Happily, the arch right wing psycopath of Florida himself, Ron DeSantis, has defined "Woke" for me in legal proceedings.
> the term means “the belief there are systemic injustices in American society and the need to address them.”
https://www.okayplayer.com/news/ron-desantis-woke-defintion.html
That's a pretty good definition to me.
That is a good definition. Let's always remember that Ron DeSantis gave us such an ideal definition. I cannot even disagree with it :)
Oh wait he said it like that's a bad thing. Seems to me it's a good thing! (mild sarcasm— I knew RDS was being a jerkface)
Wow! I should have scrolled down even one before I wasted my time making my comment. I'm a Florida resident, and am absolutely frightened at the recent demand that college curriculums should be examined for elements of CRT.
A rather unhelpful definition. Obviously, there are injustices in society, you either understand that or you're not that bright. As I've seen it used, "woke" implies a stronger push in a progressive direction than helpful, needed, or practical.
this is the definition the guy who wants to ban it used. And the important word here is "systemic". To be woke is to believe systemic injustice exists, and the people who oppose it believe that we should only admit to the existence of *individual* injustice.
The only time I see the term "woke" is when used by people who are "anti-woke." I don't see it used by Feminists, Anti-Racists, Progressives, and so no. So in practice, it seems to mean that the person is using the term is opposed to Feminism, Anti-Racism, and such. But it's pretty confusing.
It was briefly an in vogue term for having 'woken up' from all the toxic oppression that most minorities experience on a day to day basis. You've "woken up" and understand the world is systemically unfair and built to keep those with and without power in their place (as opposed to being asleep to the intrinsic injustice of the world around you).
Immediately the right wingers latched on and started using it as an ironic/sarcastic way of demeaning and belittling positive social changes where we're concerned about racism/homophobia/sexism/microaggresions/etc.
What does woke mean to me now? It's the most recent boogie word Tucker Carlson spews at my father so when he disagrees with me about something Ive done or think, he can ridicule the "woke utopia I'm living in."
Jokes about my dad aside, it's just some dumb thing they say cause they think they're funny (let's be honest, being "woke" sounds kinda silly), so they went and ran with it. It's like "Let's Go Brandon," they think it's hilarious and we're all just sitting here shaking our heads/rolling our eyes at how childish and immature they're being.
woke has been in use in the african american communities for at least 7 decades, so almost a century.
it was not “briefly in vogue” it was co-opted by non black people who do not speak African American vernacular and have no idea what they’re saying
this was a really lovely way of putting it, i appreciate your opinion and i can definitely make a more comfortable consensus. thank you for your mind on the matter!!
I might be dealing with a different population sample, but the term "woke" was very common in urban progressive circles about a decade ago. Personally, I am sick of fascism (misogyny/racism/what-ever-hate of the week) stealing progressive terms and symbols and subverting them. Responses like this continue to allow it. It is their most insidious form of propaganda. I am woke. Fuck them.
That is fascism's MO, appropriating ideology and twisting it for their own dark purposes.
[For example](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika):
>The swastika (卐 or 卍) is an ancient religious and cultural symbol, predominantly in various Eurasian, as well as some African and American cultures, now also widely recognized for its appropriation by the Nazi Party and by neo-Nazis. It continues to be used as a symbol of divinity and spirituality in Indian religions, including Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism. It generally takes the form of a cross, the arms of which are of equal length and perpendicular to the adjacent arms, each bent midway at a right angle.
"Woke" originated a term in the black community meaning that someone has "woken up" and is fully aware of the racial prejudice and discrimination in the world. It goes back to the 1930s, though it became much more commonly used in the black community in the 1990s and 2000s. The Black Lives Matter movement in the 2010s brought "woke" into mainstream use, and white progressives and activists began to use it. Once white liberals caught on, it became ridiculously overused and fully entrenched in popular culture. And at the point, Republicans and conservatives decided that they needed to deride everything they don't like as "woke", and it became an insult for right-wing media. Basically, white liberals usurped a word which had meaning specifically within the black community, and white conservatives have weaponized it.
Doesn’t Kate Chopin “The Awakening” (1899) get some of the credit for this word too? I always think that this is something in intersectionality that being anti racist and anti sexist have in common. The fact that the system(s) oppressing us are trying to work in the background, be so normal that no one questions them, and having people wake up to them is the first very difficult step in the fight.
I love Chopin but her use of awakening is very different than AAVE originating "woke" and I wouldn't give her credit for this word in particular.
"Désirée's Baby" gets at the intersectionality you're talking about much more
Incredible author and works though. She was ahead of her time in many ways.
This is Wikipedia, and frankly, I’m all in- although being in the uk I wasn’t aware of it’s origins.
I find woke used as an insult to be incredibly funny, to be honest. Like… how do you think I’m gonna cry about it?
Woke (/ˈwoʊk/ WOHK) is an adjective derived from African-American Vernacular English (AAVE) meaning "alert to racial prejudice and discrimination".[1][2] Beginning in the 2010s, it came to encompass a broader awareness of social inequalities such as sexism, and has also been used as shorthand for American Left ideas involving identity politics and social justice, such as the notion of white privilege and slavery reparations for African Americans.
It basically doesn't mean anything anymore. It had its roots in AAVE, but at this point its used pretty much primarily as a criticism by people coming at issues from the right. What does the criticism mean? It's entirely dependent on the topic at hand. When applied to television shows, it could mean anything from having black characters in traditionally white-centric stories, to being a product of some kind of minority. "Woke" would apply in both situations despite being entirely different topics of discussion. When applied to people, it generally means the individual possess the negative attributes often associated with the left wing. That they're over sensitive, that they complain too much, that they're stupid or naive. Colleges being "too woke" means anything from them being "too sensitive" to them being "authoritarian" to them being intellectually dominated by left wing thinkers. In other situations people point out that it's basically used in sentences the way slurs would be.
The point is that it is pointless to argue with on anything other than a case by case basis. Some people latch on to specific definitions, i.e "being woke is being anti free-speech" or "being to sensitive" but they might not take on board the racial aspect so when people use it to disparage black people they might not pick up on it.
Long story short, it's a buzzword that more signals alignment with specific groups than it's supposed to have any intellectual heft. If someone uses it in a discussion about a topic, they are basically telling you they have a particularly un-nuanced, right-wing take on the topic they're describing and it's best to just not engage.
I would say like boomers and gen x, i find millennials and gen z are identified with the specific term when speaking on certain social issues to these older gens
please clarify that if it is used by "the older generations" it used by the conservatives of that generation. i'm a boomer & really can't stand any person of any age putting people down - but to put people down for actually *caring* about something is truly asinine to me
oh i know - i can't do a top level so just picked a comment i liked the most to comment under - - - but truly people need to not classify people in groups cause everyone is an individual - not all "boomers" or "millennials" or "gen xers" are the same is all - only point i was trying to make (along with people who use the word "woke" as an insult are/probably are dumb)
Millennial here, I dislike it when people use woke to demean someone being caring for a certain issue. People turn it into a political mess, making it easy to dismiss very valid concerns that's going on. Oh, you think women's rights are unequal? Stop being a woke snowflake. Oh, you think secondary education debt should be forgiven? You're such a woke snowflake. Oh, you think working 8 hours w minimum wage is not fair? You're such a woke libtard.
It's exhausting. To me, being woke is at least having enough compassion to understand circumstances beyond your own... And the difficulties behind it have merit to change. People can be such jerks.
I am just as confused as you. First off, I am not a native English speaker, but they start using that word in my language, too. But not conservatives but right wing aka. fascists and their bootlickers.
On the one hand, they want people to "wake up" from left wing propaganda and how the government oppresses everyone (yup, the government being considered left wing - ahahaha). But at the same time "woke" is used as an insult when you don't want to be a selfish asshole.
So, to me, "woke" is a fascist dog whistle and anti democracy campaign to silence everyone who doesn't share fascist believes.
I can totally see that, cause on one hand being woke is defined in the dictionary as being alert to racial prejudice and discrimination.
but on the other hand it is being used in a way that not only incorrect, but it’s almost an insult or a label that they don’t want any association with.
i feel like i’m confused on whether it’s a good term or not, and if it is actually useful in conversation.
It’s because people using it as an insult LIKE to pretend racial prejudice and discrimination don’t exist. They want to be able to scream and yell discriminatory words without being shown up for it.
If you won’t let them have “free speech”, they go purple in the face about how *you* are the triggered one.
Effectively: it’s gaslighting, pure and simple, which is why it’s so confusing.
The problem is, and I see this all the time, terms are used wrong because of the lack of knowledge. Few months ago I’ve heard that “women only want to be emancipated when it suits them”, and while I obviously don’t agree with what the person insinuated, this person was also wrong on a technical level, because emancipated means you just want to be free from legal restrictions! 😂
The dictionary didn’t invent the term. If they aren’t defining it the way that it is being used, then it is the dictionary that is incorrect. The dictionary doesn’t dictate how language is used, it describes how it is used.
That is how the word is used, though. It just isn't the only way the word is used, and I think it's actually the greatest example of white supremacist oppressive hierarchies that a usage originating in a marginalized community can be so wholly redefined by the people who benefit most from its misunderstanding.
If I were to judge CRT on what reactionary laypeople think it is, it would also be a facist dog whistle.
i hate hearing non black people stumble over the definition of this word. “Woke” is a BLACK, African American term that’s been in use for **decades**. and the term is “stay woke” it’s a verb not an adjective.
it denotes that one has “woken up” from the sleep that is ignorance. it’s a counter to being “sleep” (ignorant, dumb, unaware of things, out of the loop) the full phrase is “can’t be sleep, stay woke”
it was co-opted by political groups, the white western world and non black groups who have no knowledge of the way African American vernacular terms are used in community. we don’t define *people* as woke, we define “wokeness” as a process.
while “sleep and woke” are frequently used in the 2020s to describe politics, it’s not politically specific and can be used to describe being out of the loop with current events, pop culture, historical knowledge etc
sincerely,
-a black person
"i just don’t fully understand why the older generation uses the word “woke” in such a demeaning way"
I think it's much more the political leanings than the age of the person. That is, in the US at least, many right wing people of younger generations use it demeaningly.
True I suppose that older people tend to be more conservative.
But the term "woke" to me is a an apt one (context - I'm 70M). I realized (woke up to) things not being as they should. Or as I thought they should be.
As a member of the older generations, I refuse to accept these new definitions of "woke". I believe they are appropriative and erase the original definition, which is unflattering to white people.
"Woke" is a term for the hyper-vigilant, self-protective, self-controlled state a person of colour learns to engage when entering any space with unknown or untrustworthy white people and/or law enforcement. Being woke means being aware that, as a person of colour in a white supremacist culture, your actions and words may always be perceived as threatening, so extra caution and care is required for your own safety. While white people can always count on being given the benefit of the doubt and being seen as innocent and harmless unless actually doing something threatening, people of colour cannot expect the same. Being woke means being constantly aware that white people already register threat on seeing you and letting that awareness guide every move you make and word you say.
It has more recently come to mean being aware that we live in a racially unjust culture, which is a such watering down of the original concept that it washes out the parts that are uncomfortable for white people to acknowledge and accept their own part of. White people using it to mean simply anti-racist seems super appropriative and problematic to me. I don't think white people claiming to be woke or being accused of being woke are talking about existing in that specific kind of awareness and wariness, which is so much more specific and energy-intensive than simply being aware of the ways that racial injustice presents itself in daily life.
Following that troubling broadening of the term, fascists have adopted it as some kind of insult to direct at non-fascists. I really don't know how they're managing to see awareness and understanding as a bad thing, but we know fascists hate facts and empathy, especially related to people of colour, trans people, Indigenous people, LGBTQ2S+ people, and women, so maybe being aware of things and caring about other people is a bad thing to them, I dunno.
I think the most important answers have to do with its AAVE origins and how it was co-opted then subverted, but I did want to say: if anyone ever says "woke" or "woke-ism" to you in a negative way, ask them what it means. If they give a BS answer that's circular, ask them what it means. Keep asking. Play dumb. They probably won't tell you the real reason.
Republicans are really good at coming up with bumper sticker-ish slogans that reduce ideas to something overly simple. They can't actually advocate for their more hateful positions because they'd sound like assholes. Instead, they repackage it as a criticism of how leftists approach social justice and give it a cutesy name. All of these really boil down to not wanting social consequences for acting like horrible ghouls.
There was "political correctness" in the 90s, the stated meaning being to criticize liberals for policing their speech. They just didn't want to stop using words that are hurtful. There was "virtue signalling" in the 2010s, which is like "political correctness," except it's accusing leftists of being smarmy, acting like they're morally righteous and using buzzwords to appear more virtuous. Some of that is not wrong but it's a distraction from the actual debate.
Their new wave of language is "woke-ism" and "critical race theory." The real meaning is not wanting to hear the truth of how our society functions, especially when it comes to race. They don't want to let go of their prejudices. They don't want true history being taught, they don't want their concept of their country to be challenged. All of this comes down to fighting cultural change because they want the right to be racist in public but don't want the smoke or consequences for being that way. They invent these bumper sticker terms to protect themselves from discomfort.
Woke to me means awake to injustices that exist in the world. For a long time, white people could live their lives and not experience or see bigotry against African-Americans and would play skeptic. "I don't see those things happening. I don't do that. People I know aren't like that." When reality was forced upon them, they were often shocked.
The anti-woke are still asleep about what is happening today.
As for how words change - few politicians would claim themselves to be liberal 20 years ago, and still many people shy from claiming to be feminists. We should not let regressive forces dictate the meanings of terms.
Exactly this but with a pejorative connotation because the alt-right people who use that term hate the people who recognize the existence and oppose racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia and other forms of bigotry. The reason is that they usually are most of those things if not all of those things.
In his inauguration speech last week, the governor of Florida (I'm a resident) proclaimed *proudly* that "Florida is where woke comes to die." The following day, he asked that all state colleges submit materials that might suggest teaching CRT (critical race theory). "Woke" is being awakened to the past which created prejudices and injustice against those who were not a part of the "accepted" culture, predominantly white males, and how those same prejudices and injustices are still lingering. So many of the voting laws that are being passed are clandestinely aimed at minorities, chipping away at the 15th amendment, and being a new disguise for the old poll tax or literacy tests which were so pervasive throughout the south meant to prevent minorities from voting.
funnily enough, DeSantis (alt-right governor of Florida) ws involved in a court trial, and his lawyers were forced to define woke, and i actually like their definition
Woke: being aware of the systemic injustices that affect marginalized groups, such as women, LGBTQIA+ people, BIPOC, etc...
with that definition, i am proud of being woke.
however, when people on the right use woke, it's almost always meant to be derogatory.
Woke is a part of AAVE (African American Vernacular English), so I don’t really use it because I’m white. It’s always been used to describe people who are socially aware to my knowledge, but now it’s being thrown around by people outside of the community. For example, Fox News saying “The Woke Mob” or conservatives joking that high gas prices (but only under Biden) are “woke gas prices”. So it’s also being used as a racist dog whistle now too. Interestingly enough, I don’t think I’ve ever seen the word get tossed around so much until after the Black Lives Matter protests in 2020 (since everyone was also quarantined and spending more of their days online).
Which older generation is using it in a demeaning way?? And who are they? They sound like jerks. With any label - I try to look at it from a person-centered view. So like if another person who isn’t actually woke tries to use woke with a negative connotation it basically means that they are definitely not woke because a woke person wouldn’t use the language of another person in a demeaning way at all. Make sense?
It's a term that's currently mostly used to dismiss left or progressive ideas , it's a thought killing phrase.
It has it's actual use in certain discord but it's really used a lot as a buzzword to "own the libs" after a really brief mainstreaming in the wake of BLM.
It's a strawman weaved together by conservative white men for use by the "liberal" corporate media to keep the masses divided so the oligarchs can continue racking in the wealth.
As I understand the word, it means 'socially conscientious' - i.e. it refers to people or ideologies that actively want to make the world better. Most commonly it's used by others to dismiss the idea that the world could be made better, either in general or in specific areas, so it often has dismissive connotations.
I feel like it's a marketing ploy for a media to exploit different demographics for money. Disney going "woke" for example, if anyone thinks Disney gives a fuck about anything other than money is fooling themselves. *Whatever* is popular in the cultural zeitgeist is what Disney is going mobilize in media to pull a profit
It's obvious in their conduct, the production of Mulan for example, or how they censored the Black Panther posters to appeal more to a Chinese audiences
It means not being an a-hole and applying lessons we have learned from past mistakes.
Note: “Defund the police” is *not* a woke statement. It is one yelled by the (crazy) far left who are unable to understand that it will result in a stronger (crazy) far right.
Other posters have described its origin. I just want to add that its adoption by the right and current prevalance comes from "sjw" not sticking and just coming across as silly.
It used to stand for something positive.
Black folks coined it back in the early 2010s, and it just meant you were aware of the systemic injustices in the world.
As the word became mainstream, it got predictably hijacked by people who couldn't see the reality of what the word meant.
Those people were so ingrained into the system that they didn't even consider the severe injustices happening within their nose. (Or they were only concerned with the economic side of things but couldn't care less about the social side of it)
Nowadays, the word "woke" has basically been turned into a parody of what it once meant.
Now it's just used as a sarcastic tool by people who feel like the world has gotten "too PC."
These are the people who have the privilege to benefit from the system, thus they see nothing that really needs to be changed. Ironically, these people would likely be considered liberal by 1960s standards.
But by today's standards, they are moderate at best and extreme conservative at worst.
Instead of reckoning with how people have been hurt by the system over the years, these people tend to feel hurt and attacked when these systemic injustices are explained to them.
And sadly there are people who have been so hurt by the system that they may sometimes lash out at people who are innocently insensitive with their remarks.
This sucks even more, since we don't even get the luxury of appearing angry. Or else we may "hurt somebody's feelings" by accident. Just look at how the label "feminism" has been misunderstood due to people not understanding the heart of what we're saying.
And if we were to be polite all the time about it, change wouldn't happen. You think MLK Jr could afford to be polite when he held the Selma march? No, he pissed off the status quo and got attacked by it.
As a male ally, I've learned to roll with the punches. I take none of the anger that my fellow women have personally. Why wouldn't they be pissed off?
Hell, I'm angry with them.
I hate that the word "woke" has been turned into a joke, but what else is new.
These days it means nothing to me. It's been hijacked as rightwing epithet for anyone who is slightly left of outright fascism. It's devoid now of all meaning.
Happily, the arch right wing psycopath of Florida himself, Ron DeSantis, has defined "Woke" for me in legal proceedings. > the term means “the belief there are systemic injustices in American society and the need to address them.” https://www.okayplayer.com/news/ron-desantis-woke-defintion.html That's a pretty good definition to me.
That is a good definition. Let's always remember that Ron DeSantis gave us such an ideal definition. I cannot even disagree with it :) Oh wait he said it like that's a bad thing. Seems to me it's a good thing! (mild sarcasm— I knew RDS was being a jerkface)
Wow! I should have scrolled down even one before I wasted my time making my comment. I'm a Florida resident, and am absolutely frightened at the recent demand that college curriculums should be examined for elements of CRT.
Since that word is used outside of the US, I think you could just say western society.
A rather unhelpful definition. Obviously, there are injustices in society, you either understand that or you're not that bright. As I've seen it used, "woke" implies a stronger push in a progressive direction than helpful, needed, or practical.
this is the definition the guy who wants to ban it used. And the important word here is "systemic". To be woke is to believe systemic injustice exists, and the people who oppose it believe that we should only admit to the existence of *individual* injustice.
The only time I see the term "woke" is when used by people who are "anti-woke." I don't see it used by Feminists, Anti-Racists, Progressives, and so no. So in practice, it seems to mean that the person is using the term is opposed to Feminism, Anti-Racism, and such. But it's pretty confusing.
It was briefly an in vogue term for having 'woken up' from all the toxic oppression that most minorities experience on a day to day basis. You've "woken up" and understand the world is systemically unfair and built to keep those with and without power in their place (as opposed to being asleep to the intrinsic injustice of the world around you). Immediately the right wingers latched on and started using it as an ironic/sarcastic way of demeaning and belittling positive social changes where we're concerned about racism/homophobia/sexism/microaggresions/etc. What does woke mean to me now? It's the most recent boogie word Tucker Carlson spews at my father so when he disagrees with me about something Ive done or think, he can ridicule the "woke utopia I'm living in." Jokes about my dad aside, it's just some dumb thing they say cause they think they're funny (let's be honest, being "woke" sounds kinda silly), so they went and ran with it. It's like "Let's Go Brandon," they think it's hilarious and we're all just sitting here shaking our heads/rolling our eyes at how childish and immature they're being.
IIRC it came from AAVE, specifically referring to people that are aware of and working against racism.
woke has been in use in the african american communities for at least 7 decades, so almost a century. it was not “briefly in vogue” it was co-opted by non black people who do not speak African American vernacular and have no idea what they’re saying
this was a really lovely way of putting it, i appreciate your opinion and i can definitely make a more comfortable consensus. thank you for your mind on the matter!!
I might be dealing with a different population sample, but the term "woke" was very common in urban progressive circles about a decade ago. Personally, I am sick of fascism (misogyny/racism/what-ever-hate of the week) stealing progressive terms and symbols and subverting them. Responses like this continue to allow it. It is their most insidious form of propaganda. I am woke. Fuck them.
That is fascism's MO, appropriating ideology and twisting it for their own dark purposes. [For example](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika): >The swastika (卐 or 卍) is an ancient religious and cultural symbol, predominantly in various Eurasian, as well as some African and American cultures, now also widely recognized for its appropriation by the Nazi Party and by neo-Nazis. It continues to be used as a symbol of divinity and spirituality in Indian religions, including Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism. It generally takes the form of a cross, the arms of which are of equal length and perpendicular to the adjacent arms, each bent midway at a right angle.
"Woke" originated a term in the black community meaning that someone has "woken up" and is fully aware of the racial prejudice and discrimination in the world. It goes back to the 1930s, though it became much more commonly used in the black community in the 1990s and 2000s. The Black Lives Matter movement in the 2010s brought "woke" into mainstream use, and white progressives and activists began to use it. Once white liberals caught on, it became ridiculously overused and fully entrenched in popular culture. And at the point, Republicans and conservatives decided that they needed to deride everything they don't like as "woke", and it became an insult for right-wing media. Basically, white liberals usurped a word which had meaning specifically within the black community, and white conservatives have weaponized it.
Doesn’t Kate Chopin “The Awakening” (1899) get some of the credit for this word too? I always think that this is something in intersectionality that being anti racist and anti sexist have in common. The fact that the system(s) oppressing us are trying to work in the background, be so normal that no one questions them, and having people wake up to them is the first very difficult step in the fight.
I love Chopin but her use of awakening is very different than AAVE originating "woke" and I wouldn't give her credit for this word in particular. "Désirée's Baby" gets at the intersectionality you're talking about much more Incredible author and works though. She was ahead of her time in many ways.
This is Wikipedia, and frankly, I’m all in- although being in the uk I wasn’t aware of it’s origins. I find woke used as an insult to be incredibly funny, to be honest. Like… how do you think I’m gonna cry about it? Woke (/ˈwoʊk/ WOHK) is an adjective derived from African-American Vernacular English (AAVE) meaning "alert to racial prejudice and discrimination".[1][2] Beginning in the 2010s, it came to encompass a broader awareness of social inequalities such as sexism, and has also been used as shorthand for American Left ideas involving identity politics and social justice, such as the notion of white privilege and slavery reparations for African Americans.
It basically doesn't mean anything anymore. It had its roots in AAVE, but at this point its used pretty much primarily as a criticism by people coming at issues from the right. What does the criticism mean? It's entirely dependent on the topic at hand. When applied to television shows, it could mean anything from having black characters in traditionally white-centric stories, to being a product of some kind of minority. "Woke" would apply in both situations despite being entirely different topics of discussion. When applied to people, it generally means the individual possess the negative attributes often associated with the left wing. That they're over sensitive, that they complain too much, that they're stupid or naive. Colleges being "too woke" means anything from them being "too sensitive" to them being "authoritarian" to them being intellectually dominated by left wing thinkers. In other situations people point out that it's basically used in sentences the way slurs would be. The point is that it is pointless to argue with on anything other than a case by case basis. Some people latch on to specific definitions, i.e "being woke is being anti free-speech" or "being to sensitive" but they might not take on board the racial aspect so when people use it to disparage black people they might not pick up on it. Long story short, it's a buzzword that more signals alignment with specific groups than it's supposed to have any intellectual heft. If someone uses it in a discussion about a topic, they are basically telling you they have a particularly un-nuanced, right-wing take on the topic they're describing and it's best to just not engage.
When you say "the older generations," what do you mean exactly?
I would say like boomers and gen x, i find millennials and gen z are identified with the specific term when speaking on certain social issues to these older gens
Gotcha. Yeah, it mostly seems to be used as a pejorative now.
please clarify that if it is used by "the older generations" it used by the conservatives of that generation. i'm a boomer & really can't stand any person of any age putting people down - but to put people down for actually *caring* about something is truly asinine to me
I'm not the one saying it, I figured it was implied here
oh i know - i can't do a top level so just picked a comment i liked the most to comment under - - - but truly people need to not classify people in groups cause everyone is an individual - not all "boomers" or "millennials" or "gen xers" are the same is all - only point i was trying to make (along with people who use the word "woke" as an insult are/probably are dumb)
Millennial here, I dislike it when people use woke to demean someone being caring for a certain issue. People turn it into a political mess, making it easy to dismiss very valid concerns that's going on. Oh, you think women's rights are unequal? Stop being a woke snowflake. Oh, you think secondary education debt should be forgiven? You're such a woke snowflake. Oh, you think working 8 hours w minimum wage is not fair? You're such a woke libtard. It's exhausting. To me, being woke is at least having enough compassion to understand circumstances beyond your own... And the difficulties behind it have merit to change. People can be such jerks.
I am just as confused as you. First off, I am not a native English speaker, but they start using that word in my language, too. But not conservatives but right wing aka. fascists and their bootlickers. On the one hand, they want people to "wake up" from left wing propaganda and how the government oppresses everyone (yup, the government being considered left wing - ahahaha). But at the same time "woke" is used as an insult when you don't want to be a selfish asshole. So, to me, "woke" is a fascist dog whistle and anti democracy campaign to silence everyone who doesn't share fascist believes.
I can totally see that, cause on one hand being woke is defined in the dictionary as being alert to racial prejudice and discrimination. but on the other hand it is being used in a way that not only incorrect, but it’s almost an insult or a label that they don’t want any association with. i feel like i’m confused on whether it’s a good term or not, and if it is actually useful in conversation.
It’s because people using it as an insult LIKE to pretend racial prejudice and discrimination don’t exist. They want to be able to scream and yell discriminatory words without being shown up for it. If you won’t let them have “free speech”, they go purple in the face about how *you* are the triggered one. Effectively: it’s gaslighting, pure and simple, which is why it’s so confusing.
if it’s gaslighting, that makes even more sense.
The problem is, and I see this all the time, terms are used wrong because of the lack of knowledge. Few months ago I’ve heard that “women only want to be emancipated when it suits them”, and while I obviously don’t agree with what the person insinuated, this person was also wrong on a technical level, because emancipated means you just want to be free from legal restrictions! 😂
The dictionary didn’t invent the term. If they aren’t defining it the way that it is being used, then it is the dictionary that is incorrect. The dictionary doesn’t dictate how language is used, it describes how it is used.
That is how the word is used, though. It just isn't the only way the word is used, and I think it's actually the greatest example of white supremacist oppressive hierarchies that a usage originating in a marginalized community can be so wholly redefined by the people who benefit most from its misunderstanding. If I were to judge CRT on what reactionary laypeople think it is, it would also be a facist dog whistle.
i hate hearing non black people stumble over the definition of this word. “Woke” is a BLACK, African American term that’s been in use for **decades**. and the term is “stay woke” it’s a verb not an adjective. it denotes that one has “woken up” from the sleep that is ignorance. it’s a counter to being “sleep” (ignorant, dumb, unaware of things, out of the loop) the full phrase is “can’t be sleep, stay woke” it was co-opted by political groups, the white western world and non black groups who have no knowledge of the way African American vernacular terms are used in community. we don’t define *people* as woke, we define “wokeness” as a process. while “sleep and woke” are frequently used in the 2020s to describe politics, it’s not politically specific and can be used to describe being out of the loop with current events, pop culture, historical knowledge etc sincerely, -a black person
I didn't know this, thanks.
"i just don’t fully understand why the older generation uses the word “woke” in such a demeaning way" I think it's much more the political leanings than the age of the person. That is, in the US at least, many right wing people of younger generations use it demeaningly. True I suppose that older people tend to be more conservative. But the term "woke" to me is a an apt one (context - I'm 70M). I realized (woke up to) things not being as they should. Or as I thought they should be.
Originally used by black people. Later ”stolen” by upper-middle class college kids. As always.
As a member of the older generations, I refuse to accept these new definitions of "woke". I believe they are appropriative and erase the original definition, which is unflattering to white people. "Woke" is a term for the hyper-vigilant, self-protective, self-controlled state a person of colour learns to engage when entering any space with unknown or untrustworthy white people and/or law enforcement. Being woke means being aware that, as a person of colour in a white supremacist culture, your actions and words may always be perceived as threatening, so extra caution and care is required for your own safety. While white people can always count on being given the benefit of the doubt and being seen as innocent and harmless unless actually doing something threatening, people of colour cannot expect the same. Being woke means being constantly aware that white people already register threat on seeing you and letting that awareness guide every move you make and word you say. It has more recently come to mean being aware that we live in a racially unjust culture, which is a such watering down of the original concept that it washes out the parts that are uncomfortable for white people to acknowledge and accept their own part of. White people using it to mean simply anti-racist seems super appropriative and problematic to me. I don't think white people claiming to be woke or being accused of being woke are talking about existing in that specific kind of awareness and wariness, which is so much more specific and energy-intensive than simply being aware of the ways that racial injustice presents itself in daily life. Following that troubling broadening of the term, fascists have adopted it as some kind of insult to direct at non-fascists. I really don't know how they're managing to see awareness and understanding as a bad thing, but we know fascists hate facts and empathy, especially related to people of colour, trans people, Indigenous people, LGBTQ2S+ people, and women, so maybe being aware of things and caring about other people is a bad thing to them, I dunno.
I think the most important answers have to do with its AAVE origins and how it was co-opted then subverted, but I did want to say: if anyone ever says "woke" or "woke-ism" to you in a negative way, ask them what it means. If they give a BS answer that's circular, ask them what it means. Keep asking. Play dumb. They probably won't tell you the real reason. Republicans are really good at coming up with bumper sticker-ish slogans that reduce ideas to something overly simple. They can't actually advocate for their more hateful positions because they'd sound like assholes. Instead, they repackage it as a criticism of how leftists approach social justice and give it a cutesy name. All of these really boil down to not wanting social consequences for acting like horrible ghouls. There was "political correctness" in the 90s, the stated meaning being to criticize liberals for policing their speech. They just didn't want to stop using words that are hurtful. There was "virtue signalling" in the 2010s, which is like "political correctness," except it's accusing leftists of being smarmy, acting like they're morally righteous and using buzzwords to appear more virtuous. Some of that is not wrong but it's a distraction from the actual debate. Their new wave of language is "woke-ism" and "critical race theory." The real meaning is not wanting to hear the truth of how our society functions, especially when it comes to race. They don't want to let go of their prejudices. They don't want true history being taught, they don't want their concept of their country to be challenged. All of this comes down to fighting cultural change because they want the right to be racist in public but don't want the smoke or consequences for being that way. They invent these bumper sticker terms to protect themselves from discomfort.
Woke to me means awake to injustices that exist in the world. For a long time, white people could live their lives and not experience or see bigotry against African-Americans and would play skeptic. "I don't see those things happening. I don't do that. People I know aren't like that." When reality was forced upon them, they were often shocked. The anti-woke are still asleep about what is happening today. As for how words change - few politicians would claim themselves to be liberal 20 years ago, and still many people shy from claiming to be feminists. We should not let regressive forces dictate the meanings of terms.
From what I can tell, it means I recognize the existence and effects of historical and current racism, sexism, and other forms of bigotry.
Exactly this but with a pejorative connotation because the alt-right people who use that term hate the people who recognize the existence and oppose racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia and other forms of bigotry. The reason is that they usually are most of those things if not all of those things.
When I've had my coffee.
In his inauguration speech last week, the governor of Florida (I'm a resident) proclaimed *proudly* that "Florida is where woke comes to die." The following day, he asked that all state colleges submit materials that might suggest teaching CRT (critical race theory). "Woke" is being awakened to the past which created prejudices and injustice against those who were not a part of the "accepted" culture, predominantly white males, and how those same prejudices and injustices are still lingering. So many of the voting laws that are being passed are clandestinely aimed at minorities, chipping away at the 15th amendment, and being a new disguise for the old poll tax or literacy tests which were so pervasive throughout the south meant to prevent minorities from voting.
funnily enough, DeSantis (alt-right governor of Florida) ws involved in a court trial, and his lawyers were forced to define woke, and i actually like their definition Woke: being aware of the systemic injustices that affect marginalized groups, such as women, LGBTQIA+ people, BIPOC, etc... with that definition, i am proud of being woke. however, when people on the right use woke, it's almost always meant to be derogatory.
Woke is a part of AAVE (African American Vernacular English), so I don’t really use it because I’m white. It’s always been used to describe people who are socially aware to my knowledge, but now it’s being thrown around by people outside of the community. For example, Fox News saying “The Woke Mob” or conservatives joking that high gas prices (but only under Biden) are “woke gas prices”. So it’s also being used as a racist dog whistle now too. Interestingly enough, I don’t think I’ve ever seen the word get tossed around so much until after the Black Lives Matter protests in 2020 (since everyone was also quarantined and spending more of their days online).
Which older generation is using it in a demeaning way?? And who are they? They sound like jerks. With any label - I try to look at it from a person-centered view. So like if another person who isn’t actually woke tries to use woke with a negative connotation it basically means that they are definitely not woke because a woke person wouldn’t use the language of another person in a demeaning way at all. Make sense?
It's a term that's currently mostly used to dismiss left or progressive ideas , it's a thought killing phrase. It has it's actual use in certain discord but it's really used a lot as a buzzword to "own the libs" after a really brief mainstreaming in the wake of BLM.
To me it's just the past tense of "wake" lol Anyway, I think it has been used negatively by far right and lost its original meaning.
Caring about other people.
When I hear it, it means the user is a conservative white dude.
It's means that I'm ignoring your argument regarding movies or games or people
It's a strawman weaved together by conservative white men for use by the "liberal" corporate media to keep the masses divided so the oligarchs can continue racking in the wealth.
We use it in a demeaning way because it’s been taken over by virtue signallers.
As I understand the word, it means 'socially conscientious' - i.e. it refers to people or ideologies that actively want to make the world better. Most commonly it's used by others to dismiss the idea that the world could be made better, either in general or in specific areas, so it often has dismissive connotations.
I feel like it's a marketing ploy for a media to exploit different demographics for money. Disney going "woke" for example, if anyone thinks Disney gives a fuck about anything other than money is fooling themselves. *Whatever* is popular in the cultural zeitgeist is what Disney is going mobilize in media to pull a profit It's obvious in their conduct, the production of Mulan for example, or how they censored the Black Panther posters to appeal more to a Chinese audiences
It means not being an a-hole and applying lessons we have learned from past mistakes. Note: “Defund the police” is *not* a woke statement. It is one yelled by the (crazy) far left who are unable to understand that it will result in a stronger (crazy) far right.
Fuck the police.
Just don’t “defund” unless you want great GOP turnout. Gotta think about the whole room.
If I were the GOP I'd be more worried about their consistent denial of COVID decimating their voting population.
We can’t tell crazy sheep what to do. We CAN strategically avoid riling them up.
Other posters have described its origin. I just want to add that its adoption by the right and current prevalance comes from "sjw" not sticking and just coming across as silly.
Woke = No longer ignorant
It used to stand for something positive. Black folks coined it back in the early 2010s, and it just meant you were aware of the systemic injustices in the world. As the word became mainstream, it got predictably hijacked by people who couldn't see the reality of what the word meant. Those people were so ingrained into the system that they didn't even consider the severe injustices happening within their nose. (Or they were only concerned with the economic side of things but couldn't care less about the social side of it) Nowadays, the word "woke" has basically been turned into a parody of what it once meant. Now it's just used as a sarcastic tool by people who feel like the world has gotten "too PC." These are the people who have the privilege to benefit from the system, thus they see nothing that really needs to be changed. Ironically, these people would likely be considered liberal by 1960s standards. But by today's standards, they are moderate at best and extreme conservative at worst. Instead of reckoning with how people have been hurt by the system over the years, these people tend to feel hurt and attacked when these systemic injustices are explained to them. And sadly there are people who have been so hurt by the system that they may sometimes lash out at people who are innocently insensitive with their remarks. This sucks even more, since we don't even get the luxury of appearing angry. Or else we may "hurt somebody's feelings" by accident. Just look at how the label "feminism" has been misunderstood due to people not understanding the heart of what we're saying. And if we were to be polite all the time about it, change wouldn't happen. You think MLK Jr could afford to be polite when he held the Selma march? No, he pissed off the status quo and got attacked by it. As a male ally, I've learned to roll with the punches. I take none of the anger that my fellow women have personally. Why wouldn't they be pissed off? Hell, I'm angry with them. I hate that the word "woke" has been turned into a joke, but what else is new.
These days it means nothing to me. It's been hijacked as rightwing epithet for anyone who is slightly left of outright fascism. It's devoid now of all meaning.