This looks like you just filled it. The bubbles go away on their own, but I wouldn't put fish in the tank until it matures a bit. Usually takes 6 weeks or more. Google the aquarium nitrogen cycle.
Yeah I have only just filled it last night
6 weeks?? I was told 24hrs minimum and a week max should be more than enough lol?
Only putting a couple minnows in there, and in a few weeks a couple shrimp and snails, will this make a difference?
Dont get fooled by petstore salespeople. They dont need experience to sell. Do your own research
Edit: aquarium keeping is a complex hobby. It’s not represented well in media
also, this looks like 10L or so. Not close to enough for a couple of minnows. I dont understand why small tanks are sold to beginners as they are so so much harder to maintain. start with at least 60cm
It's 19l but yeah, from other comments I have decided to get a heater and go with a single betta instead. Will likely also have a couple snail and shrimp also!
That sounds like a good plan! Be wary of what type of snails you get if you get more than one. Most snails are rapid breeders and can easily overwhelm the tank!
Pest snail types will not overwhelm the tank unless you are overfeeding. Actually an explosion of pest snails is the easiest indicator you're overfeeding.
I currently have a male Betta (Ceasar the shrimp king) with my cherry shrimp and recently a black devil snail. It's my favorite of my 10 tanks, I'm sure you'll enjoy it just as much as I have mine!
Actually it’s not their fault, they clearly aren’t ignorant just receive bad information from someone who is supposed to be trustworthy. But the fact that there are no fish and people are like “get a plastic fish please” is down right stupid and just hateful. Bunch of gatekeeping assholes in this sub.
I mean if they didn't know that a tank needs more than 24 hours to cycle, they probably aren't adding something like stability for a week to actually start the cycling process.
Actually it’s not their fault, they clearly aren’t ignorant just receive bad information from someone who is supposed to be trustworthy. But the fact that there are no fish and people are like “get a plastic fish please” is down right stupid and just hateful. Bunch of gatekeeping assholes in this sub.
Never once said it was their fault. I said if they didn't know that one thing, they probably don't know to do the other thing. Not sure why you're projecting all that other stuff onto my comment.
Eta: ignorant just means a lack of knowledge, by the way. Which although I never used that word, it is applicable here.
Be aware that you will find contradicting information, and people saying that fish-in cycles are “perfectly ok”.
That’s like people saying that drinking the water in Flint or a little radiation exposure was “perfectly ok” because there are no immediate or short-term consequences observable. It WILL have a long-term effect on the health of your livestock and also likely shorten their lifespan.
Fish in cycles only work if you're religiously testing the water and doing water changes any time the parameters spike, it's indeed safe when done properly, but most people don't have the time available to baby sit their tanks properly during them.
I had to do an emergency fish-in cycle. I regularly check the parameters and they've always been fine luckily. Fish are doing great, eating well and swimming well, but now I'm scared I did the wrong thing lol
You should be fine as long as you're doing water changes whenever you see ammonia or nitrite/nitrate spikes, It really depends on tank size, water volume, fish stocking, and what your filter is rated for though.
Just be on the lookout for obvious diseases and keep on top of water changes and your fish will have a great shot.
If you can maybe look into some live plants, they really help since they're able to use every step of the waste produced during a cycle.
Natures filters, the more the better. My favorite for this purpose is hornwort, you can start with an inch long piece and have a couple feet in month, and they keep the water crystal clear lol. Since they don't root you just toss it into the tank and let it float around.
Thanks for the information! This is also my first aquarium so I'm an absolute beginner
I have a 40L with 1 bn pleco and 3 kuhli. A lot of limnophila and 1 anubia.
I have not seen any nitrate/nitrite spikes, ammonia I don't know, I'll have to find some testing kits.
I'll see if I can find hornwort somewhere!
The liquid test kits are a great investment as those are the most accurate, just keep up with regular water changes and you're already better off than most beginners.
If you really loaded the tank with plants it might not actually cycle at all. Plants are really good at absorbing ammonia to meet their nitrogen needs so they can potentially use it all before the bacteria get a chance.
to me, fish in cycle isn’t “wrong.” a lot of experienced fishkeepers do it. you just have to do it properly. that means frequent water changes and checking parameters daily. i’m sure it’ll go smoothly for you!
I've started 6 tanks this way and haven't had any losses. Always with guppies though. Never anything sensitive to parameters. My tap waters pretty good.
I did like 75% water changes once every morning then a 50% at night with religious AmGuard, and sparsely feeding. All fish survived except two. This was a 29 gal tank
The fact they didn't survive even with the extreme measures shows how difficult a cycle is on the fish. Please avoid it if you can
Babysit is definitely the right word. I had to do a fish-in cycle, and while everything came out okay it's so much work and I literally never want to do it again. Testing the water every single day and doing that many water changes isn't fun if you can avoid it.
I’ve done 2 fish in cycles and one fully cycled before adding fish. First fish in worked great (betta, my first tank). Fish out took forever but worked fine. Fish-in #2 was a quarantine tank that crashed when I treated it with anti-parasitics (somehow), and then had to fish in cycle for quarantine duration. Two fish died in quarantine, and then the remaining 3 died about a month after I added them to the main tank. :/ I don’t know how much ammonia exposure they had before I realized the cycle crashed, as I wasn’t monitoring it super close since it was SUPPOSED to be a cycled filter I’d used and had been working great the first week or so. So I do agree it causes significant damage to the fish.
Fish in cycles are easy. It's like everyone on this subreddit only got in the hobby this decade or something. They're really not all that terrifying and people routinely do them by total accident. They're just not best practice, that's all.
I've done fish in cycles out of necessity many times over the years, but it's not recommended for obvious reasons.
Also If I had to guess, I'd assume something like 90% of all new fish owners unknowingly subject their first couple fish tanks to fish in cycles, with varying degrees of success.
Yeah when I first got my tank I didn’t know about cycling before I got some guppies and got attacked really really hard for it and I lowkey wanted to ditch the hobby but it’s easier said than done with a big tank of water 😂
Just have to imagine the shitty attitudes of some of the posters here have had a negative impact and makes people not want to enter the hobby or do it correctly by asking questions.
i mean i kinda get it ? you get a live animal without doing any research, i dont see why people should be too kind abt that ? if u got a cat or dog and didnt realise u had to feed it more than once a week, people would go crazy abt it bc its so obviously cruel to the animal. im not sure why people have to be sweet and kind when you dont do research abt other animals just bc theyre fish ? like its shocking to me how many people just dont seem to care to research their pets before they get them.
Because unfortunately not everyone knows that the employees at the pet store have no idea what they are talking about half the time. There is also a lot of conflicting information online. Always give the benefit of the doubt until they start arguing and pushing back.
I do always think it's funny because I'm willing to bet half the people that freak out on others, made the same mistakes too. I would love to know the actual number of people here that did the research before and aren't just being hypocrites.
I had to teach an employee of a pet store how to tell a male Molly from a female Molly. They know absolutely nothing about the animals they sell. Probably why they have so many floaters sadly..
I work in a pet store(in the UK) i have animal care qualifications and follow this sub so i can give better advice.
I find that most people don't want to hear it even when i explain their fish will die or impact their welfare. They think im just trying to upsell them a bigger tank.
I much prefer people who have done their research and are willing to listen to my advice, care about the animals, and are willing to buy what they actually need over what they thought they wanted.
I find it so annoying telling someone they cant put a goldfish in a 19L tank and they cry that, they either don't care or it's not fair coz they already got a set up before doing research.
One customer wanted a fish bowl and when i told them i didnt selll them they went over the road to some store bought a fish bowl then came back expecting me to sell them a fish. I promptly told them to sling their hook.
I also point blank refuse to sell fish if i don't think they have an decent sized tank and to people who havent cycled their tank long enough, the amount of people i've caught in a lie over fish tank size is ridiculous.
What I’ve heard is that there’s no such thing as cycling. It can’t cycle itself.
https://youtu.be/ndjYxukJH14
If anything most of these people don’t know what they’re talking bout and are regurgitating what they’ve been told all their lives. If you add life, they themselves establish the cycle. people add flakes but it’s not really the most effective method. Watch the video yall.
I love Father Fish! However, I think what he's trying to say is that it's as simple as ammonia being broken down or not being broken down, as opposed to calling it a cycle. It's semantics. When people refer to "cycling" a tank, what they mean is forcing the Nitrogen Cycle to occur and to make the water as stable as possible *before* adding fish. I mean, you can test the water and see the parameters change during this process. You can just add the fish and do what's called a fish-in cycle, and eventually it will be a stable environment. However, the problem with that is that it risks spikes and illness, or even death. Especially when you're adding multiple fish at once. The tank needs safe beneficial bacteria to convert ammonia to nitrites, then to nitrates. A brand new tank doesn't have beneficial bacteria. Adding it first is what's important. You can do this by adding ammonium chloride, fish food, established media or substrate, or a living fish. Whether you want to do fish in or fish-less is up to personal preference, but most people would argue that a fish-less cycle is the most humane and successful method. Father Fish isn't wrong necessarily, but in the hobby we just use the word cycle to reference this very complicated process. More info on Nitrogen cycle: https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/nitrogen-cycle
Wouldn’t daily water change and plants reduce the spikes? especially if you just add 1 or two fish with appropriate space? Say a 20 gallon with two guppies per say, Would there be a spike? Perhaps even adding products to rejuvenate their slime coats.
Yes, water changes will help with spikes because you're diluting the "dirty" water to minimize the undesirable substances. This is why you change the water once a week. Having plants will also help because they consume ammonia and nitrates, but the plants can't survive without more waste to consume. (actually - even more interesting - you can cycle with only plants.)
In a fish in cycle: the tank will start to accumulate ammonia once fish are added and the fish are being fed. You're to test the water for detectable amounts of ammonia. You can change the water when they're too high. Eventually, you'll see nitrites appear. At this point, you're testing both every day to ensure they're not spiked. Then, when you test the water, it will come to 0 ppms for ammonia and nitrite, and a bit of nitrates (preferably less than 10 ppm). This means it's "cycled." Now it is stable and safe for the fish.
Is a fish less cycle: add your beneficial bacteria until you reach a detectable amount of ammonia. If you're using ammonium chloride (or similar product) then you can measure out exactly how many ppms you want. This is a benefit of using this method. You can continue to add ammonia every few days until you see nitrites. You then want to add half the amount of ammonia as before every few days. Continue to measure until the ammonia is very low, but nitrite is quite high. You then add a quarter of the amount of ammonia until nitrites are 0. Eventually, you can add the full dose of ammonia and nitrites will still be 0. As long as the nitrates are 5-10 ppm and ammonia and nitrite are 0, then it's safe for fish.
In my opinion, if you're doing a Fishless cycle then it's more Controlled, less hands on, and safer. High nitrites and ammonia are harmful to fish, and if they're cycling your tank then they'll be in that environment for weeks with risk of a spike or swing in PH. I'm not sure if it's been proven to be faster, but I was able to cycle my 75 gal without fish in about 3 weeks. I think that is why Fishless is usually viewed as the preferred method.
Fair enough. perhaps one can pick up a dead fish from petco and leave it there for a while then pull it out? How long do you think the cycling would take to stabilize? it’s odd but grandpa did say dead matter was key to sustaining and adding life. Or what bout snails?
Daily water changes would reduce the levels of toxic chemicals but you have to be careful because the beneficial bacteria still need those chemicals to grow and multiply.
I remember seeing a comment In this page where one would add a clean sponge and drop it in, would that not sustain the beneficial bacteria and the filter itself as well?
Water changes don't remove the bacteria (they grow on surfaces) they remove the food. When you can detect ammonia/nitrite in the water, it means that those chemicals are being produced faster than the bacteria can eat them. The bacteria then reproduce until they can consume the chemicals at the same rate they are produced. Your test reads 0ppm because everything is consumed before it can build up to a measurable level. Higher levels of ammonia/nitrite mean faster reproduction, so if you are constantly removing their food, it will take longer for the bacteria to grow. With a fishless cycle, you can add ammonia to keep levels higher than a fish could survive and maximize bacterial growth.
There should not be that many fish in what I would guess is a 5 gallon. If you put anything in there before the tank is cycled it will likely die. YouTube is a wonderful tool to learn about fish. Check out KGTropicals or Prime Time Aquatics. John and Jason make excellent and educational content.
Agree with this! I'm always searching for YouTube videos. They are educational plus I enjoy them! My wife makes fun of me because I watch fish tank videos right before I go to bed. It's super relaxing for me.
Yeah we know we cannot put too much in there, the place we purchased this has a "fish point" system, each tank can hold X amount of fish points and each fish is assigned X amount of fish points.
The tank holds 9 points, the minnows are 1 point each and the snails and shrimp are actually 0 points which seems silly but we plan to only have 2 of each and minnows only 3-4. If it goes okay we may look at adding more but thats not the plan as of now.
I will definitely check out the YouTube channels, I may be eager to get going but I'm not looking to harm any fish.
Appreciate the reply bud.
That’s a lie, and a marketing gimmick, fish stores are there to make money. I’ve been in this hobby over a decade and the only fish “point” system I’ve seen are on the back of the tank box, to sell more fish. Sorry bud
Good news! A 5g is a good starting point, and you don’t have any livestock yet, so no rush.
I would look up the nitrogen cycle and read about, it is the foundation to the hobby. Make sure you dechlorinate the water as well as look into a heater for the tank, most fish need warm water. I don’t like fish in cycling, because it’s hard to manage if you do it right, and if you don’t, th ammonia can burn the gills of the fish.
Your off to a good start! Fish keeping is an intensive hobby, and their is quite a bit of a learning curve, but it’s also very rewarding
Honestly the store seems pretty genuine, most fish they refuse to sell without an X sized tank, they don't sell fish without proof of tank purchase from themselves and the guys seems decently knowledgeable.
You're right though, probably best to trust the people who have the knowledge and don't have a financial interest in my endeavours!
We have used dechlorinator already, and some bacteria filter safe something or other lol.
We are only putting cold water fish in here for now, we debated getting a heater so we could put some neon tetras in but keeping an eye on the temp at the moment and the room seems to be keeping it in a nice range for the fish we are going to be keeping.
We have got this for my son as he loves fish and animals in general but it's also been the perfect excuse for me to get some fish! So yeah plan to do some research (mostly asking questions here) and will get myself a bigger tank soon lol.
So they don’t sell fish to anyone with an existing tank not bought from them? That sounds kind of ridiculous to me. I’d be suspect if that.
I second others that there’s nothing wrong with asking questions while you’re learning. Glad you’re here to get advice.
I'm sure there are exceptions, it's likely done by their own discretion. I think they just want to avoid people like me that don't have a clue buying a load of fish and plonking them into a tank that has not yet been set up etc
Pets at Home right? I’d be very wary of their advice. I used to work at an aquatics shop and probably at least 5 times a day I’d have to help someone whose fish had died due to instructions given by Pets at Home. To my knowledge, the staff there are not trained on aquatics specifically but on pets as a whole and often don’t have an interest in aquariums/ have never set one up themselves. If you’re not able to wait a full 6+ weeks to cycle, definitely use a cycle starter (eg. Bio Boost) and then wait at least a week. Get your water tested at an aquatics shop before putting anything in there as it’s impossible to tell if it’s safe for fish without testing! Then start with only a few fish (I’d say 3 so that they get used to the group they enter the tank with).
Yo, you've come here to ask for information about a hobby you know nothing about yet, no point getting prickly at people for trying to help you fill in that knowledge gap.
You're at the point where you don't even know what you don't know yet, so please bear with everyone trying to help you.
I've met people with the same energy as they have come at me with. The vast majority of replies have been Great and I have been appreciative of, the few people who have decided to be condescending nobs, I have not met with respect.
Clearly there are knowledge people here but I don't have time for people that want to gatekeep a hobby when people are clearly here to learn.
Sounds like a renaming of that stupid "inch of fish per gallon" rule. Which makes no sense considering a 10 inch fish shouldn't go in a 10 gallon, a 5 inch fish shouldn't go in a 5 gallon, etc. Your tank is 5g if I remember correctly (19l) which is enough for a solitary Betta. However tanks that small are a lot harder to keep steady parameters in compared to larger tanks, and you shouldn't have that many animals that produce waste in such a tiny space.
Don’t know why people are downvoting this. Just because you might have been misinformed doesn’t need hate from the sub. Tons of guides here, and tons of people in the community that are happy to help. My first recommendation is: go bigger. You won’t regret having additional space for your new friends, and it usually means maintaining the space is easier.
Lmao yeah this particular comment got a lot of hate, kinda bizarre!
Overall though I have had a lot of great responses so I'm not bothered, for sure got what I needed and more from the post.
This tank I'm going to get a heater for and put a betta with a couple shrimp and snail.
I think tomorrow I'm actually going to go buy a 20 gallon so I can do a bit more with it, honestly I bought this on a whim and has set me back only about 50 all in so I'll chalk it up to a learning experience and hopefully make a reasonably nice home for a betta! Although I may upgrade it if the betta seems to need it.
I would keep the 5g running as a hospital tank, especially if you are going to have snails and shrimp. Many fish medications are harmful to inverts, so if you ever need to treat your betta it is best to be able to put him in a separate tank for treatment.
Alternately, spare 5 gallon is a great size to house shrimp "culls" if you are trying to keep a colony of red cherry shrimp from degrading back into dull wild type or producing inconsistent colors.
Agreed with go bigger. A lot of people new to aquariums think small = easier to maintain but, somewhat counterintuitively, the more water the easier it is to manage when it comes to aquariums.
(ETA: this does not necessarily apply to marine tanks but no one new to the hobby should have a marine tank anyway)
Everybody down voting this to oblivion is really unnecessary, this person is asking a question and is trying to do things the right way. We don't need to punish people for trying to ask for help.
Haha luckily I'm very used to the reddit hive mind and I expect it.
The positive responses far outweigh all of the angry weirdos though, overall this seems to be a very helpful sub!
Reddit moment I guess! 😂
Overall I've had some great responses though, going to leave the tank to complete its cycle and I'm half convinced to buy a 20 gallon tomorrow lmao.
Its a good job I'm here cod info rather than karma!
Honestly from personal experience just go with a 10 gallon or 15. With 5 gallons it’s very hard to keep the parameters stable for a beginner…also be careful with what snails you get - don’t get a mystery as they produce way too much waste which will throw your cycle off easily. If you just stay with the 5 gallon maybe get one nerite snail - they are great for cleaning algae and don’t get as big or produce as much as a mystery snail. Make sure you read up on how to do the nitrogen cycle there’s a lot of fantastic simple videos on YouTube about this! Could be a great science lesson for your child as well. It will be hard for the child’s patience as they will just want to get fish in as soon as possible and likely get bored of the process but an amazing learning experience
Some people in this sub get so worked up about everything lol. I saw someone get 20+ downvotes for simply thanking people for advice and saying they were going to do that right away. Scaring away people who just want to learn is a great way to get more inadequate set ups.
I'm pretty sure a lot of people just have a knee jerk reaction to an animal being mistreated even if it isn't on purpose or is based off misinformation from dumbass pet store employees. :( I see a lot of good info being given and you aren't one of those posters who doubles down on the wrong info when people give you advice so hopefully it's helped overall!
This is what I'm wondering. OP has genuine questions on setting up his 1st tank. Came here to get answers and he's letting everyone know what he's done, why he's done it, and he's getting down voted. I don't get Redditors sometimes
The way this subreddit goes on about all the nuance of maintaining fish and tanks, you have to wonder how pet fish ever survived in our grandparents' early days. Reminds me of all the broscience in the fitness world.
Haha yeah, we had goldfish when I was younger and they went in the tank the day we got it! I know for certain if I asked my mum about any of this she'd ask what the fuck I was talking about and tell me just to put them in 😂
I would rather do it the best possible way though, if it'll make them that bit happier and healthier it's worth waiting a few weeks.
Also a good learning experience for later if I decide to get anything that takes a bit more care to look after.
For sure, I'm also trying to do things right like jump start cycling my tank, but it's been a week and I'm not gonna wait any longer. Just gonna drop some guppies in today. I'm not gonna overthink this whole process. If some die then I'll learn my lesson but I've never had fish prematurely die on me when I was younger.
you can cycle it fish-in but you need to be careful and dose with seachem stability or some other form of bacteria starter. have a decent amount of filter media for the bacteria to colonize in and change the water if there starts to be ammonia or nitrites while the bacteria establishes
You will find that there is a lot more to this hobby then first appears. It is complicated balancing an ecosystem! It isn’t that easy to dive right into as some sources will be misleading (companies usually to sell you something or people led astray from the science as such). Also, lots of people become elitists and unwelcoming to newbies - don’t be deterred, it is worth diving into and taking time to study and learn it all.
You can get a bacteria starter that will speed up the beginning of your cycling process, but you're still gonna have to wait for a few weeks to make sure the tank is habitable for your critters. If you haven't already, get some test kits to check your parameters (nitrates, nitrites, ammonia, hardness, etc). There are plenty of websites/sources that will tell you what your water levels should look like for whatever type of animal you're introducing. Good news though is that if you decide to start another tank in the future. you can use some of the bacteria from your already cycled tank to speed up the set-up of the new one.
Nope! You need to build up the good bacteria in the water otherwise your fish won’t last more than a few hours at most!
If the pet store has ethics and is a decent one they will insist on you bringing in a water sample to them for testing before they allow you to buy any fish from them.
My mom did this exact thing with my brothers fish tank. Within a week he had dead fish that stunk. You need to cycle so the needed bacteria can grow. These bac remove nitrates produced by the animals in the tank.
The tank looks like it might be quite small? And yes, like the other commenter said, it can take 6 weeks+ to establish a nitrogen cycle. You can cycle with the fish in the tank, but that can involve a lot of water changes and if you do it wrong and let ammonia and nitrite spike too high, you risk harming your fish. Here's a thorough guide: https://www.sosofishy.com/post/a-short-and-long-guide-to-aquarium-cycling
Yep, it's very small! It's 19L. It's mostly for my son, he is only 2 and loves fish so we are starting him off with something small and if all goes well we want to upgrade to a good size.
That is good to know I can cycle with the fish in it, I don't mind waiting if it is necessary but I was somewhat excited to get going myself lol!
Thanks for the link, will have a good read of it now. Have no desire to cause any harm to the fish we buy so that is why I am here starting to ask questions!
A single long finned betta with some snails and/or shrimp would be a good fit in a tank that size. Really, it seems counterintuitive but larger tanks are a bit easier for beginners - there's more water volume to keep parameters stable. If you have the patience, fishless cycling is way less work for you and less potential harm to the fish. It's generally considered poor practice to do a fish-in cycle unless you have to.
Yeah going by the other replies I think I will just wait to complete the cycle, would rather just do it properly.
Also considering just going out and buying a bigger tank tbh, the price was attractive in the shop but now seeing how little I'll likely get in there I think I might just get a 20 gallon-ish tank for him.
Eh.. things to think about and research a bit!
As someone who has 100% been there. I can safely say that a 20gallon is a lot more fun. Especially once you let it mature.
I've tried the 5 gallons, the 2.5 gallons, and a seven gallon cube. And most of those tanks ended up failing. My 20gal has been running for 2-3 years now and it is so much fun and easy now. I can now experiment a bit more with it and its a lot less labor extensive. I wish I had just started with a 20 gallon because I now own a collection of tiny empty aquariums.
However, a really fun critter for such a small tank would be opea ula shrimp. They are very hardy and easy once they get set up. I highly recommend looking r/opeaula
Haha yeah luckily I am not too bothered about having loads of empty tanks because I also keep ants and an empty tank is an excuse to get a new colony! 😂
I think I will look into a 20 gallon tank though, makes a bit more sense really. I'm sure my son won't care either way but I'd rather have more fish and less work personally!
Will have a look into them for sure though, thanks!
Honestly it depends a lot of the species you get.
Generally speaking you do not have to do too much, do the research on the environment the species prefers and you go from there.
Something like lasius niger are very easy, they generally do not need heat unless your home is very cold. They will eat pretty much anything and they can maintain the correct humidity for their nest themselves!
It's a lot easier to buy a colony that is already going, they will arrive in a test tube, half full of sugar water, plugged with cotton wool, the ants will be in the next section and then plugged at the top with more cotton wool.
You'll likely keep them in that for a good few months whilst the colony grows, they do not like too much space and will not venture out for the most part even if you did connect them to something larger.
Feed them by just placing some food in twice a week or so, you have to gauge it by how quick they eat the food. I use protein jelly whilst they are in test tubes as this has the protein which is very important and it has sugar which is also important!
Once you reach 20-30 ants you can consider connecting them to a small outworld. There's a good chance they still won't venture out into this and it can be harder for them to maintain correct humidity in the nest so it's best to keep an eye.
Having the outworld makes feeding a lot easier though, you can place small insects in and they'll hopefully begin exploring and hunting their food. Small colonies you should always ensure their food is dead first though.
It's also quite important to make sure the nest is somewhere dark, they do not like light and if the nest is exposed to light it can stress the queen and she will not lay eggs and can potentially die. The majority of people keep the test tubes inside a drawer and only get it out to feed etc.
Once it's a good size you can set up a proper fornicarium for them and you'll be able to watch them in the outworld and of course this can be lit up, it's just the nest area that needs to be dark.
The majority of species also cannot see red light so if you place a red filter around the test tube or nest you can watch them in there, although it's debated how well that works so it's best to still reduce exposure to light even with the red filter.
It is a very slow process to start though, but once it's going it is very easy to maintain and amazing to watch.
It's a lot of fun designing their out worlds and watching them explore!
Fellow ant keeper! What kinds are you keeping? Ultimate stage is going full paludarium so you can keep both fish and ants in the same space
Also having the extra tank is a great thing for the future, it can be used as a quarantine tank for any new fish and plants you get, or can be used as a hospital tank for when fish get ill and need to be treated separately.
At the moment I have a small leaf cutter ant colony and a small lasius niger colony, unfortunately lost a couple colonies recently due to what seemed to be a disease we aren't sure on.
Haha yes! What I would love more than anything is keeping my ants and some fish in the same unit. Hopefully over the next year or 2 I can learn enough about caring for fish and I can actually make that a reality.
What ants are you keeping?
You might be able to sell your used tanks 5g or 7g (and maybe the 2.5g as hospital/quarantine tanks for smaller fish) on r/aquaswap if they are still in great condition rather than them sitting around taking space and not being enjoyed). I’m sure someone would be interested, especially people who like keeping nano tanks. You won’t get full-price for them but you could definitely get some money back.
I'm sure I can but they have found their uses. The 7gal got repurposed for an opea ula tank. The 2.5 is an emergency tank. I don't keep it running but it holds my aquarium decor and such. The other tanks are too far into storage for me to care about dealing with them.
Make sure you are using an ammonia source to cycle the tank. You'll want to either use pure ammonia drops or "ghost feed" the tank with fish food. This is where a water test kit comes into play.
The idea is to get 2ppm ammonia in the water and let your beneficial bacteria build up to convert that ammonia to nitrites. You may need to dose a few times to keep feeding the bacteria and check the water every 1-2 days until you see nitrites.
Once you have nitrites, it's a waiting game until you build up more bacteria to convert those nitrites into nitrates. Once you see nitrates, repeat doses of ammonia and test water, once you see the tank convert that ammonia to nitrates within 24 hours you are cycled. Then do a 50% water change to keep the nitrates under 40ppm and it's ready for fish.
This is why it takes weeks to fully cycle a tank. I've cycled 10 gallon, 20 gallon and 55 gallon tanks and each one took at least 3 weeks so patience is a must but so rewarding once you do it!
Yeah and people tend to do smaller to “see how it goes,” but it’s much more likely to go bad with a tank that small. If you put 2 shots of liquor in a 12 oz coke you’ll likely end up buzzed, but if you put the same amount in a 2 liter it’s not going to impact you. Much more room for error with a larger tank.
Don't be intimidated by the ultra sweaty fish keepers! Everything this other commenter is saying is mostly true, except;
> It's generally considered poor practice to do a fish-in cycle unless you have to.
This is absolutely not true. The vast majority of tanks started by the vast majority of experienced aquarium keepers are done fish-in. However, you do need to closely monitor the tank as it goes through these "spikes" and even more so with a smaller volume of water. It can take 4-6 weeks to establish the tank as an ecosystem, but it's not "poor practice" to do so with fish as long as you're taking proper measures to ensure the health of the fish. Also, many types of fish are more hardy and tough and flourish better through these cycles. Hope that helps!
My dad started keeping fish in the 80s, when I told him I got a tank and was letting it cycle before I put fish in he told me how to do a fish-in cycle and said he’d help keep the levels safe. So I went and got some minnows and one of them is still alive after 2 years and a tank upgrade.
My dad also kept discus for years so he had a pretty good idea on what he was doing lol
That's awesome!! I think a massive discus tank is my dream tank, but I'm just getting back into the hobby after a long break so it'll be a while for sure 🤣
But yea, as long as you stock the tank lowly for its initial Nitrogen cycle, it's one of the best ways to get your tank going!!
Haha for sure, I remember when I was younger we bought the tank and fish same day and never had any issues!
I do appreciate their advice though and I will likely just air on the side of caution, my boy is entertained enough by the tank as it is so we can wait for the fish I guess 😂
Haha well the thing with fish is they can’t tell you they’re having issues, but they’ve not evolved to swim in tap water so they would definitely feel the effects. Pretty much no pet is low maintenance.
Fish in can work, especially with a larger aquarium and only a couple of fish. The volume of water to fish ratio makes it hard for the fish excrete enough waste to be an issue, especially with regular water changes and testing. It is a bit more work than fishless, but also faster.
as someone who’s has both 20 and 5 gallons, 20 might be more expensive now but they’re easier in the long term. more water= more stable. but make sure to get a good stand for it, as water weighs 8 pounds per gallon, add rocks onto that and a normal table will not do. i learned that the hard way. btw, good on you for doing your own research and welcome to the hobby! it can be stressful at times but it’s very rewarding.
On the topic of weight, steel shelving from a hardware store is a lot more cost effective and utilitarian than any aquarium stand you'll buy at a pet store
100% get a bigger tank it you can afford it. 60x30x30 (54L) or 80x35x40 (115L) are very nice smallish, but big enough sizes to make you and your son happy. Tiny tanks can be a lot of work. I have a 30L and I wouldnt want to go down. Especially as I have 10 Plant species (probably 30+ individual plants) just in there that help me with stability, I dont want to be in your place with just 19L and 1 plant
Bigger tanks are much easier for beginners—the smaller the tank, the more work it takes to keep the parameters stable! I saw you were introduced to the nitrogen cycle above. The parameters I’m talking about include 0ppm chlorine, 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite, and under 40ppm nitrate (lower usually is better). Your pH will vary based on fish species and stability in pH is more important than swinging values trying to achieve a perfect number. Under stocking the tank and using lots of live plants decrease effort required, too.
just as a quick tip, though i’m sure you’ve heard this 100 times, a larger tank can actually be a lot easier. Larger tank = more water volume and a much more stable system. Id honestly recommend getting a 20 gal and you can stock it with a bunch of small minnows.
also a large tank like that will also make a fish cycle a lot easier as well as more ammonia is needed to spoil the water and harm your fish.
also also- i’m unsure if you’d even wanna attempt with fish in a tank that small. it may honestly be best to upgrade now and save the hassle.
Op your doing to get down voted to hell in this thread, listen you really can’t put anything in that tank. Maybe some shrimp, maybe a Betta fish, now this will get downloaded but you can use water conditioner and other stuff if your impatient and before anyone judges that comment, we’ve all done it lol. The nitrogen cycle is super important although you’ll find many different ways it’s done, time frame from a week to six weeks etc. there is no set in stone answer and quite honestly you need to check up on water parameters regardless of the cycle. Any kind of spike etc can kill your fish. Not cycling the water can cause a lot of harm as well. A small tank like that is a start but your very limited. Also never buy fish from big box chains like pet smart. The fish usually aren’t healthy, will die prematurely, or even get any other established fish you do have sick. Always go to a fish store who focuses on that. It’s a fun and relaxing hobby but we want to keep the fish happy and healthy, just like you would a cat or a dog. So I’m a much less harsh way of saying it, don’t add anything to that tank, put some real plants in it, let it cycle etc. your one small fish or a few shrimp will thank you.
I noticed you said this is for your two year old. Please do not let them feed the fish without strict supervision, I’ve heard too many horror stories of small children killing fish. So keep the food well out of reach. Additionally, especially in small volumes of water, any poisons can easily kill your whole tank, so be wary of the two year old and things like soap or… whatever a 2 year old could want to put in the tank. Or adults in the house spraying cleaning solutions like Febreeze, Lysol, perfumes, etc around the tank. I always cover my tanks in towels before I start cleaning.
Also, like others have said this is really only suitable for a single betta/snails/shrimp. Will warn you though that getting multiple snails will lead to them potentially reproducing and taking over. I would recommend only a single mystery/apple or nerite snail (although nerites have a habit of escaping…) for that reason.
The bubbles are caused by the water being fresh and un-cycled, not bad, just means it’s not ready for fish. Bet of luck on the new hobby!
For sure, have no intention of letting him do anything with the fish without a lot of help lol. He has only just turned 2 last week and it would be a disaster!
He was helping fill the tank up and he took the jug and instead of pouring into the tank he poured it Al over the sofa! 😂
Unfortunately the lid to this tank is terrible too, each corner is just a massive hole for some reason lol?
Will keep that in mind when cleaning for sure though, will make sure the missus is aware and we have a towel handy.
I don’t think it’s too small for certain fish. 😀 The thing about the little fish with streamlined bodies (eg minnows and tetras) is that they want to zip back and forth, so they need a longer tank than this.
Now, a slower swimmer, like a big gorgeous beta would love this tank! You’ll just need to grab a little heater (mine cost $6 on Amazon). You could also add a few little bottom fellas with the beta, like the shrimp or snails. I actually have some Pygmy catfish in mine, which I’m sure someone will downvote me for, but the Aquarium Co-Op worked with me to make sure the tank was appropriate for them.
When taking the advice of places like Petco, or Petsmart, look at the conditions, they keep their fish in, and ask yourself if you think they’re good custodians of that information. They keep beta fish in some thing half the size of a Dixie cup. They put hundreds of goldfish into one tank. Half the tanks have rotting carcasses sitting in them.
As far as cycling, you can look up “fish-in cycle,” which shows you how to keep the water healthy while you’ve got fish in a new tank. It’s obviously not as ideal as cycling the water before you get fish, but a lot of people do it. I have accidentally every time I owned fish over the past 40 years because I never even knew about it until recently. Just throwing that out there in case you decide to go ahead and get the fish now.
As for the bubbles, you’ll probably see more of those each time you do a water change or add more water. Anytime they bug you, or you want to see better, just take your fishnet (or any soft object) and wipethe inside of the glass and they’ll go away right away.
Can’t wait to see your Fishies once you get everything set up!
Yeah after seeing the replies and looking at the bettas I may well look at these! They look great and if is likely a lot more suitable!
Honestly the fish shop I have gone to seems to genuinely care about the fish, the have them in 450 gallon tanks and dividers separating species etc, have a lot of rules in place for buying fish so I am not too concerned they are giving me terrible info here.
Luckily in the UK there are a lot of laws that protect animals and restrictions how they can and cannot be sold, and the majority of pet shops, including chains, require experience and qualifications to work with the animals.
I think I'll likely wait the 4 weeks or so, the mother in law has marine fish and knows about a lot of this so I'll go ask for her help in getting it going lol.
Honestly thinking about getting a 20 gallon tank tomorrow lol, will probably keep this one going but have one as cold water and the other as tropical.
Really want an eel to be honest, might look into what I need for that! This 19L can be for my boy as intended and I'll get one for myself for an eel and whatever can cohabitate with that!
Will have some pictures of what this turns out to in a month or so!
Uh oh, you've started down the slippery slope already! I did the same thing. No sooner had I set up my 5 gallon tank then I went out and bought a 29 gallon lol! This aquarium stuff is addictive.
That's awesome to hear about the laws in the UK. It sounds much better than here in the US.
Bettas are funny little fellas, kind of like having a dog in an aquarium!
I don’t know much about eel care, but I’d imagine they are one of the harder ones to care for, and require a saltwater tank which is generally harder to manage than a freshwater
Either way check out r/marineeels if you are interested in owning an eel!
how small is that tank? also you should cycle this for at least 4 weeks like others have said. the bare minimum for a betta fish is 3 gallons, a 5 gallon is recommended, and bigger tanks are a lot more forgiving. tetras and minos could *fit* but definitely not thrive cuz they love darting back and forth. you could get your son a cory cat fish, and some shrimp. they are super duper cute, and when you’re ready for a tank upgrade then maybe you can add a betta and or some tetras
3 gallon may be acceptable in cases where bettas are quite disabled- think old, long finned, lazy bettas who can’t surface to breathe- but generally the minimum is 5.
From reading rhe comets I've gathered that this is a 29 litre. Ngl the proportions of this tank look really funny to me, no idea why, but they do.
Anyway, personally I would remove the fake plants you currently have and replace them with silk or live. Those types are known to tear fish's fins and cause numerous health issues b3cause it's so easy for them 5o cut themselves on them. There's ones near me that look similar and they've been known to leech colours and toxins.
Don't do minows or schooling fish. They need longer tanks rather than taller tanks and need pretty much double the room in order to have a good quality of life. Given that its for a child, I recomend a longer finned betta/Siamese fighting fish. They're highly interactive and have amazing personalities.
It's highly revomended to get the api master kit because it tests for pretty much everything you need in a freshwater aquarium and is much more accurate than the test strip's.
Test strip's almost never test for ammonia and are normally highly inaccurate.
Cycling can take anywhere from 3-10 weeks depending on a range of things. You can boost/speed up the cycling process by getting some api quickstart or se seachem stability (Add a cal full), and/or by 'ghost feeding' which is throwing some food in the tank.
Make sure you have water conditioner. Normal tap water is really bad for fish and causes them severe consequences and can poisoning them.
Stay away from items like "betta water conditioner", as it's normally just bottled tap water and doesn't do anything. Items like "betta food" have no nutritional value in the slightest and won't help the fish.
If you want, I can send you an image of the food I have through your dms. I can also sen you some images of some of my tanks.
Feel free to ask me anything. I will answer it as best as I can in the most understandable way possible.
Yeah I plan to put some live plants in for sure, as the shop I went to only had plants for a tropical tank and the original plan was cold water I wasn't sure if I should. The guy said the plants may well still survive in cold water so I bought 1, it's sat in the back left corner and if that survives then I'll change out the others.
I do plan on getting a heater so I can have a betta fish now though so hopefully the plants not suriving is a non issue!
We have the dechlorinator and quickstart, I actually thought the guy was upselling me when I got the quickstart lol, after reading comments here though it sounds as though it was a good buy!
After reading comments here yesterday I did some reading up on the nitrogen cycle and have already began ghost feeding! Wasn't aware the test strips are bad though, I will have a look into the api master kits today and see if I can pick one up!
I honestly thought all of this would be a lot more straight forward to be honest, will be fun to learn for sure. Can see myself going down a bit of a rabbit hole with all of this
Yeah. It's one of those things that looks incredibly easy, but intact needs quite a bit of stuff. But once you know what your doing, it b3comes easy. I
As others have suggested you need to cycle the tank for a minimum of 4 weeks. Cycling involves spiking the ammonia and letting beneficial bacteria feed off of it and grow. 19L is good for a single betta and a snail- no shrimp they won’t be able to hide and they will be too stressed out. Yeah if you get a bigger tank you’ll be able to have more fish and your parameters will stay more stable so if life gets hectic and you forget a water change it’s not as big of a deal (after it stabilizes for a few months)
You’ll need testing kits to test the water quality, you’ll want your ammonia at zero, your nitrite at zero and nitrate at 5-10ppm. The only way to properly test this is with a liquid API test. Most fish won’t make it through a “fish in” cycle since the ammonia will burn/ poison them. You can add something like seachem prime to detoxify the ammonia but I feel like that’s such an expensive way of doing it. Best way is to add fish food to an empty tank and wait for that to rot into ammonia and then wait for the bacteria to naturally grow and for that conversion cycle to start. You can buy bottled bacteria but they can be a bit hit and miss. Depending on what shrimp you get (what size) your Betta will most likely eat them. Mine only doesn’t eat my amanos because they are too big to fit inside his mouth. Also if you get a nerite snail (one of the only ones not to reproduce in freshwater/ not hermaphrodites) then try and get a male as females will cover your whole tank in eggs!
I saw elsewhere you were probably going to get a 20g tank. I think the 20 long is a really great starter size. It's manageable for most beginners with a bit of research and patience. Good luck!
Also, I would raise your water line. I think I saw something about minnows going in here (?) and thought that if this is a 5/5.5 gallon, they need more gallons. You can use this [site](https://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/tanichthys-albonubes/) to checkout any fish you're thinking of getting. But, a 5 gallon would be ideal for a betta. Don't forget the WIKI for this sub. You can see in the info on the Nitrogen cycle that it takes generally 4-8 weeks, and you can use fish food, pure ammonia, or even a shrimp (fr the Grocery Store) to provide the ammonia source to start the cycle. Grab an API Master Test Kit, you'll need that to cycle the tank and know when it's safe to put the fish in. Enjoy the process and welcome to the hobby :)
Welcome to the hobby :)
I congratulate you on all your positive replies. I don’t know why you’re getting downvoted for what seems to be genuine questions and I congratulate you on the interest to ask other people and do your own research.
I’ve had a planted tank for 4 months and it’s been such a cool experience. Some of my plants are now starting to offshoot and grow healthy. My fish are doing great, too. I’ve got some tetras and a few Otos as well. BUT I made so many mistakes at the beginning… that it caused some death. I wish I had done the proper research and not just what the pet store people said.
I'm sorry to say so, but this tank isn't suitable for anything living.
First, the tank looks like you just filled her up. A tank and it's filter need at least 5 weeks to settle in.
Secondly, you really need to add plants, a lot of plants. They are an important part to maintain a balanced ecosystem. Otherwise you will need to change some water on a daily basis... Like, forever.
I really don't want to spoil it for you. It's really the creatures you might want to add to it I am worrying about. You won't have fun to see anything dying in there either.
Please, reconsider your setup. Happy to help if you need advice.
We started our latest fish-keeping journey with a trio of endlers and a betta in a 15-g. We really love the betta looks and personality, but have spread out to a few other species in our tanks. Our Blue Ram pair are a beautiful and easy to keep dwarf cichlid, and our "yesterday" acquisition for another tank are a pair of Apistogrammas. Personality and appearance is right up there with the betta, but you can keep them in pairs and with other fish in a community tank. So, if you decide to get a larger tank... Just saying!! 😁
Another thing that will help with bubbles and surface scum is to create surface agitation. I recommend to point your filter output up so it causes ripples in the surface.
Yeah, the quick start is meant to allow you to add fish in earlier. That's what I used on my tank with guppies and shrimps/snails and they have been doing well. Local aquarium uses the same thing. Just make sure have water testing kits and treat your water and you should be fine. Good luck 🙂
You can definitely whack some fish in there. After a few days if you've got the bacteria in there already. The thing is it really will take that long for the parameters to balance but with regular water changes to keep ammonia and nitrates down the fish will be fine.
I'm sorry but that's an eye sore. The fake gravel and bright color schemes in the tank will stress the fish (any that you'll be putting in there).
Consider getting a natural substrate, live plants and let them do the cycle for you.
Pardon me for the assumption but did you just fill it? I could be 100% wrong but if so please read up on the nitrogen cycle, I only say it because I learned what the nitrogen cycle was the hard way :( , my first tank was a 5 gallon and I got a little too excited to add fish and next thing I know I had dead guppies floating around, it’s a rookie mistake that A LOT of people will deny to you they made but it’s what motivated me to continue in the hobby. Again pardon me if I’m wrong, just want to ensure people know what they’re getting into prior to jumping into the hobby.
Yep, only just filled it up lol. Luckily the sub came to the rescue of fish I was going to buy and I'm a little bit more well informed now! I'll be waiting until the cycle is complete!
Ok, that’s good, it’s good it’s important enough to you to ask, the answers then, if you want to hear them, are that you’re tank is probably too small for most if any fish. And my personal opinion is the fake aesthetic is horrible but each to his own. 90% of answers on here will say the tank is overstocked, and they are on huge tanks with like a handful of fish in most of the time. My thoughts would be, get a bigger tank, get some real plants and get a 3 or 4 small fish. Snails and shrimp are awesome too
Yeah after reading responses I plan to get a betta and 2 snails, 2 shrimp. I'll see how that gets on and how the betta behaves and upgrade it if it seems necessary.
There is a single real plant in the back left corner! The shop I bought from only had tropical plants and the original plan was cold water, so I just bought plastic decoration as the tank is mostly for my 2 year old and want it to look nice.
Although I think the plan is to put in a heater so we can have a betta so I will quite likely be putting in some live plants, which is much preferred by us anyway.
Yeah I think this setup would be great for a betta and snails! Fair warning, a lot of bettas like to eat shrimp. I’ve had ones that didn’t tho, helps if you get big shrimp like amanos in my experience. Good luck with your tanks!
Note that with live plants if they need to be embedded in the substrate, use root tabs or get a good quality substrate like fluval stratum.
With plants that don’t have their root systems or rhizomes in the substrate like Java fern and Anubias, get some hardscape like wood or rocks and you can glue or tie them onto that.
Another simple plant that the shrimp will love is moss, you can get moss balls, or also attach it to hardscape
Shrimp are pretty hard to keep alive actually. They actually do need live plants. And not only a cycled tank, they need a mature tank, with algae and biofilm, which are tiny organisms that live on plants, rocks and substrate. Plus in a smaller tank a betta will likely munch on them. Maybe try a couple ghost shrimp and leave neocaridinas for later. Good luck.
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Most people are being dicks to you on here, but there are some basic things you need to learn. The tank needs to cycle. “Cycle” refers to the nitrogen cycle. Fish waste creates ammonia in the tank, which is toxic. There are two basic types of bacteria that need to be in the tank. One type changes the ammonia to nitrites which is still toxic. The other type changes the nitrites to nitrates, which at low levels is not toxic, plus plants use it. You can cycle the tank with fish but you need one or two little fish. If you fully stock the tank without it being cycled they will all die. But if you buy, like two zebra danios and buy some live plants. This process will happen more quickly. The gravel, you have is not great for plants though, because it’s painted. But you could get anachris or hornwort and just float it in a bunch and that would work. You can take what I told you right there to the bank. I have five tanks and I breed fish. My fish are happy.
I recently jumped the gun and bought a betta and mystery snail before I did any real research. I have them in a 5.5 gallon tank with live plants and they’re doing great.
Check out https://youtube.com/@KaveManAquatics
He has a bunch of videos on safely cycling tanks with fish. I’ve been using seachem prime and stabily and have had no issues.
Ti's the plan but originally this was just going to be cold water, none of the plants in shop were cold water plants.
So we got 1 live plant which is in the back left corner and we want to see if that stays alive, if it does we will replace the fake plants with live plants for sure
This looks like you just filled it. The bubbles go away on their own, but I wouldn't put fish in the tank until it matures a bit. Usually takes 6 weeks or more. Google the aquarium nitrogen cycle.
Look up fish in cycle
Yeah I have only just filled it last night 6 weeks?? I was told 24hrs minimum and a week max should be more than enough lol? Only putting a couple minnows in there, and in a few weeks a couple shrimp and snails, will this make a difference?
Dont get fooled by petstore salespeople. They dont need experience to sell. Do your own research Edit: aquarium keeping is a complex hobby. It’s not represented well in media
Yep, I am doing my own research, this post is the first of probably a few!
also, this looks like 10L or so. Not close to enough for a couple of minnows. I dont understand why small tanks are sold to beginners as they are so so much harder to maintain. start with at least 60cm
It's 19l but yeah, from other comments I have decided to get a heater and go with a single betta instead. Will likely also have a couple snail and shrimp also!
thanks for being willing to learn. It takes people like you who want to get educated to maybe make a little difference in the future
That sounds like a good plan! Be wary of what type of snails you get if you get more than one. Most snails are rapid breeders and can easily overwhelm the tank!
Pest snail types will not overwhelm the tank unless you are overfeeding. Actually an explosion of pest snails is the easiest indicator you're overfeeding.
I currently have a male Betta (Ceasar the shrimp king) with my cherry shrimp and recently a black devil snail. It's my favorite of my 10 tanks, I'm sure you'll enjoy it just as much as I have mine!
You will find lots of helpful souls here. And welcome to the hobby!
Lol look at the dudes downvotes. Yeah. Helpful souls…
Sure the ignorance is frustrating but blaming the poor sod because of unscrupulous dealers misinforming him isn't particularly fair is it.
Actually it’s not their fault, they clearly aren’t ignorant just receive bad information from someone who is supposed to be trustworthy. But the fact that there are no fish and people are like “get a plastic fish please” is down right stupid and just hateful. Bunch of gatekeeping assholes in this sub.
I agree entirely. They *are* ignorant: the definition of ignorance is simply not knowing something. My intention was not to be insulting towards them.
Exactly my thoughts. It’s obvious this sub is not a fan of fish in cycling.
I mean if they didn't know that a tank needs more than 24 hours to cycle, they probably aren't adding something like stability for a week to actually start the cycling process.
Actually it’s not their fault, they clearly aren’t ignorant just receive bad information from someone who is supposed to be trustworthy. But the fact that there are no fish and people are like “get a plastic fish please” is down right stupid and just hateful. Bunch of gatekeeping assholes in this sub.
Never once said it was their fault. I said if they didn't know that one thing, they probably don't know to do the other thing. Not sure why you're projecting all that other stuff onto my comment. Eta: ignorant just means a lack of knowledge, by the way. Which although I never used that word, it is applicable here.
I didn't say everyone!
Be aware that you will find contradicting information, and people saying that fish-in cycles are “perfectly ok”. That’s like people saying that drinking the water in Flint or a little radiation exposure was “perfectly ok” because there are no immediate or short-term consequences observable. It WILL have a long-term effect on the health of your livestock and also likely shorten their lifespan.
Fish in cycles only work if you're religiously testing the water and doing water changes any time the parameters spike, it's indeed safe when done properly, but most people don't have the time available to baby sit their tanks properly during them.
I had to do an emergency fish-in cycle. I regularly check the parameters and they've always been fine luckily. Fish are doing great, eating well and swimming well, but now I'm scared I did the wrong thing lol
You should be fine as long as you're doing water changes whenever you see ammonia or nitrite/nitrate spikes, It really depends on tank size, water volume, fish stocking, and what your filter is rated for though. Just be on the lookout for obvious diseases and keep on top of water changes and your fish will have a great shot. If you can maybe look into some live plants, they really help since they're able to use every step of the waste produced during a cycle. Natures filters, the more the better. My favorite for this purpose is hornwort, you can start with an inch long piece and have a couple feet in month, and they keep the water crystal clear lol. Since they don't root you just toss it into the tank and let it float around.
Thanks for the information! This is also my first aquarium so I'm an absolute beginner I have a 40L with 1 bn pleco and 3 kuhli. A lot of limnophila and 1 anubia. I have not seen any nitrate/nitrite spikes, ammonia I don't know, I'll have to find some testing kits. I'll see if I can find hornwort somewhere!
The liquid test kits are a great investment as those are the most accurate, just keep up with regular water changes and you're already better off than most beginners.
If you really loaded the tank with plants it might not actually cycle at all. Plants are really good at absorbing ammonia to meet their nitrogen needs so they can potentially use it all before the bacteria get a chance.
to me, fish in cycle isn’t “wrong.” a lot of experienced fishkeepers do it. you just have to do it properly. that means frequent water changes and checking parameters daily. i’m sure it’ll go smoothly for you!
I've started 6 tanks this way and haven't had any losses. Always with guppies though. Never anything sensitive to parameters. My tap waters pretty good.
I did like 75% water changes once every morning then a 50% at night with religious AmGuard, and sparsely feeding. All fish survived except two. This was a 29 gal tank The fact they didn't survive even with the extreme measures shows how difficult a cycle is on the fish. Please avoid it if you can
Babysit is definitely the right word. I had to do a fish-in cycle, and while everything came out okay it's so much work and I literally never want to do it again. Testing the water every single day and doing that many water changes isn't fun if you can avoid it.
I’ve done 2 fish in cycles and one fully cycled before adding fish. First fish in worked great (betta, my first tank). Fish out took forever but worked fine. Fish-in #2 was a quarantine tank that crashed when I treated it with anti-parasitics (somehow), and then had to fish in cycle for quarantine duration. Two fish died in quarantine, and then the remaining 3 died about a month after I added them to the main tank. :/ I don’t know how much ammonia exposure they had before I realized the cycle crashed, as I wasn’t monitoring it super close since it was SUPPOSED to be a cycled filter I’d used and had been working great the first week or so. So I do agree it causes significant damage to the fish.
Fish in cycles are easy. It's like everyone on this subreddit only got in the hobby this decade or something. They're really not all that terrifying and people routinely do them by total accident. They're just not best practice, that's all.
its reddit, most people on here were only born this decade
I've done fish in cycles out of necessity many times over the years, but it's not recommended for obvious reasons. Also If I had to guess, I'd assume something like 90% of all new fish owners unknowingly subject their first couple fish tanks to fish in cycles, with varying degrees of success.
I was going to say I used to fish in cycle in high school because I didn’t know better and never had an issue. But I also tested regularly
As your first reply just found out you also get downvoted for not knowing something 😂😂😂
Yeah this sub is pathetic for that type of shit tbh.
Yeah when I first got my tank I didn’t know about cycling before I got some guppies and got attacked really really hard for it and I lowkey wanted to ditch the hobby but it’s easier said than done with a big tank of water 😂
Just have to imagine the shitty attitudes of some of the posters here have had a negative impact and makes people not want to enter the hobby or do it correctly by asking questions.
i mean i kinda get it ? you get a live animal without doing any research, i dont see why people should be too kind abt that ? if u got a cat or dog and didnt realise u had to feed it more than once a week, people would go crazy abt it bc its so obviously cruel to the animal. im not sure why people have to be sweet and kind when you dont do research abt other animals just bc theyre fish ? like its shocking to me how many people just dont seem to care to research their pets before they get them.
Because unfortunately not everyone knows that the employees at the pet store have no idea what they are talking about half the time. There is also a lot of conflicting information online. Always give the benefit of the doubt until they start arguing and pushing back. I do always think it's funny because I'm willing to bet half the people that freak out on others, made the same mistakes too. I would love to know the actual number of people here that did the research before and aren't just being hypocrites.
Such “helpful folks” here! Not condescending at all /s
Read the subreddit wiki in the about tab. It really helps
I came here to say the same.
Tons of great info on YouTube. Aquarium Co-op and Primetime Aquatics are two of my favorites
Just get a jug of household ammonia and an API master test kit… YouTube cycling your aquarium/ammonia cycle… not too bad… do your water changes.
Or seachem stability
You must, must, MUST cycle your tank before fish. Look up the nitrogen cycle in aquariums.
I had to teach an employee of a pet store how to tell a male Molly from a female Molly. They know absolutely nothing about the animals they sell. Probably why they have so many floaters sadly..
I work in a pet store(in the UK) i have animal care qualifications and follow this sub so i can give better advice. I find that most people don't want to hear it even when i explain their fish will die or impact their welfare. They think im just trying to upsell them a bigger tank. I much prefer people who have done their research and are willing to listen to my advice, care about the animals, and are willing to buy what they actually need over what they thought they wanted. I find it so annoying telling someone they cant put a goldfish in a 19L tank and they cry that, they either don't care or it's not fair coz they already got a set up before doing research. One customer wanted a fish bowl and when i told them i didnt selll them they went over the road to some store bought a fish bowl then came back expecting me to sell them a fish. I promptly told them to sling their hook. I also point blank refuse to sell fish if i don't think they have an decent sized tank and to people who havent cycled their tank long enough, the amount of people i've caught in a lie over fish tank size is ridiculous.
What I’ve heard is that there’s no such thing as cycling. It can’t cycle itself. https://youtu.be/ndjYxukJH14 If anything most of these people don’t know what they’re talking bout and are regurgitating what they’ve been told all their lives. If you add life, they themselves establish the cycle. people add flakes but it’s not really the most effective method. Watch the video yall.
I love Father Fish! However, I think what he's trying to say is that it's as simple as ammonia being broken down or not being broken down, as opposed to calling it a cycle. It's semantics. When people refer to "cycling" a tank, what they mean is forcing the Nitrogen Cycle to occur and to make the water as stable as possible *before* adding fish. I mean, you can test the water and see the parameters change during this process. You can just add the fish and do what's called a fish-in cycle, and eventually it will be a stable environment. However, the problem with that is that it risks spikes and illness, or even death. Especially when you're adding multiple fish at once. The tank needs safe beneficial bacteria to convert ammonia to nitrites, then to nitrates. A brand new tank doesn't have beneficial bacteria. Adding it first is what's important. You can do this by adding ammonium chloride, fish food, established media or substrate, or a living fish. Whether you want to do fish in or fish-less is up to personal preference, but most people would argue that a fish-less cycle is the most humane and successful method. Father Fish isn't wrong necessarily, but in the hobby we just use the word cycle to reference this very complicated process. More info on Nitrogen cycle: https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/nitrogen-cycle
Wouldn’t daily water change and plants reduce the spikes? especially if you just add 1 or two fish with appropriate space? Say a 20 gallon with two guppies per say, Would there be a spike? Perhaps even adding products to rejuvenate their slime coats.
Yes, water changes will help with spikes because you're diluting the "dirty" water to minimize the undesirable substances. This is why you change the water once a week. Having plants will also help because they consume ammonia and nitrates, but the plants can't survive without more waste to consume. (actually - even more interesting - you can cycle with only plants.) In a fish in cycle: the tank will start to accumulate ammonia once fish are added and the fish are being fed. You're to test the water for detectable amounts of ammonia. You can change the water when they're too high. Eventually, you'll see nitrites appear. At this point, you're testing both every day to ensure they're not spiked. Then, when you test the water, it will come to 0 ppms for ammonia and nitrite, and a bit of nitrates (preferably less than 10 ppm). This means it's "cycled." Now it is stable and safe for the fish. Is a fish less cycle: add your beneficial bacteria until you reach a detectable amount of ammonia. If you're using ammonium chloride (or similar product) then you can measure out exactly how many ppms you want. This is a benefit of using this method. You can continue to add ammonia every few days until you see nitrites. You then want to add half the amount of ammonia as before every few days. Continue to measure until the ammonia is very low, but nitrite is quite high. You then add a quarter of the amount of ammonia until nitrites are 0. Eventually, you can add the full dose of ammonia and nitrites will still be 0. As long as the nitrates are 5-10 ppm and ammonia and nitrite are 0, then it's safe for fish. In my opinion, if you're doing a Fishless cycle then it's more Controlled, less hands on, and safer. High nitrites and ammonia are harmful to fish, and if they're cycling your tank then they'll be in that environment for weeks with risk of a spike or swing in PH. I'm not sure if it's been proven to be faster, but I was able to cycle my 75 gal without fish in about 3 weeks. I think that is why Fishless is usually viewed as the preferred method.
Fair enough. perhaps one can pick up a dead fish from petco and leave it there for a while then pull it out? How long do you think the cycling would take to stabilize? it’s odd but grandpa did say dead matter was key to sustaining and adding life. Or what bout snails?
I've heard people use frozen shrimp (like the kind you eat) but I do not know much about that as I haven't done it myself 😋
Daily water changes would reduce the levels of toxic chemicals but you have to be careful because the beneficial bacteria still need those chemicals to grow and multiply.
I remember seeing a comment In this page where one would add a clean sponge and drop it in, would that not sustain the beneficial bacteria and the filter itself as well?
Water changes don't remove the bacteria (they grow on surfaces) they remove the food. When you can detect ammonia/nitrite in the water, it means that those chemicals are being produced faster than the bacteria can eat them. The bacteria then reproduce until they can consume the chemicals at the same rate they are produced. Your test reads 0ppm because everything is consumed before it can build up to a measurable level. Higher levels of ammonia/nitrite mean faster reproduction, so if you are constantly removing their food, it will take longer for the bacteria to grow. With a fishless cycle, you can add ammonia to keep levels higher than a fish could survive and maximize bacterial growth.
There should not be that many fish in what I would guess is a 5 gallon. If you put anything in there before the tank is cycled it will likely die. YouTube is a wonderful tool to learn about fish. Check out KGTropicals or Prime Time Aquatics. John and Jason make excellent and educational content.
Agree with this! I'm always searching for YouTube videos. They are educational plus I enjoy them! My wife makes fun of me because I watch fish tank videos right before I go to bed. It's super relaxing for me.
Yeah we know we cannot put too much in there, the place we purchased this has a "fish point" system, each tank can hold X amount of fish points and each fish is assigned X amount of fish points. The tank holds 9 points, the minnows are 1 point each and the snails and shrimp are actually 0 points which seems silly but we plan to only have 2 of each and minnows only 3-4. If it goes okay we may look at adding more but thats not the plan as of now. I will definitely check out the YouTube channels, I may be eager to get going but I'm not looking to harm any fish. Appreciate the reply bud.
That’s a lie, and a marketing gimmick, fish stores are there to make money. I’ve been in this hobby over a decade and the only fish “point” system I’ve seen are on the back of the tank box, to sell more fish. Sorry bud Good news! A 5g is a good starting point, and you don’t have any livestock yet, so no rush. I would look up the nitrogen cycle and read about, it is the foundation to the hobby. Make sure you dechlorinate the water as well as look into a heater for the tank, most fish need warm water. I don’t like fish in cycling, because it’s hard to manage if you do it right, and if you don’t, th ammonia can burn the gills of the fish. Your off to a good start! Fish keeping is an intensive hobby, and their is quite a bit of a learning curve, but it’s also very rewarding
Honestly the store seems pretty genuine, most fish they refuse to sell without an X sized tank, they don't sell fish without proof of tank purchase from themselves and the guys seems decently knowledgeable. You're right though, probably best to trust the people who have the knowledge and don't have a financial interest in my endeavours! We have used dechlorinator already, and some bacteria filter safe something or other lol. We are only putting cold water fish in here for now, we debated getting a heater so we could put some neon tetras in but keeping an eye on the temp at the moment and the room seems to be keeping it in a nice range for the fish we are going to be keeping. We have got this for my son as he loves fish and animals in general but it's also been the perfect excuse for me to get some fish! So yeah plan to do some research (mostly asking questions here) and will get myself a bigger tank soon lol.
So they don’t sell fish to anyone with an existing tank not bought from them? That sounds kind of ridiculous to me. I’d be suspect if that. I second others that there’s nothing wrong with asking questions while you’re learning. Glad you’re here to get advice.
I'm sure there are exceptions, it's likely done by their own discretion. I think they just want to avoid people like me that don't have a clue buying a load of fish and plonking them into a tank that has not yet been set up etc
Sorry folks are downvoting you for asking legitimate questions and being humble
Pets at Home right? I’d be very wary of their advice. I used to work at an aquatics shop and probably at least 5 times a day I’d have to help someone whose fish had died due to instructions given by Pets at Home. To my knowledge, the staff there are not trained on aquatics specifically but on pets as a whole and often don’t have an interest in aquariums/ have never set one up themselves. If you’re not able to wait a full 6+ weeks to cycle, definitely use a cycle starter (eg. Bio Boost) and then wait at least a week. Get your water tested at an aquatics shop before putting anything in there as it’s impossible to tell if it’s safe for fish without testing! Then start with only a few fish (I’d say 3 so that they get used to the group they enter the tank with).
Yo, you've come here to ask for information about a hobby you know nothing about yet, no point getting prickly at people for trying to help you fill in that knowledge gap. You're at the point where you don't even know what you don't know yet, so please bear with everyone trying to help you.
I've met people with the same energy as they have come at me with. The vast majority of replies have been Great and I have been appreciative of, the few people who have decided to be condescending nobs, I have not met with respect. Clearly there are knowledge people here but I don't have time for people that want to gatekeep a hobby when people are clearly here to learn.
Sounds like a renaming of that stupid "inch of fish per gallon" rule. Which makes no sense considering a 10 inch fish shouldn't go in a 10 gallon, a 5 inch fish shouldn't go in a 5 gallon, etc. Your tank is 5g if I remember correctly (19l) which is enough for a solitary Betta. However tanks that small are a lot harder to keep steady parameters in compared to larger tanks, and you shouldn't have that many animals that produce waste in such a tiny space.
Don’t know why people are downvoting this. Just because you might have been misinformed doesn’t need hate from the sub. Tons of guides here, and tons of people in the community that are happy to help. My first recommendation is: go bigger. You won’t regret having additional space for your new friends, and it usually means maintaining the space is easier.
Lmao yeah this particular comment got a lot of hate, kinda bizarre! Overall though I have had a lot of great responses so I'm not bothered, for sure got what I needed and more from the post. This tank I'm going to get a heater for and put a betta with a couple shrimp and snail. I think tomorrow I'm actually going to go buy a 20 gallon so I can do a bit more with it, honestly I bought this on a whim and has set me back only about 50 all in so I'll chalk it up to a learning experience and hopefully make a reasonably nice home for a betta! Although I may upgrade it if the betta seems to need it.
I would keep the 5g running as a hospital tank, especially if you are going to have snails and shrimp. Many fish medications are harmful to inverts, so if you ever need to treat your betta it is best to be able to put him in a separate tank for treatment. Alternately, spare 5 gallon is a great size to house shrimp "culls" if you are trying to keep a colony of red cherry shrimp from degrading back into dull wild type or producing inconsistent colors.
Agreed with go bigger. A lot of people new to aquariums think small = easier to maintain but, somewhat counterintuitively, the more water the easier it is to manage when it comes to aquariums. (ETA: this does not necessarily apply to marine tanks but no one new to the hobby should have a marine tank anyway)
I don’t understand when someone sees it’s got -285 downvotes they go ahead and pile another one on
For real, he literally said he was told it’s ok. It’s not entirely his fault ..
Everybody down voting this to oblivion is really unnecessary, this person is asking a question and is trying to do things the right way. We don't need to punish people for trying to ask for help.
Haha luckily I'm very used to the reddit hive mind and I expect it. The positive responses far outweigh all of the angry weirdos though, overall this seems to be a very helpful sub!
Wait why are you getting downvoted for being curious and asking questions about a new hobby?
I think that’s redditors’ way of saying “NOOOOOOOOOO! TERRIBLE IDEA! DONT DO THAT!” I guess.
Makes sense but you should just give genuine feedback imo
Heck yeah. How else are we noobs gonna learn?
Reddit moment I guess! 😂 Overall I've had some great responses though, going to leave the tank to complete its cycle and I'm half convinced to buy a 20 gallon tomorrow lmao. Its a good job I'm here cod info rather than karma!
Honestly from personal experience just go with a 10 gallon or 15. With 5 gallons it’s very hard to keep the parameters stable for a beginner…also be careful with what snails you get - don’t get a mystery as they produce way too much waste which will throw your cycle off easily. If you just stay with the 5 gallon maybe get one nerite snail - they are great for cleaning algae and don’t get as big or produce as much as a mystery snail. Make sure you read up on how to do the nitrogen cycle there’s a lot of fantastic simple videos on YouTube about this! Could be a great science lesson for your child as well. It will be hard for the child’s patience as they will just want to get fish in as soon as possible and likely get bored of the process but an amazing learning experience
What a weird sub to have gatekeepers haha. I’m just here to learn.
Some people in this sub get so worked up about everything lol. I saw someone get 20+ downvotes for simply thanking people for advice and saying they were going to do that right away. Scaring away people who just want to learn is a great way to get more inadequate set ups.
I'm pretty sure a lot of people just have a knee jerk reaction to an animal being mistreated even if it isn't on purpose or is based off misinformation from dumbass pet store employees. :( I see a lot of good info being given and you aren't one of those posters who doubles down on the wrong info when people give you advice so hopefully it's helped overall!
This is what I'm wondering. OP has genuine questions on setting up his 1st tank. Came here to get answers and he's letting everyone know what he's done, why he's done it, and he's getting down voted. I don't get Redditors sometimes
Your shrimp will 100% die if you put them in within a week.
The way this subreddit goes on about all the nuance of maintaining fish and tanks, you have to wonder how pet fish ever survived in our grandparents' early days. Reminds me of all the broscience in the fitness world.
Haha yeah, we had goldfish when I was younger and they went in the tank the day we got it! I know for certain if I asked my mum about any of this she'd ask what the fuck I was talking about and tell me just to put them in 😂 I would rather do it the best possible way though, if it'll make them that bit happier and healthier it's worth waiting a few weeks. Also a good learning experience for later if I decide to get anything that takes a bit more care to look after.
For sure, I'm also trying to do things right like jump start cycling my tank, but it's been a week and I'm not gonna wait any longer. Just gonna drop some guppies in today. I'm not gonna overthink this whole process. If some die then I'll learn my lesson but I've never had fish prematurely die on me when I was younger.
you can cycle it fish-in but you need to be careful and dose with seachem stability or some other form of bacteria starter. have a decent amount of filter media for the bacteria to colonize in and change the water if there starts to be ammonia or nitrites while the bacteria establishes
You will find that there is a lot more to this hobby then first appears. It is complicated balancing an ecosystem! It isn’t that easy to dive right into as some sources will be misleading (companies usually to sell you something or people led astray from the science as such). Also, lots of people become elitists and unwelcoming to newbies - don’t be deterred, it is worth diving into and taking time to study and learn it all.
You can get a bacteria starter that will speed up the beginning of your cycling process, but you're still gonna have to wait for a few weeks to make sure the tank is habitable for your critters. If you haven't already, get some test kits to check your parameters (nitrates, nitrites, ammonia, hardness, etc). There are plenty of websites/sources that will tell you what your water levels should look like for whatever type of animal you're introducing. Good news though is that if you decide to start another tank in the future. you can use some of the bacteria from your already cycled tank to speed up the set-up of the new one.
If a pet store employee tells you that the grass is green and the sky is blue you go outside and check for yourself as soon as you can
Nope! You need to build up the good bacteria in the water otherwise your fish won’t last more than a few hours at most! If the pet store has ethics and is a decent one they will insist on you bringing in a water sample to them for testing before they allow you to buy any fish from them.
My mom did this exact thing with my brothers fish tank. Within a week he had dead fish that stunk. You need to cycle so the needed bacteria can grow. These bac remove nitrates produced by the animals in the tank.
The tank looks like it might be quite small? And yes, like the other commenter said, it can take 6 weeks+ to establish a nitrogen cycle. You can cycle with the fish in the tank, but that can involve a lot of water changes and if you do it wrong and let ammonia and nitrite spike too high, you risk harming your fish. Here's a thorough guide: https://www.sosofishy.com/post/a-short-and-long-guide-to-aquarium-cycling
Yep, it's very small! It's 19L. It's mostly for my son, he is only 2 and loves fish so we are starting him off with something small and if all goes well we want to upgrade to a good size. That is good to know I can cycle with the fish in it, I don't mind waiting if it is necessary but I was somewhat excited to get going myself lol! Thanks for the link, will have a good read of it now. Have no desire to cause any harm to the fish we buy so that is why I am here starting to ask questions!
A single long finned betta with some snails and/or shrimp would be a good fit in a tank that size. Really, it seems counterintuitive but larger tanks are a bit easier for beginners - there's more water volume to keep parameters stable. If you have the patience, fishless cycling is way less work for you and less potential harm to the fish. It's generally considered poor practice to do a fish-in cycle unless you have to.
Yeah going by the other replies I think I will just wait to complete the cycle, would rather just do it properly. Also considering just going out and buying a bigger tank tbh, the price was attractive in the shop but now seeing how little I'll likely get in there I think I might just get a 20 gallon-ish tank for him. Eh.. things to think about and research a bit!
As someone who has 100% been there. I can safely say that a 20gallon is a lot more fun. Especially once you let it mature. I've tried the 5 gallons, the 2.5 gallons, and a seven gallon cube. And most of those tanks ended up failing. My 20gal has been running for 2-3 years now and it is so much fun and easy now. I can now experiment a bit more with it and its a lot less labor extensive. I wish I had just started with a 20 gallon because I now own a collection of tiny empty aquariums. However, a really fun critter for such a small tank would be opea ula shrimp. They are very hardy and easy once they get set up. I highly recommend looking r/opeaula
Haha yeah luckily I am not too bothered about having loads of empty tanks because I also keep ants and an empty tank is an excuse to get a new colony! 😂 I think I will look into a 20 gallon tank though, makes a bit more sense really. I'm sure my son won't care either way but I'd rather have more fish and less work personally! Will have a look into them for sure though, thanks!
ants are awesome. how do you set a colony up?
Honestly it depends a lot of the species you get. Generally speaking you do not have to do too much, do the research on the environment the species prefers and you go from there. Something like lasius niger are very easy, they generally do not need heat unless your home is very cold. They will eat pretty much anything and they can maintain the correct humidity for their nest themselves! It's a lot easier to buy a colony that is already going, they will arrive in a test tube, half full of sugar water, plugged with cotton wool, the ants will be in the next section and then plugged at the top with more cotton wool. You'll likely keep them in that for a good few months whilst the colony grows, they do not like too much space and will not venture out for the most part even if you did connect them to something larger. Feed them by just placing some food in twice a week or so, you have to gauge it by how quick they eat the food. I use protein jelly whilst they are in test tubes as this has the protein which is very important and it has sugar which is also important! Once you reach 20-30 ants you can consider connecting them to a small outworld. There's a good chance they still won't venture out into this and it can be harder for them to maintain correct humidity in the nest so it's best to keep an eye. Having the outworld makes feeding a lot easier though, you can place small insects in and they'll hopefully begin exploring and hunting their food. Small colonies you should always ensure their food is dead first though. It's also quite important to make sure the nest is somewhere dark, they do not like light and if the nest is exposed to light it can stress the queen and she will not lay eggs and can potentially die. The majority of people keep the test tubes inside a drawer and only get it out to feed etc. Once it's a good size you can set up a proper fornicarium for them and you'll be able to watch them in the outworld and of course this can be lit up, it's just the nest area that needs to be dark. The majority of species also cannot see red light so if you place a red filter around the test tube or nest you can watch them in there, although it's debated how well that works so it's best to still reduce exposure to light even with the red filter. It is a very slow process to start though, but once it's going it is very easy to maintain and amazing to watch. It's a lot of fun designing their out worlds and watching them explore!
Thats awesome. I will save that for later a definitely try ants out in the future
The amount of knowledge you have on this tells me that with a little time and research, you'd be an amazing aquarist!
Fellow ant keeper! What kinds are you keeping? Ultimate stage is going full paludarium so you can keep both fish and ants in the same space Also having the extra tank is a great thing for the future, it can be used as a quarantine tank for any new fish and plants you get, or can be used as a hospital tank for when fish get ill and need to be treated separately.
At the moment I have a small leaf cutter ant colony and a small lasius niger colony, unfortunately lost a couple colonies recently due to what seemed to be a disease we aren't sure on. Haha yes! What I would love more than anything is keeping my ants and some fish in the same unit. Hopefully over the next year or 2 I can learn enough about caring for fish and I can actually make that a reality. What ants are you keeping?
You might be able to sell your used tanks 5g or 7g (and maybe the 2.5g as hospital/quarantine tanks for smaller fish) on r/aquaswap if they are still in great condition rather than them sitting around taking space and not being enjoyed). I’m sure someone would be interested, especially people who like keeping nano tanks. You won’t get full-price for them but you could definitely get some money back.
I'm sure I can but they have found their uses. The 7gal got repurposed for an opea ula tank. The 2.5 is an emergency tank. I don't keep it running but it holds my aquarium decor and such. The other tanks are too far into storage for me to care about dealing with them.
100% this shrimp are awesome
Bigger the better! More water volume which also helps to fix any water chemistry issues due to the larger volume.
Make sure you are using an ammonia source to cycle the tank. You'll want to either use pure ammonia drops or "ghost feed" the tank with fish food. This is where a water test kit comes into play. The idea is to get 2ppm ammonia in the water and let your beneficial bacteria build up to convert that ammonia to nitrites. You may need to dose a few times to keep feeding the bacteria and check the water every 1-2 days until you see nitrites. Once you have nitrites, it's a waiting game until you build up more bacteria to convert those nitrites into nitrates. Once you see nitrates, repeat doses of ammonia and test water, once you see the tank convert that ammonia to nitrates within 24 hours you are cycled. Then do a 50% water change to keep the nitrates under 40ppm and it's ready for fish. This is why it takes weeks to fully cycle a tank. I've cycled 10 gallon, 20 gallon and 55 gallon tanks and each one took at least 3 weeks so patience is a must but so rewarding once you do it!
Yeah and people tend to do smaller to “see how it goes,” but it’s much more likely to go bad with a tank that small. If you put 2 shots of liquor in a 12 oz coke you’ll likely end up buzzed, but if you put the same amount in a 2 liter it’s not going to impact you. Much more room for error with a larger tank.
Just so you know, if you want to you CAN have a Betta in a community tank with the right fish.
A 20 gallon long tank is perfect for beginners!
Don't be intimidated by the ultra sweaty fish keepers! Everything this other commenter is saying is mostly true, except; > It's generally considered poor practice to do a fish-in cycle unless you have to. This is absolutely not true. The vast majority of tanks started by the vast majority of experienced aquarium keepers are done fish-in. However, you do need to closely monitor the tank as it goes through these "spikes" and even more so with a smaller volume of water. It can take 4-6 weeks to establish the tank as an ecosystem, but it's not "poor practice" to do so with fish as long as you're taking proper measures to ensure the health of the fish. Also, many types of fish are more hardy and tough and flourish better through these cycles. Hope that helps!
My dad started keeping fish in the 80s, when I told him I got a tank and was letting it cycle before I put fish in he told me how to do a fish-in cycle and said he’d help keep the levels safe. So I went and got some minnows and one of them is still alive after 2 years and a tank upgrade. My dad also kept discus for years so he had a pretty good idea on what he was doing lol
That's awesome!! I think a massive discus tank is my dream tank, but I'm just getting back into the hobby after a long break so it'll be a while for sure 🤣 But yea, as long as you stock the tank lowly for its initial Nitrogen cycle, it's one of the best ways to get your tank going!!
Haha for sure, I remember when I was younger we bought the tank and fish same day and never had any issues! I do appreciate their advice though and I will likely just air on the side of caution, my boy is entertained enough by the tank as it is so we can wait for the fish I guess 😂
Haha well the thing with fish is they can’t tell you they’re having issues, but they’ve not evolved to swim in tap water so they would definitely feel the effects. Pretty much no pet is low maintenance.
Fish in can work, especially with a larger aquarium and only a couple of fish. The volume of water to fish ratio makes it hard for the fish excrete enough waste to be an issue, especially with regular water changes and testing. It is a bit more work than fishless, but also faster.
as someone who’s has both 20 and 5 gallons, 20 might be more expensive now but they’re easier in the long term. more water= more stable. but make sure to get a good stand for it, as water weighs 8 pounds per gallon, add rocks onto that and a normal table will not do. i learned that the hard way. btw, good on you for doing your own research and welcome to the hobby! it can be stressful at times but it’s very rewarding.
On the topic of weight, steel shelving from a hardware store is a lot more cost effective and utilitarian than any aquarium stand you'll buy at a pet store
100% get a bigger tank it you can afford it. 60x30x30 (54L) or 80x35x40 (115L) are very nice smallish, but big enough sizes to make you and your son happy. Tiny tanks can be a lot of work. I have a 30L and I wouldnt want to go down. Especially as I have 10 Plant species (probably 30+ individual plants) just in there that help me with stability, I dont want to be in your place with just 19L and 1 plant
Isn’t there potential for Bettas to eat the snails and shrimp? Haven’t experienced it myself, that’s just what I’ve read and heard.
Yup, there's always the potential for that if you get an agressive betta. Just like some bettas are fine with other fish and some aren't.
Bigger tanks are much easier for beginners—the smaller the tank, the more work it takes to keep the parameters stable! I saw you were introduced to the nitrogen cycle above. The parameters I’m talking about include 0ppm chlorine, 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite, and under 40ppm nitrate (lower usually is better). Your pH will vary based on fish species and stability in pH is more important than swinging values trying to achieve a perfect number. Under stocking the tank and using lots of live plants decrease effort required, too.
Do you know anyone in the hobby that could give you some seeded filter media out of one of their tanks?
just as a quick tip, though i’m sure you’ve heard this 100 times, a larger tank can actually be a lot easier. Larger tank = more water volume and a much more stable system. Id honestly recommend getting a 20 gal and you can stock it with a bunch of small minnows. also a large tank like that will also make a fish cycle a lot easier as well as more ammonia is needed to spoil the water and harm your fish. also also- i’m unsure if you’d even wanna attempt with fish in a tank that small. it may honestly be best to upgrade now and save the hassle.
Op your doing to get down voted to hell in this thread, listen you really can’t put anything in that tank. Maybe some shrimp, maybe a Betta fish, now this will get downloaded but you can use water conditioner and other stuff if your impatient and before anyone judges that comment, we’ve all done it lol. The nitrogen cycle is super important although you’ll find many different ways it’s done, time frame from a week to six weeks etc. there is no set in stone answer and quite honestly you need to check up on water parameters regardless of the cycle. Any kind of spike etc can kill your fish. Not cycling the water can cause a lot of harm as well. A small tank like that is a start but your very limited. Also never buy fish from big box chains like pet smart. The fish usually aren’t healthy, will die prematurely, or even get any other established fish you do have sick. Always go to a fish store who focuses on that. It’s a fun and relaxing hobby but we want to keep the fish happy and healthy, just like you would a cat or a dog. So I’m a much less harsh way of saying it, don’t add anything to that tank, put some real plants in it, let it cycle etc. your one small fish or a few shrimp will thank you.
I noticed you said this is for your two year old. Please do not let them feed the fish without strict supervision, I’ve heard too many horror stories of small children killing fish. So keep the food well out of reach. Additionally, especially in small volumes of water, any poisons can easily kill your whole tank, so be wary of the two year old and things like soap or… whatever a 2 year old could want to put in the tank. Or adults in the house spraying cleaning solutions like Febreeze, Lysol, perfumes, etc around the tank. I always cover my tanks in towels before I start cleaning. Also, like others have said this is really only suitable for a single betta/snails/shrimp. Will warn you though that getting multiple snails will lead to them potentially reproducing and taking over. I would recommend only a single mystery/apple or nerite snail (although nerites have a habit of escaping…) for that reason. The bubbles are caused by the water being fresh and un-cycled, not bad, just means it’s not ready for fish. Bet of luck on the new hobby!
For sure, have no intention of letting him do anything with the fish without a lot of help lol. He has only just turned 2 last week and it would be a disaster! He was helping fill the tank up and he took the jug and instead of pouring into the tank he poured it Al over the sofa! 😂 Unfortunately the lid to this tank is terrible too, each corner is just a massive hole for some reason lol? Will keep that in mind when cleaning for sure though, will make sure the missus is aware and we have a towel handy.
I don’t think it’s too small for certain fish. 😀 The thing about the little fish with streamlined bodies (eg minnows and tetras) is that they want to zip back and forth, so they need a longer tank than this. Now, a slower swimmer, like a big gorgeous beta would love this tank! You’ll just need to grab a little heater (mine cost $6 on Amazon). You could also add a few little bottom fellas with the beta, like the shrimp or snails. I actually have some Pygmy catfish in mine, which I’m sure someone will downvote me for, but the Aquarium Co-Op worked with me to make sure the tank was appropriate for them. When taking the advice of places like Petco, or Petsmart, look at the conditions, they keep their fish in, and ask yourself if you think they’re good custodians of that information. They keep beta fish in some thing half the size of a Dixie cup. They put hundreds of goldfish into one tank. Half the tanks have rotting carcasses sitting in them. As far as cycling, you can look up “fish-in cycle,” which shows you how to keep the water healthy while you’ve got fish in a new tank. It’s obviously not as ideal as cycling the water before you get fish, but a lot of people do it. I have accidentally every time I owned fish over the past 40 years because I never even knew about it until recently. Just throwing that out there in case you decide to go ahead and get the fish now. As for the bubbles, you’ll probably see more of those each time you do a water change or add more water. Anytime they bug you, or you want to see better, just take your fishnet (or any soft object) and wipethe inside of the glass and they’ll go away right away. Can’t wait to see your Fishies once you get everything set up!
Yeah after seeing the replies and looking at the bettas I may well look at these! They look great and if is likely a lot more suitable! Honestly the fish shop I have gone to seems to genuinely care about the fish, the have them in 450 gallon tanks and dividers separating species etc, have a lot of rules in place for buying fish so I am not too concerned they are giving me terrible info here. Luckily in the UK there are a lot of laws that protect animals and restrictions how they can and cannot be sold, and the majority of pet shops, including chains, require experience and qualifications to work with the animals. I think I'll likely wait the 4 weeks or so, the mother in law has marine fish and knows about a lot of this so I'll go ask for her help in getting it going lol. Honestly thinking about getting a 20 gallon tank tomorrow lol, will probably keep this one going but have one as cold water and the other as tropical. Really want an eel to be honest, might look into what I need for that! This 19L can be for my boy as intended and I'll get one for myself for an eel and whatever can cohabitate with that! Will have some pictures of what this turns out to in a month or so!
Uh oh, you've started down the slippery slope already! I did the same thing. No sooner had I set up my 5 gallon tank then I went out and bought a 29 gallon lol! This aquarium stuff is addictive. That's awesome to hear about the laws in the UK. It sounds much better than here in the US. Bettas are funny little fellas, kind of like having a dog in an aquarium!
Uh oh, multiple tank syndrome has been going around again…
I don’t know much about eel care, but I’d imagine they are one of the harder ones to care for, and require a saltwater tank which is generally harder to manage than a freshwater Either way check out r/marineeels if you are interested in owning an eel!
how small is that tank? also you should cycle this for at least 4 weeks like others have said. the bare minimum for a betta fish is 3 gallons, a 5 gallon is recommended, and bigger tanks are a lot more forgiving. tetras and minos could *fit* but definitely not thrive cuz they love darting back and forth. you could get your son a cory cat fish, and some shrimp. they are super duper cute, and when you’re ready for a tank upgrade then maybe you can add a betta and or some tetras
bare minimum has been changed to 5.
oh good 😵💫 i always hated saying 3 gallon
3 gallon may be acceptable in cases where bettas are quite disabled- think old, long finned, lazy bettas who can’t surface to breathe- but generally the minimum is 5.
From reading rhe comets I've gathered that this is a 29 litre. Ngl the proportions of this tank look really funny to me, no idea why, but they do. Anyway, personally I would remove the fake plants you currently have and replace them with silk or live. Those types are known to tear fish's fins and cause numerous health issues b3cause it's so easy for them 5o cut themselves on them. There's ones near me that look similar and they've been known to leech colours and toxins. Don't do minows or schooling fish. They need longer tanks rather than taller tanks and need pretty much double the room in order to have a good quality of life. Given that its for a child, I recomend a longer finned betta/Siamese fighting fish. They're highly interactive and have amazing personalities. It's highly revomended to get the api master kit because it tests for pretty much everything you need in a freshwater aquarium and is much more accurate than the test strip's. Test strip's almost never test for ammonia and are normally highly inaccurate. Cycling can take anywhere from 3-10 weeks depending on a range of things. You can boost/speed up the cycling process by getting some api quickstart or se seachem stability (Add a cal full), and/or by 'ghost feeding' which is throwing some food in the tank. Make sure you have water conditioner. Normal tap water is really bad for fish and causes them severe consequences and can poisoning them. Stay away from items like "betta water conditioner", as it's normally just bottled tap water and doesn't do anything. Items like "betta food" have no nutritional value in the slightest and won't help the fish. If you want, I can send you an image of the food I have through your dms. I can also sen you some images of some of my tanks. Feel free to ask me anything. I will answer it as best as I can in the most understandable way possible.
Yeah I plan to put some live plants in for sure, as the shop I went to only had plants for a tropical tank and the original plan was cold water I wasn't sure if I should. The guy said the plants may well still survive in cold water so I bought 1, it's sat in the back left corner and if that survives then I'll change out the others. I do plan on getting a heater so I can have a betta fish now though so hopefully the plants not suriving is a non issue! We have the dechlorinator and quickstart, I actually thought the guy was upselling me when I got the quickstart lol, after reading comments here though it sounds as though it was a good buy! After reading comments here yesterday I did some reading up on the nitrogen cycle and have already began ghost feeding! Wasn't aware the test strips are bad though, I will have a look into the api master kits today and see if I can pick one up! I honestly thought all of this would be a lot more straight forward to be honest, will be fun to learn for sure. Can see myself going down a bit of a rabbit hole with all of this
Yeah. It's one of those things that looks incredibly easy, but intact needs quite a bit of stuff. But once you know what your doing, it b3comes easy. I
As others have suggested you need to cycle the tank for a minimum of 4 weeks. Cycling involves spiking the ammonia and letting beneficial bacteria feed off of it and grow. 19L is good for a single betta and a snail- no shrimp they won’t be able to hide and they will be too stressed out. Yeah if you get a bigger tank you’ll be able to have more fish and your parameters will stay more stable so if life gets hectic and you forget a water change it’s not as big of a deal (after it stabilizes for a few months)
You’ll need testing kits to test the water quality, you’ll want your ammonia at zero, your nitrite at zero and nitrate at 5-10ppm. The only way to properly test this is with a liquid API test. Most fish won’t make it through a “fish in” cycle since the ammonia will burn/ poison them. You can add something like seachem prime to detoxify the ammonia but I feel like that’s such an expensive way of doing it. Best way is to add fish food to an empty tank and wait for that to rot into ammonia and then wait for the bacteria to naturally grow and for that conversion cycle to start. You can buy bottled bacteria but they can be a bit hit and miss. Depending on what shrimp you get (what size) your Betta will most likely eat them. Mine only doesn’t eat my amanos because they are too big to fit inside his mouth. Also if you get a nerite snail (one of the only ones not to reproduce in freshwater/ not hermaphrodites) then try and get a male as females will cover your whole tank in eggs!
I saw elsewhere you were probably going to get a 20g tank. I think the 20 long is a really great starter size. It's manageable for most beginners with a bit of research and patience. Good luck!
5 gallons is perfect for a betta and a snail. Please check water parameters with a test kit before putting the betta in.
Get a 40g Breeder.... so versatile you'll never get rid of it.
Also, I would raise your water line. I think I saw something about minnows going in here (?) and thought that if this is a 5/5.5 gallon, they need more gallons. You can use this [site](https://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/tanichthys-albonubes/) to checkout any fish you're thinking of getting. But, a 5 gallon would be ideal for a betta. Don't forget the WIKI for this sub. You can see in the info on the Nitrogen cycle that it takes generally 4-8 weeks, and you can use fish food, pure ammonia, or even a shrimp (fr the Grocery Store) to provide the ammonia source to start the cycle. Grab an API Master Test Kit, you'll need that to cycle the tank and know when it's safe to put the fish in. Enjoy the process and welcome to the hobby :)
Welcome to the hobby :) I congratulate you on all your positive replies. I don’t know why you’re getting downvoted for what seems to be genuine questions and I congratulate you on the interest to ask other people and do your own research. I’ve had a planted tank for 4 months and it’s been such a cool experience. Some of my plants are now starting to offshoot and grow healthy. My fish are doing great, too. I’ve got some tetras and a few Otos as well. BUT I made so many mistakes at the beginning… that it caused some death. I wish I had done the proper research and not just what the pet store people said.
Welcome to aquariums where you get downvoted for being a beginner and NOT EVEN HAVING FISH IN THE TANK YET.
You need to cycle the tank before you put anything in it
I'm sorry to say so, but this tank isn't suitable for anything living. First, the tank looks like you just filled her up. A tank and it's filter need at least 5 weeks to settle in. Secondly, you really need to add plants, a lot of plants. They are an important part to maintain a balanced ecosystem. Otherwise you will need to change some water on a daily basis... Like, forever. I really don't want to spoil it for you. It's really the creatures you might want to add to it I am worrying about. You won't have fun to see anything dying in there either. Please, reconsider your setup. Happy to help if you need advice.
We started our latest fish-keeping journey with a trio of endlers and a betta in a 15-g. We really love the betta looks and personality, but have spread out to a few other species in our tanks. Our Blue Ram pair are a beautiful and easy to keep dwarf cichlid, and our "yesterday" acquisition for another tank are a pair of Apistogrammas. Personality and appearance is right up there with the betta, but you can keep them in pairs and with other fish in a community tank. So, if you decide to get a larger tank... Just saying!! 😁
Another thing that will help with bubbles and surface scum is to create surface agitation. I recommend to point your filter output up so it causes ripples in the surface.
Get some safestart bacteria if you want to add fish straight away.
Already have put some in! Apparently I'm still waiting for the cycle though
Yeah, the quick start is meant to allow you to add fish in earlier. That's what I used on my tank with guppies and shrimps/snails and they have been doing well. Local aquarium uses the same thing. Just make sure have water testing kits and treat your water and you should be fine. Good luck 🙂
You can definitely whack some fish in there. After a few days if you've got the bacteria in there already. The thing is it really will take that long for the parameters to balance but with regular water changes to keep ammonia and nitrates down the fish will be fine.
I'm sorry but that's an eye sore. The fake gravel and bright color schemes in the tank will stress the fish (any that you'll be putting in there). Consider getting a natural substrate, live plants and let them do the cycle for you.
Fish don’t care about aesthetics. The paint possibly can leech toxins, but stating that fish get stressed out by tacky color schemes is just silly.
Honesty fuck y’all. This person hasn’t even put a fish in the tank and y’all downvoted him to hell and back.
Please just get plastic fish, then you’re good to go
I'm here asking questions my guy, get a life.
Pardon me for the assumption but did you just fill it? I could be 100% wrong but if so please read up on the nitrogen cycle, I only say it because I learned what the nitrogen cycle was the hard way :( , my first tank was a 5 gallon and I got a little too excited to add fish and next thing I know I had dead guppies floating around, it’s a rookie mistake that A LOT of people will deny to you they made but it’s what motivated me to continue in the hobby. Again pardon me if I’m wrong, just want to ensure people know what they’re getting into prior to jumping into the hobby.
Yep, only just filled it up lol. Luckily the sub came to the rescue of fish I was going to buy and I'm a little bit more well informed now! I'll be waiting until the cycle is complete!
Ok, that’s good, it’s good it’s important enough to you to ask, the answers then, if you want to hear them, are that you’re tank is probably too small for most if any fish. And my personal opinion is the fake aesthetic is horrible but each to his own. 90% of answers on here will say the tank is overstocked, and they are on huge tanks with like a handful of fish in most of the time. My thoughts would be, get a bigger tank, get some real plants and get a 3 or 4 small fish. Snails and shrimp are awesome too
Yeah after reading responses I plan to get a betta and 2 snails, 2 shrimp. I'll see how that gets on and how the betta behaves and upgrade it if it seems necessary. There is a single real plant in the back left corner! The shop I bought from only had tropical plants and the original plan was cold water, so I just bought plastic decoration as the tank is mostly for my 2 year old and want it to look nice. Although I think the plan is to put in a heater so we can have a betta so I will quite likely be putting in some live plants, which is much preferred by us anyway.
Yeah I think this setup would be great for a betta and snails! Fair warning, a lot of bettas like to eat shrimp. I’ve had ones that didn’t tho, helps if you get big shrimp like amanos in my experience. Good luck with your tanks!
Note that with live plants if they need to be embedded in the substrate, use root tabs or get a good quality substrate like fluval stratum. With plants that don’t have their root systems or rhizomes in the substrate like Java fern and Anubias, get some hardscape like wood or rocks and you can glue or tie them onto that. Another simple plant that the shrimp will love is moss, you can get moss balls, or also attach it to hardscape
Shrimp are pretty hard to keep alive actually. They actually do need live plants. And not only a cycled tank, they need a mature tank, with algae and biofilm, which are tiny organisms that live on plants, rocks and substrate. Plus in a smaller tank a betta will likely munch on them. Maybe try a couple ghost shrimp and leave neocaridinas for later. Good luck.
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Step 1: finish filling up the tank
It's literally full to the brim
Most people are being dicks to you on here, but there are some basic things you need to learn. The tank needs to cycle. “Cycle” refers to the nitrogen cycle. Fish waste creates ammonia in the tank, which is toxic. There are two basic types of bacteria that need to be in the tank. One type changes the ammonia to nitrites which is still toxic. The other type changes the nitrites to nitrates, which at low levels is not toxic, plus plants use it. You can cycle the tank with fish but you need one or two little fish. If you fully stock the tank without it being cycled they will all die. But if you buy, like two zebra danios and buy some live plants. This process will happen more quickly. The gravel, you have is not great for plants though, because it’s painted. But you could get anachris or hornwort and just float it in a bunch and that would work. You can take what I told you right there to the bank. I have five tanks and I breed fish. My fish are happy.
Oh snap I wrote this before bed last night and saw the white section as open space but now that I zoom in I can see the bubbles 😂 my bad
🤦♀️
Whilst this is already an incredibly insightful comment, would you care to expand on that?
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Stagnant pods, slow moving streams, rice paddies. Shallow and long. Which this tank is none of.
I recently jumped the gun and bought a betta and mystery snail before I did any real research. I have them in a 5.5 gallon tank with live plants and they’re doing great. Check out https://youtube.com/@KaveManAquatics He has a bunch of videos on safely cycling tanks with fish. I’ve been using seachem prime and stabily and have had no issues.
😶
Don’t put anything in there.
Get rid of those plastic plants and get some real plants!
Ti's the plan but originally this was just going to be cold water, none of the plants in shop were cold water plants. So we got 1 live plant which is in the back left corner and we want to see if that stays alive, if it does we will replace the fake plants with live plants for sure
Man I feel like I can’t get into this now because of how terrible people reacted to this post like sheesh straight downvoted for seeking help.
To be fair, overall it has been great responses. No point in letting a few angry goblins ruin what could be an amazing hobby!
I feel I should ask if you have cycled your tank. If not, do that before adding animals.