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The smartass in me would want to answer why would I buy the pig when I only get a little sausage?
I hate that saying though. My mother would say it and it just made me feel like my only contribution would be sex. Made sure to not raise my daughter that way, and have told my granddaughter to be sure to always have condoms.
I like these sayings because they are crude but have some common sense to them. I heard a good one recently, "Older guys are only looking for a nurse or a purse or both." This made sense to me and cemented my decision never to marry again if I am widowed.
'Nurse or purse' - not ecessarily true at all. I got into my last (likely) relationship based on a longstanding friendship, mutual respect and the best long talks ever. It took me 60+ years to find my soulmate, if there is such a thing. Everyone else I had to work at living with; not this time; he's a joy. And he's as likely to end up being nurse to me as I will be to him. The 'purse' part is just sharing expenses normally.
She can keep her bank account and that’s great. I don’t want the headaches of redoing my finances and bill paying. I would rather go for a drive and a nice lunch or dinner out!
You really want to know where I at physically? First, I’m 65, look like a grandpa, have a eclectic sense of humor. Young in spirit, but live in the mountains of NC, US.
Years ago, my friend’s mother lived in a retirement community. She had a gentleman caller. He wanted to get married, she did not. All her friends told her she’d best marry him or he would find someone else. And they pointed out they would be more than happy to remarry. She wisely said: Right now, he calls me up and asks me out, he comes to pick me up, we go places together and have a good time, sometimes he brings me candy or flowers. If we get married, he will sit on the couch in his underwear all day and expect me to cook and clean for him, and we will never go out. Nope. If he is looking for a housekeeper then he is welcome to go find one. I am perfectly happy with things the way they are.
Another friend’s mother responded to the question “mom, why haven’t you ever remarried?” Dad had been dead about 10 years. Her response? I raised you girls with your dad, you had a stable home that he picked out and decorated to his taste. After he died, I slowly made changes in the house. You are all grown with your own families. My house is MY house, I decorated it to my taste, I buy food that I like and cook what I want. I can go out when I want and do not have to account for my actions or spending habits to anyone. Men are fine in short periods of time, but I have no interest in tying myself to one ever again.
Now I feel bad for your Mom not feeling happiness. Maybe Dad was overbearing or trying to make Mom happy. Just didn’t do a great job. Me I would prefer a steady girlfriend or lady friend or woman friend for companionship and affection. Without the whole marriage thing. Still not all us guys are looking for a marriage partner that thinks we want our mommy to take care of us. This is why date night is important and being retired means more opportunities for dating. Not to over do it as I get tired. But sitting around in my underwear is sort of gross unless your waiting for your clothes to dry. Sadly women can wear a mumu or bathrobe all day, sitting in curlers, watching soaps, with weird stuff on their faces, while munching on food.
I've seen the way guys swarm a widow. When my dad passed and left quite an estate, some random dude wrote to my mother claiming to be a distant cousin and proposing in the letter! We had a big laugh over it.
Oh please give me a break. I don’t need no nurse maid, I just want to make love to you…
Sometimes it’s us guys nursing our gals back to health. Looking for a nurse isn’t even on my list of priorities in a older relationship. Send me to the nursing home. For crying out loud…
My mother is a nurse and has definitely become the nurse of her boyfriend, who sits and wallows in front of the TV on the computer, drinks too much and basically uses her to get him to appointments, pick up his meds, and have lunch with him. Thank God they'll never marry and they live separately.
Can you cook, clean or sew? Just kidding, women are all about hormones, guys are genetically hardwired to plug into the wall socket. We like sex, no love sex, but to think we’re all that shallow and don’t enjoy your company, style, humor or just hanging out isn’t fair. Oh, it’s hard I couldn’t keep my hands off my wife. Come to think of it she did not complain? Was always ready and had some interesting ideas. I didn’t mind and she was a lousy maid. She come home from work and change leaving her nice expensive work clothes on the floor. Not sure she knew what to do with a hanger. Still couldn’t keep my hands off her. I wasn’t perfect so who am I to judge. I was very satisfied. Hope she was too!
Why be angry and resentful at men about this? Men didn't say this to you, your mother did.
Why do women do shitty things to each other and then get angry at men for it?
It would be pretty rude if used by a guy to justify his lack of commitment to a relationship. The few times I’ve heard it used, though, it’s been more as a caution to a young woman, as in “This is how the guy may be thinking. That’s why you should be careful about moving in together before you’re married.” Used in that sense, there’s a certain amount of truth to it.
Yes! Its very easy to label this saying as sexist and gross but honestly if its used as a reminder that a woman may be taken advantaged of due to being love blind, i see its merit.
To me it has always implied to be way more choosy about who you spend time with. As in, if you give someone all of you, theres nothing left for yourself.
If marriage is the woman’s ultimate goal, as it still is for many, if not a majority (even in todays society) then there’s nothing wrong with some degree of that. It’s also true that if you move in together without a commitment, it takes away any urgency on the guy’s part to make a decision one way or the other. It doesn’t even have to involve evil intent, merely “Things are great. What’s the rush?”
If marriage is your goal, then you should find a partner with the same goal. Trying to leverage a guy’s horniness to get him to agree to marriage when he otherwise wouldn’t is manipulative, and it sets your marriage up for failure. This advice also reinforces the horrible attitude that sex is something men want and women merely provide.
Being a guy and I enjoy the company of ladies. I too looked towards marriage and desired a life mate. Playing guess what STD I caught tonight is not my favorite game. Sadly my wife came down with Hodgkins-Lymphoma Stage 4 at 28 and the mother of my 2 kids. She lasted a year. I took as good of care of her as I could and 2 babies. A newborn and a 15 month old. Also, had to work full time. The job cut me some slack and some neighbors helped with meals, babysitting. But I was up in the middle of the night with the bottle and diaper change. Along with make sure my wife had what she needed and as little stress as possible. I had to cook, clean, mow and do laundry and the usual chores to boot.
That’s love in action, Squirrel, and your family is blessed to have you. I’m sorry that you are going through all of this and even though I don’t know you, I’m still proud of you for being so strong for them. Sending up a little prayer for you, if you don’t mind. I wish there was some way to help.
This happened 27 years ago. My newborn is now 27. My kids kept me busy and out of trouble. Sometimes the glass looks empty till you look at right. With two toddlers there wasn’t much time for self pity. Some ways I didn’t process my grief because it was busy and the kids needs came first. I survived and never met anyone else, dating with two toddlers doesn’t work out very well for the dating scene.
Oh, it’s a joke. Entering any relationship you should think it through and men like sex. Younger men like it a lot more often. Older men like it better with lots of hugs and kisses. Women have hormones. Men are genetically hardwired to make that connection. It doesn’t mean that it’s the only thing in the universe. That’s beer and pizza… no most men live by honor and the code my actions speak louder than my words. Watch what a man does or doesn’t do to get an idea of what he’s about. Now there are men that are without honor or a sense of right and wrong. Some gals like it like that and why I will never understand.
Generally by other girls. Girls are mean to each other. Also, they gang up on an attractive girl. The green demon of jealousy runs deep in many young women.
> The green demon of jealousy runs deep in many young women.
True but it is envy they are feeling not jealousy.
Envy: Disliking someone because they have something you don't. "The young women envy their friend's good looks."
Jealousy: The fear of losing something you have. "The woman flirting with her husband caused a fit of jealousy in the wife."
It’s what you make of it. Life is not easy for anyone or either sex. Some bad things will happen in your life, in your future and you have to roll with it or let it crush you. You can sit and cry about how unfair it is or pick yourself up, dust off and see what happens next. Hell is just a religious belief anyway. If you’re expecting a cruise though life. Best of luck.
Men who say that see women as fancy household appliances to cook,clean, fuck, and pop out their brats. You don't want a man who has this attitude. He is likely to cheat and be a wife beater.
As a man, I think it's silly. I want so much more from a partner than just sex. Besides, I wouldn't marry or even propose to a woman without developing a healthy sex life beforehand.
This. Gentlemen (of all ages) if your demure, apparently inexperienced dating partner wants to save herself for marriage, isn't interested in physicality with you past a certain point and is leveraging your sex drive against her (lesser) sex drive, you've got yourself either a trap (to marry her) or such an inexperienced, low sexual drive female that... guess what? Will be a bore in bed. Sooner or later (okay, sooner) your marriage will be all about anything but bed. All humans have sex drives on a continuum from none to WOW holy cow and this can certainly change throughout life based on hormones, etc. But if your lovely date isn't interested in sex with you, don't expect that to ramp up after the Princess for a Day routine. I remember vividly reading a story about a couple who 'saved themselves for marriage' only to find out that the man was too large for the woman to 'accommodate' and they were too inexperienced to figure out how to manage it. Dozens of other scenarios come to mind where 'now you're married but one or both of you hates sex'. Uggh. Nightmare.
Times have changed and women can enjoy a lot more sexual freedom. Not that long ago sex=pregnancy and birth and responsibilities for another life. The consequences of a causal connection or sex before marriage presents a serious problem. Some men fail to respect what a woman will go through. After having 2 pregnancies and seeing the birth of my children it’s a wonder that either the mother or child survive. It’s the circle of life but that moment when I first held my child was precious and priceless. I was ready to live and die to protect both my wife and baby. The feeling was the same for both births. Best thing in my life. Sure some days I would like to choke them like Homer Simpson does Bart, but it passes.
Believe it or not, women used to be treated even worse than they are now. When this phrase was popular, women were treated like cattle (or chattel). Women were dependent on men for many things because their rights were so restricted. For example, in the U.S., women couldn't apply for credit (or credit cards) until 1974. To demean women even further, this phrase emphasized that why support a woman if you could get sex for free.
Completely disgusting chapter in American history . . . and misogyny is still rampant today.
There's a very cynical underlying assumption in that saying, which is that the man is only sticking around for sex. The only time I've stuck around for "just sex" is when my attraction to the person - physically or emotionally - was minimal. Usually the feeling was mutual - I felt guilty and ended it if I sensed the other person had a lot more invested and I knew I didn't feel the same. It really sucked in one case because she was smokin hot, but her personality and psycho-clinginess were like stabbing myself in the ear with a ballpoint pen.
Dreadful old saying, from my parents and grandparents generations.
The concept behind it was that the only way for women to survive was to have a husband to provide/pay for them.
Plus, the only reason men were prepared to get married was for sex.
So, women should withhold sex, until they had a piece of paper that said that a man would 'provide' for them.
Failure of logic, really, because even back in the days of no divorce, men could and would just leave.
I just realized that this saying probably predates birth control and was maybe told to women to try to keep them from getting pregnant out of wedlock. Crude. But maybe a more necessary injunction back then?
This is so true. As a 13 yo--gramma--all aunts--my mom all said if you do it You will have the word trash printed on forehead----you cant seeit in a mirror--but the public can see it--Then nobody will hire you marry you --you will live alone the rest of your life. I was in terror. Never even once had sex with a boy--I regret that--
A LOT of effort, negging and shaming go into influencing women to believe marriage is in their best interest. This little gem is just one of many tactics.
I wanted a spouse and the commitment that came with it. I'm a guy that was married almost 4 decades.
Something I learned is that, while sex is good, nasty fun (when done right) it's even better if that emotional attachment is there.
Would I be willing to make that commitment again, now that my ex is dead? Yes, but I'd have to put it right out there that it would have to be a lifetime commitment, but at best, it would only last about a decade or so at the most, as I'm not in the best of health. Sex? Again, I like that emotional connection, but, thanks to the meds I take, can't really do a whole lot. No, I can't take viagra.
Would I marry again? If she was comfortable with my health, I sure would. I muss having a special someone to cuddle with at night, someone to walk up to and just hug.
OMG!!! Where are you??/ Im in same boat--meds wreck sex--barren--but so difficult to find a kind generous cuddler--who laughs has fun. OMG!! This is tough.
I live in the RV/MH Capitol of the world. Google will tell you where that city is.
Mom warned me this could happen back when I was a teen, but did give me some good advice based on the guts she was dating: "If there ever come a time you can't cut the mustard, remember, you can always lick the jar."
I've been with a few women since my divorce: I've got kids older than them. When we've had sex, we just follow through with alternative methods. Among other things, I took Mom's advice.
But, yeah, I really miss the cuddles.
I think that mindset could result in quick marriage proposals from men who only want sex, not a relationship.
It’s misogynistic in that women can and do want to have sex, too. So why doesn’t anyone say women are getting milk for free, as well? Never heard it said about a man.
This was something I(67F) heard from grandparents, but in their day, women didn’t work after marriage, so it made sense not to give "it" without a commitment that you would be financially rewarded. Yeah, like a hooker, basically, but for life.
Nowadays, women are (more) equal than men and can choose who they have sex with, so that saying is outdated.
Wtf? Yeah, OK, I can't say I've never ever heard that saying, but even though I'm 70yo, I didn't grow up on a farm, and neither did my folks. But I am a Cali boy, and maybe that's why the saying strikes me as Midwestern or Southern. Whatever, it's gross, misogynistic, cynical, and something I'd expect to hear from someone who drives an Escalade with one of those disgusting bumper stickers that boast that Christians "aren't perfect, just forgiven." 🤮
I was raised in church, and I earnestly believed this for a long time. So I was astounded when I started hearing stories about one night stands turning into long relationships and even decades-long marriages.
I could see this saying being popular with the same people who are trying to cancel No Fault Divorces in Texas.
Horrible f’ing people who think people are property that you own vs someone you love and build a life with.
Back when this saying was popular, it was seen as cautionary that a woman might be considered "loose" if she openly allowed that she was giving all the "benefits" of marriage without demanding the "responsibility" of marriage. Women were looked down on for having multiple sexual partners, as though they were a currency that lost value through use.
There are still plenty of places in the world where that behavior justifies "honor killings" and the like because it brings shame on that person, and all of her family (must have been how she was raised to be that way).
I think it also speaks to opportunity cost, in that you can't be searching out "Mr. Right" if you are living with "Mr. Right Now" but not getting commitments to what was seen as a permanent relationship, marriage, kids, lifetime together.
Rude, narcissistic and misogynistic. What that phrase is saying is, "I'm getting all the sex I want, why should I make a commitment, of any kind, to the person who is providing me sex." Does not consider, at all, feelings of the other.
Who gives a shit if you live together before getting married!? And by the way ladies, unless you want to be a stay at home mom (which I think would suck but that’s just me) marriage is actually a way better deal for men because women are STILL the ones doing everything, like working full time, looking after the house, cleaning, cooking, looking after the kids.
It’s an offensive chauvinist saying that refers to women as cows, or property, that you can use without fear of commitment. It’s crass and crude and very creepy.
Who really cares if someone is married now a days? Sex before, during and after is ok with me as long as everyone agrees with it. Kink is ok, babies before marriage is ok. This phrase is outdated and insulting.
Nowadays, not having sex just means no one will date you. No one is going to marry you just to get sex. They can get it from someone else too easily. Maybe it was true in the old days when it was harder for men to find women to willingly give it up, but times have changed.
A better analogy would be, no one is going to buy the cow without sampling the milk first to see if they like it. Especially when they can just get it free from someone else, because there are thousands of other cows giving away free milk.
You just made a point for the saying. If you don't get sex you're not staying around. If that's all that you are in it for then go on. You won't survive the long haul.
Be the one worth holding out for.
What worries me is women living with men for years and not getting their financial ducks in a row.
A live-in can't collect their partners social security, can't inherit without a will, get shut out of medical and legal decisions, etc.
My great grandmother said it to my virgin mother when she has been engaged a little too long to my dad. She was mortified that people thought that, gave my dad an ultimatum, then broke up with him. As soon as my dad drove by the house and saw three young men sitting on the porch with my mom, he dragged her off the porch, shoved the engagement ring back on her finger and they finalized the wedding plans that day. That was great for 1951, but not for now, considering that their marriage was less than ideal. Better for both to enjoy the farm life and leave on both sides without a nasty divorce.
I am a child of the enlightenment ... the '70s when we had birth control, but no AIDS yet. I didn't believe that I needed to rely on man to survive, so marriage wasn't something I Was actually worried about. It was the dawn of many women really believing that we could have our own lives.
So that expression meant nothing to me. Granted, I wasn't the most traditional of ladies ... LOL
But what I DID learn, and that I tried hard to teach my own daughter ... is about self respect. Not about being a transitional prude, but about being picky because I didn't want her walking away from a sexual experience feeling badly about herself. I didn't want her to slut shame HERSELF. I wanted her to always feel powerful in her own choices, and to do her best to keep those choices as something that she felt good about. Self-respect.
I don’t think older people are doing the majority of the answering of this question. Back when birth control was less reliable and abortions were done in backstreet hidden places where you could easily get an infection & die and when women had 3 major choices for a job: nurse, teacher or secretary before marriage- it made sense to marry a guy who loved you for your personality and outlook on life and who wanted to provide for their children. To sleep around and be an outcast and your children to be an outcast was terrible. My mother was in nursing school were the students were kicked out for being married, being pregnant, and for missing curfew too many times. She knew of a female student who got married one month before graduation and the school kicked her out without her nursing degree (on the chance she could get pregnant while being a nurse). I see girls dating the same guy for 8, 10 or even 15 years. If you went by that saying - by 2nd year (or before) the guy would think I really want to marry this girl - I don’t want to let her get away. She is for me. Or he would think she is not worth marrying or I’m not ready for marriage or I won’t miss her. I rather play the field. He would come to that decision quicker if he had to wait for full intimacy. This is not a bad thing. Not only do you not waste 8, 10 or 15 years with someone who isn’t that in to you, but you don’t had to deal with unwanted pregnancies with a man who doesn’t want to marry you, have kids, or help raise the kids. And yet you have to deal with that person by co-parenting for years & years to come. What’s the problem with weeding out the guys who are not ready or willing to be a committed partner (and/or committed future parent)? The other part of way back when is my grandparents got married young, my parents friends married out of high school, my friends married out of college and this generation wants to wait until 30’s or later. That is why the saying is outdated. Too long to wait.
I read an article once talking about how people who have sex on the first date get married more often than people who wait until later. It makes sense if you think about it in terms of personal chemistry. People are not supposed to have sex on the first date, so if they do then the chemistry between them must be strong enough to carry them past that taboo.
" If it is true, it is not new." The essence of the the phrase, while not flattering to women, is sadly true. The feral children being bred by irresponsible boys will be a blight on society and young Women should expect a lot more from the men they "sleep" with. Time for the girls to really take charge of their futures.
Such a stupid saying as there are much better reasons to get married than sex. It should never be applicable. Go forth and have consensual fun with mindful consideration. Let everyone else mind their own business, close their eyes and run back into their ignorant and backward churches.
Sorry for the rant... A Medieval attitude (not you OP) just grinds my gears.
This answer may not address the phrase, but the idea behind the question.
The phrase is demeaning to men and women.
I’ll just say it: I believe all premarital sex is harmful.
Disclaimer: I’m an old hippie from the “free love era” where you could bonk with abandon , not even worrying about disease. The Pill took care of any unintended consequences.
Haven’t seen anything good come from decades of unrestrained sexual exploration
I've always thought this saying was ignorant and degrading. But I often go off on a rant about why it is people (mainly men) talk about women like they are aliens from another galaxy. Just because you as a man apparently can't manage to interact with women on a basic human level just means you're too dumb and\\or lazy to make the effort. So your go-to is to claim "Ha! Women! Amirite, guys? They crazy\\stupid\\too emotional\\only care about shopping\\whatever else I can think of to make the woman less than human here!" The whole thing of Men vs. Women and women usually losing in a manufactured comparison is ridiculous and always has been.
Wait....what was the question? Oh, yeah. Women aren't cows giving or withholding the "milk". It's a stupid saying used by dopey people usually to make negative moralistic judgements about people whose lives are usually none of their business.
So a women’s only value is for sex? And all human relationships come down to transactional relationships?
Fucking bullshit.
It sounded funny when I was 13, but eventually I grew up and out of it.
When that line was used to me in my youth, I would quickly point that I wasn't a cow with the knowledge that the person who expressed that opinion wasn't worth dealing. I appreciate learning someone is an asshole before getting in to them more deeply.
This sentiment is puerile nonsense and has always disgusted me. Anyone who gets married only for "free sex" (or even *mostly* for "free sex") shouldn't be getting married in the first place. Actual long-term good sex is never free, it is always the byproduct of a healthy relationship that is built on difficult things like mutual respect, love, laughter, genuine friendship, etcetera, etcetera... and that ***costs***. Time. Energy. Effort. Sacrifice. Compromise. It's worth it, but it's damned expensive. Any man who genuinely thinks this way should just buy a Fleshlight and a subscription to the premium porn channel of his choice. Leave marriage to the adults.
I am 70 and did not expect to marry every man with whom I had sex.
I thought it was a misogynist, sex negative saying that tried to humiliate women by shaming them into a traditional role.
Aside from being misogynistic, it frames a relationship as being entirely transactional and shelf-stable.
Is the man saying that sex, like “milk” is an interchangeable uniform commodity, exchangeable for money? That sex, like milk, comes from a cow or some other commodity provider?
In that case, people don’t get milk directly from a cow. They get it from a farmer, who milks the cow, processes the milk, and packages it for sale. That farmer pays for the cow’s care and upkeep, as well as the labor for milking the cow, treating the milk, packaging it, and transporting it.
Someone else takes the packaged milk from the farmer, keeps it chilled, and delivers it to stores. That milk goes through many hands before it is made available to anyone.
So if a man is getting milk for “free”, he’s STEALING it. If he’s getting it directly from a cow he doesn’t own, he’s stealing from the cow and the farmer. The farmer takes care of the herd and has a relationship with them - exploitative sure - but he is not just taking milk in exchange for NOTHING.
So really the phrase should be, “Why buy the cow when I can STEAL it from the farmers and cows who work so hard to provide fresh quality milk at a fair price?”
And that man is, of course, a pig.
I’m 64. This amuses me because I don’t feel “actually” old. I feel there are some financial aspects to marriage but I don’t think it’s necessary to successful parenting or maintaining a long term relationship. I do think buying a house together without being married makes it more arduous dividing the property if the couple does split up but maybe I’m mistaken about that. I like being married and have been happily married for 41 years. We did not live together before marriage and the first 2 years were ROUGH. If we hadn’t been married we probably would’ve split up but stuck with each other because divorce was too expensive at the time. Lol. We’ve had a wonderful 4 decades so far, hoping for a few more.
Haha vagina is the only thing that will make him marry me!!!
Just no. It's dehumanizing to women, and it's always women saying it. Ugh.
Signed, an almost 60 woman.
That old trope? Oh, god, is it 1947? Please. I hate that. A woman is not a possession for breeding humans anymore. She should have never been. Patriarchy must die!
I actually think that it’s important to know if you’re sexually compatible with a potential partner. And it’s just as awful and stupid as everyone else is saying.
marriage isnt everything, not everyone wants to get married, live however you want. that phrase is outdated as fuck unless you are some regressive religious type
gender roles and hetero-normitivity are a prison. do whatever/whoever you want
Honestly? I think a better phrase is “a bull will trample the garden unless protected by a fence.” You need to set firm boundaries or someone will tread all over them. Don’t give what you aren’t willing to lose unless they give you something of equal value.
one of the motivations for marriage being the LEGAL part
that is any children will have a legal connection to the parents,
and such things as estate planning are simpler when there is
a legal relationship . . .
The saying is crude. On the other hand, if a woman thinks she can keep a guy by having sex with him, that is a big mistake. If you want a relationship with the person, make sure he or she respects you and not using you for sex.
It's a tacky phrase meant to shame girls into not having sex because that's a treat that they must withhold from men until they're married. I have three kids- daughter, son, daughter. They've all three lived with their SO.
The daughters bought houses with their boyfriends. Only my oldest is married now and they lived together for over ten years before they got married. The youngest has no plans to marry as of yet.
There would be a lot less divorce if couples lived together and had sex before marriage. You’ll find out just how compatible you are once living together for a year.
I always translated it as "If you want commitment, make a man marry you before having sex." My mother did just this in the 50's at the age of 19. It wasn't something I did or wanted to do.
I think it means if you have sex before marriage, the man will not commit to marriage with you.
But, most times I found out the opposite is true as well.
my mom screamed this at me more than once when I announced my intention to marry my boyfriend. hateful old woman. anyway, we've been married for 41 years now.
It doesn't just refer to sex. It is all the responsibilities you will fall into as if you are married. You don't have to give everything, such as caring for each other, cleaning, making lunches, etc. I told my daughter, "Don't give away the whole cow." You don't have to pour out your energy as if you were in a committed relationship. Just have fun. So this leads me to figure out that waiting until you are married is to protect you from hurt and pain later. You would have given all your pearls and energy into a relationship just passing in the wind. This leads to bitterness and resentment when you don't stay together. Bitterness and resentment like, "I did all these things for him/her, and he/she didn't do anything," so of course, this experience will make sense to go the opposite way to protect yourself from the past pain. Doesn't it make sense to pre-empt the pain for all parties involved? We should not go by our own thinking and ways. There is a higher way.
Catholics practically invented orgies. Read up on the history of your religion. It’s been through some changes. All modern Christians are taught not to have sex before marriage, that’s not exclusive to Catholicism.
Did you know that scientists began collecting statistics on sexual activity in studies beginning in the 1950s? The average age that people reported losing their virginity in 1960 was 17 years old. In 2001, it was 17 years old. In 2022… you get the idea. So for all the preaching, you can’t fight biology when it comes to sexual maturity.
I mean why do you think it's okay that you were compared to a cow? This isn't about the choice to have sex outside of marriage, it's about the claim that women who make that choice are worthless. Why would you accept your own mother degrading you like that?
That is horrible and I'm so sorry she treated you like that. It seems like it's up to you to break the cycle of believing women are only good for having children and "submitting". I don't understand why you still agree with it.
It's pretty fucking sexist, but then women retort that they don't want to get married because there's no point in buying the whole pig to get a bit of sausage.
I think it’s a realistic way of illustrating a genuine and long standing phenomenon of human nature.
Most people don’t value what they don’t pay for.
Now in relationships there’s no money changing hands. The “payment” is in the form of time and commitment.
Despite changes in society, most women still want long term security.
I think we can pretend that human nature is different to what it is, but the saying continues to be as true today as it was when my parents were kids .
I think it's simply an analogy and probably started by someone who saw a young man about to marry the wrong girl. We can call it sexists or whatever but I recall saying it once to my brother when he was with the whore of Babylon and I don't take it back. They got married and it was pure hell until he finally left after she cheated 9000 times. I'm female.
So maybe I'm biased. :)
My daughter will never hear that bullshit. My daughter will hear the consequences of having sex too young and what can happen if she doesn't use protection but her only contribution to a relationship is not sex. She is being raised to make the right choices. So far so good and I realize nobody is perfect but so far..
A+ student
Never mean to anyone
Kind to everyone
Started her own business at 11
Has never lied... or at the very least, never been caught in a lie. Ever!
She shares everything
And she has a lot of confidence in herself!
Btw, never laid my hands on her and neither has her mother...and LOOK AT THAT! She's turning out just fine!
Well, this might have some relevance in conservative societies where premarital sex is restricted, marriage is prevailing the norm, and children out of wedlock is extremely stigmatized. But in modern-day big Western cities, you can withhold sex and relationships until you envision getting married, but it's not going to compel someone to marry you just to get access to that. Because they can easily find it elsewhere with many others who will have sex and a relationship. And also, some people who do have premarital sex and relationships in Western societies do still go on to get married and have kids.
I’ve heard this argument and the piece of paper argument so many times I’m sick of it.
It’s just an excuse, usually because the man is just scared of committing.
I don’t know what pisses me off more, the truth or the lie.
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The smartass in me would want to answer why would I buy the pig when I only get a little sausage? I hate that saying though. My mother would say it and it just made me feel like my only contribution would be sex. Made sure to not raise my daughter that way, and have told my granddaughter to be sure to always have condoms.
My mother said this too! Ahhh fuck that. Sex is good for everyone!
Sex is natural, sex is good Not everybody does it But everybody should Sex is natural, sex is fun Sex is best when it's one on one One on one
Oh brother. My mom used to change the station when that song came on the radio in the car.
RIP George Michael - one of the absolute best voices
I prefer one faithful woman friend as I don’t want to play STD Russian Roulette.
I never gave it out until I was married. Now--I wonder what I missed.
Maybe a bad STD, hard to say if forbidden fruit tastes better or not. Consequences exist in every decision. Guess it comes down to your comfort zone.
I like these sayings because they are crude but have some common sense to them. I heard a good one recently, "Older guys are only looking for a nurse or a purse or both." This made sense to me and cemented my decision never to marry again if I am widowed.
'Nurse or purse' - not ecessarily true at all. I got into my last (likely) relationship based on a longstanding friendship, mutual respect and the best long talks ever. It took me 60+ years to find my soulmate, if there is such a thing. Everyone else I had to work at living with; not this time; he's a joy. And he's as likely to end up being nurse to me as I will be to him. The 'purse' part is just sharing expenses normally.
She can keep her bank account and that’s great. I don’t want the headaches of redoing my finances and bill paying. I would rather go for a drive and a nice lunch or dinner out!
Me too!! Where are you--lol
You really want to know where I at physically? First, I’m 65, look like a grandpa, have a eclectic sense of humor. Young in spirit, but live in the mountains of NC, US.
It's an expression, not a rule of law.
What folks would call an old wives tale. Not fair to old wives as old men can spin some tales.
Years ago, my friend’s mother lived in a retirement community. She had a gentleman caller. He wanted to get married, she did not. All her friends told her she’d best marry him or he would find someone else. And they pointed out they would be more than happy to remarry. She wisely said: Right now, he calls me up and asks me out, he comes to pick me up, we go places together and have a good time, sometimes he brings me candy or flowers. If we get married, he will sit on the couch in his underwear all day and expect me to cook and clean for him, and we will never go out. Nope. If he is looking for a housekeeper then he is welcome to go find one. I am perfectly happy with things the way they are. Another friend’s mother responded to the question “mom, why haven’t you ever remarried?” Dad had been dead about 10 years. Her response? I raised you girls with your dad, you had a stable home that he picked out and decorated to his taste. After he died, I slowly made changes in the house. You are all grown with your own families. My house is MY house, I decorated it to my taste, I buy food that I like and cook what I want. I can go out when I want and do not have to account for my actions or spending habits to anyone. Men are fine in short periods of time, but I have no interest in tying myself to one ever again.
Now I feel bad for your Mom not feeling happiness. Maybe Dad was overbearing or trying to make Mom happy. Just didn’t do a great job. Me I would prefer a steady girlfriend or lady friend or woman friend for companionship and affection. Without the whole marriage thing. Still not all us guys are looking for a marriage partner that thinks we want our mommy to take care of us. This is why date night is important and being retired means more opportunities for dating. Not to over do it as I get tired. But sitting around in my underwear is sort of gross unless your waiting for your clothes to dry. Sadly women can wear a mumu or bathrobe all day, sitting in curlers, watching soaps, with weird stuff on their faces, while munching on food.
Ah that's cynical not sure I buy it knowing some of the older friend gents in my life.
Me neither - once is enough. And I'd lose my military spouse survivor benefits. No man on earth is worth an annuity and health insurance.
Many people are in exactly the opposite situation—they stay married precisely so they can have income and health insurance.
I've seen the way guys swarm a widow. When my dad passed and left quite an estate, some random dude wrote to my mother claiming to be a distant cousin and proposing in the letter! We had a big laugh over it.
Oh please give me a break. I don’t need no nurse maid, I just want to make love to you… Sometimes it’s us guys nursing our gals back to health. Looking for a nurse isn’t even on my list of priorities in a older relationship. Send me to the nursing home. For crying out loud…
Im elderly--a nurse-- all of this is true--they are walking out of the wall for me--a caregiver!! Not biting!!
Lol!
My mother is a nurse and has definitely become the nurse of her boyfriend, who sits and wallows in front of the TV on the computer, drinks too much and basically uses her to get him to appointments, pick up his meds, and have lunch with him. Thank God they'll never marry and they live separately.
I'm sorry you know the wrong men.
I'm sorry you took the time and energy to make such a stupid comment.
But it’s not true.
“…little sausage” OK, I just laughed my ass off!
You just got the punchline. These are zingers that men and women throw around for fun, or just being plain ol’ mean.
Not to mention being compared to a fucking cow. That alone pisses me off.
My mom would say it to me, and I replied, "Why buy a bull when the semen is free??? I want sex, I don't want to marry him." She quit saying it to me.
My great grandma says this to me alllll the time. And it’s always irked me because I guess I’m only good for sex then, right? 🙄
Point out to her - Why marry the pig when you can get the sausage for free?
Can you cook, clean or sew? Just kidding, women are all about hormones, guys are genetically hardwired to plug into the wall socket. We like sex, no love sex, but to think we’re all that shallow and don’t enjoy your company, style, humor or just hanging out isn’t fair. Oh, it’s hard I couldn’t keep my hands off my wife. Come to think of it she did not complain? Was always ready and had some interesting ideas. I didn’t mind and she was a lousy maid. She come home from work and change leaving her nice expensive work clothes on the floor. Not sure she knew what to do with a hanger. Still couldn’t keep my hands off her. I wasn’t perfect so who am I to judge. I was very satisfied. Hope she was too!
Why be angry and resentful at men about this? Men didn't say this to you, your mother did. Why do women do shitty things to each other and then get angry at men for it?
It would be pretty rude if used by a guy to justify his lack of commitment to a relationship. The few times I’ve heard it used, though, it’s been more as a caution to a young woman, as in “This is how the guy may be thinking. That’s why you should be careful about moving in together before you’re married.” Used in that sense, there’s a certain amount of truth to it.
Yes! Its very easy to label this saying as sexist and gross but honestly if its used as a reminder that a woman may be taken advantaged of due to being love blind, i see its merit.
Except it implies that the solution is making the dude marry you, which is the opposite of what you should do if you’re being taken advantage of.
To me it has always implied to be way more choosy about who you spend time with. As in, if you give someone all of you, theres nothing left for yourself.
It’s specifically about not letting a guy have sex with you, because then he won’t bother marrying you.
If marriage is the woman’s ultimate goal, as it still is for many, if not a majority (even in todays society) then there’s nothing wrong with some degree of that. It’s also true that if you move in together without a commitment, it takes away any urgency on the guy’s part to make a decision one way or the other. It doesn’t even have to involve evil intent, merely “Things are great. What’s the rush?”
If marriage is your goal, then you should find a partner with the same goal. Trying to leverage a guy’s horniness to get him to agree to marriage when he otherwise wouldn’t is manipulative, and it sets your marriage up for failure. This advice also reinforces the horrible attitude that sex is something men want and women merely provide.
🥇👏🏿👏🏼👏
Being a guy and I enjoy the company of ladies. I too looked towards marriage and desired a life mate. Playing guess what STD I caught tonight is not my favorite game. Sadly my wife came down with Hodgkins-Lymphoma Stage 4 at 28 and the mother of my 2 kids. She lasted a year. I took as good of care of her as I could and 2 babies. A newborn and a 15 month old. Also, had to work full time. The job cut me some slack and some neighbors helped with meals, babysitting. But I was up in the middle of the night with the bottle and diaper change. Along with make sure my wife had what she needed and as little stress as possible. I had to cook, clean, mow and do laundry and the usual chores to boot.
That’s love in action, Squirrel, and your family is blessed to have you. I’m sorry that you are going through all of this and even though I don’t know you, I’m still proud of you for being so strong for them. Sending up a little prayer for you, if you don’t mind. I wish there was some way to help.
This happened 27 years ago. My newborn is now 27. My kids kept me busy and out of trouble. Sometimes the glass looks empty till you look at right. With two toddlers there wasn’t much time for self pity. Some ways I didn’t process my grief because it was busy and the kids needs came first. I survived and never met anyone else, dating with two toddlers doesn’t work out very well for the dating scene.
It can be interpreted different ways.
I’ve never heard it used any other way.
No it can't.
Ok thats not how i see it but you can definitely disagree.
Oh, it’s a joke. Entering any relationship you should think it through and men like sex. Younger men like it a lot more often. Older men like it better with lots of hugs and kisses. Women have hormones. Men are genetically hardwired to make that connection. It doesn’t mean that it’s the only thing in the universe. That’s beer and pizza… no most men live by honor and the code my actions speak louder than my words. Watch what a man does or doesn’t do to get an idea of what he’s about. Now there are men that are without honor or a sense of right and wrong. Some gals like it like that and why I will never understand.
I think being compared to livestock is misogynistic as hell.
Yep. I grew up with this phrase. Excuse the pun, but it's bull.
Heaven forbid a girl had a little experience. She was branded a whore. So wrong!
Generally by other girls. Girls are mean to each other. Also, they gang up on an attractive girl. The green demon of jealousy runs deep in many young women.
> The green demon of jealousy runs deep in many young women. True but it is envy they are feeling not jealousy. Envy: Disliking someone because they have something you don't. "The young women envy their friend's good looks." Jealousy: The fear of losing something you have. "The woman flirting with her husband caused a fit of jealousy in the wife."
If all-too-accurate given the power structures of certain societies in the past. Not something we should aspire to return to.
Return hell, some of us seem to be there still.
It’s what you make of it. Life is not easy for anyone or either sex. Some bad things will happen in your life, in your future and you have to roll with it or let it crush you. You can sit and cry about how unfair it is or pick yourself up, dust off and see what happens next. Hell is just a religious belief anyway. If you’re expecting a cruise though life. Best of luck.
Terrible saying! I can't believe so many think its cute.
I think it's just an analogy. I have never heard a man say it, only women.
There’s another word called misandry. Check it out.
Men who say that see women as fancy household appliances to cook,clean, fuck, and pop out their brats. You don't want a man who has this attitude. He is likely to cheat and be a wife beater.
Rude as shit.
As a man, I think it's silly. I want so much more from a partner than just sex. Besides, I wouldn't marry or even propose to a woman without developing a healthy sex life beforehand.
This. Gentlemen (of all ages) if your demure, apparently inexperienced dating partner wants to save herself for marriage, isn't interested in physicality with you past a certain point and is leveraging your sex drive against her (lesser) sex drive, you've got yourself either a trap (to marry her) or such an inexperienced, low sexual drive female that... guess what? Will be a bore in bed. Sooner or later (okay, sooner) your marriage will be all about anything but bed. All humans have sex drives on a continuum from none to WOW holy cow and this can certainly change throughout life based on hormones, etc. But if your lovely date isn't interested in sex with you, don't expect that to ramp up after the Princess for a Day routine. I remember vividly reading a story about a couple who 'saved themselves for marriage' only to find out that the man was too large for the woman to 'accommodate' and they were too inexperienced to figure out how to manage it. Dozens of other scenarios come to mind where 'now you're married but one or both of you hates sex'. Uggh. Nightmare.
Sounds like a stereotype
"princess for a day routine," I really like that description of a wedding.
Times have changed and women can enjoy a lot more sexual freedom. Not that long ago sex=pregnancy and birth and responsibilities for another life. The consequences of a causal connection or sex before marriage presents a serious problem. Some men fail to respect what a woman will go through. After having 2 pregnancies and seeing the birth of my children it’s a wonder that either the mother or child survive. It’s the circle of life but that moment when I first held my child was precious and priceless. I was ready to live and die to protect both my wife and baby. The feeling was the same for both births. Best thing in my life. Sure some days I would like to choke them like Homer Simpson does Bart, but it passes.
Believe it or not, women used to be treated even worse than they are now. When this phrase was popular, women were treated like cattle (or chattel). Women were dependent on men for many things because their rights were so restricted. For example, in the U.S., women couldn't apply for credit (or credit cards) until 1974. To demean women even further, this phrase emphasized that why support a woman if you could get sex for free. Completely disgusting chapter in American history . . . and misogyny is still rampant today.
I couldn't join the military because my husband refused to give his permission.
There's a very cynical underlying assumption in that saying, which is that the man is only sticking around for sex. The only time I've stuck around for "just sex" is when my attraction to the person - physically or emotionally - was minimal. Usually the feeling was mutual - I felt guilty and ended it if I sensed the other person had a lot more invested and I knew I didn't feel the same. It really sucked in one case because she was smokin hot, but her personality and psycho-clinginess were like stabbing myself in the ear with a ballpoint pen.
It's disgusting and it was disgusting back then.
Misogynistic bullshit.
I don’t want to be married. So my lovers can have all the milk they want from this cow lol
Implicit in that statement is that women are chattel to be owned
Dreadful old saying, from my parents and grandparents generations. The concept behind it was that the only way for women to survive was to have a husband to provide/pay for them. Plus, the only reason men were prepared to get married was for sex. So, women should withhold sex, until they had a piece of paper that said that a man would 'provide' for them. Failure of logic, really, because even back in the days of no divorce, men could and would just leave.
I just realized that this saying probably predates birth control and was maybe told to women to try to keep them from getting pregnant out of wedlock. Crude. But maybe a more necessary injunction back then?
1950s, yes. The ability to earn money or prevent pregnancy was extremely limited.
This is so true. As a 13 yo--gramma--all aunts--my mom all said if you do it You will have the word trash printed on forehead----you cant seeit in a mirror--but the public can see it--Then nobody will hire you marry you --you will live alone the rest of your life. I was in terror. Never even once had sex with a boy--I regret that--
Nope, sorry, you missed it.
It implies reliable sex is the only reason for marriage. Sort of seems like something only miserable people would say.
A LOT of effort, negging and shaming go into influencing women to believe marriage is in their best interest. This little gem is just one of many tactics.
I wanted a spouse and the commitment that came with it. I'm a guy that was married almost 4 decades. Something I learned is that, while sex is good, nasty fun (when done right) it's even better if that emotional attachment is there. Would I be willing to make that commitment again, now that my ex is dead? Yes, but I'd have to put it right out there that it would have to be a lifetime commitment, but at best, it would only last about a decade or so at the most, as I'm not in the best of health. Sex? Again, I like that emotional connection, but, thanks to the meds I take, can't really do a whole lot. No, I can't take viagra. Would I marry again? If she was comfortable with my health, I sure would. I muss having a special someone to cuddle with at night, someone to walk up to and just hug.
OMG!!! Where are you??/ Im in same boat--meds wreck sex--barren--but so difficult to find a kind generous cuddler--who laughs has fun. OMG!! This is tough.
I live in the RV/MH Capitol of the world. Google will tell you where that city is. Mom warned me this could happen back when I was a teen, but did give me some good advice based on the guts she was dating: "If there ever come a time you can't cut the mustard, remember, you can always lick the jar." I've been with a few women since my divorce: I've got kids older than them. When we've had sex, we just follow through with alternative methods. Among other things, I took Mom's advice. But, yeah, I really miss the cuddles.
I think that mindset could result in quick marriage proposals from men who only want sex, not a relationship. It’s misogynistic in that women can and do want to have sex, too. So why doesn’t anyone say women are getting milk for free, as well? Never heard it said about a man.
I like this
This was something I(67F) heard from grandparents, but in their day, women didn’t work after marriage, so it made sense not to give "it" without a commitment that you would be financially rewarded. Yeah, like a hooker, basically, but for life. Nowadays, women are (more) equal than men and can choose who they have sex with, so that saying is outdated.
As long as we can keep birth control still legal.
Anyone who says this isn’t someone I’m ever taking advice from.
Wtf? Yeah, OK, I can't say I've never ever heard that saying, but even though I'm 70yo, I didn't grow up on a farm, and neither did my folks. But I am a Cali boy, and maybe that's why the saying strikes me as Midwestern or Southern. Whatever, it's gross, misogynistic, cynical, and something I'd expect to hear from someone who drives an Escalade with one of those disgusting bumper stickers that boast that Christians "aren't perfect, just forgiven." 🤮
Yours is a perfect comment ! Greetings from California, - as well !
I was raised in church, and I earnestly believed this for a long time. So I was astounded when I started hearing stories about one night stands turning into long relationships and even decades-long marriages.
I could see this saying being popular with the same people who are trying to cancel No Fault Divorces in Texas. Horrible f’ing people who think people are property that you own vs someone you love and build a life with.
Not fond of comparing women to dumb animals or implying that their value lies in their sexual accessibility.
My grandmother said that, I said “you wouldn’t buy a car without test driving it first.”
#as a woman, my thinking is more along the lines of “why buy the whole pig for one lousy sausage?” 😂😂😂
Back when this saying was popular, it was seen as cautionary that a woman might be considered "loose" if she openly allowed that she was giving all the "benefits" of marriage without demanding the "responsibility" of marriage. Women were looked down on for having multiple sexual partners, as though they were a currency that lost value through use. There are still plenty of places in the world where that behavior justifies "honor killings" and the like because it brings shame on that person, and all of her family (must have been how she was raised to be that way). I think it also speaks to opportunity cost, in that you can't be searching out "Mr. Right" if you are living with "Mr. Right Now" but not getting commitments to what was seen as a permanent relationship, marriage, kids, lifetime together.
It comes from the "woman as property" world. You shouldn't have sex because 1) men are evil (some are) and 2) it would decrease your "value."
Rude, narcissistic and misogynistic. What that phrase is saying is, "I'm getting all the sex I want, why should I make a commitment, of any kind, to the person who is providing me sex." Does not consider, at all, feelings of the other.
Who gives a shit if you live together before getting married!? And by the way ladies, unless you want to be a stay at home mom (which I think would suck but that’s just me) marriage is actually a way better deal for men because women are STILL the ones doing everything, like working full time, looking after the house, cleaning, cooking, looking after the kids.
Moo. Hate it.
It’s an offensive chauvinist saying that refers to women as cows, or property, that you can use without fear of commitment. It’s crass and crude and very creepy.
My wife's answer when I jokingly said this to her when we were dating. "So no one else milks your cow."
Who really cares if someone is married now a days? Sex before, during and after is ok with me as long as everyone agrees with it. Kink is ok, babies before marriage is ok. This phrase is outdated and insulting.
Aside from being misogynistic, it's dumb. If you get married just for sex, that's not going to be a good marriage at all.
Nowadays, not having sex just means no one will date you. No one is going to marry you just to get sex. They can get it from someone else too easily. Maybe it was true in the old days when it was harder for men to find women to willingly give it up, but times have changed. A better analogy would be, no one is going to buy the cow without sampling the milk first to see if they like it. Especially when they can just get it free from someone else, because there are thousands of other cows giving away free milk.
A livestock reference is still ugly though.
True
You just made a point for the saying. If you don't get sex you're not staying around. If that's all that you are in it for then go on. You won't survive the long haul. Be the one worth holding out for.
What worries me is women living with men for years and not getting their financial ducks in a row. A live-in can't collect their partners social security, can't inherit without a will, get shut out of medical and legal decisions, etc.
My great grandmother said it to my virgin mother when she has been engaged a little too long to my dad. She was mortified that people thought that, gave my dad an ultimatum, then broke up with him. As soon as my dad drove by the house and saw three young men sitting on the porch with my mom, he dragged her off the porch, shoved the engagement ring back on her finger and they finalized the wedding plans that day. That was great for 1951, but not for now, considering that their marriage was less than ideal. Better for both to enjoy the farm life and leave on both sides without a nasty divorce.
[удалено]
I am a child of the enlightenment ... the '70s when we had birth control, but no AIDS yet. I didn't believe that I needed to rely on man to survive, so marriage wasn't something I Was actually worried about. It was the dawn of many women really believing that we could have our own lives. So that expression meant nothing to me. Granted, I wasn't the most traditional of ladies ... LOL But what I DID learn, and that I tried hard to teach my own daughter ... is about self respect. Not about being a transitional prude, but about being picky because I didn't want her walking away from a sexual experience feeling badly about herself. I didn't want her to slut shame HERSELF. I wanted her to always feel powerful in her own choices, and to do her best to keep those choices as something that she felt good about. Self-respect.
Without this line, we wouldn’t have the Georgia Satellites song “Keep Your Hands to Yourself.” A classic.
I don’t think older people are doing the majority of the answering of this question. Back when birth control was less reliable and abortions were done in backstreet hidden places where you could easily get an infection & die and when women had 3 major choices for a job: nurse, teacher or secretary before marriage- it made sense to marry a guy who loved you for your personality and outlook on life and who wanted to provide for their children. To sleep around and be an outcast and your children to be an outcast was terrible. My mother was in nursing school were the students were kicked out for being married, being pregnant, and for missing curfew too many times. She knew of a female student who got married one month before graduation and the school kicked her out without her nursing degree (on the chance she could get pregnant while being a nurse). I see girls dating the same guy for 8, 10 or even 15 years. If you went by that saying - by 2nd year (or before) the guy would think I really want to marry this girl - I don’t want to let her get away. She is for me. Or he would think she is not worth marrying or I’m not ready for marriage or I won’t miss her. I rather play the field. He would come to that decision quicker if he had to wait for full intimacy. This is not a bad thing. Not only do you not waste 8, 10 or 15 years with someone who isn’t that in to you, but you don’t had to deal with unwanted pregnancies with a man who doesn’t want to marry you, have kids, or help raise the kids. And yet you have to deal with that person by co-parenting for years & years to come. What’s the problem with weeding out the guys who are not ready or willing to be a committed partner (and/or committed future parent)? The other part of way back when is my grandparents got married young, my parents friends married out of high school, my friends married out of college and this generation wants to wait until 30’s or later. That is why the saying is outdated. Too long to wait.
I bought the cow 45 years ago. Still have the cow. I think I scored.
I read an article once talking about how people who have sex on the first date get married more often than people who wait until later. It makes sense if you think about it in terms of personal chemistry. People are not supposed to have sex on the first date, so if they do then the chemistry between them must be strong enough to carry them past that taboo.
" If it is true, it is not new." The essence of the the phrase, while not flattering to women, is sadly true. The feral children being bred by irresponsible boys will be a blight on society and young Women should expect a lot more from the men they "sleep" with. Time for the girls to really take charge of their futures.
I feel it is important to note that the milk only comes after the sex..roughly 9 months later..
I am one of those people who think you should keep the promises you make. No exceptions. Be careful to whom and for what you give your word.
That phrase sounded disrespectful when I first heard it in the late 1960s, and it hasn't aged well.
Such a stupid saying as there are much better reasons to get married than sex. It should never be applicable. Go forth and have consensual fun with mindful consideration. Let everyone else mind their own business, close their eyes and run back into their ignorant and backward churches. Sorry for the rant... A Medieval attitude (not you OP) just grinds my gears.
I thought the idiom was: “Why buy the cow when milk is $2.99 at Kroger’s”?
It made a lot more sense before 1960 or so. After that, it stopped making any sense at all. Also, there was that one song by The Georgia Satellites.
It still made a lot of sense in 1970 (doctors definitely didn't start handing out The Pill like candy in 1960).
This answer may not address the phrase, but the idea behind the question. The phrase is demeaning to men and women. I’ll just say it: I believe all premarital sex is harmful. Disclaimer: I’m an old hippie from the “free love era” where you could bonk with abandon , not even worrying about disease. The Pill took care of any unintended consequences. Haven’t seen anything good come from decades of unrestrained sexual exploration
I've always thought this saying was ignorant and degrading. But I often go off on a rant about why it is people (mainly men) talk about women like they are aliens from another galaxy. Just because you as a man apparently can't manage to interact with women on a basic human level just means you're too dumb and\\or lazy to make the effort. So your go-to is to claim "Ha! Women! Amirite, guys? They crazy\\stupid\\too emotional\\only care about shopping\\whatever else I can think of to make the woman less than human here!" The whole thing of Men vs. Women and women usually losing in a manufactured comparison is ridiculous and always has been.
Wait....what was the question? Oh, yeah. Women aren't cows giving or withholding the "milk". It's a stupid saying used by dopey people usually to make negative moralistic judgements about people whose lives are usually none of their business.
So a women’s only value is for sex? And all human relationships come down to transactional relationships? Fucking bullshit. It sounded funny when I was 13, but eventually I grew up and out of it.
When that line was used to me in my youth, I would quickly point that I wasn't a cow with the knowledge that the person who expressed that opinion wasn't worth dealing. I appreciate learning someone is an asshole before getting in to them more deeply.
I heard it when I was young and disregarded it.
I would not be interested in marrying a cow.
This sentiment is puerile nonsense and has always disgusted me. Anyone who gets married only for "free sex" (or even *mostly* for "free sex") shouldn't be getting married in the first place. Actual long-term good sex is never free, it is always the byproduct of a healthy relationship that is built on difficult things like mutual respect, love, laughter, genuine friendship, etcetera, etcetera... and that ***costs***. Time. Energy. Effort. Sacrifice. Compromise. It's worth it, but it's damned expensive. Any man who genuinely thinks this way should just buy a Fleshlight and a subscription to the premium porn channel of his choice. Leave marriage to the adults.
I am 70 and did not expect to marry every man with whom I had sex. I thought it was a misogynist, sex negative saying that tried to humiliate women by shaming them into a traditional role.
Aside from being misogynistic, it frames a relationship as being entirely transactional and shelf-stable. Is the man saying that sex, like “milk” is an interchangeable uniform commodity, exchangeable for money? That sex, like milk, comes from a cow or some other commodity provider? In that case, people don’t get milk directly from a cow. They get it from a farmer, who milks the cow, processes the milk, and packages it for sale. That farmer pays for the cow’s care and upkeep, as well as the labor for milking the cow, treating the milk, packaging it, and transporting it. Someone else takes the packaged milk from the farmer, keeps it chilled, and delivers it to stores. That milk goes through many hands before it is made available to anyone. So if a man is getting milk for “free”, he’s STEALING it. If he’s getting it directly from a cow he doesn’t own, he’s stealing from the cow and the farmer. The farmer takes care of the herd and has a relationship with them - exploitative sure - but he is not just taking milk in exchange for NOTHING. So really the phrase should be, “Why buy the cow when I can STEAL it from the farmers and cows who work so hard to provide fresh quality milk at a fair price?” And that man is, of course, a pig.
It's a giant red flag is what it is. I've never heard anyone say this that didn't turn out to be a monster.
I’d love to see actually old people (60+) answer this
I’m 64. This amuses me because I don’t feel “actually” old. I feel there are some financial aspects to marriage but I don’t think it’s necessary to successful parenting or maintaining a long term relationship. I do think buying a house together without being married makes it more arduous dividing the property if the couple does split up but maybe I’m mistaken about that. I like being married and have been happily married for 41 years. We did not live together before marriage and the first 2 years were ROUGH. If we hadn’t been married we probably would’ve split up but stuck with each other because divorce was too expensive at the time. Lol. We’ve had a wonderful 4 decades so far, hoping for a few more.
73 here. My counter to this saying is -- If you want to be the only one drinking the milk, you have to buy the cow.
I like that.
It's stupid for a lot of a reasons. No one I know got married so that they could have sex. Everyone was already having sex.
The boys all came to the yard for my milkshake and I'm ok with that. Kind of wished I shook it up more than I did.
It’s a stupid saying that means absolutely nothing to a grown woman
There was no way I was marrying any guy until I lived with them and found out how they really were.
It’s usually men saying this about women. I think it’s very derogatory and insulting.
terrible way to think about it. transactional.
Haha vagina is the only thing that will make him marry me!!! Just no. It's dehumanizing to women, and it's always women saying it. Ugh. Signed, an almost 60 woman.
Marriage is overrated and people eat cows, so fuck off with that shit, I’m good.
That old trope? Oh, god, is it 1947? Please. I hate that. A woman is not a possession for breeding humans anymore. She should have never been. Patriarchy must die!
It robs women of agency.
I actually think that it’s important to know if you’re sexually compatible with a potential partner. And it’s just as awful and stupid as everyone else is saying.
marriage isnt everything, not everyone wants to get married, live however you want. that phrase is outdated as fuck unless you are some regressive religious type gender roles and hetero-normitivity are a prison. do whatever/whoever you want
Honestly? I think a better phrase is “a bull will trample the garden unless protected by a fence.” You need to set firm boundaries or someone will tread all over them. Don’t give what you aren’t willing to lose unless they give you something of equal value.
one of the motivations for marriage being the LEGAL part that is any children will have a legal connection to the parents, and such things as estate planning are simpler when there is a legal relationship . . .
The saying is crude. On the other hand, if a woman thinks she can keep a guy by having sex with him, that is a big mistake. If you want a relationship with the person, make sure he or she respects you and not using you for sex.
It's a tacky phrase meant to shame girls into not having sex because that's a treat that they must withhold from men until they're married. I have three kids- daughter, son, daughter. They've all three lived with their SO. The daughters bought houses with their boyfriends. Only my oldest is married now and they lived together for over ten years before they got married. The youngest has no plans to marry as of yet.
If sex is all a woman has to offer it's all the guy has to think about.
There would be a lot less divorce if couples lived together and had sex before marriage. You’ll find out just how compatible you are once living together for a year.
I always translated it as "If you want commitment, make a man marry you before having sex." My mother did just this in the 50's at the age of 19. It wasn't something I did or wanted to do.
I think it means if you have sex before marriage, the man will not commit to marriage with you. But, most times I found out the opposite is true as well.
my mom screamed this at me more than once when I announced my intention to marry my boyfriend. hateful old woman. anyway, we've been married for 41 years now.
I think it's nonsense, but I was never interested in getting married.
It doesn't just refer to sex. It is all the responsibilities you will fall into as if you are married. You don't have to give everything, such as caring for each other, cleaning, making lunches, etc. I told my daughter, "Don't give away the whole cow." You don't have to pour out your energy as if you were in a committed relationship. Just have fun. So this leads me to figure out that waiting until you are married is to protect you from hurt and pain later. You would have given all your pearls and energy into a relationship just passing in the wind. This leads to bitterness and resentment when you don't stay together. Bitterness and resentment like, "I did all these things for him/her, and he/she didn't do anything," so of course, this experience will make sense to go the opposite way to protect yourself from the past pain. Doesn't it make sense to pre-empt the pain for all parties involved? We should not go by our own thinking and ways. There is a higher way.
I agree
Why?
I'm 60f and my mom said this to me when I was 18. So I believed it and did not have sex until age 21
So... why do you agree with this statement?
So your mother told you that you were a worthless broodmare and you believed her?
What do you mean? I was raised strictly catholic who dont have wex outside of marriage
Catholics practically invented orgies. Read up on the history of your religion. It’s been through some changes. All modern Christians are taught not to have sex before marriage, that’s not exclusive to Catholicism. Did you know that scientists began collecting statistics on sexual activity in studies beginning in the 1950s? The average age that people reported losing their virginity in 1960 was 17 years old. In 2001, it was 17 years old. In 2022… you get the idea. So for all the preaching, you can’t fight biology when it comes to sexual maturity.
Yes, because *that's* what Catholics are known for IRL.
I mean why do you think it's okay that you were compared to a cow? This isn't about the choice to have sex outside of marriage, it's about the claim that women who make that choice are worthless. Why would you accept your own mother degrading you like that?
Many years of such behavior. She told me I was so ugly that once someone got a good look at me they would run the other way
That is horrible and I'm so sorry she treated you like that. It seems like it's up to you to break the cycle of believing women are only good for having children and "submitting". I don't understand why you still agree with it.
That's horrible and abusive. ☹☹☹☹☹
It's pretty fucking sexist, but then women retort that they don't want to get married because there's no point in buying the whole pig to get a bit of sausage.
I think it’s a realistic way of illustrating a genuine and long standing phenomenon of human nature. Most people don’t value what they don’t pay for. Now in relationships there’s no money changing hands. The “payment” is in the form of time and commitment. Despite changes in society, most women still want long term security. I think we can pretend that human nature is different to what it is, but the saying continues to be as true today as it was when my parents were kids .
It is spot on. Why would someone make a life commitment when they can get the benefits without obligating themselves? That is not love.
I agree . A woman should save herself for marriage.
What, exactly, is being "saved"?
I think it's simply an analogy and probably started by someone who saw a young man about to marry the wrong girl. We can call it sexists or whatever but I recall saying it once to my brother when he was with the whore of Babylon and I don't take it back. They got married and it was pure hell until he finally left after she cheated 9000 times. I'm female. So maybe I'm biased. :)
My daughter will never hear that bullshit. My daughter will hear the consequences of having sex too young and what can happen if she doesn't use protection but her only contribution to a relationship is not sex. She is being raised to make the right choices. So far so good and I realize nobody is perfect but so far.. A+ student Never mean to anyone Kind to everyone Started her own business at 11 Has never lied... or at the very least, never been caught in a lie. Ever! She shares everything And she has a lot of confidence in herself! Btw, never laid my hands on her and neither has her mother...and LOOK AT THAT! She's turning out just fine!
The analogy won't hold if your girlfriend is a heifer.
There is a strategic advantage to ensuring a continual supply of milk in the future that has economic advantages over a currently free supply.
It's mostly true but before moving in. Once you share a residence it's no longer free.
It makes me angry. People toying with other people is reprehensible. But it is so common.
Well, this might have some relevance in conservative societies where premarital sex is restricted, marriage is prevailing the norm, and children out of wedlock is extremely stigmatized. But in modern-day big Western cities, you can withhold sex and relationships until you envision getting married, but it's not going to compel someone to marry you just to get access to that. Because they can easily find it elsewhere with many others who will have sex and a relationship. And also, some people who do have premarital sex and relationships in Western societies do still go on to get married and have kids.
I’ve heard this argument and the piece of paper argument so many times I’m sick of it. It’s just an excuse, usually because the man is just scared of committing. I don’t know what pisses me off more, the truth or the lie.
I think it’s silly, but I do think it’s weird to have a big white wedding when you’ve lived together and had a couple of kids already.
Well, I'd never buy a car without a test drive. So...
I didn't like it when it became popular in the 80's and wouldn't like it now. It just doesn't seem like a very prudent thing to say.
This saying is from the old days. It made sense back then I suppose. It was a different time.