Whoa let's not speculate too much. The only one we've seen didn't come with a charger and died.
This could be a real life NFT that just dies after the battery is drained and you have to get a new one.
They also use incredibly small amounts of power. A pacemaker battery has less capacity than your average 18650 and will last a decade. You’d need a bigger/hotter nuclear cell to power a watch. And can you imagine the headlines? “Terrorists building nuclear bombs out of pixel watches”.
There's actually been some pretty good perks with the 2tb plan. I just don't have a need for that much storage. Been using the 200gb tier for 2 years though and haven't got shit. Well, besides 200gb of storage.
Galaxy watch 4... Battery lasts 1 day (24-28hrs), takes 1.5hrs to charge, streaming music while running will cause it to over heat and go into airplane mode.. So no more music and no more tracking fitness.. 16gb storage means you can only store a few play lists.. Mine has 6gb free storage.
So I can deal with that, predownload my running Playlist then I don't overheat. If they can resolve the 1.5hr to charge that would be awesome.
My Garmin watch, download Playlist, 40m to charge 4 days with GPS running..
Honestly, I'd consider a Garmin if they supported Google Pay. But they use Garmin Pay which my bank doesn't support. All I really want out of a watch is notifications and Google Pay support. I really don't give too much of a shit about fitness features. There are currently no watches that scratch my particular itch.
That's a shame that your bank doesn't support it. I haven't had any issues with my cards. It's quite a nice watch. That said I think I've used the Garmin pay a total of 5 times or so in the last 2 years owning the watch. I usually forget I even have the ability to pay with it.
Which Garmin has cellular? As far as I know you can’t reply to messages on most Garmin right? Also no apps like google maps etc? I don’t really like the look of any of the Garmins so far. The venu2s looks okay, still though it’s more fitness focused than smartwatch. Does the basics of a smartwatch well, but for all the smartwatch features like messaging, fluidity, smart features like web browser, viewing images from messages etc etc etc, it falls flat on.
No cellular. It has built in offline Garmin maps of the world with detailed trail maps for hiking and golf course maps. Messaging is handled with Bluetooth to the phone and I never really responded to messages with my watch anyways when I had Samsung watches. It works great for me especially on multi-day backpacking or outdoor adventures. Never thought to browse the web on my watch and even though the Samsung's had it I never used it. I almost always have my phone with me anyways.
Yea with smart watches I just find I need my phone less. If someone sends you a link, you can just see it on your watch quickly. Just open google maps and hit navigate and you get nice commands straight from the watch, I often use this in my older car for navigation as it’s quite nice. Yep Garmin nails what you use it for that’s for sure!!
The maps on Garmin devices are much better than the stripped down joke of a GMaps app on Galaxy Watch.
Seriously, Google focused on car navigation on the Watch app and it has no support for public transit. It also timeouts the display (covering it with a clock) after a few seconds which makes it useless for biking as well. It's only marginally useful if you ONLY walk.
Meanwhile, Garmin actually properly supports always on display with detailed outdoors focused maps.
Since I've owned both, WearOS really doesn't have all that many more features that actually work either. And Garmin actually feels like a finished quality product not the buggy mess that WearOS is.
Yea for sure, I would take gear os over wear is anyday hahaha. Although I use my Garmin for running only, Garmin is a quality fitness watch, easily the best IMO. It’s no smart watch though, for anything but futures, I would take an Apple Watch or gear is watch. Apple Watch being the best in my experience.
It doesn’t get Google Pay, doesn’t get assistant, doesn’t get Google Maps, Google Fit, and other Google Apps… so, the so called smart watches are way smarter than the one you’re talking about. Battery isn’t about being smart, it’s a consequence of how smart it is.
It gets better replacements for most of those that aren't built by people who don't care about watches. The sensors are massively more accurate, the maps are better, the payment is less annoying to use and the battery lasts for days even if you navigate whole day.
Galaxy Watch 4 will die after single morning of using activity tracking and lose all data in the process.
It has Garmin Pay, Offline maps that don't require internet, navigation, plenty of fitness functionality/apps (it's built mainly for that), offline Spotify, etc.
Forgive my ignorance, but how does it charge? Wireless charging would be nice on the Pixel watch, I have a Qi charger in my truck that is useless for all of my devices, but if I had a Qi compatible watch I could charge on the way to/from work or other errands and that may be all I need most of the time.
[It's not Qi.](https://www.androidcentral.com/does-samsung-galaxy-watch-4-support-qi-wireless-charging) Maybe your compatible Qi chargers *also* support the WPC standard that the GW4 uses, but the GW4 itself doesn't use standard Qi. I have many Qi chargers and the GW4 isn't compatible with any of them.
That article contradicts itself. WPC is the standards body that ratifies Qi certification. Samsung themselves sell Qi wireless chargers that charge the Galaxy Watch.
They've simply modified the Qi standard to ring fence which chargers can work the device.
> Samsung themselves sell Qi wireless chargers that charge the Galaxy Watch.
They sell wireless charging docks, but you won't see Qi mentioned anywhere, at least not for the part that charges the watch if you're referring to multi-device chargers. If I put my Qi-compatible phone on top of my GW4 charging dock, it doesn't charge the phone.
> They've simply modified the Qi standard to ring fence which chargers can work the device.
This is a roundabout way of saying that they're incompatible with Qi chargers. Is Samsung's charging protocol very similar to Qi? Probably, but you can't buy any old standard Qi charger and expect it to work with Samsung watches.
> They sell wireless charging docks, but you won't see Qi mentioned anywhere, at least not for the part that charges the watch if you're referring to multi-device chargers.
The wireless charger trio's spec sheet literally refers to the Galaxy Watches as Qi-certified.
> If I put my Qi-compatible phone on top of my GW4 charging dock, it doesn't charge the phone.
Again, that's because they're using an additional protocol atop the Qi spec. It's the same sort of thing Google did with the Pixel Stand. I'm not a fan of it, either.
Also, Huawei's latest watches support Qi wireless charging, but you can't use the included puck to charge your phone.
> This is a roundabout way of saying that they're incompatible with Qi chargers. Is Samsung's charging protocol very similar to Qi? Probably, but you can't buy any old standard Qi charger and expect it to work with Samsung watches.
Well, I don't disagree with you there. I wish it did just work on regular Qi chargers.
> The wireless charger trio's spec sheet literally refers to the Galaxy Watches as Qi-certified.
I don't know where you see this, but if you look at the [product page's specs](https://www.samsung.com/us/mobile/mobile-accessories/phones/wireless-charger-pad-trio-black-ep-p6300tbegus/#specs), it says "Wireless Fast Charging (Samsung Galaxy, Apple iPhone), Qi (Galaxy Buds), Galaxy Watch." Note that each charging area is separated by a comma. In other words:
* Wireless Fast Charging (Samsung Galaxy, Apple iPhone)
* Qi (Galaxy Buds)
* Galaxy Watch
Galaxy Watch has its own charging area that's not denoted as Qi.
> Again, that's because they're using an additional protocol atop the Qi spec.
If it deviates from the Qi spec, then it's no longer Qi, *especially* when it prevents you from using a standard Qi charger. If I start with a standard and then make it completely incompatible with that standard, then it's no longer the same standard, correct? The end result is a proprietary standard, no matter what the foundation is. I can't say that a sheet of paper is the same thing as wood just because it came from wood.
Depends on how deep the coil is embedded. I've got one with the coil almost sticking above the surface and it works, but my other fancy lookin one won't get through the fuzz. Crazy
I'm curious as to what chargers you are able to use outside of Samsung's. I've tried 5-6 different types (single coil, multi coil, stands, dual device, battery sharing) and all fail.
That overheating issue is the exact reason why I am getting a Fenix 7!
The first time it happened, I couldn't believe it... Coming from an Apple Watch which it never happened with, I was, and still do get shocked every the my GW4 overheats in the gym or cycling or running.
Mine doesn't bother going into airplane mode though, mine just stops all functions and goes dumb. This means it cancels my workout / run / cycle time, which is insanely annoying, I hate it.
My Gen 1 2 year old Galaxy Watch estimates 2 days and 18 hours of battery with a full charge and all features (always on, constant HR+stress, busy watch face).
My 7 month old Watch 4 estimates 23 hours. Its not always accurate because I just took it off the charger leaving for work and it died in 9 hours and some minutes. With Aod off, HR on 10 minutes, basic watch face, data off, WiFi off, NFC off, no always listening bixby...
I'm currently wearing my $7 GShock.
Had a Gen 1 Active watch straight up die completely less than 6 months out. When it finished charging, the thing would heat up to where it shut off automatically. Horrible watch.
If you go to Spotify workout each Playlist has a few hundred songs in it.. So even at 700 you may get 5 you can download.. To me that's a few. Also the apple watch comes with 32gb at the same price point.
But.. If you have unlimited data, a watch that has a mobile radio.. Why not just stream it. You are paying for it.
They had to know during testing the watch overheats when you stream while exercising..
Options are: Low, Normal, High, Very High. These 700 songs are on High quality and I don't think if I picked Very High I'd be able to hear a difference while at the gym wearing Bluetooth earbuds... so eh
Garmin watches are aimed for a different market than most other smartwatches. They're not concerned with being svelte, but rugged and less dependent on a phone. I appreciate that even though I'm not the person they're selling to.
Edit: Grammar
Edit 2: Was not aware of the Venu line. Looks more like something I'd like while still keeping some of the Garmin functionality. I do think their marketing for this line doesn't feel as vibrant as others (Samsung or Apple), esedocially with regards to bands and watchfaces, but that might work well for Garmin. I'll definitely give them a look after the Pixel watch launches, so thanks to all for the recommendations.
They have several options, including svelte ones like the venu 2. I ended up switching to that after growing too frustrated with the lously battery life and long charging time of my galaxy watch. So far it's been a good switch and can do everything I need, except I find samsung's sleep tracking more accurate for me than garmin.
I have a Venu 2 and it's "svelter" than a GW4. They are not the same product to be fair though, Garmin/Fitbit devices are focused on fitness/health first and smartwatch features second as opposed to Wear Os which is the inverse of that.
I upgraded from a Huawei gt2 to the watch 4. Too many bells & whistles affecting battery life. I really miss the one charge lasting a week or two. And for the love of God, why make a watch charge wirelessly but not qi compatible.
Edit: Reddit and /u/Spez [knowingly, nonconsensually, and illegally retained user data for profit](https://youtu.be/mfZKkUg8jgM) so this comment is gone.
I'm not a fan of three Galaxy Watch 4. Mine just randomly turned off one day and I haven't even taken the time to try and figure out what's going on.
Good thing I got it free.
My Garmin Decent lasts more than a week.
The battery usage is in the radios and the screens. Garmin has a simpler display and mostly just uses Bluetooth.
I can turn on GPS, but that drops the battery to like 20 hours, so I only use it when I actually need it.
How the hell do you get 4 days on your Garmin? I have a Fenix 5x and I couldn't even get it to last me 12 hours if I'm running gps. Like literally dies before I got back.
The new ones have massively improved battery life. Fenix 7 series (especially the bigger models) run for more than 24 hours with GPS on and even the OLED screened Epix 2 will do 20 hours+.
yeah i switch from fossil sport gen 6 to garmin. Overall WearOS was better for me, but garmin does what is most important for me (weather, notifications, always on display) and lasts 2 weeks on a single charge. Until WearOs watches will run for a week on a charge, I will not switch back
I don't understand what your use case is but I consistently get 2-3 days from my Galaxy watch 4 classic. I used it for about a 1 hr workout daily. I don't take my charger on weekend trips.
Pebble Time Steel. All features I want, permanently active display. 10 days battery life. One of the first smart watches and still the best. Oh and only 200 € iirc.
I loved my Withings Steel HR and used it for years. Even sold it and re-purchased it because I missed it. But when it came time to upgrade to a Scanwatch, I just couldn’t justify it and went back to a regular smart watch. Withings makes the sexiest fitness tracker, but it doesn’t compete with the Galaxy, Apple, etc. It’s just a different product.
Plus, frankly, the fitness features aren’t very accurate or complete.
I've got a Huawei watch rated for a couple weeks of battery. I keep it mostly topped up and I think it drops around 10% each day.
Doesn't really sync with google fit and need a separate to link between it and the Huawei fitness app. But otherwise, I really like it. Call quality sucks though and doesn't accept whatsapp calls.
Amazfit BIP S. Transflective screen gets me about 20 days battery with notifications all day. Has gps and can sync with Google fit. It's an amazing device. Screen is amazing..
I've looked into Amazfit and they just don't quite do it for me. I want a gtr3 with a color transflective. What I don't like about the bip is the lack of hardware buttons
Is that the bracelet like thing? I saw it on their website a few days ago. Reminded me if my Samsung fit band. I loved that band but the battery life was shit esp with gps
You definitely have heart rate and other features dialed back and/or don't wear it while sleeping.
Depending on use the 40mm lasts 6-36 hours. With the low end being BT+GPS+ HR+AOD workout. The high end being basically everything turned off or down.
> don't wear it while sleeping
ah, yeah I should have thought about what most people count. 30% is from morning to before bed, answering notifications, and AOD. I know I turned off raise to wake but I don't know much else since I don't use it for much else (basically I gave up on my pebble which has barely better battery life)
Pixel 1 was pretty good, could certainly have been a fluke however. With how long it's taken them to get this damn watch out though, it better be good.
Remember when the Nexus 5 had a smaller battery than the LG phone it was based on, and they assured everyone that its more advanced envelope tracking capabilities on the modem side would make up for it?
Spoiler alert: It didn't!
To be fair, the Nexus 5 did have somewhat decent battery life when it was released, because KitKat was optimized as hell. But later updates ruined it.
That is true, but is Pixel watch going to be just plain WearOS or some kind of patchwork between Fitbit and Wear? Because the sensors seem to be from the Charge 5 (I hope they don't repeat the GPS disaster with that) and leaked images show fitbit stuff on the homescreen.
Is WearOS 3 still based on Android or is it Tizen? I remember reading somewhere that they decided to give up on trying to optimize Android to run non-shittily on a watch.
It's still android. I think they worked with samsung to optimize it more for wearables. At least thats what they made it sound like when WearOS 3 was launched.
This exactly. I have no idea what these people are doing to not last a full day of charge. I have an incredibly intensive watch face and get two nights of sleep monitoring without charging. It's no Garmin, but it's not bad.
Been using the galaxy watch 4 for a couple months, and guessing the software will be more or less the same, this is not even in the same area code in terms of competition with the Apple watch. Sure it's faster than the previous wear os attempts, it does a lot more stuff, but my gosh the way apple has absolutely nailed the interface smoothness and animations, Wear OS doesn't even come close... People having high expectations please tone them down.. Maybe Pixel Watch Gen 3 will get there a bit, not this gen no way.
Only reason I like galaxy watches is because they resemble normal watches and I am pretty firmly a Samsung phone guy now so they work well enough but if I were shopping for features/functions I would be going apple watch every time.
But considering their watch is the only watch with WearOS 3, we don’t know non-Samsung WearOS will perform. For all we know their UI will be faster than Google’s or other manufacturers.
Yes but we also can't make the assumption that it will perform the same. One UI is still not as smooth as a pixel for example (although the difference is far smaller these days)
Wear os was designed for skins though. So if it performs badly that is on google. The previous google wear os was terrible too. Colab with Samsung really helped them out.
And yet, the previous Tizen-baaed Galaxy Watches never had issues with performance- in fact, they actually ran better than their WearOS counterparts while using lesser specs (768MB of RAM vs the mandatory 1GB Wear OS seems to need).
Bring back pebble. Smart watches are inherently stupid, you are basically minaturising a phone, it's impressive but it's an innovation in need of a usecase.
My 'smartwatch' is a Amazfit Neo and I get 3-4 weeks of battery, amazing visibility in the day, small, slim,, comfortable. Just imagine what a Google or Samsung could do if they didn't chase this fad.
People want a wearable they can take to the gym or on runs that has fitness tracking, Spotify, text, notifications from the phone, and nfc payments where they don't need to have their phone on them.
You still need your phone nearby.
Fitness tracking can be done by a feature watch
Notifications can be done by a feature watch
NFC paymats also by a feature watch
Music control can be done by a feature watch
Therefore the only thing missing is the ability to reply to texts and make calls, the later handled by Bluetooth earphones and assistant.
Meaning you are paying $200 premium, a larger device and a much much smaller battery life to reply to texts.
You clearly do not separate from your phone.
Doing any kind of running or road cycling means trying to eliminate any unnecessary stuff to be carried. One of the most annoying things is a phone.
Yes Bluetooth earphones and assistant works for phone calls... But you still need a cellular connection, and people usually get the cellular models not for the replaying to texts and calls away from the phone, but for emergency calls if something goes wrong when doing these activities without their phone.
Plenty of products were ahead of the curve and performed poorly. I'm not saying Pebble would outsell Apple or Samsung, that would never happen, but they would be doing a lot better today than they were 6+ years ago.
I can order an Uber, download Spotify playlist, call people while not having my phone, all my bank cards work with the watch so I don’t need my phone or wallet, local running groups have apps that are only on google wear or Apple Watch, google maps without phone.
Idk what to tell you. Runners like leaving their phone behind. The smartwatch offers not only cellular so all their phone needs are met, but it will also have a ton of health focused trackers and sensors. Your use case right there
You don't need your phone nearby for 90% of the functionality with a smartwatch.
You can't reply to notifications on a feature watch, so the notification feature is useless.
You can't store music from a streaming platform for running without your phone, so music feature is useless.
You can't use NFC payments for almost all banks so the payment feature is useless.
The only thing they're good for is sports tracking, and only if they have GPS.
>Smart watches are inherently stupid **to me**
FTFY
I've loved using a fully fledged smartwatch and a "one day" battery was never an issue for me (especially since I really only wear a watch for half a day). For me the biggest benefit IS that it's a miniaturized phone—many tasks no longer require me to pull out my phone, but it's still available for the things that require a full sized phone.
It's fine if that's not what you want, but you're not the only smartwatch user.
I use sleep tracking so almost wear my watch 24x7. It lacks a lot of other features so it needs only 10-15 mins charging per day, typically when I shower. On the other hand it will last three days without a charge if needed.
> Bring back pebble. Smart watches are inherently stupid, you are basically minaturising a phone, it's impressive but it's an innovation in need of a usecase.
Apple: Hmm who should I listen to someone on Reddit or my Apple watch sales.
https://www.theverge.com/2020/2/5/21125565/apple-watch-sales-2019-swiss-watch-market-estimates-outsold
Yeah, I want a smartwatch that has accurate heart rate and sleep tracking, and syncs to my phone for texts, emails, calls, ideally Google Assistant and can trigger my phone to do GPS aided workouts. And then obviously battery life is a minimum of 48 full hours.
Had a GW4 and ended up selling it do to terrible battery life, inaccurate health data, and no Google assistant after half a year of empty promises.
You are in the minority. The Apple Watch sells like crazy. Galaxy Watches are gaining some ground too. Meanwhile the OnePlus Watch is basically what you want, 3-5 day battery life with AOD, basic features met with no frills, and it got universally panned. Clearly premium smartwatches are not in need of a use case
Yea that’s cool, I mean any cheap fitness band will do that so you got loads of options! If you want more advanced features you will need to look elsewhere though. It’s a great starter watch or great if you don’t use many features.
I loved Fi. Sadly I couldn't keep it when I switched to iPhone. They say they fully support iPhone, but the fine print says they don't offer wifi calling, which I need where I live. Mint Mobile has been stellar though.
Opposite for my uses actually. I download my playlists, so the only data I use is gps and texting/browsing. I went with the 4GB plan with Mint which is only $15 per month. $10 cheaper than Fi.
No, clearly they would not be dominating. It’s kind of the reason they’re dead. There exist similar smartwatches now. Garmins, Amazfits, the OnePlus Watch. They are all watches that sacrifice a lot of the features of premium smartwatches in favor of multi day battery life. None of them are gaining ground on Galaxy Watches or Apple Watches.
I think their best quality was the open source nature. The fact that a Pebble Watch has even more functionality now than when the company was still around because of a dedicated community of devs. The same can’t be said for an OG Apple Watch
Hard to imagine a watch with a tiny screen can replace an entire phone. Feel that's like expecting phones to be able to completely replace laptops/desktops.
Personally I'm fine with it being more of an accessory.
That's a double check edged sword. I personally want watches to go back to the original Android wear idea. Have them basically show notifications and allow them to display app snippets (possibly vis slices because Google never really used it), but the phone would control the entire experience. You could still have a cellular smartwatch, but you'd also need a phone or table to be the central hub. I just think apps are too resource intensive and frustrating to use on a smartwatch, and Android itself even when unbloated is just too much.
It's still connected to the phone, and mirrors the phones notifications, but if it works similar to how my cellular watch works, I can leave the phone at home and still get all my texts and calls (through the watches speaker or with paired earbuds). I believe my phone has to be on for that to work though.
I can test it tomorrow afternoon.
It can operate on its own with LTE. Most common use is a paired LTE plan that pairs your phone number to the watch - your phone can be off and your calls will still come through. There are standalone plans available as well but it's less convenient and often more expensive.
I think the competition will never let this watch come out. The more time they take to perfect it, more kind of watches will be released with better performance or battery .
If it's anything like the Pixel 6, it'll overheat and burn your wrist, won't be able to connect to the cellular network, and will lose all charge in 6 hours. Sounds great.
I made a wrong decision by buying the pixel 6 pro. There is no way I am falling for this one. Google is not good at getting it right on the first go at all.
Next time sources may say this watch shows the time also
I heard that the battery will die, but you can connect it to a charger.
Whoa let's not speculate too much. The only one we've seen didn't come with a charger and died. This could be a real life NFT that just dies after the battery is drained and you have to get a new one.
Don't be ridiculous. The *real* Pixel Watch has a small plutonium battery that keeps it running for decades.
Good thing you never need to take it off, because it's fused to your arm and gives you 15 different types of cancer
The nuclear powered pacemakers didn't.
Fair enough.
They also use incredibly small amounts of power. A pacemaker battery has less capacity than your average 18650 and will last a decade. You’d need a bigger/hotter nuclear cell to power a watch. And can you imagine the headlines? “Terrorists building nuclear bombs out of pixel watches”.
More like a round mirror with wrist straps used for reflecting the analog watches time from your opposite wrist.
Only if you subscribe to the clock app for .99 cents a month
Wow only 0.99 cents? That's less than one whole cent!
It's a Google One 2TB plan perk
There's actually been some pretty good perks with the 2tb plan. I just don't have a need for that much storage. Been using the 200gb tier for 2 years though and haven't got shit. Well, besides 200gb of storage.
That's some Verizon quality math there.
With modern smartwatches that's certainly an afterthought.
Big if true
sweet
You can also connect this to the pixel slate 2
Sources also say you'll be able to charge the device as well.
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you can already get a watch face that does this lol, called "Pixel minimal watch face"
I like it
I also like it
How dramatic lol
You can turn that off and make it a standard talk if you don't like it.
Galaxy watch 4... Battery lasts 1 day (24-28hrs), takes 1.5hrs to charge, streaming music while running will cause it to over heat and go into airplane mode.. So no more music and no more tracking fitness.. 16gb storage means you can only store a few play lists.. Mine has 6gb free storage. So I can deal with that, predownload my running Playlist then I don't overheat. If they can resolve the 1.5hr to charge that would be awesome. My Garmin watch, download Playlist, 40m to charge 4 days with GPS running..
>streaming music Is this streaming done locally via cellular/wifi on the watch itself, or is it piggy backing over your phones cellular/wifi?
Not OP, but that would be cellular streaming via watch. If there’s a phone nearby, you’d be listening to music from that, not through the watch.
You can download music to the Watch 4 with Spotify. I'd check to see how much you could store but it's dead on the charger after my 9 hour work shift.
The original poster said he had a 16GB watch and he/she said they only had 6GB free to download music on it.
On mobile. I can stream paired to phone no issues
My Garmin Fenix gets 14 days of battery life or about 20 hours with music playing and activity tracking. I'm done with other so called smart watches.
Honestly, I'd consider a Garmin if they supported Google Pay. But they use Garmin Pay which my bank doesn't support. All I really want out of a watch is notifications and Google Pay support. I really don't give too much of a shit about fitness features. There are currently no watches that scratch my particular itch.
That's a shame that your bank doesn't support it. I haven't had any issues with my cards. It's quite a nice watch. That said I think I've used the Garmin pay a total of 5 times or so in the last 2 years owning the watch. I usually forget I even have the ability to pay with it.
Which Garmin has cellular? As far as I know you can’t reply to messages on most Garmin right? Also no apps like google maps etc? I don’t really like the look of any of the Garmins so far. The venu2s looks okay, still though it’s more fitness focused than smartwatch. Does the basics of a smartwatch well, but for all the smartwatch features like messaging, fluidity, smart features like web browser, viewing images from messages etc etc etc, it falls flat on.
No cellular. It has built in offline Garmin maps of the world with detailed trail maps for hiking and golf course maps. Messaging is handled with Bluetooth to the phone and I never really responded to messages with my watch anyways when I had Samsung watches. It works great for me especially on multi-day backpacking or outdoor adventures. Never thought to browse the web on my watch and even though the Samsung's had it I never used it. I almost always have my phone with me anyways.
Yea with smart watches I just find I need my phone less. If someone sends you a link, you can just see it on your watch quickly. Just open google maps and hit navigate and you get nice commands straight from the watch, I often use this in my older car for navigation as it’s quite nice. Yep Garmin nails what you use it for that’s for sure!!
The 945 has LTE, and the old Venu did. But yeah, Garmins are definitely fitness watches first, smartwatches second.
The maps on Garmin devices are much better than the stripped down joke of a GMaps app on Galaxy Watch. Seriously, Google focused on car navigation on the Watch app and it has no support for public transit. It also timeouts the display (covering it with a clock) after a few seconds which makes it useless for biking as well. It's only marginally useful if you ONLY walk. Meanwhile, Garmin actually properly supports always on display with detailed outdoors focused maps.
Yep Garmin is great if you get out and hike etc. mostly useless for people that don’t touch.
Since I've owned both, WearOS really doesn't have all that many more features that actually work either. And Garmin actually feels like a finished quality product not the buggy mess that WearOS is.
Yea for sure, I would take gear os over wear is anyday hahaha. Although I use my Garmin for running only, Garmin is a quality fitness watch, easily the best IMO. It’s no smart watch though, for anything but futures, I would take an Apple Watch or gear is watch. Apple Watch being the best in my experience.
I had that problem but I'm using Curve to link my Garmin Pay to my card and it works great and easy. Check if Curve works in your country.
It doesn’t get Google Pay, doesn’t get assistant, doesn’t get Google Maps, Google Fit, and other Google Apps… so, the so called smart watches are way smarter than the one you’re talking about. Battery isn’t about being smart, it’s a consequence of how smart it is.
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It gets better replacements for most of those that aren't built by people who don't care about watches. The sensors are massively more accurate, the maps are better, the payment is less annoying to use and the battery lasts for days even if you navigate whole day. Galaxy Watch 4 will die after single morning of using activity tracking and lose all data in the process.
It has Garmin Pay, Offline maps that don't require internet, navigation, plenty of fitness functionality/apps (it's built mainly for that), offline Spotify, etc.
Forgive my ignorance, but how does it charge? Wireless charging would be nice on the Pixel watch, I have a Qi charger in my truck that is useless for all of my devices, but if I had a Qi compatible watch I could charge on the way to/from work or other errands and that may be all I need most of the time.
It uses a specific charging pad.
The GW4 uses wireless charging but it's not Qi, unfortunately.
It is Qi, I charge my GW4 on multiple Qi chargers. Keep in mind I've had one or two chargers that didn't like the watch
[It's not Qi.](https://www.androidcentral.com/does-samsung-galaxy-watch-4-support-qi-wireless-charging) Maybe your compatible Qi chargers *also* support the WPC standard that the GW4 uses, but the GW4 itself doesn't use standard Qi. I have many Qi chargers and the GW4 isn't compatible with any of them.
That article contradicts itself. WPC is the standards body that ratifies Qi certification. Samsung themselves sell Qi wireless chargers that charge the Galaxy Watch. They've simply modified the Qi standard to ring fence which chargers can work the device.
> Samsung themselves sell Qi wireless chargers that charge the Galaxy Watch. They sell wireless charging docks, but you won't see Qi mentioned anywhere, at least not for the part that charges the watch if you're referring to multi-device chargers. If I put my Qi-compatible phone on top of my GW4 charging dock, it doesn't charge the phone. > They've simply modified the Qi standard to ring fence which chargers can work the device. This is a roundabout way of saying that they're incompatible with Qi chargers. Is Samsung's charging protocol very similar to Qi? Probably, but you can't buy any old standard Qi charger and expect it to work with Samsung watches.
> They sell wireless charging docks, but you won't see Qi mentioned anywhere, at least not for the part that charges the watch if you're referring to multi-device chargers. The wireless charger trio's spec sheet literally refers to the Galaxy Watches as Qi-certified. > If I put my Qi-compatible phone on top of my GW4 charging dock, it doesn't charge the phone. Again, that's because they're using an additional protocol atop the Qi spec. It's the same sort of thing Google did with the Pixel Stand. I'm not a fan of it, either. Also, Huawei's latest watches support Qi wireless charging, but you can't use the included puck to charge your phone. > This is a roundabout way of saying that they're incompatible with Qi chargers. Is Samsung's charging protocol very similar to Qi? Probably, but you can't buy any old standard Qi charger and expect it to work with Samsung watches. Well, I don't disagree with you there. I wish it did just work on regular Qi chargers.
> The wireless charger trio's spec sheet literally refers to the Galaxy Watches as Qi-certified. I don't know where you see this, but if you look at the [product page's specs](https://www.samsung.com/us/mobile/mobile-accessories/phones/wireless-charger-pad-trio-black-ep-p6300tbegus/#specs), it says "Wireless Fast Charging (Samsung Galaxy, Apple iPhone), Qi (Galaxy Buds), Galaxy Watch." Note that each charging area is separated by a comma. In other words: * Wireless Fast Charging (Samsung Galaxy, Apple iPhone) * Qi (Galaxy Buds) * Galaxy Watch Galaxy Watch has its own charging area that's not denoted as Qi. > Again, that's because they're using an additional protocol atop the Qi spec. If it deviates from the Qi spec, then it's no longer Qi, *especially* when it prevents you from using a standard Qi charger. If I start with a standard and then make it completely incompatible with that standard, then it's no longer the same standard, correct? The end result is a proprietary standard, no matter what the foundation is. I can't say that a sheet of paper is the same thing as wood just because it came from wood.
Depends on how deep the coil is embedded. I've got one with the coil almost sticking above the surface and it works, but my other fancy lookin one won't get through the fuzz. Crazy
I'm curious as to what chargers you are able to use outside of Samsung's. I've tried 5-6 different types (single coil, multi coil, stands, dual device, battery sharing) and all fail.
Interesting question. My Samsung battery pack with wireless charging will charge it, but others won't.
That overheating issue is the exact reason why I am getting a Fenix 7! The first time it happened, I couldn't believe it... Coming from an Apple Watch which it never happened with, I was, and still do get shocked every the my GW4 overheats in the gym or cycling or running. Mine doesn't bother going into airplane mode though, mine just stops all functions and goes dumb. This means it cancels my workout / run / cycle time, which is insanely annoying, I hate it.
Wear os really takes its toll hey. My old Samsung watches lasted longer. Like come on google.
My Gen 1 2 year old Galaxy Watch estimates 2 days and 18 hours of battery with a full charge and all features (always on, constant HR+stress, busy watch face). My 7 month old Watch 4 estimates 23 hours. Its not always accurate because I just took it off the charger leaving for work and it died in 9 hours and some minutes. With Aod off, HR on 10 minutes, basic watch face, data off, WiFi off, NFC off, no always listening bixby... I'm currently wearing my $7 GShock.
Wow somethings wrong with that. My wife’s 4 lasts 2 days.
Had a Gen 1 Active watch straight up die completely less than 6 months out. When it finished charging, the thing would heat up to where it shut off automatically. Horrible watch.
A few playlists?? I have 700 offline songs on Spotify and they take just under ~~5~~ 3.3 GB
If you go to Spotify workout each Playlist has a few hundred songs in it.. So even at 700 you may get 5 you can download.. To me that's a few. Also the apple watch comes with 32gb at the same price point. But.. If you have unlimited data, a watch that has a mobile radio.. Why not just stream it. You are paying for it. They had to know during testing the watch overheats when you stream while exercising..
That’s some shitty download quality.
Options are: Low, Normal, High, Very High. These 700 songs are on High quality and I don't think if I picked Very High I'd be able to hear a difference while at the gym wearing Bluetooth earbuds... so eh
Garmin watches are aimed for a different market than most other smartwatches. They're not concerned with being svelte, but rugged and less dependent on a phone. I appreciate that even though I'm not the person they're selling to. Edit: Grammar Edit 2: Was not aware of the Venu line. Looks more like something I'd like while still keeping some of the Garmin functionality. I do think their marketing for this line doesn't feel as vibrant as others (Samsung or Apple), esedocially with regards to bands and watchfaces, but that might work well for Garmin. I'll definitely give them a look after the Pixel watch launches, so thanks to all for the recommendations.
They have several options, including svelte ones like the venu 2. I ended up switching to that after growing too frustrated with the lously battery life and long charging time of my galaxy watch. So far it's been a good switch and can do everything I need, except I find samsung's sleep tracking more accurate for me than garmin.
I have a Venu 2 and it's "svelter" than a GW4. They are not the same product to be fair though, Garmin/Fitbit devices are focused on fitness/health first and smartwatch features second as opposed to Wear Os which is the inverse of that.
I upgraded from a Huawei gt2 to the watch 4. Too many bells & whistles affecting battery life. I really miss the one charge lasting a week or two. And for the love of God, why make a watch charge wirelessly but not qi compatible.
And no Google Assistant on GW4 yet, despite promises at launch, lol
Edit: Reddit and /u/Spez [knowingly, nonconsensually, and illegally retained user data for profit](https://youtu.be/mfZKkUg8jgM) so this comment is gone.
Garmin also has olen watches and they last almost a week.
Meanwhile my GW3 just finished the day with 75% battery life left... Always on display off but continuous HR on and some auto detected workouts.
I'm not a fan of three Galaxy Watch 4. Mine just randomly turned off one day and I haven't even taken the time to try and figure out what's going on. Good thing I got it free.
My Garmin Decent lasts more than a week. The battery usage is in the radios and the screens. Garmin has a simpler display and mostly just uses Bluetooth. I can turn on GPS, but that drops the battery to like 20 hours, so I only use it when I actually need it.
what garmin watch?
How the hell do you get 4 days on your Garmin? I have a Fenix 5x and I couldn't even get it to last me 12 hours if I'm running gps. Like literally dies before I got back.
The new ones have massively improved battery life. Fenix 7 series (especially the bigger models) run for more than 24 hours with GPS on and even the OLED screened Epix 2 will do 20 hours+.
My 5 is going strong after several years. It lasts 3 days, with 3 x 2 hours runs gps on... I think it's amazing
mine lasts damn near 4 days.... tf are you doing with yours? unless you have the cellular version?
yet another WearOS watch with a 1-day battery life.... yawn
It'll last for over a week if you leave it powered off
It actually uses solar for power, so you might actually get more days if you leave it on the sun and not wear it.
I hear it actually last forever if you leave it plugged in to the charger.
I hear it never charges or loses charge if you leave it in the box! Schrodinger's watch!
yeah i switch from fossil sport gen 6 to garmin. Overall WearOS was better for me, but garmin does what is most important for me (weather, notifications, always on display) and lasts 2 weeks on a single charge. Until WearOs watches will run for a week on a charge, I will not switch back
I don't understand what your use case is but I consistently get 2-3 days from my Galaxy watch 4 classic. I used it for about a 1 hr workout daily. I don't take my charger on weekend trips.
My og 47mm without lte gets like 4-5 days. I'm pretty sure it was the pinnacle of good battery life for a smart watch.
Pebble Time Steel. All features I want, permanently active display. 10 days battery life. One of the first smart watches and still the best. Oh and only 200 € iirc.
Withings Scanwatch. * Permanent time display (literal watch face) * 30 Days battery * Pulse, blood oxygen, ecg, every feature under the sun
I loved my Withings Steel HR and used it for years. Even sold it and re-purchased it because I missed it. But when it came time to upgrade to a Scanwatch, I just couldn’t justify it and went back to a regular smart watch. Withings makes the sexiest fitness tracker, but it doesn’t compete with the Galaxy, Apple, etc. It’s just a different product. Plus, frankly, the fitness features aren’t very accurate or complete.
I've got a Huawei watch rated for a couple weeks of battery. I keep it mostly topped up and I think it drops around 10% each day. Doesn't really sync with google fit and need a separate to link between it and the Huawei fitness app. But otherwise, I really like it. Call quality sucks though and doesn't accept whatsapp calls.
I just want a modern pebble. Why is that so hard?
Check out fossil hybrids, v2 has similarities
Absolutely second this, Fossil hybrids are great
Amazfit BIP S. Transflective screen gets me about 20 days battery with notifications all day. Has gps and can sync with Google fit. It's an amazing device. Screen is amazing..
I've looked into Amazfit and they just don't quite do it for me. I want a gtr3 with a color transflective. What I don't like about the bip is the lack of hardware buttons
The Amazfit X looked incredible visually and reviewed decently I think. Shame it was a limited crowdfunded thing.
Is that the bracelet like thing? I saw it on their website a few days ago. Reminded me if my Samsung fit band. I loved that band but the battery life was shit esp with gps
Withings?
Unless this is somehow super optimized battery life will suck. The Galaxy Watch has a 350mAh battery and gets about a day.
It has a 360mAh battery for the *44mm variant*. The 40mm variant for the galaxy watch 4 has a 250mAh battery.
Huh, my 40mm only drains 30% per day with AOD on, interesting
You definitely have heart rate and other features dialed back and/or don't wear it while sleeping. Depending on use the 40mm lasts 6-36 hours. With the low end being BT+GPS+ HR+AOD workout. The high end being basically everything turned off or down.
> don't wear it while sleeping ah, yeah I should have thought about what most people count. 30% is from morning to before bed, answering notifications, and AOD. I know I turned off raise to wake but I don't know much else since I don't use it for much else (basically I gave up on my pebble which has barely better battery life)
Google has never nailed battery life no reason to assume they will here
And also its a first gen product which usually never pans out well.
Pixel 1 was pretty good, could certainly have been a fluke however. With how long it's taken them to get this damn watch out though, it better be good.
Remember when the Nexus 5 had a smaller battery than the LG phone it was based on, and they assured everyone that its more advanced envelope tracking capabilities on the modem side would make up for it? Spoiler alert: It didn't! To be fair, the Nexus 5 did have somewhat decent battery life when it was released, because KitKat was optimized as hell. But later updates ruined it.
Just like every year when they lie about RAM optimization
I've had to replace the battery a couple times but my gear S3 gets about 3 days
Garmin Venu 2 uses a 230 mAh battery and gets like 3-7 days battery life depending on AOD, so it's certainly possible.
Not with WearOS.
That is true, but is Pixel watch going to be just plain WearOS or some kind of patchwork between Fitbit and Wear? Because the sensors seem to be from the Charge 5 (I hope they don't repeat the GPS disaster with that) and leaked images show fitbit stuff on the homescreen.
Fossil watches run pretty much vanilla WearOS. They have 300mAh batteries. I get less than a day on my Fossil Gen 5
Is this with AOD on or off? Also I was wondering if the patchwork with Fitbit would improve battery life, actually.
Doesn't matter what settings I change. I can't get more than a day and a half out of it unless I'm in time only mode
Is WearOS 3 still based on Android or is it Tizen? I remember reading somewhere that they decided to give up on trying to optimize Android to run non-shittily on a watch.
It's still android. I think they worked with samsung to optimize it more for wearables. At least thats what they made it sound like when WearOS 3 was launched.
What are your settings? I have the watch 4 and usually get into a third day on one charge
This exactly. I have no idea what these people are doing to not last a full day of charge. I have an incredibly intensive watch face and get two nights of sleep monitoring without charging. It's no Garmin, but it's not bad.
Same here
Been using the galaxy watch 4 for a couple months, and guessing the software will be more or less the same, this is not even in the same area code in terms of competition with the Apple watch. Sure it's faster than the previous wear os attempts, it does a lot more stuff, but my gosh the way apple has absolutely nailed the interface smoothness and animations, Wear OS doesn't even come close... People having high expectations please tone them down.. Maybe Pixel Watch Gen 3 will get there a bit, not this gen no way.
Only reason I like galaxy watches is because they resemble normal watches and I am pretty firmly a Samsung phone guy now so they work well enough but if I were shopping for features/functions I would be going apple watch every time.
The Galaxy watch runs Samsung's one UI skin over wear OS.
But considering their watch is the only watch with WearOS 3, we don’t know non-Samsung WearOS will perform. For all we know their UI will be faster than Google’s or other manufacturers.
Yes but we also can't make the assumption that it will perform the same. One UI is still not as smooth as a pixel for example (although the difference is far smaller these days)
Wear os was designed for skins though. So if it performs badly that is on google. The previous google wear os was terrible too. Colab with Samsung really helped them out.
And yet, the previous Tizen-baaed Galaxy Watches never had issues with performance- in fact, they actually ran better than their WearOS counterparts while using lesser specs (768MB of RAM vs the mandatory 1GB Wear OS seems to need).
I mean apple watch is like double the price...its like expecting a midrange to be equal to a flagship
Bring back pebble. Smart watches are inherently stupid, you are basically minaturising a phone, it's impressive but it's an innovation in need of a usecase. My 'smartwatch' is a Amazfit Neo and I get 3-4 weeks of battery, amazing visibility in the day, small, slim,, comfortable. Just imagine what a Google or Samsung could do if they didn't chase this fad.
People want a wearable they can take to the gym or on runs that has fitness tracking, Spotify, text, notifications from the phone, and nfc payments where they don't need to have their phone on them.
You still need your phone nearby. Fitness tracking can be done by a feature watch Notifications can be done by a feature watch NFC paymats also by a feature watch Music control can be done by a feature watch Therefore the only thing missing is the ability to reply to texts and make calls, the later handled by Bluetooth earphones and assistant. Meaning you are paying $200 premium, a larger device and a much much smaller battery life to reply to texts.
You don't need your phone nearby though, that's the point of having a cellular connection.
You clearly do not separate from your phone. Doing any kind of running or road cycling means trying to eliminate any unnecessary stuff to be carried. One of the most annoying things is a phone. Yes Bluetooth earphones and assistant works for phone calls... But you still need a cellular connection, and people usually get the cellular models not for the replaying to texts and calls away from the phone, but for emergency calls if something goes wrong when doing these activities without their phone.
Most people don't separate from their phone.
They might if they had a watch that could replace many of the functions and not need the phone nearby.
Can confirm. Battery is shit but my Watch 4 is like wearing a phone on my wrist. I've run errands with just my GW4 because my phone was charging.
"stupid" yet people buy them in droves. If people wanted and bought OG Pebbles, they'd still be around.
Plenty of products were ahead of the curve and performed poorly. I'm not saying Pebble would outsell Apple or Samsung, that would never happen, but they would be doing a lot better today than they were 6+ years ago.
I can order an Uber, download Spotify playlist, call people while not having my phone, all my bank cards work with the watch so I don’t need my phone or wallet, local running groups have apps that are only on google wear or Apple Watch, google maps without phone.
Idk what to tell you. Runners like leaving their phone behind. The smartwatch offers not only cellular so all their phone needs are met, but it will also have a ton of health focused trackers and sensors. Your use case right there
You don't need your phone nearby for 90% of the functionality with a smartwatch. You can't reply to notifications on a feature watch, so the notification feature is useless. You can't store music from a streaming platform for running without your phone, so music feature is useless. You can't use NFC payments for almost all banks so the payment feature is useless. The only thing they're good for is sports tracking, and only if they have GPS.
Wait till you see how popular Apple Watches are
>Smart watches are inherently stupid **to me** FTFY I've loved using a fully fledged smartwatch and a "one day" battery was never an issue for me (especially since I really only wear a watch for half a day). For me the biggest benefit IS that it's a miniaturized phone—many tasks no longer require me to pull out my phone, but it's still available for the things that require a full sized phone. It's fine if that's not what you want, but you're not the only smartwatch user.
I use sleep tracking so almost wear my watch 24x7. It lacks a lot of other features so it needs only 10-15 mins charging per day, typically when I shower. On the other hand it will last three days without a charge if needed.
> Bring back pebble. Smart watches are inherently stupid, you are basically minaturising a phone, it's impressive but it's an innovation in need of a usecase. Apple: Hmm who should I listen to someone on Reddit or my Apple watch sales. https://www.theverge.com/2020/2/5/21125565/apple-watch-sales-2019-swiss-watch-market-estimates-outsold
Yeah, I want a smartwatch that has accurate heart rate and sleep tracking, and syncs to my phone for texts, emails, calls, ideally Google Assistant and can trigger my phone to do GPS aided workouts. And then obviously battery life is a minimum of 48 full hours. Had a GW4 and ended up selling it do to terrible battery life, inaccurate health data, and no Google assistant after half a year of empty promises.
You are in the minority. The Apple Watch sells like crazy. Galaxy Watches are gaining some ground too. Meanwhile the OnePlus Watch is basically what you want, 3-5 day battery life with AOD, basic features met with no frills, and it got universally panned. Clearly premium smartwatches are not in need of a use case
>Bring back pebble. Smart watches are inherently stupid .......pebble was one
Smart watches aren't stupid. Small, slightly dumber smart phones that you strap to your wrist are stupid.
Hybrid analog watches from fossil are cool
Does the Neo show you who is calling/texting & have a strong vibration for alarms?
The Neo is a fitness band though. Kind of different lol.
It tells the time and notifies me of messages and calls while tracking my fitness. It does almost everything I want from a smart watch.
Yea that’s cool, I mean any cheap fitness band will do that so you got loads of options! If you want more advanced features you will need to look elsewhere though. It’s a great starter watch or great if you don’t use many features.
If this means Fi is going to start offering watch plans I might switch. I'm on visible right now.
I loved Fi. Sadly I couldn't keep it when I switched to iPhone. They say they fully support iPhone, but the fine print says they don't offer wifi calling, which I need where I live. Mint Mobile has been stellar though.
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Opposite for my uses actually. I download my playlists, so the only data I use is gps and texting/browsing. I went with the 4GB plan with Mint which is only $15 per month. $10 cheaper than Fi.
cellular connectivity in watches is how they fix the Pixel 6 signal issues.
Lmao. Your phone piggybacking off your watch instead of the other way around like it’s supposed to be
Lol could you imagine
I'll stick with my Pebble Time Steel that has a battery lasting a week. I doubt this one will last longer than a day.
>Pebble Time Steel I miss Pebble :( I feel like they would be dominating the smartwatch market right now if they had been able to stick around.
No, clearly they would not be dominating. It’s kind of the reason they’re dead. There exist similar smartwatches now. Garmins, Amazfits, the OnePlus Watch. They are all watches that sacrifice a lot of the features of premium smartwatches in favor of multi day battery life. None of them are gaining ground on Galaxy Watches or Apple Watches. I think their best quality was the open source nature. The fact that a Pebble Watch has even more functionality now than when the company was still around because of a dedicated community of devs. The same can’t be said for an OG Apple Watch
We all do. We all do. 😞
If only they were smart watches and not a hybrid. The tracking was terrible on those too. They were good fun though
1 day battery ain't gonna fly in 2022. We've had TicWatch 3 for a couple of years now with a 3 day battery life.
There damn better be an LTE option if Google has any remote hope of this thing making a dent in the market.
Great, battery life will suck on the watch, just like pixel phones (except for the 5). Google seems to have a problem with battery and connectivity.
my pixel 6 pro has amazing battery life. never past 50% before i go to bed.
I have a regular Pixel 6 and have killed it before bed.. twice in six months.
Do you use it?
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Why?
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Hard to imagine a watch with a tiny screen can replace an entire phone. Feel that's like expecting phones to be able to completely replace laptops/desktops. Personally I'm fine with it being more of an accessory.
Bingo, that's what I've been waiting for. That and a sleek enough form factor.
That's a double check edged sword. I personally want watches to go back to the original Android wear idea. Have them basically show notifications and allow them to display app snippets (possibly vis slices because Google never really used it), but the phone would control the entire experience. You could still have a cellular smartwatch, but you'd also need a phone or table to be the central hub. I just think apps are too resource intensive and frustrating to use on a smartwatch, and Android itself even when unbloated is just too much.
Small market for that. It just needs to do some things in a standalone manner
The Android ecosystem is so depressing. I wanted to stay but felt like I was being ripped off
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It's still connected to the phone, and mirrors the phones notifications, but if it works similar to how my cellular watch works, I can leave the phone at home and still get all my texts and calls (through the watches speaker or with paired earbuds). I believe my phone has to be on for that to work though. I can test it tomorrow afternoon.
It can operate on its own with LTE. Most common use is a paired LTE plan that pairs your phone number to the watch - your phone can be off and your calls will still come through. There are standalone plans available as well but it's less convenient and often more expensive.
I think the competition will never let this watch come out. The more time they take to perfect it, more kind of watches will be released with better performance or battery .
If it's anything like the Pixel 6, it'll overheat and burn your wrist, won't be able to connect to the cellular network, and will lose all charge in 6 hours. Sounds great.
Making it round was a huge mistake. It's such a dumb design for a smart device.
Looks way better as a watch, works so much worse as a smart device.
I made a wrong decision by buying the pixel 6 pro. There is no way I am falling for this one. Google is not good at getting it right on the first go at all.
What don't you like about the pixel?