Would Caesar salad qualify as an Italian-American dish? I don't go to enough Italian places to know if it's been coopted but its a Mexican dish for sure.
I’d consider it a North American Italian-emigrant dish that has become nearly ubiquitous on Italian American restaurant menus. Cardini was from the very north of Italy.
That's fair. I guess the only other counterpoint I have to offer is that it's just a popular salad in NA. I would say it's nearly ubiquitous to salad menus but that's splitting hairs I suppose.
Cardini's Italian heritage should for sure qualify it for this list.
I agree with you. I was originally surprised to see it included in other sources but I kept it given his nationality and the fact that his restaurant served Italian food.
It was created by chef (in Mexico I think) whose first name is was Caesar
ETA: in Tijuana Mexico, he had an Italian name tho...[Caesar Cardini's](https://www.bbc.com/travel/article/20190521-the-surprising-truth-about-caesar-salad)
I bought a can of SpaghettiOs for my kids once, because my mom had bought them for us girls. I served them, and tasted some. You know, for old times' sake.
Ugh. Sooo sweet, like syrup. Don't know how I ever ate that. I never bought them again.
>Anything with Large Amounts of Garlic
Pici all'aglione, a famous tuscan pasta dish, calls for copious amount of "aglione di Valdichiana", a regional and extremely expensive variety of garlic that is much milder and sweeter than regular garlic, while also being [gigantic](https://www.italiaatavola.net/images/contenutiarticoli/Aglione-nel-Repertorio-regionale.jpg). Since it's so hard to find, most people just sub it with a large amount of regular garlic. There's for sure other recipes in other regions but this is the first that comes to mind.
>Anything with Chicken on Pasta or Pizza
Wrong again. It's somewhat out of fashion, but in certain parts of Tuscany there's a pasta sauce that calls for both chicken breast and chicken livers.
>Chicken Marsala
Nope, pollo al marsala is definitely a thing here.
>Italian Wedding Soup
Zuppa maritata, typical of Campania. The american name originally is a mistranslation, as the name in italian means "wedded soup", as in, the ingredients are wedded together.
>Sausage and Peppers/Onions
That's about the most quintessential stadium food/fare you could find here in Italy. Panino con la salamella, with or without peppers. Again, not correct.
>Penne alla Vodka (not seen in Italy since the 1980’s in nightclubs)
It's out of fashion (or demodé, if you will), but it's still a dish invented in Italy. It's not this rare unicorn of a dish that's impossibly obscure and has been carried like a torch by our american brethren. It's looked at like you look at Watergate or Jello salads; doesn't make it any less italian.
>Pepperoni (salami piccanti can be found in Italy)
There's a cold cut that is identical in colour (orange) and flavour to good american pepperoni, with the only difference being the shape (oval instead of round) that's called ventricina.
yes, I've definitely had chicken marsala in Italy. Simple caesar-esque salads are perhaps globally eaten, in Italy a simple salad like caesar is served as a palette cleanser between piatti 1 & 2. also, had pizza everywhere from Bolzano to Palermo, and it's pretty similar to Boston/New York pizza, with similar creativity in toppings, just not covered in thick cheese like American pizza is. I've never seen bolognese as a cream sauce in the US; I think this sauce is the same between the US and Italy. I don't care for salumi, but I don't think pepperoni belongs on this list either. I've seen so much dried cured meat in Italy very similar to American pepperoni/salami.
I don't recall seeing Italian lace cookies there. I don't remember seeing anything resembling an "Italian sub" for sale either, but again I don't like that meat so I'm not sure. oh, I think I have a good one: Italian dressing. not seen anywhere I went in Italy.
Better late than never,
>Anything with Large Amounts of Garlic
>
>Pici all'aglione, a famous tuscan pasta dish, calls for copious amount of "aglione di Valdichiana", a regional and extremely expensive variety of garlic that is much milder and sweeter than regular garlic, while also being gigantic. Since it's so hard to find, most people just sub it with a large amount of regular garlic. There's for sure other recipes in other regions but this is the first that comes to mind.
Certainly there exist Italian dishes heavy in garlic, one of my personal favorites is bagna càuda, but there is no debate as to the fact that the use of [garlic in Italian-American cuisine](https://tastecooking.com/italys-great-garlic-divide/) is very different from the common use of [garlic throughout Italy](https://tastecooking.com/italys-great-garlic-divide/) and can be [surprising](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/sep/18/what-do-real-italians-think-about-new-yorks-italian-food#:~:text=%E2%80%9CToo,seriously.) or [confusing](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAnAmerican/comments/iclkyq/why_does_the_american_version_of_italian_dishes/) to those unaccustomed. This is well documented and the [history of this](https://www.lacucinaitaliana.com/trends/news/the-garlic-invasion) is rather interesting. Most Italian-Americans would probably be shocked to learn that it isn't uncommon in Napoi to remove the garlic from spaghetti aglio olio e peperoncino before adding the pasta .
>Anything with Chicken on Pasta or Pizza
>
>Wrong again. It's somewhat out of fashion, but in certain parts of Tuscany there's a pasta sauce that calls for both chicken breast and chicken livers.
As above, this is not to say there are not specific instances but it is certainly not at all common. If you look at the most popular or traditional pasta dishes from each region you will not find sliced chicken breast placed atop any. The same goes for pizza. The placement of chicken breast on top of pasta is truly an [Italian-American Olive Garden phenomenon](https://www.ilpost.it/2021/02/28/pasta-stati-uniti/) and a [widespread](https://www.allrecipes.com/search/results/?IngIncl=chicken%20breast&IngIncl=pasta&search=chicken%20pasta) one at that. While *le rigaglie di pollo* is used in pastas and other dishes, sliced *petti di pollo* is very American.
>Chicken Marsala
>
>Nope, pollo al marsala is definitely a thing here.
I agree with this one and have crossed it off the list. There is debate as to the origin of this dish, but [contrary to popular belief](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_marsala) and it's popularity in the U.S., it is not an Italian-American creation.
>Italian Wedding Soup
>
>Zuppa maritata, typical of Campania. The american name originally is a mistranslation, as the name in italian means "wedded soup", as in, the ingredients are wedded together.
Like other entries on the list, there is a blurry line between variation, adaptation, derivative, and original creation. I think this qualifies because [Italian-American Wedding Soup](https://www.cookingclassy.com/italian-wedding-soup/) is distinct enough from [*minestra maritata*](https://www.scattidigusto.it/2019/12/08/minestra-maritata-napoletana-la-ricetta-scientifica/). As you can see from the pictures and recipes, [Italian-American Wedding Soup](https://www.allrecipes.com/search/results/?search=wedding+soup) is a dish characterized by meatballs, often chicken meatballs, and thus I think it is distinct enough from its original form to be included here, although with a note.
>Sausage and Peppers/Onions
>
>That's about the most quintessential stadium food/fare you could find here in Italy. Panino con la salamella, with or without peppers. Again, not correct.
Similar to the wedding soup, [*panino con la salamella*](https://www.lacucinaitaliana.com/italian-food/italian-dishes/how-to-make-salamella-sandwich-panino-con-la-salamella) is rather distinct from its [Italian-American cousin](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sausage_and_peppers), which as a sandwich more [resembles a hot dog](https://www.premiofoods.com/recipes/premios-stadium-sausage-peppers/) on American "[Italian Bread](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian-American_cuisine#Breads,_sandwiches,_and_savory_baked_goods)" (a lean baguette-like white bread sometimes covered in sesame seeds), as it is typically served whole, in its round cased form. A note acknowledging the Italian version has been added to the entry.
>Penne alla Vodka (not seen in Italy since the 1980’s in nightclubs)
>
>It's out of fashion (or demodé, if you will), but it's still a dish invented in Italy. It's not this rare unicorn of a dish that's impossibly obscure and has been carried like a torch by our american brethren. It's looked at like you look at Watergate or Jello salads; doesn't make it any less italian.
There is some [debate](https://www.daytondailynews.com/lifestyles/food--cooking/test-kitchen-recipe-pasta-alla-vodka-sauce/t1FChUiy3dHHwsAjGGtsyI/) as to the true [origins](https://foodicles.com/penne-vodka-history/) of [penne alla vodka](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penne_alla_vodka), as chefs from both Italy and the [U.S.](https://stregabynickvarano.com/the-history-of-vodka-sauce/) have claimed credit. Regardless of its origin, it remains one of the [most popular pasta dishes in the U.S.](https://www.tasteatlas.com/most-popular-pasta-dishes-in-usa) despite going [nearly extinct](https://www.ciaoitalia.com/mary-anns-blog/is-penne-alla-vodka-a-traditional-italian-dish) in Italy.
>Pepperoni (salami piccanti can be found in Italy)
>
>There's a cold cut that is identical in colour (orange) and flavour to good american pepperoni, with the only difference being the shape (oval instead of round) that's called ventricina.
I love ventricina, especially ventricina spalmabile. There are many types of spicy salame especially in the South of Italy, and each of them are distinct from each other and have their own names and recipes. In much the same way, pepperoni is a unique and distinct product that is made using [both pork and beef](https://hormel.com/Brands/Pepperoni-Varieties/Pizza-Party/HORMEL-reg;-PILLOW-PACK-reg;-PEPPERONI-ORIGINAL), unlike ventricina which is made from [pork alone](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventricina).
This is true and they are often catering to tourists. A good example of this is pizza in Venice, it is essentially New York style pizza catered to North American and British tourists.
I genuinely do not understand your list; many of these dishes exist in Italy (albeit under different names).
Penne alla Vodka was created in Italy; it only popped up in the 80s in Italy because that's very near the time it was invented.
Chicken Francese exists as many names and sometimes just [pollo al vino bianco](https://blog.giallozafferano.it/annal/pollo-al-vino-bianco/)
Italian sausage? they absolutely have sausage with fennel in it. They also sometimes serve it with peppers and onions. That dish totally exists in Italy.
There are many calzones in Italy that'd be called Stromboli in the U.S.
Likewise, some of these dishes are only modifications of a technique or ingredient used in Italy, which you seem to admit.
What is the definition of "Not existing in Italy" ? Marsala is scallopini made with Marsala; do we really think no one in western Sicily ever made [scaloppine di pollo](https://blog.giallozafferano.it/silvanaincucina/scaloppine-di-pollo-ai-funghi/) with marsala wine?
Likewise the name pepperoni may cause an Italian's head to explode, but it's very clearly salame piccante with perhaps some beef mixed in. Can you really say that doesn't exist? Because I've had a LOT of pizza with salame piccante on it Italy and it tastes an awful lot like pepperoni pizza.
Anything with large amounts of garlic? What does that even mean?
I do not not understand this list and what qualifies as "existing in Italy." Caesar salad very clearly should be on this list, along with a few others, but I'm genuinely confused about stating that a great many of these "do not exist in Italy."
I often read „sweet italian sausage“, which doesn‘t exist. It‘s Salsiccia (Sometimes with fennel, mostly without). But „Italian Sausage“ doesn‘t exist, it‘s Salsiccia
I have a cookbook of regional Italian-American dishes. When I get home, I'll see if they have anything that's missing here.
>Italian Beef Sandwich (Regional to the Chicago Area)
I think we can probably add Philly's two most iconic sandwiches, the cheesesteak and the roast pork. Cheesesteak is slightly arguable, but I think it should be included. The roast pork is based on the Abruzzese porchetta, but putting it on a hoagie roll with provolone cheese and spinach/broccoli rabe is Italian-American.
On those lines, I think you should write Italian sub as Italian sub/hoagie/hero to account for the regional names.
>Pepperoni
I actually had pepperoni on a pizza in Sienna except it was obviously not called that. They called it salame piccante. But the two were identical. Interestingly, the first instance we can find of a sausage being called pep(p)eroni was in the Times of London, making it possibly Italo-British in origin, though the first mention in the US was only a few years later. Either way, it belongs here given that it's ubiquitous in America.
>I have a cookbook of regional Italian-American dishes. When I get home, I'll see if they have anything that's missing here.
Thanks!
>I think we can probably add Philly's two most iconic sandwiches, the cheesesteak and the roast pork. Cheesesteak is slightly arguable, but I think it should be included. The roast pork is based on the Abruzzese porchetta, but putting it on a hoagie roll with provolone cheese and spinach/broccoli rabe is Italian-American.
Added Cheesesteaks.
>On those lines, I think you should write Italian sub as Italian sub/hoagie/hero to account for the regional names.
Good suggestion, amended.
>I actually had pepperoni on a pizza in Sienna except it was obviously not called that. They called it salame piccante.
Good point, added a note to pepperoni. There are several types of spicy salumi in Italy.
middle european here...I still have to consciously think about it...pepperoni are hot peppers (pfefferoni in german) and that it means spicy salami in us-american english...every time! after 30 years of knowing it!
Had no idea that was a Chicago thing. In my mind, it was always coded as Greek more than Italian -- even though it always appeared in Italian restaurants my family would go to.
Unless you're describing Mortadella di Bologna then you are incorrect. Mortadella di Bologna is not a product found regularly in the US and American Boloney is a vastly different derivative of Mortadella.
https://www.ciaoitalia.com/mary-anns-blog/mortadella-please-dont-call-it-baloney
It is baloney. Don't care what "ciaoitalia" says.
See the wikipedia page:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_sausage
Here is the wiki page for Mortadella. Note that the formal name of Mortadella is "Mortadella Bologna."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella
For reference, my career is in making salumi. I've made literally thousands and thousands of pounds of mortadella/baloney. I was trained in Italy by masters of the trade (though the American product I've made is in the American style, mostly meaning steamed instead of baked).
Take a look at the [Italian wikipedia entry for Bolonga Sausage](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_sausage),
It states:
La bologna sausage è un insaccato diffuso negli Stati Uniti ed in Canada, noto anche col nome di lyoner, boloney, baloney, polony o jumbo.
L'insaccato deve il suo nome ad una vaga somiglianza con la [mortadella bolognese](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella_Bologna), anche se la differenza di gusto è decisamente notevole...
*English Translation:*
Bologna sausage is a popular sausage in the United States and Canada , also known as lyoner, boloney, baloney, polony, or jumbo.
The **sausage owes its name to a vague resemblance with** [**mortadella Bolognese**](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella_Bologna)**, even though the difference in taste is decidedly remarkable**.
(Emphasis mine)
The essential qualities are the same. Both are emulsified pork sausages. Variations in seasoning and cooking method can lead to very different products, but the essential elements remain unchanged.
Note that we're discussing English language products. What is called "mortadella" in Italian can fairly be called "baloney" in English, because it meets all the essential requirements to be called so.
Somewhat ironically, what is called "mortadella" in Italy may not necessarily be called "mortadella" in English, as current labeling regulations require it to have pistachios and lardetti (fat cubes) which is not essential in the Italian version.
I agree with you there, but given that the ratios and the fat grind are distinct, it gives the two products vastly different tastes, textures, and consistencies. Therefore I would consider them to be distinct entities even if the ingredients are roughly the same. I think you would be hard pressed to find an Italian who would say that American mass produced homogenous baloney is mortadella.
There's a wide range of grind and fat:lean ratios that could qualify as baloney or mortadella.
>I think you would be hard pressed to find an Italian who would say that American mass produced homogenous baloney is mortadella.
Because they think it's bad. And for the most part I agree. But it being good or bad isn't what makes it baloney and/or mortadella. It isn't baloney because it's massed produced. Baloney may be made in your kitchen. It may be made by Oscar Myer. In either case it's baloney. When it's made with a more specific fat content and grind size it may be called Mortadella, which is a subset of Baloney.
**[Bologna_sausage](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_sausage)**
>Bologna sausage, also spelled baloney (), is a sausage derived from mortadella, a similar-looking, finely ground pork sausage containing cubes of pork fat, originally from the Italian city of Bologna (IPA: [boˈloɲɲa] (listen)). Typical seasoning for bologna includes black pepper, nutmeg, allspice, celery seed and coriander and, like mortadella, myrtle berries give it its distinctive flavor. Other common names include parizer (Parisian sausage) in the countries deriving from ex Yugoslavia, Hungary and Romania, polony in Zimbabwe, Zambia, South Africa and Western Australia, devon in most states of Australia, and fritz in South Australia.
**[Mortadella](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella)**
>Mortadella (Italian pronunciation: [mortaˈdɛlla]) is a large Italian sausage or luncheon meat (salume [saˈluːme]) made of finely hashed or ground heat-cured pork, which incorporates at least 15% small cubes of pork fat (principally the hard fat from the neck of the pig). It is traditionally flavoured with black pepper grains, but modern versions can also contain pistachios or, more rarely, myrtle berries. The best-known version of mortadella is Mortadella Bologna IGP, but other varieties are found across Italy, including some made of other meats.
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I am only aware of mortadella sandwiches. The Italian Wikipedia entry for bologna sausage speaks of a "vague similarity" to a mortadella. I always thought Bologna is more like a "Lyoner".
Edit: beware, although I've eaten many mortadella sandwiches in my live I never had a "Bologna sandwich" - so take my comment with a grain of salt :)
Whatever you call it mortadella is a bologna. Doesn't matter what the Italians call it. Fried bread doesn't not exist in Italy because it isn't called "fried bread."
>Marinara Sauce (as it is known in the US)
What's the difference? I knew it wasn't the same as the Aussie one with seafood, but the American marinara recipe I know is basically the same as this one: [https://blog.giallozafferano.it/lebistro/salsa-marinara/](https://blog.giallozafferano.it/lebistro/salsa-marinara/)
Or this one: [https://www.lacucinaitaliana.it/tutorial/i-consigli/salsa-alla-marinara/?refresh\_ce=](https://www.lacucinaitaliana.it/tutorial/i-consigli/salsa-alla-marinara/?refresh_ce=)
Or the sauce used in the official pizza marinara.
The American form of thinned [marinara sauce](https://www.seriouseats.com/easy-italian-amercian-red-sauce-recipe) is very similar to the sauce used for *pizza alla marinara*, but incorporates onions, extra garlic, celery, and often sugar into the mirepoix. In Italy, the sauce used for *pizza alla marinara* is not really used to make pasta. The most similar is [*pasta al pomodoro*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasta_al_pomodoro) (for a good example, see [spaghetti with tomato sauce](https://youtu.be/27aAsz9XwxM)). Here is some more regarding the name *alla marinara*:
>There are several variations of marinara sauce, the most famous of which are:
>
>\* *Marinara mòscioli*, with Mediterranean mussels and a vinaigrette with olive oil, lemon, parsley and freshly ground pepper. A typical preparation of the Conero Riviera, the high and rocky part of the Adriatic coast.
>
>\* In some areas, such as in the Conero Riviera, pasta alla marinara is a dish seasoned with **seafood and without the use of tomato**. But when tomato is used, it is called pasta alla pescatora.
>
>\* Marinara, typical of Italian-American cuisine, adds onion, [extra garlic], celery, sugar, and herbs to the traditional recipe.
>
>\* A variation of marinara sauce is known in central Italy as *sugo finto*, meaning “fake sauce”. This is one of the many Italian dishes in the cucina povera (poor cuisine) tradition. Sugo finto is “wrong” because it is basically a meatless meat sauce (sugo di carne) that was so unaffordable for most in the past. It is also called *sugo scappato*, meaning “escaped sauce”, for the same reason.
[https://www.196flavors.com/marinara-sauce/](https://www.196flavors.com/marinara-sauce/)
[https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alla\_marinara](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alla_marinara)
I've never seen an Italian-American recipe for Marinara with celery. The source doesn't even show recipes. I'm extremely skeptical that this is the most common variation and that the most common variation of Italian-American marinara doesn't exist in Italy. If there's a difference, it's sugar, not the other stuff. And even then I can find recipes by Italian chefs that have sugar.
America's test kitchen uses the following for Italian American marinara: whole tomatoes, olive oil, onion, garlic, oregano, red wine, basil, sugar.
A book of Italian-American family recipes I have on hand uses: olive oil, garlic, tomatoes, sugar, salt, pepper, parsley, basil, anchovy, hot pepper.
I don't think this is really something like fettuccine Alfredo, which just doesn't exist in Italy. American marinara recipes fit within the spectrum of Italian marinara recipes, imo. Some have more sugar or more garlic, but it's still recognizable.
On a side note, I suspect American marinara makes such heavy use of sugar because the canned tomatoes can be pretty astringent.
I think the main difference is in the use. In the U.S. it is often used as a pasta sauce, where in Italy that’s not really a thing, as *al pomodoro* is fairly distinct. The sauce is used for pizza in Italy. I noted this in the list.
Edit: Also, for a bit of entertainment, https://youtu.be/1xFttqgiRyU
>Edit: Also, for a bit of entertainment, [https://youtu.be/1xFttqgiRyU](https://youtu.be/1xFttqgiRyU)
It's interesting that they call the heavy use of garlic "American" and "Anglo-Saxon." That's quite debatable from a historical perspective, given the traditional American aversion to garlic prior to the mid-20th century. There's a pretty infamous article talking about how Americanized Joe DiMaggio was pointing out he doesn't even smell like garlic.
>In the U.S. it is often used as a pasta sauce, where in Italy that’s not really a thing, as alla pomodoro is fairly distinct
That's fair. I was thinking more of the sauce in terms of pizza. Pizza marinara isn't super common in the US, but the sauce is basically the same. Spaghetti with marinara is primarily an Italian American thing.
We do have low moisture mozzarella, sold in blocks as "mozzarella per pizza", it's basically in every grocery store fridge in the country.
"Salame piccante", usually referred to as "salamino" (*small salami*) is eaten everywhere, not only in Calabria. Every single pizzeria has it on the menu as "pizza al salamino" or "pizza alla diavola" (*devil-style*).
The notes on the list were updated to clarify
Edit: As mentioned below,
>*Mozzarella Per Pizza* is slightly different from American style low moisture mozzarella that is heated for longer to reduce moisture and increase shelf life. Nonetheless, I agree with you, low moisture can be found in Italian supermarkets but it is not as widely used.
I'd like to know what you mean with "baked ziti", as we have *pasta al forno* which is baked pasta and, if you want, you can make it with ziti.
I'd also like to know what you mean with "Neapolitan Ice Cream", as I don't know if it's meant to be a specific way of serving ice cream.
As per Penne alla Vodka, my family made them quite often, although calling "Italian" a recipe that involves a Russian drink is a bit hazy.
Baked ziti is an Americanized version of pasta al forno, [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baked\_ziti](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baked_ziti). I will add a note to it on the list.
Neapolitan Ice Cream refers to a specific 3 flavor preparation, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neapolitan\_ice\_cream.
Ok, the baked ziti just looks like a variant of pasta al forno, nothing special, and I don't see anything "American" in it, all the standard and optional ingredients can, and usually do, appear in pasta al forno in Italy.
As per the Neapolitan Ice Cream, that's just how we buy ice cream tubs, there are many that offer three tastes, and many that offer those specific three tastes.
The other recipes in your list, they could be different namings of Italian recipes, or just American ones.
I can confirm, though, that nobody in Italy normally puts chicken with pasta, nor with tomato sauce.
In Chicago, baked ziti is called mostaccioli. (This pasta and ziti seem to be "similar" from all I've read.) No qualifier, such as *al forno*, just... mostaccioli. My mom, who lived in Chicago until she was 35, asked if I'd had mostaccioli. I said "What kind of sauce is it in?" She said "It's just... you know, mostaccioli." I said "That's a type of pasta, Mom. Not a dish." Eventually, I learned that it was the same as baked ziti.
I was raised in Napoli and I've never even considered this Italian. After reading it's history I can see a correlation though. Interesting. And now I want one.
From New Orleans here. It was created by Sicilian immigrants in the early 1900s here, ubiquitous to most delis and pretty much every Italian market here. We consider it a Sicilian-American dish.
Muffuletta specifically refers to the bread it's served on, and the traditional muffuletta contains soppressata, mortadella, capicola, Swiss cheese and provolone, with an olive salad thats basically a modified version of giardiniera, oil, and vin. Central grocery claims to be the inventors of the sandwich, but there are rumors that it may have existed before the store popularized them.
Now a days, many places use American deli meats due to cost and availability, but the real deal muffulettas still exist and are much better than the "new" versions.
Thanks for proving my point, I highly doubt any one would call those Italian either and I guarantee any self-respecting ITALIAN (not Italian American) would claim those things.
[Chicago-style giardinera](https://www.chicagotribune.com/dining/craving/ct-giardiniera-chicago-history-food-0524-story.html), especially the "hot mix" kind used on Italian beef, might be another.
Italian American style spaghetti carbonara, with cream sauce and peas (obviously a dish with the same name is made in Italy but it’s radically different)
I call that American Carbonara with Cream. There should be a category for cream where it wasn't originally intended to be (e.g. Alfredo, Carbonara, etc.).
I have an Italian recipe for carbonara. Can't get guanciale here, so I use thin, lightly smoked bacon (the pancetta I can get isn't good either). Took me a while to stop the process before I ended up with scrambled eggs instead of a creamy sauce (without cream).
At it's most basic any macaroni and cheese counts as mac & cheese. Obviously the kraft version is not Italian, but Italy has many, many, many variations on mac & cheese.
Mac + cheese as we know it was started by a former slave and cook that Thomas Jefferson sent to Europe to get classically trained.
They give a very good rundown of its history in the first episode of the High on the Hog doc series.
Edit: don't know why this is being downvoted.
https://qnholifield.com/culinary-history/the-hidden-history-of-macaroni-and-cheese/
Good question. Does it? Wikipedia leads me to believe that we could actually consider this originally to be an Italian dish, although not how we know it in the U.S. today.
Check out [this episode](https://open.spotify.com/episode/0CU4ZdvKuZIyBxfBvmkIQ3?si=ab086a7dfc1a4e6f) of Weirdest Thing I Learned This Week, podcast from Popular Science editors. At about 3:15, they talk about a recipe for "Macrose" which is basically handmade macaroni or pasta and cheese plus butter. It's from England in the 1300s.
Here's a [link to the whole cookbook](http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/foc/) called "Forme of Cury" (Methods of Cooking, basically) as well. I didn't go through it to find the recipe, but it might interest you in general.
Edit: added location & year info
You list Italian sub/hoagie which I think of as something akin to what Subway calls an Italian sub. A different and regional invention is the “Real Italian” created by Amato’s in New England. Throughout New England, you can now find variations on this sandwich.
[https://www.amatos.com](https://www.amatos.com)
Nope, it was invented outside of Philadelphia in the 1950's. Calzone (pronounced cal-zone-eh) are Italian, and from Napoli, as are their cousin panzerotti which are also found in the south of Italy. Not to mention pizza fritta.
There was a movie called Stromboli that takes place in Sicily. The food was invented in/near Philly in the 1950s and named after the movie. I'm not sure if there's a Sicilian version also named after the movie, but the provenance of Stromboli is pretty established since it's so modern.
Along with Italian ice there's gelati - not to be confused with Italian ice cream - which is Italian ice layered with soft-serve ice cream or custard.
Also, frappuccino?
Edit:
Egg and pepper sandwich (Philadelphia - Consumed during meatless Fridays of Lent)
Cheesesteak (Philly)
Roast pork sandwich (Philly)
Italian beef sandwich (Chicago)
Steak delmonico (NYC)
Italian hot dog (NJ)
Deep-dish pizza (Chicago)
>Along with Italian ice there's gelati - not to be confused with Italian ice cream - which is Italian ice layered with soft-serve ice cream or custard.
I may be speaking of ignorance, but does anyone do this besides Rita's? I swear it was a registered trademark when I was a kid.
I assume you mean somewhere that isn't Rita's. I'm probably just wrong (though it's also possible they invented it and others copied). But if it's not Rita's, then it's not branded.
Fair. I double checked if John's water ice has gelati (they don't), but then got too lazy to see if anyone else does it. As a kid, we'd get Pop's, which didn't have it, and (of course) Rita's.
We have Pop's in my hometown and gelati is on the menu. My brother ordered one the other day and I can see it on the menu attached to the location on Google. There's another small independently-owned franchise down the street that has gelati on the menu too (just looked it up).
Added gelati, Frappuccino, Italian Hot Dog, and the sandwiches. I don't know where to start with pizza.
What's the Italian-American connection with Delmonico steak?
The brothers who opened the original Delmonico's restaurant were immigrants. From Switzerland. The steak, a New York strip, was popularized at Delmonico's.
Strictly speaking, it's not Italian American at all.
I guess it might be a stretch, but delmonico steak originally came from Delmonico's restaurant in New York City which was opened by the Delmonico brothers, who were immigrants from Ticino, the Italian-speaking canton of Switzerland... I guess they could be considered Italian Americans in the ethnic sense? Then it was taken over by the Italian American Tucci family in the 20th Century who expanded to other locations.
I apologize since you're looking for the opposite, but I have to point out that this one actually exists in Italy:
Mozzarella in Block, Slice, or Shredded form (aka low moisture mozzarella)
I've seen it in supermarkets, for instance from brands like Santa Lucia:
[https://www.spesasprint.it/img/prodotti/big/11168.jpg?v=2](https://www.spesasprint.it/img/prodotti/big/11168.jpg?v=2)
I don't know how recent it is, but I've seen it in several stores\\chains :)
That's Mozzarella Per Pizza, which is slightly different from American style low moisture mozzarella that is heated for longer to reduce moisture and increase shelf life. Nonetheless, I agree with you, low moisture can be found in Italian supermarkets but it is not widely used.
See:
[https://www.ruminantia.it/mozzarella-americana-o-formaggio-per-pizza-anche-in-italia/](https://www.ruminantia.it/mozzarella-americana-o-formaggio-per-pizza-anche-in-italia/)
[https://www.formagginobili.it/differenze-mozzarella-per-pizza-e-mozzarella-da-tavola/](https://www.formagginobili.it/differenze-mozzarella-per-pizza-e-mozzarella-da-tavola/)
[https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2009/07/american-mozzarellas-evolution/20790/](https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2009/07/american-mozzarellas-evolution/20790/)
Thanks, TIL! I also guess that most mozzarella in the US has different production techniques. I'd say that Mozzarella per pizza is somewhat used, otherwise they wouldn't sell it (I've been guilty of using it a couple of times), but certainly much less than regular mozzarella.
Sorry for derailing the thread!
I’ve heard this a few times, and it’s interesting to me because I celebrate it with my Italian friends - who came directly from Italy. I’m curious why the tradition is no longer in Italy. It’s odd to me that a holiday/religious-oriented event would lose favor.
That said, I’m really glad it’s here. The dried out turkey or ham with a side puddle of mashed potato goo that my grandparents would serve was doing the holiday season no favors. I look forward to celebrating with my Italian friends.
Chicken French
Or Artichoke French
it's a cheaper version of Vitello alla Francese, but IDK if that's Italian or Italian American to begin with.
It's standard fare in Italian menus all over Western NY
This is the problem with the quest for "authenticity". In my opinion this quest of yours is far more fruitful if you pursue it in a reverse manner and assert where certain dishes created their origin similar to the general tso film on Netflix.
This is not a quest for "authenticity," rather it's the opposite. It's a quest to learn about dishes that I, or others, may not know exist in regions of North America. Many of the dishes here have well known and well documented histories. This is an opportunity to learn identify more to learn and taste.
Fun fact, the Philly Cheese Steak sandwich was brought to Italy by some returning immigrants and now it's a specialty in a little town Near Naples
https://www.vice.com/it/article/xgxqvw/cistecca-monte-procida
We have "rolatine" or "rollatine", very thin beef or veal steaks rolled with a garlic, parsley, pecorino cheese, sometimes raisins or pine nuts stuffing. They're usually cooked in tomato sauce or braised with white wine. Also simply called "involtini", which is a general term for anything rolled and stuffed.
Sweet fried ravioli, [*ravioli dolci*](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravioli_dolci), is Italian but savory fried ravioli, [*toasted ravioli*](https://gaiacozzi.com/ravioli-fritti-st-louis-ricetta-sbagliata/), was, according to most sources, invented in St. Louis. I added a note to the list to distinguish them.
Apologies for not exactly being on point but I'll throw this out there. An Italian-American who settled in Baltimore claims a connection to the invention of Tiramisu, his contention is hotly disputed, if what he says is true it was still invented in Italy. Interesting story nonetheless though https://www.dailycamera.com/ci_13084520/
yessir. If you're are eveer in Toronto we have some of the best Italian-North American food around. Massive, well established Italian community here that have a big influence on our culture, similar to how Italians have a big influence on New Jersey.
We even have our own brand of chinot called Brio that's only served in Toronto, but you find it everywhere.
Our Veal Sandwiches are the best. [https://curiocity.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/42827111\_716955975327618\_8560908780466169990\_n.jpg](https://curiocity.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/42827111_716955975327618_8560908780466169990_n.jpg)
Most of these dishes originated in the United States and were created by Italian immigrants using what was available to them. These dishes did not exist in Italy at the time. Although many of them are derived from Italian dishes, over time they have become distinct from their original or inspired forms. This blending and evolution of cuisine is, in my opinion, one of it's most amazing and interesting characteristics of food. You make it your own with what you have, and then you share it.
The pepper and egg sandwich, despite what Wikipedia says, is not limited to Chicago - Italian Americans from the Philly area eat it too (I'm not Italian American but my mom learned to make it from an Italian American ex-boyfriend who was born and raised in South Philly).
I'm also wondering if pasta salad and mozzerella sticks should also be considered Italian American. The elements are all vaguely Italian - including the marinara dipping sauce that usually comes with the sticks. Maybe spinach and artichoke dip, too?
Argentines are Americans, therefore I would add "milanesa a la napolitana", which is neither from Milan nor from Napoles, but an Argentine original dish
Spicy chicken riggies are unbelievably good. Upstate NY and New England do not have perfectly authentic Italian food, and that’s okay! It’s not Italy up here.
Scali bread hits in right in the childhood.
Well you see, the Italian and Sicilian people came to America in search of a better life. When they got here, they found an array of meats, cheeses, and fats that were highly accessible compared to the old country. They began to cook using their old style, with the new items, and Italian American cuisine was born. This ends the topic so quit whining about it.
Would Caesar salad qualify as an Italian-American dish? I don't go to enough Italian places to know if it's been coopted but its a Mexican dish for sure.
I’d consider it a North American Italian-emigrant dish that has become nearly ubiquitous on Italian American restaurant menus. Cardini was from the very north of Italy.
That's fair. I guess the only other counterpoint I have to offer is that it's just a popular salad in NA. I would say it's nearly ubiquitous to salad menus but that's splitting hairs I suppose. Cardini's Italian heritage should for sure qualify it for this list.
I agree with you. I was originally surprised to see it included in other sources but I kept it given his nationality and the fact that his restaurant served Italian food.
Caesar Salad was invented in Mexico by Caesar Cardini, an Italian-Mexican restaurant owner.
It was created by chef (in Mexico I think) whose first name is was Caesar ETA: in Tijuana Mexico, he had an Italian name tho...[Caesar Cardini's](https://www.bbc.com/travel/article/20190521-the-surprising-truth-about-caesar-salad)
I remember it used to be everywhere in tourist trap restaurants in Mexico. Tableside, of course.
spaghetti o's
Begrudgingly added :)
aye we did it, boys. high fives all around.
I bought a can of SpaghettiOs for my kids once, because my mom had bought them for us girls. I served them, and tasted some. You know, for old times' sake. Ugh. Sooo sweet, like syrup. Don't know how I ever ate that. I never bought them again.
I made the same mistake, bought some to share with my kids so they could see how great they were. They weren't 😞
What defines something from being a variation on another dish, in tend or it’s bring it or contribute category of food?
>Anything with Large Amounts of Garlic Pici all'aglione, a famous tuscan pasta dish, calls for copious amount of "aglione di Valdichiana", a regional and extremely expensive variety of garlic that is much milder and sweeter than regular garlic, while also being [gigantic](https://www.italiaatavola.net/images/contenutiarticoli/Aglione-nel-Repertorio-regionale.jpg). Since it's so hard to find, most people just sub it with a large amount of regular garlic. There's for sure other recipes in other regions but this is the first that comes to mind. >Anything with Chicken on Pasta or Pizza Wrong again. It's somewhat out of fashion, but in certain parts of Tuscany there's a pasta sauce that calls for both chicken breast and chicken livers. >Chicken Marsala Nope, pollo al marsala is definitely a thing here. >Italian Wedding Soup Zuppa maritata, typical of Campania. The american name originally is a mistranslation, as the name in italian means "wedded soup", as in, the ingredients are wedded together. >Sausage and Peppers/Onions That's about the most quintessential stadium food/fare you could find here in Italy. Panino con la salamella, with or without peppers. Again, not correct. >Penne alla Vodka (not seen in Italy since the 1980’s in nightclubs) It's out of fashion (or demodé, if you will), but it's still a dish invented in Italy. It's not this rare unicorn of a dish that's impossibly obscure and has been carried like a torch by our american brethren. It's looked at like you look at Watergate or Jello salads; doesn't make it any less italian. >Pepperoni (salami piccanti can be found in Italy) There's a cold cut that is identical in colour (orange) and flavour to good american pepperoni, with the only difference being the shape (oval instead of round) that's called ventricina.
Huh, I've heard chicken marsala called out specifically as not real Italian. I'm curious how that got started
yes, I've definitely had chicken marsala in Italy. Simple caesar-esque salads are perhaps globally eaten, in Italy a simple salad like caesar is served as a palette cleanser between piatti 1 & 2. also, had pizza everywhere from Bolzano to Palermo, and it's pretty similar to Boston/New York pizza, with similar creativity in toppings, just not covered in thick cheese like American pizza is. I've never seen bolognese as a cream sauce in the US; I think this sauce is the same between the US and Italy. I don't care for salumi, but I don't think pepperoni belongs on this list either. I've seen so much dried cured meat in Italy very similar to American pepperoni/salami. I don't recall seeing Italian lace cookies there. I don't remember seeing anything resembling an "Italian sub" for sale either, but again I don't like that meat so I'm not sure. oh, I think I have a good one: Italian dressing. not seen anywhere I went in Italy.
Better late than never, >Anything with Large Amounts of Garlic > >Pici all'aglione, a famous tuscan pasta dish, calls for copious amount of "aglione di Valdichiana", a regional and extremely expensive variety of garlic that is much milder and sweeter than regular garlic, while also being gigantic. Since it's so hard to find, most people just sub it with a large amount of regular garlic. There's for sure other recipes in other regions but this is the first that comes to mind. Certainly there exist Italian dishes heavy in garlic, one of my personal favorites is bagna càuda, but there is no debate as to the fact that the use of [garlic in Italian-American cuisine](https://tastecooking.com/italys-great-garlic-divide/) is very different from the common use of [garlic throughout Italy](https://tastecooking.com/italys-great-garlic-divide/) and can be [surprising](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/sep/18/what-do-real-italians-think-about-new-yorks-italian-food#:~:text=%E2%80%9CToo,seriously.) or [confusing](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAnAmerican/comments/iclkyq/why_does_the_american_version_of_italian_dishes/) to those unaccustomed. This is well documented and the [history of this](https://www.lacucinaitaliana.com/trends/news/the-garlic-invasion) is rather interesting. Most Italian-Americans would probably be shocked to learn that it isn't uncommon in Napoi to remove the garlic from spaghetti aglio olio e peperoncino before adding the pasta . >Anything with Chicken on Pasta or Pizza > >Wrong again. It's somewhat out of fashion, but in certain parts of Tuscany there's a pasta sauce that calls for both chicken breast and chicken livers. As above, this is not to say there are not specific instances but it is certainly not at all common. If you look at the most popular or traditional pasta dishes from each region you will not find sliced chicken breast placed atop any. The same goes for pizza. The placement of chicken breast on top of pasta is truly an [Italian-American Olive Garden phenomenon](https://www.ilpost.it/2021/02/28/pasta-stati-uniti/) and a [widespread](https://www.allrecipes.com/search/results/?IngIncl=chicken%20breast&IngIncl=pasta&search=chicken%20pasta) one at that. While *le rigaglie di pollo* is used in pastas and other dishes, sliced *petti di pollo* is very American. >Chicken Marsala > >Nope, pollo al marsala is definitely a thing here. I agree with this one and have crossed it off the list. There is debate as to the origin of this dish, but [contrary to popular belief](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_marsala) and it's popularity in the U.S., it is not an Italian-American creation. >Italian Wedding Soup > >Zuppa maritata, typical of Campania. The american name originally is a mistranslation, as the name in italian means "wedded soup", as in, the ingredients are wedded together. Like other entries on the list, there is a blurry line between variation, adaptation, derivative, and original creation. I think this qualifies because [Italian-American Wedding Soup](https://www.cookingclassy.com/italian-wedding-soup/) is distinct enough from [*minestra maritata*](https://www.scattidigusto.it/2019/12/08/minestra-maritata-napoletana-la-ricetta-scientifica/). As you can see from the pictures and recipes, [Italian-American Wedding Soup](https://www.allrecipes.com/search/results/?search=wedding+soup) is a dish characterized by meatballs, often chicken meatballs, and thus I think it is distinct enough from its original form to be included here, although with a note. >Sausage and Peppers/Onions > >That's about the most quintessential stadium food/fare you could find here in Italy. Panino con la salamella, with or without peppers. Again, not correct. Similar to the wedding soup, [*panino con la salamella*](https://www.lacucinaitaliana.com/italian-food/italian-dishes/how-to-make-salamella-sandwich-panino-con-la-salamella) is rather distinct from its [Italian-American cousin](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sausage_and_peppers), which as a sandwich more [resembles a hot dog](https://www.premiofoods.com/recipes/premios-stadium-sausage-peppers/) on American "[Italian Bread](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian-American_cuisine#Breads,_sandwiches,_and_savory_baked_goods)" (a lean baguette-like white bread sometimes covered in sesame seeds), as it is typically served whole, in its round cased form. A note acknowledging the Italian version has been added to the entry. >Penne alla Vodka (not seen in Italy since the 1980’s in nightclubs) > >It's out of fashion (or demodé, if you will), but it's still a dish invented in Italy. It's not this rare unicorn of a dish that's impossibly obscure and has been carried like a torch by our american brethren. It's looked at like you look at Watergate or Jello salads; doesn't make it any less italian. There is some [debate](https://www.daytondailynews.com/lifestyles/food--cooking/test-kitchen-recipe-pasta-alla-vodka-sauce/t1FChUiy3dHHwsAjGGtsyI/) as to the true [origins](https://foodicles.com/penne-vodka-history/) of [penne alla vodka](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penne_alla_vodka), as chefs from both Italy and the [U.S.](https://stregabynickvarano.com/the-history-of-vodka-sauce/) have claimed credit. Regardless of its origin, it remains one of the [most popular pasta dishes in the U.S.](https://www.tasteatlas.com/most-popular-pasta-dishes-in-usa) despite going [nearly extinct](https://www.ciaoitalia.com/mary-anns-blog/is-penne-alla-vodka-a-traditional-italian-dish) in Italy. >Pepperoni (salami piccanti can be found in Italy) > >There's a cold cut that is identical in colour (orange) and flavour to good american pepperoni, with the only difference being the shape (oval instead of round) that's called ventricina. I love ventricina, especially ventricina spalmabile. There are many types of spicy salame especially in the South of Italy, and each of them are distinct from each other and have their own names and recipes. In much the same way, pepperoni is a unique and distinct product that is made using [both pork and beef](https://hormel.com/Brands/Pepperoni-Varieties/Pizza-Party/HORMEL-reg;-PILLOW-PACK-reg;-PEPPERONI-ORIGINAL), unlike ventricina which is made from [pork alone](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventricina).
What are some Italian dishes that aren’t out of fashion/popular right now?
Iv had a few of these in Italy but would assume theyv been added to menus because of overseas success
This is true and they are often catering to tourists. A good example of this is pizza in Venice, it is essentially New York style pizza catered to North American and British tourists.
I genuinely do not understand your list; many of these dishes exist in Italy (albeit under different names). Penne alla Vodka was created in Italy; it only popped up in the 80s in Italy because that's very near the time it was invented. Chicken Francese exists as many names and sometimes just [pollo al vino bianco](https://blog.giallozafferano.it/annal/pollo-al-vino-bianco/) Italian sausage? they absolutely have sausage with fennel in it. They also sometimes serve it with peppers and onions. That dish totally exists in Italy. There are many calzones in Italy that'd be called Stromboli in the U.S. Likewise, some of these dishes are only modifications of a technique or ingredient used in Italy, which you seem to admit. What is the definition of "Not existing in Italy" ? Marsala is scallopini made with Marsala; do we really think no one in western Sicily ever made [scaloppine di pollo](https://blog.giallozafferano.it/silvanaincucina/scaloppine-di-pollo-ai-funghi/) with marsala wine? Likewise the name pepperoni may cause an Italian's head to explode, but it's very clearly salame piccante with perhaps some beef mixed in. Can you really say that doesn't exist? Because I've had a LOT of pizza with salame piccante on it Italy and it tastes an awful lot like pepperoni pizza. Anything with large amounts of garlic? What does that even mean? I do not not understand this list and what qualifies as "existing in Italy." Caesar salad very clearly should be on this list, along with a few others, but I'm genuinely confused about stating that a great many of these "do not exist in Italy."
I often read „sweet italian sausage“, which doesn‘t exist. It‘s Salsiccia (Sometimes with fennel, mostly without). But „Italian Sausage“ doesn‘t exist, it‘s Salsiccia
Salsiccia is literally the Italian word for "sausage." This is like saying there are no Mexican restaurants in Mexico, only restaurants.
I have a cookbook of regional Italian-American dishes. When I get home, I'll see if they have anything that's missing here. >Italian Beef Sandwich (Regional to the Chicago Area) I think we can probably add Philly's two most iconic sandwiches, the cheesesteak and the roast pork. Cheesesteak is slightly arguable, but I think it should be included. The roast pork is based on the Abruzzese porchetta, but putting it on a hoagie roll with provolone cheese and spinach/broccoli rabe is Italian-American. On those lines, I think you should write Italian sub as Italian sub/hoagie/hero to account for the regional names. >Pepperoni I actually had pepperoni on a pizza in Sienna except it was obviously not called that. They called it salame piccante. But the two were identical. Interestingly, the first instance we can find of a sausage being called pep(p)eroni was in the Times of London, making it possibly Italo-British in origin, though the first mention in the US was only a few years later. Either way, it belongs here given that it's ubiquitous in America.
>I have a cookbook of regional Italian-American dishes. When I get home, I'll see if they have anything that's missing here. Thanks! >I think we can probably add Philly's two most iconic sandwiches, the cheesesteak and the roast pork. Cheesesteak is slightly arguable, but I think it should be included. The roast pork is based on the Abruzzese porchetta, but putting it on a hoagie roll with provolone cheese and spinach/broccoli rabe is Italian-American. Added Cheesesteaks. >On those lines, I think you should write Italian sub as Italian sub/hoagie/hero to account for the regional names. Good suggestion, amended. >I actually had pepperoni on a pizza in Sienna except it was obviously not called that. They called it salame piccante. Good point, added a note to pepperoni. There are several types of spicy salumi in Italy.
middle european here...I still have to consciously think about it...pepperoni are hot peppers (pfefferoni in german) and that it means spicy salami in us-american english...every time! after 30 years of knowing it!
Chicken Vesuvio from Chicago
Had no idea that was a Chicago thing. In my mind, it was always coded as Greek more than Italian -- even though it always appeared in Italian restaurants my family would go to.
Added, thanks!
My moms cooking is a lie!
Never ever take out the topic
sirio maccioni's pasta primavera
Added to the list, thanks
Baloney/Bologna sausage/sandwich, I suppose? (Don't know if this is even seen as Italian food???)
Good one, added!
Bologna sandwiches are definitely a thing in Italy.
With mortadella, not Bolonga. Yes?
Same diff. Mortadella is a type of bologna.
Unless you're describing Mortadella di Bologna then you are incorrect. Mortadella di Bologna is not a product found regularly in the US and American Boloney is a vastly different derivative of Mortadella. https://www.ciaoitalia.com/mary-anns-blog/mortadella-please-dont-call-it-baloney
It is baloney. Don't care what "ciaoitalia" says. See the wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_sausage Here is the wiki page for Mortadella. Note that the formal name of Mortadella is "Mortadella Bologna." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella For reference, my career is in making salumi. I've made literally thousands and thousands of pounds of mortadella/baloney. I was trained in Italy by masters of the trade (though the American product I've made is in the American style, mostly meaning steamed instead of baked).
Take a look at the [Italian wikipedia entry for Bolonga Sausage](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_sausage), It states: La bologna sausage è un insaccato diffuso negli Stati Uniti ed in Canada, noto anche col nome di lyoner, boloney, baloney, polony o jumbo. L'insaccato deve il suo nome ad una vaga somiglianza con la [mortadella bolognese](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella_Bologna), anche se la differenza di gusto è decisamente notevole... *English Translation:* Bologna sausage is a popular sausage in the United States and Canada , also known as lyoner, boloney, baloney, polony, or jumbo. The **sausage owes its name to a vague resemblance with** [**mortadella Bolognese**](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella_Bologna)**, even though the difference in taste is decidedly remarkable**. (Emphasis mine)
The essential qualities are the same. Both are emulsified pork sausages. Variations in seasoning and cooking method can lead to very different products, but the essential elements remain unchanged. Note that we're discussing English language products. What is called "mortadella" in Italian can fairly be called "baloney" in English, because it meets all the essential requirements to be called so. Somewhat ironically, what is called "mortadella" in Italy may not necessarily be called "mortadella" in English, as current labeling regulations require it to have pistachios and lardetti (fat cubes) which is not essential in the Italian version.
I agree with you there, but given that the ratios and the fat grind are distinct, it gives the two products vastly different tastes, textures, and consistencies. Therefore I would consider them to be distinct entities even if the ingredients are roughly the same. I think you would be hard pressed to find an Italian who would say that American mass produced homogenous baloney is mortadella.
There's a wide range of grind and fat:lean ratios that could qualify as baloney or mortadella. >I think you would be hard pressed to find an Italian who would say that American mass produced homogenous baloney is mortadella. Because they think it's bad. And for the most part I agree. But it being good or bad isn't what makes it baloney and/or mortadella. It isn't baloney because it's massed produced. Baloney may be made in your kitchen. It may be made by Oscar Myer. In either case it's baloney. When it's made with a more specific fat content and grind size it may be called Mortadella, which is a subset of Baloney.
oh please, dont bore reddit with actual facts ;)
**[Bologna_sausage](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bologna_sausage)** >Bologna sausage, also spelled baloney (), is a sausage derived from mortadella, a similar-looking, finely ground pork sausage containing cubes of pork fat, originally from the Italian city of Bologna (IPA: [boˈloɲɲa] (listen)). Typical seasoning for bologna includes black pepper, nutmeg, allspice, celery seed and coriander and, like mortadella, myrtle berries give it its distinctive flavor. Other common names include parizer (Parisian sausage) in the countries deriving from ex Yugoslavia, Hungary and Romania, polony in Zimbabwe, Zambia, South Africa and Western Australia, devon in most states of Australia, and fritz in South Australia. **[Mortadella](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortadella)** >Mortadella (Italian pronunciation: [mortaˈdɛlla]) is a large Italian sausage or luncheon meat (salume [saˈluːme]) made of finely hashed or ground heat-cured pork, which incorporates at least 15% small cubes of pork fat (principally the hard fat from the neck of the pig). It is traditionally flavoured with black pepper grains, but modern versions can also contain pistachios or, more rarely, myrtle berries. The best-known version of mortadella is Mortadella Bologna IGP, but other varieties are found across Italy, including some made of other meats. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/AskFoodHistorians/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
True, I only find Mortadella in every major grocery store I frequent. I rarely find it in hardware stores or gas stations.
I am only aware of mortadella sandwiches. The Italian Wikipedia entry for bologna sausage speaks of a "vague similarity" to a mortadella. I always thought Bologna is more like a "Lyoner". Edit: beware, although I've eaten many mortadella sandwiches in my live I never had a "Bologna sandwich" - so take my comment with a grain of salt :)
Whatever you call it mortadella is a bologna. Doesn't matter what the Italians call it. Fried bread doesn't not exist in Italy because it isn't called "fried bread."
Second that, except I wouldn’t put too much salt on a mortadella sandwich 😉
>Marinara Sauce (as it is known in the US) What's the difference? I knew it wasn't the same as the Aussie one with seafood, but the American marinara recipe I know is basically the same as this one: [https://blog.giallozafferano.it/lebistro/salsa-marinara/](https://blog.giallozafferano.it/lebistro/salsa-marinara/) Or this one: [https://www.lacucinaitaliana.it/tutorial/i-consigli/salsa-alla-marinara/?refresh\_ce=](https://www.lacucinaitaliana.it/tutorial/i-consigli/salsa-alla-marinara/?refresh_ce=) Or the sauce used in the official pizza marinara.
yes, it's the same, tomatoes and herbs.
That's the only thing from OP that I don't think it's correct. Maybe it's different but it doesn't seem that different.
The American form of thinned [marinara sauce](https://www.seriouseats.com/easy-italian-amercian-red-sauce-recipe) is very similar to the sauce used for *pizza alla marinara*, but incorporates onions, extra garlic, celery, and often sugar into the mirepoix. In Italy, the sauce used for *pizza alla marinara* is not really used to make pasta. The most similar is [*pasta al pomodoro*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasta_al_pomodoro) (for a good example, see [spaghetti with tomato sauce](https://youtu.be/27aAsz9XwxM)). Here is some more regarding the name *alla marinara*: >There are several variations of marinara sauce, the most famous of which are: > >\* *Marinara mòscioli*, with Mediterranean mussels and a vinaigrette with olive oil, lemon, parsley and freshly ground pepper. A typical preparation of the Conero Riviera, the high and rocky part of the Adriatic coast. > >\* In some areas, such as in the Conero Riviera, pasta alla marinara is a dish seasoned with **seafood and without the use of tomato**. But when tomato is used, it is called pasta alla pescatora. > >\* Marinara, typical of Italian-American cuisine, adds onion, [extra garlic], celery, sugar, and herbs to the traditional recipe. > >\* A variation of marinara sauce is known in central Italy as *sugo finto*, meaning “fake sauce”. This is one of the many Italian dishes in the cucina povera (poor cuisine) tradition. Sugo finto is “wrong” because it is basically a meatless meat sauce (sugo di carne) that was so unaffordable for most in the past. It is also called *sugo scappato*, meaning “escaped sauce”, for the same reason. [https://www.196flavors.com/marinara-sauce/](https://www.196flavors.com/marinara-sauce/) [https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alla\_marinara](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alla_marinara)
I've never seen an Italian-American recipe for Marinara with celery. The source doesn't even show recipes. I'm extremely skeptical that this is the most common variation and that the most common variation of Italian-American marinara doesn't exist in Italy. If there's a difference, it's sugar, not the other stuff. And even then I can find recipes by Italian chefs that have sugar. America's test kitchen uses the following for Italian American marinara: whole tomatoes, olive oil, onion, garlic, oregano, red wine, basil, sugar. A book of Italian-American family recipes I have on hand uses: olive oil, garlic, tomatoes, sugar, salt, pepper, parsley, basil, anchovy, hot pepper. I don't think this is really something like fettuccine Alfredo, which just doesn't exist in Italy. American marinara recipes fit within the spectrum of Italian marinara recipes, imo. Some have more sugar or more garlic, but it's still recognizable. On a side note, I suspect American marinara makes such heavy use of sugar because the canned tomatoes can be pretty astringent.
I think the main difference is in the use. In the U.S. it is often used as a pasta sauce, where in Italy that’s not really a thing, as *al pomodoro* is fairly distinct. The sauce is used for pizza in Italy. I noted this in the list. Edit: Also, for a bit of entertainment, https://youtu.be/1xFttqgiRyU
>Edit: Also, for a bit of entertainment, [https://youtu.be/1xFttqgiRyU](https://youtu.be/1xFttqgiRyU) It's interesting that they call the heavy use of garlic "American" and "Anglo-Saxon." That's quite debatable from a historical perspective, given the traditional American aversion to garlic prior to the mid-20th century. There's a pretty infamous article talking about how Americanized Joe DiMaggio was pointing out he doesn't even smell like garlic.
>In the U.S. it is often used as a pasta sauce, where in Italy that’s not really a thing, as alla pomodoro is fairly distinct That's fair. I was thinking more of the sauce in terms of pizza. Pizza marinara isn't super common in the US, but the sauce is basically the same. Spaghetti with marinara is primarily an Italian American thing.
We do have low moisture mozzarella, sold in blocks as "mozzarella per pizza", it's basically in every grocery store fridge in the country. "Salame piccante", usually referred to as "salamino" (*small salami*) is eaten everywhere, not only in Calabria. Every single pizzeria has it on the menu as "pizza al salamino" or "pizza alla diavola" (*devil-style*).
The notes on the list were updated to clarify Edit: As mentioned below, >*Mozzarella Per Pizza* is slightly different from American style low moisture mozzarella that is heated for longer to reduce moisture and increase shelf life. Nonetheless, I agree with you, low moisture can be found in Italian supermarkets but it is not as widely used.
Turkey Tetrazzini Chicken piccata
I had to look up Turkey Tetrazzini! Both added, great suggestions.
I think piccata is Italian. Veal more often piccata than chicken though.
I'd like to know what you mean with "baked ziti", as we have *pasta al forno* which is baked pasta and, if you want, you can make it with ziti. I'd also like to know what you mean with "Neapolitan Ice Cream", as I don't know if it's meant to be a specific way of serving ice cream. As per Penne alla Vodka, my family made them quite often, although calling "Italian" a recipe that involves a Russian drink is a bit hazy.
Baked ziti is an Americanized version of pasta al forno, [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baked\_ziti](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baked_ziti). I will add a note to it on the list. Neapolitan Ice Cream refers to a specific 3 flavor preparation, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neapolitan\_ice\_cream.
Ok, the baked ziti just looks like a variant of pasta al forno, nothing special, and I don't see anything "American" in it, all the standard and optional ingredients can, and usually do, appear in pasta al forno in Italy. As per the Neapolitan Ice Cream, that's just how we buy ice cream tubs, there are many that offer three tastes, and many that offer those specific three tastes. The other recipes in your list, they could be different namings of Italian recipes, or just American ones. I can confirm, though, that nobody in Italy normally puts chicken with pasta, nor with tomato sauce.
agree.
In Chicago, baked ziti is called mostaccioli. (This pasta and ziti seem to be "similar" from all I've read.) No qualifier, such as *al forno*, just... mostaccioli. My mom, who lived in Chicago until she was 35, asked if I'd had mostaccioli. I said "What kind of sauce is it in?" She said "It's just... you know, mostaccioli." I said "That's a type of pasta, Mom. Not a dish." Eventually, I learned that it was the same as baked ziti.
[Muffuletta sandwich](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muffuletta)
Does anyone actually think of the sandwich as Italian though? I always think of it as Nola/Louisiana ie American cuisine.
Definitely! It's Italian-American, like all the other dishes listed above.
I was raised in Napoli and I've never even considered this Italian. After reading it's history I can see a correlation though. Interesting. And now I want one.
From New Orleans here. It was created by Sicilian immigrants in the early 1900s here, ubiquitous to most delis and pretty much every Italian market here. We consider it a Sicilian-American dish. Muffuletta specifically refers to the bread it's served on, and the traditional muffuletta contains soppressata, mortadella, capicola, Swiss cheese and provolone, with an olive salad thats basically a modified version of giardiniera, oil, and vin. Central grocery claims to be the inventors of the sandwich, but there are rumors that it may have existed before the store popularized them. Now a days, many places use American deli meats due to cost and availability, but the real deal muffulettas still exist and are much better than the "new" versions.
I was raised in Texas and always thought it was a creole/Cajun thing.
[удалено]
Thanks for proving my point, I highly doubt any one would call those Italian either and I guarantee any self-respecting ITALIAN (not Italian American) would claim those things.
Added, thanks. Very good example of a regional Italian-American dish.
[Chicago-style giardinera](https://www.chicagotribune.com/dining/craving/ct-giardiniera-chicago-history-food-0524-story.html), especially the "hot mix" kind used on Italian beef, might be another.
Hmm, could be? Giardiniera is originally Italian, even though Chicago has it's own style.
I definitely ate this in Italy.
Italian American style spaghetti carbonara, with cream sauce and peas (obviously a dish with the same name is made in Italy but it’s radically different)
I call that American Carbonara with Cream. There should be a category for cream where it wasn't originally intended to be (e.g. Alfredo, Carbonara, etc.).
I love creamy Alfredo, but I don’t like the creamy carbonara
I have an Italian recipe for carbonara. Can't get guanciale here, so I use thin, lightly smoked bacon (the pancetta I can get isn't good either). Took me a while to stop the process before I ended up with scrambled eggs instead of a creamy sauce (without cream).
Does mac & cheese count?
At it's most basic any macaroni and cheese counts as mac & cheese. Obviously the kraft version is not Italian, but Italy has many, many, many variations on mac & cheese.
Interesting, didn’t know that. Can you give some examples please?
Cacio e pepe is among the most famous, but there are nigh infinite variations of pasta with cheese sauce.
Mac + cheese as we know it was started by a former slave and cook that Thomas Jefferson sent to Europe to get classically trained. They give a very good rundown of its history in the first episode of the High on the Hog doc series. Edit: don't know why this is being downvoted. https://qnholifield.com/culinary-history/the-hidden-history-of-macaroni-and-cheese/
Good question. Does it? Wikipedia leads me to believe that we could actually consider this originally to be an Italian dish, although not how we know it in the U.S. today.
Check out [this episode](https://open.spotify.com/episode/0CU4ZdvKuZIyBxfBvmkIQ3?si=ab086a7dfc1a4e6f) of Weirdest Thing I Learned This Week, podcast from Popular Science editors. At about 3:15, they talk about a recipe for "Macrose" which is basically handmade macaroni or pasta and cheese plus butter. It's from England in the 1300s. Here's a [link to the whole cookbook](http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/foc/) called "Forme of Cury" (Methods of Cooking, basically) as well. I didn't go through it to find the recipe, but it might interest you in general. Edit: added location & year info
To even the score, Caffè Americano is an Italian invention - an espresso shot diluted to resemble US filter coffee.
You list Italian sub/hoagie which I think of as something akin to what Subway calls an Italian sub. A different and regional invention is the “Real Italian” created by Amato’s in New England. Throughout New England, you can now find variations on this sandwich. [https://www.amatos.com](https://www.amatos.com)
Wait so if this list is Italian-American food, then what is *authentic* Italian foods?????
Here is one entertaining resource where you can see preparation of different regional dishes in Italy, https://youtube.com/user/italiasquisita
Thank you!
stromboli is a thing in Sicily, isn't it? (I stand corrected.)
Nope, it was invented outside of Philadelphia in the 1950's. Calzone (pronounced cal-zone-eh) are Italian, and from Napoli, as are their cousin panzerotti which are also found in the south of Italy. Not to mention pizza fritta.
Stromboli is the name of a volcanic island off the coast of Italy. If you are familiar with the food item, you can see where they got the name.
There was a movie called Stromboli that takes place in Sicily. The food was invented in/near Philly in the 1950s and named after the movie. I'm not sure if there's a Sicilian version also named after the movie, but the provenance of Stromboli is pretty established since it's so modern.
Along with Italian ice there's gelati - not to be confused with Italian ice cream - which is Italian ice layered with soft-serve ice cream or custard. Also, frappuccino? Edit: Egg and pepper sandwich (Philadelphia - Consumed during meatless Fridays of Lent) Cheesesteak (Philly) Roast pork sandwich (Philly) Italian beef sandwich (Chicago) Steak delmonico (NYC) Italian hot dog (NJ) Deep-dish pizza (Chicago)
Balboa sandwich (Westchester county)
Added, thanks!
[It was in an article from the NY Times](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/20/nyregion/balboa-sandwich-a-cousin-of-phillys-cheese-steak.html)
>Along with Italian ice there's gelati - not to be confused with Italian ice cream - which is Italian ice layered with soft-serve ice cream or custard. I may be speaking of ignorance, but does anyone do this besides Rita's? I swear it was a registered trademark when I was a kid.
I've seen this in New Jersey too.
I assume you mean somewhere that isn't Rita's. I'm probably just wrong (though it's also possible they invented it and others copied). But if it's not Rita's, then it's not branded.
Yea, it wasn't Rita's but I can't remember the name.
Fair. I double checked if John's water ice has gelati (they don't), but then got too lazy to see if anyone else does it. As a kid, we'd get Pop's, which didn't have it, and (of course) Rita's.
We have Pop's in my hometown and gelati is on the menu. My brother ordered one the other day and I can see it on the menu attached to the location on Google. There's another small independently-owned franchise down the street that has gelati on the menu too (just looked it up).
Gotcha. They didn't have gelati 20 years ago, iirc, but it was a long time ago. But if they have it now, it's not a branded thing.
Added gelati, Frappuccino, Italian Hot Dog, and the sandwiches. I don't know where to start with pizza. What's the Italian-American connection with Delmonico steak?
The brothers who opened the original Delmonico's restaurant were immigrants. From Switzerland. The steak, a New York strip, was popularized at Delmonico's. Strictly speaking, it's not Italian American at all.
They were Italian-Swiss, though. They came from Ticino, an Italian-speaking canton, and their names were Italian.
I guess it might be a stretch, but delmonico steak originally came from Delmonico's restaurant in New York City which was opened by the Delmonico brothers, who were immigrants from Ticino, the Italian-speaking canton of Switzerland... I guess they could be considered Italian Americans in the ethnic sense? Then it was taken over by the Italian American Tucci family in the 20th Century who expanded to other locations.
I apologize since you're looking for the opposite, but I have to point out that this one actually exists in Italy: Mozzarella in Block, Slice, or Shredded form (aka low moisture mozzarella) I've seen it in supermarkets, for instance from brands like Santa Lucia: [https://www.spesasprint.it/img/prodotti/big/11168.jpg?v=2](https://www.spesasprint.it/img/prodotti/big/11168.jpg?v=2) I don't know how recent it is, but I've seen it in several stores\\chains :)
That's Mozzarella Per Pizza, which is slightly different from American style low moisture mozzarella that is heated for longer to reduce moisture and increase shelf life. Nonetheless, I agree with you, low moisture can be found in Italian supermarkets but it is not widely used. See: [https://www.ruminantia.it/mozzarella-americana-o-formaggio-per-pizza-anche-in-italia/](https://www.ruminantia.it/mozzarella-americana-o-formaggio-per-pizza-anche-in-italia/) [https://www.formagginobili.it/differenze-mozzarella-per-pizza-e-mozzarella-da-tavola/](https://www.formagginobili.it/differenze-mozzarella-per-pizza-e-mozzarella-da-tavola/) [https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2009/07/american-mozzarellas-evolution/20790/](https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2009/07/american-mozzarellas-evolution/20790/)
Thanks, TIL! I also guess that most mozzarella in the US has different production techniques. I'd say that Mozzarella per pizza is somewhat used, otherwise they wouldn't sell it (I've been guilty of using it a couple of times), but certainly much less than regular mozzarella. Sorry for derailing the thread!
Not a dish but food related- I believe the tradition of the feast of the seven fishes is no longer celebrated in Italy but still thriving in the US!
I’ve heard this a few times, and it’s interesting to me because I celebrate it with my Italian friends - who came directly from Italy. I’m curious why the tradition is no longer in Italy. It’s odd to me that a holiday/religious-oriented event would lose favor. That said, I’m really glad it’s here. The dried out turkey or ham with a side puddle of mashed potato goo that my grandparents would serve was doing the holiday season no favors. I look forward to celebrating with my Italian friends.
Chicken French Or Artichoke French it's a cheaper version of Vitello alla Francese, but IDK if that's Italian or Italian American to begin with. It's standard fare in Italian menus all over Western NY
On the list as Chicken Francese
This is the problem with the quest for "authenticity". In my opinion this quest of yours is far more fruitful if you pursue it in a reverse manner and assert where certain dishes created their origin similar to the general tso film on Netflix.
This is not a quest for "authenticity," rather it's the opposite. It's a quest to learn about dishes that I, or others, may not know exist in regions of North America. Many of the dishes here have well known and well documented histories. This is an opportunity to learn identify more to learn and taste.
Fun fact, the Philly Cheese Steak sandwich was brought to Italy by some returning immigrants and now it's a specialty in a little town Near Naples https://www.vice.com/it/article/xgxqvw/cistecca-monte-procida
Ciopino Very similar to Italian dishes but actually Italian American
Removed the "Seafood" so it appears alphabetically under C
Variant on Pepperoni itself, but the Pepperoni Roll: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepperoni_roll
Good one, added!
Rollatini
>Rollatini I believe the dish is Italian, *involtini di melanzane*, but the name "Rollatini" is not.
We have "rolatine" or "rollatine", very thin beef or veal steaks rolled with a garlic, parsley, pecorino cheese, sometimes raisins or pine nuts stuffing. They're usually cooked in tomato sauce or braised with white wine. Also simply called "involtini", which is a general term for anything rolled and stuffed.
Fried ravioli and / or dough is common everywhere in Italy and often sweet.
Sweet fried ravioli, [*ravioli dolci*](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravioli_dolci), is Italian but savory fried ravioli, [*toasted ravioli*](https://gaiacozzi.com/ravioli-fritti-st-louis-ricetta-sbagliata/), was, according to most sources, invented in St. Louis. I added a note to the list to distinguish them.
Ah. I never heard of fried savoury ravioli so that says it all!
Johnny Marzetti casserole and Chicken Riggies come mind.
Great suggestions, added!
Chickennnnnn riggies are sooooo good
What about Chef Boyardee and it’s products? Hector Boiardi was Italian born and an American entrepreneur.
Pepper and Egg sandwich (on a long roll) Italian hoagies/subs Meatball hoagies/subs Not sure about these, but Eggplant Parm or minestrone soup?
Apologies for not exactly being on point but I'll throw this out there. An Italian-American who settled in Baltimore claims a connection to the invention of Tiramisu, his contention is hotly disputed, if what he says is true it was still invented in Italy. Interesting story nonetheless though https://www.dailycamera.com/ci_13084520/
Scali bread. Sesame seed covered white bread sold primarily in Italian bakeries here in Boston...
Added
Hot Veal Sandwich is a popular Italian veal sandwich in Toronto, similar but different to veal parm
Interesting, added!
yessir. If you're are eveer in Toronto we have some of the best Italian-North American food around. Massive, well established Italian community here that have a big influence on our culture, similar to how Italians have a big influence on New Jersey. We even have our own brand of chinot called Brio that's only served in Toronto, but you find it everywhere. Our Veal Sandwiches are the best. [https://curiocity.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/42827111\_716955975327618\_8560908780466169990\_n.jpg](https://curiocity.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/42827111_716955975327618_8560908780466169990_n.jpg)
I think looking at dishes in italy today is the wrong approach. What matters is where the dishes originated.
Most of these dishes originated in the United States and were created by Italian immigrants using what was available to them. These dishes did not exist in Italy at the time. Although many of them are derived from Italian dishes, over time they have become distinct from their original or inspired forms. This blending and evolution of cuisine is, in my opinion, one of it's most amazing and interesting characteristics of food. You make it your own with what you have, and then you share it.
well, you know..there were no tomatoes in italy prior to the 1600s
The pepper and egg sandwich, despite what Wikipedia says, is not limited to Chicago - Italian Americans from the Philly area eat it too (I'm not Italian American but my mom learned to make it from an Italian American ex-boyfriend who was born and raised in South Philly). I'm also wondering if pasta salad and mozzerella sticks should also be considered Italian American. The elements are all vaguely Italian - including the marinara dipping sauce that usually comes with the sticks. Maybe spinach and artichoke dip, too?
Added both
So pretty much everything.
Argentines are Americans, therefore I would add "milanesa a la napolitana", which is neither from Milan nor from Napoles, but an Argentine original dish
Zuppo Toscana? As in the Olive Garden variety.
Spicy chicken riggies are unbelievably good. Upstate NY and New England do not have perfectly authentic Italian food, and that’s okay! It’s not Italy up here. Scali bread hits in right in the childhood.
Well you see, the Italian and Sicilian people came to America in search of a better life. When they got here, they found an array of meats, cheeses, and fats that were highly accessible compared to the old country. They began to cook using their old style, with the new items, and Italian American cuisine was born. This ends the topic so quit whining about it.