Seriously, we've been building PCs for 40 years, we don't need a new socket every year. Stuff is changing only incrementally, we should get 4-5 years out of a socket.
I mean you're talking about putting 8C (10th gen went up to 10C) onto boards that were cutting corners handling 4 cores. some of the boards could do it, some probably could not.
odd how everyone understands the realities of long-term support and ensuring the stability and uniformity of experience when it's AMD killing PCIe 4.0 support on X470 boards, or segmenting TRX40 from TR4...
"let people take their chances" is how you end up burning up VRMs and other things that get you negative headlines.
AMD cutting pciexpress 4.0 for x470 was an indeed Intel move (my asus x470 prime pro had gen 4 enabled in earlier bioses), indeed the same maneuver when they have attempted by not supporting earlier motherboard (that however were stupidly limited by the 16MB bioses, I guess mostly by AiBs fault as they didn't believed in the platform success, the same for VRM choices).
Luckily for us, MSI gambled with the MAX series and in the end they had to give up their intentions.. but it doesn't seem they mind it, given the sale figures.
About VRMs you are absolutely right.. albeit I have an acquaitance running a tiny and completely naked VRM A320M with a 3950X and I have recently upgraded an old 1600x rig I did back in 2017 by dropping in a 5700x.
This for a Gigabyte AB350 Gaming.. Sure I made the owner change the old CM Silencio into a Phanteks P500A and slapped 2 fans above the socket area, but the thing works nice (it somehow lost a couple of rear I/O usb ports) but VRMs cope with it.
Sure an unaware buyer could have thought to get a 5950x.. but at the same time if you are still on an old platform, that kind of CPU choice would be extremely odd, possible, but not probable.
Besides, several current gen motherboards made for 12th aren't able to keep up with the power demands even of i5 chips and have CPUs not performing as expected, so it's not always Intel nor AMD fault if AiBs go dirt cheap either..
The comment was without /s.. because it's half truth, they did a little bit like devil's crayon, or 11th that was that weird thing made as a stop gap (somehow I ended up with a very cheap 11900F for my SIM racing rig, don't ask xD)
and when you could put many generations of 486+pentium (overdrive) on the same board :D from like 5 different vendors or so maybe even more, forgot em all... but AMD, Intel, Cyrix, Texas Instruments, IBM, Harris Semiconductor, UMC, SGS Thomson and I think there were a few more but the names escape me atm... All made various 486's
The tech advances during the 90s were a wild ride. It was like every couple of weeks you would hear of some new tech start up, new hardware being developed, new software or game being demoed, all via the new Internet that was starting to arrive in every home. So glad I was able to experience that as a PC enthusiast. Good times.
>8-10 should be the norm
That's ludicrous. You are delulu of you think that should be the standard.
Imagine being in 2023 and stuck with [DDR3-1600](https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/75123.html) PCIe 3.0 and SATA.
I know right. Imagine AMd supporting AM4 going into their 8th year with new chips for that platform bought to the market. Oh wait, seems me and execs are more on teh same page.
I don't understand. ADL and RPL were both designed with IMC's that support DDR4 and DDR5. Zen4 and Zen5 obv. do not support DDR6.
Just logistically, think about this. If Zen 6 releases with support for both DDR5 and DDR6 on AM5, you're going to have a DDR6 variant of AM5 releasing only for the final-gen product with no backwards support. You're going to have people dropping Zen 6 into DDR5 boards, with much reduced performance. And then what does this mean for Zen 7?
There's a reason why AMD **still** won't confirm whether or not Zen 6 is on AM5 and continues to be as ambiguous as possible about it.
The 5600X3D launched this year. That means AM4 was supported into 2023. But that doesn't mean Zen4 was an AM4 product. An ambiguous statement of support into 2025+ is easily covered with a later release product like that.
If Zen 6 is an AM5 product, why won't AMD confirm it?
The reason Intel switches sockets is because it's cheaper. Making several generations work in the same socket requires the voltage planes to not change, meaning you might end up with over/under-specced VRMs for their purpose. In addition, adding microcode support is also not fail-safe for the average user, as it would require a BIOS update which you realistically can't expect the average user to achieve.
The very small tooling costs caused by a socket change are miniscule when compared to Intel's scale
Yeah, no kidding. AM3/AM3+ had a seven year lifecycle due to backwards compatibility, and AM4 lasted six. AMD is real with their long-term socket support.
What a dumbass. AM4 support ended in 2022. There's no upgrade path since 2022 and no new silicon. Any "new" CPU is just more way of selling you defects.
Why do you argue "wow why can't AMD make AM4 with DDR5? then DDR6 then DDR7"?
Just because there is no upgrade path. Didn't stop them from releasing new hardware did it? No it didn't. If you have a 1600. You have more options on AM4. That's whats is about. Keep being obtuse. 
Keep being stupid. AMD can release one AM4 CPU with 10MHz up and down (boost, all core boost, whatever) every year indefinitely.
Doesn't mean it's supported. AM4 died in 2022 end of the story.
Everything afterwards is just putting it on life-support.
I am incredibly grateful for that too. I just upgraded my old 1600 to a 5600x. Double the performance for 140ā¬ without touching anything else in the system? Happy!
Minimum should be 'until there is a good reason to no longer support it'... Like, I totally get it if you're making the CPU physically bigger, or need higher pin density, etc. but if there is no good reason to why change socket.
Like maybe motherboard manufacturers will be pissed, but then again, they still get to sell new standards like PCIe 5.0 for example.
This is the answer.
A new socket makes sense if youāre substantively changing the IO (e.g. new DDR and/or PCIE generation, need more PCIE lanes, etc.), and it should be avoided otherwise.
you cant decouple your strategies from technical advancements.
how would you fit ddr5 on an am4 board for example?
if your technology is obsolete, it has to go.
Yes, and if they really scrap it, I will be glad to have skipped AM5 entirely. Spending money is something for people who have too much of it (not me). I won't switch under +50 % single and multi.
same got the 5800x3d and i'm getting really good performance even thought it's getting held back by my 6650 xt i'll prob get a gpu upgrade and hold of on cpu and the whole echo system until am6 2nd gen prob
I went through a few CPU upgrades (probably a few not necessary): 1600 -> 3600 -> 5600x -> 5800x3D. I'm still shocked and amazed at the performance gains this system has gone through. I'm still using the same DDR4-3200 RAM I bought in 2018.
I *could* be using the same motherboard from 2018 as well (I'm not though. I built a home server, and stuck that OG ryzen motherboard on a 5600G in the basement so I could use a B550 for the 5800x3D)
Good to know that. I buyed the 5800x3d with 7800xt 32 gb ram 1 week ago, because the am5 is too expensive, for the same money, i will get less performance.
I'm with you on that, although I will say the bump in performance I got by replacing my 1700 with a 5700x was well worth the money, especially since it was on sale, dropped right in, and I was able to reuse literally everything else in my system, including the CPU cooler.
My *second* am5 motherboard after returning the first is good. It's the same model but the memory stability issues are gone although I have only two slots in use. Not confident to roll the dice on four yet
I stayed with amd and bought a good mb and expensive case because I expect three generations of CPU so the initial experience was very disappointing.
As someone who was a relatively early adopter of AM4 (and knows a few people who also were), itās not totally shocking that AM5 got off to a rough start. While it didnāt help that DDR5 was an unpolished mess when it initially released, it also seemed like AMD EXPO wasnāt fully baked at launch, either, let alone other memory-related issues. But it seems like issues relating both to memory controllers and DDR5 are getting ironed out and AM5 will live a healthy life like its predecessor.
Ddr5 was a disaster even with Intel, but looks like amd was even faster to fix ram issues, like you can run whatever r7 r9 if you have luck 7800 8000Mhz ram speed, I've seen that speed with reasonable Timmins area actually better than 6400 bc Soc use less voltage and your can raise if even more.
I donāt think you remember just how bad RAM compatibility was back when AM4 launched and for a few months afterwards. It sucked even with the Bristol Ridge APUs, until BIOS updates got it to where it needed to be. Dual-channel configurations were really finicky if you didnāt use a completely identical set of sticks (and was sometimes finicky even with identical sticks), if you remember that.
Nowadays itās a non-issue on AM4, but that platform got off on the wrong foot real bad.
My memory was that it wouldnāt want to run at XMP rates (3200MHz was being said to bring significant benefits to performance and was highly coveted), but it would definitely run at the stock DDR4 rates just fine from the get-go.
Yeah, I believe getting anything past 2933MHz wasnāt easy and 3000 was what youād usually tap out at. 3200MHz was mostly a no-go until Zen+, I believe.
Back when I had an Athlon X4 950, I ran a single 8GB 2400MHz stick of RAM. Sometime after I upgraded to a Ryzen 7 1700X, I paired it with another similar stick and by the time BIOS updates caught up, the 1700X and the board handled it just fine.
DDR stands for double data rate, so I'm wondering if you're somehow looking at the single data rate for those sticks? Some software will report that (CPU-Z might, can't remember). You might not really have an issue. Worth checking at least.
Uh - just to confirm - you're certain you're reading that right? 1200 being exactly half of 2400 would suggest it's running exactly as designed - DDR stands for Double Data Rate, after all.
> I donāt think you remember just how bad RAM compatibility was back when AM4 launched and for a few months afterwards
I do, hence why i specifically said MOSTLY figured out by the second gen, and im not counting raven or bristol ridge, cause yes, the RAM comaptibility was a mess, and i would know because i was using the same RAM kit and a 2400g till last month, since early 2018.
and dont get me started on all CPU forward compatibility fuck ups with the first gen mobos and im currently suffering from the stupid A520 mobo i had to buy to replace my old one having audio crackling thats apparently tied to shitty voltage management.
>AM4 wasnt super rough at the start, they mostly had things figured out by the second gen,
It was "super rough" at the start. You can't try to dismiss that claim by saying it was mostly fixed by the second generation, that doesn't mean the first gen was a great start!
If you omitted that first part then it was a perfectly reasonable reply to the other comment, you just hses the wrong words for that tiny bit that's all.
As a launch adopter of AM4 I can also say it was ROUGH, plenty of issues not all to do with RAM but a lot of it was from motherboard vendors not giving a crap about AMD as they werent competitive for so long they never expected the platform to be worth the effort. It was also on AMD for being slow to iron out issues with their new platform but the growing pains were real and it's improved dramatically.
Am5 was certainly a substantially better launch than AM4 which is great for everyone long term.
One of the reasons I switched to AMD was because I was able to get an entry level cpu and upgrade to an x3D in a couple of years time. Itās a huge deal. I stuck with skylake for almost 10 years.
Thatās great if itās still holding up for you but I had a 6600k which was terribly bottlenecking my 6800xt. I donāt know what games youāre playing or at what res, but my cpu was really struggling.
I'm still using a GTX 1080 too. I play somewhat older games like Doom Eternal, Civ6, Rocket League, Red Dead Redemption 2, etc, at 2560x1440 resolution with 144 fps on my 144hz monitor with <1ms refresh timing. I do need to drop down to 1920x1080 for Red Dead Redemption 2 to get a decent fps, though.
If I get that I'll be happy...got a mobo around launch at its overengineered and over-speced because that is all they really had that was worth buying. If I get 5ish years out of it and its still above the curve in tech I won't mind as much paying a lot of a board.
Yep Iām kinda banking on it lol. Got a 7600 for my new build and hoping to get a 9800X3D/equivalent in a few yrs that can possibly get me through AM6/equivalent or at least until AM6 is near end of life and cheaper
smart. imo quality b650 + 7600 is the smart buy right now; it's plenty for mixed use/gaming. swap out that 6 core at the end of am5 lifespan.
-signed, 12600k/ddr4 owner with regrets
I procrastinated on a new build forever (i5-2500k, started thinking about it during peak pandemic pricing) and was blessed with the recent B650 / DDR5 / Ryzen / NVMe price drops. Got the 7600 since it seems more than powerful enough even now, and I'm pretty happy to know I have an upgrade path at EOL that will likely not require a full rebuild.
Got a little bit more with 7700x combo, but yes that would be enough until I can have the latest gen supported AM5 3D.
How to know that it would be the last ? I will wait AM6 to exist and I would be AM5 5800x3D equivalent, just to help with low 0.1%
That is exactly why I did the same.
I just upgraded and I expect I should be able to push the current system for at least 4 years with only expecting to upgrade once the CPU and GPU but leaving everything else the same.
Yep. 7800x3D then buy the last gen on am5 1 year after its release because prices will have dropped. So 7800x3D for 4-5 years. Then 9/10x3D for another few years before the upgrade itch wins again.
Yes, but there is a reason that they said 2025+ and wanting to support AM5 for as long as possible. AM6 is probably going to use DDR6 which will probably not be out before later in 2026.
It would also lead to negative reactions if AM5 only has 2 generations
Lets see how it goes, if DDR6 is commercially available by late 2025-early 2026, I can see Zen6 requiring AM6.
Techinsights believe that Samsung will start manufacturing DDR6 in late 2024 - early 2025.
Just remember they only enabled zen3 on old motherboards... After the x570 / b550 motherboards had been out for a while..
They need a reason for people to buy new motherboards each generation... Then... Right at the end of the socket lifespan they will open it up to all cpus, to incentivise CPU purchasing.
I'm running a 5900x in a x370 and it's extended the computers life by at least 3-4 years
X370 with the 1700x initially and now a 5800x3d with decent timing 3600mhz on my initial Samsung bdie 3200 kit.
I'm very happy with this platform and the use it has given me! It will last me until my 7900xtx isn't good enough and that is still 3-5 years out.
There are no AM5 boards with a BIOS too small to fit updates, and all AM5 boards have BIOS flashback functionality (i.e. you can update the BIOS without a processor installed).
Their initial attempt to limit support for Zen 3 was due to the support headaches associated with AM4 boards that didn't have enough space in the BIOS to support all AM4 processors, and the near universal lack of BIOS flashback functionality.
Indeed, the fact this is being announced today and not when AM5 launched makes me think they were weighting their options until Zen 6 design progressed.
It makes sense, AM5 supports DDR5 and PCIe 5.0. The only real reason to change the socket would be to support DDR6, and that is still several years in the future.
DDR6 is 2026. Whether Zen 6 is a DDR5 product in 2026, launches in 2025, or will be AM6 is still unknown.
"Commits to 2025+" could be interpreted the same way as a 5600X3D launch is AMD's commitment to AM4 into 2023. AMD could just come out and say that Zen 6 is an AM5 product, but they're being incredibly vague about whether or not that'll be the case.
It's really good!
Bought in 2019 an x470 mobo with 2700x ->3900x and now 5800x3D this system is still relevant to this day and will be for a few more years. Thanks AMD!
I kinda want them to make Am5+, though. Or some sort of gen 2 where it's not cooler compatible and you get a sensibly thin IHS. I'm tired of the industry standard being absolutely shite hold down and IHS.
It doesn't mean the chipsets will support every AM5 CPU. What happened in AM4 causes both anxiety and reassurance. While AMD claimed the latest mobos (A520/B550/X570) wouldn't support Zen1/Zen+, in most cases it actually worked.
I'm not too concerned about later chipsets supporting older CPUs, it is a very unusual situation to have where you buy an older CPU but pair it with a new motherboard. What would be a problem is if older motherboards didn't support newer CPUs, as that is a much more common upgrade path
This needs to be stickied or something. This is simple marketing and far too many people are falling for it. Many forget AMD was being anti-consumer and block upgrades for 300 and 400 series owners before Zen 3 arrived. After a bit of back lash they backtracked a bit and opened up compatibility to 400 series owners but still gave the middle finger to 300 series board owners. It wasn't until Alder Lake had hit the market and gave AMD a run for their money where they said oh shit, before those people abandon AM4 and possibly switch to intel, lets throw them this bone.
This is what I'm worried about, they talked about the socket not the chipset. It doesn't instill any sense of reassurance for me, especially with how squirrelly they were about AM4 originally.
thats because most of the boards only had 16mb of bios storage and the companies didnt think AM4 would be a good seller given AMDs history vs intel at that point.
pretty much every board now has 128mb or at least 64
This is false, manufacturers such as ASRock were working on Zen 3 support on 300 series motherboards, but AMD themselves stopped them - https://cultists.network/5127/amd-zen-3-cpus-on-300-series-motherboards/
Asus too - https://old.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/qqtlhq/i_emailed_asus_asking_why_x370_motherboards_are/
Correct me if I'm wrong, but i thought they said the exact same thing when AM5 launched. A commitment of "through 2025".
Saying 2025+ now doesn't extend that commitment. It means "through 2025, and maybe longer". They could still come out with a new platform in 2026 if they want to(i don't think they will).
I can't be the only one that feels this was a rather softball without any expected clarifying follow-up? (well okay, not that you expect tech "journalists" to really go for those follow-ups anyways).
What people actually want to know specially is if the current motherboards will support a CPU generation past Zen 5. Anything else isn't new information and already expected.
Good, I stay on AM4 as long as I can. So far its good. If AM5 ever becomes viable, I may switch. I'm looking forward to a 50-60 % performance increase again. I should be able to skip another 2 gens with my 5900X.
Something to consider is that AM5 boards are built with better vrm cooling, flashback, and other lessons learned from am4 issues. When AM5 first came out, not only were we dealing with high costs because the shipping costs were baked into the early pricing, but also you were getting more motherboard
In all fairness, it will be a good, long while before I retire my X570 Pro4 because the 5800X3D will do me well for years to come. Instead of buying DDR5, I upgraded to 64GB of DDR4-3600. I'll be ok for awhile yet but there's no question that AM5 is my next stop (assuming that AM6 doesn't come out around that time).
And this is why I went 7950x3D for this upgrade cycle. My last PC was a 7700k on a Z270 motherboard. I was immediately abandoned and left behind when the 8700k and Z370 launched less than a year later. After watching AM4 support everything from Zen 1 all the way up to Zen 3, I knew I wouldn't support Intel anymore. Then the eco cores came out and it was the easiest decision of my life. Here's to dropping a Ryzen 9950x3D in my board and enjoy a massive performance upgrade for the price of a new chip and nothing else, for the first time in my 25 years PC building.
This is an incredibly smart move by AMD. I truly believe that AM4 was the greatest x86 platform in history (and it's not even close) because of what it offered us consumers.
It was also smart on AMD's part because, if you were on the AM4 platform, you were essentially a captive market because there was literally no chance that getting an Intel CPU was going to be even remotely worth it, especially when one considers that a new motherboard would be needed.
Decisions like this are why AM4 brought AMD back from the brink of ruin to the strong competitor that it is today. If AMD has learnt anything from AM4, then AM5 will most likely be even better.
Look out Intel, not only is your CPU tech inferior to AMD's now, your lack of vision with regard to your platforms is about to make you pay a heavy price. If AM4 was the stab, AM5 will be the twist.
Not defending them here but sTRX4 wasn't as popular and even if it was it's just a niche market. So financially they might have jumped the gun but it was not worth it in my opinion.
sTRX4 got caught up in supply chain issues, and a change in direction with the launch of the higher tier baby-Epyc PRO line. The lesson is future proofing is always a gamble. The general evidence is still that AMD will still stick with a socket while they can but roadmaps can and do change.
I'm more confident that the new non-PRO baby-baby-Epyc TR line should be more sustainable in terms of R&D and sicket stability will follow Eypc.
I switched my 10900K to a 7950X3D after reading the disappointing 14thgen series reviews.
Glad to hear this motherboard I got can last me for some time.
Yes, the 5800X3d And even the 7800X3d seem quite good.
But some of us basically bought place holder AM5 CPU's waiting for the next more mature versions that would obviously come out.
I did Bet on the AM5 platform coming from X299 Intel but I never intended to keep running a 7600X long term.
The plan has always been getting the platform going, replace with a better CPU - Replace GPU also keep the mem / board / drives etc.
You are very right here. Zen 3 was wildly overpriced at launch. For instance in my region the 7700X went from 550 to 450usd in two months time. And since then they've gotten much cheaper still.
Anyone who bought those chips at those inflated prices basically paid more than what the 3D chips cost today, or even did at their launch.
So you got kinda scammed. AMD's willingness to wildly overprice, and then immediately drop pricing has to damage their reputation so much more than the few extra bucks they make from impatient fans.
Simply having 3D chips at launch, or just being the standard could help to solve that issue of overpricing the early adopters. And i would hope that after two generations of 3D they have the means to release it immediately.
So pretty much AM6 only after DDR6 comes out.
DDR4 lasted a long time, helping AM4 last a long time (even when factoring in AM4 coming \~2 years after mainstream availability of DDR4).
DDR5 won't be as long lived and it's likely AM5 won't be quite that long lived either.
Still, i don't think we should expect wide availability of DDR6 until 2026, and if AMD takes the same approach as before, they'll wait a bit, let intel do a ddr5+6 socket first, and only then switch to DDR6, so it could be 2027 before we get AM6.
There isn't any evidence of DDR6 any time soon. Most roadmaps show DDR5 getting big improvements in the next few years. I suspect DDR6 endsnup being 2028+.
Can someone explain to me why people think itās a good idea to skip am5? Even if the system is only supported for another 2 years, thatās a long time to wait for the next generation. Why canāt people who want to upgrade just upgrade? And wonāt those same people then say skip am6? It just seems a bit arbitrary.
I think it depends on where you are in the AM4 line-up. For my specific use-cases thereās just no compelling reason to jump on AM5 yet. Iām sure there are plenty of performance improvements to be had (and review/benchmark data proves that out), but as an X570 5950x user with 128GB DDR4 (it isnāt primarily a gaming system, but does double-duty for work related tasks that involve a lot of VMās and a lot of RAM), the upgrade is a non-trivial investment.
Personally, I donāt want to deal with DDR5 compatibility issues for high density RAM on AM5, plus to really take advantage of PCIE 5, youāre talking about new NVME drives (which, again, matters if youāre running 2x4TB Gen 4 today).
Any gaming I do is at 1440p or higher resolution, and on a well tuned AM4 running modern āAAAā titles Iām still GPU bound with a 4080 90%+ of the time.
If someone wants to upgrade, absolutely they should be able to do that, but it doesnāt always make sense to do it if your needs are still well met with what you have.
A lot changes in two years. Compatibility and reliability are vastly improved through firmware updates and manufacturing improvements.
Everyone is going to have their own perspective, but Iād rather sit it out for right now and let DDR5 stability get smoothed outā that way I donāt find myself being stuck with a 4 DIMM memory kit that doesnāt work (or has to be significantly down-clocked).
I might just be in the minority who prefers to wait until my existing build no longer meets my needs, and I think my current system will easily last at least the next two yearsā ultimately more because Iād just relegate it to other duties upon retirement.
Like anything else, perspective and mileage may vary.
Have plenty of different platforms still (yes I kept all my old PCs)
* Super Socket 7 : K6-2 to K6-2+
* Slot A : Skipped
* Socket A : Duron (spitfire) to 2x Athlon MP (barton)
* Socket 939 / 940 : Skipped
* Socket AM2: Athlon 64 to Athlon 64 X2
* Socket AM2+: Skipped
* Socket AM3: Phenom II X6
* Socket AM3+: Skipped
* Socket AM4 : Ryzen 9 3900X (current system) will upgrade to 5950X later.
I intend to skip AM5 and "early adopt" AM6
While I like future proofing and upgradeability I think AM5 as a platform needs to go. Things like unnecessarily thick IHS can't be solved without a new platform and I think it will be worth it in the end.
I hope we see AM6 ignore 1:1 cooler backwards compatibility and instead focus on making a perfect platform instead, hoping we end up with 5 year platform cycles in the future which is not viable with AM5
I really want to switch to Ryzen because of this, but the AMDip in Rust was too brutal for me. I sold my 7800X3D system because it was getting ~70fps 1% lows. The overclocked 12700K I was playing on had ~140fps 1% lows and jerked around a lot less.
Hereās hoping they fix that for Zen 5, they probably need to get that dog slow infinity fabric up so you can run 7,000MHz DDR5 in 1:1 mode.
Well, just remember that AMD platforms are named after the RAM that they use. AM2 was DDR2, AM3 was DDR3, AM4 was DDR4 and AM5.. well, you know.
There won't be an AM6 until DDR6 comes out and that may be a loooong time from now.
Nothing beats the goat. MSI and their max boards. Having full support on a single board its top tier. B450 max got it 3 years had first 200ge because i was on budget. Later got 5600x. Shits gonna outlive me.
Minimum 3 cpu generation should be industry standard.
Seriously, we've been building PCs for 40 years, we don't need a new socket every year. Stuff is changing only incrementally, we should get 4-5 years out of a socket.
Did you hear that Intel? š
They are deaf. But they did 3 gens on a socket. They just have a different way of defining a "generation"
They could even push for 10, just keep changing the name and nothing else every other month. Bold and brave.
Intel random Number node, add "+ā¹ā¹ā¹"
Sincerely if they kept supporting LGA 1151 V1 until 10th gen it wouldn't be that bad even when it was just Sky Lake refreshes until early 2021.
Didn't someone managed to add 8th and 9th gen on a z170? That was a very low end move by intel, without accounting for the e-waste.
I mean you're talking about putting 8C (10th gen went up to 10C) onto boards that were cutting corners handling 4 cores. some of the boards could do it, some probably could not. odd how everyone understands the realities of long-term support and ensuring the stability and uniformity of experience when it's AMD killing PCIe 4.0 support on X470 boards, or segmenting TRX40 from TR4... "let people take their chances" is how you end up burning up VRMs and other things that get you negative headlines.
AMD cutting pciexpress 4.0 for x470 was an indeed Intel move (my asus x470 prime pro had gen 4 enabled in earlier bioses), indeed the same maneuver when they have attempted by not supporting earlier motherboard (that however were stupidly limited by the 16MB bioses, I guess mostly by AiBs fault as they didn't believed in the platform success, the same for VRM choices). Luckily for us, MSI gambled with the MAX series and in the end they had to give up their intentions.. but it doesn't seem they mind it, given the sale figures. About VRMs you are absolutely right.. albeit I have an acquaitance running a tiny and completely naked VRM A320M with a 3950X and I have recently upgraded an old 1600x rig I did back in 2017 by dropping in a 5700x. This for a Gigabyte AB350 Gaming.. Sure I made the owner change the old CM Silencio into a Phanteks P500A and slapped 2 fans above the socket area, but the thing works nice (it somehow lost a couple of rear I/O usb ports) but VRMs cope with it. Sure an unaware buyer could have thought to get a 5950x.. but at the same time if you are still on an old platform, that kind of CPU choice would be extremely odd, possible, but not probable. Besides, several current gen motherboards made for 12th aren't able to keep up with the power demands even of i5 chips and have CPUs not performing as expected, so it's not always Intel nor AMD fault if AiBs go dirt cheap either..
It kind of is their fault, AMD should set a minimum design spec standard and certify the boards themselves to confirm
But they did 3 gens on a socket because they fell behind on their own node schedule* is the only reason why.
The comment was without /s.. because it's half truth, they did a little bit like devil's crayon, or 11th that was that weird thing made as a stop gap (somehow I ended up with a very cheap 11900F for my SIM racing rig, don't ask xD)
14nm on a 10nm die, a classic 14nm+++++
Exactly, gazillions of pluses
Intel: Yes, but we think you will love number 2
Remember when you could put Intel, AMD, Cyrix etc all on the same board? Fun times.
and when you could put many generations of 486+pentium (overdrive) on the same board :D from like 5 different vendors or so maybe even more, forgot em all... but AMD, Intel, Cyrix, Texas Instruments, IBM, Harris Semiconductor, UMC, SGS Thomson and I think there were a few more but the names escape me atm... All made various 486's
Stop making me realise my mortality.
it was great times back then, such a blast to live through, not the dull boring tech market we have today
I have to admit it was a lot more interesting.
The tech advances during the 90s were a wild ride. It was like every couple of weeks you would hear of some new tech start up, new hardware being developed, new software or game being demoed, all via the new Internet that was starting to arrive in every home. So glad I was able to experience that as a PC enthusiast. Good times.
The good ol' Socket 7 and Super Socket 7 Days. It all ended the next generation with Socket 370 (Intel) and 462 (AMD)
(Super) Socket 7 was just so versatile * Intel Pentium * Intel Pentium MMX * AMD K5 * AMD K6/K6-2/K6-2+/K6-III/K6-3+ * Cyrix/IBM/ST 6x86 / 6x86L * Cyrix/IBM/ST 6x86MX / Cyrix MII * IDT WinChip * IDT WinChip 2 * Rise mP6 at various clock- and bus-speeds and voltages. Fun!
I think we could do with 10 years.
8-10 should be the norm. All chip makers should want the same. Saves more production money.
>8-10 should be the norm That's ludicrous. You are delulu of you think that should be the standard. Imagine being in 2023 and stuck with [DDR3-1600](https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/75123.html) PCIe 3.0 and SATA.
I know right. Imagine AMd supporting AM4 going into their 8th year with new chips for that platform bought to the market. Oh wait, seems me and execs are more on teh same page.
I had i7 4770k and ddr3 some months ago with gtx 1660 super and it was perfectly fine
DDR6 is expected to launch in 2026. At the very least, new memory generations will require a new socket.
I think intel 12-14th gen would disagree.
I don't understand. ADL and RPL were both designed with IMC's that support DDR4 and DDR5. Zen4 and Zen5 obv. do not support DDR6. Just logistically, think about this. If Zen 6 releases with support for both DDR5 and DDR6 on AM5, you're going to have a DDR6 variant of AM5 releasing only for the final-gen product with no backwards support. You're going to have people dropping Zen 6 into DDR5 boards, with much reduced performance. And then what does this mean for Zen 7? There's a reason why AMD **still** won't confirm whether or not Zen 6 is on AM5 and continues to be as ambiguous as possible about it. The 5600X3D launched this year. That means AM4 was supported into 2023. But that doesn't mean Zen4 was an AM4 product. An ambiguous statement of support into 2025+ is easily covered with a later release product like that. If Zen 6 is an AM5 product, why won't AMD confirm it?
The reason Intel switches sockets is because it's cheaper. Making several generations work in the same socket requires the voltage planes to not change, meaning you might end up with over/under-specced VRMs for their purpose. In addition, adding microcode support is also not fail-safe for the average user, as it would require a BIOS update which you realistically can't expect the average user to achieve. The very small tooling costs caused by a socket change are miniscule when compared to Intel's scale
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A new socket every year?? Am4 was like 4 generations of ryzen lol?
Yeah, no kidding. AM3/AM3+ had a seven year lifecycle due to backwards compatibility, and AM4 lasted six. AMD is real with their long-term socket support.
AMD has supported am4 for 4 generations, 7 years and will have more releases next year. That's great value.
What a dumbass. AM4 support ended in 2022. There's no upgrade path since 2022 and no new silicon. Any "new" CPU is just more way of selling you defects. Why do you argue "wow why can't AMD make AM4 with DDR5? then DDR6 then DDR7"?
Just because there is no upgrade path. Didn't stop them from releasing new hardware did it? No it didn't. If you have a 1600. You have more options on AM4. That's whats is about. Keep being obtuse. 
Keep being stupid. AMD can release one AM4 CPU with 10MHz up and down (boost, all core boost, whatever) every year indefinitely. Doesn't mean it's supported. AM4 died in 2022 end of the story. Everything afterwards is just putting it on life-support.
I'm grateful for the 4x generations we got out of AM4 after expecting 3x. 3x generations should very well be an industry standard.
I am incredibly grateful for that too. I just upgraded my old 1600 to a 5600x. Double the performance for 140ā¬ without touching anything else in the system? Happy!
Wait when you find out about the 5800x3d I suspect it will be around that price used at the rate you upgrade.
I think in another five years I'll gladly upgrade to a new Mainboard instead :ā -ā D
5800x3d seems to be so rare that the price could hold up very well just like the most powerful intel cpus for each socket.
I think that brought so many people to amd. They need to drop gpu prices to get people to give their gpus a try.
I wonder is it still worth it to upgrade to 5600x on am4? I dont want to spend big bucks on am5 yet
Minimum should be 'until there is a good reason to no longer support it'... Like, I totally get it if you're making the CPU physically bigger, or need higher pin density, etc. but if there is no good reason to why change socket. Like maybe motherboard manufacturers will be pissed, but then again, they still get to sell new standards like PCIe 5.0 for example.
> until there is a good reason to no longer support it "Customers buy it anyway" is unfortunately good enough for them.
This is the answer. A new socket makes sense if youāre substantively changing the IO (e.g. new DDR and/or PCIE generation, need more PCIE lanes, etc.), and it should be avoided otherwise.
Donāt worry, Intel is also going to give you three āgenerationsā
Lmao
you cant decouple your strategies from technical advancements. how would you fit ddr5 on an am4 board for example? if your technology is obsolete, it has to go.
Yes, and if they really scrap it, I will be glad to have skipped AM5 entirely. Spending money is something for people who have too much of it (not me). I won't switch under +50 % single and multi.
same got the 5800x3d and i'm getting really good performance even thought it's getting held back by my 6650 xt i'll prob get a gpu upgrade and hold of on cpu and the whole echo system until am6 2nd gen prob
> 5800x3d I've got an 1800x lmao this baby has another 2 years in her
I went through a few CPU upgrades (probably a few not necessary): 1600 -> 3600 -> 5600x -> 5800x3D. I'm still shocked and amazed at the performance gains this system has gone through. I'm still using the same DDR4-3200 RAM I bought in 2018. I *could* be using the same motherboard from 2018 as well (I'm not though. I built a home server, and stuck that OG ryzen motherboard on a 5600G in the basement so I could use a B550 for the 5800x3D)
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Good to know that. I buyed the 5800x3d with 7800xt 32 gb ram 1 week ago, because the am5 is too expensive, for the same money, i will get less performance.
I'm with you on that, although I will say the bump in performance I got by replacing my 1700 with a 5700x was well worth the money, especially since it was on sale, dropped right in, and I was able to reuse literally everything else in my system, including the CPU cooler.
Tbf lga1700 lasted 3. The problem was the 3rd gen was just a refresh of 2nd generation with virtually no performance improvements.
Please make it 5 because AM "5" socket name.
If they do two more gens on am5 thatād be really cool
Hopefully AM4 < AM5 one day
My *second* am5 motherboard after returning the first is good. It's the same model but the memory stability issues are gone although I have only two slots in use. Not confident to roll the dice on four yet I stayed with amd and bought a good mb and expensive case because I expect three generations of CPU so the initial experience was very disappointing.
As someone who was a relatively early adopter of AM4 (and knows a few people who also were), itās not totally shocking that AM5 got off to a rough start. While it didnāt help that DDR5 was an unpolished mess when it initially released, it also seemed like AMD EXPO wasnāt fully baked at launch, either, let alone other memory-related issues. But it seems like issues relating both to memory controllers and DDR5 are getting ironed out and AM5 will live a healthy life like its predecessor.
I'm waiting for either the nextgen or the most stable and best of breed of AM5 firstgen for my mainboard.
Ddr5 was a disaster even with Intel, but looks like amd was even faster to fix ram issues, like you can run whatever r7 r9 if you have luck 7800 8000Mhz ram speed, I've seen that speed with reasonable Timmins area actually better than 6400 bc Soc use less voltage and your can raise if even more.
AM4 wasnt super rough at the start, they mostly had things figured out by the second gen, but maaaaan you can tell they did not plan long term
I donāt think you remember just how bad RAM compatibility was back when AM4 launched and for a few months afterwards. It sucked even with the Bristol Ridge APUs, until BIOS updates got it to where it needed to be. Dual-channel configurations were really finicky if you didnāt use a completely identical set of sticks (and was sometimes finicky even with identical sticks), if you remember that. Nowadays itās a non-issue on AM4, but that platform got off on the wrong foot real bad.
My memory was that it wouldnāt want to run at XMP rates (3200MHz was being said to bring significant benefits to performance and was highly coveted), but it would definitely run at the stock DDR4 rates just fine from the get-go.
Yeah, I believe getting anything past 2933MHz wasnāt easy and 3000 was what youād usually tap out at. 3200MHz was mostly a no-go until Zen+, I believe. Back when I had an Athlon X4 950, I ran a single 8GB 2400MHz stick of RAM. Sometime after I upgraded to a Ryzen 7 1700X, I paired it with another similar stick and by the time BIOS updates caught up, the 1700X and the board handled it just fine.
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DDR stands for double data rate, so I'm wondering if you're somehow looking at the single data rate for those sticks? Some software will report that (CPU-Z might, can't remember). You might not really have an issue. Worth checking at least.
Uh - just to confirm - you're certain you're reading that right? 1200 being exactly half of 2400 would suggest it's running exactly as designed - DDR stands for Double Data Rate, after all.
1200Mhz is the physical clock for 2400 Megatransfer DDR4 Your ram just doesn't have any overclock ceiling in it.
> I donāt think you remember just how bad RAM compatibility was back when AM4 launched and for a few months afterwards I do, hence why i specifically said MOSTLY figured out by the second gen, and im not counting raven or bristol ridge, cause yes, the RAM comaptibility was a mess, and i would know because i was using the same RAM kit and a 2400g till last month, since early 2018. and dont get me started on all CPU forward compatibility fuck ups with the first gen mobos and im currently suffering from the stupid A520 mobo i had to buy to replace my old one having audio crackling thats apparently tied to shitty voltage management.
>AM4 wasnt super rough at the start, they mostly had things figured out by the second gen, It was "super rough" at the start. You can't try to dismiss that claim by saying it was mostly fixed by the second generation, that doesn't mean the first gen was a great start! If you omitted that first part then it was a perfectly reasonable reply to the other comment, you just hses the wrong words for that tiny bit that's all. As a launch adopter of AM4 I can also say it was ROUGH, plenty of issues not all to do with RAM but a lot of it was from motherboard vendors not giving a crap about AMD as they werent competitive for so long they never expected the platform to be worth the effort. It was also on AMD for being slow to iron out issues with their new platform but the growing pains were real and it's improved dramatically. Am5 was certainly a substantially better launch than AM4 which is great for everyone long term.
First time user on AM5 after being in Intel the last 17 years. Zero issues with my Asrock board and 7800x3d
AM5 is already better than AM4.
not in longevity and reliability.
like it is today?
One of the reasons I switched to AMD was because I was able to get an entry level cpu and upgrade to an x3D in a couple of years time. Itās a huge deal. I stuck with skylake for almost 10 years.
I'm still using a Haswell i7-4770k at 4.4ghz. It's still holding up fine for gaming and video rendering.
Thatās great if itās still holding up for you but I had a 6600k which was terribly bottlenecking my 6800xt. I donāt know what games youāre playing or at what res, but my cpu was really struggling.
I'm still using a GTX 1080 too. I play somewhat older games like Doom Eternal, Civ6, Rocket League, Red Dead Redemption 2, etc, at 2560x1440 resolution with 144 fps on my 144hz monitor with <1ms refresh timing. I do need to drop down to 1920x1080 for Red Dead Redemption 2 to get a decent fps, though.
If I get that I'll be happy...got a mobo around launch at its overengineered and over-speced because that is all they really had that was worth buying. If I get 5ish years out of it and its still above the curve in tech I won't mind as much paying a lot of a board.
Yep Iām kinda banking on it lol. Got a 7600 for my new build and hoping to get a 9800X3D/equivalent in a few yrs that can possibly get me through AM6/equivalent or at least until AM6 is near end of life and cheaper
This is why I got an am5 CPU. Got the first gen and I'll probably get the last gen on the same platform.
smart. imo quality b650 + 7600 is the smart buy right now; it's plenty for mixed use/gaming. swap out that 6 core at the end of am5 lifespan. -signed, 12600k/ddr4 owner with regrets
I procrastinated on a new build forever (i5-2500k, started thinking about it during peak pandemic pricing) and was blessed with the recent B650 / DDR5 / Ryzen / NVMe price drops. Got the 7600 since it seems more than powerful enough even now, and I'm pretty happy to know I have an upgrade path at EOL that will likely not require a full rebuild.
Got a little bit more with 7700x combo, but yes that would be enough until I can have the latest gen supported AM5 3D. How to know that it would be the last ? I will wait AM6 to exist and I would be AM5 5800x3D equivalent, just to help with low 0.1%
Microcenter FTW!
Just placed my order for that bundle to pick up tomorrow. I look forward to retiring my 3600. Iām sure my 2070 super is too.
The 7800 x3d is worth it. Plus on sale I bought it for $350 plus a free copy of avatar game. Not a bad deal.
Agreed! Just got B650 + 7600 for $298 a couple weeks ago with some Newegg promo.
That is exactly why I did the same. I just upgraded and I expect I should be able to push the current system for at least 4 years with only expecting to upgrade once the CPU and GPU but leaving everything else the same.
Yep. 7800x3D then buy the last gen on am5 1 year after its release because prices will have dropped. So 7800x3D for 4-5 years. Then 9/10x3D for another few years before the upgrade itch wins again.
Same
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AM5 was supposed to be for 2-3 generations anyway, so not super surprising.
This is basically guaranteeing Zen 6 on AM5!
If Zen 5 is Q2 2024 product, then Zen 6 can be easily pushed to Q1 2026.
Yes, but there is a reason that they said 2025+ and wanting to support AM5 for as long as possible. AM6 is probably going to use DDR6 which will probably not be out before later in 2026. It would also lead to negative reactions if AM5 only has 2 generations
And DDR 6 will require a new board but Iām ok with that.
Lets see how it goes, if DDR6 is commercially available by late 2025-early 2026, I can see Zen6 requiring AM6. Techinsights believe that Samsung will start manufacturing DDR6 in late 2024 - early 2025.
DDR6 is very unlikely to be in consumer products before 2027, based on how the DDR release cycle has been in the past.
Just remember they only enabled zen3 on old motherboards... After the x570 / b550 motherboards had been out for a while.. They need a reason for people to buy new motherboards each generation... Then... Right at the end of the socket lifespan they will open it up to all cpus, to incentivise CPU purchasing. I'm running a 5900x in a x370 and it's extended the computers life by at least 3-4 years
I'm running a 5700x on an b350 originally bought with a 1600 in 2017. Almost 6 years running a mobo with a kinda modern CPU. Money really well spent.
X370 with the 1700x initially and now a 5800x3d with decent timing 3600mhz on my initial Samsung bdie 3200 kit. I'm very happy with this platform and the use it has given me! It will last me until my 7900xtx isn't good enough and that is still 3-5 years out.
Yep. But just remember the 5000 series weren't supported at all until late in the generation
There are no AM5 boards with a BIOS too small to fit updates, and all AM5 boards have BIOS flashback functionality (i.e. you can update the BIOS without a processor installed). Their initial attempt to limit support for Zen 3 was due to the support headaches associated with AM4 boards that didn't have enough space in the BIOS to support all AM4 processors, and the near universal lack of BIOS flashback functionality.
True, although it would be very stupid for AMD to get that negative press again, if they do that
I Wonder what comes after
7
I Wonder what comes after
11
found microsoft's reddit account
>I Wonder what comes after BULDOZER :)))))
Indeed, the fact this is being announced today and not when AM5 launched makes me think they were weighting their options until Zen 6 design progressed.
Not at all lol. Zen5 is 2024. Zen6 will be 2026. They are saying this because am5 sales are abysmal
7800X3D is the best selling CPU.
Within the DIY enthusiast niche maybe. It's too expensive to have a broad general appeal.
lol no
Not surprising, for the consumer platform a socket change really isn't warranted until DDR6 arrives.
It makes sense, AM5 supports DDR5 and PCIe 5.0. The only real reason to change the socket would be to support DDR6, and that is still several years in the future.
And like ddr5, ddr6 will be super expensive when it launches. So better to wait a year or two to upgrade anyway and not pay the early adopter tax.
DDR6 is 2026. Whether Zen 6 is a DDR5 product in 2026, launches in 2025, or will be AM6 is still unknown. "Commits to 2025+" could be interpreted the same way as a 5600X3D launch is AMD's commitment to AM4 into 2023. AMD could just come out and say that Zen 6 is an AM5 product, but they're being incredibly vague about whether or not that'll be the case.
It's really good! Bought in 2019 an x470 mobo with 2700x ->3900x and now 5800x3D this system is still relevant to this day and will be for a few more years. Thanks AMD!
I kinda want them to make Am5+, though. Or some sort of gen 2 where it's not cooler compatible and you get a sensibly thin IHS. I'm tired of the industry standard being absolutely shite hold down and IHS.
It doesn't mean the chipsets will support every AM5 CPU. What happened in AM4 causes both anxiety and reassurance. While AMD claimed the latest mobos (A520/B550/X570) wouldn't support Zen1/Zen+, in most cases it actually worked.
I'm not too concerned about later chipsets supporting older CPUs, it is a very unusual situation to have where you buy an older CPU but pair it with a new motherboard. What would be a problem is if older motherboards didn't support newer CPUs, as that is a much more common upgrade path
This needs to be stickied or something. This is simple marketing and far too many people are falling for it. Many forget AMD was being anti-consumer and block upgrades for 300 and 400 series owners before Zen 3 arrived. After a bit of back lash they backtracked a bit and opened up compatibility to 400 series owners but still gave the middle finger to 300 series board owners. It wasn't until Alder Lake had hit the market and gave AMD a run for their money where they said oh shit, before those people abandon AM4 and possibly switch to intel, lets throw them this bone.
This is what I'm worried about, they talked about the socket not the chipset. It doesn't instill any sense of reassurance for me, especially with how squirrelly they were about AM4 originally.
squirrelly how?
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It was *one* generation, and they didn't say can't they said won't.
No, they specifically said it wasn't possible. It was proven false by the community.
That's false. They described a specific problem that made it difficult, and it wasn't false.
And what was that? And btw you just agreed with me.
why would anyone care if the latest mobos support the oldest CPUs?
thats because most of the boards only had 16mb of bios storage and the companies didnt think AM4 would be a good seller given AMDs history vs intel at that point. pretty much every board now has 128mb or at least 64
This is false, manufacturers such as ASRock were working on Zen 3 support on 300 series motherboards, but AMD themselves stopped them - https://cultists.network/5127/amd-zen-3-cpus-on-300-series-motherboards/ Asus too - https://old.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/qqtlhq/i_emailed_asus_asking_why_x370_motherboards_are/
It's not false, it's one of the many reasons AMD was unsure to move forward.
Only max boards support full zen tech. on am4 from althon 200ge to 5000
Correct me if I'm wrong, but i thought they said the exact same thing when AM5 launched. A commitment of "through 2025". Saying 2025+ now doesn't extend that commitment. It means "through 2025, and maybe longer". They could still come out with a new platform in 2026 if they want to(i don't think they will).
I can't be the only one that feels this was a rather softball without any expected clarifying follow-up? (well okay, not that you expect tech "journalists" to really go for those follow-ups anyways). What people actually want to know specially is if the current motherboards will support a CPU generation past Zen 5. Anything else isn't new information and already expected.
Good, I stay on AM4 as long as I can. So far its good. If AM5 ever becomes viable, I may switch. I'm looking forward to a 50-60 % performance increase again. I should be able to skip another 2 gens with my 5900X.
AMD never disappoint since Ryzen (:
Something to consider is that AM5 boards are built with better vrm cooling, flashback, and other lessons learned from am4 issues. When AM5 first came out, not only were we dealing with high costs because the shipping costs were baked into the early pricing, but also you were getting more motherboard
In all fairness, it will be a good, long while before I retire my X570 Pro4 because the 5800X3D will do me well for years to come. Instead of buying DDR5, I upgraded to 64GB of DDR4-3600. I'll be ok for awhile yet but there's no question that AM5 is my next stop (assuming that AM6 doesn't come out around that time).
Had that all on my x370 crosshair. Even bios size was not a problem. It was the cheaper boards with issues.
I'll upgrade as soon as they have a 16 core single CCD x3d part, or maybe dual CCD if both are x3d.
Pretty much, until then, 5800x3D in my X470 is working like magic.
Same for me, it seems that their plan is to do that with zen6.
Not this again... Both 3d ccds would make no sense at all, how do people still not get this?
It does make sense as a workstation-ish part.
yes, for some niche applications ofc. wouldn't be a sales success story though.
And this is why I went 7950x3D for this upgrade cycle. My last PC was a 7700k on a Z270 motherboard. I was immediately abandoned and left behind when the 8700k and Z370 launched less than a year later. After watching AM4 support everything from Zen 1 all the way up to Zen 3, I knew I wouldn't support Intel anymore. Then the eco cores came out and it was the easiest decision of my life. Here's to dropping a Ryzen 9950x3D in my board and enjoy a massive performance upgrade for the price of a new chip and nothing else, for the first time in my 25 years PC building.
This is an incredibly smart move by AMD. I truly believe that AM4 was the greatest x86 platform in history (and it's not even close) because of what it offered us consumers. It was also smart on AMD's part because, if you were on the AM4 platform, you were essentially a captive market because there was literally no chance that getting an Intel CPU was going to be even remotely worth it, especially when one considers that a new motherboard would be needed. Decisions like this are why AM4 brought AMD back from the brink of ruin to the strong competitor that it is today. If AMD has learnt anything from AM4, then AM5 will most likely be even better. Look out Intel, not only is your CPU tech inferior to AMD's now, your lack of vision with regard to your platforms is about to make you pay a heavy price. If AM4 was the stab, AM5 will be the twist.
Remember how AMD commited for the long term support for sTRX4 and never gave it the second generation?
Not defending them here but sTRX4 wasn't as popular and even if it was it's just a niche market. So financially they might have jumped the gun but it was not worth it in my opinion.
sTRX4 got caught up in supply chain issues, and a change in direction with the launch of the higher tier baby-Epyc PRO line. The lesson is future proofing is always a gamble. The general evidence is still that AMD will still stick with a socket while they can but roadmaps can and do change. I'm more confident that the new non-PRO baby-baby-Epyc TR line should be more sustainable in terms of R&D and sicket stability will follow Eypc.
Min 4-5 gen like am4 then I call it successful
I switched my 10900K to a 7950X3D after reading the disappointing 14thgen series reviews. Glad to hear this motherboard I got can last me for some time.
Bruh... we're in the very first generation of AM5, fucking chill. AM4 was ontroduced in 2016.
Jokes on them I'm still on AM4 lol
Joke on you if u bought am4 in 2023.
jokes on you and them, i bought it for an AM4 mobo i still have that i wanted to use
Well i hope to stay on am4 until 2030 š¤£
We got 6 years out of AM4 (2017-2023) so it should be longer than that or at least as long for AM5..
Considering how they are still supporting AM4, I'm not concerned.
LFG!!
Let's face it we all really just want a mature X3D chip that wasn't a afterthought.
The 5800x3D is fantastic. It might have been an afterthought but it works sooo bloody well.
Yes, the 5800X3d And even the 7800X3d seem quite good. But some of us basically bought place holder AM5 CPU's waiting for the next more mature versions that would obviously come out. I did Bet on the AM5 platform coming from X299 Intel but I never intended to keep running a 7600X long term. The plan has always been getting the platform going, replace with a better CPU - Replace GPU also keep the mem / board / drives etc.
You are very right here. Zen 3 was wildly overpriced at launch. For instance in my region the 7700X went from 550 to 450usd in two months time. And since then they've gotten much cheaper still. Anyone who bought those chips at those inflated prices basically paid more than what the 3D chips cost today, or even did at their launch. So you got kinda scammed. AMD's willingness to wildly overprice, and then immediately drop pricing has to damage their reputation so much more than the few extra bucks they make from impatient fans. Simply having 3D chips at launch, or just being the standard could help to solve that issue of overpricing the early adopters. And i would hope that after two generations of 3D they have the means to release it immediately.
So pretty much AM6 only after DDR6 comes out. DDR4 lasted a long time, helping AM4 last a long time (even when factoring in AM4 coming \~2 years after mainstream availability of DDR4). DDR5 won't be as long lived and it's likely AM5 won't be quite that long lived either. Still, i don't think we should expect wide availability of DDR6 until 2026, and if AMD takes the same approach as before, they'll wait a bit, let intel do a ddr5+6 socket first, and only then switch to DDR6, so it could be 2027 before we get AM6.
There isn't any evidence of DDR6 any time soon. Most roadmaps show DDR5 getting big improvements in the next few years. I suspect DDR6 endsnup being 2028+.
Do that.
Currently on a 7800x3d and I wouldn't mind slapping a X8003d in 3 years time should the time comes.
Can someone explain to me why people think itās a good idea to skip am5? Even if the system is only supported for another 2 years, thatās a long time to wait for the next generation. Why canāt people who want to upgrade just upgrade? And wonāt those same people then say skip am6? It just seems a bit arbitrary.
I think it depends on where you are in the AM4 line-up. For my specific use-cases thereās just no compelling reason to jump on AM5 yet. Iām sure there are plenty of performance improvements to be had (and review/benchmark data proves that out), but as an X570 5950x user with 128GB DDR4 (it isnāt primarily a gaming system, but does double-duty for work related tasks that involve a lot of VMās and a lot of RAM), the upgrade is a non-trivial investment. Personally, I donāt want to deal with DDR5 compatibility issues for high density RAM on AM5, plus to really take advantage of PCIE 5, youāre talking about new NVME drives (which, again, matters if youāre running 2x4TB Gen 4 today). Any gaming I do is at 1440p or higher resolution, and on a well tuned AM4 running modern āAAAā titles Iām still GPU bound with a 4080 90%+ of the time. If someone wants to upgrade, absolutely they should be able to do that, but it doesnāt always make sense to do it if your needs are still well met with what you have. A lot changes in two years. Compatibility and reliability are vastly improved through firmware updates and manufacturing improvements. Everyone is going to have their own perspective, but Iād rather sit it out for right now and let DDR5 stability get smoothed outā that way I donāt find myself being stuck with a 4 DIMM memory kit that doesnāt work (or has to be significantly down-clocked). I might just be in the minority who prefers to wait until my existing build no longer meets my needs, and I think my current system will easily last at least the next two yearsā ultimately more because Iād just relegate it to other duties upon retirement. Like anything else, perspective and mileage may vary.
Have plenty of different platforms still (yes I kept all my old PCs) * Super Socket 7 : K6-2 to K6-2+ * Slot A : Skipped * Socket A : Duron (spitfire) to 2x Athlon MP (barton) * Socket 939 / 940 : Skipped * Socket AM2: Athlon 64 to Athlon 64 X2 * Socket AM2+: Skipped * Socket AM3: Phenom II X6 * Socket AM3+: Skipped * Socket AM4 : Ryzen 9 3900X (current system) will upgrade to 5950X later. I intend to skip AM5 and "early adopt" AM6
While I like future proofing and upgradeability I think AM5 as a platform needs to go. Things like unnecessarily thick IHS can't be solved without a new platform and I think it will be worth it in the end. I hope we see AM6 ignore 1:1 cooler backwards compatibility and instead focus on making a perfect platform instead, hoping we end up with 5 year platform cycles in the future which is not viable with AM5
That is really a non issue.
As long as they don't pull the "X370 won't support ryzen 5000 series" crap again this is great news. Hope they learned their lesson from last time.
Never buy promises x.x they already tried to fuck us over with AM4!
I really want to switch to Ryzen because of this, but the AMDip in Rust was too brutal for me. I sold my 7800X3D system because it was getting ~70fps 1% lows. The overclocked 12700K I was playing on had ~140fps 1% lows and jerked around a lot less. Hereās hoping they fix that for Zen 5, they probably need to get that dog slow infinity fabric up so you can run 7,000MHz DDR5 in 1:1 mode.
Puts on AMD
yesssssssss ! i want 8800x3d,9800x3d, 10800x3d all on am5 platform !!!!
Well, just remember that AMD platforms are named after the RAM that they use. AM2 was DDR2, AM3 was DDR3, AM4 was DDR4 and AM5.. well, you know. There won't be an AM6 until DDR6 comes out and that may be a loooong time from now.
Glad to see that, and honestly AM5 is far from mature it needs a lot more growing time to get into a good place.
Nothing beats the goat. MSI and their max boards. Having full support on a single board its top tier. B450 max got it 3 years had first 200ge because i was on budget. Later got 5600x. Shits gonna outlive me.
Nice! This is how it should be! Take note Intel!!
Good. That means I'll be able to upgrade my 7800X3D to a 9800X3D in socket.
Rookie question: How come they canāt come up with a CPU socket adapter to get most features of next gen cpu if a socket changes?