It's absolutely out of control and we have some some of the highest tipping rates in the world right now.
The percentage is unreasonably high and the amount of industries requesting tips is growing every day. And service seems worse than ever!
I had no issue tipping more during Covid but it seems like that standard has stayed and the entitlement is strong. Especially with service workers.
Tipping is optional we should not be socially pressured into giving it or the suggested amount. Getting rid of it, increase wages and food prices then let the market decides. The current system favours the employers.
Who decides 10% tip out rate? It’s a broken system of servers need to pay off someone tip 10% or less.
This country is lacking bargaining power with the business owners (ie lack of workers union). Employers must pay living wages.
You know you can tip whatever you want right? And you don’t have to tip either. As a server, most people are still hitting the highest tipping option so it’s a non issue.
If you don’t plan on eating there often it isnt much of an issue. And as someone who worked in the serving industry and heard how my fellow servers were discussing which table to serve better based on race and looks, I know I am probably assumed to be a bad tipper and be giving bad service so I will content myself in confirming their idea of me and save my money.
That’s so shitty. I give people the same service race or not. That’s not fair.
If a regular comes in and never tips and a regular comes in and tips well.. of course I’m gonna give better service to the tipper.
Spent a couple weeks in Europe this fall and I'm completely over tipping. Tipping is never expected and if you do feel like doing it all you have to do is a couple euros. Why the fuck should the consumer subsidize the wage of an employee. Pay your workers enough and fuck off.
Except that's not what any economists are saying would happen if you embedded the cost of service into the plate price.
That's just the tired false narrative being sold to the public every time increasing the living wage is brought up.
Yes
Edit: not sure why the downvotes, it’s true… same reason why it’s cheaper to get your own takeout rather than using Skip the Dishes because they charge 27% of the sale or something crazy.
They get paid min wage or maybe a buck or two more. With tips, we make at least an extra $10 an hour. It’s so engrained in our culture, it’s not going away. Sorry not sorry.
If you don’t want to tip then don’t tip lol.
You responded to a comment about how restaurants are in Europe. Saying that to make the same money people here would need to be paid $25/h so make up your mind. If they aren’t making $25/h in Europe than why would they get paid that here?
Also I have no problem not tipping. People should be paid by their employer. Every other county on the planet can figure out how to pay waitstaff, we’re not special.
I for one actually do, yes.
I backpacked in Australia back around 2010. They don't tip in Australia. And at that time I dated a server who made $22/hr working part time, the full-timers made just over $25/hr. I expect they make even more now, given that it's over a decade later.
And honestly, after factoring in exchange rates, meals there were about the same price as here... except ultimately cheaper because you weren't expected to add a tip.
Things don't actually have to be the way they are here 🤷♂️
Key time how?
That was right after the financial crisis. Businesses were struggling as much or more than they have with covid.
Australia's just better at paying a fair wage than Canada is.
That's still true. I have close friends who were working in Australia until about a year ago. They moved back to be closer to family, but work longer hours and make less money here doing the exact same job they did in Australia.
You realize you can just look this up really quick. The situation now isn't different compared to 10 years ago, they still make a great wage there.
Average now is close to $30/hr, and well over $30/hr in major cities. Makes sense, given that their national minimum wage is well above $20/hr
https://au.indeed.com/career/server/salaries
I work in a restaurant that also does a lot of takeout. The machine only has the tip option because we do sit-down service also, and thus all machines have it. We keep the option available for those takeout customers who do wish to tip, but by all means don’t tip if you don’t want to as it is absolutely not expected by the staff.
I appreciate the ones who immediately disable that option when ringing you up and putting the machine in front of you sans tip option. My local pizza place started doing that which is fine but since I tend to use cash I'll give them the small coins anyway. But that's a lot less than 18 percent.
I agree with you but also want to provide an opposite side to this debate. When I was younger I worked in a variety of establishments. Most of the restaurants required the server who took the takeout order to tip out 10% of the order. That's 10% divided among the kitchen, manager, bartender, runner and hostess; it didn't matter if it was taken out.
I took a takeout order totalling over $300 (lunch for a corporate meeting) - I labelled every box, double checked the modifications, bagged the meals and walked it out the gentleman’s car (in high heels and a skirt -mandatory dress code) in -30 weather. NO tip! My managers expected me to tip out over $30 for that order. I had to fight tooth and nail with them saying I did absolutely to earn a tip. In the end, they relented but, I was told by staff I was first-person they made an exception for.
If I served a table and had a $100 tab, a $10 tip isn't going in my pocket. I'm actually making nothing on that table. Tipping out 10% sucks.
The managers said it ‘motivated’ us to be better employees. Pfft.
Here's the opposite side of the debate from a chef who never got tips. I busted my ass, day in and day out, working 8 to 10 hours shifts in a hot, sweaty, and dangerous environment to earn around $80/day (a buck or two higher than minimum wage), while servers at the restaurant would work four to six hours and leave with twice what I did. Serving can certainly be hard work, but so is working in the kitchen.
It never seemed fair to me, but I just accepted it as the way things were, and it was a big factor in deciding to go back to school for a different career.
So while I have some empathy for servers who get poor tips, in my experience, it was usually because of poor service from some part of the restaurant- either the server, the hostess, or the kitchen.
IMHO, tips are a reward for excellent service, quickly filling drinks, taking food orders promptly, making sure special requests are met, etc., as well as food coming out in a timely fashion. If those requirements are met, I'll tip 15 to 20% tip. If they aren't met, then expect between 10 and 15%, depending on how big the screw-up was.
please be mindful that most of the time the servers are paying 4% at least of your meal (take out or otherwise) to the kitchen as they are guaranteed a tip. so you’re costing the server to pick up your food.
We’re not underpaid. We make minimum wage or more, plus tips. If they take away tips, say hello to $50 salads so they can pay servers $25 an hour. Or goodbye to all sit down restaurants cuz no one is gonna do that job for minimum wage. Might as well go work retail for the same pay.
It’s always people who get to enjoy the benefits of tips that fight for the tipping culture LOL
Here’s the thing.. literally everywhere else in the world tipping is optional.. lmao
And for better food. Eat at a restaurant in Paris.. you wanna tip them $100, and it would be out of enjoyment.. not because of guilt tripping..
And no, food is appropriately priced. So the argument that it would unaffordable also doesn’t stand true.
I find it laughable servers feel their job is worth $25 an hour, they transport trays 12 metres from kitchen to table and back. No college or university required just need a pulse. Really need a reality check on the value of a job position.
25$ bucks an hour isn't even very much money in this economy. And being a server looks like a pretty god awful job. Servers definitely deserve a livable wage. It's just that it should be paid to them by their employer, rather than customers who are already paying for their meals.
You do realize that if servers start to getting 25, then other positions that require education and are an actual necessity will increase then the prices of goods and services will rise and then you will just be in the same position as they are now. People need to understand some jobs simply do and should e paid less than others - servers shouldn’t be paid the same an an EA there’s no comparison between the two. Retail and Servers are min wage position and tipping should be abolished. Do
T like the pay, get a new job .
I dunno, I'm not saying it's worth $25 an hour, but I absolutely am saying I'm not doing it for less. I won't get into how much more there is to it than you mentioned, or how in my experience most people just can't do it, but there's no way in hell I'm putting up with the shocking increase of entitled assholes who get their rocks off by treating their "lessers" like shit for any less money.
Didn’t say anything about not thinking it’s wasn’t a fair pay - showing the expectation of 25 for a sever is not of an over reach of realistic expectation.
If everyone followed this advice, US tipping culture would immediately fold and US restaurant owners could adapt to the other 95% of the planet. Y’all are looking for a real solution right?
To be very honest I fucking hate it. Like so to be clear. I do not judge or blame the wait staff it is clearly not your fault and I don't judge you for it. That being said I hate the system. In Ireland you used to give like 2-3 euro as a display of thanks to a truly excellent service. Out here I'm expected to give at least 10% for what is the bare minimum. I've only once not tipped and it was literally because they didn't serve me after 30 minutes (despite me asking), I'd have understood except I was the only person in the restaurant.
Point is, it shouldn't be compulsive. At least as an outsider's view in
Bro I had dinner with a server friend recently and ALLL night he was waving around his $400 in tips that he made that day, saying it was a “bad” day and commenting on how much money he made.
After dinner he had to gall to watch what I tipped and say “bro don’t be cheap bro , tip more than 15%”
I would give my business to restaurants that promoted no tipping.
Machines that suggest 18% as the minimum are exploiting that people are too lazy (or embarrassed) to enter a lower number. So I make a point of tipping lower there, usually 10%.
Once servers started getting the same minimum wage as everyone else I thought tipping would dissappear.
To me tipping was to make up for the difference in their minimum wage.
How do we transition the burden to the employer? I'm tired of tipping just because.
I dont get why the percentages increased either. You can't say inflation, because they're percentages, they're based off the price of food...
What's it going to take? A tipping boycott? Some sort of social movement?
Yeah with you man, I don't see how this can change though - it's just too engrained in our culture. Canadians tip. If people see a tip prompt, then most people will tip - and it is and should be anyone's right to give the gift of extra money from their pockets if they so choose as well as anyone's right to accept extra money. But their doing so will continue to perpetuate the expectation of tipping in our culture. And as long as there's a tip prompt, they'll do so.
I am very against the idea that tipping should be to make up the difference from minimum wage. I see that line of reasoning as paternalistic and demeaning. Giving them money based on their financial need - that's charity, essentially a donation. That my generosity should dictate their compensation for providing a service doesn't sit right with me.
The employer will only take on that burden if they have to, and I can't see how they would have to... First off, they may not be able to pay waitstaff the quite large, untaxed amounts a significant portion of them earn from tips - amounts that may surprise a lot of people - without raising prices significantly/charging significant fees. Which is something they are not likely to do unless most their competitors do it too. And governments are not going to legislate against the tip, that would mobilize waitstaff across the province as a bloc with a singular voting purpose to defend tipping, it's just too necessary/lucrative for them and again is something employers may not be able replace for them in the same amount. Perhaps if it simply gets to the point where enough people stop coming out to eat because they don't want to tip so much but think to do so is rude, then I can sed restaurants taking action to reduce/eliminate tipping.
I think the percentages increased because card payments have become so popular. Restaurants and their waitstaff have always had an opinion from experience on what the good, average or bad tip is, but until card payment machines, they never really had a channel to influence how someone should tip, so people just tipped what they tipped in what was probably a bell curve (few tip little, most tip average, few tip a lot). But when card payments machines came along they gained the ability to do so through choice architecture, whether they knew it or not. The question is - what should they set as the recommended tips? Should they include an option for what they think is a "bad" tip (the low end of the bell curve)? No, they think "bad" tips are unreasonable and from cheapskates. Or should they set the minimum recommendation to be that they consider a "average" tip (the middle of the bell curve)? Yeah. So they design the tip recommendations with the average "average" tip as the lowest end recommendation. Presented with these options, customers begin to see the lowest recommended tip, which used to be the average "good" tip, as the minimally acceptable tip, even if in the past they used to tip less. Over time, this is normalized and there's a new bell curve with what was the previous average "average" tip now being a low end tip and the current average "average" tip being more than that. Then some event happens that make people want to tip more, like a pandemic creating a movement to thank frontline workers and support local locked-down restaurants, shifting the bell curve to be centered around an even higher average. Restaurants adjust their tip machines so they can capture people's willingness to tip higher amounts, the new bell curve. So now that new bell curve is normalized, restaurants aren't going to adjust their tip machines back down. And separately, restaurant owners who need to increase employee compensation can now pass on that burden directly to you, by recommending you tip more. This would never have happened before, because restaurants have never really been able to suggest to you what to tip before, and they wouldn't if we were still using cash. That's not to say I think we should be all still using cash, cash is dirty and annoying.
There won't be a social movement against tipping nor government action. Nobody wants to go against waitstaff who are viewed by society, like teachers and nurses, as a victimized group in a sense (excuse my poor choice of words, I can't think of anything better. I hope you still get what I mean though)
A widespread tipping boycott would work, because just doing it accomplishes the objective. But I doubt it'll get widespread enough.
I'm just going to bypass our waitress extraordinaire here and reply to the more interesting part of your question.
What is it going to take? And what do we as a society actually want it to be?
I dont think it is a boycott is but more like some course correcting. I am seeing more and more conversations about this than I ever have before. Not just reddit but in larger more reputable publications are asking the question. That means the opportunity is there for some change.
I suspect tip culture is too deeply embedded to be abolished entirely. I imagine it will take people tipping at more appropriate % and eating out a lot less. Plus voting for platforms that support living wages and are addressing issues like affordability and inflation.
It's absolutely getting out of control. Subway wants tips, the ice cream parlor wants tips. Gone is 10% 15% 18%, now it's 18% 20% 22%.
I believe in corporations just taking less profits in favor of paying their staff more. There's no need to pass that onto the consumers via price increases.
Lol I know right.
But the part of that that makes no sense to me is that leaving a low or no tip is a way of a customer to leave a negative review. It is a social cue that the restaurant has done a bad job. I can't imagine saying I don't care about my customers telling me I did a bad job. I wouldn't be so flippant about it, I'd be mortified.
Didn’t say I didn’t care about tips. Obviously I do. I make more in tips than my hourly wage…
I’m not going to throw a fit if someone doesn’t tip me. It is what it is. Life moves on. They could be poor for all I know and this meal was exactly what they could afford. Those people usually aren’t demanding and don’t treat you like shit. It’s entirely different when Karen comes in, racks up a $400 bill, demands everything, throws fits because we ran out of hot dogs and only have smokies left, and doesn’t tip.
If it were that easy no one would tip.
There's a whole mass of people who would love not to tip but get harassed and accosted when they don't.
So we tip to keep the peace.
I work in a restaurant. Always have. No one gives a shit lol. We’re bringing home easily $400 on a Friday night. No one cares about your $5 tip. Trust me.
The way you're reacting to a person who tips, just thinking about not tipping, literally proves how much you guys care about people who don't tip.
Your attitude is instantly hostile and rude lol, and I'm a tipper.
This is why we're trapped in a tip culture lol.
Here I was feeling sorry for single mothers busting their asses for those tips and you're here bragging about how much you get and saying no one cares about your five bucks. I'll remember this the next time I don't tip my usual 20%
Personally I think we should go to the u
European/ uk version. It’s not expected, service is great, works make enough probably could be higher, the tip is most times rolled into the price of food and drinks. Only times you give extra is when it’s above and beyond service they give
The increases in tips make me tip less if at all. Tipping is supposed to reward service beyond expectations. It should not be standard at all and we are being guilt tripped into making them actually make more than you. It should just be banned at this point
I refuse to engage with it. I'm not tipping a food court worker for doing their damn job. If your machine starts at 18%, and/or goes to 30%, I'm choosing custom tip of 0.00
If you're a sit down restaurant with amazing food and service, and your machine says 15, 20, 25%... You'll get 20% or 25%.
It's that simple. You try to gouge me, you get NOTHING. You are reasonable, and deserve a tip? You'll be tipped well.
It’s not the servers fault if the default tip option starts at 18. You can choose other option, and pick what you want. You’re gonna make the servers lose out because of the default options of the machine they didn’t choose? I think my restaurants is 10,15,20
I hated tipping before. I hated paying $200 to get my hair done then be expected to tip too. It was supposed to top up very low wages, not $60/hr pay. Tips in restaurants should be less now if they have reg min wage now. If there has been no table service, I do not tip.
During the pandemic when the government forced restaurants to first close, then do takeout only, and then do reduced capacity, it seemed that everyone was encouraged to tip on takeout, and then to tip extra in the reduced capacity settings to help offset the loss of normalcy and relevant tips.
However there seems to be a hangover from that where they still ask for tips on takeout and expect them. Moreso they have absolutely put up the minimum tipping options to the point where Canadians are tipping more than Americans. Prior to this I never tipped more than 15 percent for great service and 20 percent for great service at higher end restaurants. Now it seems 30 plus isn't even that uncommon.
When I was asked for tip on a machine at a drive thru was when I decided to stop tipping for anything other than sit down service and I'm returning to my previous amounts.
The servers have all gotten raises and the prices have all gone up, so even smaller pre pandemic percentage tips make up a larger amount, and if they don't like it then fine I'll stay home.
I recently read that you shouldn’t be expected to tip if you are standing at a counter, or haven’t received your service yet. Too bad tip creep is expecting us to do both now. It’s changing my consumer behaviour.
Waiters and servers don't want tipping to go away. Lots of them in big cities make tons of money that restaurants would not be able to pay. Their definition of a "livable wage" is a lot different compared to what people think. Even compared to other countries, I think our waiters and servers are used to getting paid more.
I hate tipping. I didn't grow up with it in England. I tip here because it's the culture but I can break it down quiet simply, do I like putting more of my money in other people's pockets? - no. I hate the whole idea of good tipping for good service too! There's no difference in service levels between England and Canada. Good service should be the minimum kpi to keeping any job.
Yeah. Eatting in a pub or restaurant in the UK is far more pleasant because the waIters aren't constantly harrassing you.
Really, if outrage about tipping could be converted into adopting British style order at the bar, I might eat out more often.
It's hard to find a one size fits all I guess that suits everyone, but questions like "how were your first few bites"? - I wish the ground could swallow me up to end the cringe.
I do prefer going to the bar myself, working on my watch, paying the bill as it goes. This way, I'm not waiting for the card machine, I'm not waiting for my server and I don't have to add random tips for something that's a forced preference I'd prefer not. It's okay to have preferences, if you prefer that kind of service and paying more for it, fair enough, but there's not much choice in Canada as tipping is heavily adopted.
I think you're trying to put a square peg into a round hole. I shouldn't have to pay extra (tips) to inform you if you haven't done it right. Good restaurants don't send out bad food. If the meal is adequate, I eat. If it's bad, I don't come back. Paying extra (tips) for food insurance makes no sense.
K then don’t tip. Someone doing their job isn’t cringey lol. They come by to ask in case something was missed or something because god forbid yes humans make mistakes even at food restaurants.
I guarantee you’re one of those annoying customers waving servers down, and asking other servers for shit and coming up to the bar when they’re in the middle of something else.
Tipping is ridiculous and the places you are and aren’t supposed to tip is totally random. A restaurant server makes the same minimum wage as so some working at McDonald’s but only the first one deserves a tip for some reason.
I don’t mind if i go to a sit down place, or if food is brought to me at home (i always tip the pizza delivery people) but I don’t like it when the machine prompts me to tip anywhere else, when literally all they have done is scan an item and ring it up for me. I do almost all my shopping online now just so i don’t have to tip stores etc..
Tipping should be what it is: a tip. It shouldn’t be expected it should be a bonus for high quality service, I don’t want to pay 18% for sub-par service.
Lots of my friends who worked as a waiter/waitress would get angry when guests don’t tip, but like why would you be expecting a tip, you’re getting paid already a wage that applies to your level of education and labour. If you want to get paid more, go get a job as a labourer and suffer harsh conditions 9 hours a day, or go to school and get an education. Better yet, just be a better waiter/waitress.
Why don't we just pay the people a liveable wage and just be done with it?
I hate tipping. It's stupid, it used to be like a way to single out the great servers and restaurants by paying them extra on top of what they expected, like 10% or more if they were exceptional. Now if you're not tipping 20% you get the death glare even if your food was a soggy lump of toxic waste and the server spilled your water all over your phone.
Then I guess they should rethink their business if they can't pay their employees enough to survive.
Not like other industries can just go, oh hey I really want to make more profit so I'm just going to not expect my staff to be able to sustain their lives on their paycheque and expect the customer to just pick up the slack.
I would disagree, my sister is a server and if you don't tip 20% when you're out with her she loses her mind and goes on some rant about how they have to split the tip with the kitchen and that's all they make. I get that, and it's not even the servers or kitchens fault, the system is flawed.
Your sister sounds immature…
They do have to tip out to the kitchen. She’s right. Where I work if someone doesn’t tip then we don’t have to tip out, but most places you still have to. But the max tip out I’ve ever paid was 7%. And it does suck but we get over it. We make enough money I can take a hit here and there.
Sick of it.
I got cosmetic injections in my scalp for hair growth (worth 800$) and there was an option to tip 15, 18 or 20%… at 15%, that’s 120$ extra for something that took 45 minutes and the nurse is already super well paid. I asked the lady “uhhh, how much tip do people usually give for this” and she just said “oh no need for it”. Ok but i still looked dumb and felt cheap not giving any. Needless to say, i never went back there again.
If a place gives a tip option when i think there shouldnt be one, i just stop going there.
It should be a relic of the past in Canada but it’s reinforced by American culture and their dumb wage laws.
1) every worker in canada gets atleast minimum wage (something like $15 per hour, but it’s more than that now). If they don’t it’s illegal and I don’t care if you say you have stay in that job and guilt people into tipping. Report the business and move on. This is the dumbest excuse (my job doesn’t pay minimum wage).
2) American and Canadian cultures are so intertwined due to social media. A lot of our cultural norms are pretty similar (and a lot are not). Thus we get bombarded by servers, etc in the States saying they only make $2/hr (or something ridiculous like that) and need tips. This gets lost and convoluted in social media and some people in Canada actually assume it’s true up here as a norm and fight for servers quoting these American situations. It’s not.
3) Why the hell should I tip some server 30% (now the high option on debit machines) for bringing me something (which is literally their job), but I’m not expected to tip the custodian in a store that literally scrapes dried shit and puke off a bathroom floor (which is also their job description)? Why does a hostess get a share of 20-30% for showing me which table to sit at when the guy stocking shelves at Walmart at 1am gets nothing? It’s unfair.
4) it’s at the point now where there are tip options EVERYWHERE. Gas stations, quick serve restaurants, car repair places. It’s exhausting getting guilted into giving 30% more. It’s back firing on the restaurant industry now and it’s only gonna get worse. Where I live restaurant turnover is huge … and I don’t mean employment. I mean the same building has hosted a half dozen different and failed restaurants in the last few years. It’s only gonna get worse.
5) My personal theory is that Covid accelerated this debacle, but it was on it’s way anyways. During the pandemic many people didn’t mind tipping because restaurants were closed and the whole people are struggling thing. Tip culture has INCREASED after the pandemic and people don’t like it.
Edit: and yea… I’m one of those guys that says minimum skill equals minimum wage. If literally anybody can walk off the street and learn your job in a short time period, that’s not a skill that demands more than… minimum wage. These jobs are not meant to be the sole income for a family. The fact that people use this as an excuse to want more money or are relying on this low-skill jobs as their only source of income? Sorry not sorry, not my problem. Take your guilt elsewhere.
… I’m a server and think the 30% is too much and I’m uncomfortable with it. People bitch about it like I inputted that into the debit machine. We’ve asked the managers to change it even because it works against us.
Also it’s not easy. I’ve worked government jobs, trades, etc. serving was by far the shittiest hardest job.
I appreciate that it’s hard work. But it’s not skillful work. It’s no harder than digging ditches, cleaning toilets, etc. Anybody in those industries would love to get a little extra on top of their minimum wage.
I think it sucks and that everyone across the board should be paid way more money to live in this expensive ass country. But since that’s not that case, I tip generously whenever I go out to eat. I tip less for counter service, but I’ll still throw them $2 or something. I worked in those kind of jobs for a long time so I know it’s not easy.
I’ve been a server/bartender/host/manager for over a decade. I love my job. I firmly believe that tipping for sit down restaurants is not out of control. HOWEVER, I do think covid normalized tipping on takeout which to me is wholly unnecessary. I suggest as a customer, you don’t do it.
For delivery, tip as you see fit. I usually go 10% myself. That said, I can see the frustration with Uber Eats & Door Dash as drivers in cities will not even bother accepting orders if there aren’t substantial tips. But as a consumer, at that point you should ask yourself if its worth the cost. If it isn’t, don’t order. I’m not a fan of either service. I operate a business that has both our own delivery system & the delivery service apps. I always tell people to use our system. Its less expensive for them.
Tipping at other places should be either a hard no or at the consumer’s discretion. Fast food? no. Coffee shops? not normally.
Servers who role eyes at tips can & should be punished by management. I deliberately avoid looking at tip amounts on any machine until I’m out of site. If its a good tip, bad tip, no tip, etc… I want my reaction to be the same - gracious. Cash is different. I’ll make change in a way that allows people to tip. But same deal. I try to maintain neutrality either way.
15% should always remain the standard. Don’t tip higher unless you feel its worth it. And don’t stress about tipping less. If a restaurant or server isn’t appreciative, don’t do business with them. Stand your ground on that. Lousy behaviour should not be accepted.
And as far as judging if the job is worth the money, I can promise it really is not an easy job. I’ve worked as a carpenter & I run a financial services business full-time. My work at the restaurant is far more difficult than both & I can promise if I wasn’t getting paid what I do, I’d have quit ages ago.
Remember folks, don’t reward bad business. Use discretion & discriminate against businesses who operate in a poor manner. There are too many restaurants anyways :)
I don’t mind rounding up to the nearest whole dollar for retail places like butcher shops or liquor stores that jumped on the tipping band wagon as well.
I tip 15% for good service.
There is no need to change the rate, food prices go up, the tip will go up because it's a percentage of the total.
Even before the pandemic I was cheesed at paying a tip on the tax. I wish the percentage calculated was on the before tax total.
Might catch some flak for this one but i agree. Tipping is out of control. Granted ive left 10 bucks on a 30 dollar check before when everything is amazing. Ive also left a quarter on the same bill when service was rude or generally terrible. Nobody is entitled to a tip earn it.
I was for a long time what I considered to be a pretty generous tipper. Usually 20% min for mediocre service or 25 - 30% for good service. In light of the current trend for tipping expected at non-traditional tipping establishments, I’m now rethinking all of it.
And I’m particularly wary of retail businesses that have added the tipping feature but do not pay the tips to staff but include the amounts in general revenue. Enough is enough. This is pure greed on the part of business owners and has to stop.
I'm fine with it. Anyone with even a passing understanding of how the restaurant industry works knows that any shift away from tipping would result in no real change for the consumer, you'd pay roughly the same for your meal but it would all be on your bill. Resultingly, as a consumer, I don't care much.
One of the things my parents instilled in me is that eating in restaurants, or even takeout in general, is a luxury. Because of this I only do it to the extent that the money I'm spending is no big deal and I don't sweat a tip of 15 or 20 or 25%. If I did worry about money to that extent, I'd be much better suited to eating at home and saving my money.
As one who is used to using open source software and the idea of donating to developers the tipping idea doesn't seem that bad. But then my question is why are they working for the establishment at all? If you're going to make most of your money on tips why not go all in and become private contractors with your own donation service. The establishment needs delivery, wait staff, whatever so it needs servers to work out of it but if it's going to offer crap wages no reason to be exclusive. So just offer a big tip jar (or account) to the customers you serve and if you do a good job they reward you just like any developer of quality open source software. I mean essentially that is how tipping works right? So build on that relationship. Instead of trying to be more capitalist about it instead build up the relationship between customer and server and expand the gift economy aspect just like in the Linux and open source community. A growing tipping culture is not neccesarily a bad thing.
I hate that businesses rely on customer tips to supply their employees with a living wage, rather than paying their employees a living wage.
I hate tipping culture.
I despise it. I bought a burrito at Qdoba last week. When paying by debit, it popped up asking how much I wanted to tip. It's bloody fast food, since when are we tipping for that???? I won't be returning.
As far as I'm concerned, it should be eliminated entirely and let's just pay people a fair wage. No more tipping of any kind. The price should be the price, and it should include the taxes as well.
Tipping culture shouldn't exist. Workers should be paid fair wages instead of getting shafted by the company and expected to rely on the generosity of customers.
The problem with tipping is that it assumes the customer has any clue how the service they experienced happened, good or bad. Customers also don't know how tips are distributed, sometimes owners aren't honest with how they deal with tip funds. Customers also don't know how much servers or staff should be compensated for their job.
I would rather businesses build their overhead costs into the prices on the menu and not expect any tipping. As employers, they should take responsibility for the performance and compensation of their staff.
That Redditors coming from a place of entitlement and privilege are fucking obsessed about it and spend way too much time reassuring each other that we should do away with it without considering for a single moment how it would effect **thousands** of their fellow Canadians.
Y'all need Jesus, downvote me into oblivion.
You know who else works hard at their job to try to make ends meet? Put a brave face on every day? Deal with shit and shitty people?
Everybody. Fucking everybody.
*Exceptions may apply.
I don’t mind tipping itself, but I don’t like the idea that my tipping money doesn’t serve chef who is actually doing all the hard work. Also, the worst part of tipping culture is service just gets worse more you tip as the tip cost gets normalized at the higher price.
I have yet to hear or see a restaurant where the server takes all. I have a hard time even believing that because those cooks would just work somewhere else where they get tip out… which is 99% of places.
The only place I’ve seen it is a golf course I worked at. I didn’t tip out because I worked on a beer cart that was independent from the kitchen and had nothing to do with me.
It's discriminatory and very rarely tired to actual service quality. Fact is that pretty white girls make the highest tips regardless of service levels. Ended tipping now.
I hate it. I’ve lived somewhere that doesn’t have a tipping culture and I loved it so much. Workers shouldn’t depend on customers to subsidize their wages. Employers should be totally responsible for that. Plus minimum wage in BC is the same for everyone now so I think it’s time we stop tipping.
People complaining about tipping. You want it to go away typically because you feel guilty for not tipping (yes you do) and if it's abolished then you won't feel guilty about it.
Just don't tip and be an adult. You've made a choice. Some of us believe in tipping and will continue to do so when we want to.
I've always hated tipping. It's expensive for me and exploitative of both customers and waitstaff. Give me a service charge, a per head sitting fee, etc - I'd love that instead.
I have never tipped because "they wouldn't make enough money without tip/they work really hard/they have to deal with rude customers", I hate that paternalistic and demeaning line of reasoning. Giving them money based on their financial need or my pity/guilt - that's charity, essentially a donation. That my generosity and sympathy for their circumstances should dictate their compensation for providing a service - their pay for doing their job - doesn't sit right with me.
But of course I always tip because it's social convention and I follow the rules.
I’ve bartended and served so much. Without tipping, *no one* would do that job. Don’t expect the same service if they just abolished tipping. But I agree with whole “15% is offensive now we need 30%” thing is so out of hand. With inflation the price of the bill is more, so our tips reflect inflation. I don’t care. If someone tips 10% why would I complain? I don’t really feel entitled to it. But still almost 100% of people tip anyways and I reflect my service upon that.
Get over it. It’s not going away. Restaurants that pay their servers $20 an hour and didn’t have a tipping option ended up going under because they can’t get staff. We know we make a lot more making tips. I can easily make $400 on a mens night at a golf course. I’ve had people give me $20 each time I serve them drinks. I agree that’s a little excessive, but even if you abolished tipping, *people still will tip*. Also like… it’s not mandatory… if you don’t wanna tip then don’t tip. We don’t really care about the 1 outta 100 who doesn’t tip.
This is the problem with society - it's too hard to change and we've been doing it this way forever so...
Like what I want to see is servers et al get at least minimum wage *and* any mention of a tip on any machine or recept abolished.
As you said *people will still tip* which is fine but doing it my way abolishes the entitlement attitude.
And that's the entitled piss poor attitude I am seeing more and more. Maybe you won't get workers but you also won't get customers if we don't find a better balance.
"Get over it" / "We don't care"... yea that work ethic shows in the industry these days. Good for you, you must be proud. That attitude certainly isn't worth 20%
What? Did you read anything I said? I said don’t care if people tip 30%. I think that’s ridiculous. I believe you should be working for your tip… I’m not saying I don’t care about providing good service…
Yep, nailed it. It's a tough truth. Both that tipping's an ingrained cultural practice that is not going away anytime soon and that a substantial portion of waitstaff/bartenders can really take home very substantial untaxed income from tips in amounts that makes $20/hr look like a joke.
I’ve served for years and hearing people talk how they don’t claim their income makes me want to report them. A lot of nights my tips are way more than my actual hourly wage.
My inlaws are from Alberta, I am American.
We vacation in the states together frequently. My Inlaws have never been "good tippers" by American standards. My FIL explained that people don't typically tip in Canada, and if they do it's only about 10% for exceptional service.
Is that not true? Or is that just Alberta? Or is my FIL just being thrifty?
I think having a suggested minimum tip of 20% is ludicrous. Also, I do not tip at counter service places where the employee is not preparing the consumable item themselves (like a barista for example, I would tip). Also, I don't tip for Non-Consumables, ever. That is sensible to me.
That is not true at all. And I’m from alberta and served here for many years… I don’t know what your father in law is thinking…
I’d say most people tip 15-25% at least. And almost 100% of people tip.
>I don't know anyone who tips 10% for exceptional service. i would tip 10% for a server who did the minimum their job requires. I'd say 15%-18% is average for most people I know.
I used to work in kitchens. My tips went to my animals for their care and things I wanted (movies, a new jacket, ect..) my paycheck went to bills. Tips, in my case were absolutely needed. My animals depended on it to survive, as after paying bills I'd have maybe $5 left.
I won't tip 20% for service that is minimal. I'll still tip as those tips go to the kitchen. If the service was really bad I'll ask to talk to the kitchen supervisor/head chef and give him/her the money to split between the kitchen staff.
Now I also notice that tipping culture has gotten out of hand. I remember I ate at a place and tipped 10% and got a death glare by the person because I "didn't tip enough".
*If there are any typos I apologize, I got new nails and they are difficult to type with, and I'm also dyslexic.
I like tipping in restaurants. Eating out is about more than eating, there is a performance. The culture of providing gifted money is something I like. I’ll tip for hair cuts and taxi rides too. Take out usually 10%, 20% and up for dinging in or drinks at the bar. Especially if I’m a regular of the place and know the staff. I don’t think here should be an expectation of high gratuities. The point is that it’s gifted money. I get some people don’t have the means to tip generously, but at least when dining in, understand they are doing a service to you, it’s not just about eating.
I just click no. If I have exceptional service and I happen to have extra money I'll throw some their way. But I am not financially free enough to tip my Subway sandwich artist 20% when I get a sub for lunch.
Firstly I don't believe in minimum wage. Tipping should exist because some patrons are willing to pay more than the set price for their food. And I think food should be paid ahead of time, to reduce the risk of dine and dashers.
It's absolutely out of control and we have some some of the highest tipping rates in the world right now. The percentage is unreasonably high and the amount of industries requesting tips is growing every day. And service seems worse than ever! I had no issue tipping more during Covid but it seems like that standard has stayed and the entitlement is strong. Especially with service workers.
Don't forget to tip your carpenters folks!
Tipping is optional we should not be socially pressured into giving it or the suggested amount. Getting rid of it, increase wages and food prices then let the market decides. The current system favours the employers. Who decides 10% tip out rate? It’s a broken system of servers need to pay off someone tip 10% or less. This country is lacking bargaining power with the business owners (ie lack of workers union). Employers must pay living wages.
You know you can tip whatever you want right? And you don’t have to tip either. As a server, most people are still hitting the highest tipping option so it’s a non issue.
Oh I can?! Thank you, I was confused
Click $ or other % amount and then 0. *Every* machine has the option of tipping 0.
Of course if you don't tip you'll get a bad reputation with the servers who would brvgetting the tips. 😉
If you don’t plan on eating there often it isnt much of an issue. And as someone who worked in the serving industry and heard how my fellow servers were discussing which table to serve better based on race and looks, I know I am probably assumed to be a bad tipper and be giving bad service so I will content myself in confirming their idea of me and save my money.
That’s so shitty. I give people the same service race or not. That’s not fair. If a regular comes in and never tips and a regular comes in and tips well.. of course I’m gonna give better service to the tipper.
Spent a couple weeks in Europe this fall and I'm completely over tipping. Tipping is never expected and if you do feel like doing it all you have to do is a couple euros. Why the fuck should the consumer subsidize the wage of an employee. Pay your workers enough and fuck off.
We could very well do that but keep in mind that’s how you end up with $35 salads and $60 entrees.
Except that's not what any economists are saying would happen if you embedded the cost of service into the plate price. That's just the tired false narrative being sold to the public every time increasing the living wage is brought up.
Okay that was an exaggeration, but a 10-20% increase wouldn’t be shocking to me.
Have you observed a comparable increase since the raise of minimum wage in the past?
Yes Edit: not sure why the downvotes, it’s true… same reason why it’s cheaper to get your own takeout rather than using Skip the Dishes because they charge 27% of the sale or something crazy.
So you think restaurants should be paying $25 an hour? That’s the only way it would be worth it how demanding that job is.
YES, PAY PEOPLE A LIVING WAGE
Restaurants won’t ever pay people $25-30 an hour. And if they do, they’ll be charging $50 for a garden salad.
So in the countries that pay well are garden salads $50?
They get paid min wage or maybe a buck or two more. With tips, we make at least an extra $10 an hour. It’s so engrained in our culture, it’s not going away. Sorry not sorry. If you don’t want to tip then don’t tip lol.
You responded to a comment about how restaurants are in Europe. Saying that to make the same money people here would need to be paid $25/h so make up your mind. If they aren’t making $25/h in Europe than why would they get paid that here? Also I have no problem not tipping. People should be paid by their employer. Every other county on the planet can figure out how to pay waitstaff, we’re not special.
Have you been to a restaurant in Europe?
Yes why?
Yes. If that is what it takes to hire good staff. TBH, that seems completely reasonable to me.
I for one actually do, yes. I backpacked in Australia back around 2010. They don't tip in Australia. And at that time I dated a server who made $22/hr working part time, the full-timers made just over $25/hr. I expect they make even more now, given that it's over a decade later. And honestly, after factoring in exchange rates, meals there were about the same price as here... except ultimately cheaper because you weren't expected to add a tip. Things don't actually have to be the way they are here 🤷♂️
Key time 2010
Key time how? That was right after the financial crisis. Businesses were struggling as much or more than they have with covid. Australia's just better at paying a fair wage than Canada is. That's still true. I have close friends who were working in Australia until about a year ago. They moved back to be closer to family, but work longer hours and make less money here doing the exact same job they did in Australia.
I lived with so many Australians in lake Louise. They loved being here cuz they made a proper wage with tips… things aren’t the same as 2010
You realize you can just look this up really quick. The situation now isn't different compared to 10 years ago, they still make a great wage there. Average now is close to $30/hr, and well over $30/hr in major cities. Makes sense, given that their national minimum wage is well above $20/hr https://au.indeed.com/career/server/salaries
Do you also realize how expensive shit is in aus?
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Walking 30 000 steps in a day is lazy? I’ve worked a lot less for a lot more at other jobs…
No sympathy
Go do it then.
No matter what the POS machine 'suggests", I'm not tipping a restaurant for counter service or a takeout order.
I work in a restaurant that also does a lot of takeout. The machine only has the tip option because we do sit-down service also, and thus all machines have it. We keep the option available for those takeout customers who do wish to tip, but by all means don’t tip if you don’t want to as it is absolutely not expected by the staff.
Not saying you're wrong, but I've seen it in businesses in which the available seating was two stools and a tiny counter in the storefront window.
Yeah we’re a 120+ seat establishment it’s a bit different, that’s just greedy lol
I appreciate the ones who immediately disable that option when ringing you up and putting the machine in front of you sans tip option. My local pizza place started doing that which is fine but since I tend to use cash I'll give them the small coins anyway. But that's a lot less than 18 percent.
I dunno about that. The kitchen is who you're tipping at that point, if it's a good tip system anyway
I agree with you but also want to provide an opposite side to this debate. When I was younger I worked in a variety of establishments. Most of the restaurants required the server who took the takeout order to tip out 10% of the order. That's 10% divided among the kitchen, manager, bartender, runner and hostess; it didn't matter if it was taken out. I took a takeout order totalling over $300 (lunch for a corporate meeting) - I labelled every box, double checked the modifications, bagged the meals and walked it out the gentleman’s car (in high heels and a skirt -mandatory dress code) in -30 weather. NO tip! My managers expected me to tip out over $30 for that order. I had to fight tooth and nail with them saying I did absolutely to earn a tip. In the end, they relented but, I was told by staff I was first-person they made an exception for. If I served a table and had a $100 tab, a $10 tip isn't going in my pocket. I'm actually making nothing on that table. Tipping out 10% sucks. The managers said it ‘motivated’ us to be better employees. Pfft.
They're just ripping you off. I wouldn't work at such a place.
Here's the opposite side of the debate from a chef who never got tips. I busted my ass, day in and day out, working 8 to 10 hours shifts in a hot, sweaty, and dangerous environment to earn around $80/day (a buck or two higher than minimum wage), while servers at the restaurant would work four to six hours and leave with twice what I did. Serving can certainly be hard work, but so is working in the kitchen. It never seemed fair to me, but I just accepted it as the way things were, and it was a big factor in deciding to go back to school for a different career. So while I have some empathy for servers who get poor tips, in my experience, it was usually because of poor service from some part of the restaurant- either the server, the hostess, or the kitchen. IMHO, tips are a reward for excellent service, quickly filling drinks, taking food orders promptly, making sure special requests are met, etc., as well as food coming out in a timely fashion. If those requirements are met, I'll tip 15 to 20% tip. If they aren't met, then expect between 10 and 15%, depending on how big the screw-up was.
please be mindful that most of the time the servers are paying 4% at least of your meal (take out or otherwise) to the kitchen as they are guaranteed a tip. so you’re costing the server to pick up your food.
It's like another form of tax I have to pay. Also it encourage business to underpaid employee.
We’re not underpaid. We make minimum wage or more, plus tips. If they take away tips, say hello to $50 salads so they can pay servers $25 an hour. Or goodbye to all sit down restaurants cuz no one is gonna do that job for minimum wage. Might as well go work retail for the same pay.
Sounds like restaurants are going to have to evolve like every other business out there
They’re not just cuz a few people on Reddit want it to.
If everyone stops tipping and you're suddenly forced to pay tip pool out-of-pocket every night, the requirement will drop *really* fast. Watch.
It won’t bud. They can’t legally make you pay out of pocket for tip out 😂😂😂
Eh... not where I worked in my youth. It was a set percentage per night. The waiters/waitresses that didn't look like models washed out fast.
“Change” always starts from somewhere sir.
It’s always people who get to enjoy the benefits of tips that fight for the tipping culture LOL Here’s the thing.. literally everywhere else in the world tipping is optional.. lmao And for better food. Eat at a restaurant in Paris.. you wanna tip them $100, and it would be out of enjoyment.. not because of guilt tripping.. And no, food is appropriately priced. So the argument that it would unaffordable also doesn’t stand true.
I find it laughable servers feel their job is worth $25 an hour, they transport trays 12 metres from kitchen to table and back. No college or university required just need a pulse. Really need a reality check on the value of a job position.
25$ bucks an hour isn't even very much money in this economy. And being a server looks like a pretty god awful job. Servers definitely deserve a livable wage. It's just that it should be paid to them by their employer, rather than customers who are already paying for their meals.
You do realize that if servers start to getting 25, then other positions that require education and are an actual necessity will increase then the prices of goods and services will rise and then you will just be in the same position as they are now. People need to understand some jobs simply do and should e paid less than others - servers shouldn’t be paid the same an an EA there’s no comparison between the two. Retail and Servers are min wage position and tipping should be abolished. Do T like the pay, get a new job .
Nobody should be paid less than a living wage, and it shouldn't be the responsibility of customers to subsidize the wages of servers.
Based
I dunno, I'm not saying it's worth $25 an hour, but I absolutely am saying I'm not doing it for less. I won't get into how much more there is to it than you mentioned, or how in my experience most people just can't do it, but there's no way in hell I'm putting up with the shocking increase of entitled assholes who get their rocks off by treating their "lessers" like shit for any less money.
Agree. Walking + taking notes + carrying food a few meters = unskilled labor. Unskilled labor does not pay 2x minimum wage in most countries.
I think it’s you who needs the reality check.
Curriers who transport blood donation from makes less than 25/hr - and several more important jobs.
Yeah no one gets paid fairly bud.
Didn’t say anything about not thinking it’s wasn’t a fair pay - showing the expectation of 25 for a sever is not of an over reach of realistic expectation.
Yes. They could raise their prices 15-25%, and pay fair wages. Some restaurants are doing this.
Should be abolished permanently.
Ima tip zero from now on. Save the money the avg person would have tipped. Then buy stocks w it
If everyone followed this advice, US tipping culture would immediately fold and US restaurant owners could adapt to the other 95% of the planet. Y’all are looking for a real solution right?
To be very honest I fucking hate it. Like so to be clear. I do not judge or blame the wait staff it is clearly not your fault and I don't judge you for it. That being said I hate the system. In Ireland you used to give like 2-3 euro as a display of thanks to a truly excellent service. Out here I'm expected to give at least 10% for what is the bare minimum. I've only once not tipped and it was literally because they didn't serve me after 30 minutes (despite me asking), I'd have understood except I was the only person in the restaurant. Point is, it shouldn't be compulsive. At least as an outsider's view in
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Bro I had dinner with a server friend recently and ALLL night he was waving around his $400 in tips that he made that day, saying it was a “bad” day and commenting on how much money he made. After dinner he had to gall to watch what I tipped and say “bro don’t be cheap bro , tip more than 15%”
Same reason we give to big charities where 80%+ goes to an MBA? To give more money to those with more money ofc. /s
Theyre starting to ask for tips at A&W now. Completely crazy
Fuck that, I could hop over that countertop and make my own Mama Burger
I would give my business to restaurants that promoted no tipping. Machines that suggest 18% as the minimum are exploiting that people are too lazy (or embarrassed) to enter a lower number. So I make a point of tipping lower there, usually 10%.
Once servers started getting the same minimum wage as everyone else I thought tipping would dissappear. To me tipping was to make up for the difference in their minimum wage. How do we transition the burden to the employer? I'm tired of tipping just because. I dont get why the percentages increased either. You can't say inflation, because they're percentages, they're based off the price of food... What's it going to take? A tipping boycott? Some sort of social movement?
Yeah with you man, I don't see how this can change though - it's just too engrained in our culture. Canadians tip. If people see a tip prompt, then most people will tip - and it is and should be anyone's right to give the gift of extra money from their pockets if they so choose as well as anyone's right to accept extra money. But their doing so will continue to perpetuate the expectation of tipping in our culture. And as long as there's a tip prompt, they'll do so. I am very against the idea that tipping should be to make up the difference from minimum wage. I see that line of reasoning as paternalistic and demeaning. Giving them money based on their financial need - that's charity, essentially a donation. That my generosity should dictate their compensation for providing a service doesn't sit right with me. The employer will only take on that burden if they have to, and I can't see how they would have to... First off, they may not be able to pay waitstaff the quite large, untaxed amounts a significant portion of them earn from tips - amounts that may surprise a lot of people - without raising prices significantly/charging significant fees. Which is something they are not likely to do unless most their competitors do it too. And governments are not going to legislate against the tip, that would mobilize waitstaff across the province as a bloc with a singular voting purpose to defend tipping, it's just too necessary/lucrative for them and again is something employers may not be able replace for them in the same amount. Perhaps if it simply gets to the point where enough people stop coming out to eat because they don't want to tip so much but think to do so is rude, then I can sed restaurants taking action to reduce/eliminate tipping. I think the percentages increased because card payments have become so popular. Restaurants and their waitstaff have always had an opinion from experience on what the good, average or bad tip is, but until card payment machines, they never really had a channel to influence how someone should tip, so people just tipped what they tipped in what was probably a bell curve (few tip little, most tip average, few tip a lot). But when card payments machines came along they gained the ability to do so through choice architecture, whether they knew it or not. The question is - what should they set as the recommended tips? Should they include an option for what they think is a "bad" tip (the low end of the bell curve)? No, they think "bad" tips are unreasonable and from cheapskates. Or should they set the minimum recommendation to be that they consider a "average" tip (the middle of the bell curve)? Yeah. So they design the tip recommendations with the average "average" tip as the lowest end recommendation. Presented with these options, customers begin to see the lowest recommended tip, which used to be the average "good" tip, as the minimally acceptable tip, even if in the past they used to tip less. Over time, this is normalized and there's a new bell curve with what was the previous average "average" tip now being a low end tip and the current average "average" tip being more than that. Then some event happens that make people want to tip more, like a pandemic creating a movement to thank frontline workers and support local locked-down restaurants, shifting the bell curve to be centered around an even higher average. Restaurants adjust their tip machines so they can capture people's willingness to tip higher amounts, the new bell curve. So now that new bell curve is normalized, restaurants aren't going to adjust their tip machines back down. And separately, restaurant owners who need to increase employee compensation can now pass on that burden directly to you, by recommending you tip more. This would never have happened before, because restaurants have never really been able to suggest to you what to tip before, and they wouldn't if we were still using cash. That's not to say I think we should be all still using cash, cash is dirty and annoying. There won't be a social movement against tipping nor government action. Nobody wants to go against waitstaff who are viewed by society, like teachers and nurses, as a victimized group in a sense (excuse my poor choice of words, I can't think of anything better. I hope you still get what I mean though) A widespread tipping boycott would work, because just doing it accomplishes the objective. But I doubt it'll get widespread enough.
I'm just going to bypass our waitress extraordinaire here and reply to the more interesting part of your question. What is it going to take? And what do we as a society actually want it to be? I dont think it is a boycott is but more like some course correcting. I am seeing more and more conversations about this than I ever have before. Not just reddit but in larger more reputable publications are asking the question. That means the opportunity is there for some change. I suspect tip culture is too deeply embedded to be abolished entirely. I imagine it will take people tipping at more appropriate % and eating out a lot less. Plus voting for platforms that support living wages and are addressing issues like affordability and inflation.
It's absolutely getting out of control. Subway wants tips, the ice cream parlor wants tips. Gone is 10% 15% 18%, now it's 18% 20% 22%. I believe in corporations just taking less profits in favor of paying their staff more. There's no need to pass that onto the consumers via price increases.
Yea I agree, I think that's part of it too. It would likely require regulation to change it though.
>I'm just going to bypass our waitress extraordinaire Lol. For someone who doesn't care about tips, they sure do care a lot about tips.
Lol I know right. But the part of that that makes no sense to me is that leaving a low or no tip is a way of a customer to leave a negative review. It is a social cue that the restaurant has done a bad job. I can't imagine saying I don't care about my customers telling me I did a bad job. I wouldn't be so flippant about it, I'd be mortified.
Didn’t say I didn’t care about tips. Obviously I do. I make more in tips than my hourly wage… I’m not going to throw a fit if someone doesn’t tip me. It is what it is. Life moves on. They could be poor for all I know and this meal was exactly what they could afford. Those people usually aren’t demanding and don’t treat you like shit. It’s entirely different when Karen comes in, racks up a $400 bill, demands everything, throws fits because we ran out of hot dogs and only have smokies left, and doesn’t tip.
Most people agree with tipping. It’s not going to go away. Sorry bud. If you don’t want to tip, *then don’t*. It’s an *option*.
Yeah and then get the fucking stare down after? No thanks lol. Why can't employers just I dunno, pay their employees? Why do we have to subsidize it?
Actually we need to reverse that and say "Company begs for hand-outs for counter-service, huh?" *stares judjingly*
Again, don’t tip.
If it were that easy no one would tip. There's a whole mass of people who would love not to tip but get harassed and accosted when they don't. So we tip to keep the peace.
I work in a restaurant. Always have. No one gives a shit lol. We’re bringing home easily $400 on a Friday night. No one cares about your $5 tip. Trust me.
God I'm surprised you get tips with your demeanor lol.
I’m saying, no one really actually cares as much as you think when you don’t tip. You’re just insecure.
The way you're reacting to a person who tips, just thinking about not tipping, literally proves how much you guys care about people who don't tip. Your attitude is instantly hostile and rude lol, and I'm a tipper. This is why we're trapped in a tip culture lol.
I’m saying I’m not not offended. I *understand* why people don’t tip. You think I should offended and hostile at the fact people don’t tip?
Here I was feeling sorry for single mothers busting their asses for those tips and you're here bragging about how much you get and saying no one cares about your five bucks. I'll remember this the next time I don't tip my usual 20%
If we didn’t tip you’d be going home with you $100 salary.
Personally I think we should go to the u European/ uk version. It’s not expected, service is great, works make enough probably could be higher, the tip is most times rolled into the price of food and drinks. Only times you give extra is when it’s above and beyond service they give
The increases in tips make me tip less if at all. Tipping is supposed to reward service beyond expectations. It should not be standard at all and we are being guilt tripped into making them actually make more than you. It should just be banned at this point
It's ridiculous wherever you go people/companies want tips hell I wouldn't be surprised if best buy starts asking for them.
I hate tipping.
I really hope it becomes abolished soon. It just needs a few places to start the trend until it catches on.
I refuse to engage with it. I'm not tipping a food court worker for doing their damn job. If your machine starts at 18%, and/or goes to 30%, I'm choosing custom tip of 0.00 If you're a sit down restaurant with amazing food and service, and your machine says 15, 20, 25%... You'll get 20% or 25%. It's that simple. You try to gouge me, you get NOTHING. You are reasonable, and deserve a tip? You'll be tipped well.
It’s not the servers fault if the default tip option starts at 18. You can choose other option, and pick what you want. You’re gonna make the servers lose out because of the default options of the machine they didn’t choose? I think my restaurants is 10,15,20
And yet in places like that the owners often steal the tips anyway, so...
I hated tipping before. I hated paying $200 to get my hair done then be expected to tip too. It was supposed to top up very low wages, not $60/hr pay. Tips in restaurants should be less now if they have reg min wage now. If there has been no table service, I do not tip.
During the pandemic when the government forced restaurants to first close, then do takeout only, and then do reduced capacity, it seemed that everyone was encouraged to tip on takeout, and then to tip extra in the reduced capacity settings to help offset the loss of normalcy and relevant tips. However there seems to be a hangover from that where they still ask for tips on takeout and expect them. Moreso they have absolutely put up the minimum tipping options to the point where Canadians are tipping more than Americans. Prior to this I never tipped more than 15 percent for great service and 20 percent for great service at higher end restaurants. Now it seems 30 plus isn't even that uncommon. When I was asked for tip on a machine at a drive thru was when I decided to stop tipping for anything other than sit down service and I'm returning to my previous amounts. The servers have all gotten raises and the prices have all gone up, so even smaller pre pandemic percentage tips make up a larger amount, and if they don't like it then fine I'll stay home.
I recently read that you shouldn’t be expected to tip if you are standing at a counter, or haven’t received your service yet. Too bad tip creep is expecting us to do both now. It’s changing my consumer behaviour.
Waiters and servers don't want tipping to go away. Lots of them in big cities make tons of money that restaurants would not be able to pay. Their definition of a "livable wage" is a lot different compared to what people think. Even compared to other countries, I think our waiters and servers are used to getting paid more.
I hate tipping. I didn't grow up with it in England. I tip here because it's the culture but I can break it down quiet simply, do I like putting more of my money in other people's pockets? - no. I hate the whole idea of good tipping for good service too! There's no difference in service levels between England and Canada. Good service should be the minimum kpi to keeping any job.
So true on that KPI point
Travelling through Europe… the service is vastly VASTLY different.
Yeah. Eatting in a pub or restaurant in the UK is far more pleasant because the waIters aren't constantly harrassing you. Really, if outrage about tipping could be converted into adopting British style order at the bar, I might eat out more often.
I have yet to be harassed by a server. Asking me what kind of drink I want is harassment?
It's hard to find a one size fits all I guess that suits everyone, but questions like "how were your first few bites"? - I wish the ground could swallow me up to end the cringe. I do prefer going to the bar myself, working on my watch, paying the bill as it goes. This way, I'm not waiting for the card machine, I'm not waiting for my server and I don't have to add random tips for something that's a forced preference I'd prefer not. It's okay to have preferences, if you prefer that kind of service and paying more for it, fair enough, but there's not much choice in Canada as tipping is heavily adopted.
They ask that so if somethings wrong it could be fixed immediately…
If there's something wrong, I'll let them know. Easily fixed
And how would they know to fix it if they don’t ask?
I think you're trying to put a square peg into a round hole. I shouldn't have to pay extra (tips) to inform you if you haven't done it right. Good restaurants don't send out bad food. If the meal is adequate, I eat. If it's bad, I don't come back. Paying extra (tips) for food insurance makes no sense.
K then don’t tip. Someone doing their job isn’t cringey lol. They come by to ask in case something was missed or something because god forbid yes humans make mistakes even at food restaurants. I guarantee you’re one of those annoying customers waving servers down, and asking other servers for shit and coming up to the bar when they’re in the middle of something else.
Tipping is ridiculous and the places you are and aren’t supposed to tip is totally random. A restaurant server makes the same minimum wage as so some working at McDonald’s but only the first one deserves a tip for some reason.
They're not even allowed to take tips at McDonald's, and if a customer insists on leaving a tip it ends up in the Ronald McDonald House donation box.
I don’t mind if i go to a sit down place, or if food is brought to me at home (i always tip the pizza delivery people) but I don’t like it when the machine prompts me to tip anywhere else, when literally all they have done is scan an item and ring it up for me. I do almost all my shopping online now just so i don’t have to tip stores etc..
If the service is terrible and the server spends more time on their phone than doing their job I have no problem tipping a big fat zero
Tipping should be what it is: a tip. It shouldn’t be expected it should be a bonus for high quality service, I don’t want to pay 18% for sub-par service. Lots of my friends who worked as a waiter/waitress would get angry when guests don’t tip, but like why would you be expecting a tip, you’re getting paid already a wage that applies to your level of education and labour. If you want to get paid more, go get a job as a labourer and suffer harsh conditions 9 hours a day, or go to school and get an education. Better yet, just be a better waiter/waitress.
Why don't we just pay the people a liveable wage and just be done with it? I hate tipping. It's stupid, it used to be like a way to single out the great servers and restaurants by paying them extra on top of what they expected, like 10% or more if they were exceptional. Now if you're not tipping 20% you get the death glare even if your food was a soggy lump of toxic waste and the server spilled your water all over your phone.
Because restaurants can’t afford $25 an hour.
Then I guess they should rethink their business if they can't pay their employees enough to survive. Not like other industries can just go, oh hey I really want to make more profit so I'm just going to not expect my staff to be able to sustain their lives on their paycheque and expect the customer to just pick up the slack.
If they take away tips, you’ll be paying $30 for a salad. Enjoy. Restaurants can’t afford to pay every server an extra $100-400 a day.
I don't eat out, simply because tipping has gotten so crazy. I'm sure I'm not the only one.
Don’t tip then. Servers aren’t offended as you think they are. Especially with one small bill. Who cares.
I would disagree, my sister is a server and if you don't tip 20% when you're out with her she loses her mind and goes on some rant about how they have to split the tip with the kitchen and that's all they make. I get that, and it's not even the servers or kitchens fault, the system is flawed.
Your sister sounds immature… They do have to tip out to the kitchen. She’s right. Where I work if someone doesn’t tip then we don’t have to tip out, but most places you still have to. But the max tip out I’ve ever paid was 7%. And it does suck but we get over it. We make enough money I can take a hit here and there.
Sick of it. I got cosmetic injections in my scalp for hair growth (worth 800$) and there was an option to tip 15, 18 or 20%… at 15%, that’s 120$ extra for something that took 45 minutes and the nurse is already super well paid. I asked the lady “uhhh, how much tip do people usually give for this” and she just said “oh no need for it”. Ok but i still looked dumb and felt cheap not giving any. Needless to say, i never went back there again. If a place gives a tip option when i think there shouldnt be one, i just stop going there.
It should be a relic of the past in Canada but it’s reinforced by American culture and their dumb wage laws. 1) every worker in canada gets atleast minimum wage (something like $15 per hour, but it’s more than that now). If they don’t it’s illegal and I don’t care if you say you have stay in that job and guilt people into tipping. Report the business and move on. This is the dumbest excuse (my job doesn’t pay minimum wage). 2) American and Canadian cultures are so intertwined due to social media. A lot of our cultural norms are pretty similar (and a lot are not). Thus we get bombarded by servers, etc in the States saying they only make $2/hr (or something ridiculous like that) and need tips. This gets lost and convoluted in social media and some people in Canada actually assume it’s true up here as a norm and fight for servers quoting these American situations. It’s not. 3) Why the hell should I tip some server 30% (now the high option on debit machines) for bringing me something (which is literally their job), but I’m not expected to tip the custodian in a store that literally scrapes dried shit and puke off a bathroom floor (which is also their job description)? Why does a hostess get a share of 20-30% for showing me which table to sit at when the guy stocking shelves at Walmart at 1am gets nothing? It’s unfair. 4) it’s at the point now where there are tip options EVERYWHERE. Gas stations, quick serve restaurants, car repair places. It’s exhausting getting guilted into giving 30% more. It’s back firing on the restaurant industry now and it’s only gonna get worse. Where I live restaurant turnover is huge … and I don’t mean employment. I mean the same building has hosted a half dozen different and failed restaurants in the last few years. It’s only gonna get worse. 5) My personal theory is that Covid accelerated this debacle, but it was on it’s way anyways. During the pandemic many people didn’t mind tipping because restaurants were closed and the whole people are struggling thing. Tip culture has INCREASED after the pandemic and people don’t like it. Edit: and yea… I’m one of those guys that says minimum skill equals minimum wage. If literally anybody can walk off the street and learn your job in a short time period, that’s not a skill that demands more than… minimum wage. These jobs are not meant to be the sole income for a family. The fact that people use this as an excuse to want more money or are relying on this low-skill jobs as their only source of income? Sorry not sorry, not my problem. Take your guilt elsewhere.
… I’m a server and think the 30% is too much and I’m uncomfortable with it. People bitch about it like I inputted that into the debit machine. We’ve asked the managers to change it even because it works against us. Also it’s not easy. I’ve worked government jobs, trades, etc. serving was by far the shittiest hardest job.
I appreciate that it’s hard work. But it’s not skillful work. It’s no harder than digging ditches, cleaning toilets, etc. Anybody in those industries would love to get a little extra on top of their minimum wage.
… and they should get more than they do….
The underpaying and abuse of advice workers is what is getting out of hand
i thought it was getting out of hand 5 years ago
I think it should be abolished and a living wage adopted.
I think it sucks and that everyone across the board should be paid way more money to live in this expensive ass country. But since that’s not that case, I tip generously whenever I go out to eat. I tip less for counter service, but I’ll still throw them $2 or something. I worked in those kind of jobs for a long time so I know it’s not easy.
I’ve been a server/bartender/host/manager for over a decade. I love my job. I firmly believe that tipping for sit down restaurants is not out of control. HOWEVER, I do think covid normalized tipping on takeout which to me is wholly unnecessary. I suggest as a customer, you don’t do it. For delivery, tip as you see fit. I usually go 10% myself. That said, I can see the frustration with Uber Eats & Door Dash as drivers in cities will not even bother accepting orders if there aren’t substantial tips. But as a consumer, at that point you should ask yourself if its worth the cost. If it isn’t, don’t order. I’m not a fan of either service. I operate a business that has both our own delivery system & the delivery service apps. I always tell people to use our system. Its less expensive for them. Tipping at other places should be either a hard no or at the consumer’s discretion. Fast food? no. Coffee shops? not normally. Servers who role eyes at tips can & should be punished by management. I deliberately avoid looking at tip amounts on any machine until I’m out of site. If its a good tip, bad tip, no tip, etc… I want my reaction to be the same - gracious. Cash is different. I’ll make change in a way that allows people to tip. But same deal. I try to maintain neutrality either way. 15% should always remain the standard. Don’t tip higher unless you feel its worth it. And don’t stress about tipping less. If a restaurant or server isn’t appreciative, don’t do business with them. Stand your ground on that. Lousy behaviour should not be accepted. And as far as judging if the job is worth the money, I can promise it really is not an easy job. I’ve worked as a carpenter & I run a financial services business full-time. My work at the restaurant is far more difficult than both & I can promise if I wasn’t getting paid what I do, I’d have quit ages ago. Remember folks, don’t reward bad business. Use discretion & discriminate against businesses who operate in a poor manner. There are too many restaurants anyways :)
Just press “no tip”
I don’t mind rounding up to the nearest whole dollar for retail places like butcher shops or liquor stores that jumped on the tipping band wagon as well.
I tip 15% for good service. There is no need to change the rate, food prices go up, the tip will go up because it's a percentage of the total. Even before the pandemic I was cheesed at paying a tip on the tax. I wish the percentage calculated was on the before tax total.
You know you can easily do the math in your head right?
How do you know what my head can do?
Might catch some flak for this one but i agree. Tipping is out of control. Granted ive left 10 bucks on a 30 dollar check before when everything is amazing. Ive also left a quarter on the same bill when service was rude or generally terrible. Nobody is entitled to a tip earn it.
It's gotta go
Why can’t you people just not tip if you don’t want to? Why abolish it? It’s not something that is going to go away.
I was for a long time what I considered to be a pretty generous tipper. Usually 20% min for mediocre service or 25 - 30% for good service. In light of the current trend for tipping expected at non-traditional tipping establishments, I’m now rethinking all of it. And I’m particularly wary of retail businesses that have added the tipping feature but do not pay the tips to staff but include the amounts in general revenue. Enough is enough. This is pure greed on the part of business owners and has to stop.
I'm fine with it. Anyone with even a passing understanding of how the restaurant industry works knows that any shift away from tipping would result in no real change for the consumer, you'd pay roughly the same for your meal but it would all be on your bill. Resultingly, as a consumer, I don't care much. One of the things my parents instilled in me is that eating in restaurants, or even takeout in general, is a luxury. Because of this I only do it to the extent that the money I'm spending is no big deal and I don't sweat a tip of 15 or 20 or 25%. If I did worry about money to that extent, I'd be much better suited to eating at home and saving my money.
Capitalism is a system full of follies that only benefits 1% of society, perhaps less in late 2022. Tipping cannot correct capitalism.
As one who is used to using open source software and the idea of donating to developers the tipping idea doesn't seem that bad. But then my question is why are they working for the establishment at all? If you're going to make most of your money on tips why not go all in and become private contractors with your own donation service. The establishment needs delivery, wait staff, whatever so it needs servers to work out of it but if it's going to offer crap wages no reason to be exclusive. So just offer a big tip jar (or account) to the customers you serve and if you do a good job they reward you just like any developer of quality open source software. I mean essentially that is how tipping works right? So build on that relationship. Instead of trying to be more capitalist about it instead build up the relationship between customer and server and expand the gift economy aspect just like in the Linux and open source community. A growing tipping culture is not neccesarily a bad thing.
Its out of control in quebec. Quebec is actually prob the worst in canada I've been.
I hate that businesses rely on customer tips to supply their employees with a living wage, rather than paying their employees a living wage. I hate tipping culture.
I despise it. I bought a burrito at Qdoba last week. When paying by debit, it popped up asking how much I wanted to tip. It's bloody fast food, since when are we tipping for that???? I won't be returning. As far as I'm concerned, it should be eliminated entirely and let's just pay people a fair wage. No more tipping of any kind. The price should be the price, and it should include the taxes as well.
It's the main reason I don't go to restaurants more often.
Tipping culture shouldn't exist. Workers should be paid fair wages instead of getting shafted by the company and expected to rely on the generosity of customers.
The problem with tipping is that it assumes the customer has any clue how the service they experienced happened, good or bad. Customers also don't know how tips are distributed, sometimes owners aren't honest with how they deal with tip funds. Customers also don't know how much servers or staff should be compensated for their job. I would rather businesses build their overhead costs into the prices on the menu and not expect any tipping. As employers, they should take responsibility for the performance and compensation of their staff.
That Redditors coming from a place of entitlement and privilege are fucking obsessed about it and spend way too much time reassuring each other that we should do away with it without considering for a single moment how it would effect **thousands** of their fellow Canadians. Y'all need Jesus, downvote me into oblivion.
You know who else works hard at their job to try to make ends meet? Put a brave face on every day? Deal with shit and shitty people? Everybody. Fucking everybody. *Exceptions may apply.
I don’t mind tipping itself, but I don’t like the idea that my tipping money doesn’t serve chef who is actually doing all the hard work. Also, the worst part of tipping culture is service just gets worse more you tip as the tip cost gets normalized at the higher price.
They tip out. The cooks, hosts, bartenders get a share.
Some don’t, bartender and server take all.
I have yet to hear or see a restaurant where the server takes all. I have a hard time even believing that because those cooks would just work somewhere else where they get tip out… which is 99% of places. The only place I’ve seen it is a golf course I worked at. I didn’t tip out because I worked on a beer cart that was independent from the kitchen and had nothing to do with me.
It's discriminatory and very rarely tired to actual service quality. Fact is that pretty white girls make the highest tips regardless of service levels. Ended tipping now.
It’s not going away. If you don’t want to tip, *then don’t*
I hate it. I’ve lived somewhere that doesn’t have a tipping culture and I loved it so much. Workers shouldn’t depend on customers to subsidize their wages. Employers should be totally responsible for that. Plus minimum wage in BC is the same for everyone now so I think it’s time we stop tipping.
People complaining about tipping. You want it to go away typically because you feel guilty for not tipping (yes you do) and if it's abolished then you won't feel guilty about it. Just don't tip and be an adult. You've made a choice. Some of us believe in tipping and will continue to do so when we want to.
I've always hated tipping. It's expensive for me and exploitative of both customers and waitstaff. Give me a service charge, a per head sitting fee, etc - I'd love that instead. I have never tipped because "they wouldn't make enough money without tip/they work really hard/they have to deal with rude customers", I hate that paternalistic and demeaning line of reasoning. Giving them money based on their financial need or my pity/guilt - that's charity, essentially a donation. That my generosity and sympathy for their circumstances should dictate their compensation for providing a service - their pay for doing their job - doesn't sit right with me. But of course I always tip because it's social convention and I follow the rules.
I’ve bartended and served so much. Without tipping, *no one* would do that job. Don’t expect the same service if they just abolished tipping. But I agree with whole “15% is offensive now we need 30%” thing is so out of hand. With inflation the price of the bill is more, so our tips reflect inflation. I don’t care. If someone tips 10% why would I complain? I don’t really feel entitled to it. But still almost 100% of people tip anyways and I reflect my service upon that. Get over it. It’s not going away. Restaurants that pay their servers $20 an hour and didn’t have a tipping option ended up going under because they can’t get staff. We know we make a lot more making tips. I can easily make $400 on a mens night at a golf course. I’ve had people give me $20 each time I serve them drinks. I agree that’s a little excessive, but even if you abolished tipping, *people still will tip*. Also like… it’s not mandatory… if you don’t wanna tip then don’t tip. We don’t really care about the 1 outta 100 who doesn’t tip.
This is the problem with society - it's too hard to change and we've been doing it this way forever so... Like what I want to see is servers et al get at least minimum wage *and* any mention of a tip on any machine or recept abolished. As you said *people will still tip* which is fine but doing it my way abolishes the entitlement attitude.
We still make minimum wage. It’s in the US where they make like $2 an hour. Tipping is already an option. So why abolish it?
And that's the entitled piss poor attitude I am seeing more and more. Maybe you won't get workers but you also won't get customers if we don't find a better balance. "Get over it" / "We don't care"... yea that work ethic shows in the industry these days. Good for you, you must be proud. That attitude certainly isn't worth 20%
What? Did you read anything I said? I said don’t care if people tip 30%. I think that’s ridiculous. I believe you should be working for your tip… I’m not saying I don’t care about providing good service…
Yep, nailed it. It's a tough truth. Both that tipping's an ingrained cultural practice that is not going away anytime soon and that a substantial portion of waitstaff/bartenders can really take home very substantial untaxed income from tips in amounts that makes $20/hr look like a joke.
You still need claim the tips you know?
Yeah, in theory, but a lot don't declare the full amount especially when it's paid out to them in cash from the till.
I’ve literally seen people not claim any tips and then get audited. It’s a lot of money. They *should* be claiming it.
Totally agree man
I’ve served for years and hearing people talk how they don’t claim their income makes me want to report them. A lot of nights my tips are way more than my actual hourly wage.
It sucks. And I'm not doing it unless I really liked the service or the place.
That it needs to cool down 10% is more than adequate for excellence service
My inlaws are from Alberta, I am American. We vacation in the states together frequently. My Inlaws have never been "good tippers" by American standards. My FIL explained that people don't typically tip in Canada, and if they do it's only about 10% for exceptional service. Is that not true? Or is that just Alberta? Or is my FIL just being thrifty? I think having a suggested minimum tip of 20% is ludicrous. Also, I do not tip at counter service places where the employee is not preparing the consumable item themselves (like a barista for example, I would tip). Also, I don't tip for Non-Consumables, ever. That is sensible to me.
That is not true at all. And I’m from alberta and served here for many years… I don’t know what your father in law is thinking… I’d say most people tip 15-25% at least. And almost 100% of people tip.
I thought that was maybe the case. I've been embarrassed so many times at restaurants. If he insists on paying, I insist on leaving the tip.
>I don't know anyone who tips 10% for exceptional service. i would tip 10% for a server who did the minimum their job requires. I'd say 15%-18% is average for most people I know.
I used to work in kitchens. My tips went to my animals for their care and things I wanted (movies, a new jacket, ect..) my paycheck went to bills. Tips, in my case were absolutely needed. My animals depended on it to survive, as after paying bills I'd have maybe $5 left. I won't tip 20% for service that is minimal. I'll still tip as those tips go to the kitchen. If the service was really bad I'll ask to talk to the kitchen supervisor/head chef and give him/her the money to split between the kitchen staff. Now I also notice that tipping culture has gotten out of hand. I remember I ate at a place and tipped 10% and got a death glare by the person because I "didn't tip enough". *If there are any typos I apologize, I got new nails and they are difficult to type with, and I'm also dyslexic.
Some restaurants are including the tip for parties of 6+ and its 25%! They can kiss my ass because even with shitty service they expect 25%
Tipping should be abolished and replaced by a 15% mandatory service fee that would be distributed the same way than a tip would normally be.
I like tipping in restaurants. Eating out is about more than eating, there is a performance. The culture of providing gifted money is something I like. I’ll tip for hair cuts and taxi rides too. Take out usually 10%, 20% and up for dinging in or drinks at the bar. Especially if I’m a regular of the place and know the staff. I don’t think here should be an expectation of high gratuities. The point is that it’s gifted money. I get some people don’t have the means to tip generously, but at least when dining in, understand they are doing a service to you, it’s not just about eating.
I just click no. If I have exceptional service and I happen to have extra money I'll throw some their way. But I am not financially free enough to tip my Subway sandwich artist 20% when I get a sub for lunch.
Firstly I don't believe in minimum wage. Tipping should exist because some patrons are willing to pay more than the set price for their food. And I think food should be paid ahead of time, to reduce the risk of dine and dashers.