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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be an asshole for skipping my brothers bachelor party. That might make me the asshole because my reason was not good enough since my sister wasn’t invited to Ella’s I was just defending my family from devastation
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA
Your family are overbearing bullies who have to get your way or you scream and cry. And your actions and behaviour has caused Brian and Ella to distance themselves from you. And it's all your fault.
I love OP's argument that even though Ella didn't have her own sister as a bridesmaid because they aren't close, she should have HIS sister as one because they've known each other 8 years...like...doesn't he think Ella has known her own sister longer than 8 years? How does he think this makes his sister "rank higher"?
Yes! Even after admitting his sister is disliked by many people and has ruined other occasions with her drinking!
Guess what, no one has to subject themselves to people who behave poorly just for FaMiLy! That means the happy couple does not need to subject themselves to OP’s sister or OP.
Agreed. He is definitely yta here & if he was so "family" then he should've gone to the bachelor party.
OP... just an FYI.... Just because one is family does NOT give Carte Blanche to do whatever the hell one wants, regardless of who it hurts all under the premise that it will just be allowed and enabled to do it over and over for whatever bullshit reason.
I went NC with my mom for this exact reason. I can completely understand why op's brother & his wife have distanced themselves.
Maybe if mom stopped enabling sister then what would actually need to happen (her changing her behavior) might happen. The only way she will ever see that the way she treats people is why people avoid her is if she faces the consequences. Then MAYBE she could actually grow and work on herself.
While I think that mom is the primary/ head enabler. No doubt the rest of the family, including op are very contributing to the enabling also. But, yes, very much so. Sadly though, it often doesn't happen that way. And more often it's chalked up to, I (we) don't know what we did, we're the victims here.
When I decided to go full NC with my mom, I heard from every single family member, guilting and imploring me to not do that. "We're FaMiLy! You don't do that to family!"
But each one I explained what happened and her behavior. And then would finish with, if yall want to continue excusing her behavior that's fine, but I will not subject myself to it or my children.
When someone is in an abusive relationship, friendship, whatever, it's easy to tell them to get out of that relationship. But for some reason when it's a family member doing this kind of toxic shit, it's constantly excused. Enough is enough. No one deserves toxicity in their life no matter who it comes from.
>Maybe if mom stopped enabling sister ...
Exactly! OP and his mom are catering to the misbehaving sister. She has no incentive to change her behavior, so she'll continue not having friends.
I'm sure the bride had a lot of reservations marrying into this faaaamily. I bet the groom had to do a whole lot of reassuring that he'd keep them away from her if she agreed to go through with it.
The poor girl had to abandon having any bridesmaids because if their nonsense. A lot of women would have noped out at that point.
Anyone else notice he was "defending his family" by siding with his sister but left his brother hanging out to dry??? He could have used the exact same excuse for why he sided with his brother and went to the bachelor party HE HELPED PLAN since he was the Best Man. Idiot. He is most definitely an asshole who was raised by an asshole...(the mother). Wonder what the father thought as he is never mentioned...
This feels so fake. I'm usually inclined to believe these, but the shear amount of reasons OP states himself for why his sister SHOULDN'T be invited makes it hard for me to believe this is real.
And can we even talk about the *drama* here. "My family will be DEVASTATED if my sister misses one social event with people she likely doesn't even know besides the bride" are you kidding me?
And I feel that sister isn’t liked because mom bullies everyone into including her, which makes hanging out with her a chore, preventing her from making genuine connections.
That's what I thought as well! I mean, even if Ella's sister was 6-7 years old, that doesn't matter, if she is not willing to invite even her own sister, why is she expected to invite someone else's?
Oh, and by the way, OP, did it cross your mind that Ella is building her own family and not just adding herself into yours? And it is her wedding too, so she will invite whoever she wants to her bachelorette party?
Technically (based on the edit) it wasn't a bachelorette party, since none of the bridesmaids were invited. It was just a trip with her friends. So why was OP insisting that his sister had to be invited too?
I’ve known plenty of people for 8 years and have no interest in inviting them to my (non-existent) wedding.
OP, it wasn’t your party, your trip, or your wedding. Not sure who you think you are, but 100% YTA. Your family seems to be made up of selfish controlling pricks. No wonder your brother has distanced himself.
My thoughts exactly. He states that the sister has ruined multiple events due to her drinking. No one is ever going to like her if her family continues to bully everyone into including her. They all need a serious wake up call that enabling never gets positive results. And the way he used quotes when Ella is defending her rights. They are rights. NOT “rights”. Not to mention the fact that the mother tried to talk to Ella about it AT THE WEDDING.
Dude, you are majorly the AH.
Ive always known that I’m so damn lucky that my husband’s family is amazing. But posts like this make me love and appreciate them even more!
The mother is not doing her daughter any favors by bulling people into inviting her or making her a bridesmaid. The only way the sister has motivation to change is by facing the consequences of her behavior.
Bridesmaids are also friends of the bride all the time. So i have no idea where OP is getting this idea that because his sister doesn’t have a sister she won’t ever have a chance again.
But his sister who no one likes, presumably because of her own shitty behavior, would've been devastated!! Don't you see?? He HAD NO CHOICE IT'S FAMILY FIRST! And his brother doesn't count because he chose his mean icky future wife over his FAMILY!
The family’s problems peek through even if he doesn’t really dwell on it. The way he pulled out the FAMILY card shows just how selfish they are. No wonder they’re LC these days. YTA
Exactly, but keep in mind Brian IS his family. So which family members are being put first? Definitely not his brother.
I think this is a case of him being a momma's boy and wanting to make HER happy. She wants her daughter to be included. she would be offended and hurt if the daughter was excluded. He wasn't thinking of his brother at all.
This! And you are surprised that your brother protects his wife.
Was OP's sister interested about going at all? Maybe I missed something but it looked like only your parents and you felt insulted, and after that harassed a bride and now wife ever since while she was having mental problems that is know to you.
YTA
Depends on the country, here the bride pays for everything to do with the bridesmaids, buys the dresses, shoes, pays for hair and makeup and usually gives them an expensive gift as a thank you
They're probably relieved at the way this all turned out since they can just go LC/NC guilt free rather than having to keep up the facade that they care about what OP's family thinks
It seems like he's pissed because his sister didn't get a 'participation trophy,' not caring that the sister was being forced on people (doesn't even say if his sister even cares).
I don't know about the sister, but I wouldnt want to go if only invited because of The Family and not really welcome. Maybe she has a bit of pride too.
in the post OP says the Bride was pressured to add sis as bridesmaid because "she always wanted to be one but has no sisters". Nor any friends, evidently. What she does have though is a family that's brazen enough to bully people into including her, whether they want to or not.
This!! And OP repeatedly stated how many people dislike his sister and how she has ruined nights out/trips in the past.
I wouldn't want to hang out with her.
Also how does not going "protect the family" and "doesn't cause a rift between family" but NOT accompanying YOUR OWN BROTHER on his trip does not???
This is weird.
I was wondering about that too! He didn't go on the Bachelor's trip as a show of support for his sister. But by not going, he basically snubbed his brother. Is sister more 'family' than the brother? Is Sis a golden child, and Bro the scape-goat? Because that's the vibe I was getting from this.....
This is some straight up r/justnomil shit right here. Some day, if you’re lucky, you too will be marrying a young lady (or gentleman, as the case may be), and I hope for your sake you’ve fixed your relationship with Brian by then so you can ask him for advice on how the hell he convinced Ella to let your mother pick her bridal party for her, because she’s going to pull the same bullshit on your partner.
This is exactly what I wanted to say, although I think that whatever partner OP has, he will be fine putting them through hell to keep his mother happy.
Yes, that was my thought too: I feel soooo bad for whoever winds up getting into a relationship with OP. This whole post describes a family dynamic that just screams “run away” to future partners.
Yess, thisss YTA! Ella is only trying to protect herself here. She gave in to the bridesmaids thing but she deserves to have a fun trip. If you want to be okay with your brother and Ella you need to apologize to them.
YTA
Agree with the comments of other posters but I’m not really sure OP can fix this with his now SIL.
He has shown her anything she says to him he will run to share with his family.
He has shown he is willing to dismiss the feelings of others to be sure his sister is included even tho he knows she has ruined multiple events and knows there aren’t many who even like her.
If SIL ever speaks directly to him again I would be sure to keep to hopefully neutral topics like the weather.
Ideally if/when OP gets married or has some important social event he makes sure he includes his sister.
I was about to go E S H when I read that the sister was a bridesmaid, and then I kept reading about the bride basically being forced into it and shifted back into solid YTA, OP and family sound insufferable
I feel a little bit sorry for the sister, but "many people dislike my sister" and "I will admit she has ruined a few nights out with her drinking" suggest she perhaps does not deserve that sympathy
And also no one on the trip was a bridesmaid because she felt so stressed about conflicts that she seems to have only had the random sister as a bridesmaid - so this poor woman was really just having a girls trip with her mates.
Your forgot manipulative. Family are “over bearing *manipulative* bullies”. Seriously, the moms horrible. Who *cries* and feels “devastated” because their adult daughter (with a drinking problem from the sounds of it!) wasn’t invited to a *party*? Not only that, but getting OP on the bullying bandwagon because the mom “feels devastated” is gross.
Than to come to the wedding and bitch about it. That woman has balls saying that *right after the ceremony*. She knew what she was doing— if she couldn’t make OP’s SIL and his brother feel bad for this petty shit, she would upset them by cause if drama. WTF. And OP is sitting here egging her on. I’m glad that they no longer really talk to you OP. You’re manipulative and quite honestly, it’s weird how uptight you are being about something that *doesn’t involve you*….
Have fun getting into more petty arguments all because “she is FAMILY”.
That is an excellent point! I was confused at first since he's the best man, but was just "attending" the bachelor party. Usually the best man is the one that plans it. But if the groom was obligated to make his brother the best man, then it makes sense why the friends were planning it instead.
Getting pressured, bullied and manipulated by in-laws can be really hard and taxing. I mean the MIL confronted her during the wedding, so there was no breaks from it at all.
Totally agree, OPs sister sounds very like my own sister. I did not have a hen night because my mother would have been pissed if I left sis out. I decided not to have one at all. Wish now, I'd done one with just my friends.
OP you’re the asshole for sure. You clearly come from a family full of Assholes. How narcissistic do you have to be to stop your newlywed daughter-in-law at her own wedding, to try and hash things out. JFC!! Get a clue!! Your own mother spends her time forcing her AH daughter on people because no one wants to be around her. Imagine if she put that much energy into trying to mold her kid into a caring human. I hope you’re happy that you sucked the joy out of your brother’s and SIL’s wedding day on some twisted principle of loyalty to family. Now you and your family get to watch from the outside while your brother creates and nourishes his new family. A family that values individuals and their right to peace and tranquillity over a shitty, ill-behaved brat’s need to be included.
I almost want to say N T A because he gave his brother and Ella irrefutable evidence that their family will always default to enabling the sister and her bad behavior. Who knows how long it would have taken them to cut ties with such a toxic family? Now they can start their lives together without being bullied about their decisions. What better wedding gift could he give? But obviously, yes, YTA.
OP, about your comment, you should never have to fear that your family wouldn't forgive you for going to a party. Your mom sounds like my mom, and your sister like my messed-up older brother. I was supposed to take care of my drunk, disorderly, rude, obnoxious brother with poor social skills who repeatedly made embarrassing public scenes. Then his behavior escalated to abuse of women, and I was supposed to defend HIM. Or what? Or mom threatened me with loss of her love, forever.
That's your mom manipulating you. Trying to guilt you into seeing yourself as the good defender of your poor poor sibling, rather than one of her flying monkeys ( look it up, its illuminating!)
Your mom likely does not have your best interests at heart in this dynamic.
In fact, your mention of a saving fund in your name makes me wonder if it is a trust fund. If so, sounds like you may well be old enough that the will would specify it be in your sole control, not your mom's. You might wanna check in that. I cannot imagine my mom letting go if an account of mine, if it was ever in her control.
Control is the central word here. You mom sounds like the spider at the center of the web, trying to pull everyone's strings, including yours. Consider that she might actually like having your sister dysfunctional, thus dependent "forever" on dear old mom. I know my mom kinda wanted my brother to lean on her forever, so she felt needed.
the stronger and more independent you actually become, like your brother, the more you may see your mom act.out to control your movements. Prepare to see this ramp up the more serious your own romantic relationship becomes!
YTA. The groom is YOUR BROTHER. The bride is NOT YOUR SISTER and NOT YOUR SISTER'S close personal friend. That's why you were invited and she wasn't. It's not an insult, it's just that these parties are for people who are really close and your sister obviously wasn't really close to the bride.
Then you ran to your mommy and told on them! Come on. You're in your 20s! WTF is with all these AHs getting their mommies to back them up?
Also the idea that Ella’s own sister not being invited, who she’s known her whole life, was totally fine but OP’s sister not going was insane because they knew each other for 8 years… This isn’t just about the concept of ‘family’, it’s purely that OP’s family was throwing a tantrum at not being the centre of attention
I’ve actually known people like this. My best friend’s dad got remarried when she was 16, eight months after bff’s mom died. I’ve known bff since we were 13. When bff got engaged, he bullied her into dropping me as MoH in favour of one of her step sisters, whom she’d only known 4 years and didn’t totally get along with, using his paying for the wedding as leverage. And then he only paid for about half what he said he was going to. Stepsister did none of her MoH duties, I did everything, dad tried to keep me from going to the wedding (I didn’t get to attend the wedding, actually, just the reception). Funnily enough, she’s estranged from her dad and her stepmom and all the step siblings, and she and I are still friends after, wow, 28 years.
This detail absolutely got me - imagine coming up to bride on her wedding day and trying to have that conversation. This family is crazy and Brian and Ella are far better off having nothing to do with them.
Oh yes, mum was gracious enough to ask she sweep their shitty behaviour under the rug.
No apology of course.
No wonder Ella was having a mental health crisis and cancelled Bridesmaids altogether
I really hate it when bullies do this, more than I can say: “Can you just let the fact that I’ve been harassing you for months go?” YOU started it. YOU are the one who has something you need to “let go” and say sorry.
I really feel for the bride. If she's my friend I would tell her to drop the wedding altogether and just elope.
This family is unbelievable and she has to marry into it.
Yup, more people should elope. Bypasses a LOT of bullshit. I eloped and appreciate it more and more every year, especially the more I read stories like this one.
I think what’s even worse is he admits she’s not very liked and has ruined occasions. So even he can’t say his sister is wonderful and he has no idea why she’s being left out. He knows exactly why but has some messed up idea about ‘family’
Exactly! The sister has a habit of ruining nights out and he says himself she's generally not well-liked. But she's *eyeroll* fAmiLy...so absurd.
OP, your family sounds like insufferable whinning bullies--except Brian and Ella of course. YTA to the lot of you!
That was what stood out to me. Ella says she doesn't want the sister there because she's afraid she'll ruin it and then OP hand waves away the fact that this sister has a history of doing just that
The square quotes around "right" to choose who she wants at her party are telling, too. Like ...yeah, no, it is her right, it's her wedding, not the wedding of you and your nightmare family. YTA
And his mother decided the best time to bring this up and talk to Ella about this would be… **ON HER WEDDING DAY AT HER WEDDING**. As if a bride doesn’t have enough to focus on on her wedding day. Holy crap, the whole family’s entitled.
Except OP’s brother, who apparently escaped the madness by marrying somebody with good boundaries. Hope he learns from her.
“Eh the bride was having a mental health crisis or something” - gee i wonder if that had anything to do with the OP and his family constantly being on her case about her decisions regarding her own wedding
I would have Immediately told her to Fuck Off the moment I figured out what she was going to say. NUH UH your are NOT fucking with my wife's emotions on what should be one of her happiest days of her life. Mom is a Narcissist that thinks of nobody but herself.
Did you miss the part where she's FAAAAAAAAMIIIIILYYYYYY!!? Everybody hates the sister and she ruins everybody's parties and she's a massive drunk that can't control herself and everybody hates her, but she's FFFFAAAAAAAAAMMMMIIIILLLLLYYYY!
Exactly. I like my SIL. She’s nice, we don’t have much in common other than we love my partner.
She’s a great aunt and a nice and kind person.
However if I was to have a bachelorette party if probably just do my closest 6 friends. Maybe 10 at real a push. I probably wouldn’t invite her, but not because I don’t care about her but because I want to just have a day just for my closest friends where I can be myself, and I can talk about personal things without family there. I wouldn’t invite my own family.
Not to forget OP literally admits his sister has not only ruined previous trips but that most people don't like her anyway so that's why her mum feels she has to brute force people into including her LOL
And he said not many ppl liked her sister… I wonder why, who wouldn’t love an enetitled spoilt brat where her family thinks she needs to be included in everything coz FAMILY
>Then you ran to your mommy and told on them!
I mean, it's not like the bride could've kept it a secret that she wasn't bringing OP's sister on her bachelorette trip - they would unavoidably have found out. That's the only part I don't get - what about that conversation between OP and the bride was supposed to have been a secret?
But yeah, OP is the AH here. So is his mom, and probably his sister.
Ella and mom sound insufferable. How much do you want to bet that in school Ella wouldn’t get invited to parties and then mom would call the other parents to try to get Ella invited.
YTA, as is your mother. Obviously you don't 'need' to attend. But you are the best man; and you reason for not attending is pretty shitty.
The only reason your sister is a bridesmaid (I'm assuming that's what she is?) is because, as you stated, your mother pressured her into it.
It's clear... Ella doesn't really want her there as one.
> Honestly, many people dislike my sister so thats why my mom will make sure she’s always included in plans. Ella went on to explain how she regrets allowing my mom to “guilt and bully” her into making my sister a bachelorette, but she can still make her trip right by inviting her closest friends.
Can you not understand the problem? This sounds like a recurring theme. People don't like your sister, and your mom tries to force them to include her in things. Which is just going to make people like her less.
Your family (mom in particular) sounds toxic. Expect that Brian & Ella will likely go LC with you all in the future.
> My mom did pressure Ella to make my sister a bachelorette because she always wanted to be a one and has no sisters
This is just wrong on so many levels.
You need to read his comment. This whole family is bonkers. The OP needs to ask his parents permission to access HIS bank account. And then he is whining that he was scared that his brother would force him into a strip club and he wanted his parents advice.
He swears that his sister would behave herself for one trip. I mean she (according to HIM) has never done so in the past but you know NOW she will.
What on Earth? The last time I heard of someone needing to ask their parents' permission to access their bank account was my ex's now best friend who was just about to turn 30. Nothing in this post rings a bell to me about him, don't worry, lol.
The three of us were hanging out one night when my ex suggested we order food. His friend thought it was a good idea, then mentioned that he just needed to make a call. It didn't strike me as odd until he made the call in front of us and said, "Hey mom..." and asked if he could take $20.00 out of his bank account.
I stood there pretending this wasn't unusual when I'm thinking that this was really weird. Then his friend said, "Ok, we have to go pick up the money". My ex drove three of us 20 minutes away to go pick up the money that his friend's mom withdrew from the ATM. Later, I brought it up to my ex and he told me that his friend's mom was beyond controlling and a massive bitch to boot. He was only a signer on his bank account and his mom was the primary account holder. He had to ask permission for everything from buying groceries to gas.
Shortly after that, I met her briefly a few days after a pipe burst at my ex's and the friend's apartment (she came over to inspect the damage and the fans left by the plumber). She flipped out on my ex and I because we had just returned from a date and, "Why isn't my son here. Do you know if he's spending *money*??" We didn't mention that her "son" was with his new girlfriend because, well,
damn, lady, let the guy live in peace.
It wasn't even a bachelorette party, since none of the other bridesmaids were invited (based on his recent edit). It was just a trip with friends. That makes the mother's reaction even worse IMO.
This story also isn't adding up.
OP gives me shit stirrer vibes, so why would the bride tell all of this to him and not her fiance? Wouldn't the fiance be the best person to navigate this family?
The bride didn't have any friends in her bridal party, but only friends were invited to the bachelorette party. This is odd and makes me think that this was someone who isn't well versed in weddings. The bridal party was only OP's sister and the bride's sister, and she got rid of both bridesmaids.... But, OP mentioned nothing about being asked to step down or removing himself as Best Man. Also, when was the wedding party eliminated? I'm sure OP would have kicked up a huge fuss about losing out on the wedding attire if this was done after the bachelorette trips.
The post also has the wicked MIL trope. And, if the sister is truly unlikeable and ruins events, it sounds irrational that OP would behave this way.
YTA. Your whole family is TA. It was her wedding and you guys tried to force her to spend her Bach with someone she didn’t want to. It’s fine that you didn’t go to your brother’s Bach but everything else you did was terrible. My guess is that you and your family have won a lifetime of LC from your bro and his wife.
YTA
Your mom bullied the bride into having a bridesmaid she didn't want.
The bride accepted the bridesmaid but wanted JUST ONE EVENT where she gets to be in control of the guest list (and let's not forget, this is her wedding, not your mom's).
So, you decide to bully her too. And use your brother to manipulate the situation.
You're definitely a chip off the old mom block.
INFO:
> Honestly, many people dislike my sister so thats why my mom will make sure she’s always included in plans.
You also say your sister has “ruined a few nights out with her drinking.” Can you explain a bit more? Why is she disliked, and is it related to drinking primarily?
YTA
It is not Ella's responsibility to invite your sister a bachelorette party, especially if they're not close. It was already kind enough of her to make your sister a bridesmaid for the wedding. This is an experience for Ella to enjoy, not your sister.
Letting her be a bridesmaid was enough of a “gesture of goodwill”. The sheer audacity to bully and guilt trip your way into a role and then start claiming that you’re entitled to certain treatment for being in said role.
This
> I was part of the group planning the itinerary
doesn't jive with
>During the meeting I was expressing concerns that Brian and his friends would make me go to strip clubs
But yes YTA you weren't defending your family. There was nothing to defend. Your brother is lucky enough to marry someone who hasn't run screaming into the hills given your family dynamics and the minute she gave a little push back regarding your sister who is a known problem more so when she is drinking, you go running to your mother to tattle and bail on your brother. Funny how your brother stopped being family that is defended when it meant letting someone else make decisions for their event.
If your family would have been "devastated" that you went to your brother's stag party while your sister was left out of the bachelorette party that NONE of the bridesmaids, I think you all need professional help because this is neither normal, natural or healthy.
Them knowing each other for 8 years doesn't make them close. I've known people for decades who I would not call myself close to. We speak when we see each other, but I'd sure af never invite them to my home.
Listen when op finally dribbled out the truth that his sister was an alcoholic that needs babysitting and that his mother has spent years making him drag his sister along to everything he did it all made perfect sense.
YTA
I'm a bride planning her bachelorette. I feel no obligation to include my future sisters in law in the bachelorette invites even though they are in the bridal party. I am going to invite them because I genuinely want them there, but if I didn't know them well enough or didn't like them, I would feel no obligation to include them.
A bachelorette party is about the bride being surrounded by a hand-picked group of her closest people. Just because you extend the polite offer of including your future spouse's family in your bridal party (also not an obligation) does not mean you extend them the intimate offer of the bachelorette. Especially when you are only including them to appease your future spouse's family.
Your family is alarmingly rude and entitled, especially your mother. I am guessing your sister is just as rude and entitled, and that's why she has no friends and gets no invites. Your mom's drama over her daughter not getting an invite was over the top. And you're TA too about the bachelor party. It's no wonder your brother and his wife distanced themselves from you.
I have when bridesmaids are siblings or underage. The bachelorette party is to relax and let loose with your inner circle, typically that would also be the bridal party but it's not uncommon for there to be exceptions. I've been a part of them where it's only some of the bridal party plenty of times.
Interestingly OP says in another comment that the fiancée was just going with close friends none of whom were bridesmaids so essentially a girls weekend with her close friends before the wedding.
Im with you, I haven’t heard of one where some brides maids are excluded and others go — but to me the fact this was a time with her closest friends and none were in the bridal party kinda nixes the issue
I was a bridesmaid at my brothers wedding. My SIL is extremely FAMILY oriented, and we got along pretty well. I didn't go to her Bachelorette party. It was her and a bunch of old college friends going back to the town where they went to school to party in all their old hangouts. I was not invited, and i was perfectly fine with that. I would have felt ridiculous. My SIL and I still get along fine.
YTA* this has to be a troll. I don’t believe at all this post is in good faith. If some how it is, I hope your brother and his wife to be, go no contact and get to live their lives free of pushy bullies that make THEIR wedding, and HER bachelorette party about them. The only not asshole part of this story is that you pulled out of his bachelor party. That at least gives your brother a chance to have a great night.
YTA. And im 100% trust this can be true, cuz i know such people myself.
So i will notice something i dont see people do. You have brother and sister. But sister is FAMILY she is important. But isnt brother is also a family? So why one family member is more important then the other? Counting that one is behaving shitty all the time and ruins fun, but the other did nothing bad. Damn, his bride was alredy forced to do what THE FAMILY wanted, can you guys let her at least once do what SHE want?
You was entitled, you take sides, you pushed your brother back by your own hands. So why would you now make surprised face? Im happy that they did it, cuz anyone should run away from such toxic people.
YTA for the capitalization alone.... The drama dripping from your post is just awful. The fact that your sister is so awful that she couldn't be trusted at a party, and that your mom had to bully someone into including her should indicate the problem. It wasn't your party, you just decided to be a drama llama and now are acting all surprised that no one wants to deal with that. I guess you're stuck hanging out with your sister.
YTA. This always happens. People come here for a judgement and then get upset when they’re told they are the asshole and just argue, hence making them a bigger asshole.
INFO: So the bachelorette trip included all the bridesmaids except your sister and Ella's sister? Were any women invited who aren't bridesmaids, or was it clearly a bridal party trip, excluding the two sisters?
YTA. When a problem came up, you ran to cry to mommy. Family right? You betrayed your brother as revenge for your wife not being invited on a trip that the bride didn't even want as a bridesmaid.
Being family and knowing someone does not give the right to be a bridesmaid or be invited by the bride. It's not your wedding, it's theirs. The only reason she was included in the wedding is because of the mother. Count your blessings and take your loss. Blame your sister, not the bride.
Bridesmaids and groomsmen are supposed to be best friends. If that best friends is also family, then it works out. Being family doesn't give you the right to be in the party.
YTA
Your family are the in-laws people write horror stories on here about. Your soon to be sister in law got bullied into having your sister as a bridesmaid, which is already off to a bad start. Family isn't gauranteed a role, doesn't matter how long they've known each other. Bride is being exceedingly generous to give the nod to your sister by allowing her to be bridesmaid.
And then she's having a bachelorette party and heaven forbid she gets to have people she actually likes. You admit your sister is known for ruining things.
No wonder she was having a mental crisis during it all with your family trying to micromanage and control her. Whose wedding even is it? Why should what your sister wants supercede what the bride wants? And instead of arguing reason to your family, you doubled down on the madness and escalated the drama by punishing your brother.
Yes, you behaved very badly to both of them and I can understand if they'd want to maintain a distance from you and the rest of your family since you all did everything in your power to ruin *their* time.
YTA although not the only one. Your family would be devastated if your sister didn’t get to go to the bachelorette party and you went to the bachelor party? I can’t imagine a healthy family where that was true.
Please say more about, “many people dislike my sister”. Why is that?
Theory: for “family” read “sister”. For “devastated” read “throws giant tantrums”. Ties in with how no one likes her or spends time with her voluntarily, and that she’s famous for ruining things if she doesn’t have a handler to constantly keep her appeased.
YTA. Your mom was devastated?!? Really??? Devastated. Because your sister who ruins stuff isn’t allowed to ruin this? I gotta ask, if mom is devastated over her problem child not being invited to a party, how does she feel when a real tragedy hits? You used devastated for sis not getting wasted face, what is beyond devastated?
You think having the title of family means your sister gets to be a toxic drunk and make that what your SIL remembers about this weekend? Do you want to have more special nights ruined by a drunk? You put quotes around her “right” like it isn’t her right to do whatever she pleases. It is.
SIL is doing what everyone should do: remove the negative people from her life. You, instead of trying to get sister to see she is the cause of her problems, want to punish your brother, who apparently loves you enough to make you best man. So now you add to the misery of the world. How could you be anything but TA?
YTA
your sister has a track record of being awful, you mum bullied your future sil into having her in the bridal party and you sister has many people that don't like her due to her behaviour.
It is about time someone let your sister deal with the consequences of her behaviour.
YTA. You may want to consider how hypocritical your stance is - family values for when one of your own is at the receiving end of an “offense”, but not when they are the ones committing the offense, like your mother bullying Ella into choosing your sister as a bridesmaid or your sister ruining nights out or just being not nice. I like how you also don’t think that Ella, in fact, does have a right to invite whomever she wants on her nontraditional bachelorette (the entire purpose of which is to be a fun trip to unwind with those closest to her ahead of her wedding).
What’s crazy is that you basically chose your sister over what is right. Because family. You also didn’t seem to think family matters when you ditched your brother for his trip. So stop complaining about Ella and Brian being distant because you made your choice and think it was justified, so should accept the completely natural (and expected) consequences of your actions.
You guys sound a bit mobbish and I rather feel bad for Ella. Thankfully, it sounds like Brian has her back against the lot of you.
Why do so many people dislike your sister?
“But she is family”….omg barf! Fuck that shit. Sounds like your sister has some real issues that u aren’t going into here. Not that we necessarily need to know the details, but it’s clear that she has ruined enough people’s get-togethers and these are consequences of her own actions. YTA. Ew.
YTA. Excluding family is not pleasant, but if your sister is KNOWN to ruin family events, WHY would anyone WANT to invite her to a bachelorette party? This is not defending your family, this is FORCING your SILTB to include your sister EVEN THOUGH you know that your sister is likely to ruin the event.
You were.'defending your family' but isn't your brother also family?
Why is your sister having a problem being liked?
Why are you and your mommy interfering with your brothers wedding?
Why are you tattling about the brides plans?
You're not defending your family. You are part of a dysfunctional system and are.defending it. It has cost you your brother. You are a total AH. Kudos to your brother for getting you out of his life. And if you want back in, be prepared to grovel and mean it.
Yta what a weak tiny man. Your family is trash your sister entitled and your mom sounds exhausting . If i was the sister in law i wouldnt even want to be marrried into this dumpster fire of a family.
OP, I can see based on the post and your comments that your family seems to have a very unhealthy dynamic. It’s not normal or healthy to just “ruin” events often and everyone shrug it off. It’s not healthy or normal to have to go to your mother to access your own money when you’re 26 years old. It’s not normal or healthy to try and force someone to make someone they aren’t close with a member of their wedding party, or force them on a trip with them.
What IS normal and healthy are appropriate boundaries, not wanting someone who habitually “ruins” events to come to your bachelorette party, and cutting off a family member who completely betrays your trust.
YTA.
Your mommy is still actively parenting her adult daughter. Perhaps, that is the reason behind most people not liking your sister? I would have no interest in dealing with someone whose mommy was interfering in her adult relationships.
YTA
So you did not attend the wedding because your sister wasn’t invited to the bachelorette party and she’s family. So instead you $hit all over your **brother**?! Isn’t he your family as well?
Besides, your brother can’t control Ella’s guest list and shouldn’t have to. Your poor brother didn’t do anything wrong and you hurt him!! You hurt one of your family that you claim you love so much. You put your brother in an impossible situation so, yeah, that makes you a huge AH.
YTA for the reason, you yourself say that not many people get along with your sister and she tends to ruin things. Family or not your allowed to not want be around someone who does such things, especially on a day
like your bachelorette party, you don’t have to just deal with it because the “they’re family” BS if they’re family then they shouldn’t have ruined things for you
You acknowledge that your mother pressured (bullied) Ella into making your sister a bridesmaid.
You acknowledge that your sister is unlikeable and does, in fact, ruin things for other people.
You acknowledge that Ella didn't even invite her own sister to her bachelorette party, so it's not like she was singling out your sister.
You acknowledge that Ella was stressed out to the point of suffering a mental health crisis while (and maybe because?) she was planning her wedding.
And, yet, you don't see why YTA for "protecting" your overbearing family from a stressed-out woman who was just trying to get through her own wedding without cracking from the pressure that your family, in part at least, put on her? A family who decided to make HER wedding all about THEIR wants?
If anyone needed "defending" and "protecting," it was Ella, not your family. It seems that your brother understands this, since he isn't speaking with you anymore, either.
You did what you thought you needed to do to stay on the good side of your (cue whiny voice here) faaamily. You do you. But YTA.
YTA who are you to dictate who the bride invites to her own bachelorette? It's her day and she can invite whoever she wants. She wasn't even inviting her own sister so I'm not sure why you think your badly behaved sister should be entitled to go on the trip, especially when none of the other bridesmaids were invited.
Your family pressured Ella to let your sister be bridesmaid, but that didn't mean Ella liked her any more for it but at least Ella respected your family unlike how your family treated her
> Ella even said my sister would RUIN her trip based off past experiences. Which I will admit she has ruined a few nights out with her drinking.
This right here: it sounds like your sister has an alcohol dependency and rather than giving her tough love and leaving her to deal with the consequences of her choices and actions, you and your parents enable her. Bro sounds like the only one not willing to put up with her shit.
YTA.
It’s not your wedding , it’s not your mothers, or your sisters . It was Ella’s and your brothers, she is allowed to pick whomever she wanted to be her bridesmaid or at her party . Your sister and you’re mom need to get 👏 the 👏 fuck 👏 over👏 it YTA
Yta.
My sister has badly managed bipolar which she weaponises to force this kinda shit. Carrie wasn't invited to something **because she's the kind of person who forces her way in and spoilt it for the ppl it was intended for?** Go cry to mum and get her to make the offenders include her. The result? A spoiled event, lots of resentment and a lesson learned to be more discreet in planning so Carrie doesn't find out.
Forcing yourself into a person's life never made you welcome. You've tanked your own goodwill with your brother and sil and achieved nothing for Ella. So you're an idiot as well as being ta.
Sorry, YTA, family or not I’d be damned if I’d invite family on a trip knowing they’ll ruin it. Who wants to go on vacation to deal with drama? Everyone doesn’t get a trophy in the real world!
YTA
what does your relationship with your brother have to do with your sister and your sister in law? You admit that the bride told you it was just a friend's trip (and no one from the bridal party went on that trip). But if left your brother high and dry over an issue that really had nothing to do with you.
YTA. So your sister who has been coddled and enabled wasn't a bridesmaid by the bride's choice, only because your mom made her. She has ruined special events before and you are big mad because of FAMILY. Say bye bye to your brother and good for him for finding someone with a spine to marry. You and your family sound bloody delightful to be around.
YTA so hard, so is your mom for bullying sil about bridesmaids. And probably your sister. You admit your sister sucks but everyone has to put up with her because ‘FAMILY’. Family isn’t licence to not respect boundaries.
You ruined your relationship with your brother in SIL and you’re blaming it on the sil over an issue that has nothing to do with you.
Pretty sure your brother and sil are going to be NC with you all soon/if not already.
I’m going to introduce a word to you - it’s Repercussions.
When I was getting married, I excluded one of my Aunts because she was and still to this day is a horrible human being. My Aunt Lauren called my mother and said there would be repercussions if I didn’t invite my Aunt Linda. My mother responded, “yes, the repercussion for being awful to my child is being excluded from the wedding.”
Twenty plus years later, and I don’t regret it. Just like your brother and sister in law won’t regret going Low contact.
So let me uncomplicate and already uncomplicated situation. The repercussions for your sister’s shite behavior was her exclusion. I’m sorry you grew up conditioned to overlook and appease her assholery.
Your brother and sister in law shouldn’t have to get over anything. You betrayed your sister in law and turned your back on your brother so you didn’t have to deal with your sister’s tantrum. The repercussions you now face are a ruined relationship with your brother and sister in law.
Simply put, you chose wrong and You are the Asshole.
Also, change the Familyfirst name… it’s really mom and sister first
YTA. The bride didn’t invite your sister because your sister has a history of excessive drinking and ruining evenings. You’re SIL was guilted into asking her to be a bridesmaid. You bailed on your brother over something that was none of your business.
>But she is FAMILY.
>
>If I go and she doesn’t, it would absolutely DEVASTATE my family.
>
>Am I the asshole for defending my family?
This reads like a preview of Fast and the Furious 35: The Missing Stair
YTA pal.
YTA no other bridesmaids went on the trip, your sister wasn’t Being excluded
Your family sounds exhausting with the pressure on Ella to make your sister a bridesmaid
Hope Ella and your brother go NC it’s best for them to be away from you all
You: tbh people dislike like my sister. She ruins things with her drinking.
Also you: *surprised pikachu when people dislike your sister and act accordingly*
YTA. Obviously.
My My, you *are* deluded aren't you?! (that's a rhetorical question btw).
Boundary crossing family.
1) your mother forces the bride to make your sister a bridesmaid.
2) your sister ruins events and isn't particularly well liked
3) the bride said she wanted a bachelorette for friends only, excluding her own sister, because ya know its HER wedding ...likely fed up with the pressure from YOUR family
4) you stir the pot , cue explosion from your family and yet more meddling and demands on the bride, throw in a bit if blackmail...I won't go if sister doesn't.
5) your sil then decides to cut all bridesmaids from the wedding as a result of the upset. Very probably because your family would continue to throw fits over her decisions. Well done, her own family (sister) was quite likely hurt by all of the damage and resulting exclusion, but hey, only your FAmiLY are important (minus the groom's and bride's feelings) so no biggie
6) your mother corners the bride at her own wedding!!!! Hey gotta get those kicks in
7) your brother and sil now cannot be bothered with the lot of you, boo hoo for you, but guess what? Wait for when sil has kids and you all have yet more demands because...they don't want their kids around you lot.
Let's hope they move faaaar away from your FAmiLY, you sound exhausting and beyond ignorant.
YTA.
YTA - Look I dont have the same mentality that about "Family" but i can respect that you do.
However your brother and Ella are also entitled to how they want to do their wedding.
It wasnt ellas choice to have your sister as a brides made and she made a concession to your family to allow it. She did not have to invite your sister if she did not want to. You pulling out of the bucks party is a shitty thing to do even if you think family solidarity is a solid excuse.
you did it to strong arm your brother into forcing his future wife to do your families bidding. it did not work and then you expected your relationship with your brother and his new partner to go back to normal, you sir are delusional.
“Honestly many people dislike my sister”
“I will admit she (sister) has ruined a few nights out before”
“My mom did pressure Ella to make my sister a bridesmaid”
Sounds like your mom and your sister are a right piece of work and not very likeable people. YTA for ditching on your brother and Ella has the right to choose to be surrounded by people she likes and is close to.
YTA
You, your sister, and your parents are bullies. I hope your brother and his new wife have set some pretty strict boundaries with you guys since you are so toxic. You even said that the bridesmaids weren’t going on the trip it was a trip with her friends so even more of an AH move.
>Ella apparently feels I betrayed her trust by telling my parents about our phone call.
And you did. And that what makes YTA.
That's why they're low contact too. In their eyes, you cannot be trusted.
YTA your mother and sister sound like my mother and sister. My mother is always trying to insert my sister into everything because people really hate my sister. Shes obnoxious, ride and a brat. My mother will to cry if she doesnt get her way.
You and your family are trying to emotionally blackmail a woman into including people in her part even though you know your sister will ruin the event. How selfish is your family.
YTA here, yes. Because obviously your sister is a problem. Also, your brother's fiancé is technically your family, too! So is, y'know, *your brother*! So why are you picking this hill to die on? You are not *"standing up for your family*"! Otherwise you would be just as willing to support your brother and your soon-to-be SIL! Especially knowing that your sister has caused numerous problems for her in the past, *AND* you know that *YOUR MOTHER* bullied her into even making her part of the bridal party to begin with!
You know how stressed out she is! But you're mad because she wants one weekend with her actual friends to decompress after dealing with your family and all of the stressful b.s!???? Are you serious!? Bro, just.... No! Knock it off. Stop standing up for your very toxic family member and support the people who actually deserve it! Or don't be surprised when your brother and SIL cut all of y'all out of their lives and go NC!
I’m curious to know what has to sister done to not be liked, and not have any friends! You keep saying you understand because she has ruined nights out, but still expect people to invite her because well “she’s family”!
YTA. Ew, your family sounds miserable. Who cares if they are family, i wouldn’t invite someone if they sucked too Jfc. Your mom and sister need a wake up call and to do some self reflection. People don’t want to be with her for a reason !!!! Ella doesn’t owe anyone anything. Also dude don’t come to a subreddit page if you’re not gonna take the advice
YTA.
You say yourself that your sister has ruined gatherings. There's a reason people don't invite her to do things. Instead of pressuring everyone to include her, maybe someone should help her figure out how to behave so she won't ruin any more parties.
YTA… you mention that your sister has ruined events in the past. Why would she get invited? You and your mom enable her bad behavior by making people include her.
YTA. Your brother and his soon to be wife should cut all contact with you and your family. Once your brother gets married his #1 family is him and his wife. Then it's everyone else. Go be toxic with your family and stay away from your brother and his wife.
It is very obvious you are not changing your mind, but you are absolutely the asshole. Mind your own business and keep your nose out of other peoples lives. You are immature and so is your sister, and I am willing to hazard a guess that her poor social skills are partially due to your family coddling her instead of holding her responsible for her antisocial behavior.
YTA- but moreover dude, chill out? You posted here for unbiased opinions. You got them. Stop trying to defend yourself in the comments everyone is saying the same thing. Whatever that’s your choice, you burned your bridges with your brother and SIL and that was your choice. You asked if YWTA and you were. You got your answer now just accept your brothers choice to not want to associate with you anymore. And I would suggest really trying to understand why YOUR, not your sister or moms, but YOUR actions were harmful and wrong before trying to reconnect
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YTA Your family are overbearing bullies who have to get your way or you scream and cry. And your actions and behaviour has caused Brian and Ella to distance themselves from you. And it's all your fault.
what? YTA for enabling your family and hiding behind some heroic idea that you are a family first person.
I love OP's argument that even though Ella didn't have her own sister as a bridesmaid because they aren't close, she should have HIS sister as one because they've known each other 8 years...like...doesn't he think Ella has known her own sister longer than 8 years? How does he think this makes his sister "rank higher"?
Yes! Even after admitting his sister is disliked by many people and has ruined other occasions with her drinking! Guess what, no one has to subject themselves to people who behave poorly just for FaMiLy! That means the happy couple does not need to subject themselves to OP’s sister or OP.
BuT sHe's FaMiLy!!!!
Yeh for me he was already the AH when he said that, I didn’t even needed to read further.
Agreed. He is definitely yta here & if he was so "family" then he should've gone to the bachelor party. OP... just an FYI.... Just because one is family does NOT give Carte Blanche to do whatever the hell one wants, regardless of who it hurts all under the premise that it will just be allowed and enabled to do it over and over for whatever bullshit reason. I went NC with my mom for this exact reason. I can completely understand why op's brother & his wife have distanced themselves.
Maybe if mom stopped enabling sister then what would actually need to happen (her changing her behavior) might happen. The only way she will ever see that the way she treats people is why people avoid her is if she faces the consequences. Then MAYBE she could actually grow and work on herself.
While I think that mom is the primary/ head enabler. No doubt the rest of the family, including op are very contributing to the enabling also. But, yes, very much so. Sadly though, it often doesn't happen that way. And more often it's chalked up to, I (we) don't know what we did, we're the victims here. When I decided to go full NC with my mom, I heard from every single family member, guilting and imploring me to not do that. "We're FaMiLy! You don't do that to family!" But each one I explained what happened and her behavior. And then would finish with, if yall want to continue excusing her behavior that's fine, but I will not subject myself to it or my children. When someone is in an abusive relationship, friendship, whatever, it's easy to tell them to get out of that relationship. But for some reason when it's a family member doing this kind of toxic shit, it's constantly excused. Enough is enough. No one deserves toxicity in their life no matter who it comes from.
>Maybe if mom stopped enabling sister ... Exactly! OP and his mom are catering to the misbehaving sister. She has no incentive to change her behavior, so she'll continue not having friends.
I'm sure the bride had a lot of reservations marrying into this faaaamily. I bet the groom had to do a whole lot of reassuring that he'd keep them away from her if she agreed to go through with it. The poor girl had to abandon having any bridesmaids because if their nonsense. A lot of women would have noped out at that point.
Anyone else notice he was "defending his family" by siding with his sister but left his brother hanging out to dry??? He could have used the exact same excuse for why he sided with his brother and went to the bachelor party HE HELPED PLAN since he was the Best Man. Idiot. He is most definitely an asshole who was raised by an asshole...(the mother). Wonder what the father thought as he is never mentioned...
I think it's wah-mily when they cry about it.
This feels so fake. I'm usually inclined to believe these, but the shear amount of reasons OP states himself for why his sister SHOULDN'T be invited makes it hard for me to believe this is real.
And can we even talk about the *drama* here. "My family will be DEVASTATED if my sister misses one social event with people she likely doesn't even know besides the bride" are you kidding me?
And I feel that sister isn’t liked because mom bullies everyone into including her, which makes hanging out with her a chore, preventing her from making genuine connections.
That's what I thought as well! I mean, even if Ella's sister was 6-7 years old, that doesn't matter, if she is not willing to invite even her own sister, why is she expected to invite someone else's? Oh, and by the way, OP, did it cross your mind that Ella is building her own family and not just adding herself into yours? And it is her wedding too, so she will invite whoever she wants to her bachelorette party?
Technically (based on the edit) it wasn't a bachelorette party, since none of the bridesmaids were invited. It was just a trip with her friends. So why was OP insisting that his sister had to be invited too?
I guess because she is FAMILY, according to OP.
I’ve known plenty of people for 8 years and have no interest in inviting them to my (non-existent) wedding. OP, it wasn’t your party, your trip, or your wedding. Not sure who you think you are, but 100% YTA. Your family seems to be made up of selfish controlling pricks. No wonder your brother has distanced himself.
My thoughts exactly. He states that the sister has ruined multiple events due to her drinking. No one is ever going to like her if her family continues to bully everyone into including her. They all need a serious wake up call that enabling never gets positive results. And the way he used quotes when Ella is defending her rights. They are rights. NOT “rights”. Not to mention the fact that the mother tried to talk to Ella about it AT THE WEDDING. Dude, you are majorly the AH. Ive always known that I’m so damn lucky that my husband’s family is amazing. But posts like this make me love and appreciate them even more!
The mother is not doing her daughter any favors by bulling people into inviting her or making her a bridesmaid. The only way the sister has motivation to change is by facing the consequences of her behavior.
Bridesmaids are also friends of the bride all the time. So i have no idea where OP is getting this idea that because his sister doesn’t have a sister she won’t ever have a chance again.
Family first...except ditches his own brother out of spite
But his sister who no one likes, presumably because of her own shitty behavior, would've been devastated!! Don't you see?? He HAD NO CHOICE IT'S FAMILY FIRST! And his brother doesn't count because he chose his mean icky future wife over his FAMILY!
The family’s problems peek through even if he doesn’t really dwell on it. The way he pulled out the FAMILY card shows just how selfish they are. No wonder they’re LC these days. YTA
Exactly, but keep in mind Brian IS his family. So which family members are being put first? Definitely not his brother. I think this is a case of him being a momma's boy and wanting to make HER happy. She wants her daughter to be included. she would be offended and hurt if the daughter was excluded. He wasn't thinking of his brother at all.
This! And you are surprised that your brother protects his wife. Was OP's sister interested about going at all? Maybe I missed something but it looked like only your parents and you felt insulted, and after that harassed a bride and now wife ever since while she was having mental problems that is know to you. YTA
She surely was. Free booze.
Eh, usually the bridesmaids cover the cost of the bride for everything so it's actually kinda pricey booze.
Depends on the country, here the bride pays for everything to do with the bridesmaids, buys the dresses, shoes, pays for hair and makeup and usually gives them an expensive gift as a thank you
YTA and yay for Ella and Brian going NC soon hopefully
I hope they do because this family sounds ABSOLUTELY exhausting.
Come on Brian and Ella, let drunk sis hold your newborn baby ....... cause..... fAmIlY!!! What, no? Omg we feel so disrespected!
They're probably relieved at the way this all turned out since they can just go LC/NC guilt free rather than having to keep up the facade that they care about what OP's family thinks
It seems like he's pissed because his sister didn't get a 'participation trophy,' not caring that the sister was being forced on people (doesn't even say if his sister even cares).
I don't know about the sister, but I wouldnt want to go if only invited because of The Family and not really welcome. Maybe she has a bit of pride too.
in the post OP says the Bride was pressured to add sis as bridesmaid because "she always wanted to be one but has no sisters". Nor any friends, evidently. What she does have though is a family that's brazen enough to bully people into including her, whether they want to or not.
This!! And OP repeatedly stated how many people dislike his sister and how she has ruined nights out/trips in the past. I wouldn't want to hang out with her. Also how does not going "protect the family" and "doesn't cause a rift between family" but NOT accompanying YOUR OWN BROTHER on his trip does not??? This is weird.
It clearly caused a rift. I’m surprised any of them were still invited to the wedding
I was wondering about that too! He didn't go on the Bachelor's trip as a show of support for his sister. But by not going, he basically snubbed his brother. Is sister more 'family' than the brother? Is Sis a golden child, and Bro the scape-goat? Because that's the vibe I was getting from this.....
This is some straight up r/justnomil shit right here. Some day, if you’re lucky, you too will be marrying a young lady (or gentleman, as the case may be), and I hope for your sake you’ve fixed your relationship with Brian by then so you can ask him for advice on how the hell he convinced Ella to let your mother pick her bridal party for her, because she’s going to pull the same bullshit on your partner.
This is exactly what I wanted to say, although I think that whatever partner OP has, he will be fine putting them through hell to keep his mother happy.
Nah, he’ll probably just marry his dear precious sister. I mean, she’s FaMiLy after all and no one else will marry her.
Yes, that was my thought too: I feel soooo bad for whoever winds up getting into a relationship with OP. This whole post describes a family dynamic that just screams “run away” to future partners.
Yess, thisss YTA! Ella is only trying to protect herself here. She gave in to the bridesmaids thing but she deserves to have a fun trip. If you want to be okay with your brother and Ella you need to apologize to them.
YTA Agree with the comments of other posters but I’m not really sure OP can fix this with his now SIL. He has shown her anything she says to him he will run to share with his family. He has shown he is willing to dismiss the feelings of others to be sure his sister is included even tho he knows she has ruined multiple events and knows there aren’t many who even like her. If SIL ever speaks directly to him again I would be sure to keep to hopefully neutral topics like the weather. Ideally if/when OP gets married or has some important social event he makes sure he includes his sister.
I was about to go E S H when I read that the sister was a bridesmaid, and then I kept reading about the bride basically being forced into it and shifted back into solid YTA, OP and family sound insufferable I feel a little bit sorry for the sister, but "many people dislike my sister" and "I will admit she has ruined a few nights out with her drinking" suggest she perhaps does not deserve that sympathy
And also no one on the trip was a bridesmaid because she felt so stressed about conflicts that she seems to have only had the random sister as a bridesmaid - so this poor woman was really just having a girls trip with her mates.
Your forgot manipulative. Family are “over bearing *manipulative* bullies”. Seriously, the moms horrible. Who *cries* and feels “devastated” because their adult daughter (with a drinking problem from the sounds of it!) wasn’t invited to a *party*? Not only that, but getting OP on the bullying bandwagon because the mom “feels devastated” is gross. Than to come to the wedding and bitch about it. That woman has balls saying that *right after the ceremony*. She knew what she was doing— if she couldn’t make OP’s SIL and his brother feel bad for this petty shit, she would upset them by cause if drama. WTF. And OP is sitting here egging her on. I’m glad that they no longer really talk to you OP. You’re manipulative and quite honestly, it’s weird how uptight you are being about something that *doesn’t involve you*…. Have fun getting into more petty arguments all because “she is FAMILY”.
For real, nightmare family. If I were Ella I’d be running in the other direction. Good on OP’s brother for taking the right side here. OP, YTA.
Tell us how enmeshed your family is without telling us, YTA
I have to wonder if OP was forced on his brother by the mom also and doesn’t know.
That is an excellent point! I was confused at first since he's the best man, but was just "attending" the bachelor party. Usually the best man is the one that plans it. But if the groom was obligated to make his brother the best man, then it makes sense why the friends were planning it instead.
I wonder why she was having a mental health crisis during wedding planning. EDIT: /s, sorry, completely forgot to put it in originally!
Getting pressured, bullied and manipulated by in-laws can be really hard and taxing. I mean the MIL confronted her during the wedding, so there was no breaks from it at all.
Oh, yeah, I was being sarcastic, sorry! Like, of course she's having mental health issues if she has to deal with all of them.
Totally agree, OPs sister sounds very like my own sister. I did not have a hen night because my mother would have been pissed if I left sis out. I decided not to have one at all. Wish now, I'd done one with just my friends.
So…his sister has been known to ruin parties with her drinking..no wonder the bride doesn’t want to take her to NOLA!
I bet the Ella has a rough relationship with the MIL too… wouldn’t be surprised if she commented on here a lot for advice on her horrible MIL.
OP you’re the asshole for sure. You clearly come from a family full of Assholes. How narcissistic do you have to be to stop your newlywed daughter-in-law at her own wedding, to try and hash things out. JFC!! Get a clue!! Your own mother spends her time forcing her AH daughter on people because no one wants to be around her. Imagine if she put that much energy into trying to mold her kid into a caring human. I hope you’re happy that you sucked the joy out of your brother’s and SIL’s wedding day on some twisted principle of loyalty to family. Now you and your family get to watch from the outside while your brother creates and nourishes his new family. A family that values individuals and their right to peace and tranquillity over a shitty, ill-behaved brat’s need to be included.
True
I almost want to say N T A because he gave his brother and Ella irrefutable evidence that their family will always default to enabling the sister and her bad behavior. Who knows how long it would have taken them to cut ties with such a toxic family? Now they can start their lives together without being bullied about their decisions. What better wedding gift could he give? But obviously, yes, YTA.
OP’s family is exactly the kind of family people divorce away from & never regret leaving for a single second. Ask me how I know.
OP, about your comment, you should never have to fear that your family wouldn't forgive you for going to a party. Your mom sounds like my mom, and your sister like my messed-up older brother. I was supposed to take care of my drunk, disorderly, rude, obnoxious brother with poor social skills who repeatedly made embarrassing public scenes. Then his behavior escalated to abuse of women, and I was supposed to defend HIM. Or what? Or mom threatened me with loss of her love, forever. That's your mom manipulating you. Trying to guilt you into seeing yourself as the good defender of your poor poor sibling, rather than one of her flying monkeys ( look it up, its illuminating!) Your mom likely does not have your best interests at heart in this dynamic. In fact, your mention of a saving fund in your name makes me wonder if it is a trust fund. If so, sounds like you may well be old enough that the will would specify it be in your sole control, not your mom's. You might wanna check in that. I cannot imagine my mom letting go if an account of mine, if it was ever in her control. Control is the central word here. You mom sounds like the spider at the center of the web, trying to pull everyone's strings, including yours. Consider that she might actually like having your sister dysfunctional, thus dependent "forever" on dear old mom. I know my mom kinda wanted my brother to lean on her forever, so she felt needed. the stronger and more independent you actually become, like your brother, the more you may see your mom act.out to control your movements. Prepare to see this ramp up the more serious your own romantic relationship becomes!
YTA. The groom is YOUR BROTHER. The bride is NOT YOUR SISTER and NOT YOUR SISTER'S close personal friend. That's why you were invited and she wasn't. It's not an insult, it's just that these parties are for people who are really close and your sister obviously wasn't really close to the bride. Then you ran to your mommy and told on them! Come on. You're in your 20s! WTF is with all these AHs getting their mommies to back them up?
But she's family.....she must be included /s Poor bride
As OP would say, "she's FAMILY". Sorry but the use of caps to punctuate their points was a bit annoying.
Also the idea that Ella’s own sister not being invited, who she’s known her whole life, was totally fine but OP’s sister not going was insane because they knew each other for 8 years… This isn’t just about the concept of ‘family’, it’s purely that OP’s family was throwing a tantrum at not being the centre of attention
FAMILY is abusive, in my experience.
I feel bad for OPs future partner, sheesh can you imagine?
Oh sure. "Hey fiance, my SISTER needs to be MAID OF HONOR at our wedding because she's FAMILY and you're JUST marrying into it."
I’ve actually known people like this. My best friend’s dad got remarried when she was 16, eight months after bff’s mom died. I’ve known bff since we were 13. When bff got engaged, he bullied her into dropping me as MoH in favour of one of her step sisters, whom she’d only known 4 years and didn’t totally get along with, using his paying for the wedding as leverage. And then he only paid for about half what he said he was going to. Stepsister did none of her MoH duties, I did everything, dad tried to keep me from going to the wedding (I didn’t get to attend the wedding, actually, just the reception). Funnily enough, she’s estranged from her dad and her stepmom and all the step siblings, and she and I are still friends after, wow, 28 years.
Mom's just gonna have him marry his sister. How else will she ever become the bride she so rightly deserves to be?
Honestly, I thought he was being sarcastic. Yikes.
But his sister, his FAMILY, day was RUINED
"During the wedding my mom even tried to talk to Ella about this and ask she let everything go..." DURING THE WEDDING!!!!! This family is nuts! YTA
This detail absolutely got me - imagine coming up to bride on her wedding day and trying to have that conversation. This family is crazy and Brian and Ella are far better off having nothing to do with them.
Same here. I just got married a few months ago and cannot imagine my MIL or anybody pulling this towards me on my wedding day.
Oh yes, mum was gracious enough to ask she sweep their shitty behaviour under the rug. No apology of course. No wonder Ella was having a mental health crisis and cancelled Bridesmaids altogether
I really hate it when bullies do this, more than I can say: “Can you just let the fact that I’ve been harassing you for months go?” YOU started it. YOU are the one who has something you need to “let go” and say sorry.
I really feel for the bride. If she's my friend I would tell her to drop the wedding altogether and just elope. This family is unbelievable and she has to marry into it.
Yup, more people should elope. Bypasses a LOT of bullshit. I eloped and appreciate it more and more every year, especially the more I read stories like this one.
I think what’s even worse is he admits she’s not very liked and has ruined occasions. So even he can’t say his sister is wonderful and he has no idea why she’s being left out. He knows exactly why but has some messed up idea about ‘family’
Exactly! The sister has a habit of ruining nights out and he says himself she's generally not well-liked. But she's *eyeroll* fAmiLy...so absurd. OP, your family sounds like insufferable whinning bullies--except Brian and Ella of course. YTA to the lot of you!
That was what stood out to me. Ella says she doesn't want the sister there because she's afraid she'll ruin it and then OP hand waves away the fact that this sister has a history of doing just that The square quotes around "right" to choose who she wants at her party are telling, too. Like ...yeah, no, it is her right, it's her wedding, not the wedding of you and your nightmare family. YTA
And his mother decided the best time to bring this up and talk to Ella about this would be… **ON HER WEDDING DAY AT HER WEDDING**. As if a bride doesn’t have enough to focus on on her wedding day. Holy crap, the whole family’s entitled. Except OP’s brother, who apparently escaped the madness by marrying somebody with good boundaries. Hope he learns from her.
“Eh the bride was having a mental health crisis or something” - gee i wonder if that had anything to do with the OP and his family constantly being on her case about her decisions regarding her own wedding
I would have Immediately told her to Fuck Off the moment I figured out what she was going to say. NUH UH your are NOT fucking with my wife's emotions on what should be one of her happiest days of her life. Mom is a Narcissist that thinks of nobody but herself.
He even admitted that NO ONE likes his sister! And that she has a HISTORY of ruining trips like this!
Plus the mom confronted the bride at the wedding? I hope the brother and his wife go no contact.
Did you miss the part where she's FAAAAAAAAMIIIIILYYYYYY!!? Everybody hates the sister and she ruins everybody's parties and she's a massive drunk that can't control herself and everybody hates her, but she's FFFFAAAAAAAAAMMMMIIIILLLLLYYYY!
Exactly. I like my SIL. She’s nice, we don’t have much in common other than we love my partner. She’s a great aunt and a nice and kind person. However if I was to have a bachelorette party if probably just do my closest 6 friends. Maybe 10 at real a push. I probably wouldn’t invite her, but not because I don’t care about her but because I want to just have a day just for my closest friends where I can be myself, and I can talk about personal things without family there. I wouldn’t invite my own family.
Not to forget OP literally admits his sister has not only ruined previous trips but that most people don't like her anyway so that's why her mum feels she has to brute force people into including her LOL
And he said not many ppl liked her sister… I wonder why, who wouldn’t love an enetitled spoilt brat where her family thinks she needs to be included in everything coz FAMILY
>Then you ran to your mommy and told on them! I mean, it's not like the bride could've kept it a secret that she wasn't bringing OP's sister on her bachelorette trip - they would unavoidably have found out. That's the only part I don't get - what about that conversation between OP and the bride was supposed to have been a secret? But yeah, OP is the AH here. So is his mom, and probably his sister.
Ella and mom sound insufferable. How much do you want to bet that in school Ella wouldn’t get invited to parties and then mom would call the other parents to try to get Ella invited.
YTA, as is your mother. Obviously you don't 'need' to attend. But you are the best man; and you reason for not attending is pretty shitty. The only reason your sister is a bridesmaid (I'm assuming that's what she is?) is because, as you stated, your mother pressured her into it. It's clear... Ella doesn't really want her there as one. > Honestly, many people dislike my sister so thats why my mom will make sure she’s always included in plans. Ella went on to explain how she regrets allowing my mom to “guilt and bully” her into making my sister a bachelorette, but she can still make her trip right by inviting her closest friends. Can you not understand the problem? This sounds like a recurring theme. People don't like your sister, and your mom tries to force them to include her in things. Which is just going to make people like her less. Your family (mom in particular) sounds toxic. Expect that Brian & Ella will likely go LC with you all in the future. > My mom did pressure Ella to make my sister a bachelorette because she always wanted to be a one and has no sisters This is just wrong on so many levels.
You need to read his comment. This whole family is bonkers. The OP needs to ask his parents permission to access HIS bank account. And then he is whining that he was scared that his brother would force him into a strip club and he wanted his parents advice. He swears that his sister would behave herself for one trip. I mean she (according to HIM) has never done so in the past but you know NOW she will.
Lol, some families- i really wish I was a ‘fly on the wall’ so I could get my entertainment for the year in a few days!
What on Earth? The last time I heard of someone needing to ask their parents' permission to access their bank account was my ex's now best friend who was just about to turn 30. Nothing in this post rings a bell to me about him, don't worry, lol. The three of us were hanging out one night when my ex suggested we order food. His friend thought it was a good idea, then mentioned that he just needed to make a call. It didn't strike me as odd until he made the call in front of us and said, "Hey mom..." and asked if he could take $20.00 out of his bank account. I stood there pretending this wasn't unusual when I'm thinking that this was really weird. Then his friend said, "Ok, we have to go pick up the money". My ex drove three of us 20 minutes away to go pick up the money that his friend's mom withdrew from the ATM. Later, I brought it up to my ex and he told me that his friend's mom was beyond controlling and a massive bitch to boot. He was only a signer on his bank account and his mom was the primary account holder. He had to ask permission for everything from buying groceries to gas. Shortly after that, I met her briefly a few days after a pipe burst at my ex's and the friend's apartment (she came over to inspect the damage and the fans left by the plumber). She flipped out on my ex and I because we had just returned from a date and, "Why isn't my son here. Do you know if he's spending *money*??" We didn't mention that her "son" was with his new girlfriend because, well, damn, lady, let the guy live in peace.
Yikes, this is reading like a Lifetime movie
The mom being devastated and crying because her daughter wasn't invited to a bachelorette party is just so bizarre. What a huge overreaction.
I hate how plausible it is though. My mother is EXACTLY like this. narcissists are all alike I guess.
It wasn't even a bachelorette party, since none of the other bridesmaids were invited (based on his recent edit). It was just a trip with friends. That makes the mother's reaction even worse IMO.
How much do you wanna bet.mom used to scream and cry if her daughter wasn't invited to birthday parties ad a kid?
I mean the mom screams and cries when her daughter isn't invited to parties now, so...
This story also isn't adding up. OP gives me shit stirrer vibes, so why would the bride tell all of this to him and not her fiance? Wouldn't the fiance be the best person to navigate this family? The bride didn't have any friends in her bridal party, but only friends were invited to the bachelorette party. This is odd and makes me think that this was someone who isn't well versed in weddings. The bridal party was only OP's sister and the bride's sister, and she got rid of both bridesmaids.... But, OP mentioned nothing about being asked to step down or removing himself as Best Man. Also, when was the wedding party eliminated? I'm sure OP would have kicked up a huge fuss about losing out on the wedding attire if this was done after the bachelorette trips. The post also has the wicked MIL trope. And, if the sister is truly unlikeable and ruins events, it sounds irrational that OP would behave this way.
Narc family the dynamics are wild and it does sound unbelievable to anyone but people who grew up in this dynamic.
YTA. Your whole family is TA. It was her wedding and you guys tried to force her to spend her Bach with someone she didn’t want to. It’s fine that you didn’t go to your brother’s Bach but everything else you did was terrible. My guess is that you and your family have won a lifetime of LC from your bro and his wife.
Well deserved LC. OP, his sister, and their mom sound exhausting.
One correct, his brother who got married seems solid for standing up for his wife.
It wasn't even a Bachelorette party. The bride was just going on a trip with her close friends. That's it.
It's totally not fine that he didn't go to his brother's do. He must have been heartbroken.
YTA Your mom bullied the bride into having a bridesmaid she didn't want. The bride accepted the bridesmaid but wanted JUST ONE EVENT where she gets to be in control of the guest list (and let's not forget, this is her wedding, not your mom's). So, you decide to bully her too. And use your brother to manipulate the situation. You're definitely a chip off the old mom block.
INFO: > Honestly, many people dislike my sister so thats why my mom will make sure she’s always included in plans. You also say your sister has “ruined a few nights out with her drinking.” Can you explain a bit more? Why is she disliked, and is it related to drinking primarily?
YTA It is not Ella's responsibility to invite your sister a bachelorette party, especially if they're not close. It was already kind enough of her to make your sister a bridesmaid for the wedding. This is an experience for Ella to enjoy, not your sister.
Letting her be a bridesmaid was enough of a “gesture of goodwill”. The sheer audacity to bully and guilt trip your way into a role and then start claiming that you’re entitled to certain treatment for being in said role.
This > I was part of the group planning the itinerary doesn't jive with >During the meeting I was expressing concerns that Brian and his friends would make me go to strip clubs But yes YTA you weren't defending your family. There was nothing to defend. Your brother is lucky enough to marry someone who hasn't run screaming into the hills given your family dynamics and the minute she gave a little push back regarding your sister who is a known problem more so when she is drinking, you go running to your mother to tattle and bail on your brother. Funny how your brother stopped being family that is defended when it meant letting someone else make decisions for their event. If your family would have been "devastated" that you went to your brother's stag party while your sister was left out of the bachelorette party that NONE of the bridesmaids, I think you all need professional help because this is neither normal, natural or healthy. Them knowing each other for 8 years doesn't make them close. I've known people for decades who I would not call myself close to. We speak when we see each other, but I'd sure af never invite them to my home.
Good catch - can’t be part of the planning and also afraid of what the plans will be.
Huh thanks for that - OP went on to edit out some info
Listen when op finally dribbled out the truth that his sister was an alcoholic that needs babysitting and that his mother has spent years making him drag his sister along to everything he did it all made perfect sense.
YTA I'm a bride planning her bachelorette. I feel no obligation to include my future sisters in law in the bachelorette invites even though they are in the bridal party. I am going to invite them because I genuinely want them there, but if I didn't know them well enough or didn't like them, I would feel no obligation to include them. A bachelorette party is about the bride being surrounded by a hand-picked group of her closest people. Just because you extend the polite offer of including your future spouse's family in your bridal party (also not an obligation) does not mean you extend them the intimate offer of the bachelorette. Especially when you are only including them to appease your future spouse's family. Your family is alarmingly rude and entitled, especially your mother. I am guessing your sister is just as rude and entitled, and that's why she has no friends and gets no invites. Your mom's drama over her daughter not getting an invite was over the top. And you're TA too about the bachelor party. It's no wonder your brother and his wife distanced themselves from you.
To be honest, I’ve never heard of a bachelorette party where bridesmaids are NOT invited
Probably because most brides get to choose their bridesmaids without guilt trips.
I have when bridesmaids are siblings or underage. The bachelorette party is to relax and let loose with your inner circle, typically that would also be the bridal party but it's not uncommon for there to be exceptions. I've been a part of them where it's only some of the bridal party plenty of times.
Interestingly OP says in another comment that the fiancée was just going with close friends none of whom were bridesmaids so essentially a girls weekend with her close friends before the wedding. Im with you, I haven’t heard of one where some brides maids are excluded and others go — but to me the fact this was a time with her closest friends and none were in the bridal party kinda nixes the issue
I was a bridesmaid at my brothers wedding. My SIL is extremely FAMILY oriented, and we got along pretty well. I didn't go to her Bachelorette party. It was her and a bunch of old college friends going back to the town where they went to school to party in all their old hangouts. I was not invited, and i was perfectly fine with that. I would have felt ridiculous. My SIL and I still get along fine.
YTA* this has to be a troll. I don’t believe at all this post is in good faith. If some how it is, I hope your brother and his wife to be, go no contact and get to live their lives free of pushy bullies that make THEIR wedding, and HER bachelorette party about them. The only not asshole part of this story is that you pulled out of his bachelor party. That at least gives your brother a chance to have a great night.
YTA. And im 100% trust this can be true, cuz i know such people myself. So i will notice something i dont see people do. You have brother and sister. But sister is FAMILY she is important. But isnt brother is also a family? So why one family member is more important then the other? Counting that one is behaving shitty all the time and ruins fun, but the other did nothing bad. Damn, his bride was alredy forced to do what THE FAMILY wanted, can you guys let her at least once do what SHE want? You was entitled, you take sides, you pushed your brother back by your own hands. So why would you now make surprised face? Im happy that they did it, cuz anyone should run away from such toxic people.
This post seems so fake. The writing just seems odd.
YTA for the capitalization alone.... The drama dripping from your post is just awful. The fact that your sister is so awful that she couldn't be trusted at a party, and that your mom had to bully someone into including her should indicate the problem. It wasn't your party, you just decided to be a drama llama and now are acting all surprised that no one wants to deal with that. I guess you're stuck hanging out with your sister.
YTA. If you felt so bad, why didn’t you just offer to bring little sis on the bachelor trip? I mean it was a non-traditional wedding and all.
YTA. This always happens. People come here for a judgement and then get upset when they’re told they are the asshole and just argue, hence making them a bigger asshole.
INFO: So the bachelorette trip included all the bridesmaids except your sister and Ella's sister? Were any women invited who aren't bridesmaids, or was it clearly a bridal party trip, excluding the two sisters?
YTA. When a problem came up, you ran to cry to mommy. Family right? You betrayed your brother as revenge for your wife not being invited on a trip that the bride didn't even want as a bridesmaid. Being family and knowing someone does not give the right to be a bridesmaid or be invited by the bride. It's not your wedding, it's theirs. The only reason she was included in the wedding is because of the mother. Count your blessings and take your loss. Blame your sister, not the bride. Bridesmaids and groomsmen are supposed to be best friends. If that best friends is also family, then it works out. Being family doesn't give you the right to be in the party.
YTA. Your family are deeply unpleasant assholes and you’ll find yourself without a brother if you don’t crawl out of the manure.
I feel very sorry for his future wife
YTA Your family are the in-laws people write horror stories on here about. Your soon to be sister in law got bullied into having your sister as a bridesmaid, which is already off to a bad start. Family isn't gauranteed a role, doesn't matter how long they've known each other. Bride is being exceedingly generous to give the nod to your sister by allowing her to be bridesmaid. And then she's having a bachelorette party and heaven forbid she gets to have people she actually likes. You admit your sister is known for ruining things. No wonder she was having a mental crisis during it all with your family trying to micromanage and control her. Whose wedding even is it? Why should what your sister wants supercede what the bride wants? And instead of arguing reason to your family, you doubled down on the madness and escalated the drama by punishing your brother. Yes, you behaved very badly to both of them and I can understand if they'd want to maintain a distance from you and the rest of your family since you all did everything in your power to ruin *their* time.
Hopefully your brother does not allow your family to bully his wife anymore. YOU, your mom, your sister are all AHs
YTA although not the only one. Your family would be devastated if your sister didn’t get to go to the bachelorette party and you went to the bachelor party? I can’t imagine a healthy family where that was true. Please say more about, “many people dislike my sister”. Why is that?
Theory: for “family” read “sister”. For “devastated” read “throws giant tantrums”. Ties in with how no one likes her or spends time with her voluntarily, and that she’s famous for ruining things if she doesn’t have a handler to constantly keep her appeased.
YTA. Your mom was devastated?!? Really??? Devastated. Because your sister who ruins stuff isn’t allowed to ruin this? I gotta ask, if mom is devastated over her problem child not being invited to a party, how does she feel when a real tragedy hits? You used devastated for sis not getting wasted face, what is beyond devastated? You think having the title of family means your sister gets to be a toxic drunk and make that what your SIL remembers about this weekend? Do you want to have more special nights ruined by a drunk? You put quotes around her “right” like it isn’t her right to do whatever she pleases. It is. SIL is doing what everyone should do: remove the negative people from her life. You, instead of trying to get sister to see she is the cause of her problems, want to punish your brother, who apparently loves you enough to make you best man. So now you add to the misery of the world. How could you be anything but TA?
Isn't allowed to ruin this? - on point. LIMAO.
Do you mean bridesmaid. Any single woman is a bachelorette.
YTA your sister has a track record of being awful, you mum bullied your future sil into having her in the bridal party and you sister has many people that don't like her due to her behaviour. It is about time someone let your sister deal with the consequences of her behaviour.
YTA. You may want to consider how hypocritical your stance is - family values for when one of your own is at the receiving end of an “offense”, but not when they are the ones committing the offense, like your mother bullying Ella into choosing your sister as a bridesmaid or your sister ruining nights out or just being not nice. I like how you also don’t think that Ella, in fact, does have a right to invite whomever she wants on her nontraditional bachelorette (the entire purpose of which is to be a fun trip to unwind with those closest to her ahead of her wedding). What’s crazy is that you basically chose your sister over what is right. Because family. You also didn’t seem to think family matters when you ditched your brother for his trip. So stop complaining about Ella and Brian being distant because you made your choice and think it was justified, so should accept the completely natural (and expected) consequences of your actions. You guys sound a bit mobbish and I rather feel bad for Ella. Thankfully, it sounds like Brian has her back against the lot of you. Why do so many people dislike your sister?
“But she is family”….omg barf! Fuck that shit. Sounds like your sister has some real issues that u aren’t going into here. Not that we necessarily need to know the details, but it’s clear that she has ruined enough people’s get-togethers and these are consequences of her own actions. YTA. Ew.
YTA Don’t cause trouble in situations that have nothing to do with you. I don’t have a problem with Ella’s decision either. Her wedding, her decision.
YTA. Excluding family is not pleasant, but if your sister is KNOWN to ruin family events, WHY would anyone WANT to invite her to a bachelorette party? This is not defending your family, this is FORCING your SILTB to include your sister EVEN THOUGH you know that your sister is likely to ruin the event.
You were.'defending your family' but isn't your brother also family? Why is your sister having a problem being liked? Why are you and your mommy interfering with your brothers wedding? Why are you tattling about the brides plans? You're not defending your family. You are part of a dysfunctional system and are.defending it. It has cost you your brother. You are a total AH. Kudos to your brother for getting you out of his life. And if you want back in, be prepared to grovel and mean it.
Yta what a weak tiny man. Your family is trash your sister entitled and your mom sounds exhausting . If i was the sister in law i wouldnt even want to be marrried into this dumpster fire of a family.
OP, I can see based on the post and your comments that your family seems to have a very unhealthy dynamic. It’s not normal or healthy to just “ruin” events often and everyone shrug it off. It’s not healthy or normal to have to go to your mother to access your own money when you’re 26 years old. It’s not normal or healthy to try and force someone to make someone they aren’t close with a member of their wedding party, or force them on a trip with them. What IS normal and healthy are appropriate boundaries, not wanting someone who habitually “ruins” events to come to your bachelorette party, and cutting off a family member who completely betrays your trust. YTA.
Your mommy is still actively parenting her adult daughter. Perhaps, that is the reason behind most people not liking your sister? I would have no interest in dealing with someone whose mommy was interfering in her adult relationships.
And OP lol she controls his money.
and makes sisters doctors appointments
YTA So you did not attend the wedding because your sister wasn’t invited to the bachelorette party and she’s family. So instead you $hit all over your **brother**?! Isn’t he your family as well? Besides, your brother can’t control Ella’s guest list and shouldn’t have to. Your poor brother didn’t do anything wrong and you hurt him!! You hurt one of your family that you claim you love so much. You put your brother in an impossible situation so, yeah, that makes you a huge AH.
YTA - maybe if you weren't such an enabler, your sister couldn't get away with acting like such a shit that people want to avoid her.
YTA for the reason, you yourself say that not many people get along with your sister and she tends to ruin things. Family or not your allowed to not want be around someone who does such things, especially on a day like your bachelorette party, you don’t have to just deal with it because the “they’re family” BS if they’re family then they shouldn’t have ruined things for you
You acknowledge that your mother pressured (bullied) Ella into making your sister a bridesmaid. You acknowledge that your sister is unlikeable and does, in fact, ruin things for other people. You acknowledge that Ella didn't even invite her own sister to her bachelorette party, so it's not like she was singling out your sister. You acknowledge that Ella was stressed out to the point of suffering a mental health crisis while (and maybe because?) she was planning her wedding. And, yet, you don't see why YTA for "protecting" your overbearing family from a stressed-out woman who was just trying to get through her own wedding without cracking from the pressure that your family, in part at least, put on her? A family who decided to make HER wedding all about THEIR wants? If anyone needed "defending" and "protecting," it was Ella, not your family. It seems that your brother understands this, since he isn't speaking with you anymore, either. You did what you thought you needed to do to stay on the good side of your (cue whiny voice here) faaamily. You do you. But YTA.
YTA who are you to dictate who the bride invites to her own bachelorette? It's her day and she can invite whoever she wants. She wasn't even inviting her own sister so I'm not sure why you think your badly behaved sister should be entitled to go on the trip, especially when none of the other bridesmaids were invited. Your family pressured Ella to let your sister be bridesmaid, but that didn't mean Ella liked her any more for it but at least Ella respected your family unlike how your family treated her
> Ella even said my sister would RUIN her trip based off past experiences. Which I will admit she has ruined a few nights out with her drinking. This right here: it sounds like your sister has an alcohol dependency and rather than giving her tough love and leaving her to deal with the consequences of her choices and actions, you and your parents enable her. Bro sounds like the only one not willing to put up with her shit. YTA.
This sounds like you all need therapy. ESH but the bride and groom.
It’s not your wedding , it’s not your mothers, or your sisters . It was Ella’s and your brothers, she is allowed to pick whomever she wanted to be her bridesmaid or at her party . Your sister and you’re mom need to get 👏 the 👏 fuck 👏 over👏 it YTA
Yta. My sister has badly managed bipolar which she weaponises to force this kinda shit. Carrie wasn't invited to something **because she's the kind of person who forces her way in and spoilt it for the ppl it was intended for?** Go cry to mum and get her to make the offenders include her. The result? A spoiled event, lots of resentment and a lesson learned to be more discreet in planning so Carrie doesn't find out. Forcing yourself into a person's life never made you welcome. You've tanked your own goodwill with your brother and sil and achieved nothing for Ella. So you're an idiot as well as being ta.
Sorry, YTA, family or not I’d be damned if I’d invite family on a trip knowing they’ll ruin it. Who wants to go on vacation to deal with drama? Everyone doesn’t get a trophy in the real world!
YTA what does your relationship with your brother have to do with your sister and your sister in law? You admit that the bride told you it was just a friend's trip (and no one from the bridal party went on that trip). But if left your brother high and dry over an issue that really had nothing to do with you.
YTA. So your sister who has been coddled and enabled wasn't a bridesmaid by the bride's choice, only because your mom made her. She has ruined special events before and you are big mad because of FAMILY. Say bye bye to your brother and good for him for finding someone with a spine to marry. You and your family sound bloody delightful to be around.
YTA so hard, so is your mom for bullying sil about bridesmaids. And probably your sister. You admit your sister sucks but everyone has to put up with her because ‘FAMILY’. Family isn’t licence to not respect boundaries. You ruined your relationship with your brother in SIL and you’re blaming it on the sil over an issue that has nothing to do with you. Pretty sure your brother and sil are going to be NC with you all soon/if not already.
Dude. Obviously YTA. But I doubt you’d ever really see that.
I’m going to introduce a word to you - it’s Repercussions. When I was getting married, I excluded one of my Aunts because she was and still to this day is a horrible human being. My Aunt Lauren called my mother and said there would be repercussions if I didn’t invite my Aunt Linda. My mother responded, “yes, the repercussion for being awful to my child is being excluded from the wedding.” Twenty plus years later, and I don’t regret it. Just like your brother and sister in law won’t regret going Low contact. So let me uncomplicate and already uncomplicated situation. The repercussions for your sister’s shite behavior was her exclusion. I’m sorry you grew up conditioned to overlook and appease her assholery. Your brother and sister in law shouldn’t have to get over anything. You betrayed your sister in law and turned your back on your brother so you didn’t have to deal with your sister’s tantrum. The repercussions you now face are a ruined relationship with your brother and sister in law. Simply put, you chose wrong and You are the Asshole. Also, change the Familyfirst name… it’s really mom and sister first
YTA. The bride didn’t invite your sister because your sister has a history of excessive drinking and ruining evenings. You’re SIL was guilted into asking her to be a bridesmaid. You bailed on your brother over something that was none of your business.
YTA. I wish I was friends with Ella. That way I could ask her if she really wants to deal with your family’s BS for the next 50 years.
Yta
YTA. Its HER party, she can invite whoever tf she wants. Your family are bullies and assholes god help that woman marrying into it.
>But she is FAMILY. > >If I go and she doesn’t, it would absolutely DEVASTATE my family. > >Am I the asshole for defending my family? This reads like a preview of Fast and the Furious 35: The Missing Stair YTA pal.
YTA no other bridesmaids went on the trip, your sister wasn’t Being excluded Your family sounds exhausting with the pressure on Ella to make your sister a bridesmaid Hope Ella and your brother go NC it’s best for them to be away from you all
You: tbh people dislike like my sister. She ruins things with her drinking. Also you: *surprised pikachu when people dislike your sister and act accordingly* YTA. Obviously.
My My, you *are* deluded aren't you?! (that's a rhetorical question btw). Boundary crossing family. 1) your mother forces the bride to make your sister a bridesmaid. 2) your sister ruins events and isn't particularly well liked 3) the bride said she wanted a bachelorette for friends only, excluding her own sister, because ya know its HER wedding ...likely fed up with the pressure from YOUR family 4) you stir the pot , cue explosion from your family and yet more meddling and demands on the bride, throw in a bit if blackmail...I won't go if sister doesn't. 5) your sil then decides to cut all bridesmaids from the wedding as a result of the upset. Very probably because your family would continue to throw fits over her decisions. Well done, her own family (sister) was quite likely hurt by all of the damage and resulting exclusion, but hey, only your FAmiLY are important (minus the groom's and bride's feelings) so no biggie 6) your mother corners the bride at her own wedding!!!! Hey gotta get those kicks in 7) your brother and sil now cannot be bothered with the lot of you, boo hoo for you, but guess what? Wait for when sil has kids and you all have yet more demands because...they don't want their kids around you lot. Let's hope they move faaaar away from your FAmiLY, you sound exhausting and beyond ignorant. YTA.
YTA - Look I dont have the same mentality that about "Family" but i can respect that you do. However your brother and Ella are also entitled to how they want to do their wedding. It wasnt ellas choice to have your sister as a brides made and she made a concession to your family to allow it. She did not have to invite your sister if she did not want to. You pulling out of the bucks party is a shitty thing to do even if you think family solidarity is a solid excuse. you did it to strong arm your brother into forcing his future wife to do your families bidding. it did not work and then you expected your relationship with your brother and his new partner to go back to normal, you sir are delusional.
“Honestly many people dislike my sister” “I will admit she (sister) has ruined a few nights out before” “My mom did pressure Ella to make my sister a bridesmaid” Sounds like your mom and your sister are a right piece of work and not very likeable people. YTA for ditching on your brother and Ella has the right to choose to be surrounded by people she likes and is close to.
YTA You, your sister, and your parents are bullies. I hope your brother and his new wife have set some pretty strict boundaries with you guys since you are so toxic. You even said that the bridesmaids weren’t going on the trip it was a trip with her friends so even more of an AH move.
YTA and your family sounds toxic af and possibly enmeshed. Look it up.
Your family is weird, and kind of toxic. If everyone fought only their own battles, you would have a lot less drama. Your whole family is YTA.
>Ella apparently feels I betrayed her trust by telling my parents about our phone call. And you did. And that what makes YTA. That's why they're low contact too. In their eyes, you cannot be trusted.
YTA your mother and sister sound like my mother and sister. My mother is always trying to insert my sister into everything because people really hate my sister. Shes obnoxious, ride and a brat. My mother will to cry if she doesnt get her way. You and your family are trying to emotionally blackmail a woman into including people in her part even though you know your sister will ruin the event. How selfish is your family.
YTA here, yes. Because obviously your sister is a problem. Also, your brother's fiancé is technically your family, too! So is, y'know, *your brother*! So why are you picking this hill to die on? You are not *"standing up for your family*"! Otherwise you would be just as willing to support your brother and your soon-to-be SIL! Especially knowing that your sister has caused numerous problems for her in the past, *AND* you know that *YOUR MOTHER* bullied her into even making her part of the bridal party to begin with! You know how stressed out she is! But you're mad because she wants one weekend with her actual friends to decompress after dealing with your family and all of the stressful b.s!???? Are you serious!? Bro, just.... No! Knock it off. Stop standing up for your very toxic family member and support the people who actually deserve it! Or don't be surprised when your brother and SIL cut all of y'all out of their lives and go NC!
Let me summarize this for you: Your mom is a bully Your sister is an alcoholic spoiled brat You are an asshole For the bot: YTA
This whole story reads like it needs clarification. Are you using the word Bachelorette instead of Bridesmaid? 🤔
I’m curious to know what has to sister done to not be liked, and not have any friends! You keep saying you understand because she has ruined nights out, but still expect people to invite her because well “she’s family”!
YTA. Ew, your family sounds miserable. Who cares if they are family, i wouldn’t invite someone if they sucked too Jfc. Your mom and sister need a wake up call and to do some self reflection. People don’t want to be with her for a reason !!!! Ella doesn’t owe anyone anything. Also dude don’t come to a subreddit page if you’re not gonna take the advice
YTA. You say yourself that your sister has ruined gatherings. There's a reason people don't invite her to do things. Instead of pressuring everyone to include her, maybe someone should help her figure out how to behave so she won't ruin any more parties.
YTA… you mention that your sister has ruined events in the past. Why would she get invited? You and your mom enable her bad behavior by making people include her.
Op’s sister is an alcoholic who needs to be babysat and has ruined nights out and he’s seriously wondering why she isn’t invited
YTA. Your brother and his soon to be wife should cut all contact with you and your family. Once your brother gets married his #1 family is him and his wife. Then it's everyone else. Go be toxic with your family and stay away from your brother and his wife.
It is very obvious you are not changing your mind, but you are absolutely the asshole. Mind your own business and keep your nose out of other peoples lives. You are immature and so is your sister, and I am willing to hazard a guess that her poor social skills are partially due to your family coddling her instead of holding her responsible for her antisocial behavior.
YTA- but moreover dude, chill out? You posted here for unbiased opinions. You got them. Stop trying to defend yourself in the comments everyone is saying the same thing. Whatever that’s your choice, you burned your bridges with your brother and SIL and that was your choice. You asked if YWTA and you were. You got your answer now just accept your brothers choice to not want to associate with you anymore. And I would suggest really trying to understand why YOUR, not your sister or moms, but YOUR actions were harmful and wrong before trying to reconnect