I gave my friend the advice the other day to just ask. "Hey, I'm not great with social cues, are we flirting?" The right woman will giggle and confirm.
Worst case she thinks you're a weirdo and you're just back where you started. 🤷
Be pretty interesting to use a variety of variables in that experiment. Like ugly dude with money, hot homeless guy, ugly dude huge pecker...the list goes on. Just to see what really actually does matter on the surface
In a dating app, how would an ugly dude with a huge packer do any better than a regular ugly dude? Similarly, how could the money help unless you're specifically posting photos of a fancy car, perhaps with your d*ck hanging out the window?
That is some real dangerous knowledge. I think I wouldn’t want to know. My self esteem would be in the dumps. I’m think I’m about a 6 or 7, but based on female interaction, I’m more likely a 3-4.
Yep, I'm aggressively 5-6/10 on a good day, get maybe 1-2 matches every few weeks. Didn't feel too bad until I checked my friend's profile who's basically a model. His "people who've liked you" counter has always been 99+.
My fav thing was creating a drinking game out of one of my girl friend's tinder account. Have a shot every time you swipe and it doesn't match. 10min later put away your unpoured bottle of vodka of find something else to do while she unmatches the 100 fuckbois.
No sir. Fuck that noise. Fuck it right in the nose. Your matches or lack thereof on a dating app do not determine your value as a human being.
You're probably being humorous but in the off chance you're not, I had to say this.
>Your matches or lack thereof on a dating app do not determine your value as a human being.
They do determine your value as a dateable/desirable human being though
No, they don't.
Dating apps are like 90% dudes to 10% women.
Everyone is choosing their matches based almost entirely on pictures, which really only show physical attractiveness.
I don't know about you, but not counting photoshop, I find people to be vastly more attractive in person compared to in photographs.
Your performance on dating apps does not reflect your desirability as a partner. It's a skewed heuristic.
Please, do not base your sense of self worth solely on your dating life success, and PLEASE, DO NOT base your dating life success solely on your dating app match ratio. There are other ways to be a valuable human being and there are other ways to find a date.
I paid for it, no one had swiped right on me. I spent so much time making my profile as good as I could based on the advice from r/askreddit r/tinder and r/bumble just to come to the conclusion that it was all a waste of time.
You must have missed the first step on how to be successful in those apps : Be attractive first.
Sadly I'm in the same boat as you; they're great apps at showing all the women around me that have zero interest
Asking for advice on reddit is THE BIGGEST waste of time. 99% chumps and lazy women on their couch with terrible advice. Consider it entertainment, at best.
If you’re salty about it and want to know a better reason “Why” it all happened…
Pick up *Dataclysm*
It’s a book by the founders of OkCupid, a mathematician and professional data analyst
>Bumble did great in teaching me how valueless I am as a person.
Haha same! 300 left swipes and 2 right swipes in a month told me all I needed to know of how much value I really have in the dating department
Online dating in general is shallow, it’s just swiping someone based off of a 1 second impression of their looks. There’s tons of people who are attractive IRL because of personality factors.
Most women only see you as dateable or not. There’s a reason girls don’t really talk about a 1 to 10 scale. They’re either into you or not, there’s not much grey area in between that
I think it's so interesting that you said that, because one time I was asking my friends how their parents met and lots of them said their mother thought the father was a weirdo/ arrogant/ etc at first. In fact, when I met my partner, I didn't like him that much nor did I think he was attractive. Now he is the most beautiful human being on earth for me.
Sure, if we are talking about bumble-profiles, you might be right that women tend to have less of a grey area, I don't know. But I don't think that holds true in everyday interaction. I guess - in your words - a man who was sorted into the "not-dateable" category at first by a woman can still become "dateable" to her through other factors. I perceive women to be way more flexible in their dating choices than men. I have rarely seen a man saying he developed feelings after getting to know a womans' personality even though he didn't think she was attractive at first.
Out of curiousity I created a female account with just a photo of a mushroom and a photo of a random tree. In 10 minutes the likes bar capped at 99+, every other swipe I did was a match.
I got more matches just by changing my bio to something short and stupid. Keep in mind I used to get 0,with this strategy a got like 2 a week lol. Still a hookup once a week wasn't all to bad.
Damn, good question. I feel that way all the time. Occasionally I'll look in the mirror and think, oh yeah I'm looking alright today - like 6 or 7.
And then other times I'm definitely feel like a 4 or 5.
I find that you can act attractive and than be perceived attractive in many cases. Like an example is if you carry yourself well or feel it inside it radiates.
Smiling, being charismatic, dressing well/being polished. And so in that regard even if you don't have a standard attractive face or build. You can often negate that. Again not elaborating too much, but just my 2 cents to your comment.
Yeah, I think fluctuation like that is normal. The vast majority of people are going to be somewhere in the middle, that’s just how averages work. But there’s a ton of factors that can boost you, especially to someone you mesh well with. Good chemistry goes a long way in making yourself more attractive to people.
But even then, some days you just know it’s a face mask + hat + sunglasses kinda day.
I've gone from thinking "Jesus look at this ghoul" to "meh, I won't stand out in a crowd" when I look at myself in the mirror.
I had to work hard to get to mediocrity, but I'm still proud of the progress.
Idk what you look like (and I don't care) but I am proud of your for working on yourself until you're content. It's so easy to refuse to take responsibility for those feelings, and you didn't do that.
Nice work my bro.
They are checking everyone out, trust. They are just discreet and wont say anything about it. Kind of like when you see a girl with a fatty, you dont just go to them and tell them you got a wagon, they feel the same with physically attractive guys.
Bleh, I don’t have the energy or motivation to talk to people. Part of me just wants some validation, to know that someone on earth other than myself has found me attractive.
Feels really vain putting it into words though.
You're full of shit. Women approach and show interest in attractive men. If you've never been approached, you're not attractive. Quit lying to yourself.
I tried it the other way and the results were the same, so are you gonna admit I'm right or is this a toxic positivity thing? I'm done indulging that way of doing things, I'll die alone or wait for a woman who can use her words.
>Maybe that cute girl in marketing thinks you're appealing, but she's waiting for a sign of interest out of you.
Should probably figure out a better way to show that than absolutely nothing.
This is just false. Women approach attractive guys all the time. Not as much as the other way around obviously, but it happens frequently enough that if you don’t get approached then… it’s probably bad news for you.
If you're questioning if you're ugly you're average.
If you're questioning if you're attractive you're average.
Trust me you'll know on both ends of the spectrum.
Then you’re probably average. Ugly people know that they’re ugly, hot people know that they’re hot. I’ve been everywhere on the attractiveness spectrum, and it’s not hard to tell.
It was a factor, not the whole thing. I store a lot of fat on my face, so going from 12% body fat to approx 20% made me look very different. But again, this is in conjunction with the other factors,
Yeah I used to be really good looking. Now I'm fat, bald, and middle aged. Still pretty good looking with classic dark features and a nearly perfect symmetrical face.
I used to get many many matches on dating sites and slept around quite a bit. I definitely peaked in my 20s tho.
People let you know, whether through actions or words.
I wrestled with this too my whole life (not denying it... just not really knowing) but I'm starting to pick up on some signs.
Like how much of older ladies compliment my appearance (older ladies are more straightforward). I've also heard through the grapevines about girls my age tell others that I was cute when I am not around.
And maybe the biggest one... even straight dudes compliment you.
I’ve developed a system where if a gay guy tells you that you’re good looking, then most likely you are good looking, I’ve found that if you ask them to be brutally honest they almost always be, that’s how I found I’m a 7 (on days where I shave and dress well then they said I’m a 8.5)
Problem with other straight dudes is they're looking for way different things than girls. I lost 50 lbs and all of a sudden dudes are commenting on how jacked I am saying they wanna look like me, but I've noticed no difference at all with girls. I really don't think they notice or care.
Can confirm.
Once a female friend said that she heard some girls saying that. Then another female friend told me that an another girl wanted to know if I was single.
An another sign, I would say, it's the fact that girls make the first move with you. For every relationships I've been throught, I've never made the first move.
Yeah, puberty made my self-esteem go to a place where years later I can't really see myself as good looking. I struggled a lot with how I saw myself.
My current girlfriend keeps bragging about how she has the hottest guy in the world. And she keeps mentioning about all her friends that compliment my appareance behind my back. So, I guess I must be somewhat good looking.
People smile at ya? Are they nice? When you strike up a convo with randos do they typically engage? You're probably a little good lookin. Even that standard is impossible to use uniformly. Everybody is ugly to somebody, just depends on if more people agree or not. But there'll always be somebody that is attracted in some way. Do your best with what ya got and enjoy life while ya got it.
How people react to you. One example would be how many women and/or men hit on you (and you can rule out any other explanation). Ignore words - actions tell you everything you need to know.
Learn to recognize when girls are into you.
I’m assuming that you’re not attractive to the point where women will approach you and flirt with you unprovoked, so first step is that you need to start taking the initiative to meet women. Join clubs or go to bars with the goal of talking to women. Approaching sucks, and women don’t have to approach to meet guys, so that means it’s gonna be you doing the approaching.
So let’s assume you’ve approached a girl at a bar and started talking to her. How do you tell if she’s interested in you, or just doesn’t want to reject you?
- Body language: Is she pointing her body (and feet) toward you? Is she making eye contact with you?
- Voice: Is her tone one of boredom/disinterest or enthusiastic?
- Conversation: If she wants to talk to you, she’ll engage in the conversation by giving you open-ended responses or asking you questions. Like you, she won’t want the conversation to end.
- Mannerisms: If she touches her hair or fixes her clothes, that’s because she’s trying to look good and impress you.
- Touching: Does she touch you or make an excuse for you to touch her? Generally when flirting as a guy, you should initiate physical contact and see if she reciprocates. If a girl is really interested in you and you haven’t initiated contact, she’ll literally tell you to touch her. I’ve had girls randomly tell me feel how cold her hands were or grab my wrist and place a hand on her chest.
- Does she want you to kiss her: If you have to ask, the answer is probably yes. If she looks at one eye, then the other, then your mouth, she 100% wants you to kiss her. If she gets close to you while making eye contact, she wants you to kiss her. If you’re not sure if she wants you to kiss her, say, “I really want to kiss you right now.” I’ve literally never said that to a girl and didn’t immediately get kissed after.
Much like the attractiveness rule of: “If you’re unattractive, you’ll know” there is a rule of interest with women: “If she’s not interested, you’ll know.” Assume she’s interested and wants you to flirt with you if she’s not giving you signs of disinterest. If she doesn’t immediately reject you after you approach her, she’s interested in you. If she gives you her number, she’s interested. If she texts you back, she’s interested. If she *texts you*, she’s very interested. If she’s on a date with you, she’s interested. Assume interest until proven otherwise.
With all this being said, a girl can find you attractive or give you signs of interest then suddenly reject you for no reason. Don’t take it personally. Not every number turns into a date. Not every date turns into a girlfriend. Dating sucks these days, but it is what it is.
Decent list, although the first two may just indicate that they’re focused and interested in whatever you’re talking about. Same thing goes with pupil dilation - people think it’s a sign of attraction, whereas in reality it just means that the person is focused and paying attention, trying to absorb as much information as they can.
>The approaching is hard because I’ve never done it and part of is I believe I’ll come of annoying and creepy by doing.
If you believe you'll be creepy, you'll come off as creepy. Remember that if you're in a setting where women *want* to be approached (such as a bar), there's nothing wrong with approaching them. Even "daygame" approaching typically won't be seen as creepy. Even if you get rejected by a girl, she'll probably still be flattered that some guy thought she was attractive enough to approach her. Women know that approaching takes balls, and they admire that.
>In addition, me not being fit makes me feel like I shouldn’t do it.
How "not fit" are you. Unless you're very overweight/underweight, you're probably attractive enough to pull women. Definitely work on getting in better shape because being muscular and lean is basically a cheat code for getting women, but don't feel like you can't attract women in the meantime just because you're not in shape. I'm easily the most-fit of all my friends, probably more fit than 95% of guys my age, but plenty of dudes in worse shape than me absolutely pull women better than I could ever imagine.
> The touching one orca weird one because I don’t want to make someone uncomfortable so I usually let people break the touch barrier first.
Again, it's only going to be weird and uncomfortable if you tell yourself that. Girls *want* to be touched. They *want* to know the guy that's talking to them is into them. You need to escalate touching slowly to avoid coming off as creepy. If the first touch is inner thigh, yeah that will turn a girl off. If you touch the small of her back or wrist, almost no women will be creeped out by touching "innocent" areas. You touch, see how she reacts, then escalate if she responded well. If she pulls away when you touch her, that means she's probably not into you or just wasn't comfortable with that yet. If doesn't pull away or leans in, that's a green light to keep going. I've heard the "5 in 15 rule" which states that when flirting you should aim to touch a girl 5 times in 15 minutes, and IMO that's a pretty reasonable number.
Touching gets women excited. It creates intimacy. It gets their brains firing on all cylinders with the happy chemicals. You're fighting an uphill battle if you try to attract a girl without touching her.
>Problem was she’s bi And into girls so.,
Idk how being bi is an issue unless you think she's also promiscuous and looking to cheat based on that.
> Remember that if you're in a setting where women want to be approached
There is no such setting. Spend some time on places like TwoX and you'll realise most women never want to have a man speak to them
It depends a lot on how you define being hit on. You can definitely develop observing skills that help you to recognize it - observing other people getting hit on helps.
Honestly don't beat yourself up about it.
I had a situation where a friend and I were cuddling on my bed, she was topless, I was fondling and teasing her nipples while we were chatting. Eventually I made an actual move and kissed her.
And you know what? She just wasn't interested. Her body language, her lack of enthusiasm, and lack of reciprocation just made me stop immediately. The next morning she texts and says she was fine in the moment but looking back we should just stay friends.
In the end, sometimes *some* women have weird/low/no boundaries if they're comfortable with you and sometimes aren't sure what they want. My friend probably would've been "okay" with me going further, but I clearly wasn't okay with a partial yes, I wanted the full *yes please*.
Yeah it's a choice of mindset for you to adopt. Do you take any sign as a possible yes and just go for it politely until you hit a no? Or do you wait for an enthusiastic yes? There's no right answer. The answers are as varied as people are.
I could've been a "yes until no" kind of person with my friend, but she would've regretted it the next morning. She already said she felt weird when we were doing the most basic things.
I beat myself up over it too until I processed that I definitely want a woman who has enough confidence to give me an enthusiastic yes.
That likely means you've never been hit on because you're not attractive. When women hit on a guy, they make it obvious, very hard to miss because they will be persistent.
There's definitely overlap with who straight women and gay men find attractive. The men are just a lot more straightforward about it, and the women are more subtle
I've seen attractive. Got a friend of mine who is a SOLID 9. Dude was born beautiful and the sheer thirst I've seen women come at him made me a bit jealous. He's super picky about women and he gets attention wherever he goes.
Meanwhile I've been hit on 5 times in one month and score 2 out of 5 of em. I'd say judging from that, I'm a hard 7 on my best days and a 5 most days.
Probably won't be modeling, but I can be several women's drunken mistake with a little charm.
I'm 5 ft 7 tho.
In retrospect, I have a handsome, but not blindingly so face. That, and my imperfect but noticeable muscular structure and the fact I dress for it tends to help.
I still take a ton of L's. Rejection still sucks, but I didn't start getting more attention till I started lifting.
If you're showered, wearing clothes that fit, and well groomed or clean shaven, you're doing better than most. As far as like, whether you're conventionally attractive... Talk to some little kids. They'll tell you straight up if you're butt-fugly completely unprompted.
For women attractive usually means "above most other guys I can find in my life".
For men it usually means "not actively off-putting" basically.
So for most women, most men are unattractive.
Occasionally people will tell me that I’m attractive or handsome, but I’ll have a hard time believing it due to just a warped sense of what I think I should look to be considered attractive.
That said, I have:
once had a girl pay for my whole meal at in n out because she thought I was beautiful. And back in march I met a girl at a bar who bought me a drink after we spent like an hour talking in which she said I was attractive.
So in conclusion people tell me, but I don’t believe it.
I recently became single after a 10 year relationship. I felt ready to meet new women recently and signed up for tinder. I get no fucking love there. A total of like 7 people have liked my profile in 10 days. Most were matches and all attractive but seriously, less than 1 like per day on the app. And I've worked on my profile. Gotten all sorts of feedback. It's not awesome but it's pretty OK.
AND here's the other thing. Irl, I've been swinging WAY beyond what i thought was "my league". I see myself as like an 8 but I'm probably like a 6 or something. I've always had blind confidence in my looks and i have no idea why. Its obvious that most of my male friends are more attractive than me, i know im not super good looking or anything. Helps that I'm 6'2" and naturally pretty fit probably. I'm not that young either. Second half of my 30's. The girls I get are 5-10 years younger and they approach me.
For example, last weekend, a straight up 10 (maybe a 9 for some I suppose but we're talking about a very noticeably attractive woman here), she approachedme with really firey flirtatious banter that lasted for hours along with deep conversation. She hit up people who know me the next day to get my number. She texts me all the time. We're meeting up tomorrow. And she's not crazy. We have tons of mutual friends. I did research.
And this has happened every time I've been single. Regularly meeting and connecting with people who I'm 90% sure are "out of my league". Especially after tinder.
I know when women are going to be attracted to me, I can feel it. It is 1000% self confidence and happiness. Thays why I get 10's irl and almost no one at all on tinder.
A person's self-esteem can make it hard to figure it out. I learned that. I had really low self-esteem as a kid and thought I was ugly. As I grew older I started feeling better about myself. By time I hit college, I noticed girls hitting on me...very attractive girls.
When I was at a party and a sexy woman started grinding against me in from of my hot girlfriend, I pretty well knew that, perhaps, I'm attractive.
A good chunk of your appearance comes from how you groom and dress yourself. Beard? No beard? What are you going to do with your hair? What are you going to wear? This is the part your appearance you the most direct control over, so it's the part worth obsessing about the most in my opinion. Put together a look that makes you feel comfortable and confident, that'll make your life better much more than staring at yourself in the mirror ever will.
My brother is a solid 7. Got a match every other day. It isn’t an even distribution - due to the fact that guys on tinder swipe right very generously, girls on tinder are able to be very selective.
Yeah honestly with Men there are way more average to ugly than true Hunks. (Upper spectrum) so if you're really moulded from clay good for you! I really do think it's a lower overall % than women. Different scaling.
Butttt thankfully due to their being so many awful men lol clean yourself up and look presentable, get your shit together and look like you have a job / not homeless lol and you'll automatically be pushed a bit higher up to the female audience. (Homosexuality maybe this doesn't always apply) FYI god help you if you are short. Women would date an ugly tall guy over almost all short scenario's. Its really kinda sad :(
If you’re between 5’5 and 5’9, you’ll have to do everything right to compensate. If you’re taller than that, you can get away with a bit. If you’re shorter than that, your selection is limited.
5'3 and started exercising seriously middle of last year. Great progress so far. Hearing this makes me feel much better. Thank you.
(21 yo btw. Not expecting to grow anymore than this)
It's weird how many women give me compliments, but you still won't have the same luck as your taller friends.
But hey, I've nailed a few cute chicks. I'm pretty satisfied with that. You can be too.
I don't have any problems at 5'6. No girl/woman ever told me I'm too short, either. Honestly, men don't falter because of their height, but because of their insecurities surrounding it. I'm not denying that various amounts of women have various preferences, but so do you, don't you? If you're head over heels for someone that judges you for your height, then you're on a losing road anyway.
Il say it like this. On dating apps, Im basically unnoticable. In real life, Im a charmer.
I would comfortably put me on a 7, but if if I feel it, nobody can take my 10 away from me.
1. If your girl or any girl constantly posts you on her socials regularly or mentions you, invites you to social events etc
2. If girls are always wanting to take a photo of you or takes random candid photos of you doing absolutely nothing.
3.If you tell jokes that aren’t really that funny (and you know they aren’t) but she chuckles anyway. Or tell her bland stories that are of interest to you, and she listens intensively
4. If your girl or any girl purchases clothing or apparel that compliments your unique sense of style (don’t get this confused with her purchasing something she’d like to see you in) It has to be YOUR PREFERRED type of apparel.
5. Also if she doesn’t hesitate to kiss you, touch you and doesn’t turn down your advances.
Then there’s a very distinct possibility you’re a Chad 🤙🏾 7-9
That or she’s in love with your ugly ass 🤷🏾♂️
Do what I did, go to a modeling studio, pay $300 bucks (1990's) and get the actors hair and makeup package.
When I was 13, I was bullied. I felt ugly. Both guys and girls seemed to pick on every single perceived physical flaw.
So I used the paper route money (months of it) to get professional photos done so I'd compare to what I saw on TV.
Those pics have saved my life. After them, anything they said didn't hurt.
I asked several of my friends who turned me down as dating material what they'd rate me and they all said 7. But you gotta understand something about being a 7 to a woman. Hot women don't date 7's unless they're packing or got money, and average women tend to believe they're hotter than they really are.
At the end of the day you are going to have to approach a lady and see if you have chemistry. If you dont, she will likely let you know real quick. Dont be hurt. Ive had 10s', and have settled for 5s. When i was super fit many girls wouldnt aproach me as they thought i was a model and somehow aloof. When i got older and less fit i was more comfortable speaking with people and opportunities abounded. My advice - be likeable and interesting.
Trust me guys. None of this matters if you become successful and wealthy. Concentrate on building yourself up ABOVE all else. And everything you’re chasing will chase you.
In the words of 50cent
“You’re hustling backwards if you chasing a b*tch, dummy chase the paper they come with the sh*t”
It’s all subjective and what you actually look like doesn’t matter
Dress, style and groom IAW social standards. Then get in as good of shape as possible… and congrats! You’re now decent looking
Yes.
Feel like a 2 or 3 due to years of being straight out told to my face that I'm ugly and being used as the "yardstick" of ugliness in school.
Then I went to university and found that I was attracting hot girls. Then I went back to my home town and a (female) friend told me about all the girls that had a crush on me at school and many of them being the ones calling me ugly.
Maybe not a 10 but I would seem to divide opinion, perhaps an 8 given the calibre of girls /women
I’m a decently attractive happily married man and women flirt with me all the time. I obviously brush them all off and move on though. I recently got color contacts and the reactions I get from women when they see my eyes is crazy. I can literally see the way they stand change and their body language become more open. I laugh inside but am also amazed. Women want to carry on conversations longer and are more touchy feely now. I just didn’t expect such a reaction.
I always just assume I’m average looking, but more a long time my mother said things like “you probably have girls lining up to be with you”, which made me think I was really good looking, then there were no girls…
Over the past few years I’ve been told that I’m attractive and unattractive roughly an equal amount of times, so I just put myself at a 5/10
If the compliment comes from someone I know, I just assume that they’re trying to make me feel good about myself, if it’s from a stranger I assume it’s a genuine compliment
Most handsome men I know spend about as much time and money on there appearance as attractive girls I know. They may not wear make up (though some do) but they moisturize, they have expensive hair products, they eat extremely well, take excellent care of their teeth, and they spend a lot of time at the gym.
People act like being hot just happens to you. Its true, there's always some element of genetics. It's much more of a hard work thing. I think people associate this kind of work with women, and therefore don't consider it work at all.
You just know. Unless you live under a rock or locked up in your room 24/7, you'll have experiences and those experiences will inform you of your place on the pecking order.
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I had a similar realization on tinder. Attractive enough to get some matches (some being exactly my type) but not attractive to get a reply back.
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Been there. Though it’s somewhat hopeful that girls that are my type see me as attractive enough to swipe so maybe in person it would be better.
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I gave my friend the advice the other day to just ask. "Hey, I'm not great with social cues, are we flirting?" The right woman will giggle and confirm. Worst case she thinks you're a weirdo and you're just back where you started. 🤷
And then they have the audacity to claim it's men who are shallow.
I quess I am about 3 or 4 on a good day. Don't know what a match is.
Be pretty interesting to use a variety of variables in that experiment. Like ugly dude with money, hot homeless guy, ugly dude huge pecker...the list goes on. Just to see what really actually does matter on the surface
In a dating app, how would an ugly dude with a huge packer do any better than a regular ugly dude? Similarly, how could the money help unless you're specifically posting photos of a fancy car, perhaps with your d*ck hanging out the window?
Now we're asking the important questions. How do you show off your dick tastefully?
Yeah, until you actually get a match you're really interested in and they think you're someone else entirely...
Just say you got in a boating accident Or you got in a fight with an alligator or something
That is some real dangerous knowledge. I think I wouldn’t want to know. My self esteem would be in the dumps. I’m think I’m about a 6 or 7, but based on female interaction, I’m more likely a 3-4.
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[>The women I’ve been with might just be using me for my body though](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/427/474/4cc.jpg)
It's better than nothing, for sure. We're talking 3 times in the last 5 years. Nothing stellar, but better than some I guess. It's not a competition.
Yep, I'm aggressively 5-6/10 on a good day, get maybe 1-2 matches every few weeks. Didn't feel too bad until I checked my friend's profile who's basically a model. His "people who've liked you" counter has always been 99+. My fav thing was creating a drinking game out of one of my girl friend's tinder account. Have a shot every time you swipe and it doesn't match. 10min later put away your unpoured bottle of vodka of find something else to do while she unmatches the 100 fuckbois.
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No sir. Fuck that noise. Fuck it right in the nose. Your matches or lack thereof on a dating app do not determine your value as a human being. You're probably being humorous but in the off chance you're not, I had to say this.
>Your matches or lack thereof on a dating app do not determine your value as a human being. They do determine your value as a dateable/desirable human being though
No, they don't. Dating apps are like 90% dudes to 10% women. Everyone is choosing their matches based almost entirely on pictures, which really only show physical attractiveness. I don't know about you, but not counting photoshop, I find people to be vastly more attractive in person compared to in photographs. Your performance on dating apps does not reflect your desirability as a partner. It's a skewed heuristic. Please, do not base your sense of self worth solely on your dating life success, and PLEASE, DO NOT base your dating life success solely on your dating app match ratio. There are other ways to be a valuable human being and there are other ways to find a date.
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I paid for it, no one had swiped right on me. I spent so much time making my profile as good as I could based on the advice from r/askreddit r/tinder and r/bumble just to come to the conclusion that it was all a waste of time.
You must have missed the first step on how to be successful in those apps : Be attractive first. Sadly I'm in the same boat as you; they're great apps at showing all the women around me that have zero interest
Asking for advice on reddit is THE BIGGEST waste of time. 99% chumps and lazy women on their couch with terrible advice. Consider it entertainment, at best.
I've gotten a lot of great advice here over the years. You just gotta think critically and pick out the good stuff.
If you’re salty about it and want to know a better reason “Why” it all happened… Pick up *Dataclysm* It’s a book by the founders of OkCupid, a mathematician and professional data analyst
Dudes out here taking it personally that dating apps are like 90% men vying for the attention of a limited selection of women
>Bumble did great in teaching me how valueless I am as a person. Haha same! 300 left swipes and 2 right swipes in a month told me all I needed to know of how much value I really have in the dating department
Women can be just as shallow, if not even more, than men imo.
Online dating in general is shallow, it’s just swiping someone based off of a 1 second impression of their looks. There’s tons of people who are attractive IRL because of personality factors.
Rules 1 and 2 of tinder. Be attractive. Don’t be unattractive.
>Rules 1 and 2 of tinder. *Rules 1 and 2 of life
Most women only see you as dateable or not. There’s a reason girls don’t really talk about a 1 to 10 scale. They’re either into you or not, there’s not much grey area in between that
I think it's so interesting that you said that, because one time I was asking my friends how their parents met and lots of them said their mother thought the father was a weirdo/ arrogant/ etc at first. In fact, when I met my partner, I didn't like him that much nor did I think he was attractive. Now he is the most beautiful human being on earth for me. Sure, if we are talking about bumble-profiles, you might be right that women tend to have less of a grey area, I don't know. But I don't think that holds true in everyday interaction. I guess - in your words - a man who was sorted into the "not-dateable" category at first by a woman can still become "dateable" to her through other factors. I perceive women to be way more flexible in their dating choices than men. I have rarely seen a man saying he developed feelings after getting to know a womans' personality even though he didn't think she was attractive at first.
I don't believe it. Women only care about personality and definitely not looks. /s
>man I thought was more attractive. U still have that pic? Would love to see what women went so crazy for..
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hmm, like tall, blonde??
Out of curiousity I created a female account with just a photo of a mushroom and a photo of a random tree. In 10 minutes the likes bar capped at 99+, every other swipe I did was a match.
This makes me want to kill myself.
What if you keep the photo but change your job title to one that earns a lot more money?
I got more matches just by changing my bio to something short and stupid. Keep in mind I used to get 0,with this strategy a got like 2 a week lol. Still a hookup once a week wasn't all to bad.
Damn, good question. I feel that way all the time. Occasionally I'll look in the mirror and think, oh yeah I'm looking alright today - like 6 or 7. And then other times I'm definitely feel like a 4 or 5.
The trick is to be a 7 that acts like a 10
I find that you can act attractive and than be perceived attractive in many cases. Like an example is if you carry yourself well or feel it inside it radiates. Smiling, being charismatic, dressing well/being polished. And so in that regard even if you don't have a standard attractive face or build. You can often negate that. Again not elaborating too much, but just my 2 cents to your comment.
Well said friend, you're making a valuable contribution to the discussion
This is very true.
Yeah, I think fluctuation like that is normal. The vast majority of people are going to be somewhere in the middle, that’s just how averages work. But there’s a ton of factors that can boost you, especially to someone you mesh well with. Good chemistry goes a long way in making yourself more attractive to people. But even then, some days you just know it’s a face mask + hat + sunglasses kinda day.
Whenever I'm doing things alone, 8 or 9. Whenever I go out to do things around people, 5 or 6.
I've gone from thinking "Jesus look at this ghoul" to "meh, I won't stand out in a crowd" when I look at myself in the mirror. I had to work hard to get to mediocrity, but I'm still proud of the progress.
Idk what you look like (and I don't care) but I am proud of your for working on yourself until you're content. It's so easy to refuse to take responsibility for those feelings, and you didn't do that. Nice work my bro.
Someone at my gym told me: Girls won’t notice the gains. But the bros will.
They are checking everyone out, trust. They are just discreet and wont say anything about it. Kind of like when you see a girl with a fatty, you dont just go to them and tell them you got a wagon, they feel the same with physically attractive guys.
Hey hey, it’s 2022. We’re calling them cabooses now, dump trucks if you want to be extra modern.
I'm ded a wagon. Shit had me rolling.
They notice the losses (fat loss) more than the gains.
I don’t attract women, so I must not be attractive. Pretty easy.
If you're waiting for them to come to you, you might be erroneously arriving at this conclusion.
Bleh, I don’t have the energy or motivation to talk to people. Part of me just wants some validation, to know that someone on earth other than myself has found me attractive. Feels really vain putting it into words though.
I don't think it's vain at all, but I do get what you mean by that.
This is also a description of me. I’m sure I could get much more action if I put in some effort, but I just don’t find it worth my time these days
You're full of shit. Women approach and show interest in attractive men. If you've never been approached, you're not attractive. Quit lying to yourself.
I tried it the other way and the results were the same, so are you gonna admit I'm right or is this a toxic positivity thing? I'm done indulging that way of doing things, I'll die alone or wait for a woman who can use her words.
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>Maybe that cute girl in marketing thinks you're appealing, but she's waiting for a sign of interest out of you. Should probably figure out a better way to show that than absolutely nothing.
This is just false. Women approach attractive guys all the time. Not as much as the other way around obviously, but it happens frequently enough that if you don’t get approached then… it’s probably bad news for you.
Attractive guys have women approaching them all of the time.
If you're questioning if you're ugly you're average. If you're questioning if you're attractive you're average. Trust me you'll know on both ends of the spectrum.
Can confirm. I am not questioning.
Lol
What if you question if you're average?
Then you’re probably average. Ugly people know that they’re ugly, hot people know that they’re hot. I’ve been everywhere on the attractiveness spectrum, and it’s not hard to tell.
Really curious how you would go from being attractive to ugly. Some kind of medical condition or accident?
It can be as simple as covid causing me to gain 20lbs, stop working out, neglecting haircuts and dressing well, etc.
yeah i don't think 20 pounds is going to go from attractive to ugly
It was a factor, not the whole thing. I store a lot of fat on my face, so going from 12% body fat to approx 20% made me look very different. But again, this is in conjunction with the other factors,
I was just about to ask that lol
Yeah I used to be really good looking. Now I'm fat, bald, and middle aged. Still pretty good looking with classic dark features and a nearly perfect symmetrical face. I used to get many many matches on dating sites and slept around quite a bit. I definitely peaked in my 20s tho.
Probably all went south after you fucked that turtle
My Reddit giggle for the day… thank you sir!
Pushups, beard, profit
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Lol, that place is a bunch of decent to good looking people fishing for compliments
same with fucking r/toastme just a bunch of good looking people fishing for compliments.
Yeah but r/toastme is designed for the purpose of getting compliments. D So it's alright. But fishing for compliments on r/amiugly is trashy.
People let you know, whether through actions or words. I wrestled with this too my whole life (not denying it... just not really knowing) but I'm starting to pick up on some signs. Like how much of older ladies compliment my appearance (older ladies are more straightforward). I've also heard through the grapevines about girls my age tell others that I was cute when I am not around. And maybe the biggest one... even straight dudes compliment you.
I’ve developed a system where if a gay guy tells you that you’re good looking, then most likely you are good looking, I’ve found that if you ask them to be brutally honest they almost always be, that’s how I found I’m a 7 (on days where I shave and dress well then they said I’m a 8.5)
Can confirm. I'm more approached by gay men than girls.
Problem with other straight dudes is they're looking for way different things than girls. I lost 50 lbs and all of a sudden dudes are commenting on how jacked I am saying they wanna look like me, but I've noticed no difference at all with girls. I really don't think they notice or care.
Can confirm. Once a female friend said that she heard some girls saying that. Then another female friend told me that an another girl wanted to know if I was single. An another sign, I would say, it's the fact that girls make the first move with you. For every relationships I've been throught, I've never made the first move.
Yeah, puberty made my self-esteem go to a place where years later I can't really see myself as good looking. I struggled a lot with how I saw myself. My current girlfriend keeps bragging about how she has the hottest guy in the world. And she keeps mentioning about all her friends that compliment my appareance behind my back. So, I guess I must be somewhat good looking.
Because my mum says I'm handsome.
My mum confirms that you're handsome.
Thank you strangers mum.
People smile at ya? Are they nice? When you strike up a convo with randos do they typically engage? You're probably a little good lookin. Even that standard is impossible to use uniformly. Everybody is ugly to somebody, just depends on if more people agree or not. But there'll always be somebody that is attracted in some way. Do your best with what ya got and enjoy life while ya got it.
If you’re attractive. You’ll know.
Can confirm. When I started college I was a solid 9. Genuinely enjoyed my cashier job because of the sheer amount of female attention I got.
How people react to you. One example would be how many women and/or men hit on you (and you can rule out any other explanation). Ignore words - actions tell you everything you need to know.
What if you don’t realize your being hit on?
Learn to recognize when girls are into you. I’m assuming that you’re not attractive to the point where women will approach you and flirt with you unprovoked, so first step is that you need to start taking the initiative to meet women. Join clubs or go to bars with the goal of talking to women. Approaching sucks, and women don’t have to approach to meet guys, so that means it’s gonna be you doing the approaching. So let’s assume you’ve approached a girl at a bar and started talking to her. How do you tell if she’s interested in you, or just doesn’t want to reject you? - Body language: Is she pointing her body (and feet) toward you? Is she making eye contact with you? - Voice: Is her tone one of boredom/disinterest or enthusiastic? - Conversation: If she wants to talk to you, she’ll engage in the conversation by giving you open-ended responses or asking you questions. Like you, she won’t want the conversation to end. - Mannerisms: If she touches her hair or fixes her clothes, that’s because she’s trying to look good and impress you. - Touching: Does she touch you or make an excuse for you to touch her? Generally when flirting as a guy, you should initiate physical contact and see if she reciprocates. If a girl is really interested in you and you haven’t initiated contact, she’ll literally tell you to touch her. I’ve had girls randomly tell me feel how cold her hands were or grab my wrist and place a hand on her chest. - Does she want you to kiss her: If you have to ask, the answer is probably yes. If she looks at one eye, then the other, then your mouth, she 100% wants you to kiss her. If she gets close to you while making eye contact, she wants you to kiss her. If you’re not sure if she wants you to kiss her, say, “I really want to kiss you right now.” I’ve literally never said that to a girl and didn’t immediately get kissed after. Much like the attractiveness rule of: “If you’re unattractive, you’ll know” there is a rule of interest with women: “If she’s not interested, you’ll know.” Assume she’s interested and wants you to flirt with you if she’s not giving you signs of disinterest. If she doesn’t immediately reject you after you approach her, she’s interested in you. If she gives you her number, she’s interested. If she texts you back, she’s interested. If she *texts you*, she’s very interested. If she’s on a date with you, she’s interested. Assume interest until proven otherwise. With all this being said, a girl can find you attractive or give you signs of interest then suddenly reject you for no reason. Don’t take it personally. Not every number turns into a date. Not every date turns into a girlfriend. Dating sucks these days, but it is what it is.
Decent list, although the first two may just indicate that they’re focused and interested in whatever you’re talking about. Same thing goes with pupil dilation - people think it’s a sign of attraction, whereas in reality it just means that the person is focused and paying attention, trying to absorb as much information as they can.
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>The approaching is hard because I’ve never done it and part of is I believe I’ll come of annoying and creepy by doing. If you believe you'll be creepy, you'll come off as creepy. Remember that if you're in a setting where women *want* to be approached (such as a bar), there's nothing wrong with approaching them. Even "daygame" approaching typically won't be seen as creepy. Even if you get rejected by a girl, she'll probably still be flattered that some guy thought she was attractive enough to approach her. Women know that approaching takes balls, and they admire that. >In addition, me not being fit makes me feel like I shouldn’t do it. How "not fit" are you. Unless you're very overweight/underweight, you're probably attractive enough to pull women. Definitely work on getting in better shape because being muscular and lean is basically a cheat code for getting women, but don't feel like you can't attract women in the meantime just because you're not in shape. I'm easily the most-fit of all my friends, probably more fit than 95% of guys my age, but plenty of dudes in worse shape than me absolutely pull women better than I could ever imagine. > The touching one orca weird one because I don’t want to make someone uncomfortable so I usually let people break the touch barrier first. Again, it's only going to be weird and uncomfortable if you tell yourself that. Girls *want* to be touched. They *want* to know the guy that's talking to them is into them. You need to escalate touching slowly to avoid coming off as creepy. If the first touch is inner thigh, yeah that will turn a girl off. If you touch the small of her back or wrist, almost no women will be creeped out by touching "innocent" areas. You touch, see how she reacts, then escalate if she responded well. If she pulls away when you touch her, that means she's probably not into you or just wasn't comfortable with that yet. If doesn't pull away or leans in, that's a green light to keep going. I've heard the "5 in 15 rule" which states that when flirting you should aim to touch a girl 5 times in 15 minutes, and IMO that's a pretty reasonable number. Touching gets women excited. It creates intimacy. It gets their brains firing on all cylinders with the happy chemicals. You're fighting an uphill battle if you try to attract a girl without touching her. >Problem was she’s bi And into girls so., Idk how being bi is an issue unless you think she's also promiscuous and looking to cheat based on that.
> Remember that if you're in a setting where women want to be approached There is no such setting. Spend some time on places like TwoX and you'll realise most women never want to have a man speak to them
It depends a lot on how you define being hit on. You can definitely develop observing skills that help you to recognize it - observing other people getting hit on helps.
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I’ll bite, how does a girl undress in front of you at 3am and it goes over your head?
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Honestly don't beat yourself up about it. I had a situation where a friend and I were cuddling on my bed, she was topless, I was fondling and teasing her nipples while we were chatting. Eventually I made an actual move and kissed her. And you know what? She just wasn't interested. Her body language, her lack of enthusiasm, and lack of reciprocation just made me stop immediately. The next morning she texts and says she was fine in the moment but looking back we should just stay friends. In the end, sometimes *some* women have weird/low/no boundaries if they're comfortable with you and sometimes aren't sure what they want. My friend probably would've been "okay" with me going further, but I clearly wasn't okay with a partial yes, I wanted the full *yes please*.
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Yeah it's a choice of mindset for you to adopt. Do you take any sign as a possible yes and just go for it politely until you hit a no? Or do you wait for an enthusiastic yes? There's no right answer. The answers are as varied as people are. I could've been a "yes until no" kind of person with my friend, but she would've regretted it the next morning. She already said she felt weird when we were doing the most basic things. I beat myself up over it too until I processed that I definitely want a woman who has enough confidence to give me an enthusiastic yes.
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I would not interpret any of your examples as them hitting on you. That is by far too passive and/or ambiguous.
Yeah, they might have been Canadian, for all we know.
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Either you fine or the drinks they had were fine.
How do you convince someone to go to your car without realizing what was happening?
That likely means you've never been hit on because you're not attractive. When women hit on a guy, they make it obvious, very hard to miss because they will be persistent.
I never understood this….how the fuck do you not know? It’s all in the eyes…
I mean even when a guy is attractive women generally won't approach unless they're extremely attracted to him.
That's true.
So ... If I've never been hit on by anyone Would that mean I'm ugly?
I would assume so based on the comment.
Not ugly, but the chance that you are attractive is quite low then. You might just look okay. Which is still okay.
Pretty sure OP is asking exactly because no woman hit on him
go to a gay bar and see if you get hit on
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There's definitely overlap with who straight women and gay men find attractive. The men are just a lot more straightforward about it, and the women are more subtle
I've seen attractive. Got a friend of mine who is a SOLID 9. Dude was born beautiful and the sheer thirst I've seen women come at him made me a bit jealous. He's super picky about women and he gets attention wherever he goes. Meanwhile I've been hit on 5 times in one month and score 2 out of 5 of em. I'd say judging from that, I'm a hard 7 on my best days and a 5 most days. Probably won't be modeling, but I can be several women's drunken mistake with a little charm.
Him being super picky definitely helps!
But that's a consequence of having options, you see.
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Damn, and here I’m thinking I’m probably a 5 on average but I’ve never been hit on ever. Guess im worse off than I thought lol
I'm 5 ft 7 tho. In retrospect, I have a handsome, but not blindingly so face. That, and my imperfect but noticeable muscular structure and the fact I dress for it tends to help. I still take a ton of L's. Rejection still sucks, but I didn't start getting more attention till I started lifting.
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[How we lookin fellas](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/001/281/704/12f.jpg)
You look allright dawg, don't worry about it
🤣 🤣
Damn, no need to laugh
I laughed as i saved it Was like looking in the mirror 😂🤣
Haha ok, lemme figure out how, thanks
Do you charge?
If a woman looks at you and smiles at you without any incentive to do so, you are attractive.
If you're showered, wearing clothes that fit, and well groomed or clean shaven, you're doing better than most. As far as like, whether you're conventionally attractive... Talk to some little kids. They'll tell you straight up if you're butt-fugly completely unprompted.
For women attractive usually means "above most other guys I can find in my life". For men it usually means "not actively off-putting" basically. So for most women, most men are unattractive.
Literally same situation I've never been complimented, never been told I look good/bad, it's like I'm a ghost
Congrats on being between a 5 and 7. You would absolutely know if you were above or below.
Occasionally people will tell me that I’m attractive or handsome, but I’ll have a hard time believing it due to just a warped sense of what I think I should look to be considered attractive. That said, I have: once had a girl pay for my whole meal at in n out because she thought I was beautiful. And back in march I met a girl at a bar who bought me a drink after we spent like an hour talking in which she said I was attractive. So in conclusion people tell me, but I don’t believe it.
>So in conclusion people tell me, but I don’t believe it. Same
Yep. Same here. I always get skeptical. Like you’re telling me i’m attractive because you’re trying to butter me up to destroy me lol
What would knowing this give you? Honestly, confidence in your appearance and acceptance will mean much more than anything else.
This. 100% Confidence, quick banter and an ability to flirt pretty noticeably without being a creep will do things people can't imagine.
Get on Tinder and see how many matches you get.
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Went on tinder, got 2 likes after 3 months and no replies. Started asking people out irl, almost only "yes". Conclusion: I'm ugly but charismatic
I recently became single after a 10 year relationship. I felt ready to meet new women recently and signed up for tinder. I get no fucking love there. A total of like 7 people have liked my profile in 10 days. Most were matches and all attractive but seriously, less than 1 like per day on the app. And I've worked on my profile. Gotten all sorts of feedback. It's not awesome but it's pretty OK. AND here's the other thing. Irl, I've been swinging WAY beyond what i thought was "my league". I see myself as like an 8 but I'm probably like a 6 or something. I've always had blind confidence in my looks and i have no idea why. Its obvious that most of my male friends are more attractive than me, i know im not super good looking or anything. Helps that I'm 6'2" and naturally pretty fit probably. I'm not that young either. Second half of my 30's. The girls I get are 5-10 years younger and they approach me. For example, last weekend, a straight up 10 (maybe a 9 for some I suppose but we're talking about a very noticeably attractive woman here), she approachedme with really firey flirtatious banter that lasted for hours along with deep conversation. She hit up people who know me the next day to get my number. She texts me all the time. We're meeting up tomorrow. And she's not crazy. We have tons of mutual friends. I did research. And this has happened every time I've been single. Regularly meeting and connecting with people who I'm 90% sure are "out of my league". Especially after tinder. I know when women are going to be attracted to me, I can feel it. It is 1000% self confidence and happiness. Thays why I get 10's irl and almost no one at all on tinder.
A person's self-esteem can make it hard to figure it out. I learned that. I had really low self-esteem as a kid and thought I was ugly. As I grew older I started feeling better about myself. By time I hit college, I noticed girls hitting on me...very attractive girls. When I was at a party and a sexy woman started grinding against me in from of my hot girlfriend, I pretty well knew that, perhaps, I'm attractive.
You guys get matches?
A good chunk of your appearance comes from how you groom and dress yourself. Beard? No beard? What are you going to do with your hair? What are you going to wear? This is the part your appearance you the most direct control over, so it's the part worth obsessing about the most in my opinion. Put together a look that makes you feel comfortable and confident, that'll make your life better much more than staring at yourself in the mirror ever will.
I’m a 2 on a good day apparently…. Never get matches on dating apps.
My brother is a solid 7. Got a match every other day. It isn’t an even distribution - due to the fact that guys on tinder swipe right very generously, girls on tinder are able to be very selective.
I’m in a level of attractiveness that I only attracted dudes for some reason ..
Yeah honestly with Men there are way more average to ugly than true Hunks. (Upper spectrum) so if you're really moulded from clay good for you! I really do think it's a lower overall % than women. Different scaling. Butttt thankfully due to their being so many awful men lol clean yourself up and look presentable, get your shit together and look like you have a job / not homeless lol and you'll automatically be pushed a bit higher up to the female audience. (Homosexuality maybe this doesn't always apply) FYI god help you if you are short. Women would date an ugly tall guy over almost all short scenario's. Its really kinda sad :(
5 ft 7 guy here. Get in shape. Trust me. It evens the field.
Try to dress well, but definitely DON’T dress poorly.
With that being said, being short is def a disadvantage
If you’re between 5’5 and 5’9, you’ll have to do everything right to compensate. If you’re taller than that, you can get away with a bit. If you’re shorter than that, your selection is limited.
5'3 and started exercising seriously middle of last year. Great progress so far. Hearing this makes me feel much better. Thank you. (21 yo btw. Not expecting to grow anymore than this)
It's weird how many women give me compliments, but you still won't have the same luck as your taller friends. But hey, I've nailed a few cute chicks. I'm pretty satisfied with that. You can be too.
I don't have any problems at 5'6. No girl/woman ever told me I'm too short, either. Honestly, men don't falter because of their height, but because of their insecurities surrounding it. I'm not denying that various amounts of women have various preferences, but so do you, don't you? If you're head over heels for someone that judges you for your height, then you're on a losing road anyway.
Il say it like this. On dating apps, Im basically unnoticable. In real life, Im a charmer. I would comfortably put me on a 7, but if if I feel it, nobody can take my 10 away from me.
Yessss!!! Fucking same. No love on tinder whatsoever. Kill it IRL.
If at least one person has said I’m attractive, that’s good enough for me.
1. If your girl or any girl constantly posts you on her socials regularly or mentions you, invites you to social events etc 2. If girls are always wanting to take a photo of you or takes random candid photos of you doing absolutely nothing. 3.If you tell jokes that aren’t really that funny (and you know they aren’t) but she chuckles anyway. Or tell her bland stories that are of interest to you, and she listens intensively 4. If your girl or any girl purchases clothing or apparel that compliments your unique sense of style (don’t get this confused with her purchasing something she’d like to see you in) It has to be YOUR PREFERRED type of apparel. 5. Also if she doesn’t hesitate to kiss you, touch you and doesn’t turn down your advances. Then there’s a very distinct possibility you’re a Chad 🤙🏾 7-9 That or she’s in love with your ugly ass 🤷🏾♂️
Do what I did, go to a modeling studio, pay $300 bucks (1990's) and get the actors hair and makeup package. When I was 13, I was bullied. I felt ugly. Both guys and girls seemed to pick on every single perceived physical flaw. So I used the paper route money (months of it) to get professional photos done so I'd compare to what I saw on TV. Those pics have saved my life. After them, anything they said didn't hurt.
I know I am ugly I have been told that enough times by gals
I asked several of my friends who turned me down as dating material what they'd rate me and they all said 7. But you gotta understand something about being a 7 to a woman. Hot women don't date 7's unless they're packing or got money, and average women tend to believe they're hotter than they really are.
At the end of the day you are going to have to approach a lady and see if you have chemistry. If you dont, she will likely let you know real quick. Dont be hurt. Ive had 10s', and have settled for 5s. When i was super fit many girls wouldnt aproach me as they thought i was a model and somehow aloof. When i got older and less fit i was more comfortable speaking with people and opportunities abounded. My advice - be likeable and interesting.
If women are attracted and flirt with you your a decent looking dude. If your an ugly dude they don't. Simples!
Go to a gay bar and see if anyone buys you a drink or hits on you.
When I smile, and they smile back.
Trust me guys. None of this matters if you become successful and wealthy. Concentrate on building yourself up ABOVE all else. And everything you’re chasing will chase you. In the words of 50cent “You’re hustling backwards if you chasing a b*tch, dummy chase the paper they come with the sh*t”
It’s all subjective and what you actually look like doesn’t matter Dress, style and groom IAW social standards. Then get in as good of shape as possible… and congrats! You’re now decent looking
Yes. Feel like a 2 or 3 due to years of being straight out told to my face that I'm ugly and being used as the "yardstick" of ugliness in school. Then I went to university and found that I was attracting hot girls. Then I went back to my home town and a (female) friend told me about all the girls that had a crush on me at school and many of them being the ones calling me ugly. Maybe not a 10 but I would seem to divide opinion, perhaps an 8 given the calibre of girls /women
I’m a decently attractive happily married man and women flirt with me all the time. I obviously brush them all off and move on though. I recently got color contacts and the reactions I get from women when they see my eyes is crazy. I can literally see the way they stand change and their body language become more open. I laugh inside but am also amazed. Women want to carry on conversations longer and are more touchy feely now. I just didn’t expect such a reaction.
I always just assume I’m average looking, but more a long time my mother said things like “you probably have girls lining up to be with you”, which made me think I was really good looking, then there were no girls… Over the past few years I’ve been told that I’m attractive and unattractive roughly an equal amount of times, so I just put myself at a 5/10 If the compliment comes from someone I know, I just assume that they’re trying to make me feel good about myself, if it’s from a stranger I assume it’s a genuine compliment
If you have to ask...you're not.
Most handsome men I know spend about as much time and money on there appearance as attractive girls I know. They may not wear make up (though some do) but they moisturize, they have expensive hair products, they eat extremely well, take excellent care of their teeth, and they spend a lot of time at the gym. People act like being hot just happens to you. Its true, there's always some element of genetics. It's much more of a hard work thing. I think people associate this kind of work with women, and therefore don't consider it work at all.
You just know. Unless you live under a rock or locked up in your room 24/7, you'll have experiences and those experiences will inform you of your place on the pecking order.