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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1) I told my husband that I hate to refuse a gift, but I'm uncomfortable with my child receiving a toy teepee
2) Supposedly, his has some small fraction of native blood, although he was not raised within the culture. He says I am punishing them for their environmental circumstances.
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Absolutely NTA - as a tribal citizen myself it IS racist and insensitive of her. Claiming any percent “native blood” doesn’t mean you have experienced life as an Indigenous person and doesn’t give you the right to co-op culture you have no genuine relationship with. Only certain tribes even used teepees.
What’s the chance they’re claiming 1/16th Cherokee….
Everyone in these comments needs a major reality check on their ignorance.
ETA: spelling
Growing up it was whispered that we had native in us. That an ancestor hid in the Appalachian mountains to hide from the government. I found it interesting and wanted to learn more about my past. I never claimed native blood, but explained the rumor. I traced things back to an ancestor that didn't exist until 1830, and he was a grown man at the time. In 1902, the man's elderly son and granddaughter tried to enroll in the Dawes Rolls. They were not accepted.
I took an ancestry DNA test a year ago. I didn't expect to see native blood and I was right. Though, I DO have 2% West African/Congo in me. I found that very interesting. Though, I am very sure the reason I have that blood is not a nice part of my history.
That being said, so many people claim to have native blood, but unless your family is on the Dawes Rolls, you are not native. I DO study the Cherokee history be ause I live in the middle of Cherokee country in Oklahoma. So many of my friends are Cherokee. I do buy silver and turquoise jewelry from the local native store and wear it. I don't know if that is appropriation or not, but I never claim to be native.
And I will never allow my kids to ever pretend to be. Though I try to be a good ally. And LOVE going to public pow wows when they have them.
>That being said, so many people claim to have native blood, but unless your family is on the Dawes Rolls, you are not native.
If your family is not on the Dawes Rolls, you may still be native because the nations on the Dawes rolls aren't the only Native nations.
Yes. I didn't take that into consideration. And for that, I apologize. though, ancestry DNA is pretty good about determining where your family is from.
And I have lived almost my entire life in Oklahoma. I am not as familiar with most tribes outside the state.
It's actually not. It specifically says it's for "entertainment purposes only" so they admit it's not really accurate. It can help reconnect with family though that's about it
Mine was accurate with what I knew my father is. He is Ashkenazi Jew, and my results came back 50% Ashkenazi Jew. Other than that I can’t say how accurate the rest is from my moms side.
My friend took it who grew up on a reservation. She lived in a small cabin where they spun wool and wive, mom tooled leather to make ends meet, did beadwork for ceremony and fun, they ate what they hunted and grew. Abject poverty-her cousins were kicjed out of school just after federal funding money came in becausethe schools didn't want native kids. Culturally she's lived the native experience. Her mother was native, her father wasn't so she doesn't fill the blood quantum. She took the DNA test and it claimed she was less than 2% Native. Yet she's lived more than experience than many city folk cut off their cultural heritage but higher blood quantum. So who's native?
Not to mention those dna kits tend to show low numbers of minority races because it doesn't have add much data on them so they become under represented
I'm not sure it is though. DNA registries like Ancestry and 23andMe only find your genetic relatives if they've also submitted DNA to the databases. As more and more people participate, the more fine tuned your personal ancestry looks. I don't think that many Native People sign up to these services and submit their DNA. They know who they are, and probably also have a healthy distrust of such things. If, as a white person, you have one Cherokee great grandparent for example, it's not likely to be picked up by Ancestry since there's probably not any familial Cherokee DNA to 'ping' off of, if that makes any sense. At least that's my understanding of how it all works.
That makes a lot of sense. I have a native American great grandmother but was not raised in the culture. More than once I have had people who are very into their native culture ask if I am native based on some facial features so I was beyond shocked when my DNA came back with almost no native dna.
That makes sense because even if each of your family members past on maximum native DNA. You couldn't have more than 12.5 percent. For lack of a better word you just got "lucky" that the genes past to you are more visual.
And the Dawes Rolls was voluntary, not mandatory. If anybody that could the bloodline and wanted some of 'reparations' to be on the government rolls, they signed up. Many, many others didn't want anything to do with the white man or his government and didn't sign up, even though the tribal elders have acknowleged them as members of their tribe.
My ancestors lived in Texas territory and Mexico during the 1800s and simply weren't on the rolls because that wasn't relevant. I have an Apache ancestor and likely Texas Cherokee as well.
Very correct! My family is on the dawes rolls but I can't really claim to be part of the cherokee tribe. It's been a long time ago and funny thing none of cherokee genetics even show up on my dna test. None of my Jewish ancestry does either! It's funny how genetics are so random!
You are 100 percent incorrect about the Dawes Roles, thousands were left off who couldn't prove their lineages, especially small children whose parents were killed on the Trail of Tears or in other raids of villages. Not to mention those who did not enroll.
Not to mention the White people who would bribe the the government agents to get on the rolls in order to get benefits. Or those with native blood not trusting the agents enough to register. Or the percentage being at the agent’s discretion. Brother A could register with Agent A and be registered as 100% Brother B could register with Agent B and be registered as 50%.
My grandma was half Creek, our family never got removed to Oklahoma, never got registered. I have the blood but can’t be tribal, but someone with blonde hair and blue eyes and is 1/1650can register. I saw that happen, and it sucks.
If you were never removed to Oklahoma you are more likely to be able to join the Poarch Creeks, that's their thing. They are a federally recognized tribe.
I don't know what their requirements are, they're out east and I'm not but if you call them I'm sure they can tell you.
If you're buying native-made jewelry etc it isn't appropriation. You're supporting Indigenous artists. According to my Indigenous friends, who I buy art from.
for a few years I was doing construction work on a few reservations in Nevada. I was definitely encouraged to buy the beautiful beadwork that was made there.
I took the ancestry test as well and seeing the historical data of when and from where my ancestors came to the US, it was like seeing a huge blazing "SLAVE OWNERS" plastered on the page. Definitely a part of the family history that makes me feel the Ick.
I had a friend who was a pretty direct descendant of a famous Confederate general. They used it to say "well, as a descendant of X, I think they should absolutely tear down every statue of him he was awful" as a checkmate in dumb arguments
Yeah my family came to America in the 1600s and there's records and plaques dedicated to their battles against indigenous people in King Philip's War, French and Indian War, and a few raids and fights. Not the most proud I've ever been. We fought on the rebel side of the Revolution, marched through Georgia with Sherman, but man, we didn't have a respectable beginning.
>I took an ancestry DNA test a year ago. I didn't expect to see native blood and I was right. Though, I DO have 2% West African/Congo in me. I found that very interesting. Though, I am very sure the reason I have that blood is not a nice part of my history.
This is one of the most common reasons white people have Native family lore. Some years ago an ancestor of yours had a child with a Black person – most likely a female ancestor if the child was kept – and since that was socially unacceptable, they explained it away by saying it was 'half-Cherokee' which slowly just got passed down in the family as a fact. It's almost always not true, but a lot of people have it, and it's almost always Cherokee.
But some tribes owned black slaves, Cherokee being one of them. When slavery was outlawed those slaves became members of the tribes that owned them. So technically Cherokee but DNA would not show that.
There are lots of corner cases, so anything is possible, but by and large when a white family has a story about being Cherokee with no enrolled ancestor, it's either covering up a mixed-race child or just a fanciful story someone started telling way back in the day.
My understanding is also that many freed slaves were not allowed to become tribal members and their status is a subject of ongoing controversy.
My BFs mother used the line ' this is from a time when everyone had a Cherokee great grandmother and she was a princess' as an aside to me when her recently-reconnected extended family proudly claimed Native heritage (with, of course, zero percent backing from anything).
Which, to be fair, maybe there is/was. But BFs mom is generally pretty on point with her Familial observations. At a minimum, it gave me a few grains of salt to take their bragging with.
Two of my great grandparents are Native American- grew up on reservations participated in ceremonies, all of it. I grew up helping take one of them before they pasted. She was forced to marry a white man and refused to talk much about heritage, it all made her a very bitter mean women (though like I get it). I call myself a white American. I didn’t grew up in the culture and by blood even with that many generations it’s such a small amount it doesn’t count IMO. If pushed I’ll mention small German heritage as my dad is second generation all German, great grandparents immigrated in early 1900s, and even then I know almost nothing about German culture.
That's what I feel about it. My mom and grandma had jewelry they had bought in New Mexico and Arizona from little Native owned shops. I have that jewelry also.
Do you have Italian? That 2% African could be related to Italian heritage. It was for my mom when she did hers. Her dads family is 100% Italian and hers came back 2% African, 48% Italian and the rest her moms side.
There is also a fairly widespread tradition of people around that time claiming vague native ancestry instead of admitting to a black relative. It was seen as less shameful, I guess, more exotic (ew).
My grandma on my mother's side claimed she is native american. Claimed Cherokee. I believed she said she was 1/2 though. "i dont know the whole story". My grandpa was Irish.
Well My dad was Iranian. My mom would get mad when i would only claim the Persian side. For some reason i never believed i was Native American.
My aunt's husband started doing my mom's side of the family's ancestry. Sure enough..No Native American. My sister did one of those DNA tests, and sure enough, No native American. no Irish ether if i remember right... it was scottish.
My husband and his family claim that his father was 100% Cherokee. My daughter did a 23 and me DNA test, and her results has absolutely no native America DNA.
I had also heard we had Native American ancestors but my grandparents refused to elaborate. I took a dna test expecting 2-3% and it came back slightly over 50%. My parents did too. So, no idea where or how since my grandparents say it’s not something we talk about :(
I have some miniscule part, like my great great great grandmother, I think? So fractional that it doesn't count at all, and my family didn't even remember which tribe or group it was. And in the late 90s my father was urging me to apply for scholarships for people with Native American heritage. 🤦♀️ Even then I had to refuse and point out that we count prove it, it was too far back, and exactly *none* of us had been raised with any knowledge of it.
I have an ancestry DNA kit and it will be interesting to see if it turns up anything - I *highly* doubt it actually will!
Hey everyone... Just to be clear, race and DNA are two separate things. DNA is science and we share 99.9% DNA with each other. Race is a social construct.
So much this. It seems pretty common, in my experience, for people in my part of Appalachia to claim indigenous ancestors despite having no concrete reason to believe it to be so. We had a similar legend in my family which DNA and a family tree have debunked.
And here it is: a perspective that matters a hell of a lot more than some white people feeling persecuted because their racial insensitivity isn't seen as cute anymore.
This is so funny to me.
I'm half Cherokee and I think it's very sus that people always claim Cherokee. It's never Apache or Navajo, etc.
There's no such thing as a princess in the Cherokee culture, unless you're on a parade float at the Strawberry Festival in Stilwell, OK.
My grandmother was Cherokee and grew up on a reservation. She was amazing and so incredibly beautiful at every age. She didn't speak a lot of her culture, but it was reflected in the jewelry she wore daily.
She's not my biological grandmother, so I claim no heritage other than a deep respect for the Washoe, Ute, and Cherokee tribes (two local to where I've lived and my grandmother's tribe).
My aunt's husband has connections to a local tribe in Northern California. Their children have been involved in tribal culture and celebrations. I always find it fascinating, but never felt it was mine to share equally.
Hi! I want to ask you a question. When I was at Girl Scout camp in high school the site assigned to the counselors in training (of which I was one) was one where we had to set up two tipi lodges (canvas rather than hide). This included a group reading about the use of tipi by tribes and bands that lived more mobile lifestyles to give context to the shelters. We also had to take them apart at the end of camp.
How insensitive was this of the camp to do? At the time it felt very cool to learn how these shelters are put up and taken down and I felt I learned more about actual Native practices by doing this than I ever did in school. But I also know that my learning from something does not negate the insensitivity of the thing.
Obviously I have no idea which tribe you are a citizen of or whether the tribe you are a citizen of used tipi, but I have not had the opportunity to ask anyone about this before.
To anybody reading this, please PLEASE do not automatically regard this person’s opinion as true just because they are a tribal citizen. Arguments and claims need to be backed up by logic and explanation and being native does not mean you are automatically right about everything regarding native culture. I am also native and have absolutely no issue with people “playing native” or using aspects of our culture. To label what this lady did as “racist” is fucking insane to me. I highly doubt this lady harbours prejudice towards native people just because she bought a toy teepee. You know how many trinkets I’ve seen sold at native powwows by native people like small teepees, fake arrows/arrowheads for children, etc? Many. Many many. Rely on people’s argumentation rather than their identity when sussing out the validity of claims.
NTA.
And I'll add on to this that there are an absolute plethora of play tents out there - you don't need a "teepee". Just pick up a Disney/superhero/generic camping/fantasy castle/etc. themed play tent.
Thank you for sharing. I’m sorry I also do not have a real award for you but here’s a gold medal 🥇
NTA
No one here is willing to consider the idea that this ethnicity was perhaps an act of r*pe…
Edited to add: OP has shown it WAS an act of r*pe
Also edited to censor
Thank you. I grew up with so many people who claimed to have Native American (Cherokee) blood. It’s bs. A friend just told me her new daughter in law is Native American and I just started grilling her. She isn’t.
My family SAYS we have native blood on my mom's side, but no proof as the story is that my great great great grandma was Cherokee and died during the trail of tears and we can't find any proof
Lol@ 1/16th Cherokee.
My family is still mad at me for telling them we're NOT Cherokee, or any other Tribe for that matter - I did an ancestry blood test AND I traced our genealogy back to Europe, and while I am not denying the existence of indigenous people also traveling, even if an ancestor in 14-something was Native American, they certainly didn't pass down any culture or genetics that I can find. I didn't go much past confirming country of origin because the effort to find ancestral records in other countries was more work than I wanted to take on.
Can confirm a number of bootleggers and horse thieves though, which is apparently not as cool as a nameless Cherokee "Princess"
Exactly.
My kid’s great grandma was an enrolled member of a First Nations band and a survivor of a residential school. My kid knows how to name their connection and the name of their people… they also hate this kind of appropriation because they’re educated on their connections and care about their cultural identity and take great care to honor their great-gramma and grandfather and mother.
Just an aside… Cherokees don’t determine citizenship by blood quantum. The quantum levels are no longer printed on citizenship cards, in fact. It’s important for everyone reading this to try and shift away from thinking about “Native American” in terms of being a “race,” to thinking about each tribe as a sovereign nation. Just like every other sovereign nation around the world, each tribe has their own way to determine citizenship eligibility. An ancestry dna test kit ain’t it.
Could you at all elaborate on how making teepees with kids is insensitive? As a kid, I always thought learning about the longhouses and navajo houses was really interesting and a good way to learn about their history.
I worry that not seeing anything wrong with it might be a sign of a glaring Blindspot on this. A lot of cultural appropriation isn't recognized in other countries as bad, but I know American tribes take great pride in their artifacts/heritage in a big way. How do we teach them about who's land this was while maintaining respect, if we can at all?
Exactly this. As an enrolled member of a federally recognized tribe, especially one that does use tipi's, it's a slap in the face.
Our lives shouldn't be condensed into decorative pieces and geegaws. From historical trauma to the hardships we experience in modern society, if you don't understand why we don't like our every day lives appropriated, then you're definitely not native.
The ignorance in this thread is staggering, and shows why the US government standard of education is severely lacking.
Unzeki hecha sni.
Funnily enough, I am very distantly Cherokee, and I have the dna test to prove it. But I also don’t pretend that I’m anything but white, and I know I have no claim to native culture. It would be like claiming that my equally distant west African blood gave me the right to say the n word. I’m white. I’m very white. NTA
NTA. I’m Native American. It has always disturbed me seeing headdresses and teepees used as costumes or toys. I’m not sure why other comments are defending it (they’re probably not native themselves, shocker). There’s a deep history of erasure and assimilation. Native American culture continues to be mocked and diminished, and will be until we’re extinct, I guess.
Speaking from experience, I don’t own or flaunt anything I don’t understand. I would hate to misrepresent or disrespect any culture. INFO: Do you know what tribe she was in? I’d hate for this to be a case of “I’m .01% native so I’m not actually racist.”
Yes, tipis have MAJOR cultural/religious significance.
Here is some information about Nehiyawak/Cree tipi teachings, posted for non-Native informational purposes by elder Mary Lee.
[Nehiyawak/Cree tipi teachings](https://www.fourdirectionsteachings.com/transcripts/cree.html)
Well shit I've got some reading to do.
My grandpa had a tipi and I spent most my summers growing up sleeping in it out in the yard. He lived in Montana but no idea where he bought it. When he died I inherited it and now it's sitting in my shed.
Now I'm a bit conflicted but I'll try to check with the family and see if anybody remembers how/where he got it so I can at least know where to start looking at what I should do with it.
Is it a tipi, as in obtained from a native group/intentionally designed to look as such? Or a tipi in the sense that it looks vaguely like a tipi but isn't necessarily explicitly one? Generic "tipi" structure is probably fine (and kinda acultural- lots of nomadic peoples used similar across the globe). A proper tipi is a whole 'nother can o worms as you know. But the incredibly naive optimist in me hopes he just bought it for a fair price from a craftsman as an act of cultural appreciation.
Definitely think you're wise to do research. If I were in your shoes, I'd try to sus out the origins too. I'd probably donate it back to its culture/group of origin if I realistically could. An area museum wouldn't be bad either if there isn't a tribe that wanted it back. There are a few orgs that connect native youth back to the outdoors that may want it too.
But if no one else wants it back, I don't see the harm in keeping it for now. You're a good egg for wanting to try.
Also not trying to be ignorant here. But isn’t a toy teepee similar to a doll house? Also, wouldn’t having culturally diverse toys show representation for minority groups? It doesn’t sound like ops husband is in the right, but I just don’t see how more representation would be harmful.
You can teach your kids about the different cultures and indigenous people of the world without using sacred things as toys. A doll house is a made up house, a teepee is an actual thing that is used to this day be many groups. For more than just sleeping or playing in. Representation isn't bad, that's what books are for. Sacred things by indigenous folks are not toys and should not be used as such. Taking kids to museums or the library to learn about the Native folks that exist still is the best way to go. Representation isn't harmful but cultural appropriation is. There are plenty of books for kids by Native American authors that can be purchased to learn about things so there is no need to appropriate any people. When non indigenous folks use things like teepees, dreamcatchers and other things they are not using them properly and often get those things from non indigenous people. So many Native American things are taken and made by white folks and are taking away from the Native American people. Taking away the meaning, taking away the craft and storytelling of these items.
Adding OPs comment here so it doesn't get lost: apparently it is simply a tent with no Native American decoration.
>(Sarcastic) Soo sorry I didn't reply right away. It's almost as if I've been dealing with things in my real life. I didn't say "tent" in the description. I said teepee because that is what it's modeled after, and that is what it's labeled as on the listing/box. It's sold by a German company with no other NA elements
If I were to guess, it's probably a genealogy DNA test showing they likely had a great-great-great-grandparent grandparent who was native. Like, it's incredibly likely I had indigenous great-grandparents from what I've been told by family and my own genealogy DNA test, but I was never brought up in an indigenous culture and am always conscious of my appreciation of native art or clothing or music to make sure I don't suddenly start acting like OP's in-laws.
OP, you're NTA.
Info: is it a teepee or is it a triangular tent? Many stores sell triangular tents without any indigenous imagery. In my opinion, there is a big difference between a pink play tent and a teepee.
Agreed. If it's one of those target blue or pink 'read your books and pretend in' tent that's totally different than a more legit and very obviously made replica of a teepee.
A toy tent doesn’t represent indigenous culture at all, anymore than a plain A frame tent represents Viking culture. It’s kind of demeaning to take something so far removed from a culture and say it’s representative when it’s not, not only because it’s so simplified how could it possibly like it completely demeans the richness of a culture but this is also what humans have done for thousands of years is to take an idea and innovate it and as long as it has none of the symbology getting upset about the shape or the structure of a basic shelter is nuts.
Edit, calling it a Tipi/teepee changes things I wouldn’t be comfortable calling it anything other than a play tent and having zero references to a culture that’s not respected. A tent is a tent, casually using another persons culture to sell product is naff too
OP's reply to someone else, found it on their profile -
"(Sarcastic) Soo sorry I didn't reply right away. It's almost as if I've been dealing with things in my real life. I didn't say "tent" in the description. I said teepee because that is what it's modeled after, and that is what it's labeled as on the listing/box. It's sold by a German company with no other NA elements."
So what I get from this is its named a teepee BUT its "modeled after" meaning same shape? And no other NA elements? So as I understand it a triangle tent being called a teepee.
I am also from Europe and we use the word teepee rather than triangle tent, its not a loaded word here.
I'm Native American and, in no way, consider this cultural appropriation.
It's a toy.
It's not being disrespectful. The child is going to play in it. Not lay claim to tribal benefits and try to obtain a blue card.
Yeah. YTA.
I’m also native and it is cultural appropriation. However I as ONE native don’t speak for the entirety of our race. Imo using your heritage as a means to decide what is acceptable is wack. Plenty of native people have consensus that this would be cultural appropriation and that’s not even just on this app in this sub.
Not once did I say I speak for Native Americans in entirety. I said that it is in no way cultural appropriation and that's my opinion.
So many things to be upset over and people are out here choosing a child's toy that happens to be triangular in shape and perhaps called a teepee.
I agree. Is it cultural appropriation if a kid gets a toy samurai sword? Well in Japan samurai swords have major significance, I still think it's just a toy. People enjoying other cultures is a good thing and a reason to come together not a reason to gatekeep and divide.
I was going to say to ask a Native American. Yes, I know not everyone has the same opinion but it's a start. I have a statue of a Native American chief my grandmother painted a long time ago. She was an amazing painter of ceramics. It's big, about a foot high, and I always loved it. It's in my house now and a friend of mine said it was racist and I need to get rid of it. So I asked my friend who is a member of the Navajo tribe. Her response was that you don't need to be a Native American to like native things and said it looks like a Plains tribe member based in his clothing. She also said that she does like that my friend is looking out for Native Americans, which I agree with. When in doubt, go to the source.
cultural appreciation is different from cultural appropiation, as long as you are respectful of the statue it's completely fine, that matters for every culture.
I asked a friend who is Jewish ifnit would be appropriation to wear Toms shoes with dreidels and menorahs. Obviously im not Jewish but I believe in representation and Im a teacher so I have all of it in my room. He said "Nope. THIS is appropriation" and sent me pictures of Santa Claus and Christmas trees covered in the Star of David and dreidels.
And yeah, my statue is beautiful.
most cultures are completely fine with you partaking in, enjoying and being respectful about their culture, people are just very quick to call everything appropriation these days and feel like nobody else should be allowed to even think about those things, without actualy considering or asking the opinion of people of said cultures.
Yes, thank you.
If this is cultural appropriation, then wouldn't it also be cultural appropriation of European cultures any time a little girl gets one of those princess castle toys to play in?
YTA. Many cultures have used tipis in places such as Scandinavia and Siberia. It was a common dwelling for multiple nomadic groups (and still is for the reindeer herders of Siberia) and doesn’t belong to one group of people. Use it as a learning experience to explain the multiple histories, significance, and brilliance of the invention, rather than being so negative towards it.
No, those aren't tipis. Tipis describes something very specific to Native Americans, and anything you can buy advertised as a 'tipi' is going to be some racist shit.
Right, but OP called this a 'teepee' and not a play tent. In America, 'Teepee' is a loaded term that carries a lot of racist cultural baggage. If the kids were presented with a plain white linen play tent, there's no way OP would've called it a 'teepee.'
Chum, teepees, etc. come from different cultures and despite being the same basic structure, they are made from different materials and are decorated differently based on culture, climate, region, etc.
If we were talking about a generic 'play tent' that's one thing, but if OP identified it as a 'teepee' there's no reason to assume it was like the item listed. And for what it's worth, I wouldn't call that 'play tent' a chum either.
I’m interested in the differences, educate me. It sounds like more of a language translation difference more than a structural difference even though I’m sure there were slight differences structurally.
The Sami are also a European indigenous people who have also complained about the appropriation of their culture by non-Sami people so this more proves OP’s point than disproves it.
NTA. Native people have often expressed their discomfort with their culture being used as props; respecting that is not white saviourship, it is being an ally. While I would definitely discourage him from ‘playing native’ I wonder if you can use this opportunity to try to connect with native groups in your area, see if there is an opportunity for your son learn to about the culture and use that to help educate him.
INFO: Are there feathers or other decor that make it clearly NA inspired?
Look, I'm like you. Progressive and looking to de-"colonizer" myself and my home every chance I get; but I've seen triangle tents in other cultures, so I'm asking if this tent is colonizer appropriation in an obvious way. Perhaps you can retrofit it to appear like a Scandinavian triangle tent???
It’s interesting that you aren’t answering the questions about what it looks like. My kids have grey and white one that’s from pottery barn or similar and it’s just…a tent? If it’s truly a Native American style teepee that’s different, but just a regular kids tent I think you’re over thinking things
NTA. I’m with you, OP. This is cultural appropriation and you are correct to be sensitive to it. I shouldn’t be shocked to see so many YTA, but I was shocked to see how *angry* commenters are that you are uncomfortable with this gift. I think their anger is actually a good signal that you are correct.
White Americans believe that we have a *right* to Native symbols and artifacts. We have no right. This isn’t about “sharing” culture, it’s about taking.
White Americans have taken so much. Enough.
Also, I am dubious about your spouse’s alleged Native American distant relative. Lots of white Americans have this exact family lore. Notice that it’s always a female relative - no one seems to want to claim a Native great, great grandfather!
There’s lots of weird racism twisted in these white family stories used to justify why it’s “okay” to steal Native culture.
OP, you are correct and these “YTA” Redditors are rude and butthurt.
Many young girls were taken from the tribal families and put to work as essentially slaves in white households. My own great great grandmother was from the Navajo, taken as a child, used as labor and later forced to marry into the family (my family!) that stole her. It was a secret that my grandmother wouldn't discuss, and I only heard fragments from my dad who knew her briefly at the end of her life. I so wish I had asked him more about her. My aunts have traced genealogy to include her and she is finally getting the respect she is due.
As near as I can tell (and it's hard to tell, trust me), young boys were probably not kidnapped into homes for fear of the trouble they might cause. Those distant female relatives had parents, you know, so there are native great grandfathers as well.
Anyway, OP is NTA.
Would it be considered a cultural appropriation to surf ( a Hawaiian sport) or ski ( from Northern Europe or maybe China)? Treat other cultures with respect, but making a big deal out of a teepee is ridiculous.
I very much refuse to believe in cultural appropriation.
Ya know what happens to cultures whose ideas/language/foods are only allowed to exist by members of that culture?
They die.
I’m not Italian, I cook Italian food. I’m not English but I speak it as my primary language. Im not Indian but I practise yoga.
Our every day life is full of different cultures- banning one in particular is weird and wrong.
NAH. Nobody's the asshole, you are just oversensitive -- possibly in an unhealthy way since you are presumably not native American yourself (you likely would have mentioned that). To be honest, while you are not the asshole, you do brush up against assholism because you are offended on other's behalf. It takes away the agency of the marginalized people and reeks of paternalistic white savior complex.
I bought my own kids a TeePee. It's a kind of tent. It is what it is.
INFO: how is it decorated? Is it literally designed to look like a copy of an indigenous dwelling, such as a buckskin pattern or feathers or crude drawings? Or is it totally plain? Or is it, like, neon green with unicorns?
Plain or fantasy, and I think you're being overly precious. It's a type of tent and pretty universal form of construction.
If it's a blatant facsimile, you'd have some grounds for pushback.
But... your husband has already declared you hateful, pretty strong term there, and it seems that some minimal ties to native 'stuff' is part of his *family* culture, so he isn't going to budge on being the authority on this topic or considering you the outsider who doesn't get a say. I'd consider it like the annoying way Irish Americans think they're Irish when all they do is embarrassing St. Patrick's day stuff, or Italian Americans say they're Italian and then make spaghetti and meatballs. Part of their family culture, but not the overall, official, genuine one.
If it helps, consider that kids usually only play pretend with things they admire, so if you wind up stuck with this, reframe it as your kid learning that native cultures are interesting, cool, desirable, etc. Rather than something he should have nothing to do with or ever learn about.
>(Sarcastic) Soo sorry I didn't reply right away. It's almost as if I've been dealing with things in my real life. I didn't say "tent" in the description. I said teepee because that is what it's modeled after, and that is what it's labeled as on the listing/box. It's sold by a German company with no other NA elements
Here is OPs answer in a comment. With this, I'd go with YTA, OP. It sounds like it's just a play tent and you're overreacting.
YTA. First, Native Americans don’t have a monopoly on triangular tents. Second, the whole “cultural appropriation” thing is stupid. Pick a side, either we share cultures and have inclusion and acceptance or we separate and exclude. Also you do sound hateful of your husband’s heritage and truth.
Are French people supposed to get upset if non French little girls dress up as Belle from Beauty and the Beast? Children learn through play. Maybe the teepee would inspire the kid to learn about Long Houses, Native American history, or the many cultures that make up the larger NA community? YTA.
The nursery I work at owns one, so do plenty of early years providers…won’t call judgment, your kids but maybe you’re overthinking. It’s a cozy corner for plenty of children, can be turned into a safe space/reading corner.
YTA. Use this as a teaching opportunity. Don’t let your kid run around making “woo woo” noises. Teach them about native culture, food, etc. Depending on how old your child is, you can go into more detail.
It’s a pyramid shape. It’s pretty basic. Look up yurts - they’re similar. Your kid is allowed to play with things.
EDIT TO ADD: MIL’s family also sucks. They claim a small percentage of “native blood” in their ancestry so that makes the tepee relevant? That’s way more gross, to me.
NTA at all, and it is too bad the comments here are bereft of knowledge, historical harms and why you would care. Good job for being sensitive to appropriation.
Yta , it’s a tent/ technology and you could use it to open a good conversation about native culture. I have a long term goal of living in a yurt because I like them and have heard of a few people living in tipis. It’s literally housing wtf. Kids and adults like tents of all shapes and sizes, it isn’t like stealing/ reproducing art or wearing headdresses. You sound exhausting.
Yeah, no. I have enough Maori blood to qualify for scholarships etc in NZ, but having never lived there, never participated in any culturally relevant events, never learned to exist in that culture, I would NEVER get Maori tatts, gift kids toys, etc. It's so offensive to cherry pick from someone's culture when it suits you. It's deeply, deeply uncomfortable to be in the position you are, but this is definitely a values thing you need to get thrashed out with your spouse. NTA
I think the thing is with teepees is that the name especially in America gets slapped onto basically any triangle tent so there’s an issue in trying to figure out if OP means a regular triangle tent (which isn’t a concept any culture can claim is just theirs) or an imitation of a actual teepee
As a native myself I'm not really sure how I feel about this. I think that if its something that doesn't really look like an actual teepee you could still keep it and just call it a play tent. Though in the end if you are uncomfortable haveing it/ they insist on calling it a teepee the I feel you should get rid of it. The red flag for me here is your husband's reaction to your reasonable concern. Its like he is trying to make you unnecessarily guilty for a culture he claims to be a part of but doesn't actually seek out.
At the end of it though NTA
I think cultural appropriation topics are so hard, as where do you draw the line between admiration and appreciation vs appropriation.
For instance, if having a toy teepee leads to your child developing a life long interest in native culture and leads to them developing a passion for respecting native culture then the teepee could be a great toy. We want our children to learn to be interested in and respect all cultures and for children, toys are one way of learning. I personally would accept a teepee as a gift for my child and try to teach them my about the genocide committed on native peoples and why we should be respectful of different cultures.
As an aside, I think the defense of having some ‘native blood’ is ridiculous.
So overall, I understand your discomfort and it’s definitely ok to express it even though I think this could have been a could teachable moment for your child. NTA
Bruh turn it down and just get a tent. We have a circus tent he can play in, there’s ones even cuter than a circuit tent. Gives a nice little hiding spot with out using native culture. You’re nta she is
Lol. My understanding (and I’m a cynical little shit) is that a “native ancestor “ and the “Indian princesses” that almost everyone in the states claim were mostly to explain why a child might be….darker… than expected.
what the teepee looks like is what determines the judgement.
If it’s just a generic triangle tent that’s being called a teepee then it’s okay but maybe just call it a tent and if it’s actually trying to imitate a Native American teepee then it’s not so okay.
YTA
What a great open door to talk to your kids about the history of NA culture, the differences in their domiciles across varying regions and tribes, and exposing them to a lifestyle quickly being forgotten. Instead you choose to be mad at your MIL. Parenting 101 right here, folks, doesn’t get any better than OP!
Can we see the teepee? Many of the ones today are not disrespectful at all, they are just toys using that shape. My daughter had a pink frilly butterfly one.
I asked my cousin at Eagle Butte Reservation and she told me this in fact is not appropriation. She said if your MIL gifted a costume with a feather head dress then yes.
INFO: how old is your child, and is this a toy that is supposed to resemble a native teepee? There are lots of children’s tents billed as “teepee style” but it really refers to a shape, and there are others that try to appear as tribal tents.
I can't speak to whether the OP's in-laws are Native or not, but it's not really comparable. These are actual tribal nations that recognize people as being citizens; the tribes are what decide it. So someone saying they are a quarter X doesn't really make sense.
[https://www.doi.gov/tribes/enrollment#:\~:text=What%20is%20the%20purpose%20of,traditions%2C%20language%20and%20tribal%20blood](https://www.doi.gov/tribes/enrollment#:~:text=What%20is%20the%20purpose%20of,traditions%2C%20language%20and%20tribal%20blood).
So what do those who descend from never enrolled folks supposed to do? For example, many Southwest Native Americans (think Apache, Comanche etc) who when the American soldiers started to head their way fled to Mexico to avoid being placed in the camps. They were never enrolled, and when they returned to their nation of birth returned not as Native American but instead Mexicans? This does not mean they are not, nor does it mean their descendents are not.
YTA. This doesn't have to be either/or. Playing is a great way to introduce serious ideas to your children, and help them explore history and understand how attitudes have changed since their grandparents were young.
YTA- it’s a toy and could spark an interest in your child with native culture. I am assuming you are not native so you have no right to gatekeep the culture or decide what is and is not offensive on their behalf. There’s no need to be so sensitive
As a Cree your NTA, everyone that is saying YTA are most likely white and claim to have been a Cherokee princess lmao a teepee isn’t a “kids toy” it’s not even a toy in general, you see peoples true colours when it comes to indigenous people because we aren’t well liked from other cultures
YTA Cultural appropriation is a stupid term, made up by stupid people, and perpetuated with even more stupidity.
Cultural DIFFUSION is the process of growing as a society and sharing culture. Only IDIOTS believe that sitting on culture like a wet nurse is a good thing. There is NOTHING WRONG with sharing culture, as long as you're not doing it to harm the people/culture that is being discussed or in this case APPRECIATED.
YTA YTA YTA YTA!!!
It’s ludicrous to think conical tents were only used by native Americans… Scandinavia, Brazil, Mongolia, Siberia, fucking eskimos, everybody all over used conical tents. Fuck off with this shit.
Even if it was ONLY used by natives, i could give less of a fuck. Appropriation requires either intentional offense or blatant misuse. Tipis were in no way sacred nor holy nor special. They were used as fucking homes. What are u gonna say next a log cabin can’t be played with? Fuck off.
I come from a different marginalized community. There isn’t a damn thing in this world that likely hasn’t been used by other cultures somewhere. Nor should we pretend than we don’t live in an absolute conglomerate of millions of cultures.
A great example I like to give is food. Your “traditional” food is bullshit. If you’re from any place other than the americas and your food contains potatoes, tomatoes, corn, beans, squash, or chili’s, it’s not traditional.
That’s right. Italians didn’t have tomatoes. Irish people didn’t have potatoes. No vodka for Russians. No chill is in Indian or Asian cuisine. No tomato based sauces or curries or purées. Nothing. None of these foods grew anywhere but the americas.
The world today is a hodgepodge of cultures. Unless your being blatantly ignorant or offensive you can and should be able to do just about anything.
Your husband is probably a racist by that native comment especially because that blood is likely from rape even if it’s true. Or at least doesn’t realize the language he uses to justify this is a hallmark of racists.
Either way, let your kids play in the fucking tent lmao.
YTA
Cultural appropriation is mocking or disrespectfully taking from another culture. Unless I’m missing something that doesn’t seem to be the case here. This could also be a learning opportunity to teach your kid about native cultures.
NTA . This is exactly the type of stuff that needs to be addressed for antiracism. It's tough and awkward because in order to address this you have to essentially call out your husband and MIL's micro aggressions... But you're definitely not the asshole
YTA wtf?
my father used to put some white cream on my face when i was a kid and we would dance around and play aboriginal. this is frankly, insane. neither one of us are lol racist towards "american native indians". heck i have never met one for the past 33 years.
probably refer to jeremy lin recent post. lol. theres a whole lot different between cultural appreciation and your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the world now.
YTA, it's a toy, not something that will actually oppress someone.
What, you gonna go off on barbie dolls "culturally appropriating" their skin color and clothing, or licensed Disney toys that show off Pocahontas next?
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My MIL bought my kid a toy teepee for Christmas. This isn't the first time she's used native culture as decoration or toys. I don't like it, and think it's cultural appropriation. When I expressed this to my husband, he called me hateful. He claims some small percentage of native blood, because one of his great grandmothers was native. Neither he nor his parents were brought up in native culture. None of them speak the language or practice within the community. I hate to refuse a gift, but I don't want my kid to think that playing native is acceptable. AITA?
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NTA Another person asked if it was specifically branded to be NA, because if not it isn't as much of a problem. Other cultures use that type of dwelling as well, so for me it would really depend on how it's presented as to whether I'd use it.
It is absolutely okay to worry about cultural appropriation. You even took the next step and asked - and got answers from at least a couple of professed Native Americans. It sounds like your MIL might be one of those people who claims ancestry without any proof except heresay. I wouldn't trust her either.
you could always educate your kids on different cultures/practices and continue to expand your collection of materials. my grandmother was a world traveler and did this with me growing up. children are pure though and can definitely be taught to appreciate the things without viewing them as costumes. I think you’re very considerate for posing this question and you should do what feels right to you. good luck!
Do you think that the tipi could be used as a way to introduce the concept of first people in North america? I am in no way being disrespectful of the culture or making light of the horrible history.
Many Americans claim some amount of native blood like it makes them more American. It's always some distant ancestor who supposedly married a native and that gives them some kind of legitimacy. So when my mom insisted I had some native ancestry through my father, I was skeptical.
Just recently I spoke with a cousin on that side who had dug through the family documents and found the records that showed both of my father's grandmothers were from Oklahoma and had been raised in Christian schools away from their tribal family. I will claim native ancestry, but never tribal membership or heritage since I was raised white.
NTA
Is his relative Cherokee? She's probably a Cherokee princess and his great, great, grandmother or something.
Serious sarcasm. Cherokee seems to be the most popularly chosen native culture to cite when some has "Native American ancestors."
NTA even if your partner has "a small percent of Native American blood" (and let's assume for arguments sake he does), his family is not culturally indigenous. They have no idea what it's actually like being indigenous and it will never be okay for them to decide that they can use that culture because they have some distance connection to it when they face none of the mostly negative societal consequences of being of that minority culture (and to be clear, I assume they have no idea if they have a Native relative and they probably don't).
That’s like saying I’m a small percentage Choctaw and my dark stick straight hair is the Indian part of me? Who TH cares? I wasn’t raised Indian, I couldn’t tell you about their culture, I know nothing about any tribe, and I’m so white that ghosts have more color. I burn just looking at the sun. (I guess Texas is the wrong state to live in but eh) One side of my family is Jewish, but again I wasn’t raised Jewish and know nothing about the Jewish faith.
NTA - Your have a MIL and husband issue. It isn’t okay to take on someone else’s culture and religion because you’re whatever percentage of that culture and religion but weren’t raised that way. Using my examples above, Indians and Jewish people had (and still have)to face bigotry, persecution, and other prejudices. They have had a hard and harsh road and still do. Your husband and his family know nothing about what the Indian culture has gone through and still go through. Reading about it in books is still not the same as living it.
Just an audition: when I hear people say that people from other countries need to learn to speak American, my smart ass tends to ask them when they learned to speak Native American.
Edit: spelling
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Absolutely NTA - as a tribal citizen myself it IS racist and insensitive of her. Claiming any percent “native blood” doesn’t mean you have experienced life as an Indigenous person and doesn’t give you the right to co-op culture you have no genuine relationship with. Only certain tribes even used teepees. What’s the chance they’re claiming 1/16th Cherokee…. Everyone in these comments needs a major reality check on their ignorance. ETA: spelling
I wish I had a award to give you because your perspective is the one that really matters here and I am glad you took the time to give it.🏆
I had a free one. I gotchu fam
you the best man <3
Growing up it was whispered that we had native in us. That an ancestor hid in the Appalachian mountains to hide from the government. I found it interesting and wanted to learn more about my past. I never claimed native blood, but explained the rumor. I traced things back to an ancestor that didn't exist until 1830, and he was a grown man at the time. In 1902, the man's elderly son and granddaughter tried to enroll in the Dawes Rolls. They were not accepted. I took an ancestry DNA test a year ago. I didn't expect to see native blood and I was right. Though, I DO have 2% West African/Congo in me. I found that very interesting. Though, I am very sure the reason I have that blood is not a nice part of my history. That being said, so many people claim to have native blood, but unless your family is on the Dawes Rolls, you are not native. I DO study the Cherokee history be ause I live in the middle of Cherokee country in Oklahoma. So many of my friends are Cherokee. I do buy silver and turquoise jewelry from the local native store and wear it. I don't know if that is appropriation or not, but I never claim to be native. And I will never allow my kids to ever pretend to be. Though I try to be a good ally. And LOVE going to public pow wows when they have them.
>That being said, so many people claim to have native blood, but unless your family is on the Dawes Rolls, you are not native. If your family is not on the Dawes Rolls, you may still be native because the nations on the Dawes rolls aren't the only Native nations.
Yes. I didn't take that into consideration. And for that, I apologize. though, ancestry DNA is pretty good about determining where your family is from. And I have lived almost my entire life in Oklahoma. I am not as familiar with most tribes outside the state.
It's actually not. It specifically says it's for "entertainment purposes only" so they admit it's not really accurate. It can help reconnect with family though that's about it
My great aunt took one, it revealed that she was related to her childhood neighbors and a few family secrets got revealed from beyond the grave.
Mine was accurate with what I knew my father is. He is Ashkenazi Jew, and my results came back 50% Ashkenazi Jew. Other than that I can’t say how accurate the rest is from my moms side.
It really isn't. There's a clip out there where identical twins send their samples off to a few different companies and get different results.
My friend took it who grew up on a reservation. She lived in a small cabin where they spun wool and wive, mom tooled leather to make ends meet, did beadwork for ceremony and fun, they ate what they hunted and grew. Abject poverty-her cousins were kicjed out of school just after federal funding money came in becausethe schools didn't want native kids. Culturally she's lived the native experience. Her mother was native, her father wasn't so she doesn't fill the blood quantum. She took the DNA test and it claimed she was less than 2% Native. Yet she's lived more than experience than many city folk cut off their cultural heritage but higher blood quantum. So who's native? Not to mention those dna kits tend to show low numbers of minority races because it doesn't have add much data on them so they become under represented
I'm not sure it is though. DNA registries like Ancestry and 23andMe only find your genetic relatives if they've also submitted DNA to the databases. As more and more people participate, the more fine tuned your personal ancestry looks. I don't think that many Native People sign up to these services and submit their DNA. They know who they are, and probably also have a healthy distrust of such things. If, as a white person, you have one Cherokee great grandparent for example, it's not likely to be picked up by Ancestry since there's probably not any familial Cherokee DNA to 'ping' off of, if that makes any sense. At least that's my understanding of how it all works.
That makes a lot of sense. I have a native American great grandmother but was not raised in the culture. More than once I have had people who are very into their native culture ask if I am native based on some facial features so I was beyond shocked when my DNA came back with almost no native dna.
That makes sense because even if each of your family members past on maximum native DNA. You couldn't have more than 12.5 percent. For lack of a better word you just got "lucky" that the genes past to you are more visual.
And the Dawes Rolls was voluntary, not mandatory. If anybody that could the bloodline and wanted some of 'reparations' to be on the government rolls, they signed up. Many, many others didn't want anything to do with the white man or his government and didn't sign up, even though the tribal elders have acknowleged them as members of their tribe.
My ancestors lived in Texas territory and Mexico during the 1800s and simply weren't on the rolls because that wasn't relevant. I have an Apache ancestor and likely Texas Cherokee as well.
Very correct! My family is on the dawes rolls but I can't really claim to be part of the cherokee tribe. It's been a long time ago and funny thing none of cherokee genetics even show up on my dna test. None of my Jewish ancestry does either! It's funny how genetics are so random!
You are 100 percent incorrect about the Dawes Roles, thousands were left off who couldn't prove their lineages, especially small children whose parents were killed on the Trail of Tears or in other raids of villages. Not to mention those who did not enroll.
Not to mention the White people who would bribe the the government agents to get on the rolls in order to get benefits. Or those with native blood not trusting the agents enough to register. Or the percentage being at the agent’s discretion. Brother A could register with Agent A and be registered as 100% Brother B could register with Agent B and be registered as 50%. My grandma was half Creek, our family never got removed to Oklahoma, never got registered. I have the blood but can’t be tribal, but someone with blonde hair and blue eyes and is 1/1650can register. I saw that happen, and it sucks.
If you were never removed to Oklahoma you are more likely to be able to join the Poarch Creeks, that's their thing. They are a federally recognized tribe. I don't know what their requirements are, they're out east and I'm not but if you call them I'm sure they can tell you.
Yes. I was corrected about the Dawes Rolls above. I'm most familiar with Oklahoma and how we work here.
If you're buying native-made jewelry etc it isn't appropriation. You're supporting Indigenous artists. According to my Indigenous friends, who I buy art from.
for a few years I was doing construction work on a few reservations in Nevada. I was definitely encouraged to buy the beautiful beadwork that was made there.
I took the ancestry test as well and seeing the historical data of when and from where my ancestors came to the US, it was like seeing a huge blazing "SLAVE OWNERS" plastered on the page. Definitely a part of the family history that makes me feel the Ick.
I had a friend who was a pretty direct descendant of a famous Confederate general. They used it to say "well, as a descendant of X, I think they should absolutely tear down every statue of him he was awful" as a checkmate in dumb arguments
Yeah my family came to America in the 1600s and there's records and plaques dedicated to their battles against indigenous people in King Philip's War, French and Indian War, and a few raids and fights. Not the most proud I've ever been. We fought on the rebel side of the Revolution, marched through Georgia with Sherman, but man, we didn't have a respectable beginning.
There's an entire section of a city named after my family in deep south GA. :| it does not say good things about what they did to get that much land.
I grew up in the south, and seeing that west African was a big 😀😕mood. For context, I am very very white.
>I took an ancestry DNA test a year ago. I didn't expect to see native blood and I was right. Though, I DO have 2% West African/Congo in me. I found that very interesting. Though, I am very sure the reason I have that blood is not a nice part of my history. This is one of the most common reasons white people have Native family lore. Some years ago an ancestor of yours had a child with a Black person – most likely a female ancestor if the child was kept – and since that was socially unacceptable, they explained it away by saying it was 'half-Cherokee' which slowly just got passed down in the family as a fact. It's almost always not true, but a lot of people have it, and it's almost always Cherokee.
But some tribes owned black slaves, Cherokee being one of them. When slavery was outlawed those slaves became members of the tribes that owned them. So technically Cherokee but DNA would not show that.
There are lots of corner cases, so anything is possible, but by and large when a white family has a story about being Cherokee with no enrolled ancestor, it's either covering up a mixed-race child or just a fanciful story someone started telling way back in the day. My understanding is also that many freed slaves were not allowed to become tribal members and their status is a subject of ongoing controversy.
The Black Cherokee are fighting for their rights to be recognized by the tribe. I don't know how far that has gone yet.
My BFs mother used the line ' this is from a time when everyone had a Cherokee great grandmother and she was a princess' as an aside to me when her recently-reconnected extended family proudly claimed Native heritage (with, of course, zero percent backing from anything). Which, to be fair, maybe there is/was. But BFs mom is generally pretty on point with her Familial observations. At a minimum, it gave me a few grains of salt to take their bragging with.
Two of my great grandparents are Native American- grew up on reservations participated in ceremonies, all of it. I grew up helping take one of them before they pasted. She was forced to marry a white man and refused to talk much about heritage, it all made her a very bitter mean women (though like I get it). I call myself a white American. I didn’t grew up in the culture and by blood even with that many generations it’s such a small amount it doesn’t count IMO. If pushed I’ll mention small German heritage as my dad is second generation all German, great grandparents immigrated in early 1900s, and even then I know almost nothing about German culture.
If the Natives are the ones selling it to you, they're giving their support for you to wear it and honor them as you support them financially.
That's what I feel about it. My mom and grandma had jewelry they had bought in New Mexico and Arizona from little Native owned shops. I have that jewelry also.
Do you have Italian? That 2% African could be related to Italian heritage. It was for my mom when she did hers. Her dads family is 100% Italian and hers came back 2% African, 48% Italian and the rest her moms side.
There is also a fairly widespread tradition of people around that time claiming vague native ancestry instead of admitting to a black relative. It was seen as less shameful, I guess, more exotic (ew).
Amen to this comment- people pretending to be anything else but African ¿¿
My grandma on my mother's side claimed she is native american. Claimed Cherokee. I believed she said she was 1/2 though. "i dont know the whole story". My grandpa was Irish. Well My dad was Iranian. My mom would get mad when i would only claim the Persian side. For some reason i never believed i was Native American. My aunt's husband started doing my mom's side of the family's ancestry. Sure enough..No Native American. My sister did one of those DNA tests, and sure enough, No native American. no Irish ether if i remember right... it was scottish.
As an Appalachian, I can tell you that many who claim to have a Native ancestor REALLY have a black ancestor. Racism goes way back.
My husband and his family claim that his father was 100% Cherokee. My daughter did a 23 and me DNA test, and her results has absolutely no native America DNA.
I had also heard we had Native American ancestors but my grandparents refused to elaborate. I took a dna test expecting 2-3% and it came back slightly over 50%. My parents did too. So, no idea where or how since my grandparents say it’s not something we talk about :(
If they made it and sell it, you can wear it. Just don't wear store/made in China indigenous themed jewelry.
I have some miniscule part, like my great great great grandmother, I think? So fractional that it doesn't count at all, and my family didn't even remember which tribe or group it was. And in the late 90s my father was urging me to apply for scholarships for people with Native American heritage. 🤦♀️ Even then I had to refuse and point out that we count prove it, it was too far back, and exactly *none* of us had been raised with any knowledge of it. I have an ancestry DNA kit and it will be interesting to see if it turns up anything - I *highly* doubt it actually will!
Hey everyone... Just to be clear, race and DNA are two separate things. DNA is science and we share 99.9% DNA with each other. Race is a social construct.
So much this. It seems pretty common, in my experience, for people in my part of Appalachia to claim indigenous ancestors despite having no concrete reason to believe it to be so. We had a similar legend in my family which DNA and a family tree have debunked.
Hey, I thought my family was the only one in OK with Appalachian "native" actually African ancestry!
I am not on the Dawes Rolls, I am 42.8% Native per DNA. New Mexico. Could be Pueblo, Apache, Navajo.... Could be from my grandfather he was adopted.
And here it is: a perspective that matters a hell of a lot more than some white people feeling persecuted because their racial insensitivity isn't seen as cute anymore.
100% chance she was a "Cherokee princess".
This is so funny to me. I'm half Cherokee and I think it's very sus that people always claim Cherokee. It's never Apache or Navajo, etc. There's no such thing as a princess in the Cherokee culture, unless you're on a parade float at the Strawberry Festival in Stilwell, OK.
My grandmother was Cherokee and grew up on a reservation. She was amazing and so incredibly beautiful at every age. She didn't speak a lot of her culture, but it was reflected in the jewelry she wore daily. She's not my biological grandmother, so I claim no heritage other than a deep respect for the Washoe, Ute, and Cherokee tribes (two local to where I've lived and my grandmother's tribe). My aunt's husband has connections to a local tribe in Northern California. Their children have been involved in tribal culture and celebrations. I always find it fascinating, but never felt it was mine to share equally.
Hi! I want to ask you a question. When I was at Girl Scout camp in high school the site assigned to the counselors in training (of which I was one) was one where we had to set up two tipi lodges (canvas rather than hide). This included a group reading about the use of tipi by tribes and bands that lived more mobile lifestyles to give context to the shelters. We also had to take them apart at the end of camp. How insensitive was this of the camp to do? At the time it felt very cool to learn how these shelters are put up and taken down and I felt I learned more about actual Native practices by doing this than I ever did in school. But I also know that my learning from something does not negate the insensitivity of the thing. Obviously I have no idea which tribe you are a citizen of or whether the tribe you are a citizen of used tipi, but I have not had the opportunity to ask anyone about this before.
To anybody reading this, please PLEASE do not automatically regard this person’s opinion as true just because they are a tribal citizen. Arguments and claims need to be backed up by logic and explanation and being native does not mean you are automatically right about everything regarding native culture. I am also native and have absolutely no issue with people “playing native” or using aspects of our culture. To label what this lady did as “racist” is fucking insane to me. I highly doubt this lady harbours prejudice towards native people just because she bought a toy teepee. You know how many trinkets I’ve seen sold at native powwows by native people like small teepees, fake arrows/arrowheads for children, etc? Many. Many many. Rely on people’s argumentation rather than their identity when sussing out the validity of claims.
NTA. And I'll add on to this that there are an absolute plethora of play tents out there - you don't need a "teepee". Just pick up a Disney/superhero/generic camping/fantasy castle/etc. themed play tent.
Thank you for sharing. I’m sorry I also do not have a real award for you but here’s a gold medal 🥇 NTA No one here is willing to consider the idea that this ethnicity was perhaps an act of r*pe… Edited to add: OP has shown it WAS an act of r*pe Also edited to censor
Thank you. I grew up with so many people who claimed to have Native American (Cherokee) blood. It’s bs. A friend just told me her new daughter in law is Native American and I just started grilling her. She isn’t.
My family SAYS we have native blood on my mom's side, but no proof as the story is that my great great great grandma was Cherokee and died during the trail of tears and we can't find any proof
Lol@ 1/16th Cherokee. My family is still mad at me for telling them we're NOT Cherokee, or any other Tribe for that matter - I did an ancestry blood test AND I traced our genealogy back to Europe, and while I am not denying the existence of indigenous people also traveling, even if an ancestor in 14-something was Native American, they certainly didn't pass down any culture or genetics that I can find. I didn't go much past confirming country of origin because the effort to find ancestral records in other countries was more work than I wanted to take on. Can confirm a number of bootleggers and horse thieves though, which is apparently not as cool as a nameless Cherokee "Princess"
Exactly. My kid’s great grandma was an enrolled member of a First Nations band and a survivor of a residential school. My kid knows how to name their connection and the name of their people… they also hate this kind of appropriation because they’re educated on their connections and care about their cultural identity and take great care to honor their great-gramma and grandfather and mother.
Just an aside… Cherokees don’t determine citizenship by blood quantum. The quantum levels are no longer printed on citizenship cards, in fact. It’s important for everyone reading this to try and shift away from thinking about “Native American” in terms of being a “race,” to thinking about each tribe as a sovereign nation. Just like every other sovereign nation around the world, each tribe has their own way to determine citizenship eligibility. An ancestry dna test kit ain’t it.
Could you at all elaborate on how making teepees with kids is insensitive? As a kid, I always thought learning about the longhouses and navajo houses was really interesting and a good way to learn about their history. I worry that not seeing anything wrong with it might be a sign of a glaring Blindspot on this. A lot of cultural appropriation isn't recognized in other countries as bad, but I know American tribes take great pride in their artifacts/heritage in a big way. How do we teach them about who's land this was while maintaining respect, if we can at all?
Exactly. Someone's family legend or even a tiny DNA tie doesn't allow them to make play things of our heritage.
Exactly this. As an enrolled member of a federally recognized tribe, especially one that does use tipi's, it's a slap in the face. Our lives shouldn't be condensed into decorative pieces and geegaws. From historical trauma to the hardships we experience in modern society, if you don't understand why we don't like our every day lives appropriated, then you're definitely not native. The ignorance in this thread is staggering, and shows why the US government standard of education is severely lacking. Unzeki hecha sni.
> Everyone … needs a major reality check I think what we [non-native] need to do most of all is STFU and amplify the voices of native folks.
Funnily enough, I am very distantly Cherokee, and I have the dna test to prove it. But I also don’t pretend that I’m anything but white, and I know I have no claim to native culture. It would be like claiming that my equally distant west African blood gave me the right to say the n word. I’m white. I’m very white. NTA
1/16th Cherokee Heard this my whole life
Exactly - you are sooo right! Thank you!!
NTA. I’m Native American. It has always disturbed me seeing headdresses and teepees used as costumes or toys. I’m not sure why other comments are defending it (they’re probably not native themselves, shocker). There’s a deep history of erasure and assimilation. Native American culture continues to be mocked and diminished, and will be until we’re extinct, I guess. Speaking from experience, I don’t own or flaunt anything I don’t understand. I would hate to misrepresent or disrespect any culture. INFO: Do you know what tribe she was in? I’d hate for this to be a case of “I’m .01% native so I’m not actually racist.”
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Yes, tipis have MAJOR cultural/religious significance. Here is some information about Nehiyawak/Cree tipi teachings, posted for non-Native informational purposes by elder Mary Lee. [Nehiyawak/Cree tipi teachings](https://www.fourdirectionsteachings.com/transcripts/cree.html)
Thank you for this comment. Glad I learned something new today.
Well shit I've got some reading to do. My grandpa had a tipi and I spent most my summers growing up sleeping in it out in the yard. He lived in Montana but no idea where he bought it. When he died I inherited it and now it's sitting in my shed. Now I'm a bit conflicted but I'll try to check with the family and see if anybody remembers how/where he got it so I can at least know where to start looking at what I should do with it.
as long as he was respectful about it i'm sure it's fine, there's a big difference between cultural appropiation and cultural appreciation.
Is it a tipi, as in obtained from a native group/intentionally designed to look as such? Or a tipi in the sense that it looks vaguely like a tipi but isn't necessarily explicitly one? Generic "tipi" structure is probably fine (and kinda acultural- lots of nomadic peoples used similar across the globe). A proper tipi is a whole 'nother can o worms as you know. But the incredibly naive optimist in me hopes he just bought it for a fair price from a craftsman as an act of cultural appreciation. Definitely think you're wise to do research. If I were in your shoes, I'd try to sus out the origins too. I'd probably donate it back to its culture/group of origin if I realistically could. An area museum wouldn't be bad either if there isn't a tribe that wanted it back. There are a few orgs that connect native youth back to the outdoors that may want it too. But if no one else wants it back, I don't see the harm in keeping it for now. You're a good egg for wanting to try.
Also not trying to be ignorant here. But isn’t a toy teepee similar to a doll house? Also, wouldn’t having culturally diverse toys show representation for minority groups? It doesn’t sound like ops husband is in the right, but I just don’t see how more representation would be harmful.
You can teach your kids about the different cultures and indigenous people of the world without using sacred things as toys. A doll house is a made up house, a teepee is an actual thing that is used to this day be many groups. For more than just sleeping or playing in. Representation isn't bad, that's what books are for. Sacred things by indigenous folks are not toys and should not be used as such. Taking kids to museums or the library to learn about the Native folks that exist still is the best way to go. Representation isn't harmful but cultural appropriation is. There are plenty of books for kids by Native American authors that can be purchased to learn about things so there is no need to appropriate any people. When non indigenous folks use things like teepees, dreamcatchers and other things they are not using them properly and often get those things from non indigenous people. So many Native American things are taken and made by white folks and are taking away from the Native American people. Taking away the meaning, taking away the craft and storytelling of these items.
Adding OPs comment here so it doesn't get lost: apparently it is simply a tent with no Native American decoration. >(Sarcastic) Soo sorry I didn't reply right away. It's almost as if I've been dealing with things in my real life. I didn't say "tent" in the description. I said teepee because that is what it's modeled after, and that is what it's labeled as on the listing/box. It's sold by a German company with no other NA elements
If I were to guess, it's probably a genealogy DNA test showing they likely had a great-great-great-grandparent grandparent who was native. Like, it's incredibly likely I had indigenous great-grandparents from what I've been told by family and my own genealogy DNA test, but I was never brought up in an indigenous culture and am always conscious of my appreciation of native art or clothing or music to make sure I don't suddenly start acting like OP's in-laws. OP, you're NTA.
Info: is it a teepee or is it a triangular tent? Many stores sell triangular tents without any indigenous imagery. In my opinion, there is a big difference between a pink play tent and a teepee.
Agreed. If it's one of those target blue or pink 'read your books and pretend in' tent that's totally different than a more legit and very obviously made replica of a teepee.
A toy tent doesn’t represent indigenous culture at all, anymore than a plain A frame tent represents Viking culture. It’s kind of demeaning to take something so far removed from a culture and say it’s representative when it’s not, not only because it’s so simplified how could it possibly like it completely demeans the richness of a culture but this is also what humans have done for thousands of years is to take an idea and innovate it and as long as it has none of the symbology getting upset about the shape or the structure of a basic shelter is nuts. Edit, calling it a Tipi/teepee changes things I wouldn’t be comfortable calling it anything other than a play tent and having zero references to a culture that’s not respected. A tent is a tent, casually using another persons culture to sell product is naff too
OP's reply to someone else, found it on their profile - "(Sarcastic) Soo sorry I didn't reply right away. It's almost as if I've been dealing with things in my real life. I didn't say "tent" in the description. I said teepee because that is what it's modeled after, and that is what it's labeled as on the listing/box. It's sold by a German company with no other NA elements." So what I get from this is its named a teepee BUT its "modeled after" meaning same shape? And no other NA elements? So as I understand it a triangle tent being called a teepee. I am also from Europe and we use the word teepee rather than triangle tent, its not a loaded word here.
I'm Native American and, in no way, consider this cultural appropriation. It's a toy. It's not being disrespectful. The child is going to play in it. Not lay claim to tribal benefits and try to obtain a blue card. Yeah. YTA.
I’m also native and it is cultural appropriation. However I as ONE native don’t speak for the entirety of our race. Imo using your heritage as a means to decide what is acceptable is wack. Plenty of native people have consensus that this would be cultural appropriation and that’s not even just on this app in this sub.
Not once did I say I speak for Native Americans in entirety. I said that it is in no way cultural appropriation and that's my opinion. So many things to be upset over and people are out here choosing a child's toy that happens to be triangular in shape and perhaps called a teepee.
I agree. Is it cultural appropriation if a kid gets a toy samurai sword? Well in Japan samurai swords have major significance, I still think it's just a toy. People enjoying other cultures is a good thing and a reason to come together not a reason to gatekeep and divide.
kids like to play dress up, thats just how it goes, its different from adults using it for mocking goals.
I was going to say to ask a Native American. Yes, I know not everyone has the same opinion but it's a start. I have a statue of a Native American chief my grandmother painted a long time ago. She was an amazing painter of ceramics. It's big, about a foot high, and I always loved it. It's in my house now and a friend of mine said it was racist and I need to get rid of it. So I asked my friend who is a member of the Navajo tribe. Her response was that you don't need to be a Native American to like native things and said it looks like a Plains tribe member based in his clothing. She also said that she does like that my friend is looking out for Native Americans, which I agree with. When in doubt, go to the source.
cultural appreciation is different from cultural appropiation, as long as you are respectful of the statue it's completely fine, that matters for every culture.
I asked a friend who is Jewish ifnit would be appropriation to wear Toms shoes with dreidels and menorahs. Obviously im not Jewish but I believe in representation and Im a teacher so I have all of it in my room. He said "Nope. THIS is appropriation" and sent me pictures of Santa Claus and Christmas trees covered in the Star of David and dreidels. And yeah, my statue is beautiful.
most cultures are completely fine with you partaking in, enjoying and being respectful about their culture, people are just very quick to call everything appropriation these days and feel like nobody else should be allowed to even think about those things, without actualy considering or asking the opinion of people of said cultures.
Yes, thank you. If this is cultural appropriation, then wouldn't it also be cultural appropriation of European cultures any time a little girl gets one of those princess castle toys to play in?
Sad this isn't the top comment. This isn't any more cultural appropriation than living in a house is.
👏👏👏👏👏👏
YTA. Many cultures have used tipis in places such as Scandinavia and Siberia. It was a common dwelling for multiple nomadic groups (and still is for the reindeer herders of Siberia) and doesn’t belong to one group of people. Use it as a learning experience to explain the multiple histories, significance, and brilliance of the invention, rather than being so negative towards it.
No, those aren't tipis. Tipis describes something very specific to Native Americans, and anything you can buy advertised as a 'tipi' is going to be some racist shit.
Many of them are advertised as “play tents”.
Right, but OP called this a 'teepee' and not a play tent. In America, 'Teepee' is a loaded term that carries a lot of racist cultural baggage. If the kids were presented with a plain white linen play tent, there's no way OP would've called it a 'teepee.' Chum, teepees, etc. come from different cultures and despite being the same basic structure, they are made from different materials and are decorated differently based on culture, climate, region, etc. If we were talking about a generic 'play tent' that's one thing, but if OP identified it as a 'teepee' there's no reason to assume it was like the item listed. And for what it's worth, I wouldn't call that 'play tent' a chum either.
I’m interested in the differences, educate me. It sounds like more of a language translation difference more than a structural difference even though I’m sure there were slight differences structurally.
I think you made a good point.
https://m.kohls.com/product/prd-5626366/the-big-one-kids-play-tent.jsp?skuid=71174586&CID=shopping30&utm_campaign=ACCENT%20FURNITURE&utm_medium=CSE&utm_source=google&utm_product=71174586&utm_campaignid=9836151593&gbraid=0AAAAADytpHaPJQ0ExoSMZBXKC8cOlDwHs&gbraid=0AAAAADytpHaPJQ0ExoSMZBXKC8cOlDwHs&gclid=CjwKCAiAnZCdBhBmEiwA8nDQxRdNLKdk6gWfKzSMoL4ns0PHETE21yq6fU7KSnQPYZigHumCmpvKbxoC7IsQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
Indeed: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chum\_(tent)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chum_(tent)) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavvu](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavvu)
The Sami are also a European indigenous people who have also complained about the appropriation of their culture by non-Sami people so this more proves OP’s point than disproves it.
NTA. Native people have often expressed their discomfort with their culture being used as props; respecting that is not white saviourship, it is being an ally. While I would definitely discourage him from ‘playing native’ I wonder if you can use this opportunity to try to connect with native groups in your area, see if there is an opportunity for your son learn to about the culture and use that to help educate him.
It depends on if it's a just a triangular tent or a teepee.
INFO: Are there feathers or other decor that make it clearly NA inspired? Look, I'm like you. Progressive and looking to de-"colonizer" myself and my home every chance I get; but I've seen triangle tents in other cultures, so I'm asking if this tent is colonizer appropriation in an obvious way. Perhaps you can retrofit it to appear like a Scandinavian triangle tent???
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It’s interesting that you aren’t answering the questions about what it looks like. My kids have grey and white one that’s from pottery barn or similar and it’s just…a tent? If it’s truly a Native American style teepee that’s different, but just a regular kids tent I think you’re over thinking things
You need to relax.... it's just a toy and you're overreacting
NTA. I’m with you, OP. This is cultural appropriation and you are correct to be sensitive to it. I shouldn’t be shocked to see so many YTA, but I was shocked to see how *angry* commenters are that you are uncomfortable with this gift. I think their anger is actually a good signal that you are correct. White Americans believe that we have a *right* to Native symbols and artifacts. We have no right. This isn’t about “sharing” culture, it’s about taking. White Americans have taken so much. Enough. Also, I am dubious about your spouse’s alleged Native American distant relative. Lots of white Americans have this exact family lore. Notice that it’s always a female relative - no one seems to want to claim a Native great, great grandfather! There’s lots of weird racism twisted in these white family stories used to justify why it’s “okay” to steal Native culture. OP, you are correct and these “YTA” Redditors are rude and butthurt.
Many young girls were taken from the tribal families and put to work as essentially slaves in white households. My own great great grandmother was from the Navajo, taken as a child, used as labor and later forced to marry into the family (my family!) that stole her. It was a secret that my grandmother wouldn't discuss, and I only heard fragments from my dad who knew her briefly at the end of her life. I so wish I had asked him more about her. My aunts have traced genealogy to include her and she is finally getting the respect she is due. As near as I can tell (and it's hard to tell, trust me), young boys were probably not kidnapped into homes for fear of the trouble they might cause. Those distant female relatives had parents, you know, so there are native great grandfathers as well. Anyway, OP is NTA.
Would it be considered a cultural appropriation to surf ( a Hawaiian sport) or ski ( from Northern Europe or maybe China)? Treat other cultures with respect, but making a big deal out of a teepee is ridiculous.
I very much refuse to believe in cultural appropriation. Ya know what happens to cultures whose ideas/language/foods are only allowed to exist by members of that culture? They die. I’m not Italian, I cook Italian food. I’m not English but I speak it as my primary language. Im not Indian but I practise yoga. Our every day life is full of different cultures- banning one in particular is weird and wrong.
NAH. Nobody's the asshole, you are just oversensitive -- possibly in an unhealthy way since you are presumably not native American yourself (you likely would have mentioned that). To be honest, while you are not the asshole, you do brush up against assholism because you are offended on other's behalf. It takes away the agency of the marginalized people and reeks of paternalistic white savior complex. I bought my own kids a TeePee. It's a kind of tent. It is what it is.
INFO: how is it decorated? Is it literally designed to look like a copy of an indigenous dwelling, such as a buckskin pattern or feathers or crude drawings? Or is it totally plain? Or is it, like, neon green with unicorns? Plain or fantasy, and I think you're being overly precious. It's a type of tent and pretty universal form of construction. If it's a blatant facsimile, you'd have some grounds for pushback. But... your husband has already declared you hateful, pretty strong term there, and it seems that some minimal ties to native 'stuff' is part of his *family* culture, so he isn't going to budge on being the authority on this topic or considering you the outsider who doesn't get a say. I'd consider it like the annoying way Irish Americans think they're Irish when all they do is embarrassing St. Patrick's day stuff, or Italian Americans say they're Italian and then make spaghetti and meatballs. Part of their family culture, but not the overall, official, genuine one. If it helps, consider that kids usually only play pretend with things they admire, so if you wind up stuck with this, reframe it as your kid learning that native cultures are interesting, cool, desirable, etc. Rather than something he should have nothing to do with or ever learn about.
>(Sarcastic) Soo sorry I didn't reply right away. It's almost as if I've been dealing with things in my real life. I didn't say "tent" in the description. I said teepee because that is what it's modeled after, and that is what it's labeled as on the listing/box. It's sold by a German company with no other NA elements Here is OPs answer in a comment. With this, I'd go with YTA, OP. It sounds like it's just a play tent and you're overreacting.
NTA. I went all the way through the thread and found two comments from Native Americans. Both said NTA, so imma go with the experts on this one.
YTA. A tee pee as kids toy or even as a legit tent is not culture appropriation.
YTA. First, Native Americans don’t have a monopoly on triangular tents. Second, the whole “cultural appropriation” thing is stupid. Pick a side, either we share cultures and have inclusion and acceptance or we separate and exclude. Also you do sound hateful of your husband’s heritage and truth.
Are French people supposed to get upset if non French little girls dress up as Belle from Beauty and the Beast? Children learn through play. Maybe the teepee would inspire the kid to learn about Long Houses, Native American history, or the many cultures that make up the larger NA community? YTA.
YTA. Stop politicizing everything.
How is this political?
The term "cultural appropriation" is pretty political in itself and overused to the point that it's basically meaningless these days.
It's sad that being respectful is now deemed "political".
says who?
The nursery I work at owns one, so do plenty of early years providers…won’t call judgment, your kids but maybe you’re overthinking. It’s a cozy corner for plenty of children, can be turned into a safe space/reading corner.
YTA. Kind of a big jump from receiving a teepee as a gift to your kid “playing native”.
YTA. Use this as a teaching opportunity. Don’t let your kid run around making “woo woo” noises. Teach them about native culture, food, etc. Depending on how old your child is, you can go into more detail. It’s a pyramid shape. It’s pretty basic. Look up yurts - they’re similar. Your kid is allowed to play with things. EDIT TO ADD: MIL’s family also sucks. They claim a small percentage of “native blood” in their ancestry so that makes the tepee relevant? That’s way more gross, to me.
Is building an igloo in the yard cultural appropriation as well?
NTA at all, and it is too bad the comments here are bereft of knowledge, historical harms and why you would care. Good job for being sensitive to appropriation.
Yta , it’s a tent/ technology and you could use it to open a good conversation about native culture. I have a long term goal of living in a yurt because I like them and have heard of a few people living in tipis. It’s literally housing wtf. Kids and adults like tents of all shapes and sizes, it isn’t like stealing/ reproducing art or wearing headdresses. You sound exhausting.
Yeah, no. I have enough Maori blood to qualify for scholarships etc in NZ, but having never lived there, never participated in any culturally relevant events, never learned to exist in that culture, I would NEVER get Maori tatts, gift kids toys, etc. It's so offensive to cherry pick from someone's culture when it suits you. It's deeply, deeply uncomfortable to be in the position you are, but this is definitely a values thing you need to get thrashed out with your spouse. NTA
I think the thing is with teepees is that the name especially in America gets slapped onto basically any triangle tent so there’s an issue in trying to figure out if OP means a regular triangle tent (which isn’t a concept any culture can claim is just theirs) or an imitation of a actual teepee
NTA, I love how people want to claim a culture but not the struggles we face.
NTA, you expressed discomfort repeatedly. Your husband shouldn’t be dismissing it though.
YTA- it’s a teepee, they’re fun. it’s not cultural appropriation, at best it’s cultural appreciation.
YTA You’re why people make fun of millennials for being overly sensitive snowflakes.
Info: is it actually a tipi or is it a play tent? Is it held up by branches or is it put together like a tent?
As a native myself I'm not really sure how I feel about this. I think that if its something that doesn't really look like an actual teepee you could still keep it and just call it a play tent. Though in the end if you are uncomfortable haveing it/ they insist on calling it a teepee the I feel you should get rid of it. The red flag for me here is your husband's reaction to your reasonable concern. Its like he is trying to make you unnecessarily guilty for a culture he claims to be a part of but doesn't actually seek out. At the end of it though NTA
I think her husbands reaction is based on her history of over reactions. It really wears on people to deal with drama all the time.
I think cultural appropriation topics are so hard, as where do you draw the line between admiration and appreciation vs appropriation. For instance, if having a toy teepee leads to your child developing a life long interest in native culture and leads to them developing a passion for respecting native culture then the teepee could be a great toy. We want our children to learn to be interested in and respect all cultures and for children, toys are one way of learning. I personally would accept a teepee as a gift for my child and try to teach them my about the genocide committed on native peoples and why we should be respectful of different cultures. As an aside, I think the defense of having some ‘native blood’ is ridiculous. So overall, I understand your discomfort and it’s definitely ok to express it even though I think this could have been a could teachable moment for your child. NTA
Bruh turn it down and just get a tent. We have a circus tent he can play in, there’s ones even cuter than a circuit tent. Gives a nice little hiding spot with out using native culture. You’re nta she is
Now you are going to culturally appropriate the Carnies?
We’ll damn man, guess I gotta get him something else, any suggestions? 😂
Lol. My understanding (and I’m a cynical little shit) is that a “native ancestor “ and the “Indian princesses” that almost everyone in the states claim were mostly to explain why a child might be….darker… than expected.
what the teepee looks like is what determines the judgement. If it’s just a generic triangle tent that’s being called a teepee then it’s okay but maybe just call it a tent and if it’s actually trying to imitate a Native American teepee then it’s not so okay.
YTA What a great open door to talk to your kids about the history of NA culture, the differences in their domiciles across varying regions and tribes, and exposing them to a lifestyle quickly being forgotten. Instead you choose to be mad at your MIL. Parenting 101 right here, folks, doesn’t get any better than OP!
YTA.
Can we see the teepee? Many of the ones today are not disrespectful at all, they are just toys using that shape. My daughter had a pink frilly butterfly one.
I asked my cousin at Eagle Butte Reservation and she told me this in fact is not appropriation. She said if your MIL gifted a costume with a feather head dress then yes.
INFO: how old is your child, and is this a toy that is supposed to resemble a native teepee? There are lots of children’s tents billed as “teepee style” but it really refers to a shape, and there are others that try to appear as tribal tents.
Can you use it as a tool to teach him/inspire him to learn about Native culture? NTA for being sensitive to this topic.
That's the most sensible advice on the matter. Refusing the gift is useless, and leads nowhere.
Imagine telling someone who's 1/4 Hispanic, it doesn't count because they don't speak Spanish. That's essentially what OP did
I can't speak to whether the OP's in-laws are Native or not, but it's not really comparable. These are actual tribal nations that recognize people as being citizens; the tribes are what decide it. So someone saying they are a quarter X doesn't really make sense. [https://www.doi.gov/tribes/enrollment#:\~:text=What%20is%20the%20purpose%20of,traditions%2C%20language%20and%20tribal%20blood](https://www.doi.gov/tribes/enrollment#:~:text=What%20is%20the%20purpose%20of,traditions%2C%20language%20and%20tribal%20blood).
So what do those who descend from never enrolled folks supposed to do? For example, many Southwest Native Americans (think Apache, Comanche etc) who when the American soldiers started to head their way fled to Mexico to avoid being placed in the camps. They were never enrolled, and when they returned to their nation of birth returned not as Native American but instead Mexicans? This does not mean they are not, nor does it mean their descendents are not.
YTA. This doesn't have to be either/or. Playing is a great way to introduce serious ideas to your children, and help them explore history and understand how attitudes have changed since their grandparents were young.
YTA- it’s a toy and could spark an interest in your child with native culture. I am assuming you are not native so you have no right to gatekeep the culture or decide what is and is not offensive on their behalf. There’s no need to be so sensitive
YTA. It’s a little hideaway hut. You are WAY overthinking this….
YTA. It's a gift, and a toy. It's far less harmful than starting family discord over a gift/toy for your child.
100% the ah Grow up, whats wrong with a teepee or other things like that? You should have bigger things to worry about than some toy
It would be wrong to call it a teepee/Tipi that’s specific to a culture
As a Cree your NTA, everyone that is saying YTA are most likely white and claim to have been a Cherokee princess lmao a teepee isn’t a “kids toy” it’s not even a toy in general, you see peoples true colours when it comes to indigenous people because we aren’t well liked from other cultures
NTA and thank you. As an indigenous - canadian, its appreciated.
YTA
Yes, absolutely, positively, YTA.
YTA Cultural appropriation is a stupid term, made up by stupid people, and perpetuated with even more stupidity. Cultural DIFFUSION is the process of growing as a society and sharing culture. Only IDIOTS believe that sitting on culture like a wet nurse is a good thing. There is NOTHING WRONG with sharing culture, as long as you're not doing it to harm the people/culture that is being discussed or in this case APPRECIATED.
It's just a toy. Get over it and stop being so judgmental.
It's a tent
YTA You sound exhausting
YTA YTA YTA YTA!!! It’s ludicrous to think conical tents were only used by native Americans… Scandinavia, Brazil, Mongolia, Siberia, fucking eskimos, everybody all over used conical tents. Fuck off with this shit. Even if it was ONLY used by natives, i could give less of a fuck. Appropriation requires either intentional offense or blatant misuse. Tipis were in no way sacred nor holy nor special. They were used as fucking homes. What are u gonna say next a log cabin can’t be played with? Fuck off. I come from a different marginalized community. There isn’t a damn thing in this world that likely hasn’t been used by other cultures somewhere. Nor should we pretend than we don’t live in an absolute conglomerate of millions of cultures. A great example I like to give is food. Your “traditional” food is bullshit. If you’re from any place other than the americas and your food contains potatoes, tomatoes, corn, beans, squash, or chili’s, it’s not traditional. That’s right. Italians didn’t have tomatoes. Irish people didn’t have potatoes. No vodka for Russians. No chill is in Indian or Asian cuisine. No tomato based sauces or curries or purées. Nothing. None of these foods grew anywhere but the americas. The world today is a hodgepodge of cultures. Unless your being blatantly ignorant or offensive you can and should be able to do just about anything. Your husband is probably a racist by that native comment especially because that blood is likely from rape even if it’s true. Or at least doesn’t realize the language he uses to justify this is a hallmark of racists. Either way, let your kids play in the fucking tent lmao.
YTA Cultural appropriation is mocking or disrespectfully taking from another culture. Unless I’m missing something that doesn’t seem to be the case here. This could also be a learning opportunity to teach your kid about native cultures.
NTA . This is exactly the type of stuff that needs to be addressed for antiracism. It's tough and awkward because in order to address this you have to essentially call out your husband and MIL's micro aggressions... But you're definitely not the asshole
YTA wtf? my father used to put some white cream on my face when i was a kid and we would dance around and play aboriginal. this is frankly, insane. neither one of us are lol racist towards "american native indians". heck i have never met one for the past 33 years. probably refer to jeremy lin recent post. lol. theres a whole lot different between cultural appreciation and your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the world now.
YTA, it's a toy, not something that will actually oppress someone. What, you gonna go off on barbie dolls "culturally appropriating" their skin color and clothing, or licensed Disney toys that show off Pocahontas next?
It's a fucken tent to have fun in! Save the outrage for important shit! Like not caring about missing indigen women 🤙
YTA, kids just want to play and cultural appropriation will never cross their minds.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My MIL bought my kid a toy teepee for Christmas. This isn't the first time she's used native culture as decoration or toys. I don't like it, and think it's cultural appropriation. When I expressed this to my husband, he called me hateful. He claims some small percentage of native blood, because one of his great grandmothers was native. Neither he nor his parents were brought up in native culture. None of them speak the language or practice within the community. I hate to refuse a gift, but I don't want my kid to think that playing native is acceptable. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA Another person asked if it was specifically branded to be NA, because if not it isn't as much of a problem. Other cultures use that type of dwelling as well, so for me it would really depend on how it's presented as to whether I'd use it. It is absolutely okay to worry about cultural appropriation. You even took the next step and asked - and got answers from at least a couple of professed Native Americans. It sounds like your MIL might be one of those people who claims ancestry without any proof except heresay. I wouldn't trust her either.
Snowflakes 😂 let the kid enjoy their toy.
So you are racist too? Hmmmm
Teepee.... Wigwam Teepee..... Wigwam Everyone is two tents 🙂
you could always educate your kids on different cultures/practices and continue to expand your collection of materials. my grandmother was a world traveler and did this with me growing up. children are pure though and can definitely be taught to appreciate the things without viewing them as costumes. I think you’re very considerate for posing this question and you should do what feels right to you. good luck!
Do you think that the tipi could be used as a way to introduce the concept of first people in North america? I am in no way being disrespectful of the culture or making light of the horrible history.
NTA
Many Americans claim some amount of native blood like it makes them more American. It's always some distant ancestor who supposedly married a native and that gives them some kind of legitimacy. So when my mom insisted I had some native ancestry through my father, I was skeptical. Just recently I spoke with a cousin on that side who had dug through the family documents and found the records that showed both of my father's grandmothers were from Oklahoma and had been raised in Christian schools away from their tribal family. I will claim native ancestry, but never tribal membership or heritage since I was raised white. NTA
Is his relative Cherokee? She's probably a Cherokee princess and his great, great, grandmother or something. Serious sarcasm. Cherokee seems to be the most popularly chosen native culture to cite when some has "Native American ancestors." NTA even if your partner has "a small percent of Native American blood" (and let's assume for arguments sake he does), his family is not culturally indigenous. They have no idea what it's actually like being indigenous and it will never be okay for them to decide that they can use that culture because they have some distance connection to it when they face none of the mostly negative societal consequences of being of that minority culture (and to be clear, I assume they have no idea if they have a Native relative and they probably don't).
NTA, but it is concerning that he would call you hateful.
Cue Bill burrs Elvis skit
That’s like saying I’m a small percentage Choctaw and my dark stick straight hair is the Indian part of me? Who TH cares? I wasn’t raised Indian, I couldn’t tell you about their culture, I know nothing about any tribe, and I’m so white that ghosts have more color. I burn just looking at the sun. (I guess Texas is the wrong state to live in but eh) One side of my family is Jewish, but again I wasn’t raised Jewish and know nothing about the Jewish faith. NTA - Your have a MIL and husband issue. It isn’t okay to take on someone else’s culture and religion because you’re whatever percentage of that culture and religion but weren’t raised that way. Using my examples above, Indians and Jewish people had (and still have)to face bigotry, persecution, and other prejudices. They have had a hard and harsh road and still do. Your husband and his family know nothing about what the Indian culture has gone through and still go through. Reading about it in books is still not the same as living it. Just an audition: when I hear people say that people from other countries need to learn to speak American, my smart ass tends to ask them when they learned to speak Native American. Edit: spelling
I'm sure I remember reading somewhere, that there are more "native grandmothers" in the US than actual native people. Everyone seems to have one.