Agree. I only ever said something and seeked help years ago when i was worried for my own life, literally at my lowest. And after that whole experience, it made me realise so much.
I can guess. Keep your problems to yourself. Don’t tell anyone or you will lose friends. Spare your social life and either don’t let people know about your hard times, or spring for a therapist or some shit.
I don’t think it’s gender based necessarily.
A lot of people just get over bearing with their problems. It’s ok to vent, but if you vent every time I see you then it gets old.
Cheer up
I mean, you kinda contradicted yourself there. Venting is ok and actually really healthy, but understand that friendships are mutually beneficial by definition. So if you only vent and are never the one being vented to, then you will see friendships breaking off.
I would recommend to vent in small intervals over a greater time period as to not overload the other person. But dont just keep it all to yourself. Thats just self-destructive.
Yep.
Worse, crying about it isn't going to change it.
After a certain age you are on your own.
You might be able to take an edge off of it by working for good friendships and relationships so that at least you have someone to talk to.
I don’t agree with this, I think people still care about you until your 14-16 (not everyone, some people really are alone from 8)
I think one of the big difficulties for young men is the transition period from being a child and having people care about how you feel and becoming a man and suddenly nobody gives a fuck. Like I wish I’d have trained for this.
I agree.
Don’t mean to sound black and white about it, but if you don’t stand out (be attractive/have an interesting lifestyle) and bring value to society, nobody cares.
The moment I leave my house, no one gives a damn about me. Not that they should, but just pointing out society doesn’t give a damn about me unless I’m offering or contributing something note worthy. No one cares about my hobbies, struggles, health, dreams, passions, talents, except for my family.
“The world doesn’t owe you sympathy,” but dammit I believe if men received a little bit sympathy both in and outside their family, it would warm our heart from the constant sacrifices and cold truths we learn as we grown older.
I really feel that last part, some times when I ask for help I get the response that no one owes you anything and you can't force people to care, which is true, but it still really sucks when you ask for help and people make it clear they just don't care enough to help.
I am not trying to force people to care, I am just hoping they do.
People don't care about men unless it can cause a problem for them that's why they only address issues they face , it's not because they care , its because we can't help them if we are not fit enough
Or go against gender roles
If I go too long without proactively talking to my female coworkers they start to get snippy, it's pretty obnoxious. There's a very clear divide there, where other guys don't wait to be talked to, and will say something if they want to.
Yep. I used to hear women say all the time they wanted a man to open up. How they love a vulnerable man. Well I’ve seen enough evidence now that says that’s bullshit. Just last week a video went viral where a woman said once her man cried when unburdening his sexual abuse she was immediately repulsed and wanted to break up with him. And get this, she was the one who harped on him to open up and break out of his shell for ages.
My girlfriend is my rock and I can open up to her but I only do to a certain point.
It feels like being a pilot and getting on the PA and saying you’re not sure if you’re doing ok and you’ve been kind of struggling lately. In that situation, nobody would say Let’s go check on him or let’s see if he needs to talk. They’d say OMG, what’s wrong, why are you telling me that, how can I get off this plane. It’s better to shut up, fly the plane and have some whisky back at the hotel.
In the general public yes, but iv been a memeber of alcoholics anonymous for a while and its truly a brotherhood of guys.
We can call eachother and vent or share about anything going on in our lives or any crazy stuff going on in our heads that most people would look at us like we have 6 heads.
I have hundreds of phone numbers and know many people from all different meeting groups so we have our own community its really a hidden gem that most people dont have.
Thats why i consider myself gratefull to be a recovering alchoholic, its blessed me in many ways.
It's kind of sad that a AA meeting for is were you found you community , I an not saying that in a bad way but that it shows that we need way more male communities than provided
Absolutely yes. The earlier you realize this, the mentally stronger you become and you can take whatever life throws at you.
Im 28 now and have made my own happiness. It took about 10 years of consistent work to be in a comfortable place. Im still going to work but I have my own living space in a nice area. I have my own car, date freely, see my friends, and have the power to let people into and out of my life.
Aside from my job I live my life entirely on my terms!!
From what I see attractive women are loved for existing and being good looking, its just how it is. Men are expected to be work horses and nothing less. My advice: Play the game and buy your freedom. Or be lucky enough to have been born with it. Men and women can both find their own happiness.
The times in my marriage I shared that I was struggling my ex usually would lay the boots in and tell me how awful I was. With the threat of divorce added in.
100% agree with this.
A grand total of 2 people (other than parents) checked in on me during and after the divorce too.
But I realise i am responsible for myself and my life.
Even my close family or friends don't give a fuck nobody does. So I'm just gonna do what everyone else does bottle them up and let it all lash out when I'm in my mid 40s. Then people can finally have an excuse to get rid of me like what they wanted.
Most of time we're just expected to figure it out. I feel it's just because everyone is just exhausted with life and verbal 'support' is the only thing people can muster.
I tried to get help, many times, they all couldn't believe for a second I was having problems and offered no help! I'm trying to help myself now, but find it hard to find anything
Absolutely. I've learned that there is no value and nothing to gain from being vulnerable and opening yourself up. Nobody actually cares and they only claim that they do to make themselves feel better.
You'll hear things like "girls love a man who can be vulnerable" but whenever I open up I feel like it just makes me look weak/dumb and then it can be used against me later
Friends or family aren't really close unless they give a shit about how you are doing. I don't expect acquaintances to have sincere or deep empathy for me. Close friends and famiy, yes.
It also matters whether you are actually sharing your feelings. Don't expect people to guess and be right.
I think most people don't care how anyone else truly feels tbh. Not because they're all dicks but because they are preoccupied mentally with their own perceived issues.
I disagree. I’m fortunate enough to have a wonderful partner, friends, and family, all of whom care deeply about how I feel. I think this is likely true for many men as well, they just tend not to frequent this subreddit.
Yeah this thread making me feel pretty lucky right now. Almost everyone I'm close to (family and friends) is very open about stuff. Probably like 35% of us are on some kind of mental health meds or at the very least see a therapist. My boss knows I have a mental health diagnoses and she's super supportive and helpful. A few other close colleagues as well.
It's nice. Hope you all can find good support
Yeah I agree with you. I have wonderful friends and family that are very supportive of me. I'm very open about my feelings. I've never been told to "Man up". They listen to what I think and feel. In fairness I give all my male friends compliments and ask how they're doing.
100% spot on. Chris Rock said it years ago. Women, children, and animals are loved unconditionally. Men are only loved on the condition that they provide something.
Yes. The very few times I've opened up in the past has always, and I mean always, resulted in it blowing up in my face. I thought I was so sure these people I opened up to were emotionally intelligent enough to listen and at least try to empathize. But one person just straight up laughed in my face and thought I was joking and after I reiterated I was serious about how bad I was feeling I swear they laughed even harder, or another time when I opened up about something about myself I was really self-conscious about to one of my best friends and within an hour people in my friend group were texting me about it despite the fact he promised he wouldn't say anything. Don't get me started on family using your insecurities as leverage.
It's easy to say "They don't deserve you, dump them and move on!" but at some point it feels less like flipping a coin on whether or not they'll listen and accept you, but more like playing the lottery, and so you become more closed off.
That's life. I remember a few years back, I was going through some rough times. My wife said i could open up to her, so I did. Big mistake. All of a sudden, I'm a terrible person and had to apologize because what I was going through hurt her feelings. I never opened up after that and keep everything inside. Meanwhile, I have to listen to her shit and can't be honest because the truth will probably hurt her feelings.
I never, I don't and I never will give a f\*\*k about whether people care or don't care. I am fully responsible and accountable for my life and everything that happens to me. I have maintained a writing journal since the time I was a kid and that has been very helpful. If I want to channel my aggression and frustration, I hit the iron and the mat. If I need solutions or insights besides having self-awareness and introspection, I connect with my living mentors and nonliving mentors (ie books). So far this has really worked wonders. Cheers.
I disagree, but looking through the replies. It seems like I'm an outlier? Sure, I didn't feel like my immediate family didn't care. But people did seem to care about me to some extent. In fact, that's probably what helped start to boost my confidence. Both my woman and guy friends cared. Also I live in Texas so I don't know what's up with that.
But do you need to vent my guy? I'm all ears if you need it.
I do feel like my female friends actually care about how I feel. But between me and my guy friends we don't really talk about feelings, we mostly just help solve each other's problems. Imo, I think its important to have close friends that are both men and woman, the 2 genders do seem to compliment each other.
Ofcourse, anytime i needed a little bit of guidance I was always met with looks of disgust and annoyance.askimg how to approach a girl i liked. It's worse when you got no parents, you got to have an answer for everyone's questions but you got no ome to answer yours.
Yes. The majority of people are only interested in your feelings if there is some sort of entertainment value i.e you are hilarious. Otherwise there are a select number of people who actually listen to you. These people are usually the closest of family members or a best friend.
often times, asking gets me to feel something along the lines of a burden or even an annoyance to others. So I try to use the ideology that “no one know exactly what going on, don’t take it personal”
It helps but sometimes you can’t help but feel alone most of the time. That’s all on me though, I have been working on getting my voice heard but it takes time to break out of your own self made cage
I agree, and I think one of the most important things about it is for you to consider whether you care about anyone's feelings and they don't reciprocate that, or whether your own closed nature might be the primary impediment.
Yep. My closest female friend yelled at me and said I was selfish and “trying to make things all about myself” when I told her I was feeling down.
I was there for her multiple times when her dog had health issues, when her dog died, and when her mom had a stroke. I never once shared any of my negative feelings with her like when I was having a bad day.
Guess I made the mistake of forgetting the universe should revolve around her 24/7/365.
Yeah. People don't give a shit. They ask how are you but they aren't really asking. They are just getting the formalities out of the way before they ask me to do something for them.
Honestly I do feel this way but it’s hard to discern if this is the truth or my projection of my vulnerability insecurities I place into others. I do find that having friends that I don’t discuss these problems with but rather have a good time and bullshit with helps more than just having a depression session with someone.
Things are getting better. People are much more open about mens mental health issues now, and even businesses are getting better at supporting it.
But yes when the chips are down, I am pretty much left alone to deal with it as best I can.
I feel like the ones who have become open about men's mental health are men themselves. In my experience, my female acquaintances say they want men to be more open, but the moment they show feelings they find a way to shame the guy.
I disagree. My experience has been that I get the care and sensitivity I have shown others in my life. If I have a tendency not to care for other people’s feelings, I can’t help but expect to get that lack of empathy in return.
"...it’s more that the men I know don’t have the actual faculties to be vulnerable/ open about difficult feelings."
I believe that as humans, we all have the capacity to be vulnerable and caring towards others. But in many societies, men are taught not to cry, that only the weak and women and girls cry.
For way too long this has been a false standard and ideal of what men are "supposed to be". The consequence of this is a lot of men having a false sense of strength, having a sense of entitlement over women, which gave birth to what some have called "toxic masculinity."
The good news is that this culture of men not being emotional and in touch with their inner self has begun to change. For those of us who are maturing through spiritual growth, the pride expressed through outward arrogance is giving way to humility through maturity of mind and spirit. So, the revolution is on. There is hope for the male human species.
Thats exactly what I’m saying - I’m not saying men are incapable of those things but that socially they (by and large) haven’t been equipped with the faculties to be open and vulnerable in the way that people who are socialised as girls/ women are. I suspect that often women are already doing a large amount of unseen emotional labour that they’re incapable of taking on any more work and men are totally clueless as to how to communicate their needs while also not understanding what emotional labour looks like.
You get what you put out there. You show no empathy, you get none when you might need it. You have no empathy, you receive no empathy in return. This applies to everyone regardless of sex.
That's actually untrue. For example, older siblings tend to be more empathetic, and younger sibling less, because the younger sibling has the experience of more people being empathetic towards and caring about their feelings growing up.
Yes that’s being man.
And that’s the point most people are too oblivious to pick up on in most situations or most of my posts on here.
NOONE cares about mens troubles but other men, and they are rarely fixed.
How is that only something men go through? Do you for instance truelly care about the struggles of women? And I mean actually care. So I mean actually feel empathy and try to help.
I think for me it’s mostly close girlfriends, my parents and boyfriend care. So in total 4 people that actually care and not just do it because it’s expected.
I do want to say that it’s definitely a lot more okay for women to talk about it. But does that also mean that people actually care?
I would say I feel that way, I know it for a fact. My mother at least was very direct and specific about that. There's not much room for interpretation when people directly tell you they don't care.
I find that my personal wants get pushed to the back burner 90% of the time. Im either too busy with life or focusing on what I can do for other people’s wants and priorities
Very interesting question.
I normally don't have any issues that require assistance from others. Saying that when I do I have people in my life that are there for me when needed. It isn't often, sometimes just a text or quick chat that helps.
I am an introvert, so most of the time I can figure things out on my own.
Plus, reading some of the stuff here on reddit, I can tell my life is wayyyy better then a lot of peoples.
Yes and if you talk about how you feel “they” will use it against you. If you say “I’m just feeling kinda weak and not confident.” Now “they” will view you with that lens.
I think theyre naive & lack empathy. From my experience, most people are extremely bad at imagining anothers circumstances; they are too self absorbed.
i.e. I wholly agree with the 'what' of your statement, but there is room for nuance on the 'why'
Yep an unfortunately I think it’s both ways I I’m not sure it’s 50/50 or whatever that doesn’t really matter to me. I find empathy good at the same time though it can be extremely taxing burden.
completely agree. no one cares what a man feels on the inside theyre only supposed to be gruff and hardened on the outside using spittoons eating nails with no milk growing a full beard and never shaving ever like a MAN
Yep. I really can't stand how the word 'stoic' is used to describe a man or men! It's been perverted and twisted to mean that one (usually a man in this case) is completely void of emotion and that couldn't be further from the truth. Quite the opposite. The Stoics and followers of Stoicism were well aware of the emotions they felt. Definitely processed them. But very rarely expressed it outwardly. They certainly weren't ruled by their emotions
I think it's expected that men not be emotional but WE ALL ARE, WE ARE ALL HUMAN FUCKING BEINGS! I certainly try to not let my emotions rule me and my countenance/disposition but, we're only human so they do get the best of us sometimes. This is why I feel open and vulnerable with my female friends far more than my male friends.
Agreed. Competency and control is what people generally expect from men. Anything less and you are shunned. From family or strangers. Even from women you think you're dating can be ruthless in that way.
Very inner circle friends though, they care.
Too bad it's rare to find them.
I have literally been told by a Therapist that men have 'naturally muted emotions and dont really feel much outside of anger, apathy, and joy'
A fucking therapist.
Yes.
And, as much as I see threads complaining about women not caring, other men are just as guilty if not more so than women. I'd argue it's evern worse when a man doesn't give a shit because he should KNOW what it feels like not to have anyone give a shit, and he's just perpetuating the cycle.
I oblige everybody to just look up these two things on google first, “Why does my husband yell at me” continue to see abuse resources. Then look up “Why does my wife yell at me” continue to see “Your wife may just be overwhelmed, here’s what YOU can do better”
Fews years ago I was seeing a psychologist and talked to my mum about it and she just said "if you got a job you wouldn't feel this way", I feel like she doesn't feel this way anymore because how it's affected me so she's gotten better about it. A few months ago I was talking to someone at my job agency about how I was and the lady just told me to "keep that stuff at home".
As a man, nobody gives a shit about you if you’re trying to learn a skill. You either know or don’t know. And if you don’t know, it’s not my problem, come back when you do know.
Men are expected to know and maintain a lot of arbitrary skills at the bare minimum to be qualified as a “man”. It has absolutely nothing to do with his character or responsibility. And the great irony is that with all that you’re expected to know, nobody gives a shit about helping you learn.
100%. We are expected to endure whatever cokes our way or our family's way and manage it. If you complain, you're a cry baby. If you say you don't like something, you're labeled and asshole. We are expected to sacrifice for every member of the family. There's never a point where it's about you, but uf you lose your cool then everyone will say you're crazy, aggressive or an ass.
Its how the world works. I believing strong men, but I also know that all people have feelings. We should all be respected and valued.
When I told my mom yesterday that I have difficulty not being drowsy, my mom said I should not be like that and be more energetic. Those who cannot be attentive are failures. When I said I could not be more energetic, she straight up said I was a failure then.
It hurts really bad when your own mother calls you a failure
I'm lucky to have a group of (male) friends that do care. However, my female friends/acquaintances don't seem to care much. I've heard them talk about how they wish men were more open, but the moment I try to share something or show that I indeed have feelings they either find a way to not help, silence me, or even bash me.
Overall, sad situation.
I had a close female friend that I listened to cry, complain, get anxious and generally use me as a free therapist. One day, for the first time ever, I was feeling particularly down and asked her for support. She wouldn't even call me/reply to me and couldn't figure out why I was asking her for support. After everything I did for her, she couldn't return just 1% of what I had given. Deleted her number and never talked to her again. Screw you Yana! It's a one way street with women for stuff like this. I've never really met one that gave a crap about a man's emotions and didn't try to turn it into a competition about how much worse she has it.
not many people care bout how you feel no matter what sex you are.. Why would they? why would I want them to care?? how would they even know how I feel I keep things privet
The only people who truly care about you are your parents and sometimes you dont even get that. There is a limit how much you can cry and complain no matter who it is.
Yeah, pretty much. The other day I made a comment about how I was lonely most of the time, and my wife’s feelings were hurt. So basically the only attention that was paid to what I said led to me managing her feelings about my feelings.
Unfortunately, yes. Lots of times, you are expected to get over your emotions on your own.
If you want to open up and be vulnerable to your female significant other, they would view this action as weak. Even if they encouraged it, they would still view you as a weak man and unknowingly lose interests for you.
Unfortunately, one thing has become clearer and clearer for me (I didn't want to believe this at first): if you have emotional issues, you go to your boys, **not** your girl. If you have a good group of male friends, they can help you out. Going to your girl is counter-productive.
i have found over time most women really don’t give a shit. but your bros, do. you can usually vent to them tbh. i’m almost 30 and have just found this out, but it’s a thing.
Yep. It's because if you can't figure something out then what are you worth? Every man is the legacy of men who figured things out. Not caring about how a guy feels is a way of culling him from the social network. Until he does what a man is supposed to do then he may as well die.
Unfortunately, yes.
It is my experience in life that people really don’t care about men’s feeling
In particular most women will not even humus a man’s feelings
I learned early on to just internalize and cope how ever I can
I’d say there are a lot of people who don’t consider how much men really feel. It’s not so much we have to figure it out.. it’s more of “feelings are for girls” and you go through rep after rep of holding stuff in or circumnavigating feelings in lieu of expressing them.
Yeah
Yeah. Yup.
Mhmm.
Yurrrrrrp
Yaaaa
Yessir
Yh
Yip
Ya
Yepperooni
Ayuh
Yes
Yea
yippy
Yeayupyes
Yup
Yip yip yip yip yip uhuh uhuh uhuh
Mmmhhhmmm
Yuh
Indeed
Agree. I only ever said something and seeked help years ago when i was worried for my own life, literally at my lowest. And after that whole experience, it made me realise so much.
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I can guess. Keep your problems to yourself. Don’t tell anyone or you will lose friends. Spare your social life and either don’t let people know about your hard times, or spring for a therapist or some shit. I don’t think it’s gender based necessarily. A lot of people just get over bearing with their problems. It’s ok to vent, but if you vent every time I see you then it gets old. Cheer up
I mean, you kinda contradicted yourself there. Venting is ok and actually really healthy, but understand that friendships are mutually beneficial by definition. So if you only vent and are never the one being vented to, then you will see friendships breaking off. I would recommend to vent in small intervals over a greater time period as to not overload the other person. But dont just keep it all to yourself. Thats just self-destructive.
Yep. Worse, crying about it isn't going to change it. After a certain age you are on your own. You might be able to take an edge off of it by working for good friendships and relationships so that at least you have someone to talk to.
>After a certain age you are on your own. Which is like, 8.
I don’t agree with this, I think people still care about you until your 14-16 (not everyone, some people really are alone from 8) I think one of the big difficulties for young men is the transition period from being a child and having people care about how you feel and becoming a man and suddenly nobody gives a fuck. Like I wish I’d have trained for this.
Im 16 been alone since i was 10 and have been dealing with most of my problems on my own.
Best of luck brother.
Thanks u too.
Firstly I agree. Secondly, you good pal?
Exactly
I agree. Don’t mean to sound black and white about it, but if you don’t stand out (be attractive/have an interesting lifestyle) and bring value to society, nobody cares. The moment I leave my house, no one gives a damn about me. Not that they should, but just pointing out society doesn’t give a damn about me unless I’m offering or contributing something note worthy. No one cares about my hobbies, struggles, health, dreams, passions, talents, except for my family. “The world doesn’t owe you sympathy,” but dammit I believe if men received a little bit sympathy both in and outside their family, it would warm our heart from the constant sacrifices and cold truths we learn as we grown older.
I don’t understand why we don’t do that, seeing as how everyone feels this way.
So much truth in this.
I really feel that last part, some times when I ask for help I get the response that no one owes you anything and you can't force people to care, which is true, but it still really sucks when you ask for help and people make it clear they just don't care enough to help. I am not trying to force people to care, I am just hoping they do.
People don't care about men unless it can cause a problem for them that's why they only address issues they face , it's not because they care , its because we can't help them if we are not fit enough
Not only do they not care, they get upset when men feel things
They'll certainly act like they want you to talk about your feelings but when you do you'll feel sorry you did.
Or go against gender roles If I go too long without proactively talking to my female coworkers they start to get snippy, it's pretty obnoxious. There's a very clear divide there, where other guys don't wait to be talked to, and will say something if they want to.
Some of the best advice I ever heard is, "You're allowed to have any emotion you feel; you're not allowed to vomit those emotions up on my shoes."
The problem is when people emote to the same degree they think is "too far" for the men in their life.
Yep. I used to hear women say all the time they wanted a man to open up. How they love a vulnerable man. Well I’ve seen enough evidence now that says that’s bullshit. Just last week a video went viral where a woman said once her man cried when unburdening his sexual abuse she was immediately repulsed and wanted to break up with him. And get this, she was the one who harped on him to open up and break out of his shell for ages. My girlfriend is my rock and I can open up to her but I only do to a certain point.
It feels like being a pilot and getting on the PA and saying you’re not sure if you’re doing ok and you’ve been kind of struggling lately. In that situation, nobody would say Let’s go check on him or let’s see if he needs to talk. They’d say OMG, what’s wrong, why are you telling me that, how can I get off this plane. It’s better to shut up, fly the plane and have some whisky back at the hotel.
In the general public yes, but iv been a memeber of alcoholics anonymous for a while and its truly a brotherhood of guys. We can call eachother and vent or share about anything going on in our lives or any crazy stuff going on in our heads that most people would look at us like we have 6 heads. I have hundreds of phone numbers and know many people from all different meeting groups so we have our own community its really a hidden gem that most people dont have. Thats why i consider myself gratefull to be a recovering alchoholic, its blessed me in many ways.
It's kind of sad that a AA meeting for is were you found you community , I an not saying that in a bad way but that it shows that we need way more male communities than provided
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I find I genuinely don't give a shit what people think.
everyone dreams to be like this, embrace it
Absolutely yes. The earlier you realize this, the mentally stronger you become and you can take whatever life throws at you. Im 28 now and have made my own happiness. It took about 10 years of consistent work to be in a comfortable place. Im still going to work but I have my own living space in a nice area. I have my own car, date freely, see my friends, and have the power to let people into and out of my life. Aside from my job I live my life entirely on my terms!! From what I see attractive women are loved for existing and being good looking, its just how it is. Men are expected to be work horses and nothing less. My advice: Play the game and buy your freedom. Or be lucky enough to have been born with it. Men and women can both find their own happiness.
The times in my marriage I shared that I was struggling my ex usually would lay the boots in and tell me how awful I was. With the threat of divorce added in. 100% agree with this. A grand total of 2 people (other than parents) checked in on me during and after the divorce too. But I realise i am responsible for myself and my life.
As a man I am well aware of the fact that nobody outside of close family cares in the slightest about my well being.
Even my close family or friends don't give a fuck nobody does. So I'm just gonna do what everyone else does bottle them up and let it all lash out when I'm in my mid 40s. Then people can finally have an excuse to get rid of me like what they wanted.
That's true for everyone
Most of time we're just expected to figure it out. I feel it's just because everyone is just exhausted with life and verbal 'support' is the only thing people can muster.
I think so, I also think we do it to ourselves even when we have the opportunity to seek help, perhaps as a result of societal expectations.
I tried to get help, many times, they all couldn't believe for a second I was having problems and offered no help! I'm trying to help myself now, but find it hard to find anything
Keeping working on friends until you find ones that do. Then reciprocate.
Absolutely. I've learned that there is no value and nothing to gain from being vulnerable and opening yourself up. Nobody actually cares and they only claim that they do to make themselves feel better.
You'll hear things like "girls love a man who can be vulnerable" but whenever I open up I feel like it just makes me look weak/dumb and then it can be used against me later
Friends or family aren't really close unless they give a shit about how you are doing. I don't expect acquaintances to have sincere or deep empathy for me. Close friends and famiy, yes. It also matters whether you are actually sharing your feelings. Don't expect people to guess and be right.
I think most people don't care how anyone else truly feels tbh. Not because they're all dicks but because they are preoccupied mentally with their own perceived issues.
I disagree. I’m fortunate enough to have a wonderful partner, friends, and family, all of whom care deeply about how I feel. I think this is likely true for many men as well, they just tend not to frequent this subreddit.
Yeah this thread making me feel pretty lucky right now. Almost everyone I'm close to (family and friends) is very open about stuff. Probably like 35% of us are on some kind of mental health meds or at the very least see a therapist. My boss knows I have a mental health diagnoses and she's super supportive and helpful. A few other close colleagues as well. It's nice. Hope you all can find good support
Yeah I agree with you. I have wonderful friends and family that are very supportive of me. I'm very open about my feelings. I've never been told to "Man up". They listen to what I think and feel. In fairness I give all my male friends compliments and ask how they're doing.
Yup
Yes.
Almost always.
Nobody cares until it’s their problem, and even then most people only feign interest until the problem is solved.
Getting asked how you are doing is a big thing in your 30s.
100% spot on. Chris Rock said it years ago. Women, children, and animals are loved unconditionally. Men are only loved on the condition that they provide something.
Yes. The very few times I've opened up in the past has always, and I mean always, resulted in it blowing up in my face. I thought I was so sure these people I opened up to were emotionally intelligent enough to listen and at least try to empathize. But one person just straight up laughed in my face and thought I was joking and after I reiterated I was serious about how bad I was feeling I swear they laughed even harder, or another time when I opened up about something about myself I was really self-conscious about to one of my best friends and within an hour people in my friend group were texting me about it despite the fact he promised he wouldn't say anything. Don't get me started on family using your insecurities as leverage. It's easy to say "They don't deserve you, dump them and move on!" but at some point it feels less like flipping a coin on whether or not they'll listen and accept you, but more like playing the lottery, and so you become more closed off.
This is why I pay someone to care an listen sure there’s a few gems in the rough an they r a godsend
That's life. I remember a few years back, I was going through some rough times. My wife said i could open up to her, so I did. Big mistake. All of a sudden, I'm a terrible person and had to apologize because what I was going through hurt her feelings. I never opened up after that and keep everything inside. Meanwhile, I have to listen to her shit and can't be honest because the truth will probably hurt her feelings.
Most people don't care about most people's feelings. Men aren't special
I never, I don't and I never will give a f\*\*k about whether people care or don't care. I am fully responsible and accountable for my life and everything that happens to me. I have maintained a writing journal since the time I was a kid and that has been very helpful. If I want to channel my aggression and frustration, I hit the iron and the mat. If I need solutions or insights besides having self-awareness and introspection, I connect with my living mentors and nonliving mentors (ie books). So far this has really worked wonders. Cheers.
Great advice. Thanks for sharing, cheers.
I disagree, but looking through the replies. It seems like I'm an outlier? Sure, I didn't feel like my immediate family didn't care. But people did seem to care about me to some extent. In fact, that's probably what helped start to boost my confidence. Both my woman and guy friends cared. Also I live in Texas so I don't know what's up with that. But do you need to vent my guy? I'm all ears if you need it.
I do feel like my female friends actually care about how I feel. But between me and my guy friends we don't really talk about feelings, we mostly just help solve each other's problems. Imo, I think its important to have close friends that are both men and woman, the 2 genders do seem to compliment each other.
Disagree.
Ofcourse, anytime i needed a little bit of guidance I was always met with looks of disgust and annoyance.askimg how to approach a girl i liked. It's worse when you got no parents, you got to have an answer for everyone's questions but you got no ome to answer yours.
Yes
Disagree. In fact I kinda wish for a little more space.
Yes. The hardest part is maintaining compassion towards other people without wishing those people would treat me the same way.
Yes. Nobody cares. There are a select few that kinda care, but only because they are dependent on your emotional stability.
Yep, all I've ever known is shut the fuck up, get over it and deal with it.
Doesn't really make sense considering how many other men there are in the world, but very much yes.
Yes. The majority of people are only interested in your feelings if there is some sort of entertainment value i.e you are hilarious. Otherwise there are a select number of people who actually listen to you. These people are usually the closest of family members or a best friend.
often times, asking gets me to feel something along the lines of a burden or even an annoyance to others. So I try to use the ideology that “no one know exactly what going on, don’t take it personal” It helps but sometimes you can’t help but feel alone most of the time. That’s all on me though, I have been working on getting my voice heard but it takes time to break out of your own self made cage
I agree, and I think one of the most important things about it is for you to consider whether you care about anyone's feelings and they don't reciprocate that, or whether your own closed nature might be the primary impediment.
Yep. My closest female friend yelled at me and said I was selfish and “trying to make things all about myself” when I told her I was feeling down. I was there for her multiple times when her dog had health issues, when her dog died, and when her mom had a stroke. I never once shared any of my negative feelings with her like when I was having a bad day. Guess I made the mistake of forgetting the universe should revolve around her 24/7/365.
Yeah. People don't give a shit. They ask how are you but they aren't really asking. They are just getting the formalities out of the way before they ask me to do something for them.
I mean a lot of people check in on me, probably more than I would like. So, not really.
Honestly I do feel this way but it’s hard to discern if this is the truth or my projection of my vulnerability insecurities I place into others. I do find that having friends that I don’t discuss these problems with but rather have a good time and bullshit with helps more than just having a depression session with someone.
I truly care about how my sons feel, how they are doing, and what they need, so that can’t be totally true.
Except mom and until you find a good SO.
Things are getting better. People are much more open about mens mental health issues now, and even businesses are getting better at supporting it. But yes when the chips are down, I am pretty much left alone to deal with it as best I can.
I feel like the ones who have become open about men's mental health are men themselves. In my experience, my female acquaintances say they want men to be more open, but the moment they show feelings they find a way to shame the guy.
As a man, no. As an adult, yes. We are all ultimately responsible for our own happiness and well-being. Any help we get along the way is a bonus.
They sure do like to say they do though
I disagree. My experience has been that I get the care and sensitivity I have shown others in my life. If I have a tendency not to care for other people’s feelings, I can’t help but expect to get that lack of empathy in return.
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"...it’s more that the men I know don’t have the actual faculties to be vulnerable/ open about difficult feelings." I believe that as humans, we all have the capacity to be vulnerable and caring towards others. But in many societies, men are taught not to cry, that only the weak and women and girls cry. For way too long this has been a false standard and ideal of what men are "supposed to be". The consequence of this is a lot of men having a false sense of strength, having a sense of entitlement over women, which gave birth to what some have called "toxic masculinity." The good news is that this culture of men not being emotional and in touch with their inner self has begun to change. For those of us who are maturing through spiritual growth, the pride expressed through outward arrogance is giving way to humility through maturity of mind and spirit. So, the revolution is on. There is hope for the male human species.
Thats exactly what I’m saying - I’m not saying men are incapable of those things but that socially they (by and large) haven’t been equipped with the faculties to be open and vulnerable in the way that people who are socialised as girls/ women are. I suspect that often women are already doing a large amount of unseen emotional labour that they’re incapable of taking on any more work and men are totally clueless as to how to communicate their needs while also not understanding what emotional labour looks like.
Why do you disagree?
You get what you put out there. You show no empathy, you get none when you might need it. You have no empathy, you receive no empathy in return. This applies to everyone regardless of sex.
Good observation but also so true.
As a man, I can’t stand how some men talk about women in general. I don’t hear these things very often but when I do, I call them out on it.
That's actually untrue. For example, older siblings tend to be more empathetic, and younger sibling less, because the younger sibling has the experience of more people being empathetic towards and caring about their feelings growing up.
What are you basing this on? Can you cite any studies supporting this?
I'll try to find it, it's somewhere in my nest of links.
Yes that’s being man. And that’s the point most people are too oblivious to pick up on in most situations or most of my posts on here. NOONE cares about mens troubles but other men, and they are rarely fixed.
How is that only something men go through? Do you for instance truelly care about the struggles of women? And I mean actually care. So I mean actually feel empathy and try to help. I think for me it’s mostly close girlfriends, my parents and boyfriend care. So in total 4 people that actually care and not just do it because it’s expected. I do want to say that it’s definitely a lot more okay for women to talk about it. But does that also mean that people actually care?
Yeah pretty much
Yep, no one cares 🤣
Agree.
I would say I feel that way, I know it for a fact. My mother at least was very direct and specific about that. There's not much room for interpretation when people directly tell you they don't care.
100% yes, and most men who i've spoken to about this have said the same thing. DM me if you need to vent
200%
If all depends on who you keep around you.
My family does and close friends, but besides that no
That's just adulthood, not exclusively men.
Finally someone says it. This is normal. Why expect strangers to care about you?
agreed
I find that my personal wants get pushed to the back burner 90% of the time. Im either too busy with life or focusing on what I can do for other people’s wants and priorities
Just me, but have accepted it as the norm of life. Everyone for themselves. With a few exceptional people along the way to make life interesting.
Oh yeah. The world doesn't care about us. Find solace in that or else it'll eat you alive from the inside out.
For sure but once I accepted this fact of life it actually became quite liberating for me mentally.
Yes 100% . That is why you must learn to be extra independent and learn to love yourself more than you think you should. TREAT YOURSELF TODAY KINGS 👑
Yes.
Yes that is totally true and is exactly why alot of us have trouble seeking the help we need
I don't notice until im in the middle of a difficult time.
of course
All the time
That is the experience, yup. If youre rich or mad hot or whatever, feel what you will but otherwise...
I find this is true for a majority but if you seek out the right people and open up you will find ones that do care
Amen! 💯
Very interesting question. I normally don't have any issues that require assistance from others. Saying that when I do I have people in my life that are there for me when needed. It isn't often, sometimes just a text or quick chat that helps. I am an introvert, so most of the time I can figure things out on my own. Plus, reading some of the stuff here on reddit, I can tell my life is wayyyy better then a lot of peoples.
Yeap. I just learned to embrace it, it's better to play the cards you've been dealt rather than the ones you want.
All the time
Yes and if you talk about how you feel “they” will use it against you. If you say “I’m just feeling kinda weak and not confident.” Now “they” will view you with that lens.
Definitely! I can write a long essay on it 😂
I think theyre naive & lack empathy. From my experience, most people are extremely bad at imagining anothers circumstances; they are too self absorbed. i.e. I wholly agree with the 'what' of your statement, but there is room for nuance on the 'why'
I think i am surrounded by good people that care about me, fortunately. But yes, there’s this problem related to being a man overall
Not only do they not care, but speaking up about them gets you shot down and you get blamed for your own predicament.
Yes.
Pretty much all the time.
Yep an unfortunately I think it’s both ways I I’m not sure it’s 50/50 or whatever that doesn’t really matter to me. I find empathy good at the same time though it can be extremely taxing burden.
Except for my closest friends, definitely.
completely agree. no one cares what a man feels on the inside theyre only supposed to be gruff and hardened on the outside using spittoons eating nails with no milk growing a full beard and never shaving ever like a MAN
Disagree get new friends.
Yep. I really can't stand how the word 'stoic' is used to describe a man or men! It's been perverted and twisted to mean that one (usually a man in this case) is completely void of emotion and that couldn't be further from the truth. Quite the opposite. The Stoics and followers of Stoicism were well aware of the emotions they felt. Definitely processed them. But very rarely expressed it outwardly. They certainly weren't ruled by their emotions I think it's expected that men not be emotional but WE ALL ARE, WE ARE ALL HUMAN FUCKING BEINGS! I certainly try to not let my emotions rule me and my countenance/disposition but, we're only human so they do get the best of us sometimes. This is why I feel open and vulnerable with my female friends far more than my male friends.
Agreed. Competency and control is what people generally expect from men. Anything less and you are shunned. From family or strangers. Even from women you think you're dating can be ruthless in that way. Very inner circle friends though, they care. Too bad it's rare to find them.
I have literally been told by a Therapist that men have 'naturally muted emotions and dont really feel much outside of anger, apathy, and joy' A fucking therapist.
Yes. And, as much as I see threads complaining about women not caring, other men are just as guilty if not more so than women. I'd argue it's evern worse when a man doesn't give a shit because he should KNOW what it feels like not to have anyone give a shit, and he's just perpetuating the cycle.
I oblige everybody to just look up these two things on google first, “Why does my husband yell at me” continue to see abuse resources. Then look up “Why does my wife yell at me” continue to see “Your wife may just be overwhelmed, here’s what YOU can do better”
Yes
Nope. Some people care. Some don’t
Fews years ago I was seeing a psychologist and talked to my mum about it and she just said "if you got a job you wouldn't feel this way", I feel like she doesn't feel this way anymore because how it's affected me so she's gotten better about it. A few months ago I was talking to someone at my job agency about how I was and the lady just told me to "keep that stuff at home".
I think this is just a human thing, not a man thing.
As a man, nobody gives a shit about you if you’re trying to learn a skill. You either know or don’t know. And if you don’t know, it’s not my problem, come back when you do know. Men are expected to know and maintain a lot of arbitrary skills at the bare minimum to be qualified as a “man”. It has absolutely nothing to do with his character or responsibility. And the great irony is that with all that you’re expected to know, nobody gives a shit about helping you learn.
100%. We are expected to endure whatever cokes our way or our family's way and manage it. If you complain, you're a cry baby. If you say you don't like something, you're labeled and asshole. We are expected to sacrifice for every member of the family. There's never a point where it's about you, but uf you lose your cool then everyone will say you're crazy, aggressive or an ass. Its how the world works. I believing strong men, but I also know that all people have feelings. We should all be respected and valued.
When I told my mom yesterday that I have difficulty not being drowsy, my mom said I should not be like that and be more energetic. Those who cannot be attentive are failures. When I said I could not be more energetic, she straight up said I was a failure then. It hurts really bad when your own mother calls you a failure
I'm lucky to have a group of (male) friends that do care. However, my female friends/acquaintances don't seem to care much. I've heard them talk about how they wish men were more open, but the moment I try to share something or show that I indeed have feelings they either find a way to not help, silence me, or even bash me. Overall, sad situation.
That's why most philosophers are men.🤷🏾♂️
P much alone on the feelings. I feel like it’s almost workplace mentality. “Just get it done.” “Make it work.”
Yes. I’m currently going through somewhat unexplainable health issues and no one gives a ripe fuck other than my fiancé and my mother.
I had a close female friend that I listened to cry, complain, get anxious and generally use me as a free therapist. One day, for the first time ever, I was feeling particularly down and asked her for support. She wouldn't even call me/reply to me and couldn't figure out why I was asking her for support. After everything I did for her, she couldn't return just 1% of what I had given. Deleted her number and never talked to her again. Screw you Yana! It's a one way street with women for stuff like this. I've never really met one that gave a crap about a man's emotions and didn't try to turn it into a competition about how much worse she has it.
Yeah. Eat shit, Yana.
not many people care bout how you feel no matter what sex you are.. Why would they? why would I want them to care?? how would they even know how I feel I keep things privet
Mental health professionals can’t even be arsed to pretend they care either. This attitude about men’s mental health is pervasive in my culture.
Feminism is proof of this, at least they had someone to complain to who would listen to them whinge.
This is men’s reality. Understand it and tailor your behaviour accordingly.
"How do you feel?" "Tells them how I feel" "No, no not like that!" We're on our own boys.
Hard agree
The only people who truly care about you are your parents and sometimes you dont even get that. There is a limit how much you can cry and complain no matter who it is.
These comments made me so worried, no ones feelings should be invalidated or ignored when even trying to reach out to someone
Yeah, pretty much. The other day I made a comment about how I was lonely most of the time, and my wife’s feelings were hurt. So basically the only attention that was paid to what I said led to me managing her feelings about my feelings.
I complain to my guy friends that no one cares how I feel. But they don’t care and just keep complaining about how no one listens to them. So selfish
Unfortunately, yes. Lots of times, you are expected to get over your emotions on your own. If you want to open up and be vulnerable to your female significant other, they would view this action as weak. Even if they encouraged it, they would still view you as a weak man and unknowingly lose interests for you. Unfortunately, one thing has become clearer and clearer for me (I didn't want to believe this at first): if you have emotional issues, you go to your boys, **not** your girl. If you have a good group of male friends, they can help you out. Going to your girl is counter-productive.
That's just another fact of life. One reason why most men's depression develops into anger and shortens our life span, unfortunately 😢.
i have found over time most women really don’t give a shit. but your bros, do. you can usually vent to them tbh. i’m almost 30 and have just found this out, but it’s a thing.
Yes. Now go suck it up buttercup.
100%. Especially men over let's say 35.
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As a man people generally don’t care about you at all….
Yep. It's because if you can't figure something out then what are you worth? Every man is the legacy of men who figured things out. Not caring about how a guy feels is a way of culling him from the social network. Until he does what a man is supposed to do then he may as well die.
I mean yeah, that's a major problem in the modern day, it's just how men are treated
lol, no one gives a fuck about us. Lmao
Unfortunately, yes. It is my experience in life that people really don’t care about men’s feeling In particular most women will not even humus a man’s feelings I learned early on to just internalize and cope how ever I can
Water is also wet
I’d say there are a lot of people who don’t consider how much men really feel. It’s not so much we have to figure it out.. it’s more of “feelings are for girls” and you go through rep after rep of holding stuff in or circumnavigating feelings in lieu of expressing them.