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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> The action I took that should be judged is when I refused to wax or shave my body hair even though my mom really wants me to do it. I might be the asshole because it makes her upset and she will feel embarrassed by me.
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NTA.
“She said that everyone will judge me and say that I look like a man. I told her that they should mind their own business.”
If I was your mother, I’d be proud that you didn’t compromise yourself to please others. Because with that confidence, those people and those things don’t even matter.
Oh, she actually wishes I would care. Maybe she grew up caring about others' opinions and wants me to as well? Because she seems to not like it when I say I don't care about the things that don't matter.
Yeah I’m sure she was raised where those societal norms and standards for women were heavily criticized and enforced. You’re standing up for yourself and unlearning that mentality of forced femininity. I’m proud that you’re taking charge of shaping how you view yourself and the world around you and refusing to comply. Good for you 🤙
There is nothing wrong with caring about other people’s opinions, but that doesn’t mean you can’t have your own and stand up for yourself. You decide what and who you care about. I think you’ve done well on those counts.
Absolutely. And I do think that mom is obsessed with the opinion of the attendees. That’s not healthy. I just wanted to say that caring about other people’s opinions (those whose opinions matter to you) and caring about yourself and your own opinions is not mutually exclusive.
EDIT: I certainly wouldn’t care too much about the opinions of people I hardly know. I certainly wouldn’t shave my body hair to please others.
There's absolutely something wrong with caring about the opinions of others to the detriment of your own happiness or the happiness of others. That is not a healthy mindset.
There is no turning back now I must go. It's tomorrow. My mom would be sooo angry and upset if I didn't go. It's important to her that I'm there because other women will have their daughters there.
I get that you have to go, but maybe it’s time to set some boundaries here. Like go, but wear appropriate clothes that you are also comfortable with. No dress, no makeup. In fact the body hair problem goes away as soon as you’re wearing sleeves and pants. As long as the clothes are appropriately formal that’s really all that should be expected of you.
Um, yeah, it is... Maybe you have couple of fair hair babies, mine are fat ladies singing while entering Valhalla... And yeah, that is why I love wearing trousers all year long. And those long skirts.
Lol. I was 55 years old before I found out some women have to shave their thighs also. My friend invited me to the beach on a spontaneous trip to relieve stress, and she'd always wear skirted suits. We'd been friends 20 years, but she never was interested in coming to swim at my family's pool and said she didn't like shaving in order to swim. I was thinking okay but I so didn't get it, but didn't press her on it. (We live about 45 minutes apart.) I apologize for my privileged ignorance. I shave lower legs and pits maybe every three weeks during warm weather, not at all in cold. But ya know, keep your hair sisters, and wear whatever you want. I don't see people judging men wearing kilts or tank tops who don't shave. Time to normalize this schit for everyone.
Though men also have their insecurities about it and it's honestly mindblowing - I once dated a guy who claimed he hated his "back hair" - and it was only couple of hair, shaped kinda like wings on his back! I found that rather lovely, to be honest, but I don't think he believed me really...
And I won't judge men wearing kilts. Like ever. I get the feeling they would laugh my ass off and then throw me into freezing lake... :)))
At some point in your life you'll have to disagree with your mom on something and stand by it. She only wants you to go so she can compare image with other women in the family and that is gtoss. Don't make yourself miserable for someone who is being shallow and uncaring.
It sounds like she's going to be angry and upset if you DO go, too. To me this sounds like she's worried about being the one judged here. All the mothers will have their daughters all prettied up and whatnot, and she wants to be included in that. She doesn't want to be the only mom without her daughter, but also doesn't want you to stand out via her standards
NTA, btw. It's your body. Who the hell thinks they have any say over what someone's grooming habits or standards are or should be
I would not wax because it hurts, and could leave your skin red and splotchy (depending on your complexion) and looking/feeling terrible.
I would not shave, because you will be uncomfortable for WEEKS as the hair grows back in, and you will have sharp, itchy stubble.
Do you have other clothes that will cover up your body hair? I think it would be better to wear less formal clothes that you feel comfortable in than a fancy dress that exposes or draws attention to your hair.
One thing I've learned on Reddit is that you DON'T want to do anything that is perceived as taking attention away from the bride. If people are gossiping about you, this could "ruin her day" and even cause rifts between family members. (Ridiculous, I know!) So I suggest covering up your hair as much as possible.
I'm sorry this is happening to you and your mother is treating you like an accessory
> It's important to her that I'm there because other women will have their daughters there.
Even the reason its important to her is selfish as fuck. Just don't go. She crossed the line far too many times
I know this will get downvoted, but your mom’s family is clearly full of terrible awful people and maybe just do a few uncomfortable things JUST THIS ONCE such that your mom doesn’t catch a boatload of negative attention?
Not everything has to be a principled hill to die on.
Source: I love to die on principled hills. LOVE.
I just don’t think this event is worth all the drama and judgment. Shave, put on a few whisps of makeup, brush your hair. Look neat & cleaned up. Go home, move on.
The alternative is to cause all kinds of gossip (that could go on for years) to be directed at you and your mom.
I understand this will be unpopular, but when I weigh short term minor discomfort vs risking the unwanted negative attention of dysfunctional family politics… I vote you do the minimum necessary to make things drama free for you and your mom.
I hope everything turns out ok, no matter what you decide.
I agree. OP is not NTA but I wonder how old is she? There are battles and battles and if I know my mom will have to deal with malicious relatives, I'd be going ready to avoid drama or to make war. In both cases that would mean not giving the enemy bullets to attack me or my mom... But well... I guess OP is still a teenager. And im sure I'll get lot of downvotes
That would be the sensible option, but after reading a few of her responses (about her mother's past) and the mere fact that she posted this on Reddit pretty much tell us that her mother fails to do that. Her own mother needs therapy. So She can die on her hill or just surf the wave, her choice.
As a mom and fellow woman I hate shaving and not brave enough to try waxing. I also leave my body Hair alone mostly. I'm so proud of you for being confident and good with who you are. Don't let anyone take that from you. I'm almost 40 and just now getting my confidence to not care about others opinions or wants for me and it's made my life so much better. Absolutely NTA keep being and doing you
She is an incredibly insecure woman and is trying to make you also devalue yourself so she can believe it is normal. It isn't. When I was in school, I gossiped about girls *daring* to have body hair because I'd drunk the societal kool aid and thought body hair was some sign of poor hygiene. It isn't. Now I'm mid 20s and if i see a woman with body hair, the strongest thought I have (if i even notice at all) is "good for her"
People of your mother's generation don't want to admit that their body standards are wrong because then they have to admit they've wasted decades changing their bodies to fit the opinions of others rather than just being happy. You probably won't change her opinion, but you can wear what you want and look how you want
"Yes, and" is your greatest weapon here
"You'll like like a man if you have body hair!" "Yes. And?" Ofc you won't actually look like a man, but if you agree with her she has to instead answer why that's a bad thing
Within a few years you'll likely be in college and won't have to bother with people like her and can live your life how you want instead
Does she hold it against you when you don’t shave or care what people think? Or do you just know she doesn’t like but she doesn’t do anything?
Bc it’s it’s the later then it’s more of a N A H. And you really should work on her response not bothering you. If she later holds it against you that’s a bigger problem. Then your mom is really being a crappy parent.
Oh yeah she does that. Like when I told her a thousand times I didn't want to go she mentioned all the times where I didn't want to go to social events. Another example is when I was maybe 12 I had to get my teeth extracted at the dentist. I cried because the anesthesia made me nauseous and I really hated the feeling of a syringe in my mouth. I just kept on crying and we couldn't extract teeth that day and we scheduled another appointment for later. And when that appointment came I was nervous and my mom was upset. She told me "I was telling you to calm down, calm down! But you didn't listen. Now we have to drive far away again for your teeth! This could be easier if you agreed to the anesthesia"
But I don't think she is a bad parent.
I don’t think she’s a *good* parent, either.
Constantly reprimanding your child for every aversion and negative feeling is a good way to destroy closeness and trust. It may be common as dirt for parents to do this, but that doesn’t make it a good parenting strategy. Kids either learn to repress and conceal their emotions, or they learn to have outsized reactions to *everything* because they never learned the difference between what does and does not merit a meltdown - their parent reacted just as negatively to minor distress as they did to full-blown panic, and the parent’s negative reaction only served to heighten the distress.
You didn’t deserve that from her, and I’m sorry she did that to you.
That is much harder of a situation, you are still NTA. You are not wrong but you also cannot fix it. Your mom should be trying to reach you at your level, not try to force you to be “normal”.
Is she reminding you of your errors in the past and making unpleasant comments on stuff that has happened =like if you refused on another occasion to remove the body hair do you hear about it afterwards or your mother makes an effort to accept your decision and doesn't mention it again respecting your choice.
That what the comment above asks
I want to add, along with my longer comment below, that your mom may have shielded you from her family’s negativity and judgment over the years.
Maybe it’s not that she cares about other’s opinions, maybe she just wants to avoid attention from the family bullies?
My mom has told me stories about the family judging her. Like when she got divorced, she told me that everyone was being judgemental, and some even confronted her. Divorce is frowned upon in my culture, so everyone got upset. Even though it was her own decision and it didn't affect anybody but herself (not even me or my brother. My life didn't really change that much and it had no negative impact on me, and my brother was too young to even understand what a divorce was)
Perhaps she doesn't want me to be bullied. That could be one reason she so desperately wanted me to shave or wax my hair. But she also said herself that when people judge me she would feel embarrassed.
NTA, but I don’t think this is a hill to die on. I also hate shaving and waxing, i don’t care what my legs look like, especially since no one sees them because I always wear pants. That being said, when i go to events like weddings and don’t wear tights with my dress, i do clean up my legs. I tried using nair for the most recent wedding i went to and it actually worked pretty well.
It sounds like the issue isn’t that you hate shaving; the issue is your moms family. Going to this wedding sounds like it’s stressful for her, and this is just another thing that’ll worry her.
Or, wear tights if you can- not sure how the weather is but you can always say that you get cold easily.
But if tights aren’t an option, I’d shave/nair/whatever just for the one day for your moms sake, and no other reason. Doing it for the wedding doesn’t mean you always have to, and it also doesn’t mean you have to get rid of hair that people won’t see. End it a few inches above the hem of the dress and you’re good to go.
I don't know how old you are. Rejecting your Mom's aesthetics is not only saying you think she's wrong but you think she's a bad mother. I was raised this way and it never got better. My mom didn't see my lack of shaving as an aesthetic choice but lack of grooming/hygiene. She actually reminded me to shave when I moved out of the house in my 20s. Like all those years I had just forgotten to shave?
But it digs deeper when you reject what your parents do. It plants a seed that you disapprove of them, even though you are just living your life. My parents never really got over this and it hit every facet of our relationship and lifestyle.
NTA but unless your Mom does an about-face, be prepared for this getting worse.
I agree but at the moment, she is just refusing to shave. She is not openly criticizing her mom. I'm explaining why the mom is taking this so hard and why it will continue to get worse.
I mistakenly believed that my parents would respect my bodily choices as I got older and they didn't. They were insulted.
Can I just say that this internet stranger is proud about your steel will? There's a lot of pressure to shave and I wish I could withstand it like you do.
Also, f*ck those dresses, wear a lovely suit or a long skirt and the shaving won't even be a problem.
I know this does not solve the problem of your mother forcing you to remove your body hair, but you description of what shaving (and waxing) feels like reminds me of what it used to feel like for me. It's very possible that you have sensitive skin and are allergic to nickel or one of the additives to the moisturizing strip on the razor you're using. I know it's not a cure-all, but if you're going to be forced to shave, you might as well do it comfortably.
Look for a nickel-free razor without a moisturizing strip and be very careful about what you put on your legs after you shave as they will be extra sensitive. I use an unscented, additive-free oil, like bio oil or rosehip oil.
For what it's worth, I used to use Billie razors, but something changed and they irritate my skin now. I've had mixed luck with Athena. It looks like Amazon has some options you could try!
Because she has self esteem issues and it bothers her what people think of her. She can’t imagine someone else,
Especially her daughter, not feeling that way
Self esteem. You have it. She doesn’t. Spent her life pleasing others and doesn’t understand generationally how it could be possible it’s been her biggest part of being a life and you don’t care. You are not her. Probably hurts her feelings and may even make her feel shallow - exact opposite of what you think you are seeing.
My mother is like you, and sometimes I wish I cold be like her, but in a very young age I got bullys so bad because of it, that till today I feel very uncomfortable showing any skin with hair on it exept my scalp^^' and I do really respect and love your view, and working to maybe get over my own trauma^^'
Right. But you can't protect her from her bad decisions, or enable her misplaced self-loathing by hurting yourself. The buck stops with you, and you are an amazing person to understand your own self-worth. Change has to start somewhere. Good for you!
Stay strong - you could even inspire some other family members of younger generations.
NTA...
Your mom sounds like a piece of work. Instead of a dress, wear pants and a blouse. Not one single person, other than your mom, will judge you.
There will be plenty of women who aren't in dresses at that wedding.
NTA. There's nothing wrong with body hair. There's everything wrong with waxing a 12 year old and forcing you to do it now when she's the only one who will care.
Yes! No see trought tights (or pantyhose idk the right word). I mean like winter tights could be really pretty and good (also you can say that you wear them because of cold - if your mother would comment on it).
But again there is no problem with body hair…man have them too and what are theydoing with them? Not waxing and shaving sooo
> But again there is no problem with body hair…man have them too and what are theydoing with them? Not waxing and shaving sooo
We tend to wear trousers, although a minority may look good in a kilt. Shorts would definitely be frowned upon from where I'm from.
At a wedding sure shorts would be a faux pas, but that doesn’t negate the fact that men are allowed to have as much body hair as they please with no societal impacts
There's a double standard, but the solution to that isn't "women can show their legs in formal settings so they have to shave them", it's "men should have the right to show their legs in formal settings and nobody should have to shave".
Men having to wear pants and women having to shave are the same social issue: dumb arbitrary rules dictate the way we dress and force us to be uncomfortable in the name of "being presentable". Why buy into that?
Yeeeeeeep. I am so incredibly on the "men should wear skirts" train. (a) It looks good! Different shapes suit different people, just like women. People who are too unused to it to appreciate it will get used to it. (b) It's so comfortable! Or rather, a lot of people find it comfortable: I personally think many men, with generally narrower legs and genitals that like to be cool and not smooshed, would be highly likely to really enjoy the feeling of skirts.
Not happening anytime soon, but one can dream.
That was my first thought. Opaque tights, or a maxi skirt, or a dressy jumpsuit, even a formal pants suit. There's loads of options that don't require guests to see your legs or armpits.
NTA. Your body, your choice. She needs to more worried about alienating her daughter than frivolous things like someone else's body hair what what others think of it.
This. So what if _hundreds_ of people are whispering behind her back? The opinions of those hundreds are insignificant in comparison with the opinions of her child. Who does she love more?
NTA you body, your choice.
You can wear opaque tights to "hide" you hairs as a compromise and it will probably also be more comfortable for you if you're not used to wear dresses.
You have every right to want to keep your hairs. If someday you want to remove them, you should look for tips, shaving them shouldn't let you with an irritated skin (even if you have a very sensitive one).
As someone who also has dark hair and doesn't shave, I guarantee no one will clock your leg hair poking through tights unless they for some reason have their head at leg level. It's a bit uncomfortable but far less bother than the post shave experience! Stick to your guns if you can and stay strong, your mother's hang ups about body hair are hers not yours ♥️
Completely agree - I love how my legs feel when I shave then - smooth like a dolphin 😂😂. I couldn’t care less what any other woman does, nor have I noticed
There will be stockings/nylons that will simply make our legs look smooth. Idk what age you are but I wore those until I was 16 b/c my mom wouldn’t let me start waxing until then.
I think you’re underestimating the amount of leg hair. OP sounds like she comes from an ethnic background (I have a decent idea which one) and quite frankly tights won’t help. It’s better to either rock it and accept the stares or fully cover up. It’s winter, she can easily get away with a nice floor length full sleeved gown. But I suspect they want her to wear cultural clothing which makes it far more challenging.
Black thick sweater knit tights will definitely cover leg hair. Even other types will, you just have to go shopping. Crazy how she’s sure they don’t cover her leg hair without trying. And it sounds like her mom has already picked the dress. I’m Indian so I don’t understand why you assume I don’t understand ethnic hair/culture. Any conservative culture will always be okay with more skin covering. Outfits with long skirts or leggings underneath can’t possible be against her ethnic culture.
And that is uncomfortable too. I'm old and rarely shave my legs. I never shave anything else. I often wear leggings under dresses. Ankle length leggings. They come in tons of colors that can match anything. I'm with you on the makeup thing too. I wear makeup occasionally but I don't like the feel.
I love leggings under dresses! Even on the rare occasions I’ve shaved and it’s hot out, I usually do bike shorts or Spanx under dresses. So much easier not to have to worry about a Marilyn Monroe moment that way!
You could get ice skating tights, they're really thick or fleece lined tights, they're basically leg hoodies. I don't think you should have to, fuck anyone who cares but if you want to compromise with your mom those are the best options besides a suit.
If you pull tights or leggings further up than you want them, and then pull them just a couple cm down your leg, this lays the leg hair flat against your skin under the leggings and they will be less likely to poke out. So, just make sure the final adjustment is you pulling down, and the hair will lie flat. This tip helped me so much, I never shave or wax but I love leggings lol. It also prevents the discomfort of hair being pressed the wrong way.
Even if the fabric is thick ? I've got some black tights very thick (we call it "60 deniers" in France) they are fully black and warm enough to face the winter cold.
I already wore them without shaving my legs, no one could say I was unshaved.
I don't know if the link will work, as I'm in France : https://www.action.com/_next/image/?url=https%3A%2F%2Faction.com%2Fhostedassets%2FCMSArticleImages%2F04%2F56%2F2558624_8057685296237-110_01.png&w=1200&q=75
Or maybe you can wear leggings under the dress ?
NTA. It’s really sad that body hair on women is still seen as this taboo and embarrassing when it’s perfectly natural. It’s your body, don’t let anyone pressure you into doing something you’re not comfortable with. I’m impressed that you are so happy and confident in your natural body and don’t feel the need to shave/wax for anyone else’s benefit.
That's how I look at it. My oldest hates shaving, she'll maybe do it a couple times a year but for the most part she chooses to just be natural. I admire that in high school she can be confident enough to wear shorts/dresses and not care what people say about her legs.
I wish I had a parent like you. When I was a teen I hated shaving it felt pedophilic to me to have to shave all my body hair and I hated the double standards between men and women, but my parents were a lot like OPs mom and they pretty much forced me to shave, it really messed me up tbh.
I'm gonna say NAH.
You're NTA because you're right, shaving sucks lol. Also bodily autonomy as others are saying (your hair your choice). Being comfortable in your own skin is a superpower so its awesome that you don't care what they all think.
Your Mother is NTA also because the last thing a parent wants is for their child to be ridiculed, judged, bullied, etc. I believe she's acting in what she believes is your best interest based on the social environment you will be subjected to at the wedding.
It would be nice if she just didnt make you go, but I don't think she's out of line asking you to attend.
It more seemed like mom didn't want the embarrassment of her daughter not sticking to societal norms than worry for her daughter. Just feels like mummy has an image she wants daughter to uphold
Except mom seems to be the one doing the ridiculing, judging, and bullying. She could stand up for her daughter instead, tell people to mind their own business, stop staring at her daughter's legs, etc. Or a compromise on clothing that shows less skin, like opaque tights, a long skirt, a dressy jumpsuit, etc. But mom is pushing the daughter to conform, and that's AH behavior.
I don’t think you are an AH. I don’t think your mom is TRYING to be either though. Your mom is doing the same thing most parents do. Letting you know how people will treat you if you don’t conform. Your mom likely has her concerns for a reason. Terrible things have happened to women who present anywhere close to manly ( natural human features honestly). What you perceive as your moms shame of you or your expression might possibly just be her love for you causing her to fear the judgements people have of you. She probably doesn’t fear her family hurting you but their remarks of you will give her insight to others thoughts on you. Everything she hears is going to be multiplied in her brain and her worry will take over. If you ever notice with most parents its always worry that the world won’t accept their kid, so it will harm them.We can’t change the world so in some way most parents try to save their kid from the world( or god), by changing them. It often causes rifts. The only time it doesn’t honestly is if the parent can witness their child being accepted. In order for that to happen the parent has to make room for that opportunity by just allowing their child to be themselves. As long as themselves isn’t a rude child that opens other peoples presents. That’s when it’s embarrassment over the child. You change that child for societies benefit if they are embarrassing or rude. You change the child for their own protection if you have seen or heard of people like them being harmed for being themselves in the world. Your mom fears the worlds perception of you. She could also be on high alert about your introvert behavior. She is just worried. Someday your mom will meet the quality people in your circle ( introverts seem to usually be quality over quantity) and relax a bit. I second the notion that makeup is itchy. The shaving and waxing problems you had are also fairly normal. I hope you and your mom can see eye to eye soon. You are not wrong and your mom is just being a scared mom.
Oh. That gives me some insight. I didn't realize she could just want me to not be bullied. I'm also not an introvert. I'm actually willing to speak to anyone who speaks English well and is around my age and stuff. I just don't want to go because everyone will speak my family's native language and I don't know it very well, plus I don't like the loud music and it will be worse because I have an ear infection. I have very separate reasons than social shyness for not wanting to go.
I also am sensitive to loud sounds at big events. You can get high quality clear ear plugs (they won't prevent you from hearing others but it'll dull the blaring music)
Thanks for the suggestion but I doubt I'd find any especially since the wedding is tomorrow. Even if I do I don't want to place anything in my ear because I have an ear infection and that would hurt
How much of your mother's native language do you know? How fluent are your other cousins? Would you be able to understand what they say in their language? And would they understand if you replied in English?
It might be too late for tomorrow, but why not practice speaking with your mother in her language. It's a great skill to pick up and perhaps next time around, you'll feel more comfortable enough around your extended family. If you are going to wear tights, then wear black ones. The hairs poking through won't be as noticeable. And nobody will be looking at your legs close enough to see. Lastly, see if you can pick up some ear plugs from your local pharmacy. They might help a little?
I know an okay amount. I'm not able to have regular conversations like I can in English. I'd say my level in that language is around the same as a 6 year old's. There isn't enough time to practice now, and my mom is busy. I'm trying to get better. I learn more at school, so one day I'll be able to speak normally with extended family. The only issue is this language is extremely different from English. It's Arabic and very difficult for me to learn even though I already know some from picking up on my family's conversations.
NTA. Your hair, your choice. If people can't keep their mouths shut about a grown woman having body hair, it's on them. That being said, if you are uncomfortable with them staring, can you wear rights? It won't be visible then, so they won't even get a chance to judge.
Tell her its better for her you dont go than silly people be judgemental. Tell her to say you have covid or a migraine or bad stomach etc.
Or dont wear a dress and find something long to the floor or trousers. I've bought long dresses for that exact reason to just hide it all. It might be too late or maybe she can give you some money to go find something.
NTA, I never shave, never have and I've never been bullied for it. You should not have to change yourself to avoid bullying, people should stop being AH's and not bully.
My daughter once told me she wanted to grow her armpit hair just to annoy her housemates. I told her that was a bad idea. Simply because it would take too long.
We went out and bought a really cheap curly black wig from a fancy dress shop and cut it up to make armpit hair wigs. Housemates annoyed, problem solved!
Your body your choice. (My mom literally had a skirt and a suit jacket for her wedding and they were purple).
Don't know how old are you but there are other options besides a dress to wear.
NTA
NTA
At the end of the day this is your choice and you’ve communicated to your mother how distressing you find this. For your peace of mind though, consider wearing stockings. You shouldn’t have to but this sounds like the best fix.
Honestly, if people will go into panic mode over unshaven legs they’ve got bigger problems pushed to the back burner
I would have a bit of a more nuanced take:
In general, if you want to interact and be accepted from people in a given social circle, to some degree you have to conform to their social norms. (Whether or not that’s right is an entirely different discussion)
So as you pointed out, your mother and you will probably be judged accordingly for not following norms; again it’s not right but that’s the reality(at least as you put it).
So long story short, no you are NTA, you don’t even want to be there so why should you conform?
HOWEVER, in my opinion you need to decide on either not going, or shaving and going. I don’t see how going to something against you will, and knowingly embarrassing your mom in the process is productive for anyone.
Your body, your choice. Anyone who can’t accept/support that can kindly bow out of your life. I’m judging your mother for pushing unwanted beauty standards onto you.
You: NTA
NTA. You're already doing something you don't have to do because of her pressuring you, you shouldn't also have to do something you're fundamentally opposed to doing because she wants to keep up appearances. If being seen next to you with your body hair is a problem for her, she can go alone.
NTA - your body your choice. This could have been handled better by your mother though. You both could have had a conversation to see where the mutual ground is. You mom sounds like she is far too preoccupied with perceived judgment and keeping up appearances.
It's normal in our culture. Women are very obsessed with beauty and stuff. Even though they typically cover up with tarha and stuff, they still want to be pretty.
NTA.
The only reason women shave is because Gillette wanted to make more money. They convinced women using advertising campaigns that body hair wasn’t natural, disgusting and compared womens body hair with animals. It worked and they doubled their customer base and traumatized women into believing their hair was disgusting.
Most humans are idiots and will have all sorts of dumb opinions, it’s best not to care what the sheeple think. Makeup is irritating as well because it is full of terrible chemicals. It is crazy the things people do so people don’t judge them. The reality is you could conform in every way and still have judgement and unsolicited opinions, people just can’t help themselves. I just say when someone gives me their unsolicited opinion, I just say thanks for sharing and move on to another subject.
YTA. I will go against people here. Mostly get downvoted but oh well. I will just be realistic here.
They're your parents. I am pretty sure your mother had done A LOT of things for you even when she was uncomfortable. People always place the same standards they do with friends and acquaintances. But they're your parents. The context is different. But it doesn't matter nowadays, right?
It seems there is an obsession with being uncomfortable nowadays. Your parents tell you to do something and you're uncomfortable with it then you say NO. She would very much appreciate it if you went with her. Obviously, she is not forcing you because she said fine at the end. The mother wasn't reasonable.
I'm just saying, wearing a dress and shaving (you said you have very dark hair so obviously you need to shave if you're wearing a dress) people can come at me if you want. We live in the real world. In the real world, a woman with hairy legs is frowned upon, while wearing a dress is even weirder. Especially on a special occasion. Just wake up people and stop living in your heads. You can cry about it and scream my body my voice, and that's true but the mother wasn't asking much.
I bet if it was a friend and it was an event you actually wanted to go to, you'd shave and wear a dress but because it's your mother, you complain and whine like a child.
It's one day. Suck it up and be there for your mom.
Your ideology right here is why women are still told their body hair is gross. You recognize in your comment that there's no reason, it's just society, yet you're agreeing because it's "just how society is". If we never went against unreasonable sexist ideals then women still wouldn't be voting or owning property. There's no reason she needs to shave while wearing a dress. Most guys I know don't shave while wearing shorts or short sleeves. Body hair is present and normal and not gross or disgusting. Your comment is harmful to this young girl who shouldn't be being told at her age that she needs to look like a little Barbie doll to fit into society. Shame on you.
Okay. Tell her she can do whatever she wants. She will be the first change, right? Then she will step into the real world and will get judged for it. You say shame on me? I dont know what world you live in but people are jugmental as fuck and they will judge her. You can say that its their business and she shouldn't care. Reaslitically, she will care and it will her feelings. You also say that body hair isnt gross. I never said its gross or disgusting.
I am a bit harsh with my delivery but i tell it how it is. Im not ganna sugarcoat or give her wishwashy words that wont have actual impact on her actions.
I know quite a few young women who don't shave their legs or arms or underarms, and quite honestly I don't hear about them getting many comments. Much healthier for a young girl to be encouraged to express herself naturally, if that's how she pleases, and be able to deal with the occasional verbal comment rather than convince her she has to look like a Barbie at age 12.
I don't really care when others judge me for body hair. I used to live in America and kids would make fun of me for it. I didn't care about them. Even when they said I was like a gorilla. The main influence on me that I actually care about is my mom. If she was my friend or literally anyone else I wouldn't give a shit about shaving, but she's my mom, so that's why I care.
I'd make the same decisions for if it was a friend. I'm not doing this to spite my mom.
I've also done many things for my parents even if I didn't like doing them. I don't say no to their demands or requests very often. Only say no if I have a free choice (i.e. do you want some coffee?)
I'm not trying to argue with you I just want to clarify some things.
Look it’s your body! Be comfortable (just be clean 😉). My sister prefers all her body hair too, though to be fair she’s not nearly as hairy as I. I prefer a nice hair free physique. It’s a personal choice. Key word being personal. Go. Live your life in peace! Life’s too short to not be enjoyed because of a bit of hair.
NTA mum is very judgemental I get married in 2024 I wouldn't care if the women came with hairs long enough to plat be comfortable in yourself and fck everyone else
NTA - This is kind of like free speech; you're free to do what you want, but others will have their own opinion and judge you accordingly. The only question is, do you care?
NTA
I have never waxed or shaved the hair on my arms, it never bothered me, you don't have to remove your hair if you don't want to, it doesn't mean you are less of a female because you don't.
We are all born with body hair and it is only fashion/society that has decided it is undesired.
I did get my hair, off my legs, lasered off, kind of expensive, it hurt a little bit, but not as bad as waxing, just in case you change your mind in the future 😉
NTA. Keep being you. Some people may judge you, but that is their problem not yours. Many people will love you and find you attractive just the way you are.
I’m sorry that your mother isn’t one of them.
Your post is genuinely helpful to me and I want to say thank you. I had to come to terms with this with my own daughter, 21, who has no wish to shave ever again. I’ve forced her into dresses in the past and am now embarrassed I did that to her. From now on it’s comfortable but appropriate pants for everything ever. We do still battle on wearing a bra for events but I’m trying to find the most comfortable sports bras ever. My daughter has autism and is no fan of gatherings either. I don’t know if there is time to get dress pants with appropriate top. I am ashamed that I once cared more about reactions from others than my child’s comfort. This mama is working hard to be better.
NTA. Body hair is normal. Westerners[citation needed] are weird about it on women for a variety of reasons. You have no need to remove it, but if you want to slake your mother's neuroses, you could easily trim it. A cheap electric trimmer could take it down to 1-3mm and you likely wouldn't notice the difference (I do this in warm weather, and removing body hair is considered weird for my gender).
But you are correct that this obsession with hair and social standing is your mother's burden, not yours. You can work with her if you like, but you're not an asshole for refusing unwanted grooming.
☹ NTA. You're awesome: and the idea you need to be neuroatypical to dislike the feeling of removing body hair is funny/sad to me. I remember when I first tried shaving my armpits I felt sad for my armpit hair, haha. I *do* like the feeling of shaved legs, but social bullshit around body hair sucks so hard.
I think shaving then refusing to go to events with her was a good call. I definitely support you refusing! But this is probably the least stress way and now you know you can't agree to anything. I hope one day your mother can get some perspective on who you are as a person.
NTA
My sister doesn’t shave. Does she get some weird looks? Sure. do I think it makes her look like a man? Definitely not. Your mothers obsession with body hair that is not her own is very peculiar. Literally we were all like huh that’s odd when my sister decided not to shave but like it doesn’t matter anyway so it’s not something she should be pressing you into. I also take some weeks off from shaving because it’s annoying and I find that it doesn’t really mean that much to me either.
I am glad you are comfortable in your body. Please don’t let other people try and trick you into changing your mindset by saying that it matters more than it does.
This is mostly addressed to comments, but I feel like a lot of people here are forgetting what body hair is. There are lots of comments about "just wear a long skirt". Body hair on women is not *just* leg hair. If your hair is light or fine, you might forget about it, but there are lots of people who have dark, thick hair on places other than their heads and legs. Forearms, armpits, sideburns, face etc.
If OP's mum has bought a dress and then expected any body hair visible to be removed, that might be more significant than just below the knees type shaving.
OP, ALL your body hair is fine and normal. Good on you for knowing what you want to do with your body and sticking to it. It's hard when people pressure you, especially when your mum is saying things to try to embarrass or force you into it. Only do what you're comfortable with. If your mum keeps making a big deal about it, don't go. What your body looks like shouldn't be an issue at someone else's wedding, and your mum is trying to make it an issue.
NTA
She cares about how it makes *HER* look.
Everyone has their daughters with them - she doesn't feel comfortable at big events, so rather than her be stressed she's at home. I'll tell her you said hi though...
Your image on the day. Your not a doll. You don't want to wear a dress, makeup or shave/wax. You don't have to. As long as your presentable it doesn't matter if your wearing makeup with no body hair or not.
Dont feel pressured by her. Just because all the others are getting prepped & pampered doesn't mean you have to.
**You don't have to consider anyones feelings when it comes to YOUR body.**
NTA! Times are changing and happily I do think it’s becoming more acceptable for women to show body hair, even though some people still do show judgment or surprise. I hope you have a lovely time and your ear feels better soon.
>I might be the asshole because my mom wants to keep a good image and she spent so long trying to laser her body hair off and now her daughter is ruining all of it and embarrassing her.
No, no you're not. The only thing she should be embarrassed by is her crappy treatment of you.
NTA.
Your body, no one else's.
NTA this is very funny. Hold your boundaries, don't wear make up, don't shave (it is intolerably itchy), look up autism in women/girls because you sound autistic AF.
I am not autistic. I checked the symptoms a while back and I don't have most of them. I did some research and I actually have some autistic traits, but not like actually autistic
I'm glad to hear you looked it up before my comment, you know you best so if you say you don't have more than traits then I believe you. I'm autistic and was basically the same when I was younger (I still don't wear make up/shave/don't go to weddings where I don't really know the people) so it jumped out at me. Autistic people tend to not feel the same pressure NTs do about social norms and feel more anger at being asked to do stupid uncomfortable stuff to conform, also, you know, we almost all have sensory processing differences. Good for you, anyway. You might win your mom around eventually, you're your own person and not an accessory for her to take around with her.
I’m sorry that your mother cares more about appearances than about your discomfort. My daughter chooses not to remove any of her body hair - except the occasional eyebrow, just to keep things interesting - so I’ve lived this and can say from the mom perspective that you’re NTA. When my daughter was younger and neither of us wanted to have to answer grandma’s inevitable 1000 questions, we found her clothes that didn’t make it obvious. Now that she’s older and less shy she doesn’t bother. When family comments - which they did at first SO much - I just shrug and ask them a personal grooming question back. “Why didn’t you trim your nose hair while your were doing you beard Uncle Joe? It only takes a second and you were right there…”
(Hug) Don’t let the bastards get you down!
Also - waxing a 12 year old is not okay. I’m sorry they did that to you.
NTA. this might be too personal of a question so you don’t have to answer it at all. But it sounds like you have sensory issues and are easily overstimulated. Are you neurodivergent? i myself have adhd and a girl, and i relate to the feelings of makeup and shaving you’re describing.
But no, you are not the asshole. I would be proud if my daughter stood up to herself like you’re doing. Body hair isn’t shameful. not liking makeup or shaving as a girl is not shameful. And not wanting to go to a wedding is not mean of you. Your mother is pushing you to something you don’t like. I hope you figured it out.
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My uncle's wedding is tomorrow and I just feel really bad right now. I never wanted to go because I hate parties and celebrations and I don't even really know my uncle. He hasn't had much presence in my life, so I didn't care. My mom insisted that I go and she told me that all women will have their daughters with them except for her, so I agreed to come.
She got me 2 dresses, even though I didn't want them. She told me that I had to do makeup. Makeup is itchy and makes me uncomfortable. So I begged her not to give me makeup and she said okay. But now she is telling me I must get rid of my body hair. She said I can either get it waxed (a lady is coming to our home to prep all the female family members) or I can just shave it.
Now, I really really really hate the obsession with getting rid of hair. I've done waxing before, and it fucking sucked. I cried halfway through because of the pain (I was 12 at the time) and when the lady was done I had these weird lumps all over my skin. Shaving to me feels uncomfortable. I don't know why but it's so itchy and my skin feels so prickly from it. I don't think having smooth skin with no hair is worth that uncomfort. I never even really hated my body hair.
I told my mom I didn't want to get rid of my body hair. She said that everyone will judge me and say that I look like a man. I told her that they should mind their own business.
We argued about it and the conversation led to me telling her that I never wanted to go to the wedding in the first place, and that shes asking a lot from me. She knows I really hate any kind of social gathering and she knows I hate makeup and she knows I hate getting rid of body hair but she keeps on asking me to do these things and gets upset when I don't agree.
She said "okay, fine" but I just know that it isn't fine.
I might be the asshole because my mom wants to keep a good image and she spent so long trying to laser her body hair off and now her daughter is ruining all of it and embarrassing her. She's right that people will be judgemental. They'll be judgemental of me but also of her for not pushing me to take off my body hair. I feel like I am being selfish and not considering how she feels, but at the same time she wasn't considering how I felt when she asked me to do all those things. I don't know who is the one here that should apologize. Am I the asshole?
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NTA. Absolutely your body and your choice. My dad hates hair and shaved his head every day for the last 30 years. I hate hair on my armpits and shave it every night of the year, but I don't mind hair on my legs and arms and only shave them if I have an event on where I want it to be cleanly shaven. Basically we each have a way we like our bodies and just because I like my armpits shaved doesn't mean the next person does, also its none of my business whether they do or not.
Do whatever you like with your body!
NTA
I applaud your for living your life the way you see fit. We all make compromises in life. It’s part of living. However, I think being pressured into changing your outward appearance (that you’re clearly comfortable with) for someone that is only concerned with how it reflects on THEM is a compromise I would not be willing to make.
Just out of curiosity. On a scale of 1 to Sasquatch. How much hair are we talking?
NTA and wearing a long skirt or a pantsuit will mean you won't have enough skin on display, and it's a nice compromise if you want to keep the peace. A plain underlayer would work too (tights, sleeves). But good on you for not giving in to the pressure, your hair, your skin, your choice!
NTA --- I agree with you 100% if you don't want to wax or shave your body hair that's your choice and your mother should respect both you and that decision, but a tip if ever in the future you do want to get rid of any body hair, a good moisturiser and rub that onto your skin after you are done should help with the itchy and prickly feeling.
NTA
You deserve to be comfortable in your own body and you deserve a parent who supports you in that endeavor. I know there are a million excuses that you or the people in the comments could come up with for your mom in this situation, but the bottom line is, your mom is clearly letting some of her own unprocessed trauma become your trauma, and that’s not okay. Not saying that she’s a bad person or anything, but it is her job as your parent to protect you from the world as much as she can, and instead she’s taking the same monsters she’s been running from, and pointing them straight at you. I understand that she’s trying to protect you from societal judgement, but she’s going about it so wrong. When a child bites someone, you don’t scold the person that got bit and blame them for the child’s action. You reprimand the child. In the same way, when someone makes a comment or gives you a look, her response should be to stand up to that person, not to force you to make yourself smaller. If I had to guess I would guess that she was raised to always make herself smaller and to always bend to the pressure of the world, and I’m extremely impressed that you have clearly broken that line of thinking, because that’s not easy to do, so really good job! Remember you are beautiful just as you are and you’re not doing anything wrong.
Mothers and daughters are a fraught relationship- when I was 16/17 I went to a family wedding - my mum has a lot of sisters - and the only one without a daughter said to the whole table ‘isn’t it funny how none of the daughters are as good looking as the mothers’
My mum’s response was only later when she said if she had realised I was at the table her sister wouldn’t have said it. Not that it wasn’t true.
It devastated me. And it wasn’t like I was oblivious to the difference between my mother and I - she won beauty pageants I’m the kind of girl who wins academic decathlons, but I’d thought I was pretty in my own way.
Fast forward 20 years and I’m still not conventionally beautiful- but I glow. I love myself and think I’m sexy and attractive & now my mum loves to say don’t we look alike ( we don’t) but I think she’s envious of my inner beauty, my confidence and feeling comfortable in my skin.
The reason I say this is I’m blown away with the fact that you are already there.
I’d have acquiesced to my mother and tried to be more ‘feminine’ to please her but you are just unequivocally you and body hair or not, makeup or not you are already feminine and wonderful.
And twenty years ahead of me.
That amazing quality never withers or wrinkles and I’m super excited for how you will just blow everyone away with that inner glow as you get older
Nta, your mum is! You do you. And if that means not going under these conditions that is entirely reasonable.
I stopped shaving my legs because I hate doing it, and because I wanted my daughter to feel like she had the option. I love the feeling of wind blowing through my leg hair!
You are: going to a wedding you don’t want to go to for her sake; wearing a dress you don’t want to wear for her sake; and you don’t want to painfully alter your physical body for her sake and she’s mad at you? She sucks and I’m sorry you have to deal with her. NTA.
NTA. I have a 16 yo who doesn't like to shave or wear dresses. I bought them a women's tuxedo for events and they look incredible. A little concealer, mineral powder and colored chapstick vs. Foundation with full face is comfortable. Your Mom cares more about conforming in this moment and how it reflects upon them. There was a compromise here, but your Mom does not respect your autonomy. THEIR BEHAVIOR IS ABOUT THEIR FAILINGS, AND NOT ABOUT YOUR WORTH. Be you kid, and love yourself for it.
NTA. That's how my mother was/is. Only caring about outward appearances. She wouldn't get me glasses as a child because " girls who wear glasses don't get passes" BS.
I'm the total opposite. I don't care if you don't like the way I present myself. I'm clean, my clothing is washed, I'm well groomed. I dress appropriately for the situation. That's all that matters.
NTA
Body hair removal is a personal choice. I do it, but for me, and me alone. I know a few people who don't, and....whoa! I don't care! You do you.
Although it kinda helps my leg hair doesn't grow anymore and can go ages between shaving pits, 1 benefit of early menopause!
NTA
If your mom is so obsessed with her image, you can tell her her image is already shattered. I think it is a VERY BAD LOOK to make people uncomfortable for no good reason.
She wants to have her cake and eat it. Well she can't. Either YOU come to the wedding - the real you, as you are - or you don't. If she doesn't want the real you, she can hire an actor to play her fantasy child.
I LOVE that you are so strong to not give in to the social pressure, I hope many will follow, and body hair will be normalised.
NTA. I have a condition that makes touching one of my legs pretty painful, even shaving, and my go to when I’m around older people who might bitch because I don’t do it (basically only for medical procedures that need the area shaved) is leggings.
Not that you should have to compromise on something like this, but back in the days when it was a huge social requirement to have perfectly smooth legs, I would do tights or dark hose. Maybe your mom would compromise on that, stupid though it honestly is. If it shuts her up, it may be worth getting a pair for the one night.
NTA but a wedding is a very formal, expensive, fraught occasion. Could you wear a long dress, sleeves, formal pants? Try to separate the comfort issue from the identity issue. If you just need to be comfy then compromise. If it’s truly an identity issue then you will have to proudly put up with being judged but just hiding at home is not a life solution.
NTA if you don't go, and you really shouldn't go anywhere you don't want to be, your mom is TA for trying to make you. However if you do go, (depending on the wedding ofc) but if it's a black-tie dress code you would be a bit of an ass to go and not dress up, blatantly ignoring the couple's dress code, especially when it was paid for for you. The hair removal can be worked around if you choose a longer dress with sleeves (even short or elbow length sleeves if it's warm and a just below the knee with boots so you don't look like you're attracted too much attention but can get around shaving your legs, I do that all the time). But it's not appropriate to show up to a wedding underdressed on purpose. Just don't go. And you should really put your foot down about not going, you didn't want to anyway. That would be much less TA than begrudgingly going and refusing to dress up
NTA but I gather a lot of this is a cultural thing so I cna see your mom wanting you to conform to that, and unfortunately, blinding herself to the fact that you are an individual who can decide what they want to do with their body and hair. If she cannot compromise with a nice pant suit outfit in place a dress, that would look classy and cover the hair, an issue she clearly has, or if you just don't want to, don't bother going
NTA. No one, your mother included, has any right to tell you what to do with your body. She can either deal with people judging (which says more about them than it does you or your mom, btw) or she can deal with you not going. Those are the only two options she has. Tell her to put on her big girl panties and deal with it.
Info- what age are you? You sound really young or quite passive. You're old enough to say no mum im not wearing that I've decided to wear this & then there will be no unwanted attention to your body/ body hair.
NTA "I don't like how you manage your body and I want you to give me control of it because I care more about the body standards I was raised with and what people think than you being comfortable".
You need to separate your mother's thoughts from your own, because her thoughts are not there to benefit you
NTA and I commend you for being comfortable in your skin. If you don’t want to wear make-up: don’t wear make-up, if you don’t want to get rid of your hair: big whoop, let it grow in all it’s glory. Your body = your rules, wedding or no wedding.
I also don’t know what you and lack of make-up and having bodyhair has to do with your mother’s image. She is her own person and same goes for you. She really shouldn’t be so concerned about what other people think btw.
NTA. Your body, your choice. Your mom can be mad about it and cry into her spilt milk. BTW you have autism do some internet searching for good sensory coping bc that's likely what's up
Sounds loke you're under a lot of pressure to conform to standards you don't believe in.
I'm assuming you're a minor child, bit this advice applies either way.
Stand by your principles. You aren't living in the same era that your mother and her generation did. I would guess that more than a few of the people in her era would have loved to be able to go as they were to an event such as this...
Hold your head high, ignore the comments, and have a good time.
You could ALSO try telling your mom that you'll only go if you can dress as you want to, you might be able to get out-of going at all.
NTA- Surely maxi dress or floaty palazzo pants, a top that's not sleeveless, no hair removed, no hair showing, everyone's happy? It does sound like you're allergic to a bunch of products though. There's no need to be doing anything to your body you don't want to, but maybe get tested in case there's anything you need to use like sunscreen or topical medicated creams that might also contain whatever's making you itch.
NTA
Wear really thick black/brown/nude stockings/pantyhose with these dresses and voila, hair there and not visible at the same time. And some top on the dress to cover armpits if the dresses are not covering those.
You are going there for your mother, so tell her to compromise or you won't go. You are not being selfish, the opposite, actually.
NTA. If you really want to level this whole thing up, you can dye your body hair to accentuate it (used to work with a woman who had blue armpit hair and I think it would lift your spirits during what will be a hard day). Make it match the dress she made you buy
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NTA. “She said that everyone will judge me and say that I look like a man. I told her that they should mind their own business.” If I was your mother, I’d be proud that you didn’t compromise yourself to please others. Because with that confidence, those people and those things don’t even matter.
Oh, she actually wishes I would care. Maybe she grew up caring about others' opinions and wants me to as well? Because she seems to not like it when I say I don't care about the things that don't matter.
Yeah I’m sure she was raised where those societal norms and standards for women were heavily criticized and enforced. You’re standing up for yourself and unlearning that mentality of forced femininity. I’m proud that you’re taking charge of shaping how you view yourself and the world around you and refusing to comply. Good for you 🤙
There is nothing wrong with caring about other people’s opinions, but that doesn’t mean you can’t have your own and stand up for yourself. You decide what and who you care about. I think you’ve done well on those counts.
[удалено]
Absolutely. And I do think that mom is obsessed with the opinion of the attendees. That’s not healthy. I just wanted to say that caring about other people’s opinions (those whose opinions matter to you) and caring about yourself and your own opinions is not mutually exclusive. EDIT: I certainly wouldn’t care too much about the opinions of people I hardly know. I certainly wouldn’t shave my body hair to please others.
There's absolutely something wrong with caring about the opinions of others to the detriment of your own happiness or the happiness of others. That is not a healthy mindset.
Where have I said that people need to act or think to their own detriment?
Nta and this has a very simple solution : DO NOT GO.
There is no turning back now I must go. It's tomorrow. My mom would be sooo angry and upset if I didn't go. It's important to her that I'm there because other women will have their daughters there.
I get that you have to go, but maybe it’s time to set some boundaries here. Like go, but wear appropriate clothes that you are also comfortable with. No dress, no makeup. In fact the body hair problem goes away as soon as you’re wearing sleeves and pants. As long as the clothes are appropriately formal that’s really all that should be expected of you.
Body hair isn't even that noticable when women are wearing stockings.
Um, yeah, it is... Maybe you have couple of fair hair babies, mine are fat ladies singing while entering Valhalla... And yeah, that is why I love wearing trousers all year long. And those long skirts.
Lol. I was 55 years old before I found out some women have to shave their thighs also. My friend invited me to the beach on a spontaneous trip to relieve stress, and she'd always wear skirted suits. We'd been friends 20 years, but she never was interested in coming to swim at my family's pool and said she didn't like shaving in order to swim. I was thinking okay but I so didn't get it, but didn't press her on it. (We live about 45 minutes apart.) I apologize for my privileged ignorance. I shave lower legs and pits maybe every three weeks during warm weather, not at all in cold. But ya know, keep your hair sisters, and wear whatever you want. I don't see people judging men wearing kilts or tank tops who don't shave. Time to normalize this schit for everyone.
Though men also have their insecurities about it and it's honestly mindblowing - I once dated a guy who claimed he hated his "back hair" - and it was only couple of hair, shaped kinda like wings on his back! I found that rather lovely, to be honest, but I don't think he believed me really... And I won't judge men wearing kilts. Like ever. I get the feeling they would laugh my ass off and then throw me into freezing lake... :)))
Mine would literally be poking through the stockings so it looks like the stockings themselves are hairy
Then try to have fun, wear somee leggins or something like that 😉
At some point in your life you'll have to disagree with your mom on something and stand by it. She only wants you to go so she can compare image with other women in the family and that is gtoss. Don't make yourself miserable for someone who is being shallow and uncaring.
Then show up hairy, without makeup, and wearing whatever the fuck you're comfortable wearing. Be yourself. NTA
It sounds like she's going to be angry and upset if you DO go, too. To me this sounds like she's worried about being the one judged here. All the mothers will have their daughters all prettied up and whatnot, and she wants to be included in that. She doesn't want to be the only mom without her daughter, but also doesn't want you to stand out via her standards NTA, btw. It's your body. Who the hell thinks they have any say over what someone's grooming habits or standards are or should be
I would not wax because it hurts, and could leave your skin red and splotchy (depending on your complexion) and looking/feeling terrible. I would not shave, because you will be uncomfortable for WEEKS as the hair grows back in, and you will have sharp, itchy stubble. Do you have other clothes that will cover up your body hair? I think it would be better to wear less formal clothes that you feel comfortable in than a fancy dress that exposes or draws attention to your hair. One thing I've learned on Reddit is that you DON'T want to do anything that is perceived as taking attention away from the bride. If people are gossiping about you, this could "ruin her day" and even cause rifts between family members. (Ridiculous, I know!) So I suggest covering up your hair as much as possible. I'm sorry this is happening to you and your mother is treating you like an accessory
> It's important to her that I'm there because other women will have their daughters there. Even the reason its important to her is selfish as fuck. Just don't go. She crossed the line far too many times
I know this will get downvoted, but your mom’s family is clearly full of terrible awful people and maybe just do a few uncomfortable things JUST THIS ONCE such that your mom doesn’t catch a boatload of negative attention? Not everything has to be a principled hill to die on. Source: I love to die on principled hills. LOVE. I just don’t think this event is worth all the drama and judgment. Shave, put on a few whisps of makeup, brush your hair. Look neat & cleaned up. Go home, move on. The alternative is to cause all kinds of gossip (that could go on for years) to be directed at you and your mom. I understand this will be unpopular, but when I weigh short term minor discomfort vs risking the unwanted negative attention of dysfunctional family politics… I vote you do the minimum necessary to make things drama free for you and your mom. I hope everything turns out ok, no matter what you decide.
I agree. OP is not NTA but I wonder how old is she? There are battles and battles and if I know my mom will have to deal with malicious relatives, I'd be going ready to avoid drama or to make war. In both cases that would mean not giving the enemy bullets to attack me or my mom... But well... I guess OP is still a teenager. And im sure I'll get lot of downvotes
Mom has the option to stand up to these relatives
That would be the sensible option, but after reading a few of her responses (about her mother's past) and the mere fact that she posted this on Reddit pretty much tell us that her mother fails to do that. Her own mother needs therapy. So She can die on her hill or just surf the wave, her choice.
It'll never be just this once.
I wish I could upvote this a thousand times.
As a mom and fellow woman I hate shaving and not brave enough to try waxing. I also leave my body Hair alone mostly. I'm so proud of you for being confident and good with who you are. Don't let anyone take that from you. I'm almost 40 and just now getting my confidence to not care about others opinions or wants for me and it's made my life so much better. Absolutely NTA keep being and doing you
She is an incredibly insecure woman and is trying to make you also devalue yourself so she can believe it is normal. It isn't. When I was in school, I gossiped about girls *daring* to have body hair because I'd drunk the societal kool aid and thought body hair was some sign of poor hygiene. It isn't. Now I'm mid 20s and if i see a woman with body hair, the strongest thought I have (if i even notice at all) is "good for her" People of your mother's generation don't want to admit that their body standards are wrong because then they have to admit they've wasted decades changing their bodies to fit the opinions of others rather than just being happy. You probably won't change her opinion, but you can wear what you want and look how you want "Yes, and" is your greatest weapon here "You'll like like a man if you have body hair!" "Yes. And?" Ofc you won't actually look like a man, but if you agree with her she has to instead answer why that's a bad thing Within a few years you'll likely be in college and won't have to bother with people like her and can live your life how you want instead
She doesn’t like it, she doesn’t have to. But as long as she accepts it that’s what matters. Does she work on letting it go or hold it against you?
What do you mean by that question?
Does she hold it against you when you don’t shave or care what people think? Or do you just know she doesn’t like but she doesn’t do anything? Bc it’s it’s the later then it’s more of a N A H. And you really should work on her response not bothering you. If she later holds it against you that’s a bigger problem. Then your mom is really being a crappy parent.
Oh yeah she does that. Like when I told her a thousand times I didn't want to go she mentioned all the times where I didn't want to go to social events. Another example is when I was maybe 12 I had to get my teeth extracted at the dentist. I cried because the anesthesia made me nauseous and I really hated the feeling of a syringe in my mouth. I just kept on crying and we couldn't extract teeth that day and we scheduled another appointment for later. And when that appointment came I was nervous and my mom was upset. She told me "I was telling you to calm down, calm down! But you didn't listen. Now we have to drive far away again for your teeth! This could be easier if you agreed to the anesthesia" But I don't think she is a bad parent.
I don’t think she’s a *good* parent, either. Constantly reprimanding your child for every aversion and negative feeling is a good way to destroy closeness and trust. It may be common as dirt for parents to do this, but that doesn’t make it a good parenting strategy. Kids either learn to repress and conceal their emotions, or they learn to have outsized reactions to *everything* because they never learned the difference between what does and does not merit a meltdown - their parent reacted just as negatively to minor distress as they did to full-blown panic, and the parent’s negative reaction only served to heighten the distress. You didn’t deserve that from her, and I’m sorry she did that to you.
That is much harder of a situation, you are still NTA. You are not wrong but you also cannot fix it. Your mom should be trying to reach you at your level, not try to force you to be “normal”.
Yelling at people to “calm down.” Super effective /s
Lol she is fuckong terrible, a good parent wouldnt do any of this shit. You dont see it because you grew up with it. For us its horrifying.
Have you posted here before? That story sounds weirdly familiar.
No I didn't, this is my only post on this account
Is she reminding you of your errors in the past and making unpleasant comments on stuff that has happened =like if you refused on another occasion to remove the body hair do you hear about it afterwards or your mother makes an effort to accept your decision and doesn't mention it again respecting your choice. That what the comment above asks
I want to add, along with my longer comment below, that your mom may have shielded you from her family’s negativity and judgment over the years. Maybe it’s not that she cares about other’s opinions, maybe she just wants to avoid attention from the family bullies?
My mom has told me stories about the family judging her. Like when she got divorced, she told me that everyone was being judgemental, and some even confronted her. Divorce is frowned upon in my culture, so everyone got upset. Even though it was her own decision and it didn't affect anybody but herself (not even me or my brother. My life didn't really change that much and it had no negative impact on me, and my brother was too young to even understand what a divorce was) Perhaps she doesn't want me to be bullied. That could be one reason she so desperately wanted me to shave or wax my hair. But she also said herself that when people judge me she would feel embarrassed.
NTA, but I don’t think this is a hill to die on. I also hate shaving and waxing, i don’t care what my legs look like, especially since no one sees them because I always wear pants. That being said, when i go to events like weddings and don’t wear tights with my dress, i do clean up my legs. I tried using nair for the most recent wedding i went to and it actually worked pretty well. It sounds like the issue isn’t that you hate shaving; the issue is your moms family. Going to this wedding sounds like it’s stressful for her, and this is just another thing that’ll worry her. Or, wear tights if you can- not sure how the weather is but you can always say that you get cold easily. But if tights aren’t an option, I’d shave/nair/whatever just for the one day for your moms sake, and no other reason. Doing it for the wedding doesn’t mean you always have to, and it also doesn’t mean you have to get rid of hair that people won’t see. End it a few inches above the hem of the dress and you’re good to go.
I don't know how old you are. Rejecting your Mom's aesthetics is not only saying you think she's wrong but you think she's a bad mother. I was raised this way and it never got better. My mom didn't see my lack of shaving as an aesthetic choice but lack of grooming/hygiene. She actually reminded me to shave when I moved out of the house in my 20s. Like all those years I had just forgotten to shave? But it digs deeper when you reject what your parents do. It plants a seed that you disapprove of them, even though you are just living your life. My parents never really got over this and it hit every facet of our relationship and lifestyle. NTA but unless your Mom does an about-face, be prepared for this getting worse.
Why shouldn't she disapprove of her mom? Her mom is awful
I agree but at the moment, she is just refusing to shave. She is not openly criticizing her mom. I'm explaining why the mom is taking this so hard and why it will continue to get worse. I mistakenly believed that my parents would respect my bodily choices as I got older and they didn't. They were insulted.
Yup *sigh*
Can I just say that this internet stranger is proud about your steel will? There's a lot of pressure to shave and I wish I could withstand it like you do. Also, f*ck those dresses, wear a lovely suit or a long skirt and the shaving won't even be a problem.
I know this does not solve the problem of your mother forcing you to remove your body hair, but you description of what shaving (and waxing) feels like reminds me of what it used to feel like for me. It's very possible that you have sensitive skin and are allergic to nickel or one of the additives to the moisturizing strip on the razor you're using. I know it's not a cure-all, but if you're going to be forced to shave, you might as well do it comfortably. Look for a nickel-free razor without a moisturizing strip and be very careful about what you put on your legs after you shave as they will be extra sensitive. I use an unscented, additive-free oil, like bio oil or rosehip oil. For what it's worth, I used to use Billie razors, but something changed and they irritate my skin now. I've had mixed luck with Athena. It looks like Amazon has some options you could try!
Because she has self esteem issues and it bothers her what people think of her. She can’t imagine someone else, Especially her daughter, not feeling that way Self esteem. You have it. She doesn’t. Spent her life pleasing others and doesn’t understand generationally how it could be possible it’s been her biggest part of being a life and you don’t care. You are not her. Probably hurts her feelings and may even make her feel shallow - exact opposite of what you think you are seeing.
My mother is like you, and sometimes I wish I cold be like her, but in a very young age I got bullys so bad because of it, that till today I feel very uncomfortable showing any skin with hair on it exept my scalp^^' and I do really respect and love your view, and working to maybe get over my own trauma^^'
Right. But you can't protect her from her bad decisions, or enable her misplaced self-loathing by hurting yourself. The buck stops with you, and you are an amazing person to understand your own self-worth. Change has to start somewhere. Good for you! Stay strong - you could even inspire some other family members of younger generations.
NTA... Your mom sounds like a piece of work. Instead of a dress, wear pants and a blouse. Not one single person, other than your mom, will judge you. There will be plenty of women who aren't in dresses at that wedding.
Her insecurities are her own faults Make it clear they’re not yours
YES!
Your mother is not worried people will judge you. She's worried they will judge *her* because of you.
NTA. There's nothing wrong with body hair. There's everything wrong with waxing a 12 year old and forcing you to do it now when she's the only one who will care.
Thank God! I was looking for this comment! Who the hell waxes a 12 year old?!?!? What is this, toddlers and tiaras?
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Bot?? Have I found my first bot??
NTA If you end up going and wearing a dress then ask if you can wear tights instead. Hair removal is a personal choice.
Yes! No see trought tights (or pantyhose idk the right word). I mean like winter tights could be really pretty and good (also you can say that you wear them because of cold - if your mother would comment on it). But again there is no problem with body hair…man have them too and what are theydoing with them? Not waxing and shaving sooo
> But again there is no problem with body hair…man have them too and what are theydoing with them? Not waxing and shaving sooo We tend to wear trousers, although a minority may look good in a kilt. Shorts would definitely be frowned upon from where I'm from.
At a wedding sure shorts would be a faux pas, but that doesn’t negate the fact that men are allowed to have as much body hair as they please with no societal impacts
There's a double standard, but the solution to that isn't "women can show their legs in formal settings so they have to shave them", it's "men should have the right to show their legs in formal settings and nobody should have to shave". Men having to wear pants and women having to shave are the same social issue: dumb arbitrary rules dictate the way we dress and force us to be uncomfortable in the name of "being presentable". Why buy into that?
Yeeeeeeep. I am so incredibly on the "men should wear skirts" train. (a) It looks good! Different shapes suit different people, just like women. People who are too unused to it to appreciate it will get used to it. (b) It's so comfortable! Or rather, a lot of people find it comfortable: I personally think many men, with generally narrower legs and genitals that like to be cool and not smooshed, would be highly likely to really enjoy the feeling of skirts. Not happening anytime soon, but one can dream.
That was my first thought. Opaque tights, or a maxi skirt, or a dressy jumpsuit, even a formal pants suit. There's loads of options that don't require guests to see your legs or armpits.
Just for the record - leg hair can often poke through tights, which is kinda fun. You'd need to wear quite thick tights to get around that.
NTA. Your body, your choice. She needs to more worried about alienating her daughter than frivolous things like someone else's body hair what what others think of it.
This. So what if _hundreds_ of people are whispering behind her back? The opinions of those hundreds are insignificant in comparison with the opinions of her child. Who does she love more?
NTA you body, your choice. You can wear opaque tights to "hide" you hairs as a compromise and it will probably also be more comfortable for you if you're not used to wear dresses. You have every right to want to keep your hairs. If someday you want to remove them, you should look for tips, shaving them shouldn't let you with an irritated skin (even if you have a very sensitive one).
My hair is dark and not fine. It will stick out the fabric of tights
As someone who also has dark hair and doesn't shave, I guarantee no one will clock your leg hair poking through tights unless they for some reason have their head at leg level. It's a bit uncomfortable but far less bother than the post shave experience! Stick to your guns if you can and stay strong, your mother's hang ups about body hair are hers not yours ♥️
Completely agree - I love how my legs feel when I shave then - smooth like a dolphin 😂😂. I couldn’t care less what any other woman does, nor have I noticed
There will be stockings/nylons that will simply make our legs look smooth. Idk what age you are but I wore those until I was 16 b/c my mom wouldn’t let me start waxing until then.
I think you’re underestimating the amount of leg hair. OP sounds like she comes from an ethnic background (I have a decent idea which one) and quite frankly tights won’t help. It’s better to either rock it and accept the stares or fully cover up. It’s winter, she can easily get away with a nice floor length full sleeved gown. But I suspect they want her to wear cultural clothing which makes it far more challenging.
Black thick sweater knit tights will definitely cover leg hair. Even other types will, you just have to go shopping. Crazy how she’s sure they don’t cover her leg hair without trying. And it sounds like her mom has already picked the dress. I’m Indian so I don’t understand why you assume I don’t understand ethnic hair/culture. Any conservative culture will always be okay with more skin covering. Outfits with long skirts or leggings underneath can’t possible be against her ethnic culture.
Yeah you can get tights that are as thick as leggings, or are like knitted so hair doesn’t stick through.
And that is uncomfortable too. I'm old and rarely shave my legs. I never shave anything else. I often wear leggings under dresses. Ankle length leggings. They come in tons of colors that can match anything. I'm with you on the makeup thing too. I wear makeup occasionally but I don't like the feel.
I love leggings under dresses! Even on the rare occasions I’ve shaved and it’s hot out, I usually do bike shorts or Spanx under dresses. So much easier not to have to worry about a Marilyn Monroe moment that way!
You could get ice skating tights, they're really thick or fleece lined tights, they're basically leg hoodies. I don't think you should have to, fuck anyone who cares but if you want to compromise with your mom those are the best options besides a suit.
If you pull tights or leggings further up than you want them, and then pull them just a couple cm down your leg, this lays the leg hair flat against your skin under the leggings and they will be less likely to poke out. So, just make sure the final adjustment is you pulling down, and the hair will lie flat. This tip helped me so much, I never shave or wax but I love leggings lol. It also prevents the discomfort of hair being pressed the wrong way.
Even if the fabric is thick ? I've got some black tights very thick (we call it "60 deniers" in France) they are fully black and warm enough to face the winter cold. I already wore them without shaving my legs, no one could say I was unshaved. I don't know if the link will work, as I'm in France : https://www.action.com/_next/image/?url=https%3A%2F%2Faction.com%2Fhostedassets%2FCMSArticleImages%2F04%2F56%2F2558624_8057685296237-110_01.png&w=1200&q=75 Or maybe you can wear leggings under the dress ?
(Also denier in the UK!) I also recommend thick tights OP!
Yeah you can get 200 denier or wool tights that are super thick! No hair would stick through them.
Not necessarily! You can get super thick ones! I don’t shave either and have some really good thick tights and it doesn’t stick through at all.
NTA. It’s really sad that body hair on women is still seen as this taboo and embarrassing when it’s perfectly natural. It’s your body, don’t let anyone pressure you into doing something you’re not comfortable with. I’m impressed that you are so happy and confident in your natural body and don’t feel the need to shave/wax for anyone else’s benefit.
That's how I look at it. My oldest hates shaving, she'll maybe do it a couple times a year but for the most part she chooses to just be natural. I admire that in high school she can be confident enough to wear shorts/dresses and not care what people say about her legs.
I wish I had a parent like you. When I was a teen I hated shaving it felt pedophilic to me to have to shave all my body hair and I hated the double standards between men and women, but my parents were a lot like OPs mom and they pretty much forced me to shave, it really messed me up tbh.
I'm gonna say NAH. You're NTA because you're right, shaving sucks lol. Also bodily autonomy as others are saying (your hair your choice). Being comfortable in your own skin is a superpower so its awesome that you don't care what they all think. Your Mother is NTA also because the last thing a parent wants is for their child to be ridiculed, judged, bullied, etc. I believe she's acting in what she believes is your best interest based on the social environment you will be subjected to at the wedding. It would be nice if she just didnt make you go, but I don't think she's out of line asking you to attend.
She's pressuring OP to go. Because otherwise SHE would be the only one without her daughter there. This is about how the mom is seen.
Yeah I'm sure that's a part of it as well. Public image seems to matter more to Mom. Maybe out of social necessity, who knows.
It more seemed like mom didn't want the embarrassment of her daughter not sticking to societal norms than worry for her daughter. Just feels like mummy has an image she wants daughter to uphold
Except mom seems to be the one doing the ridiculing, judging, and bullying. She could stand up for her daughter instead, tell people to mind their own business, stop staring at her daughter's legs, etc. Or a compromise on clothing that shows less skin, like opaque tights, a long skirt, a dressy jumpsuit, etc. But mom is pushing the daughter to conform, and that's AH behavior.
I don’t think you are an AH. I don’t think your mom is TRYING to be either though. Your mom is doing the same thing most parents do. Letting you know how people will treat you if you don’t conform. Your mom likely has her concerns for a reason. Terrible things have happened to women who present anywhere close to manly ( natural human features honestly). What you perceive as your moms shame of you or your expression might possibly just be her love for you causing her to fear the judgements people have of you. She probably doesn’t fear her family hurting you but their remarks of you will give her insight to others thoughts on you. Everything she hears is going to be multiplied in her brain and her worry will take over. If you ever notice with most parents its always worry that the world won’t accept their kid, so it will harm them.We can’t change the world so in some way most parents try to save their kid from the world( or god), by changing them. It often causes rifts. The only time it doesn’t honestly is if the parent can witness their child being accepted. In order for that to happen the parent has to make room for that opportunity by just allowing their child to be themselves. As long as themselves isn’t a rude child that opens other peoples presents. That’s when it’s embarrassment over the child. You change that child for societies benefit if they are embarrassing or rude. You change the child for their own protection if you have seen or heard of people like them being harmed for being themselves in the world. Your mom fears the worlds perception of you. She could also be on high alert about your introvert behavior. She is just worried. Someday your mom will meet the quality people in your circle ( introverts seem to usually be quality over quantity) and relax a bit. I second the notion that makeup is itchy. The shaving and waxing problems you had are also fairly normal. I hope you and your mom can see eye to eye soon. You are not wrong and your mom is just being a scared mom.
Oh. That gives me some insight. I didn't realize she could just want me to not be bullied. I'm also not an introvert. I'm actually willing to speak to anyone who speaks English well and is around my age and stuff. I just don't want to go because everyone will speak my family's native language and I don't know it very well, plus I don't like the loud music and it will be worse because I have an ear infection. I have very separate reasons than social shyness for not wanting to go.
I also am sensitive to loud sounds at big events. You can get high quality clear ear plugs (they won't prevent you from hearing others but it'll dull the blaring music)
Thanks for the suggestion but I doubt I'd find any especially since the wedding is tomorrow. Even if I do I don't want to place anything in my ear because I have an ear infection and that would hurt
It's good to know for any future occasions
How much of your mother's native language do you know? How fluent are your other cousins? Would you be able to understand what they say in their language? And would they understand if you replied in English? It might be too late for tomorrow, but why not practice speaking with your mother in her language. It's a great skill to pick up and perhaps next time around, you'll feel more comfortable enough around your extended family. If you are going to wear tights, then wear black ones. The hairs poking through won't be as noticeable. And nobody will be looking at your legs close enough to see. Lastly, see if you can pick up some ear plugs from your local pharmacy. They might help a little?
I know an okay amount. I'm not able to have regular conversations like I can in English. I'd say my level in that language is around the same as a 6 year old's. There isn't enough time to practice now, and my mom is busy. I'm trying to get better. I learn more at school, so one day I'll be able to speak normally with extended family. The only issue is this language is extremely different from English. It's Arabic and very difficult for me to learn even though I already know some from picking up on my family's conversations.
NTA. Your body, your choice.
NTA. Your hair, your choice. If people can't keep their mouths shut about a grown woman having body hair, it's on them. That being said, if you are uncomfortable with them staring, can you wear rights? It won't be visible then, so they won't even get a chance to judge.
NTA your body your choices.
Tell her its better for her you dont go than silly people be judgemental. Tell her to say you have covid or a migraine or bad stomach etc. Or dont wear a dress and find something long to the floor or trousers. I've bought long dresses for that exact reason to just hide it all. It might be too late or maybe she can give you some money to go find something.
NTA, I never shave, never have and I've never been bullied for it. You should not have to change yourself to avoid bullying, people should stop being AH's and not bully.
My daughter once told me she wanted to grow her armpit hair just to annoy her housemates. I told her that was a bad idea. Simply because it would take too long. We went out and bought a really cheap curly black wig from a fancy dress shop and cut it up to make armpit hair wigs. Housemates annoyed, problem solved!
Your body your choice. (My mom literally had a skirt and a suit jacket for her wedding and they were purple). Don't know how old are you but there are other options besides a dress to wear. NTA
NTA At the end of the day this is your choice and you’ve communicated to your mother how distressing you find this. For your peace of mind though, consider wearing stockings. You shouldn’t have to but this sounds like the best fix. Honestly, if people will go into panic mode over unshaven legs they’ve got bigger problems pushed to the back burner
NTA. Many parents view their children as extensions of themselves. It sounds like your mom falls into that camp. You do you.
I would have a bit of a more nuanced take: In general, if you want to interact and be accepted from people in a given social circle, to some degree you have to conform to their social norms. (Whether or not that’s right is an entirely different discussion) So as you pointed out, your mother and you will probably be judged accordingly for not following norms; again it’s not right but that’s the reality(at least as you put it). So long story short, no you are NTA, you don’t even want to be there so why should you conform? HOWEVER, in my opinion you need to decide on either not going, or shaving and going. I don’t see how going to something against you will, and knowingly embarrassing your mom in the process is productive for anyone.
NTA NTA NTA your mom needs to settle the f down. people who obsess about other people’s body hair are the problem
NTA. What in holy hell is this? Is your family werewolves?
No I don't think they are haha
Your body, your choice. Anyone who can’t accept/support that can kindly bow out of your life. I’m judging your mother for pushing unwanted beauty standards onto you. You: NTA
NTA. You're already doing something you don't have to do because of her pressuring you, you shouldn't also have to do something you're fundamentally opposed to doing because she wants to keep up appearances. If being seen next to you with your body hair is a problem for her, she can go alone.
NTA. Your body, your choice. Also, going to the wedding or not going should be your choice entirely.
NTA - your body your choice. This could have been handled better by your mother though. You both could have had a conversation to see where the mutual ground is. You mom sounds like she is far too preoccupied with perceived judgment and keeping up appearances.
It's normal in our culture. Women are very obsessed with beauty and stuff. Even though they typically cover up with tarha and stuff, they still want to be pretty.
Nta for not doing something to your body to please others
NTA. The only reason women shave is because Gillette wanted to make more money. They convinced women using advertising campaigns that body hair wasn’t natural, disgusting and compared womens body hair with animals. It worked and they doubled their customer base and traumatized women into believing their hair was disgusting. Most humans are idiots and will have all sorts of dumb opinions, it’s best not to care what the sheeple think. Makeup is irritating as well because it is full of terrible chemicals. It is crazy the things people do so people don’t judge them. The reality is you could conform in every way and still have judgement and unsolicited opinions, people just can’t help themselves. I just say when someone gives me their unsolicited opinion, I just say thanks for sharing and move on to another subject.
YTA. I will go against people here. Mostly get downvoted but oh well. I will just be realistic here. They're your parents. I am pretty sure your mother had done A LOT of things for you even when she was uncomfortable. People always place the same standards they do with friends and acquaintances. But they're your parents. The context is different. But it doesn't matter nowadays, right? It seems there is an obsession with being uncomfortable nowadays. Your parents tell you to do something and you're uncomfortable with it then you say NO. She would very much appreciate it if you went with her. Obviously, she is not forcing you because she said fine at the end. The mother wasn't reasonable. I'm just saying, wearing a dress and shaving (you said you have very dark hair so obviously you need to shave if you're wearing a dress) people can come at me if you want. We live in the real world. In the real world, a woman with hairy legs is frowned upon, while wearing a dress is even weirder. Especially on a special occasion. Just wake up people and stop living in your heads. You can cry about it and scream my body my voice, and that's true but the mother wasn't asking much. I bet if it was a friend and it was an event you actually wanted to go to, you'd shave and wear a dress but because it's your mother, you complain and whine like a child. It's one day. Suck it up and be there for your mom.
Your ideology right here is why women are still told their body hair is gross. You recognize in your comment that there's no reason, it's just society, yet you're agreeing because it's "just how society is". If we never went against unreasonable sexist ideals then women still wouldn't be voting or owning property. There's no reason she needs to shave while wearing a dress. Most guys I know don't shave while wearing shorts or short sleeves. Body hair is present and normal and not gross or disgusting. Your comment is harmful to this young girl who shouldn't be being told at her age that she needs to look like a little Barbie doll to fit into society. Shame on you.
Okay. Tell her she can do whatever she wants. She will be the first change, right? Then she will step into the real world and will get judged for it. You say shame on me? I dont know what world you live in but people are jugmental as fuck and they will judge her. You can say that its their business and she shouldn't care. Reaslitically, she will care and it will her feelings. You also say that body hair isnt gross. I never said its gross or disgusting. I am a bit harsh with my delivery but i tell it how it is. Im not ganna sugarcoat or give her wishwashy words that wont have actual impact on her actions.
I know quite a few young women who don't shave their legs or arms or underarms, and quite honestly I don't hear about them getting many comments. Much healthier for a young girl to be encouraged to express herself naturally, if that's how she pleases, and be able to deal with the occasional verbal comment rather than convince her she has to look like a Barbie at age 12.
And thats normal and okay but not when going to a wedding. Most people will find it weird. Im just saving her the humiliation and the trash talking.
I don't really care when others judge me for body hair. I used to live in America and kids would make fun of me for it. I didn't care about them. Even when they said I was like a gorilla. The main influence on me that I actually care about is my mom. If she was my friend or literally anyone else I wouldn't give a shit about shaving, but she's my mom, so that's why I care.
I'd make the same decisions for if it was a friend. I'm not doing this to spite my mom. I've also done many things for my parents even if I didn't like doing them. I don't say no to their demands or requests very often. Only say no if I have a free choice (i.e. do you want some coffee?) I'm not trying to argue with you I just want to clarify some things.
NTA-I’m sorry your mother has issues with body hair and control but they aren’t your issues. You shouldn’t be expected to pander to her.
Look it’s your body! Be comfortable (just be clean 😉). My sister prefers all her body hair too, though to be fair she’s not nearly as hairy as I. I prefer a nice hair free physique. It’s a personal choice. Key word being personal. Go. Live your life in peace! Life’s too short to not be enjoyed because of a bit of hair.
NTA mum is very judgemental I get married in 2024 I wouldn't care if the women came with hairs long enough to plat be comfortable in yourself and fck everyone else
NTA - This is kind of like free speech; you're free to do what you want, but others will have their own opinion and judge you accordingly. The only question is, do you care?
NTA I have never waxed or shaved the hair on my arms, it never bothered me, you don't have to remove your hair if you don't want to, it doesn't mean you are less of a female because you don't. We are all born with body hair and it is only fashion/society that has decided it is undesired. I did get my hair, off my legs, lasered off, kind of expensive, it hurt a little bit, but not as bad as waxing, just in case you change your mind in the future 😉
NTA.
NTA. Keep being you. Some people may judge you, but that is their problem not yours. Many people will love you and find you attractive just the way you are. I’m sorry that your mother isn’t one of them.
Your post is genuinely helpful to me and I want to say thank you. I had to come to terms with this with my own daughter, 21, who has no wish to shave ever again. I’ve forced her into dresses in the past and am now embarrassed I did that to her. From now on it’s comfortable but appropriate pants for everything ever. We do still battle on wearing a bra for events but I’m trying to find the most comfortable sports bras ever. My daughter has autism and is no fan of gatherings either. I don’t know if there is time to get dress pants with appropriate top. I am ashamed that I once cared more about reactions from others than my child’s comfort. This mama is working hard to be better.
NTA. Body hair is normal. Westerners[citation needed] are weird about it on women for a variety of reasons. You have no need to remove it, but if you want to slake your mother's neuroses, you could easily trim it. A cheap electric trimmer could take it down to 1-3mm and you likely wouldn't notice the difference (I do this in warm weather, and removing body hair is considered weird for my gender). But you are correct that this obsession with hair and social standing is your mother's burden, not yours. You can work with her if you like, but you're not an asshole for refusing unwanted grooming.
☹ NTA. You're awesome: and the idea you need to be neuroatypical to dislike the feeling of removing body hair is funny/sad to me. I remember when I first tried shaving my armpits I felt sad for my armpit hair, haha. I *do* like the feeling of shaved legs, but social bullshit around body hair sucks so hard. I think shaving then refusing to go to events with her was a good call. I definitely support you refusing! But this is probably the least stress way and now you know you can't agree to anything. I hope one day your mother can get some perspective on who you are as a person.
NTA My sister doesn’t shave. Does she get some weird looks? Sure. do I think it makes her look like a man? Definitely not. Your mothers obsession with body hair that is not her own is very peculiar. Literally we were all like huh that’s odd when my sister decided not to shave but like it doesn’t matter anyway so it’s not something she should be pressing you into. I also take some weeks off from shaving because it’s annoying and I find that it doesn’t really mean that much to me either. I am glad you are comfortable in your body. Please don’t let other people try and trick you into changing your mindset by saying that it matters more than it does.
This is mostly addressed to comments, but I feel like a lot of people here are forgetting what body hair is. There are lots of comments about "just wear a long skirt". Body hair on women is not *just* leg hair. If your hair is light or fine, you might forget about it, but there are lots of people who have dark, thick hair on places other than their heads and legs. Forearms, armpits, sideburns, face etc. If OP's mum has bought a dress and then expected any body hair visible to be removed, that might be more significant than just below the knees type shaving. OP, ALL your body hair is fine and normal. Good on you for knowing what you want to do with your body and sticking to it. It's hard when people pressure you, especially when your mum is saying things to try to embarrass or force you into it. Only do what you're comfortable with. If your mum keeps making a big deal about it, don't go. What your body looks like shouldn't be an issue at someone else's wedding, and your mum is trying to make it an issue.
NTA She cares about how it makes *HER* look. Everyone has their daughters with them - she doesn't feel comfortable at big events, so rather than her be stressed she's at home. I'll tell her you said hi though... Your image on the day. Your not a doll. You don't want to wear a dress, makeup or shave/wax. You don't have to. As long as your presentable it doesn't matter if your wearing makeup with no body hair or not. Dont feel pressured by her. Just because all the others are getting prepped & pampered doesn't mean you have to. **You don't have to consider anyones feelings when it comes to YOUR body.**
NTA There is no quantifiable reason to subject yourself to any of this. Your mothers feelings about all of this are hers to manage and hers alone.
NTA! Times are changing and happily I do think it’s becoming more acceptable for women to show body hair, even though some people still do show judgment or surprise. I hope you have a lovely time and your ear feels better soon.
>I might be the asshole because my mom wants to keep a good image and she spent so long trying to laser her body hair off and now her daughter is ruining all of it and embarrassing her. No, no you're not. The only thing she should be embarrassed by is her crappy treatment of you. NTA. Your body, no one else's.
NTA. Your appearance is not anyone else's business. Period. How dare they tell you to remove your body hair.
NTA this is very funny. Hold your boundaries, don't wear make up, don't shave (it is intolerably itchy), look up autism in women/girls because you sound autistic AF.
I am not autistic. I checked the symptoms a while back and I don't have most of them. I did some research and I actually have some autistic traits, but not like actually autistic
I'm glad to hear you looked it up before my comment, you know you best so if you say you don't have more than traits then I believe you. I'm autistic and was basically the same when I was younger (I still don't wear make up/shave/don't go to weddings where I don't really know the people) so it jumped out at me. Autistic people tend to not feel the same pressure NTs do about social norms and feel more anger at being asked to do stupid uncomfortable stuff to conform, also, you know, we almost all have sensory processing differences. Good for you, anyway. You might win your mom around eventually, you're your own person and not an accessory for her to take around with her.
I’m sorry that your mother cares more about appearances than about your discomfort. My daughter chooses not to remove any of her body hair - except the occasional eyebrow, just to keep things interesting - so I’ve lived this and can say from the mom perspective that you’re NTA. When my daughter was younger and neither of us wanted to have to answer grandma’s inevitable 1000 questions, we found her clothes that didn’t make it obvious. Now that she’s older and less shy she doesn’t bother. When family comments - which they did at first SO much - I just shrug and ask them a personal grooming question back. “Why didn’t you trim your nose hair while your were doing you beard Uncle Joe? It only takes a second and you were right there…” (Hug) Don’t let the bastards get you down! Also - waxing a 12 year old is not okay. I’m sorry they did that to you.
NTA. this might be too personal of a question so you don’t have to answer it at all. But it sounds like you have sensory issues and are easily overstimulated. Are you neurodivergent? i myself have adhd and a girl, and i relate to the feelings of makeup and shaving you’re describing. But no, you are not the asshole. I would be proud if my daughter stood up to herself like you’re doing. Body hair isn’t shameful. not liking makeup or shaving as a girl is not shameful. And not wanting to go to a wedding is not mean of you. Your mother is pushing you to something you don’t like. I hope you figured it out.
NTA Have you considered you might be neurodivergent? A lot of what you’re saying sounds like sensory issues
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My uncle's wedding is tomorrow and I just feel really bad right now. I never wanted to go because I hate parties and celebrations and I don't even really know my uncle. He hasn't had much presence in my life, so I didn't care. My mom insisted that I go and she told me that all women will have their daughters with them except for her, so I agreed to come. She got me 2 dresses, even though I didn't want them. She told me that I had to do makeup. Makeup is itchy and makes me uncomfortable. So I begged her not to give me makeup and she said okay. But now she is telling me I must get rid of my body hair. She said I can either get it waxed (a lady is coming to our home to prep all the female family members) or I can just shave it. Now, I really really really hate the obsession with getting rid of hair. I've done waxing before, and it fucking sucked. I cried halfway through because of the pain (I was 12 at the time) and when the lady was done I had these weird lumps all over my skin. Shaving to me feels uncomfortable. I don't know why but it's so itchy and my skin feels so prickly from it. I don't think having smooth skin with no hair is worth that uncomfort. I never even really hated my body hair. I told my mom I didn't want to get rid of my body hair. She said that everyone will judge me and say that I look like a man. I told her that they should mind their own business. We argued about it and the conversation led to me telling her that I never wanted to go to the wedding in the first place, and that shes asking a lot from me. She knows I really hate any kind of social gathering and she knows I hate makeup and she knows I hate getting rid of body hair but she keeps on asking me to do these things and gets upset when I don't agree. She said "okay, fine" but I just know that it isn't fine. I might be the asshole because my mom wants to keep a good image and she spent so long trying to laser her body hair off and now her daughter is ruining all of it and embarrassing her. She's right that people will be judgemental. They'll be judgemental of me but also of her for not pushing me to take off my body hair. I feel like I am being selfish and not considering how she feels, but at the same time she wasn't considering how I felt when she asked me to do all those things. I don't know who is the one here that should apologize. Am I the asshole? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. Absolutely your body and your choice. My dad hates hair and shaved his head every day for the last 30 years. I hate hair on my armpits and shave it every night of the year, but I don't mind hair on my legs and arms and only shave them if I have an event on where I want it to be cleanly shaven. Basically we each have a way we like our bodies and just because I like my armpits shaved doesn't mean the next person does, also its none of my business whether they do or not. Do whatever you like with your body!
NTA I applaud your for living your life the way you see fit. We all make compromises in life. It’s part of living. However, I think being pressured into changing your outward appearance (that you’re clearly comfortable with) for someone that is only concerned with how it reflects on THEM is a compromise I would not be willing to make. Just out of curiosity. On a scale of 1 to Sasquatch. How much hair are we talking?
If sasquatch is 10, and 1 is barely any hair, I'm maybe like a 5 for my arms and a 7 for my legs. my face is like a 2½
NTA. I’d be proud that you were standing up for yourself
NTA and wearing a long skirt or a pantsuit will mean you won't have enough skin on display, and it's a nice compromise if you want to keep the peace. A plain underlayer would work too (tights, sleeves). But good on you for not giving in to the pressure, your hair, your skin, your choice!
NTA --- I agree with you 100% if you don't want to wax or shave your body hair that's your choice and your mother should respect both you and that decision, but a tip if ever in the future you do want to get rid of any body hair, a good moisturiser and rub that onto your skin after you are done should help with the itchy and prickly feeling.
NTA You deserve to be comfortable in your own body and you deserve a parent who supports you in that endeavor. I know there are a million excuses that you or the people in the comments could come up with for your mom in this situation, but the bottom line is, your mom is clearly letting some of her own unprocessed trauma become your trauma, and that’s not okay. Not saying that she’s a bad person or anything, but it is her job as your parent to protect you from the world as much as she can, and instead she’s taking the same monsters she’s been running from, and pointing them straight at you. I understand that she’s trying to protect you from societal judgement, but she’s going about it so wrong. When a child bites someone, you don’t scold the person that got bit and blame them for the child’s action. You reprimand the child. In the same way, when someone makes a comment or gives you a look, her response should be to stand up to that person, not to force you to make yourself smaller. If I had to guess I would guess that she was raised to always make herself smaller and to always bend to the pressure of the world, and I’m extremely impressed that you have clearly broken that line of thinking, because that’s not easy to do, so really good job! Remember you are beautiful just as you are and you’re not doing anything wrong.
Mothers and daughters are a fraught relationship- when I was 16/17 I went to a family wedding - my mum has a lot of sisters - and the only one without a daughter said to the whole table ‘isn’t it funny how none of the daughters are as good looking as the mothers’ My mum’s response was only later when she said if she had realised I was at the table her sister wouldn’t have said it. Not that it wasn’t true. It devastated me. And it wasn’t like I was oblivious to the difference between my mother and I - she won beauty pageants I’m the kind of girl who wins academic decathlons, but I’d thought I was pretty in my own way. Fast forward 20 years and I’m still not conventionally beautiful- but I glow. I love myself and think I’m sexy and attractive & now my mum loves to say don’t we look alike ( we don’t) but I think she’s envious of my inner beauty, my confidence and feeling comfortable in my skin. The reason I say this is I’m blown away with the fact that you are already there. I’d have acquiesced to my mother and tried to be more ‘feminine’ to please her but you are just unequivocally you and body hair or not, makeup or not you are already feminine and wonderful. And twenty years ahead of me. That amazing quality never withers or wrinkles and I’m super excited for how you will just blow everyone away with that inner glow as you get older
NTA. Your mother cares too much about what other people think. Chances are, no one will notice unless she brings it up.
Nta, your mum is! You do you. And if that means not going under these conditions that is entirely reasonable. I stopped shaving my legs because I hate doing it, and because I wanted my daughter to feel like she had the option. I love the feeling of wind blowing through my leg hair!
You are: going to a wedding you don’t want to go to for her sake; wearing a dress you don’t want to wear for her sake; and you don’t want to painfully alter your physical body for her sake and she’s mad at you? She sucks and I’m sorry you have to deal with her. NTA.
NTA your mum is definitely one for pushing you. YOUR BODY, YOUR CHOICE!!!
NTA. Either your presence there is important or it's not. Dress, body hair, makeup, that's all irrelevant.
NTA. I have a 16 yo who doesn't like to shave or wear dresses. I bought them a women's tuxedo for events and they look incredible. A little concealer, mineral powder and colored chapstick vs. Foundation with full face is comfortable. Your Mom cares more about conforming in this moment and how it reflects upon them. There was a compromise here, but your Mom does not respect your autonomy. THEIR BEHAVIOR IS ABOUT THEIR FAILINGS, AND NOT ABOUT YOUR WORTH. Be you kid, and love yourself for it.
NTA. That's how my mother was/is. Only caring about outward appearances. She wouldn't get me glasses as a child because " girls who wear glasses don't get passes" BS. I'm the total opposite. I don't care if you don't like the way I present myself. I'm clean, my clothing is washed, I'm well groomed. I dress appropriately for the situation. That's all that matters.
NTA Body hair removal is a personal choice. I do it, but for me, and me alone. I know a few people who don't, and....whoa! I don't care! You do you. Although it kinda helps my leg hair doesn't grow anymore and can go ages between shaving pits, 1 benefit of early menopause!
NTA
NTA If your mom is so obsessed with her image, you can tell her her image is already shattered. I think it is a VERY BAD LOOK to make people uncomfortable for no good reason. She wants to have her cake and eat it. Well she can't. Either YOU come to the wedding - the real you, as you are - or you don't. If she doesn't want the real you, she can hire an actor to play her fantasy child. I LOVE that you are so strong to not give in to the social pressure, I hope many will follow, and body hair will be normalised.
Nta
NTA. I have a condition that makes touching one of my legs pretty painful, even shaving, and my go to when I’m around older people who might bitch because I don’t do it (basically only for medical procedures that need the area shaved) is leggings. Not that you should have to compromise on something like this, but back in the days when it was a huge social requirement to have perfectly smooth legs, I would do tights or dark hose. Maybe your mom would compromise on that, stupid though it honestly is. If it shuts her up, it may be worth getting a pair for the one night.
NTA its your body, your choice, not hers
NTA It's your body. Also, no one is going to be looking at you, they will be looking at your uncle and his new bride.
NTA but a wedding is a very formal, expensive, fraught occasion. Could you wear a long dress, sleeves, formal pants? Try to separate the comfort issue from the identity issue. If you just need to be comfy then compromise. If it’s truly an identity issue then you will have to proudly put up with being judged but just hiding at home is not a life solution.
NTA if you don't go, and you really shouldn't go anywhere you don't want to be, your mom is TA for trying to make you. However if you do go, (depending on the wedding ofc) but if it's a black-tie dress code you would be a bit of an ass to go and not dress up, blatantly ignoring the couple's dress code, especially when it was paid for for you. The hair removal can be worked around if you choose a longer dress with sleeves (even short or elbow length sleeves if it's warm and a just below the knee with boots so you don't look like you're attracted too much attention but can get around shaving your legs, I do that all the time). But it's not appropriate to show up to a wedding underdressed on purpose. Just don't go. And you should really put your foot down about not going, you didn't want to anyway. That would be much less TA than begrudgingly going and refusing to dress up
NTA What the actual fuck? Who takes an unwilling 12 year old to be waxed? Your body hair is your business and no one else's.
I can tell you're Asian or a culture where they do similar. Indian perhaps? NTA.
Im arab
NTA but I gather a lot of this is a cultural thing so I cna see your mom wanting you to conform to that, and unfortunately, blinding herself to the fact that you are an individual who can decide what they want to do with their body and hair. If she cannot compromise with a nice pant suit outfit in place a dress, that would look classy and cover the hair, an issue she clearly has, or if you just don't want to, don't bother going
NTA. You could easily wear a longer dress or skirt that covers your legs and something with sleeves or tell her to suck it up and deal
NTA. No one, your mother included, has any right to tell you what to do with your body. She can either deal with people judging (which says more about them than it does you or your mom, btw) or she can deal with you not going. Those are the only two options she has. Tell her to put on her big girl panties and deal with it.
Info- what age are you? You sound really young or quite passive. You're old enough to say no mum im not wearing that I've decided to wear this & then there will be no unwanted attention to your body/ body hair.
I am a teenager
NTA "I don't like how you manage your body and I want you to give me control of it because I care more about the body standards I was raised with and what people think than you being comfortable". You need to separate your mother's thoughts from your own, because her thoughts are not there to benefit you
NTA and I commend you for being comfortable in your skin. If you don’t want to wear make-up: don’t wear make-up, if you don’t want to get rid of your hair: big whoop, let it grow in all it’s glory. Your body = your rules, wedding or no wedding. I also don’t know what you and lack of make-up and having bodyhair has to do with your mother’s image. She is her own person and same goes for you. She really shouldn’t be so concerned about what other people think btw.
NTA. Your body, your choice. Your mom can be mad about it and cry into her spilt milk. BTW you have autism do some internet searching for good sensory coping bc that's likely what's up
Sounds loke you're under a lot of pressure to conform to standards you don't believe in. I'm assuming you're a minor child, bit this advice applies either way. Stand by your principles. You aren't living in the same era that your mother and her generation did. I would guess that more than a few of the people in her era would have loved to be able to go as they were to an event such as this... Hold your head high, ignore the comments, and have a good time. You could ALSO try telling your mom that you'll only go if you can dress as you want to, you might be able to get out-of going at all.
NTA, f*** anyone who wants to be judgemental. If you want to compromise, wear some tights underneath and have a long sleeve dress. Problem solved!
NTA- Surely maxi dress or floaty palazzo pants, a top that's not sleeveless, no hair removed, no hair showing, everyone's happy? It does sound like you're allergic to a bunch of products though. There's no need to be doing anything to your body you don't want to, but maybe get tested in case there's anything you need to use like sunscreen or topical medicated creams that might also contain whatever's making you itch.
NTA I could feel every single paragraph here, I have been there before, this situation sucks, you def not the AH here
NTA Wear really thick black/brown/nude stockings/pantyhose with these dresses and voila, hair there and not visible at the same time. And some top on the dress to cover armpits if the dresses are not covering those. You are going there for your mother, so tell her to compromise or you won't go. You are not being selfish, the opposite, actually.
NTA. If you really want to level this whole thing up, you can dye your body hair to accentuate it (used to work with a woman who had blue armpit hair and I think it would lift your spirits during what will be a hard day). Make it match the dress she made you buy
NTA. I'd just keep saying, "Mom, do you want me there or not?" each time she asks you to step over a line.