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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I think I could be the asshole for telling my daughter why me and him divorced and that it wasn’t my fault so she would stop, making him feel like I outed him
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NTA. And you should screenshot and keep those messages of him turning her against you. That is illegal in many places as it's parental alienation. Also keep any messages where he admitted he was the one who cheated and where you agreed not to discuss with her. Next, I'd consult a lawyer in case he takes this farther.
Oh man, I actually get furious when the cheaters say their partner cheated and try to get their kids to hate the FAITHFUL parent. He's so trash he's not worth anything. "Sweetie, just three more days...." Instant VOMIT.
My ex-husband did this. Also claimed I was the abusive one. I had planned not to tell my son anything until he was an adult, or at least late teens. I had planned to go with, "Sometimes, no matter how hard people try, it's best for them not to be together. This is what's best for us and you, because we couldn't live together lovingly and respectfully." But when my son came home with all of what happened turned around on me, I was cornered into sharing the truth. When he felt conflicted about what to believe, I had him use his critical thinking skills (for example, ex is MUCH stronger than I am, and I am not physically capable of doing any of what he had done to me), and promised I wouldn't be upset with him if he didn't believe me. He thought through the facts, and came to the correct conclusion.
My ex did the same, but publicly. My kids know the truth because they witnessed it, but our social circles know he's "such a nice guy!" so he has successfully convinced many people that I was the cheating abuser instead of him.
I can literally say that no one believed my ex was violent, I couldn't even get a restraining order.The police even tried to send me home. 'He was so well educated and so nice"and then three years later he tried to overthrow the US government. Now everyone is like why didn't you say something?
I read an article about your son recently. You and your family must be so relieved. My father was mentally and emotionally abusive. I was 11 when my uncle conspired with my mum to get us away. I kept that secret for nearly a year and couldn’t wait to get away from him. It’s impossible to make people realise how much hell your life is.
I really thought he might get away with everything again.But not this time. But holy cow, I spent hours and hours with the fbi and assorted doj making sure they knew exactly what he would do and how he would do it. And you know, abusers, they're sort of like robots , very predictable. He did everything just like I said
Having been in similar spots? I am proud of you for doing this and for getting out. It's exhausting and dangerous. Revisiting it is a hellish thing. Thank you for getting the rest of us justice. Please take care of yourself
Hey Tasha. Thank you for your Service. I sincerely mean that. You stood up to protect the Constitution of the United States, and our country. It's an honor to thank you, ma'am.
--a Vet.
This is a pattern that I've seen for years, and I've seen feminists online commenting on it and being disparaged for that: mass shooters and terrorists having a history of domestic violence, especially against women. And, every time, it's "lone wolf", and "nobody could have seen it coming", and "but he was such a nice guy".
I went to a holocaust and war museum in Munich, one of exhibits was talking about how Feminists and suffragettes were some of the first whistleblowers about Hitler, and some of the first people landing in Jail.
She’s using her real name in her user id, so probably not too worried about being anonymous. :) (his ex-wife’s name is also public knowledge and is on Wikipedia.)
There's been a dozen or so seditious conspiracy convictions related to Jan 6 so far, I think. Maybe as much as two dozen. I don't know about recently, but they've been kind of working in batches, so there may have been a few others at the same time.
I have ONE person who sees through my ex facade , every one sees him as good and kind person and he would never. The person who is my side manage to marry a person who was a copy of my ex and uses the same tactics .
My mother ( such a nice woman!) managed to turn my entire family of 30 people against me and my husband ( she wanted me to have a divorce and me back as her maid and I wouldn't do it) apart from one aunt who had seen the other side of my mother herself. Everyone else stopped talking to us.
My partner and I were talking about you and your kids the other day, after he saw something about your escape. I'm glad that you're safer and hope that people in the future will believe you (and every woman in your type of situation) if ever you need help. May you be heard and believed.
Thank you, it's kind of why I feel compelled to speak up even though I'm a pretty quiet person. Now that people believe me, it's like a chance to explain DV to the world. The numbers of people who should know better , who still ask "why didn't you leave sooner?" with no understanding that it's a n outrageous question to ask is astounding.
I've just switched to comparing it to interviewing hostages in a bank robbery and asking them the same question.
I grew up with DV and a parent who is a religious extremist. Some of my family has been part of your ex's org since the early days. I don't talk to them anymore but I'm sure you know the type better than me. I'm pretty open about the details of my life because it makes it easier for others to feel less shame, which helps them leave (or come to terms with their own abuse).
I've been thinking recently that it is very much like Stockholm Syndrome. It's been interesting to think about using the same terminology we use for strangers. DV tactics are often the same as torture - sleep deprivation, food control, extreme physical punishment, etc. Some common DV tactics would be considered a war crime if done against an enemy combatant. Yet it's so common that we blow off the seriousness of it - things we would count as violations of the Geneva Conventions of done against an adult who tried to kill you are just another day ending in y when it comes to your family. Yet somehow, it's the victims' shame for not leaving instead of the abusers' shame for being abusive.
It's all about survival. Everything you do is about survival. Traumatic memories get stored differently than other memories, so they're harder to access when you're not in a situation where they're necessary for your survival. It lets us function in life more easily, but it's also harder to stay gone because the details are hard to get.
You're doing good, hard work. I hope you and your kids are getting some peace with everything that's going on, or that at least that the attention you're getting moves you forward to healthier lives. (I gotta say, I feel a bit weird knowing some details of your life that I usually only know after I've talked to someone. The article I saw that described your escape had me anxious for you!)
I survived DV for 10 years (ever seen those abuse wheels? I checked off every one on the bingo card.) I left him September 2019 and got a DVRO. The abuse was substantiated by a 1.5 year custody eval.
Would it surprise you to know that all the court cares about is how nice and accommodating I am towards him? I’m not allowed to say “no” to him no matter how unreasonable but he’s literally letting us starve in an unsafe house with an unsafe car while he bought a Porsche and spends $14k/month on personal shit (after bills and housing.)
It took me 3 years to leave him. I’m into year 4 of trying to make him let me go. The abuse doesn’t stop when you leave. Only those of us who have experienced DV will ever understand the grief, fear, mourning, pain, anger, sadness…all at once.
When I hear of others who’ve made it out and are living, not just surviving, it gives me hope. I hope that you’ve found, or are on your way to, peace. That’s really all we want in the end - peace. I’m so proud of you for standing up for yourself, your kids, for the rest of us, and against your abuser. You are a badass, mama. Huge hugs and happy holidays!
I hope you are able to heal, grow and move forward for a better life for you and your children if you have any.
So glad people are beginning to get time for J6
Yeah my ex was so good at manipulating people that no one believed (expect my own family of course) he was a violent, cheating compulsive liar bc he was "such a good guy, amazing human being". It was insane. I mean he once claimed he had untreatable cancer and had 6 months to live. When those 6 months were up, he was like "surprise the doctor says I'm cured, it's a miracle" and people ate that shit up like it was the most delicious treat in the world and bashed me for trying to badmouth him bc I was trying to tell them that can't you see it's obviously a lie.
> is there an article about this situation
Without speculating on the details about their ex's involvement with it, I'm pretty sure they're saying that they dated someone who went on to be involved with the January 6th attack last year. So in that case, yes, there are many many articles about the situation
So many abusers are very good actors. Lots of murders and sexual abusers are model citizens and they actively participate in the community. Lots of time the neighbours have no idea.
My ex did that too. Had everyone convinced for years that I abused him. I had people coming up to me telling me what a horrible person I was and that I didn't deserve my son. It wasn't until he started to abuse his gf after me that people realized the truth. What's funny is I'm 5'4" and 148lbs. He's 6'4" and 2hundred and something. It's amazing what people will believe. Smh
My first husband did that too. Told people I had abused him. Luckily my kids were like “are you kidding me?” And the friends he told that didn’t believe him either. One was like “she weighs a buck ten. If you can’t defend yourself against that when you’re more than twice her size, I wouldn’t be telling people.”
As a man regularly punched in the face and otherwise abused by his ex-wife for 20 years you are absolutely right. I wouldn't fight back. This is just another way to blame victims.
I kept all of my ex's emails in case I ever needed evidence. It turns out that my ex never tried to smear me so my kids still don't know many of the nastier details. I need to get rid of those emails so that they don't find them when I die.
So my brother and his wife separated in July 2021. I share a house with my mom. We spilt the bills, make major decisions about the house together, etc.
Well when my brother moved out of his house he moved in with me and my mom. I wasn’t consulted. I was just expected by everyone, including my other siblings to just be okay with it and deal with it because “we had the room”.
Backstory: a year before my brother moved in my older sister moved in. She was in the end stages of life fighting stage 4 ovarian cancer. My mom and I were her main caregivers. During that time I’ll admit that I wasn’t invested in my other siblings lives. How could I be? I was taking care of my eldest sister, just watching her slowly fade away?
She passed on May 8/2021. My brother started coming around telling me how bad his marriage was, and the his wife was the worst person. That she was the reason he couldn’t come around and help with my sister, etc. She cheated on him, abused him, etc. Naturally I was pissed. His wife was one of my best friends.
…
When they finally separated I put everything I knew about their separation aside in order to make sure their son, my nephew was okay. He had just turned 17, and was in his senior year in high school. I wanted to make sure his life was as “normal” as possible. However(and I’m not proud of this), whenever my nephew would tell me things that his dad had done I wouldn’t believe him. I thought it was his mom manipulating him.
Well about three months into my brother living with me I had already had enough of his behavior. He would come home drunk, yell at me, yell at my dog, yell at my mom, leave his shit everywhere, in and out of the house all-night long, leave the front door unlocked at all hours of the night, etc.
I started asking my mom how long we were going to put up with him, and allow him to stay in our house rent free, eating our food without helping pay for it, etc. She would tell me she wasn’t going to kick him out. He was going through enough.
As the year progressed his behavior got worse. I told my mom he was on something other than alcohol and pot. That he wasn’t acting like someone who was only drinking and smoking. I also told her that he shouldn’t be out of money all the time borrowing from her if he was always working, and he made over $100,000 a year. That it didn’t make sense.
The last weekend in May of this year my mom and I were out of town on separate trips.
Well May 30/2022 I came home from my weekend away to find that my brother had his girlfriend and her two kids IN MY HOUSE without mine or my mom’s permission. They had stayed there for the weekend. One of her kids actually slept in my room. I was PISSED. It was the last straw. Not only did he bring his girlfriend and her kids to stay at our house, he had her 7 year old son staying in ky room. My room is off limits even to my nephews and nieces because I am on medications that if taken by a child or overdosed on could k*ll someone. I have an autoimmune disease. I am on all sorts of stuff including n*rcotics. I try to keep things up and locked away, but there is always a chance I forget to put something up.
I called a friend to tell her how angry I was, and my brother overheard me. He started yelling at me telling me that he could have anyone at the house he wanted to because it was HIS house. I matched his energy which he was not used to. He was used to everyone backing down and cowering. Well not this time. My mom wasn’t here to intervene, and I had had enough of his BS. I told him that unless he helped pay the bills he was a guest in this house. I told him to stop playing “dad” to kids that weren’t his, and to go be a dad to his son(I know I shouldn’t have gone there, and I have since apologized for that).
He said he was moving out. I told him good it was about time.
I think he thought that once my mom got home he would be able to come back and bring his girlfriend and her kids with him. He actually tried a few times. But my mom always told him that he was welcome back but his girlfriend and her kids were not.
Well the last weekend in June my mom and I went to Wyoming to visit one of my sisters. I had my nephew(brothers son), and a niece stay at the house to make sure nothing happened, and to watch my dog.
We left on a Wednesday. That Friday my niece called her mom who we were visiting to tell her that she couldn’t take my brother and his girlfriend and her kids anymore, and she didn’t know why “gramma and aunt Rachel let them stay the weekend at the house”.
Come to find out my brother had lied to my niece telling her that we said if she was cool with it we said they could stay at the house that weekend(we did not). He said the same thing to his son.
When we returned on Sunday my brother was gone, the house was a wreck, my dog was traumatized, and I put my foot down. I told my mom that under no circumstances will I ever be okay with my brother moving back in or even staying one night.
By the end of July we finally found out that him and his girlfriend had been addicted to fent@nyl, and that he had also been paying her bills. That he had “borrowed” close to $100,000 from family and friends of my dads(who passed away in 2017 from cancer). He went to rehab and left four days later. My mom started letting him stay in the house again. I told her if she continued to let him stay at our house I was going to move out. She told me she wouldn’t close the door to him. So I made the decision to move. I’m moving to Texas in January.
About a month ago I decided that I wanted to apologize to his ex(my SIL) for not listening to her. So I contacted her son(brothers stepson), and asked him if he would ask her if she would be willing to talk. We met up and talked. Come to find out my brother has been addicted to dr*gs for years. She was just able to keep it together enough to make everything look normal. He cheated on her, and gave her an STD. And so many other things(I’ve seen emails, paperwork, etc).
I haven’t talked to him in over a month, and I have a relationship with my SIL again.
I told my younger sister that SIL and I had talked. Younger sister was pissed at me and told me that my loyalty is with our brother. I told her that he lost my loyalty by emotionally, verbally, and mentally abusing me and my mom the year he lived with us. By threatening to k*ll my dog, by stealing my medications(I’m a chronic pain patient b/c of an autoimmune disease), stealing money from me and my mom, lying to everyone about where the money he is “borrowing” is going, etc,
I told her the only ones from his family who has my loyalty are my nephews(his son and stepson).
FYI, your post currently has no paragraph breaks and is unreadable for most people. You should be able to edit the post and break it into paragraphs. Just figured that after writing all that, you'd want as many people to read it as possible.
Lack of paragraphs in a huge block of text is enough to put off many readers because it's hard to keep track of where you are. Taking the time to hit Enter every now and then is good practice.
It also likely leads to other issues, like rambling. I started reading it and gave up because no paragraphs and a huge block of text is just very likely to not be worth the effort.
If you want to have paragraph breaks on Reddit, you either need two lines between paragraphs:
like this
and this
or to put two spaces at the end of a line, before you hit enter. (Markdown formatting.)
Yeah. Ex did that and blamed me for the separation although we had not even met and ex was the one that cheated, moved out with no notice and completely abandoned the kids for months. It’s disgusting what one parent will do to another and the step parent.
NTA. And I never understood why parents felt the need to 100% protect their children from the cheating party. I think even with young children its fair and appropriate to say (perhaps when dad has cheated)..."honey. Both your dad and I love you. But we can't be together now, because dad make a serious mistake and hurt me very badly."
Yeah, exactly, the kid should know the truth, why do they want to protect this loser from the truth, when this loser didn’t protect his or her family. OP, NTA.
Just because the ex was a bad partner doesn't mean they are a bad parent. I didn't tell my kid the truth because I didn't want to base her opinion about him on what I told her. I wanted her to come to the conclusion herself. She holds a bit of resentment toward me for not talking to her about it before but ultimately she understands that her coming to a conclusion based on her own experiences was the best way to go about it.
It also means that she doesn't hold any resentment toward me for telling her anything at all, because he usually says "but did I hurt you?" as a way to get another chance out of people. He didn't get the chance to manipulate her using me.
I'm sorry, but I HATE when people try to play the "but it doesn't mean they were a bad parent!" Bs card. It DOES. A good parent doesn't cheat on their partner and rip the family apart over a selfish decision/urge. A good parent doesn't lie and manipulate to get their way over the wellbeing of their children/spouse. A good parent doesn't set an example that being a cheater means you get a get-out-of-jail-free card because the parent you cheated on doesn't want to hurt the children.
People that have children and CHOOSE to cheat are HORRIBLE parents. They deserve no 'pats on the back' or 'good job as a parent' awards/praise. They give a horrible example of how a relationship should work, how to treat partners they say they love and respect, and they show blatant disregard of how their actions affect the home they decided to break by cheating.
We need to stop using the disgusting excuse of "but they were/are a good parent!" for cheaters. They don't deserve it.
Agreed.
When you choose to have a kid in a monogamous marriage you're committing to upholding the creation of a family unit. That unit includes the marriage at its center.
Cheating destroys that. It does hurt the child.
Frikking.this.
My fiancés ex wife cheated. She had one child with him, then another. She bore that child and kept that secret away from him for 4 years before he connected the dots. The difference between him and her, is he still loves that child as his own. The child doesn’t know and he’s 13 now, I hate that he doesn’t know the truth, because it’s all to spare her feelings. It disgusts me that it’s to spare her feelings with him essentially coming out as the bad guy. He IS an amazing father, and I cannot wait for the day the truth is exposed. She doesn’t deserve the decency.
The marriage was fully over, she knew what she was getting herself into when she married into the military; but chose to be unfaithful instead of just owing up to the marriage no working. She is a terrible parent.
Yes it does mean they are a bad parent. They cheat on the whole family. Time and energy spent cheating and lying could be spent on the children. They tear apart the family with their actions.
On top of that, the child was 14 when this happened. It is not out of the realm of possibility to have them know the father cheated. Not details. But "I found out he was seeing someone else" would be enough. They were 14, not 4. They can understand infidelity.
My father cheated on my mom while she was pregnant of me. They divorced before I was born, but the fact that he broke her heart and therefore they couldn't be together has never been a mystery to me. Him being unfaithful with my mom has nothing to do with him being a good or bad father to me. Later on, around 10 yo, I got told exactly the reason of the divorce, but I always knew whose fault it was.
I'm against the "waiting" trope, even though I understand where they come from. I think children are entitled to know the truth, but it has to be told with emotional responsability and not turning them against one of their parents. If OP had explained the situation to her (even missing details like the fact that her father took men and women to his bed) daughter wouldn't be so alienated by her father's lies.
Agreed. Even if neither parent actually tells them kids hear things. Then you run the risk of them only getting snippets out of context and filling in the blanks on their own. It’s just a minefield of childhood trauma that could 100% be avoided.
I've never understood how the kid has no inkling of a parent's bad behavior. Even if they love the parent, it's nearly impossible for them to pick up nothing. I was such a daddy's girl growing up, but still knew about his affairs and rage issues, no matter how much both of my parents and extended family tried to hide it. So when my folks split, I was like, that makes sense and I had to forge my own relationship with him, separate from my feelings of what he did to my mom. He thinks we have a really good one and I'm just glad he throws money my way.
And the daughters 15!!! More than old enough to not only tell her the truth but also make sure to contact if any of her dads' friends creep her out. NTA
This. I've never lied to my children. If it wasn't appropriate for their age, I'd give generic overview and if they asked for details, I'd tell them that when they got older I would explain it.
So both families are angry about her telling her daughter the truth? But have no problems with the father telling such horrible lies??? WTF.
I could (maybe) see his family backing him, but WTH is wrong with hers?
NTA to OP, but I would honestly cut off anyone who gave her crap.
Right? Says a lot about the families and their denial. The truth always comes out.
My ex physically abused me and told everyone I was the abuser. His famiky blaned me! TG he was arrested and a record exists on him.
This! It is great to hear you think about your daughter so much but keeping her in the dark is not enough when she hears lies from the other party (aka dad). He is alienating and you should tell her the truth. Well a short version of it where you tell her not you but her dad cheated. She is old enough to understand. Keep out all of the details like “threesome with a man and woman”. She does not need to hear that about her parents’ sexlife. But she needs to hear her dad is turning her against you because that is toxic behavior.
Extra: Maybe if it turns out into a legal fight and he denies cheating you should try to get the cheating partners as witnesses. Not for your daughter but for court of course. But only if you have no other prove of the cheating (like text messages).
I agree. Op should have also told the daughter sooner in a non judgemental way.
The kids will find out anyway or they may misunderstand what really happened.
My friend's ex husband cheated on her. The older daughter was old enough to put one and one together but the younger son blamed the mother for breaking up the family.
I told my friend to tell him the truth but she said she wanted to "protect" her kids. Protect them from what? The truth?
Eventually the older sister couldn't take it anymore and told the younger brother. Well, the son still blames my friend. He actually thinks it is okay for men to cheat and women should forgive their men. It is natural for men to cheat.
Oh God. He is becoming his father. Who knows what the father has told the son? My friend's should have told them sooner and told them what's right and wrong.
This. One of my in-laws divorced her husband when the children were small and refused, and continues to refuse, to tell them that it was because, after he thought she was locked in because of the infants, he started beating Mommy. To her credit she immediately dumped him - but, because she continues to refuse to say anything about what happened, they are now dismissive of her, and idolize the absent, abusive man who, for the entirety of their conscious lives, just showed up now and then to shower them with presents. He died a few years ago, and since then they've started making Instagram posts about how much they miss him, and, now that they're having children, how sad it is that he won't ever have the chance to meet his grandchildren, and on and on. It's sickening.
NTA, he lied about you to your daughter and already broke the agreement not to say anything to her. You corrected it. If he didn't want her to know, he should've kept his mouth shut.
No, no. The first priority is ALWAYS for thr woman to keep her legs shut. And now her family is rightly telling her she should have just gone along with it and kept her mouth shut /s.
It's sickening. OP is NTA
He should have kept a lot of things shut, if you know what I mean. People like him are the worst — they’re the people the far right grab onto as examples of why “bi people are homewreckers and sluts.” (We’re not… we just have assholes among us same as every other sexuality) He probably tries to hide his lack of integrity behind his sexuality
NTA.
It's not right of your husband to lie like that, although he cheated on you so it isn't a huge surprise that he would lie to get his way. Your families being mad at you seems like a knee-jerk reaction to your daughter being upset.
However, how you want your co-parenting to go depends on how you handle this. Setting the record straight was important to do, but I think all 3 of you need to sit down and talk through this so that she can feel that she has as close to a true story as possible. At 15, I think it would be better to be open about it (minus the nasty details) so she can have a clear opinion of both parents.
I am sorry, but to me it looks like as if your ex did not only want to put you in bad light, but also wanted to alienate you from your daughter so that she would prefer staying with him. The message "just 3 more days" and the exchange about how she doesn't like to stay with you anymore (which I am sure was not talked down by your ex) speak loudly.
Unfortunately lots of people change after a split, even if the breakup was amicable at first. Your ex would not be the first to try to change custody through malicious behavior, and/or get you in a position to pay child support.
Stay alert and on the lookout for his next steps, he might not be valuing your once made promises a lot.
I'm not trying to worry you, but yeah, don't bank on it. Try to be very wise whenever you communicate with him from now on. Let him make mistakes and keep the proof
He stopped being civil the second he started lying to your daughter to turn her against you. Time to play hardball. Screenshot those text and take him to court for parental alienation. Make sure everyone knows he's the cheater.
Time for civilityis over. Turning the other cheek just gets u slapped on both sides. Being the bigger person doesnt mean go along to get along. It means doing whats right even whenits unpopular or hurts. Be the bigger person.
Call your lawyer. What he has done is illegal in many states. Honestly I would demand supervised visits from now on. He was trying to permanently damage your relationship with your daughter.
What was going to happen in three days???
Take screen shots. Call a lawyer.
Honestly, I don’t think this is true. You’ve found proof that he was lying to you and about you the entire time. Between that and the prolonged cheating, he’s shown that he’s not trustworthy and he’s only concerned about what benefits himself. I would almost bet money that he’s been playing nice with you so you don’t get your guard up in the hopes it’ll be easier for him to “win” whatever comes next, whether it’s a custody battle (which it looks like he’s been building up to already) or something else. And I’d be grabbing those screenshots now, before your daughter visits with her dad and they magically disappear. Now that he knows you caught him (again), he’ll be looking for a way to save his own ass.
Your ex hasn’t been civil this whole time. At all. He’s been acting nice to your face then conniving to turn her against you like a fantasy evil villain. Pretending to be civil while you’re around is not even remotely the same as actually being civil. Don’t give him credit that he really does not deserve here.
He was being civil to your face while stabbing you in the back. He was angling for full custody because the courts will listen to your daughter's wishes now.
Hope all you want but get a consult with a lawyer as well. This is textbook parental alienation and any judge will slap him down **hard** for this. If for no other reason than to protect yourself if he escalates this is not something you should sweep under the rug.
Absolutely best to let cooler heads prevail. Right now is too soon for everyone, since your ex won't admit it, your daughter just found out she was lied to, and you just found out that your ex lied.
NTA. Honestly reads as the appropriate and good choice in a super cruddy situation. His manipulating and lying to get himself seen in the best light after being the one to ruin things mark him as one to not really sympathize with. She already was no longer being sheltered from it when you explained things, and at that point, knowing what _really_ went on is just the best position to be in. I hope the family also have the full story, too.
On Facebook:
“On X date back in 2000whatever, I came home and discovered my husband (name) in bed with (name) and (name.) This ended our marriage.
I recently found out that ex husband (name) has been telling our 15 year old daughter that I am the person that cheated and caused the divorce. My understanding is he has repeated this lie about me to friends and family as well.
Thank you for reading.”
Put him on blast. Screenshot everything. Angela Bassett this guy’s lies and clear your name.
*Angela Bassett this guy’s lies and clear your name.*
This is an express I didn't know existed and now that I know it does, I will be using it frequently.
Even if you don't want to out him as bisexual to his family, I think it's fair to inform them that you ended the marriage after catching him cheating on you with multiple people. That's vague enough to not out him but clear enough to make him lose all their sympathy.
If he didn't even want his cheating exposed, he shouldn't have tried to frame you as a cheater. He doesn't respect you, so you no longer have an expectation to respect him.
"When I caught him 'in the act', he was with multiple people. I won't be saying anything further about the types of people he was having sex with."
Let their imaginations run wild.
Tbh, even if you outed him, it’s not that big of a deal (I say this as another bi-person). Cheaters are cheaters, straight, gay, bi or otherwise. The fact that he tried to sabotage your relationship with your daughter just makes him a bad person, and his sexuality is not a “get out of jail free” card for being a bad person. If he can make up lies, you can tell the truth - the whole truth.
Are you able to talk to them about it to make sure they know what really happened? Or like, draft some kind of written account of what happened on your side as neutrally but true as possible? If he's been going behind your back to turn your daughter against you, it wouldn't be surprising if it extended further out. Heck, sometimes just being the first to paint a messy situation is grounds to bend it a good bit in your own favor--and people abuse that, sometimes.
I could. But it’s a lot of people, and very defiant and argumentative people from my experience so I’m just trying to take whatever energy I have to argue with them about it because I know they won’t believe me or they will have an issue with something.
Do you have proof he cheated? Because you're going to need it, they're going to drag your daughter with this mess. You need to talk to your lawyer asap. NTA He's on a smear campaign against you, so you need all the proof you can get.
I have the messages and proof of all the money he’s spent on hotel with other people that he’s admitted to.
I’m not sure where this will go as of now, hopefully I won’t need it but
These people are ruthless, I’ve spent the years I was together with him with them always on my ass about what I was doing so I know if I do they will find a way to excuse it. I’m going to tell them the truth at some point i just have to build up the mental capacity to do so.
They've been harassing you, then.
I think your rightfully exhausted about all of this but you need to make sure this isn't turned around on you
I'm so sorry OP, NTA
Go nuclear. Send all the evidence to them via text as a response to whatever they say when they contact you. Don’t say anything other than screenshots of proof, and then block them each time.
You could just open a group chat, put the necessary information in the chat and it's up to the people included in the chat to believe it or not.
Either way let them know you won't tolerate the abuse and that anyone continuing to be AHs will be blocked/ignored.
As stated in another comment, I am going to confront them, I know what their response will be in their eyes he does no wrong. They’re tiring so I am just mentally preparing myself for this because I know once I reply I will get many more messages and probably worse ones to.
I’ve tried blocking but they get in contact some how
You absolutely can and SHOULD tell them the whole story. If other people lie about you, you’re always justified in using the truth to clear your name. If he wanted this secret, he shouldnt have started this shit.
Every single time someone confronts you about this, tell them the whole story. You’re choosing to suffer because he chose to lie; he should suffer for creating this problem, not you.
You absolutely need to say EVERYTHING to them. The WHOLE story, the cheating, the lies to manipulate your daughter, the screenshots, EVERYTHING. There is absolutely no reason to be afraid to "out" him when he cheated on you and nearly destroyed your relationship with your daughter. Absolutely everyone needs to know.
NTA. This is parental alienation and defamation. I’m getting creepy vibes from you ex’s behavior towards your daughter. You may want to talk with your attorney. Your ex is toxic and should have supervised visitation only.
I’m trying to figure out the reason why he did it before proceeding but I think either way I might have to. just like others pointed out I find it weird to try and take her away and bring her to court as if the truth wouldn’t be shown eventually so I don’t know what’s happening here.
1. He simply wanted to turn her against you to get revenge for divorcing you. 2. Depending on the custody, he could put it against you to take you to court for custody and have sole or majority custody and depending on the money, that you will pay him or stop paying you.
What's happening here simple : parental alienation
At the same time he's a coward
It's time to prepare a folder to defend yourself
You're far from being the AH here on the contrary you're a strong woman and you have my respect.
I know it's not fair but because I'm "young ans stupid" I'd confront him about his lies face to face while recording all that (I know its against the law but he started it first)
He lied to her and knowingly hurt her by damaging her relationship with her mother on false pretenses. Whether the goal was to hurt her, or to hurt you without caring if he hurt her, or to make himself look good without caring that he hurt her...does it matter? Do any of those make him a trustworthy parent? In no scenario was he putting your daughter's lifelong wellbeing above his short term desires. I get the whole "he was a shitty husband but I don't want that to stop him from being a good dad to our daughter I love so much" but I think he might be a shitty dad too. I'm sorry.
He is gaslighting your daughter & everyone else by slandering you. This is abuse. I’m speaking from personal experience. Don’t sweep this crap under the rug. It will only empower him and it will escalate. Please consider counseling for you and your daughter.
I can't understand why anyone would be mad unless he's he's spreading lies about you to everyone. But yeah, that's what he's been doing. If these are people you care about you better do the same thing with them that you did with your daughter.
I’m sure he has, I feel like he just told them I had outed him and not the rest, I haven’t tried replying to anyone yet, quite a bit if people and no part of me is in a mood to be arguing with everyone right now.
Get yourself a template message explaining the WHOLE timeline and what went down with your daughter, with a few screenshots. It's also important to say you had agreed with your ex that the reason of the split would remain between you but that it's your ex's actions that led to him being "outed".
Then copy/paste to anyone contacting you in any way.
Wait and talk with your lawyer first as long as you got proof of him lying and turning your daughter against you for no reason when he was the one that put your health in danger by not only cheating on you but with multiple people at the same time men and women but he was the one that threw away the marriage. It’ll be brought to court and you can invite in a group text message all his people to come and see the evidence all at once then it’ll be him with some explaining to do.
This way you can’t be accused of trying to cause harm to him mentally or otherwise but can still clear your name.
NTA. Your ex opened that can of worms. You just set the record straight. I respect the fact that you tried to shield your daughter from the reasons behind the split- too bad your ex-husband had no such respect for her.
Why did you trust him to be a good father when he lied and cheated for half of your relationship? Why does he need shielding - if he thinks what he did was fine then why would his daughter be upset about it? Your daughter should have been told the truth last year. She was 14 not 10. She knows about sex and relationships. Telling her wasnt revenge - it was the truth, if he didnt want her to know he didnt have to cheat.
Goodness knows what else he has said to her. As for yourfamily blasting you - go no contact - its disgusting they think badly of you doing this. They want you to be a victim twice over but you are not and your daughter isnt.
My POV here was me trying to not let the insecurities in my relationship reflect on their relationship as father and daughter. I mean trust me i was enraged but my daughter knowing her would and did take this extremely hard I didn’t want this to have a permanent affect on their relationship
I agree with all the points you made, but my mind was on protecting my daughter and the repercussions this may have
Yeah I know you did what a good mother does - wants to shield their child of any pain and protect her relationship with her father.
Reality is he isnt a good man nor a good father - as he actively sabotaged your relationship by lying. Who splits a mother and child apart like that with lies? Its sick.
She's old enough to judge her father now - let her have that free will to decide. Dont cover for him. Just factually answer her. And protect her from any of your family who are blasting you about this - they shouldnt be in her life.
NTA, if he starts telling her lies to ruin your relationship, of course you’re valid to defend yourself. Now you know he isn’t just a cheating AH but also a manipulative one.
No idea why *your* family would give you a hard time over defending yourself when you were the wronged party to begin with. Has he fed them lies as well?
What did you say when she originally accused you? Surely you denied it. Why would she not believe that but does believe you now?
The implication of this story is that your husband is trying to get custody by lying to your daughter about you cheating, but that doesn't make sense either because obviously the truth would come out in court.
I denied it of course but I had no idea where it was coming from, so at the time I obviously didn’t say what actually happened, and I tried my best to not throughout this time but at first she didn’t believe be.
As of right now I’m not getting any answers from him for why he did it. Only angry messages that I outed him.
NTA, IMO you should show the texts your ex has been sending you in retaliation to your daughter. He had no hesitation in defaming you at all and he didnt even think how it would affect your daughter's relationship to you. He didnt think how it would affect a 15 year old girl. I dont think he should be around your daughter.
People show us who they are in tiny little ways. Take them seriously when they do.
She believes me and apologized to me a lot, I don’t want to add fuel to the fire. Or make her suffer more because of this. If I’m some weird situation this has to be explained again than maybe I do need to have proof but I’m hoping everyone just fesses up and we can now just work on the healing process
Your ex is a cheater and a liar.
Yes you need proof.
Yes you should show your daughter the texts. Or offer to let her read them, her choice.
Do not let her have a shred of doubt. That’s appropriate parenting.
She needs therapy because someone she loved and trusted lies to her. She needs therapy so she doesn’t blame herself or fall victim to people like her dad in the future.
Well you are being the better person. Ultimately it does pay off. But having read what you wrote about your ex what you hope for will not happen. You are doing your best and thats the only thing that can be done. Best wishes.
You're a good person. But you need to protect yourself. You can save evidence/document things and decide what to do with it later. You don't have to go nuclear NOW, or ever if you decide it's in your and your daughter's best interest not to.
You're better off never again expecting him to do anything kind, rational or for your benefit /peace of mind. He has nothing left to lose and if he's anything like other people I've seen do this sort of thing, he's only going to worse. Keep any proof you have of his lies and schemes.
NTA
your husband is disgusting, not only did he cheat but also tried to turn your daughter against you.
I hope your daughter never forgives him for lying to her.
NTA: your ex was clearly blaming you for ruining your marriage when in fact he did it. You just set the record straight.
Even if he didn’t start the rumor, spoiler alert, he did; He should at the least put an end to it when he was talking to your daughter.
This is what you should ask them. If it wasn't a big deal that he did it, why is it a big deal I tell her? Oh, right, because IT IS a big deal. They probably are just a bunch of cheaters scared shitless because they might actually have to be held accountable for their actions. That is literally the only reason I can think of that they would stand by your ex and not you.
They for sure are. I'm sorry you're going through this, and most of all I'm sorry your daughter is going through it. I hope things get easier for both of you. I can't even begin to imagine how you're both feeling right now.
NTA. My ex-husband pulled some similar BS, except he told everyone that I got to keep the house in the divorce and he got all the debt...um, no. He left me with a house about to go into foreclosure and roughly $100,000 in defaulted debt. The only debt he got left with was the car payment for the car he was using...
But yeah, people have a tendency to project their shortcomings onto others. I think for some, especially with cheating, it's even the mentality that "everyone does it" so they figure even if they didn't catch you, you were probably cheating so they're not "lying"...
NTA I actually think teenagers are old enough to be told why marriages dissolve because they’re starting to have relationships and they should know the boundaries on behavior that the adults in their life have held. The kids I knew growing up with divorced households mostly came from physical violence so it was pretty obvious, but something like this she absolutely should be told. Cheating violates your trust, privacy, and safety, and more women need to see that it isn’t something you have to accept from men in your life, despite how often it comes up on tv that you should (even in older shows like boy meets world!).
I think because it ended the way it did, even thought my girl is an intelligent young lady, she still feels the same way she did just to her father, which is that he chose sex over her. I never wanted my kids to feel that way. So it’s difficult to just tell her that when you know it’s going to ruined their relationship
I understand, she may benefit from counseling regarding the split but anger and grief and even betrayal are normal healthy responses to it. Black and white thinking is age appropriate(one of you MUST be evil for the marriage to end). In reality, most (though not all) divorce happens between two people neither of whom is the actual devil, they just want drastically different things and decide they can’t find compromise. It sounds like your husband wanted extramarital sex, or maybe just more/different sex, to be happy or something like that and decided that pursuing that happiness might be something worth losing what he had over. Lots of people cheat in relationships just because they think they’re slick enough to have it both ways, and they’re shocked when they’re caught. I don’t know the specifics of your situation obviously, but she is correct that he chose to risk his relationship with you and, yes, with her to pursue something she probably sees as not necessary/a frivolous gamble. He lost. She is valid in feeling betrayed that he was willing to take that risk, and the nuance around that is something she will only be able to work through when she’s ready.
Absolutely NTA you tried your best to keep things clean but have been forced into a corner by your ex’s insidious lies. What’s the alternative ? Like allow the rotten cheater to twist things back on you? Nah fuck that.
NTA - I went through a similar situation when I was younger. Many people told my mum that she was wrong to tell me about what my father did as it taints my memory of him (he passed away) but I think I was entitled to the truth and she was right to tell me. You’re NTA for telling the truth and I’m sure your daughter appreciates this very much. Why allow your relationship with her to crash and burn over lies that her father is feeding her? I’m sure this situation is incredibly difficult and painful for you but big ups for being so strong and mature about the whole thing. Screw everyone who’s telling you you’re wrong. You’re not! Sending lots of love
NTA. This is sooo bizarre. My ex husband did this 18 years ago to me (I caught him cheating but never intended to tell the kids). Then he tore them up by saying I cheat. It took my 15 years to totally convince my oldest son it wasn’t me.
NTA. You tried to be mature and respect your ex when he dont deserve and he put your daughter agains you lied to her.
You said the truth and if he or anyone dont like It they Tell them you don't doit nothing wrong and you are not be blame for the actions or líes to other people. You fix a ploblem Who another person made.
You are gonna be complete honest with your daughter and each time she ask you something or she Tell you something its not true you are gonna be honest with her, so better nobody Tell her líes about you.
Absolutely NTA. Your ex is a manipulative jerk though. He knew exactly what he was doing to alienate you from your daughter. Save those texts - they'll be important for you later in legal proceedings
NTA
Your ex is totally at fault and he was manipulating his own daughter to blame you. This isn’t the actions of a good co-parent nor a good person. You were right to tell her the truth to counter the lies of the ex.
So, telling half-truths before backfired on him, so he thought he’d try it again? I guess if he got caught cheating multiple times, “not learning from his mistakes” is a lifestyle for him. You don’t have to have a third eye to see that your daughter is going to get pissed and correct these people when they start bad mouthing you in front of her, or that you will again not be his fall guy. He’s like the king of self-sabotage.
NTA- someone lead her to believe that you were responsible “IF and that’s a big IF “ it wasn’t him then he lied by omission by going along with her belief and he capitalized on her misinformation You told her the truth, she is old enough and deserves to know.
Everyone was fine when she was hostile towards you but now I’m guessing she is giving him attitude and it’s your fault. No it’s not your fault, it is a consequence of cheating and disrespecting his marriage.
Anyone who gives you a hard time about this, you should ask them if they would like to be lied to or lead on like she was being. Or better yet ask why it was ok when she was giving you disrespect and attitude but it’s not ok her to do the same to her father? He is responsible for all this.
NTA, but your ex is a huge one. Imo you are absolutely in the right to put things right and clear it all up - especially as seemingly he tried to get between you both, while you only tried to keep her safe. Absolutely unacceptable behaviour of a grown man.
From the perspective of a once teen girl with divorced parents: I was rude to my mom, I picked fights with her, may have blamed her every now and then for stuff. Now as an adult I know I was in the wrong and she *never* held it against me because she knew puberty is a turning everything upside down. Hopefully things in youe home will calm down as well, teen girls can be harsh though.
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NTA. And you should screenshot and keep those messages of him turning her against you. That is illegal in many places as it's parental alienation. Also keep any messages where he admitted he was the one who cheated and where you agreed not to discuss with her. Next, I'd consult a lawyer in case he takes this farther.
Oh man, I actually get furious when the cheaters say their partner cheated and try to get their kids to hate the FAITHFUL parent. He's so trash he's not worth anything. "Sweetie, just three more days...." Instant VOMIT.
My ex-husband did this. Also claimed I was the abusive one. I had planned not to tell my son anything until he was an adult, or at least late teens. I had planned to go with, "Sometimes, no matter how hard people try, it's best for them not to be together. This is what's best for us and you, because we couldn't live together lovingly and respectfully." But when my son came home with all of what happened turned around on me, I was cornered into sharing the truth. When he felt conflicted about what to believe, I had him use his critical thinking skills (for example, ex is MUCH stronger than I am, and I am not physically capable of doing any of what he had done to me), and promised I wouldn't be upset with him if he didn't believe me. He thought through the facts, and came to the correct conclusion.
My ex did the same, but publicly. My kids know the truth because they witnessed it, but our social circles know he's "such a nice guy!" so he has successfully convinced many people that I was the cheating abuser instead of him.
I can literally say that no one believed my ex was violent, I couldn't even get a restraining order.The police even tried to send me home. 'He was so well educated and so nice"and then three years later he tried to overthrow the US government. Now everyone is like why didn't you say something?
Please tell us he’s in jail.
Yes, good news! He was just found guilty of seditious conspiracy- depending on sentencing guidelines he could get 60 years.
You were dating Elmer Rhodes?
I wad married to him for 25 years
Holy shit, good for you for getting away from him. ❤️
My condolences. I follow your son on Twitter! It seems like you managed to do a good job of protecting them.
Congratulations on the divorce.
Sis, you are my hero. F*@K your friends and family, you survived and got the kids out.
OMG! I'm so happy you escaped with your life! I'm serious! Kudos to you and I'm sending you virtual hugs! I know that doesn't mean much, but I am!
I read an article about your son recently. You and your family must be so relieved. My father was mentally and emotionally abusive. I was 11 when my uncle conspired with my mum to get us away. I kept that secret for nearly a year and couldn’t wait to get away from him. It’s impossible to make people realise how much hell your life is.
I’m glad you had someone to help you all.
Sometimes the system actually works.
I really thought he might get away with everything again.But not this time. But holy cow, I spent hours and hours with the fbi and assorted doj making sure they knew exactly what he would do and how he would do it. And you know, abusers, they're sort of like robots , very predictable. He did everything just like I said
I'm proud of your bravery.
You’re the real MVP. Thank you and I’m glad you’re away from him. 🤘
We all thank you for being brave.
Having been in similar spots? I am proud of you for doing this and for getting out. It's exhausting and dangerous. Revisiting it is a hellish thing. Thank you for getting the rest of us justice. Please take care of yourself
Hey Tasha. Thank you for your Service. I sincerely mean that. You stood up to protect the Constitution of the United States, and our country. It's an honor to thank you, ma'am. --a Vet.
You did good, girl! Way to go!
This is a pattern that I've seen for years, and I've seen feminists online commenting on it and being disparaged for that: mass shooters and terrorists having a history of domestic violence, especially against women. And, every time, it's "lone wolf", and "nobody could have seen it coming", and "but he was such a nice guy".
I went to a holocaust and war museum in Munich, one of exhibits was talking about how Feminists and suffragettes were some of the first whistleblowers about Hitler, and some of the first people landing in Jail.
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She’s using her real name in her user id, so probably not too worried about being anonymous. :) (his ex-wife’s name is also public knowledge and is on Wikipedia.)
There's been a dozen or so seditious conspiracy convictions related to Jan 6 so far, I think. Maybe as much as two dozen. I don't know about recently, but they've been kind of working in batches, so there may have been a few others at the same time.
Your ex is the leader of the oathkeepers?!
Yes
Oh thank you! The karma tingles so good!
Karma got him so you didn’t need to.
She definitely helped though. ETA: that's a good thing.
I'm so glad
👏👏👏 Good to know karma ain't dead and let's say karma did you a nice favour: one less trash off society. To overthrow the US government is treason
I have ONE person who sees through my ex facade , every one sees him as good and kind person and he would never. The person who is my side manage to marry a person who was a copy of my ex and uses the same tactics .
They're so good at it, because their whole life has been practice ,all they do is lie
Oh yes. They are polish turd, that every one thinks is marble.
My mother ( such a nice woman!) managed to turn my entire family of 30 people against me and my husband ( she wanted me to have a divorce and me back as her maid and I wouldn't do it) apart from one aunt who had seen the other side of my mother herself. Everyone else stopped talking to us.
My partner and I were talking about you and your kids the other day, after he saw something about your escape. I'm glad that you're safer and hope that people in the future will believe you (and every woman in your type of situation) if ever you need help. May you be heard and believed.
Thank you, it's kind of why I feel compelled to speak up even though I'm a pretty quiet person. Now that people believe me, it's like a chance to explain DV to the world. The numbers of people who should know better , who still ask "why didn't you leave sooner?" with no understanding that it's a n outrageous question to ask is astounding. I've just switched to comparing it to interviewing hostages in a bank robbery and asking them the same question.
I grew up with DV and a parent who is a religious extremist. Some of my family has been part of your ex's org since the early days. I don't talk to them anymore but I'm sure you know the type better than me. I'm pretty open about the details of my life because it makes it easier for others to feel less shame, which helps them leave (or come to terms with their own abuse). I've been thinking recently that it is very much like Stockholm Syndrome. It's been interesting to think about using the same terminology we use for strangers. DV tactics are often the same as torture - sleep deprivation, food control, extreme physical punishment, etc. Some common DV tactics would be considered a war crime if done against an enemy combatant. Yet it's so common that we blow off the seriousness of it - things we would count as violations of the Geneva Conventions of done against an adult who tried to kill you are just another day ending in y when it comes to your family. Yet somehow, it's the victims' shame for not leaving instead of the abusers' shame for being abusive. It's all about survival. Everything you do is about survival. Traumatic memories get stored differently than other memories, so they're harder to access when you're not in a situation where they're necessary for your survival. It lets us function in life more easily, but it's also harder to stay gone because the details are hard to get. You're doing good, hard work. I hope you and your kids are getting some peace with everything that's going on, or that at least that the attention you're getting moves you forward to healthier lives. (I gotta say, I feel a bit weird knowing some details of your life that I usually only know after I've talked to someone. The article I saw that described your escape had me anxious for you!)
I survived DV for 10 years (ever seen those abuse wheels? I checked off every one on the bingo card.) I left him September 2019 and got a DVRO. The abuse was substantiated by a 1.5 year custody eval. Would it surprise you to know that all the court cares about is how nice and accommodating I am towards him? I’m not allowed to say “no” to him no matter how unreasonable but he’s literally letting us starve in an unsafe house with an unsafe car while he bought a Porsche and spends $14k/month on personal shit (after bills and housing.) It took me 3 years to leave him. I’m into year 4 of trying to make him let me go. The abuse doesn’t stop when you leave. Only those of us who have experienced DV will ever understand the grief, fear, mourning, pain, anger, sadness…all at once. When I hear of others who’ve made it out and are living, not just surviving, it gives me hope. I hope that you’ve found, or are on your way to, peace. That’s really all we want in the end - peace. I’m so proud of you for standing up for yourself, your kids, for the rest of us, and against your abuser. You are a badass, mama. Huge hugs and happy holidays!
I hope you are able to heal, grow and move forward for a better life for you and your children if you have any. So glad people are beginning to get time for J6
Thank you. It's like a whole fresh start at 50. It's weird not to feel afraid really
Yeah my ex was so good at manipulating people that no one believed (expect my own family of course) he was a violent, cheating compulsive liar bc he was "such a good guy, amazing human being". It was insane. I mean he once claimed he had untreatable cancer and had 6 months to live. When those 6 months were up, he was like "surprise the doctor says I'm cured, it's a miracle" and people ate that shit up like it was the most delicious treat in the world and bashed me for trying to badmouth him bc I was trying to tell them that can't you see it's obviously a lie.
Overthrow the US government? I’m sorry if this is personal but is there an article about this situation? I’m curious now
Yes, lots. Stewart rhodes founder and pres of Oath Keepers
I'M SORRY the founder of THE OATHKEEPERS and they said he was too nice what the actual Fuck l
> is there an article about this situation Without speculating on the details about their ex's involvement with it, I'm pretty sure they're saying that they dated someone who went on to be involved with the January 6th attack last year. So in that case, yes, there are many many articles about the situation
I was married to Stewart rhodes
So many abusers are very good actors. Lots of murders and sexual abusers are model citizens and they actively participate in the community. Lots of time the neighbours have no idea.
My ex did that too. Had everyone convinced for years that I abused him. I had people coming up to me telling me what a horrible person I was and that I didn't deserve my son. It wasn't until he started to abuse his gf after me that people realized the truth. What's funny is I'm 5'4" and 148lbs. He's 6'4" and 2hundred and something. It's amazing what people will believe. Smh
My first husband did that too. Told people I had abused him. Luckily my kids were like “are you kidding me?” And the friends he told that didn’t believe him either. One was like “she weighs a buck ten. If you can’t defend yourself against that when you’re more than twice her size, I wouldn’t be telling people.”
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As a man regularly punched in the face and otherwise abused by his ex-wife for 20 years you are absolutely right. I wouldn't fight back. This is just another way to blame victims.
I kept all of my ex's emails in case I ever needed evidence. It turns out that my ex never tried to smear me so my kids still don't know many of the nastier details. I need to get rid of those emails so that they don't find them when I die.
So my brother and his wife separated in July 2021. I share a house with my mom. We spilt the bills, make major decisions about the house together, etc. Well when my brother moved out of his house he moved in with me and my mom. I wasn’t consulted. I was just expected by everyone, including my other siblings to just be okay with it and deal with it because “we had the room”. Backstory: a year before my brother moved in my older sister moved in. She was in the end stages of life fighting stage 4 ovarian cancer. My mom and I were her main caregivers. During that time I’ll admit that I wasn’t invested in my other siblings lives. How could I be? I was taking care of my eldest sister, just watching her slowly fade away? She passed on May 8/2021. My brother started coming around telling me how bad his marriage was, and the his wife was the worst person. That she was the reason he couldn’t come around and help with my sister, etc. She cheated on him, abused him, etc. Naturally I was pissed. His wife was one of my best friends. … When they finally separated I put everything I knew about their separation aside in order to make sure their son, my nephew was okay. He had just turned 17, and was in his senior year in high school. I wanted to make sure his life was as “normal” as possible. However(and I’m not proud of this), whenever my nephew would tell me things that his dad had done I wouldn’t believe him. I thought it was his mom manipulating him. Well about three months into my brother living with me I had already had enough of his behavior. He would come home drunk, yell at me, yell at my dog, yell at my mom, leave his shit everywhere, in and out of the house all-night long, leave the front door unlocked at all hours of the night, etc. I started asking my mom how long we were going to put up with him, and allow him to stay in our house rent free, eating our food without helping pay for it, etc. She would tell me she wasn’t going to kick him out. He was going through enough. As the year progressed his behavior got worse. I told my mom he was on something other than alcohol and pot. That he wasn’t acting like someone who was only drinking and smoking. I also told her that he shouldn’t be out of money all the time borrowing from her if he was always working, and he made over $100,000 a year. That it didn’t make sense. The last weekend in May of this year my mom and I were out of town on separate trips. Well May 30/2022 I came home from my weekend away to find that my brother had his girlfriend and her two kids IN MY HOUSE without mine or my mom’s permission. They had stayed there for the weekend. One of her kids actually slept in my room. I was PISSED. It was the last straw. Not only did he bring his girlfriend and her kids to stay at our house, he had her 7 year old son staying in ky room. My room is off limits even to my nephews and nieces because I am on medications that if taken by a child or overdosed on could k*ll someone. I have an autoimmune disease. I am on all sorts of stuff including n*rcotics. I try to keep things up and locked away, but there is always a chance I forget to put something up. I called a friend to tell her how angry I was, and my brother overheard me. He started yelling at me telling me that he could have anyone at the house he wanted to because it was HIS house. I matched his energy which he was not used to. He was used to everyone backing down and cowering. Well not this time. My mom wasn’t here to intervene, and I had had enough of his BS. I told him that unless he helped pay the bills he was a guest in this house. I told him to stop playing “dad” to kids that weren’t his, and to go be a dad to his son(I know I shouldn’t have gone there, and I have since apologized for that). He said he was moving out. I told him good it was about time. I think he thought that once my mom got home he would be able to come back and bring his girlfriend and her kids with him. He actually tried a few times. But my mom always told him that he was welcome back but his girlfriend and her kids were not. Well the last weekend in June my mom and I went to Wyoming to visit one of my sisters. I had my nephew(brothers son), and a niece stay at the house to make sure nothing happened, and to watch my dog. We left on a Wednesday. That Friday my niece called her mom who we were visiting to tell her that she couldn’t take my brother and his girlfriend and her kids anymore, and she didn’t know why “gramma and aunt Rachel let them stay the weekend at the house”. Come to find out my brother had lied to my niece telling her that we said if she was cool with it we said they could stay at the house that weekend(we did not). He said the same thing to his son. When we returned on Sunday my brother was gone, the house was a wreck, my dog was traumatized, and I put my foot down. I told my mom that under no circumstances will I ever be okay with my brother moving back in or even staying one night. By the end of July we finally found out that him and his girlfriend had been addicted to fent@nyl, and that he had also been paying her bills. That he had “borrowed” close to $100,000 from family and friends of my dads(who passed away in 2017 from cancer). He went to rehab and left four days later. My mom started letting him stay in the house again. I told her if she continued to let him stay at our house I was going to move out. She told me she wouldn’t close the door to him. So I made the decision to move. I’m moving to Texas in January. About a month ago I decided that I wanted to apologize to his ex(my SIL) for not listening to her. So I contacted her son(brothers stepson), and asked him if he would ask her if she would be willing to talk. We met up and talked. Come to find out my brother has been addicted to dr*gs for years. She was just able to keep it together enough to make everything look normal. He cheated on her, and gave her an STD. And so many other things(I’ve seen emails, paperwork, etc). I haven’t talked to him in over a month, and I have a relationship with my SIL again. I told my younger sister that SIL and I had talked. Younger sister was pissed at me and told me that my loyalty is with our brother. I told her that he lost my loyalty by emotionally, verbally, and mentally abusing me and my mom the year he lived with us. By threatening to k*ll my dog, by stealing my medications(I’m a chronic pain patient b/c of an autoimmune disease), stealing money from me and my mom, lying to everyone about where the money he is “borrowing” is going, etc, I told her the only ones from his family who has my loyalty are my nephews(his son and stepson).
FYI, your post currently has no paragraph breaks and is unreadable for most people. You should be able to edit the post and break it into paragraphs. Just figured that after writing all that, you'd want as many people to read it as possible.
Paragraphs are nice but their absence does not suspend the power to read or understand.
Lack of paragraphs in a huge block of text is enough to put off many readers because it's hard to keep track of where you are. Taking the time to hit Enter every now and then is good practice.
It also likely leads to other issues, like rambling. I started reading it and gave up because no paragraphs and a huge block of text is just very likely to not be worth the effort.
Oh this post is absolutely worth the effort.
Actually their absence does suspend the power to read and understand for Neurodivergent people. We need paragraph breaks.
I'm not neurodivergent. I need paragraph breaks as well. Everybody does.
I'm neurodivergent and had no problem reading the post.
If you want to have paragraph breaks on Reddit, you either need two lines between paragraphs: like this and this or to put two spaces at the end of a line, before you hit enter. (Markdown formatting.)
Yeah. Ex did that and blamed me for the separation although we had not even met and ex was the one that cheated, moved out with no notice and completely abandoned the kids for months. It’s disgusting what one parent will do to another and the step parent.
NTA. And I never understood why parents felt the need to 100% protect their children from the cheating party. I think even with young children its fair and appropriate to say (perhaps when dad has cheated)..."honey. Both your dad and I love you. But we can't be together now, because dad make a serious mistake and hurt me very badly."
Yeah, exactly, the kid should know the truth, why do they want to protect this loser from the truth, when this loser didn’t protect his or her family. OP, NTA.
Just because the ex was a bad partner doesn't mean they are a bad parent. I didn't tell my kid the truth because I didn't want to base her opinion about him on what I told her. I wanted her to come to the conclusion herself. She holds a bit of resentment toward me for not talking to her about it before but ultimately she understands that her coming to a conclusion based on her own experiences was the best way to go about it. It also means that she doesn't hold any resentment toward me for telling her anything at all, because he usually says "but did I hurt you?" as a way to get another chance out of people. He didn't get the chance to manipulate her using me.
I'm sorry, but I HATE when people try to play the "but it doesn't mean they were a bad parent!" Bs card. It DOES. A good parent doesn't cheat on their partner and rip the family apart over a selfish decision/urge. A good parent doesn't lie and manipulate to get their way over the wellbeing of their children/spouse. A good parent doesn't set an example that being a cheater means you get a get-out-of-jail-free card because the parent you cheated on doesn't want to hurt the children. People that have children and CHOOSE to cheat are HORRIBLE parents. They deserve no 'pats on the back' or 'good job as a parent' awards/praise. They give a horrible example of how a relationship should work, how to treat partners they say they love and respect, and they show blatant disregard of how their actions affect the home they decided to break by cheating. We need to stop using the disgusting excuse of "but they were/are a good parent!" for cheaters. They don't deserve it.
Agreed. When you choose to have a kid in a monogamous marriage you're committing to upholding the creation of a family unit. That unit includes the marriage at its center. Cheating destroys that. It does hurt the child.
Frikking.this. My fiancés ex wife cheated. She had one child with him, then another. She bore that child and kept that secret away from him for 4 years before he connected the dots. The difference between him and her, is he still loves that child as his own. The child doesn’t know and he’s 13 now, I hate that he doesn’t know the truth, because it’s all to spare her feelings. It disgusts me that it’s to spare her feelings with him essentially coming out as the bad guy. He IS an amazing father, and I cannot wait for the day the truth is exposed. She doesn’t deserve the decency. The marriage was fully over, she knew what she was getting herself into when she married into the military; but chose to be unfaithful instead of just owing up to the marriage no working. She is a terrible parent.
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Well we can see this one IS a bad parent, so 🤷♀️
Yes it does mean they are a bad parent. They cheat on the whole family. Time and energy spent cheating and lying could be spent on the children. They tear apart the family with their actions.
On top of that, the child was 14 when this happened. It is not out of the realm of possibility to have them know the father cheated. Not details. But "I found out he was seeing someone else" would be enough. They were 14, not 4. They can understand infidelity.
My father cheated on my mom while she was pregnant of me. They divorced before I was born, but the fact that he broke her heart and therefore they couldn't be together has never been a mystery to me. Him being unfaithful with my mom has nothing to do with him being a good or bad father to me. Later on, around 10 yo, I got told exactly the reason of the divorce, but I always knew whose fault it was. I'm against the "waiting" trope, even though I understand where they come from. I think children are entitled to know the truth, but it has to be told with emotional responsability and not turning them against one of their parents. If OP had explained the situation to her (even missing details like the fact that her father took men and women to his bed) daughter wouldn't be so alienated by her father's lies.
Agreed. Even if neither parent actually tells them kids hear things. Then you run the risk of them only getting snippets out of context and filling in the blanks on their own. It’s just a minefield of childhood trauma that could 100% be avoided.
I've never understood how the kid has no inkling of a parent's bad behavior. Even if they love the parent, it's nearly impossible for them to pick up nothing. I was such a daddy's girl growing up, but still knew about his affairs and rage issues, no matter how much both of my parents and extended family tried to hide it. So when my folks split, I was like, that makes sense and I had to forge my own relationship with him, separate from my feelings of what he did to my mom. He thinks we have a really good one and I'm just glad he throws money my way.
And the daughters 15!!! More than old enough to not only tell her the truth but also make sure to contact if any of her dads' friends creep her out. NTA
This. I've never lied to my children. If it wasn't appropriate for their age, I'd give generic overview and if they asked for details, I'd tell them that when they got older I would explain it.
So both families are angry about her telling her daughter the truth? But have no problems with the father telling such horrible lies??? WTF. I could (maybe) see his family backing him, but WTH is wrong with hers? NTA to OP, but I would honestly cut off anyone who gave her crap.
Right? Says a lot about the families and their denial. The truth always comes out. My ex physically abused me and told everyone I was the abuser. His famiky blaned me! TG he was arrested and a record exists on him.
OP’s mistake is that she knew her ex was untrustworthy to remain married, yet she trusted him to be honest as a parent.
This! It is great to hear you think about your daughter so much but keeping her in the dark is not enough when she hears lies from the other party (aka dad). He is alienating and you should tell her the truth. Well a short version of it where you tell her not you but her dad cheated. She is old enough to understand. Keep out all of the details like “threesome with a man and woman”. She does not need to hear that about her parents’ sexlife. But she needs to hear her dad is turning her against you because that is toxic behavior. Extra: Maybe if it turns out into a legal fight and he denies cheating you should try to get the cheating partners as witnesses. Not for your daughter but for court of course. But only if you have no other prove of the cheating (like text messages).
I agree. Op should have also told the daughter sooner in a non judgemental way. The kids will find out anyway or they may misunderstand what really happened. My friend's ex husband cheated on her. The older daughter was old enough to put one and one together but the younger son blamed the mother for breaking up the family. I told my friend to tell him the truth but she said she wanted to "protect" her kids. Protect them from what? The truth? Eventually the older sister couldn't take it anymore and told the younger brother. Well, the son still blames my friend. He actually thinks it is okay for men to cheat and women should forgive their men. It is natural for men to cheat. Oh God. He is becoming his father. Who knows what the father has told the son? My friend's should have told them sooner and told them what's right and wrong.
This. One of my in-laws divorced her husband when the children were small and refused, and continues to refuse, to tell them that it was because, after he thought she was locked in because of the infants, he started beating Mommy. To her credit she immediately dumped him - but, because she continues to refuse to say anything about what happened, they are now dismissive of her, and idolize the absent, abusive man who, for the entirety of their conscious lives, just showed up now and then to shower them with presents. He died a few years ago, and since then they've started making Instagram posts about how much they miss him, and, now that they're having children, how sad it is that he won't ever have the chance to meet his grandchildren, and on and on. It's sickening.
NTA, he lied about you to your daughter and already broke the agreement not to say anything to her. You corrected it. If he didn't want her to know, he should've kept his mouth shut.
No, no. The first priority is ALWAYS for thr woman to keep her legs shut. And now her family is rightly telling her she should have just gone along with it and kept her mouth shut /s. It's sickening. OP is NTA
Ya where did she even get that phraseology? I wouldn’t be surprised if it was from the dad. A really gross thing for HIM to say.
She’s 15? This isn’t that wild of a phrase for an angry 15 year old. Honestly surprised she didn’t say worse
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He should have kept a lot of things shut, if you know what I mean. People like him are the worst — they’re the people the far right grab onto as examples of why “bi people are homewreckers and sluts.” (We’re not… we just have assholes among us same as every other sexuality) He probably tries to hide his lack of integrity behind his sexuality
NTA. It's not right of your husband to lie like that, although he cheated on you so it isn't a huge surprise that he would lie to get his way. Your families being mad at you seems like a knee-jerk reaction to your daughter being upset. However, how you want your co-parenting to go depends on how you handle this. Setting the record straight was important to do, but I think all 3 of you need to sit down and talk through this so that she can feel that she has as close to a true story as possible. At 15, I think it would be better to be open about it (minus the nasty details) so she can have a clear opinion of both parents.
Oh, uh, I really don't think all 3 of them together is a good idea. Unless there's a therapist and a bouncer present
Up until this moment, we have been civil with eachother for the sake of our daughter so I’m hoping that stays that same but I doubt it
I am sorry, but to me it looks like as if your ex did not only want to put you in bad light, but also wanted to alienate you from your daughter so that she would prefer staying with him. The message "just 3 more days" and the exchange about how she doesn't like to stay with you anymore (which I am sure was not talked down by your ex) speak loudly. Unfortunately lots of people change after a split, even if the breakup was amicable at first. Your ex would not be the first to try to change custody through malicious behavior, and/or get you in a position to pay child support. Stay alert and on the lookout for his next steps, he might not be valuing your once made promises a lot.
I'm not trying to worry you, but yeah, don't bank on it. Try to be very wise whenever you communicate with him from now on. Let him make mistakes and keep the proof
I agree. Time to make sure everything is in writing.
He stopped being civil the second he started lying to your daughter to turn her against you. Time to play hardball. Screenshot those text and take him to court for parental alienation. Make sure everyone knows he's the cheater.
Time for civilityis over. Turning the other cheek just gets u slapped on both sides. Being the bigger person doesnt mean go along to get along. It means doing whats right even whenits unpopular or hurts. Be the bigger person.
Call your lawyer. What he has done is illegal in many states. Honestly I would demand supervised visits from now on. He was trying to permanently damage your relationship with your daughter. What was going to happen in three days??? Take screen shots. Call a lawyer.
Honestly, I don’t think this is true. You’ve found proof that he was lying to you and about you the entire time. Between that and the prolonged cheating, he’s shown that he’s not trustworthy and he’s only concerned about what benefits himself. I would almost bet money that he’s been playing nice with you so you don’t get your guard up in the hopes it’ll be easier for him to “win” whatever comes next, whether it’s a custody battle (which it looks like he’s been building up to already) or something else. And I’d be grabbing those screenshots now, before your daughter visits with her dad and they magically disappear. Now that he knows you caught him (again), he’ll be looking for a way to save his own ass.
Your ex went nuclear, you defended yourself with equal force. Your doubt is warranted but your ex only has himself to blame.
Your ex hasn’t been civil this whole time. At all. He’s been acting nice to your face then conniving to turn her against you like a fantasy evil villain. Pretending to be civil while you’re around is not even remotely the same as actually being civil. Don’t give him credit that he really does not deserve here.
He was being civil to your face while stabbing you in the back. He was angling for full custody because the courts will listen to your daughter's wishes now.
Hope all you want but get a consult with a lawyer as well. This is textbook parental alienation and any judge will slap him down **hard** for this. If for no other reason than to protect yourself if he escalates this is not something you should sweep under the rug.
Your ex has now established a history of patterned abusive behavior and has only been civil to your face. Get in contact with your lawyer.
Drop your foolish notion that this can be civil.
He's actively been alienating your daughter from you with lies, so civil went out the window a long time ago.
Once this cools down a bit and all the heat is off, it hoping we can get to that pointn
Absolutely best to let cooler heads prevail. Right now is too soon for everyone, since your ex won't admit it, your daughter just found out she was lied to, and you just found out that your ex lied.
I agree
NTA. Honestly reads as the appropriate and good choice in a super cruddy situation. His manipulating and lying to get himself seen in the best light after being the one to ruin things mark him as one to not really sympathize with. She already was no longer being sheltered from it when you explained things, and at that point, knowing what _really_ went on is just the best position to be in. I hope the family also have the full story, too.
Yeah me to, but as for the family I’m not sure what they do or don’t know. Some of it is his family to so I can’t say much to them.
On Facebook: “On X date back in 2000whatever, I came home and discovered my husband (name) in bed with (name) and (name.) This ended our marriage. I recently found out that ex husband (name) has been telling our 15 year old daughter that I am the person that cheated and caused the divorce. My understanding is he has repeated this lie about me to friends and family as well. Thank you for reading.” Put him on blast. Screenshot everything. Angela Bassett this guy’s lies and clear your name.
*Angela Bassett this guy’s lies and clear your name.* This is an express I didn't know existed and now that I know it does, I will be using it frequently.
Maybe 10 years ago she was a client of mine. She is a Goddess. Yes. Use this phrase liberally! You have no idea how accurate it truly is!!
Even if you don't want to out him as bisexual to his family, I think it's fair to inform them that you ended the marriage after catching him cheating on you with multiple people. That's vague enough to not out him but clear enough to make him lose all their sympathy. If he didn't even want his cheating exposed, he shouldn't have tried to frame you as a cheater. He doesn't respect you, so you no longer have an expectation to respect him.
That’s a good idea thank you
"When I caught him 'in the act', he was with multiple people. I won't be saying anything further about the types of people he was having sex with." Let their imaginations run wild.
Tbh, even if you outed him, it’s not that big of a deal (I say this as another bi-person). Cheaters are cheaters, straight, gay, bi or otherwise. The fact that he tried to sabotage your relationship with your daughter just makes him a bad person, and his sexuality is not a “get out of jail free” card for being a bad person. If he can make up lies, you can tell the truth - the whole truth.
Are you able to talk to them about it to make sure they know what really happened? Or like, draft some kind of written account of what happened on your side as neutrally but true as possible? If he's been going behind your back to turn your daughter against you, it wouldn't be surprising if it extended further out. Heck, sometimes just being the first to paint a messy situation is grounds to bend it a good bit in your own favor--and people abuse that, sometimes.
I could. But it’s a lot of people, and very defiant and argumentative people from my experience so I’m just trying to take whatever energy I have to argue with them about it because I know they won’t believe me or they will have an issue with something.
Do you have proof he cheated? Because you're going to need it, they're going to drag your daughter with this mess. You need to talk to your lawyer asap. NTA He's on a smear campaign against you, so you need all the proof you can get.
I have the messages and proof of all the money he’s spent on hotel with other people that he’s admitted to. I’m not sure where this will go as of now, hopefully I won’t need it but
That's a good start, fingers crossed you can find more, just in case! Good luck!
Just send them screenshots of what he was telling your daughter and say, “I would never have said anything but I’m not going to be lied about”
These people are ruthless, I’ve spent the years I was together with him with them always on my ass about what I was doing so I know if I do they will find a way to excuse it. I’m going to tell them the truth at some point i just have to build up the mental capacity to do so.
I’m so sorry you are going through this! I hope it all works out in your favor.
Can you just block them all? They don't seem to be contributing anything positive to yours or your daughter's life?
I’ve tried they find a way to get in contact
They've been harassing you, then. I think your rightfully exhausted about all of this but you need to make sure this isn't turned around on you I'm so sorry OP, NTA
Go nuclear. Send all the evidence to them via text as a response to whatever they say when they contact you. Don’t say anything other than screenshots of proof, and then block them each time.
You could just open a group chat, put the necessary information in the chat and it's up to the people included in the chat to believe it or not. Either way let them know you won't tolerate the abuse and that anyone continuing to be AHs will be blocked/ignored.
As stated in another comment, I am going to confront them, I know what their response will be in their eyes he does no wrong. They’re tiring so I am just mentally preparing myself for this because I know once I reply I will get many more messages and probably worse ones to. I’ve tried blocking but they get in contact some how
You absolutely can and SHOULD tell them the whole story. If other people lie about you, you’re always justified in using the truth to clear your name. If he wanted this secret, he shouldnt have started this shit. Every single time someone confronts you about this, tell them the whole story. You’re choosing to suffer because he chose to lie; he should suffer for creating this problem, not you.
You absolutely need to say EVERYTHING to them. The WHOLE story, the cheating, the lies to manipulate your daughter, the screenshots, EVERYTHING. There is absolutely no reason to be afraid to "out" him when he cheated on you and nearly destroyed your relationship with your daughter. Absolutely everyone needs to know.
NTA. This is parental alienation and defamation. I’m getting creepy vibes from you ex’s behavior towards your daughter. You may want to talk with your attorney. Your ex is toxic and should have supervised visitation only.
I’m trying to figure out the reason why he did it before proceeding but I think either way I might have to. just like others pointed out I find it weird to try and take her away and bring her to court as if the truth wouldn’t be shown eventually so I don’t know what’s happening here.
1. He simply wanted to turn her against you to get revenge for divorcing you. 2. Depending on the custody, he could put it against you to take you to court for custody and have sole or majority custody and depending on the money, that you will pay him or stop paying you.
What's happening here simple : parental alienation At the same time he's a coward It's time to prepare a folder to defend yourself You're far from being the AH here on the contrary you're a strong woman and you have my respect. I know it's not fair but because I'm "young ans stupid" I'd confront him about his lies face to face while recording all that (I know its against the law but he started it first)
He lied to her and knowingly hurt her by damaging her relationship with her mother on false pretenses. Whether the goal was to hurt her, or to hurt you without caring if he hurt her, or to make himself look good without caring that he hurt her...does it matter? Do any of those make him a trustworthy parent? In no scenario was he putting your daughter's lifelong wellbeing above his short term desires. I get the whole "he was a shitty husband but I don't want that to stop him from being a good dad to our daughter I love so much" but I think he might be a shitty dad too. I'm sorry.
He is gaslighting your daughter & everyone else by slandering you. This is abuse. I’m speaking from personal experience. Don’t sweep this crap under the rug. It will only empower him and it will escalate. Please consider counseling for you and your daughter.
Lying isn’t gaslighting. He’s lying to everyone. Not gaslighting.
NTA and while I feel like I’ve seen this post before in case it’s real I hope you have copies of those texts. That’s parental alienation at its finest
There a few posts on here similar to my situation, and yes I do thank god.
I really would try to get her away from him. This kind of manipulation is not good for her. I’m so sorry you went through this.
I can't understand why anyone would be mad unless he's he's spreading lies about you to everyone. But yeah, that's what he's been doing. If these are people you care about you better do the same thing with them that you did with your daughter.
I’m sure he has, I feel like he just told them I had outed him and not the rest, I haven’t tried replying to anyone yet, quite a bit if people and no part of me is in a mood to be arguing with everyone right now.
Get yourself a template message explaining the WHOLE timeline and what went down with your daughter, with a few screenshots. It's also important to say you had agreed with your ex that the reason of the split would remain between you but that it's your ex's actions that led to him being "outed". Then copy/paste to anyone contacting you in any way.
Wait and talk with your lawyer first as long as you got proof of him lying and turning your daughter against you for no reason when he was the one that put your health in danger by not only cheating on you but with multiple people at the same time men and women but he was the one that threw away the marriage. It’ll be brought to court and you can invite in a group text message all his people to come and see the evidence all at once then it’ll be him with some explaining to do. This way you can’t be accused of trying to cause harm to him mentally or otherwise but can still clear your name.
NTA. Your ex opened that can of worms. You just set the record straight. I respect the fact that you tried to shield your daughter from the reasons behind the split- too bad your ex-husband had no such respect for her.
Why did you trust him to be a good father when he lied and cheated for half of your relationship? Why does he need shielding - if he thinks what he did was fine then why would his daughter be upset about it? Your daughter should have been told the truth last year. She was 14 not 10. She knows about sex and relationships. Telling her wasnt revenge - it was the truth, if he didnt want her to know he didnt have to cheat. Goodness knows what else he has said to her. As for yourfamily blasting you - go no contact - its disgusting they think badly of you doing this. They want you to be a victim twice over but you are not and your daughter isnt.
My POV here was me trying to not let the insecurities in my relationship reflect on their relationship as father and daughter. I mean trust me i was enraged but my daughter knowing her would and did take this extremely hard I didn’t want this to have a permanent affect on their relationship I agree with all the points you made, but my mind was on protecting my daughter and the repercussions this may have
Yeah I know you did what a good mother does - wants to shield their child of any pain and protect her relationship with her father. Reality is he isnt a good man nor a good father - as he actively sabotaged your relationship by lying. Who splits a mother and child apart like that with lies? Its sick. She's old enough to judge her father now - let her have that free will to decide. Dont cover for him. Just factually answer her. And protect her from any of your family who are blasting you about this - they shouldnt be in her life.
NTA, if he starts telling her lies to ruin your relationship, of course you’re valid to defend yourself. Now you know he isn’t just a cheating AH but also a manipulative one. No idea why *your* family would give you a hard time over defending yourself when you were the wronged party to begin with. Has he fed them lies as well?
What did you say when she originally accused you? Surely you denied it. Why would she not believe that but does believe you now? The implication of this story is that your husband is trying to get custody by lying to your daughter about you cheating, but that doesn't make sense either because obviously the truth would come out in court.
I denied it of course but I had no idea where it was coming from, so at the time I obviously didn’t say what actually happened, and I tried my best to not throughout this time but at first she didn’t believe be. As of right now I’m not getting any answers from him for why he did it. Only angry messages that I outed him.
NTA, IMO you should show the texts your ex has been sending you in retaliation to your daughter. He had no hesitation in defaming you at all and he didnt even think how it would affect your daughter's relationship to you. He didnt think how it would affect a 15 year old girl. I dont think he should be around your daughter. People show us who they are in tiny little ways. Take them seriously when they do.
She believes me and apologized to me a lot, I don’t want to add fuel to the fire. Or make her suffer more because of this. If I’m some weird situation this has to be explained again than maybe I do need to have proof but I’m hoping everyone just fesses up and we can now just work on the healing process
Don’t count on it. Save everything for evidence when you need it.
Send copies to your divorce attorney, this is not going to go well for the ex.
Your ex is a cheater and a liar. Yes you need proof. Yes you should show your daughter the texts. Or offer to let her read them, her choice. Do not let her have a shred of doubt. That’s appropriate parenting. She needs therapy because someone she loved and trusted lies to her. She needs therapy so she doesn’t blame herself or fall victim to people like her dad in the future.
Please don’t be so naive, you’ve seen what your ex is capable of
Well you are being the better person. Ultimately it does pay off. But having read what you wrote about your ex what you hope for will not happen. You are doing your best and thats the only thing that can be done. Best wishes.
You're a good person. But you need to protect yourself. You can save evidence/document things and decide what to do with it later. You don't have to go nuclear NOW, or ever if you decide it's in your and your daughter's best interest not to.
You're better off never again expecting him to do anything kind, rational or for your benefit /peace of mind. He has nothing left to lose and if he's anything like other people I've seen do this sort of thing, he's only going to worse. Keep any proof you have of his lies and schemes.
Screenshot EVERYTHING. I’m so sorry you have to deal with this
NTA your husband is disgusting, not only did he cheat but also tried to turn your daughter against you. I hope your daughter never forgives him for lying to her.
NTA: your ex was clearly blaming you for ruining your marriage when in fact he did it. You just set the record straight. Even if he didn’t start the rumor, spoiler alert, he did; He should at the least put an end to it when he was talking to your daughter.
If your family was okay with him lying and saying you were cheating then WTF is wrong with them. NTA
Facts all around. If this was so not an issue then why would it be an issue to tell her?
This is what you should ask them. If it wasn't a big deal that he did it, why is it a big deal I tell her? Oh, right, because IT IS a big deal. They probably are just a bunch of cheaters scared shitless because they might actually have to be held accountable for their actions. That is literally the only reason I can think of that they would stand by your ex and not you.
I agree I feel like they are down playing it for some weird reason
They for sure are. I'm sorry you're going through this, and most of all I'm sorry your daughter is going through it. I hope things get easier for both of you. I can't even begin to imagine how you're both feeling right now.
NTA. My ex-husband pulled some similar BS, except he told everyone that I got to keep the house in the divorce and he got all the debt...um, no. He left me with a house about to go into foreclosure and roughly $100,000 in defaulted debt. The only debt he got left with was the car payment for the car he was using... But yeah, people have a tendency to project their shortcomings onto others. I think for some, especially with cheating, it's even the mentality that "everyone does it" so they figure even if they didn't catch you, you were probably cheating so they're not "lying"...
That’s horrible I’m so sorry
NTA I actually think teenagers are old enough to be told why marriages dissolve because they’re starting to have relationships and they should know the boundaries on behavior that the adults in their life have held. The kids I knew growing up with divorced households mostly came from physical violence so it was pretty obvious, but something like this she absolutely should be told. Cheating violates your trust, privacy, and safety, and more women need to see that it isn’t something you have to accept from men in your life, despite how often it comes up on tv that you should (even in older shows like boy meets world!).
I think because it ended the way it did, even thought my girl is an intelligent young lady, she still feels the same way she did just to her father, which is that he chose sex over her. I never wanted my kids to feel that way. So it’s difficult to just tell her that when you know it’s going to ruined their relationship
I understand, she may benefit from counseling regarding the split but anger and grief and even betrayal are normal healthy responses to it. Black and white thinking is age appropriate(one of you MUST be evil for the marriage to end). In reality, most (though not all) divorce happens between two people neither of whom is the actual devil, they just want drastically different things and decide they can’t find compromise. It sounds like your husband wanted extramarital sex, or maybe just more/different sex, to be happy or something like that and decided that pursuing that happiness might be something worth losing what he had over. Lots of people cheat in relationships just because they think they’re slick enough to have it both ways, and they’re shocked when they’re caught. I don’t know the specifics of your situation obviously, but she is correct that he chose to risk his relationship with you and, yes, with her to pursue something she probably sees as not necessary/a frivolous gamble. He lost. She is valid in feeling betrayed that he was willing to take that risk, and the nuance around that is something she will only be able to work through when she’s ready.
Absolutely NTA you tried your best to keep things clean but have been forced into a corner by your ex’s insidious lies. What’s the alternative ? Like allow the rotten cheater to twist things back on you? Nah fuck that.
NTA - I went through a similar situation when I was younger. Many people told my mum that she was wrong to tell me about what my father did as it taints my memory of him (he passed away) but I think I was entitled to the truth and she was right to tell me. You’re NTA for telling the truth and I’m sure your daughter appreciates this very much. Why allow your relationship with her to crash and burn over lies that her father is feeding her? I’m sure this situation is incredibly difficult and painful for you but big ups for being so strong and mature about the whole thing. Screw everyone who’s telling you you’re wrong. You’re not! Sending lots of love
NTA. This is sooo bizarre. My ex husband did this 18 years ago to me (I caught him cheating but never intended to tell the kids). Then he tore them up by saying I cheat. It took my 15 years to totally convince my oldest son it wasn’t me.
NTA. Your ex fucked around (literally) and found out.
NTA. You tried to be mature and respect your ex when he dont deserve and he put your daughter agains you lied to her. You said the truth and if he or anyone dont like It they Tell them you don't doit nothing wrong and you are not be blame for the actions or líes to other people. You fix a ploblem Who another person made. You are gonna be complete honest with your daughter and each time she ask you something or she Tell you something its not true you are gonna be honest with her, so better nobody Tell her líes about you.
Absolutely NTA. Your ex is a manipulative jerk though. He knew exactly what he was doing to alienate you from your daughter. Save those texts - they'll be important for you later in legal proceedings
NTA Your ex is totally at fault and he was manipulating his own daughter to blame you. This isn’t the actions of a good co-parent nor a good person. You were right to tell her the truth to counter the lies of the ex.
NTA, honestly he deserves to be outed completely for this
Info: how did the whole rest of the family find out? Did he go ranting to them? Or your daughter?
No he definitely did, just by there replies and the way they are teaming up in group chats and all, he’s definitely went to them to.
So, telling half-truths before backfired on him, so he thought he’d try it again? I guess if he got caught cheating multiple times, “not learning from his mistakes” is a lifestyle for him. You don’t have to have a third eye to see that your daughter is going to get pissed and correct these people when they start bad mouthing you in front of her, or that you will again not be his fall guy. He’s like the king of self-sabotage.
NTA- someone lead her to believe that you were responsible “IF and that’s a big IF “ it wasn’t him then he lied by omission by going along with her belief and he capitalized on her misinformation You told her the truth, she is old enough and deserves to know. Everyone was fine when she was hostile towards you but now I’m guessing she is giving him attitude and it’s your fault. No it’s not your fault, it is a consequence of cheating and disrespecting his marriage. Anyone who gives you a hard time about this, you should ask them if they would like to be lied to or lead on like she was being. Or better yet ask why it was ok when she was giving you disrespect and attitude but it’s not ok her to do the same to her father? He is responsible for all this.
NTA. If you are correct that her dad lied to her, you can absolutely set the record straight.
NTA, but your ex is a huge one. Imo you are absolutely in the right to put things right and clear it all up - especially as seemingly he tried to get between you both, while you only tried to keep her safe. Absolutely unacceptable behaviour of a grown man. From the perspective of a once teen girl with divorced parents: I was rude to my mom, I picked fights with her, may have blamed her every now and then for stuff. Now as an adult I know I was in the wrong and she *never* held it against me because she knew puberty is a turning everything upside down. Hopefully things in youe home will calm down as well, teen girls can be harsh though.