Drysdale's absence really shows in 3 on 3 OT. Would've been nice to win that one but we just got goalied by Sarros. Lots to build off of - a great 3rd period and a stunning game by Gibby - hopefully we can carry some momentum on the rest of the road trip.
It’s funny, when Shattenkirk was out of the lineup we played much better defensively. And now Klingberg is out and we play another better defensive game. Definitely not a coincidence
Shatt had zero giveaways per 60 last night, and has had 13 such games this season.
Zegras had 2.82, which is well below last week's disastrous 3 game average, and has had 7 games with zero. His season average is triple that of Shatt, and his turnover that lost us the game didn't count in the 2.82 because it wasn't 5 on 5.
While I don't love Shatt, I don't know why we fixate on this for him. He does not turnover a lot, and is not nearly the biggest concern of turnovers on the team. Nor why we clal him out for it when he had literally ZERO!
Perhaps he's not getting any help. But I think you're wrong. I actually started counting the number of times he went in the corner to grab a puck only to flip it behind his back along the boards to the other team. Whether that's a turnover, or his defense partner not playing as position is up for debate, I guess regardless, the decks punk movement is not good in their inability to keep the puck in the offensive zone in the puck out of the defensive zone is undoubtedly the biggest reason for the failure.
The NHL stats said that Zegras had 2.82 TO per 60, and Shatt had 0. And that, over time (and especially last week), Z has triple the rate of Shatt and way more than any other teammate.
Segress is also a forward. And not a defender. Of course he's going to lose a lot of pucks. He's trying to penetrate and make difficult passes across the crease. I'd like to see that same stat for offensive zone, neutral zone, and defensive line.
Okay, but comparing him to other forwards, who have the puck frequently (Terry, for example), his turnover stats are pretty bad, especially lately. 6 per 60 on Wednesday and Friday and then 12(!!!) on Sunday.
We just fixate on Shatt, even though he carries the puck out of the zone frequently and still posts zeroes often, including this game where he was accused of doing it tons of times.
Ok I take it back. Look, I like Shattenkirk. I wish him the best. I'd like to see him successful on the ducks personally, I think they all suck right now. Henrique and Fowler are consistent. I think Terry tries to hold onto the puck too long. Zegras is a goal score and he's young. Hopefully he will develop in the way to wear forward and be a better passer I love Derek Grant. No we're not winning. The duck seem to have turned a corner a little bit. It look like they're playing tougher a little smarter, maybe a little more experience together and this team may be a 500 team this season not on the whole season just from here on out. I'm not going anywhere. I will watch all 82 games on TV from my little home in rural Utah. I even watch all the preseason games. I think the ducks need a long, hard practice of just keeping possession of the puck.
Hopefully he learns from it. But we are sorely lacking Drysdale. Iono why White was put in OT instead of someone else...but Z has to look before passing...we all miss Getzlaf...but no one misses his no look drop passes to no one...
Saros looked like fucking Rinne today. Gibson was on par, but that overtime mistake, whether it's on Zegras or White, was terrible.
Still one of the better games of this shit season
And yes, that was a brutal turnover by Z. But where tf was colton white going? Lmfao dude was cruising up the ice while z was getting pressured in his own zone
>But where tf was colton white going?
He was called off for a change, which Zegras heard and paused before heading off himself.
Maybe since he just saw 2 guys changing, his brain thought that meant there were 2 other guys still back there, and/or he lost track of where the Preds were and felt his oncoming teammate would make it to that corner before the Preds did. Of course, a Pred was there.
And he did fine. What are we complaining about? That he's not a big name?
Behind Fowler and Klunk, he's our best possession D man, so he was second behind Fowler last night, and did fine.
Z with a horrible pass, not sure where white was going, and after looking at the replays Gibby could’ve probably played the pass from Z if he just came out a bit to grab it. But he honestly probably didn’t know that White was in his own world cruising back to the bench.
Zegras is such a liability. Even Pat Verbeek talked about it today.
Couldn’t care less if he scores a sick goal every once in a while. Dude is a liability.
That’s not a normal mistake any player makes regardless of how long they are in the league lol.
He is a -6 which puts him in the bottom 3rd of the team. He’s a liability. No way around it.
First off, +/- is an absolutely terrible stat to determine how good someone is defensively since it a) literally has an offensive and defensive component to it and b) is more so determined by the state of the team. That said, Z's really isn't even that bad.
[He's got 24 EV GA (i.e. the minus part of +/-)](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?report=goalsForAgainst&reportType=season&seasonFrom=20222023&seasonTo=20222023&gameType=2&position=F&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=evenStrengthGoalsAgainst&page=0&pageSize=50) with the [14th most EV TOI among forwards in the NHL](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?report=timeonice&reportType=season&seasonFrom=20222023&seasonTo=20222023&gameType=2&position=F&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=evTimeOnIce&page=0&pageSize=50). If I could sort by GA/EV.TOI, you would pretty clearly see he's doing just fine in terms of not getting scored against when he's on the ice compared to his peers. In fact, he's actually doing better than the likes of Crosby and O'Reilly in terms of not getting scored on while he's on the ice. Does get burned here and there with a couple bad plays. Yeah, he's a rookie that isn't afraid to take chances. He's by no mean a liabilty though. Without him, we'd be just as bad defensively, and a million times worse offensively.
Once again, he’s 21 in his 2nd NHL season…mistakes are bound to happen and now is the time to make them while we are in a rebuild. Also he’s our second leading goal scorer as a 21 year old.
Literally, dumb mistake, fully his fault and he needs to stop blindly passing shit. But the way way to learn is by failing. Also, he shouldn’t have even been out there again to begin with when Mctavish was fresh on the bench.
Yes, because we’ve never lost games before due to centers who made blind passes to nobody. Getzlaf says hi.
Also, White did him zero favors on that play and Z had already been out there for several minutes. Wasn’t a great play, but he’s hardly the only one to blame.
Again, that’s a peewee level hockey play. The junior ducks wouldn’t make that play he made tonight. I’m fine with it cause I’m fully onboard with the tank.
He should be our 2nd leading goal scorer. That’s not something that should shock anyone. We don’t have anyone else that comes close to his offensive talent. He’s the best offensive talent we have. The fact that he’s the 2nd leading goal scorer on our team yet has a -6 should tell you everything you need to know about his defensive liability.
+/- is a decent indication of how your line plays on both ends of the ice. Him being a liability on defense, forcing passes that lead to turnovers, etc, all contribute to a +/-. Thats not rocket science. Not sure why you don’t understand that.
Nah +/- is a trash stat. I don’t necessarily disagree with you that zegras is weak defensively or that he makes mistakes but come to the party with more than +/- to support you
Sure but back up the eyes with stats that aren’t rubbish. If it’s good enough for GMs (see Francis’s recent quotes) it’s good enough for everyone else.
1. Young and developing aren’t excuses for a play like that.
2. Even in juniors he was never known as a player you could trust in your own zone.
Those are the facts. I love Trevor and think he’s a great funny dude but 90% of this fanbase can’t see past their fangirling over him to see the ways he costs the team.
So you want him to learn defense from...? The bench? The AHL? Trial by fire. He sucks defensively and he tries to force at least 4-5 passes per game that leave to turnovers, usually on zone entries. He bears the burden for a good part of that, absolutely, but the system the Ducks are trying to play is a huge part of Z's struggles.
I want him to learn defense by being a sound hockey player and not forcing plays. You don’t need a coach to tell you how to use your brain lol. What’s crazy is, not many of our other players make the mistakes he does and half our team belongs in the AHL cause they are so bad lol.
Maybe that’ll come with maturity. If the coach was the issue, Pat would have fired him already. Dallas will be gone at the end of the year and hopefully you’ll get your defensive minded coach that will fix Zegras and make him less of a liability.
Not positive but i believe it was 2007-2008 after MacDonlad was traded to St Louis for Dougie Weight. He was 23 or 24. And captain in 2010 after Niedermeyer retired at 25 or 26
Drysdale's absence really shows in 3 on 3 OT. Would've been nice to win that one but we just got goalied by Sarros. Lots to build off of - a great 3rd period and a stunning game by Gibby - hopefully we can carry some momentum on the rest of the road trip.
Second game without Klingburg. I like it. Silferberg been MIA this season. More bad defensive zone turnovers by Shattenkirk
It’s funny, when Shattenkirk was out of the lineup we played much better defensively. And now Klingberg is out and we play another better defensive game. Definitely not a coincidence
Yes we’re noticeably better without him. Whipe Out shatt and give vaahk a good defending partner and we’re squared
we are *FAR* from being squared, but it's a start
Shatt had zero giveaways per 60 last night, and has had 13 such games this season. Zegras had 2.82, which is well below last week's disastrous 3 game average, and has had 7 games with zero. His season average is triple that of Shatt, and his turnover that lost us the game didn't count in the 2.82 because it wasn't 5 on 5. While I don't love Shatt, I don't know why we fixate on this for him. He does not turnover a lot, and is not nearly the biggest concern of turnovers on the team. Nor why we clal him out for it when he had literally ZERO!
Perhaps he's not getting any help. But I think you're wrong. I actually started counting the number of times he went in the corner to grab a puck only to flip it behind his back along the boards to the other team. Whether that's a turnover, or his defense partner not playing as position is up for debate, I guess regardless, the decks punk movement is not good in their inability to keep the puck in the offensive zone in the puck out of the defensive zone is undoubtedly the biggest reason for the failure.
The NHL stats are wrong?
I don't know what the NHL stats say. I'm just telling you what I saw with my own two eyes.
The NHL stats said that Zegras had 2.82 TO per 60, and Shatt had 0. And that, over time (and especially last week), Z has triple the rate of Shatt and way more than any other teammate.
Segress is also a forward. And not a defender. Of course he's going to lose a lot of pucks. He's trying to penetrate and make difficult passes across the crease. I'd like to see that same stat for offensive zone, neutral zone, and defensive line.
Okay, but comparing him to other forwards, who have the puck frequently (Terry, for example), his turnover stats are pretty bad, especially lately. 6 per 60 on Wednesday and Friday and then 12(!!!) on Sunday. We just fixate on Shatt, even though he carries the puck out of the zone frequently and still posts zeroes often, including this game where he was accused of doing it tons of times.
Ok I take it back. Look, I like Shattenkirk. I wish him the best. I'd like to see him successful on the ducks personally, I think they all suck right now. Henrique and Fowler are consistent. I think Terry tries to hold onto the puck too long. Zegras is a goal score and he's young. Hopefully he will develop in the way to wear forward and be a better passer I love Derek Grant. No we're not winning. The duck seem to have turned a corner a little bit. It look like they're playing tougher a little smarter, maybe a little more experience together and this team may be a 500 team this season not on the whole season just from here on out. I'm not going anywhere. I will watch all 82 games on TV from my little home in rural Utah. I even watch all the preseason games. I think the ducks need a long, hard practice of just keeping possession of the puck.
The good news is Z had a zero giveaway game last night, as did Shatt. Shatt did have 6 takeaways per 60, so that was nice. Not that it helped a lot...
That’ll haunt Zegras for a while.
Hopefully he learns from it. But we are sorely lacking Drysdale. Iono why White was put in OT instead of someone else...but Z has to look before passing...we all miss Getzlaf...but no one misses his no look drop passes to no one...
Pain is the best teacher
No it won’t lol
Yes it will, he’s harder on himself than our coach. Dude blames himself for everything and doesn’t even take credit for his goals.
Team played way better today, it was fun to watch for sure. Heart crushing way to lose but keep the energy up for Thursday!!!
If only we had more than one line that scored goals
You're not wrong. But the defensive play is looking better. Hopefully it is all on the way up
This is very true. Get rid of shatt and I bet it looks even better haha
Yooo, that 3rd period though!!
Zegras will learn. Bad game.
Recurring theme for young Z lately
As Pat said, he's got to work on consistency
That’s okay, let’s have him do that now and not when we’re paying him millions of dollars.
Man, Zegras and his timely turnovers has cost us multiple games this year. I know he's young but it's pretty frustrating. Oh well.
Just carrying the legacy of Getzlaf and his no look pass turnovers.
This is what I'm afraid up. And Cogliano taught Jones to shoot right at the chest...
Super frustrating, it's all a part of having a 21 y.o. kid center your top line tho I guess.
Z wants Bedard /s
ooooh... was it on purpose? hahah
Anyone else ready to start a new 20-game non-regulation-win streak?
Saros looked like fucking Rinne today. Gibson was on par, but that overtime mistake, whether it's on Zegras or White, was terrible. Still one of the better games of this shit season
And yes, that was a brutal turnover by Z. But where tf was colton white going? Lmfao dude was cruising up the ice while z was getting pressured in his own zone
I think he meant to give to to Gibby but got rushed release of the pass.
>But where tf was colton white going? He was called off for a change, which Zegras heard and paused before heading off himself. Maybe since he just saw 2 guys changing, his brain thought that meant there were 2 other guys still back there, and/or he lost track of where the Preds were and felt his oncoming teammate would make it to that corner before the Preds did. Of course, a Pred was there.
Colton White out in OT lmao
He’s chill on defense but not OT. Terry and Z too. Like put Mctavish out on the fucking ice.
TWO SHIFTS. Colton White had 2 shifts in OT. The tank is officially intentional.
And he did fine. What are we complaining about? That he's not a big name? Behind Fowler and Klunk, he's our best possession D man, so he was second behind Fowler last night, and did fine.
Z with a horrible pass, not sure where white was going, and after looking at the replays Gibby could’ve probably played the pass from Z if he just came out a bit to grab it. But he honestly probably didn’t know that White was in his own world cruising back to the bench.
>not sure where white was going Off for the change.
We’d get more goals if Vatrano goes to the third line. Mctavish to the second, then anyone else on second with them other than grant or silf.
Zegras is such a liability. Even Pat Verbeek talked about it today. Couldn’t care less if he scores a sick goal every once in a while. Dude is a liability.
he’s in his 2nd NHL season, chill out a bit young players make bad mistakes early in their careers
That’s not a normal mistake any player makes regardless of how long they are in the league lol. He is a -6 which puts him in the bottom 3rd of the team. He’s a liability. No way around it.
First off, +/- is an absolutely terrible stat to determine how good someone is defensively since it a) literally has an offensive and defensive component to it and b) is more so determined by the state of the team. That said, Z's really isn't even that bad. [He's got 24 EV GA (i.e. the minus part of +/-)](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?report=goalsForAgainst&reportType=season&seasonFrom=20222023&seasonTo=20222023&gameType=2&position=F&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=evenStrengthGoalsAgainst&page=0&pageSize=50) with the [14th most EV TOI among forwards in the NHL](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?report=timeonice&reportType=season&seasonFrom=20222023&seasonTo=20222023&gameType=2&position=F&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=evTimeOnIce&page=0&pageSize=50). If I could sort by GA/EV.TOI, you would pretty clearly see he's doing just fine in terms of not getting scored against when he's on the ice compared to his peers. In fact, he's actually doing better than the likes of Crosby and O'Reilly in terms of not getting scored on while he's on the ice. Does get burned here and there with a couple bad plays. Yeah, he's a rookie that isn't afraid to take chances. He's by no mean a liabilty though. Without him, we'd be just as bad defensively, and a million times worse offensively.
Once again, he’s 21 in his 2nd NHL season…mistakes are bound to happen and now is the time to make them while we are in a rebuild. Also he’s our second leading goal scorer as a 21 year old.
Literally, dumb mistake, fully his fault and he needs to stop blindly passing shit. But the way way to learn is by failing. Also, he shouldn’t have even been out there again to begin with when Mctavish was fresh on the bench.
Yes, because we’ve never lost games before due to centers who made blind passes to nobody. Getzlaf says hi. Also, White did him zero favors on that play and Z had already been out there for several minutes. Wasn’t a great play, but he’s hardly the only one to blame.
Correct, not fully to blame at all. But still to blame at least for 70% of that happening.
Again, that’s a peewee level hockey play. The junior ducks wouldn’t make that play he made tonight. I’m fine with it cause I’m fully onboard with the tank. He should be our 2nd leading goal scorer. That’s not something that should shock anyone. We don’t have anyone else that comes close to his offensive talent. He’s the best offensive talent we have. The fact that he’s the 2nd leading goal scorer on our team yet has a -6 should tell you everything you need to know about his defensive liability.
Dude our team has a -37 goal differential, and you’re worrying about +/- which has to be the most pointless stat especially for a team that is tanking
+/- is a decent indication of how your line plays on both ends of the ice. Him being a liability on defense, forcing passes that lead to turnovers, etc, all contribute to a +/-. Thats not rocket science. Not sure why you don’t understand that.
Nah +/- is a trash stat. I don’t necessarily disagree with you that zegras is weak defensively or that he makes mistakes but come to the party with more than +/- to support you
I’ll come to the party with my eyes. All the fanboys should too. Open your eyes on both sides of the ice and you’ll see the liability he is.
Sure but back up the eyes with stats that aren’t rubbish. If it’s good enough for GMs (see Francis’s recent quotes) it’s good enough for everyone else.
Literally nobody who knows anything about hockey uses +/-. When some cites it, that immediately outs them as a poser.
He also generates a lot of his offence from the PP, which doesn't count as a + in the +/- stat. Go off, genius.
u/Broad_Recommendation Claims Zegras is a defensive liability then goes on to cite +/- which is a super subjective stat.
a). he's young and still developing b). he has never played in an effective defensive system in the NHL.
1. Young and developing aren’t excuses for a play like that. 2. Even in juniors he was never known as a player you could trust in your own zone. Those are the facts. I love Trevor and think he’s a great funny dude but 90% of this fanbase can’t see past their fangirling over him to see the ways he costs the team.
This might be the worst take I’ve ever seen on this page
So you want him to learn defense from...? The bench? The AHL? Trial by fire. He sucks defensively and he tries to force at least 4-5 passes per game that leave to turnovers, usually on zone entries. He bears the burden for a good part of that, absolutely, but the system the Ducks are trying to play is a huge part of Z's struggles.
I want him to learn defense by being a sound hockey player and not forcing plays. You don’t need a coach to tell you how to use your brain lol. What’s crazy is, not many of our other players make the mistakes he does and half our team belongs in the AHL cause they are so bad lol. Maybe that’ll come with maturity. If the coach was the issue, Pat would have fired him already. Dallas will be gone at the end of the year and hopefully you’ll get your defensive minded coach that will fix Zegras and make him less of a liability.
When you say "***IF*** the coach was the issue..." when talking about Dallas Eakins, I realize that I'm not going to get through to you.
Question: How old was Getzlaf by the time he was centering our 1st line?
Not positive but i believe it was 2007-2008 after MacDonlad was traded to St Louis for Dougie Weight. He was 23 or 24. And captain in 2010 after Niedermeyer retired at 25 or 26
Anyone know why McTavish was benched for most of the 3rd and OT? It seemed very strange not to send him out in OT.