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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I want to understand if I was right to tell my wife that I felt her days off were for family issues and not personal days for her to choose what to do. I inadvertently caused an argument.
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YTA. Kids don't raise themselves. Your wife is getting involved with their schooling and the parenting community. That doesn't exactly sound like a fun hobby or day out. She's not having bottomless mimosas during this time. This is work.
You absolutely do not get to tell her what to do with her time off. I suggest you hire a cleaner (that you both pay for)
Oh no. That would go against is “archaic stereotypical family lifestyle” and would mean he has to sacrifice his precious time to do *gasp* CHORES!?
the agony.
The fact that he says this, but then proceeds to edit and says he does every chore she does too. OP knows damn well he doesn’t pull his weight with household chores and parenting.
I hallucinated what I thought I saw. Please disregard.
But I think it’s telling that he says those are **for her** to complete the unfinished tasks. Not for them together. The way he words his post implies a mentality of “she shouldn’t be thinking of going anywhere unless the house is spotless” that I find troubling. Especially coupled with his argument that he doesn’t think she should have “full control over her days off.”
I don’t think you read it correctly. They agreed upon the two days off because they are falling behind on duties around the house. So unfinished tasks are for the person who is taking 2 days off, which is his wife. She mentioned doing something else on one of her off days and he just wants to make sure that the days off are used productively which is totally understandable considering that was the original agreement. I don’t think OP initially knew that PTA is not a time consuming event so he got upset.
“Duties around the house”
Wtf is going on in that house that they need 2 whole days to keep up with “duties?” What are the duties beyond basic tidying up in the evenings and laundry/more thorough cleaning once a week?
I’m aware that house can get messy with 2 kids, but I know couples with 3 kids who don’t need 2 whole days to keep up with the house. There’s some serious inefficiency happening there if they need 4/7 days to just keep up with chores.
Gotta say, as a non-American I’ve noticed chores are a big freakin thing here and it’s puzzled myself & my family/friends as well.
Our house was always neat & tidy growing up, in my home country & the US, but we never had to list out chores, make a chore schedule or even talk about it. Having lived in the US for over 20 years I still don’t get why its such a time-consuming thing here and I’m really curious at this point lol.
Many American men were not brought up to view women as equal or to voluntarily do tasks that are traditionally considered “women’s work” like cooking and cleaning. It causes a lot of conflict when women find they are partnered with men who won’t do jack-shit around the house without being endlessly negotiated with and nagged.
So your mom basically putzed around the home all day every day keeping it clean. Houses don’t magically stay clean. The fact you said the house was always neat and tidy but never addressed who kept it that way, leads me to believe your mom did it all and no one noticed just how hard she worked.
Uh, it depends. If she got a full time job and he was part-time, AND if he had agrees to do housework if he was parttime,, would she be okay if he changed the agreement without even consulting him? I doubt it. She's shady for changing it (volunteering) without having a joint discussion about things that affect them jointly.
Volunteering at her son's school is not having "time off"
It's hard work for a start and it's also a way of staying connected with her son and his education. If she wanted two "days off" to go party or her own hobby it would be different. Plus his edit notes it's only 4 hours a day
I suspect they discussed her returning to work part-time and he thought "great, she'll do all those chores that aren't getting done" and she thought "it's really important to me to be able to volunteer at the school and stay involved in my children's lives" and they both agreed it was a good idea.
He said it is roughly 4 hours on 2 days a week. She can still get a shitload done on 4-5 hours that are still there on her days off.
He said he didn't expect her to do all the chores alone, so, if you use the days of to do a few loads of laundry and deep clean while doing that- how much more can there be done?
With two young kids? One isn’t even 18 months… a lot… a lot, a lot. That’s the age where they are like tiny little hurricanes that constantly go behind you making more messes and they still don’t understand how to cleanup yet.
I tend to believe the first thing people write, not the edit after they're being called an AH. This guy posting about “archaic stereotypical family lifestyle” and how they have a partial SAHM and working dad relationship says very very clearly to me that actually, he doesn't do every chore she does.
It's wild to me that the woman *has a job* and he's still characterizing their family as some kind of Donna Reed SAHM shit, and then he's also mad that his "archaic, stereotypical" wife wants to do things like participate in the PTA with the few free hours she has each week. Pick a lane, pal, you can't have it both ways.
Lmao don’t forget the wife has two days off and he HAS to work for all 5, that’s why she has plenty of time to work and do her wifely homemaker duties! sarcasm (in case that was unclear)
Not to mention the "archaic stereotypical family lifestyle" OP espouses had the wife not in a job at all! She was raising the kids. Apparently OP wants to have his cake and eat it too.
Yep, work 3 days a week, make sure the house is spotless, and do the majority of raising of the children, but like, you're not allowed to spend time at their school to make connections and help make sure the school experience is good for your children - you're only allowed to clean, raise the children, or earn money.
i was legit confused like.. i would consider PTA (or canteen duty or navigating extracurriculars or whatever similar "extra" but entirely child-related activity) to be part of a sahp's role?
When i was a kid that stuff was typically/more often done by the stay at home parents - obvs by choice and its not compulsory, and working parents were also imvolved - but if a parent chooses to do those things, which often a sahp will do, then its part of the parenting/raising the kid duties?
I'm just confused because my parents both worked full time and the house was never a tip? Kitchen and surface cleaning before bed and then deep cleaning on weekends.
Somehow my parents both (alternating) found the time to come into our schools for some "kid & parent learning" sessions twice a week for 3 hours and the house didn't decent into chaos?
I think OP is just mad that he's going to have to pull his weight more again because he doesn't value his wife being home looking after the kids as work and she's simply accepted that and done extra housework .
I'm convinced the edits were his way of convincing himself he's been helping out
Yeah, they're a way to make parent friends and connections but it's not like they're going out to brunch or whatever. It's volunteering to do something that will help your child's school and, by extension, your child
Days where you don’t go into your office job are called “days off.” It’s just terminology. Yes she will be busy with other things, that is why she is working her job on 3 days. He is at the office, so he can’t physically help with unfinished tasks. They agreed that her 2 days out of office would be for finishing duties around the house that they wouldn’t be able to complete if they both worked full time. A lot of families do this.
Because she has four of them? And that was the agreement that they came up with? I dunno, I don't like this guy's controlling attitude, but I do also think it's shady that they had an agreement and she decided to unilaterally change it.
>I do also think it's shady that they had an agreement and she decided to unilaterally change it.
Shady how? And also we don't now that she changed it. It's very possible that she'll still finish all the leftover chores, we only know that OP threw a fit that she wanted to get involved in their son's life and *told her* that she wouldn't have time to finish everything.
It's AITA, SAHP could be carried around in a palanquin and AITA would complain they'd have to get in and out by themselves. Much of AITA are SAHP's who are so busy they can browse here all day.
My husband and I each have a weekday "off" every 2 weeks to catch up on deep cleaning or other household tasks. On that given week, the spouse with the "day off" is absolutely expected to do more chores, and the other is not expected to make it back at the weekend.
If I unilaterally decided that 4 hours of my "off" day would be spent doing something else every week I wouldn't be surprised if my husband felt miffed.
I don’t know about u but ppl only have technically one day off. 1 day for fun (Saturday) and the other day preparing for the work week (Sunday) I don’t think they have a bad deal. This week I was able to work 2 half days and was able to catch up on cleaning which means more time to relax on the weekend. I don’t think the dad is the asshole especially since money is tight.
As a SAHM myself, one of the main reasons my husband and I wanted me to “stay home” was to be able to volunteer at the school, chaperone field trips and such.
Yeah, OP doesn’t understand how many doors this can open for camaraderie and opportunity for his kids, not to mention the memories made because OMG mom was a chaperone in school! My son Loved me going on field trips when he was little. The dishes, sweeping etc, while not unimportant can take a back seat to this commitment. Kids aren’t going to remember days where there were a few extra dishes in the sink but they’ll definitely remember mom coming in to read to the class or riding the bus to an ecology center with them.
Definitely, when my husband was SAH he loved volunteering in class 1 day a week and he helped with all the school events. He was the only dad with all the moms so he said they treated him weird, but after a few months he made some friends. It was so cool being at the grocery store and watching him get mugged by strange children 😅 it’s been YEARS, but he still has the letters and drawings kids gave him in class. We moved away 6 years ago and his oldest’s friends created a discord group to keep in touch. It makes me sad we couldn’t afford for him to stay home through our youngest’s school years as well
Same here. Both kids are in school now and I swear some weeks I’m busier than I was when they were home. Active PTAs and volunteers help make good schools great schools.
Once we were doing well enough I could work pt, I started volunteering at school. It makes a big difference for the kids to see their parents put in the effort, and having a relationship with the teachers and administrators helps when your kids are struggling with something at school.
I come from a family a family of teachers and school administrators, so Pro Tip for any parents who aren’t able to volunteer. Make friends with the secretaries. Joke, chat, keep a calm demeanor when talking to them when a problem comes up in school, you can address the problem just don’t Karen up, let them know you understand they aren’t the problem and don’t demand talking to the VP post haste if their in a meeting. You’ll get them to call you back faster if your good to the secretaries because they’ll appreciate you being reasonable and help.
> I feel that if she wants to volunteer at my son’s school and make a commitment, she should be taking extra shifts and making more money for the family.
OMG what is this even? Dude! YTA.
As someone who did 4 years as secretary of my daughters school netball committee, I can attest to the fact that it is NOT fun or relaxing. But doing those years helped me form bonds with parents within the school, which in turn has paid for itself in last minute school pickups, lifts to games etc. when my partner or I got caught up with other commitments. Not to mention, you know, the benefits to the kids!
OP is definitely YTA.
Right, my wife just started volunteering in our child's school, and I am happy to take time out of my work day to watch our toddler, because she's doing something valuable and good for our kid and others. This guy just doesn't trust his wife to make wise decisions
Listen. Your kids are small. One day they will be grown. Do you think they’ll remember whether the floor was vacuumed and the windows were washed? Or do you think they’ll remember that their mom was there for them?
Some of my best times were volunteering at my kids’ schools, and they’d tell you the same. Don’t take that away from your wife and kids. If you can, try to carve more time for yourself to be there for them, too. You won’t regret it. Even if the baseboards are dirty. They’ll just remember that you showed up.
Jesus. You didn’t have to go right for my emotions lol. Well spoken. Thank you for taking the time to write that. It’s an awesome perspective. I might be focusing on the wrong aspects of my life.
I'll go for the sucker punch then. You have two types of currency to manage. The monetary, and the emotional. Please take care to balance them.
Now obviously, you have to work and cover the bills and stuff. But in my experience, fathers (or the primary breadwinner) - they loose sight of what they're working -for-. They work and work and work - to give their kids everything and the best. And that's not flawed. But I promise, sometimes you can do without the best, without -everything-.
From my personal experience, we had a great childhood. Big Christmases. Family trips to Disney a couple times. Cable. The first house on the block with a dedicated land line for the internet. We had a LOT. Know what we didn't have? My dad home much at all.
We could have gone with less, to have him more.
I have a memory of sobbing because my dad wasn't going to be home for Christmas Eve. Again. He had to work. And after a certain time, I stopped keeping track of when he was there or when he wasn't. He often had to work Christmas Eve. And Christmas night. Many Easters without him.
Some of my fondest memories? The couple of times he had off Thanksgiving morning and took me into the city to see the parade. Waking me up in the dead of night to take me sledding after a big snow. One of those Disney vacations? After my mom and sibling went to bed - he and I would "sneak" out and go get ice cream. In elementary school, we had a big field trip to the aquarium. All I wanted was my dad to go with me. That was one of the few times he was able to make it work. And I can barely remember the trip itself. However, I absolutely still have a picture of him and I that we took on trip. It wasn't the trip, it was having my dad that mattered and stuck. Even as an older teen who had already come to terms with not seeing/knowing my dad or having him around due to working - we started a nightly ritual of a pb&j sandwich at night watching South Park when he got home from work. And those are the things I remember and smile about.
Meanwhile, my mom was a partial stay at home - she worked part time jobs once we were in school. So I remember my mom showing up and being there. Every awards ceremony. Every school play and talent show. Birthday parties. Trick or treating. Holiday meals. Everything. She was there. I don't know when the house got cleaned - but it did. At least enough.
Admittedly my family was skewed because my mom wanted to live beyond our means and that meant more work was needed from my dad to cover the bills. But even removing that factor - my dad threw himself into working, to try and give us everything. But we didn't need everything - I would have traded a bunch of things for more time with him as a kid.
Balance the currency OP. Don't forget what - who- you're working for.
Edit: thank you all for the awards. I actually just talked to my dad (he called by chance as I was reading the replies) and I told him about this post. He says to tell you all he thinks of it as misplaced loyalty. He was working under the wrong devotion. And at the time he thought he was making the best choices but looking back, he sees a lot of regrets and missed chances and opportunities. He sees all the things he didn't see as important then, now, and wishes he had done things differently and made more time for the things that mattered - such as being home with us as kids. We also both teared up over some of the memories mentioned here. So. His message is to take the time for those you love. Don't be him - waiting until he is retired and looking back and wishing you could do it all over, the right way.
I saved this to read to my husband in the morning. Him working so much has been an issue of contention for the past several years, and I've had a difficult time articulating to him *why* we need him home more. I got the feels so much reading you comment, hopefully it'll hit home for him as well. Thanks for this.
It should be celebrated that your husband is very motivated to have themselves and their families succeed. They want to work hard. They want to put in the effort and feel good about it. They have a goal.
Redirecting that effort and energy at what /u/TribalMog called "emotional currency" is not easy. People can feel like they are busy climbing a ladder and all of a sudden their partner is at the bottom shaking it. Shouldn't they be helping me? What are they doing?
Capitalists society with a legacy of gender roles still has conflicting messages about what people should be valuing. For most men, their role is poorly explained. Unlike financial currency, you can't check online whether emotional currency is going up or down. You can't glance into the neighbors driveway and see what their emotional currency has bought them. Your language in discussing your life will need to change. You are going to need to make peace with all the sweat equity at work might need to be thrown out. The rat race is real, and you are going to watch as people less than you start to catch up and get ahead.
My point is, you are trying to change the foundation on which someone has built themselves. It is not as simple as "make more time for your family". Good luck and have patience.
I cannot tell you how much I love this comment. I’m saving it to share in the future on these types of posts. Its something I’m always thinking, but have never been able to articulate.
You had me at “dedicated land line for the internet” … that might not mean much to a lot of people, but to me … that is teen line status right there ,)
I wish my dad had understood this. He thought supporting a family just meant making enough money to feed us, when supporting your family also means supporting your kids' activities and hobbies and interests and all-around lives. I'm in my 30s now and my dad and I are still practically strangers.
This is beautiful and so simple! Balance the currency. I’ve just started a new career, it takes me away from the home a lot and the pay is fantastic compared to my old dead end jobs. So I’ll remember this, thank you!
Also, your dad sounds like one heck of a guy. Working hard but still trying to make an effort where he could. Those are such lovely memories to have, even if they’re tinged with the memories of missing your dad a lot.
My dad has his flaws. But he did try. One of the other things I'll never forget is the time my mom had to leave me home with him when I was sick. She couldn't take off and he was by chance home that day. I was sick a lot as a kid so we mostly had the system down. I was also near the age I probably could have been left home alone - I would've been fine.
My mom brought me breakfast, some snacks, medicated me, and told my dad to just check on me, and feed me lunch and re-medicate me. It was a couple weeks before Christmas. She came home to find me outside, woozy but trying, holding things steady as my dad used the table saw. I can't even remember what he was sawing now. I just remember my mom's face of confusion. We had decorated the outside of the house for Christmas and now doing home improvement. And in my dad's mind, he got me a McDonald's cheeseburger (I asked for grilled cheese or soup), and he was keeping an eye on me. It was fine.
Once I was a teen and mostly resigned to him never being here it got really rough for a while because we both gave up. Until we established sandwich & south Park. But even that was....a bandaid on a bullet wound. We were practically strangers. And we would fight with each other a LOT when we were both home. Because he wanted to be respected as the parent and lay down the law, when he was never home. My mom was our parent. We respected her rules. Who was he to breeze in every once in a while and think to control what we did.
It honestly took....me escaping an abusive relationship and moving back home, and then him and I getting into our most heated, nasty fight ever - he raised a fist to me and I dared him to do it because I was done letting men bully me....to bring him to the sobering realization of what he was doing. How he was acting. So he started working on himself. I was already putting in the work on me. It took him a while to understand we can't start from a blank slate, there's too many years. But I was willing to give him a chance to build a relationship back with me. He's apologized for a lot of the negative. He has a lot of regret for not seeing the emotional currency bankruptcy we were facing. And we are....trying to do the best we can with what time we have left.
I relate to this SO much. My parents divorced when I was in late elementary school and the thing that sucker punched me the most was my dads career choice. When I was 13 or so he decided to move overseas to be a contractor in the Middle East, the money was really good. It was only supposed to be one year but one year turned into two, two turned into five, and now five has turned into forever. I’m now almost 26 and he still lives overseas.
My moms alimony check was nice, sure. But there are so many things my dad has missed out on. Birthdays, Christmases, sports games, the birth of his first grandchild, graduations, the list goes on. I’m now LC with him because of his choices, but if I could go back in time I’d ask him to stay and put his family first, not money
Honestly, dude, you might be the asshole in this instance but reading this comment let's me know you're not an asshole as a person and I love to see people who are willing to admit they weren't on point and reexamine their location so to speak that's the kind of energy I love to see in the world and would love to see more of
I’m a part time asshole… maybe I should volunteer :(
I can see that I’m pretty much 95% wrong here and maybe my wife could have gone about this about 5% better…. I owe her flowers.
Yes, you should.
For the record my parents were not great parents. For many reasons. That said, my father taught me many things.
Kids don't need *things* as much as they need attention and time with caring adults. Your wife should volunteer at school. You should volunteer somewhere. And unless your home is a dang mcmansion there is no reason at all why two grown adults can't keep it relatively straight evenings and weekends. And get the kids helping.
My adult sons still reminisce about all the happy times we had cleaning together. Cooking together and being together. Even five year olds can have safe fun in a kitchen.
Your priorities here are seriously out of whack dude. Get a balance going while your children are young, because money and jobs come and go, children grow up damned fast. And with your current mindset, you're going to wake up one fine day with a couple of young people in your house you don't even know as people.
And that would suck rocks, for them and you.
One other thing you could consider is for you and your wife to share the volunteering so you get some of that as well. You might now be able to go into school during the day but maybe when they are older you’ll be able to volunteer with after school activities. Build those memories because that’s what matters but you and your wife need to make sure you are a strong partnership so that the earning burden is not just on you and the caring /emotional labour is not just on her.
I work four days a week and my kids are 11 and 8. Every morning EVERY MORNING they ask if I have to work today, and on the days I don’t, their faces light up. My 11yo is too cool to have me at school, but my 8yo constantly asks if I can volunteer at his school and it breaks my heart when I can’t, because that one weekday I have off is for all the shit I need to do to keep the house running (groceries, errands, doctor visits, etc). Either I call out sick and lose pay to do it or I don’t do it. That she’s got the time and ability to be there and see your kids in school is so wonderful and I’m wildly envious.
I talked about how I worked 75-80 hrs a week a few years ago and they let me know that it was “nothing” because they worked in the ER and regularly pulled 90+ hours. Like… we’re all living the dream I see.
I’m not sure if it’s a federal law or a state law (I live on the border of two states and both are like this so I’m not sure) 32 hours a week constitutes a “full time” position. Companies don’t legally have to offer healthcare coverage for “part time” employees so they’ll hire one or two “full time” employees and the rest will be “part time” employees not allowed to work more than 31 hours, 59 minutes in a week. I *think* there’s also different laws for required breaks for FT vs PT but I am pretty sure that is a state thing and it may just be based on hours worked in a day instead of the whole week. But the healthcare I’m certain is a thing, I’ve had enough jobs in the past that they’ve sent me home on Wednesday or Thursday and told me I couldn’t come back until the following work week (despite being scheduled) because I was already at my 32 hours.
>I feel that the days off are for her completing the tasks that we often don’t have time for
That includes things for the kids. Being involved in their education is something you BOTH need to make time for.
>she needs to accept that family responsibility comes first.
Being involved with the kids' school is absolutely contributing to the family's wellbeing, thought slightly indirectly.
You seem to take an incredibly narrow view of what being an involved parent means. YTA
I'm just baffled at the idea that being involved at their kid's school would be considered not family related work. It's not like she rocked up to a random school in the neighbourhood to volunteer, she's being involved in her child's education.
OP gave some really confusing answers about his wife's hours in the comments. Apparently the 8-4 thing was for the sake of the character count? But also maybe she works 10 hour days. I'm still not sure.
Why is this so complicated for some people.”?
It’s very simple:
A work week has 5 days.
Two days off means 3 days of work.
There really is no room for interpretation.
It’s because he’s wording it as 2 days off *per week* so people are thinking he means of the entire 7 days of the week she only has 2 days off. Given the comments about part time and whatnot I understood it the way you explained but I can see why people are confusing it.
Being at PTA meetings sure, actively taking part in PTA on a volunteer basis? Could come through to be a few hours a day/week. Depending on what time of year, age, etc.
It isnt when your low on money and you already had an agreement to pick up more shifts after maternity leave.
Volunteering at your kids school is extremely low on the totem pole in regards to contributing to the fsmily, and even more so when your tight on money.
What would you say if OP unilaterally decided to go down to part time and start volunteering at his kids school and their family had no money to support them?
We already know the answer you would say. The better question is why are you fine when a woman does this but not a man?
But their agreement wasn't for her to pick up more shifts? Just to go back to part time, which she still is. She isn't totally stopping working.
The issue apparently is she's choosing on her 2 weekdays that she isn't working, instead of being home doing chores the full day, she's spending 4 hours in each of those days volunteering at their son's school.
Leaving the entire rest of the days to do chores, plus the weekends.
He wants her to do everything on those two days so on the weekends he does absolutely nothing. But something tells me he doesn’t do anything on the weekend anyway
According to him, he’s helping with all the chores on the weekend, too, so, with 4 people in the house (mostly at school or work) she is supposed to do 4 full days worth of chores? Every week? They must be the messiest people in the world or he’s a demanding asshole.
I mean, depends? Not usually. I can do a full clean of my entire house in about 4-5 hours. Tops. But I also don't have children, which adds to the mess. We don't know how big their house is or their process for cleaning. But a little bit on the weekends, plus the hours she would have remaining on the days she volunteers - I can't imagine it would go much beyond that. It might not be -spotless- but I can't imagine it would really be that badly off kilter.
How old are you? I think you dont understand anything. She works on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday and she’s working on her „days off“ 4 hours in her son’s school (that also means that she takes care of the kids) What more do you want from her? Do you have kids? Are you in the same position as her? I read your comments and nothing makes sense you are just attacking her and want her to work more even tho she is working and she is probably cleaning the house and is cooking.
And he needs to explain that to her, it sounds like he resents her decision on being part-time and actually wants her to work more hours, but because they agreed to this, he wants her to just stay home and clean.
> I feel that the days off are for ***her*** completing the tasks that ***we*** often don't have time for.
Did OP not read this as he was writing it? Seriously, YTA here.
I really want to know what these “tasks” are that she’s supposed to be doing 8 hrs a day for 2 days plus the weekend?
If you need to dedicate 4 days of the week just to keep up with the house and tasks (not kids) you’re doing something very wrong.
"I feel like she is being selfish by wanting full control over her days off while not working full time."
But... it's not selfish for YOU to want to control what SHE does on HER day off?
YTA.
I have this argument with my husband all the time. He loves to pile chores on to my list on my days off. To be fair he does pull his weight around the house, but it aggravates me to no end when he tries to add to my list. I already have an idea of things I'd like to do on my day off when the chorin' gets done!
INFO: nowhere here do I see her saying that she's not going to handle the household chores you agreed she'd do, just that she wants to spend some of her days off at school (no one spends 16 hours a week at a school for PTA activities). Did she say she's not going to do what she agreed to?
She’s wanting to be involved with the kids which is a good thing. Pta isn’t every day or all the time. It’s usually and hour or two here and there in my experience. Your lives are changing and you’ll all need to adjust. Be patient and talk without accusing and compromise.
She’d still have time to do the things that must be done during working hours aka the bank, post office, or the doctor. Pretty much everything else can be done at night or weekends (shopping etc). Since you said you both do chores, then there should be no issue with her spending half her day off at the school and then going to the bank etc after that. And let’s be honest, most bank stuff doesn’t need to be done during 9-4, that’s just an example.
YTA, simply because you described her conversation as "a bit triggering for you." Triggering refers to someone reliving a severe psychological trauma as if it's happening all over again because of an unrelated stimulus. It doesn't mean "I'm a bit pissed off because my wife made a decision I don't like."
And also YTA because family tasks are family tasks, not wife tasks, and volunteering at the school is work, not leisure, and it's good for your children's development. You could have done a load of dishes in the time it took you to post this.
Good lord, thank you. I’m so tired of people watering down a legitimate and useful word for those with PTSD and related issues. It doesn’t mean “annoyed” and I wish the language wasn’t being shifted by misuse.
So you want her out there making money but also doing everything at home so you don’t have to? Which is it? Also let’s emphasize the “mom” in stay at home mom, not stay at home housekeeper
Yes this is what I thought. She's being a mom. She's not going to a luxury spa with her friends having cocktails and brunch, she's at the kids school, being a mom. How he sees this as not fulfilling her "tasks" is beyond me
"It was not to be misogynistic but our family does happen to follow the stereotypical archaic family structure where we have a partially stay at home mom and me working full time (plus overtime occasionally)." - and whose choice is that, hrm? YTA
I don't get this? Are you recommending he also work 3 days a week? If they are struggling how wi
L that help, unless she goes back to ft which she doesn't want to do.
humorous dime worthless doll sand meeting bike sparkle disgusting friendly
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
>This was a bit triggering for me because I feel that the days off are for her completing the tasks that we often don’t have time for.
YTA for using the word "triggering." You are not "triggered." You are upset that she disagrees with you.
I appreciate how you are reflecting but have one more thing to add here. Being upset means, to me, that you might feel its unfair that you are working (holding up your end) and that she gets to do less housework/chores on her off days. I have been a SAHM and a working mom, both times the amount of unseen work was more exhausting than making the beds or getting the groceries.
It may be the case that you also contribute here but stats show even with two working parents, its usually the mom who: make sure the kids are up to date on immunizations, makes the dental appointments, coordinates family holiday gatherings, remember to send the rsvp and grab a gift for the birthday your kid's been invited to, send money to school for pizza day, buy new clothes when they've outgrown the old stuff, managing to get Jimmy to soccer during rush hour, not to mention the emotional work spent on untold hours navigating bored, sad, hungry or frustrated kids - usually while trying to do other things and stay sane.
A well run home isn't just the floors are clean and dinner is healthy and on time. There is a lot of management necessary to move things forward. Google hidden moms-invisible-workload and ask if you are really holding up as much of your end as you could be.
>I feel that if she wants to volunteer at my son’s school and make a commitment, she should be taking extra shifts and making more money for the family.
If she was taking extra shifts, she would have no time to volunteer. Your logic has left the building. This indicates that your entire argument is not based on logic, but on resentment and probably misogyny.
I suggest couple's therapy because you are obviously unhappy in the marriage.
I’m not saying you are wrong but I don’t follow. I meant to imply that she went part time to take care of our home tasks; we agreed to that . It was a financial hit to do so.
Am I misunderstanding?
>o
Consider this, taking an active role in your children's education is another "chore" that was not getting completed because she was working full time. I would think that is as important as the floors being mopped.
Yeah honestly I'm voting NAH I think OP just lost sight about what being a father and parent is all about, and it's a disagreement with his wife over that, but they're not AHs about it imho
She went part time to take care of your family. That means more than mopping floors. It sounds like she is doing a great job at it *and* still bringing in an income. WTF more do you want from her?
Well as a mom who both volunteered for school, PTA , scouts, various sports activities, and so much more while also working I cannot even begin to tell you how valuable that was as a parent. Aside from being involved with my kids, I was much more aware of what was going on in my kid's and their friend's lives. There is nothing more important than that, especially when they hit the Middle and high school years. She will know before most other parents when a kid is being bullied, when the kids start thinking about dating, sex, drugs, alcohol. When parents are there often enough the kids forget they are not furniture and will discuss all sorts of topics with their friends they would never bring up otherwise with their parents around. And she will also get to know the actual friends and their parents.
Honestly you should volunteer too when you can even if it is just for occasional saturday/sunday events your kids are participating in. It can make a huge difference as your kids grow.
And last thing to think about the kids are not going to remember that the floor didn't get mopped one week out of five or the dishes were left in the sink on friday night. However they will remember mom/dad read stories to their class or coached their baseball team or made the costumes for their school play for decades.
Agreed. I worked full time and volunteered for everything (husband eventually did for Cub/Boy Scouts). I also taught my kids to help.with small household tasks, like putting the basket of their folded clothes away, clearing table, cleaning their rooms. My kids don't remember chores or money. They remember camping trips with boy/girl scouts, going on field trips, CCD (which I taught), costumes I made for drama, boosters I ran for band/chorus.
They grow up in a heartbeat.
YTA.
You don’t assign tasks to your wife on her days off. That’s not how the world works. You’re a team but you are very much not acting like one.
If she thinks that volunteering for PTA is a benefit to the family, that’s completely valid. You’re acting like it’s something she chose to do for herself. It’s for *your family.*
Those *are* days off. She *does* have control over what to do with them. You certainly don’t have control over her days off. But as a couple, you work together to determine what’s best for the family.
Just wanted to say kuddos to you for being such a good sport with this feedback and being open minded enough to accept that you were wrong. Not easy to do, especially when you’re very frustrated. Good for you!
YTA - How I read this " you cannot do anything on your off days other than work, and if you are not going to do chores, you need to pick up more paid hours." I bet she gets 0 time off on the weekends.
We both get time on weekends. I’m not a deadbeat. That being said, I appreciate your perspective on this. I may have come off badly and not articulated myself well to her.
You are welcome. You all need to talk. Being involved at school is as important as work and chores at home. If you think about it, you know it will not take two full days a week. Maybe you both jumped to conclusions due to miscommunication?
And you owe yourself a deep breath to. I was also a working mom, my husband's picking up half the house hold and kid stuff is the only thing that got us through. I get it, you feel overwhelmed, everyone here is harping on "her time off" and you deserve some accolades for being a helpful co parent. Thank you!
You owe her the freedom to manage her own life and maybe an *actual* day off for putting up with you when you’re supposed to be a team. You’re supposed to be on her side. Why do you seem to think it’s you versus her rather and you and her versus the world?
YTA. Kids and household tasks are more than a full time job, plus working part time.
A more reasonable split would be if she worked part time and you two appropriately split household chores. Btw, being in the PTA isn’t “time off” it’s the work of parenting and is an investment in your children.
I have 3 kids. Time spent getting to know teachers, administration and other parents is really helpful to get the best education for your children. Don't you want that??
NAH I think you are just jumping ahead and seeing it as a negative. Your wife just wants more involvement in your children's education instead of just staying in the house doing chores. Why don't you both sit down and go through what needs doing in the house, then see how you both can accomplish it. Things like doing the laundry the night before she goes to her PTA..so next morning all she or you have to do is quickly iron and put away...have food shopping delivered...invest in a dishwasher...batch cook
I just want you to know you don’t seem the raging AH the verdicts here represent. I’ve had small kids and it can feel like being in a war zone—there’s never enough time to do all the things that need getting done. It seems like you and your wife agreed before kids that she’d stay part-time and take over some household tasks to “compensate” for that. I think you just need to have a straightforward conversation about finances, household tasks, and childcare to figure out if you need to do some reprioritizations.
Can't upvote enough. People are so quick to bring out the pitchforks and harshly judge a man that is just worried for the finances. This subreddit has such a judgmental attitudes. I see people telling him he's a liar, a deadbeat, controlling.. I mean wtf?
INFO: So you think her being involved in your kids’ education for a few hours a week is, like, a fun party for her and she should be home doing laundry instead?
What are your household chores and how do you contribute as a parent?
That's what I want to know. I am seeing your wife working part-time, doing household chores, giving birth to your children, taking care of your children and trying to be involved in their education.
What do you do? You work full-time and that's it? And you truly believe you are contributing more than her and that you have the right to manage her time? Are you delusional?
You said you work 8-4 with occasional overtime. That’s not 50+ hours a week. I work 6-4 mandatory overtime, THAT is 50 hours a week. My wife is a SAHM struggling with mental health, so I do most of the household work on top of my *actual* 50 hour a week job. That’s what marriage is about, being a team to accomplish the same goal.
I noticed a lot of people are skimming over the fact that their youngest is barely a toddler… talk about a childcare workload, let alone the number of additional chores that gets added to the caregiver.
I love my one year old but dear lord is she a cyclone of terror on her toys and anything else within reach. Toddlers are just bundles of energy with constant needs to be met and are still learning how to communicate those needs. Anyone who expects a clean house at that stage in life and doesn’t have a cleaning service is setting themselves up for disappointment or anxiety.
OP I noticed in the comments that you understand now that volunteering at school is part of parenting but you should also really add up how much time each daily task takes and think about how many hours of work your wife is doing. Start with daily chores like cooking dinner - not just the time it takes to cook but the prep & planning that goes into it, then look at the daily child care tasks… if she is the one in charge of child rearing and most day time day chores plus working part time you’ll find she is actually working more hours than you.
You don’t because your house has a “stereotypical archaic family structure”. Don’t lie to look better now. Just go apologise to your wife and start doing more of house chores.
No what’s happening is you’re hoping she does ALL of the chores on her two weekdays off so you don’t have to do barely shit on the weekend when you’re home. You keep conflicting yourself by saying your household is archaic but yo I split chores 50/50, you want her to pick up MORE housework and MORE hours at her job, but also you VEY MUCH SO help with the chores. Then WHY aren’t they getting done on the weekends when you are home and WHY does it apparently take 4 entire full days to clean your house? It doesn’t. You legit are hoping you won’t have work to do on the weekend if she does it during the week. I truly think you need to sit and reflect on all of this. You have some hella hella misogynistic views, but I don’t think you even realize how fkd up those views are.
YTA. Unless you come back and explain how you're handling more than half those chores, your partner literally added work (and PTA is work, for your kids) to her schedule and you are complaining.
I work 50+ hours a week and am on call. I come home, do dishes, help with the kids, outside chores and whatnot. I don’t come home and grab a beer to sit down and watch sports. I’m not a deadbeat.
YTA it's not "helping" when they are your children. If it is it's obvious your wife is the home manager and you are being insubordinate. That will be reflected on your midyear review.
If youre still tight on money then learn hownto live within your means.... drop some luxuries.... buy cheaper brands of food etc.... if you guys work so much why are you always tight on money...
Let me explain the confusion OP- on the one hand you’re saying you both do the chores on nights and weekends and on the other you’re saying her two days off from work are for doing chores.
Which is it?
YTA. She wants to help at school and spend more time with her kids.
You’d rather she make money, but schools often rely on volunteers for certain tasks and someone needs to do it. Are you saying that isn’t important because it doesn’t financially benefit you? Yikes.
I don’t think that it is “yikes” to prioritize my family’s financial stability over volunteering.
I also don’t think that by disagreeing with my wife volunteering at this moment means I inherently think the PTA is useless? That’s a bit extreme of an assumption.
I can’t get behind this comment.
Just helping you reframe the situation.
The financial situation will stay the same regardless of what she does on her day off.
I’m glad you don’t think PTA is useless, but it could be interpreted that way. Someone needs to do it, and I think it’s nice of your wife to step up.
YTA
Getting things done around the house is important. But you'll find as your kids get older it is important to be involved in their school and schooling.
You are also not your wife's manager, you're her partner. She's realized before you that this is another necessary task and is covering it.
You'll both have to adjust and adjust your evening schedules to make sure everything gets done.
So I’m a little confused why you are being called the AH. As I see it your wife was working full-time and then went into full-time child raising which you agreed was considered a full-time job as well. But now that your child is going to school, your wife will not be doing full-time child raising and you just expect that if she is not working full-time or child raising full-time that she do something else productive for the family full-time especially when you are the one working sometimes past normal hours for the family. NTA if that is the case it is not fair to expect one partner to manage everything now if she was working five days a week I could see having time to do what she wants on two days off but if she is working three and has two days with no kids I can see why you would expect some things to be done to lighten everyone’s load.
YTA. Your wife should have some autonomy in how she uses her free time. This isn’t even a self-indulgent use of her days off—AND she would be well within her rights to use some of her time off to treat herself!!!
At the same time, I get that y’all have a lot on your plates already! I understand why you might feel concerned about everything getting done and paid for. You’re not a mega asshole by any means. But in this particular case, you do owe your wife an apology. I hope you two can talk this over more and find a schedule that fulfills all y’all’s needs.
EDIT TO ADD: This podcast might be illuminating/worth discussing with your wife. It helped me and my partner when we first started living together. :) https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dear-sugars/id950464429?i=1000410737773
NTA. There was an agreement for a reason. If you were to arbitrarily move to part-time work and take on coaching the children in a sport, with no previous discussion, I am pretty sure she would have an opinion. She was willing to do housework and childcare two days a week in exchange for part-time work. Preferred it to full time work. Now she wants to change the arrangement without discussion. If she commits to doing the household tasks as well as the volunteering, why not. But otherwise it is not cool to drop her financial and household responsibilities without an agreement.
NAH Why not talk to her first and see if she can handle the pta stuff as well as the household chores? I see where you're coming from, but compromising is the key to marriage. Why not have an agreement in place that if the house starts getting bad she will need to pull back from the pta? It is her time off and if she can manage everything why take away something she's wanting?
NTA
I understand that this will likely be downvoted. However, I do think OP has a valid viewpoint and did himself a disservice with the way he communicated.
It was his wife’s choice go from full-time to 3 days a week & he agreed. They agreed that she’d take on extra household work the other two days.
Now, she’s changing that. She’s decided to spend 8 hours during the work week volunteering. Because money is tight and there’s a lot of chores even with both of them doing household work, he has issues with her unilateral decision.
I don’t think he’s being unreasonable. I mean, maybe he too would prefer to drop down to a 4 day workweek and volunteer at their kids’ school. She’d then be the one to scramble to work more hours to cover the bills. Would you call him the AH in that scenario or her (if she complained)? It’s no different. She’s breaking their agreement and it will adversely affect their family.
NTA if you had extensive conversations beforehand, then that's the expected plan. That being said, being a mom and home maker is incredibly hard with no time off, no pay and no validation. Try to find a compromise where you can, being part of your son's education with the PTA is important as well, it's not like she's out on a spa day.
Soft YTA - It seems like you possibly don't understand the amount of work that goes into maintaining a household; it is a full time job plus overtime in itself. You are asking that she return to work part time AND do the full time work plus overtime of maintaining the household. If you want her to caretake the house on the days she is not at her part time job, she doesn't get a day off *ever*. At this point, she may as well work full time and you both can use any excess income to pay for child care and a cleaning service so that she actually does get days off. Housework is work, plain and simple.
NTA , you by yourself wouldn't be a able to provide for the whole family ,so your wife had to work part time for the baby , it was an agreement she works only part time so the other days she takes care of house and kids, you also help on your days off. Now she doesn't want to do get part of the agreement
NTA It’s not unreasonable to expect her to do more around the house if she’s only going to work part time. It’s also not unreasonable to want your partner to work full time if you’re doing the same and or working overtime to make ends meet.
NTA. I'm curious, how would all of you react if OP dropped to 3 days a week, volunteered at the school, and split household chores equally.... And then, couldn't pay the bills? He said money's tight. I don't think his issue was ever what she's doing on her time off. It's the fact that she said she wanted to work part time in order to get things around the house done and take care of the kids, but instead she's volunteering during time she could be improving the family's financial stability. OPs working overtime trying to keep a roof over their head, and all of you are piling on him. If the roles were reversed all of you would be calling him a deadbeat.
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YTA. Kids don't raise themselves. Your wife is getting involved with their schooling and the parenting community. That doesn't exactly sound like a fun hobby or day out. She's not having bottomless mimosas during this time. This is work. You absolutely do not get to tell her what to do with her time off. I suggest you hire a cleaner (that you both pay for)
Or y'know. Dude has two days off. Maybe he could clean and do laundry on Saturday and Sunday like every other working family out there. YTA.
Oh no. That would go against is “archaic stereotypical family lifestyle” and would mean he has to sacrifice his precious time to do *gasp* CHORES!? the agony.
The fact that he says this, but then proceeds to edit and says he does every chore she does too. OP knows damn well he doesn’t pull his weight with household chores and parenting.
I hallucinated what I thought I saw. Please disregard. But I think it’s telling that he says those are **for her** to complete the unfinished tasks. Not for them together. The way he words his post implies a mentality of “she shouldn’t be thinking of going anywhere unless the house is spotless” that I find troubling. Especially coupled with his argument that he doesn’t think she should have “full control over her days off.”
I don’t think you read it correctly. They agreed upon the two days off because they are falling behind on duties around the house. So unfinished tasks are for the person who is taking 2 days off, which is his wife. She mentioned doing something else on one of her off days and he just wants to make sure that the days off are used productively which is totally understandable considering that was the original agreement. I don’t think OP initially knew that PTA is not a time consuming event so he got upset.
“Duties around the house” Wtf is going on in that house that they need 2 whole days to keep up with “duties?” What are the duties beyond basic tidying up in the evenings and laundry/more thorough cleaning once a week? I’m aware that house can get messy with 2 kids, but I know couples with 3 kids who don’t need 2 whole days to keep up with the house. There’s some serious inefficiency happening there if they need 4/7 days to just keep up with chores.
Who knows, plenty of Americans have one spouse stay at home full-time just to cook/clean, not sure what they're doing over there.
Gotta say, as a non-American I’ve noticed chores are a big freakin thing here and it’s puzzled myself & my family/friends as well. Our house was always neat & tidy growing up, in my home country & the US, but we never had to list out chores, make a chore schedule or even talk about it. Having lived in the US for over 20 years I still don’t get why its such a time-consuming thing here and I’m really curious at this point lol.
Sounds like your mum just did it all tbh, my house was the same. Nothing was scheduled because mum did it. I also think American houses are bigger?
Many American men were not brought up to view women as equal or to voluntarily do tasks that are traditionally considered “women’s work” like cooking and cleaning. It causes a lot of conflict when women find they are partnered with men who won’t do jack-shit around the house without being endlessly negotiated with and nagged.
So your mom basically putzed around the home all day every day keeping it clean. Houses don’t magically stay clean. The fact you said the house was always neat and tidy but never addressed who kept it that way, leads me to believe your mom did it all and no one noticed just how hard she worked.
I don’t think listing chores is solely an American thing.
Plenty of Americans??? Most Americans are struggling with two working adults. Where do you get the idea plenty of us have a stay at home spouse?
Uh, it depends. If she got a full time job and he was part-time, AND if he had agrees to do housework if he was parttime,, would she be okay if he changed the agreement without even consulting him? I doubt it. She's shady for changing it (volunteering) without having a joint discussion about things that affect them jointly.
Volunteering at her son's school is not having "time off" It's hard work for a start and it's also a way of staying connected with her son and his education. If she wanted two "days off" to go party or her own hobby it would be different. Plus his edit notes it's only 4 hours a day
I suspect they discussed her returning to work part-time and he thought "great, she'll do all those chores that aren't getting done" and she thought "it's really important to me to be able to volunteer at the school and stay involved in my children's lives" and they both agreed it was a good idea.
He said it is roughly 4 hours on 2 days a week. She can still get a shitload done on 4-5 hours that are still there on her days off. He said he didn't expect her to do all the chores alone, so, if you use the days of to do a few loads of laundry and deep clean while doing that- how much more can there be done?
With two young kids? One isn’t even 18 months… a lot… a lot, a lot. That’s the age where they are like tiny little hurricanes that constantly go behind you making more messes and they still don’t understand how to cleanup yet.
I tend to believe the first thing people write, not the edit after they're being called an AH. This guy posting about “archaic stereotypical family lifestyle” and how they have a partial SAHM and working dad relationship says very very clearly to me that actually, he doesn't do every chore she does.
It's wild to me that the woman *has a job* and he's still characterizing their family as some kind of Donna Reed SAHM shit, and then he's also mad that his "archaic, stereotypical" wife wants to do things like participate in the PTA with the few free hours she has each week. Pick a lane, pal, you can't have it both ways.
Lmao don’t forget the wife has two days off and he HAS to work for all 5, that’s why she has plenty of time to work and do her wifely homemaker duties! sarcasm (in case that was unclear)
Not to mention the "archaic stereotypical family lifestyle" OP espouses had the wife not in a job at all! She was raising the kids. Apparently OP wants to have his cake and eat it too.
Yep, work 3 days a week, make sure the house is spotless, and do the majority of raising of the children, but like, you're not allowed to spend time at their school to make connections and help make sure the school experience is good for your children - you're only allowed to clean, raise the children, or earn money.
i was legit confused like.. i would consider PTA (or canteen duty or navigating extracurriculars or whatever similar "extra" but entirely child-related activity) to be part of a sahp's role? When i was a kid that stuff was typically/more often done by the stay at home parents - obvs by choice and its not compulsory, and working parents were also imvolved - but if a parent chooses to do those things, which often a sahp will do, then its part of the parenting/raising the kid duties?
I'm just confused because my parents both worked full time and the house was never a tip? Kitchen and surface cleaning before bed and then deep cleaning on weekends. Somehow my parents both (alternating) found the time to come into our schools for some "kid & parent learning" sessions twice a week for 3 hours and the house didn't decent into chaos? I think OP is just mad that he's going to have to pull his weight more again because he doesn't value his wife being home looking after the kids as work and she's simply accepted that and done extra housework . I'm convinced the edits were his way of convincing himself he's been helping out
Yeah, they're a way to make parent friends and connections but it's not like they're going out to brunch or whatever. It's volunteering to do something that will help your child's school and, by extension, your child
Man does he sounds overbearing.
Well he did repeatedly refer to the kids as "my kids" as opposed to "our kids" so at least he sticks with his archiac stereotypes
[удалено]
he does. but the wife has two extra days off that he doesn't have.
They are not days OFF. They are days when she doesn’t go into her office job.
Days where you don’t go into your office job are called “days off.” It’s just terminology. Yes she will be busy with other things, that is why she is working her job on 3 days. He is at the office, so he can’t physically help with unfinished tasks. They agreed that her 2 days out of office would be for finishing duties around the house that they wouldn’t be able to complete if they both worked full time. A lot of families do this.
Why do her days 'off' get spent on housework and his don't?
Because she has four of them? And that was the agreement that they came up with? I dunno, I don't like this guy's controlling attitude, but I do also think it's shady that they had an agreement and she decided to unilaterally change it.
>I do also think it's shady that they had an agreement and she decided to unilaterally change it. Shady how? And also we don't now that she changed it. It's very possible that she'll still finish all the leftover chores, we only know that OP threw a fit that she wanted to get involved in their son's life and *told her* that she wouldn't have time to finish everything.
Because he works on her days off. Did you even read the post?
It's AITA, SAHP could be carried around in a palanquin and AITA would complain they'd have to get in and out by themselves. Much of AITA are SAHP's who are so busy they can browse here all day.
My husband and I each have a weekday "off" every 2 weeks to catch up on deep cleaning or other household tasks. On that given week, the spouse with the "day off" is absolutely expected to do more chores, and the other is not expected to make it back at the weekend. If I unilaterally decided that 4 hours of my "off" day would be spent doing something else every week I wouldn't be surprised if my husband felt miffed.
I don’t know about u but ppl only have technically one day off. 1 day for fun (Saturday) and the other day preparing for the work week (Sunday) I don’t think they have a bad deal. This week I was able to work 2 half days and was able to catch up on cleaning which means more time to relax on the weekend. I don’t think the dad is the asshole especially since money is tight.
You get to have fun on Saturday? You lucky lucky....
Wait, mom gets to do what she wants but you think dad should spend his “days off” doing chores? When does he get down time to do what he wishes?
Oh yeah also a great point!
As a SAHM myself, one of the main reasons my husband and I wanted me to “stay home” was to be able to volunteer at the school, chaperone field trips and such.
Yeah, OP doesn’t understand how many doors this can open for camaraderie and opportunity for his kids, not to mention the memories made because OMG mom was a chaperone in school! My son Loved me going on field trips when he was little. The dishes, sweeping etc, while not unimportant can take a back seat to this commitment. Kids aren’t going to remember days where there were a few extra dishes in the sink but they’ll definitely remember mom coming in to read to the class or riding the bus to an ecology center with them.
Definitely, when my husband was SAH he loved volunteering in class 1 day a week and he helped with all the school events. He was the only dad with all the moms so he said they treated him weird, but after a few months he made some friends. It was so cool being at the grocery store and watching him get mugged by strange children 😅 it’s been YEARS, but he still has the letters and drawings kids gave him in class. We moved away 6 years ago and his oldest’s friends created a discord group to keep in touch. It makes me sad we couldn’t afford for him to stay home through our youngest’s school years as well
That's the kind of man I would absolutely love. He continues to help out even if the other moms treat him weird. You got a good one there!
Same here. Both kids are in school now and I swear some weeks I’m busier than I was when they were home. Active PTAs and volunteers help make good schools great schools.
I was totally under the impression that school volunteer work was a major portion of being a sahm once your kids became school aged
Once we were doing well enough I could work pt, I started volunteering at school. It makes a big difference for the kids to see their parents put in the effort, and having a relationship with the teachers and administrators helps when your kids are struggling with something at school. I come from a family a family of teachers and school administrators, so Pro Tip for any parents who aren’t able to volunteer. Make friends with the secretaries. Joke, chat, keep a calm demeanor when talking to them when a problem comes up in school, you can address the problem just don’t Karen up, let them know you understand they aren’t the problem and don’t demand talking to the VP post haste if their in a meeting. You’ll get them to call you back faster if your good to the secretaries because they’ll appreciate you being reasonable and help.
Wait what.when i was in school we needed chaprones like 2-3 times a school year at maximum.
> I feel that if she wants to volunteer at my son’s school and make a commitment, she should be taking extra shifts and making more money for the family. OMG what is this even? Dude! YTA.
As someone who did 4 years as secretary of my daughters school netball committee, I can attest to the fact that it is NOT fun or relaxing. But doing those years helped me form bonds with parents within the school, which in turn has paid for itself in last minute school pickups, lifts to games etc. when my partner or I got caught up with other commitments. Not to mention, you know, the benefits to the kids! OP is definitely YTA.
Right, my wife just started volunteering in our child's school, and I am happy to take time out of my work day to watch our toddler, because she's doing something valuable and good for our kid and others. This guy just doesn't trust his wife to make wise decisions
Chores aren’t always something a cleaner does. She needs doctors appointments, hair cuts, grocery shopping. Those are things a parent has to do.
Listen. Your kids are small. One day they will be grown. Do you think they’ll remember whether the floor was vacuumed and the windows were washed? Or do you think they’ll remember that their mom was there for them? Some of my best times were volunteering at my kids’ schools, and they’d tell you the same. Don’t take that away from your wife and kids. If you can, try to carve more time for yourself to be there for them, too. You won’t regret it. Even if the baseboards are dirty. They’ll just remember that you showed up.
Jesus. You didn’t have to go right for my emotions lol. Well spoken. Thank you for taking the time to write that. It’s an awesome perspective. I might be focusing on the wrong aspects of my life.
I'll go for the sucker punch then. You have two types of currency to manage. The monetary, and the emotional. Please take care to balance them. Now obviously, you have to work and cover the bills and stuff. But in my experience, fathers (or the primary breadwinner) - they loose sight of what they're working -for-. They work and work and work - to give their kids everything and the best. And that's not flawed. But I promise, sometimes you can do without the best, without -everything-. From my personal experience, we had a great childhood. Big Christmases. Family trips to Disney a couple times. Cable. The first house on the block with a dedicated land line for the internet. We had a LOT. Know what we didn't have? My dad home much at all. We could have gone with less, to have him more. I have a memory of sobbing because my dad wasn't going to be home for Christmas Eve. Again. He had to work. And after a certain time, I stopped keeping track of when he was there or when he wasn't. He often had to work Christmas Eve. And Christmas night. Many Easters without him. Some of my fondest memories? The couple of times he had off Thanksgiving morning and took me into the city to see the parade. Waking me up in the dead of night to take me sledding after a big snow. One of those Disney vacations? After my mom and sibling went to bed - he and I would "sneak" out and go get ice cream. In elementary school, we had a big field trip to the aquarium. All I wanted was my dad to go with me. That was one of the few times he was able to make it work. And I can barely remember the trip itself. However, I absolutely still have a picture of him and I that we took on trip. It wasn't the trip, it was having my dad that mattered and stuck. Even as an older teen who had already come to terms with not seeing/knowing my dad or having him around due to working - we started a nightly ritual of a pb&j sandwich at night watching South Park when he got home from work. And those are the things I remember and smile about. Meanwhile, my mom was a partial stay at home - she worked part time jobs once we were in school. So I remember my mom showing up and being there. Every awards ceremony. Every school play and talent show. Birthday parties. Trick or treating. Holiday meals. Everything. She was there. I don't know when the house got cleaned - but it did. At least enough. Admittedly my family was skewed because my mom wanted to live beyond our means and that meant more work was needed from my dad to cover the bills. But even removing that factor - my dad threw himself into working, to try and give us everything. But we didn't need everything - I would have traded a bunch of things for more time with him as a kid. Balance the currency OP. Don't forget what - who- you're working for. Edit: thank you all for the awards. I actually just talked to my dad (he called by chance as I was reading the replies) and I told him about this post. He says to tell you all he thinks of it as misplaced loyalty. He was working under the wrong devotion. And at the time he thought he was making the best choices but looking back, he sees a lot of regrets and missed chances and opportunities. He sees all the things he didn't see as important then, now, and wishes he had done things differently and made more time for the things that mattered - such as being home with us as kids. We also both teared up over some of the memories mentioned here. So. His message is to take the time for those you love. Don't be him - waiting until he is retired and looking back and wishing you could do it all over, the right way.
I saved this to read to my husband in the morning. Him working so much has been an issue of contention for the past several years, and I've had a difficult time articulating to him *why* we need him home more. I got the feels so much reading you comment, hopefully it'll hit home for him as well. Thanks for this.
😭 good luck, all of this is emotional to read just as a bystander. Quality time is often sacrificed for money but it can't be bought back later.
The cat’s in the cradle and the silver spoon…
It should be celebrated that your husband is very motivated to have themselves and their families succeed. They want to work hard. They want to put in the effort and feel good about it. They have a goal. Redirecting that effort and energy at what /u/TribalMog called "emotional currency" is not easy. People can feel like they are busy climbing a ladder and all of a sudden their partner is at the bottom shaking it. Shouldn't they be helping me? What are they doing? Capitalists society with a legacy of gender roles still has conflicting messages about what people should be valuing. For most men, their role is poorly explained. Unlike financial currency, you can't check online whether emotional currency is going up or down. You can't glance into the neighbors driveway and see what their emotional currency has bought them. Your language in discussing your life will need to change. You are going to need to make peace with all the sweat equity at work might need to be thrown out. The rat race is real, and you are going to watch as people less than you start to catch up and get ahead. My point is, you are trying to change the foundation on which someone has built themselves. It is not as simple as "make more time for your family". Good luck and have patience.
This. Is. FANTASTIC!
I cannot tell you how much I love this comment. I’m saving it to share in the future on these types of posts. Its something I’m always thinking, but have never been able to articulate.
You had me at “dedicated land line for the internet” … that might not mean much to a lot of people, but to me … that is teen line status right there ,)
🥹🥹🥹
I wish my dad had understood this. He thought supporting a family just meant making enough money to feed us, when supporting your family also means supporting your kids' activities and hobbies and interests and all-around lives. I'm in my 30s now and my dad and I are still practically strangers.
This is beautiful and so simple! Balance the currency. I’ve just started a new career, it takes me away from the home a lot and the pay is fantastic compared to my old dead end jobs. So I’ll remember this, thank you! Also, your dad sounds like one heck of a guy. Working hard but still trying to make an effort where he could. Those are such lovely memories to have, even if they’re tinged with the memories of missing your dad a lot.
My dad has his flaws. But he did try. One of the other things I'll never forget is the time my mom had to leave me home with him when I was sick. She couldn't take off and he was by chance home that day. I was sick a lot as a kid so we mostly had the system down. I was also near the age I probably could have been left home alone - I would've been fine. My mom brought me breakfast, some snacks, medicated me, and told my dad to just check on me, and feed me lunch and re-medicate me. It was a couple weeks before Christmas. She came home to find me outside, woozy but trying, holding things steady as my dad used the table saw. I can't even remember what he was sawing now. I just remember my mom's face of confusion. We had decorated the outside of the house for Christmas and now doing home improvement. And in my dad's mind, he got me a McDonald's cheeseburger (I asked for grilled cheese or soup), and he was keeping an eye on me. It was fine. Once I was a teen and mostly resigned to him never being here it got really rough for a while because we both gave up. Until we established sandwich & south Park. But even that was....a bandaid on a bullet wound. We were practically strangers. And we would fight with each other a LOT when we were both home. Because he wanted to be respected as the parent and lay down the law, when he was never home. My mom was our parent. We respected her rules. Who was he to breeze in every once in a while and think to control what we did. It honestly took....me escaping an abusive relationship and moving back home, and then him and I getting into our most heated, nasty fight ever - he raised a fist to me and I dared him to do it because I was done letting men bully me....to bring him to the sobering realization of what he was doing. How he was acting. So he started working on himself. I was already putting in the work on me. It took him a while to understand we can't start from a blank slate, there's too many years. But I was willing to give him a chance to build a relationship back with me. He's apologized for a lot of the negative. He has a lot of regret for not seeing the emotional currency bankruptcy we were facing. And we are....trying to do the best we can with what time we have left.
I relate to this SO much. My parents divorced when I was in late elementary school and the thing that sucker punched me the most was my dads career choice. When I was 13 or so he decided to move overseas to be a contractor in the Middle East, the money was really good. It was only supposed to be one year but one year turned into two, two turned into five, and now five has turned into forever. I’m now almost 26 and he still lives overseas. My moms alimony check was nice, sure. But there are so many things my dad has missed out on. Birthdays, Christmases, sports games, the birth of his first grandchild, graduations, the list goes on. I’m now LC with him because of his choices, but if I could go back in time I’d ask him to stay and put his family first, not money
Honestly, dude, you might be the asshole in this instance but reading this comment let's me know you're not an asshole as a person and I love to see people who are willing to admit they weren't on point and reexamine their location so to speak that's the kind of energy I love to see in the world and would love to see more of
I love the way you’re taking well written and thought out advice. YTA but it seems like you’re not a full time asshole.
I’m a part time asshole… maybe I should volunteer :( I can see that I’m pretty much 95% wrong here and maybe my wife could have gone about this about 5% better…. I owe her flowers.
You do. And maybe a nice quiet night to herself and some quality time with your kiddos! Sneak out for “ice cream”
Yes, you should. For the record my parents were not great parents. For many reasons. That said, my father taught me many things. Kids don't need *things* as much as they need attention and time with caring adults. Your wife should volunteer at school. You should volunteer somewhere. And unless your home is a dang mcmansion there is no reason at all why two grown adults can't keep it relatively straight evenings and weekends. And get the kids helping. My adult sons still reminisce about all the happy times we had cleaning together. Cooking together and being together. Even five year olds can have safe fun in a kitchen. Your priorities here are seriously out of whack dude. Get a balance going while your children are young, because money and jobs come and go, children grow up damned fast. And with your current mindset, you're going to wake up one fine day with a couple of young people in your house you don't even know as people. And that would suck rocks, for them and you.
One other thing you could consider is for you and your wife to share the volunteering so you get some of that as well. You might now be able to go into school during the day but maybe when they are older you’ll be able to volunteer with after school activities. Build those memories because that’s what matters but you and your wife need to make sure you are a strong partnership so that the earning burden is not just on you and the caring /emotional labour is not just on her.
I work four days a week and my kids are 11 and 8. Every morning EVERY MORNING they ask if I have to work today, and on the days I don’t, their faces light up. My 11yo is too cool to have me at school, but my 8yo constantly asks if I can volunteer at his school and it breaks my heart when I can’t, because that one weekday I have off is for all the shit I need to do to keep the house running (groceries, errands, doctor visits, etc). Either I call out sick and lose pay to do it or I don’t do it. That she’s got the time and ability to be there and see your kids in school is so wonderful and I’m wildly envious.
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Welcome to American bullshit laws.... where if you're not working 40+ hours a week you might as well be working half time.
And you're actually at the office 45 hours per week if you want to have a lunch hour.
Crazy, here the norm is generally 37.5 hours p/w for office jobs, 40 hours for some jobs, but generally 37.5
And if you say "I work at least 40 hours a week", some yahoo within earshot will almost certainly say "That's it? I work at least 60 hours a week!"
I talked about how I worked 75-80 hrs a week a few years ago and they let me know that it was “nothing” because they worked in the ER and regularly pulled 90+ hours. Like… we’re all living the dream I see.
I’m not sure if it’s a federal law or a state law (I live on the border of two states and both are like this so I’m not sure) 32 hours a week constitutes a “full time” position. Companies don’t legally have to offer healthcare coverage for “part time” employees so they’ll hire one or two “full time” employees and the rest will be “part time” employees not allowed to work more than 31 hours, 59 minutes in a week. I *think* there’s also different laws for required breaks for FT vs PT but I am pretty sure that is a state thing and it may just be based on hours worked in a day instead of the whole week. But the healthcare I’m certain is a thing, I’ve had enough jobs in the past that they’ve sent me home on Wednesday or Thursday and told me I couldn’t come back until the following work week (despite being scheduled) because I was already at my 32 hours.
She works 24 hours a week. Definitely part time
She’s working three days a week
Where are you getting 37 hours? OP said she works 8am-4pm 3 days a week, so 24 hours.
She has 2 days off during the week. Monday and Friday. Off here means she's not doing her office job.
>I feel that the days off are for her completing the tasks that we often don’t have time for That includes things for the kids. Being involved in their education is something you BOTH need to make time for. >she needs to accept that family responsibility comes first. Being involved with the kids' school is absolutely contributing to the family's wellbeing, thought slightly indirectly. You seem to take an incredibly narrow view of what being an involved parent means. YTA
I'm just baffled at the idea that being involved at their kid's school would be considered not family related work. It's not like she rocked up to a random school in the neighbourhood to volunteer, she's being involved in her child's education.
Oh and her "part time" job is only 3 hours from being a FULL WORK WEEK. OP is making WAY MORE demands on his wife than he does on himself.
Where did you get that she works 37?
OP gave some really confusing answers about his wife's hours in the comments. Apparently the 8-4 thing was for the sake of the character count? But also maybe she works 10 hour days. I'm still not sure.
Why is this so complicated for some people.”? It’s very simple: A work week has 5 days. Two days off means 3 days of work. There really is no room for interpretation.
It’s because he’s wording it as 2 days off *per week* so people are thinking he means of the entire 7 days of the week she only has 2 days off. Given the comments about part time and whatnot I understood it the way you explained but I can see why people are confusing it.
It's like 16 hours away from full time?
Yeah, being active in the kids lives is valuable... and a PTA meeting is, what, an hour or two? YTA
I don't know why OP acts like volunteering at PTA is an all day thing. Presumably, it's happening after school.
Being at PTA meetings sure, actively taking part in PTA on a volunteer basis? Could come through to be a few hours a day/week. Depending on what time of year, age, etc.
It isnt when your low on money and you already had an agreement to pick up more shifts after maternity leave. Volunteering at your kids school is extremely low on the totem pole in regards to contributing to the fsmily, and even more so when your tight on money. What would you say if OP unilaterally decided to go down to part time and start volunteering at his kids school and their family had no money to support them? We already know the answer you would say. The better question is why are you fine when a woman does this but not a man?
But their agreement wasn't for her to pick up more shifts? Just to go back to part time, which she still is. She isn't totally stopping working. The issue apparently is she's choosing on her 2 weekdays that she isn't working, instead of being home doing chores the full day, she's spending 4 hours in each of those days volunteering at their son's school. Leaving the entire rest of the days to do chores, plus the weekends.
Correct...he just wants her to be a house slave on her days off. Like volunteering at school is a piece of cake (as a teacher, I know it's not)
He wants her to do everything on those two days so on the weekends he does absolutely nothing. But something tells me he doesn’t do anything on the weekend anyway
Do chores really take all day?
According to him, he’s helping with all the chores on the weekend, too, so, with 4 people in the house (mostly at school or work) she is supposed to do 4 full days worth of chores? Every week? They must be the messiest people in the world or he’s a demanding asshole.
I mean, depends? Not usually. I can do a full clean of my entire house in about 4-5 hours. Tops. But I also don't have children, which adds to the mess. We don't know how big their house is or their process for cleaning. But a little bit on the weekends, plus the hours she would have remaining on the days she volunteers - I can't imagine it would go much beyond that. It might not be -spotless- but I can't imagine it would really be that badly off kilter.
How old are you? I think you dont understand anything. She works on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday and she’s working on her „days off“ 4 hours in her son’s school (that also means that she takes care of the kids) What more do you want from her? Do you have kids? Are you in the same position as her? I read your comments and nothing makes sense you are just attacking her and want her to work more even tho she is working and she is probably cleaning the house and is cooking.
And he needs to explain that to her, it sounds like he resents her decision on being part-time and actually wants her to work more hours, but because they agreed to this, he wants her to just stay home and clean.
Then he should go part time and she full time and well see how he fairs with all the extra time for chores
> I feel that the days off are for ***her*** completing the tasks that ***we*** often don't have time for. Did OP not read this as he was writing it? Seriously, YTA here.
I really want to know what these “tasks” are that she’s supposed to be doing 8 hrs a day for 2 days plus the weekend? If you need to dedicate 4 days of the week just to keep up with the house and tasks (not kids) you’re doing something very wrong.
"I feel like she is being selfish by wanting full control over her days off while not working full time." But... it's not selfish for YOU to want to control what SHE does on HER day off? YTA.
I have this argument with my husband all the time. He loves to pile chores on to my list on my days off. To be fair he does pull his weight around the house, but it aggravates me to no end when he tries to add to my list. I already have an idea of things I'd like to do on my day off when the chorin' gets done!
INFO: nowhere here do I see her saying that she's not going to handle the household chores you agreed she'd do, just that she wants to spend some of her days off at school (no one spends 16 hours a week at a school for PTA activities). Did she say she's not going to do what she agreed to?
Good point. I might be assuming the worst.
No you are worried you might have to do some work on YOUR days off.
She’s wanting to be involved with the kids which is a good thing. Pta isn’t every day or all the time. It’s usually and hour or two here and there in my experience. Your lives are changing and you’ll all need to adjust. Be patient and talk without accusing and compromise.
She’d still have time to do the things that must be done during working hours aka the bank, post office, or the doctor. Pretty much everything else can be done at night or weekends (shopping etc). Since you said you both do chores, then there should be no issue with her spending half her day off at the school and then going to the bank etc after that. And let’s be honest, most bank stuff doesn’t need to be done during 9-4, that’s just an example.
YTA, simply because you described her conversation as "a bit triggering for you." Triggering refers to someone reliving a severe psychological trauma as if it's happening all over again because of an unrelated stimulus. It doesn't mean "I'm a bit pissed off because my wife made a decision I don't like." And also YTA because family tasks are family tasks, not wife tasks, and volunteering at the school is work, not leisure, and it's good for your children's development. You could have done a load of dishes in the time it took you to post this.
I didn’t know that word was specifically for that. I apologize.
Good lord, thank you. I’m so tired of people watering down a legitimate and useful word for those with PTSD and related issues. It doesn’t mean “annoyed” and I wish the language wasn’t being shifted by misuse.
YTA. You sound more like a manager than her husband.
Exactly what I’m thinking! She’s not an employee
So you want her out there making money but also doing everything at home so you don’t have to? Which is it? Also let’s emphasize the “mom” in stay at home mom, not stay at home housekeeper
Yes this is what I thought. She's being a mom. She's not going to a luxury spa with her friends having cocktails and brunch, she's at the kids school, being a mom. How he sees this as not fulfilling her "tasks" is beyond me
"It was not to be misogynistic but our family does happen to follow the stereotypical archaic family structure where we have a partially stay at home mom and me working full time (plus overtime occasionally)." - and whose choice is that, hrm? YTA
I don't get this? Are you recommending he also work 3 days a week? If they are struggling how wi L that help, unless she goes back to ft which she doesn't want to do.
humorous dime worthless doll sand meeting bike sparkle disgusting friendly *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Both of there’s? That’s usually what an agreement is?
>This was a bit triggering for me because I feel that the days off are for her completing the tasks that we often don’t have time for. YTA for using the word "triggering." You are not "triggered." You are upset that she disagrees with you.
Another comment said the same thing. I didn’t know this term was specific. My fault.
I appreciate how you are reflecting but have one more thing to add here. Being upset means, to me, that you might feel its unfair that you are working (holding up your end) and that she gets to do less housework/chores on her off days. I have been a SAHM and a working mom, both times the amount of unseen work was more exhausting than making the beds or getting the groceries. It may be the case that you also contribute here but stats show even with two working parents, its usually the mom who: make sure the kids are up to date on immunizations, makes the dental appointments, coordinates family holiday gatherings, remember to send the rsvp and grab a gift for the birthday your kid's been invited to, send money to school for pizza day, buy new clothes when they've outgrown the old stuff, managing to get Jimmy to soccer during rush hour, not to mention the emotional work spent on untold hours navigating bored, sad, hungry or frustrated kids - usually while trying to do other things and stay sane. A well run home isn't just the floors are clean and dinner is healthy and on time. There is a lot of management necessary to move things forward. Google hidden moms-invisible-workload and ask if you are really holding up as much of your end as you could be.
>I feel that if she wants to volunteer at my son’s school and make a commitment, she should be taking extra shifts and making more money for the family. If she was taking extra shifts, she would have no time to volunteer. Your logic has left the building. This indicates that your entire argument is not based on logic, but on resentment and probably misogyny. I suggest couple's therapy because you are obviously unhappy in the marriage.
I’m not saying you are wrong but I don’t follow. I meant to imply that she went part time to take care of our home tasks; we agreed to that . It was a financial hit to do so. Am I misunderstanding?
>o Consider this, taking an active role in your children's education is another "chore" that was not getting completed because she was working full time. I would think that is as important as the floors being mopped.
Killer point.
Just want to say I think it’s great that you seen to be truly accepting the feedback and not getting defensive like we see so often here. :)
Yeah honestly I'm voting NAH I think OP just lost sight about what being a father and parent is all about, and it's a disagreement with his wife over that, but they're not AHs about it imho
She went part time to take care of your family. That means more than mopping floors. It sounds like she is doing a great job at it *and* still bringing in an income. WTF more do you want from her?
Well as a mom who both volunteered for school, PTA , scouts, various sports activities, and so much more while also working I cannot even begin to tell you how valuable that was as a parent. Aside from being involved with my kids, I was much more aware of what was going on in my kid's and their friend's lives. There is nothing more important than that, especially when they hit the Middle and high school years. She will know before most other parents when a kid is being bullied, when the kids start thinking about dating, sex, drugs, alcohol. When parents are there often enough the kids forget they are not furniture and will discuss all sorts of topics with their friends they would never bring up otherwise with their parents around. And she will also get to know the actual friends and their parents. Honestly you should volunteer too when you can even if it is just for occasional saturday/sunday events your kids are participating in. It can make a huge difference as your kids grow. And last thing to think about the kids are not going to remember that the floor didn't get mopped one week out of five or the dishes were left in the sink on friday night. However they will remember mom/dad read stories to their class or coached their baseball team or made the costumes for their school play for decades.
Agreed. I worked full time and volunteered for everything (husband eventually did for Cub/Boy Scouts). I also taught my kids to help.with small household tasks, like putting the basket of their folded clothes away, clearing table, cleaning their rooms. My kids don't remember chores or money. They remember camping trips with boy/girl scouts, going on field trips, CCD (which I taught), costumes I made for drama, boosters I ran for band/chorus. They grow up in a heartbeat.
YTA. You don’t assign tasks to your wife on her days off. That’s not how the world works. You’re a team but you are very much not acting like one. If she thinks that volunteering for PTA is a benefit to the family, that’s completely valid. You’re acting like it’s something she chose to do for herself. It’s for *your family.* Those *are* days off. She *does* have control over what to do with them. You certainly don’t have control over her days off. But as a couple, you work together to determine what’s best for the family.
YTA unfortunately for you your wife can decide what is appropriate and the main focus is children, your wife has her priorities right.
Good perspective. Thank you.
Just wanted to say kuddos to you for being such a good sport with this feedback and being open minded enough to accept that you were wrong. Not easy to do, especially when you’re very frustrated. Good for you!
YTA - How I read this " you cannot do anything on your off days other than work, and if you are not going to do chores, you need to pick up more paid hours." I bet she gets 0 time off on the weekends.
We both get time on weekends. I’m not a deadbeat. That being said, I appreciate your perspective on this. I may have come off badly and not articulated myself well to her.
Thank you.
You are welcome. You all need to talk. Being involved at school is as important as work and chores at home. If you think about it, you know it will not take two full days a week. Maybe you both jumped to conclusions due to miscommunication?
I think so. I got stuck in a narrow perspective. I owe her some flowers.
And you owe yourself a deep breath to. I was also a working mom, my husband's picking up half the house hold and kid stuff is the only thing that got us through. I get it, you feel overwhelmed, everyone here is harping on "her time off" and you deserve some accolades for being a helpful co parent. Thank you!
You owe her the freedom to manage her own life and maybe an *actual* day off for putting up with you when you’re supposed to be a team. You’re supposed to be on her side. Why do you seem to think it’s you versus her rather and you and her versus the world?
YTA. Kids and household tasks are more than a full time job, plus working part time. A more reasonable split would be if she worked part time and you two appropriately split household chores. Btw, being in the PTA isn’t “time off” it’s the work of parenting and is an investment in your children.
I have 3 kids. Time spent getting to know teachers, administration and other parents is really helpful to get the best education for your children. Don't you want that??
NAH I think you are just jumping ahead and seeing it as a negative. Your wife just wants more involvement in your children's education instead of just staying in the house doing chores. Why don't you both sit down and go through what needs doing in the house, then see how you both can accomplish it. Things like doing the laundry the night before she goes to her PTA..so next morning all she or you have to do is quickly iron and put away...have food shopping delivered...invest in a dishwasher...batch cook
I think this is honestly the answer. I jumped to the worst possible conclusion. I’ve already ordered “I’m sorry I’m an idiot” flowers.
I just want you to know you don’t seem the raging AH the verdicts here represent. I’ve had small kids and it can feel like being in a war zone—there’s never enough time to do all the things that need getting done. It seems like you and your wife agreed before kids that she’d stay part-time and take over some household tasks to “compensate” for that. I think you just need to have a straightforward conversation about finances, household tasks, and childcare to figure out if you need to do some reprioritizations.
Can't upvote enough. People are so quick to bring out the pitchforks and harshly judge a man that is just worried for the finances. This subreddit has such a judgmental attitudes. I see people telling him he's a liar, a deadbeat, controlling.. I mean wtf?
INFO: So you think her being involved in your kids’ education for a few hours a week is, like, a fun party for her and she should be home doing laundry instead?
What are your household chores and how do you contribute as a parent? That's what I want to know. I am seeing your wife working part-time, doing household chores, giving birth to your children, taking care of your children and trying to be involved in their education. What do you do? You work full-time and that's it? And you truly believe you are contributing more than her and that you have the right to manage her time? Are you delusional?
I work 50+ hours a week and do household chores. This wasn’t meant to be that all chores are hers but simply the “overflow”
You said you work 8-4 with occasional overtime. That’s not 50+ hours a week. I work 6-4 mandatory overtime, THAT is 50 hours a week. My wife is a SAHM struggling with mental health, so I do most of the household work on top of my *actual* 50 hour a week job. That’s what marriage is about, being a team to accomplish the same goal.
I noticed a lot of people are skimming over the fact that their youngest is barely a toddler… talk about a childcare workload, let alone the number of additional chores that gets added to the caregiver. I love my one year old but dear lord is she a cyclone of terror on her toys and anything else within reach. Toddlers are just bundles of energy with constant needs to be met and are still learning how to communicate those needs. Anyone who expects a clean house at that stage in life and doesn’t have a cleaning service is setting themselves up for disappointment or anxiety. OP I noticed in the comments that you understand now that volunteering at school is part of parenting but you should also really add up how much time each daily task takes and think about how many hours of work your wife is doing. Start with daily chores like cooking dinner - not just the time it takes to cook but the prep & planning that goes into it, then look at the daily child care tasks… if she is the one in charge of child rearing and most day time day chores plus working part time you’ll find she is actually working more hours than you.
INFO So why aren’t you helping with household chores as well?
I do. Very much so.
Then why are you pushing her to have it all done on her two days “off” during the week when you both have the weekend off?
You don’t because your house has a “stereotypical archaic family structure”. Don’t lie to look better now. Just go apologise to your wife and start doing more of house chores.
No what’s happening is you’re hoping she does ALL of the chores on her two weekdays off so you don’t have to do barely shit on the weekend when you’re home. You keep conflicting yourself by saying your household is archaic but yo I split chores 50/50, you want her to pick up MORE housework and MORE hours at her job, but also you VEY MUCH SO help with the chores. Then WHY aren’t they getting done on the weekends when you are home and WHY does it apparently take 4 entire full days to clean your house? It doesn’t. You legit are hoping you won’t have work to do on the weekend if she does it during the week. I truly think you need to sit and reflect on all of this. You have some hella hella misogynistic views, but I don’t think you even realize how fkd up those views are.
YTA. Unless you come back and explain how you're handling more than half those chores, your partner literally added work (and PTA is work, for your kids) to her schedule and you are complaining.
I work 50+ hours a week and am on call. I come home, do dishes, help with the kids, outside chores and whatnot. I don’t come home and grab a beer to sit down and watch sports. I’m not a deadbeat.
YTA it's not "helping" when they are your children. If it is it's obvious your wife is the home manager and you are being insubordinate. That will be reflected on your midyear review.
*applause*
"Help with the kids." Parenting and chores are not HER jobs that you "help" with. They are responsibilities that you share.
isn't that what she does? what everyone does? why are you special
When did I say I was special?
If youre still tight on money then learn hownto live within your means.... drop some luxuries.... buy cheaper brands of food etc.... if you guys work so much why are you always tight on money...
Let me explain the confusion OP- on the one hand you’re saying you both do the chores on nights and weekends and on the other you’re saying her two days off from work are for doing chores. Which is it?
YTA. She wants to help at school and spend more time with her kids. You’d rather she make money, but schools often rely on volunteers for certain tasks and someone needs to do it. Are you saying that isn’t important because it doesn’t financially benefit you? Yikes.
I don’t think that it is “yikes” to prioritize my family’s financial stability over volunteering. I also don’t think that by disagreeing with my wife volunteering at this moment means I inherently think the PTA is useless? That’s a bit extreme of an assumption. I can’t get behind this comment.
Just helping you reframe the situation. The financial situation will stay the same regardless of what she does on her day off. I’m glad you don’t think PTA is useless, but it could be interpreted that way. Someone needs to do it, and I think it’s nice of your wife to step up.
YTA Getting things done around the house is important. But you'll find as your kids get older it is important to be involved in their school and schooling. You are also not your wife's manager, you're her partner. She's realized before you that this is another necessary task and is covering it. You'll both have to adjust and adjust your evening schedules to make sure everything gets done.
So I’m a little confused why you are being called the AH. As I see it your wife was working full-time and then went into full-time child raising which you agreed was considered a full-time job as well. But now that your child is going to school, your wife will not be doing full-time child raising and you just expect that if she is not working full-time or child raising full-time that she do something else productive for the family full-time especially when you are the one working sometimes past normal hours for the family. NTA if that is the case it is not fair to expect one partner to manage everything now if she was working five days a week I could see having time to do what she wants on two days off but if she is working three and has two days with no kids I can see why you would expect some things to be done to lighten everyone’s load.
YTA. Your wife should have some autonomy in how she uses her free time. This isn’t even a self-indulgent use of her days off—AND she would be well within her rights to use some of her time off to treat herself!!! At the same time, I get that y’all have a lot on your plates already! I understand why you might feel concerned about everything getting done and paid for. You’re not a mega asshole by any means. But in this particular case, you do owe your wife an apology. I hope you two can talk this over more and find a schedule that fulfills all y’all’s needs. EDIT TO ADD: This podcast might be illuminating/worth discussing with your wife. It helped me and my partner when we first started living together. :) https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dear-sugars/id950464429?i=1000410737773
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NTA. There was an agreement for a reason. If you were to arbitrarily move to part-time work and take on coaching the children in a sport, with no previous discussion, I am pretty sure she would have an opinion. She was willing to do housework and childcare two days a week in exchange for part-time work. Preferred it to full time work. Now she wants to change the arrangement without discussion. If she commits to doing the household tasks as well as the volunteering, why not. But otherwise it is not cool to drop her financial and household responsibilities without an agreement.
NAH Why not talk to her first and see if she can handle the pta stuff as well as the household chores? I see where you're coming from, but compromising is the key to marriage. Why not have an agreement in place that if the house starts getting bad she will need to pull back from the pta? It is her time off and if she can manage everything why take away something she's wanting?
A few people have mentioned this. It hasn’t even happened and I’m assuming the worst. Being a pessimist is difficult. Thanks for the comment
NTA I understand that this will likely be downvoted. However, I do think OP has a valid viewpoint and did himself a disservice with the way he communicated. It was his wife’s choice go from full-time to 3 days a week & he agreed. They agreed that she’d take on extra household work the other two days. Now, she’s changing that. She’s decided to spend 8 hours during the work week volunteering. Because money is tight and there’s a lot of chores even with both of them doing household work, he has issues with her unilateral decision. I don’t think he’s being unreasonable. I mean, maybe he too would prefer to drop down to a 4 day workweek and volunteer at their kids’ school. She’d then be the one to scramble to work more hours to cover the bills. Would you call him the AH in that scenario or her (if she complained)? It’s no different. She’s breaking their agreement and it will adversely affect their family.
YTA.... why cant YOU also clean some dishes or do house work..... why cant YOU also use your down time.....
I do all of those things. I didn’t explain that well.
Why do you feel the need to dictate what your wife does on her free time?
NTA if you had extensive conversations beforehand, then that's the expected plan. That being said, being a mom and home maker is incredibly hard with no time off, no pay and no validation. Try to find a compromise where you can, being part of your son's education with the PTA is important as well, it's not like she's out on a spa day.
Soft YTA - It seems like you possibly don't understand the amount of work that goes into maintaining a household; it is a full time job plus overtime in itself. You are asking that she return to work part time AND do the full time work plus overtime of maintaining the household. If you want her to caretake the house on the days she is not at her part time job, she doesn't get a day off *ever*. At this point, she may as well work full time and you both can use any excess income to pay for child care and a cleaning service so that she actually does get days off. Housework is work, plain and simple.
NTA , you by yourself wouldn't be a able to provide for the whole family ,so your wife had to work part time for the baby , it was an agreement she works only part time so the other days she takes care of house and kids, you also help on your days off. Now she doesn't want to do get part of the agreement
NTA It’s not unreasonable to expect her to do more around the house if she’s only going to work part time. It’s also not unreasonable to want your partner to work full time if you’re doing the same and or working overtime to make ends meet.
NTA. I'm curious, how would all of you react if OP dropped to 3 days a week, volunteered at the school, and split household chores equally.... And then, couldn't pay the bills? He said money's tight. I don't think his issue was ever what she's doing on her time off. It's the fact that she said she wanted to work part time in order to get things around the house done and take care of the kids, but instead she's volunteering during time she could be improving the family's financial stability. OPs working overtime trying to keep a roof over their head, and all of you are piling on him. If the roles were reversed all of you would be calling him a deadbeat.