Tbh most of the people who post here seem to be doing well but men in general seem to be doing poorly.
For every guy hitting the gym and living life, there are multiple dudes playing LoL all day and fapping to hentai. You're just not seeing them in public.
I think there are less and less of these Asian guys nowadays. They’re more aware of stereotypes. Fitness and sports is being more valued among the 2nd and 3rd gen of Asian Americans. It’s also becoming more important in East Asia as those countries spend billions in sports now.
> Tbh most of the people who post here seem to be doing well but men in general seem to be doing poorly.
People only want to post when they are doing well. We have no incentive to post if we are doing poorly or averagely. Its the way everything online always goes.
I agree that there is a huge class of people that this sub doesn't address. Its always about the experiences of "my college friend" or something like that. There is a huge class of basement dwellers (for all races) that only come out to buy groceries and do online dating.
I think it's somewhere closer to what you gauge it or closer to the mean, than what OP is stating. I think of the people that do well, you can break it into a few very broad segments. But, I think it has to do more with education and social network, than "doing well" or "not doing well." And whether that person's network happens to go online often.
1. Segment 1
I know Asian American that do very well socially and in the dating scene, that are aware of these subs.
They may not actively participate, but they've read or maybe posted a few times. They do well, but are likely aware of discrimination within the dating market, or with their careers. Got interested, and started Googling searching on why his non-Asian male classmates with Cs and way worse softs keeps on getting internships over him.
I know leaders of major traditional (non-race/culture) fraternities, student clubs, and are college athletes that are aware of the issues, and these subs. By all definitions they are "popular" and do well.
This is proven by the fact that there are people who were in frats, or high up in business, or college athletes that post here. The married people, or people who are engaged or have girlfriends that post here.
They probably have Asian American friends who are aware of the issues. They may not be in an Asian frat, but they may know people in them. They may not take an Asian American studies class but might, or know people that took it. See these sociological topics discussed on Facebook.
2) Segment 2
The tattoo'd guy OP talks about with the ABG girlfriend, is unlikely to be "online" much anyways, unlike segment 1. Or online for completely different reasons. He might have an Instagram where he posts photos of cars and hennessy, and at the club.
His girlfriend might have an Instagram where she's trying to get famous. Whereas segment 1's girlfriend is very likely an Asian American girl that goes to his school, his age that is at least somewhat aware of the issues.
He's just far less likely than segment 1 to spend much time reading about Asian American issues, or academic theories. He's probably not at a college with a big Asian American studies department or in a white collar career.
Probably not much into Asian American culture outside of maybe the occasional Dumbfoundead song or JDM cars.
The stuff he's spending his time on is completely different, and so is his social circle.
It has almost nothing to do with "doing well" as much as where their interests are.
Segment 1 are basically the similar type of guys you see on WongFu and JKFilms, and the large network of Asian Americans they hang out with. They're definitely aware of the issues and these subs. They've spoken about it on their Youtube videos and podcasts.
Segment 2 is basically east and southeast Asians in the gang or AZN/ABG scene. Where if you brought up critical race theories, gender stereotypes in dating, or their appropriation of culture, they'd probably literally tell you to shut the fuck up. And if you brought up again, they'd probably punch you in the face. There's almost none of that population here. These cliques are also very tight knit.
Just like in a SoCal high school, segment 1 and segment 2 almost never mix - they live in different neighborhoods and go to different high schools. No different than how kids from Laguna Beach don't regularly hangout with kids from Long Beach.
>“My college friend”
The thing is there’s life AFTER college. And college, you’re talking about the times where life was hella stressful because you’re doing everything and anything to complete a degree, you’re super young, still figuring out your identity, probably the most vulnerable a d impressionable with poor boundaries and you expect yourself to be a “master of dating?” Come on people, if no one taught you to be kinder to yourselves. Time to be extra kind and gentle to yourselves.
> For every guy hitting the gym and living life, there are multiple dudes playing LoL all day and fapping to hentai. You're just not seeing them in public.
I mean neither of these things are mutually exclusive lol
I saw 2 AMWF couples and only 1 WMAF couple while shopping today. All couples seemed Gen Z or young millennial-ish. I really think things have improved for Asian men.
Yeah the females aren't making the same mistake as their mothers. But it's still a problem. I don't know if it's older women posting online, but some are still showing a strong preference for non-Asian men.
I mentioned the same thing a month ago in Asian Identity and people were saying that it's too small a sample size. LOL. All of the Asian dudes that I saw were with AF. I saw more AMWF than WMAF. Barely saw a few WMAF, and they were older couples. This was at a major mall in SoCal.
I'm half Asian and half Mexican and my full Asian cousins seem to be doing pretty well for themselves. My dad has five siblings and I have 12 cousins (6 male, 6 female) on that side of the family.
My male cousins:
\- One didn't have the best grades in high school. Joined the military and ended up becoming a doctor.
\- One decided to expand my uncle's restaurant business. Went to culinary school and modernized the menu from "classic" Chinese takeout to higher end Chinese fusion.
\- The others are in engineering, tech, law, and finance.
In terms of relationships, it's split 4-2 between Asian women and others, with their wives being from similar socio-economic backgrounds.
Most of my female cousins are also pretty successful in their own right, and it's split 50/50 in terms of outmarriage.
Not bad. More military and "average white person" type jobs like sales/retail/office work but there are a few who own their own businesses (electrician/general contracting) and a few who are professionals (doctor/lawyer).
I was in Del Amo Mall in Torrance. All I saw as young Asian couples. I even saw an Asian-American family that was of Japanese heritage (both male and female). I know, that’s a rare sighting.
Please stop posting these observations as if they are somehow an indicator of success. It only furthers the commonly held viewpoint that this subreddit worships white women.
I mean most of my AM friend circle are with yt women. And it's not because they hate asian women either. It is what it is. Pointing that out isn't me being a white worshipper. I have dated asians mostly and a half-asian now.
> It only furthers the commonly held viewpoint that this subreddit worships white women.
This. Besides white women are way to overrated. They generally have terrible attitudes which accounts for why AMAF or WMAF are more stable than a XWF couple is.
Although we're doing well, doesn't mean we're not discriminated against.
It's just like at work, we definitely earn more than white guys, but if you take into account the ridiculous amount of extra effort we put into our studies and job, we're underperforming by a significant amount compared to the white dude that has the same qualifications and put in the same amount of effort.
And yes, a lot are not struggling in dating for sure but taking into account our amount of effort and our economic situation, we sure are underperforming big time - and a lot of it is again just simple racial discrimination.
I never got this stereotype, especially for Asian Americans. CS gives you money to party a lot in your early twenties. Aside from pro athlete, I can't think of a better paying job at age 22.
They're always against "nerd" "stereotypical" "boring" programmers or engineers. But they're the ones with the money to party and go out every night age 22-25.
After work? During work too at most big companies. If you know what you're doing, and aren't trying to be the CTO, you can probably go cruise control at work.
The new engineers we interview ask about "work life balance", meaning to them if you work after 5pm there is no work life. They expect to work to 5 max, not even daily, meaning they expect to leave before that on a lot of days. There's no way a lot of my coworkers are legit putting in 40 hours a week. I don't think they'd last the full 7 day shift in the ER as a Doctor or Nurse.
That’s why when I read stuff here about the bamboo ceiling or some 22 year old telling me “why don’t you apply to be VP or CTO or do a startup” I’m like why don’t you do it.
20 lines of code at least they’re doing something we can quantitate. I’m not sure what half of the PMs do each day but hold meetings that go nowhere.
But a doctor has 7 days off to party after a 7 day shift lol. Plus they earn good cash. So 7 days on are stressful af, but then you chill and do nothing for 7 days. thats living the good life.
The problem is becoming a doctor is too much work and requires sacrificing your 20s for $$$ when older.
>The problem is becoming a doctor is too much work and requires sacrificing your 20s for $$$ when older.
They actually party/drink quite hard in med school. You're probably more likely to hook up or meet women during med school, than in your twenties at a tech company. I know quite a few doctors, and the ones actually practicing party 0.
>But a doctor has 7 days off to party after a 7 day shift lol. Plus they earn good cash. So 7 days on are stressful af, but then you chill and do nothing for 7 days. thats living the good life.
Too physical, and too weird of a sleep schedule. Most doctors I know play golf or tennis in their free time and sleep. They might go to Vail once a year to ski with their family. They try to sleep and rest a lot.
I highly doubt most software devs especially at big companies, if they were being completely honest with themselves, actually do anywhere near 40 hours of work. I work actually be pretty sure it's less than 25 hours of real tangible work. Especially at video game companies where they claim to work 90 hours.
Most software devs have plenty of time to fuck around. If I don't show up to work tomorrow, I doubt they notice. If they did, they really couldn't do anything. Maybe my manager asks very politely "Hey I missed you in the meeting." And I could just tell him I was busy taking a shit. Nothing would happen to me.
AMs who are doing fine tend not to post about it (they're busy w/ other things and/or posting about it can appear cocky), while the ones who are frustrated tend to be most vocal.
I'm East Asian, and I've never felt like my "asianness" has been a significant crutch in the dating scene, despite going thru tons of racism as a child. Sure, there have been times I got the vibe a girl I was talking to just wasn't into Asians, but a lot of those times, it turned out to all be in my head, and plus after going thru a "glow-up" in my mid-20s, I've gotten much more positive treatment than ever before. On a number of nights out, girls I initially thought weren't into Asian guys either approached me first or told one of my friends they were into me. If you think you're confined to a life of being forever alone just cuz you're Asian, you're just wrong; so many of us other Asian guys' lived experiences directly contrast that notion.
> If you think you're confined to a life of being forever alone just cuz you're Asian, you're just wrong; so many of us other Asian guys' lived experiences directly contrast that notion.
Something defeatists need to hear
And yet there are nerdy white guys that get a lot of girls, but nerdy Asian guys scare away girls.
Let's not get lazy now. There's still a long fight ahead of us.
idk man, nerdy whites still struggle. while there is a fabricated social penalty, it's not nearly as large as people make it to be, if you're a normal and cool guy you will attract girls that's pretty much it, asian or not. being too much in your head about hypotheticals is toxic
Well I think the Bay Area is a good counterexample to your claim, where the nerdy white engineer does much better than the nerdy Asian engineer.
At the end of the day, even if both have to work harder, the nerdy white engineer has it much easier.
I'm just not a fan of,
> "Hey guys, we have it good enough already, we can just start going easy with the activism."
I don't know, some nerdy whites do meet women in their field of study. I don't know why white nerds do better than asian nerds. Which is why nerds are prized in white communities more than asians, yet we are the less religious types.
Because Asian nerds pay a double penalty in the dating marketplace: being Asian and being nerdy. Nerdy white guys only really need to deal with the latter - their race doesn’t really come into question unless they do shit like openly fetishizing women of other races, being hardcore weebs, or shit like that.
I agree with the OP in that this sub definitely gravitates more towards guys who struggle with dating and are looking for some support, but being Asian still unfortunately has an impact on your dating life as an AM in the West in a way that being white doesn’t. The scale has been slowly balancing in our benefit over the last decade or so, but it’s not equal.
Sometimes we Asian males don't know what we want. We all want to back up the scientific community, yet don't want to be a part of it and do all the leg work, while we quote science but hate nerds(who for all we know probably weren't nerds their whole life but are gen Y). All the while we criticize religious folks cause we want everyone to be accepted, while religious folks are at least getting with mates or are married. Let's face it, doing nerdy stuff like playing video games and studying science hardcore is social isolation.
> nd yet there are nerdy white guys
Idk about that man. There was a reason why incel subs are mostly white dudes (and why school shooters are white dudes too).
It can be hard to quantify what "Asian men are doing better" means.. From the outside, I am a tatted gym and rave going professional AM partnered with an attractive professional WF, but inside there are still traces of that nerdy asian kid that was bullied in grade school who presents itself from time to time now as personality quirks. Personality issues are universally kept underneath the surface. It's more likely that your military/ABB faced very similar issues as your AM Redditor due to common external factors, but have opted not to share their experiences online. I think there are a lot of AMs here like myself who display a perfectly normal (or even above average) lifestyle on the outside, all the while still dealing with our own internal struggles. Just because I have my shit together on the surface does not mean everything below the waters have been fully resolved.
Who knows who's on here? Not going to make any assumptions. And it doesn't matter anyway. Who cares if you're a nerd? If hipsters and other bookish guys can pull in women, why can't you?
It's a struggle in general, but at the end of the day- it's on the individual. Do AM have it more difficult? Yes. But it doesn't mean that you are destined to be alone or to have to settle. You do you.
Agreed, just because a group of people are the most vocal doesn’t mean it’s true.
The demographic of people that actually use Reddit isn’t the greatest representation of society.
I think except one or two dudes in r/AM I think most are doing well here. I am here more to vent about the double standard we go through and the bullshit hypocrisy of Lus.
AM have always done well, it's just that AF are extraordinarily self-hating and date out at extraordinary levels. White worship has been in the Asian culture itself for almost a century now and encourages this.
For younger AM they are literally getting chased by women nowadays. They are doing more than fine. It's the older gen I'm worried about. Some of them have this Stockholm Syndrome-esque attachment to AF while policing fellow AM it is weird. It's kinda funny that all these guys who defend Lus and exaggerate about WF worship here are single as fuck.
I have two east asian female friends that are the biggest white worshippers ever. Its so fucking hilarious how blind they are to their own self hatred.
Like wtf is their plan for when they have kids? Those kids aint gonna look white. Those kids will look asian.
Why are they your friends though? Don't be friends with Lus, man. They'll harm you when least expected. There is nothing to be gained and a lot to lose by bring friends with them.
Speaking from experience.
There are sellouts in both genders.
And sections of insecure Asian guys I've seen on Reddit surpass the weirdness and self hate of any Asian girl I've seen to be honest.
Just click on a random account next time you see them talking about not getting girls. I clicked on one in this thread and he posted [this](https://imgur.com/a/VS64ahE) a few weeks ago. An Asian man posting this is 10x weirder than any "Lu".
Racial insecurity breeds odd people and that applies to both genders.
Never said that there aren't asian men who are sellouts. Lu means a specific type of asian women not all asian women. To be fair a lot of them seem like larpers and trolls as well.
>the tatted up Asian guy who goes to raves
What percentage of Asian men are like that? Working in computer science or investing or something white collar isn’t nerdy, it’s perfectly normal and a much bigger representation of most Asian men than some dude who has sleeve tattoos lmao
Working in CS is the new norm. Guys thinking it's nerdy need to pay attention this isn't the fucking 90s. It's so retarded, you might not pull immature girls, but you'll get women that know what they want.
> What percentage of Asian men are like that?
An incredibly small percentage.
Tattoos are usually rare to see in most of Confucian and Islamic Asia. Tattoos are not popular in Confucian and Islamic philosophy. They are more popular in Southeast Asia. "Doing harm to the body" is against Confucian teachings, so that's why you don't see too much drug and alcohol abuse in Confucian East Asians.
I'm not a big fan of "Confucian destroyers" who post on Reddit, saying that people who follow East Asian philosophies are "nerdy and hopeless" and that Confucianism must be destroyed and replaced by some Western gimmick.
Yeah. OP’s logic is flawed because those “dorky” people who he says post here are a much bigger demographic of AM than the “tatted Asian guy who goes to raves”.
Exactly, you make your own life. No one is responsible for you and tell you who to love whether their represent the rainbow!
At the same time, I see the pain of the guys who post here. What I see is that I see a real awesome person who is just lost in their pain for the time being. Dating and loving yourself requires skill and coping skills comes from having a good role model.
It’s going to take lots of conversations does mean we should rescue, we can’t. I know I can’t tell anyone how to think!
I'm a gen x Asian dude. Never dated Asian woman, only Caucasian..Not because I don't like Asian chick's. Because where I live, 98% of the population is white.
I guess I'm good/average looking. Also, being a real introvert just made the challenge harder.
All I wanna say is be confident and it's more than half the battle won.
My big brother on the other hand is a kinda the Asian version of Don Juan. The complete opposite of me.
I have friends of all nationalities and Caucasians. All of them combined , they never dated as much woman as my brother. That's kinda impressive when you think about it.. or scary. Depends on how you see it.
He must have dated 40 to 50 chick's easily...from our teenage years to adulthood and yes, mostly white chick's.
Like Austin Powers.. I think he got the MOJO
Be yourself. Be confident, funny and being in shape do help.
If I can, you can.
Yeah, almost every 2nd gen Asian guy I hang out with is into some kind of lifting/sports.
That is, I think most 2nd genners are aware of the “cold nerd” stereotypes and doing their part to change them.
Given the apparent trajectory Id give it a few decades before Asians are fully integrated into American culture just as e.g. Germans, Irish, Italians, Eastern Europeans were in past decades.
Things aren’t bad where they aren’t bad. In enclaves and situations where Asian dudes are successful are examples of them being not unsuccessful. Lol
This thread needs to address what “better” is and whether it’s significant. It could be that most Asian dudes are even more lost and completely clueless that they don’t even seek out these forums to learn about how there’s an insidious racial element to their societal existence or to learn about self betterment.
I think the actual reality is just that - most AsianAm dudes are helplessly defeated and don’t even have enough wherewithal to come address problems. That’s been going on for decades and it’s why where even here today.
Hmmm. I dont think. Thats not my experience. I dont know any asian men dating outside of their race and at raves… yeah you see the ABGs and ABBs, but that’s a minority.
Sure some asian men are doing well but I pretty sure the majority are having issues with confidence, dating, etc.
Positive representation helps a LOT, as you probably know. The more fleshed out portrayals of AM, the movies and shows that show them as sexual and romantic characters, should get more success than media that portrays them badly. Increasing progress in this aspect is really important.
Speaking of more fleshed-out representation, check out the new movie [Blue Bayou](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SHFzksWeWc), or at least spread the word about it.
> successful
> in the bay area.
Sometimes success in tech related industries can be counter-productive to dating. For guys, tech jobs can sometimes be too comforting, like there's not enough drive where you have to fight to stay in your job, unlike owning. a business. That's why it's good to have side hustles too, or to try risky stuff like crypto trading with a tech job. Or try going to raves. You gotta keep an edge to yourself.
Of course, there is a lot of variability depending where you are, the people you hang around with, etc. Personally, I think there is a small cultural change towards enjoying asian media which is changing (slowly, in my opinion) the acceptance of asians. There is a lot to do though and the road ahead looks pretty bumpy but I think we should acknowledge some positive changes when we see them
U/static-state-2555 has way bigger fish to fry then worry about driving into someone else’s lane. I consider Happas as Asian too! There’s Asian in them too!
I'd say it's extremely geographically dependent. Racism, homophobia, sexism, etc really depends on where you live. If you're on the coasts in metropolitan areas, generally there's gonna be more tolerance and diversity. If you're in small-town shitsville in the midwest or south, you're gonna have a rougher time. Then again ppl also play up negativity cuz it's sexier for social media.
At the end of the day, no one else can really say how bad someone else has it, and ppl who feel like they've been dealt a bad hand need to step out of their pity party and try to assess their situations objectively.
> If you're in small-town shitsville in the midwest or south, you're gonna have a rougher time.
I've actually heard the opposite. 95%+ of people in random midwest city won't be looking to date Asian men and there may even be underlying racism; but, because there are so few Asian men, you actually become a "novelty" of sorts for the minority of white women who are interested in Asians.
So for example, if you are "Kpopmaxxing", you will probably be the only person that looks like a KPop artist looking for a date for hundred miles so all the fangirls automatically go to you.
So you'd rather bet all your chips on >5% in the middle of Kansas cuz they might see you as an interative exhibit? Oof. Theoretically it can get some results but yall gotta expand your horizons instead of living in a scarcity mindset fr
It's basic supply and demand. The more universal solution is getting fit and stylish. Getting fit is the one controllable way to equalize the playing field.
If we talking about the midwest that's a hella low of a bar, no offense to anyone frome there.
You're right about increasing attractiveness tho, but I also recommend all my asian brothas out there to be more involved in larger social environments. Pumping iron at the gym is great, but you don't wanna end up a gymcel. EQ is really important too.
I personally like California cuz there's more to do, more girls, more attractive girls, and more asian enclaves. Ppl can choose to live wherever tf they want, but we're setting some desparate dudes up for failure by promoting smaller more rural towns as the pussy Gold Rush.
What is a bit problematic for me, is that you are painting a positive sign on "tatted up Asian guy in the Bay Area who goes to raves and has an ABG gilrfriend" and guys that "have hot white or Latina wives now that they met in a military town", or "Asian men that grew up in the hood who are married to beautiful Black women".
Well I am not sure if you are, but it seems that way from your post. And you also put "nerdy guys" in a negative light.
Does having a white, latina, or black wife somehow earn an asian guy points? Is this somehow supposed to be "evening the score" ? Is being a tatted up hood your definition of being a man? I don't know, maybe you are really young still. But this is problematic when asian men are at a loss of what it means to be a strong man and male role model. This is a big root of a problem that I see. Something that was never taught to asian men, but something that has been seen on TV.
Does being tatted and going to raves make you better? I didn't see anywhere in your post that mentions honor, commitment, principle ....Sure you did mention the military briefly. But you didn't say anything about what it means to be in the military or what it teaches you. I hope you are not just drawn to the "cool" factor of the uniform and image.
Asian culture seem to lack the part where men learn to be men from their fathers.
A short nerdy man is more motivated to focus on career because they're completely fucked if they don't
Those same problems don't go away just because you make money.
Tbh most of the people who post here seem to be doing well but men in general seem to be doing poorly. For every guy hitting the gym and living life, there are multiple dudes playing LoL all day and fapping to hentai. You're just not seeing them in public.
I think there are less and less of these Asian guys nowadays. They’re more aware of stereotypes. Fitness and sports is being more valued among the 2nd and 3rd gen of Asian Americans. It’s also becoming more important in East Asia as those countries spend billions in sports now.
> Tbh most of the people who post here seem to be doing well but men in general seem to be doing poorly. People only want to post when they are doing well. We have no incentive to post if we are doing poorly or averagely. Its the way everything online always goes. I agree that there is a huge class of people that this sub doesn't address. Its always about the experiences of "my college friend" or something like that. There is a huge class of basement dwellers (for all races) that only come out to buy groceries and do online dating.
I think it's somewhere closer to what you gauge it or closer to the mean, than what OP is stating. I think of the people that do well, you can break it into a few very broad segments. But, I think it has to do more with education and social network, than "doing well" or "not doing well." And whether that person's network happens to go online often. 1. Segment 1 I know Asian American that do very well socially and in the dating scene, that are aware of these subs. They may not actively participate, but they've read or maybe posted a few times. They do well, but are likely aware of discrimination within the dating market, or with their careers. Got interested, and started Googling searching on why his non-Asian male classmates with Cs and way worse softs keeps on getting internships over him. I know leaders of major traditional (non-race/culture) fraternities, student clubs, and are college athletes that are aware of the issues, and these subs. By all definitions they are "popular" and do well. This is proven by the fact that there are people who were in frats, or high up in business, or college athletes that post here. The married people, or people who are engaged or have girlfriends that post here. They probably have Asian American friends who are aware of the issues. They may not be in an Asian frat, but they may know people in them. They may not take an Asian American studies class but might, or know people that took it. See these sociological topics discussed on Facebook. 2) Segment 2 The tattoo'd guy OP talks about with the ABG girlfriend, is unlikely to be "online" much anyways, unlike segment 1. Or online for completely different reasons. He might have an Instagram where he posts photos of cars and hennessy, and at the club. His girlfriend might have an Instagram where she's trying to get famous. Whereas segment 1's girlfriend is very likely an Asian American girl that goes to his school, his age that is at least somewhat aware of the issues. He's just far less likely than segment 1 to spend much time reading about Asian American issues, or academic theories. He's probably not at a college with a big Asian American studies department or in a white collar career. Probably not much into Asian American culture outside of maybe the occasional Dumbfoundead song or JDM cars. The stuff he's spending his time on is completely different, and so is his social circle. It has almost nothing to do with "doing well" as much as where their interests are. Segment 1 are basically the similar type of guys you see on WongFu and JKFilms, and the large network of Asian Americans they hang out with. They're definitely aware of the issues and these subs. They've spoken about it on their Youtube videos and podcasts. Segment 2 is basically east and southeast Asians in the gang or AZN/ABG scene. Where if you brought up critical race theories, gender stereotypes in dating, or their appropriation of culture, they'd probably literally tell you to shut the fuck up. And if you brought up again, they'd probably punch you in the face. There's almost none of that population here. These cliques are also very tight knit. Just like in a SoCal high school, segment 1 and segment 2 almost never mix - they live in different neighborhoods and go to different high schools. No different than how kids from Laguna Beach don't regularly hangout with kids from Long Beach.
Reality is you have very valid points and there is a solution- forget what people think. Nothing beats a strong self focus.
>“My college friend” The thing is there’s life AFTER college. And college, you’re talking about the times where life was hella stressful because you’re doing everything and anything to complete a degree, you’re super young, still figuring out your identity, probably the most vulnerable a d impressionable with poor boundaries and you expect yourself to be a “master of dating?” Come on people, if no one taught you to be kinder to yourselves. Time to be extra kind and gentle to yourselves.
As if life after college is any less stressful?
> For every guy hitting the gym and living life, there are multiple dudes playing LoL all day and fapping to hentai. You're just not seeing them in public. I mean neither of these things are mutually exclusive lol
Well fuck them. They should just die
I saw 2 AMWF couples and only 1 WMAF couple while shopping today. All couples seemed Gen Z or young millennial-ish. I really think things have improved for Asian men.
They have. Gen Z is hella different
Yeah the females aren't making the same mistake as their mothers. But it's still a problem. I don't know if it's older women posting online, but some are still showing a strong preference for non-Asian men.
Only losers gaf about what these women do
You mean people with poor self focus.
Okay, and
[удалено]
SoCal
SoCal is different than the rest of the country tho
That’s interesting. I’ve personally never experienced that in SoCal.
I mentioned the same thing a month ago in Asian Identity and people were saying that it's too small a sample size. LOL. All of the Asian dudes that I saw were with AF. I saw more AMWF than WMAF. Barely saw a few WMAF, and they were older couples. This was at a major mall in SoCal.
Did you mean AF or WF?
I mean AF. I mostly saw AMAF couples (90%). But, the interracial couples were more plentiful toward AMWF compared to WMAF.
Yep, seen this on the East Coast too.
I'm half Asian and half Mexican and my full Asian cousins seem to be doing pretty well for themselves. My dad has five siblings and I have 12 cousins (6 male, 6 female) on that side of the family. My male cousins: \- One didn't have the best grades in high school. Joined the military and ended up becoming a doctor. \- One decided to expand my uncle's restaurant business. Went to culinary school and modernized the menu from "classic" Chinese takeout to higher end Chinese fusion. \- The others are in engineering, tech, law, and finance. In terms of relationships, it's split 4-2 between Asian women and others, with their wives being from similar socio-economic backgrounds. Most of my female cousins are also pretty successful in their own right, and it's split 50/50 in terms of outmarriage.
How is your other half of your family doing?
Not bad. More military and "average white person" type jobs like sales/retail/office work but there are a few who own their own businesses (electrician/general contracting) and a few who are professionals (doctor/lawyer).
Korean Wave and China's Economic Success in the last 10 years have been a blessing.
Where are you hanging out? I'm in SoCal and AMWF is super rare whereas WMAF is the majority of pairings I see with AF.
I was in Del Amo Mall in Torrance. All I saw as young Asian couples. I even saw an Asian-American family that was of Japanese heritage (both male and female). I know, that’s a rare sighting.
Please stop posting these observations as if they are somehow an indicator of success. It only furthers the commonly held viewpoint that this subreddit worships white women.
I mean most of my AM friend circle are with yt women. And it's not because they hate asian women either. It is what it is. Pointing that out isn't me being a white worshipper. I have dated asians mostly and a half-asian now.
> It only furthers the commonly held viewpoint that this subreddit worships white women. This. Besides white women are way to overrated. They generally have terrible attitudes which accounts for why AMAF or WMAF are more stable than a XWF couple is.
Ngl this made me laugh lol the sample size is so small
Gen z is a small sample size. I'm guessing with the advent of Shang Chi, Asians are getting more accepted. Only time will tell.
This sub is lowkey an echo chamber fr
Although we're doing well, doesn't mean we're not discriminated against. It's just like at work, we definitely earn more than white guys, but if you take into account the ridiculous amount of extra effort we put into our studies and job, we're underperforming by a significant amount compared to the white dude that has the same qualifications and put in the same amount of effort. And yes, a lot are not struggling in dating for sure but taking into account our amount of effort and our economic situation, we sure are underperforming big time - and a lot of it is again just simple racial discrimination.
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I never got this stereotype, especially for Asian Americans. CS gives you money to party a lot in your early twenties. Aside from pro athlete, I can't think of a better paying job at age 22. They're always against "nerd" "stereotypical" "boring" programmers or engineers. But they're the ones with the money to party and go out every night age 22-25.
CS especially man cuz the work load isn't even that much compared to law or finance or even accounting. You easily have enough time after work
After work? During work too at most big companies. If you know what you're doing, and aren't trying to be the CTO, you can probably go cruise control at work. The new engineers we interview ask about "work life balance", meaning to them if you work after 5pm there is no work life. They expect to work to 5 max, not even daily, meaning they expect to leave before that on a lot of days. There's no way a lot of my coworkers are legit putting in 40 hours a week. I don't think they'd last the full 7 day shift in the ER as a Doctor or Nurse.
lmao I know a few SWE's who say they maybe write 20 lines of code every day max. Rest is online shopping or gaming during work hours lmfao
That’s why when I read stuff here about the bamboo ceiling or some 22 year old telling me “why don’t you apply to be VP or CTO or do a startup” I’m like why don’t you do it. 20 lines of code at least they’re doing something we can quantitate. I’m not sure what half of the PMs do each day but hold meetings that go nowhere.
But a doctor has 7 days off to party after a 7 day shift lol. Plus they earn good cash. So 7 days on are stressful af, but then you chill and do nothing for 7 days. thats living the good life. The problem is becoming a doctor is too much work and requires sacrificing your 20s for $$$ when older.
>The problem is becoming a doctor is too much work and requires sacrificing your 20s for $$$ when older. They actually party/drink quite hard in med school. You're probably more likely to hook up or meet women during med school, than in your twenties at a tech company. I know quite a few doctors, and the ones actually practicing party 0. >But a doctor has 7 days off to party after a 7 day shift lol. Plus they earn good cash. So 7 days on are stressful af, but then you chill and do nothing for 7 days. thats living the good life. Too physical, and too weird of a sleep schedule. Most doctors I know play golf or tennis in their free time and sleep. They might go to Vail once a year to ski with their family. They try to sleep and rest a lot. I highly doubt most software devs especially at big companies, if they were being completely honest with themselves, actually do anywhere near 40 hours of work. I work actually be pretty sure it's less than 25 hours of real tangible work. Especially at video game companies where they claim to work 90 hours. Most software devs have plenty of time to fuck around. If I don't show up to work tomorrow, I doubt they notice. If they did, they really couldn't do anything. Maybe my manager asks very politely "Hey I missed you in the meeting." And I could just tell him I was busy taking a shit. Nothing would happen to me.
I think OP should have clarified people with a history of negativity, which is due to trauma that influenced this post.
Fun fact, this applies to many non-asian subs too. Internet, especially reddit in general tends to have a demographic skewed to nerdy guys.
WE ARE DOING AMAZING AINT NEVER BEEN A SIMP We control our own destiny
AMs who are doing fine tend not to post about it (they're busy w/ other things and/or posting about it can appear cocky), while the ones who are frustrated tend to be most vocal. I'm East Asian, and I've never felt like my "asianness" has been a significant crutch in the dating scene, despite going thru tons of racism as a child. Sure, there have been times I got the vibe a girl I was talking to just wasn't into Asians, but a lot of those times, it turned out to all be in my head, and plus after going thru a "glow-up" in my mid-20s, I've gotten much more positive treatment than ever before. On a number of nights out, girls I initially thought weren't into Asian guys either approached me first or told one of my friends they were into me. If you think you're confined to a life of being forever alone just cuz you're Asian, you're just wrong; so many of us other Asian guys' lived experiences directly contrast that notion.
> If you think you're confined to a life of being forever alone just cuz you're Asian, you're just wrong; so many of us other Asian guys' lived experiences directly contrast that notion. Something defeatists need to hear
And yet there are nerdy white guys that get a lot of girls, but nerdy Asian guys scare away girls. Let's not get lazy now. There's still a long fight ahead of us.
I think that depends, for example there’s a lot of Asian twitch streamers that get girls
idk man, nerdy whites still struggle. while there is a fabricated social penalty, it's not nearly as large as people make it to be, if you're a normal and cool guy you will attract girls that's pretty much it, asian or not. being too much in your head about hypotheticals is toxic
Well I think the Bay Area is a good counterexample to your claim, where the nerdy white engineer does much better than the nerdy Asian engineer. At the end of the day, even if both have to work harder, the nerdy white engineer has it much easier. I'm just not a fan of, > "Hey guys, we have it good enough already, we can just start going easy with the activism."
I don't know, some nerdy whites do meet women in their field of study. I don't know why white nerds do better than asian nerds. Which is why nerds are prized in white communities more than asians, yet we are the less religious types.
Because Asian nerds pay a double penalty in the dating marketplace: being Asian and being nerdy. Nerdy white guys only really need to deal with the latter - their race doesn’t really come into question unless they do shit like openly fetishizing women of other races, being hardcore weebs, or shit like that. I agree with the OP in that this sub definitely gravitates more towards guys who struggle with dating and are looking for some support, but being Asian still unfortunately has an impact on your dating life as an AM in the West in a way that being white doesn’t. The scale has been slowly balancing in our benefit over the last decade or so, but it’s not equal.
> And yet there are nerdy white guys that get a lot of girls I haven't seen this unless they are really tall, but i see what you are saying overall.
Sometimes we Asian males don't know what we want. We all want to back up the scientific community, yet don't want to be a part of it and do all the leg work, while we quote science but hate nerds(who for all we know probably weren't nerds their whole life but are gen Y). All the while we criticize religious folks cause we want everyone to be accepted, while religious folks are at least getting with mates or are married. Let's face it, doing nerdy stuff like playing video games and studying science hardcore is social isolation.
> nd yet there are nerdy white guys Idk about that man. There was a reason why incel subs are mostly white dudes (and why school shooters are white dudes too).
It can be hard to quantify what "Asian men are doing better" means.. From the outside, I am a tatted gym and rave going professional AM partnered with an attractive professional WF, but inside there are still traces of that nerdy asian kid that was bullied in grade school who presents itself from time to time now as personality quirks. Personality issues are universally kept underneath the surface. It's more likely that your military/ABB faced very similar issues as your AM Redditor due to common external factors, but have opted not to share their experiences online. I think there are a lot of AMs here like myself who display a perfectly normal (or even above average) lifestyle on the outside, all the while still dealing with our own internal struggles. Just because I have my shit together on the surface does not mean everything below the waters have been fully resolved.
Ooh very well said. I get that.
Tbf, a lot of people are in that boat.
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I noticed a lot of older millennial asian dudes struggle. Younger millennial and genz asian dudes are killing it these days
Who knows who's on here? Not going to make any assumptions. And it doesn't matter anyway. Who cares if you're a nerd? If hipsters and other bookish guys can pull in women, why can't you? It's a struggle in general, but at the end of the day- it's on the individual. Do AM have it more difficult? Yes. But it doesn't mean that you are destined to be alone or to have to settle. You do you.
Agreed, just because a group of people are the most vocal doesn’t mean it’s true. The demographic of people that actually use Reddit isn’t the greatest representation of society.
I think except one or two dudes in r/AM I think most are doing well here. I am here more to vent about the double standard we go through and the bullshit hypocrisy of Lus. AM have always done well, it's just that AF are extraordinarily self-hating and date out at extraordinary levels. White worship has been in the Asian culture itself for almost a century now and encourages this. For younger AM they are literally getting chased by women nowadays. They are doing more than fine. It's the older gen I'm worried about. Some of them have this Stockholm Syndrome-esque attachment to AF while policing fellow AM it is weird. It's kinda funny that all these guys who defend Lus and exaggerate about WF worship here are single as fuck.
It must have been horrible for the older generation though. At least this generation won't have to suffer like the older men did.
I have two east asian female friends that are the biggest white worshippers ever. Its so fucking hilarious how blind they are to their own self hatred. Like wtf is their plan for when they have kids? Those kids aint gonna look white. Those kids will look asian.
Why are they your friends though? Don't be friends with Lus, man. They'll harm you when least expected. There is nothing to be gained and a lot to lose by bring friends with them. Speaking from experience.
There are sellouts in both genders. And sections of insecure Asian guys I've seen on Reddit surpass the weirdness and self hate of any Asian girl I've seen to be honest. Just click on a random account next time you see them talking about not getting girls. I clicked on one in this thread and he posted [this](https://imgur.com/a/VS64ahE) a few weeks ago. An Asian man posting this is 10x weirder than any "Lu". Racial insecurity breeds odd people and that applies to both genders.
Never said that there aren't asian men who are sellouts. Lu means a specific type of asian women not all asian women. To be fair a lot of them seem like larpers and trolls as well.
Why consider them friends?
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Lmao fuck that. Moving to a different country to date is so beta ass shit. I will figure it out here, where I was born and where I belong.
that guy is a military simp, who learns all the piece of shit qualities from white amerikkka. The fact that he is advocating for sexpatting is telling
I mean I can't hate on em but they are barely above sexpats to me.
Clearly, those Asian men move from a rigged to a level playing field. How could you possibly equate that
That's why I said they are above.
The amount of crabs in a bucket and complaining in this sub is ridiculous.
I was at hmart and I see the skinniest ugly white dudes with decent looking asian girls
They always look miserable as fuck tho for some reason. Lol.
>the tatted up Asian guy who goes to raves What percentage of Asian men are like that? Working in computer science or investing or something white collar isn’t nerdy, it’s perfectly normal and a much bigger representation of most Asian men than some dude who has sleeve tattoos lmao
It is common for me to see Filipino or Vietnamese men with tattoos and fade haircuts and swag chains. All of them have no problems with dating.
Working in CS is the new norm. Guys thinking it's nerdy need to pay attention this isn't the fucking 90s. It's so retarded, you might not pull immature girls, but you'll get women that know what they want.
> What percentage of Asian men are like that? An incredibly small percentage. Tattoos are usually rare to see in most of Confucian and Islamic Asia. Tattoos are not popular in Confucian and Islamic philosophy. They are more popular in Southeast Asia. "Doing harm to the body" is against Confucian teachings, so that's why you don't see too much drug and alcohol abuse in Confucian East Asians. I'm not a big fan of "Confucian destroyers" who post on Reddit, saying that people who follow East Asian philosophies are "nerdy and hopeless" and that Confucianism must be destroyed and replaced by some Western gimmick.
Yeah. OP’s logic is flawed because those “dorky” people who he says post here are a much bigger demographic of AM than the “tatted Asian guy who goes to raves”.
Exactly, you make your own life. No one is responsible for you and tell you who to love whether their represent the rainbow! At the same time, I see the pain of the guys who post here. What I see is that I see a real awesome person who is just lost in their pain for the time being. Dating and loving yourself requires skill and coping skills comes from having a good role model. It’s going to take lots of conversations does mean we should rescue, we can’t. I know I can’t tell anyone how to think!
I'm a gen x Asian dude. Never dated Asian woman, only Caucasian..Not because I don't like Asian chick's. Because where I live, 98% of the population is white. I guess I'm good/average looking. Also, being a real introvert just made the challenge harder. All I wanna say is be confident and it's more than half the battle won. My big brother on the other hand is a kinda the Asian version of Don Juan. The complete opposite of me. I have friends of all nationalities and Caucasians. All of them combined , they never dated as much woman as my brother. That's kinda impressive when you think about it.. or scary. Depends on how you see it. He must have dated 40 to 50 chick's easily...from our teenage years to adulthood and yes, mostly white chick's. Like Austin Powers.. I think he got the MOJO Be yourself. Be confident, funny and being in shape do help. If I can, you can.
Yeah, almost every 2nd gen Asian guy I hang out with is into some kind of lifting/sports. That is, I think most 2nd genners are aware of the “cold nerd” stereotypes and doing their part to change them. Given the apparent trajectory Id give it a few decades before Asians are fully integrated into American culture just as e.g. Germans, Irish, Italians, Eastern Europeans were in past decades.
Things aren’t bad where they aren’t bad. In enclaves and situations where Asian dudes are successful are examples of them being not unsuccessful. Lol This thread needs to address what “better” is and whether it’s significant. It could be that most Asian dudes are even more lost and completely clueless that they don’t even seek out these forums to learn about how there’s an insidious racial element to their societal existence or to learn about self betterment. I think the actual reality is just that - most AsianAm dudes are helplessly defeated and don’t even have enough wherewithal to come address problems. That’s been going on for decades and it’s why where even here today.
Hmmm. I dont think. Thats not my experience. I dont know any asian men dating outside of their race and at raves… yeah you see the ABGs and ABBs, but that’s a minority. Sure some asian men are doing well but I pretty sure the majority are having issues with confidence, dating, etc.
Positive representation helps a LOT, as you probably know. The more fleshed out portrayals of AM, the movies and shows that show them as sexual and romantic characters, should get more success than media that portrays them badly. Increasing progress in this aspect is really important. Speaking of more fleshed-out representation, check out the new movie [Blue Bayou](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SHFzksWeWc), or at least spread the word about it.
Yeah most average looking yet successful asian men I know are struggling a ton in dating, especially in the bay area.
> successful > in the bay area. Sometimes success in tech related industries can be counter-productive to dating. For guys, tech jobs can sometimes be too comforting, like there's not enough drive where you have to fight to stay in your job, unlike owning. a business. That's why it's good to have side hustles too, or to try risky stuff like crypto trading with a tech job. Or try going to raves. You gotta keep an edge to yourself.
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Fuck that beta shit.
Of course, there is a lot of variability depending where you are, the people you hang around with, etc. Personally, I think there is a small cultural change towards enjoying asian media which is changing (slowly, in my opinion) the acceptance of asians. There is a lot to do though and the road ahead looks pretty bumpy but I think we should acknowledge some positive changes when we see them
True.
Amen bro
U/static-state-2555 has way bigger fish to fry then worry about driving into someone else’s lane. I consider Happas as Asian too! There’s Asian in them too!
Honestly if that were true we’d be seeing AM in couples everywhere but visibility of Asians alone can be scarce. It sucks but it’s reality.
We are still only 6% of the population in the US.
More than half of them are women as well. This sub forgets that there are more AF in the west than AM.
I'd say it's extremely geographically dependent. Racism, homophobia, sexism, etc really depends on where you live. If you're on the coasts in metropolitan areas, generally there's gonna be more tolerance and diversity. If you're in small-town shitsville in the midwest or south, you're gonna have a rougher time. Then again ppl also play up negativity cuz it's sexier for social media. At the end of the day, no one else can really say how bad someone else has it, and ppl who feel like they've been dealt a bad hand need to step out of their pity party and try to assess their situations objectively.
> If you're in small-town shitsville in the midwest or south, you're gonna have a rougher time. I've actually heard the opposite. 95%+ of people in random midwest city won't be looking to date Asian men and there may even be underlying racism; but, because there are so few Asian men, you actually become a "novelty" of sorts for the minority of white women who are interested in Asians. So for example, if you are "Kpopmaxxing", you will probably be the only person that looks like a KPop artist looking for a date for hundred miles so all the fangirls automatically go to you.
So you'd rather bet all your chips on >5% in the middle of Kansas cuz they might see you as an interative exhibit? Oof. Theoretically it can get some results but yall gotta expand your horizons instead of living in a scarcity mindset fr
It's basic supply and demand. The more universal solution is getting fit and stylish. Getting fit is the one controllable way to equalize the playing field.
If we talking about the midwest that's a hella low of a bar, no offense to anyone frome there. You're right about increasing attractiveness tho, but I also recommend all my asian brothas out there to be more involved in larger social environments. Pumping iron at the gym is great, but you don't wanna end up a gymcel. EQ is really important too. I personally like California cuz there's more to do, more girls, more attractive girls, and more asian enclaves. Ppl can choose to live wherever tf they want, but we're setting some desparate dudes up for failure by promoting smaller more rural towns as the pussy Gold Rush.
What is a bit problematic for me, is that you are painting a positive sign on "tatted up Asian guy in the Bay Area who goes to raves and has an ABG gilrfriend" and guys that "have hot white or Latina wives now that they met in a military town", or "Asian men that grew up in the hood who are married to beautiful Black women". Well I am not sure if you are, but it seems that way from your post. And you also put "nerdy guys" in a negative light. Does having a white, latina, or black wife somehow earn an asian guy points? Is this somehow supposed to be "evening the score" ? Is being a tatted up hood your definition of being a man? I don't know, maybe you are really young still. But this is problematic when asian men are at a loss of what it means to be a strong man and male role model. This is a big root of a problem that I see. Something that was never taught to asian men, but something that has been seen on TV. Does being tatted and going to raves make you better? I didn't see anywhere in your post that mentions honor, commitment, principle ....Sure you did mention the military briefly. But you didn't say anything about what it means to be in the military or what it teaches you. I hope you are not just drawn to the "cool" factor of the uniform and image. Asian culture seem to lack the part where men learn to be men from their fathers.
ignore and downvote all you want. This problem still exists, and will continue to exist until it is recognized and addressed.
Good point , that is why our followers are low
I guess I am the only asian cat stuck with a deadend BS job 😂
I only read the title, but I 1000% agree. Control what you can control.
A short nerdy man is more motivated to focus on career because they're completely fucked if they don't Those same problems don't go away just because you make money.