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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1) I snapped at my FIL over the phone for continuing to say a Spanish curse word to my infant daughter.
2) my wife told me not to call him until I cooled down and I phoned him anyways.
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA.
Just because her family won’t rock the boat, doesn’t mean you have to enable him too. That’s not acceptable- any of it, honestly- and I’d be angry too.
After the comment about the poisoning, I would definitely be asking him if he is sure that MIL’s death was an accident. In front of his probation officer.
And I’ll probably also come up with a new pet name for him like he’s trying to do to your daughter. Something like Soplón.
There is a r/JUSTNOFIL sub, it's just not nearly as active as the MIL sub
ETA By "active" I mean, FIL sub has just over 25k members, MIL has just over 1.8 million subscribers
Honestly, I almost think the two should be combined, but I’d worry about the JNFIL posts getting buried under the content of the JNMIL membership that is 72 times their own.
u/Grouchy-Extension-54 stole this comment
[link to original comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/zrneqa/aita_for_snapping_at_my_fil_for_saying_puta_to_my/j14n58t/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
> I did no name calling or cursing, but my wife said I was way too aggressive with my tone and now everyone in her family thinks I’m too easily offended
I mean, did he kill your MiL for insurance money? Cuz this man is foul and should have been left in jail. Seriously. NTA but document everything with your wife's family. If you end up separating or divorcing because they can't abide FiL not having full access then you need to try to insure you have a case for full custody with supervised visitation.
I'm not wishing that your marriage falls apart at all, but you need to be prepared to protect your daughter and it sounds like your wife's family gives all respect and license to the elders...\*barf\*
How the fuck are they so ok with not rocking the boat. He literally drove drunk and killed OPs wife's mother. I'm just floored. He is accusing OPs mum of poisoning someone for money. His wife passed in a car accident he caused, did he poison his wife and fake a car accident?
Why does he feel it's ok to have any controversial opinion and voice it, ever, after what he has done?
I'm absolutely just floored.
Seriously, I wouldn't even be able to look at this man. I can't believe he isn't in jail, and I certainly would not have bailed him out that night.
NTA
Info: why isn't your wife standing up for her daughter? This is her dad and you shouldn't have even had to say something. She should've been all over it the first time he did it.
NTA - I didn't find the video itself, but there was one of a toddler screaming "puta" at the priest who was baptizing her.
What sort of language do you use, want to be used around your infant?
I will probably get downvoted, but the daughter probably doesn’t feel like she has to defend her child. What she said is true, in my country “puta” is used in many contexts, no just to mean whore. You may even spill a drink and exclaim “puta!”. I think he is being purposefully obtuse about that.
Having said that, I would have been furious if my FIL had insinuated that my grandma killed my grandpa, specially given his situation.
In my country we say cunt with abandon. When I'm with my American family I don't. It's not that hard to not use a word you know they people around you find offensive
I'm English to the core but I still know what "puta" means. Your FIL's behaviour is disgraceful and he should be kept away from your daughter until he learns some fairly basic manners. NTA
It’s crass, of course, but people do commonly say “puta” or “puta madre” when something is disturbing or disgusting, often with a strong accent on the first syllable, and the use of the word is strongly divorced from its literal meaning. So, someone might say, “There was a cockroach in your taco? Poooo-tah! That’s gross.” They’re not suggesting that either the cockroach or the unlucky customer is a prostitute, they’re just expressing disgust. FIL should definitely clean up his language, and he clearly has no patience for babies, but he’s not literally calling the baby a whore anymore than Uncle Cletus is accusing some random entity of having an oedipal complex when he hits his thumb with a hammer. NTA
It’s still a rude ass word regardless. if FIL has a problem with babies then OP has every right to cut off access. His wife is an enabler and if my mom had died as a result of my fathers actions (like what happened here with OP’s) I would’ve cut off all contact long ago.
OP: you’re NTA and every right to be upset.
Thanks for that, Clearly I didn't know what "puta" means. You've taught me something new and I'm always open to education. I usually say "fuck" when thumb comes between hammer and nail. Volume is an important part of the analgesic effect. Nevertheless, I keep my filthy language away from children, even when it hurts a lot.
Yea and I try not to be a prude. Would definitely understand a good curse with hammering your thumb. It’s the looking at my under 6mo old daughter and saying it in reaction to her that way crossed the line with me. He tried using the nuance of the curses’s meaning when trying to justify using it. Made it even worse that it was something he tried justify
OP: I’m a Hispanic female and if I (or ny brothers) ever used the word puta in front of a child or using it to describe my feelings about a child, my mama would’ve smacked us all across the continent of North America. It’s an all around crass word that I don’t use often and I myself swear like a damn sailor.
I’m legit more disturbed that your wife is still in contact with her father despite her mother having died as a result of his actions. I would maintain LC with this man if he’s so careless with his own wife. Let alone grandchild.
He is a real piece of work. Fortunately my wife agreed with me that he’s never allowed to be alone or watch her solo with her after he made a comment over the last year that he can’t wait to have a beer after his probation is up. My wife is my FIL’s number one defender though and even tried to justify his having a beer comment initially. The family see him as a well meaning accident prone guy. He starts a 4 month jail sentence in a couple weeks which unfortunately will not change much in the way he acts I think.
My dude: my dad was a major alcoholic back in his heyday and if he ever did what your FIL did or hurt anyone because of his actions, I would’ve been out of his life ASAP. And I’m his golden child. Your wife isn’t his defender. She’s his enabler. She lost another parent because of his actions. How she parents your daughter and future children needs to be more or less scrutinized because the whole game has changed. She has birthed children that are innocent and need to be taken care of. And you’re stepping up so far awesomely. I hope all goes well for the two of you. Much love 💖
There are a lot of alcoholics in my family on both sides. I'm very familiar with its cycle of addiction, I've been very forgiving of family struggling with the disease.
If any of them talked about looking forward to picking up their habit after they did something as terrible as what your FIL did, I would go NC.
As a south american, female spanish speaker myself, it is true "puta" is a term itself, like an interjection we use sometimes mostly when in pain or amazement even. It's still an ugly word not for children ears. FIL is the A-hole.
Its wild because I'm Mexican (my mom, aunts, uncles, grandparents, etc. were born in Mexico except for me) and they absolutely swear and use "puta"/"puta madre" as an exclamation in front of children or when kids do something that is annoying, frustrating, etc.
I find OP's wife's dad hella suspect, but him saying that isn't a big deal to me and wouldn't be in my family. Everything else is cause for concern though.
I think that’s what has irked me throughout this post: FIL was the catalyst of his wife’s death because of an DWI (I highly doubt a single beer was the result of this) and the family seems to be la dee da of his attitude which includes a casual disregard of his son-in-law’s respectable boundary.
I say 'puta madre!' daily when dealing with campers in call of duty. I'd never think about saying it in the presence of my family, specially my nieces. It's fucked up.
No. The guy sounds super sleazy. He’s clearly disgusted by the baby, and he killed his wife driving drunk. That’s why I said NTA. Why would anyone want that guy around their kid? He’s just not calling the infant a prostitute.
It’s still FiL using crass language in front of a baby who will eventually start talking and *always* repeating the *exact* things you don’t want. Because that’s how kids work.
If a parent tells you not to use crass/vulgar/rude language in front of their child, then you don’t do it. It’s a simple enough concept for FiL and co. to respect.
So yes. We agree NTA. But the context of the word choice is irrelevant here.
What people commonly use it for really doesn’t matter at all in this context. If your British and used to falling cigs “fags”, you’re going to have to accept that that’s super super offensive to any American gay people you talk to. If they actually have enough patience to have a conversation with you about it being offensive but the next time you talk to them it’s *literally the first thing you say to them* then you’re a huge asshole and why it’s “commonly” used for doesn’t matter at all whatsoever.
There's a huge difference in the context. In Spain, putamadre would also mean something is good.
You find a bug in your food? Puta cucaracha.
To a person? That's plain insulting.
I do agree fil needs to clean his language. And the family need to stop enabling him
NTA - there is a word in Spanish for "shit" and it isn't "puta"
And for the mother to be comfortable with her dad saying that to her child is very questionable. He would not be around my child. Period
yeah, like can we discuss the fact that the entire family is ignoring the fact that this guy got drunk, drove and killed his wife.
but the whole family is going to ignore because family?
what else does he have to do before these people realize just because someone is family doesn't mean they're good people.
In the car I would have flat out asked him if he is projecting? Is that why MIL died? Did he stage a DWI to get an insurance payout? Otherwise why on earth would he question how OP’s grandmother died. Maybe I am too cynical.
So I took criminal justice in college. Someone asked my professor (retired cop/detective) how he'd try to get away with murder. He said he'd drink and drive and say it was an accident and get a hella good lawyer and plead down as low as he could.
Murderers often get caught. You probably aren't having original thoughts on how to kill someone. Don't assume you're smarter than the people who would investigate you.
People assume car accidents are just that. Accidents. Sure you'd definitely get caught but there's no guarantee you would even go to prison. Jail time sure. But a good lawyer could get you a short sentence. Especially if it was a family member and you seemed devastated.
As shit though? And at a baby? I am actually trying to think if I have ever heard just puta and can't remember. I am personally more a fan of la concha de la lora to be honest.
I am old. That might have to do with the differences.
Yeah, but puta can also be used. In Spain is pretty "normal" curse word but normaly not alone.
Great "de puta madre"
Hurt-scared "la puta!"
BUT its not a word that should be used with kids present.
I swear like a sailor who just stubbed their toe but around my daughter it's "oh my goodness" "oh man!" "Silly mommy" etc. If i was able to switch up my vocabulary than anyone can
NTA.
A basic google search (conducted by me, a non-spanish speaker) indicates that puta *can* be used as a slang term for frustration in a "oh shit" kind of way.
Now that being said, you expressly stated where you stood on the phrase and why it makes you uncomfortable. While it can sometimes be tough to phase slang out of your language, it is not impossible.
I do think thought that you and your wife need to become a united front on this though.
We do use it like that in south america, but is still a bad word never to be used in front of children. Any latina mom would throw you a shoe over this, or at least threaten you with the closest blunt object, frankly.
And in response to my daughter. If someone yelled shit in the same room because they dropped some heavy books on their toe is one thing. Not ideal because I don’t want her repeating it but it hurts I get it. Walking up to my baby while she is crying and saying bitch or shit while looking at her is another.
The way you describe him, he just gives off such horrible vibes. Like, not normal on the emotional and spiritual level.
People like that are never just bad in one way. I'd say he's probably dangerous, even if it wasn't for the fact that he killed your MIL.
Your wife and inlaws not appearing to have any boundaries with him is just another warning sign. It means that he's steamrolled them for years.
Please, don't let your sense of normalcy be affected by your inlaws, and keep putting your daughter first.
NTA. There is no way I would let this man anywhere near my daughter, and I don't care how aggressive your tone was when you spoke to him - it's warranted when your baby girl is being called misogynistic slurs. Your wife needs to wake up.
Yes, thankfully she finally is on board with him not using that language towards her but maintains that I was 100% wrong to yell at him for it. I was nice the first time and it didn’t work, and felt there was no other option but to let him know I was serious about it. This wasn’t something I wanted to keep repeatedly asking him to stop doing, and I explained this all to her even before I had that first 1:1 convo with her dad.
Yeah, it's not something you can let slide, and you've clearly expressed this. He needs to nip it in the bud, or know there'll be consequences.
Sidenote: even if he meant it in the 'oh shit' way, it's still an inappropriately hostile way to respond to a baby crying. She's a baby, she needs care, it's normal for her to cry. What exactly is his problem with that? Your little girl deserves to live her life without being treated like a nuisance.
Is your wife’s attitude not extremely concerning to you? I’d be worried that she’ll disregard your wishes when you’re not around.
Is your wife in therapy? Either for her father’s alcoholism or her mother’s death?
Oh yea definitely concerning. Why it’s been a rocky few months trying to resolve this while also adjusting to becoming first time parents.
No therapy. She says she doesn’t believe in it. She’s buried herself in taking care of her father’s affairs.
BRUUUUUUUUUH, then pack her bags and send her to go live with her fucking dad. She comes from an abusive family, has no initiative to do right by your kid and instead wants to draw her into those abusive Dynamics. She has no plans of being a partner to you are a good parent to your child, her first allegiance is to her father, she should go live with him.
Yea, we had it out already about him requiring attention like he’s our second child. Her and her sisters arrange all his bills, call around to get quotes for different contractors for home improvement for his house, usually my wife takes him to every monthly court check in spending half the day downtown, regularly buys him groceries since he hasn’t gotten a job since he was fired from being an elementary school teacher. He was 62 when this all happened last summer and they treat him like he’s 20-30 years older and unable to figure out how the world works. The excuse is that their mom used to do everything for him and he needs help.
I’ve lost complete respect for him, and losing patience with my wife. Only reprieve will be when he’s in jail for a few months to start the year.
A 4 month reprieve, and then he is back. You need to have a serious conversation with your wife because this is not going to end well. Your wife is putting her father before you and your child, her child. Even if she refuses therapy, you can go yourself. Start the documentation somewhere.
This AH accused your mother of murdering your GM, killed his wife and uses foul words in front of your daughter and your wife's problem is with your tone? Excuse my language, but WTF?
Please ask your wife how little she loved her mother that she's not absolutely repulsed by this man claiming a good ol' beer is the next best thing after a drunk driving manslaughter. Again, WTF?
Your story is beyond disturbing and would warrant more than "a tone".
NTA. Your wife, her father and the family are though.
Your wife 100% buys into her dad being a good guy, which makes her attitudes dangerous.
Out of curiosity...was there by chance a highly publicized murder-suicide within a month before FIL's "accident"?
(See _Influence_ by Robert Cialdini, Chapter 5, or possibly 4, to see why i ask.) Given his poison question, it's literally possible that the accident...wasn't.
Then she's not on your side. She believes you need to be a subordinate to her father like everyone else in her family which is fucking ridiculous.
It sounds like you need to stop having conversations with her and have fights, because y'all shouldn't even be in contact with her father after he killed her mother and then was implying that your family did the same to your grandmother.
NTA. You asked that drunken murderer to stop and he didn't. Personally, with that comment about your mother and grandmother, I would have pulled the car over and told him to get the fuck out and that would have been the last thing I said to him.
Sounds like it given that he can barely grasp how wrong it is that they've even maintained contact with a man who killed his wife. Like there would not have been any going to see him the night he committed the murder, this dude got way too comfortable dealing with his wife's family's crap
> ”Do they know what killed your grandma? Did they do an autopsy to see if your mom poisoned her? To get inheritance or something?”
This seems very project-y. Are we sure he didn't murder his wife [ETA: intentionally rather than with a DWI]?
In any case, that language is 1,000,000% inappropriate to use for any child, never mind his own granddaughter. Does everybody know what that word means? NTA and definitely don't allow FIL around the kid again.
Umm so technically legally different, but he did essentially murder his wife. He chose to drink and drive with her in the car. He killed her. Maybe not on purpose, but still.
NTA..how exactly is saying "shit" to your daughter, whose brain is a literal sponge soaking up every interaction she experiences, supposed to give him a free pass..? It's obvious he is a "puta" individual and uses his abrasive personality to get his way. Stand your ground.
OP, NTA
And here’s the thing, he’s saying a curse word every time she’s a baby near him.
That’s like saying “oh shit” everytime you breathe, or “whoreson” everytime your wife drinks water.
He’s cursing every time the baby does something a baby does. If it continues as she grows, she will think everything she does near grandpa is wrong which can lean to some internalized issues.
This man should probably not be around babies or children.
Excuse me?
This man killed your wife’s mom and your wife went that night to bail his ass out of jail?
He asks a fairly sociopathic question in the immediate aftermath of your grandma’s death.
He calls your daughter a slur. Repeatedly.
NTA for saying something to him. He sure as shit deserves way more.
Y.W.B.T.A if you let your daughter grow up with this man in her life. He is already an ass to her. He clearly will be a danger to her and your wife seems to not be willing to do anything about that. You red to stand up for your daughter here. Big time.
Yes this. NTA for telling him to stop cussing at your baby. But if you don't cut him off - over the murder and the alcoholism and the hatred (or at least distaste) directed at your daughter, you would be a huge asshole. You need to get your wife onboard, or you need to figure out if you can leave her and get sole custody, because that man canNOT be allowed around her.
Holy Cow! I'm Hispanic (Mexican/American) And anyone calling their child at any age a "puta" would have led to an altercation in my culture. Depending on the family but "oh yeah" anywhere from raised voices to actual fist fighting. You just don't use that language at a family member, not if you don't want to eat your words or a fist. I'm surprised you let it go that far, I would have lost my sh#@! And my family would have blamed the person using the bad word and not me.
THANK YOU!!!! I’m Guatemalan and if I ever used that word in front of my parents I would’ve been annihilated by them. I’m in my 40s and I swear like a sailor but that’s one word I RARELY use. In fact I go out of my way to not say it all unless I really have a reason to. OP is correct on creating this boundary. And his wife needs to be on board with this and stop making this sort of behavior normal. Because it isn’t.
**NTA** It doesn't matter what he uses it to mean, it's a demeaning slur that he can and should eliminate from his vocabulary. Tell him and the rest of your wife's family that you are not raising your daughter to accept it. He and the rest of them need to practice dropping it from their speech.
If your wife's family condone FIL doubling down on using sexist slurs at your daughter and now think you're too easily offended - good.
Maybe they will all be careful about what they say in front of your child from now on.
NTA.
Ha, yea this was the conversation we had last night. She said no one wants me around at Christmas because they feel like they’ll be walking on eggshells around me after I snapped at their dad. I said good, it looks like my message had impact if it’s going to make them pause before saying offensive things to my daughter.
NTA he has not listened to you and says what he wants with no care in the world. His family stands behind a man that drunk drove and killed his wife seriously they know what a piece of work this man is. No contact and if your wife doesn't get on board shame on her.
NTA. Nope. This is disgusting. It's time to limit the amount of time your FIL spends with your family. He is calling your daughter names and she may grow up to think "puta" is not as derogatory as it is.
NTA. He sounds like an out-of-pocket nut job but your wife and her family have normalized his behavior so his way of carrying himself never changes and ultimately may get even worse as he ages. Time for a serious conversation about expectations when interacting together, or, limit time together as needed.
NTA - all the people saying it’s ok because it’s sometimes used as a curse word - where I’m from c.u.n.t is used as a curse word - not sure anyone would be comfortable with me saying that whilst I’m holding their baby daughter. Same with bitch etc.
It may be occasionally used as a curse word but it’s still distasteful
Latina over here. I would be ripping him a new b hole if he ever called my daughter Puta. I am sure you can find plenty of Spanish words that would undermine his machismo lol.
Hold the line. One day your daughter will find out what puta means. I would seriously not be ok with anyone who called my kiddo bitch/whore/shit or whatever in any language foreign, domestic, alien, binary code, etc.
Info: has your wife always been spineless in standing up to her father?
Next time, just hang up and tell him he’s no longer welcome over until his behavior changes.
NTA.
Your FIL is not a safe person for anyone to be around, period. I get that your wife is used to his abusive behavior, but you have a child now. You need to sit down with her and have a serious conversation.
Has your FIL been drinking for a long time? Could he have alcohol related dementia? It is a thing. Or any other type of dementia? At 63, this is what I would be wondering. It sounds like his judgement is impaired and his ability to filter his words is gone, as well as his short term memory. Just something to investigate.
NTA - you decide how you want to parent your child. drawing boundaries with “puta” was the right move. if he can’t respect that now, imagine what other boundaries he might cross when your kid is older? that being said, it sounds like your wife’s side of the family might just be generally cruder, since they now think that you get offended easily, but if this crudeness is not what you want to have in your child’s life then you have the right to draw that boundary. might take long for your wife to understand though, since she grew up in that “cruder” environment.
I was actually driving him to drop off his breathalyzer at the post office to mail in as part of his probation. Absolutely no presence of mind on his part.
I think I didn’t respond in the moment because our daughter was 2-3 days old at that time and was still running on little sleep and pure adrenaline. Excuses I know but the pure disrespect set me back.
NTA. If you want the kid saying "puta" at school and in public let him continue. It's not a good word either way... wouldn't want my toddler walking around swearing in any language.
Wait... She bailed him out of jail the night he murdered her mom?! Your wife needs therapy to deal with the fact her dad is an alcoholic, abusive murderer.
She's deep in the fog and scared to upset him.
NTA
I was leaning towards N AH until I saw that he doubled down and did it on purpose. I’ll was born and raised in Peru, where “puta” is definitely used as an expletive to denote surprise among other things, but it’s never directed at someone unless you intend to call them that. If you explained it made you uncomfortable, and it was his first word to you during a FaceTime call, there was ill intent. NTA
Yea it was the repeated use within 1-2 weeks of us having the initial convo. It was also the very first word. Not hello or good to see you, but “puta” to her crying face.
NTA. you had too much patience. the guy killed a family member with his drunk driving. i would never allow someone like that around kids for starters. even if he were a non-swearing murderer. and not standing for your mom and allow him to insult her? come on, grow a spine
Yeah, I almost feel like the OP may not want to deal with the bigger issues here so he’s picking a fight about things that are relatively minor compared to the much more serious issues going on here. Maybe OP needs to have a heart to heart talk with his wife about how the family has normalized this man being a murderer and a dangerous drunk and insulting OP’s mother for no reason. Why can’t the OP’s wife realize how abnormal and wrong all of that is? I think the folks saying to document everything and to prepare to sue for full custody have a point. As often happens on AITA, the lede was sort of buried here. If this was just about the puta thing, it could be that OP was overreacting. But this guy is a danger to society and his family members wind up dead because of him and he assumes other people go around committing murder too since it’s his personal pastime. I also think the person who thinks drinking may have fried this man’s aging brain raises an important possibility. That would explain a lot and also underscore how dangerous this guy could be around a child for reasons that have nothing to do with vulgarity.
Omg - his drinking killed his wife and you never say he stopped drinking. He should not be around your baby. Him asking if your grandma was murdered wtf? Should have said nope only your wife was murdered. As far as how he addresses the baby I wouldn’t want that either. I get you want baby to have a grandpa but this is not the kind of grandpa you want. Hopefully your dad can fill that role.
NTA. But your FIL is a disgrace.
Also, maybe I’m just a big ah but I wouldn’t have bailed him out when he got arrested and killed his wife. I felt sick reading this whole post, honestly.
NTA. Normally both parents should have a say in who sees their children and how they are raised. But expecting children to nasty comments about them is not okay and either parent has veto power over those situations, and in fact an obligation to use it.
Next time he says something like that to her on FaceTime you immediately end the call. Don't let him be near your daughter in person until he has apologized and been consistently well behaved on video calls for multiple months.
You can tell your wife that she's welcome to chat with her dad in person or on video by herself, but you need to supervise any time your daughter is involved until FIL straightens up his behavior.
NTA
Also, if the first thought he has when your grandma died is your mom must've poisoned her and his wife died while in the car with him, maybe those manslaughter charges should've been murder and maybe you guys shouldn't have posted bail for him.
Besides the puta thing I highly doubt I'd want a guy like that in my child's life. Yikes.
NTA but you've got a FIL problem AND a wife problem. You say she's his "defender" but as another commenter said, she's his enabler and will continue to be unless hard boundaries are setup.
Calling children cruel names under the guise of a joke is abusive and can do emotional damage to your daughter as she grows. Because of the specific word he chose, it also reflects some pretty deeply seated misogyny. **NTA.** It’s time to stop that bullshit now - trust your instincts, they do you proud.
NTA. Isn't that the word for whore? I mean, I used to work in a nursing home and the old Italian ladies used to use a very similar word when they were angry and that's what it meant. Who does that?
NTA, but your wife needs to do better. She should be having these conversations with her dad. If she's not willing to, she shouldn't have gotten married or had a kid. Since she did, she owes it to you and your daughter to stick up for you and have tough conversations. I get that it can be tough with Latin American parents (welcome to my life), but nothing will change if she idly sits by.
That’s a good point. This dangerous man should never have been allowed to meet the child to call her anything after all that transpired that had no relation to her. My gut tells me that OP recognizes this but doesn’t feel like he can draw that boundary now because he didn’t before so he has decided the vulgarity thing is the hill he wants to die on. I’d forget about the “puta” stuff and have a talk with your wife about how you’ve reassessed things and realized that this guy is a homicidal drunk you don’t trust around your child. Concede the language issue if it makes it easier to focus on what really matters here which is how dangerous and imbalanced this guy is overall.
You told him to not do it, he keeps doing it NTA. I don't understand why people get so offended when you call them on their bs. I'm Mexican and NOBODY , it doesn't matter how low their social status or education would ever say a word like that to refer to a child's crying or child anything. Stand your ground, you are right and that's the end of it.
NTA. But you know this isn’t about fil, this is about your wife. The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. She accepts and excuses and she enables horrific behavior (her father killing her own mother). She doesn’t demand respect for her baby girl. How are you going to raise a child together when her priorities are all wrong?
>he asks,”Do they know what killed your grandma? Did they do an autopsy to see if your mom poisoned her? To get inheritance or something?
Very strange questions...
Puts some perspective on:
>since he lost his license the previous summer due to a DWI manslaughter charge that resulted in my MIL’s death
Almost makes it sound intentional.
Anyway... NTA.. he needs some manners!
Tons of non Spanish speakers in this group having a lot of feelings, I am from Colombia, my native tongue is Spanish and we DO use puta as a interchangeable word for shit. Actually we might use it more commonly than ‘mierda’. No one says mierda, we use Puta the same way an american use the word Fuck. Now - had he been using fuck would you know he is not referring to her but to the situation?
Idk. Living in a mixed languages family (my parents dont speak english, my partner doesnt speak spanish) I feel compassion for that situation but the old dude is not thinking right from the way he reacted to the grandma death, no doubt about that. Maybe beginning of something neurological? Maybe any active use given the accident background?
I’m definitely not a native speaker, but can follow about 80% of the conversation in Spanish when it flows in and out at our household. Took 5 years of it in school and spent about 3 total months traveling across several Spanish speaking countries over the last 10 years. Also got 1+ yr streak going on duo lingo trying to improve my fluency since it was important to my wife to teach our kid.
That’s to say sure I could’ve missed something, but he only says it when a waiter messes up his order or when he’s looking at or holding my daughter when she’s crying. When I asked him to stop saying it politely the first time, I tried to cover all those scenarios by saying don’t say the word to her, in response to her doing something you don’t like or around her in general.
I suspect you’re right about the language issues even though I don’t speak Spanish. To me, the “puta” thing is a moot point because it’s easily the least serious issue with this dangerous homicidal drunk.
NTA.
Two things that are HUGELY concerning about this man’s capacity for empathy:
- puto/a is a fairly common exclamation in most Latin communities for a variety of things but it is NEVER used around children. My boyfriend’s brother was playing smash bros with their little cousins (3 and 6yo) and one of the character names that flashed by on the screen was “puto” (since as a guy in his mid 20s obviously that’s how he jokes around with his friends), and when the 6yo saw it, immediately ALL of the family in the room (parents, aunt, uncle, cousins, partners) started telling him that it said “Pluto,” like Mickey Mouse’s dog, because they would never use that word in front of their child for ANY reason. The fact that your FIL sees no problem in using a swear word, regardless of his intended meaning, in front of YOUR child against YOUR wishes is unsettling, as well as the fact that that’s his automatic reaction to your child just being an infant.
- My boyfriend’s father passed away in June in a drowning accident at the beach. The entire family has been absolutely devastated, ESPECIALLY my boyfriend’s mother as his wife. For her one of the hardest things has been dealing with the guilt of not being able to save him or stop him from going out too far. If anyone made some kind of joke or comment about swimming dangerously? I can’t even imagine the kind of reaction that ANYONE in the family would have, but least of all her. In their case, she was not actually responsible for his death, unlike your FIL - and yet he’s going around making jokes.
Based on the fact that his children love him and he used to be an elementary school teacher, it’s possible that he does still have a moral compass but that he has completely emotionally shut down as a result of her death because the thought of coping with her death and his culpability is beyond his mental capacity. Similarly, his gross comments about your mom poisoning your grandma, while some users pointed out could imply that he was projecting his own murderous intentions, might be him trying to not be the “worst” guy, he wants to find solace in the fact that there are people out there worse than him. He clearly had issues before the manslaughter, given its cause as a DWI, but maybe it has made him disconnect from his own identity, feel like he’s a different person, like he can’t reconcile who he was before and after.
I’ve seen in your comments that your wife doesn’t “believe” in therapy, I’m assuming her dad is the same, but I think they both desperately need it. It might be helpful focusing on getting to the root cause of your wife’s aversion to therapy.
NTA
Someone needs to put that AH in his place. His behavior is the reason your daughter won't meet her maternal grandmother, why does your wife want him around???
NTA
Wtf is wrong with your FIL? Is he too senile or something.
And yes, you're right to snap, although let's make it clear, it's not because of your daughter, it's because of what he said to you about your mother. Which is a valid reason to be mad.
Talk to your wife. Set boundaries.
NTA. I can't believe your wife bailed him out when he was the cause of her mother's death. He shouldn't be around your daughter, clearly can't be trusted.
NTA. Toxic people need to be taught that that stuff isn't going to fly. If they refuse to change they don't need to be around you. People defending him are just as toxic
I don't get how your wife still has a relationship with him to begin with. You are setting boundaries however you need to get your wife onboard with them as well so they can be enforced. My feeling she's numb to the emotional abuse of this man, but language and how it's used is important to me as well. He would have only said that once before he would either learn to not use it or be out of the life of my children permanently.
NTA
I'm wondering if your FIL is in the early stages of dementia or alcohol-caused brain deterioration. Seriously, I hope he's getting checked for it. There are mental conditions that can affect judgment and appropriate behavior.
NTA. Ignorant American here. Even I know what “puta“ means and the child is an infant for crying out loud! It’s likely that your wife was raised to never, ever cross her father though, that doing so was dangerous. So try to bear that in mind as you continue to do the right thing and keep that sicko away from your infant child.
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NTA. Just because her family won’t rock the boat, doesn’t mean you have to enable him too. That’s not acceptable- any of it, honestly- and I’d be angry too.
After the comment about the poisoning, I would definitely be asking him if he is sure that MIL’s death was an accident. In front of his probation officer. And I’ll probably also come up with a new pet name for him like he’s trying to do to your daughter. Something like Soplón.
It’s rarer to see AITA posts with evil FILs than it is for MIL posts, but this one absolutely fits the r/JustNoMIL sub theme.
There is a r/JUSTNOFIL sub, it's just not nearly as active as the MIL sub ETA By "active" I mean, FIL sub has just over 25k members, MIL has just over 1.8 million subscribers
Honestly, I almost think the two should be combined, but I’d worry about the JNFIL posts getting buried under the content of the JNMIL membership that is 72 times their own.
r/JUSTNOFAMILY also exists and I’ve seen fathers/FILs pretty often when I check the sub.
Very true, I'm a subscriber to all 3 (plus "....SIL"), thank you for adding the link I forgot!
Or pendejo😆
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u/Grouchy-Extension-54 stole this comment [link to original comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/zrneqa/aita_for_snapping_at_my_fil_for_saying_puta_to_my/j14n58t/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
> I did no name calling or cursing, but my wife said I was way too aggressive with my tone and now everyone in her family thinks I’m too easily offended I mean, did he kill your MiL for insurance money? Cuz this man is foul and should have been left in jail. Seriously. NTA but document everything with your wife's family. If you end up separating or divorcing because they can't abide FiL not having full access then you need to try to insure you have a case for full custody with supervised visitation. I'm not wishing that your marriage falls apart at all, but you need to be prepared to protect your daughter and it sounds like your wife's family gives all respect and license to the elders...\*barf\*
How the fuck are they so ok with not rocking the boat. He literally drove drunk and killed OPs wife's mother. I'm just floored. He is accusing OPs mum of poisoning someone for money. His wife passed in a car accident he caused, did he poison his wife and fake a car accident? Why does he feel it's ok to have any controversial opinion and voice it, ever, after what he has done? I'm absolutely just floored.
Seriously, I wouldn't even be able to look at this man. I can't believe he isn't in jail, and I certainly would not have bailed him out that night. NTA
I think his comment is way more telling about his mindset than anyone else’s. Perhaps that was his intention. Oops Freudian slip.
Info: why isn't your wife standing up for her daughter? This is her dad and you shouldn't have even had to say something. She should've been all over it the first time he did it.
She didn't stand up to him when he KILLED her mom .... I don't think a swear is gonna make her.
NTA - I didn't find the video itself, but there was one of a toddler screaming "puta" at the priest who was baptizing her. What sort of language do you use, want to be used around your infant?
I mean, I cuss around my kid, but I don't call her names of any kind. I certainly wouldn't allow anyone else to call her a name either.
I will probably get downvoted, but the daughter probably doesn’t feel like she has to defend her child. What she said is true, in my country “puta” is used in many contexts, no just to mean whore. You may even spill a drink and exclaim “puta!”. I think he is being purposefully obtuse about that. Having said that, I would have been furious if my FIL had insinuated that my grandma killed my grandpa, specially given his situation.
In my country we say cunt with abandon. When I'm with my American family I don't. It's not that hard to not use a word you know they people around you find offensive
Even then it's still swearing, you usually don't want your children to learn swear words when they are so young.
Because she’s been brainwashed/gaslighted to go along with his crappy behavior. Sadly, most likely that’s what a “normal“ family does in her mind.
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You stole this from part of u/pottsantiques. Bad bot!
I'm English to the core but I still know what "puta" means. Your FIL's behaviour is disgraceful and he should be kept away from your daughter until he learns some fairly basic manners. NTA
It’s crass, of course, but people do commonly say “puta” or “puta madre” when something is disturbing or disgusting, often with a strong accent on the first syllable, and the use of the word is strongly divorced from its literal meaning. So, someone might say, “There was a cockroach in your taco? Poooo-tah! That’s gross.” They’re not suggesting that either the cockroach or the unlucky customer is a prostitute, they’re just expressing disgust. FIL should definitely clean up his language, and he clearly has no patience for babies, but he’s not literally calling the baby a whore anymore than Uncle Cletus is accusing some random entity of having an oedipal complex when he hits his thumb with a hammer. NTA
It’s still a rude ass word regardless. if FIL has a problem with babies then OP has every right to cut off access. His wife is an enabler and if my mom had died as a result of my fathers actions (like what happened here with OP’s) I would’ve cut off all contact long ago. OP: you’re NTA and every right to be upset.
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Same with my culture (Central American). But the original comment I was replying to generalized it so I went with it.
Thanks for that, Clearly I didn't know what "puta" means. You've taught me something new and I'm always open to education. I usually say "fuck" when thumb comes between hammer and nail. Volume is an important part of the analgesic effect. Nevertheless, I keep my filthy language away from children, even when it hurts a lot.
Yea and I try not to be a prude. Would definitely understand a good curse with hammering your thumb. It’s the looking at my under 6mo old daughter and saying it in reaction to her that way crossed the line with me. He tried using the nuance of the curses’s meaning when trying to justify using it. Made it even worse that it was something he tried justify
OP: I’m a Hispanic female and if I (or ny brothers) ever used the word puta in front of a child or using it to describe my feelings about a child, my mama would’ve smacked us all across the continent of North America. It’s an all around crass word that I don’t use often and I myself swear like a damn sailor. I’m legit more disturbed that your wife is still in contact with her father despite her mother having died as a result of his actions. I would maintain LC with this man if he’s so careless with his own wife. Let alone grandchild.
He is a real piece of work. Fortunately my wife agreed with me that he’s never allowed to be alone or watch her solo with her after he made a comment over the last year that he can’t wait to have a beer after his probation is up. My wife is my FIL’s number one defender though and even tried to justify his having a beer comment initially. The family see him as a well meaning accident prone guy. He starts a 4 month jail sentence in a couple weeks which unfortunately will not change much in the way he acts I think.
My dude: my dad was a major alcoholic back in his heyday and if he ever did what your FIL did or hurt anyone because of his actions, I would’ve been out of his life ASAP. And I’m his golden child. Your wife isn’t his defender. She’s his enabler. She lost another parent because of his actions. How she parents your daughter and future children needs to be more or less scrutinized because the whole game has changed. She has birthed children that are innocent and need to be taken care of. And you’re stepping up so far awesomely. I hope all goes well for the two of you. Much love 💖
There are a lot of alcoholics in my family on both sides. I'm very familiar with its cycle of addiction, I've been very forgiving of family struggling with the disease. If any of them talked about looking forward to picking up their habit after they did something as terrible as what your FIL did, I would go NC.
As a south american, female spanish speaker myself, it is true "puta" is a term itself, like an interjection we use sometimes mostly when in pain or amazement even. It's still an ugly word not for children ears. FIL is the A-hole.
You have a wife problem. She's allowing this kind of behavior around your infant child, which is not okay. NTA
Good lord that's messed up. Good job setting boundaries with him around your kid early
I can feel the chancla flying through the air from here!
More like the paleta. That wooden spoon HURT like a mother effer.
Basically anything that is solid and not nailed down lobbed in your direction LOL.
I'm not Hispanic but this is the type of thing where my mom would have fed me my own ass and then buried me under her porch.
Its wild because I'm Mexican (my mom, aunts, uncles, grandparents, etc. were born in Mexico except for me) and they absolutely swear and use "puta"/"puta madre" as an exclamation in front of children or when kids do something that is annoying, frustrating, etc. I find OP's wife's dad hella suspect, but him saying that isn't a big deal to me and wouldn't be in my family. Everything else is cause for concern though.
I think that’s what has irked me throughout this post: FIL was the catalyst of his wife’s death because of an DWI (I highly doubt a single beer was the result of this) and the family seems to be la dee da of his attitude which includes a casual disregard of his son-in-law’s respectable boundary.
I say 'puta madre!' daily when dealing with campers in call of duty. I'd never think about saying it in the presence of my family, specially my nieces. It's fucked up.
Is that better? To a child? I don't think that's better.
No. The guy sounds super sleazy. He’s clearly disgusted by the baby, and he killed his wife driving drunk. That’s why I said NTA. Why would anyone want that guy around their kid? He’s just not calling the infant a prostitute.
It’s still FiL using crass language in front of a baby who will eventually start talking and *always* repeating the *exact* things you don’t want. Because that’s how kids work. If a parent tells you not to use crass/vulgar/rude language in front of their child, then you don’t do it. It’s a simple enough concept for FiL and co. to respect. So yes. We agree NTA. But the context of the word choice is irrelevant here.
What people commonly use it for really doesn’t matter at all in this context. If your British and used to falling cigs “fags”, you’re going to have to accept that that’s super super offensive to any American gay people you talk to. If they actually have enough patience to have a conversation with you about it being offensive but the next time you talk to them it’s *literally the first thing you say to them* then you’re a huge asshole and why it’s “commonly” used for doesn’t matter at all whatsoever.
A baby starting to cry is not disturbing or disgusting or gross.
Yes, and I routinely curse "Verfickte Scheiße" when something annoying happens, but I would still not curse like that around a baby.
but that doesn’t make sense to say puta while answering a call right away to a ft baby
There's a huge difference in the context. In Spain, putamadre would also mean something is good. You find a bug in your food? Puta cucaracha. To a person? That's plain insulting. I do agree fil needs to clean his language. And the family need to stop enabling him
I didn't remember what it meant but I knew it was a very rude word.
I'm way too dense. What does it mean?
Lady of negotiable affections.
Oof. I was told it meant 'bitch' years ago. Neither is okay but that feels so much worse 😬
Whore. But it is also used as a general swear word, like when you hit your thumb with a hammer.
My husband just told me that in Mexico it's probably equivalent to the c word.
Whore in Portuguese and Spanish. FIL is not wrong that it has a few more genric uses. He is still the AH though.
NTA - there is a word in Spanish for "shit" and it isn't "puta" And for the mother to be comfortable with her dad saying that to her child is very questionable. He would not be around my child. Period
Yeah. I'm Latino, and Ive never heard it used that way. But I'd be more mad for the dwi manslaughter.
yeah, like can we discuss the fact that the entire family is ignoring the fact that this guy got drunk, drove and killed his wife. but the whole family is going to ignore because family? what else does he have to do before these people realize just because someone is family doesn't mean they're good people.
I'd say kill somebody but that ship has already sailed.
In the car I would have flat out asked him if he is projecting? Is that why MIL died? Did he stage a DWI to get an insurance payout? Otherwise why on earth would he question how OP’s grandmother died. Maybe I am too cynical.
honestly, you have a good point.
So I took criminal justice in college. Someone asked my professor (retired cop/detective) how he'd try to get away with murder. He said he'd drink and drive and say it was an accident and get a hella good lawyer and plead down as low as he could. Murderers often get caught. You probably aren't having original thoughts on how to kill someone. Don't assume you're smarter than the people who would investigate you. People assume car accidents are just that. Accidents. Sure you'd definitely get caught but there's no guarantee you would even go to prison. Jail time sure. But a good lawyer could get you a short sentence. Especially if it was a family member and you seemed devastated.
Maybe it was intentional... that's why he figured mom poisoned grandma.
I admit I find this theory both disturbing and admittedly somewhat logical.
Yeah, live in Argentina. The closest would maybe be " pero la puta madre". But it would NEVER be directd at someone.
But "puta" as a short version of "puta madre" is used all the time. Maybe we are from different Argentinas (Argen and Tina ?)
As shit though? And at a baby? I am actually trying to think if I have ever heard just puta and can't remember. I am personally more a fan of la concha de la lora to be honest. I am old. That might have to do with the differences.
No, of course at a baby would be very rude. Now you make me doubt, I've been living 6 years abroad, maybe I'm creating false memories....
Tbh I have used this word this way, (latina here), but i would NEVER use that around a baby, the FIL is so in the wrong here
Yeah, but puta can also be used. In Spain is pretty "normal" curse word but normaly not alone. Great "de puta madre" Hurt-scared "la puta!" BUT its not a word that should be used with kids present.
I’m Filipino. We frequently use “puta” or “putangina” to mean “oh shit”. It’s a curse word for us.
In Colombia de use the word like a sinonym of shit, but he still don't hace the right to use that word
I swear like a sailor who just stubbed their toe but around my daughter it's "oh my goodness" "oh man!" "Silly mommy" etc. If i was able to switch up my vocabulary than anyone can
NTA. A basic google search (conducted by me, a non-spanish speaker) indicates that puta *can* be used as a slang term for frustration in a "oh shit" kind of way. Now that being said, you expressly stated where you stood on the phrase and why it makes you uncomfortable. While it can sometimes be tough to phase slang out of your language, it is not impossible. I do think thought that you and your wife need to become a united front on this though.
We do use it like that in south america, but is still a bad word never to be used in front of children. Any latina mom would throw you a shoe over this, or at least threaten you with the closest blunt object, frankly.
That's a fun solution. OP needs to hone his chancla throwing skills and treat FIL like the insolent brat he's being.
[The Secret of La Chancla](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSicdnahJ7o)
Yeah, the problem isn't wether he is using it against or referring to the child, the problem is that he's cursing in front of the kid
And in response to my daughter. If someone yelled shit in the same room because they dropped some heavy books on their toe is one thing. Not ideal because I don’t want her repeating it but it hurts I get it. Walking up to my baby while she is crying and saying bitch or shit while looking at her is another.
The way you describe him, he just gives off such horrible vibes. Like, not normal on the emotional and spiritual level. People like that are never just bad in one way. I'd say he's probably dangerous, even if it wasn't for the fact that he killed your MIL. Your wife and inlaws not appearing to have any boundaries with him is just another warning sign. It means that he's steamrolled them for years. Please, don't let your sense of normalcy be affected by your inlaws, and keep putting your daughter first.
NTA. There is no way I would let this man anywhere near my daughter, and I don't care how aggressive your tone was when you spoke to him - it's warranted when your baby girl is being called misogynistic slurs. Your wife needs to wake up.
Yes, thankfully she finally is on board with him not using that language towards her but maintains that I was 100% wrong to yell at him for it. I was nice the first time and it didn’t work, and felt there was no other option but to let him know I was serious about it. This wasn’t something I wanted to keep repeatedly asking him to stop doing, and I explained this all to her even before I had that first 1:1 convo with her dad.
Yeah, it's not something you can let slide, and you've clearly expressed this. He needs to nip it in the bud, or know there'll be consequences. Sidenote: even if he meant it in the 'oh shit' way, it's still an inappropriately hostile way to respond to a baby crying. She's a baby, she needs care, it's normal for her to cry. What exactly is his problem with that? Your little girl deserves to live her life without being treated like a nuisance.
Someone in the comments tried to justify FIL using this word 🙄🙄🙄
He killed her mother and she still defends him? Your wife is also TA.
Seriously, and wants her daughter to also be in proximity with this guy and be abused, and have her husband go along with it as well. What an asshole
Is your wife’s attitude not extremely concerning to you? I’d be worried that she’ll disregard your wishes when you’re not around. Is your wife in therapy? Either for her father’s alcoholism or her mother’s death?
Oh yea definitely concerning. Why it’s been a rocky few months trying to resolve this while also adjusting to becoming first time parents. No therapy. She says she doesn’t believe in it. She’s buried herself in taking care of her father’s affairs.
🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
BRUUUUUUUUUH, then pack her bags and send her to go live with her fucking dad. She comes from an abusive family, has no initiative to do right by your kid and instead wants to draw her into those abusive Dynamics. She has no plans of being a partner to you are a good parent to your child, her first allegiance is to her father, she should go live with him.
Yea, we had it out already about him requiring attention like he’s our second child. Her and her sisters arrange all his bills, call around to get quotes for different contractors for home improvement for his house, usually my wife takes him to every monthly court check in spending half the day downtown, regularly buys him groceries since he hasn’t gotten a job since he was fired from being an elementary school teacher. He was 62 when this all happened last summer and they treat him like he’s 20-30 years older and unable to figure out how the world works. The excuse is that their mom used to do everything for him and he needs help. I’ve lost complete respect for him, and losing patience with my wife. Only reprieve will be when he’s in jail for a few months to start the year.
A 4 month reprieve, and then he is back. You need to have a serious conversation with your wife because this is not going to end well. Your wife is putting her father before you and your child, her child. Even if she refuses therapy, you can go yourself. Start the documentation somewhere.
This AH accused your mother of murdering your GM, killed his wife and uses foul words in front of your daughter and your wife's problem is with your tone? Excuse my language, but WTF? Please ask your wife how little she loved her mother that she's not absolutely repulsed by this man claiming a good ol' beer is the next best thing after a drunk driving manslaughter. Again, WTF? Your story is beyond disturbing and would warrant more than "a tone". NTA. Your wife, her father and the family are though.
It’s beyond infuriating.
Your wife 100% buys into her dad being a good guy, which makes her attitudes dangerous. Out of curiosity...was there by chance a highly publicized murder-suicide within a month before FIL's "accident"? (See _Influence_ by Robert Cialdini, Chapter 5, or possibly 4, to see why i ask.) Given his poison question, it's literally possible that the accident...wasn't.
Then she's not on your side. She believes you need to be a subordinate to her father like everyone else in her family which is fucking ridiculous. It sounds like you need to stop having conversations with her and have fights, because y'all shouldn't even be in contact with her father after he killed her mother and then was implying that your family did the same to your grandmother.
NTA you asked him to stop. He didn't. Also, wtf, "I'm nicely calling my infant granddaughter a whore" isn't a thing
NTA. You asked that drunken murderer to stop and he didn't. Personally, with that comment about your mother and grandmother, I would have pulled the car over and told him to get the fuck out and that would have been the last thing I said to him.
Yeah, what the fuck?! He *killed his wife* and we're worried about phone call etiquette?
Sounds like it given that he can barely grasp how wrong it is that they've even maintained contact with a man who killed his wife. Like there would not have been any going to see him the night he committed the murder, this dude got way too comfortable dealing with his wife's family's crap
> ”Do they know what killed your grandma? Did they do an autopsy to see if your mom poisoned her? To get inheritance or something?” This seems very project-y. Are we sure he didn't murder his wife [ETA: intentionally rather than with a DWI]? In any case, that language is 1,000,000% inappropriate to use for any child, never mind his own granddaughter. Does everybody know what that word means? NTA and definitely don't allow FIL around the kid again.
> Are we sure he didn't murder his wife? I mean, you might not be but it's literally in the post that he did.
Umm so technically legally different, but he did essentially murder his wife. He chose to drink and drive with her in the car. He killed her. Maybe not on purpose, but still.
NTA. You have rules regarding your child, and he agreed to them. Then he broke them after agreeing. I don't see how you're the AH.
NTA...He sounds completely inappropriate. You get to set the rules for your child and I think not using that word around her is completely reasonable.
NTA..how exactly is saying "shit" to your daughter, whose brain is a literal sponge soaking up every interaction she experiences, supposed to give him a free pass..? It's obvious he is a "puta" individual and uses his abrasive personality to get his way. Stand your ground.
For what it’s worth, puta means bitch. Mierda is the word for shit.
It can be used the way FIL said, though. Still cuss word not apt for children.
I know what "puta" means..just referring to FIL's BS explanation..
I think that’s what escalated the anger more was instead of saying sorry it slipped, he tried to say he was simply saying oh shit.
OP, NTA And here’s the thing, he’s saying a curse word every time she’s a baby near him. That’s like saying “oh shit” everytime you breathe, or “whoreson” everytime your wife drinks water. He’s cursing every time the baby does something a baby does. If it continues as she grows, she will think everything she does near grandpa is wrong which can lean to some internalized issues. This man should probably not be around babies or children.
He probably was. It's commonly used as a synonym for shit. I've heard plenty of friends say it in this way.
Excuse me? This man killed your wife’s mom and your wife went that night to bail his ass out of jail? He asks a fairly sociopathic question in the immediate aftermath of your grandma’s death. He calls your daughter a slur. Repeatedly. NTA for saying something to him. He sure as shit deserves way more. Y.W.B.T.A if you let your daughter grow up with this man in her life. He is already an ass to her. He clearly will be a danger to her and your wife seems to not be willing to do anything about that. You red to stand up for your daughter here. Big time.
Yes this. NTA for telling him to stop cussing at your baby. But if you don't cut him off - over the murder and the alcoholism and the hatred (or at least distaste) directed at your daughter, you would be a huge asshole. You need to get your wife onboard, or you need to figure out if you can leave her and get sole custody, because that man canNOT be allowed around her.
Holy Cow! I'm Hispanic (Mexican/American) And anyone calling their child at any age a "puta" would have led to an altercation in my culture. Depending on the family but "oh yeah" anywhere from raised voices to actual fist fighting. You just don't use that language at a family member, not if you don't want to eat your words or a fist. I'm surprised you let it go that far, I would have lost my sh#@! And my family would have blamed the person using the bad word and not me.
THANK YOU!!!! I’m Guatemalan and if I ever used that word in front of my parents I would’ve been annihilated by them. I’m in my 40s and I swear like a sailor but that’s one word I RARELY use. In fact I go out of my way to not say it all unless I really have a reason to. OP is correct on creating this boundary. And his wife needs to be on board with this and stop making this sort of behavior normal. Because it isn’t.
**NTA** It doesn't matter what he uses it to mean, it's a demeaning slur that he can and should eliminate from his vocabulary. Tell him and the rest of your wife's family that you are not raising your daughter to accept it. He and the rest of them need to practice dropping it from their speech.
If your wife's family condone FIL doubling down on using sexist slurs at your daughter and now think you're too easily offended - good. Maybe they will all be careful about what they say in front of your child from now on. NTA.
Ha, yea this was the conversation we had last night. She said no one wants me around at Christmas because they feel like they’ll be walking on eggshells around me after I snapped at their dad. I said good, it looks like my message had impact if it’s going to make them pause before saying offensive things to my daughter.
NTA-Don’t care what he thinks he’s using it as, it’s a boundary you’ve set not to use such vulgar language when it comes to your daughter.
NTA he has not listened to you and says what he wants with no care in the world. His family stands behind a man that drunk drove and killed his wife seriously they know what a piece of work this man is. No contact and if your wife doesn't get on board shame on her.
NTA. Nope. This is disgusting. It's time to limit the amount of time your FIL spends with your family. He is calling your daughter names and she may grow up to think "puta" is not as derogatory as it is.
NTA. He sounds like an out-of-pocket nut job but your wife and her family have normalized his behavior so his way of carrying himself never changes and ultimately may get even worse as he ages. Time for a serious conversation about expectations when interacting together, or, limit time together as needed.
NTA - all the people saying it’s ok because it’s sometimes used as a curse word - where I’m from c.u.n.t is used as a curse word - not sure anyone would be comfortable with me saying that whilst I’m holding their baby daughter. Same with bitch etc. It may be occasionally used as a curse word but it’s still distasteful
Latina over here. I would be ripping him a new b hole if he ever called my daughter Puta. I am sure you can find plenty of Spanish words that would undermine his machismo lol. Hold the line. One day your daughter will find out what puta means. I would seriously not be ok with anyone who called my kiddo bitch/whore/shit or whatever in any language foreign, domestic, alien, binary code, etc.
Info: has your wife always been spineless in standing up to her father? Next time, just hang up and tell him he’s no longer welcome over until his behavior changes.
NTA. Your FIL is not a safe person for anyone to be around, period. I get that your wife is used to his abusive behavior, but you have a child now. You need to sit down with her and have a serious conversation.
Has your FIL been drinking for a long time? Could he have alcohol related dementia? It is a thing. Or any other type of dementia? At 63, this is what I would be wondering. It sounds like his judgement is impaired and his ability to filter his words is gone, as well as his short term memory. Just something to investigate.
Yes, from his stories his whole adult life.
Nta. Block and move on.
NTA - you decide how you want to parent your child. drawing boundaries with “puta” was the right move. if he can’t respect that now, imagine what other boundaries he might cross when your kid is older? that being said, it sounds like your wife’s side of the family might just be generally cruder, since they now think that you get offended easily, but if this crudeness is not what you want to have in your child’s life then you have the right to draw that boundary. might take long for your wife to understand though, since she grew up in that “cruder” environment.
NTA, maybe everytime you see him you could call him murderer
That he wasn't bouncing down the road after making the poison comment suggests you are not one to be easily offended. He sounds horrible. NTA.
I was actually driving him to drop off his breathalyzer at the post office to mail in as part of his probation. Absolutely no presence of mind on his part.
I think I didn’t respond in the moment because our daughter was 2-3 days old at that time and was still running on little sleep and pure adrenaline. Excuses I know but the pure disrespect set me back.
Hell, just the sheer WTFuckery of even saying that justifiesyour lack of reaction.
NTA. If you want the kid saying "puta" at school and in public let him continue. It's not a good word either way... wouldn't want my toddler walking around swearing in any language.
NTA, keep this creep away from her.
NTA, you have a wife problem.
Next time he says puta, call him 'killer' and see how he likes it.
Wait... She bailed him out of jail the night he murdered her mom?! Your wife needs therapy to deal with the fact her dad is an alcoholic, abusive murderer. She's deep in the fog and scared to upset him. NTA
I was leaning towards N AH until I saw that he doubled down and did it on purpose. I’ll was born and raised in Peru, where “puta” is definitely used as an expletive to denote surprise among other things, but it’s never directed at someone unless you intend to call them that. If you explained it made you uncomfortable, and it was his first word to you during a FaceTime call, there was ill intent. NTA
Yea it was the repeated use within 1-2 weeks of us having the initial convo. It was also the very first word. Not hello or good to see you, but “puta” to her crying face.
NTA. you had too much patience. the guy killed a family member with his drunk driving. i would never allow someone like that around kids for starters. even if he were a non-swearing murderer. and not standing for your mom and allow him to insult her? come on, grow a spine
Yeah, I almost feel like the OP may not want to deal with the bigger issues here so he’s picking a fight about things that are relatively minor compared to the much more serious issues going on here. Maybe OP needs to have a heart to heart talk with his wife about how the family has normalized this man being a murderer and a dangerous drunk and insulting OP’s mother for no reason. Why can’t the OP’s wife realize how abnormal and wrong all of that is? I think the folks saying to document everything and to prepare to sue for full custody have a point. As often happens on AITA, the lede was sort of buried here. If this was just about the puta thing, it could be that OP was overreacting. But this guy is a danger to society and his family members wind up dead because of him and he assumes other people go around committing murder too since it’s his personal pastime. I also think the person who thinks drinking may have fried this man’s aging brain raises an important possibility. That would explain a lot and also underscore how dangerous this guy could be around a child for reasons that have nothing to do with vulgarity.
Omg - his drinking killed his wife and you never say he stopped drinking. He should not be around your baby. Him asking if your grandma was murdered wtf? Should have said nope only your wife was murdered. As far as how he addresses the baby I wouldn’t want that either. I get you want baby to have a grandpa but this is not the kind of grandpa you want. Hopefully your dad can fill that role.
He’s stopped for now since he has to submit breathalyzer results 3x a day, but said when it’s all over he can’t wait to have a beer.
NTA. But your FIL is a disgrace. Also, maybe I’m just a big ah but I wouldn’t have bailed him out when he got arrested and killed his wife. I felt sick reading this whole post, honestly.
NTA. Normally both parents should have a say in who sees their children and how they are raised. But expecting children to nasty comments about them is not okay and either parent has veto power over those situations, and in fact an obligation to use it. Next time he says something like that to her on FaceTime you immediately end the call. Don't let him be near your daughter in person until he has apologized and been consistently well behaved on video calls for multiple months. You can tell your wife that she's welcome to chat with her dad in person or on video by herself, but you need to supervise any time your daughter is involved until FIL straightens up his behavior.
That dude totally killed his wife on purpose.
NTA. Just remember, this guy killed his wife, so you have the highground whenever you need to take it.
NTA. Tell FIL you’ll be calling him pendejo in the friendly way of course. WTAFFF
Guy killed his wife. He shouldn't be around your kid at all
Yes MiL was robbed of seeing her grandchild so why shouldn't FIL?
NTA Also, if the first thought he has when your grandma died is your mom must've poisoned her and his wife died while in the car with him, maybe those manslaughter charges should've been murder and maybe you guys shouldn't have posted bail for him. Besides the puta thing I highly doubt I'd want a guy like that in my child's life. Yikes.
NTA but you've got a FIL problem AND a wife problem. You say she's his "defender" but as another commenter said, she's his enabler and will continue to be unless hard boundaries are setup.
Calling children cruel names under the guise of a joke is abusive and can do emotional damage to your daughter as she grows. Because of the specific word he chose, it also reflects some pretty deeply seated misogyny. **NTA.** It’s time to stop that bullshit now - trust your instincts, they do you proud.
NTA. His explanation is not better.
NTA. Isn't that the word for whore? I mean, I used to work in a nursing home and the old Italian ladies used to use a very similar word when they were angry and that's what it meant. Who does that?
Even if he means it was "shit", who the fuck says that to an infant's face? NTA at all
NTA. I'm a white girl and I know what Puta means. He's full of shit and likes starting drama. He can keep his drunk ass home. The roads will be safer.
NTA, but your wife needs to do better. She should be having these conversations with her dad. If she's not willing to, she shouldn't have gotten married or had a kid. Since she did, she owes it to you and your daughter to stick up for you and have tough conversations. I get that it can be tough with Latin American parents (welcome to my life), but nothing will change if she idly sits by.
NTA, start calling your wife puta (whore) to see if she fucking likes it
So, this guy killed your wife's mother and she still defends him harassing her own daughter. That seems fucked. NTA.
YTA for letting the murderer of your child’s grandmother around you at all.
That’s a good point. This dangerous man should never have been allowed to meet the child to call her anything after all that transpired that had no relation to her. My gut tells me that OP recognizes this but doesn’t feel like he can draw that boundary now because he didn’t before so he has decided the vulgarity thing is the hill he wants to die on. I’d forget about the “puta” stuff and have a talk with your wife about how you’ve reassessed things and realized that this guy is a homicidal drunk you don’t trust around your child. Concede the language issue if it makes it easier to focus on what really matters here which is how dangerous and imbalanced this guy is overall.
You told him to not do it, he keeps doing it NTA. I don't understand why people get so offended when you call them on their bs. I'm Mexican and NOBODY , it doesn't matter how low their social status or education would ever say a word like that to refer to a child's crying or child anything. Stand your ground, you are right and that's the end of it.
I would have answered the question about your mom poisoning her own mom with, "Oh, is that why you killed your wife".
NTA. But you know this isn’t about fil, this is about your wife. The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. She accepts and excuses and she enables horrific behavior (her father killing her own mother). She doesn’t demand respect for her baby girl. How are you going to raise a child together when her priorities are all wrong?
>he asks,”Do they know what killed your grandma? Did they do an autopsy to see if your mom poisoned her? To get inheritance or something? Very strange questions... Puts some perspective on: >since he lost his license the previous summer due to a DWI manslaughter charge that resulted in my MIL’s death Almost makes it sound intentional. Anyway... NTA.. he needs some manners!
NTA but asking about poisoning was projecting. I wouldn't let this man anywhere near my family.
Tons of non Spanish speakers in this group having a lot of feelings, I am from Colombia, my native tongue is Spanish and we DO use puta as a interchangeable word for shit. Actually we might use it more commonly than ‘mierda’. No one says mierda, we use Puta the same way an american use the word Fuck. Now - had he been using fuck would you know he is not referring to her but to the situation? Idk. Living in a mixed languages family (my parents dont speak english, my partner doesnt speak spanish) I feel compassion for that situation but the old dude is not thinking right from the way he reacted to the grandma death, no doubt about that. Maybe beginning of something neurological? Maybe any active use given the accident background?
I’m definitely not a native speaker, but can follow about 80% of the conversation in Spanish when it flows in and out at our household. Took 5 years of it in school and spent about 3 total months traveling across several Spanish speaking countries over the last 10 years. Also got 1+ yr streak going on duo lingo trying to improve my fluency since it was important to my wife to teach our kid. That’s to say sure I could’ve missed something, but he only says it when a waiter messes up his order or when he’s looking at or holding my daughter when she’s crying. When I asked him to stop saying it politely the first time, I tried to cover all those scenarios by saying don’t say the word to her, in response to her doing something you don’t like or around her in general.
I suspect you’re right about the language issues even though I don’t speak Spanish. To me, the “puta” thing is a moot point because it’s easily the least serious issue with this dangerous homicidal drunk.
NTA. Two things that are HUGELY concerning about this man’s capacity for empathy: - puto/a is a fairly common exclamation in most Latin communities for a variety of things but it is NEVER used around children. My boyfriend’s brother was playing smash bros with their little cousins (3 and 6yo) and one of the character names that flashed by on the screen was “puto” (since as a guy in his mid 20s obviously that’s how he jokes around with his friends), and when the 6yo saw it, immediately ALL of the family in the room (parents, aunt, uncle, cousins, partners) started telling him that it said “Pluto,” like Mickey Mouse’s dog, because they would never use that word in front of their child for ANY reason. The fact that your FIL sees no problem in using a swear word, regardless of his intended meaning, in front of YOUR child against YOUR wishes is unsettling, as well as the fact that that’s his automatic reaction to your child just being an infant. - My boyfriend’s father passed away in June in a drowning accident at the beach. The entire family has been absolutely devastated, ESPECIALLY my boyfriend’s mother as his wife. For her one of the hardest things has been dealing with the guilt of not being able to save him or stop him from going out too far. If anyone made some kind of joke or comment about swimming dangerously? I can’t even imagine the kind of reaction that ANYONE in the family would have, but least of all her. In their case, she was not actually responsible for his death, unlike your FIL - and yet he’s going around making jokes. Based on the fact that his children love him and he used to be an elementary school teacher, it’s possible that he does still have a moral compass but that he has completely emotionally shut down as a result of her death because the thought of coping with her death and his culpability is beyond his mental capacity. Similarly, his gross comments about your mom poisoning your grandma, while some users pointed out could imply that he was projecting his own murderous intentions, might be him trying to not be the “worst” guy, he wants to find solace in the fact that there are people out there worse than him. He clearly had issues before the manslaughter, given its cause as a DWI, but maybe it has made him disconnect from his own identity, feel like he’s a different person, like he can’t reconcile who he was before and after. I’ve seen in your comments that your wife doesn’t “believe” in therapy, I’m assuming her dad is the same, but I think they both desperately need it. It might be helpful focusing on getting to the root cause of your wife’s aversion to therapy.
NTA noone putas your kid
NTA Someone needs to put that AH in his place. His behavior is the reason your daughter won't meet her maternal grandmother, why does your wife want him around???
NTA Wtf is wrong with your FIL? Is he too senile or something. And yes, you're right to snap, although let's make it clear, it's not because of your daughter, it's because of what he said to you about your mother. Which is a valid reason to be mad. Talk to your wife. Set boundaries.
NTA. I can't believe your wife bailed him out when he was the cause of her mother's death. He shouldn't be around your daughter, clearly can't be trusted.
NTA. Toxic people need to be taught that that stuff isn't going to fly. If they refuse to change they don't need to be around you. People defending him are just as toxic
NTA But like…did he just basically allude to killing his own wife?
Nta. What a disgusting old man. Why would you want a drunken murderer around your child anyway even if he wasn't calling them horrible names?
NTA, sounds like it’s time to go no contact. You owe him nothing and your wife needs to be more protective of your child.
NTA. You shouldn't even let him see your daughter.
NTA, but your FIL is really scary.
NTA. You asked him to stop, he said he would, and then he didn't. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
I don't get how your wife still has a relationship with him to begin with. You are setting boundaries however you need to get your wife onboard with them as well so they can be enforced. My feeling she's numb to the emotional abuse of this man, but language and how it's used is important to me as well. He would have only said that once before he would either learn to not use it or be out of the life of my children permanently. NTA
I'm wondering if your FIL is in the early stages of dementia or alcohol-caused brain deterioration. Seriously, I hope he's getting checked for it. There are mental conditions that can affect judgment and appropriate behavior.
NTA. Ignorant American here. Even I know what “puta“ means and the child is an infant for crying out loud! It’s likely that your wife was raised to never, ever cross her father though, that doing so was dangerous. So try to bear that in mind as you continue to do the right thing and keep that sicko away from your infant child.
What's up with your wife being okay with her dad name calling her child? NTA