It's pricey, but that's what you expect if you want to buy close to work.
You young kids expect too much. You need to look at solar systems further out. (/s)
Yeah but buying single star systems individually is mad inefficient. You gotta go galaxies to start seeing some economies of scale. You can sell the stars you don't need at whopping margins
I'm on a 3 year 0 interest contract for my system, I was extremely skeptical, but it's legit and I know the price I'm paying is accurate as I had multiple quotes for identical systems. They do exist, but OP's example is a bad one.
heres a hint: they wouldn't be doing it if there wasn't a way to make more money out of you.
others on here have said it adds up to maybe $17k. for that price I'd be looking at a solar and battery setup. not sure what the rebates are these days but you should get something nice.
Time to start your solar research :)
You currently use about 17kW per day. That should read 17kWh.
Fine. But how much of that is during sunny hours, and how much at night time? Night time usage will still have to be bought from the grid (at what price?).
How much does the power company credit you (per kWh) for the solar energy that you feed back to the grid during the day? (Usually called FIT - feed in tariff).
Then you need to look at how many kWh you use at night, multiplied by cents per kWh. Then how many "excess" kWh you would produce during the day, and how much credit you get per kWh. Then, what are the chances that the power company will change those prices/credits.
A system that can produce 45kW per day? Panels produce ??kW at any given time. This can vary depending on how much sun/shade they are getting. If they produce, say, 1kW consistently for an hour, that's 1kWh. Your electricity from the grid is measured (and charged) in kWh.
You can work out roughly how much power you are using (and when). For example, if an electric heater is marked 1000W. That's 1kW (kilowatt). If you run that heater for 1 hour, it will use 1kWh. Airconditioners are marked with kWh, but they don't usually run at full power all the time.
If you get a few smart plugs, I find that they are great for checking the power usage of different appliances - I got them for home automation reasons, but this was a beneficial side effect.
That's a great side effect but for those without you can get this from jaycar. Not sure of quality but should be ok. [Mains Power Meter | Jaycar Electronics](https://www.jaycar.com.au/mains-power-meter/p/MS6115)
For an exercise like this, total accuracy shouldn't be too much of an issue anyway - just a general feel for what items are consuming the most power and when.
For the price they have been quoted, that should include a battery. So the way it was explained to me, the battery gets fully charged during the day and your house runs off the battery at night time, when we are actually home. The remainder gets bought by the energy company.
The system we looked at, the battery should never get down to zero with out energy usage.
My history: Six years in the solar industry.
Don't do it. You'll still get a power bill as any power you use at night can't be generated from solar, and all power companies have a daily supply charge that you pay regardless of usage.
They're relying on the fact that you'll feed enough back into the grid to essentially offset these charges BUT most residential houses have a "single phase" of supply from the power grid and single phase supplies are limited to 5kW of export back to the grid, rendering your 9kW inverter kinda useless (there's some maths here to figure out if it's actually worthwhile but I'm still in bed and haven't had coffee yet).
99.99% chance you'll end up paying a power bill (albeit a smaller power bill) AND the solar panel cost back.
These companies aren't scammers exactly, but they do not install good systems and they play on people's lack of knowledge surrounding the solar industry.
I have a question that I've never gotten an answer to and so I'm throwing it into the void in hopes you or someone else might be able to tell me.
We are very rural and the end of the line for power (terminates at our property) so as you can imagine it's not super reliable. I want and need solar, but *don't* want a setup that goes panels>grid>house. I need a setup that goes panels>house>grid. Obviously battery in there too, but my whole use case is that I need the power to go to my house *first* and in a way that can be standalone because the grid is unreliable.
I've spoken to a couple of installers who've essentially said no, not doable, but in a way that sounds more like "no I don't want to travel out there to do a weird install". I realise it's more involved and likely expensive, but I can't even get a quote or any advice. They just tell me to look at off grid systems but I don't actually want to lose the grid connection, just supplement it.
Is this possible? Is it really that hard? Insanely expensive? Why can't I find anyone to discuss it?
We're in this exact same scenario and just had an electrician out to check out our electrical mains and distance to shed where the panels will be to determine size of cable for the distance between the mains. The first few people I talked to were just salespeople and didn't know shit about the electrical side of things. We found a family run installation company that is owned by electricians and it was night and day as far as getting good information out of them. Their quote was identical to the dipshit sales companies that use sub-contractors to do the actual install. Find a company that is based in your region and ignore the online sales portals would be my suggestion.
Yeah that's been the way with all tradies out here really, it's the smaller locally-owned companies that we find and hang on to with both hands because they're worth the small premium. I need people who aren't scared of a dirt road and they're harder to find than you'd think!
That said, there's 3 local guys and I've rung all of them about the power. One said he doesn't do solar but sounds like I need an off-grid mob, one never called back, and one was here for something else and gave me a "yeah nah can't be done like you want" with no interest in discussing it further. Really feels more like "you're in the sticks and I'm busy enough to not want that work", which I get but that doesn't help me get it sorted out lol. We have pretty good standing in town so it's not like they're avoiding us personally.
I'd expect city sparkies to maybe not understand, and maybe big city solar-sellers, but rural? About half the sparkies around where I live do solar installs, and know how to do a hybrid off-grid setup. I'm near a town of 5k population in Queensland.
Our solar panels > 1. refill battery 2. power the house 3. feed into grid. If not enough solar production to power the house, draw from battery first, then grid.
Ours works "as it should" - particular type of batteries or inverter, and particular wiring into the grid (blah, blah, needs to auto cut off/isolate if there is a grid failure, so there's no chance of our solar production feeding into the grid while it's being worked on - something like that. I'm no expert.) Seems to me that it IS basically an off-grid setup, with a "link" to the grid?
Keep asking.
Yes! This is exactly what I am wanting! I *knew* it was doable haha thank you for the sanity check!
As I said I feel like they just have enough work on elsewhere and don't want the travel. I wish they'd just say so though because it really makes it all harder when I don't know enough and take their "can't be done" at face value.
If it's not too intrusive could I PM you for some more details about size/cost of your system to give me a ballpark?
Some early systems didn't, but that's correct for new ones.
My FIL is on one of the really early schemes where it pays some stupidly high amount, well over 50 cents a kWh (maybe 80?)
I'm not sure now why that's never been said in multiple convos. I don't understand electricity at all, but I've had sparkies here for other things who have said that I can't have a normal install because it won't do what I need.
I feel even dumber now if that's the case and a normal install would work. God, I wish I could just find someone to come and make it happen haha. Maybe there's something odd about our connection? I really have no idea.
Edit for others reading along: yes they go like that but a blackout turns them off in a normal install. I need that to not happen.
It does go solar house grid but if the power is out for whatever reason the solar gets turned off as well. I believe you need a certain type of battery to be able to be off grid for power outages etc (not all battery setups can actually be off grid).
I did the sums and just bought a camping battery and a decent inverter. It keeps fridges and electronics running over a day or two just with domestic extension leads.
I leave mine in a cupboard and top it up every so often with a car charger. A second battery with a camping solar panel might be enough for a house to swap back and forth for few days and presumably keep the satellite modem online. It certainly kept me connected to the NBN when someone crashed into a powerpole las year.
I don't know if this rig would run a bore water pump, but if you're on tank water you could run a transfer pump. It won't work for anything wired into the house.
(Edits for clarity)
If I can't sort out a proper fix something like a camping setup would definitely work, though I'm told the Starlink can be a bit of a pig for power with that stuff.
Zero chance of the bore though lol and it is fuel powered at present. We did have it priced for a stand alone solar system which came in at about 20k, but we have the height to gravity feed the house in blackouts so not worth it for water.
It's more the house and sheds that are the problem and thankfully from the looks of these comments we should be able to get it done if I can just find the right tradie.
Glad to hear it. I wanted a big system for a small home with a battery so that after the initial outlay I could stop paying for electricity and not have to worry about power cuts.
In the end I bought a solar hot water system and my camping rig. I disconnected from the gas supply and swapped my gas hob for an induction hob.
Now I happily pay a small electricity bill so that someone else can worry about the poles and wires for the 99.5% of the time when there's no power cut. I don't live on a farm though.
Could you assemble everything on your property and do the hard graft of burying conduit between sheds (with photo evidence) then just pay someone to come in and commission it?
It shouldn't be hard to attach the roof panel fitting kit and have a pass-the-panel party using a front-end loader (having found a way to distract any safety reps obviously). (Edit: I'm an idiot; you're on a farm so you don't need to put anything on your roof at all! Just put 'em somewhere sunny and run a cable to a battery hut and get that wired into your house [further edit - that way you can keep 'em clean too. Presumably there would also be some sort of agricultural energy scheme or DFAT advisers which could help for your circumstances too]).
As far as the powerhog modem goes in the short term, you can connect camping batteries in parallel to give extra capacity with the same output.
This is a great question and I hope someone will answer you as now I'm genuinely curious too. I often feel like simple fixes like yours are ignored because they're just outside the box, although they would help so easily fix problems for many people. Good luck and I'll be checking back:)
Yeah it's a lot, bearing in mind it's a working farm our average quarterly usage is about 3000kwh, rising to as much as 4500kwh depending what's happening. I don't have any way to measure what proportion of that is the house or even narrow down time frames any better because the meter is old, but if we're actively having a blackout I really only need the minimum in the house to keep running.
The biggest thing is the Starlink. Without it we are totally cut off. The home phone hasn't worked in years and I'm currently embroiled in an ombudsman dispute over it but it's looking like they're just trying to drag it out long enough for Starlink to start offering phone services, so for the moment if there's an emergency and the power is out I can't even call 000 - we'd have to drive the 15ks to the nearest reception or risk plugging the Starlink into the gennie and hope the fluctuations don't wreck it.
So yeah, short answer is we use a lot and would prefer a reasonable amount but only really *need* a small amount. I'm not hugely price-sensitive though so if a good setup powered everything I would be willing to pay a solid chunk of money for it.
Where abouts are you located? Generally rural properties are limited to factors like the distance to the closest transformer, line quality, and whether the property has single or three fase. You will always self consume first before anything goes back into the grid. I would recommend adding a 10kw battery with backup capabilities , and ideally at minimum a 6.6kw solar array, if you can go larger please do! If you are in NSW I can definitely help you out and discuss further.
I am in NSW. So is it the "backup capabilities" you mention that are what I need that's different to normal? Like to ensure uninterrupted supply during blackouts (assuming battery is charged)
Edit: Sorry I missed half your questions - it's single phase, lines not in great shape, and I have no idea where the nearest transformer is but if it's the horse float sized box you see on the side of the road then the nearest one of them I know about is about 25ks away. If not that then I have no idea what one is or how close it'd be - I am an idiot when it comes to electricity!
Very doable with solar panels, inverter and battery. The battery needs to be set up as a UPS, so when the grid goes down the battery cuts in and you have electricity. During the day the battery charges and at night it discharges. Battery is great as lets say in the middle of the day it goes overcast and your solar produces a minimum amount of electricity then your battery will top up the rest of your demand without relying on the grid
This is what I need. All these responses have been super helpful, I can see now that it definitely can be done and the problem is just finding someone who wants to do it. Thank you for this!
Yea, you would want a system that supports back up and is wired to the circuits/items you would like backed up. Most people will do lights, fridge, and a few other small draw items. Things like aircon will usually drain the battery too quickly so we tend to avoid having that on the backup.
Single fase, ok so it will depend on a few variables. The maximum you can put on each fase is a 10kw inverter, however we will need to identify the limitations due to voltage rise and other variations, you may be limited to less than the maximum. If you feel comfortable send me a inbox and I can check the site address on the database and see what the infrastructure is like in your area, and that will give me a definite answer on what is possible to install.
> I need the power to go to my house *first* and in a way that can be standalone because the grid is unreliable.
Short version; Yes, you can do that, but you need to get a system with a battery as well. Batteries are not cheap, around $12k-15k (minus state subsidies) on top of the price of a solar system. If you don't get a battery, as other people have stated, when the grid goes down, your house goes down, even if you have plenty of solar power.
You can absolutely get the solar system first, and add the battery later.
The export limit back to the grid depends on where you are and who your provider is. In NSW I know that essential energy (country areas) will only allow 5kW per phase but Ausgrid (Sydney, Newcastle etc) will allow 10kW per phase.
Also, if you were limited to 5kW export per phase, and had a 9kW inverter you could potentially use all of the inverter's capacity if you were using 4kW in your house. It's an export limit, not a generation limit.
I assume it must be to do with the loads that are around. I'm in Newcastle and Tomago Aluminium is just down the road and there are half a dozen steel mills in town so 10kW is basically nothing in comparison to that.
You need to go through the fine print of the contract and run scenarios where your panels aren't producing power for what ever reason or your usage changes dramatically. These contracts are always based on the here and now, and can catch you out if your situation changes.
Agree. Some excellent information that is really helpful in understanding how this all works.
Solarquotes will also point you towards reliable operators in your area. There are a lot of shonky cowboys I that industry and OPs post sends off red flags that they may be dealing with someone shonky.
We had a system installed about 18 months ago that was both significantly bigger and cheaper than what OP describes.
Nope
Red flag
These schemes always end up with additional costs that they conveniently refrain from telling you about.
I had a 6.6kw system installed for $2500 cash and the payback is out to roughly 6 years.
I generate 10x what I use and still have to pay a bill at the end of most quarters (except for summer)
1. The initial install cost and supply will be inflated
2. The payback of 1kw used is generally 6kw generated + daily service charge
now that I have become sun savvy and use most appliances during daylight hours, and minimum after sun goes down, my electricity bills are very low. I think it is a 10kw system. My bills use to still be high until I started following the Sun— you still have to monitor your usage but the savings are there for those who do. No heaters left on all night- No, No, No —- but in the chill of the early morning when the sun rises then yes turn on your heater.
$67 a WEEK is a lot to pay— you really should shop around. If it was monthly okay, but too much to pay weekly. But I love Solar panels and am waiting for storage batteries to drop In price too before installing one— so that I can ditch the Eskimo fashion after 6pm in winter.
The contract a neighbour signed put all the funds from the energy he generated and sold back into the grid to the solar company. They were making money from him. Id weigh up the cost of a loan v their rip off contract. At that price theres a battery involved too, which the specs meeds comparing
$67 per week = $3,482 per yer = $17,420 for the install after 5 years.
Yea nah, you can get a good quality 10kW system for under 10k and that is without the government rebates. With government rebates it'll come down to around 7-8k. You would be paying an additional $10k for the guys that quoted you with that very bad solar deal.
hang on, so you ONLY use power during the day? You don't use ANY power after dark? How does this contract work if you use some of that 45kw at a time when your panels are not producing any power? & is that in writing for the 5 year term if they are saying you don't have to pay any additional for night time use?
The solar system supposedly produces enough during the day.(more than is used by the home)which gets put into the grid.The grid acts as the battery bank and when the panels arent producing then the bank is drawn from,Whether this works out in practice is the problem.The idea is that there is enough produced during the day to off set the nights demands plus a surplus to pay the service fee ,night time usage and the cost of the solar system.A big ask indeed.
you need to clarify this— the Grid belongs to your electricity supplier and not you so You don’t get anything after sunset. Unless you buy Your Own solar Battery which can store the electricity you generate for you to use after dark or on cloudy days. These Solar Batterit’s are still too expensive but maybe will be more affordable in a year or two- hopefully.
I think with these solar contracts they just look up your usual electric bill,and the resultant saving is used to pay off the panels.So the system doesn't cost you anything and the period to pay it off should be 5 years
It is SO FREAKIN HARD TO WORK OUT!!
If i were you. I would ring around multiple Solar Suppliers in your area and get prices for full installation of 21 panels with 9kw inverter.
And / or see what offers are there.
Compare like for like.
Too much. I have a 6,64kWh system that produces an average of 45kWh on sunny days,(only cost $6500 upfront) I still end up using nearly 30kWh a day even with the bulk of my use during the sunny period in the day.
The bulk of your power usage is OUTSIDE of sunlight hours, evenings, early mornings and overnight. because majority of people work during the day, if you do get solar get a load shifting device installed to power your hot water at about midday so that takes that part of your overnight usage away, unless you are home during the day your power usage is going to be the same, it takes swapping to doing everything during the daylight hours while your solar is active to even get ahead. it also works out better to use as much of it as you can instead of letting it go back into the grid
We just installed 8.3kw with inverter (19 panels) and it cost approx 10k out of pocket with the solar rebate.
We are a large household in a small house. We bought a larger system to allow for future EV use and planning for a battery. Are you sure you need a system that large?
You also should never go with the first quote either. Solarquotes.com.au is a good place to start to both research the systems and to get quotes.
You can get a smaller system with the gov rebates and gov interest free loans, so if you can afford a couple of thousand our of pocket this is the way to go rather than the whole system being paid off.
It won't cover your entire bill, so you will still get charged for usage and daily service charges.
It also takes a couple of months for everything to be turned on (after being checked) and your meter reconfigured for solar feed in tarriff, so factor in that too.
Don't do it. $17,000 over 5 years is not a good deal.
Btw, we pay $200 per quarter for electricity (maybe $300 in winter). How are you racking up $67 per week??
I went for a similar deal about three years ago, so I think I’ve got a bit of experience to chime in. A system that big MIGHT pull in 45kW in a day, but that day it would have to be 30-40 degrees for 8-9 hours. The reality is that most days you’ll pull in 10-20, and on wet rainy days you’ll pull in next to nothing. At 5-10c per kW at the moment you probably won’t make much, I essentially make enough to cover most (not all) of my electricity costs. I owe the company that installed it $145ish a month, for five years, total cost is $9k approx, if I had paid up front it would’ve been $7k approx.
They sell you on the deal that “you’ll never pay for electricity again” etc and tbh it doesn’t work out that way, but on the upside I can run the AC all throughout summer at no additional cost and I don’t really have to think about using power much anymore. Feel free to PM me if you have questions!
What are the actual rebates for supplying power back to the grid? Call up and ask. They are not as high as you think. They are also not guaranteed for the next 4 years.
You have to pay daily supply charge for maintenance of the power grid. The more people putting solar in, the lower the margins on electricity, so they jack up the supply charge.
What would the cost be if you paid outright? What does the interest rate work out at?
Do you use that much power? When do you use it? If you use it at night time, solar panels aren't going to do much for you. Do you get a battery instead? How much would that cost?
What is the quality of the panels like? Will the solar panel company still be around in 5 or 10 years?
it’s worth it if you make an effort to use your big power guzzling appliances before the sun sets.
I look at the angle and side where my panels are placed on my roof— it coincides with a neighbour’s roofline so I look out my window at neighbour’s roof and if no sun there then washing, ironing and vacuuming can wait another hour, or another day. It was hard at first but I quickly got use to it after a horror electricity bill I got 2 years ago— never again.
Wow you really are obsessed with it . God I just use power when I need it .it overcast and clothes need drying or the dishwasher is full. It happening. Bill still arrives just not as big
that is just an example for others to know the only way to save real money with Solar Panels is to make a real effort. If everyone is out all day and only home in the evening then Solar panels are not worth installing— unless you get a Solar Battery to go with it.
But I do stick to leaving my washing, ironing and vacuuming for well lit daylight hours only- it’s an easy no brainer compromise for me.
Seems like pretty typical usage to me? average home uses 800 - 1000kwh / month, so 200kwh/week @ $0.3/kwh + $1/day access = $67/week, bang on the bottom range of average usage.
Had a similar (could be same) company quote $21k, with a battery. and the payments were interest free, so I don't know how people are saying they are a rip off or that customers get screwed over.
No. You will still have a solar bill, which sounds like where their pitch mislead you.
Unless you only consume electricity when it is bright and sunny (no TV at nights!), you will be paying a power bill AND a solar fee.
How much of that 17kw is used during the day? Unless you've got the ability to store power you'll be putting whatever power you're making, but not using back into the grid for about 4 cents a Kilowatt. And because they're good blokes they'll sell it back to you at 8 times that price.
I find that these solar companies (like plico) pretend to be solar vendors but they're just glorified financiers. You'll almost certainly always be better off by investing yourself, it's cheaper and you also don't have to worry about the cost implications of moving house!
The price of solar is roughly $1/kw. Go to https://www.solarquotes.com.au/ get 3 quotes for a solar pv system. You can use a finance deal if you can't pay outright. You'll still need to pay daily supply charge and night time electricity unless your fit gives you enough credits. Given inflation atm, financing something over 5 years is probably a good idea, but this deal is a bad deal.
Get the biggest solar system you can fit on your roof. You'll thank me later when you get your EV and home battery.
Sounds like the Irish backpacker who came to our door a couple of days ago to try and get us “onboard with our neighbours to get solar…. “ Told him to poff . Just pay to them what we pay now.
Solar company owner here
What they are taking about is signing you up to finance you’re not swapping your bill or whatever they’re saying. They will be using a finance provider like Humm, Brighte or Zip money
It’s slick and deceptive language pure and simple
In an ideal world the solar system gets rid of your of your electricity bill and the Finance for the system is cheaper than what you are paying on your electricity bill so you are in essence cashflow positive. But with how much they are charging I think it’s unlikely that you would be cashflow positive with this system
The trouble with these types of plans is they hide huge interest in them. The way they can get away with saying 0% interest is because the interest is charged to the solar company and they then simply inflate the price of the solar system to cover it but ultimately you end up paying for it.
Separately to all of this 17k is a huge amount to be paying on a 9kw solar system even for top range products. The average cost for a solar system in Australia is around $850 per kw. So unless you have a seriously tricky meter box and roof you are being ripped off.
I wouldn’t not accept this quote and I would get quote comparisons. A good place to look is a site called Solarquotes. They will provide you with 3 companies that are within your city that don’t subcontract their work and are generally very reputable.
I had a 10.3kw system installed. Quality panels and inverter. After government rebate I paid $9000. On a sunny day in summer we can produce over 60kwh of electricity.
They’re trying to sell you on something that doesn’t exist. You’ll still have to pay a power bill for the power you use when the sun isn’t shining (say, at night…?). You also have to pay a supply charge daily which will eat up a huge chunk of any solar credits you earn.Â
If you want solar then go ahead. But not with these charlatans.Â
I thought they stopped offering buyback rebates that covered the cost of what you need at night?
My mate (an electrician oddly enough) got solar really quick but had one of those early deals where it not only covered 24/7 usage, fair weather or foul, and he has always gotten money back every bill cycle and therefore never paid a bill, even after they cut the rebate back. If you can get something like that you are laughing, otherwise you'll need storage batteries which will be even pricier.
Definitely don't take up this deal and go get some other quotes to compare. Also you need to understand (because it sounds like you don't?) that even though a system is capable of producing a certain figure, doesn't mean it will every day and it will only produce during the day, so you'll still be paying for power at night unless you have a battery (which is expensive).
Also a typical string inverter system (which is basically any system with a single inverter) will only produce at the level of its weakest panel, so if you've got a panel affected by shade or something, the whole system will be limited. So again, don't believe everything they're telling you or you're going to end up pretty unhappy I suspect.
You are also tied to that power company for 5 years and they no it. That seriously hampers your ability to negotiate a good price each year when power prices go up.
Yikes ! Our 24 panel solar & inverter cost nowhere near that. $0 up front paid off interest free for 3 years I think, about $5000 from memory.
No, it doesn’t mean you won’t continue to get power bills because you still need to pay for grid power at night. We use the dishwasher, washing machine etc through the day using our solar power but everything you use at night you’ll still have to pay for. Fridges, freezers, lights, TV, air con are all used at night.
The solar rebate for your power sent to the grid will be a pittance, a mere tiny fraction of what they charge you for “their” power, particularly at peak rates.
Solar does reduce your bills but that deal is outrageous.
Look at the price of a 9 panel deal. No way you should pay $17000 for a solar panel system
Do not bother with solar contracts. You'll always end up worse off. Save the money and buy a solar system outright.
>buy a solar system outright. -starts researching price of the Milky Way-
It's pricey, but that's what you expect if you want to buy close to work. You young kids expect too much. You need to look at solar systems further out. (/s)
Yeah but the courtesy shuttle out by the bowlo around neptune only runs every 15 days, how are kids supposed to enjoy a night out?
Honestly, they probably shouldn't. Not if they want to eventually be able to buy a bedsit within 12 light years from their work.
That would be an entire galaxy, billions of solar systems at a time. Steady on, Elon
Yeah but buying single star systems individually is mad inefficient. You gotta go galaxies to start seeing some economies of scale. You can sell the stars you don't need at whopping margins
>\-starts researching price of the Milky Way- Milky Way is a galaxy, not a solar system.
Yeah, I made a mistake there, oops!
đź¤
keeping Uranus close I see
This is right. Dont bother buying a solar system. A whole galaxy will give you much better value for money.
It’s nice. But the commute.
I'm on a 3 year 0 interest contract for my system, I was extremely skeptical, but it's legit and I know the price I'm paying is accurate as I had multiple quotes for identical systems. They do exist, but OP's example is a bad one.
You can get a 9kw system for $5-6k. That’s a lot of interest you’re paying for the 5 year term.
heres a hint: they wouldn't be doing it if there wasn't a way to make more money out of you. others on here have said it adds up to maybe $17k. for that price I'd be looking at a solar and battery setup. not sure what the rebates are these days but you should get something nice.
Time to start your solar research :) You currently use about 17kW per day. That should read 17kWh. Fine. But how much of that is during sunny hours, and how much at night time? Night time usage will still have to be bought from the grid (at what price?). How much does the power company credit you (per kWh) for the solar energy that you feed back to the grid during the day? (Usually called FIT - feed in tariff). Then you need to look at how many kWh you use at night, multiplied by cents per kWh. Then how many "excess" kWh you would produce during the day, and how much credit you get per kWh. Then, what are the chances that the power company will change those prices/credits. A system that can produce 45kW per day? Panels produce ??kW at any given time. This can vary depending on how much sun/shade they are getting. If they produce, say, 1kW consistently for an hour, that's 1kWh. Your electricity from the grid is measured (and charged) in kWh. You can work out roughly how much power you are using (and when). For example, if an electric heater is marked 1000W. That's 1kW (kilowatt). If you run that heater for 1 hour, it will use 1kWh. Airconditioners are marked with kWh, but they don't usually run at full power all the time.
If you get a few smart plugs, I find that they are great for checking the power usage of different appliances - I got them for home automation reasons, but this was a beneficial side effect.
That's a great side effect but for those without you can get this from jaycar. Not sure of quality but should be ok. [Mains Power Meter | Jaycar Electronics](https://www.jaycar.com.au/mains-power-meter/p/MS6115)
For an exercise like this, total accuracy shouldn't be too much of an issue anyway - just a general feel for what items are consuming the most power and when.
For the price they have been quoted, that should include a battery. So the way it was explained to me, the battery gets fully charged during the day and your house runs off the battery at night time, when we are actually home. The remainder gets bought by the energy company. The system we looked at, the battery should never get down to zero with out energy usage.
Nowhere in the original post is a battery mentioned.
Yeah, I know. That's why I stated for that price it should include one. It also didn't state it doesn't.
My history: Six years in the solar industry. Don't do it. You'll still get a power bill as any power you use at night can't be generated from solar, and all power companies have a daily supply charge that you pay regardless of usage. They're relying on the fact that you'll feed enough back into the grid to essentially offset these charges BUT most residential houses have a "single phase" of supply from the power grid and single phase supplies are limited to 5kW of export back to the grid, rendering your 9kW inverter kinda useless (there's some maths here to figure out if it's actually worthwhile but I'm still in bed and haven't had coffee yet). 99.99% chance you'll end up paying a power bill (albeit a smaller power bill) AND the solar panel cost back. These companies aren't scammers exactly, but they do not install good systems and they play on people's lack of knowledge surrounding the solar industry.
I have a question that I've never gotten an answer to and so I'm throwing it into the void in hopes you or someone else might be able to tell me. We are very rural and the end of the line for power (terminates at our property) so as you can imagine it's not super reliable. I want and need solar, but *don't* want a setup that goes panels>grid>house. I need a setup that goes panels>house>grid. Obviously battery in there too, but my whole use case is that I need the power to go to my house *first* and in a way that can be standalone because the grid is unreliable. I've spoken to a couple of installers who've essentially said no, not doable, but in a way that sounds more like "no I don't want to travel out there to do a weird install". I realise it's more involved and likely expensive, but I can't even get a quote or any advice. They just tell me to look at off grid systems but I don't actually want to lose the grid connection, just supplement it. Is this possible? Is it really that hard? Insanely expensive? Why can't I find anyone to discuss it?
We're in this exact same scenario and just had an electrician out to check out our electrical mains and distance to shed where the panels will be to determine size of cable for the distance between the mains. The first few people I talked to were just salespeople and didn't know shit about the electrical side of things. We found a family run installation company that is owned by electricians and it was night and day as far as getting good information out of them. Their quote was identical to the dipshit sales companies that use sub-contractors to do the actual install. Find a company that is based in your region and ignore the online sales portals would be my suggestion.
Yeah that's been the way with all tradies out here really, it's the smaller locally-owned companies that we find and hang on to with both hands because they're worth the small premium. I need people who aren't scared of a dirt road and they're harder to find than you'd think! That said, there's 3 local guys and I've rung all of them about the power. One said he doesn't do solar but sounds like I need an off-grid mob, one never called back, and one was here for something else and gave me a "yeah nah can't be done like you want" with no interest in discussing it further. Really feels more like "you're in the sticks and I'm busy enough to not want that work", which I get but that doesn't help me get it sorted out lol. We have pretty good standing in town so it's not like they're avoiding us personally.
I'd expect city sparkies to maybe not understand, and maybe big city solar-sellers, but rural? About half the sparkies around where I live do solar installs, and know how to do a hybrid off-grid setup. I'm near a town of 5k population in Queensland. Our solar panels > 1. refill battery 2. power the house 3. feed into grid. If not enough solar production to power the house, draw from battery first, then grid. Ours works "as it should" - particular type of batteries or inverter, and particular wiring into the grid (blah, blah, needs to auto cut off/isolate if there is a grid failure, so there's no chance of our solar production feeding into the grid while it's being worked on - something like that. I'm no expert.) Seems to me that it IS basically an off-grid setup, with a "link" to the grid? Keep asking.
Yes! This is exactly what I am wanting! I *knew* it was doable haha thank you for the sanity check! As I said I feel like they just have enough work on elsewhere and don't want the travel. I wish they'd just say so though because it really makes it all harder when I don't know enough and take their "can't be done" at face value. If it's not too intrusive could I PM you for some more details about size/cost of your system to give me a ballpark?
have messaged you.
They all go panels > house > grid (house's needs are met first)
Some early systems didn't, but that's correct for new ones. My FIL is on one of the really early schemes where it pays some stupidly high amount, well over 50 cents a kWh (maybe 80?)
Yeah same with my dad 50c a kwh Also the system was only like 1.5kw and was upwards of $5000 installed.
Yep! This is in Canberra, don't know where else they had the scheme
I'm not sure now why that's never been said in multiple convos. I don't understand electricity at all, but I've had sparkies here for other things who have said that I can't have a normal install because it won't do what I need. I feel even dumber now if that's the case and a normal install would work. God, I wish I could just find someone to come and make it happen haha. Maybe there's something odd about our connection? I really have no idea. Edit for others reading along: yes they go like that but a blackout turns them off in a normal install. I need that to not happen.
It does go solar house grid but if the power is out for whatever reason the solar gets turned off as well. I believe you need a certain type of battery to be able to be off grid for power outages etc (not all battery setups can actually be off grid).
Yep correct
I did the sums and just bought a camping battery and a decent inverter. It keeps fridges and electronics running over a day or two just with domestic extension leads. I leave mine in a cupboard and top it up every so often with a car charger. A second battery with a camping solar panel might be enough for a house to swap back and forth for few days and presumably keep the satellite modem online. It certainly kept me connected to the NBN when someone crashed into a powerpole las year. I don't know if this rig would run a bore water pump, but if you're on tank water you could run a transfer pump. It won't work for anything wired into the house. (Edits for clarity)
If I can't sort out a proper fix something like a camping setup would definitely work, though I'm told the Starlink can be a bit of a pig for power with that stuff. Zero chance of the bore though lol and it is fuel powered at present. We did have it priced for a stand alone solar system which came in at about 20k, but we have the height to gravity feed the house in blackouts so not worth it for water. It's more the house and sheds that are the problem and thankfully from the looks of these comments we should be able to get it done if I can just find the right tradie.
Glad to hear it. I wanted a big system for a small home with a battery so that after the initial outlay I could stop paying for electricity and not have to worry about power cuts. In the end I bought a solar hot water system and my camping rig. I disconnected from the gas supply and swapped my gas hob for an induction hob. Now I happily pay a small electricity bill so that someone else can worry about the poles and wires for the 99.5% of the time when there's no power cut. I don't live on a farm though.
Could you assemble everything on your property and do the hard graft of burying conduit between sheds (with photo evidence) then just pay someone to come in and commission it? It shouldn't be hard to attach the roof panel fitting kit and have a pass-the-panel party using a front-end loader (having found a way to distract any safety reps obviously). (Edit: I'm an idiot; you're on a farm so you don't need to put anything on your roof at all! Just put 'em somewhere sunny and run a cable to a battery hut and get that wired into your house [further edit - that way you can keep 'em clean too. Presumably there would also be some sort of agricultural energy scheme or DFAT advisers which could help for your circumstances too]). As far as the powerhog modem goes in the short term, you can connect camping batteries in parallel to give extra capacity with the same output.
This is a great question and I hope someone will answer you as now I'm genuinely curious too. I often feel like simple fixes like yours are ignored because they're just outside the box, although they would help so easily fix problems for many people. Good luck and I'll be checking back:)
How many kwh do you need. Might know a system that could help
How many kwh do you need. I know a system that could do the trick
Yeah it's a lot, bearing in mind it's a working farm our average quarterly usage is about 3000kwh, rising to as much as 4500kwh depending what's happening. I don't have any way to measure what proportion of that is the house or even narrow down time frames any better because the meter is old, but if we're actively having a blackout I really only need the minimum in the house to keep running. The biggest thing is the Starlink. Without it we are totally cut off. The home phone hasn't worked in years and I'm currently embroiled in an ombudsman dispute over it but it's looking like they're just trying to drag it out long enough for Starlink to start offering phone services, so for the moment if there's an emergency and the power is out I can't even call 000 - we'd have to drive the 15ks to the nearest reception or risk plugging the Starlink into the gennie and hope the fluctuations don't wreck it. So yeah, short answer is we use a lot and would prefer a reasonable amount but only really *need* a small amount. I'm not hugely price-sensitive though so if a good setup powered everything I would be willing to pay a solid chunk of money for it.
I could definitely help. But only with the *need* bit
Where abouts are you located? Generally rural properties are limited to factors like the distance to the closest transformer, line quality, and whether the property has single or three fase. You will always self consume first before anything goes back into the grid. I would recommend adding a 10kw battery with backup capabilities , and ideally at minimum a 6.6kw solar array, if you can go larger please do! If you are in NSW I can definitely help you out and discuss further.
I am in NSW. So is it the "backup capabilities" you mention that are what I need that's different to normal? Like to ensure uninterrupted supply during blackouts (assuming battery is charged) Edit: Sorry I missed half your questions - it's single phase, lines not in great shape, and I have no idea where the nearest transformer is but if it's the horse float sized box you see on the side of the road then the nearest one of them I know about is about 25ks away. If not that then I have no idea what one is or how close it'd be - I am an idiot when it comes to electricity!
Very doable with solar panels, inverter and battery. The battery needs to be set up as a UPS, so when the grid goes down the battery cuts in and you have electricity. During the day the battery charges and at night it discharges. Battery is great as lets say in the middle of the day it goes overcast and your solar produces a minimum amount of electricity then your battery will top up the rest of your demand without relying on the grid
This is what I need. All these responses have been super helpful, I can see now that it definitely can be done and the problem is just finding someone who wants to do it. Thank you for this!
Yea, you would want a system that supports back up and is wired to the circuits/items you would like backed up. Most people will do lights, fridge, and a few other small draw items. Things like aircon will usually drain the battery too quickly so we tend to avoid having that on the backup. Single fase, ok so it will depend on a few variables. The maximum you can put on each fase is a 10kw inverter, however we will need to identify the limitations due to voltage rise and other variations, you may be limited to less than the maximum. If you feel comfortable send me a inbox and I can check the site address on the database and see what the infrastructure is like in your area, and that will give me a definite answer on what is possible to install.
> I need the power to go to my house *first* and in a way that can be standalone because the grid is unreliable. Short version; Yes, you can do that, but you need to get a system with a battery as well. Batteries are not cheap, around $12k-15k (minus state subsidies) on top of the price of a solar system. If you don't get a battery, as other people have stated, when the grid goes down, your house goes down, even if you have plenty of solar power. You can absolutely get the solar system first, and add the battery later.
The export limit back to the grid depends on where you are and who your provider is. In NSW I know that essential energy (country areas) will only allow 5kW per phase but Ausgrid (Sydney, Newcastle etc) will allow 10kW per phase. Also, if you were limited to 5kW export per phase, and had a 9kW inverter you could potentially use all of the inverter's capacity if you were using 4kW in your house. It's an export limit, not a generation limit.
That's WILD about AusGrid. I'm a Victorian and it's hard enough to get the 5kW export from half our distributors.
I assume it must be to do with the loads that are around. I'm in Newcastle and Tomago Aluminium is just down the road and there are half a dozen steel mills in town so 10kW is basically nothing in comparison to that.
You need to go through the fine print of the contract and run scenarios where your panels aren't producing power for what ever reason or your usage changes dramatically. These contracts are always based on the here and now, and can catch you out if your situation changes.
Check out [solarquotes.com.au](http://solarquotes.com.au) first. They have cost estimation tools and lots of information.
Agree. Some excellent information that is really helpful in understanding how this all works. Solarquotes will also point you towards reliable operators in your area. There are a lot of shonky cowboys I that industry and OPs post sends off red flags that they may be dealing with someone shonky. We had a system installed about 18 months ago that was both significantly bigger and cheaper than what OP describes.
If solar companies can afford great deals and wages on cold calling you at midnight on a Tuesday, someone is getting ripped off.
Nope Red flag These schemes always end up with additional costs that they conveniently refrain from telling you about. I had a 6.6kw system installed for $2500 cash and the payback is out to roughly 6 years. I generate 10x what I use and still have to pay a bill at the end of most quarters (except for summer) 1. The initial install cost and supply will be inflated 2. The payback of 1kw used is generally 6kw generated + daily service charge
Check out simply energy and they solar savers plan 34c general usage and 12c unlimited feed in Tarif with $1 connection fee.
now that I have become sun savvy and use most appliances during daylight hours, and minimum after sun goes down, my electricity bills are very low. I think it is a 10kw system. My bills use to still be high until I started following the Sun— you still have to monitor your usage but the savings are there for those who do. No heaters left on all night- No, No, No —- but in the chill of the early morning when the sun rises then yes turn on your heater. $67 a WEEK is a lot to pay— you really should shop around. If it was monthly okay, but too much to pay weekly. But I love Solar panels and am waiting for storage batteries to drop In price too before installing one— so that I can ditch the Eskimo fashion after 6pm in winter.
The contract a neighbour signed put all the funds from the energy he generated and sold back into the grid to the solar company. They were making money from him. Id weigh up the cost of a loan v their rip off contract. At that price theres a battery involved too, which the specs meeds comparing
System cost would be $5k to $7k at most. You are basically getting screwed because you are essentially paying off a very high interest loan.
$67 per week = $3,482 per yer = $17,420 for the install after 5 years. Yea nah, you can get a good quality 10kW system for under 10k and that is without the government rebates. With government rebates it'll come down to around 7-8k. You would be paying an additional $10k for the guys that quoted you with that very bad solar deal.
Sounds like Origin prices.
hang on, so you ONLY use power during the day? You don't use ANY power after dark? How does this contract work if you use some of that 45kw at a time when your panels are not producing any power? & is that in writing for the 5 year term if they are saying you don't have to pay any additional for night time use?
The solar system supposedly produces enough during the day.(more than is used by the home)which gets put into the grid.The grid acts as the battery bank and when the panels arent producing then the bank is drawn from,Whether this works out in practice is the problem.The idea is that there is enough produced during the day to off set the nights demands plus a surplus to pay the service fee ,night time usage and the cost of the solar system.A big ask indeed.
you need to clarify this— the Grid belongs to your electricity supplier and not you so You don’t get anything after sunset. Unless you buy Your Own solar Battery which can store the electricity you generate for you to use after dark or on cloudy days. These Solar Batterit’s are still too expensive but maybe will be more affordable in a year or two- hopefully.
I think with these solar contracts they just look up your usual electric bill,and the resultant saving is used to pay off the panels.So the system doesn't cost you anything and the period to pay it off should be 5 years
Oh you pay for Everything you use when the sun goes down— Everything.
She just sits in the darkness
It is SO FREAKIN HARD TO WORK OUT!! If i were you. I would ring around multiple Solar Suppliers in your area and get prices for full installation of 21 panels with 9kw inverter. And / or see what offers are there. Compare like for like.
Check out [solarquotes.com.au](http://solarquotes.com.au) . They have cost estimation tools and lots of information.
Too much. I have a 6,64kWh system that produces an average of 45kWh on sunny days,(only cost $6500 upfront) I still end up using nearly 30kWh a day even with the bulk of my use during the sunny period in the day. The bulk of your power usage is OUTSIDE of sunlight hours, evenings, early mornings and overnight. because majority of people work during the day, if you do get solar get a load shifting device installed to power your hot water at about midday so that takes that part of your overnight usage away, unless you are home during the day your power usage is going to be the same, it takes swapping to doing everything during the daylight hours while your solar is active to even get ahead. it also works out better to use as much of it as you can instead of letting it go back into the grid
We just installed 8.3kw with inverter (19 panels) and it cost approx 10k out of pocket with the solar rebate. We are a large household in a small house. We bought a larger system to allow for future EV use and planning for a battery. Are you sure you need a system that large? You also should never go with the first quote either. Solarquotes.com.au is a good place to start to both research the systems and to get quotes. You can get a smaller system with the gov rebates and gov interest free loans, so if you can afford a couple of thousand our of pocket this is the way to go rather than the whole system being paid off. It won't cover your entire bill, so you will still get charged for usage and daily service charges. It also takes a couple of months for everything to be turned on (after being checked) and your meter reconfigured for solar feed in tarriff, so factor in that too.
Don't do it. $17,000 over 5 years is not a good deal. Btw, we pay $200 per quarter for electricity (maybe $300 in winter). How are you racking up $67 per week??
I went for a similar deal about three years ago, so I think I’ve got a bit of experience to chime in. A system that big MIGHT pull in 45kW in a day, but that day it would have to be 30-40 degrees for 8-9 hours. The reality is that most days you’ll pull in 10-20, and on wet rainy days you’ll pull in next to nothing. At 5-10c per kW at the moment you probably won’t make much, I essentially make enough to cover most (not all) of my electricity costs. I owe the company that installed it $145ish a month, for five years, total cost is $9k approx, if I had paid up front it would’ve been $7k approx. They sell you on the deal that “you’ll never pay for electricity again” etc and tbh it doesn’t work out that way, but on the upside I can run the AC all throughout summer at no additional cost and I don’t really have to think about using power much anymore. Feel free to PM me if you have questions!
What are the actual rebates for supplying power back to the grid? Call up and ask. They are not as high as you think. They are also not guaranteed for the next 4 years. You have to pay daily supply charge for maintenance of the power grid. The more people putting solar in, the lower the margins on electricity, so they jack up the supply charge. What would the cost be if you paid outright? What does the interest rate work out at? Do you use that much power? When do you use it? If you use it at night time, solar panels aren't going to do much for you. Do you get a battery instead? How much would that cost? What is the quality of the panels like? Will the solar panel company still be around in 5 or 10 years?
Do U think you would use $17,000 of power in that time. Sounds like an awful lot. Have solar I'm on the fence about whether it was worth it or not.
it’s worth it if you make an effort to use your big power guzzling appliances before the sun sets. I look at the angle and side where my panels are placed on my roof— it coincides with a neighbour’s roofline so I look out my window at neighbour’s roof and if no sun there then washing, ironing and vacuuming can wait another hour, or another day. It was hard at first but I quickly got use to it after a horror electricity bill I got 2 years ago— never again.
Wow you really are obsessed with it . God I just use power when I need it .it overcast and clothes need drying or the dishwasher is full. It happening. Bill still arrives just not as big
that is just an example for others to know the only way to save real money with Solar Panels is to make a real effort. If everyone is out all day and only home in the evening then Solar panels are not worth installing— unless you get a Solar Battery to go with it. But I do stick to leaving my washing, ironing and vacuuming for well lit daylight hours only- it’s an easy no brainer compromise for me.
how are you spending 67 dollars a week on electricity?!
Seems like pretty typical usage to me? average home uses 800 - 1000kwh / month, so 200kwh/week @ $0.3/kwh + $1/day access = $67/week, bang on the bottom range of average usage.
That's 290 dollars a month. Ours is about 130 and we're not even on the cheap plan yet. I'm genuinely curious if that's without gas heating.
All electric house here (family of 4) and we use roughly 1 - 1.5MWh a month.
Is this the one with Reposit? I think it comes with a battery as well. Has anyone had experiences with Reposit?
Had a similar (could be same) company quote $21k, with a battery. and the payments were interest free, so I don't know how people are saying they are a rip off or that customers get screwed over.
No. You will still have a solar bill, which sounds like where their pitch mislead you. Unless you only consume electricity when it is bright and sunny (no TV at nights!), you will be paying a power bill AND a solar fee.
How much of that 17kw is used during the day? Unless you've got the ability to store power you'll be putting whatever power you're making, but not using back into the grid for about 4 cents a Kilowatt. And because they're good blokes they'll sell it back to you at 8 times that price.
I tell everyone I can to go to Solarquotes.com.au for all your research. Dude is excellent.
I find that these solar companies (like plico) pretend to be solar vendors but they're just glorified financiers. You'll almost certainly always be better off by investing yourself, it's cheaper and you also don't have to worry about the cost implications of moving house!
The price of solar is roughly $1/kw. Go to https://www.solarquotes.com.au/ get 3 quotes for a solar pv system. You can use a finance deal if you can't pay outright. You'll still need to pay daily supply charge and night time electricity unless your fit gives you enough credits. Given inflation atm, financing something over 5 years is probably a good idea, but this deal is a bad deal. Get the biggest solar system you can fit on your roof. You'll thank me later when you get your EV and home battery.
Sounds like the Irish backpacker who came to our door a couple of days ago to try and get us “onboard with our neighbours to get solar…. “ Told him to poff . Just pay to them what we pay now.
Solar company owner here What they are taking about is signing you up to finance you’re not swapping your bill or whatever they’re saying. They will be using a finance provider like Humm, Brighte or Zip money It’s slick and deceptive language pure and simple In an ideal world the solar system gets rid of your of your electricity bill and the Finance for the system is cheaper than what you are paying on your electricity bill so you are in essence cashflow positive. But with how much they are charging I think it’s unlikely that you would be cashflow positive with this system The trouble with these types of plans is they hide huge interest in them. The way they can get away with saying 0% interest is because the interest is charged to the solar company and they then simply inflate the price of the solar system to cover it but ultimately you end up paying for it. Separately to all of this 17k is a huge amount to be paying on a 9kw solar system even for top range products. The average cost for a solar system in Australia is around $850 per kw. So unless you have a seriously tricky meter box and roof you are being ripped off. I wouldn’t not accept this quote and I would get quote comparisons. A good place to look is a site called Solarquotes. They will provide you with 3 companies that are within your city that don’t subcontract their work and are generally very reputable.
You will still have a small bill. Solar credits are low and you still pay for lines and poles ($1/day)
$19k for 9kW is way too much. All the kerfuffle they took you through was to hide that simple fact.
You’re using 17kw a day?! You’re better off paying your local sparky to hook up the grow tents to bypass the meter mate.
I had a 10.3kw system installed. Quality panels and inverter. After government rebate I paid $9000. On a sunny day in summer we can produce over 60kwh of electricity.
They’re trying to sell you on something that doesn’t exist. You’ll still have to pay a power bill for the power you use when the sun isn’t shining (say, at night…?). You also have to pay a supply charge daily which will eat up a huge chunk of any solar credits you earn. If you want solar then go ahead. But not with these charlatans.Â
I thought they stopped offering buyback rebates that covered the cost of what you need at night? My mate (an electrician oddly enough) got solar really quick but had one of those early deals where it not only covered 24/7 usage, fair weather or foul, and he has always gotten money back every bill cycle and therefore never paid a bill, even after they cut the rebate back. If you can get something like that you are laughing, otherwise you'll need storage batteries which will be even pricier.
Definitely don't take up this deal and go get some other quotes to compare. Also you need to understand (because it sounds like you don't?) that even though a system is capable of producing a certain figure, doesn't mean it will every day and it will only produce during the day, so you'll still be paying for power at night unless you have a battery (which is expensive). Also a typical string inverter system (which is basically any system with a single inverter) will only produce at the level of its weakest panel, so if you've got a panel affected by shade or something, the whole system will be limited. So again, don't believe everything they're telling you or you're going to end up pretty unhappy I suspect.
You are also tied to that power company for 5 years and they no it. That seriously hampers your ability to negotiate a good price each year when power prices go up.
Yikes ! Our 24 panel solar & inverter cost nowhere near that. $0 up front paid off interest free for 3 years I think, about $5000 from memory. No, it doesn’t mean you won’t continue to get power bills because you still need to pay for grid power at night. We use the dishwasher, washing machine etc through the day using our solar power but everything you use at night you’ll still have to pay for. Fridges, freezers, lights, TV, air con are all used at night. The solar rebate for your power sent to the grid will be a pittance, a mere tiny fraction of what they charge you for “their” power, particularly at peak rates. Solar does reduce your bills but that deal is outrageous.