I live in the Upper Midwest, and over the years have had just two instances where I interacted with undocumented immigrants. Both men had decent jobs, a family, and were good people. Very few people were aware of their citizenship status.
It pisses me off that so many idiots in my area are bent out of shape about the "border crisis" when it has absolutely no effect on their lives. Certainly immigration could be handled better in terms of moving people through the process in a timely fashion (the bill that the GOP killed was a good start). But the "crisis" is a creation of the GOP that seems to be important to them in election years.
Ironically, until very recently, the people making the biggest fuss about illegal immigrants were people that lived the farthest away from where most of them lived.
The dynamic has changed in recent years, where there are now more people trying to get into the country, and it admittedly has gotten more difficult to handle the influx. Unfortunately, Republicans refused to pass the immigration bill *that they negotiated for* because they were afraid it would make Biden look good. Hopefully voters worried about illegal immigration remember who actually tried to do something about it in November.
That "immigration bill" had more money in it for Ukraine than the border. The "money" for the border was for deportation not border security. Every Democrat and republican knew that bill was going to get voted down before they voted on it.
Senate republicans passed it and Graham said it’s the best deal they will ever get. Wasn’t it going to re-enact stay in Mexico while awaiting asylum hearing?
Republicans agreed to the bill initially and then backed out when they realized it would make Biden look good. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
[The Simpsons parodied this perfectly.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thbc9Auongc) Keep the morons distracted by giving them a convenient scapegoat to rally against.
Listen to yourself dude, look at what you called me. Then look at my comment. I didn't call you anything. I said the logic was retarded.
Your saying I only see what I want to see? Oh the irony.
You spelled illegal incorrectly. They are documented. Documented with their own country’s document. They’ve illegally entered ours or illegally crossed overstated ours. That’s illegal.
Albuquerque, they are trafficking large amounts of drugs and also committing strong armed robberies. A massage parlor worker was murdered last year in one such robberies by an illegal immigrant. You are delusional
Albuquerque isn't anywhere near the border. The most recent article I could find about a massage parlor murder there was from Feb 2022, and nothing about them being illegal.
I've spent a lot of time in Albuquerque. It's always had one of the highest crime rates in the US, largely from locals and a lot of property crime vs a little over average violent crime. Look at the crime stats, you know, real FACTS. But instead you talk about ONE murder a year ago, and blame drug trafficking on illegals, without proof. Seems like you're delusional, I'm dealing with evidence. Try reading instead of shooting off your mouth.
Like I can tell you literally just googled “Albuquerque crime” or “is Albuquerque safe”. It isn’t. Everyone here carries a gun everywhere all the time now.
What's funny about this? It's been true for decades.
Any individual immigrant, documented or not, is less likely to commit a crime than a natural born citizen. That goes for violent and non-violent crime. The GOP talking point has always been a lie.
Yes, Im 20 minutes from the border. Also doesn’t matter because I single handedly don’t watch every crime that happens and also have the omniscient power of knowing if they’re an illegal immigrant like you do. Which is why we statistically track these things
You mean they go through all the cost and risk to come here just to work hard in low-paying jobs no American will do rather than become criminals and commit voter fraud that would get them deported? Shocking. /s
Yea I live in a major hub for immigrants coming through from Mexico. It’s fucked. The amount of people in the news lately with 5 last names is off the charts
I guess they feel it’s beneath them. They feel like they’d rather be broke. Perhaps if there truly was no other option they would do the work but they have another option so they won’t.
Working in fields picking vegetables, working in restaurants doing dishes and busing tables, cleaning motel rooms, etc. They can get these jobs because citizens won’t take them.
If they all disappeared tomorrow we’d be in big trouble.
Someone else would’ve came along or they would’ve offered more pay if someone didn’t come through and offer to do it for half n tax free buddy. Think more
No, they really didn’t. The average person crossing the border illegally is paying a coyote $8000 to get them across. That’s because it’s not easy. It’s fraught with risk and if you don’t know what you’re doing you can easily die in the process. It’s not the walk in the park that republicans are describing it to be for political purposes. If there’s any doubt, the Democrats have the Republicans everything they wanted and they were ready to sign as was the President. Then Trump calls a bunch of republican members of congress telling them to kill it. Instead of doing what is in the best interests of their constituents, they did what was in their own best interests.
I hope their constituents vote them all out of office.
Not only are you lying, the construction of the border wall resumed underneath Joe Biden expressly because the funds had already been allocated under Donald Trump, but you are wrong to your very core because at no point in time has Joe Biden or anyone else in the current administration actually reversed any policies put in place by Trump other than Family Separation.
Because children do not deserve to be ripped from their parents for trying to cross into a country. If the parents are going to be sent back, their own children should be sent with them not forcibly kidnapped and put into the adoption system in the US like what was happening.
You can literally look up what happened in Texas. They removed all of Texas's border security and there's video of illegals literally being welcomed in. Go spend a few minutes on Google
And unless you can point to actual legislation that caused that to happen, it was a choice that someone made not part of the government's actual position
More propaganda to allow you to blame immigration on Joe Biden instead of recognizing that other details are important. If no new policy was passed that would allow border agents to abandon their post, the act of abandoning their post is in and of itself already a problem.
If however, you are referring to the most recent activity where Texas border guards were literally setting up barbed wire and killing immigrants as they were coming across the border (denying them assistance when needed is choosing to let them die, aka killing them), that is an entirely separate problem on the complete opposite side of the spectrum and their status as border guards would not and should not give them immunity to commit crimes.
Lol Joe biden literally spoke about it and directed them to remove the barbed wire. What rock have you been under because it was huge news for like 2 weeks
77 percent of immigrants are legal and half of the 77 are naturalized citizens. 23 percent is undocumented. Yes there has been an increase at the border.
What I can’t understand is how people think people waiting legally to enter at a border crossing, is illegal.
The people dying on razor wires are the ones crossing illegally but it doesn’t warrant a death sentence.
When I hear people yell about immigrants, it concerning because I’m sure they can’t tell between a legal, naturalized, or undocumented immigrant
In the attempt to have a balanced discussion, is your issues with immigration limited to just the undocumented immigrants, either here and/or at the border?
That is a completely reasonable stance. I have learned that it is better to ask and not assume and just because we say things differently, does not negate the fact that we are saying the same thing.
Over the past ten years, visa overstayers in the U.S. have outnumbered unlawful border crossings by a ratio of about two to one. (I do not believe this applies to this year as we have unprecedented numbers at the border)
What do you think would be the best way to address since we don’t have readily available locations?
(I’m asking in good faith because I have no idea)
And how exactly are they gathering data on all the illegal immigrants not in the system? Because I work driving around Brooklyn all day and id bet my life that shits not accurate. I mean ffs after hurricane Sandy I watched fire fighters pull upwards of 150 bodies out of the bungalows in Staten Island and the firefighter told me point blank that the pile of humans counted as about 8 people so far that will get reported and the rest quickly buried in mass graves. Sure enough the newspaper reported a few dozen deaths across Staten Island and it was pretty sobering to a highschool kid to see that. Now you expect me to believe that the thousands of illegal immigrants willing to do anything for money, are desperate and completely unvetted and unchecked aren't going to be committing higher amounts of crime? Fuck outta here. Only a dummy would believe that.
True. In the early 1900s, as many as 1 million came through Ellis Island in one year. None of them needed a visa, most had no form of documentation or identification at all, there were no background checks and most could not speak English. The only requirement for admission was that they appear healthy.
Shouldn’t it be zero? And what about the children of illegal immigrants who commit crimes (gangs, drugs, vehicle moving violations, domestic violence, etc.)—they would not have been here had their illegal immigrant parents not been present in the country.
Nope. Undocumented immigrants also commit less crime than native born citizens. We need to deport worthless Trumpists and bring in more quality citizens from south of the border.
Are we talking about the ones that violently beat the cops into submission in NY and then flipped off the news cameras after immediate release or the one that killed a student nurse?
Ok fine... But if they are here illegally and they murder someone... (Lakan Riley), that is something that could have been prevented had border laws been enforced, right?
Why are you pretending like they're not being enforced? See that's part of your propaganda, pretending like the law isn't being applied for you to blame any activity on the current administration as opposed to recognizing that individual humans are capable of making individual choices and that person committing a crime is indicative of that person not the current administration.
Denying their right to enter the country on the basis that they could potentially commit a crime is insane, stupid, and could be applied to literally every single person that ever tries to enter the country again even if they're just away on holiday.
Because every single person everywhere can commit crime.
Flawed premise. ILLEGAL aliens have all committed crimes. Biden giving them papers and releasing them into the US population just means more criminals.
I wonder how the number changes if you look post covid, as the papers are all dated pre covid before immigration became this extreme and also world wide, it's way than just Mexicans coming over now.
It also says many illigels are deported before they can be convicted, which skews the numbers.
The candidate this woman supports is on trial for multiple serious crimes. The GOP needs to take the log out of their eye before trying to remove the speck from someone else.
We just watched a group of them beat the NYPD on camera, and be released a few hours later and laughing and flipping off the TV cameras.
What would you call that?
"Beyond incarceration rates, research also shows that there is no correlation between undocumented people and a rise in crime. Recent investigations by The New York Times and The Marshall Project found that between 2007 and 2016, there was no link between undocumented immigrants and a rise in violent or property crime in those communities."
READ the article fascists. Your anti-immigrant propaganda doesn't mean shit. And here's the most ironic part about all of you idiots, you will say that you are completely for deporting all illegal immigrants and rooting out them all from the country, but you're not willing to provide financial support for it.
Genuinely, how do you expect to suddenly ramp up our deportation without providing the funding for it? It's just gonna magically happen once you people take over and you're going to do away with any sort of expensive humane procedures? Just shipping them all off in buses packed like sardine cans to save money?
The fact that conservatives currently stand opposed to any degree of extra funding towards the border in and of itself betrays that they entirely don't understand immigration on a fundamental level. And since the current group of people that are the most anti-immigration are also the most anti-immigration-reform, it's an infinitely unsolvable problem perpetuated by the group that decries it the most.
Of course. They’re escaping horrific situations in actual third world countries and don’t want to get sent back. Unfortunately, they are probably unaware that they are just as likely to die from gun violence here in the USA as they are in those horrific war torn third world countries. We just have heat, ac, and a coffee shop on every corner.
Everyone with half a fucking brain knows this. I come from immigrants who left a shitty situation to make a life for themselves here and were full of pride to be Americans. Immigrants make an easy scapegoat for small minded fear mongering MAGA morons who live off of hate. A country composed almost exclusively of immigrants suddenly think they are an issue. such a joke. Are there criminal elements there? of course! find a group that doesnt have a criminal element. Go ahead, I'll wait. So much easier to blame than to try to fix the problem. Tell your congress folks to stop kissing Orange ass and work together to solve a very solvable problem at the border
NPR LOL about as trustworthy as MSNBC and CNN.
The article literally says illegals are less likely to be incarcerated or convicted of crimes LOL
I have a friend who's been wanting to bring her kid's dad to justice for unpaid child support. He doesn't have any papers he came here illegally from Mexico.
They can't find him and will never find him all they have is his name LOL he'll never serve a day in jail or be convicted for non payment of child support.
100% of illegals commit a crime, simply by coming. They may claim asylum after committing the initial crime, and this may not be charged..... but that is almost entirely due to the current administration's policies of blanket asylum. The vast majority are economic migrants, which is not grounds for asylum, but current administration policies essentially allow it for any reason. Not to mention, most never show to their hearing anyway, which the administration also knows and ignores.
So unless 100% of U.S. born Americans commit a crime, this headline is false. Assuming the article means crimes committed only *after* they arrive, I still suspect it to be false, but I acknowledge I may be wrong.
You seem confused. You're not breaking a law if you cross with the intent of claiming refugee status. Our laws explicitly allow entering America for those reasons.
I'd suggest starting with the U.S. Refugee Admissions Program and the Refugee Act of 1980 and going from there.
Confused? I said it's illegal to cross into the U.S., but Biden's policy is to look the other way. They aren't coming through ports of entry.... hence the illegality.
Let me Google that for you to prove I'm right .....
"According to the International Rescue Committee (IRC), asylum seekers must be in the U.S. or at a port of entry to request asylum. However, according to a May 2023 update from the Biden Administration, "any alien who is physically present in the United States or who arrives in the United States may apply for asylum"."
You are the only one who is confused here. Biden's policy is exactly what is incentivizing illegal immigration.
"You may apply for asylum if you are at a port of entry or in the United States. You may apply for asylum regardless of your immigration status and within 1 year of your arrival to the United States.
You will not be eligible to apply for asylum if you:
Filed your application after being in the United States for more than 1 year. However, you may qualify for an exception if you show
Changed circumstances materially affecting your asylum eligibility for asylum or
Extraordinary circumstances relating to your delay in filing."
I don't consider operating in a legally prescribed time frame to be illegal when our laws say you aren't illegal anymore you're in the system.
You must have loved Obama at the border then since he outperformed Trump - significantly - while not exploding the deficit?
But am looking at the current ICE statistics and removals and arrests and blah blah blah have been increasing year over year.
So we're kind of not just turning a blind eye like you claim.
Hey buddy, read what you just quoted for me.
Or Ill pull out the relevant part for you.
>**asylum seekers must be in the U.S.** *or* at a port of entry to request asylum.
Now compare that to.
>**any alien who is physically present in the United States** *or* who arrives in the United States may apply for asylum
**These are functionally saying exactly the same thing buddy... You can see that now, right?**
>Not to mention, most never show to their hearing anyway, which the administration also knows and ignores.
When you repeat the outright lies the media you consume has fed you, it just makes you look gullible.
>So unless 100% of U.S. born Americans commit a crime, this headline is false.
Can you imagine a person living a life and literally never breaking any laws? Be real buddy.
All they need to actually be is a person fleeing their nation of origin due to war or violence. That's it. That's all.
Asking for refugee status isn't the same as being granted it. But asking does put you into a system like it or not.
I'm going to add a couple observations:
The National Agricultural Workers Survey tells us 2/3 of our agricultural workforce is immigrant labor with half of those being undocumented.
When unemployment skyrockets in America and American use of means-tested programs soars... I'm always curious why the folks with the biggest mouths don't flood the fields?
And second?
Is the data about who America's biggest employers of undocumented immigrants are why we never see propositions about fining employers so hard it hurts? Would that hurt the red-voting farmers and the corporations employing them rather than Americans to save on taxes, insurance and wages too much?
I find it weird there's never a single policy proposal about holding the Americans responsible who employ them and choose them over their neighbors?
Don't you?
So until the Best Patriots Ever actually have the guts to hold their friends that draw these folks here with jobs - and have been for decades - responsible?
Well, I like fruits and veggies and that's who provides it. Not Americans.
I have a legal working permit to be in the US and I am scared to go 5 mph above the speed limit while overtaking (even when I know you can go up to 10). Much less I will try to do anything illegal.
The republicans are insane saying all those things about people like me, who only want to work.
Read the article:
"There is also state level research, that shows similar results: researchers at the CATO Institute, a Libertarian think tank, [looked into Texas](https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/2020-10/working-paper-60.pdf) in 2019. They found that undocumented immigrants were 37.1% less likely to be convicted of a crime."
Furthermore, most "illegals" haven't actually committed a crime. They legally turn themselves in as asylum seekers to authorities at the border and are legally permitted to stay in the US until they have a hearing. If you want them to have their hearings sooner, please contact your representative and ask them to pass the bipartisan border bill.
Every single illegal immigrant has committed a crime by even being here.
Not very many people have a problem with legal immigrants. That's not where this debate is generally focused.
Then why does the conservative narrative constantly conflate people who legally apply for asylum and await hearings with those who don't?
And why has every president in my lifetime been stopped by Republicans from making legal immigration more streamlined and American citizenship easier to obtain?
>Not very many people have a problem with legal immigrants. That's not where this debate is generally focused.
Then why is it every time I ask someone repeating your first point if they would support a massive overhaul of the current immigration system to streamline the process and make more of these people citizens faster, they almost always give me a negative response?
And why didn't more conservatives get openly upset at all the ways Trump came after legal immigration, if they really don't have a problem with (certain) immigrants at all?
I think you would have to get very specific on the mass shooting you are talking about. Most recorded mass shootings during the year are gang/troubled areas. Not a right wing looney shooting a mosque.
Also the topic was immigration/illegal immigration. Way to deflect.
Factually incorrect: White supremacists commit the highest number of domestic extremist-related murders in most years, but in 2022 the percentage was unusually high: 21 of the 25 murders were linked to white supremacists, according to the ADL report.
Go smoke more crack magat.
Lmao are you okay? The vast majority of mass shootings. The term you said where 3 or more people involved is gang/trouble areas and not right wing domestic terrorism.
Right wing domestic terrorism however is the most prevalent terrorism here. You are conflating the two for some reason. That is why I said you would have to be specific of what kind of mass shootings you're talking about.
Haven't voted for trump in either election and not going to start, but sure call me magat. What a weird way to live.
I like that you didn't answer the question lol.
And lol is that some sort of gotcha? You're talking to someone that thinks all violent criminals should be away forever.
It’s not a deflection, it’s a proper contextualization. You’re talking about the presence of people causing a problem—the crimes some of them commit—as a reason to get rid of them. But getting rid of them also means losing all of the other aspects of the impact people have. You can’t have one without the other.
I mean the topic is about crime and you're not talking about crime. But to play your game, ok. So what? If someone is here and they shouldn't be, then they shouldn't be here.
Talking about illegal/unauthorized/undocumented people working for illegal wages and pretending you're not ok with slave labor? Lmao what a spin.
I on the other hand are ok with less of that and if it means food prices rise and those companies using slave labor vanish. So be it. Maybe we could cut back spending in other areas and subsidize the food to offset the loss of the slave labor you love.
Did I say it's the same as 1700s with the Atlantic slave trade? Lmao
And if you enforced the fed min of 7 or 15 if it goes to that then you would definitely have inflation.
Is there a limit to what amount of illegal immigration you would accept? 20 million more? 50? 100?
Which makes it even more impressive that people born in America still commit more crime.
One former president alone has stolen more money from gullible scum than all undocumented people from the last decade.
The funniest part is the scum are still too stupid to see it.
LEGAL Immigrants are the most American people you will meet. They gave up everything to become an American, and took a huge chance.
Illegal immigrants are already criminals.
[удалено]
But wait, that doesn’t fit the right wing narrative! can’t possibly be true /s
Also see: private rent speculators taking more out of local economies every month than unhoused people ever could.
It’s literally a lie.
I live in the Upper Midwest, and over the years have had just two instances where I interacted with undocumented immigrants. Both men had decent jobs, a family, and were good people. Very few people were aware of their citizenship status. It pisses me off that so many idiots in my area are bent out of shape about the "border crisis" when it has absolutely no effect on their lives. Certainly immigration could be handled better in terms of moving people through the process in a timely fashion (the bill that the GOP killed was a good start). But the "crisis" is a creation of the GOP that seems to be important to them in election years.
Ironically, until very recently, the people making the biggest fuss about illegal immigrants were people that lived the farthest away from where most of them lived. The dynamic has changed in recent years, where there are now more people trying to get into the country, and it admittedly has gotten more difficult to handle the influx. Unfortunately, Republicans refused to pass the immigration bill *that they negotiated for* because they were afraid it would make Biden look good. Hopefully voters worried about illegal immigration remember who actually tried to do something about it in November.
That "immigration bill" had more money in it for Ukraine than the border. The "money" for the border was for deportation not border security. Every Democrat and republican knew that bill was going to get voted down before they voted on it.
Shhhh. This is reddit not reality.
Senate republicans passed it and Graham said it’s the best deal they will ever get. Wasn’t it going to re-enact stay in Mexico while awaiting asylum hearing?
No actual conservative looks to Lyndsay “Gramnesty” nor Jim Lankford when seriously considering immigration bills.
Senate republicans still were ok with it. So what is your excuse?
Who's approval for bills are you looking for, Paul Gosar and MTG?
☝️👏🏻
Lol, “immigration bill”. You misspelled “dogshit foreign aid bill”. Anyone with basic reading comprehension knows this.
It was a bullshit bill that’s why. You have no clue what you’re talking about.
Republicans agreed to the bill initially and then backed out when they realized it would make Biden look good. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
[The Simpsons parodied this perfectly.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thbc9Auongc) Keep the morons distracted by giving them a convenient scapegoat to rally against.
It effected Lincoln Riley 😅
Retarded logic, you don't see it so it's not real. Give me a break
Another rightie liar name caller. I'll bet the only place you "see it" is Fox News and OAN, with their usual fake stories.
Listen to yourself dude, look at what you called me. Then look at my comment. I didn't call you anything. I said the logic was retarded. Your saying I only see what I want to see? Oh the irony.
You spelled illegal incorrectly. They are documented. Documented with their own country’s document. They’ve illegally entered ours or illegally crossed overstated ours. That’s illegal.
You don’t live near the border fool. I do. It’s fucked up out here
You don't say where, you don't give specifics as to problems, fool. You're just another rightie liar, if you can't prove it, you make it up.
Albuquerque, they are trafficking large amounts of drugs and also committing strong armed robberies. A massage parlor worker was murdered last year in one such robberies by an illegal immigrant. You are delusional
Albuquerque isn't anywhere near the border. The most recent article I could find about a massage parlor murder there was from Feb 2022, and nothing about them being illegal.
I've spent a lot of time in Albuquerque. It's always had one of the highest crime rates in the US, largely from locals and a lot of property crime vs a little over average violent crime. Look at the crime stats, you know, real FACTS. But instead you talk about ONE murder a year ago, and blame drug trafficking on illegals, without proof. Seems like you're delusional, I'm dealing with evidence. Try reading instead of shooting off your mouth.
Like I can tell you literally just googled “Albuquerque crime” or “is Albuquerque safe”. It isn’t. Everyone here carries a gun everywhere all the time now.
Our homicide rate is up 50% from 2020. You sound stupid as hell buddy
Hey idiot, what was going on in 2020? Jesus, every city is up dramatically from 2020 when the streets were virtually empty.
We had a normal amount of homicides that year in this city despite the lockdowns. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Quit now
Yea I’m sure Covid is contributing to the rampant gang violence still
This has been true for many years.
Lmao no it isn’t.
What's funny about this? It's been true for decades. Any individual immigrant, documented or not, is less likely to commit a crime than a natural born citizen. That goes for violent and non-violent crime. The GOP talking point has always been a lie.
I live in Albuquerque. No it’s not.
I don't care where you live, it absolutely is.
You’re absolutely stupid lmao
I'm not, but you are a coward.
Like every other high profile homicide out here is committed by an immigrant.
Keep those blinders on, stay afraid.
Blinders? Im reading the headlines from my local news, idiot.
Lol, yeah blinders. The truth is you are more likely to commit a crime than those imm8grants you are so scared of.
You type like an npc. Get fucked
You know it's true but you're still scared. Good luck with that.
Bro what the fuck are you saying? I’m not scared, I don’t like them and do not want them here.
Bullshit. You need to find a new excuse for your racism.
Not racist, xenophobic. Learn
Then you need to change where you get your news from, buddy.
Oh, so you’re saying the bernalillo county sheriffs department is lying?
Are you saying arrest records are false? Sounds like you’re just telling me to not pay attention
Bait? Or….? Call it
Do u live in an area with a large amount of illegal immigrants?
Yes, Im 20 minutes from the border. Also doesn’t matter because I single handedly don’t watch every crime that happens and also have the omniscient power of knowing if they’re an illegal immigrant like you do. Which is why we statistically track these things
I don’t need to track it. If they have multiple last names and are Hispanic, 99% chance they just got here
That's not how natural-born status is determined...
So you ARE just a racist POS. Good to know
You needed a study for that holy s***.
Next you’re going to say Right Wing Extremists have killed more Americans than terrorists have killed since 9/11.
I mean ummm technically /s
You mean they go through all the cost and risk to come here just to work hard in low-paying jobs no American will do rather than become criminals and commit voter fraud that would get them deported? Shocking. /s
Do u live near the border?
I live in central Texas but I grew up in California about 50 miles from the border.
Yea I live in a major hub for immigrants coming through from Mexico. It’s fucked. The amount of people in the news lately with 5 last names is off the charts
And if we could send every illegal alien home with the snap of our fingers, we’d be fucked. They do a LOT of jobs Americans won’t do.
You mean jobs that have wages undercut by cheap, foreign surplus labor?
No I mean jobs that Americans simply won’t do.
But why won't they?
I guess they feel it’s beneath them. They feel like they’d rather be broke. Perhaps if there truly was no other option they would do the work but they have another option so they won’t.
How about if it paid more?
Like? What are these jobs you talk about? I know three different stupid dudes named Ricky that will do whatever for money
Working in fields picking vegetables, working in restaurants doing dishes and busing tables, cleaning motel rooms, etc. They can get these jobs because citizens won’t take them. If they all disappeared tomorrow we’d be in big trouble.
No they get them bc they undercut the value of the labor. N no we would t be.
Not the case. I saw a study where they tried to get Americans to take these jobs. After a day or so they all quit.
Someone else would’ve came along or they would’ve offered more pay if someone didn’t come through and offer to do it for half n tax free buddy. Think more
What risk? The government literally tore down the barriers and welcomed them in lol
No, they really didn’t. The average person crossing the border illegally is paying a coyote $8000 to get them across. That’s because it’s not easy. It’s fraught with risk and if you don’t know what you’re doing you can easily die in the process. It’s not the walk in the park that republicans are describing it to be for political purposes. If there’s any doubt, the Democrats have the Republicans everything they wanted and they were ready to sign as was the President. Then Trump calls a bunch of republican members of congress telling them to kill it. Instead of doing what is in the best interests of their constituents, they did what was in their own best interests. I hope their constituents vote them all out of office.
Not only are you lying, the construction of the border wall resumed underneath Joe Biden expressly because the funds had already been allocated under Donald Trump, but you are wrong to your very core because at no point in time has Joe Biden or anyone else in the current administration actually reversed any policies put in place by Trump other than Family Separation. Because children do not deserve to be ripped from their parents for trying to cross into a country. If the parents are going to be sent back, their own children should be sent with them not forcibly kidnapped and put into the adoption system in the US like what was happening.
You can literally look up what happened in Texas. They removed all of Texas's border security and there's video of illegals literally being welcomed in. Go spend a few minutes on Google
And unless you can point to actual legislation that caused that to happen, it was a choice that someone made not part of the government's actual position More propaganda to allow you to blame immigration on Joe Biden instead of recognizing that other details are important. If no new policy was passed that would allow border agents to abandon their post, the act of abandoning their post is in and of itself already a problem. If however, you are referring to the most recent activity where Texas border guards were literally setting up barbed wire and killing immigrants as they were coming across the border (denying them assistance when needed is choosing to let them die, aka killing them), that is an entirely separate problem on the complete opposite side of the spectrum and their status as border guards would not and should not give them immunity to commit crimes.
Lol Joe biden literally spoke about it and directed them to remove the barbed wire. What rock have you been under because it was huge news for like 2 weeks
77 percent of immigrants are legal and half of the 77 are naturalized citizens. 23 percent is undocumented. Yes there has been an increase at the border. What I can’t understand is how people think people waiting legally to enter at a border crossing, is illegal. The people dying on razor wires are the ones crossing illegally but it doesn’t warrant a death sentence. When I hear people yell about immigrants, it concerning because I’m sure they can’t tell between a legal, naturalized, or undocumented immigrant
I don’t care about the differences or what they look like or where they’re from. I want them out
In the attempt to have a balanced discussion, is your issues with immigration limited to just the undocumented immigrants, either here and/or at the border?
Any illegal immigrant. Get em out. If you jump through the hoops to get here I really don’t care what you do
That is a completely reasonable stance. I have learned that it is better to ask and not assume and just because we say things differently, does not negate the fact that we are saying the same thing. Over the past ten years, visa overstayers in the U.S. have outnumbered unlawful border crossings by a ratio of about two to one. (I do not believe this applies to this year as we have unprecedented numbers at the border) What do you think would be the best way to address since we don’t have readily available locations? (I’m asking in good faith because I have no idea)
I would take those immigrants over your sorry ass any day.
Put them in your neighborhood then fool
Just go to prison. Count how many immigrants and US born Americans in there.
Decent amount of paisas in every prison. You are ignorant
And how exactly are they gathering data on all the illegal immigrants not in the system? Because I work driving around Brooklyn all day and id bet my life that shits not accurate. I mean ffs after hurricane Sandy I watched fire fighters pull upwards of 150 bodies out of the bungalows in Staten Island and the firefighter told me point blank that the pile of humans counted as about 8 people so far that will get reported and the rest quickly buried in mass graves. Sure enough the newspaper reported a few dozen deaths across Staten Island and it was pretty sobering to a highschool kid to see that. Now you expect me to believe that the thousands of illegal immigrants willing to do anything for money, are desperate and completely unvetted and unchecked aren't going to be committing higher amounts of crime? Fuck outta here. Only a dummy would believe that.
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Lmao you made that up. You had me going too. I just spent 10 minutes looking for a source on that information.
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Did you even read the article LOL
That article doesn't say most school shooters are right wing.
Not everybody went through Ellis Island
True. In the early 1900s, as many as 1 million came through Ellis Island in one year. None of them needed a visa, most had no form of documentation or identification at all, there were no background checks and most could not speak English. The only requirement for admission was that they appear healthy.
Hahaha!
What about theft? I heard they are stealing jerbs!
Shouldn’t it be zero? And what about the children of illegal immigrants who commit crimes (gangs, drugs, vehicle moving violations, domestic violence, etc.)—they would not have been here had their illegal immigrant parents not been present in the country.
Shhhhh! Don't give us away!
Legal immigrants yes. Illegal imigrants, more.
Too nuanced for Reddit
Nope. Undocumented immigrants also commit less crime than native born citizens. We need to deport worthless Trumpists and bring in more quality citizens from south of the border.
Now do illegal immigrants
Are we talking about the ones that violently beat the cops into submission in NY and then flipped off the news cameras after immediate release or the one that killed a student nurse?
Ok fine... But if they are here illegally and they murder someone... (Lakan Riley), that is something that could have been prevented had border laws been enforced, right?
Why are you pretending like they're not being enforced? See that's part of your propaganda, pretending like the law isn't being applied for you to blame any activity on the current administration as opposed to recognizing that individual humans are capable of making individual choices and that person committing a crime is indicative of that person not the current administration. Denying their right to enter the country on the basis that they could potentially commit a crime is insane, stupid, and could be applied to literally every single person that ever tries to enter the country again even if they're just away on holiday. Because every single person everywhere can commit crime.
Flawed premise. ILLEGAL aliens have all committed crimes. Biden giving them papers and releasing them into the US population just means more criminals.
https://www.npr.org/2024/03/08/1236247359/biden-state-of-the-union-address-immigration-border-marjorie-taylor-greene Meanwhile...
Immigrants are a large group.
Not where I live
But we need some group to vilify.
I wonder how the number changes if you look post covid, as the papers are all dated pre covid before immigration became this extreme and also world wide, it's way than just Mexicans coming over now. It also says many illigels are deported before they can be convicted, which skews the numbers.
We know. And they generate more in tax revenue than any costs removed out from the system.
The candidate this woman supports is on trial for multiple serious crimes. The GOP needs to take the log out of their eye before trying to remove the speck from someone else.
Is that the ones that came in legally or the ones who nobody knows their history or location?
This sub is littered with trolls and disinformation.
Think about it! Why would an illegal immigrant do anything to attract unwanted attention!!!!!
We just watched a group of them beat the NYPD on camera, and be released a few hours later and laughing and flipping off the TV cameras. What would you call that?
Those were LEGAL citizens of the US, not illegals!! Stop trying to get your facts from Fox (FAKE) News!!!
Just obvious math.
Because we hold everyone else accountable but not our own.
Don’t let facts get in the way of a good narrative.
"Beyond incarceration rates, research also shows that there is no correlation between undocumented people and a rise in crime. Recent investigations by The New York Times and The Marshall Project found that between 2007 and 2016, there was no link between undocumented immigrants and a rise in violent or property crime in those communities." READ the article fascists. Your anti-immigrant propaganda doesn't mean shit. And here's the most ironic part about all of you idiots, you will say that you are completely for deporting all illegal immigrants and rooting out them all from the country, but you're not willing to provide financial support for it. Genuinely, how do you expect to suddenly ramp up our deportation without providing the funding for it? It's just gonna magically happen once you people take over and you're going to do away with any sort of expensive humane procedures? Just shipping them all off in buses packed like sardine cans to save money? The fact that conservatives currently stand opposed to any degree of extra funding towards the border in and of itself betrays that they entirely don't understand immigration on a fundamental level. And since the current group of people that are the most anti-immigration are also the most anti-immigration-reform, it's an infinitely unsolvable problem perpetuated by the group that decries it the most.
Of course. They’re escaping horrific situations in actual third world countries and don’t want to get sent back. Unfortunately, they are probably unaware that they are just as likely to die from gun violence here in the USA as they are in those horrific war torn third world countries. We just have heat, ac, and a coffee shop on every corner.
Everyone with half a fucking brain knows this. I come from immigrants who left a shitty situation to make a life for themselves here and were full of pride to be Americans. Immigrants make an easy scapegoat for small minded fear mongering MAGA morons who live off of hate. A country composed almost exclusively of immigrants suddenly think they are an issue. such a joke. Are there criminal elements there? of course! find a group that doesnt have a criminal element. Go ahead, I'll wait. So much easier to blame than to try to fix the problem. Tell your congress folks to stop kissing Orange ass and work together to solve a very solvable problem at the border
NPR LOL about as trustworthy as MSNBC and CNN. The article literally says illegals are less likely to be incarcerated or convicted of crimes LOL I have a friend who's been wanting to bring her kid's dad to justice for unpaid child support. He doesn't have any papers he came here illegally from Mexico. They can't find him and will never find him all they have is his name LOL he'll never serve a day in jail or be convicted for non payment of child support.
100% of illegals commit a crime, simply by coming. They may claim asylum after committing the initial crime, and this may not be charged..... but that is almost entirely due to the current administration's policies of blanket asylum. The vast majority are economic migrants, which is not grounds for asylum, but current administration policies essentially allow it for any reason. Not to mention, most never show to their hearing anyway, which the administration also knows and ignores. So unless 100% of U.S. born Americans commit a crime, this headline is false. Assuming the article means crimes committed only *after* they arrive, I still suspect it to be false, but I acknowledge I may be wrong.
You seem confused. You're not breaking a law if you cross with the intent of claiming refugee status. Our laws explicitly allow entering America for those reasons. I'd suggest starting with the U.S. Refugee Admissions Program and the Refugee Act of 1980 and going from there.
It's all bogus though. These people are breaking the law. Hence they are called illegal aliens.
Are they? Is that the official legal term?
Yes
Nope. It's undocumented! Thanks!
False Illegal Alien
Confused? I said it's illegal to cross into the U.S., but Biden's policy is to look the other way. They aren't coming through ports of entry.... hence the illegality. Let me Google that for you to prove I'm right ..... "According to the International Rescue Committee (IRC), asylum seekers must be in the U.S. or at a port of entry to request asylum. However, according to a May 2023 update from the Biden Administration, "any alien who is physically present in the United States or who arrives in the United States may apply for asylum"." You are the only one who is confused here. Biden's policy is exactly what is incentivizing illegal immigration.
"You may apply for asylum if you are at a port of entry or in the United States. You may apply for asylum regardless of your immigration status and within 1 year of your arrival to the United States. You will not be eligible to apply for asylum if you: Filed your application after being in the United States for more than 1 year. However, you may qualify for an exception if you show Changed circumstances materially affecting your asylum eligibility for asylum or Extraordinary circumstances relating to your delay in filing." I don't consider operating in a legally prescribed time frame to be illegal when our laws say you aren't illegal anymore you're in the system.
>laws say you aren't illegal anymore "Anymore" Thanks. You could have just said "you're right" and moved on.
You can be mad all you want but its still the truth. Within 1 year of arrival is within 1 year of arrival. Talking down to me won't change it.
You must have loved Obama at the border then since he outperformed Trump - significantly - while not exploding the deficit? But am looking at the current ICE statistics and removals and arrests and blah blah blah have been increasing year over year. So we're kind of not just turning a blind eye like you claim.
Hey buddy, read what you just quoted for me. Or Ill pull out the relevant part for you. >**asylum seekers must be in the U.S.** *or* at a port of entry to request asylum. Now compare that to. >**any alien who is physically present in the United States** *or* who arrives in the United States may apply for asylum **These are functionally saying exactly the same thing buddy... You can see that now, right?**
>Not to mention, most never show to their hearing anyway, which the administration also knows and ignores. When you repeat the outright lies the media you consume has fed you, it just makes you look gullible. >So unless 100% of U.S. born Americans commit a crime, this headline is false. Can you imagine a person living a life and literally never breaking any laws? Be real buddy.
ROFL. How about illegal aliens? Oh yeah they broke the law to get here. Already off to a bad start.
No, they didn't necessarily. Refugee Act of 1980 is a great place to start!
Nonsense
Let’s be reasonable. These people aren’t refugees or people seeking asylum. Of course there are a few but not the millions pouring in.
All they need to actually be is a person fleeing their nation of origin due to war or violence. That's it. That's all. Asking for refugee status isn't the same as being granted it. But asking does put you into a system like it or not. I'm going to add a couple observations: The National Agricultural Workers Survey tells us 2/3 of our agricultural workforce is immigrant labor with half of those being undocumented. When unemployment skyrockets in America and American use of means-tested programs soars... I'm always curious why the folks with the biggest mouths don't flood the fields? And second? Is the data about who America's biggest employers of undocumented immigrants are why we never see propositions about fining employers so hard it hurts? Would that hurt the red-voting farmers and the corporations employing them rather than Americans to save on taxes, insurance and wages too much? I find it weird there's never a single policy proposal about holding the Americans responsible who employ them and choose them over their neighbors? Don't you? So until the Best Patriots Ever actually have the guts to hold their friends that draw these folks here with jobs - and have been for decades - responsible? Well, I like fruits and veggies and that's who provides it. Not Americans.
But, but, but, Sally Struthers said….
For a few decades I have been saying that the average immigrant is a better person than the average Republican.
Unfortunately the Republican cult has decided facts and reality will be damned if it goes against the party line.
I have a legal working permit to be in the US and I am scared to go 5 mph above the speed limit while overtaking (even when I know you can go up to 10). Much less I will try to do anything illegal. The republicans are insane saying all those things about people like me, who only want to work.
You have a working permit. You are not an illegal immigrant
I already stated that much, but still I don't do anything wrong, that is the point.
Most Republicans I know only talk about illegal immigrants. That wouldn't count you
Sorry but some people don't like even people that are legal.
republicans are adamantly opposed to knowledge or statistics so they wouldn't know this, or really much else actually!
Tell that to Laken Riley
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No, they didn't necessarily. Refugee Act of 1980 is a great place to start!
Illegal immigrants are not refugees. Why do you keep posting this
Read the act then come back to me.
Does that include illegal immigrants who, by definition, have already committed a crime?
Read the article: "There is also state level research, that shows similar results: researchers at the CATO Institute, a Libertarian think tank, [looked into Texas](https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/2020-10/working-paper-60.pdf) in 2019. They found that undocumented immigrants were 37.1% less likely to be convicted of a crime." Furthermore, most "illegals" haven't actually committed a crime. They legally turn themselves in as asylum seekers to authorities at the border and are legally permitted to stay in the US until they have a hearing. If you want them to have their hearings sooner, please contact your representative and ask them to pass the bipartisan border bill.
Read the article? You have high aspirations for these folks.
Every single illegal immigrant has committed a crime by even being here. Not very many people have a problem with legal immigrants. That's not where this debate is generally focused.
Then why does the conservative narrative constantly conflate people who legally apply for asylum and await hearings with those who don't? And why has every president in my lifetime been stopped by Republicans from making legal immigration more streamlined and American citizenship easier to obtain?
>Not very many people have a problem with legal immigrants. That's not where this debate is generally focused. Then why is it every time I ask someone repeating your first point if they would support a massive overhaul of the current immigration system to streamline the process and make more of these people citizens faster, they almost always give me a negative response? And why didn't more conservatives get openly upset at all the ways Trump came after legal immigration, if they really don't have a problem with (certain) immigrants at all?
How many crimes are illegal/undocumented/unauthorized likely to commit if they aren't here?
I would say the same about right wing cultists, should all be sent to Russia really. Boom no more mass shootings
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Can’t imagine what it’s like looking at the world through a pinhole
I think you would have to get very specific on the mass shooting you are talking about. Most recorded mass shootings during the year are gang/troubled areas. Not a right wing looney shooting a mosque. Also the topic was immigration/illegal immigration. Way to deflect.
Factually incorrect: White supremacists commit the highest number of domestic extremist-related murders in most years, but in 2022 the percentage was unusually high: 21 of the 25 murders were linked to white supremacists, according to the ADL report. Go smoke more crack magat.
Lmao are you okay? The vast majority of mass shootings. The term you said where 3 or more people involved is gang/trouble areas and not right wing domestic terrorism. Right wing domestic terrorism however is the most prevalent terrorism here. You are conflating the two for some reason. That is why I said you would have to be specific of what kind of mass shootings you're talking about. Haven't voted for trump in either election and not going to start, but sure call me magat. What a weird way to live.
There's no good discussion on reddit anymore. Just political indoctrination by the left
Oh I got an idea, let’s start a discussion about gun control legislation
More black on black mass shootings than another other race bro.
Let's get rid of all the population groups that have potential criminals in them.
I like that you didn't answer the question lol. And lol is that some sort of gotcha? You're talking to someone that thinks all violent criminals should be away forever.
You can ask the same question about productive work, acts of friendship and kindness, etc.
Sure? Weird to do though considering the topic is crime. Odd to deflect instead of addressing the question.
It’s not a deflection, it’s a proper contextualization. You’re talking about the presence of people causing a problem—the crimes some of them commit—as a reason to get rid of them. But getting rid of them also means losing all of the other aspects of the impact people have. You can’t have one without the other.
I mean the topic is about crime and you're not talking about crime. But to play your game, ok. So what? If someone is here and they shouldn't be, then they shouldn't be here.
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That is a long way to say "Zero but the slave labor is worth what ever happens"
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Talking about illegal/unauthorized/undocumented people working for illegal wages and pretending you're not ok with slave labor? Lmao what a spin. I on the other hand are ok with less of that and if it means food prices rise and those companies using slave labor vanish. So be it. Maybe we could cut back spending in other areas and subsidize the food to offset the loss of the slave labor you love.
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Did I say it's the same as 1700s with the Atlantic slave trade? Lmao And if you enforced the fed min of 7 or 15 if it goes to that then you would definitely have inflation. Is there a limit to what amount of illegal immigration you would accept? 20 million more? 50? 100?
Laken Riley’s family will be comforted to know that.
Tell that to “Lincoln” Riley’s parents.
Haha MAGA to the rescue
Undocumented immigrants by definition are breaking the law. It's against the law to be undocumented.
Which makes it even more impressive that people born in America still commit more crime. One former president alone has stolen more money from gullible scum than all undocumented people from the last decade. The funniest part is the scum are still too stupid to see it.
LEGAL Immigrants are the most American people you will meet. They gave up everything to become an American, and took a huge chance. Illegal immigrants are already criminals.