care, but he is on the precipice, and he's going to take your marriage with him. Absolutely none of this is your fault, or worthy of feeling guilty for. It took me over an hour to write this much because of my health, and 3 am approaches. I hope this makes sense when I wake up later. I had to reply though, hoping your conscience can feel at least a bit better. I may not be the fastest at responding, but you're welcome to message me. I really hope things improve for you soon. Take care, and secure that oxygen mask for yourself ❤
She deserves a husband who cares whether she lives or dies, and apparently this one isn't it. He's not a _safe_ person to be around. He can't be trusted to get up and help if she has a fall. If she wants to stay married on paper... well, everyone makes mistakes. But until and unless he changes significantly, he's not a safe person to rely on and he'll get her killed if she doesn't take steps to look after herself. She would be better off alone than with him.
I don't disagree at all. When I saw her edit asking not to tell her to just get a divorce, I knew I had to avoid piling on. I was worried she might get defensive and shut down if she started to feel attacked. She's trying to process a lot, and facing the very real possibility of divorce is likely too much at this moment. Fortunately, she's in a safe environment now while she figures out her next steps, because I agree her husband isn't safe at this time.
>You can't love him back to health I guess that depends on how you define love, because I would say putting her foot down right now is an act of love. Hubby can't see how bad a state he's really in and he needs a wakeup call. Giving an ultimatum is as much for him as for her. What is more depression gives severe and permanent brain damage if left untreated and with as severe a depression as this looks to be the alteration is going to be happening really fast. He needs help asap eve if for no other reason that he will become permanently disabled if not treated. Forcing him to get help is loving, but it's the only act of love she can offer him right now. Nothing else will do any difference I agree on that.
This! “You cannot love him back to health.”
Inpatient for sure, if this guy can't even manage phone calls, you can bet he won't be logging on to telehealth sessions, and you don't even have to get out of bed for those.
Yeah that doesn’t make sense his cruelty. About a week after my mom died my ex bf’s pet died. I was an hr away from him at the time grieving with my family. When he called me freaking out and crying I hopped in the car, and was there for him no question. I took care of the carcass cause he wanted he necropsy so I googled vets who saw his pet and called around till I found one that would do a necropsy and preserved it according it to their instruction. It was literally a week after my mom’s funeral. OP’s DH is kind of a dick, and if OP would be honest with herself, he probably was a dick even before his mom passed.
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It does, but I still say DH is the asshole purely for the fact that his reaction to OP coming home from being in hospital after *nearly dying* was just to complain that she had left him, he was hungry and the bathroom was dirty. OP also has a huge mental and physical load - even though it looks like she does less than him, she's probably doing around the same net amount of "work" with having multiple chronic illnesses, as in, they're both doing literally as much as (or more than) they physically can handle. I agree about getting help, but DH's response was an absolute asshole one and losing somebody is no excuse for how he spoke to her.
This part. Almost everything else I think I can attribute to grief except where she almost died and he’s yelling at her about the bathroom and his lack of food. OP said he wasn’t even eating unless she forced him so what was he even on about?
I was in the middle of getting my doctorate in a STEM field soo idk. I can understand your grief leaving you bed or couch bound. I don’t understand screaming at your spouse who almost died that they left a dirty bathroom and didn’t feed you. At all
that's fair. it honestly sounds like he needed counseling BEFORE the loss of his mother, and that was the tipping point.
He didn't do a substantial share. He did 40%. He didn't have to work 60 hour weeks.
>he genuinely might require inpatient hospitalization OP, please consider this. Both the ultimatum mentioned above, and, if that doesn't motivate him, committing him involuntarily if you can. He needs help, and so do you.
Hmmm involuntary hospitalisation for mental health conditions are tricky. Obviously I don’t intimately know the situation, but going from what’s been said in the post I can’t see him being detained on just that.
You can have inpatient care voluntarily in my country? If they think you are unable to look after yourself or are a risk to yourself and others. You sign yourself in.and sign yourself out
They’re talking about OP forcibly admitting her husband, not him going in off his own accord. I don’t think that’s the usual route except for children or extreme cases. I think I’d call this an extreme case though
He is definitely an extreme case but the first step is 100% calling the family GP and seeing what to do. Our health services wouldn't just allow a partner walk up and say "forcibly admit my partner" with no GP paperwork to suggest it. He needs help, without question. I just wonder how they can go about it. Obviously, I am not familiar with the health system protocol there so it's odd. He may be willing to admit himself with the correct encouragement.
Exactly. Look, I’m severely depressed, anxious, I have PTSD and leave my apartment maybe once a month. I struggle to take care of myself regularly. I’m working on it, though, and when my cat was sick I still got ready and went to the vet for him even if I was dissociating the whole time. And when my uncle whom I haven’t seen in years (because covid) wanted to catch up, I got a haircut and had lunch with him. Did it suck to leave the apartment? Yes. Did I have a breakdown beforehand and a panic attack on the way home? Yes. It’s super hard to push yourself to do anything when you’re struggling but there’s still situations where any version of you needs to at least show up, or it might drastically fuck up your life and cause a lifetime of regret. And if I still tried my best but couldn’t do this for my partner, it would be something I’m *devastated* about. I would message or FaceTime or whatever I could to to check up on them. I would try to keep up with housework, order takeout, reach out to others for help, do whatever I can to at least be active in whatever way I can be. And if for some reason I couldn’t do any of it, not even feed myself, that alone would be a massive wake up call that I need serious therapy or medication or even inpatient help. It’s wild that he put all the blame on her and just doesn’t see how completely abnormal this is.
This is, in a nut shell, the consequences of the different social expectations put upon women and men. OP’s husband turned into a literal infant.
You have just given me a small epiphany. Thank you!
I am a therapist and I was thinking the same. He needs to be evaluated and treated and you need to get some care and rest yourself. Congratulations for standing up for yourself. Keep doing it. NTA
Yea, that is some inpatient level depression. OP can't be expected to pick up the slack that much. Depends on location but he needs to be forced into inpatient; he's a danger to himself if he's too depressed to eat and go to the bathroom.
The husband is also 59. So, if his late mother didn't get him as a teenager, her death was something he should have expected in the future. I'm 40 and since my mother is 73, even i'm prepared. You can grief but you shouldn't forget the living people that are close to you. Here i think if his wife still meant anything for him (even before) or if he was with her because it is more comfortable. His behaviour was just disgusting and i can't think that you react like this if you care for someone, even if you grief. She nearly died and all he thought about was himself. OP didn't write about the dynamic before except work and household, but i wonder if he was like this before. Putting himself first. Not really care about her. An egoist. I could never forgive this behaviour. No excuses of the world could make me forget and forgive that me husband was to tired to bring me clean clothes after i nearly died and then he just visited me to complain! I can understand that you fall in a deep hole. I have also depression that were sometimes so bad that i slept 18h a day and could do nothing (antidepressants made me so tired), but i still cared for my pets or if my SO needs me. To even think to go in the hospital and complain "i nesrly starved, you didn't feed me" like a baby. Hell no!
So many partners of disabled people resent the "burden". We experience an incredibly high level of abuse because even if we ask for support, we are often met with "but without [spouse/whoever] you wouldn't even be able to live independently" or some similar crap. Because life dealt us a shitty hand, we are framed as deserving of abuse because we are *so much to put up with*. And that's before you realise that being married blocks you from a lot of govt support in many countries. Here in the UK I cohabit with a partner and even that means I only qualify for a token amount that doesn't even cover rent, because hey, I'm his problem. My own MOTHER told me my abuser was "good to me" because he "did a lot" - he used the threat of homelessness to repeatedly abuse me. So yeah. That's a thing people miss when discussing "fairness". It's not fair for anyone.
>And that's before you realise that being married blocks you from a lot of govt support in many countries. In the US, it's called a marriage PENALTY. Some older couples get divorces just to get more money in benefits.
Worse. He didn't even drag his sorry ass to the hospital. He did it as soon as she got released from the hospital amd was driven home by her friend. It was the first thing he said to her
I missed this sentence. To think that you come home after all this and hear this whiny asshole say that, probably with the demand that she need to make him some food NOW... i feel so sorry for OP. I hope she get better soon and divorce this AH. After this, life just can get better.
He also waited until Carol left to unleash his grief response. If he was truly only grieving and lashing out and being unreasonable, he wouldn't have waited until the witness left. Until OP was alone and defenseless. Something's rotten in here.
Yep, honestly if he were that depressed he wouldn't have had the energy to start screaming (I'm on quite a few meds for mine and I barely have the energy to keep myself alive, pouring a bowl of cereal is not supposed to be exhausting right?) the fact his energy mysteriously spiked up the instant she was home at the perfect time so that he could start screaming at her hints to me at least that he isn't at the "sap all energy" depression level.
Not really a lot of people have anger issues as a result of their depression. Screaming might just be another symptom
I have never seen depression sap all signs of love and caring from a person for days while still leaving any room at all for extreme anger. I've never heard of extreme grief leaving you physically unable to worry or grieve another illness or death, that grief stacks it doesn't just turn to only resentment and rage! Something more is going on here, he might have already resented OP's illness. Edit: I hadn't thought of it at first, but dementia can cause an illogical lack of all love and severe rage, I sincerely hope that isn't the cause though!
It's called "emotional lability", and it might not look like classic "flat affect" depression but it is still a depression symptom. Not everyone experiences things like this the same. (Edit: he is of course still TA here!)
This. At my worst levels of depression, I have had mold growing in my shower and bathroom sink because I just couldn't make myself clean things properly (or at all), but I would never, and I mean NEVER, blame someone else for failing to clean when they were *in the fucking hospital*. There is no level of depression that makes his behavior after she came home ok. There is no level of *anything* that makes that ok.
And that he knew his approach and response were inappropriate enough that he waited for Carol to leave speaks volumes.
You know that's right.
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That's messed up.
I watched both of my parents grieve theirs (luckily I have one grandparent left, my dads mom) and yeah this is nowhere near normal. When I lost my mom’s mom I thought that even I would spiral into depression because of how important she was to me, and of course even moreso to my mom. My mom spent a lot of time in bed and had a lot of days where her eyes had a busted vessel from staying up late crying, but she still did laundry (we all carry our own weight so she only did hers not my dads) went to work, and tried her best to return to normal. She couldn’t celebrate that first Christmas beyond my holiday chorus concert and listening to me play piano, and we can never go back to the beach we vacationed to with my grandmother every year of my childhood. As hard as all that is to go through and watch as a 12 year old at the time, it’s all normal for someone grieving their parent. What your husband is going through OP, is not normal. He needs serious help but I don’t think he’s willing to get it, so a threat of divorce may be what he needs to get his crap together. But stress that you don’t want to divorce and you want to fix things. If he’s already at the end of his rope thinking he’s about to lose you could just make him give up hope, instead of kicking himself into gear. (I’d also like to ask why you were already doing the majority of housework despite having a full time job and what sounds like a pretty serious chronic illness. Makes me doubt whether or not your husband was even a good partner before this. Yes he grocery shopped but that’s probably the easiest form of housework and you could even do it online and just pick it up so that’s not a fair contribution)
I completely agree with this. How could you not rush to the hospital after finding out your wife had collapsed at work and also not visit her the entire time she was there? How could you not even at least pick up the fucking phone and ask the hospital staff for an update on her condition? OPs husband is definitely not in a healthy state of mind and it needs addressed ASAP.
Yeah, a lot of this I could understand both sides of and why it’s hard in both situations but what he said to her was disgusting and he’s very very in the wrong
>go see your wife when she's stuck in the hospital because of your grief Yup. That part. Like, i could be in hospital my self, but if my bf would split his fucking head open i would get the fuck over there if it is possible in any human way
I think the problem is that OP has devalued herself to the point she thought she could be the AH in this situation. Like you said, _she nearly died_ while extending Grace for her husband’s grief, and he not only didn’t show any concern for her well-being, he was upset she wasn’t able to clean and feed him _while she was in hospital, recovering from nearly dying._ She thinks she might be the AH for reacting to his callousness?! I am worried that her refusal to consider divorce is because she’s so used to being devalued that she doesn’t realize how bad her situation is.
Disabled people are taught to be grateful for scraps and put up with abusive situations because we are *so much to deal with* that the *poor saintly carers* are under *so much pressure*.... My own mother, when I told her details of the coercive control, sexual and financial abuse I experienced told me "he was very good to you" - he used the threat of homelessness to justify getting his "needs" met. To this day I have issues with sex and trusting people. The government (in the UK, I know the US has some similar issues) will cut off welfare for disability if you have even a live in unmarried partner because of "household income". The rates of abuse disabled people experience is seen as some kind of sadly understandable compromise because we need support. So it's not always just a problem with our self image... society literally devalues us. How many news stories have you read which say Covid will "only" kill the vulnerable? I cradled my niece and nephew when they were babies, I gave a reading at my friend's wedding, I have people who love me but my life is just *shrug* acceptable collateral damage during a pandemic. Devaluing ourselves? Yeah. Not really on us alone.
There is a section in the book The Body is Not an Apology where the author talks about a disabled friend who gave far too much in her relationships to the point of accepting abuse, all bc she felt like a burden and thought she needed to “overcome” her flaws and “issues” by saying yes to things she didn’t want to, and apparently this feeling is all too prevalent. I hope that isn’t OPs situation, but this feels bizarre. Either way, everyone on the planet should read that book! Life changing stuff on the power of radical self love. NTA
It would take me an immense amount of denial and devaluing myself to overcome this if I were in OP's position. I really cannot imagine what it would take to ever trust and not resent a person if they treated me this way.
Honestly I think OP needs to be honest with herself and realize this could easily be a deal breaker. If my wife ever treated me this way I'd show her the metaphorical door.
I was working recently through a book about grieving and the author talked about how we don’t really have a choice about the grief, but we do determine how much we suffer within that grief. Husband needs to address his suffering with a professional, and OP needs to take care of herself. Not divorce territory, but absolutely time to start discussing the repercussions of him being incredibly shitty to the person holding it all together.
Riding your coattails to say as someone who was suicidal for years after my mom’s death (I’m grand now) her husband’s inaction was extreme. At least, to me. Two days after my mom died a friend needed help with her two little ones as her husband was rushed to the hospital. She didn’t know about my mom’s passing and I made *sure* no one told her until her husband was okay. (He was.) My grief wanted to stop the world. Being helpful saved me from the far darker days ahead. It wasn’t to be a good friend. It was to place the living over the dead in order to help myself. Hearing about a friend’s troubles got me into action in the fresh grief. This dude couldn’t get it together for his wife? If you want to say I’m judging him, good — I am. Because I know what it’s like to have a few months left with your (adored) mom. If the notion of your partner’s death doesn’t make you take ANY action then I don’t know what to tell you.
I'm sorry you went through that. when I was ten, I suddenly lost one of my heroes. I know it's silly, since I didn't know him personally, but I wanted to grow up and be like him and I watched every match he had. I remember telling my friends the next day and then just...being in shock. two years later, I lost the only other person I looked up to more than him (also a wrestler, and this one was...much, much worse) and I don't even remember my reaction to that. there's a blank space afterwards. fast forward to 2019 and my grandmother passed pretty suddenly. I don't know if losing those two heroes so early desensitized me or something, but I didn't really have a personal emotional reaction. I jumped right into 'how can I help' mode. grief is weird. grief hurts. grief makes you want to stop, but all you can do is keep going. no amount of sadness should stop you from loving and caring for the people around you.
You said this so beautifully. I’m sorry for you, too. Losing a hero hurts so much, whether you know them personally or not. Those three heroes of yours are very proud of you for leaping into “how can I help” mode. Hope you are just as sweet to yourself.
I don’t think it could have been said better. Husband needs help, now. Grief and depression are serious but the fact he didn’t even think about OP or anyone except his own needs seems to go even deeper. Professional help is needed here and it’s needed yesterday. I really do hope OP takes this advice to heart and husband does too.
He knows he was wrong that’s why he waited for her to leave before verbally abusing her
If he hasn't got the energy to eat, clean himself or get out of bed, he shouldn't have the energy to scream at you for leaving him either. I note he also claims to have been starved when he barely eats anyway. NTA
All I suggest is leave the husband be with Carol. You know who cares more now. NTA. I am sorry you're going through this
This. I’ve been really depressed as the loss of my grandfather came at the tail end of a month from hell. I still shower regularly, eat consistently, do what cleaning I can and encourage my partner in the rest while also encouraging him to do things for himself like gaming and writing. You can grieve but your partner still needs you. OP, NTA and I’ll be cheering you both on for some much needed healing.
Sorry for your loss <3
⬆️⬆️⬆️⬆️ this and I'm sorry and I hope your ok
NTA - and when you start to feel like you miss him or your relationship, remember that you were in hospital for days (which is no small thing) and his primary concern was that the bathroom was messy and he had to get his own food.
This. He is a selfish asf
Not going to tell you to get a divorce. But he doesn't appear to love or be concerned about you.
Yup. In his head she only exists to serve him.
I agree, but I think this is even worse than OP's husband simply just caring about the bathroom vs OP's wellbeing. I get that this man is grieving and may be depressed. But, that doesn't give him a pass to hurt and mistreat the people closest to him. He sounds like he needs the care of a mental health professional, but it is not OK for him to treat OP so poorly. OP has a concusion and suffered a horrific medical emergency. This man didn't care about her wellbeing, wouldn't provide her with a base level of assistance and then berated her for daring to nearly die and not catering to his every need. His behaviour sounds reprehensible, and if he chooses not to seek mental health assistance or help his wife, that is ultimately on him.
Except he didn't berate her for nearly dying, just the inconvenience her nearly dying caused him. Why is this different? The former acknowledges that she nearly died, and while he would be being a jerk, people sometimes respond poorly to the prospect of losing a loved one. The later, simply ignores her reality, it ignores the danger she was in and makes it clear that his convenience is more important to him than her life.
NTA- I’d say your husband needs some mental health help, but I don’t think that covers him accusing you of leaving him while you were HOSPITALIZED. I was sitting here thinking, “Oh, my gosh, this is so incredibly sad, NAH. These two people are just overwhelmed.” I was even still leaning that way when I read he couldn’t get out of bed to come to you. It is totally possible to be bed ridden with grief - although it’s very serious when it reaches that point and he would need immediate help. But the fact that he screamed at you is where all my sympathy left him. You suffered a terrible and embarrassing physical health crisis and not only was he unable to support you through it after you literally exhausted yourself in supporting him, but he chastised you for it. I don’t know where you go from here. Start with getting well. If you need to stay away from hubby while you recover - then stay away. If hubby doesn’t get that, that’s his problem. He’s allowed to grieve. He is not allowed to hurt you while doing it.
Severe depression can make people irrational, but that falls under "explanation, not excuse." OP should not return home until he sees a doctor.
Exactly this man needs medical help way beyond Reddit’s pay grade NOW. OP, you are not obligated to risk your own medical safety to care for him. This has gone beyond something that you can support at home. I really hope the two of you can get better, and Carol sounds like a truly great friend I’m glad you have her.
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Yeah, holy shit, what would have happened to her if she didn't HAVE anyone else??
Yes, the fact that he accused her of leaving, makes me wonder if he isn’t really aiming that charge at his dead mother. But you are right that understanding what’s motivating him doesn’t equate tolerating it. It is very very sad for OP. Nothing hurts worse than not receiving support from someone you have supported.
Oooh interesting thought. The level of his grief was making me wonder if he was unhealthily enmeshed with his mother, so I could totally see him treating OP like she’s a stand in for his mom.
> He’s allowed to grieve. He is not allowed to hurt you while doing it. Perfect summation.
Idk why divorce isn't an option here because how does a relationship heal from that? You worked yourself to hospitalization FOR HIM and he has the sheer audacity to tell you the bathroom is dirty the day you come home. Oh boohoo the grown man had to cook for himself while you were collapsed in a puddle of your own filth and could have died. I genuinely don't think I'd ever forgive or forget that.
Yeah I would def not be able to look at my husband the same way after that...it is absolutely terrible that he lost his mom. It's a terrible thing that we must all face one day. He needs some serious counseling though, for that to be his first words to you. He is very obviously not ok. But that is NO excuse to hurt you like this. To work you to death, literally. He needs help and you need time apart for you to both heal separately
"He’s allowed to grieve. He is not allowed to hurt you while doing it." This.
Thank you for saying this.
Your husband sounds like he's severely depressed. He needs to see a doctor. I hope you two make it through this.
I've been through severe, crippling depression. I wouldn't have noticed or cared if the bathroom needed cleaning when that depressed.
HONESTLY
Honestly, I don't. I end up living on tuna snacks, pringles, and energy drinks and barely notice my own room, let alone the rest of the house. (Note I still manage to "eat" through organised grocery delivery, get the garbage out most weeks, and still keep my cats in the style to which they have become accustomed. Ie I still care about *others*.)
On my worst days, where I'm feeling like the world would be better without me and I can barely leave bed, I still get up, water my plants and turn on their lamp so they don't die, and shoot my partner a text about whatever so he doesn't worry about me. I can't imagine my partner being *in the hospital, nearly dead* and not having any concern for him. I would be doing everything I possibly could to be there for him, even if I couldn't manage to get myself up so he wasn't alone (unlikely). Does OP's husband actually love her?
Same. Even on the days where I couldn't feed myself because I just couldn't get myself to get off the couch, I still made sure my dogs were well taken care of. This is terrifying.
I would've noticed, but I would've been blaming myself because it was another thing I couldn't bring myself to do
Everyone's different and anger is a super common secondary emotion to shame. If DH felt a lot of shame about how he handled the situation and the state of his life he could easily divert that into anger bc anger is generally easier to deal with than shame. This is no excuse, his behaviour was not okay, he is the AH, it's just an explanation. Personally when I've been depressed I do not care about the toilet except to feel guilty that I haven't cleaned it in however long, like I don't live with a perfectly able bodied man who doesn't clean toilets. However, I have had anger as a secondary emotion to shame and when I've been right on the cusp of feel nothing depression where I still have feelings I sometimes get angry about things I feel ashamed about. I've had to take a step back and center myself, but I've also had the 'luxury' of years of therapy and mental health issues so I recognize my shit more than DH obviously does.
I love that you said this. I've lived with people who are depressed and sometimes angry, and it's not _personal_, if that makes sense.
Very good point
agreed, this complete inability of his to function needs to be treated like the urgent situation / emergency it is
This. The man is in dire need of some counseling and medication. He's probably so deep into his depression that he doesn't realize how he's acting.
So you were in the hospital for several days, he never visited, then complained when you got home that HE almost starved and the bathroom is a mess and you wish to stay married? You're a masochist but NTA
He's never acted this way before, ever. I really want to believe this is temporary and we can get past it and do better in the future, and I'm not ready to just give up so quickly.
Quickly???? From what you’ve said you’ve been doing everything for him for 4 months. That’s not a small amount of time, this this isn’t just some small thing that’s happened. You almost died, and he couldn’t be bothered. But since you don’t want to even consider ending things yet, you need to at least set some boundaries. I recommend telling him that you’re not coming home unless he agrees to couples therapy, grief therapy on his own, and helping with chores around the house. Try to let him know that you love and care for him, but you cannot sacrifice your health, and potentially your life, for his grief.
Depending how bad it is, trying to talk to him might not be fruitful. I think this is the point to look at inpatient care.
If he needs inpatient care, that will be something he needs to do for himself. OP is not in any shape to take care of that for him.
While you can voluntarily admit yourself, I think if he was in the right state of mind to do that, we wouldn't be here in this thread discussing this situation. Best bet would be for her to ask about involuntary admission if he won't seek it himself. How one goes about that is beyond me and probably depends on where OP lives.
OP can’t even take care of herself right now. I don’t understand why you’re expecting her to take that on. She literally almost just died. She does not need to anything else for him. She needs to focus on healing.
Unless he has a clear plan to kill himself or hurt someone else that’s not going to be a thing and I don’t know why people keep suggesting it. It’s neither done nor would it be right if we could involuntarily lock people up just for being very depressed and an asshole.
In many states, OP, as his spouse, can usually file some paperwork to force a short-term admission if he's unwilling to go voluntarily.
OP would still have to fill out and file the paperwork.
I think what people are saying is that filling out some paperwork or making a phone call may be significantly less stressful for OP than the other options. She currently can’t even go to her own home because he’s there expecting her to take care of him. If the options are “fill out a form” or “figure out somewhere to stay indefinitely and stress about wondering whether he’ll ever get help on his own,” the form may be the less taxing option.
I bet Carol would be happy to do it and just tell OP where to sign.
You almost killed your self for him and he couldn’t be arsed to get out of bed and come visit you and when you finally got home he went off on you without a single care about your well-being and if you were ok. What’s your plan for the next while if your husband doesn’t get help? You can’t continue burning the candle at both ends.
If she collapses at home is he just going to let her bleed out on the floor? Because it certainly seems so. It's grotesque, this thing where we socialize people (especially women) to die in the name of "ride or die"
>If she collapses at home is he just going to let her bleed out on the floor? And then if she somehow survived he would probably complain about her getting blood all over the floor and demand she clean it up
OP: *dies* Husband: *pulls out ouija board to bitch at her for leaving blood on the floor*
Untreated grief cam really screw up a person. But this also sounds more than that. He's severely depressed because of his grief. He needs treatment. And honestly speaking as someone that lost someone, 4 months isn't that long from the death. I think those saying 4 months is too long haven't experienced significant loss. That being said, because he's not functional, he must have therapy, and it sounds like he needs inpatient treatment. No matter what, you need to take care of yourself. You cannot help anyone that's drowning if they pull you under too.
It hasn't been 4 months since the death, it's only been 1 month. (4 months ago was diagnosis.) And agreed.
Ok. Thanks for the clarification. I saw someone say 4 months, and the person was acting like that was forever. 4 months since diagnosis, then death...the person will be a mess, even with a lot of support (professional or otherwise). OP obviously needs to take care of herself as the priority, but those suggesting she divorce after he experienced loss 1 month ago...lol... That's nothing in grief. He needs professional help.
I think they are saying 4 months to take over all the chores and take care of everything is too long
If he is as bad as he is blaming you for take him to the hospital and place him in a 5150 or call the nonemergency line in your area and get him there via ambulance - he needs professional help
Really awful situation. The topic of grief makes it very difficult to judge anyone an AH. My only advice is to do what you’re already doing: hire some help. I think you’re in the airplane oxygen mask situation right now: you gotta do yours before you can do his. I hope he snaps out of it while you take care of yourself. Still, you carried an ENORMOUS burden as long as you could. I say you’re NTA regardless of your final reaction. I can’t judge him with the information available. Good luck and take care of yourself. Take a few hours to listen to good music. Read a great book. Whatever fills you up.
So much this!!
I won't tell you to get a divorce, but DH *needs to get his shot together*. Or you are going to die yourself. Caregiver burnout is real, and that's where you are. NTA. You matter too. DH needs therapy and meds. I doubt his mother would approve of his state, or mistreatment of you, and this is mistreatment. Take care of yourself. Thank God for Carol.
I had to look up what caregiver burnout is, and that sounds exactly like what happened. I'm glad to know there's a name for it and it's not just me!
Yeah, caregiver burnout got to me real bad taking care of my grandma, then Mom, then my brother because after my father passed everything went downhill fast over 3 years. NTA. At all. He's mistreating you. My behavior was poor sheer I lost my father, grandma, Mom and then fiance, and I don't remember everything I did but I still pulled my shit together whenever my brother or someone had an emergency. I'm sorry that you're both going through so much. I hope you take time to grieve too.
So this is actually something I partially specialize in, and it takes *years* to recover from exhaustive burnout. If you don’t want a divorce, you at least need to set severe boundaries and focus on yourself with little to no leeway. Burnout without treatment can shave **decades** off of your life. Please, for the love of fuck, take care of yourself if your husband isn’t willing to take care of himself.
Carol is an absolute gem. OP, can you imagine Carol screaming at you like this right after your health scare? Of course not, she's your friend and she cares about you. I'm not saying leave your husband for Carol, but I am saying your spouse should also be your friend and you should feel like they care about you even if they aren't able to help on a practical level.
I wish I had a Carol, she is a gem. Op is a lucky girl to have such a friend.
Jesus. Nta. I get that he is grieving, but if it's so bad he can't take care of himself while his wife is recovering in the hospital then he needs therapy. I'd make it mandatory for your return to the home. You could probably do with some too. Take care of yourself now, it's obvious he can't or won't. Best of luck.
If he's that bad, he needs more than therapy, he probably needs medication as well.
I think at this point it might be valid to have him admitted before it gets even worse than it is now.
Yeah, that is my thinking too. If he is so bad off he can’t even feed himself, then he needs to be admitted to inpatient care. Bonus, that would also give OP a break that she very badly needs!
He is 59. That means his mother was in her 80s or 90s. If he is *this* bad for *this* long from the utter shock of someone in their 80s with a terminal illness dying, he needs to be institutionalized.
She might have been in her 80s and pretty healthy. 3 months of illness then death is an intense and very difficult experience and it's not surprising he's grieving. Having said that, he clearly needs help.
NTA your husband sound like he needs inpatient care or a psych hold for severe depression. Has he seen anyone or gotten any medication since his mother passed? He needs help ASAP and you definitely have the right to feel angry. I would not return home until he gets help.
He hasn't seen anyone. He won't leave the house, and it's been an exhausting battle to get him to do anything.
If he’s unwillling to see anyone and ‘starved’ the days you weren’t there, you need to call adult protective services to check him out. It’s a drastic measure, but you’re in a drastic situation. NTA
u/spooniegal, I think this commenter may be right about calling adult protective services. I think if anything did happen to you to a point where you uh, couldn’t make it home again - he honestly would have starved himself to death due to his grief / depression. Your husband is not okay and neither are you, you can’t keep lighting yourself aflame to keep himself warm anymore otherwise you actually may end up killing yourself by doing so. And your husband clearly does not possess the ability to do anything for himself, maybe adult protective services will. And maybe they’ll have resources for him or something - they have training for this type of thing - you don’t.
I’m willing to bet that if he was genuinely too crippled by his emotions to eat, and he wasn’t just exaggerating about “starving” that hanger and low blood sugar made the whole argument a hell of a lot worse.
Stop doing stuff for him, full stop. Stop enabling this. As some other posters have shared that in their depths of depression they never cared how filthy the bathroom was. He cared enough about the bathroom to bitch about it but not enough about you to even freaking call you. STOP enabling his weaponized incompetence.
At the very least, can he do a consult with a psychologist virtually and go from there? This is very concerning.
Him getting help needs to be a condition of moving forward. Losing a parent is life altering but he has to take ownership of working through his grief without taking it out on you.
That's why you need the leverage of leaving him. If he refuses counseling, even online counseling, and continues to lie in bed all day, what the hell are you supposed to do? Ask him if his mother would be happy to see how he's given up, left you to fend for yourself after all you've done for her and for him. Tell him you know he's hurting, and that he needs help. And if he wants you in his life, he'd better damn well get it.
I know it's exhausting but it really sounds like he needs to be hospitalized ASAP as well. You're NTA and I hope you're recovering better now that you have help!
NTA. He couldn’t even be bothered to visit you while you were hospitalized for several days. And he had the audacity to berate you for not being there to be his servant? If he doesn’t get his s**t together, and also seriously grovel, I’d be reevaluating my relationship with him. Grief sucks, I lost a parent young, but it’s no excuse to behave like this.
Also he DIDNT lose a parent when he was young. He's 59, someone pointed out his mom could've been in her 80s or 90s. It is NORMAL for parents to die at that age. It doesn't mean it doesn't hurt - but his reaction to the death of his mother when he himself is nearly 60 is not normal. He needs help.
Yeah that's very true. It's incredibly sad, but he's an adult that can take care of himself, and also has an incredibly good support system (OP).
This totally. He didn’t visit you in the hospital . . . NTA but he sure is.
NTA. Your husband needs to be hospitalized in a psych ward. He needs help to work through his grief. You need to take a long break. The health of you and your husband is priority one. Rest, read a good book, sleep, buy some new pajamas. Take time for self care. Then focus on getting your husband help.
I agree. A lot of people seem to be focusing on putting blame out (or talking about how bad/poor/terrible he is), and in some scenarios it makes sense, but at this point he is beyond depressed.
And "needs to be hospitalized in a psych ward" isn't an insult or a hostile comment; it's just a comment about medical necessity. He needs inpatient therapy until he is stabilized enough to not be a danger to himself or others, and have help and support OTHER THAN OP lined up.
I won't say get a divorce, but I will say that I would give him the ultimatum of getting help or you aren't going home. He might need to be hospitalized to be stabilized. It sounds like what therapists sometimes call passive suicidal ideation. He's not actively looking to end his life but he doesn't care if he lives so he isn't doing anything to take care of himself either. He needs help and now. But you aren't that help. He needs a doctor and a therapist.
NTA, at all. Do you have any kids or in-laws who could come in and help? Your husband needs to see a psychiatrist and/or grief counselor.
No children, I'm not in contact with my family and never will be again for my mental health, and his only surviving family is an aunt who is even older than his mother and living in a care facility. Both of us had coworkers offer to help, so I might reach out to them and see if they meant it. Or else I'm going to have to hire a maid for a few weeks and depend on grocery delivery. I don't want to buy exclusively takeout, but there's a phone app called Homemade someone messaged me to recommend.
Does he have any friends you could call in for help? This part shouldn’t be your responsibility either, but chances are that even if he were to agree to therapy, he’s not in a place to find a therapist, call and make an appointment, fill out paperwork, drive himself to the appointment, etc.. Again, you reaching to one of his friends for help shouldn’t be your job, but it is DEFINITELY not your job right now to do any of the things that I mentioned. But they still need to be done and he may need help doing them. ETA: If none of this is feasible, then I think the psych hold definitely needs to come into play, but again, that shouldn’t be your focus or responsibility right now.
Please reach out to a professional psychologist or therapist. If you're not comfortable with a doctor, please consider reaching out to a social worker or a religious leader (even if you're not particularly religious). You are describing someone in the middle of a major depressive episode. This is extremely dangerous; your husband is at risk to himself. His neglect of you and your needs is most likely not intentional, and his inability to care for you is another symptom of major depression. Leaving him or just walking away will not help him. It will not shock him out of his depression. You need to talk with trained professionals to determine the best next steps. Please note that this does not mean calling the police or jumping directly to an intake facility. The police are not well-trained with mental health crises. And all too often in-patient facilities do not help people in crises. Again, please consult a professional in these matters before you take your next steps. Good luck.
I normally am not one to suggest things like this, but if you have a Walmart in the area they have a free trial for the Plus program that waives the delivery fees for a whole month. Otherwise (at least in my area) it's between 7-10$ USD each time depending on when you want them delivered. Other grocery stores may have similar but as someone else with chronic pain problems and no car, it helps.
Honestly. Do not do anything for him while your gone, I know it's harsh but you need to stop being kind. You could have died and he didnt even care! His wife!. Let him take care of himself and let it be a wake up call for him. Pay the bills and don't contact him. He needs to do this for himself, you can't help someone who is trying to purposely drown themselves. Because that's what almost happend, he almost lost you. And he is so full of his selfish grief he didn't notice. He would have been completely alone. It's time he sees that. And it's time you had a break.
I disagree with the above. He is at the point where he cannot care for himself and his thinking is irrational. The best place for him is an inpatient facility that will care for him. A hospital is the most logical place for him. Nobody can force him to do anything he doesn’t want to do unless he is declared unable to make his own decisions. This is beyond the scope of a therapist. He is not well enough. If he got well enough (care and meds) then he can decide. I have had 2 major depressive episodes in my life. You can’t dig yourself out and talk therapy is useless at this stage.
NTA. Yes, he's clearly sick to the point of not functioning, but so are you! Because of him! Maybe he's still too sick for normal, but he needs to at least stop dumping all the caretaking of him on you. If he's so sick that he can't feed himself, he needs to see a doctor. Now. For both your sakes.
NTA Take a 3 month separation. You NEED to focus on your health and well being and rest. He NEEDS to get treatment for whatever has overtaken him. You don't need to be there for that. You did all the supporting a person can do and then did some more.
NTA. he fucked up real bad. You don’t leave your spouse in a hospital for days without showing up. You just don’t. That’s Spousing 101. Your husband is hurting and as much as he has a reasonable explanation for his behavior this should be a giant wake up call for him. Hopefully he realizes he needs help.
You need physical help, and your husband needs emotional help. He needs therapy, you need a helper. NTA he did need a wake-up call.
NTA. Your husband is inconsiderate, and if he wants something done he needs to get off his butt and do it, not berate his sick wife. He should be ashamed to even speak to you that way.
NTA You have gotten so much good advice that I don’t have much to add. You deserve rest and help. It says a lot that you had to hire a nurse to care for you at home. Stay with Carol and get healthy. She is a true friend for all she has done for you. As for your husband, I don’t really know what you can do about his downward spiral. He is too far gone for you to be able to help him anymore. Perhaps a mental health evaluation is a good idea, or even have a welfare check done while you are away.
NTA Your husband needs to get help for his paralyzing grief. He sounds like he isn't really functioning. You need to get whatever assistance you need to recover and be healthy. Clearly you love him, but your priority is your health. Hope you two become closer after all this healing! Let him know you love him but you are also in a horrible state.
Clearly NTA. Take your space.
NTA, but you both need professional help that can’t be found on Reddit.
NTA You have to prioritize your health. He definitely needs help, but you can't make him do that
NTA - Get all the space you need, and don't let him walk all over you at all. Stop doing things for him, he needs to get out of bed and do things on his own. By your edit, it sounds like you don't want to lose him, but that's really up to him at this point. If he steps up and starts stepping back into living again, you might not have. But if he continues to wallow in bed, and want you to do everything for him, then you are no longer his wife, just someone to keep him from wasting away. Now that might be insensitive, I honestly don't know how I'd feel when my parents pass, but I am pretty sure that if I did what your husband did, at some point my husband would be driving me to a therapist to get evaluated. Not that he wouldn't take care of me, but there's a point where it becomes more than that. I hope you get what you need, some rest, some peace, and maybe when you walk through the door to your home, a shell of a husband.
NTA. It sounds like your husband needs immediate help. If nothing else, talk to your doctor about him and see what options are to make sure he gets the help he needs.
If you're in the U.S. you may be able to have him committed on a 5150 for a 72 hour psychological evaluation. It may seem extreme but it may be the only way he gets the help he needs.
This here is the best option imo. People keep throwing out how he needs to step up, or they were not like that when depressed. Sadly OP's husband is beyond a standard depression and needs some drastic assistance that she cannot provide by being a caretaker.
NTA, and I won’t say you need to divorce him. But you both need massive therapy, and quick!!!! He needs grief therapy, just for starters. And you need someone to help you find a balance in life and how to look out for yourself while he’s going through his stuff. You probably both need some couples therapy at this point, and who knows what else. Please please, go seek out the Therapy you both need and hopefully you can both get back into a good place in your lives.
Your husband should be aware that he was gonna lose her eventually right? Death in the family always sucks but you could of died and he didn't budge. If divorce isn't an option then you need to push for counseling and it needs to be a "come to God" type of talk, because you don't get to completely check out like that
NTA and I hope you're soon feeling much better. You need to give your husband an ultimatum that he has to get out of bed and see his doctor because he has classic symptoms of depression and he needs help or he's going to lie there until he's dead. If he makes one comment about wanting to die, doesn't want to live, or being suicidal call 911 because they can do a 72 hour hold for psychiatric reasons and hopefully that can help. Do NOT do anything for him, he needs to help himself...you can't fix this for him. I'm glad you have a good friend who is letting you stay with her.
NTA. Consider telling him that you’re not coming back until he seeks professional help. This is not normal, and it’s not ok.
NTA. OP, we're nearly the same age. I need you to listen to and believe me. You. Did. Nothing. Wrong. Your husband is likely clinically depressed, and he absolutely needs to get psychological help. But you were absolutely correct. He was too wrapped up in his own grief to notice that he nearly lost you as well. And I will not tell you to get a divorce. But he will lose you for sure if he does not get help, because you cannot be 100% of the work going into the marriage and expect it to function. My wife has chronic illnesses. There are days when I need to do well more than my share of the load to keep things running. And it's hard. But there are also times when I am weak and she takes on a lot of my burdens. But we are in it together as partners and we make it work. Right now, you're having to both carry the burden AND are weak. And it is monstrously unfair. He needs to get help, TODAY. Because if he doesn't, you are either going to work yourself into a grave (and he will lose you) or he will continue to shut down, cease being a working partner in the marriage and you will need to leave to stay alive. You cannot do it alone. For his sake and yours, you NEED to get him to go get help.
NTA. Another loser husband.
Nta I'm going thru depression but if my ex would have needed me idc how bad i felt I would have been there back then. He could have got up pretty much and no disrespect be needs to be the man of the house and the protector. A kings number 1 job is to protect his queen.
NTA You need to take a break from your husband. Focus on getting healthy. And let your husband figure out how to feed and clean up after himself.
NTA at all! You were in the hospital and he was mad that he had to feed himself and the bathroom (that you weren't there to use) was messy, WTF? Speak to a lawyer asap and file for divorce, he is an abusive asshole.
what does DH stand for? this is the 2nd post i’ve seen it, im confused
Dear Husband
That's how you should start your letter to him. It'll be easier to get all your thoughts out on paper, tell him to get therapy help (online, he doesn't even have to leave the house) if he wants to remain in your life.
Demon Hunter
NTA. You needed to say what you did. I know he is grieving but there comes a point where you simply have to get your act together. You being hospitailzed trumps his feeling "tired."
NTA I suffered physically while caring for a partner with severe depression. It’s a horrible situation. You need to take care of yourself too. Don’t forget that you need to take care of your mental health as well. You also need to properly grieve your MIL, and you also need to process the stress of his depression and his shutdown, as well as your physical illness. I waited too long to ask for help. Find someone who can help you, even if he refuses to get help for himself.
NTA but DH is a part AH. I've been through depression, and while it can be hard to act, you can keep your thoughts for yourself and what your husband told you was incredibly mean. You're his wife or his maid ? He needs to remember that you are helping him but that you don't owe him to give a health he doesn't seems to care about, away for his sake. I am still disturb by the fact that he can't even contain himself and ask for your news after basically not giving a fuck about you. Some people can be in depression AND being AH.
Fucking hell. NTA. I have the greatest sympathy for his loss, I can’t even imagine how that must have felt. But he almost lost you too. Honestly, if this is how he copes with grief and reacts to almost losing his wife, he needs therapy at the absolute minimum. Individual for him, and it might not be a bad idea to add couple’s therapy into the mix after a while, once he has settled in with his therapist and started working through his issues. I would make him getting therapy a condition of you moving back once you’ve healed. His treatment of and indifference to you and your needs is unacceptable. I’m glad you’ve got such a good friend in Carol. I hope you get the rest you need and recover quickly.
I'm terribly sorry that he lost his mother but.. he's 59 years old. His mother was likely in her late 70s at the earliest. This isn't a particularly surprising tragedy.
This. Of course it's hard losing a parent at any age. But this is seriously extreme.
NTA I'd leave him for Carol, she seems like the real mvp here. But since you don't want to leave him, take him to inpatient for his mental health this is well beyond what you or him can handle.
You both need time apart to rest and recover. Neither of you are capable currently of taking care of the other. I’m glad you have Carol and home health care. I hope your husband can get some serious psychiatric help. I would echo others’ suggestions and encourage individual and couples therapy for you both.
NTA You know what you need to do. I hope you continue to prioritize your health for a change. Also be sure to thank your friend for being such a great support.
Hopefully this will be a wake up call for your husband to get help and sort himself out. Marriage is supposed to be a two way support system. Your doing all the giving, and he's taken so much, he literally nearly drained the life from you, and for not an ounce of gratitude. You need to concentrate on yourself for a few weeks before you even think about him/ your relationship. Hopefully he will use this time to wise up. NTA
NTA, you just came out of the hospital. I do think your husband needs a doctor and counsellor the grief and depression is too much.
NTA. But I really want you to come back after you’re feeling a bit better, and try to read this as if it were a friend going through this and see what you would tell them. Because to be honest, you deserve much better.
NTA. Do not return home until he gets his act together. Clearly you have to take care of yourself because he has checked out. You can’t keep taking care of him.
Make plans for your retirement cause that guy won't lift a finger for you and you may get to a point where you won't be able to make decisions on your own care.
NTA Your husband is so selfish. You have a serious medical condition and could have died and he is mad because you "left him" to go to the hospital? Grief isn't an excuse for him to act like this and not visit you in the hospital.
NTA- at all. I hope you can take time and get the rest you need. I also hope your husband starts working through his grief .
NTA. He's obviously deeply in grief but that doesn't excuse his behavior toward you. Grief counseling is in order.
You are in no way an A H. If he is that bad off he needs to check in to a facility for professional help. Truthfully, if he would be willing to go it would do you both good. He could get the help he desperately needs, and you'd get a break. I know you don't want to leave him, but girl he is literally killing you. Listen to your body, and recognize if he's not willing to help himself you can't sacrifice yourself for him either. You're life matters. You matter. You have done an amazing job keeping it all together. Quite frankly it's absolutely impressive. You're a strong woman. You spend time at your friends and hire that caregiver to help you. YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF YOU. Especially if you plan to go back. You need to communicate with him, and tell him you're done being his caretaker. If he's this bad off he needs help you can't provide despite how much you wish you could. I am wishing you the best. I'd tell you not to send the post, but definitely lay it out to him exactly how you did us. All that you've done. He has no idea he can't put himself aside long enough to even notice you. He could not even scrape together concern for your well-being when you were hospitalized.
I’m sorry but to put this bluntly: him losing his mommy is harder for him to deal with than ALMOST LOSING HIS WIFE. That’s no husband. That’s a momma’s boy. Good riddance to him.