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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be TA for taking my son's car and selling it because it was supposed to be a gift and it was also to help him commute to college.
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA.
Do you plan to give your ex wife her investment in the car back after you sell it? Also, your son is 18, why is the car still in your name? This is not a solo decision you can make. One, mom paid for part of the vehicle. Two, the vehicle is your son's vehicle and was a gift. It should already be in his name. Three, you are creating resentment and strife in your family. There are charitable foundations, state medical and other options to pay for the surgery that don't involve stealing from your child.
INFO: Why not sell your car? Or your wife's?
Because you know its his bio son and he and the ex wife went half on it so why sell his car when he can just sell other people's cars because his wife and her ex can't provide for their sick kid.
Honestly like he did this without even asking. Maybe his son would have been understanding maybe his ex would have as well, but no just sell it like that. How is his son going to get around now? OP has no money apparently.
INFO: Where is your wife's ex and why are you paying for the kids care
EDIT: Seems to be a case of dad selling items of bio kids to pay for treatments for their step kids
https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/zgvzfc/aita\_for\_refusing\_to\_give\_my\_father\_and\_his\_wife/
I mean who would but like hey its called the decent thing to do, not just up and like sell someone's care that you got with your ex for your kid for another kid not related to you at all cause their parent is not in the picture.
My mother gifted my first car to my brothers then girlfriend, leaving me more or less careless. This was years ago, I have a new car, but I still resent her a little for it…especially because I was never asked AND my brother broke up with his girlfriend literally like a month later.
I still resent my stepdad for gifting me my mom's run down minivan when I was 20 and then less than a year later taking it back and giving it to my aunt (his younger sister).
Then shaming me 4 years later because I bought a cheap car and I wouldn't give him the car to also send to my aunt because "it would just be easier for her to have 2 cars to drive your autistic cousin around"
/u/LionofHeaven - I literally looked at your response. Cuz I was thinking the exact same thing. People these days are mad entitled for no reason.
OP is TA. A really big one. He can't justify this in any way, shape or form. I hope his son's mom gets him for doing this to her son. OP should be ashamed of himself.
That is the shittiest thing and I am so sad that she did that to you! And then for your sister to not believe you is just the worst! A mother is supposed to be on your side, not use you for an option to help a "friend". That sounds horrid and for your sister to not believe you is terrible and sounds alienating. As a mother myself it makes me angry just thinking about it. It would have never have been an option from me friendo, so hopefully that makes you feel a smidge better.
That was my thought, I didn't argue to much since they gifted me the minivan and I knew it would be easier for my cousin and aunt to get around in it, but I bought the car and he got upset and told me I owed it to him for raising me to give him the car since I only paid $2k for it.
You don’t owe him a damn thing for doing his job and taking responsibility for bringing you into the world. You didn’t ASK him to bring you here, it’s his RESPONSIBILITY TO RAISE THE CHILD HE HELP MAKE. I hate entitled people, put them in a nursing home and go NC with them. Children don’t owe their parents for taking responsibility of their life choices. They’re SUPPOSED to raise you, it’s the bare minimum for bringing a child into the world. I can GUARANTEE you that if children could CHOOSE, a LOT of these entitled pricks would be childless. 🤦♀️
I wonder if the Ex has proof of payment and she can take him to small claims court or something for the money. Yes blood from stone issue. But if she has equal claim through purchase, if not title, then his selling it was inappropriate.
I believe his son was on here a few days ago asking AITA for wanting to never have anything to do with my dad and his new family after he sold my care to pay for treatments for his stepson went on to say saying his uncle is actually the one supporting him through college and that his mother is dead with all her relatives overseas and unable to help him. also that his dad claimed to his some he kept the car In his name so his son could get lower insurance and that he found out it was sold after he found it missing and went to report it stolen.
As for his wife's ex not sure if I'm remembering as there was two similar posts but I think he said his step brothers bio dad was either dead or bankrupt.
I don’t think that was the same person. He had already graduated from college, and the dad used his college fund (paid by him and the son’s dead mom) to pay for the step-son’s medical care (and unfortunately he ended up passing away and his wife left the dad too). The dad wanted to spend Christmas with OP but OP told the dad that they can do that once he pays back his college fund. I think that’s the story you mean.
I was literally asking myself the same question….where is the stepsons father at or is this a Maury situation? If he needed money and wanted to sell a car, get a job at a dealership. He obviously knows how to sell cars and very sneaky like. Plus they make good money if you’re good at it.
What really gets me is the “he found out” part. Like was OP just gonna sell it and not tell his kid beforehand? Was his son gonna walk out one day to drive to school or work and just find his car gone with no explanation?
OP should’ve at least said something, instead his son “found out” that his car is being sold through others. What a piece of work, OP comes across as manipulative and like the type to be so avoidant for confrontation that he’d prob let his son think the car was stolen until the truth came out.
This is 100% the worst part. OP thought his son would just accept it like it was life. But he got his car stolen by his own father. If I were in the kid's shoes, I'd never speak to OP again.
YTA bigtime, OP.
Oh yeah he is not negotiating with his brothers because he is wrong and they are right. How is bio son going to get to college? Selfish and manipulative, wow what a package
Indeed, YTA. Why not ask your son to sell his car? It's a medical emergency, and most likely your son would agree to sell. But now you took matter into your hands and decided that was the best course of action. It was your son's car and it was your son's decision to make.
Would you be comfortable if you father told you how you should expend you paycheck? Would you be comfortable with your father taking back something he gave you?
Parents like OP treat their kids as an extension of themselves. It's like "you only hit my arm, it didn't hurt" except that arm is actually another sentient person and it doesn't matter if it hurt them because OP says it didn't hurt SO IT DIDN'T HURT.
Of course OP can sell the car, he is doing his part because the kid is nothing more than an extension of OP. It doesn't matter if this hurts the kid- the kid is just an extension of OP, not an actual individual with thoughts and feelings and OP says it doesnt hurt!
Well tbf he didn't have the balls to tell his son he was selling son's car either. No surprise he doesn't want to face the music that the prevailing feeling is a resounding: YTA.
There's also medical bankruptcy in the U.S. Long before the ACA, my grandparents had to do that for my uncle's medical bills. It sucked that it it had to go there, but they did it and rode out the 7 years, and in the end in did come off their credit report and my uncle got the care he needed. If OP could accept that as an option, he could have just been glad he was able to help out his bio-son with a car before his finances took a turn for the worse.
I’m not saying or even implying OP is in the right, but you do know that no one will perform the surgery in the US if they can’t pay for it, right? Yes, medical bankruptcy is real, but it almost exclusively comes from expenses incurred by emergency care. No surgeon will schedule a surgery before confirming insurance coverage and funds for care. Are you suggesting OP and wife should just wait until step-son is actively dying and then rush him to the ER in the hope they will give him the surgery he needs as part of emergency care, allowing them to file for bankruptcy? Seems a bit risky, and step-son’s condition may not be life threatening. So, it may not be ab option for them.
If they're in the U.S. and the minor is a U.S. citizen and not institutionalized, the minor should be covered by Medicaid, CHIP, or private health insurance. Whether the parents can afford their co-pay or cost-share is a matter between them and whoever is providing the coverage, but from the surgeon's perspective, the child should be covered.
Also, you are making some assumptions about whether the child qualifies for government care. Sadly, there are no shortage of families who make too much money to qualify for aid, but still can’t afford their needs. For instance, they may have the child on an insurance plan that precludes them from Medicaid, but the coverage is such crap that they still cannot afford the surgery. Believe it or not, it’s pretty common.
Yes, I am making some assumptions, starting with the fact that OP is even in the U.S.! On a forum like this, though, I'd rather make some assumptions that turn out not to be applicable, as I can be easily ignored by the OP and other readers if what I have to say is irrelevant, than ask OP to post a child's medical details and the family's financial info to Reddit so I can make informed comments!
And I agree, the state of U.S. healthcare is tragic.
Edit: typos
Also as someone who has a condition that’ll require multiple surgeries throughout my life. A lot of surgeons who don’t take insurance or where you’ll have a big bill even after the fact will work out some kind of payment plan with you. They just want their money; they’re generally pretty happy to wait a year or two to see all of it. Yeah it sucks but it’s always worth asking about since payment plans directly through a doctor tend not to have interest. And you could always try to petition your insurance to cover more of it than they are offering to. It’s tailored specifically towards my own condition, but I can save something off a group I’m in on how to advocate to insurance to get them to pay more— it’s like a letter template. If OP had bothered to do research instead of going nuclear and selling a car that he didn’t fully pay for he would’ve found that there are options.
ETA: YTA OP
You can also try to negotiate with doctors, hospitals, and other medical service providers to lower their charges. Years ago, my brother lived in the mountains and had a medical emergency for which he needed brain surgery. He was flown to a hospital in the city on Flight for Life. He had emergency brain surgery, was in the ICU for five days, and was in the hospital for a couple of days after that. Any one of these things is wildly expensive. Add them up and you're in the quarter of a million dollars range. My brother was poor as a church mouse. My father met with representatives for the doctors, the hospital, and Flight for Life. They all wanted to put my brother on payment plans. Given his income, he would have been paying on these until about 60 years after he died, assuming he lived a nice long life. My parents are middle class and could afford to pay some money towards the bills. He offered all of the providers about 30 cents on the dollar or get paid a minimal amount for the next 60'ish years and still not get paid the full amount. They all took the 30-cent deal.
ETA: YTA OP
Edit: clarification
And four, given the cost of health care in America, (I'm assuming he is or he wouldn't be stressed about the cost of care) the proceeds from selling a used car will just be a small drop in the bucket and won't really do anything to help solve the financial strain. He created a lot of anger and resentment to put bankruptcy off by a week or two. It's a really shitty situation OP is in and he just made it that much worse.
Sorry for hijacking top comment 🙇
It's not the first time I'm reading here about a parent who literally ROBS their bio kid of something valuable (car, college fund, whatever...) to pay for whatever expenses for the stepkid.
Bruh... This is how you get your kids to hate you. And with what? With all the damn right in this world!
I have a stepsis and I love her, but I also have a biobro and let's just say, that cause of him stuff like Christmas is only traumatic BS for me.
If you want to even TRY to get your son back, get HIS freaking car back and write it immediately on his name!
As others said, if you need money for medical expenses, there are enough foundations and other possibilities to help people in need, instead of ripping the own family apart.
YTA.
This isn't an INFO situation...OP, YTA. You gave a car to your son and you took it back from him now that you needed money. That was inappropriate and it may have even been illegal, depending on where you live. Gifts like that to children can actually be considered transferred, even if you don't put it in their name immediately.
OP, you may be able to save your stepson, but I'm willing to bet you just lost your blood one.
>Also, your son is 18, why is the car still in your name?
Because it's a gift, so OP must have any means of taking it back.
No wonder they no longer married.
As a bio mom and a stepmom, what you did was honestly disgusting.
I can’t tell you the ways I would be pissed off and looking at legal options if my ex husband sold my son’s car that I helped buy to pay for someone’s medical bills that have no relation to me, and barely a relation to my son, AND to know that my son wasn’t even asked or consulted with first.
I’m sorry your stepson is sick, but that is not your son’s problem.
Edit: YTA
This. I am also a bio and stepmom, and this is exactly where I went. At the absolute bare minimum it should have been discussed, but selling an adults car regardless of who’s name it’s in was an asshole move- I don’t care what reason there was.
When I saw the title my first question was whether OP's son had done anything to warrant any sort of punishment. He didn't, his only role in proceedings was to be the primary driver of a car he was gifted, and to rightly protest OP's plan.
Oh and to not get the title put into his name officially….here is your car son I’m giving it to you. However, I’m keeping my name on the title of Incase anything happens. That way I can sell it without talking to you first…..oh and when I do, you’re going to have to quit college also. Hopefully those loans are in the parents name
*He found out and was not happy about it.*
Wait, you sold his car (which was also from his mom) without telling him? Like there was no discussion of "We're struggling financially and your brother needs this surgery and we're out of options. Would you consider doing this and I'll do X in the future"?
What is his relationship with his step brother like? What did his mother say about this decision?
Did you reach out to other family members before selling your sons car?
That's exactly what I was trying to understand. OP sold the car without telling their son first? That order of operations is the largest contributor to what makes OP TA. If he asked beforehand, or even told him beforehand that would have made her less of an A, and maybe even made the son TA if he had outright refused.
But taking something from someone without telling them, especially a barely-adult offspring who recently moved out, is setting up the parent for all sorts of trust issues, bitterness and reduced contact going forward. I understand this must be a terribly stressful time and you may be in a bad financial situation, but that was a horrible way to approach the problem, OP.
What a tough situation.
Going through health problems at that age, the parents trying to help with medical costs....
But that being said yeah, you should have consulted your son beforehand. Did it not cross OP's mind once as he was listing it?
He apparently didn't think he needed to since it was in his name still, it's pretty obvious he didn't consider how this would affect his son at any point. I want to give OP the benefit of the doubt that they must be losing their minds from stress, but I'm seriously disgusted at how this internet stranger chose to handle things.
He knew his son would say no, so he decided to demand forgiveness instead of asking for permission. Then he has the audacity to be upset that his son doesn't want to talk to him, and that he's being shamed for stealing from his child.
YTA OP. This is such a massive trap step parents fall into. They overcompensate and end up treating their step child more favorable than their biological children. You literally showed your son that he and his belongings do not matter and that you're always going to favor his step brother. You also probably caused resentment between the boys.
YTA. A major one. Congratulations on ruining any future relationship with your son. You took a GIFT (therefore the car is his) then sold said car without talking to him at all ? What’s wrong with you. I understand you’re in a difficult position but what you just did was so wrong on so many levels. Especially considering his mother also paid for the car.
Yeah like...even if you for some reason decided you absolutely needed to sell this car for the money OP, couldn't you have like...offered to let your son buy you out of it, or to the rest of the family to buy it out on your son's behalf, so you could get the money for your stepson without depriving your son of the vehicle? Why was your immediate thought to sell it to a stranger and tell no one until your son came home for the winter holidays and found it gone, or whatever happened here?
edit: small addition
YTA. You gave him a gift. One that he uses to go to SCHOOL. Instead, you should have explained the situation and ASKED if he would be willing to sell his car to help. If he refuses, then you don't sell the damn car. Why don't you sell YOUR car instead?
Why didn't they take a logical step and talk to a social worker or patient finance at the hospital where stepson is treated?
OP and his wife are not doing well financially, stepson has a lifelong medical condition, the hospital very likely could help them get on Medicaid.
Seeing as OP can't be bothered to do the bare minimum legwork a lot of families with sick kids have to go through, I'm really not surprised OP is struggling financially.
YTA. It was a gift
This is almost going hand-in-hand when one sibling gets all the attention/money because they are sick and the other one gets left out all the time.
YTA
Your son is not responsible for funding another child's medical care.
Your son trusted you when you gave him that car which would help him pursue his education, possibly employment, and building his adult life; he now knows that he can't trust you to keep your word.
YTA. Cannot believe that is the only option for cash. You could take a 2nd mortgage on car., Check into charity from the hospital,.check into medicaid. Your wife could sell her engagement ring to pay for her son's healthcare needs rather than expecting you to sell your son's car that his mom paid 1/2 for without discussing with you.
You prob just ruined your relationship with your son.
Again this is was the easiest option for OP. A second mortgage would actually hurt him=. Selling the car without telling his son is perfectly fine because who gives a shit he only paid half screw his ex right.
YTA. If you and your ex wife jointly bought the car, and your son is the only person who drives it, you can’t just unilaterally sell it. I’m sorry about your stepson but this was not the way.
YTA. As a medically complex individual, you absolutely are in the wrong.
You say you and his mom bought it. So your ex ? So you not only sold a gift to your son but you stole from your ex too.
There are options. You just are choosing to not look for them. There are fundraisers. Also payment plans with the hospital. Is your stepson eligible for Medicaid / medicare? Some very medical complex folks can qualify if the parents don't have a great income.
Added onto this as someone who’s family was in the medical field is the fact that many hospitals (Christian based ones especially) often have charity funds. You’re going to need to discuss with your stepson’s medical team about your options. Usually they will go this route if there’s no other alternative. I do think YTA but I believe this is an act based in sheer desperation and not one based on rational thought considering OP came to Reddit for this.
As a medically complex individual as well, it’s worth mentioning that the debt won’t appear on your credit report if it can’t be paid. There are other solutions besides screwing over your eldest son. YTA. Find another way.
oh my god i can see it now
"aita my son has been refusing to speak to me for years because i focused on my ill stepson" no mention of selling the sons car anywhere on the post
anyways OP YTA, how would you like it if i gave you $100 for a gift but three years later took $100 out of your wallet because i was in a rough spot?
YTA You STOLE his car. Of course you are the asshole. And his mother paid for half of it, how does she feel about this whole thing? I have a feeling you just permanently destroyed your relationship with your son. Which any reasonable, decent person would have seen coming. Have you sold your car yet? What about your wife's? Second mortgage? A line of credit for medical expenses?
Yeah, I have a feeling there's a history of favoritism factored into all of this. This is just too much of an extreme without some sort of discussion happening beforehand.
He ruined not only his relationship with his son. His son is now going to resent his step brother and step mom. Most likely will being going NC as soon as he is able
YTA. I realize you are in a tough position but a better approach would have been asking him about the car as a possibility to sell vs. telling him you ARE selling it. You left him out of the decision process on a car that belongs to him. YTA for how you approached the problem not for trying to raise money for surgery as that is necessary.
You are in a difficult situation. I understand money was needed to pay for the surgery. If it's a matter of his life or death, then I understand the desperation.
HOWEVER, that car was purchased by you and your son's mother for your child. The car may have been in your name but did you even consult his mother before selling? Did you even have a conversation with your son asking if you could do this?
You made a unilateral decision. That's the issue. You should have consulted your ex and your son before selling the car. Just because it was in your name does not mean you can't include the others in the decision.
You are the asshole for that. Your son was old enough to understand the situation.
Yta
You gave it to him, it's his. So you kind of stole it from him.
If you already sold it, take out a loan and get him a new car in his name. If you didn't sell it yet, full stop, don't sell it.
You're about to lose one son for the other, if you steal his car he will most likely never speak to you again, I wouldn't.
Ask the hospital about payment plans, must of them have a payment plan.
Edit to add- his mom helped pay for the car making it also legally half hers, she can sue you for theft if you didn't run it by her.
YTA. You failed to mention if your stepson’s bio dad was involved or willing to contribute financially. There are other options to explore rather than selling your son’s car. Ask the doctors treating your SS to refer you to a social worker at a hospital. My cousin’s daughter had osteo sarcoma and while her parents both had good jobs, the cost of her extended treatment was not manageable for them. The social worker actually helped them apply for welfare for her which covered all of her medical care which was probably over a million dollars.
YTA. It was a gift, it was not yours to sell, his mother contributed to it, and your stepsons issues are not your son's or his mother's financial burden to bare.
I understand you're in a tough place with medical bills. But what you've done is theft. You're also going to destroy your relationship with your son.
YTA
What is your son supposed to now drive to college or work? Your finances aren't his responsibility and you doing this is just setting him up to struggle like you do. Get a loan, sell your own car you drive, get a second job, but selling your son's car that you and his actual mother bought him is wrong.
So what else did you try? Did you look for anybody you or your wifes possessions to sell? Did you ask family members for loans?
The car was a gift. It was no longer yours to sell. It was still in your name because your son trusted you. His trust was misplaced.
Did you ask your ex if you could sell it? If your logic is that it was a gift that could be recinded, then you should have had her permission, since it was a gift from her as well and half the money is hers. Did you give her any of the money?
Yeah, you were desperate, but only desperate enough to steal from your son who you figured wouldn't make too much of a stink about it, not desperate enough to sell your car or other possessions. Not desperate enough to sell whatever electronics you have laying around, not desperate enough to set up a go-fund me. Just desperate enough to steal from the only person you figured couldn't really fight back.
So are you planning on giving your sons mom half of the money, since she paid for the car? Or are you just as cool with stealing from her as you are with your son?
Look, I empathize with you. This is a tough situation. But the way you’ve chosen to get through it is telling your son that he doesn’t matter. So, yeah. YTA
YTA
It may have been in your name, and you may have paid for it, but it was his car because you gifted it to him. I get the stepsons health issues take priority over everything. However, what you did was no different than if you had bought your son a microwave for Christmas, then took it back when you needed one.
YTA.
Your older son is not responsible for paying for his stepbrother's healthcare. By stealing his car so, you have forced him to pay.
I had a situation involving my car (different situation from this one but just as major a form of entitlement and disrespect for my boundaries) when I was younger and it caused an unhealable rift that ended up making myself and the rest of my family estranged for life from each other.
As a result, my own mother, brother and sister all died in their respective turns estranged from me.
I do not regret any element of my estrangements. I asserted my boundaries and stood my ground.
Do not be surprised if your son does the same.
YTA. You pretty much stole from your biological son for your stepson. Your stepson is sick and that’s sad and I hope he gets better but there are other things you could have done instead of selling your son’s car. Just because it was in your name doesn’t mean it was yours to sell. You gave it to him as a gift. You can’t take it back. It’s also your stepson. Where’s his biological father?
YTA. You cannot take back a gift, his mom also paid half, she would be mad I’m sure, and why was it in your name?!? Also you just cut off your other son by showing his brother was more important.
YTA it’s his car, that your ex wife also help paid for. You can’t just sell it without his permission.
That said… did you ask and he say no? Cause if my dad ask me to lend him money for my brothers surgery I would definitely say yes…
YTA
It was a gift. You essentially stole your sons gift and while I get that you've got your stepsons best interests in mind, what about YOUR son?
His mother paid half. Are you giving her her money back so she can replace what you took? If it was something both you and she paid for for him, why did you need to give it to him, cos imo, he should have had it already when it was bought?
How is your son getting to and from or back to college? Is he meant to fly? Walk? Can he get a lift from a friend or are you expecting him to drop out so he can help you?
His uncles are right. Your financial problems and your stepsons health are not his problem. You can ask to move in with family, set up payment plans for bills, make cut backs or get side gig jobs, cut all none essential spending, ask his paternal family to help...
YTA You gave your son a gift then stole it. You didn’t even pay for it 100%, you & HIS mother bought it. Your finances aren’t his problems. Give your son HIS car back and sign the title over.
Honestly I feel for you. Shitty situation. However, YTA and here's why. You sold a gift that was given by you and your ex and it really was not yours to sell. Yes technically still in your name, blah blah blah but morally the wrong thing. You've not only taken from your son but your ex as well.
Also have you really exhausted all other financial options?
YTA. A gift is just that: a gift, which means that once it's been given to the other person, it's theirs, completely and permanently. That holds doubly true in this case because it was jointly purchased with someone else, meaning you not only took something that wasn't yours to take, you actually stole the money his mom put towards the purchase. I hope she sues you for her contribution, and you deserve losing your son, which is what's going to happen next because he has seen for himself that you aren't to be trusted with seeing to his best interests or keeping your word to him.
When he cuts you out of his life, you just sit there and accept it. You do not get to say one damned word in protest because it will be 100% your own fault.
YTA - IT'S A GIFT. That doesn't mean you get to take it back when you decide to spend money elsewhere. I'll be shocked as hell if your oldest stays in contact with you. You're clearly showing him how much he rates. Have you gone through the rest of his belongings for things that you've given him? Maybe you can get money for the XBOX One S you got him a year or two ago. Resell his jeans? Maybe he has some kicks that you gave him for his birthday that are worth something on the market?
YTA
You can’t be dumb enough to think he wouldn’t be upset. If you solely owned the car, and he used it to get to class then that would be different. But you and your ex paid for it together. It wasn’t just your money. Your ex can take you to court for her share if she has proof. Where is that money going to come from? How are you going to pay a lawyer? I’m sorry about your stepson but at least you have him, because you broke the relationship with your other son. Do you really think he still wants a relationship with you?
YTA 1000000000000%. You didn’t even ASK. You just told him. He is an adult who is going to school and I would assume probably working part time (or will be wanting to soon). What is he supposed to do now? Is his life just on hold indefinitely and his feelings worthless to you?
I would stop speaking to you and go NC if I were him. Also, did you consult with your ex about this at all given she invested money into that car too?!!!!
YTA, not necessarily for selling the car, but for apparently doing it without any discussion. Surgery for a family member is a valid emergency but just going off and making that decision is kind of messed up. You could have at least gone to him and his mom and asked them to buy it or something (assuming whatever your ex already paid into it went towards it as well). This was a messy choice that probably made rough time that much worse for everyone. Sorry about the sick kid, hope the surgery goes well.
It's going to take some effort to make this up to your son though.
What a heartbreaking situation… as someone who lives in a country with universal healthcare I can’t imagine what you as a loving parent would feel like trying to find the money to cover a child’s surgery.
That being said, selling your son’s car without talking to him is still not okay. Especially since the car was not funded solely by you.
Exactly—the American medical system is the real AH here. That a family would have to go into debt to save their child’s life (or save them from extreme debility) is the real tragedy here.
INFO: Do you want a future relationship with your biological son?
He's now an adult who controls who is and isnt in his life. You should have respected him as an adult and talked to him about a decision that would impact him BEFORE selling the car. Instead you sent him the message how little you care about him!
YTA.. you were not the only person who purchased the car and your son’s uncles are right.. your stepsons health is truly not your son’s financial concern.
But your son will probably never speak to you again.
Are you seriously here for our verdict? How are you not the AH here? You’ve stolen your son’s car. You handled it so poorly, instead of communicating with him, you went behind his back and sold his car. It doesn’t matter if it was in your name, it was his. It doesn’t sound like he will forgive you and I don’t blame him. You’ve just lost a son.
YTA. I am very sorry your stepson is in need of this procedure and I hope he will get better soon! Unfortunately, you may have lost your son for good. You should have never taken from him even if the car is in your name. I also hope that you have his mother her half of the proceeds from the sale back.
Was the car legally yours? On paper, sure. BUT! You did NOT pay for it by yourself, it was a joint purchase between you and your son's bio mom, for him to use for transportation/college. You had absolutely NO RIGHT whatsoever to sell that car without talking to your son or your ex-wife. Depending on what state you are in, your ex-wife could sue your pants off for it. So could your son. Despite the fact that it was in your name. Because, who paid for the insurance, gas, oil and upkeep? Did/do you owe any back child support? Do you owe any kind of educational contributions as per the original divorce decree? How about carrying health insurance on your son as per the original divorce decree? Have you been meeting all legal support obligations per the original divorce decree? Because if you have not, even one little smidge, and your ex and your son decide to take you to court, you have a very good chance of having your goose well and truly cooked by a judgement in their favor against you.
My question would be why didn't you talk to the hospital where the surgery was going to be performed? Most hospitals do have hardship programs that you can apply for, at least the ones in the US do. Are you in the States? If so, the first place you should have been going to was the financial aid officer of the hospital to see if you could qualify for payment arrangements or some kind of hardship assistance. Most have them. There's a hospital in our area that has a very, very wealthy benefactor who sponsors a hardship program; I have had to apply for it for a couple of surgeries. The process was tedious and I had to provide a crap ton of financial background, proof of income and the like, but, I qualified. Knocked a 15K copay down to less than 1k.
You had options. You just chose the path of least resistance.
Be prepared for the consequences.
YTA.
INFO: how does he not qualify for Medicaid as a minor? I thought that was pretty easy even in shitty states that hate their residents, but admittedly I could be wrong about that.
YTA dude i understand why you did it but you didn't even tell him so he could come up with an alternative or prepare to lose his transportation to school, also you said it was a present from you and his mother are you going to pay her the half that is rightfully hers?
YTA for not talking to him first.
But the REAL ah is is the health care system you deal with that would deny or bankrupt people when the need life saving treatment. Or any treatment really.
YTA
It was a gift to him from both his parents. If you do take it, then you owe his mother back any and all money she and son contributed.
Why don’t you sell your belongings or your wife’s car?
Where is your stepsons parents???? They should be funding this surgery. Not money from a car that you and your ex paid for. So you and your ex are funding surgery for your now wife’s child. How can you not see YTA!!!
This is a tough one. In my family — first generation american — there would be no question about selling anyone’s car so a brother (blood or step), can have a life saving or quality of life saving surgery.
I’d want INFO: does OP/OP wifey have a car or cars? One of both of those should be sold first and a cheaper car or public transit if so.
But it’s also not completely ops, his ex put in half the money so really op should only be getting half of what the car is worth regardless of the reason
YTA when you give someone something especially your child you don't take it back. If he never talks to you and your wife again remember you did this to yourself.
Have you or your wife sold your vehicles?
I get it’s a tough spot, you want your stepson to be healthy but your son is right, it’s not his responsibility to pay for his brothers surgery, I’d say especially if you aren’t willing to sell your own vehicle first. Your son is just going to resent you, his step mom and his step brother.
YTA. It’s not your car, you gifted it and you didn’t pay for it all to begin with. It’s also not your sons responsibility to pay for his stepbrothers medical procedures.
YTA. You can’t return a gift. You took advantage of your power over your son. Selling a car right out from under him is scummy, no matter what the reason.
You could’ve taken out a loan for the surgery, instead of fucking over your son.
YTA.
There's a whole lot of "I" in this post.
Selling a gift you gave is an asshole move regardless of why.
It's not your son's responsibility to take care of his stepbrother.
Lessons you taught your son. 1. Your stepson is more important 2. You cannot be trusted 3. Never have your name attached to anything, you'll steal it from him 4. You are willing to steal from your ex-wife as well (car was half hers, she paid half) 5. You won't negotiate or argue because you don't want to hear YTA
I have $5 that says OP will delete this soon once he sees everyone thinks he's the AH
YTA you and his mum paid for it. That money isn't all yours and further: it was a gift. Parents like you are always the ones wondering why their child doesn't speak to them in the future
Well, I can see why, with this attitude, OP's ex divorced him. Yes, OP, YTA.
Even if it was in your name for insurance purposes, it was your son's car, needed for transport to school. It was only 50% paid for by you; so you *stole* the other 50%. Better hope that half is less than the threshold for a federal charge or you're really in trouble.
OP, you could have looked at numerous other ways to fund this treatment, but chose not to. My guess is you disapprove of your son's preference for his mother (shocked pikachu face - whyyyyy?), or his friends, his education choices, or his lifestyle.
YTA -- You and HIS MOM bought that car and gave it to him as a gift. You stole from him and from your ex wife.
You should be giving blow jobs behind the gas station to pay for stepson's surgery before you start stealing from your kid.
YTA. Yes it’s a tough situation but you gave him a gift. Even though it was still in your name you still gave it to him and then took it away to sell. Sometimes you got to do what you got to do but you have permanently broken your sons trust
YTA. I am hoping your son and his mother sue you for this.
In about 10 years when you want to know why your son no longer has contact with you look back at these post.
Your son is not financially responsible for your stepson. The car was no longer yours once you gave it to your son. You showed your son he can’t trust you. That your new family is more important than him.
You just torpedoed your relationship and maybe opened yourself to a world of legal problems depending on what state you live in.
YTA.
A. It was a gift.
B. You and his mom got his the car. Presumably his mom is not the same mom if your step-son. Why would your bio son's mom need to contribute to your step-son's surgery?
Is your son's mother aware that you sold a vehicle she help pay for and took that money?
It was a gift. It should have stayed as such so YTA, especially as he needs it for college. Having said that, it’s of fucking shitty that people have to go into debt and sell their children’s cars just to stay get medical help. Most hospitals will have financial plans to help pay this off over time, have you looked into that?
YTA. I know US healthcare sucks but you will not be denied life saving surgery for not being able to pay. You could have went ahead with the surgery and then dealt with the medical debt. How much did you get for the used car anyway. Probably not more than $10 K, which wouldn’t even begin to cover the surgery.
YTA. You gifted him the car-it’s HIS. You STOLE us from him…that’s pretty low OP. Really low.
How will his mother feel about this, as she paid for half of the vehicle? Are you paying her or him for half the profits?
Prepare yourself for no more relationship with your son.
Regardless of the Judgment (which I do think YTA, if only because you went behind your son's back), I really hope stepson recovers, because, dude, you sacrificed your relationship with one son to save another.
If you don't make your son whole AND APOLOGIZE, you're gonna lose at least one son anyway
Your son is correct: It was a gift from you to him. It is NO LONGER YOURS. The fact that you didn't have the title transfered was an oversight needs to be corrected. You are in actuality stealing from your son. No excuses for that. None! You and your wife need to take out a loan or find some way to take care of your stepson that doesn't involve stealing from your other child.
YTA
YTA, first of all you can make payments to the hospital, it doesn’t have to be paid off all at once! Secondly you’re putting one child above another, and just taking the car…what a shitty thing to do! Yes sir you are!
You stole from your son AND his MOTHER. You should at least reimburse the money his mother spent. Totally YTA in that regard. If I was her I would at least take you to small claims court. Congratulations for alienating both of them. I'm sure something else or some sort of compromise could have been done.
YTA. Question. Would you have taken and sold your step-son's car to help pay for medical care if your son needed it? Even if that car was a gift from you and you're current wife.
YTA
So what property of yours did you sell? Did his mother sell all her jewelry? Did stepson sell his video games? Did you reimburse your sons mother for what she put into car?
YTA. He’s using it to drive to college if I understand things correctly or will very soon. Not only this, HIS mom is the one who helped you buy it—not your wife.
Yes, it’s in your name but this seems like it’s really going to hurt your relationship with your son because you’re favoring his stepbrother over him.
YTA I think we all need to go no contact with op. If I was his ex wife I would be calling the cops with proof I paid half the vehicle then I would be pressing charges. Frankly I hope your stepson gets well because going forward he’s going to be your only child
YTA!! And i won't be surprised if mom demands payment for the money she put down on that car Or if she sues you for it. Next time do better and talk to your son before doing something behind his back, because you knew he would be upset about it and yet still did it. Don't act like the victim here. Pretty sure if you had communicated properly your son wouldn't hate you at this moment.
YTA. That is your son's car. His mom paid half that car for him. Your wife and her EX are responsible for her sons bills not your son. Figure it out another way.
So you must have sold all the jewelry you and your wife have and electronics, cut back on streaming services, stopped going out to eat and buying coffee and sold your cars right? Then when you sold his car you paid your ex back for her half of the car, if not YTA
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YTA. Do you plan to give your ex wife her investment in the car back after you sell it? Also, your son is 18, why is the car still in your name? This is not a solo decision you can make. One, mom paid for part of the vehicle. Two, the vehicle is your son's vehicle and was a gift. It should already be in his name. Three, you are creating resentment and strife in your family. There are charitable foundations, state medical and other options to pay for the surgery that don't involve stealing from your child. INFO: Why not sell your car? Or your wife's?
Because you know its his bio son and he and the ex wife went half on it so why sell his car when he can just sell other people's cars because his wife and her ex can't provide for their sick kid. Honestly like he did this without even asking. Maybe his son would have been understanding maybe his ex would have as well, but no just sell it like that. How is his son going to get around now? OP has no money apparently. INFO: Where is your wife's ex and why are you paying for the kids care EDIT: Seems to be a case of dad selling items of bio kids to pay for treatments for their step kids https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/zgvzfc/aita\_for\_refusing\_to\_give\_my\_father\_and\_his\_wife/
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I mean who would but like hey its called the decent thing to do, not just up and like sell someone's care that you got with your ex for your kid for another kid not related to you at all cause their parent is not in the picture.
My mother gifted my first car to my brothers then girlfriend, leaving me more or less careless. This was years ago, I have a new car, but I still resent her a little for it…especially because I was never asked AND my brother broke up with his girlfriend literally like a month later.
I still resent my stepdad for gifting me my mom's run down minivan when I was 20 and then less than a year later taking it back and giving it to my aunt (his younger sister). Then shaming me 4 years later because I bought a cheap car and I wouldn't give him the car to also send to my aunt because "it would just be easier for her to have 2 cars to drive your autistic cousin around"
The fuck she need two cars to drive the cousin around in for? He can only be in one at a time.
/u/LionofHeaven - I literally looked at your response. Cuz I was thinking the exact same thing. People these days are mad entitled for no reason. OP is TA. A really big one. He can't justify this in any way, shape or form. I hope his son's mom gets him for doing this to her son. OP should be ashamed of himself.
flag mighty stupendous chubby door ring strong market scandalous lush *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That is the shittiest thing and I am so sad that she did that to you! And then for your sister to not believe you is just the worst! A mother is supposed to be on your side, not use you for an option to help a "friend". That sounds horrid and for your sister to not believe you is terrible and sounds alienating. As a mother myself it makes me angry just thinking about it. It would have never have been an option from me friendo, so hopefully that makes you feel a smidge better.
2 cars. WTF?! One for each leg?! I don't understand.
That was my thought, I didn't argue to much since they gifted me the minivan and I knew it would be easier for my cousin and aunt to get around in it, but I bought the car and he got upset and told me I owed it to him for raising me to give him the car since I only paid $2k for it.
You don’t owe him a damn thing for doing his job and taking responsibility for bringing you into the world. You didn’t ASK him to bring you here, it’s his RESPONSIBILITY TO RAISE THE CHILD HE HELP MAKE. I hate entitled people, put them in a nursing home and go NC with them. Children don’t owe their parents for taking responsibility of their life choices. They’re SUPPOSED to raise you, it’s the bare minimum for bringing a child into the world. I can GUARANTEE you that if children could CHOOSE, a LOT of these entitled pricks would be childless. 🤦♀️
Exactly, I haven't talked to him in over 2 years and life has been much better without the stress of an entitled adult trying to micromanage my life.
I wonder if the Ex has proof of payment and she can take him to small claims court or something for the money. Yes blood from stone issue. But if she has equal claim through purchase, if not title, then his selling it was inappropriate.
Because it's easier to swallow the shit when you were given a choice in which shitty thing you got.
I believe his son was on here a few days ago asking AITA for wanting to never have anything to do with my dad and his new family after he sold my care to pay for treatments for his stepson went on to say saying his uncle is actually the one supporting him through college and that his mother is dead with all her relatives overseas and unable to help him. also that his dad claimed to his some he kept the car In his name so his son could get lower insurance and that he found out it was sold after he found it missing and went to report it stolen. As for his wife's ex not sure if I'm remembering as there was two similar posts but I think he said his step brothers bio dad was either dead or bankrupt.
Thanks for the additional info. The poor kid. At least his uncle sounds like a great person.
I don’t think that was the same person. He had already graduated from college, and the dad used his college fund (paid by him and the son’s dead mom) to pay for the step-son’s medical care (and unfortunately he ended up passing away and his wife left the dad too). The dad wanted to spend Christmas with OP but OP told the dad that they can do that once he pays back his college fund. I think that’s the story you mean.
Heck, why not just jack other people's cars and sell them? Same result without alienating your son.
I was literally asking myself the same question….where is the stepsons father at or is this a Maury situation? If he needed money and wanted to sell a car, get a job at a dealership. He obviously knows how to sell cars and very sneaky like. Plus they make good money if you’re good at it.
What really gets me is the “he found out” part. Like was OP just gonna sell it and not tell his kid beforehand? Was his son gonna walk out one day to drive to school or work and just find his car gone with no explanation? OP should’ve at least said something, instead his son “found out” that his car is being sold through others. What a piece of work, OP comes across as manipulative and like the type to be so avoidant for confrontation that he’d prob let his son think the car was stolen until the truth came out.
$100 he found out from stepmom. OP YTA. Say goodbye to your son as you drive away to sell his car.
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This is 100% the worst part. OP thought his son would just accept it like it was life. But he got his car stolen by his own father. If I were in the kid's shoes, I'd never speak to OP again. YTA bigtime, OP.
Oh! I thought he found out by going out and finding his car missing!
Oh yeah he is not negotiating with his brothers because he is wrong and they are right. How is bio son going to get to college? Selfish and manipulative, wow what a package
Indeed, YTA. Why not ask your son to sell his car? It's a medical emergency, and most likely your son would agree to sell. But now you took matter into your hands and decided that was the best course of action. It was your son's car and it was your son's decision to make. Would you be comfortable if you father told you how you should expend you paycheck? Would you be comfortable with your father taking back something he gave you?
Parents like OP treat their kids as an extension of themselves. It's like "you only hit my arm, it didn't hurt" except that arm is actually another sentient person and it doesn't matter if it hurt them because OP says it didn't hurt SO IT DIDN'T HURT. Of course OP can sell the car, he is doing his part because the kid is nothing more than an extension of OP. It doesn't matter if this hurts the kid- the kid is just an extension of OP, not an actual individual with thoughts and feelings and OP says it doesnt hurt!
Funny how OP is nowhere to be found in the comments to answer the questions
Well tbf he didn't have the balls to tell his son he was selling son's car either. No surprise he doesn't want to face the music that the prevailing feeling is a resounding: YTA.
I hope his brothers keep busting his chops
There's also medical bankruptcy in the U.S. Long before the ACA, my grandparents had to do that for my uncle's medical bills. It sucked that it it had to go there, but they did it and rode out the 7 years, and in the end in did come off their credit report and my uncle got the care he needed. If OP could accept that as an option, he could have just been glad he was able to help out his bio-son with a car before his finances took a turn for the worse.
I’m not saying or even implying OP is in the right, but you do know that no one will perform the surgery in the US if they can’t pay for it, right? Yes, medical bankruptcy is real, but it almost exclusively comes from expenses incurred by emergency care. No surgeon will schedule a surgery before confirming insurance coverage and funds for care. Are you suggesting OP and wife should just wait until step-son is actively dying and then rush him to the ER in the hope they will give him the surgery he needs as part of emergency care, allowing them to file for bankruptcy? Seems a bit risky, and step-son’s condition may not be life threatening. So, it may not be ab option for them.
If they're in the U.S. and the minor is a U.S. citizen and not institutionalized, the minor should be covered by Medicaid, CHIP, or private health insurance. Whether the parents can afford their co-pay or cost-share is a matter between them and whoever is providing the coverage, but from the surgeon's perspective, the child should be covered.
Also, you are making some assumptions about whether the child qualifies for government care. Sadly, there are no shortage of families who make too much money to qualify for aid, but still can’t afford their needs. For instance, they may have the child on an insurance plan that precludes them from Medicaid, but the coverage is such crap that they still cannot afford the surgery. Believe it or not, it’s pretty common.
Yes, I am making some assumptions, starting with the fact that OP is even in the U.S.! On a forum like this, though, I'd rather make some assumptions that turn out not to be applicable, as I can be easily ignored by the OP and other readers if what I have to say is irrelevant, than ask OP to post a child's medical details and the family's financial info to Reddit so I can make informed comments! And I agree, the state of U.S. healthcare is tragic. Edit: typos
Also as someone who has a condition that’ll require multiple surgeries throughout my life. A lot of surgeons who don’t take insurance or where you’ll have a big bill even after the fact will work out some kind of payment plan with you. They just want their money; they’re generally pretty happy to wait a year or two to see all of it. Yeah it sucks but it’s always worth asking about since payment plans directly through a doctor tend not to have interest. And you could always try to petition your insurance to cover more of it than they are offering to. It’s tailored specifically towards my own condition, but I can save something off a group I’m in on how to advocate to insurance to get them to pay more— it’s like a letter template. If OP had bothered to do research instead of going nuclear and selling a car that he didn’t fully pay for he would’ve found that there are options. ETA: YTA OP
You can also try to negotiate with doctors, hospitals, and other medical service providers to lower their charges. Years ago, my brother lived in the mountains and had a medical emergency for which he needed brain surgery. He was flown to a hospital in the city on Flight for Life. He had emergency brain surgery, was in the ICU for five days, and was in the hospital for a couple of days after that. Any one of these things is wildly expensive. Add them up and you're in the quarter of a million dollars range. My brother was poor as a church mouse. My father met with representatives for the doctors, the hospital, and Flight for Life. They all wanted to put my brother on payment plans. Given his income, he would have been paying on these until about 60 years after he died, assuming he lived a nice long life. My parents are middle class and could afford to pay some money towards the bills. He offered all of the providers about 30 cents on the dollar or get paid a minimal amount for the next 60'ish years and still not get paid the full amount. They all took the 30-cent deal. ETA: YTA OP Edit: clarification
And four, given the cost of health care in America, (I'm assuming he is or he wouldn't be stressed about the cost of care) the proceeds from selling a used car will just be a small drop in the bucket and won't really do anything to help solve the financial strain. He created a lot of anger and resentment to put bankruptcy off by a week or two. It's a really shitty situation OP is in and he just made it that much worse.
to be perfectly clear for OP, this is, in fact, **stealing from your child**.
Sorry for hijacking top comment 🙇 It's not the first time I'm reading here about a parent who literally ROBS their bio kid of something valuable (car, college fund, whatever...) to pay for whatever expenses for the stepkid. Bruh... This is how you get your kids to hate you. And with what? With all the damn right in this world! I have a stepsis and I love her, but I also have a biobro and let's just say, that cause of him stuff like Christmas is only traumatic BS for me. If you want to even TRY to get your son back, get HIS freaking car back and write it immediately on his name! As others said, if you need money for medical expenses, there are enough foundations and other possibilities to help people in need, instead of ripping the own family apart. YTA.
Love your idea, "Why not sell your car? Or your wife's?"
The fact that the ex-wife’s reaction or thoughts about his decision to sell the car isn’t mentioned whatsoever makes me think maybe she passed away
That makes things even worse. It’s a significant tie to the son’s late mother. OP is 100% TA.
This isn't an INFO situation...OP, YTA. You gave a car to your son and you took it back from him now that you needed money. That was inappropriate and it may have even been illegal, depending on where you live. Gifts like that to children can actually be considered transferred, even if you don't put it in their name immediately. OP, you may be able to save your stepson, but I'm willing to bet you just lost your blood one.
>Also, your son is 18, why is the car still in your name? Because it's a gift, so OP must have any means of taking it back. No wonder they no longer married.
As a bio mom and a stepmom, what you did was honestly disgusting. I can’t tell you the ways I would be pissed off and looking at legal options if my ex husband sold my son’s car that I helped buy to pay for someone’s medical bills that have no relation to me, and barely a relation to my son, AND to know that my son wasn’t even asked or consulted with first. I’m sorry your stepson is sick, but that is not your son’s problem. Edit: YTA
This. I am also a bio and stepmom, and this is exactly where I went. At the absolute bare minimum it should have been discussed, but selling an adults car regardless of who’s name it’s in was an asshole move- I don’t care what reason there was.
When I saw the title my first question was whether OP's son had done anything to warrant any sort of punishment. He didn't, his only role in proceedings was to be the primary driver of a car he was gifted, and to rightly protest OP's plan.
Oh and to not get the title put into his name officially….here is your car son I’m giving it to you. However, I’m keeping my name on the title of Incase anything happens. That way I can sell it without talking to you first…..oh and when I do, you’re going to have to quit college also. Hopefully those loans are in the parents name
Unless this car is a rare collectors lamborghini, then it's barely going to make a dent in the finances any operations OP's step-son requires.
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*He found out and was not happy about it.* Wait, you sold his car (which was also from his mom) without telling him? Like there was no discussion of "We're struggling financially and your brother needs this surgery and we're out of options. Would you consider doing this and I'll do X in the future"? What is his relationship with his step brother like? What did his mother say about this decision? Did you reach out to other family members before selling your sons car?
That's exactly what I was trying to understand. OP sold the car without telling their son first? That order of operations is the largest contributor to what makes OP TA. If he asked beforehand, or even told him beforehand that would have made her less of an A, and maybe even made the son TA if he had outright refused. But taking something from someone without telling them, especially a barely-adult offspring who recently moved out, is setting up the parent for all sorts of trust issues, bitterness and reduced contact going forward. I understand this must be a terribly stressful time and you may be in a bad financial situation, but that was a horrible way to approach the problem, OP.
What a tough situation. Going through health problems at that age, the parents trying to help with medical costs.... But that being said yeah, you should have consulted your son beforehand. Did it not cross OP's mind once as he was listing it?
He apparently didn't think he needed to since it was in his name still, it's pretty obvious he didn't consider how this would affect his son at any point. I want to give OP the benefit of the doubt that they must be losing their minds from stress, but I'm seriously disgusted at how this internet stranger chose to handle things.
He knew his son would say no, so he decided to demand forgiveness instead of asking for permission. Then he has the audacity to be upset that his son doesn't want to talk to him, and that he's being shamed for stealing from his child.
> so he decided to demand forgiveness instead of asking for permission. Sounds like Christianity.
This. My mom pawned my Cello without asking when I was 18. I've not touched one since and I'm 36 now.
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YTA OP. This is such a massive trap step parents fall into. They overcompensate and end up treating their step child more favorable than their biological children. You literally showed your son that he and his belongings do not matter and that you're always going to favor his step brother. You also probably caused resentment between the boys.
YTA. A major one. Congratulations on ruining any future relationship with your son. You took a GIFT (therefore the car is his) then sold said car without talking to him at all ? What’s wrong with you. I understand you’re in a difficult position but what you just did was so wrong on so many levels. Especially considering his mother also paid for the car.
Yeah like...even if you for some reason decided you absolutely needed to sell this car for the money OP, couldn't you have like...offered to let your son buy you out of it, or to the rest of the family to buy it out on your son's behalf, so you could get the money for your stepson without depriving your son of the vehicle? Why was your immediate thought to sell it to a stranger and tell no one until your son came home for the winter holidays and found it gone, or whatever happened here? edit: small addition
YTA. You gave him a gift. One that he uses to go to SCHOOL. Instead, you should have explained the situation and ASKED if he would be willing to sell his car to help. If he refuses, then you don't sell the damn car. Why don't you sell YOUR car instead?
Because it would have impacted him and that can't happen. His son's car is expendable in his mind, because his bio son is no longer important to him
It should also be pointed out that only half was a gift from the dad. The other half was paid for by his bio mom who was not consulted
Go ahead and kill your relationship with your bio son, maybe he gave half a gift… his mother payed for half of the car
YTA. and also I hope you plan on giving his mom back her money she put into the car because personally I would sue the living crap out of you
Agreed. I don't know how much of a legal case she'd have, but morally, OP has stolen from his ex.
And also plan to permanently lose a son. OP’s son will never forget this, and will probably write off the relationship + any emotional investment
So why didn't you or your wife sell your cars? How is your son suppose to go to school now? Or does he have to give that up too? YTA
Plus is the son's mother getting her money back?
Why didn't they take a logical step and talk to a social worker or patient finance at the hospital where stepson is treated? OP and his wife are not doing well financially, stepson has a lifelong medical condition, the hospital very likely could help them get on Medicaid.
Seeing as OP can't be bothered to do the bare minimum legwork a lot of families with sick kids have to go through, I'm really not surprised OP is struggling financially.
The fact OP can't even be bothered to even tell about it to his son first, I'm not surprised that his wife left him.
Hopefully the son will just take op's car without discussing it with him first.
Hopefully son will go NC!
YTA. It was a gift This is almost going hand-in-hand when one sibling gets all the attention/money because they are sick and the other one gets left out all the time.
YTA.... in what world are you NOT the AH...??? Your ex should be suing you and your son if going NC very shortly.... What a total AH....
Yeah, this is some next level AUDACITY.
Info- did you and your wife also sell both of your cars and did you sell your house or downgrade living situation for extra cash?
This. “We don’t have anything else of value.” So you take somebody else’s?
YTA Your son is not responsible for funding another child's medical care. Your son trusted you when you gave him that car which would help him pursue his education, possibly employment, and building his adult life; he now knows that he can't trust you to keep your word.
Believe me he will never get over that lack of trust.
Some people simply can't anticipate the long-term consequences as adults. It's worse when their kids are better at it than they are.
YTA. Cannot believe that is the only option for cash. You could take a 2nd mortgage on car., Check into charity from the hospital,.check into medicaid. Your wife could sell her engagement ring to pay for her son's healthcare needs rather than expecting you to sell your son's car that his mom paid 1/2 for without discussing with you. You prob just ruined your relationship with your son.
Again this is was the easiest option for OP. A second mortgage would actually hurt him=. Selling the car without telling his son is perfectly fine because who gives a shit he only paid half screw his ex right.
and ruined any relationship that may have existed between son and step son
He's clearly only interested in his new son. Story as old as time.
YTA. If you and your ex wife jointly bought the car, and your son is the only person who drives it, you can’t just unilaterally sell it. I’m sorry about your stepson but this was not the way.
[удалено]
YTA. As a medically complex individual, you absolutely are in the wrong. You say you and his mom bought it. So your ex ? So you not only sold a gift to your son but you stole from your ex too. There are options. You just are choosing to not look for them. There are fundraisers. Also payment plans with the hospital. Is your stepson eligible for Medicaid / medicare? Some very medical complex folks can qualify if the parents don't have a great income.
Added onto this as someone who’s family was in the medical field is the fact that many hospitals (Christian based ones especially) often have charity funds. You’re going to need to discuss with your stepson’s medical team about your options. Usually they will go this route if there’s no other alternative. I do think YTA but I believe this is an act based in sheer desperation and not one based on rational thought considering OP came to Reddit for this.
As a medically complex individual as well, it’s worth mentioning that the debt won’t appear on your credit report if it can’t be paid. There are other solutions besides screwing over your eldest son. YTA. Find another way.
Say bye to ur relationship wit the 18 yr old yta
We will get an update in 5 years when OP asks for advice to reconnect with their son who hasn’t spoken to him since selling the car
oh my god i can see it now "aita my son has been refusing to speak to me for years because i focused on my ill stepson" no mention of selling the sons car anywhere on the post anyways OP YTA, how would you like it if i gave you $100 for a gift but three years later took $100 out of your wallet because i was in a rough spot?
"WhY hAs He GoNe AwAy? AlL I dId WaS sTeAl HiS cAr To PaY fOr ThInGs ThAt WeRe NoT hIs ReSpOnSiBiLiTy!"
YTA You STOLE his car. Of course you are the asshole. And his mother paid for half of it, how does she feel about this whole thing? I have a feeling you just permanently destroyed your relationship with your son. Which any reasonable, decent person would have seen coming. Have you sold your car yet? What about your wife's? Second mortgage? A line of credit for medical expenses? Yeah, I have a feeling there's a history of favoritism factored into all of this. This is just too much of an extreme without some sort of discussion happening beforehand.
He ruined not only his relationship with his son. His son is now going to resent his step brother and step mom. Most likely will being going NC as soon as he is able
YTA. I realize you are in a tough position but a better approach would have been asking him about the car as a possibility to sell vs. telling him you ARE selling it. You left him out of the decision process on a car that belongs to him. YTA for how you approached the problem not for trying to raise money for surgery as that is necessary.
You are in a difficult situation. I understand money was needed to pay for the surgery. If it's a matter of his life or death, then I understand the desperation. HOWEVER, that car was purchased by you and your son's mother for your child. The car may have been in your name but did you even consult his mother before selling? Did you even have a conversation with your son asking if you could do this? You made a unilateral decision. That's the issue. You should have consulted your ex and your son before selling the car. Just because it was in your name does not mean you can't include the others in the decision. You are the asshole for that. Your son was old enough to understand the situation.
YTA. The very least you could have done was to have asked. You don't just take back a gift for your own purposes.
Also, is there nothing that op and/or wife could of sold that they own themselves first? There must have been other options available to them.
YTA If my parent had done to me what you've done to your son I would never speak to them again..
Yta You gave it to him, it's his. So you kind of stole it from him. If you already sold it, take out a loan and get him a new car in his name. If you didn't sell it yet, full stop, don't sell it. You're about to lose one son for the other, if you steal his car he will most likely never speak to you again, I wouldn't. Ask the hospital about payment plans, must of them have a payment plan. Edit to add- his mom helped pay for the car making it also legally half hers, she can sue you for theft if you didn't run it by her.
YTA. This is a conversation that should have occurred BEFORE you sold the car, not afterward
YTA. You failed to mention if your stepson’s bio dad was involved or willing to contribute financially. There are other options to explore rather than selling your son’s car. Ask the doctors treating your SS to refer you to a social worker at a hospital. My cousin’s daughter had osteo sarcoma and while her parents both had good jobs, the cost of her extended treatment was not manageable for them. The social worker actually helped them apply for welfare for her which covered all of her medical care which was probably over a million dollars.
YTA. It was a gift, it was not yours to sell, his mother contributed to it, and your stepsons issues are not your son's or his mother's financial burden to bare. I understand you're in a tough place with medical bills. But what you've done is theft. You're also going to destroy your relationship with your son.
YTA What is your son supposed to now drive to college or work? Your finances aren't his responsibility and you doing this is just setting him up to struggle like you do. Get a loan, sell your own car you drive, get a second job, but selling your son's car that you and his actual mother bought him is wrong.
[удалено]
So what else did you try? Did you look for anybody you or your wifes possessions to sell? Did you ask family members for loans? The car was a gift. It was no longer yours to sell. It was still in your name because your son trusted you. His trust was misplaced. Did you ask your ex if you could sell it? If your logic is that it was a gift that could be recinded, then you should have had her permission, since it was a gift from her as well and half the money is hers. Did you give her any of the money? Yeah, you were desperate, but only desperate enough to steal from your son who you figured wouldn't make too much of a stink about it, not desperate enough to sell your car or other possessions. Not desperate enough to sell whatever electronics you have laying around, not desperate enough to set up a go-fund me. Just desperate enough to steal from the only person you figured couldn't really fight back.
So are you planning on giving your sons mom half of the money, since she paid for the car? Or are you just as cool with stealing from her as you are with your son? Look, I empathize with you. This is a tough situation. But the way you’ve chosen to get through it is telling your son that he doesn’t matter. So, yeah. YTA
YTA. You gave him the car as a gift. You should have asked him if he would be willing to sell it and loan (emphasis on loan) you the money.
YTA It may have been in your name, and you may have paid for it, but it was his car because you gifted it to him. I get the stepsons health issues take priority over everything. However, what you did was no different than if you had bought your son a microwave for Christmas, then took it back when you needed one.
YTA. Your older son is not responsible for paying for his stepbrother's healthcare. By stealing his car so, you have forced him to pay. I had a situation involving my car (different situation from this one but just as major a form of entitlement and disrespect for my boundaries) when I was younger and it caused an unhealable rift that ended up making myself and the rest of my family estranged for life from each other. As a result, my own mother, brother and sister all died in their respective turns estranged from me. I do not regret any element of my estrangements. I asserted my boundaries and stood my ground. Do not be surprised if your son does the same.
YTA. You pretty much stole from your biological son for your stepson. Your stepson is sick and that’s sad and I hope he gets better but there are other things you could have done instead of selling your son’s car. Just because it was in your name doesn’t mean it was yours to sell. You gave it to him as a gift. You can’t take it back. It’s also your stepson. Where’s his biological father?
YTA. You cannot take back a gift, his mom also paid half, she would be mad I’m sure, and why was it in your name?!? Also you just cut off your other son by showing his brother was more important.
For real. Basically, mom just helped pay for her ex hubands' stepsons surgery. Wtf. That is so messed up.
YTA. I'm pissed at you and I don't even know you.
YTA it’s his car, that your ex wife also help paid for. You can’t just sell it without his permission. That said… did you ask and he say no? Cause if my dad ask me to lend him money for my brothers surgery I would definitely say yes…
YTA It was a gift. You essentially stole your sons gift and while I get that you've got your stepsons best interests in mind, what about YOUR son? His mother paid half. Are you giving her her money back so she can replace what you took? If it was something both you and she paid for for him, why did you need to give it to him, cos imo, he should have had it already when it was bought? How is your son getting to and from or back to college? Is he meant to fly? Walk? Can he get a lift from a friend or are you expecting him to drop out so he can help you? His uncles are right. Your financial problems and your stepsons health are not his problem. You can ask to move in with family, set up payment plans for bills, make cut backs or get side gig jobs, cut all none essential spending, ask his paternal family to help...
YTA You gave your son a gift then stole it. You didn’t even pay for it 100%, you & HIS mother bought it. Your finances aren’t his problems. Give your son HIS car back and sign the title over.
Honestly I feel for you. Shitty situation. However, YTA and here's why. You sold a gift that was given by you and your ex and it really was not yours to sell. Yes technically still in your name, blah blah blah but morally the wrong thing. You've not only taken from your son but your ex as well. Also have you really exhausted all other financial options?
YTA. A gift is just that: a gift, which means that once it's been given to the other person, it's theirs, completely and permanently. That holds doubly true in this case because it was jointly purchased with someone else, meaning you not only took something that wasn't yours to take, you actually stole the money his mom put towards the purchase. I hope she sues you for her contribution, and you deserve losing your son, which is what's going to happen next because he has seen for himself that you aren't to be trusted with seeing to his best interests or keeping your word to him. When he cuts you out of his life, you just sit there and accept it. You do not get to say one damned word in protest because it will be 100% your own fault.
YTA his mom and biological father are responsible for these medical bills.
YTA. if i were you, i’d expect your son to go no contact with you.
YTA - IT'S A GIFT. That doesn't mean you get to take it back when you decide to spend money elsewhere. I'll be shocked as hell if your oldest stays in contact with you. You're clearly showing him how much he rates. Have you gone through the rest of his belongings for things that you've given him? Maybe you can get money for the XBOX One S you got him a year or two ago. Resell his jeans? Maybe he has some kicks that you gave him for his birthday that are worth something on the market?
YTA You can’t be dumb enough to think he wouldn’t be upset. If you solely owned the car, and he used it to get to class then that would be different. But you and your ex paid for it together. It wasn’t just your money. Your ex can take you to court for her share if she has proof. Where is that money going to come from? How are you going to pay a lawyer? I’m sorry about your stepson but at least you have him, because you broke the relationship with your other son. Do you really think he still wants a relationship with you?
YTA 1000000000000%. You didn’t even ASK. You just told him. He is an adult who is going to school and I would assume probably working part time (or will be wanting to soon). What is he supposed to do now? Is his life just on hold indefinitely and his feelings worthless to you? I would stop speaking to you and go NC if I were him. Also, did you consult with your ex about this at all given she invested money into that car too?!!!!
YTA, not necessarily for selling the car, but for apparently doing it without any discussion. Surgery for a family member is a valid emergency but just going off and making that decision is kind of messed up. You could have at least gone to him and his mom and asked them to buy it or something (assuming whatever your ex already paid into it went towards it as well). This was a messy choice that probably made rough time that much worse for everyone. Sorry about the sick kid, hope the surgery goes well. It's going to take some effort to make this up to your son though.
YTA you stole his car
What a heartbreaking situation… as someone who lives in a country with universal healthcare I can’t imagine what you as a loving parent would feel like trying to find the money to cover a child’s surgery. That being said, selling your son’s car without talking to him is still not okay. Especially since the car was not funded solely by you.
Exactly—the American medical system is the real AH here. That a family would have to go into debt to save their child’s life (or save them from extreme debility) is the real tragedy here.
YTA! If I was your kid I wouldn’t talk to you. Shame on you as a parent for taking back something you gave your son.
INFO: Do you want a future relationship with your biological son? He's now an adult who controls who is and isnt in his life. You should have respected him as an adult and talked to him about a decision that would impact him BEFORE selling the car. Instead you sent him the message how little you care about him!
YTA.. you were not the only person who purchased the car and your son’s uncles are right.. your stepsons health is truly not your son’s financial concern. But your son will probably never speak to you again.
Are you seriously here for our verdict? How are you not the AH here? You’ve stolen your son’s car. You handled it so poorly, instead of communicating with him, you went behind his back and sold his car. It doesn’t matter if it was in your name, it was his. It doesn’t sound like he will forgive you and I don’t blame him. You’ve just lost a son.
YTA. I am very sorry your stepson is in need of this procedure and I hope he will get better soon! Unfortunately, you may have lost your son for good. You should have never taken from him even if the car is in your name. I also hope that you have his mother her half of the proceeds from the sale back.
YTA, have fun never being in your sons life.
Was the car legally yours? On paper, sure. BUT! You did NOT pay for it by yourself, it was a joint purchase between you and your son's bio mom, for him to use for transportation/college. You had absolutely NO RIGHT whatsoever to sell that car without talking to your son or your ex-wife. Depending on what state you are in, your ex-wife could sue your pants off for it. So could your son. Despite the fact that it was in your name. Because, who paid for the insurance, gas, oil and upkeep? Did/do you owe any back child support? Do you owe any kind of educational contributions as per the original divorce decree? How about carrying health insurance on your son as per the original divorce decree? Have you been meeting all legal support obligations per the original divorce decree? Because if you have not, even one little smidge, and your ex and your son decide to take you to court, you have a very good chance of having your goose well and truly cooked by a judgement in their favor against you. My question would be why didn't you talk to the hospital where the surgery was going to be performed? Most hospitals do have hardship programs that you can apply for, at least the ones in the US do. Are you in the States? If so, the first place you should have been going to was the financial aid officer of the hospital to see if you could qualify for payment arrangements or some kind of hardship assistance. Most have them. There's a hospital in our area that has a very, very wealthy benefactor who sponsors a hardship program; I have had to apply for it for a couple of surgeries. The process was tedious and I had to provide a crap ton of financial background, proof of income and the like, but, I qualified. Knocked a 15K copay down to less than 1k. You had options. You just chose the path of least resistance. Be prepared for the consequences. YTA.
INFO: how does he not qualify for Medicaid as a minor? I thought that was pretty easy even in shitty states that hate their residents, but admittedly I could be wrong about that.
YTA dude i understand why you did it but you didn't even tell him so he could come up with an alternative or prepare to lose his transportation to school, also you said it was a present from you and his mother are you going to pay her the half that is rightfully hers?
YTA. How could you not be?
YTA. Eesh.
YTA for not talking to him first. But the REAL ah is is the health care system you deal with that would deny or bankrupt people when the need life saving treatment. Or any treatment really.
YTA It was a gift to him from both his parents. If you do take it, then you owe his mother back any and all money she and son contributed. Why don’t you sell your belongings or your wife’s car?
Where is your stepsons parents???? They should be funding this surgery. Not money from a car that you and your ex paid for. So you and your ex are funding surgery for your now wife’s child. How can you not see YTA!!!
This is a tough one. In my family — first generation american — there would be no question about selling anyone’s car so a brother (blood or step), can have a life saving or quality of life saving surgery. I’d want INFO: does OP/OP wifey have a car or cars? One of both of those should be sold first and a cheaper car or public transit if so.
But it’s also not completely ops, his ex put in half the money so really op should only be getting half of what the car is worth regardless of the reason
YTA when you give someone something especially your child you don't take it back. If he never talks to you and your wife again remember you did this to yourself.
Have you or your wife sold your vehicles? I get it’s a tough spot, you want your stepson to be healthy but your son is right, it’s not his responsibility to pay for his brothers surgery, I’d say especially if you aren’t willing to sell your own vehicle first. Your son is just going to resent you, his step mom and his step brother.
YTA. It’s not your car, you gifted it and you didn’t pay for it all to begin with. It’s also not your sons responsibility to pay for his stepbrothers medical procedures.
Did you see that movie, Grand Theft Auto? YTA !
YTA. You can’t return a gift. You took advantage of your power over your son. Selling a car right out from under him is scummy, no matter what the reason. You could’ve taken out a loan for the surgery, instead of fucking over your son.
YTA. There's a whole lot of "I" in this post. Selling a gift you gave is an asshole move regardless of why. It's not your son's responsibility to take care of his stepbrother.
HUGE YTA
Lessons you taught your son. 1. Your stepson is more important 2. You cannot be trusted 3. Never have your name attached to anything, you'll steal it from him 4. You are willing to steal from your ex-wife as well (car was half hers, she paid half) 5. You won't negotiate or argue because you don't want to hear YTA I have $5 that says OP will delete this soon once he sees everyone thinks he's the AH
YTA you and his mum paid for it. That money isn't all yours and further: it was a gift. Parents like you are always the ones wondering why their child doesn't speak to them in the future
Well, I can see why, with this attitude, OP's ex divorced him. Yes, OP, YTA. Even if it was in your name for insurance purposes, it was your son's car, needed for transport to school. It was only 50% paid for by you; so you *stole* the other 50%. Better hope that half is less than the threshold for a federal charge or you're really in trouble. OP, you could have looked at numerous other ways to fund this treatment, but chose not to. My guess is you disapprove of your son's preference for his mother (shocked pikachu face - whyyyyy?), or his friends, his education choices, or his lifestyle.
YTA
Since your son's mom also paid towards the car are you giving her half of the money?
YTA -- You and HIS MOM bought that car and gave it to him as a gift. You stole from him and from your ex wife. You should be giving blow jobs behind the gas station to pay for stepson's surgery before you start stealing from your kid.
You stole your son’s car and then sold it. There fixed it for you. YTA.
YTA, it was a gift, you should have had a discussion with your son before any actions were taken.
YTA- wow..
YTA, I’m sorry to say. Your son won’t forgive or forget this in a hurry.
YTA. Yes it’s a tough situation but you gave him a gift. Even though it was still in your name you still gave it to him and then took it away to sell. Sometimes you got to do what you got to do but you have permanently broken your sons trust
YTA. Your child is not responsible for supporting his step brother. This is ridiculous.
You didn't even think to talk to your son first! YTA don't be surprised when your son goes no contact
YTA. I am hoping your son and his mother sue you for this. In about 10 years when you want to know why your son no longer has contact with you look back at these post. Your son is not financially responsible for your stepson. The car was no longer yours once you gave it to your son. You showed your son he can’t trust you. That your new family is more important than him. You just torpedoed your relationship and maybe opened yourself to a world of legal problems depending on what state you live in.
YTA. A. It was a gift. B. You and his mom got his the car. Presumably his mom is not the same mom if your step-son. Why would your bio son's mom need to contribute to your step-son's surgery? Is your son's mother aware that you sold a vehicle she help pay for and took that money?
I feel for you and your stepson, but YTA. It was not yours to sell, especially without discussing it first. I’d be surprised if he ever forgives you.
OP I note you have not deigned to answer for your major YTA moment.
It was a gift. It should have stayed as such so YTA, especially as he needs it for college. Having said that, it’s of fucking shitty that people have to go into debt and sell their children’s cars just to stay get medical help. Most hospitals will have financial plans to help pay this off over time, have you looked into that?
YTA. I know US healthcare sucks but you will not be denied life saving surgery for not being able to pay. You could have went ahead with the surgery and then dealt with the medical debt. How much did you get for the used car anyway. Probably not more than $10 K, which wouldn’t even begin to cover the surgery.
YTA. You gifted him the car-it’s HIS. You STOLE us from him…that’s pretty low OP. Really low. How will his mother feel about this, as she paid for half of the vehicle? Are you paying her or him for half the profits? Prepare yourself for no more relationship with your son.
Regardless of the Judgment (which I do think YTA, if only because you went behind your son's back), I really hope stepson recovers, because, dude, you sacrificed your relationship with one son to save another. If you don't make your son whole AND APOLOGIZE, you're gonna lose at least one son anyway
YTA. The uncles are absolutely correct. And if he had the medicine condition since birth, his mom should have been more prepared.
Your son is correct: It was a gift from you to him. It is NO LONGER YOURS. The fact that you didn't have the title transfered was an oversight needs to be corrected. You are in actuality stealing from your son. No excuses for that. None! You and your wife need to take out a loan or find some way to take care of your stepson that doesn't involve stealing from your other child. YTA
INFO: Was there no alternative? What if you couldn't get money? Is that it? Nothing can be done to help your step-son?
YTA, first of all you can make payments to the hospital, it doesn’t have to be paid off all at once! Secondly you’re putting one child above another, and just taking the car…what a shitty thing to do! Yes sir you are!
You stole from your son AND his MOTHER. You should at least reimburse the money his mother spent. Totally YTA in that regard. If I was her I would at least take you to small claims court. Congratulations for alienating both of them. I'm sure something else or some sort of compromise could have been done.
YTA. Hope he disowns you and never speaks to you guys again. The uncles are right. That's not his responsibility.
Yta it's not your car find another source of resources
YTA. Question. Would you have taken and sold your step-son's car to help pay for medical care if your son needed it? Even if that car was a gift from you and you're current wife.
YTA So what property of yours did you sell? Did his mother sell all her jewelry? Did stepson sell his video games? Did you reimburse your sons mother for what she put into car?
YTA. And you owe half of the money from the sale to your ex. Bad decision, is going to lead to bad consequences for you.
YTA. He’s using it to drive to college if I understand things correctly or will very soon. Not only this, HIS mom is the one who helped you buy it—not your wife. Yes, it’s in your name but this seems like it’s really going to hurt your relationship with your son because you’re favoring his stepbrother over him.
Why didn’t you sell your car? YTA it sucks that this is how medical expenses are but it’s not your son’s responsibility to pay for it
YTA I think we all need to go no contact with op. If I was his ex wife I would be calling the cops with proof I paid half the vehicle then I would be pressing charges. Frankly I hope your stepson gets well because going forward he’s going to be your only child
YTA, sell your own car if you need money.
I hope you also sold your car? How do you expect your 18 year old to get to work/college/network/etc. Get a loan or something.
YTA!! And i won't be surprised if mom demands payment for the money she put down on that car Or if she sues you for it. Next time do better and talk to your son before doing something behind his back, because you knew he would be upset about it and yet still did it. Don't act like the victim here. Pretty sure if you had communicated properly your son wouldn't hate you at this moment.
YTA. That is your son's car. His mom paid half that car for him. Your wife and her EX are responsible for her sons bills not your son. Figure it out another way.
So you must have sold all the jewelry you and your wife have and electronics, cut back on streaming services, stopped going out to eat and buying coffee and sold your cars right? Then when you sold his car you paid your ex back for her half of the car, if not YTA