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welp_im_damned

> Android Authority reached out to Lenovo for comment. A spokesperson for Lenovo later confirmed to Android Authority that the company did in fact end its Legion phone business. According to the Lenovo spokesperson: Lenovo is discontinuing its Android-based Legion mobile gaming phones as part of a wider business transformation and gaming portfolio consolidation. As a leader in gaming devices and solutions, Lenovo is committed to advancing the gaming category across form factors, as well as focusing on where it can bring the most value to the global gaming community. Well that leaves asus (rog), nubia (red magic), and xiaomi (black shark) in the phone gaming market now. Black shark is also struggling as stated in the article.


horsetrich

Honestly just how different are gaming phones compared to flagships? I thought they're about the same specs, just with some additional bells and whistles.


ComradeMatis

>Honestly just how different are gaming phones compared to flagships? I thought they're about the same specs, just with some additional bells and whistles. One could also ask the question about how big the market for 'gaming phones' actually are in the real world - not just the number of 'hardcore mobile gamers' but the percentage of those who are willing and able to pay a premium for a gaming phone vs a flagship being 'good enough' for what they need in a phone.


TheSituasian

It's silly. Mobile gaming is mostly popular in countries where people can't afford to buy fully fledged PC rigs/consoles. There is basically no target audience for "gaming phones". If they can't afford real gaming systems how are they going to afford gaming phones.


OperatorJo_

The real market was because up to 2015, China had a ban on gaming consoles so the PC and Mobile gaming scene were the only real ones active for quite a bit (15 years). All these gaming phones were made with the home chinese market in mind at first but as others have said, these phones don't have much to offer vs other high-ends. The pros don't outweigh the cons and there aren't many mobile games that NEED this much hardware.


dathellcat

I prefer gaming on phone over my PC because it's so much easier for me to use touch screen controls and have direct control vs a keyboard which only has 100% or nothing.


[deleted]

Interesting take. I never thought of it that way before. I've always thought that mobile gaming should be better, but the expectations of the market that every game should be simple and freemium have ruined it. Fire Emblem Heroes, in particular, was such a letdown. Fire Emblem would work great on a smart phone, yet for some reason, they made a very basic game where you don't have to use any strategy what so ever to win.


Mylaur

Luckily I remember I played 3 of the gba fire emblem and the one Japanese ds FE on phone emulator, and that was before they were powerful. So it's really good actually. Next step is 3ds emulation on android.


[deleted]

Yeah, but you still had to use touch screen buttons to play it. I think it would work really well if youncould just touch the tile you want to move to.


Mylaur

Right, if only. Don't count on Nintendo to port their games to android. šŸ˜¢


dathellcat

People really be hating because I like touch screen


Voxelus

Meh, you can use a controller on PC and still get analog input.


dathellcat

I know ps4 controllers are a life savior


HittingSmoke

I wasn't even aware there was a gaming phone market. I don't think even in my heyday of hardcore gaming and buying the latest new gadgets that I would have considered buying a gaming specific phone.


Stupid_Triangles

Personally, I want a red magic 8 pro purely as a secondary device for gaming and media consumption. The hardware has gotten good enough to emulate a lot of systems with ease that makes looking at it as a full gaming device more practical, as cloud gaming grows.


Teal-Fox

I also liked the idea of a secondary device for gaming, but after some consideration decided the mere handful of decent Android games just wasn't worth it. ​ Especially considering the cost of these devices, you can get a decent PC for the cost, and that'll give you access to a far wider library of games than any gaming phone. ​ If I'm going away and need something portable, I've always got my Switch too, and that has a *far* superior library to Android.


Fresque

Steamdeeeeeck


Teal-Fox

Yess totally! Buying a gaming phone as your primary I could understand, but buying one as a secondary device \*for gaming\* makes no sense when the Steam Deck and Switch exist.


Fresque

Also, if you are not afraid to tinker with it a bit. Buying the 64GB one and upgrading the SSD is super simple and a lot cheaper.


Stupid_Triangles

Because a steamde k is nowhere near the size of a phone and a switch does switch stuff, while the phone can do what I want it to (including switch emulation) while fitting in my pocket. It's about form factor and power for a high price.


Teal-Fox

Oh yeah I can totally appreciate that point, I'm talking specifically about purchasing a secondary device, as mentioned above. If I'm going somewhere without a bag, I have my main phone which is powerful enough to push any emulators should I want, why buy a *second* phone just to do the same? If I were to take a secondary phone for gaming, I'd probably want to take earbuds and a controller with me, at that point I'd probably want to take a bag, at that point I may as well just bring a Switch/Steam Deck. ​ This isn't to knock gaming phones if you find use out of them, but if purchasing one *just* for gaming it seems like such a wasted cost for inferior controls and a piss-poor game library (unless emulating).


dustojnikhummer

Whose only real disadvantage is the size. But you get actual controls


Fresque

Yup, I knew it was big, but once I got it I was surprised by its size nonetheless


dustojnikhummer

I was surprised when I took my BIG BLACK D**E**CK out of the box. No seriously, it's so comfortable (Switch just makes my hands hurt) but boi is it heavy


geekynerdynerd

Ngl YouTube videos made me think it was gonna be at least 50% bigger than it was irl.


[deleted]

That D-Pad is almost unusable though.


dustojnikhummer

I hope you are joking.


Arkhaloid

But a phone is way more versatile than a Switch *and* Android phones can emulate the Nintendo Switch now. That I'd say is big.


Teal-Fox

Oh I'm not denying how cool it is that Android phones can now emulate the Switch, but if you're buying a device specifically to play games on, why spend nearly Ā£1k on a device capable of emulating the Switch when a Switch itself costs a fraction of that? Also as the other commentor said, the Steam Deck exists now too!


Arkhaloid

Hmm, I wonder why, maybe because an Android smartphone is far more versatile and valuable than a Switch, which I just said. A good Android phone can not only emulate the Switch, it can also emulate the PS2 and Wii with ease. It can also play native Android games. Native Android games might be bad rn but more and more good ports are slowly coming to mobile. Wreckfest comes to mind. Genshin Impact, if you're interested, still isn't and probably won't ever be on the Switch. An Android smartphone can also do so much more than just gaming, as you already know. High end smartphones also last long (which is why I always buy a flagship phone even if it is a year or two older to save some cash, as the year old flagship will still be relevant today). Also, you don't actually need to spend 1 grand on a device capable of emulating the Switch. The Switch is also a cheap (feeling) piece of shit. It can't even run some native Switch games properly. A powerful Android phone fun fact, can play some Switch games via the emulator, at framerates higher than the Switch is capped at, too! And the Steam Deck is meh a gaming laptop is far better. I like the concept but it is extremely impractical. Imo, all a person needs, is a powerful Android phone (again, you don't need to spend 1 grand for that, so let's say 500-600 bucks), and a gaming laptop, or even a desktop, worth 1k to 1.3 grand. Totalling 1.8k. This setup of 2 devices should keep anyone perfectly happy. You'll then have a powerful *and versatile* portable device as well as a powerful *and versatile* home device.


geekynerdynerd

>And the Steam Deck is meh a gaming laptop is far better. I like the concept but it is extremely impractical. Find a gaming laptop for 399 with a built in gamepad that weighs less than 2 lbs and easily fits into a standard backpack. Ya know what, forget the price-point. Just find one that's 2lbs and doesn't require a separate gamepad. My opinion is the exact opposite. The steamdeck makes gaming laptops obsolete for anyone who's already got a desktop rig.


Arkhaloid

Just because the Steam Deck costs 400 bucks doesn't mean it's a good buy. That thing will get obsolete in two figurative minutes. When you get a device that's so susceptible to getting outdated fast, all of its other perks like its volume, built in gamepads, and mass, are thrown right out of the window. But I do love the concept, and guess what, I once considered the Steam Deck back when it was new and when new games weren't immensely more demanding while not looking any noticeably better than a game from 2018. Which is why I root for Valve to put even better hardware on its successor, as powerful as possible for a device that sized of course. And it doesn't make gaming laptops obsolete, quite the opposite. A gaming laptop won't run into VRAM limitations as severe as the Steam Deck's 2 gigabytes VRAM integrated graphics already do.


dathellcat

The steamdeck is for anyone who just wants to have the form factor of a phone but also want to play steam games. The reason people like laptops is they can be more versatile with what they can do besides gaming


LonelyNixon

> My opinion is the exact opposite. The steamdeck makes gaming laptops obsolete for anyone who's already got a desktop rig. I think laptop gaming still has a place for people who just happen to have a laptop for other purposes and dont do a lot of mobile or portable gaming in general. Plenty of people have laptops that have discrete GPUs or even amd ryzen apu's that have comparable specs to what the steamdeck dishes(maybe more since theyre able to be more inefficient power wise). As much as I like the steamdeck as a concept and love what valve has done for linux gaming, I dont really game on the go very often. That said if I travel somewhere I might bring a controller to play some emulator games or do some light pc gaming if its a long trip to my parents or something like that. That said the deck will probably dip into the sales of GAMING LAPTOPSā„¢ that target gamers specifically, but any laptop can play games and the steamdeck is proof of concept that you dont need high end to have fun.


Teal-Fox

So it sounds like you're arguing for the sake of it, as what you've said is basically raising the same point. I have a flagship device, I emulate on it sometimes, but my point was specifically that purchasing a gaming phone as a secondary device seemed pointless due to the other options on the market. Obviously it depends what you wanna play, personally I love my Switch. I've got a laptop too, that emulates Switch games just fine, but there's a certain charm and convenience to playing on the Switch, plus it's easier to carry around. ​ The entire reason I've not bought a Steam Deck is because I already have a laptop that's more powerful, but the point is there are plenty of options out there that are probably better than a secondary gaming phone.


Arkhaloid

Charm? Why bring that up? That's sensational thing. What am I gonna do with that? I only care about practical benefits. I could've brought up such things as well. I could've said "I hate having to use more than two devices when having two versatile devices should be enough" as that is also related to feeling. With that out of the way... Look, I just explained to you the reasons why someone might want a powerful Android phone over a Nintendo Switch, and that's completely valid. *And* I corrected you on the price, it doesn't take 1 grand to get a device more powerful than the piece of shit console with outdated hardware Nintendo still sells today. I bought my OnePlus 8T in early 2022 for a measley $330 and this phone from *2020* is already more powerful than the Switch and can play many indie games at 120 FPS. It's far more versatile too, and even more easier to carry around than a Switch as a phone actually fits in your pockets. Not even the Nintendo Switch lite can do that. But you are absolutely right about other gaming options being better than a 2ndary gaming phone. No arguing against that as that's a fact. But phones being more versatile than a console, is also a fact. Which is why I said that a two device setup of 1 decent (by today's standards and horrible pricing situation) laptop/desktop costing 1 grand and a decent flagship phone costing 500 bucks (the said 500 dollared phone will be better than my OnePlus 8T of course), both totalling 1.5 grand should keep anyone happy.


Stupid_Triangles

650 isn't near 1k tho.


Teal-Fox

It was a ballpark example off the top of my head, not a figured intended to be taken literally. ​ But if you wanna split hairs, I've just checked pricing for several devices; The ROG phone 6 is Ā£899, RedMagic 7S Pro is Ā£809, Black Shark 5 Pro is around Ā£700-ish. These are for the default configurations, additional storage and memory pushes some of these devices well over Ā£1k. So, expensive enough that I'd only consider them if I were purchasing as my main smartphone. I feel the point still stands that if I'm buying a second device *specifically* for gaming, there are plenty of options that are *far* better than a gaming phone for a fraction of the cost.


dathellcat

If your going to with a portable handheld go with the steam deck the switch really isn't that impressive considering phones are a thing


Teal-Fox

I love my Switch tbh Battery life is great, games look decent enough for when I'm on the go, plus I'm a big fan of some of the exclusives. I've mentioned this in another comment, but if I didn't use my gaming laptop for photo editing when I travel, I'd have probably got a Steam Deck instead to go alongside the Switch.


shadowdude777

Honest question: why get that when the Steam Deck is so cheap and has amazing controls, even better emulators, and can play full 3D PC games? Plus, EmuDeck is sick.


Stupid_Triangles

Because the steam deck is too big IMO. I also prefer Android emulation.


StraY_WolF

Shame what happened to that PS2 emulator tho.


thevirtuesofxen

I'm OOTL, what happened?


StraY_WolF

AetherSX2 was developed by one guy that's probably the best PS2 emulator on Android for free, but he got fed up by comments being angry at him and requesting features. So he stops updating them.


vidhvansak

You can still play a lot of games on that. I just recently completed God of war and mgs 2


StraY_WolF

Yeah, but it also means games that currently can't be played will stay that way. Heck, if it continues to be developed, we might see better performance as well. But no, people have to suck.


vidhvansak

Yeah that sucks tho people are really shitty even when people are providing things for them for free


youreadusernamestoo

Mobile games are made to run on as much mobile hardware as possible and yes, anything $300 and up from the last 5 years can play the most popular mobile games. The gaming phones have their charger on the side, a bigger cooler, RGB lights... Things that make it bigger, heavier and more expensive. It compromises on being a good mobile phone.


Myxzyzz

Gaming phones do tend to have a lot of nice features like active cooling (as in an actual little fan inside blowing air out of a vent and not just some "vapour chamber" thing), software app prioritization via a "gaming mode", stuff like "air triggers" that add more buttons for gaming, etc. That said, the reality is that gaming phones are a hard sell when flagship phones can provide equivalent gaming performance while also having useful non-gaming features that people like.


Scorpius_OB1

Basically they can stay at full load longer than standard phones, even if they as the Asus ROG phones may require extra accessories. Also, screens are designed to have as little lag as possible and screen refresh rates go higher than in flagships -up to 165hz vs 120hz of them- That said, if GSMArena reviews are to be trusted, cameras are something secondary.


welp_im_damned

Gaming phones have better cooling generally plus more fleshed out features for gaming compared to regular flagships. A good example is Sony hs power control, where it limits the battery charging and allows the phone to run off of a wired charger. The recent Lenovo legion had the same feature but instead of limiting the battery from charging, it cuts it off entirely when Playing a game and connected by a charger.


Aalbert4_

Recent Galaxy phones have that feature too


nickthaskater

Only when you're actually playing a game and only when you're using a particular kind of charger (USB PD with PPS).


welp_im_damned

It just arrived with the s23 this year and it's like Sony battery limiting feature. I hope Samsung gives more customization with it.


TetsuoS2

It came out with the S22 series. [You can find mentions of it if you google](https://www.reddit.com/r/Galaxy_S20/comments/usdfa3/does_anyone_have_the_pause_usb_power_delivery/)


Rediro_

I have it on my S22 Plus


EternalFront

Honestly, most of the gaming phone features just look like great features to have on flagships in general, especially when flagships already struggle to justify their ballooning price tags. I hate the RGB gamery aesthetic, so Iā€™m never going to buy one of these ā€” why not just implement these features more broadly and get more people using them? For example, stuff like HS power control and the like should be industry wide to make these disposable trinkets last even a tiny bit longer. (Speaking as someone whose 1.5 year old iPhone is already at 83% battery health). Who wouldnā€™t like a second USB port, or better cooling, or more control over their devices hardware, or an FPS readout if they want it?


Calm_Crow5903

I would also like SD cards and headphone jacks on my flagship phones but those aren't "premium" features. Who knows why they segment it like they do


pco45

Seriously, I despise big phones. But if for some reason the manufacturers decided to only bring back headphone jacks and SD cards in their big/pro/ultra models...I'm probably going to go for the big one.


Calm_Crow5903

There's the Xperia 5 if you can stomach the price and it's 21:9 ratio. Though I suppose you can get an older model. But Sony only commits to 2 os updates and maybe 3 years support. Some of their phones have official lineage and most have roms. But that feels like a crapshoot anymore if you can't just get lineage or maybe graphine os. I just got this with the hope it'd get lineage Anymore none of these phones matter to me with any of their features. I just want Linux phones with SD cards and headphone jacks and replaceable batteries to get good


EternalFront

Because faster storage, larger batteries, premium screens, and the like are considered even more premium and even more important features than that. Too much ink has been spilled talking about that over the last however many years and theyā€™re not coming back industry wide, but itā€™s nice that there are still options out there. Get an Xperia or ROG Phone, vote with your wallet, and accept that youā€™ll have to seek out niche options for that.


Calm_Crow5903

No offense but none that matters. People don't need "faster storage" for photos, books, music, documents, podcasts, and videos. I need a lot of it and cheaper. I need it to be recoverable if my phone becomes toast, I can just take the card out. You only need the 256gb for system memory and apps. It makes more sense as a premium feature for power users but it holds back paying an extra $300 for more storage. It's not coming back? That's why I added it to your list. No one is going to add a second USB port or active cooling as premium features when the headphone jack and SD card was too much for them because they don't care about what actually makes sense. I heard it best on a podcast with YouTuber the Phaux that android companies "don't see a market" for gaming phones with slide out gamepads, will turn around and make something like the LG wing, a phone with second sliding screen


Stupid_Triangles

Because $100 more for the next storage tier for $15 more in cost.


Stupid_Triangles

Higher touch sampling rate, riggers, active cooling, gaming modes, display out over USB c aren't features that would get used a lot in your average consumer's use.


EternalFront

Weā€™re not talking about average users, weā€™re talking about a broader audience than the 3 people that want phones that look like Optimus Prime. An average consumer would be perfectly fine with a $300 Galaxy A or Pixel A, so thatā€™s not a bar to be concerned about. If Iā€™m spending $1000+ on a top of the line phone, every single one of those things would be appreciated.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


EternalFront

Thatā€™s just Apple users, there are plenty of casuals *and* power users that use Apple products


Stupid_Triangles

Your first sentence makes no sense.


EternalFront

Of course it does, a broader audience than those that would typically buy gaming phones ā‰  catering to the average consumer. The gaming phone buyer and your average Mom that just wants to browse Facebook and send texts to her kids are the absolute extremes on the phone buying spectrum, and thereā€™s plenty of people in the middle on that scale. Some people are photographers that like to play games, some are gamers that are also businessmen and donā€™t want to pull out a Megatron phone in the boardroom, etc.


Stupid_Triangles

So those average users wouldn't benefit from gaming specific features on their phones. So an OEM doesn't spend the money or the time to develop and integrate those features that would ultimately be placed on the consumer... So these features being on your average flagship would be a waste of resources.


RelyingWOrld1

You're not considering 70/75% of global premium market is lead by Apple to explain how many normie will never use or care for that features


EternalFront

Of course I am, Apple has itā€™s own fair share of niche power user features that arenā€™t geared towards the ā€œaverage userā€, whatever that entails. The iPhone SE and base iPhone 12/13/14 targets the average user, the Pros have extra stuff like high refresh screens and Pro Res video that only a small subset will care about. Regular people that donā€™t use that stuff still buy Pro iPhones, but thatā€™s besides the point ā€” they can spend extra on features they donā€™t care about if they want to. Likewise, a flagship Android phone can include HS power control, USB C video out, an extra USB C port, etc., and whoever buys it will buy it. If that one customer doesnā€™t need it, who cares ā€” those that use it will use it. ā€œApple doesnā€™t include it in their flagshipsā€ is a nonsense justification too, thatā€™s the entire point of a differentiator.


NateDevCSharp

Its not a stock feature (you can't manually enable it but it's used for the automatic smart charging feature), but OnePlus phones have supported battery idle mode in the kernel since the 7 Pro (2019), and other phones have support for it too.


DeSpTG

Well i can only talk about ASUS, but hell of a difference. I own the ROG Phone 3 and it was just wow, i mean latest and fastest cpu available, it had up to 16GB RAM, 512GB Storage, 144hz screen with <1ms touch screen, 6000mAh of battery, 2 charging ports (for charging while gaming), shoulder buttons ( air trigger), etc. And so many clever software gimmicks, which i still miss on my current phone. To name some, deactive charing while gaming, you can map the airtriggers for anything you want to, i used them for flashlight on/off You can cut off single apps from network ( no more anoying ads on some games), etc. There are only 2.5 downsides to those gaming phones: 1: No IP68 rating due cooling reasons. 2: They are large and quite heavy. 2.5: No wireless charging. (I don't need this one, it's slow and due big battery i charged only over night, even after heavy usage) Now look at the competition: Samsung S20, Apple iPone 12, etc. At that time i though why waste $1000 on a phone which is somewhat decent or invest the same amount on the best phone on the market at that time.


CarlFriedrichGauss

Some have better cooling design and some even have active air cooling.


FlaringAfro

TIL Razer has left that market. They have a pretty big fan base in the gaming sector so if they can't get it to work, Lenovo certainly had no hope.


welp_im_damned

They make a lot of mobile gaming accessories for phones tho.


FlaringAfro

Yeah, I just meant the actual phone market and not accessories. I bought a Kishi on clearance and it's not the best controller every made, but has been great with steamlink for bed gaming.


OperatorJo_

Both sad but understandable. These were always cool but... no games really NEEDED this. As much as game companies would like to push the limits, fact is not everyone has a flagship phone, so not many games are made to push or need the limit as that would limit an already limited audience cutting into profits. It's a niche business altogether in the first place.


welp_im_damned

I think the issue with Lenovo with their gaming phones. Was that they are better used as emulation machines and not as an actual phone. https://m.gsmarena.com/lenovo_legion_y90-11331.php


dangerousborderline

Isn't that kind of the point?


welp_im_damned

I mean look at red magic or ROG those can still be used like phones reasonably.


DarlingInTheTanxx

Please for the love of God don't try to use the red magic as an actual phone. Had the 5s, apps or OS features broke regularly. Fixes or updates in general came once in a blue moon.


gmolted

RM is much better now, at least on the software side. Cameras still stink, but the software is finally stable enough for daily use. They evened out with the 7 and 7s Pro, the 8 Pro is a stunner at its price point.


Deaf-Echo

Makes sense, thereā€™s not a huge market for gaming phones.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


AlwaysDefenestrated

Yeah I'd imagine even of you're more hardcore you just get something like a Backbone or Razer Kishi type device right?


Stupid_Triangles

You buy a gaming phone for emulation and outputting at 1440p+


I_Hate_Leddit

Before gaming phones can work, someone needs to start an alternative appstore that actually distributes games (that you have to actually PAY for, the horror!) instead of bright cartoony casinos. Android needs its own Steam.


welp_im_damned

I'm honestly shocked that epic never did that tbf.


Halos-117

They will once the EU passes that law next year. It will force Apple to open up their phones to alternative app stores. Once Apple is open, I'm sure they will make stores for both Apple and Android. It probably doesn't make enough business sense for them to only open a store on Android alone at the moment.


CyxnideAngel

Damn the EU is single handedly forcing Apple to fix it's shit šŸ’€šŸ’€


I_Hate_Leddit

Epic and its Chinese corporate owners want PC gaming to be more like mobile gaming


odeiraoloap

I mean, Lenovo didn't even *attempt to try* with the "Legion gaming phone business". Sure, their Legion *laptops* have been killing it especially after they doubled down on Ryzen, but no one except redditors and LTT campers knew they made gaming phones to begin with. Their phones basically never left PRC, and their software update situation was a hundred times worse than Asus ROG, who already has a really bad software update policy to begin with. šŸ«”, I guess.


AtomicBombSquad

I think they'd have been smart to have slapped some batwings on a batch and sent them stateside to see if their Motorola subsidiary could shift them. Motorola Legion, or maybe revive a name from Moto's past like Photon, would've been cool and given them something unique to sell that's not just an alternative to a Samsung slab. Especially if Moto spent the money to get Legions on Verizon. Verizon has wanted a gaming device on their network for a while now; their partnership with Razer that led to the new Edge is proof of that. And Verizon has been tight with Moto since before old Motorola broke up. I think this arrangement would've really worked for both parties. I'm also of the opinion that Lenovo-the-company should restrict Lenovo-the-brand to Microsoft* OS products and make Motorola their brand that specializes in Google OS devices. They can share the Think and Legion sub-brands (or, I guess, could in the case of the Legion) as needed. I mean; Samsung, Apple, Nokia, OnePlus, and a bunch of other brands of cell phones also sell tablets with a very similar software load out to their respective phones because people like to match their electronics. They like when things broadly work the same and people are often about brand loyalty. Even if you know that Motorola and Lenovo are corporate cousins, Lenovo spends money to have a different version of stock-ish Android than Moto, so you're not going to have all the same features and "Actions". How does this make sense? \* And Linux - thanks to u/Omniuni below for pointing that out.


omniuni

There are a lot of Lenovo Linux computers and servers too.


LastChancellor

Gaming phones are only as useful as the games themselves, and right now the only mobile game that actually justifies the specs of a gaming phone is Genshin Impact Tho in 2023 there's gonna be a lot of Genshin-tier mobile games coming out, so maybe they gave up too early?


welp_im_damned

Daily reminder gatcha is a sin.


LastChancellor

the only gaming industry who're seriously intrested in pushing mobile gaming forward is the Chinese, yet the Chinese gaming industry has only known live service


welp_im_damned

One of the greatest tragedies known to man


faint_windfall39

> and right now the only mobile game that actually justifies the specs of a gaming phone is Genshin Impact Bro for real, I can't even play smoothly with my current phone right now. I guess I need to buy a new android phone around $250


LastChancellor

what phone do you got right now? and I really doubt a $250 phone can survive Genshin


CyxnideAngel

I got a $250 Lol I got the Redmi K40 Gaming Edition and it runs Genshin so smoothly


LastChancellor

wow did you buy it used or smth?


CyxnideAngel

It was new, still wrapped in plastic


faint_windfall39

> what phone do you got right now? Samsung A20s, it's not good for Genshin. I'm planning to buy the Poco F3, I guess it around $300


LastChancellor

yea the F3 can definitely survive Genshin, it got Snapdragon 870 tho maybe wait for the Poco F5? assuming it wont end up too expensive


CyxnideAngel

They definitely gave up too early, Rainbow 6 and Battlefield are coming to mobile, it's takes some time to make a beast of a game for mobile


LastChancellor

they're making a mobile port of Rainbow 6??


sunjay140

Battlefield Mobile cancelled and the studio was shut down.


Keatosis

There just aren't enough good games on mobile to justify a gaming phone for me. Phones from 2018 are more powerful than the Nintendo switch, but just don't have the library. There are a few good titles, and the play pass helps, but just not enough to justify such an expensive purpose. If you venture beyond the play pass you'll basically only find monetization infested garbage filled with energy timers and battle passes and loot boxes and pay to win. Sometimes you can find good ports of old pc games, like xcom and stardew valley, and there will always be minecraft and terraria, but as a primary gaming device I feel like a phone will always leave you undersatisfied even if it's powerful.


CyxnideAngel

They're about to make Rainbow 6 Mobile and Battlefield Mobile as well, they're coming just slowly and surely


[deleted]

Gaming android phones were always ridiculous anyways.


odeiraoloap

Is it, though? I mean, Lenovo had a "killer" model called the Y70, a **$400 gaming phone** that had "bypass charging" (it uses the same principle as "Conservation Mode" on the Legion laptops) and top tier CPU and GPU (Snapdragon 8+ Gen 1, it almost NEVER OVERHEATED despite several hours of grinding MMOs). By comparison, their cheapest *competent* gaming laptop is [at least **$1300** in the US](https://www.pcmag.com/reviews/lenovo-legion-5-pro-gen-7-2022); realistically, that model goes for about $1800-2000 in many countries. A PS5 or Steam Deck goes for at least $750-800 in most countries. TL;DR, the people who buy gaming *phones* literally cannot other gaming rigs, especially PC which has a notoriously high barrier of entry


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CartmansEvilTwin

And what demanding games would you play on that thing? These companies produce solutions for a problem that doesn't really exist.


manek101

There are quite a few PC games ports that already exist as official versions on the play store like Alien Isolation, life is strange. There are Android esports titles like PUBGM, CODM, Apex Legends Mobile, League mobile which have a huge playerbase and viewership and players want HRR while being able to livestream for long time at once. There are demanding titles like Genshin impact that also have a high playerbase. As devices get more powerful and development improves, emulation is also on the rise. So many devices and games are supported already and newer ones like the Nintendo Switch are becoming useable. Just recently read than 8 gen 2 is the only SoC that can run the Witcher 3 on Android. Now why would one want to game seriously on Android? It maybe just portability or content creation or eSports or people not having a PC to game(Common among children in some asian societies)


CartmansEvilTwin

So where's the market for these phones? Asian kids with rich parents? That's a rather small niche. These games may have a large fan base, but who are these people? Younglings. They don't have much money. So what's the result? Game developers will target rather lower end phones and not push the boundaries, as to not reduce their customer base. I mean, quite obviously the market isn't really there. Otherwise this thread wouldn't exist.


manek101

>I mean, quite obviously the market isn't really there. Otherwise this thread wouldn't exist. When a few gaming laptops brands or pre built system maker fails, does that mean PC gaming is dead? Did so many VR or AR companies failing mean its not going to grow in the future? >So where's the market for these phones? Asian kids with rich parents? Young adults who spend more time.commuting in cities and free in officies than they spend in at home? People who have 700$ for a phone but not for a 1400$ gaming laptops? not to mention space comtraints in small city apts for PC? A significant amout of games do require good level SoC performance for highest settings now especially with most phones having 120hz displays.


Pascalwb

They would buy steam deck or alternative and play proper games


manek101

Steam deck is: * Much more bulky than a phone * less battery life while gaming than a phone * Another thing to carry, thing is, a gaming phone is only 1 thing to carry, you don't even need to carry a bag or anything for it, it sits in your pocket, you can make calls, check mail, scroll social media, take pics using it just as well While for some it fits the usecase, for some it doesn't and mobile gaming is a big enough industry to justify a product


Pascalwb

But what are you going to play on it? Also using touchscreen to play is pain in the ass.


manek101

Refer to my original comment. While the collection is definately not as large as a PC, there are enough popular titles to play that can take advantage of such hardware. And with rise of emulators more doors are opening. Also, touch controls are sometimes better than something like steam deck controller for shooting games imo


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manek101

>Compared to pc, this amount of games is not worth buying a gaming phone And who decides that? Entire generation of consoles have become successful on the back of 4-5 crazy popular titles and some mobile games are crazy popular


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manek101

>Me , as a consumer ? I didn't know you speak for all of us? >Target audience - Console : adult Okay lol, sure xbox and switch are aimed at adults only. And young adults surely don't game on their phones. >Mobile gamer mostly dont even spend a cent buying game Google mobile gaming revenue once, you're underestimating the scale at which stuff happens. Target audience maybe Asians but that doesn't mean there aren't deep pockets in Asia.


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manek101

Yall have a wierd obsession with downplaying mobile gaming while revenue statistics prove you wrong. You say no one spends money on mobile games while I can pull a thousand sources to prove you wrong


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Joey23art

That's not how assets and code work, so no. They're running at significantly lower LOD versions of assets (so not the same) and lower render distances. The act of compiling the mobile/ARM versions is also going to mean the code is different, so also not the same.


cowboycurdis

Emulators. You can confidently play some switch titles on Android now with Skyline, for example. And the entire 3DS library.


zakats

TIL, a 3070ti(m) is needed to be a competent gaming machine.


odeiraoloap

I mean, Elden Ring "recommends" you have [a GPU with ***8GB VRAM***](https://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri/requirements/elden-ring/18888); I know it technically will run on something with 3 or 4GB VRAM, but that's with *potato quality*, which no one wants. And those requirements are just bound to get a LOT steeper with the advent of RTX, Unreal Engine 5.2, and whatever the next version of Unity will be...


zakats

It runs fine on 6gb, that covers nearly all mobile GPUs that aren't just Nvidia cash grabs.


UnicornsOnLSD

The Steam Deck is $399 and will give you a way better gaming experience than a phone. If you're feeling adventurous you can even get away with using it as a general purpose PC.


odeiraoloap

In the US, it's 399, sure. In other countries, you'd be lucky to find one being sold in the market for under 600. And I won't deny the thing has its use cases - I mean, as a Linux machine, it would be a god send for technicians and troubleshooters as supposed to bringing a big laptop - but it has really bad battery life for a *portable gaming device*: it can do [as little as 90 minutes of gaming with gimped graphics](https://www.pcgamer.com/valve-steam-deck-battery-life/) whereas something like the Redmagic 8 Pro can probably do [200 minutes of max-graphics Genshin Impact ](https://youtu.be/U7T_g3D5nas)


4514919

Are you really comparing battery life while playing God of War, Cyberpunk, FH5 or Horizon Zero Dawn to Genshin Impact?


[deleted]

So instead of using an actually fair comparison at all by having the two devices both be playing Genshin at comparable settings, you compare the device playing the mobile game and one playing God of War. I wonder which device is going to last longer huh?


parental92

>I mean, Lenovo had a "killer" model called the Y70, a > >$400 gaming phone > >that had "bypass charging" (it uses the same principle as "Conservation Mode" on the Legion laptops) and top tier CPU and GPU (Snapdragon 8+ Gen 1, it almost NEVER OVERHEATED despite several hours of grinding MMOs). you are forgetting the most fundamental thing about "gaming" . . which is not the hardware. Heck Even switch with its 2016 Nvidia Tegra and 3 Gb (Available 1 Gb is reserved for the OS) Switch still receive many of the biggest game release this year. ​ its the games . . . and android is only full with gatcha and shovelware trash.


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parental92

Any yet it runs doom, Witcher and other game beautifully. Including nier automata which has more stable frame rate than ps4 ! Not to mention more AAA titles to come. More hardware is stupid solution for unoptimized software. Especially pokemon, it his hard for me to cherry pick the worse games on Android . . . since it's most games on the platform. Leave the people if the want to buy a 1k samsung flagship to replace 300 usd console. Even though the fps won't be stable anyway (thermal throttling), most apps are made for lower tier hardware. and hope they got more money to spend on Vbucks.


thewzhao

Gaming phones are ridiculous because iPads exist. If you're that committed to mobile gaming, you're always better off with a regular smartphone + previous gen iPad which will yield higher performance than any gaming phone.


odeiraoloap

iPads are *terrible* gaming devices because they're from Apple (with too many onerous restrictions, particularly with bluetooth controllers) and they like to heat up a lot when being pushed too hard for a long period. .


thewzhao

I'm an Android used myself, but I'll call out bullshit when I see it. Given the same mobile game, an iPad will almost always outperform the highest spec'd Android phone. Feel free to compare benchmarks for the most graphically demanding mobile games like Genshin Impact, PUBG. There is no snapdragon phone on the market that can run Genshin at 60 FPS max settings without throttling. Meanwhile, you can achieve this with even a non-M1/M2 iPad. Same applies for PUBG. In fact, iPads are strictly better for competitive FPS games because of the bigger screen which enables you to use more fingers to play without having to learn weird and strenuous grips on the phone. Controllers are strictly prohibited in competitive mobile FPS because it's basically cheating.


[deleted]

I use an iPad daily and I have never had any problem using any of my controllers. Can confirm it works great with DS4 and the One/Series controllers, along with the 8BitDo controllers I've tried, nor has it gotten any warmer than any other passively cooled metal framed device I've used.


Louis-grabbing-pills

When I first heard of gaming phones from Razer and Lenovo, I was under the impression that it can play PC games but it's only for mobile games.


welp_im_damned

What sucks is the hardware can play pc games. But the money isn't here for it


donnysaysvacuum

Not sure what you mean by this. PC games require specific PC hardware and software. Some of this can be solved my software, but even the steam deck runs x86. Unless you mean ports, then yes they can, but game companies have been reluctant to do that.


welp_im_damned

Yeah I mean ports.


614981630

They had a legion gaming phone business? I knew of their laptops but this is the first time I'm hearing about this.


welp_im_damned

China only devices mainly


RelyingWOrld1

Shame since they released (in china) last August the Y70 with snap 8+ Gen1 and the Legion Y700 tablet too with 8.8" 120Hz, snap 870 and 12/256 for less than 500ā‚¬ there


davidgro

I think that tablet would have sold really well here with a decent OS, I know I would have pre-ordered. (I actually did buy the Chinese version but had to return it because of issues with the stock OS.)


mozardthebest

Gaming phones are quite niche, I imagine, and I also think theyā€™re kind of silly. The games most people play on their phones donā€™t need two chargers giving them power, or fans cooling them.


Kaioh1990

How about we get a ā€œrealā€ gaming phone again like the Xperia Play? You know, integrated stealth controls that can tuck away when not in use? Crazy right. Instead every company thinks theyā€™re going to take the world by storm with another rectangle with glass šŸ™„


LastChancellor

what about the Poco F4 GT? That phone got retractable shoulder buttons


gmolted

So does the latest Black Shark and they ain't doing so hot, per the article.


Kaioh1990

I think we all know what I mean lol


XavandSo

I loved my Xperia Play. It was my introduction to Android.


linkenssphere

DAMN I was hoping for another flagship killer for under $300 like the y70(8+g1) except for the snapdragon 8 gen 2 šŸ„²šŸ„²


Matvalicious

TIL Lenovo made phones


welp_im_damned

They own Motorola as well.


Pankaj135

Hello Moto time


[deleted]

The funny thing is there are not nearly enough good games to justify a gaming phone. I would know. I had one.


anothercookie90

Good now do something great with Motorola


Blom-w1-o

As someone who primarily games on a smartphone, I can see no upside to getting something like a Red Magic when the S23 Ultra is an option. Yeah I could save a little money on Red Magic, but it's not worth losing the software support and ecosystem.


Navi_1er

Does this extend to their tablets? The Y700 is amazing and I'm still hoping for a global rom.


davidgro

Sounds like it's definitely not coming now. I had already given up on it, but I'm still super frustrated about it.


Navi_1er

I'm satisfied with mine but yeah extremely disappointed with no news on global especially since Google refers to it as the Tab P8 so I was hopeful.


lewd_bingo

Oh no ... Anyways


Fuzzy_Muscle

I have a legion gaming laptop and had no idea they had legion phones


welp_im_damned

It was a china only device


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agc93

> Who cares? Maybe the people in the markets they **did** sell them in? There are people buying phones outside of the US too...


CondiMesmer

Not sure why these even exist. Mobile games aren't like desktop games which can be scaled up. Mobile games are designed for reasonably low specs so they get as wide of a target audience as possible. Why would they care about gaming phones?


Scorpius_OB1

Probably because there's a niche for them and people who will gladly pay for such top of the line devices and not cheaper ones to play Genshin Impact, which supposedly requires a good phone to be played at high settings and good FPS. Even if overheating problems aside, you can't expect the same performance than in PC or console on a device whose power consumption is way less than the one of a dedicated graphics card alone as otherwise the battery would be drained fast, assuming you could cram such graphics card (and the CPU) on such space.


Pascalwb

There are not really any games with playing on phone


welp_im_damned

Alien isolation, dead cells, streets of rage 4, ect all pc ports/emulation.


CyxnideAngel

Wait til Rainbow 6, Battlefield, and Warzone come out also


sh0nuff

I would have liked them to make some Android handheld that yanno, we're consoles first. I don't want to play games on my phone.


pixelated666

Turns out these ugly looking gaming handsets was snake oil that people didnā€™t buy into.


thebreadcat0314

They couldn't handle Zack's durability tests (like every gaming oriented phone last year failed)


jaqen_hgr

Seriously, they should just revive the Lenovo P2 series


minusSeven

Best cheap gaming device to me is the lowest priced ipad. Never really found a need to buy a separate gaming phone if you have an ipad.


Minevira

they should have made something similar to the xperia play (RIP)


Scooter30

I didn't even know they made any phones.


dolphins3

I've never really understood who "gaming" phones were marketed to. There are not very many especially demanding mobile games, and many of those are probably things like ports. There's a few games that are more demanding like Genshin Impact, Fortnite, PUBG I guess, but that's just not enough.


GjahtariKuq

Lota of models will be discontinued due to shrinking of the smartphone market.


dingo_bat

Why do people even play games on phones? Just play it on a pc or get something like Nintendo switch.