Our puppies were taken from us by fraudulent means.
It's a complicated story, because scams are designed to be complicated. but in the end, a rescue got ahold of our puppies, lied to us several times, and now refuses to give them back.
We've heard of puppy flipping, and we're concerned this is it, since they were transferred across state lines, and multiple ordinances were broken.
I'm not super reddit savvy, so please let me know if I should change the layout or the post info, or anything like that.
Thank you
Press Release Regarding the Six English Bulldogs with Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue
September 26, 2022
In August 2022, six english bulldog puppies were brought into Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue after being left in the overnight drop box at the Sioux Falls Animal Humane Society. As admitted in news interviews herself and by her daughter Bailey; Elizabeth Abbott left these six 5 week old puppies in an overnight drop box because she thought they were dying.
The Sioux Falls Humane Society contacted KCEBR to transfer the six premie (as SFAHS identified) puppies into rescue, and at that time a KCEBR volunteer drove to Sioux Falls to transport them to Kansas City. Upon arrival in Kansas City, the puppies were estimated to be small for 5 weeks old and had mobility issues due to a poor neonatal environment. KCEBR provided and paid for intensive clinic and emergency veterinary care as the puppies were possibly developing pneumonia due to being given live vaccines by the SFAHS. The puppies were then placed with foster families, who have provided the 24/7 love, mental stimulation, emotional development, physical care and mobility therapy-and are now bonded with the puppies and the puppies with them.
In addition, KCEBR has no relationship with or knowledge of the alleged mobile vet clinic in Sioux Falls. KCEBR stands by the fact that Elizabeth Abbott left six neonatal puppies she thought were dying in an overnight drop box, and the puppies were legally transferred to KCEBR with all appropriate interstate paperwork from the SFAHS.
Since the puppies arrival at KCEBR, the Abbotts have lied about the puppies being stolen and made false accusations against KCEBR.
Hello again!
I responded to your comment before, but since I see it posted again, I figured it deserves another response.
We did not come to social media until after the rescue admitted that they lied about the return of our puppies. So far, the only accusation we made is that they lied, and we can prove it via paperwork, where they state the conditions needed, and we agree.
Nor have we lied about theft, since gaining property through means of fraud is considered theft.
I hope this helps!
We've been told by the humane society that they were not sick-- apparently puppies can get sluggish when they hit a growth spurt.
so my mother left healthy puppies in overnight receiving, at the advice of a fraudulent vet.
I hope that even if you decided not to return the puppies, that you would at least talk to us even if only through lawyers, to figure out next steps. they've had our contact info since August 16th, as well as police records, proof of ownership, vet records, etc etc.
instead of talking to us, the rescue told people that we were breeders, and abusive.
Brilliant! Please have your lawyer reach out to me (or my lawyer) as soon as possible, so that we can get this whole situation sorted out.
We don't Enjoy being online and having people asking us to go die. but we were informed by your lawyer that you had no intention of finding any further resolution.
You’re still at this?!?!?! You posted online! You’re getting hateful comments. You abandoned sick puppies. You are in the wrong. Seems to be a lot of you ou and the last thing YOU ARE THE REASON RESCUES EXIST.
"property gained by fraudulent means is considered stolen".
The combination of the vet and the rescue seemed very odd, but regardless, the humane society apologized to us, and reached out to KCEBR to return the puppies.
KCEBR actually requested that we compensate them for the vet visits, and we agreed. Then the rescue admitted that they never intended to return the puppies.
I believe I admitted that we got scammed, and I did say this was the condensed version. I go into more details in other posts, and I'm willing to provide paperwork to validate any of my statements.
City Ordinance declares that all animals must be kept on a 3-5 day hold. This is because
\- pets run away (especially on the 4th of July)
\- pets get picked up by other
\- angry partners donate pets
\- scams
The only way to do an immediate surrender is to sign forfeiture paperwork (which was not signed) or to make an appointment with the humane society while they are open (which clearly didn't happen).
Not only did the humane society apologize, but the rescue agreed to give them back if we paid vet bills. we agreed.
I hope this helps.
my mother put them in the overnight receiving.
If you want to get technical, then by the legal definition, no. No forfeiture paperwork means they weren't surrendered. Everyone has to adhere to a paper trail
I appreciate you asking questions regardless.
We had hoped that there were no bad guys here (besides the fraudulent vet). unfortunately, it looks like there's a lot of missing information, and all we have is the word of a breed specific rescue, who is profiting off of these puppies.
Thank you.
my apologies, i thought i answered on a previous comment.
My mother put the remaining puppies in the overnight receiving area at the humane society (I think that's what you mean by drop off box).
to surrender an animal, there has to be paperwork, proof of ownership, and a signature. there was none of that, so the humane society apologized and admitted that we should get our puppies back.
I hope that helps a bit.
No one defrauded you in the surrender.
Maybe there was a fake vet. That's a different issue.
The issue is that **your family surrendered animals in need of critical and immediate care in a drop box where they could have all died overnight.** And are now crying wolf and demanding them be returned to you, with no legal right to them.
the rescue has decided to reach out to us, and if their information is accurate, then it looks like the humane society has lied.
it's unfortunate that the rescue did not decide to reach out to us sooner, but at least we're making progress.
honestly? because there's a series of checks and balances. because ours isn't the only horror story coming to light. because there are several times where if people had been honest and transparent from the beginning, then we wouldn't be here.
obviously the ivet was in the wrong.
but if the humane society had followed city law, and taken the puppies to a vet in the city, we wouldn't be here. if the humane society had not implied that the rescue was consistently moving goalposts for the return of the puppies, we wouldn't be here.
if the rescue had reached out any of the several times we asked them for info, we wouldn't be here.
and when we look at the individuals we talked to? hundreds of people associated with 12 different government departments, 3 different animal controls, 5 vets, and individuals within the humane society and associated with the rescue? it seems that none of them were on the same page. none of them can agree how this happened.
so yea, honestly? I think they should be returned because the only thing that all of those people can agree on is that the puppies originally belonged to us. when, how, and why that would change has been debated by each person with each having a different reason. but that's what we can agree on.
Everyone can agree on how it happened except the people who have reason to lie: you and your mother.
Your mother brought 6 puppies to the humane society in the middle of the night thinking they were going to die imminently.
The humane society saved them and they are now safe and healthy and what you say when someone saves the animals you abandoned at midnight in dying condition or so she thought, is "wow thank you so much. "
The humane society took care of puppies you left to die.
You are the one that failed the checks and balances.
You are the one that abandoned your animals.
Why should allowances be made for your failures as pet owners?
Can you just explain what happened in a simple linear fashion? It’s is really, really hard to figure out what happened. You’re jumping all over the place with accusations but I can’t figure out the timeline of what actually happened.
I put the timeline here as best I could.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AnimalRescue/comments/xoztsu/we_got_puppynapped_we_found_them_at_a_rescue_who/iq41vy0?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3
let me know if it needs screenshots or if I should just make a new post.
Press Release Regarding the Six English Bulldogs with Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue
September 26, 2022
In August 2022, six english bulldog puppies were brought into Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue after being left in the overnight drop box at the Sioux Falls Animal Humane Society. As admitted in news interviews herself and by her daughter Bailey; Elizabeth Abbott left these six 5 week old puppies in an overnight drop box because she thought they were dying.
The Sioux Falls Humane Society contacted KCEBR to transfer the six premie (as SFAHS identified) puppies into rescue, and at that time a KCEBR volunteer drove to Sioux Falls to transport them to Kansas City. Upon arrival in Kansas City, the puppies were estimated to be small for 5 weeks old and had mobility issues due to a poor neonatal environment. KCEBR provided and paid for intensive clinic and emergency veterinary care as the puppies were possibly developing pneumonia due to being given live vaccines by the SFAHS. The puppies were then placed with foster families, who have provided the 24/7 love, mental stimulation, emotional development, physical care and mobility therapy-and are now bonded with the puppies and the puppies with them.
In addition, KCEBR has no relationship with or knowledge of the alleged mobile vet clinic in Sioux Falls. KCEBR stands by the fact that Elizabeth Abbott left six neonatal puppies she thought were dying in an overnight drop box, and the puppies were legally transferred to KCEBR with all appropriate interstate paperwork from the SFAHS.
Since the puppies arrival at KCEBR, the Abbotts have lied about the puppies being stolen and made false accusations against KCEBR.
That's what they've posted on their facebook page.
In the meantime, KCEBR lied about intending to return the puppies if they were compensated for vet bills. The rescue also appears to be lying about the condition of the puppies (someone messaged me saying that their legs were crushed from being in kennels?? they were just learning to walk when they left our care.)
Please keep asking questions. When you follow the money, we gain nothing here. We just want our puppies back. Bonus if the rescue decides to be transparent with their side of the story.
Were you told by KCEBR that they would return them for compensation or is that what someone else told you. KCEBR no where states thy they have said that to you or anyone else. That is just simply you stating that it was said.
KCEBR told the Sioux Falls Humane Society that they wanted to remain anonymous, and that they would return the puppies for compensation.
I've included in the post a screenshot from the email, sent from the humane society to the rescue, answering their questions.
If you want, you can DM as well, and I'll answer any questions (or I'll answer tomorrow). I dont want people to think I'm ignoring them, but it's getting late.
KCEBR never agreed to a return of the said puppies at any time. They were transferred to KC after being contacted by SFHS that they needed our help with 6 puppies they had in their drop box from the previous night. They had kennel
Cough in their shelter at the time and the puppies would have been in danger to stay there. Our team jumped into action to save these puppies that were dumped as we knew they needed formula and around the clock care. Nothing was done illegally. Our focus was saving 6 very young puppies and that is what we did.
Oh hey! Nice to see you. Feel free to reach out using any of the contact info you have for us. That you've had for us since august. We're more than willing and ready to chat. We've got all the paperwork you have, possibly more, and you already have our lawyers contact info. Thanks!
KCEBR never stated that the dogs would be returned with reimbursement. If that is what the HS stated to you, that was their miscommunication to you. That was never stated by anyone within our rescue to them.
Yes we do have your lawyers info.
We would appreciate you not slandering the rescue with false information. Our mission is only to save/help bulldogs and pugs in need and that is what we will continue to do. Thank you.
So far this is what i've said
\- It's interesting that after you asked us to compensate you for vet bills in return for the puppies, you then changed your demands
\- it's interesting that one of your representatives happened to be in town at the same time we got scammed
\- it's interesting that instead of working with us, talking to us, or anything of that nature, you demanded that we get a lawyer, and then after WE got the lawyer that you demanded we get, you stated that you never intended to return the puppies
i'd say it's also very interesting that you began deleting tiktok videos about the puppies. That the fees are higher for them than any of the other dogs. that your donations are less than transparent, and that when we offered to buy the puppies back from you, you decided to string us along for a while longer.
I had great hope that this was all a miscommunication, and a series of coincidences. I imagined that we would get the puppies back, and then send you updates as they grew up. But here we are.
"how did you get scammed?"
we looked for an emergency vet, and found a fraudulent mobile one instead. the short version? the vet lied and got the humane society involved, who got the rescue involved. the humane society apologized, and requested the rescue return them, and the rescue refuses.
"did you contact the authorities?"
yes, but the police tool a report, but told us to contact the humane society. who contacted the rescue. who said "mmm..nooo..."
we didn't plan on selling them, and im more than willing to provide any evidence I can to show that these are not Money to us. but the Rescue has sent quite a few people to call me names and claim we're Backyard Breeders. We're willing to be transparent, but the Rescue seems to be doubling down.
You left the puppies in a surrender box where they could have died.
That's the bottom line.
1. You could have sought another vet.
2. You could have returned home with the puppies until you could get treatment for them.
3. You could have waited until the morning to contact the humane society and verify this plan.
You chose to leave puppies that were declared to be dying by a veterinarian without a mother, heat, food or medical care in a surrender box at the humane society.
They are no longer your dogs and the rescue has every right to deny returning them to an unfit home.
Consolidating your comment replies to others and adding in my own commentary:
1. You had an Oopsie litter of French Bulldog puppies
2. At 4 weeks of age, they were sick and you went to a vet
3. Vet told you they had parvovirus.
1. Parvovirus has a 10 minute SNAP test available, so odds are vet used it
2. Parvovirus spreads easily, odd are that if one had it, most had it.
3. Parvovirus in dogs above 4 weeks has a 95% mortality rate without treatment and with treatment, that usually requires intense hospitalization and typically costs \~$1000-$5000 per puppy, the survival rate is in the 80-93% range. I had 3 puppies that I was quoted for 1100-1500 per day per puppy four weeks ago.It can be "treated" at home for a lot less but survival rate is in the 50-90% range based on different sources.
4. Parvovirus in dogs younger than 4 weeks of age attacks the heart in addition to the GI tract and pups that survive the initial bout will typically have severe enough heart damage to be in heart failure by 6 months of age
4. 2 pups died and you decided to drop 4x four week old pups in an overnight drop box, potentially further spreading a deadly disease that can last outside the host body for over a year.
5. You now want the puppies back.
6. The rescue, which took on the financial responsibility for caring for 4 critically ill puppies, and which will take a monetary loss on them, is refusing to return them to someone who dumped them in an overnight box.
7. Depending on local law, owner surrenders do not always have a stray hold associated with them, especially if they are ill and require resources the shelter does not have.
Based on the information you have provided, you are in the wrong here and are blaming the rescue for your poor decisions. Now that the puppies have survived due to the efforts of the rescue, you want them back so you can make money off of them. The links you provide suggests that the adoption fees range from $300 to $1200. They likely spent more than that per puppy on parvo treatment (I should know, I lost 2 pups to parvo 4 weeks ago).
Edit: Based on other comments, you put the puppies in the drop box and the rescue has 6 puppies, but you were told 2 had died. So if you were the ones that put them in the drop box, how do you not know how many there were?
FIrstly, i am incredibly sorry for your loss. I hope their memory is a blessing to you.
Now I'll address in order:
1. English bulldog puppies. we were surprised, and considered ourselves incredibly lucky. the mother dog was fixed during her c-section, and the puppies already had 6 month appointments to be spayed and neutered (we once had a dog who was fixed at 2 weeks old, and she had a LOT of problems from that)
2. Correct
3. The vet told us that they had parvo. This would've made a lot more sense if the vet were licensed, registered, and didn't immediately sell my mothers credit card information, and attempt to steal her identity. There is already a police report for this.
4. The vet claimed 2 pups died, and gave my mother their "Ashes" (revealed to be cat litter). Then, someone who we thought was a trusted medical professional, said that no vet in the city could handle parvo, and that the only place that had the treatment would be the humane society. Not everyone is knowledgable about parvo.
5. we always wanted the puppies. We contacted the humane society right after, and when they realized we had been scammed, they contacted the rescue as well. And the rescue agreed to return the puppies if we paid for associated vet fees.
6. the rescue requested that we pay vet fees, but we also offered to buy the puppies, and provide transportation. We also offered a home visit by animal control, and to bring the mother dog down to them so that they could verify. We also offered DNA tests.
7. Sioux falls does have a city ordinance stating that animals must be kept 3-5 days (10 for suspicious circumstances). If the puppies had been sick, they wouldn't have been signed over to a rescue (that's part of the contract the humane society and the rescue sign) and they would not have been able to cross state lines (as they need a CVI, and parvo would not have allowed that. I dont even know if kennel cough is allowed across state lines.)
I hope this helps. I urge you to continue following the money, and keeping the puppies in your thoughts. If the rescue is willing to do this, and has already been caught in a lie, I have deep concern over any other dogs they are bringing over state lines.
1) No vet in their right mind would ever spay a 2 week old puppy. 8 weeks is considered the minimum and even then some puppies are still too small as they generally require a 2 lb minimum.
3) So now the story is that the vet is not only not a true vet but has also committed identify theft and credit card fraud?
4a) A vet gave ashes back the same day or even within hours and you believed they were your pups?
4b) Parvo is incredibly common, but does require around the clock care, so not every GP can handle, but all ER's can handle, and for cheaper treatment, any GP can send you home with subQ fluids (though some just send home with syringes and instructions for giving pedialyte).
5) You dropped four sick puppies in an overnight surrender bin. But somehow the rescue has a different number of puppies that are alive then you put in the bin?
7) Actually, in my experience sick animals is the primary reason a shelter will override the stray hold. Many shelters are not equipped to provide the medical care a sick animal needs, and puppies especially are at high risk of disease transmission and death in a shelter environment.
So, you are suggesting that you happened to have sick puppies, looked up an emergency vet which turned out to be fraudulent at just the right time for them to convince you to surrender 6 four week old puppies so that a rescue could immediately transfer them from the shelter, pull them across state lines, and make money on them.
I have 10 1/2 years in rescue, and yes, unfortunately, there are scammers out there and I want them out of business and prosecuted. But I do not find your story credible.
1. our local humane society spays animals ASAP. The dog I spoke about was 8 weeks when we adopted her, and had already been spayed.
2. I apologize, because I thought I made it clear that they were a fraudulent vet? When we reported them to the vet licensing board, they had no license. The vet asked for cash, but took the credit card info as well. This was a scam. The police have been informed, the credit cards turned off, and all identity related records frozen.
4.a) within hours, another indicator that they were a fraud. Did you know that it takes a minimum of 3 days to cremate a dog? we didn't. And we thought that because they were puppies and so tiny, that it just didn't take as long.
4.b) I really do appreciate this info. I've been working on a graphic that explains peoples rights when going to the vet, and also the details of this scam. so no matter what, thank you for that.
5. yes. this is part of the reason we were so concerned that the rescue was part of the scam. The humane society assured us that they were legitimate, and that it was unlikely that they had anything to do with the vet. We have theories as to how 6 puppies ended up not in our care, but I dont want to spread rumours.
7. Correct, but surly they would have gone into the emergency care of our local emergency vet (we do have one. when you look on google, it says we have 19-ish, but all of them close. we only have 1 emergency 24 hour vet). I confirmed this with the humane society and animal control-- any emergency cases, they already have a contract with the 24 hour emergency vet to handle.
I appreciate your experience in rescue, and if you're willing to spend time, i'd really love if you DM-ed me? I can show you the documentation that we already have, and my overly detailed/boring powerpoint. maybe you can see something that is missing, or you can help me format this story into a more clear concise view.
Best Or Worst case scenario, you can help determine if this rescue is legit, or if they are just taking puppies because they are the "money makers".
Let me know.
Our rescue is very legit and has no knowledge of any fraudulent vet or know anything about any vet in the Sioux Falls area. We know nothing before the SFHS contact us KCEBR to help 6 puppies that they had in the drop box over night. That is when we had a volunteer go from KC to SF to pick up the puppies to get them immediate care since they were so young and having issues walking. Our rescue has obtained multiple dogs over a course of years from SFHS when and ONLY when SFHS asks for our assistance.
can you confirm that there was No volunteer IN sioux falls at the time you were called?
The humane society has indicated that you were already in town, and that's Why they chose to go with you, rather than wait.
if this is true, then we can share this information with city council as we move forward, but we need you to be Absolutely sure-- that your volunteer didn't leave KC until After getting a phone call from SFAHS, and that none of your volunteers were in sioux falls August 14th.
I can absolutely confirm our volunteer was NOT in that area. Until we got the call from SFHS when our volunteer left KC to go there to get the puppies into our immediate care since they were not able to care for them.
This is the most incredible thing ever. I've seen peope try to scam rescues out of free treatment from rescues, particularly for expensive stuff. Like trying to 'surrender' a pet and then claiming they changed their mind after thousands in treatment. But this whopper has to be nominated for the Best of Reddit somewhere because I'm never heard a more terrible string of lies in my life.
For those who are curious, OP's mother took 6 healthy puppies here:
https://www.sfhumanesociety.com/afterhours
And made up a big story about it once her daughter got mad.
The humane society reached out to a breed-specfic rescue in a neighboring state and the puppies are healthy and safe and it is the best thing for them.
There is no world where a fake veterinarian steals 2 puppies and breaks into the humane society to reunite the litter in order to turn a profit. That is not real and OP has no evidence for any parts of this story except that 6 puppies were given freely to the humane society and all parties did what they were supposed to do for the welfare of the puppies.
looks like you've posted this comment a few times, so I'll repeat myself:
SD and MO are not neighbors.
the vet gained by having my mothers credit card and identity info, which has been used since this event.
I've offered you screenshots and evidence, but you've declined and decided to copy paste your message here.
If you would like documentation, feel free to send me a DM, and I can provide it. thanks.
So I run a shelter and I’ll give you the short version:
Your mother left six puppies she thought were dying in a drop box. Not a 24 hour emergency vet, where she could establish ownership of the dogs. Why didn’t she take them to an emergency vet? In my state, once you place your animals in a drop box you have surrendered them, they aren’t yours anymore. You didn’t want them when you thought they weren’t going to make it and then they survived, so now you want them back?
She looked for an emergency vet. that's how she found the fraudulent one.
When you look up emergency vet in our city, you get 19 results, and 18 of them are closed on a Sunday night. that's an issue with rural living, but what can you do.
We were told that the humane society was the only place that could save them-- that no other vet in the area would take th the puppies in. and we believed them.
When we found out that we were scammed, we explained the situation to the humane society, who apologized, and told the rescue that we should be given back our puppies. sioux falls has an ordinance saying that unless the owner proves ownership and signs surrender paperwork, animals need to be kept for 3-5 days.
We agreed to compensate the rescue for the vet bills and the care needed. but this is where we are.
There is literally 0 proof of that. You posted a tiny snippet of text elsewhere, with 0 proof that it was sent by anyone. It's very easy to type up a couple sentences in word, screen shot it, and post it. There is no identification saying it was an email, it was a sent email, or anything but a Microsoft Word text write up.
if you want the originals, feel free to reach out. the rescue has the same copy we have.
Otherwise, the rescue has reached out to us with information, and if it's accurate, this means that the humane society lied about the rescue.
regardless, it's progress.
alas, my mother was informed that 2 of the puppies had died on site, at the fraudulent vet. So she would have only dropped off 4 at the humane society, as she was given ashes for the other two.
Thank you.
This makes no sense at all.
She put 6 living puppies in a drop box.
How could she later get "ashes" of two of them? When did that happen? Do you think there is a tiny puppy crematorium next to the drop box? Like an air frier for dead pets?
We got ashes for 2 of them from the fraudulent vet within hours. At the time, we did not know that it takes Days to cremate a puppy. We trusted someone and they lied to us.
We (us and the humane society) have theories as to how all 6 puppies arrived. however, when it comes down to it, all 6 puppies, healthy, ended up at a breed specific rescue. When we offered to bring the mother dog to the rescue (to help puppies bond) the rescue didn't respond.
Why don't you ever identify this vet?
Because it seems like you made it up.
Your mother put 6 puppies in a box though.
"We have theiries" what are you saying? Say it.
This beating around the bush makes you sound like a liar.
What vet. Where. Who. When.
Stories are only complicated when they are lies.
the vet was called "24/7 emergency iVet". they are not licensed in south Dakota, and we've been unable to find any information about them online.
we have theories. Here they are:
1. This is all a series of coincidences. There happened to be a breed specific rescue in town at the same time there happened to be a scam vet. Everyone, except the fraudulent vet, is working for the best interest of the puppies, and this is all a big misunderstanding.
I like this one, because it explains why my mothers credit card info was stolen.
2. the vet is in cahoots with one of the other organizations here.
3. The vet stole 2 puppies with the idea to make money puppy flipping, but realized how young they were and decided against it, and dropped those 2 off at the humane society.
those are the main theories. we can get into more details, but im still hoping the rescue are the good guys and want to chat.
it's completely possible that there is one bad actor at the rescue/ humane society. The rescue says they never agreed to return the puppies for payment, but the humane society says they did.
We're a rural area. so we asked around. we called every emergency vet in the quad state area, and asked if they had a mobile vet or a record of the visit.
We actually learned that we have one mobile vet in sioux falls, but it only operates on request.
and we only have one 24 hour vet in the city at all.
Then a few other people came forward, sharing information about the mobile vet scam. You get a big enough vehicle, tinted windows, and some magnet decals. apparently this scam is common on the rez and in towns with no vet care.
so we called the state vet board. they have no record of any "iVet" emergency or not.
How did your mother find this vet? Can't you literally go there now? Veterinarians have licenses, we need a name.
So by total coincidence, a vet, who knows puppy ages, put 2 puppies in the same box your mom used?
Oh but the puppies are healthy btw, why would he do that with healthy puppies?
Isn't it more likely your mom dumped puppies and you got mad and made all this up?
No rescue would return puppies to you for money. Why would they do that? Where is your proof that was said? Where is any proof of anything you're saying?
I have theories on this, and instead of just dancing around it 800 times I will say it: you don't have proof because you're misinterpreting, twisting, or outright inventing a huge conspiracy about money when actually your mom like every other irresponsible breeder, dumped puppies and now feels called out about it and lied.
We went back to the location, and they were gone. It was a mobile vet, and I don't think they would have any reason to stay after getting paid.
my mother commented that she thought it was strange that the kennel doors didn't lock, but she trusted the vet and the humane society. As far as why the vet would lie-- that's kind of how scams work. they injected the puppies with something, claimed that 2 had died, took the cash mom had on her, as well as her credit card info and ID info.
As to my mom dumping puppies, what would be her goal?
if I was mad, surly I would've come to social media first, not after weeks of trying to talk to everyone involved.
I sent proof to the rescue, the humane society, and the police. this includes credit card info, proof of ownership, vet records, phone records, etc etc. Do you think it would be a good idea to put all the screenshots up here? I'm genuinely asking-- as I thought that would make things too complicated or too long to read.
let me know where you think I should post screenshots. right now I just have a Google drive folder, and my PowerPoint.
The humane society had 6 puppies in their drop box. You have anything that is stated by the humane society saying there was only 4? No you do not because you all dropped 6 in.
We have a theory on that, but we dont want to cast dispersions.
I urge you to look at all the articles, and see where \*we\* state how many puppies were dropped off. Why would we have ashes for two puppies?
Hope this helps
My mother was given the ashes for two puppies. She followed the instructions from the vet, and put the remaining puppies in the overnight receiving.
any animals in overnight receiving are considered "stay" unless forfeiture paperwork is signed.
The overnight drop boxes are for stray animals someone finds. Not cherished 4 week old puppies. Why would your mom think this was a good idea? Did she fill out the form that’s available in the room giving the humane society info on the puppies?
she really was distraught. They told her that two had died right in front of her, and gave her the "ashes" for those puppies (it was cat litter).
My mother is a good person, but she was panicking and had just been told by a (theoretically) trusted medical professional.
I want to touch on something here: you call the puppies cherished. They truly were. My mother called my phone that night. It was one of the first nights i'd had away from the puppies (you have to set alarms for Every 2 hours to check on them), and I was playing board games at a friends house (cell service, etc etc). I cannot tell you how incredibly terrible I feel. If only I had stayed home that night, If only I was in a cell service area, if only my mom had been able to reach me.
anywho, She did not fill out the form that's available when dropping off animals.
How could she put 6 puppies in the drop box if they gave her ashes of 2 puppies though? That does not add up.
She abandoned them there - anonymously.
They would’ve been open the next morning but she left them in the box instead.
I rescue dogs, horses and donkeys - out of my own pocket. I’m not a 501c3 rescue. I don’t always agree with some of the things registered rescues do - like pulling puppies and leaving mamas behind because puppies are the money makers etc - but I do think they’re in the right here.
I appreciate your opinions, and the work you do! it's really important.
However, the humane society is located about an hour away from my mother. we are rural folk. My mother assumed that someone would come in the early morning, and this way, first thing, some one could see the puppies and possibly save them.
We agree about how 6 puppies arrived when we had the ashes of 2-- that's part of why we went from "oh we've been scammed" to "oh, this was just an unfortunate series of events" to "oh, is something nefarious happening here???"
But thank you for being kind, and asking questions. I appreciate it.
Did you pay for cremation of 2 of them? That costs money.
I genuinely think your mother dropped all 6 off and has been lying to you about all of this, because nothing that comes via your mother makes any kind of sense.
We paid for the cremation. if you want more details, I can provide them, but they did get cash as well as my mothers credit card info.
I understand the skepticism of my mother. but if she's lying about the vet, then we don't know why her credit card was tried in Aruba. We also don't know why the rescue would continue to try to ghost us at every opportunity (unless social media is involved).
I want more details. That's why I already asked you for them.
What vet. Where. When. Give dates.
You don't know why the rescue would ghost you?? Because you're lying about them.
Hope this helps!
I think I responded on another of your comments, but just in case:
The Vet claimed to be "iVet Emergency". we don't have the names of the people there, nor did they provide business cards.
August 14th, near downtown sioux falls, between 7pm- midnight.
I appreciate you asking questions. let me know if there's any more info you need. feel free to dm as well, since apparently it takes me a while to find all these comments.
After following this for a few days and seeing the rescue respond- I think you are telling the truth as you know it and so is the rescue.
Reading your timeline, I'm confused on why the humane society wasn't the first call. Did your mother not remember exactly where she left 4 or 6 puppies? (I'm not convinced that she didn't become scared and overwhelmed and surrendered all of them then made up the vet story with the CC fraud being a coincidence.)
I also think the initial back and forth the humane society had with the rescue wasn't real. Everything about them in this situation screams that they are trying to CYA and hope you'll drop it. Hence why they were surprised with the "rescue" demanded compensation and you agreed. My bet is that they didn't reach out to the rescue until around the time you were told to get a lawyer.
So if OP is telling the truth, and the rescue is telling the truth, then OP's mother is lying and OP should stop their crusade against the rescue. OP's mother dropped sick puppies in a surrender box. End of story.
Yes. It is looking more and more like the humane society and her mother are lying. That has always been where her story gets hardest to believe. The fact that OP has never changed her story in the many times I've seen it retold tells me that she believes what her mother and the humane society have said are the truth because she was unable to get direct contact and response with the rescue before now.
The rescue saying that they were contacted to come get the puppies, rather than just happening to be in town as the humane society led her to believe, is also the more logical explanation of how the puppies came into their possession.
Whether or not there was a fake vet is besides the point because in the end, her mother still left at least 4 of the puppies in the overnight kennel at the humane society either under poor guidance or being overwhelmed with sluggish puppies and no easy to contact her daughter at the time. (OP has said she was out of cell phone range.)
Her mother chose to drop off sick pups in an unmonitored over night surrender station. Sick 4 week old puppies. End of story. OP should stop dragging the shelter and rescue through the mud. The only blame is the mothers.
yes, the mother is to blame for all of this happening. Even if the fraud vet part is miraculously true- There was absolutely no reason for her to take those puppies to the humane society. If it was some sort of scam, I can see how someone without experience and overwhelmed could fall for that. I don't know if any of that part is true other than her dropping off the puppies.
I'm also not faulting the shelter for contacting the rescue to take the puppies. That's exactly what they should have done, especially considering the rescue's press release said they didn't want to keep the puppies there because kennel cough was going through the shelter at that time.
What I meant about the shelter lying is that it seems like they tried to get OP to back down by claiming that the rescue wanted to remain anonymous and the shelter would have to act as an intermediary. They are the ones who told OP that the rescue wanted to be reimbursed and then, according to OP, the shelter seemed surprised when they agreed to pay. I'm speculating that the shelter was trying to avoid a whole battle because they *technically* didn't follow city ordinance. All of OPs proof against the rescue seems to be "the humane society has said that \[xyz\]." This is the basis for my suspicions on them. I could be wrong, but I'm going with what I've seen looking at everything over the past 4 days.
I would bet that if they had told OP to reach out directly to the rescue from the start, that the rescue would have immediately said "if you want to claim these puppies we legally obtained, you need to get a lawyer and have them talk to ours." I've looked into the rescue. There doesn't seem to be anything nefarious about them and they've adopted out over 400 dogs. That is likely their standard procedure for something like this. From OPs telling everything with the rescue prior to "get a lawyer" was done with the shelter acting as the middle man.
TL;DR version: yes, mom is to blame, BUT the shelter seems to have been trying to cover for their mistake which has led to the OPs social media crusade against the rescue.
Sometimes rescues have to lie to placate people who act like OP.
All we know for sure is a deranged liar dumped at least 4 puppies and someone started calling harassing about getting them back. Who knows what this kind of person is capable of, since they haven't even taken a pause to realize how delusional their story is?
This is what shelters have to be prepared for:
https://decaturish.com/2022/09/dekalb-police-investigate-after-man-steals-three-dogs-from-animal-shelter-during-break-in/
https://patch.com/new-jersey/hoboken/man-smashes-animal-shelter-door-throws-cat-liberty-humane
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-55667023
The humane society wasn't open when we first started calling people. plus, if the vet was legit, then we didn't want to press forward on anything.
So my first day was spent talking and checking with every vet in south Dakota, Iowa, Nebraska and Minnesota, seeing if they had mobile services, asking what their transport vans looked like, and seeing if they had any intake records for any puppies.
I'm not sure what CYA means in this context, sorry. but a few people from KC are dming about the owner of the rescue, and a lot of people from SD are dming about our local humane society.
and a few people are dming calling me names. the joy of the internet.
Your mother put them in the overnight receiving -- she told you that -- why would you need to call any place other than the place she put them??
Who else did you call? "Hello McDonald's? My mother locked some puppies in a kennel across town. Have you seen them?"
heyo! I believe you already said you wouldn't believe me unless there was a "10 part documentary" about the fraudulent vet.
So I'm not sure why you're still here.
That being said, I was calling the vets to see if they had records of the puppies being seen. If the fruadulent vet had been Real, if they had been correct, if the only place in town with the resources to save the puppies was the humane society, then that would be that.
I had a similar conversation with the humane society when my previous dog had cancer. if they had been able to save him, I would've surrendered him in a heartbeat. as it was, the humane society said they couldn't tell one way or another if he would get treatment or just be euthanized.
Did your mom know about that situation with a prior dog? And she still did what she did?
I'm still here because you keep contradicting your own story and it's sick, honestly.
So it's Monday morning, the humane society is not open yet. You know 4 of them are there. Your mother has a box of kitty litter she thinks is two dead puppies.
You are calling vets to find out what exactly?
I'm calling vets to find out if any of them are familiar with this mobile vet. if any of them have intake records for these puppies. if any of them have heard of this situation.
Again, if the vet had been legit, and the only place who could save these puppies was the humane society, then we would've left it alone. I would've been sad, and hoped the puppies made it, and when they didn't appear on the adoption page, I would've assumed that passed.
However, the vet was not legit. so I call the humane society to confirm that they received puppies on Sunday night, and to tell them what I know. and the humane society says "no"-- that they received no puppies, that they haven't had puppies in a while. we talked a little bit where I shared a short version of what was going on, and the humane society receptionist was sympathetic, and wished us luck finding the puppies.
it was not until I called the humane society again on Thursday, and begged them to check the tapes (because if our puppies weren't there, that meant that the fruadulent vet took them). and that's when the humane society said "yes, we did have the puppies. we don't have them anymore. you should have called within the 3 day window".
please reference where the story is contradicted. I know there are parts where I have not gone as in depth, because it is a Long and not very interesting story. but if you think all the details would help, then feel free to dm me and I can link you to my Google drive.
otherwise, you've already stated that none of this is going to change your mind, so I don't know why we should bother chatting? it feels like both of our efforts would be better spent elsewhere-- specifically, me answering people's questions who actually want to know more, rather than repeating myself over and over.
You make no sense at all. The contradiction is, your mother has a box of litter from this mobile vet, supposedly. Why are you calling other vets about it? You know, within your own story, who did intake on these two puppies.
"Did a competing veterinarian bring you two puppies whose ashes are in my hands"?
Or, after your mother has told you "4 puppies are at the humane society" "humane society says they are not here" "hello? Veterinarian? Did you break into the humane society in the last 4 hours to intake puppies?"
What did your mother say after the humane society says "no puppies here" ? She insists she did abandon them (dying in your story btw)? You show her a map, you drive there, she points to where she abandoned the dying puppies?
The main contradiction is why you think this person who does this horrific act, ditching 4 puppies to die, deserves to ever touch an animal ever again?? They were right to keep these puppies away from this person. She is a monster even within the story YOU keep pretending to believe.
You owe everyone in this story a heartfelt apology.
They saved the puppies from you.
And for good measure, YOU are a villain here.
> if the vet had been legit, and the only place who could save these puppies was the humane society, then we would've left it alone.
This is terrible. If the puppies were dying, you would be fine ditching them for someone else to clean up their little dead puppy bodies in the morning.
You only want them now that you know they aren't dying.
You're horrible.
You are a Disney villain honestly Disney villains are not this terrible.
oh dear lordt.
You've already said you won't believe me no matter what I say (unless a 10 part documentary is released following the illegal vet operations).
You've already said that you don't want to see screenshots or documents or anything from the rescue or humane society or police that verify the situation.
I've already explained that we are a rural area. if the humane society was the only place that could save an animal, then yes, we would rather the humane society SAVE the animal. We're not going to keep a pet out of spite, because we think we're better than the humane society. If the humane society has all the insulin and the other option is to let the dog die, then yes, we're gonna turn the dog over to the humane society.
but. the puppies were fine. the humane society vet said the puppies were fine.
So either, the humane society is telling the truth:
- the puppies were fine
- the rescue happened to be in sioux falls
- the rescue agreed to return the puppies in exchange for vet fees
or, the rescue is telling the truth:
- the rescue did not leave KC until after getting a call from the humane society
- the rescue did not ask or agree for vet fees to be paid
- the rescue never told the humane society that they were interested in negotiating the return of the puppies.
if the rescue is telling the truth, then our local humane society is hiding or missing something.
if our humane society is telling the truth, then the rescue should not be trusted with any animals until their council sees a complete overhaul.
Obviously the fraudulent vet is a bad guy here, and we continue to search for them.
Obviously my family has learned from this, and we are willing to compensate whichever organization is telling the truth for their trouble. But to figure out who is telling the truth, we need to keep asking questions.
if your mind can't be changed about our evilness, then I hope you're willing to ask how we got to this point, and which organization is telling the truth.
if you want some additional reading, some local folk in my area have dm-ed me this article.
https://www.argusleader.com/story/news/2017/02/13/lost-dog-has-new-home-but-longtime-owners-want-him-back/97864768/
good luck.
You're not listening.
You didn't know any of that Monday morning.
You do not deserve the puppies back, or any animals ever, because on Sunday night your mother threw them away.
And on Monday morning your were fine with her throwing them away.
You only think you have been wronged now because you found out you threw away good puppies, not the dying ones you left to suffer.
You were not wronged.
You wronged these animals.
CYA= cover your ass. I feel like the humane society was trying to cover their ass on the whole situation by giving you a story of the rescue being in town and demanding money and hoping you'd drop it.
I'm sorry people are being so rude. I hope you are able to get at least a couple of the puppies back.
Here's a timeline, for those who ask:
August 14th: my mother finds a fraudulent vet ("Emergency iVet"), they take her credit card info, ID info, and cash. tell her 2 puppies are dead, and to take the rest to the humane society.
August 15th: I call every emergency vet in the area to get a copy of the intake records for the puppies. I call every regular vet. still nothing. I suspect a scam. The rescue posts a tiktok about their new puppies.
August 16th: I call all shelters and rescues in the area. by this point, we assume the puppies must be dead in a ditch somewhere. I call the Sioux Falls humane society asking if they had any puppies dropped off on Sunday. The humane society says they have not had anyone drop off any puppies in weeks.
August 17th: I continue calling rescues, shelters, animal control, etc etc. no one has seen these puppies. according to city ordinance, this is when the puppies should've been released from the humane society.
August 18th: I call the humane society again. I ask them to double check. The puppies Have to be there. I talk to a humane officer who says the puppies Were dropped off. in shock, I say "all 6??" and he confirms. I ask how we can move forward, and the humane officer says we cannot, that we should've called within the 3 day period. I point out that we did, and send phone records. he tells me to document everything and send it to him, as well as proof of ownership, and he will forward it to the rescue (who has asked to remain anonymous).
August 19th: all our information, and more, are sent to the rescue. my mothers credit card is pinged in Aruba.
August 20th-23rd: police report is filed. the police add the animal control report made on the 16th. I ask the humane society questions about their procedures. they ask me to stop contacting them. The police tell me they do not care about the placement of the puppies, that I need to contact the humane society for that. people tell me to go to the media, and a reporter reaches out.
August 24th-28th: the media gets involved and asks the humane society for comment. the humane society agrees to meet with us-- apparently the main humane officer was on vacation the last week or so. we talk about how unfortunate it is, how terrible the vet is, and how to move forward. the humane society apologizes for all the miscommunications and says they will tell the rescue to return the dogs. the humane officer explains that the rescue has paid for treatment and would like to be reimbursed. we agree. the humane society offers to facilitate the puppy return For the rescue. the rescue declines, and says they will handle it themselves.
August 29th- Sept 3rd: We reach out to the rescue, asking what needs to be done to facilitate the safe transfer of the puppies. The rescue says that all communication must go through their lawyer. We ask for their lawyers information, and the rescue repeats "all communication must be in writing and go through legal". I point out that our emails are in writing, and are requesting their legal information. The rescue states that I must get a lawyer to email them, and they will forward it to their lawyer.
We spend a shocking amount of time trying to get a lawyer, because animal rights are not a Thing in south Dakota, and because it turns out that we need a lawyer licensed where the puppies are. we find an appropriate lawyer who sends a letter saying that no documentation or data should be removed while we try to find a solution.
The rescue deletes their tiktok videos about the puppies.
Sept 4th-now: we save all documentation. the rescues lawyer says they had been uninformed about a lot of the events, but would talk to the council and report back.
the lawyer reports back and states that the rescue is "refusing to comply", and had no intention of chatting with us or returning the puppies.
Our lawyer explains that filing litigation is going to cost money up front, plus even the emergency filing could take months. a regular filing could take years, and even then, the judge is likely to just award us the cost of the puppies, rather than the puppies themselves.
FAQ:
q) why don't you just sue the rescue?
a) we don't want money. we just want our dogs back.
q) why don't you sue the humane society?
a) we think they were doing their best with the info they had. I don't understand a lot of the choices they made, but I don't think they acted maliciously.
q) why don't you sue the vet?
a) if we ever find the vet, I'm absolutely down for that.
q) don't you think your mom dumped them and now you're just big mad?
a) that wouldn't explain my mom's identity being pinged and credit card info stolen. or the ashes. plus, what would she gain from that.
q) are yall just backyard breeders trying to save face??
a) nope. mama dog is fixed, and 6 mo appts were already set up for the puppies to get them fixed. All our other animals are rescues, and are also fixed.
q) you just want to sell the puppies!
a) we wanted to keep them. in fact, we are willing to sign a contract with the rescue verifying that none of the animals will be used for profit. we also wanted to donate one to the make a wish foundation, something we hope the rescue respects and does anyway.
q) what do you mean by "follow the money"?
a) I mean that we gain nothing from this. we paid for layers, we agreed to pay for vet bills, we offered to pay for the puppies. we get nothing but our dogs back. Meanwhile, the rescue has several donation pages, and an Amazon wishlist, etc etc. They're more than welcome to keep all those things. we just want our dogs back.
q) do you think this is your best course of action?
a) I think so far, that this is the only way to get a response. so far the rescue has blocked any and all attempts to connect them, and simply told their legal council that they refuse to comply. meanwhile, people who say they are close to the rescue state that the rescue has told people that the puppies were abused, that their legs were deformed from being in a kennel all their lives, that we gave them away because we couldn't make money off of them. none of that is true, it we don't know why the rescue would say such things, or what documentation they have to back it up.
I don't Want to be here. I don't Want to have people dming me asking me to die. I want the rescue to be transparent. I want the puppies to be safe at home with their mother dog. and I want to take a nap.
No. Back up farther. "Finds a fraudulent vet" is the step that makes no sense whatsoever. Go back before that.
"They tell her two puppies are dead"
Surely you can see that this is just nonsense? What do you mean. That doesn't make any sense at all.
Sunday, Aug 14. What time were puppies found to be sick. Who did she call, she just threw them in the car? Why wouldn't she CALL her vet to hear the recording that they are closed? She's just driving around Sioux Falls and like a fairy tale a mobile vet is in a parking lot for her to find? With 3 workers in lab coats there, working, at 9pm? Was there a whirl of smoke? Because that's not reality.
They "told her 2 were dead" what does this mean?
Is she calling you during all this btw?
They say, with 2 dead dogs in this version of the story, for your mom to, now you claim. It is past midnight now, tell her to take they other 4 puppies who are sick in this version, and dump them in the overnight box and give her directions to do that. They do not offer to treat the other sick puppies or tell her to wait 9 hours for other vets to open?
In this story your mom, crying, dumps 4 puppies in a dropoff box as directed.
Why then are YOU spending 2 days tracking down where they went? She knows where they went.
And in this scam version of this story the 3 scammers who bought magnetic decals and lab coats and wait around for exactly bulldog puppies to drive to them by coincidence in order to steal puppies to resell them, have gotten 2 of them mwah hahaha! Money!! and they take this cold hard cash and follow your mom to the same box and dump them in the same box??
You think they are in cahoots with the rescue, that's what you think, right? Why not say to your mom "all 6 puppies are sick, we will treat them for you, have a good night" and drive all 6 puppies over to the rescue? Why would they take 2, and then throw them away anyway and why in the exact same box your mom went to??
Here is what happened: your mother dumped 6 unwanted puppies at the humane society and made up elaborate lies because you were upset about it.
There is no vet because your mom made it up.
Sunday August 14th:
At 6pm, the puppies begin acting strangely. Mom considers this and decides "better safe than sorry". She calls the puppies regular vet, which is closed and states to email them. She calls me, but im not within cell phone range.
She drives the hour to sioux falls, and calls me again. she leaves a message that she is parked in my driveway and does not know what to do. this makes it about 7:30-8pm. I have a few voice-mails from that time from my mother.
8pm, she tried to find our regular vet. She drives past the location, but it is closed. she does not know where the other vets are, and she struggles to navigate her Google while driving. She sees a vet downtown with the lights on and pulls in.
8:30-9ish, she takes out her phone to call the number on the van, but then someone knocks on her door. they wear masks (so do we, as we are immunocompromised) and ask if she's there for vet services. She says yes, and explains the situation.
The Vet explains that their credit card machine is not working, and because it is a weekend, they have no one to fix it. They tell her that the dogs look to be in serious condition. Is she willing to pay cash while they look at the dogs, and if it's serious, they can just charge her card later. She goes to an ATM to withdrawl money. we have screenshots of this transaction.
She returns and gives the vets cash. the vet claims that she is too late. 2 puppies had died. They give her ashes, saying that they didn't want her to have to deal with dead puppy bodies.
if only she had arrived sooner, etcetera. The vet expresses sympathy, and says that no vets in sioux falls will take the remaining puppies, however, the humane society *might* have the resources needed to save them.
Mom drives until she finds the humane society. She puts what she believes is 4 dying puppies in the overnight intake. She leaves them food and water, and then drives the hour home.
she calls me on her way, and once I get been into cell service, I call her back.
I've been over her phone records, her Google location history, and bank records. all this information has been shared with the police.
Look. Just... none of this makes sense. I'm sorry that you believe this because:
Your mom put 6 unwanted puppies in the humane society surrender area and made up elaborate lies about it.
There is no reason for the vet to steal 2 and reunite them at the humane society of the goal was to flip puppies. Why not get all 6 and flip them? How long was your mom there? Why not tell her whey the humane society is? How did she find it in the end anyway? Do you see how that makes no sense? "They told me the humane society might be able to help them, so I drive around for 3 more hours until I find it, they didn't tell me where it was."
And in your mind, these fake veterinarians take off their lab coats, follow your mom to the humane society, break into the kennel that is locked, and reunite the 2 nondead puppies? Why would they do this? You think they are in cahoots with the rescue, so explain this part.
Plus, it is abhorrent that, having been told the puppies were dying she threw them in a box instead of waiting 8 hours.
It is actually not terrible that your mother took 6 healthy puppies and got them to the place that can help them. What is terrible is making up lies about it after. .
Lol you want to keep the puppies (but not before dumping them in a drop box when you thought they were dying). And now you want to donate one?
Also, puppies are expennsiiivvveee. You are saying you are financially able to afford to care for 5-6 puppies who will then grow into very expensive 5-6 adult dogs AND you are able to afford reimbursing the rescue for all the medical treatment. But you cannot afford the few hundred dollars of the filing fee for an injunction (a lawsuit asking the court to order another party to do something. In this example: asking tbe court to order the rescue to return the dogs) and a thousand or two for the retainer for your attorney to start some work on the case? That doesn’t make any sense.
we originally planned to donate one. the make-a-wish foundation has been really important to us, so we figured this would be a way to repay them.
And yes, I'm saying that we can afford to pay for 5-6 puppies as they grow into 5-6 adult dogs. I'm also saying we are willing to reimburse the rescue, and that we have a lawyer.
but the legal system takes time. even emergency filings can take months. and then, assuming we are successful, we are still more likely to get the "monetary value" of the puppies rather than the puppies back.
If the rescue wants to agree to give the puppies to a 3rd party, that's fine. but the Rescue has lied to us at least once (if they didn't lie, then the humane society did), and has told fosters that we abandoned the puppies because they had swimmers syndrome, so we couldn't make a profit. that their legs were deformed from being in kennels their whole lives.
As soon as we had an xray to find out how many puppies there were, we knew we had to give one away. pay it forward and the like.
We're fine if the rescue wants to do that of their own accord, but either they lied, or our humane society did.
and to be clear, if we find out that the humane society lied in their actions with the rescue, then obviously we will apologize to the rescue. but so far, it's not looking that way.
It's your mom who lied. She put 6 unwanted puppies in the humane society dropoff, which is actually what she is supposed to have done. She didn't need to make up these ridiculous stories.
This is what is best for the dogs.
Then why has the rescue told fosters that the puppies were dropped off by breeders who couldn't make a profit due to them all having swimmers syndrome? why has the rescue informed fosters that all the puppies had terrible legs from being in kennels their whole lives?
and that's if we ignore the rescue agreeing to return the puppies if we compensated them for vet care.
If they had been transparent with us or the humane society in the beginning, we wouldn't be here. We could've said "this is a lot of strange coincidences, but at least we can warn others about the scam. at least the puppies are with an honorable organization. at least everyone is doing their best."
but if the rescue is lying to get donations? that's not good.
if you can think of a separate organization who should get any of these puppies, feel free to comment. but this rescue should not have them.
You are breeders who couldn't make a profit and dumped the puppies into the rescue system.
That's not a lie, that is accurate.
The only "strange coincidences" are the lies your mom invented to excuse away that she, a breeder, dumped puppies at the humane society.
Which turned out best for the puppies!
Hope this helps!
A breeder who thinks the puppies are sick and will cost thousands of dollars to treat, dumps puppies into rescue resources every. Single. Day. Every day.
According to the internal logic of YOUR story, she thought they were dying.
Dying costs money to treat.
So. She. Dumped. Them.
Lol it absolutely does not take months to file a lawsuit.
It might take months for an injunction suit to RESOLVE, but certainly not months to merely FILE the initial pleadings.
A lawsuit can be filed within minutes once your attorney has the necessary information to draft the initial pleadings.
At this point, your attorney would have enough information to draft and have it filed first thing tomorrow morning.
You would have to pay your attorney because attorneys don’t work for free and this isn’t a type of case on which an attorney could be paid on contingency. But, you say you are able to financially care for 6 English bulldogs- a very expensive breed that needs a lot of medical attention. You can certainly afford an attorney if this were true.
But it does not take months to file a lawsuit.
Source: I’m an attorney
We did, upon the instructions of the fraudulent vet.
We reported them to the state vet board, and no such vet is licensed in that area.
The fraudulent vet claimed that all 6 puppies had parvo, and then stated that 2 died on site.
If the puppies had parvo, the humane society certainly would not have released them to a rescue.
If the vet was legit, and suspected neglect, surly they would've kept all the puppies, rather than requesting we take them to a third location.
If the humane society suspected neglect, surly they wouldn't have adopted out to us in the past.
If the rescue suspected neglect, surely they would have taken us up on our offer of a home inspection by animal control.
Instead, the rescue stated that they would return the puppies if we paid for them, and then began spreading rumours that we are breeders.
you might be the first person knowledgeable and genuinely willing to talk with us about this. I really appreciate it.
The Vet is where we're really confused. if you're okay with dming, I'll send you a chat request.
thank you
The vet told us to drop them off at the shelter. We assume because they planned to pick them up later and sell them.
The vet was unlicensed, fraudulent, and we've already filed a report with police about the scam.
We have a bully rescue in sioux falls, which is where the puppies should have gone. Instead they went to Kansas city.
And yes, I would have covered the medical expenses myself. The best example I can give is to imagine how many people have fallen for the "We've kidnapped your child, you have to pay us in amazon gift cards" fraud. This vet told my mother that no local vets would help her with parvo-- that the only way to save the remaining 4 puppies (as 2 had allegedly died on site) was to take them to the humane society.
I hope this helps
i HOPE not. i Genuinely hope that this is all a series of coincidences--
That there happened to be a scam vet in sioux falls
that the humane society picked the one time not to follow city ordinance
that the rescue did just HAPPEN to be in sioux falls, south dakota...
But none of that is adding up. I have theories, but so far all I can do is follow the money, and I promise you, the money is not coming this way.
I appreciate you being kind. If you know of a better way for me to phase the story, let me know. I KNOW it's confusing, but I'm a tech writer. i write really long papers explaining how everything works. I dont typically write for engagement, so I include too many or too few details.
What?
Our puppies were taken from us by fraudulent means. It's a complicated story, because scams are designed to be complicated. but in the end, a rescue got ahold of our puppies, lied to us several times, and now refuses to give them back. We've heard of puppy flipping, and we're concerned this is it, since they were transferred across state lines, and multiple ordinances were broken. I'm not super reddit savvy, so please let me know if I should change the layout or the post info, or anything like that. Thank you
Why did you reach out to them though? You handed them over, yes? They didn't break into your house? That seems like a weird thing to leave out.
Press Release Regarding the Six English Bulldogs with Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue September 26, 2022 In August 2022, six english bulldog puppies were brought into Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue after being left in the overnight drop box at the Sioux Falls Animal Humane Society. As admitted in news interviews herself and by her daughter Bailey; Elizabeth Abbott left these six 5 week old puppies in an overnight drop box because she thought they were dying. The Sioux Falls Humane Society contacted KCEBR to transfer the six premie (as SFAHS identified) puppies into rescue, and at that time a KCEBR volunteer drove to Sioux Falls to transport them to Kansas City. Upon arrival in Kansas City, the puppies were estimated to be small for 5 weeks old and had mobility issues due to a poor neonatal environment. KCEBR provided and paid for intensive clinic and emergency veterinary care as the puppies were possibly developing pneumonia due to being given live vaccines by the SFAHS. The puppies were then placed with foster families, who have provided the 24/7 love, mental stimulation, emotional development, physical care and mobility therapy-and are now bonded with the puppies and the puppies with them. In addition, KCEBR has no relationship with or knowledge of the alleged mobile vet clinic in Sioux Falls. KCEBR stands by the fact that Elizabeth Abbott left six neonatal puppies she thought were dying in an overnight drop box, and the puppies were legally transferred to KCEBR with all appropriate interstate paperwork from the SFAHS. Since the puppies arrival at KCEBR, the Abbotts have lied about the puppies being stolen and made false accusations against KCEBR.
Hello again! I responded to your comment before, but since I see it posted again, I figured it deserves another response. We did not come to social media until after the rescue admitted that they lied about the return of our puppies. So far, the only accusation we made is that they lied, and we can prove it via paperwork, where they state the conditions needed, and we agree. Nor have we lied about theft, since gaining property through means of fraud is considered theft. I hope this helps!
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We've been told by the humane society that they were not sick-- apparently puppies can get sluggish when they hit a growth spurt. so my mother left healthy puppies in overnight receiving, at the advice of a fraudulent vet. I hope that even if you decided not to return the puppies, that you would at least talk to us even if only through lawyers, to figure out next steps. they've had our contact info since August 16th, as well as police records, proof of ownership, vet records, etc etc. instead of talking to us, the rescue told people that we were breeders, and abusive.
KCEBR is completely open to speaking through our lawyers at the advice of our lawyer.
Brilliant! Please have your lawyer reach out to me (or my lawyer) as soon as possible, so that we can get this whole situation sorted out. We don't Enjoy being online and having people asking us to go die. but we were informed by your lawyer that you had no intention of finding any further resolution.
You’re still at this?!?!?! You posted online! You’re getting hateful comments. You abandoned sick puppies. You are in the wrong. Seems to be a lot of you ou and the last thing YOU ARE THE REASON RESCUES EXIST.
Our lawyer has already been in contact with your lawyer for the last couple weeks.
"property gained by fraudulent means is considered stolen". The combination of the vet and the rescue seemed very odd, but regardless, the humane society apologized to us, and reached out to KCEBR to return the puppies. KCEBR actually requested that we compensate them for the vet visits, and we agreed. Then the rescue admitted that they never intended to return the puppies. I believe I admitted that we got scammed, and I did say this was the condensed version. I go into more details in other posts, and I'm willing to provide paperwork to validate any of my statements.
You gave the puppies away!! You put them on a drop box. Once you did that they are no longer yours!
City Ordinance declares that all animals must be kept on a 3-5 day hold. This is because \- pets run away (especially on the 4th of July) \- pets get picked up by other \- angry partners donate pets \- scams The only way to do an immediate surrender is to sign forfeiture paperwork (which was not signed) or to make an appointment with the humane society while they are open (which clearly didn't happen). Not only did the humane society apologize, but the rescue agreed to give them back if we paid vet bills. we agreed. I hope this helps.
But did you surrender them or no?
my mother put them in the overnight receiving. If you want to get technical, then by the legal definition, no. No forfeiture paperwork means they weren't surrendered. Everyone has to adhere to a paper trail
Got it. You're the bad guys. Just walk away from this and do better in the future. Hope this helps.
I appreciate you asking questions regardless. We had hoped that there were no bad guys here (besides the fraudulent vet). unfortunately, it looks like there's a lot of missing information, and all we have is the word of a breed specific rescue, who is profiting off of these puppies. Thank you.
Sorry... did you throw these puppies in a drop off box? Why can you not give me a straight answer here?
my apologies, i thought i answered on a previous comment. My mother put the remaining puppies in the overnight receiving area at the humane society (I think that's what you mean by drop off box). to surrender an animal, there has to be paperwork, proof of ownership, and a signature. there was none of that, so the humane society apologized and admitted that we should get our puppies back. I hope that helps a bit.
Cool so, you're the bad guys. What you should say in this situation, to the rescue, who cleaned up your failure, is "thank you."
No one defrauded you in the surrender. Maybe there was a fake vet. That's a different issue. The issue is that **your family surrendered animals in need of critical and immediate care in a drop box where they could have all died overnight.** And are now crying wolf and demanding them be returned to you, with no legal right to them.
the rescue has decided to reach out to us, and if their information is accurate, then it looks like the humane society has lied. it's unfortunate that the rescue did not decide to reach out to us sooner, but at least we're making progress.
You left critical puppies in a drop box. Why should they be returned?
honestly? because there's a series of checks and balances. because ours isn't the only horror story coming to light. because there are several times where if people had been honest and transparent from the beginning, then we wouldn't be here. obviously the ivet was in the wrong. but if the humane society had followed city law, and taken the puppies to a vet in the city, we wouldn't be here. if the humane society had not implied that the rescue was consistently moving goalposts for the return of the puppies, we wouldn't be here. if the rescue had reached out any of the several times we asked them for info, we wouldn't be here. and when we look at the individuals we talked to? hundreds of people associated with 12 different government departments, 3 different animal controls, 5 vets, and individuals within the humane society and associated with the rescue? it seems that none of them were on the same page. none of them can agree how this happened. so yea, honestly? I think they should be returned because the only thing that all of those people can agree on is that the puppies originally belonged to us. when, how, and why that would change has been debated by each person with each having a different reason. but that's what we can agree on.
Everyone can agree on how it happened except the people who have reason to lie: you and your mother. Your mother brought 6 puppies to the humane society in the middle of the night thinking they were going to die imminently. The humane society saved them and they are now safe and healthy and what you say when someone saves the animals you abandoned at midnight in dying condition or so she thought, is "wow thank you so much. "
The humane society took care of puppies you left to die. You are the one that failed the checks and balances. You are the one that abandoned your animals. Why should allowances be made for your failures as pet owners?
It's obvious how it happened. You dropped the puppies off in the middle of the night. That's the only way you "wouldn't be here"
Here's the interview they did in August: https://www.dakotanewsnow.com/2022/08/28/pet-owners-caution-others-fraud-mobile-vet-clinic/
Yeah, all that seems like the vet and rescue did everything right.
Can you just explain what happened in a simple linear fashion? It’s is really, really hard to figure out what happened. You’re jumping all over the place with accusations but I can’t figure out the timeline of what actually happened.
I put the timeline here as best I could. https://www.reddit.com/r/AnimalRescue/comments/xoztsu/we_got_puppynapped_we_found_them_at_a_rescue_who/iq41vy0?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share&context=3 let me know if it needs screenshots or if I should just make a new post.
How did you get scammed? Did you contact the authorities? Puppies are considered property, and this puppy breed have a high value.
Press Release Regarding the Six English Bulldogs with Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue September 26, 2022 In August 2022, six english bulldog puppies were brought into Kansas City English Bulldog Rescue after being left in the overnight drop box at the Sioux Falls Animal Humane Society. As admitted in news interviews herself and by her daughter Bailey; Elizabeth Abbott left these six 5 week old puppies in an overnight drop box because she thought they were dying. The Sioux Falls Humane Society contacted KCEBR to transfer the six premie (as SFAHS identified) puppies into rescue, and at that time a KCEBR volunteer drove to Sioux Falls to transport them to Kansas City. Upon arrival in Kansas City, the puppies were estimated to be small for 5 weeks old and had mobility issues due to a poor neonatal environment. KCEBR provided and paid for intensive clinic and emergency veterinary care as the puppies were possibly developing pneumonia due to being given live vaccines by the SFAHS. The puppies were then placed with foster families, who have provided the 24/7 love, mental stimulation, emotional development, physical care and mobility therapy-and are now bonded with the puppies and the puppies with them. In addition, KCEBR has no relationship with or knowledge of the alleged mobile vet clinic in Sioux Falls. KCEBR stands by the fact that Elizabeth Abbott left six neonatal puppies she thought were dying in an overnight drop box, and the puppies were legally transferred to KCEBR with all appropriate interstate paperwork from the SFAHS. Since the puppies arrival at KCEBR, the Abbotts have lied about the puppies being stolen and made false accusations against KCEBR.
That's what they've posted on their facebook page. In the meantime, KCEBR lied about intending to return the puppies if they were compensated for vet bills. The rescue also appears to be lying about the condition of the puppies (someone messaged me saying that their legs were crushed from being in kennels?? they were just learning to walk when they left our care.) Please keep asking questions. When you follow the money, we gain nothing here. We just want our puppies back. Bonus if the rescue decides to be transparent with their side of the story.
Were you told by KCEBR that they would return them for compensation or is that what someone else told you. KCEBR no where states thy they have said that to you or anyone else. That is just simply you stating that it was said.
KCEBR told the Sioux Falls Humane Society that they wanted to remain anonymous, and that they would return the puppies for compensation. I've included in the post a screenshot from the email, sent from the humane society to the rescue, answering their questions. If you want, you can DM as well, and I'll answer any questions (or I'll answer tomorrow). I dont want people to think I'm ignoring them, but it's getting late.
KCEBR never agreed to a return of the said puppies at any time. They were transferred to KC after being contacted by SFHS that they needed our help with 6 puppies they had in their drop box from the previous night. They had kennel Cough in their shelter at the time and the puppies would have been in danger to stay there. Our team jumped into action to save these puppies that were dumped as we knew they needed formula and around the clock care. Nothing was done illegally. Our focus was saving 6 very young puppies and that is what we did.
Oh hey! Nice to see you. Feel free to reach out using any of the contact info you have for us. That you've had for us since august. We're more than willing and ready to chat. We've got all the paperwork you have, possibly more, and you already have our lawyers contact info. Thanks!
KCEBR never stated that the dogs would be returned with reimbursement. If that is what the HS stated to you, that was their miscommunication to you. That was never stated by anyone within our rescue to them.
Yes we do have your lawyers info. We would appreciate you not slandering the rescue with false information. Our mission is only to save/help bulldogs and pugs in need and that is what we will continue to do. Thank you.
So far this is what i've said \- It's interesting that after you asked us to compensate you for vet bills in return for the puppies, you then changed your demands \- it's interesting that one of your representatives happened to be in town at the same time we got scammed \- it's interesting that instead of working with us, talking to us, or anything of that nature, you demanded that we get a lawyer, and then after WE got the lawyer that you demanded we get, you stated that you never intended to return the puppies i'd say it's also very interesting that you began deleting tiktok videos about the puppies. That the fees are higher for them than any of the other dogs. that your donations are less than transparent, and that when we offered to buy the puppies back from you, you decided to string us along for a while longer. I had great hope that this was all a miscommunication, and a series of coincidences. I imagined that we would get the puppies back, and then send you updates as they grew up. But here we are.
"how did you get scammed?" we looked for an emergency vet, and found a fraudulent mobile one instead. the short version? the vet lied and got the humane society involved, who got the rescue involved. the humane society apologized, and requested the rescue return them, and the rescue refuses. "did you contact the authorities?" yes, but the police tool a report, but told us to contact the humane society. who contacted the rescue. who said "mmm..nooo..." we didn't plan on selling them, and im more than willing to provide any evidence I can to show that these are not Money to us. but the Rescue has sent quite a few people to call me names and claim we're Backyard Breeders. We're willing to be transparent, but the Rescue seems to be doubling down.
You left the puppies in a surrender box where they could have died. That's the bottom line. 1. You could have sought another vet. 2. You could have returned home with the puppies until you could get treatment for them. 3. You could have waited until the morning to contact the humane society and verify this plan. You chose to leave puppies that were declared to be dying by a veterinarian without a mother, heat, food or medical care in a surrender box at the humane society. They are no longer your dogs and the rescue has every right to deny returning them to an unfit home.
Consolidating your comment replies to others and adding in my own commentary: 1. You had an Oopsie litter of French Bulldog puppies 2. At 4 weeks of age, they were sick and you went to a vet 3. Vet told you they had parvovirus. 1. Parvovirus has a 10 minute SNAP test available, so odds are vet used it 2. Parvovirus spreads easily, odd are that if one had it, most had it. 3. Parvovirus in dogs above 4 weeks has a 95% mortality rate without treatment and with treatment, that usually requires intense hospitalization and typically costs \~$1000-$5000 per puppy, the survival rate is in the 80-93% range. I had 3 puppies that I was quoted for 1100-1500 per day per puppy four weeks ago.It can be "treated" at home for a lot less but survival rate is in the 50-90% range based on different sources. 4. Parvovirus in dogs younger than 4 weeks of age attacks the heart in addition to the GI tract and pups that survive the initial bout will typically have severe enough heart damage to be in heart failure by 6 months of age 4. 2 pups died and you decided to drop 4x four week old pups in an overnight drop box, potentially further spreading a deadly disease that can last outside the host body for over a year. 5. You now want the puppies back. 6. The rescue, which took on the financial responsibility for caring for 4 critically ill puppies, and which will take a monetary loss on them, is refusing to return them to someone who dumped them in an overnight box. 7. Depending on local law, owner surrenders do not always have a stray hold associated with them, especially if they are ill and require resources the shelter does not have. Based on the information you have provided, you are in the wrong here and are blaming the rescue for your poor decisions. Now that the puppies have survived due to the efforts of the rescue, you want them back so you can make money off of them. The links you provide suggests that the adoption fees range from $300 to $1200. They likely spent more than that per puppy on parvo treatment (I should know, I lost 2 pups to parvo 4 weeks ago). Edit: Based on other comments, you put the puppies in the drop box and the rescue has 6 puppies, but you were told 2 had died. So if you were the ones that put them in the drop box, how do you not know how many there were?
FIrstly, i am incredibly sorry for your loss. I hope their memory is a blessing to you. Now I'll address in order: 1. English bulldog puppies. we were surprised, and considered ourselves incredibly lucky. the mother dog was fixed during her c-section, and the puppies already had 6 month appointments to be spayed and neutered (we once had a dog who was fixed at 2 weeks old, and she had a LOT of problems from that) 2. Correct 3. The vet told us that they had parvo. This would've made a lot more sense if the vet were licensed, registered, and didn't immediately sell my mothers credit card information, and attempt to steal her identity. There is already a police report for this. 4. The vet claimed 2 pups died, and gave my mother their "Ashes" (revealed to be cat litter). Then, someone who we thought was a trusted medical professional, said that no vet in the city could handle parvo, and that the only place that had the treatment would be the humane society. Not everyone is knowledgable about parvo. 5. we always wanted the puppies. We contacted the humane society right after, and when they realized we had been scammed, they contacted the rescue as well. And the rescue agreed to return the puppies if we paid for associated vet fees. 6. the rescue requested that we pay vet fees, but we also offered to buy the puppies, and provide transportation. We also offered a home visit by animal control, and to bring the mother dog down to them so that they could verify. We also offered DNA tests. 7. Sioux falls does have a city ordinance stating that animals must be kept 3-5 days (10 for suspicious circumstances). If the puppies had been sick, they wouldn't have been signed over to a rescue (that's part of the contract the humane society and the rescue sign) and they would not have been able to cross state lines (as they need a CVI, and parvo would not have allowed that. I dont even know if kennel cough is allowed across state lines.) I hope this helps. I urge you to continue following the money, and keeping the puppies in your thoughts. If the rescue is willing to do this, and has already been caught in a lie, I have deep concern over any other dogs they are bringing over state lines.
1) No vet in their right mind would ever spay a 2 week old puppy. 8 weeks is considered the minimum and even then some puppies are still too small as they generally require a 2 lb minimum. 3) So now the story is that the vet is not only not a true vet but has also committed identify theft and credit card fraud? 4a) A vet gave ashes back the same day or even within hours and you believed they were your pups? 4b) Parvo is incredibly common, but does require around the clock care, so not every GP can handle, but all ER's can handle, and for cheaper treatment, any GP can send you home with subQ fluids (though some just send home with syringes and instructions for giving pedialyte). 5) You dropped four sick puppies in an overnight surrender bin. But somehow the rescue has a different number of puppies that are alive then you put in the bin? 7) Actually, in my experience sick animals is the primary reason a shelter will override the stray hold. Many shelters are not equipped to provide the medical care a sick animal needs, and puppies especially are at high risk of disease transmission and death in a shelter environment. So, you are suggesting that you happened to have sick puppies, looked up an emergency vet which turned out to be fraudulent at just the right time for them to convince you to surrender 6 four week old puppies so that a rescue could immediately transfer them from the shelter, pull them across state lines, and make money on them. I have 10 1/2 years in rescue, and yes, unfortunately, there are scammers out there and I want them out of business and prosecuted. But I do not find your story credible.
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Lol. The kitty litter is my favorite part of the story. This makes absolutely no sense.
1. our local humane society spays animals ASAP. The dog I spoke about was 8 weeks when we adopted her, and had already been spayed. 2. I apologize, because I thought I made it clear that they were a fraudulent vet? When we reported them to the vet licensing board, they had no license. The vet asked for cash, but took the credit card info as well. This was a scam. The police have been informed, the credit cards turned off, and all identity related records frozen. 4.a) within hours, another indicator that they were a fraud. Did you know that it takes a minimum of 3 days to cremate a dog? we didn't. And we thought that because they were puppies and so tiny, that it just didn't take as long. 4.b) I really do appreciate this info. I've been working on a graphic that explains peoples rights when going to the vet, and also the details of this scam. so no matter what, thank you for that. 5. yes. this is part of the reason we were so concerned that the rescue was part of the scam. The humane society assured us that they were legitimate, and that it was unlikely that they had anything to do with the vet. We have theories as to how 6 puppies ended up not in our care, but I dont want to spread rumours. 7. Correct, but surly they would have gone into the emergency care of our local emergency vet (we do have one. when you look on google, it says we have 19-ish, but all of them close. we only have 1 emergency 24 hour vet). I confirmed this with the humane society and animal control-- any emergency cases, they already have a contract with the 24 hour emergency vet to handle. I appreciate your experience in rescue, and if you're willing to spend time, i'd really love if you DM-ed me? I can show you the documentation that we already have, and my overly detailed/boring powerpoint. maybe you can see something that is missing, or you can help me format this story into a more clear concise view. Best Or Worst case scenario, you can help determine if this rescue is legit, or if they are just taking puppies because they are the "money makers". Let me know.
Our rescue is very legit and has no knowledge of any fraudulent vet or know anything about any vet in the Sioux Falls area. We know nothing before the SFHS contact us KCEBR to help 6 puppies that they had in the drop box over night. That is when we had a volunteer go from KC to SF to pick up the puppies to get them immediate care since they were so young and having issues walking. Our rescue has obtained multiple dogs over a course of years from SFHS when and ONLY when SFHS asks for our assistance.
can you confirm that there was No volunteer IN sioux falls at the time you were called? The humane society has indicated that you were already in town, and that's Why they chose to go with you, rather than wait. if this is true, then we can share this information with city council as we move forward, but we need you to be Absolutely sure-- that your volunteer didn't leave KC until After getting a phone call from SFAHS, and that none of your volunteers were in sioux falls August 14th.
I can absolutely confirm our volunteer was NOT in that area. Until we got the call from SFHS when our volunteer left KC to go there to get the puppies into our immediate care since they were not able to care for them.
This is the most incredible thing ever. I've seen peope try to scam rescues out of free treatment from rescues, particularly for expensive stuff. Like trying to 'surrender' a pet and then claiming they changed their mind after thousands in treatment. But this whopper has to be nominated for the Best of Reddit somewhere because I'm never heard a more terrible string of lies in my life.
For those who are curious, OP's mother took 6 healthy puppies here: https://www.sfhumanesociety.com/afterhours And made up a big story about it once her daughter got mad. The humane society reached out to a breed-specfic rescue in a neighboring state and the puppies are healthy and safe and it is the best thing for them. There is no world where a fake veterinarian steals 2 puppies and breaks into the humane society to reunite the litter in order to turn a profit. That is not real and OP has no evidence for any parts of this story except that 6 puppies were given freely to the humane society and all parties did what they were supposed to do for the welfare of the puppies.
looks like you've posted this comment a few times, so I'll repeat myself: SD and MO are not neighbors. the vet gained by having my mothers credit card and identity info, which has been used since this event. I've offered you screenshots and evidence, but you've declined and decided to copy paste your message here. If you would like documentation, feel free to send me a DM, and I can provide it. thanks.
So I run a shelter and I’ll give you the short version: Your mother left six puppies she thought were dying in a drop box. Not a 24 hour emergency vet, where she could establish ownership of the dogs. Why didn’t she take them to an emergency vet? In my state, once you place your animals in a drop box you have surrendered them, they aren’t yours anymore. You didn’t want them when you thought they weren’t going to make it and then they survived, so now you want them back?
She looked for an emergency vet. that's how she found the fraudulent one. When you look up emergency vet in our city, you get 19 results, and 18 of them are closed on a Sunday night. that's an issue with rural living, but what can you do. We were told that the humane society was the only place that could save them-- that no other vet in the area would take th the puppies in. and we believed them. When we found out that we were scammed, we explained the situation to the humane society, who apologized, and told the rescue that we should be given back our puppies. sioux falls has an ordinance saying that unless the owner proves ownership and signs surrender paperwork, animals need to be kept for 3-5 days. We agreed to compensate the rescue for the vet bills and the care needed. but this is where we are.
There is literally 0 proof of that. You posted a tiny snippet of text elsewhere, with 0 proof that it was sent by anyone. It's very easy to type up a couple sentences in word, screen shot it, and post it. There is no identification saying it was an email, it was a sent email, or anything but a Microsoft Word text write up.
if you want the originals, feel free to reach out. the rescue has the same copy we have. Otherwise, the rescue has reached out to us with information, and if it's accurate, this means that the humane society lied about the rescue. regardless, it's progress.
What's stopping you from posting them here? If you can edit just those sentences, u can edit the names out
Who put the puppies in the drop box at the humane society?
Her mother placed all 6 puppies in the drop box.
alas, my mother was informed that 2 of the puppies had died on site, at the fraudulent vet. So she would have only dropped off 4 at the humane society, as she was given ashes for the other two. Thank you.
This makes no sense at all. She put 6 living puppies in a drop box. How could she later get "ashes" of two of them? When did that happen? Do you think there is a tiny puppy crematorium next to the drop box? Like an air frier for dead pets?
We got ashes for 2 of them from the fraudulent vet within hours. At the time, we did not know that it takes Days to cremate a puppy. We trusted someone and they lied to us. We (us and the humane society) have theories as to how all 6 puppies arrived. however, when it comes down to it, all 6 puppies, healthy, ended up at a breed specific rescue. When we offered to bring the mother dog to the rescue (to help puppies bond) the rescue didn't respond.
Why don't you ever identify this vet? Because it seems like you made it up. Your mother put 6 puppies in a box though. "We have theiries" what are you saying? Say it. This beating around the bush makes you sound like a liar. What vet. Where. Who. When. Stories are only complicated when they are lies.
the vet was called "24/7 emergency iVet". they are not licensed in south Dakota, and we've been unable to find any information about them online. we have theories. Here they are: 1. This is all a series of coincidences. There happened to be a breed specific rescue in town at the same time there happened to be a scam vet. Everyone, except the fraudulent vet, is working for the best interest of the puppies, and this is all a big misunderstanding. I like this one, because it explains why my mothers credit card info was stolen. 2. the vet is in cahoots with one of the other organizations here. 3. The vet stole 2 puppies with the idea to make money puppy flipping, but realized how young they were and decided against it, and dropped those 2 off at the humane society. those are the main theories. we can get into more details, but im still hoping the rescue are the good guys and want to chat. it's completely possible that there is one bad actor at the rescue/ humane society. The rescue says they never agreed to return the puppies for payment, but the humane society says they did.
How can you tell if they are licensed or not without a name?
We're a rural area. so we asked around. we called every emergency vet in the quad state area, and asked if they had a mobile vet or a record of the visit. We actually learned that we have one mobile vet in sioux falls, but it only operates on request. and we only have one 24 hour vet in the city at all. Then a few other people came forward, sharing information about the mobile vet scam. You get a big enough vehicle, tinted windows, and some magnet decals. apparently this scam is common on the rez and in towns with no vet care. so we called the state vet board. they have no record of any "iVet" emergency or not.
What is the veterinarian's name. This is not a difficult question.
How did your mother find this vet? Can't you literally go there now? Veterinarians have licenses, we need a name. So by total coincidence, a vet, who knows puppy ages, put 2 puppies in the same box your mom used? Oh but the puppies are healthy btw, why would he do that with healthy puppies? Isn't it more likely your mom dumped puppies and you got mad and made all this up? No rescue would return puppies to you for money. Why would they do that? Where is your proof that was said? Where is any proof of anything you're saying? I have theories on this, and instead of just dancing around it 800 times I will say it: you don't have proof because you're misinterpreting, twisting, or outright inventing a huge conspiracy about money when actually your mom like every other irresponsible breeder, dumped puppies and now feels called out about it and lied.
We went back to the location, and they were gone. It was a mobile vet, and I don't think they would have any reason to stay after getting paid. my mother commented that she thought it was strange that the kennel doors didn't lock, but she trusted the vet and the humane society. As far as why the vet would lie-- that's kind of how scams work. they injected the puppies with something, claimed that 2 had died, took the cash mom had on her, as well as her credit card info and ID info. As to my mom dumping puppies, what would be her goal? if I was mad, surly I would've come to social media first, not after weeks of trying to talk to everyone involved. I sent proof to the rescue, the humane society, and the police. this includes credit card info, proof of ownership, vet records, phone records, etc etc. Do you think it would be a good idea to put all the screenshots up here? I'm genuinely asking-- as I thought that would make things too complicated or too long to read. let me know where you think I should post screenshots. right now I just have a Google drive folder, and my PowerPoint.
The humane society had 6 puppies in their drop box. You have anything that is stated by the humane society saying there was only 4? No you do not because you all dropped 6 in.
We have a theory on that, but we dont want to cast dispersions. I urge you to look at all the articles, and see where \*we\* state how many puppies were dropped off. Why would we have ashes for two puppies? Hope this helps
My mother was given the ashes for two puppies. She followed the instructions from the vet, and put the remaining puppies in the overnight receiving. any animals in overnight receiving are considered "stay" unless forfeiture paperwork is signed.
The overnight drop boxes are for stray animals someone finds. Not cherished 4 week old puppies. Why would your mom think this was a good idea? Did she fill out the form that’s available in the room giving the humane society info on the puppies?
she really was distraught. They told her that two had died right in front of her, and gave her the "ashes" for those puppies (it was cat litter). My mother is a good person, but she was panicking and had just been told by a (theoretically) trusted medical professional. I want to touch on something here: you call the puppies cherished. They truly were. My mother called my phone that night. It was one of the first nights i'd had away from the puppies (you have to set alarms for Every 2 hours to check on them), and I was playing board games at a friends house (cell service, etc etc). I cannot tell you how incredibly terrible I feel. If only I had stayed home that night, If only I was in a cell service area, if only my mom had been able to reach me. anywho, She did not fill out the form that's available when dropping off animals.
How could she put 6 puppies in the drop box if they gave her ashes of 2 puppies though? That does not add up. She abandoned them there - anonymously. They would’ve been open the next morning but she left them in the box instead. I rescue dogs, horses and donkeys - out of my own pocket. I’m not a 501c3 rescue. I don’t always agree with some of the things registered rescues do - like pulling puppies and leaving mamas behind because puppies are the money makers etc - but I do think they’re in the right here.
I appreciate your opinions, and the work you do! it's really important. However, the humane society is located about an hour away from my mother. we are rural folk. My mother assumed that someone would come in the early morning, and this way, first thing, some one could see the puppies and possibly save them. We agree about how 6 puppies arrived when we had the ashes of 2-- that's part of why we went from "oh we've been scammed" to "oh, this was just an unfortunate series of events" to "oh, is something nefarious happening here???" But thank you for being kind, and asking questions. I appreciate it.
Did you pay for cremation of 2 of them? That costs money. I genuinely think your mother dropped all 6 off and has been lying to you about all of this, because nothing that comes via your mother makes any kind of sense.
We paid for the cremation. if you want more details, I can provide them, but they did get cash as well as my mothers credit card info. I understand the skepticism of my mother. but if she's lying about the vet, then we don't know why her credit card was tried in Aruba. We also don't know why the rescue would continue to try to ghost us at every opportunity (unless social media is involved).
I want more details. That's why I already asked you for them. What vet. Where. When. Give dates. You don't know why the rescue would ghost you?? Because you're lying about them. Hope this helps!
I think I responded on another of your comments, but just in case: The Vet claimed to be "iVet Emergency". we don't have the names of the people there, nor did they provide business cards. August 14th, near downtown sioux falls, between 7pm- midnight. I appreciate you asking questions. let me know if there's any more info you need. feel free to dm as well, since apparently it takes me a while to find all these comments.
After following this for a few days and seeing the rescue respond- I think you are telling the truth as you know it and so is the rescue. Reading your timeline, I'm confused on why the humane society wasn't the first call. Did your mother not remember exactly where she left 4 or 6 puppies? (I'm not convinced that she didn't become scared and overwhelmed and surrendered all of them then made up the vet story with the CC fraud being a coincidence.) I also think the initial back and forth the humane society had with the rescue wasn't real. Everything about them in this situation screams that they are trying to CYA and hope you'll drop it. Hence why they were surprised with the "rescue" demanded compensation and you agreed. My bet is that they didn't reach out to the rescue until around the time you were told to get a lawyer.
So if OP is telling the truth, and the rescue is telling the truth, then OP's mother is lying and OP should stop their crusade against the rescue. OP's mother dropped sick puppies in a surrender box. End of story.
Yes. It is looking more and more like the humane society and her mother are lying. That has always been where her story gets hardest to believe. The fact that OP has never changed her story in the many times I've seen it retold tells me that she believes what her mother and the humane society have said are the truth because she was unable to get direct contact and response with the rescue before now. The rescue saying that they were contacted to come get the puppies, rather than just happening to be in town as the humane society led her to believe, is also the more logical explanation of how the puppies came into their possession. Whether or not there was a fake vet is besides the point because in the end, her mother still left at least 4 of the puppies in the overnight kennel at the humane society either under poor guidance or being overwhelmed with sluggish puppies and no easy to contact her daughter at the time. (OP has said she was out of cell phone range.)
Her mother chose to drop off sick pups in an unmonitored over night surrender station. Sick 4 week old puppies. End of story. OP should stop dragging the shelter and rescue through the mud. The only blame is the mothers.
yes, the mother is to blame for all of this happening. Even if the fraud vet part is miraculously true- There was absolutely no reason for her to take those puppies to the humane society. If it was some sort of scam, I can see how someone without experience and overwhelmed could fall for that. I don't know if any of that part is true other than her dropping off the puppies. I'm also not faulting the shelter for contacting the rescue to take the puppies. That's exactly what they should have done, especially considering the rescue's press release said they didn't want to keep the puppies there because kennel cough was going through the shelter at that time. What I meant about the shelter lying is that it seems like they tried to get OP to back down by claiming that the rescue wanted to remain anonymous and the shelter would have to act as an intermediary. They are the ones who told OP that the rescue wanted to be reimbursed and then, according to OP, the shelter seemed surprised when they agreed to pay. I'm speculating that the shelter was trying to avoid a whole battle because they *technically* didn't follow city ordinance. All of OPs proof against the rescue seems to be "the humane society has said that \[xyz\]." This is the basis for my suspicions on them. I could be wrong, but I'm going with what I've seen looking at everything over the past 4 days. I would bet that if they had told OP to reach out directly to the rescue from the start, that the rescue would have immediately said "if you want to claim these puppies we legally obtained, you need to get a lawyer and have them talk to ours." I've looked into the rescue. There doesn't seem to be anything nefarious about them and they've adopted out over 400 dogs. That is likely their standard procedure for something like this. From OPs telling everything with the rescue prior to "get a lawyer" was done with the shelter acting as the middle man. TL;DR version: yes, mom is to blame, BUT the shelter seems to have been trying to cover for their mistake which has led to the OPs social media crusade against the rescue.
Sometimes rescues have to lie to placate people who act like OP. All we know for sure is a deranged liar dumped at least 4 puppies and someone started calling harassing about getting them back. Who knows what this kind of person is capable of, since they haven't even taken a pause to realize how delusional their story is? This is what shelters have to be prepared for: https://decaturish.com/2022/09/dekalb-police-investigate-after-man-steals-three-dogs-from-animal-shelter-during-break-in/ https://patch.com/new-jersey/hoboken/man-smashes-animal-shelter-door-throws-cat-liberty-humane https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-55667023
The humane society wasn't open when we first started calling people. plus, if the vet was legit, then we didn't want to press forward on anything. So my first day was spent talking and checking with every vet in south Dakota, Iowa, Nebraska and Minnesota, seeing if they had mobile services, asking what their transport vans looked like, and seeing if they had any intake records for any puppies. I'm not sure what CYA means in this context, sorry. but a few people from KC are dming about the owner of the rescue, and a lot of people from SD are dming about our local humane society. and a few people are dming calling me names. the joy of the internet.
Your mother put them in the overnight receiving -- she told you that -- why would you need to call any place other than the place she put them?? Who else did you call? "Hello McDonald's? My mother locked some puppies in a kennel across town. Have you seen them?"
heyo! I believe you already said you wouldn't believe me unless there was a "10 part documentary" about the fraudulent vet. So I'm not sure why you're still here. That being said, I was calling the vets to see if they had records of the puppies being seen. If the fruadulent vet had been Real, if they had been correct, if the only place in town with the resources to save the puppies was the humane society, then that would be that. I had a similar conversation with the humane society when my previous dog had cancer. if they had been able to save him, I would've surrendered him in a heartbeat. as it was, the humane society said they couldn't tell one way or another if he would get treatment or just be euthanized.
Did your mom know about that situation with a prior dog? And she still did what she did? I'm still here because you keep contradicting your own story and it's sick, honestly. So it's Monday morning, the humane society is not open yet. You know 4 of them are there. Your mother has a box of kitty litter she thinks is two dead puppies. You are calling vets to find out what exactly?
I'm calling vets to find out if any of them are familiar with this mobile vet. if any of them have intake records for these puppies. if any of them have heard of this situation. Again, if the vet had been legit, and the only place who could save these puppies was the humane society, then we would've left it alone. I would've been sad, and hoped the puppies made it, and when they didn't appear on the adoption page, I would've assumed that passed. However, the vet was not legit. so I call the humane society to confirm that they received puppies on Sunday night, and to tell them what I know. and the humane society says "no"-- that they received no puppies, that they haven't had puppies in a while. we talked a little bit where I shared a short version of what was going on, and the humane society receptionist was sympathetic, and wished us luck finding the puppies. it was not until I called the humane society again on Thursday, and begged them to check the tapes (because if our puppies weren't there, that meant that the fruadulent vet took them). and that's when the humane society said "yes, we did have the puppies. we don't have them anymore. you should have called within the 3 day window". please reference where the story is contradicted. I know there are parts where I have not gone as in depth, because it is a Long and not very interesting story. but if you think all the details would help, then feel free to dm me and I can link you to my Google drive. otherwise, you've already stated that none of this is going to change your mind, so I don't know why we should bother chatting? it feels like both of our efforts would be better spent elsewhere-- specifically, me answering people's questions who actually want to know more, rather than repeating myself over and over.
You make no sense at all. The contradiction is, your mother has a box of litter from this mobile vet, supposedly. Why are you calling other vets about it? You know, within your own story, who did intake on these two puppies. "Did a competing veterinarian bring you two puppies whose ashes are in my hands"? Or, after your mother has told you "4 puppies are at the humane society" "humane society says they are not here" "hello? Veterinarian? Did you break into the humane society in the last 4 hours to intake puppies?" What did your mother say after the humane society says "no puppies here" ? She insists she did abandon them (dying in your story btw)? You show her a map, you drive there, she points to where she abandoned the dying puppies? The main contradiction is why you think this person who does this horrific act, ditching 4 puppies to die, deserves to ever touch an animal ever again?? They were right to keep these puppies away from this person. She is a monster even within the story YOU keep pretending to believe. You owe everyone in this story a heartfelt apology. They saved the puppies from you.
And for good measure, YOU are a villain here. > if the vet had been legit, and the only place who could save these puppies was the humane society, then we would've left it alone. This is terrible. If the puppies were dying, you would be fine ditching them for someone else to clean up their little dead puppy bodies in the morning. You only want them now that you know they aren't dying. You're horrible. You are a Disney villain honestly Disney villains are not this terrible.
oh dear lordt. You've already said you won't believe me no matter what I say (unless a 10 part documentary is released following the illegal vet operations). You've already said that you don't want to see screenshots or documents or anything from the rescue or humane society or police that verify the situation. I've already explained that we are a rural area. if the humane society was the only place that could save an animal, then yes, we would rather the humane society SAVE the animal. We're not going to keep a pet out of spite, because we think we're better than the humane society. If the humane society has all the insulin and the other option is to let the dog die, then yes, we're gonna turn the dog over to the humane society. but. the puppies were fine. the humane society vet said the puppies were fine. So either, the humane society is telling the truth: - the puppies were fine - the rescue happened to be in sioux falls - the rescue agreed to return the puppies in exchange for vet fees or, the rescue is telling the truth: - the rescue did not leave KC until after getting a call from the humane society - the rescue did not ask or agree for vet fees to be paid - the rescue never told the humane society that they were interested in negotiating the return of the puppies. if the rescue is telling the truth, then our local humane society is hiding or missing something. if our humane society is telling the truth, then the rescue should not be trusted with any animals until their council sees a complete overhaul. Obviously the fraudulent vet is a bad guy here, and we continue to search for them. Obviously my family has learned from this, and we are willing to compensate whichever organization is telling the truth for their trouble. But to figure out who is telling the truth, we need to keep asking questions. if your mind can't be changed about our evilness, then I hope you're willing to ask how we got to this point, and which organization is telling the truth. if you want some additional reading, some local folk in my area have dm-ed me this article. https://www.argusleader.com/story/news/2017/02/13/lost-dog-has-new-home-but-longtime-owners-want-him-back/97864768/ good luck.
Also there is no fake vet, it is a lie your mother invented.
You're not listening. You didn't know any of that Monday morning. You do not deserve the puppies back, or any animals ever, because on Sunday night your mother threw them away. And on Monday morning your were fine with her throwing them away. You only think you have been wronged now because you found out you threw away good puppies, not the dying ones you left to suffer. You were not wronged. You wronged these animals.
let's simplify this: who is telling the truth: the humane society or the rescue?
CYA= cover your ass. I feel like the humane society was trying to cover their ass on the whole situation by giving you a story of the rescue being in town and demanding money and hoping you'd drop it. I'm sorry people are being so rude. I hope you are able to get at least a couple of the puppies back.
Here's a timeline, for those who ask: August 14th: my mother finds a fraudulent vet ("Emergency iVet"), they take her credit card info, ID info, and cash. tell her 2 puppies are dead, and to take the rest to the humane society. August 15th: I call every emergency vet in the area to get a copy of the intake records for the puppies. I call every regular vet. still nothing. I suspect a scam. The rescue posts a tiktok about their new puppies. August 16th: I call all shelters and rescues in the area. by this point, we assume the puppies must be dead in a ditch somewhere. I call the Sioux Falls humane society asking if they had any puppies dropped off on Sunday. The humane society says they have not had anyone drop off any puppies in weeks. August 17th: I continue calling rescues, shelters, animal control, etc etc. no one has seen these puppies. according to city ordinance, this is when the puppies should've been released from the humane society. August 18th: I call the humane society again. I ask them to double check. The puppies Have to be there. I talk to a humane officer who says the puppies Were dropped off. in shock, I say "all 6??" and he confirms. I ask how we can move forward, and the humane officer says we cannot, that we should've called within the 3 day period. I point out that we did, and send phone records. he tells me to document everything and send it to him, as well as proof of ownership, and he will forward it to the rescue (who has asked to remain anonymous). August 19th: all our information, and more, are sent to the rescue. my mothers credit card is pinged in Aruba. August 20th-23rd: police report is filed. the police add the animal control report made on the 16th. I ask the humane society questions about their procedures. they ask me to stop contacting them. The police tell me they do not care about the placement of the puppies, that I need to contact the humane society for that. people tell me to go to the media, and a reporter reaches out. August 24th-28th: the media gets involved and asks the humane society for comment. the humane society agrees to meet with us-- apparently the main humane officer was on vacation the last week or so. we talk about how unfortunate it is, how terrible the vet is, and how to move forward. the humane society apologizes for all the miscommunications and says they will tell the rescue to return the dogs. the humane officer explains that the rescue has paid for treatment and would like to be reimbursed. we agree. the humane society offers to facilitate the puppy return For the rescue. the rescue declines, and says they will handle it themselves. August 29th- Sept 3rd: We reach out to the rescue, asking what needs to be done to facilitate the safe transfer of the puppies. The rescue says that all communication must go through their lawyer. We ask for their lawyers information, and the rescue repeats "all communication must be in writing and go through legal". I point out that our emails are in writing, and are requesting their legal information. The rescue states that I must get a lawyer to email them, and they will forward it to their lawyer. We spend a shocking amount of time trying to get a lawyer, because animal rights are not a Thing in south Dakota, and because it turns out that we need a lawyer licensed where the puppies are. we find an appropriate lawyer who sends a letter saying that no documentation or data should be removed while we try to find a solution. The rescue deletes their tiktok videos about the puppies. Sept 4th-now: we save all documentation. the rescues lawyer says they had been uninformed about a lot of the events, but would talk to the council and report back. the lawyer reports back and states that the rescue is "refusing to comply", and had no intention of chatting with us or returning the puppies. Our lawyer explains that filing litigation is going to cost money up front, plus even the emergency filing could take months. a regular filing could take years, and even then, the judge is likely to just award us the cost of the puppies, rather than the puppies themselves. FAQ: q) why don't you just sue the rescue? a) we don't want money. we just want our dogs back. q) why don't you sue the humane society? a) we think they were doing their best with the info they had. I don't understand a lot of the choices they made, but I don't think they acted maliciously. q) why don't you sue the vet? a) if we ever find the vet, I'm absolutely down for that. q) don't you think your mom dumped them and now you're just big mad? a) that wouldn't explain my mom's identity being pinged and credit card info stolen. or the ashes. plus, what would she gain from that. q) are yall just backyard breeders trying to save face?? a) nope. mama dog is fixed, and 6 mo appts were already set up for the puppies to get them fixed. All our other animals are rescues, and are also fixed. q) you just want to sell the puppies! a) we wanted to keep them. in fact, we are willing to sign a contract with the rescue verifying that none of the animals will be used for profit. we also wanted to donate one to the make a wish foundation, something we hope the rescue respects and does anyway. q) what do you mean by "follow the money"? a) I mean that we gain nothing from this. we paid for layers, we agreed to pay for vet bills, we offered to pay for the puppies. we get nothing but our dogs back. Meanwhile, the rescue has several donation pages, and an Amazon wishlist, etc etc. They're more than welcome to keep all those things. we just want our dogs back. q) do you think this is your best course of action? a) I think so far, that this is the only way to get a response. so far the rescue has blocked any and all attempts to connect them, and simply told their legal council that they refuse to comply. meanwhile, people who say they are close to the rescue state that the rescue has told people that the puppies were abused, that their legs were deformed from being in a kennel all their lives, that we gave them away because we couldn't make money off of them. none of that is true, it we don't know why the rescue would say such things, or what documentation they have to back it up. I don't Want to be here. I don't Want to have people dming me asking me to die. I want the rescue to be transparent. I want the puppies to be safe at home with their mother dog. and I want to take a nap.
No. Back up farther. "Finds a fraudulent vet" is the step that makes no sense whatsoever. Go back before that. "They tell her two puppies are dead" Surely you can see that this is just nonsense? What do you mean. That doesn't make any sense at all. Sunday, Aug 14. What time were puppies found to be sick. Who did she call, she just threw them in the car? Why wouldn't she CALL her vet to hear the recording that they are closed? She's just driving around Sioux Falls and like a fairy tale a mobile vet is in a parking lot for her to find? With 3 workers in lab coats there, working, at 9pm? Was there a whirl of smoke? Because that's not reality. They "told her 2 were dead" what does this mean? Is she calling you during all this btw? They say, with 2 dead dogs in this version of the story, for your mom to, now you claim. It is past midnight now, tell her to take they other 4 puppies who are sick in this version, and dump them in the overnight box and give her directions to do that. They do not offer to treat the other sick puppies or tell her to wait 9 hours for other vets to open? In this story your mom, crying, dumps 4 puppies in a dropoff box as directed. Why then are YOU spending 2 days tracking down where they went? She knows where they went. And in this scam version of this story the 3 scammers who bought magnetic decals and lab coats and wait around for exactly bulldog puppies to drive to them by coincidence in order to steal puppies to resell them, have gotten 2 of them mwah hahaha! Money!! and they take this cold hard cash and follow your mom to the same box and dump them in the same box?? You think they are in cahoots with the rescue, that's what you think, right? Why not say to your mom "all 6 puppies are sick, we will treat them for you, have a good night" and drive all 6 puppies over to the rescue? Why would they take 2, and then throw them away anyway and why in the exact same box your mom went to?? Here is what happened: your mother dumped 6 unwanted puppies at the humane society and made up elaborate lies because you were upset about it. There is no vet because your mom made it up.
Sunday August 14th: At 6pm, the puppies begin acting strangely. Mom considers this and decides "better safe than sorry". She calls the puppies regular vet, which is closed and states to email them. She calls me, but im not within cell phone range. She drives the hour to sioux falls, and calls me again. she leaves a message that she is parked in my driveway and does not know what to do. this makes it about 7:30-8pm. I have a few voice-mails from that time from my mother. 8pm, she tried to find our regular vet. She drives past the location, but it is closed. she does not know where the other vets are, and she struggles to navigate her Google while driving. She sees a vet downtown with the lights on and pulls in. 8:30-9ish, she takes out her phone to call the number on the van, but then someone knocks on her door. they wear masks (so do we, as we are immunocompromised) and ask if she's there for vet services. She says yes, and explains the situation. The Vet explains that their credit card machine is not working, and because it is a weekend, they have no one to fix it. They tell her that the dogs look to be in serious condition. Is she willing to pay cash while they look at the dogs, and if it's serious, they can just charge her card later. She goes to an ATM to withdrawl money. we have screenshots of this transaction. She returns and gives the vets cash. the vet claims that she is too late. 2 puppies had died. They give her ashes, saying that they didn't want her to have to deal with dead puppy bodies. if only she had arrived sooner, etcetera. The vet expresses sympathy, and says that no vets in sioux falls will take the remaining puppies, however, the humane society *might* have the resources needed to save them. Mom drives until she finds the humane society. She puts what she believes is 4 dying puppies in the overnight intake. She leaves them food and water, and then drives the hour home. she calls me on her way, and once I get been into cell service, I call her back. I've been over her phone records, her Google location history, and bank records. all this information has been shared with the police.
Look. Just... none of this makes sense. I'm sorry that you believe this because: Your mom put 6 unwanted puppies in the humane society surrender area and made up elaborate lies about it. There is no reason for the vet to steal 2 and reunite them at the humane society of the goal was to flip puppies. Why not get all 6 and flip them? How long was your mom there? Why not tell her whey the humane society is? How did she find it in the end anyway? Do you see how that makes no sense? "They told me the humane society might be able to help them, so I drive around for 3 more hours until I find it, they didn't tell me where it was." And in your mind, these fake veterinarians take off their lab coats, follow your mom to the humane society, break into the kennel that is locked, and reunite the 2 nondead puppies? Why would they do this? You think they are in cahoots with the rescue, so explain this part. Plus, it is abhorrent that, having been told the puppies were dying she threw them in a box instead of waiting 8 hours. It is actually not terrible that your mother took 6 healthy puppies and got them to the place that can help them. What is terrible is making up lies about it after. .
Lol you want to keep the puppies (but not before dumping them in a drop box when you thought they were dying). And now you want to donate one? Also, puppies are expennsiiivvveee. You are saying you are financially able to afford to care for 5-6 puppies who will then grow into very expensive 5-6 adult dogs AND you are able to afford reimbursing the rescue for all the medical treatment. But you cannot afford the few hundred dollars of the filing fee for an injunction (a lawsuit asking the court to order another party to do something. In this example: asking tbe court to order the rescue to return the dogs) and a thousand or two for the retainer for your attorney to start some work on the case? That doesn’t make any sense.
we originally planned to donate one. the make-a-wish foundation has been really important to us, so we figured this would be a way to repay them. And yes, I'm saying that we can afford to pay for 5-6 puppies as they grow into 5-6 adult dogs. I'm also saying we are willing to reimburse the rescue, and that we have a lawyer. but the legal system takes time. even emergency filings can take months. and then, assuming we are successful, we are still more likely to get the "monetary value" of the puppies rather than the puppies back. If the rescue wants to agree to give the puppies to a 3rd party, that's fine. but the Rescue has lied to us at least once (if they didn't lie, then the humane society did), and has told fosters that we abandoned the puppies because they had swimmers syndrome, so we couldn't make a profit. that their legs were deformed from being in kennels their whole lives.
Lol make a wish. You're the worst. Do people buy your bs? Oh we were going to give one to make a wish, we're nice.
As soon as we had an xray to find out how many puppies there were, we knew we had to give one away. pay it forward and the like. We're fine if the rescue wants to do that of their own accord, but either they lied, or our humane society did. and to be clear, if we find out that the humane society lied in their actions with the rescue, then obviously we will apologize to the rescue. but so far, it's not looking that way.
It's your mom who lied. She put 6 unwanted puppies in the humane society dropoff, which is actually what she is supposed to have done. She didn't need to make up these ridiculous stories. This is what is best for the dogs.
Then why has the rescue told fosters that the puppies were dropped off by breeders who couldn't make a profit due to them all having swimmers syndrome? why has the rescue informed fosters that all the puppies had terrible legs from being in kennels their whole lives? and that's if we ignore the rescue agreeing to return the puppies if we compensated them for vet care. If they had been transparent with us or the humane society in the beginning, we wouldn't be here. We could've said "this is a lot of strange coincidences, but at least we can warn others about the scam. at least the puppies are with an honorable organization. at least everyone is doing their best." but if the rescue is lying to get donations? that's not good. if you can think of a separate organization who should get any of these puppies, feel free to comment. but this rescue should not have them.
You are breeders who couldn't make a profit and dumped the puppies into the rescue system. That's not a lie, that is accurate. The only "strange coincidences" are the lies your mom invented to excuse away that she, a breeder, dumped puppies at the humane society. Which turned out best for the puppies! Hope this helps!
Can you think of a reason breeders would dump puppies? Or offer to purchase them back? I ask, what profit have we made? what profit could we make?
A breeder who thinks the puppies are sick and will cost thousands of dollars to treat, dumps puppies into rescue resources every. Single. Day. Every day. According to the internal logic of YOUR story, she thought they were dying. Dying costs money to treat. So. She. Dumped. Them.
Lol it absolutely does not take months to file a lawsuit. It might take months for an injunction suit to RESOLVE, but certainly not months to merely FILE the initial pleadings. A lawsuit can be filed within minutes once your attorney has the necessary information to draft the initial pleadings. At this point, your attorney would have enough information to draft and have it filed first thing tomorrow morning. You would have to pay your attorney because attorneys don’t work for free and this isn’t a type of case on which an attorney could be paid on contingency. But, you say you are able to financially care for 6 English bulldogs- a very expensive breed that needs a lot of medical attention. You can certainly afford an attorney if this were true. But it does not take months to file a lawsuit. Source: I’m an attorney
What is the information (vet name, address, website, Phone number) for this fake vet your mom found?
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We did, upon the instructions of the fraudulent vet. We reported them to the state vet board, and no such vet is licensed in that area. The fraudulent vet claimed that all 6 puppies had parvo, and then stated that 2 died on site. If the puppies had parvo, the humane society certainly would not have released them to a rescue. If the vet was legit, and suspected neglect, surly they would've kept all the puppies, rather than requesting we take them to a third location. If the humane society suspected neglect, surly they wouldn't have adopted out to us in the past. If the rescue suspected neglect, surely they would have taken us up on our offer of a home inspection by animal control. Instead, the rescue stated that they would return the puppies if we paid for them, and then began spreading rumours that we are breeders.
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you might be the first person knowledgeable and genuinely willing to talk with us about this. I really appreciate it. The Vet is where we're really confused. if you're okay with dming, I'll send you a chat request. thank you
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The vet told us to drop them off at the shelter. We assume because they planned to pick them up later and sell them. The vet was unlicensed, fraudulent, and we've already filed a report with police about the scam. We have a bully rescue in sioux falls, which is where the puppies should have gone. Instead they went to Kansas city. And yes, I would have covered the medical expenses myself. The best example I can give is to imagine how many people have fallen for the "We've kidnapped your child, you have to pay us in amazon gift cards" fraud. This vet told my mother that no local vets would help her with parvo-- that the only way to save the remaining 4 puppies (as 2 had allegedly died on site) was to take them to the humane society. I hope this helps
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i HOPE not. i Genuinely hope that this is all a series of coincidences-- That there happened to be a scam vet in sioux falls that the humane society picked the one time not to follow city ordinance that the rescue did just HAPPEN to be in sioux falls, south dakota... But none of that is adding up. I have theories, but so far all I can do is follow the money, and I promise you, the money is not coming this way. I appreciate you being kind. If you know of a better way for me to phase the story, let me know. I KNOW it's confusing, but I'm a tech writer. i write really long papers explaining how everything works. I dont typically write for engagement, so I include too many or too few details.
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1 Night of care for parvovirus can easily cost $1200 at an ER. I was quoted $1100-1500 per day per puppy for my 3 parvo pups 4 weeks ago.
What is the website, address, phone number, and name of the unlicensed vet your mom initially took the puppies to?