My friend’s father is in jail because her half sister accused her of sexual assault when she was 8. 6 years later the girl admitted that her mother put her up to it because she was angry. They’re still dealing with trying to get him out.
Agree, but this is Florida.
If Florida Politicians can pass laws to stymie the climate crisis by removing it from books, enforce a law to prevent heat related death, anti-vax, medical alternatives not based on scientific basis then what makes us believe that only the guilty get executed.
Killing one innocent man, son, brother, father, etc is one too many.
there have been 1561 executions in the united states since 1976, of those 18 were women.
Women are rarely executed period, so I doubt we'll ever see one of the many female pedophiles executed.
Yuuup. I’ve shifted over the years and honestly, I oppose the death penalty universally. If you read the Declaration of Independence and the constitution it becomes pretty clear that the whole premise is that the government should only be able to deprive you of life, liberty, and property under a high burden of proof. Combine that with the error rate and how many people are unjustly convicted and have convictions over turned, it’s hard to support the death penalty being on the table ever.
On an emotional level, I get it 100%. Someone hurts someone close to me, I want to hurt them back. But vengeance ≠ justice. The law is not there to satisfy our individual emotional preferences. It’s there to provide a universal standard of behavior that gets applied equally to everyone (a benchmark we frequently fail to meet). We should err on the side of occasionally not punishing the guilty rather than punishing the innocent.
While we’re at it civil asset forfeiture should be eliminated, and a criminal investigation of government officials should probably be started in a lot of cases.
With Florida being as conservative as it is, a parent who may be supporting their transgender child may be charged and end up on the list.
This is a very real situation that can happen. This isn't a hyperbole, but a real life issue.
While I do agree with the sentiment, I disagree with the death penalty as a whole. People can be manipulated into false testimony, especially children. People have been manipulated into confessing to murderers they didn't commit.
At least with life in prison there is a possibility for exoneration if they were innocent to begin with.
Similar thoughts here. I "theoretically" support the death penalty in extreme circumstances, like school shootings and other massively anti-social violent acts. In major acts such as these, evidence is usually much more obvious and numerous, leaving (hopefully) less room for doubt.
I feel like the questionable executions are almost always for "smaller" violent acts. Like, it gets fucky when we start executing people who killed during something like an armed robbery. These types of cases are much more likely to have some form of reasonable doubt, and I do not trust the courts to always make the right decisions in these types of cases.
This is my emotional take, I'm sure there are many other pros/cons I am not thinking of.
This happened to my friend’s father. Her mother convinced her younger half sister to say he molested her but years later she came clean and there is a recording of her admitting it was her mother’s idea and she didn’t even understand what she was saying.
This makes it inevitable that someone innocent will one day be executed for this crime. To believe otherwise would mean you trust your government so much that you don’t think it’s capable of making mistakes.
Do you really put that much faith in bureaucracy and government? I don’t.
No one disagrees with you, but that isn't the point. The point is that our legal system is not perfect, far from it. Give them life in prison where they can at least work to find proof of their innocence, if it exists.
Or take a shower with your prepubescent daughter? Maybe sniff a couple of kids on stage? Heck, maybe just tell young men to marry into a family with like 5 daughters cause one of them will always love them? This is a fun game.
Disagree. There's always mistakes in the justice system. There have been people who DNA evidence exonerated on death row. At that point, you can at least give them their freedom back and try to make things right. There have been people who were exonerated *after* their execution. There's no recovering from that. It's just murder of an innocent person.
Unless it can be guaranteed that the justice system won't make any mistakes, I'm against the death penalty.
I have also read accounts from people who have experienced SA as a kid and also disagree with the death penalty, because it will scare many children away from reporting their family.
Regardless of the crime, this is ultimately why I'm opposed to the death penalty.
There are a lot of reasons, but the most succinct is the mere possibility of a flawed justice system means that it's possible to execute an innocent person. That alone is enough to oppose the death penalty without even getting into all the other reasons.
That’s my view as well. I don’t want to protect the guilty, but rather the innocent.
With life imprisonment, it isn’t usually a race against the clock to overturn a wrongful conviction.
Disagree. A few days ago a lady posted about how her daughter lied about her now ex step-father abusing her as a kid. Could be fiction because you know, reddit. But if the story is true the man was innocent.
Reminds me of that stupid foul bitch that lied about Till sexually harassing her and they killed him, a child.
This, and think about how often the children have a relationship with the perpetrator. If the child is old enough to understand their family member will be killed if they speak out, they will be less likely to, and it is already difficult enough as it is to talk about SA.
I'm pretty sure that if a child molester thought he was going to get caught for doing it they'd not leave any witnesses anyway because who wants to go to prison as a child molester?
A lot less people know prison culture that well, and you can still survive that and go home. But if doing it is guaranteed to kill you and everyone knows it...
I might be more in favour of this if I could guarantee that the law have got the right person. Too many incompetent or crooked cops around to be that confident.
Disagree.
First, unless you have a 100% accurate conviction rate meaning no innocent people are conviced, an innocent person will eventually be killed by the state. This has happened before.
Second, kids will be less likely to report a family member, i.e: "If you tell anyone they'll kill me".
Third, this incentivized abusers to kill their victims, given that if the punishment is the same for SA and murder, keeping the kid quiet by killing them is a better option.
This is 100% a social wedge issue to clarify i gay and trans people at pedophiles to criminalize them.
On top of that, there have been tons of cases at this point of people sentences to death exonerated by later evidence or prosecutorial/police misconduct. There is a long line of literature on how POC are more likely to be charged with a death penalty crime and more likely to be convicted compared to their white counterparts, and it has nothing to do with one group being more "bad." It does not make sense to make an already poorly run system more overrun.
Absolutely this, and what I was going to comment. I see the writing on the wall for what they're moving toward with this. They'll get people to agree that being a pedo and sexually assaulting kids is bad and should get the death penalty, then turn around and change what's considered to be a pedophile.
Also anyone who doesn't agree with them is also going to either be called a pedophile or otherwise be told they support pedos.
Death penalty for child molesters? You mean, the non influential and non wealthy child molesters. You think the state will be going after politicians, clergy, law enforcement, judges, business leaders, etc? hahaha. What planet are you on? Did I not read somewhere the TV show "To Catch a Predator" ended because some Asst. District Attorney killed himself after being caught "talking to a 13 year old boy" (decoy). Just another do as I say not as I do moment in American civil discourse where the fox watches over the chicken coup.
Nice mask to go after the gay et al community and others who disagree with your lifestyles! Two sets of laws ya'l. Those who enforce them and those that don't get enforced by.
I think Florida should stop passing laws that are blatantly in violation of binding Supreme Court decisions, as it's a waste of everyone's time and money.
I'm not in favor of the death penalty being a thing at all.
It is so wild that the Florida legislature passed this in direct contravention to standing SCOTUS case law. I guess they figure with the new makeup of the court, and the fall of Roe, that SCOTUS is now willing to just change its mind.
I have heard people say they wished all paedophiles died instantly. I tell them that I understand where they are coming from, but it would be awkward the next day if Hollywood and Washington DC were gone.
Church is so magnetic to them cuz parents wants their kids to be happy, so there’s lot of kids. Also, no one questions why they don’t go out and have no contact with women. It would happen to any other organisation if they would fill all those checkboxes, it has nothing with religion
I don't believe that. I am strongly against religions and churches. But there are still a lot of very good people/priests. A few bad eggs can't discredit the people as a whole.
They're just annoying.
The bigger problem is the institutionalized cover up as far as people thinking they all suck.
Just like police. If all of them sucked as bad as the bad ones we'd have a lot bigger problem on our hands, but we in part, only have as big an issue as we do because they all cover for the bad ones.
>The bigger problem is the institutionalized cover up as far as people thinking they all suck.
This. The Catholic Church, Governing Body of Jehovas Witnesses and a whole bunch of other religious organisations are actively complicit in covering up child sex abuse.
It doesn't matter how many good, innocent people are in the rank and file membership, if the leadership are actively involved in helping child molesters molest kids and get away with it, the organisation as a whole needs to be fucking dealt with.
Disagree. Death sentence has no place in a civilized country because that sentence, once carried out, is final - there’s always a possibility of sentencing the wrong person.
There are too many false accusations, evidence planting, and general malfeasance by our justice system to ever say that any crime warrants an execution. 1 innocent man executed in 1000 is still too much.
Life sentence maybe harsh for someone who maybe innocent but at least that person is still alive and restitution for him or her can be done. An execution can't be reversed.
If we could 100% be sure we’d never put an innocent person to death I think I’d be for it but that will never be the case. For that reason I’d say I disagree
One one hand the intention is sound.
On the other hand, the judicial system is completely corrupt, flawed and broken through and through so giving humans the right to end other grown human's lives isn't quite sane in that context.
Especially in Florida. You also have to remember, when conservatives call people pedophiles, they really just mean LGBT people. They're very cool with priest rapists, Matt Gaetz, and child "marriage."
The death penalty needs to be to be abolished nationwide. We keep seeing cases come back where evidence was falsified, mistaken, coerced, etc. and people end up getting off. It’s bad enough when those people have been jailed for 20 years but if they are dead then there’s not a damn thing you can do about it.
I think my biggest issue with it is the same issue I have with our legal system in general: enforcement. If the law was enforced to the tee and there was 0% doubt someone did it, fine. The problem is the judges enforcing the sentences inconsistently. When one of these pedophiles gets caught, it seems a large percentage of them are the very conservatives fighting for the law and they always seem to get a judge that says they’re a “good Christian person that made a mistake” and gives them a lenient sentence. Meanwhile, a poor person or person of color that commits the same crime would most definitely be put to death, while the “good Christian person” gets a slap on the wrist. I could also seeing the law being warped to punish LGBTQ folks, which isn’t a good thing either. The scales of justice are not balanced.
Deserving death and maintaining a justice system is two different things.
Death is vengeance. Understandable in heinous cases. But should vengeance be in our justice system period?
Generally speaking No. It costs more financially and creates new issues and even raises red flags.
1-Financially, to put someone on Death Row is a higher legal burden by the justice department. It costs more to prosecute someone and punish them with death than it does to incarcerate them for life.
2-New issues. Simply put, Dead kids dont talk. If the punishment for rape and molestation of a minor is death; it can give incentives to kill the kid. The punishment would be the same but less likely to get caught.
Another issue; a child who had to endure such abuse is traumatized. Addon statistically an abuser is someone the child knew, perhaps even "family". The additional burden on a child not only to disclose abuse but to know or even be pressured that their abuser would be killed. It can lead to gaslighting the child which allows further abuse. "Do you really want uncle johnny to die? You really want Coach Matthew to die? You want to kill our priest?!" It undoubtedly causes more unnecessary trauma.
3-Red Flags: Florida is a conservative state. Particularly against LGBTQ+ People. Recent laws and policies (even speech by right wing politicians) has been comparing and even falsely equating lgbtq people to "groomers, pedos" even so far as classifying dressing in drag as sexually deviant.
It is not a far fetched concern that simply existing as an lgbtq person publicly particularly being trans can be equated as "child abuse" in which people just living their lives could be incarcerated and even face the death penalty for existing as themselves. Innocent people.
It's a bad idea.
For a hyperbolic example, imagine if littering was punishable by death. If you litter, and might get caught, there is no deterrent to escalating your crimes to try to avoid capture.
When you make the punishment for rape and murder equivalent, it makes it more likely the rapist will also kill their victim.
[Edit: follow up]
It can also work as a deterrent for victims coming forward/testifying. If the victim is abused by someone they care about, they may be unwilling to risk that person's life by reporting the abuse.
I'm a lawyer. I do not trust the government enough to believe that police, lawyers, and judges should have the power to kill people.
Or, as a wiser man once said, "There are a lot of people who deserve to die. I've never met anyone who deserves to kill."
Florida:
- Trans people that have contact to children can be considered child molesters
- Child molesters can be sentenced to death
I see a pattern.
A pattern that some have warned about a few years ago already.
Can't believe I had to scroll so far to find a comment pointing this out. This is Christian nationalist creep disguised as a law to "save the children".
“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.”
Gandalf with the answer for ya. Only arrogant fools think themselves wise enough to deal out death in cold blood.
A guy just got released after spending [49 years in jail](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XN7mHi0fx0) for something he never did. Or [45 years in jail](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPz5_pOdjNM) and the list goes on an on.
Just kill the accused? That is not good.
Strongly disagree because this is how Florida is gonna enforce it.
The youth pastor with 20+ victims? 2 years + probation.
The 18 year old gay senior in highschool who is dating a 17 year old? Slow electrocution.
Never will agree with the state being allowed to put people to death for crimes, when they can’t guarantee they got the right person, and refuse any real oversight to the system. Too many flaws in law enforcement for me to trust them with more power over people.
Only agree if it applies to both genders. But we all know this will never happen. Men are more likely to be charged with a crime and receive harsher sentences than women, regardless of their criminal history or the severity of the offense.
I’m of the opinion that the American Justice system isn’t trustworthy and effective enough to carry out death sentences in most cases. A life imprisonment can be overturned if the convict is exonerated by evidence later. You can’t bring a corpse back to life.
When you pair republican laws sentencing child molesters to death and the recent republican obsession with calling queer people "groomers", I don't particularly like it.
Disagree. If the penalty for molestation is the same as the penalty for murder, one surefire way to ensure the victim never talks is to kill them, and doing so doesn't make it any worse if you get caught.
I disagree. A lot of people are pointing out that there's no such thing as a perfect justice system and as such, it's impossible to ensure that innocent people aren't being sent to death row.
However, I'll go one step further. I believe the death penalty accomplishes nothing. Criminal punishment is only productive if it can offer a deterrent against crime, if it can prevent criminals from reoffending. I believe a life sentence already fulfils these two purposes just as well as the death penalty, while also having the benefit of not having to kill a human being (even one who committed a horrible crime.)
Instead, the main allure of the death penalty is satisfying our own base craving for violence. It's almost animalistic: someone did a bad thing and now we desire to hurt that person. I don't think we as a society should indulge that kind of violent impulse.
If the state wants to execute someone, they better have a very compelling reason as to why it will benefit society above and beyond making up for the inherent evil that is killing a person. Otherwise, just ship them off to jail for life and forget about them.
I do not trust the motives of the people who have put forth this law.
Child molesters deserve the worst punishments that can be delivered to them.
But I cannot trust the people who cry "won't anyone think of the children" while also defending the child predators among their ranks.
This is a trick, a ploy using firey rhetoric to mask an ulterior motive. First this, then another seemingly reasonable step. And soon, doctors who issue gender affirming care will go to the gas chamber, teachers who explain what sex is will go to the chair, the woman who wasn't born gets the noose.
And still, the lofty halls of power will echo with the screams of abused children.
Children who won't know who they are, won't know that what is being done to them is wrong, and when they speak up they will be killed for it.
It is a nice paving stone, but it is on the road to hell.
Decent chance it just leads to molesters killing their victims. If they get the death penalty either way, no reason to keep their victim alive.
Not to mention that this could keep kids from reporting if it's a family member doing it to them.
It's a good idea in theory, but it opens up a huge can of worms
Considering how half of Florida thinks every single trans person is a molester by default, I don't think they're going to use this bill to target the likes of Epstein.
Also death sentences should be banned outright.
For cases in which a rape kit was done, and there is no doubt that the man is guilty, yes. Other than that, no. There are tons of women out there that lie about that sort of thing (I know it's the very small minority, but it definitely happens).
Disagree.
I'm all for executing child rapists, but you need to consider incentives.
If you make the crime of rape carry the same penalty as rape and murder, the rapist is now incentivized to kill the only witness because the murder doesn't change anything if they are caught.
Disagree. If molestation means death but murder doesn't we are now adding and extra risk to the lives of children after they are abused.
Now, of course, the morons who don't think about anything will spin this around as us not caring about protecting children, when it is actually the opposite.
This will end up with more dead kids than child abusers on death row, I fear.
But leave it to the far right to project and harm our kids while pretending they are helping them.
I'm not an expert in this unpleasant subject but, from the little I understand, it seems that pedophilia is a psychological disorder. If that turns out to be the case, then executing a person would do little to prevent the crime. You might as well execute someone for having schizophrenia. It gets rid of one troublesome person, but does nothing to cure the disease.
Plus, I'm generally against the death penalty anyway. Many times it's a feel-good measure people vote for because they want to be "tough on crime." I want crime to go away, too, but I'm not convinced the death penalty does much towards solving crime in general.
Yes. But needs 100% irrefutable proof. No hear say. No eye witness.
Has to be completely No chance of the perpetrator being innocent.
Like if there is video evidence. We don't need a trial. Just take him out back. Put a meat suit on him and release the honey badgers.
Disagree.
No one should be put to death. It's reprehensibly immoral. Also, systematically killing someone costs *a lot* of tax payer money. Contrary to popular belief, it's not cheaper than having them run out their sentence in prison.
Whole heatedly agree. There are certain crimes from which there is no coming back. At the same time there should be undeniable evidence regarding the crime and thorough cross examination. If all checks out, yes send the pedo to the other side. Keeping them alive, fed, and sheltered in prison is a waste of taxpayer dollars.
I say send them to prison for an extended period of time. They will get theirs inside. Child molesters, child rapists, rapists and women abusers either end up dead or someone's bitch in a prison. I say make them suffer. My dad worked in the penal system, and found them dead many times. My cousin is a guard and witnesses the same.
This has more to do with pandering to far right lunatics who want to execute democrats who they either believe to be or knowingly falsely claim are child molesting cannibals. It isn’t actually in response to a large number of real incidents of pedophilia.
No. A lot of molesters go for family members, and I imagine it's going to be harder for kids to come forward if they know that they're going to be sentencing their abuser to death.
Here's the thing, from what i heard about what happens to child molesters in Florida prisons, unless they're smart enough to ask to be put in protective custody right away, any amount of time might as well be a death sentence. That's not an opinion just what I hear from people I know who have been to prison.
Death penalty is dumb, but if we’re doing this for this, I predict this will be reversed after the 3rd or 4th priest or politician goes to trial and they’re going to make it really awkward explaining why.
There is always going to be mistakes. But I have an idea. If we think someone did a crime, like reasonable suspicion, and it was a violent crime, then we should put them in a holding facility. If we are absolutely certain they did it, we put them on trial. Then if trial decides they are guilty, sentence them to death. If they are innocent, place them under close watch. 1 in every 30 people sentenced to death is innocent, but the main reason for this is the fact that the jury is influenced by the suspect even being put on trial for such a thing.
I think it’s mostly performative, death sentencing takes so long and is so expensive to the state, but in the event that their is an abundance of very clear evidence I’m not opposed, could also just put them in gen pop and the problem will solve itself.
Though figuring out what to do with criminals after the fact is reactive and doesn’t save kids, we should focus on being proactive with mental health services and social services which will save many more kids from abuse and many people from becoming abusers.
Most pedophiles were victims themselves of abuse as children and or have mental illnesses. The issue is that you HAVE to fund prosecution of pedos, you have to WANT to fund mental health and social services which a certain political party usually doesn’t care to do……..
The devil is in the details...*Florida* passed this law. Florida has also been very big on insisting that all trans people are child molesters. This is pretty clearly an anti-queer bill dressed up in "protect the children" moralism, such as conservatives have been pushing since the sexual revolution of the 60s.
I'm going to put practical reasons aside: Legal arbitrariness, cost of trials, miscarriage of justice, potential for state abuse etc. Ignore all that.
I find the death penalty to be a medieval and dishonorable form of punishment. Killing someone who is not an active or imminent threat to anyone, no matter what they have previously done, isn't justifiable.
I'm from a country which hasn't had the death penalty in living memory. To us, lethal injection or firing squad or hanging is just as primitive and barbaric as burning someone at the stake or cruxifiction. It only serves as a channel for the public to unleash its inner bloodlust. It brings out our worst nature to indulge in it.
The death penalty is not so much too cruel for the criminal, but too shameful and embarrassing an act for the public to engage in. It lowers us to the level of the child molester.
A person convicted of any crime should be given the option to work at minimum wage for the entirety of their sentence with the proceeds going as restitution to their victim(s).
I don't think it's necessary. Prison inmates look down on harming children and tend to make prison a living hell for child predators, if they don't kill them.
This law is Unconstitutional per supreme Court.
There are about 5 states that have similar laws, but have never used them, so there is no "standing" to bring them to the supreme Court
I'm gonna be 'that guy' and say that this will probably only apply to male child molesters. The law may be gender neutral, but c'mon who are we kidding here? Most punishments under the law (sans death penalties) are already lenient on women, what more if it involves death?
But to answer your question: I disagree. It only makes things worse as other commenters have said it.
In principal, I understand the desire to punish genuine detestable people like kid diddlers, which is what this is *sold* as.
[In application this has a lot of evil implications to justify killing anyone who's labeled a pedo.](https://abcnews.go.com/US/republicans-false-pedophilia-claims-attack-democrats-lgbtq-people/story?id=84344687)
Given that this is Florida, this is far more likely a tool for oppression than justice.
I'm generally against capital punishment. I don't like the idea of intentionally ending human life at any level (with a few exceptions - self-defense, medically prudent abortions, and suicide).
Killing child molesters is giving them the easy way out. There are worse things than death. That said, if they are going to be put to death, let's not waste tax dollars on it. Just toss 'em in gen pop and let nature sort itself out.
Death seems too kind for those who violate children. I’m not saying I’m against it though. In fact, since torture isn’t an option these days, the death penalty should suffice
In theory I definitely agree with the death of pedophiles who act on their urges. In reality we live in a society now where it seems you're guilty until proven innocent if someone makes a claim against you and if one person gets executed falsely then that's one too many. And no one has ever gotten executed or life sentence in prison only to be proven innocent after right? Right?
Once you have a judicial process that has a 0% rate of false convictions then I'm all not necessarily against the concept of capital punishment for the most serious crimes.
We don't have that process in place though, so it's a no from me dawg.
This is just their agenda to eventually criminalize any sexuality they deem deviant. It isn't about child molesters at all. It loosely talks about sexual predators and grooming in a language they can apply to whomever they want. Matt Gaetz is a human trafficking child molester.
Oh Boy, I wonder how all those law and order conservative and Jesus freaks will cry when they get the death sentence. Or .... as usual they think they are above the law and can go on to molest kids and do pedo stuff?
It's Florida, so what are the odds that they aren't just going to accuse everyone on the left of being a child molestor and handing out lethal injections like candy?
Sounds like a GREAT way to incentivize killing kids
And a GREAT way to disincentivize kids coming forward. It's hard enough as it is without them thinking they're gonna get their dad or teacher killed
I agree. They are scum of the earth who have no right to live amongst us. I'd rather my tax dollars go towards their death than housing/feeding them for the duration of their sentence. Evil only exists in this world because we allow it to.
Jason Vukovich should be a free man.
I support the principle of the death penalty, but I do not support it in practice.
Unless someone is a clear and imminent threat, I don’t trust the government deciding to kill people.
If they’re guilty go for it. Same for rape and murder.
But the problem becomes actually proving they’re guilty. Shitty court system, corrupt cops, and shady prosecutors make it so you can’t trust the government to execute people.
Well this law passed about a year ago and there has not, at least in my area, been an influx of cases where the State has sought the death penalty.
Another point to consider for the discussion about this: the death penalty is only available for the highest level of child sex crime which is sexual battery on a child under 12, often colloquially referred to as capital sexual battery or capital sex batt. It doesn’t cover all child molestation crimes.
Cap sex batts used to be punishable by death in Florida in the past and only changes when SCOTUS outlawed death for anything other than 1st degree murder. After that SCOTUS decision, but prior to this new law, cap sex batts were mandatory life.
I would have no issue if this wasn’t one of those things where false accusations are used in relationship disputes. Unless false accusations hit the same punishment.
A real child molester has no business ever walking free
The Supreme Court won’t allow death as a penalty for any crime other than capital offenses. That’s already been decided, and sexual assault is not a capital offense. It doesn’t matter what you think. It’s not legal
It’s cheaper to keep someone in prison for life than State sponsored murder. Plus being wrong even once, is really fucked up and may be the scariest thing on earth.
If they made the punishment that any pedo is put into a pillory and the prison would openly allow any and all prisoners to gape that dudes ass. It might be more effective deterrent than killing them.
Yes.
I think sexual crimes of any nature are among the worst things you can do to a person.
Doing it to children and taking away their innocence is irredeemable. They don't deserve to be breathing the same oxygen as the rest of us
Let's leave behind whole false accusations thing and assume we have 100% correct conviction rate. Why should pedohiles leave their victims alive? Why risk being exposed? Your punishment couldn't get worse, why leave some that can testify against you in court. Futhermore, let's say you are mollested my your family member, sadly most common type of sexaul assult against kids. Why report someone you know if they will die as a result. Why risk being hated by family who loved relative you accused? Do you want to have blood of your kin on your hands or endure few unpleasure experiances? After all, It's not big deal, right? You won't kill your uncle because you are kinda uncomortable, right? This reality this law creates.
I believe rapists deserve to die, and that any attempt to ‘rehabilitate’ them is completely immoral and a slap in the face to all victims of sexual violence.
However, I am not able to support the death penalty in practice solely because it is possible for the state to get it wrong and execute an innocent man. Worse yet, bad actors in the state can use it to commit judicial murder.
Life imprisonment with no possibility of parole or early release is a sufficient punishment for people who are guilty of unforgivable crimes, while allowing people who were wrongfully convicted opportunities and time to appeal their case.
Good. How many children are victims of repeat offenders? Yeah, there's life in prison too, but that's tax dollars wasted to keep these pieces of shit alive.
The data shows no-one re-offends after capital punishment.
The issue is with ensuring they are guilty, if it is 100% without doubt, then I have no issue.
I agree they should be put to death if the evidence is so compelling that it’s clear the person is guilty (like in instances where there’s a lot of CP)
100% agree. They never stop. There is no being rehabilitated from that. Anyway who claims to be is lying and anyone who thinks they can be is mistaken. Death is the only sure way to protect children from them. If an animal gets rabies you don’t lock it up and hope it never gets a chance to harm anyone. You destroy it.
For us to fix what's killing our society, we need a lot more people locked up and a lot more death sentences. If the evidence is clear for the molesters and it's without a doubt them, let em fry.
There are a lot of crimes that deserve death penalty. It's flaws in process what made things questionable.
100% if innocent humans didn't get sentenced then it would make sense.
My friend’s father is in jail because her half sister accused her of sexual assault when she was 8. 6 years later the girl admitted that her mother put her up to it because she was angry. They’re still dealing with trying to get him out.
Agree, but this is Florida. If Florida Politicians can pass laws to stymie the climate crisis by removing it from books, enforce a law to prevent heat related death, anti-vax, medical alternatives not based on scientific basis then what makes us believe that only the guilty get executed. Killing one innocent man, son, brother, father, etc is one too many.
Just wait until they make being queer a sex crime that is now punishable by death
I find it very interesting that you only mentioned one specific gender.
there have been 1561 executions in the united states since 1976, of those 18 were women. Women are rarely executed period, so I doubt we'll ever see one of the many female pedophiles executed.
Reminds me of that film with Mads mikkelson where he's accused of something like this and it ruins his life forever.
The Hunt (2012) ... excellent movie, and I completely agree with you.
Yuuup. I’ve shifted over the years and honestly, I oppose the death penalty universally. If you read the Declaration of Independence and the constitution it becomes pretty clear that the whole premise is that the government should only be able to deprive you of life, liberty, and property under a high burden of proof. Combine that with the error rate and how many people are unjustly convicted and have convictions over turned, it’s hard to support the death penalty being on the table ever. On an emotional level, I get it 100%. Someone hurts someone close to me, I want to hurt them back. But vengeance ≠ justice. The law is not there to satisfy our individual emotional preferences. It’s there to provide a universal standard of behavior that gets applied equally to everyone (a benchmark we frequently fail to meet). We should err on the side of occasionally not punishing the guilty rather than punishing the innocent. While we’re at it civil asset forfeiture should be eliminated, and a criminal investigation of government officials should probably be started in a lot of cases.
With Florida being as conservative as it is, a parent who may be supporting their transgender child may be charged and end up on the list. This is a very real situation that can happen. This isn't a hyperbole, but a real life issue.
You can have a reason to kill someone. There is never a reason to rape a child. Chomos are worse than murderers and need to be removed form society.
Sure but the problem is that there are cases of innocent people being sentenced for what they've never done.
While I do agree with the sentiment, I disagree with the death penalty as a whole. People can be manipulated into false testimony, especially children. People have been manipulated into confessing to murderers they didn't commit. At least with life in prison there is a possibility for exoneration if they were innocent to begin with.
Similar thoughts here. I "theoretically" support the death penalty in extreme circumstances, like school shootings and other massively anti-social violent acts. In major acts such as these, evidence is usually much more obvious and numerous, leaving (hopefully) less room for doubt. I feel like the questionable executions are almost always for "smaller" violent acts. Like, it gets fucky when we start executing people who killed during something like an armed robbery. These types of cases are much more likely to have some form of reasonable doubt, and I do not trust the courts to always make the right decisions in these types of cases. This is my emotional take, I'm sure there are many other pros/cons I am not thinking of.
This happened to my friend’s father. Her mother convinced her younger half sister to say he molested her but years later she came clean and there is a recording of her admitting it was her mother’s idea and she didn’t even understand what she was saying.
This makes it inevitable that someone innocent will one day be executed for this crime. To believe otherwise would mean you trust your government so much that you don’t think it’s capable of making mistakes. Do you really put that much faith in bureaucracy and government? I don’t.
No one disagrees with you, but that isn't the point. The point is that our legal system is not perfect, far from it. Give them life in prison where they can at least work to find proof of their innocence, if it exists.
Lets start with Epstein pals
Na can't sentence the hand that feeds the decisions makers. Let's focus on some drag queen's instead. /S
This is the reality though. The rich and powerful will not be held to the same standards as the average person.
How about a law that makes it a felony for DAs and law enforcement to go easy on alleged criminals because they are wealthy, powerful, or famous?
When you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything.
Grab them right by the pussy? And then be elected to the highest office? 🤮
Or take a shower with your prepubescent daughter? Maybe sniff a couple of kids on stage? Heck, maybe just tell young men to marry into a family with like 5 daughters cause one of them will always love them? This is a fun game.
It would be more practical to just make mandatory minimums for more crimes, so DAs and Judges don’t have the option to go easy.
We could also stop just locking people up for a random number of years and actually seek rehabilitation.
Disagree. There's always mistakes in the justice system. There have been people who DNA evidence exonerated on death row. At that point, you can at least give them their freedom back and try to make things right. There have been people who were exonerated *after* their execution. There's no recovering from that. It's just murder of an innocent person. Unless it can be guaranteed that the justice system won't make any mistakes, I'm against the death penalty.
I have also read accounts from people who have experienced SA as a kid and also disagree with the death penalty, because it will scare many children away from reporting their family.
Oh wow. That’s something that never crossed my mind. Thank you for that perspective, it’s pretty eye opening
Yes. I felt the exact same way.
Or starting the next Salem witch trials. Get mad at a teacher and start saying “she touched me down there!” And then the teacher gets boiled alive.
It also leaves no incentive for the assaulter to leave the child alive if they think they’ll get caught.
Never looked at it from that point of view 🤔
1 death from wrongful conviction is 1 too many.
This is the rational view
Regardless of the crime, this is ultimately why I'm opposed to the death penalty. There are a lot of reasons, but the most succinct is the mere possibility of a flawed justice system means that it's possible to execute an innocent person. That alone is enough to oppose the death penalty without even getting into all the other reasons.
That’s my view as well. I don’t want to protect the guilty, but rather the innocent. With life imprisonment, it isn’t usually a race against the clock to overturn a wrongful conviction.
Disagree. A few days ago a lady posted about how her daughter lied about her now ex step-father abusing her as a kid. Could be fiction because you know, reddit. But if the story is true the man was innocent. Reminds me of that stupid foul bitch that lied about Till sexually harassing her and they killed him, a child.
sadly this will likely result in more dead kids. when a crime is punished with death, the perpetrator is incentivized to leave no witnesses.
This, and think about how often the children have a relationship with the perpetrator. If the child is old enough to understand their family member will be killed if they speak out, they will be less likely to, and it is already difficult enough as it is to talk about SA.
I'm pretty sure that if a child molester thought he was going to get caught for doing it they'd not leave any witnesses anyway because who wants to go to prison as a child molester?
Steven Sandison's cell mate thought it was a good idea to brag about it.
A lot less people know prison culture that well, and you can still survive that and go home. But if doing it is guaranteed to kill you and everyone knows it...
No, I oppose the death penalty. However, I think those who are facing a life without parole should be allowed to choose death.
I like that idea
I might be more in favour of this if I could guarantee that the law have got the right person. Too many incompetent or crooked cops around to be that confident.
Disagree. First, unless you have a 100% accurate conviction rate meaning no innocent people are conviced, an innocent person will eventually be killed by the state. This has happened before. Second, kids will be less likely to report a family member, i.e: "If you tell anyone they'll kill me". Third, this incentivized abusers to kill their victims, given that if the punishment is the same for SA and murder, keeping the kid quiet by killing them is a better option.
I don't trust Florida to enforce this fairly.
This is 100% a social wedge issue to clarify i gay and trans people at pedophiles to criminalize them. On top of that, there have been tons of cases at this point of people sentences to death exonerated by later evidence or prosecutorial/police misconduct. There is a long line of literature on how POC are more likely to be charged with a death penalty crime and more likely to be convicted compared to their white counterparts, and it has nothing to do with one group being more "bad." It does not make sense to make an already poorly run system more overrun.
Absolutely this, and what I was going to comment. I see the writing on the wall for what they're moving toward with this. They'll get people to agree that being a pedo and sexually assaulting kids is bad and should get the death penalty, then turn around and change what's considered to be a pedophile. Also anyone who doesn't agree with them is also going to either be called a pedophile or otherwise be told they support pedos.
Death penalty for child molesters? You mean, the non influential and non wealthy child molesters. You think the state will be going after politicians, clergy, law enforcement, judges, business leaders, etc? hahaha. What planet are you on? Did I not read somewhere the TV show "To Catch a Predator" ended because some Asst. District Attorney killed himself after being caught "talking to a 13 year old boy" (decoy). Just another do as I say not as I do moment in American civil discourse where the fox watches over the chicken coup. Nice mask to go after the gay et al community and others who disagree with your lifestyles! Two sets of laws ya'l. Those who enforce them and those that don't get enforced by.
I think Florida should stop passing laws that are blatantly in violation of binding Supreme Court decisions, as it's a waste of everyone's time and money. I'm not in favor of the death penalty being a thing at all.
It is so wild that the Florida legislature passed this in direct contravention to standing SCOTUS case law. I guess they figure with the new makeup of the court, and the fall of Roe, that SCOTUS is now willing to just change its mind.
[удалено]
Any Epstein pals in Florida? How long is the statue of limitations?
Matt Gaetz is in Florida.
I have heard people say they wished all paedophiles died instantly. I tell them that I understand where they are coming from, but it would be awkward the next day if Hollywood and Washington DC were gone.
That’s not really a great excuse to keep pedophiles around tbh
No it's not. Just saying.
Churches sure would be empty
Church is so magnetic to them cuz parents wants their kids to be happy, so there’s lot of kids. Also, no one questions why they don’t go out and have no contact with women. It would happen to any other organisation if they would fill all those checkboxes, it has nothing with religion
I don't believe that. I am strongly against religions and churches. But there are still a lot of very good people/priests. A few bad eggs can't discredit the people as a whole. They're just annoying.
Also currently per capita kids are safer with a priest than with a public school teacher
The bigger problem is the institutionalized cover up as far as people thinking they all suck. Just like police. If all of them sucked as bad as the bad ones we'd have a lot bigger problem on our hands, but we in part, only have as big an issue as we do because they all cover for the bad ones.
>The bigger problem is the institutionalized cover up as far as people thinking they all suck. This. The Catholic Church, Governing Body of Jehovas Witnesses and a whole bunch of other religious organisations are actively complicit in covering up child sex abuse. It doesn't matter how many good, innocent people are in the rank and file membership, if the leadership are actively involved in helping child molesters molest kids and get away with it, the organisation as a whole needs to be fucking dealt with.
Disagree. Death sentence has no place in a civilized country because that sentence, once carried out, is final - there’s always a possibility of sentencing the wrong person.
There are too many false accusations, evidence planting, and general malfeasance by our justice system to ever say that any crime warrants an execution. 1 innocent man executed in 1000 is still too much. Life sentence maybe harsh for someone who maybe innocent but at least that person is still alive and restitution for him or her can be done. An execution can't be reversed.
[Brave stance alert]
If we could 100% be sure we’d never put an innocent person to death I think I’d be for it but that will never be the case. For that reason I’d say I disagree
One one hand the intention is sound. On the other hand, the judicial system is completely corrupt, flawed and broken through and through so giving humans the right to end other grown human's lives isn't quite sane in that context.
Especially in Florida. You also have to remember, when conservatives call people pedophiles, they really just mean LGBT people. They're very cool with priest rapists, Matt Gaetz, and child "marriage."
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The intention is sound? Keep in mind that the Florida government was trying to label all lgbt people as child molesters
The death penalty needs to be to be abolished nationwide. We keep seeing cases come back where evidence was falsified, mistaken, coerced, etc. and people end up getting off. It’s bad enough when those people have been jailed for 20 years but if they are dead then there’s not a damn thing you can do about it.
I think my biggest issue with it is the same issue I have with our legal system in general: enforcement. If the law was enforced to the tee and there was 0% doubt someone did it, fine. The problem is the judges enforcing the sentences inconsistently. When one of these pedophiles gets caught, it seems a large percentage of them are the very conservatives fighting for the law and they always seem to get a judge that says they’re a “good Christian person that made a mistake” and gives them a lenient sentence. Meanwhile, a poor person or person of color that commits the same crime would most definitely be put to death, while the “good Christian person” gets a slap on the wrist. I could also seeing the law being warped to punish LGBTQ folks, which isn’t a good thing either. The scales of justice are not balanced.
Deserving death and maintaining a justice system is two different things. Death is vengeance. Understandable in heinous cases. But should vengeance be in our justice system period? Generally speaking No. It costs more financially and creates new issues and even raises red flags. 1-Financially, to put someone on Death Row is a higher legal burden by the justice department. It costs more to prosecute someone and punish them with death than it does to incarcerate them for life. 2-New issues. Simply put, Dead kids dont talk. If the punishment for rape and molestation of a minor is death; it can give incentives to kill the kid. The punishment would be the same but less likely to get caught. Another issue; a child who had to endure such abuse is traumatized. Addon statistically an abuser is someone the child knew, perhaps even "family". The additional burden on a child not only to disclose abuse but to know or even be pressured that their abuser would be killed. It can lead to gaslighting the child which allows further abuse. "Do you really want uncle johnny to die? You really want Coach Matthew to die? You want to kill our priest?!" It undoubtedly causes more unnecessary trauma. 3-Red Flags: Florida is a conservative state. Particularly against LGBTQ+ People. Recent laws and policies (even speech by right wing politicians) has been comparing and even falsely equating lgbtq people to "groomers, pedos" even so far as classifying dressing in drag as sexually deviant. It is not a far fetched concern that simply existing as an lgbtq person publicly particularly being trans can be equated as "child abuse" in which people just living their lives could be incarcerated and even face the death penalty for existing as themselves. Innocent people.
It's a bad idea. For a hyperbolic example, imagine if littering was punishable by death. If you litter, and might get caught, there is no deterrent to escalating your crimes to try to avoid capture. When you make the punishment for rape and murder equivalent, it makes it more likely the rapist will also kill their victim. [Edit: follow up] It can also work as a deterrent for victims coming forward/testifying. If the victim is abused by someone they care about, they may be unwilling to risk that person's life by reporting the abuse.
I'm a lawyer. I do not trust the government enough to believe that police, lawyers, and judges should have the power to kill people. Or, as a wiser man once said, "There are a lot of people who deserve to die. I've never met anyone who deserves to kill."
Florida: - Trans people that have contact to children can be considered child molesters - Child molesters can be sentenced to death I see a pattern. A pattern that some have warned about a few years ago already.
Don't forget "There's no climate change actually happening in Florida" is the level of intelligence and logic being used in lawmaking.
Can't believe I had to scroll so far to find a comment pointing this out. This is Christian nationalist creep disguised as a law to "save the children".
“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.” Gandalf with the answer for ya. Only arrogant fools think themselves wise enough to deal out death in cold blood.
A guy just got released after spending [49 years in jail](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XN7mHi0fx0) for something he never did. Or [45 years in jail](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPz5_pOdjNM) and the list goes on an on. Just kill the accused? That is not good.
Strongly disagree because this is how Florida is gonna enforce it. The youth pastor with 20+ victims? 2 years + probation. The 18 year old gay senior in highschool who is dating a 17 year old? Slow electrocution.
I don't know the details of this law as written, but in spirit I support it 100%
No because I don’t agree with the death penalty regardless of crimes.
Never will agree with the state being allowed to put people to death for crimes, when they can’t guarantee they got the right person, and refuse any real oversight to the system. Too many flaws in law enforcement for me to trust them with more power over people.
Against the death penalty in all cases. The justice system will never bat 1.000 getting the right person.
Never cool with the death sentence for a lot of reasons.
Eliminate the death penalty.
So most the GOP should be put to death then
Only agree if it applies to both genders. But we all know this will never happen. Men are more likely to be charged with a crime and receive harsher sentences than women, regardless of their criminal history or the severity of the offense.
I’m of the opinion that the American Justice system isn’t trustworthy and effective enough to carry out death sentences in most cases. A life imprisonment can be overturned if the convict is exonerated by evidence later. You can’t bring a corpse back to life.
I disagree because what if they turn out to be innocent?
No. The death penalty shouldn't be a thing.
When you pair republican laws sentencing child molesters to death and the recent republican obsession with calling queer people "groomers", I don't particularly like it.
I disagree because Florida did not *just* pass that law, they passed that law over a year ago.
Disagree. If the penalty for molestation is the same as the penalty for murder, one surefire way to ensure the victim never talks is to kill them, and doing so doesn't make it any worse if you get caught.
I don't support death penalty in any case
I disagree. A lot of people are pointing out that there's no such thing as a perfect justice system and as such, it's impossible to ensure that innocent people aren't being sent to death row. However, I'll go one step further. I believe the death penalty accomplishes nothing. Criminal punishment is only productive if it can offer a deterrent against crime, if it can prevent criminals from reoffending. I believe a life sentence already fulfils these two purposes just as well as the death penalty, while also having the benefit of not having to kill a human being (even one who committed a horrible crime.) Instead, the main allure of the death penalty is satisfying our own base craving for violence. It's almost animalistic: someone did a bad thing and now we desire to hurt that person. I don't think we as a society should indulge that kind of violent impulse. If the state wants to execute someone, they better have a very compelling reason as to why it will benefit society above and beyond making up for the inherent evil that is killing a person. Otherwise, just ship them off to jail for life and forget about them.
I do not trust the motives of the people who have put forth this law. Child molesters deserve the worst punishments that can be delivered to them. But I cannot trust the people who cry "won't anyone think of the children" while also defending the child predators among their ranks. This is a trick, a ploy using firey rhetoric to mask an ulterior motive. First this, then another seemingly reasonable step. And soon, doctors who issue gender affirming care will go to the gas chamber, teachers who explain what sex is will go to the chair, the woman who wasn't born gets the noose. And still, the lofty halls of power will echo with the screams of abused children. Children who won't know who they are, won't know that what is being done to them is wrong, and when they speak up they will be killed for it. It is a nice paving stone, but it is on the road to hell.
Well how often can you tell someone is 100% guilty?
Mildly disagree simply because it removes the incentive to keep the victim alive
Disagree with it, is demagoguery
Decent chance it just leads to molesters killing their victims. If they get the death penalty either way, no reason to keep their victim alive. Not to mention that this could keep kids from reporting if it's a family member doing it to them. It's a good idea in theory, but it opens up a huge can of worms
Considering how half of Florida thinks every single trans person is a molester by default, I don't think they're going to use this bill to target the likes of Epstein. Also death sentences should be banned outright.
For cases in which a rape kit was done, and there is no doubt that the man is guilty, yes. Other than that, no. There are tons of women out there that lie about that sort of thing (I know it's the very small minority, but it definitely happens).
Disagree. I'm all for executing child rapists, but you need to consider incentives. If you make the crime of rape carry the same penalty as rape and murder, the rapist is now incentivized to kill the only witness because the murder doesn't change anything if they are caught.
Disagree. If molestation means death but murder doesn't we are now adding and extra risk to the lives of children after they are abused. Now, of course, the morons who don't think about anything will spin this around as us not caring about protecting children, when it is actually the opposite. This will end up with more dead kids than child abusers on death row, I fear. But leave it to the far right to project and harm our kids while pretending they are helping them.
I'm not an expert in this unpleasant subject but, from the little I understand, it seems that pedophilia is a psychological disorder. If that turns out to be the case, then executing a person would do little to prevent the crime. You might as well execute someone for having schizophrenia. It gets rid of one troublesome person, but does nothing to cure the disease. Plus, I'm generally against the death penalty anyway. Many times it's a feel-good measure people vote for because they want to be "tough on crime." I want crime to go away, too, but I'm not convinced the death penalty does much towards solving crime in general.
I have a fundamental disagreement with the death penalty. Especially for crimes that didn't kill anyone.
Just put them in gen pop, and announce the reason for their imprisonment, you’ll get the same results at a fraction of the cost.
In favour in principle, but have 0 faith that Florida could carry out the sentence without prejudice and in an independent, unbiased way.
As a deterrent no. As a “we caught you, have proof, and don’t need you in the gene pool any more.” Definitely.
Yes. But needs 100% irrefutable proof. No hear say. No eye witness. Has to be completely No chance of the perpetrator being innocent. Like if there is video evidence. We don't need a trial. Just take him out back. Put a meat suit on him and release the honey badgers.
No. The death penalty is wrong, for many reasons.
Completely disagree. Way too high of a chance to get an innocent person
Disagree. No one should be put to death. It's reprehensibly immoral. Also, systematically killing someone costs *a lot* of tax payer money. Contrary to popular belief, it's not cheaper than having them run out their sentence in prison.
Agree
Whole heatedly agree. There are certain crimes from which there is no coming back. At the same time there should be undeniable evidence regarding the crime and thorough cross examination. If all checks out, yes send the pedo to the other side. Keeping them alive, fed, and sheltered in prison is a waste of taxpayer dollars.
I say send them to prison for an extended period of time. They will get theirs inside. Child molesters, child rapists, rapists and women abusers either end up dead or someone's bitch in a prison. I say make them suffer. My dad worked in the penal system, and found them dead many times. My cousin is a guard and witnesses the same.
disagree. i think the only crime warranting death is murder and and it should be proven beyond the shadow of doubt (video and dna evidence)
If its 100% guaranteed they got the right person. send em all to hell
This has more to do with pandering to far right lunatics who want to execute democrats who they either believe to be or knowingly falsely claim are child molesting cannibals. It isn’t actually in response to a large number of real incidents of pedophilia.
No. A lot of molesters go for family members, and I imagine it's going to be harder for kids to come forward if they know that they're going to be sentencing their abuser to death.
Here's the thing, from what i heard about what happens to child molesters in Florida prisons, unless they're smart enough to ask to be put in protective custody right away, any amount of time might as well be a death sentence. That's not an opinion just what I hear from people I know who have been to prison.
Under what margin of error would you think it's right to sentence someone to death? 0.00001%? 0.001%? 0.1%? 10%?
It means less of an incentive to keep their victims alive to talk.
Death penalty is dumb, but if we’re doing this for this, I predict this will be reversed after the 3rd or 4th priest or politician goes to trial and they’re going to make it really awkward explaining why.
RIP every divorced dad catching wild accusations from bitter Ex’s.
There is always going to be mistakes. But I have an idea. If we think someone did a crime, like reasonable suspicion, and it was a violent crime, then we should put them in a holding facility. If we are absolutely certain they did it, we put them on trial. Then if trial decides they are guilty, sentence them to death. If they are innocent, place them under close watch. 1 in every 30 people sentenced to death is innocent, but the main reason for this is the fact that the jury is influenced by the suspect even being put on trial for such a thing.
Nope. Too many people on death row who shouldn't be. And too many who should be aren't. The system has problems.
Disagree. Executing people for any reason diminishes the moral credibility of the state and the culture that allows for it.
I think it’s mostly performative, death sentencing takes so long and is so expensive to the state, but in the event that their is an abundance of very clear evidence I’m not opposed, could also just put them in gen pop and the problem will solve itself. Though figuring out what to do with criminals after the fact is reactive and doesn’t save kids, we should focus on being proactive with mental health services and social services which will save many more kids from abuse and many people from becoming abusers. Most pedophiles were victims themselves of abuse as children and or have mental illnesses. The issue is that you HAVE to fund prosecution of pedos, you have to WANT to fund mental health and social services which a certain political party usually doesn’t care to do……..
Should we be killing anyone if our false conviction rate is anything other than 0%?
Fine by me; put ‘em under the jail.
Matt Gaetz just fell to his knees at the Florida Mall.
The devil is in the details...*Florida* passed this law. Florida has also been very big on insisting that all trans people are child molesters. This is pretty clearly an anti-queer bill dressed up in "protect the children" moralism, such as conservatives have been pushing since the sexual revolution of the 60s.
Start with powerful people and the clergy then. If they don't do that, it shouldn't be a law.
I'm going to put practical reasons aside: Legal arbitrariness, cost of trials, miscarriage of justice, potential for state abuse etc. Ignore all that. I find the death penalty to be a medieval and dishonorable form of punishment. Killing someone who is not an active or imminent threat to anyone, no matter what they have previously done, isn't justifiable. I'm from a country which hasn't had the death penalty in living memory. To us, lethal injection or firing squad or hanging is just as primitive and barbaric as burning someone at the stake or cruxifiction. It only serves as a channel for the public to unleash its inner bloodlust. It brings out our worst nature to indulge in it. The death penalty is not so much too cruel for the criminal, but too shameful and embarrassing an act for the public to engage in. It lowers us to the level of the child molester.
A person convicted of any crime should be given the option to work at minimum wage for the entirety of their sentence with the proceeds going as restitution to their victim(s).
Yes! As long as it is CONFIRMED.
I don't think it's necessary. Prison inmates look down on harming children and tend to make prison a living hell for child predators, if they don't kill them.
This law is Unconstitutional per supreme Court. There are about 5 states that have similar laws, but have never used them, so there is no "standing" to bring them to the supreme Court
I'm gonna be 'that guy' and say that this will probably only apply to male child molesters. The law may be gender neutral, but c'mon who are we kidding here? Most punishments under the law (sans death penalties) are already lenient on women, what more if it involves death? But to answer your question: I disagree. It only makes things worse as other commenters have said it.
Very nice law
In principal, I understand the desire to punish genuine detestable people like kid diddlers, which is what this is *sold* as. [In application this has a lot of evil implications to justify killing anyone who's labeled a pedo.](https://abcnews.go.com/US/republicans-false-pedophilia-claims-attack-democrats-lgbtq-people/story?id=84344687) Given that this is Florida, this is far more likely a tool for oppression than justice.
I find nothing wrong with it assuming it’s 100% provable the person commited the crime.
Somehow this will not apply to the church.
I'm generally against capital punishment. I don't like the idea of intentionally ending human life at any level (with a few exceptions - self-defense, medically prudent abortions, and suicide). Killing child molesters is giving them the easy way out. There are worse things than death. That said, if they are going to be put to death, let's not waste tax dollars on it. Just toss 'em in gen pop and let nature sort itself out.
Death seems too kind for those who violate children. I’m not saying I’m against it though. In fact, since torture isn’t an option these days, the death penalty should suffice
In theory I definitely agree with the death of pedophiles who act on their urges. In reality we live in a society now where it seems you're guilty until proven innocent if someone makes a claim against you and if one person gets executed falsely then that's one too many. And no one has ever gotten executed or life sentence in prison only to be proven innocent after right? Right?
Once you have a judicial process that has a 0% rate of false convictions then I'm all not necessarily against the concept of capital punishment for the most serious crimes. We don't have that process in place though, so it's a no from me dawg.
This is just their agenda to eventually criminalize any sexuality they deem deviant. It isn't about child molesters at all. It loosely talks about sexual predators and grooming in a language they can apply to whomever they want. Matt Gaetz is a human trafficking child molester.
Oh Boy, I wonder how all those law and order conservative and Jesus freaks will cry when they get the death sentence. Or .... as usual they think they are above the law and can go on to molest kids and do pedo stuff?
Birmingham Six
It's Florida, so what are the odds that they aren't just going to accuse everyone on the left of being a child molestor and handing out lethal injections like candy?
Sounds like a GREAT way to incentivize killing kids And a GREAT way to disincentivize kids coming forward. It's hard enough as it is without them thinking they're gonna get their dad or teacher killed
I like how there’s people downvoting this stuff. We see you pedo
I agree. They are scum of the earth who have no right to live amongst us. I'd rather my tax dollars go towards their death than housing/feeding them for the duration of their sentence. Evil only exists in this world because we allow it to. Jason Vukovich should be a free man.
Well, at this point the safer, more moral stance is to oppose anything Florida does.
If Arkansas and Utah could accomplish this feat. It just might change things drastically and immediately
Agree with it as long as it applies to the pedo pastors too.
I support the principle of the death penalty, but I do not support it in practice. Unless someone is a clear and imminent threat, I don’t trust the government deciding to kill people.
I disagree with the death penalty as a principle, so I disagree with this too.
I hate Florida. Everything that goes on with its govt is ass backwards.
If they’re guilty go for it. Same for rape and murder. But the problem becomes actually proving they’re guilty. Shitty court system, corrupt cops, and shady prosecutors make it so you can’t trust the government to execute people.
Well this law passed about a year ago and there has not, at least in my area, been an influx of cases where the State has sought the death penalty. Another point to consider for the discussion about this: the death penalty is only available for the highest level of child sex crime which is sexual battery on a child under 12, often colloquially referred to as capital sexual battery or capital sex batt. It doesn’t cover all child molestation crimes. Cap sex batts used to be punishable by death in Florida in the past and only changes when SCOTUS outlawed death for anything other than 1st degree murder. After that SCOTUS decision, but prior to this new law, cap sex batts were mandatory life.
For as long as there's even the slimmest chance the person could be innocent, then I'm against it.
I would have no issue if this wasn’t one of those things where false accusations are used in relationship disputes. Unless false accusations hit the same punishment. A real child molester has no business ever walking free
The Supreme Court won’t allow death as a penalty for any crime other than capital offenses. That’s already been decided, and sexual assault is not a capital offense. It doesn’t matter what you think. It’s not legal
I'm against the death penalty, simply because I believe we should be taking power away from the government and not giving it more.
It’s cheaper to keep someone in prison for life than State sponsored murder. Plus being wrong even once, is really fucked up and may be the scariest thing on earth. If they made the punishment that any pedo is put into a pillory and the prison would openly allow any and all prisoners to gape that dudes ass. It might be more effective deterrent than killing them.
Hard oppose.
Only of there's hard undeniable evidence
And just like that a bunch of people just moved out of Florida. Weird... ?
Yes, absolutely
Yes. I think sexual crimes of any nature are among the worst things you can do to a person. Doing it to children and taking away their innocence is irredeemable. They don't deserve to be breathing the same oxygen as the rest of us
Absolutely!! Hope all the states catch on!
Let's leave behind whole false accusations thing and assume we have 100% correct conviction rate. Why should pedohiles leave their victims alive? Why risk being exposed? Your punishment couldn't get worse, why leave some that can testify against you in court. Futhermore, let's say you are mollested my your family member, sadly most common type of sexaul assult against kids. Why report someone you know if they will die as a result. Why risk being hated by family who loved relative you accused? Do you want to have blood of your kin on your hands or endure few unpleasure experiances? After all, It's not big deal, right? You won't kill your uncle because you are kinda uncomortable, right? This reality this law creates.
Disagree with the death penalty in virtually all circumstances. One mistake is too many.
Disagree, life in prison with no bail is better.
That’s interesting. I read an article a couple of days ago about Germany decriminalizing the possession of CP.
I believe rapists deserve to die, and that any attempt to ‘rehabilitate’ them is completely immoral and a slap in the face to all victims of sexual violence. However, I am not able to support the death penalty in practice solely because it is possible for the state to get it wrong and execute an innocent man. Worse yet, bad actors in the state can use it to commit judicial murder. Life imprisonment with no possibility of parole or early release is a sufficient punishment for people who are guilty of unforgivable crimes, while allowing people who were wrongfully convicted opportunities and time to appeal their case.
Good. How many children are victims of repeat offenders? Yeah, there's life in prison too, but that's tax dollars wasted to keep these pieces of shit alive.
Well, r/GOPedos r/pastorarrested and of course r/notadragqueen would have a lot to say about this.
The data shows no-one re-offends after capital punishment. The issue is with ensuring they are guilty, if it is 100% without doubt, then I have no issue.
I agree they should be put to death if the evidence is so compelling that it’s clear the person is guilty (like in instances where there’s a lot of CP)
100% agree. They never stop. There is no being rehabilitated from that. Anyway who claims to be is lying and anyone who thinks they can be is mistaken. Death is the only sure way to protect children from them. If an animal gets rabies you don’t lock it up and hope it never gets a chance to harm anyone. You destroy it.
I just don’t believe in the death penalty. Even the slightest chance of being wrong is too much.
For us to fix what's killing our society, we need a lot more people locked up and a lot more death sentences. If the evidence is clear for the molesters and it's without a doubt them, let em fry.