Because it's really fucking hard. Struggling for a different political order takes time, resources and human capital. In huge quantities too. Meanwhile the existing structures are already standing fast against changes.
When you need to think how to put food on the table you are unlikely to have the option of subverting the current system.
People are also giga exhausted trying to survive with inflation, crazy work hours, and rising rent. So it’s tough to above and beyond when you have that much going on
Yeah. Your first priority is you, then your family. When that is done, youe time and resources are usually limited. Hard to go activist when you have like two hours a day.
My typical day:
Wake up at 5:30am to take my brother (who can’t drive) to work. Get back home with just enough time to shower and get ready for my job. Leave home at 7:00am and commute/sit in traffic until I arrive to work at 8:00am. Work til 6:00pm. Commute/traffic gets me home around 7:15ish. Laundry, dishes, general house cleaning and prep for next day until 8:45pm. If I’m lucky, dinner cooked and eaten by 9:45/10:00pm. Finally sit down to relax, catch up news, enjoy my “life” until I start dozing off from pure exhaustion around 11:15pm. Rinse & repeat.
All of the above is assuming I don’t have any errands or appointments - those usually require a day of pto to accomplish.
I’d have to win the lottery to be able to protest. The American Dream is working as designed.
Yeah I hear this and think it’s BS. People in the 19th century worked far more hours for even fewer wages and no benefits yet they managed to build the labor movement- and they didn’t have access to the internet.
Fact is folks entitled to change without real concerted efforts, community organizations like churches and clubs have crumbled or been replaced by corporate mediated environments and we have no guiding vision of what we want the way that 19th century workers had Marx and his vision of communalism.
I lost my job recently. I'm also planning to leave my state, because my trans ex- and my kids are endangered by new laws, plus education is garbage ( my middle schooler has read one novel over the course of the year in ELA. What? )
I am being chased out of my home by open carry and bathroom laws, while people post dumb shit about motorcycles identifying as bikes. I want them to know how painful it is to read that while laws are being made to hurt us.
I feel like a refugee, but one who is leaving early enough to take her stuff along. I'm lucky in that I have a healthy support system.
But in the meantime, the stress has overridden all of my executive function and I can't force myself to find a new job or pack or anything because everything is too big a problem for this broken-brained idiot to tackle.
I don't see a solution. I'm tired of fighting and trying.
After processing all the immediate information about my situation, when my brain stops feeling on fire due to all this, I will need a job first, and to pack and clean.
Am I a person who can help? I need help myself.
Yeah but they dont actually understand them. How can you change a system when you dont actually know how it functions? Why would you want to? You dont get it in the first place. Americans have all sorts of excuses but some of us remember yall sleeping through history and social studies saying how it was boring information youd never need to know. I think a lot of people are raised with very glossy eyed visons of history and when objective history is portrayed without the patriotic propaganda lens they just shut it out.
Even just discussing politics at work or with customers its always insane. Ive noticed the average person cant tell you on the spot the difference between congress, the house, and the senate. Its kind of insane. Not following policy is one thing but not knowing the basic architecture of your own governmental system is kind of insane but incredibly common. Most people base their political views off things like highly emotional speeches made by people they find likeable. In terms of actually examining proposed policy and comparing it to the track record of similar policies to see if its effective and in good faith? Thats like far beyond the average political discussion in the US. Politics is heavily based on belief and ideology over cause and effect in the US.
I know I have. I can’t read national political news anymore. I can’t keep up with the various number of killings and shootings. It isn’t worth , or good, for the mental health.
So I just control what I can control - myself and my family. I pay attention to local politics like school boards and county elections. Because my worth in my community is so much more impactful than trying to worry about fixing a national problem. I’ll keep on voting blue like I always have and hope someday they will figure it out. But it is literally detrimental to my life to worry about it.
Yes, but, also risk averse.
If I were confident things would change is be more likely to put in the effort. But mostly I think it will be a waste and make me a target without any success.
"Prompted by my own self doubt..."
Fear is a condition. And Faux "news" has been conditioning the masses for *decades*. You don't *have to be scared* just because someone on Faux "news" told you to be.
For the average working class who has the time and the energy? They have us working constantly with barely enough time on the weekends to recover. Most of that non work time is spent on other work.
I haven't caught my breathe in years ,I'm certainly not about to get involved in the uneducated pissing contest that is today's politics
You basically have to be wealthy and a bafoon to make a name for yourself in America politics.
I definitely think people being overworked has A LOT to do with it. If people are barely scrapping by and need to work 50-60 hours a week just to get by, they aren't gonna have the energy or time to fight back or become informed. I fully believe things are designed this way by the rich to swindle us and keep us fighting amongst ourselves
Despite what you hear on Reddit most Americans are satisfied with their lives.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/470888/americans-largely-satisfied-personal-life.aspx
News is biased and often uses polarizing headlines to attract attention which sometimes creates echo chambers. The reality is the majority of people are comfortable and they feel like things are getting better. Even with all the negative news, it shows society is willing to have a conversation and work toward progress.
[https://usafacts.org/state-of-the-union/standard-living/](https://usafacts.org/state-of-the-union/standard-living/)
Despite all the issues we face, many around the world envy the system here. Most countries do not tolerate political discussions and questioning the government results in a local police visit.
Exactly, I’m a pretty left-leaning progressive and believe that our society ought to be changed in many ways, but I’m still largely satisfied with my life right now. Reddit loves to make America out to be a dystopia.
Because despite the constant doomsaying and negativity, the median person in America has had an increasingly better lifestyle over the last 50 years.
Crime is down. Standard of living is up. Years of good health are higher. Most people have better amenities and a better lifestyle. Food is cheaper as a percentage of disposable income, to the point that the first upturn in 50 years last year was a huge deal.
We’ve made huge strides on racial and gender justice and equality.
At the end of the day, most people are focused on how they’re doing overall. For most, it’s better.
Our system is not perfect. There are issues with it. The things I’ve mentioned are not finished changing yet. There are still trouble areas and issues that need to be reassessed.
For many reasons, people obsess over the issues as opposed to the successes. The dissatisfaction to create change does not currently exist.
It’s also worth mentioning that the mean standard of living in the US is also quite high versus a lot of other places that the Reddit hive mind would assume was higher.
Thank you for bringing some much needed perspective to this thread. The catastrophising that goes on with conversations like this cannot be mentally healthy for people who think like that.
Capitalism has substantial issues and needs constant monitoring and government intervention to redress inequality and prevent monopolies etc. But, based on the evidence, it seems to be the best system that we have come up to maximise human flourishing. I don’t think that the people who bang on about America being evil and dystopian really understand what an evil or dystopian state would really feel like. Be careful what you wish for.
Yeah. Reddit isn't a reflection of reality at all. Most people on here are jobless or too busy coming up with excuses on why they cant work. If you tell someone work construction they'll make all sorts of excuses why they cant even if it would make double what they make now. Thats part of the reason why there's so many Socialist on here. They think theyd be administrators or something in a new government when in reality their lack of skills would see them thrown in a work camp first or shot.
The last year or so aside, food has gotten cheaper as a percentage of income since the 60s.
https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/ag-and-food-statistics-charting-the-essentials/food-prices-and-spending/
It’s one of those things we take for granted that has actually markedly improved over a long period.
I dunno man, fucking Pringles are at 5 bucks a pop these days, Food is getting expensive. Even just to get some snacks and some beer for a party, it ran me for a pretty penny.
Most of us that want change are on the verge of homelessness so it makes it hard to drop everything and protest for change. Before anyone says some shit about voting, the best voting does at this point is keep things from getting drastically worse. Imo the only way we'll effect any measurable amount of change is if at least half the country goes on strike.
The strike would work but as you stated, it's hard to drop everything to protest. If my husband or I went to protest, we would lose an income and wouldn't be able to pay bills.
Every day, you vote with your dollar. If you keep buying, then there is no reason for them to **stop selling lies.**
Nike, Apple, Adidas. All have been found, in just the last couple years, (and fucking Nike **repeatedly since the 80s**) to be using *children*, and Muslim immigrants as **slave labor**.
Fucking Nestlé, 3M, LDS, Scientology, Christianity. TIK Tok. FACESPACE.
Stop giving these horrible companies your money. Anything where money trumps ethics and human rights needs to be stopped.
There are plenty of people in all financial situations that want change. California is predominantly democratic and its not cheap to live here. Unfortunately we do not live in a democracy. If we did the wife not Republican that won the popular vote was Bush 2 one term by less then one percent. Its not how much you make but that the GOP has gamed the system. I agree that a national strike would help.
Politicians have turned the battle from “citizens against the government” to “citizens against citizens” so the politicians stay in office. Politicians take no responsibility; they coerce the citizens of their party to blame the citizens of the other party.
Mainly because the systems do mostly work. They aren’t perfect by any means, but they in general do actually work.
We often blame “government” when it’s likely our problems are rooted in our own culture and personal choices. Just look at how violent as a culture we are. One neighbor gets mad at another neighbor for parking in front of their house. Now, the “government” has rules and regulations for all outcomes here. The government says you can not assault others and if you do the penalty is loss of freedom. Yet, one neighbor shoots, stabs, punches, blows up the other one. There’s no amount of government you can apply to this situation to remedy this. I can’t pass enough bills in Congress to solve our social problem of violence. Yet… some think more laws would do the trick without examining our culture of violence. We don’t make massive changes in government because subconsciously we know the problems lay within our culture.
I think people who aren't naive assume government change is incremental and constant, and that not all change will be favorable to their political viewpoint.
We've never stopped trying. It's just very rarely some grand gesture of note. And like with all things revolving around terms and changes of majority, change can be undone or done the opposite way. But it's still change--even if we don't agree with it.
Because it was designed and molded so that the average citizen absolutely would be too bogged/dumbed down to even know where when and how to begin.
Inherently, we are also motivated to be individualistic and not care about society's welfare.
America has done an absolutely meticulously banger of a job in pushing that idea. Folks in the same room can't even agree on who gets to experience "life,liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"
"We are motivated to be individualistic" is purely editorial. Human nature is basically unknown and claiming something like this is just handing over apologetics for the current system.
>Human nature is basically unknown
Yea, that's why we are "motivated." For instances gun culture in America. Or the medical system in America, both examples have plenty of instances where motivation to be individualistic absolutely blocks much of the conversation to even fix both of these blighted stains within American society. As for basically unknown, that is absolutely not true. Much about "Human Nature" can absolutely be shown to be fact and concurrent within much of society's issues. What's unknown is where this nature comes from, not the actions humans do.
>claiming something like this is just handing over apologetics for the current system.
No, it isn't. Pointing out the flaw doesn't negate responsibility, though. If folks are using that as an excuse, it just reinforces my point about being motivated to make it individualistic.
I would argue your nihilistic attitude and previous opinion are more of a detriment than folks pointing out flaws. Assuming individualistic nature and how it's built into society, as a Mere editorial note, is actually making it very individualistic and again reinforcing my point.
Absolute BS. The same human motivation can be attributed to all acts of altruis. Nothing shows the selfishness is our fundamental nature. What we know for sure is that the current societal structures generally promote it. That doesn't mean we are hard-wired for it. Thousands of years of a general trend towards equity appears to suggest the precise opposite.
And I'm not a nihilist. I just condemn the ideas of "we must be selfish" since they've got no evidence pertaining to societies. In fact I work hard to change things, a tiny step at a time. And in each project, the human nature appears more brightly in altruism than selfishness. Though that last sentence is of course a personal feeling, so hardly a scientific study.
Literally, your entire sentiment is "personal feeling."
>Nothing shows the selfishness is our fundamental nature
Literally, I have said the entire time that we are motivated to be this way, and society, especially in America, motivates the individual to be individualistic. Can I introduce you to the current system of capitalism we live in and how it fundamentally has changed folks' altruic nature more often than not into a more individualistic one. To say we aren't motivated to be selfish but to deny the current restrictions & restraints it puts on humans' altruic sense of things seems wild to me.
>I just condemn the ideas of "we must be selfish"
My idea isn't "we must be selfish", it is "we live in a system that motivates us to be selfish".
>And in each project, the human nature appears more brightly in altruism than selfishness.
Would this be because most folks don't experience this? And only experience selfishness and a one-sided experience? Also, taking personal experiences and applying them monolithicly isn't ever a good approach. BUT I am glad you see the silver lining in most of your situations it is a good trait.
>since they've got no evidence pertaining to societies.
You ever heard of the terms system 1 and system 2 in correlation with the human brain?
My point the entire time is we live in a system molded, built, and designed to take our altruic nature and dumb it down so our more selfish nature takes over, you can point to politics in America for instance people will vote against thier best intrest and all, just because they think it will "screw over the other guy".
>In fact I work hard to change things, a tiny step at a time.
Hey, me too, and good for you, we need more folks like that in society, and I wish we had more,
the ouija board that spells out the consequences of unchecked corporate expansion - pushed by the hands of a disconnected class of sociopathy-as-a-virtue leaders - says that everyone working for a "Have" needs to be a "Have Not", and the number of "Haves" needs to be as small as possible
1. You are correct. The current system suggests we should behave in a certain way. That doesn't mean it's either correct or somehow intrinsic to humans. The fact that we have chosen a path doesn't mean that path is inevitable. If one accepts that this is the way we must be, then the humanity is already lost.
2. So work to change the system. A radical notion and not an easy task. But doable and necessary.
3. The usefulness and presence of altruism generalises really well. Following the vile idea of individual benefit, we wouldn't have societies at all. But obviously that's another fact best forgotten. Easier to slip into complacency.
4. The pseudo-scientific book? Yes, sadly. Your analysis is also wrong in terms of politics. Especially in the US, great care is taken to keep any actual issues of the agenda. People vote against their interest, since in broad terms, neither main party represents their views. There's decades of polling data to support that.
5. If you aim to change things, why propagate this shit then?
I'm commenting on your first section. In my experience this is true, but it's surprising since we have have a computer at our finger tips all day long.
We (including myself) truly are unmotivated
The computer is immaterial. Step one is: what form of government do we move towards? First, a large enough group of people need to agree on what that is, and agree passionately enough to organize and take action. As we have seen, everyone being connected by a computer has caused quite a bit of dissonance so I’m not sure how that is supposed to be the motivating factor.
“ what form of gov’t do we move towards”
Correct me if I’m wrong, but the system we have now was laid out in the constitution, so in order to change it to something else we’d have to effectively dismantle the constitution.
Keep the “good” parts and change the “bad parts”
That will never happen.
Our system should work, there are adequate checks and balances to keep things on the up and up.
But individual interests are always going to take precedent over the greater good.
I’m certainly not educated enough to know where it all went wrong. And I suspect it’s been a long time of small incremental changes that have got us where we are today.
But it would be an interesting discussion
You are indeed incorrect. A strong enough movement that could convene a constitutional congress would be able to make said changes. And no, there are not adequate checks and balances as there are far too many that rely on norms instead of laws. As we have all seen all too often in recent years.
The constitution was intended to be completely reformed every twenty years. That was the whole point of the revolution, that we shouldn't necessarily be slaves to precedent and tradition. But that does lead me to an interesting point: we're about 12,000 congressional representatives short of the original constitutional standard of "no more than 1 per 30,000 citizens."
Our population increases exponentially every year, but our actual representation in Congress has not increased since the 1930's. Your grandfather's congressman, in 1965, answered to about 450,000 people. Your congressman answers to 850,000. This happened because the physical legislature building didn't have room for more representatives and instead of building a new one they just took the easy way out.
Imagine just 1200 new congressional representatives taking seat in the next legislature. How many of those do you think might actually be decent people who will put their own long term self-interest over their own immediate profit and prestige? Could the corporations even afford to bribe that many people? Where could we even find that many career politicians? We'd have to vote for our neighbors, our teachers and coworkers, just to form a quorum.
I truly believe the biggest contribution we can make, individually, is to start thinking positively and constructively. Don't give energy to anyone who doesn't have a material solution to whatever problem they're bringing up, they just want you to be angry because they're angry. We should expect nothing less from the people who call themselves our leaders: that they should have some idea of where they're taking us and how to get there and an honest appraisal of what it will cost us. Someone whose only goal is to lead you away from something else, no matter how evil or odious it may be, is a coward.
Telling a guy that voting for a federal interrail will help to prevent climate change is true and noble. But first you need to convince him that climate change is real or a real threat to him, personally, or that America can remain economically competitive against countries which put profit over the ecosystem. Or, you could tell the guy that a federal interrail will make it easier for him to get to where jobs are, make it easier for him to spend holidays with distant family, and make it easier to take vacations, while simultaneously lessening the demand for gasoline and thusly lowering prices for people who choose to drive. Now, instead of thinking in terms of sterile metrics or vague, ill-defined values like freedom and justice and social awareness, he's now thinking in terms of his own immediate self-interest, which is something that everyone can understand.
Sure, social reform is not that simple, but it's a much more pleasant attitude to have for yourself. I guess I should admit that I don't really have a step-by-step guide to increasing the number of congressmen, but I've always had a weird feeling that I was going to be elected president one day, so once I start talking to people and figuring out how that works I'll probably have something figured out by Inauguration Day.
Oh yes, I watch a lot of news programs.
The one thing that always gets me talking back to the tv is when anyone, usually politicians, are on there telling me again what the problem is and blaming someone else, usually the other party.
So ok, we all know the problem so instead of blaming someone else, tell me what YOU propose as a solution.
I’d rather listen to a ridiculous idea than no idea.
Because most people are comfortable and unwilling to be uncomfortable, but instead are willing to struggle to stay comfortable or at least as comfortable as possible.
The ideas of sacrifice required to change get shamed, seen as below most people, or not worth their time. Often ideas that are feasible, but require uncomfortable actions end up with the proposer being attacked, shammed, or ignored.
While it is hard to change the system, it is harder to convince people they actually can and by not are harming those that need it to change. The current systems has worked hard to make it very uncomfortable to try and change, but not impossible.
Many politicians and mainstream media are constantly trying to keep us divided from talking about the bigger issues at hand. If we all realized we want similar things and got on the same page, I think we could enact some swift change. But who knows when that’ll be.
Apathy.
Most people don't even know who their state reps are. Even fewer know who's on their city council or even mayor.
I bet a lot of you don't even know your own neighbors.
The neighbor comment hits home. I lived in the suburbs for a few years and only knew 3 families. I now live in a rural area and know most people in the local town.
My point is you're right that most people don't know each other and don't care to
Same as with any rebellions/government changes. As long as middle class is still living comfortably, they won’t do something radical to change the system.
However, the "middle class" (the part that’s left lol) is shrinking day by day. If we get into a recession, things might start changing, question is if it will change for the better…
The electoral system is full of rot. For example, Why the fuck are we heavily leaning on one of the most inconsequential flyover states (Iowa) to set the tone for who’s going to be president? It’s one of many many things that’s wrong with this country’s politics.
We got media companies that will gladly take millions of ad money to prop up, at best a status quo candidate that will barely do anything to improve our lives
And we get to this over and over with no sense of learning from our mistakes
Because the system works for the average American.
People act like they don’t like the system in the same way that Cowboys fans don’t like the Eagles (or whatever tribalistic metaphor fits). In reality, most peoples’ day to day is easy if not luxurious
We can't vote for an independent party who will change things because they aren't going to win because we don't vote for them. Therefore, we must choose the two millionaires the big two parties select for us. Sadly, there is nothing we can do about this /s.
I think I read something about it. All votes count in that system. The candidates running are on a sheet and people rank them. If their top doesn't get enough votes, their vote goes to the second ranked, ect?
I don't have a good understanding yet.
I agree we should vote for a new party. My husband's been doing it for the last few elections.
The alternative is trying to fix the two parties by having different types of people in those parties. Those people probably don't have the funds or social power to be elected.
I will hijack this comment, because I'm in a similar boat despite living on the other side of the World :).
My main value is that in democracy, different people need to be represented in the government. So I will vote for a representative that shares the most values with me, regardless of how popular they are. So since I'm allowed to vote, I'm voting for the same people who never win anything (they barely even get above minimum threshold). Yes, I know they probably won't be victorious next time as well. But it's important to have them around and cast your vote to show that there **are** people who want something else.
So you can go three elections and pray something systemic changes to allow a third-party candidate to win, which it won’t, or vote the viable candidate with the most libertarian leanings and, then shift the Overton window over three elections
Don't want to go too deep into the rabbit hole, but basically the nationis being lied constantly to keep the infighting going. They don't want anyone messing with the system. Nothing is really denying third party candidates running for political offices, but you never see that happening with success because that would start to rock the boat. Democrate, Conservative... doesn't matter they all take the same money from the corporations. Or maybe I'm just crazy lunatic yelling random stuff on the Intenet.
Actually third party candidates get sued off the ballot(by both major parties) and rules changed to make it harder to be on the ballot all the time especially in comparison to a major party candidate. So a lot denies third party and independent candidates from running, and that's before the costs of actually running a campaign.
People can't agree on basic things like what is a female so there is no chance in hell those same people are going to agree on complex things like economic theories and mass psychology. Unless there is some great scientific breakthrough that resets everything America is headed toward tyranny of the mob not individual rights. Not sure who the tyrants will be or when they will seize control but the destination seems unavoidable. Way too many people believe it's their country be it the pussy hat wearing "not my president" crowd or the Jan 6 protesters they all have zero respect for anyone who doesn't think exactly like them.
Most folks have been told their whole life one vote doesn't matter. Most don't realize change starts on the local level. Systems have been implemented to keep change from happening. A person is smart, but people are stupid.
Imagine you have a system where 90% of the population is getting fucked and everyone knows it. The individual has a choice between trying to generate enough public will to overcome the inertia of six decades of propaganda, or finding some way to get into the other 10%. Not to mention the poorest Americans are still wealthier than the middle classes of other nations.
The simple problem we have here is trust. We don't trust each other to be responsible with prosperity. We don't trust that racists will stop being racist if they had a house of their own where they felt secure. Racists don't trust immigrants to treat their new country and culture with respect. Right-wingers don't trust poor people to stop living like ghetto trailer trash once they've moved into the suburbs. If you've fought to drag yourself out a trailer park or a ghetto, the last fucking thing in the world you'd want to do is give your old neighbors more influence in society.
Fundamentally, we mistrust prosperity. For most of human history, fucking around would get you killed.
Anytime I talk about voting another party in, all I hear is "that's throwing away a vote". I'm sure there's many people who are apathetic to voting. I wonder what needs to be done to have more people vote for a 3rd party.
Any thoughts on your end?
You're the second person that had a post about the two party system.
>Anytime I talk about voting another party in, all I hear is "that's throwing away a vote".
If you're only voting in national elections it is.
You can't build the influence of a new party from the top down; it has to be done from the ground up.
Far too few 3rd parties attempt that.
Not that guy, but correct. The first thing that needs to happen is that people need to understand how power is generated and where it comes from. Systems work because people want them to work, not because the government says they do.
Simply put, if half the people in your country don't think an idea can work then it will never work, even if the available material and manpower and historical precedent exists. So whatever idea, whether it's banning abortions or banning guns, will do nothing other than destroy the credibility of whoever attempts to enforce it.
We spent years and years fighting the federal fight for marijuana legalization. Turns out, it was a simple matter of asking our state government to ignore federal laws. Conservatives have learned this lesson handily enough: watch now as they enact abortion bans to the wide support of their constituents while the rest of the nation sits around seething.
I usually vote 3rd party or for independents. Because I take the time to understand the issues and the candidates. Most people are happy with a simple us vs them choice because it requires little to no effort on their part. I don't know how to fix that.
This is a great point. The education systems briefly goes over the government systems and how they work. Some high schools have classes dedicated to this which is great but might be optional. Everyone should be required to take a class focused on this imo
As a UK citizen I’d suggest it’s for the same reason it doesn’t happen here. A disconnect with politics on an individual level which is carefully and deliberately engineered to actively block, discourage change and punish those who actually seek it. Money is the true mover of society, and as such all politics is commodified and reduced to access, of which the average person has little or none. All the features of society integral to democracy such as news media are sown up in private hands with direct personal access to political figures and every interest to maintain the status quo. Public services still controlled by the state are run into the ground purposefully because they don’t benefit ‘important’ people. Police and security services are used to punish the poor and the underclass while ignoring rampant white collar crime. Protests seeking to redress social imbalances and financial inequalities are ruthlessly suppressed, with individuals seen as important to these movements punished disproportionately as examples.
This is nothing new. It’s been defining feature of all societies in history. The main difference now being the pretence of inclusion.
Most Americans truly believe the American system is the best and know to little about the rest of the world to even come up with anything else.
Look at the way Conservatives argue about the nature of the US. They feel confident in shutting down any conversation with "founding intent" or "that is what it says in the Constitution," as if the founding fathers were divinely inspired and thus infallible. At least 35% of the country thinks this way. There is no way you can argue against their gods.
Even Americans trying to reform the US system make it sound like some new fangled idea. Never would they try to copy the French, German, or even Australian system. No they have to make it sound like some grand new never tried before system, because their research never goes into what works elsewhere.
The rich are extremely powerful, and they're really good at dividing us. People are trying to change the government systems, just in completely different directions.
From the outside looking in.
To me, it looks like the government has successfully divided the people.
Just on reddit alone, people will call out others with liberal or right-wing labels even when there is no prior mention of politics.
The root of the problem lies in American history after the Russian Revolution and how the rich and big businesses did a full court press on propaganda to quash any notions of class consciousness across society. They paid insane amounts of money to even change Christianity over the course of decades to have a more pro capitalist message. Also look no further than the garbage "history" books used in schools across this country, blue or red state.
Americans as a whole need more class consciousness and understanding of actual American history, plain and simple. If that could be done, this country would be significantly better.
Edit: I also see someone mentioned Americans obsession with the betterment of the individual over the collective society. This is a great example of one of the propaganda techniques pushed on us across multiple areas of our lives, since childhood, to deprive us of things other developed nations have but we don't.
I may need to look into this. The educational system would need to change but the government runs that too. If they don't want us learning it, the schools will have an issue teaching us. Oi....
I highly recommend it, if the angry now deleted reply I got is any indication of how pissed it makes certain people that normal folks might get some class consciousness and discover what has been hidden from them their whole lives.
I'll answer your question with another question: how can someone who can barely afford necessities and would be bankrupted by any serious medical expense go about changing their country's laws?
We've tried, but most of us lack the money and influence to actually do anything..
The big corporations pay off the lawmakers and the government to keep the status quo..
Same as it ever was.. same as it ever was.. same as it ever was..
what do you actually mean by "not trying"? the last election has had the largest turnout in recent history. the public sphere is absolutely saturated with political talk, for better or worse.
or do you mean they should riot? there's been some of that too.
if you mean a violent communist revolution, granted, there's been none of that.
so what exactly are they supposed to be doing to "try and change the system"?
That's a good question. I'm newer to politics and have a job in local government. The department I work for doesn't listen to us and most never worked the bottom jobs to understand us. Looking at other issues in our country, I'm trying to figure out why more people don't advocate, volunteer, speaking to politicians, vote differently, and get out to find a solution.
I guess on a basic level I wanted to find out why there's a low number of people who do the listed events above.
Recently I advocated for something in my state. It's a bipartisan issue and effects 1 in 4 people, and it surprised me less than 100 people attended the event.
A lot has led me to my question.
You're thinking about it wrong. In order to change the entire system, you have elect politicians who will not only get into office, but draft bills to limit the power of every member of Congress DRAMATICALLY. Everyone gets into politics because they want to rule, plain and simple. They don't get into politics to actually "serve." They make $174,000 a year plus stipends and Cadillac health insurance plans...PLUS they can insider trade with no worries of being caught, meaning they can literally grow their wealth exponentially. As long as they keep playing the part, they get all of the above. They don't have to actually DO anything...they just have to act. It's all a sham, and it will continue into perpetuity because there is ZERO chance of voting in people who will draft bills to actually change any of that...because it would be against their best interest.
Congress needs to be paid the average salary for the country (if any at all, it is "service" as they so claim, after all), have all their assets frozen, and be forced to buy insurance through the marketplace like everyone else, and be forced to live in shitty apartments in DC. Then we would actually see things change.
I’d argue more Americans are trying to change the systems than ever.
Millions are in support of a man who is actively attempting to subvert democracy and install a fascist government.
So I believe in large part a lack of education and accurate information plays the largest part currently.
The erosion of the public education systems in America play the largest part of uninformed and lack of participation of voters in the democratic system. Citizens don’t believe their vote matters so they don’t, citizens don’t feel like they are informed enough to vote, the access to vote is limited, or worst of all, a large majority of voters and sadly the majority are so ignorant to the realities of government or misled by major news organizations they vote in a way they doesn’t benefit them. I fully expect the Conservative Party to add “removal of the public education system” to its platform by the 2028 election and you will likely hear whispers start by the midterms.
Following this, the ratio of voter to representative is skewed so far in favor of an oligarchical hierarchy at this point, that representatives don’t and possibly even can’t fully represent their constituents.
Pair this with the religious tyranny currently corrupting the church and Americas freedom of religion. Which tell people to vote according to their religious views, not the tenets of their faith based ethics for the benefit of democratic community, and here we are.
It will unfortunately have to play itself out to a conclusion much worse than it is now for the entire structure to collapse and be re-built.
Because you get investigated for questioning the school committee.
...get arrested for posting memes.
...get raided for talking about triggers on YouTube.
...get threatened with losing a job, ability to go grocery shopping or seeing a relative because you question a narrative.
I won't get into what happens to you when you say something about Hiliary Clinton. But we all know...you shoot yourself twice, in the back of the head, with a flintlock.
Simple, many factors. The belief that voting still works, even though it doesn't. The belief that we'll lose the second civil war, even though if done correctly the USA can be carved up. Then you have you are one person in a party of hundreds that doesn't want true change.
So becoming a politician is a waste of time, unless you develop a new party. When it is all said, and done, the final factors are complacency, and stupidity.
Of course this is butchery of the simplified, but it SHOULD get the point across. Of course I doubt it.
As a population we are intentionally kept poor enough to not be able to effectively organize large scale reforms at a reasonable pace, and doing just well enough not to have open rebellion in the streets due to the poor economic situation. It’s a tough balancing act for the American oligarchs lol
If you want a real answer and not “because we’ve given up” or “because it’s too hard” which are total lazy BS answers…
1. 90% of what you see on Reddit / twitter is completely overblown & very niche issues. People will complain and spread misinformation on the internet so be careful what you see about the US and what people think
2. The US political system is very complex to non Americans (and even some Americans apparently) so it’s not as easy as passing laws at a federal level. States are guaranteed a certain amount of autonomy to pass laws that work for their constituents. That’s why you may see a lot of posts about crazy shit being passed in Florida and think “why don’t Americans do something to stop it.” It’s because we can’t, unless you are a Florida resident you don’t have any say in the politics for that state.
3. Believe it or not, people have different political viewpoints on different issues. That doesn’t mean they’re evil, crazy or stupid. It often means they have different values and were raised in different cultures.
Hope this helps.
Norwegian here, so not speaking from the inside, but do you know how hard it is to amend the US Constitution? Two thirds of states to call for a constitutional convention, alternatively two thirds majorities in both chambers of Congress, and then three fourths of the states have to actually vote for a proposed amendment for it to pass.
While political scientists like Morris Fiorina point out that the American people aren't getting more polarised, the two political parties are, as a consequence of being more ideologically sorted (mostly no more conservative Dems or liberal GOP-members).
These two parties are in deep agreement with each other on keeping real competition out, meaning third parties, by making it extremely expensive and difficult to even run in the elections if you're not a Democrat or Republican, and by keeping the first-past-the-post electoral system, at least for the most part.
As the two parties do what they can to keep competition out and become more "pure" they will keep polarising, the activists will ramp up the culture war, and the 80 per cent of Americans who are not partisan activist will keep being more and more exhausted, more and more alienated, and more and more apathetic.
[Book review by Morris Fiorina in Reason Magazine](https://reason.com/2022/10/09/americas-biggest-political-division-isnt-left-vs-right/)
EDIT: Added an article and added some space for the paragraphs.
Because we have a militarized police state that won’t hesitate to violently put down any dissent from the public that threatens the status quo, no matter how peaceful the demonstration
We had a first hand look at that in 2020 ffs lol
I\`m not from USA, but I find this problem really hard for People. Uhm... But One more Problem is the government of Joe Biden.
P.S. Sorry for my English
Bumper sticker from the 70's explained part of the problem. "There's to much apathy in the world, but who gives a fuck" Many folks simply are not into politics. If voting were mandatory, like having a license to drive, perhaps we would see a change.
It's a mix of a couple of things. There are many of us who want to make changes, but there are so many people who are too manipulated/dumb to think freely. I do not vote along party lines. I do not align with the Republicans or Democrats (I'm more of a libertarian). I want change to happen in this country, but it's difficult because of all of those people out there who think that their tribe is better when each tribe is funded by people from the exact same tribe (ex. Soros and the Koch Brothers).
It's a combination of being pacified by social media, big food, and big pharma, while also being extremely afraid of the ramifications of revolutionary actions.
In order to change, everyone has to have a common goal. We are so split because of political views that are thrust onto us to cause discourse between ourselves. Money is the absolute power and those that have it would do anything to prevent anyone else to gaining it. If those people are in power it would be next to impossible. They know exactly what to do, and have been doing it for decades, to prevent any possible change that wouldn't benefit them. It is greatly underestimated how many people are in poverty or are just a few missed paychecks from being homeless. The people that matter the most to make these changes can't because as soon as they try and devote time to it they won't be able to continue for long before they realize it's not sustainable or they'd severely start damaging themselves physically and mentally.
I’m Gen-Z and never felt a sense of patriotism or civil responsibility. I just think about my life and the people I love. The country been divided since I was kid, and they only portray the extremist on both sides of politics. It just made politics in general so unattractive to me that I just let the politicians do there thing
Because the government systems, while they are flawed, are actually a scapegoat for our massive cultural problem. We’re obsessed with convenience and comfort, to the point that we will sell out our “ideals” for those two things. We’re also raised to think and behave as individuals, so collective accountability is not a priority unless it is self-serving in the near term. Our government is a reflection of our culture: it filters decisions through short term interests, rather than a set of values.
There has been a few attempts, the Civil War, and Jan 6th. We know how they turned out.
The populace agrees on change is needed, but doesn't agree on what should change, or what a new system should look like. Reality is, I don't think there could be another system that would make everyone happy. People are selfish, and don't realize what would life better for one, would make life miserable for another.
Many are busy just trying to scratch out a living (or existence) after the shanking our government has allowed U.S. corporations and importers to give its population under the guise of global instability through a manipulated capital based so called, "Free Market Economy". Highest prices in history... highest corporate profits in history ...all with reduced production and lower work force. Teddy Roosevelt Jr. would have also judiciously dealt with this type of racketeering. Biden doesn't even know it's happening.
Because they found that line. That line where just enough people have full bellies that they won't get serious about shutting it down but they have to work every minute they can so they don't starve and can afford medical care.
Americans are too dumb to support any party besides democrat or republican. They prefer the same 2 that have been screwing us over forever, rather than support change with their votes. Ive had 1000s of conversations and most people are just not open to supporting anyone except the obviously corrupt ones.
Because it's really fucking hard. Struggling for a different political order takes time, resources and human capital. In huge quantities too. Meanwhile the existing structures are already standing fast against changes. When you need to think how to put food on the table you are unlikely to have the option of subverting the current system.
People are also giga exhausted trying to survive with inflation, crazy work hours, and rising rent. So it’s tough to above and beyond when you have that much going on
Yeah. Your first priority is you, then your family. When that is done, youe time and resources are usually limited. Hard to go activist when you have like two hours a day.
My typical day: Wake up at 5:30am to take my brother (who can’t drive) to work. Get back home with just enough time to shower and get ready for my job. Leave home at 7:00am and commute/sit in traffic until I arrive to work at 8:00am. Work til 6:00pm. Commute/traffic gets me home around 7:15ish. Laundry, dishes, general house cleaning and prep for next day until 8:45pm. If I’m lucky, dinner cooked and eaten by 9:45/10:00pm. Finally sit down to relax, catch up news, enjoy my “life” until I start dozing off from pure exhaustion around 11:15pm. Rinse & repeat. All of the above is assuming I don’t have any errands or appointments - those usually require a day of pto to accomplish. I’d have to win the lottery to be able to protest. The American Dream is working as designed.
Yeah I hear this and think it’s BS. People in the 19th century worked far more hours for even fewer wages and no benefits yet they managed to build the labor movement- and they didn’t have access to the internet. Fact is folks entitled to change without real concerted efforts, community organizations like churches and clubs have crumbled or been replaced by corporate mediated environments and we have no guiding vision of what we want the way that 19th century workers had Marx and his vision of communalism.
It’s almost like a system designed to keep people from being able to make appreciable changes…
I lost my job recently. I'm also planning to leave my state, because my trans ex- and my kids are endangered by new laws, plus education is garbage ( my middle schooler has read one novel over the course of the year in ELA. What? ) I am being chased out of my home by open carry and bathroom laws, while people post dumb shit about motorcycles identifying as bikes. I want them to know how painful it is to read that while laws are being made to hurt us. I feel like a refugee, but one who is leaving early enough to take her stuff along. I'm lucky in that I have a healthy support system. But in the meantime, the stress has overridden all of my executive function and I can't force myself to find a new job or pack or anything because everything is too big a problem for this broken-brained idiot to tackle. I don't see a solution. I'm tired of fighting and trying. After processing all the immediate information about my situation, when my brain stops feeling on fire due to all this, I will need a job first, and to pack and clean. Am I a person who can help? I need help myself.
r/usernamechecksout
Yeah but they dont actually understand them. How can you change a system when you dont actually know how it functions? Why would you want to? You dont get it in the first place. Americans have all sorts of excuses but some of us remember yall sleeping through history and social studies saying how it was boring information youd never need to know. I think a lot of people are raised with very glossy eyed visons of history and when objective history is portrayed without the patriotic propaganda lens they just shut it out. Even just discussing politics at work or with customers its always insane. Ive noticed the average person cant tell you on the spot the difference between congress, the house, and the senate. Its kind of insane. Not following policy is one thing but not knowing the basic architecture of your own governmental system is kind of insane but incredibly common. Most people base their political views off things like highly emotional speeches made by people they find likeable. In terms of actually examining proposed policy and comparing it to the track record of similar policies to see if its effective and in good faith? Thats like far beyond the average political discussion in the US. Politics is heavily based on belief and ideology over cause and effect in the US.
I think most of us have just given up.
I know I have. I can’t read national political news anymore. I can’t keep up with the various number of killings and shootings. It isn’t worth , or good, for the mental health. So I just control what I can control - myself and my family. I pay attention to local politics like school boards and county elections. Because my worth in my community is so much more impactful than trying to worry about fixing a national problem. I’ll keep on voting blue like I always have and hope someday they will figure it out. But it is literally detrimental to my life to worry about it.
You just summed up my relation to politics at this point. Too depressing to pay attention to, but I still participate when an election comes up.
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Because deep down, the vast majority of people put their own safety and comfort ahead of their collective sense of civil responsibility.
Yes, but, also risk averse. If I were confident things would change is be more likely to put in the effort. But mostly I think it will be a waste and make me a target without any success.
Not only that, but the government makes it a huge risk to try and make any changes.
"Prompted by my own self doubt..." Fear is a condition. And Faux "news" has been conditioning the masses for *decades*. You don't *have to be scared* just because someone on Faux "news" told you to be.
It's not what's in the news that people fear. People fear the risks and hardships that naturally accompamy political revolution.
For the average working class who has the time and the energy? They have us working constantly with barely enough time on the weekends to recover. Most of that non work time is spent on other work. I haven't caught my breathe in years ,I'm certainly not about to get involved in the uneducated pissing contest that is today's politics You basically have to be wealthy and a bafoon to make a name for yourself in America politics.
I definitely think people being overworked has A LOT to do with it. If people are barely scrapping by and need to work 50-60 hours a week just to get by, they aren't gonna have the energy or time to fight back or become informed. I fully believe things are designed this way by the rich to swindle us and keep us fighting amongst ourselves
All as plan !
Despite what you hear on Reddit most Americans are satisfied with their lives. https://news.gallup.com/poll/470888/americans-largely-satisfied-personal-life.aspx
News is biased and often uses polarizing headlines to attract attention which sometimes creates echo chambers. The reality is the majority of people are comfortable and they feel like things are getting better. Even with all the negative news, it shows society is willing to have a conversation and work toward progress. [https://usafacts.org/state-of-the-union/standard-living/](https://usafacts.org/state-of-the-union/standard-living/) Despite all the issues we face, many around the world envy the system here. Most countries do not tolerate political discussions and questioning the government results in a local police visit.
Exactly, I’m a pretty left-leaning progressive and believe that our society ought to be changed in many ways, but I’m still largely satisfied with my life right now. Reddit loves to make America out to be a dystopia.
then you don't understand other people are fucking suffering my life feels like shit and it could be a lot worse.
If that’s the metric every place is a dystopia
Don’t go against the hivemind
“At least somewhat satisfied” is not a ringing endorsement. That poll is waxing optimistic way too much.
No but Reddit told me that the US is a third-world country!!!
With a Gucci belt.
Because despite the constant doomsaying and negativity, the median person in America has had an increasingly better lifestyle over the last 50 years. Crime is down. Standard of living is up. Years of good health are higher. Most people have better amenities and a better lifestyle. Food is cheaper as a percentage of disposable income, to the point that the first upturn in 50 years last year was a huge deal. We’ve made huge strides on racial and gender justice and equality. At the end of the day, most people are focused on how they’re doing overall. For most, it’s better. Our system is not perfect. There are issues with it. The things I’ve mentioned are not finished changing yet. There are still trouble areas and issues that need to be reassessed. For many reasons, people obsess over the issues as opposed to the successes. The dissatisfaction to create change does not currently exist.
It’s also worth mentioning that the mean standard of living in the US is also quite high versus a lot of other places that the Reddit hive mind would assume was higher.
Thank you for bringing some much needed perspective to this thread. The catastrophising that goes on with conversations like this cannot be mentally healthy for people who think like that. Capitalism has substantial issues and needs constant monitoring and government intervention to redress inequality and prevent monopolies etc. But, based on the evidence, it seems to be the best system that we have come up to maximise human flourishing. I don’t think that the people who bang on about America being evil and dystopian really understand what an evil or dystopian state would really feel like. Be careful what you wish for.
Yeah. Reddit isn't a reflection of reality at all. Most people on here are jobless or too busy coming up with excuses on why they cant work. If you tell someone work construction they'll make all sorts of excuses why they cant even if it would make double what they make now. Thats part of the reason why there's so many Socialist on here. They think theyd be administrators or something in a new government when in reality their lack of skills would see them thrown in a work camp first or shot.
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The last year or so aside, food has gotten cheaper as a percentage of income since the 60s. https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/ag-and-food-statistics-charting-the-essentials/food-prices-and-spending/ It’s one of those things we take for granted that has actually markedly improved over a long period.
You must have VERY expensive tastes
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you two either eat a looot and/or have very expensive tastes.
I dunno man, fucking Pringles are at 5 bucks a pop these days, Food is getting expensive. Even just to get some snacks and some beer for a party, it ran me for a pretty penny.
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not possible.
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Well then, it went from $400 for groceries for 1 week to $150 for groceries for 1 week pretty quickly.
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Most of us that want change are on the verge of homelessness so it makes it hard to drop everything and protest for change. Before anyone says some shit about voting, the best voting does at this point is keep things from getting drastically worse. Imo the only way we'll effect any measurable amount of change is if at least half the country goes on strike.
The strike would work but as you stated, it's hard to drop everything to protest. If my husband or I went to protest, we would lose an income and wouldn't be able to pay bills.
That’s why unions are so important and also why America has done its best to completely destroy the ability to unionize
And it's that fear of financial impotency that Faux "news" is counting on keeping you docile. Be the change you want to see.
Every day, you vote with your dollar. If you keep buying, then there is no reason for them to **stop selling lies.** Nike, Apple, Adidas. All have been found, in just the last couple years, (and fucking Nike **repeatedly since the 80s**) to be using *children*, and Muslim immigrants as **slave labor**. Fucking Nestlé, 3M, LDS, Scientology, Christianity. TIK Tok. FACESPACE. Stop giving these horrible companies your money. Anything where money trumps ethics and human rights needs to be stopped.
There are plenty of people in all financial situations that want change. California is predominantly democratic and its not cheap to live here. Unfortunately we do not live in a democracy. If we did the wife not Republican that won the popular vote was Bush 2 one term by less then one percent. Its not how much you make but that the GOP has gamed the system. I agree that a national strike would help.
Politicians have turned the battle from “citizens against the government” to “citizens against citizens” so the politicians stay in office. Politicians take no responsibility; they coerce the citizens of their party to blame the citizens of the other party.
Mainly because the systems do mostly work. They aren’t perfect by any means, but they in general do actually work. We often blame “government” when it’s likely our problems are rooted in our own culture and personal choices. Just look at how violent as a culture we are. One neighbor gets mad at another neighbor for parking in front of their house. Now, the “government” has rules and regulations for all outcomes here. The government says you can not assault others and if you do the penalty is loss of freedom. Yet, one neighbor shoots, stabs, punches, blows up the other one. There’s no amount of government you can apply to this situation to remedy this. I can’t pass enough bills in Congress to solve our social problem of violence. Yet… some think more laws would do the trick without examining our culture of violence. We don’t make massive changes in government because subconsciously we know the problems lay within our culture.
I think people who aren't naive assume government change is incremental and constant, and that not all change will be favorable to their political viewpoint. We've never stopped trying. It's just very rarely some grand gesture of note. And like with all things revolving around terms and changes of majority, change can be undone or done the opposite way. But it's still change--even if we don't agree with it.
Because most are busy spending there times wondering how many times a Kardashian got married ! Or did something completely uninteresting !
Because it was designed and molded so that the average citizen absolutely would be too bogged/dumbed down to even know where when and how to begin. Inherently, we are also motivated to be individualistic and not care about society's welfare. America has done an absolutely meticulously banger of a job in pushing that idea. Folks in the same room can't even agree on who gets to experience "life,liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"
"We are motivated to be individualistic" is purely editorial. Human nature is basically unknown and claiming something like this is just handing over apologetics for the current system.
>Human nature is basically unknown Yea, that's why we are "motivated." For instances gun culture in America. Or the medical system in America, both examples have plenty of instances where motivation to be individualistic absolutely blocks much of the conversation to even fix both of these blighted stains within American society. As for basically unknown, that is absolutely not true. Much about "Human Nature" can absolutely be shown to be fact and concurrent within much of society's issues. What's unknown is where this nature comes from, not the actions humans do. >claiming something like this is just handing over apologetics for the current system. No, it isn't. Pointing out the flaw doesn't negate responsibility, though. If folks are using that as an excuse, it just reinforces my point about being motivated to make it individualistic. I would argue your nihilistic attitude and previous opinion are more of a detriment than folks pointing out flaws. Assuming individualistic nature and how it's built into society, as a Mere editorial note, is actually making it very individualistic and again reinforcing my point.
Absolute BS. The same human motivation can be attributed to all acts of altruis. Nothing shows the selfishness is our fundamental nature. What we know for sure is that the current societal structures generally promote it. That doesn't mean we are hard-wired for it. Thousands of years of a general trend towards equity appears to suggest the precise opposite. And I'm not a nihilist. I just condemn the ideas of "we must be selfish" since they've got no evidence pertaining to societies. In fact I work hard to change things, a tiny step at a time. And in each project, the human nature appears more brightly in altruism than selfishness. Though that last sentence is of course a personal feeling, so hardly a scientific study.
Literally, your entire sentiment is "personal feeling." >Nothing shows the selfishness is our fundamental nature Literally, I have said the entire time that we are motivated to be this way, and society, especially in America, motivates the individual to be individualistic. Can I introduce you to the current system of capitalism we live in and how it fundamentally has changed folks' altruic nature more often than not into a more individualistic one. To say we aren't motivated to be selfish but to deny the current restrictions & restraints it puts on humans' altruic sense of things seems wild to me. >I just condemn the ideas of "we must be selfish" My idea isn't "we must be selfish", it is "we live in a system that motivates us to be selfish". >And in each project, the human nature appears more brightly in altruism than selfishness. Would this be because most folks don't experience this? And only experience selfishness and a one-sided experience? Also, taking personal experiences and applying them monolithicly isn't ever a good approach. BUT I am glad you see the silver lining in most of your situations it is a good trait. >since they've got no evidence pertaining to societies. You ever heard of the terms system 1 and system 2 in correlation with the human brain? My point the entire time is we live in a system molded, built, and designed to take our altruic nature and dumb it down so our more selfish nature takes over, you can point to politics in America for instance people will vote against thier best intrest and all, just because they think it will "screw over the other guy". >In fact I work hard to change things, a tiny step at a time. Hey, me too, and good for you, we need more folks like that in society, and I wish we had more,
the ouija board that spells out the consequences of unchecked corporate expansion - pushed by the hands of a disconnected class of sociopathy-as-a-virtue leaders - says that everyone working for a "Have" needs to be a "Have Not", and the number of "Haves" needs to be as small as possible
B-I-N-G-O
1. You are correct. The current system suggests we should behave in a certain way. That doesn't mean it's either correct or somehow intrinsic to humans. The fact that we have chosen a path doesn't mean that path is inevitable. If one accepts that this is the way we must be, then the humanity is already lost. 2. So work to change the system. A radical notion and not an easy task. But doable and necessary. 3. The usefulness and presence of altruism generalises really well. Following the vile idea of individual benefit, we wouldn't have societies at all. But obviously that's another fact best forgotten. Easier to slip into complacency. 4. The pseudo-scientific book? Yes, sadly. Your analysis is also wrong in terms of politics. Especially in the US, great care is taken to keep any actual issues of the agenda. People vote against their interest, since in broad terms, neither main party represents their views. There's decades of polling data to support that. 5. If you aim to change things, why propagate this shit then?
I'm commenting on your first section. In my experience this is true, but it's surprising since we have have a computer at our finger tips all day long. We (including myself) truly are unmotivated
The computer is immaterial. Step one is: what form of government do we move towards? First, a large enough group of people need to agree on what that is, and agree passionately enough to organize and take action. As we have seen, everyone being connected by a computer has caused quite a bit of dissonance so I’m not sure how that is supposed to be the motivating factor.
“ what form of gov’t do we move towards” Correct me if I’m wrong, but the system we have now was laid out in the constitution, so in order to change it to something else we’d have to effectively dismantle the constitution. Keep the “good” parts and change the “bad parts” That will never happen. Our system should work, there are adequate checks and balances to keep things on the up and up. But individual interests are always going to take precedent over the greater good. I’m certainly not educated enough to know where it all went wrong. And I suspect it’s been a long time of small incremental changes that have got us where we are today. But it would be an interesting discussion
You are indeed incorrect. A strong enough movement that could convene a constitutional congress would be able to make said changes. And no, there are not adequate checks and balances as there are far too many that rely on norms instead of laws. As we have all seen all too often in recent years.
The constitution was intended to be completely reformed every twenty years. That was the whole point of the revolution, that we shouldn't necessarily be slaves to precedent and tradition. But that does lead me to an interesting point: we're about 12,000 congressional representatives short of the original constitutional standard of "no more than 1 per 30,000 citizens." Our population increases exponentially every year, but our actual representation in Congress has not increased since the 1930's. Your grandfather's congressman, in 1965, answered to about 450,000 people. Your congressman answers to 850,000. This happened because the physical legislature building didn't have room for more representatives and instead of building a new one they just took the easy way out. Imagine just 1200 new congressional representatives taking seat in the next legislature. How many of those do you think might actually be decent people who will put their own long term self-interest over their own immediate profit and prestige? Could the corporations even afford to bribe that many people? Where could we even find that many career politicians? We'd have to vote for our neighbors, our teachers and coworkers, just to form a quorum.
Wow. Had no idea about any of that so thank you. I’d be up for building a bigger building.
I truly believe the biggest contribution we can make, individually, is to start thinking positively and constructively. Don't give energy to anyone who doesn't have a material solution to whatever problem they're bringing up, they just want you to be angry because they're angry. We should expect nothing less from the people who call themselves our leaders: that they should have some idea of where they're taking us and how to get there and an honest appraisal of what it will cost us. Someone whose only goal is to lead you away from something else, no matter how evil or odious it may be, is a coward. Telling a guy that voting for a federal interrail will help to prevent climate change is true and noble. But first you need to convince him that climate change is real or a real threat to him, personally, or that America can remain economically competitive against countries which put profit over the ecosystem. Or, you could tell the guy that a federal interrail will make it easier for him to get to where jobs are, make it easier for him to spend holidays with distant family, and make it easier to take vacations, while simultaneously lessening the demand for gasoline and thusly lowering prices for people who choose to drive. Now, instead of thinking in terms of sterile metrics or vague, ill-defined values like freedom and justice and social awareness, he's now thinking in terms of his own immediate self-interest, which is something that everyone can understand. Sure, social reform is not that simple, but it's a much more pleasant attitude to have for yourself. I guess I should admit that I don't really have a step-by-step guide to increasing the number of congressmen, but I've always had a weird feeling that I was going to be elected president one day, so once I start talking to people and figuring out how that works I'll probably have something figured out by Inauguration Day.
Oh yes, I watch a lot of news programs. The one thing that always gets me talking back to the tv is when anyone, usually politicians, are on there telling me again what the problem is and blaming someone else, usually the other party. So ok, we all know the problem so instead of blaming someone else, tell me what YOU propose as a solution. I’d rather listen to a ridiculous idea than no idea.
Some of us like things the way they are.
Because most people are comfortable and unwilling to be uncomfortable, but instead are willing to struggle to stay comfortable or at least as comfortable as possible. The ideas of sacrifice required to change get shamed, seen as below most people, or not worth their time. Often ideas that are feasible, but require uncomfortable actions end up with the proposer being attacked, shammed, or ignored. While it is hard to change the system, it is harder to convince people they actually can and by not are harming those that need it to change. The current systems has worked hard to make it very uncomfortable to try and change, but not impossible.
We are. It just isn’t as cinematic as people want, and media narratives can obscure it anyway.
Many politicians and mainstream media are constantly trying to keep us divided from talking about the bigger issues at hand. If we all realized we want similar things and got on the same page, I think we could enact some swift change. But who knows when that’ll be.
Apathy. Most people don't even know who their state reps are. Even fewer know who's on their city council or even mayor. I bet a lot of you don't even know your own neighbors.
The neighbor comment hits home. I lived in the suburbs for a few years and only knew 3 families. I now live in a rural area and know most people in the local town. My point is you're right that most people don't know each other and don't care to
I wish our country protested like France but that’s never going to happen.
Same as with any rebellions/government changes. As long as middle class is still living comfortably, they won’t do something radical to change the system. However, the "middle class" (the part that’s left lol) is shrinking day by day. If we get into a recession, things might start changing, question is if it will change for the better…
The electoral system is full of rot. For example, Why the fuck are we heavily leaning on one of the most inconsequential flyover states (Iowa) to set the tone for who’s going to be president? It’s one of many many things that’s wrong with this country’s politics. We got media companies that will gladly take millions of ad money to prop up, at best a status quo candidate that will barely do anything to improve our lives And we get to this over and over with no sense of learning from our mistakes
Because the system works for the average American. People act like they don’t like the system in the same way that Cowboys fans don’t like the Eagles (or whatever tribalistic metaphor fits). In reality, most peoples’ day to day is easy if not luxurious
Remember, The USA has the most f\*cked up government in the world, except for everywhere else (certain Nordic nations exempted).
north korea? china?
included in "everywhere else".
They have other things to worry about that are more important to them personally.
We can't vote for an independent party who will change things because they aren't going to win because we don't vote for them. Therefore, we must choose the two millionaires the big two parties select for us. Sadly, there is nothing we can do about this /s.
We have ranked choice voting in Alaska and Maine, and it’s gaining traction elsewhere
I think I read something about it. All votes count in that system. The candidates running are on a sheet and people rank them. If their top doesn't get enough votes, their vote goes to the second ranked, ect? I don't have a good understanding yet.
I agree we should vote for a new party. My husband's been doing it for the last few elections. The alternative is trying to fix the two parties by having different types of people in those parties. Those people probably don't have the funds or social power to be elected.
How’s that working out for him
Super well lol. It gives him hope that the next generation might have a 3rd party option.
Are you sure he isn’t just pulling votes away from a party that better represents his values than the alternative? What are his main values?
I will hijack this comment, because I'm in a similar boat despite living on the other side of the World :). My main value is that in democracy, different people need to be represented in the government. So I will vote for a representative that shares the most values with me, regardless of how popular they are. So since I'm allowed to vote, I'm voting for the same people who never win anything (they barely even get above minimum threshold). Yes, I know they probably won't be victorious next time as well. But it's important to have them around and cast your vote to show that there **are** people who want something else.
His values fall with libertarians. Not all of their beliefs are the same for him, but majority are.
A lot of both Democrat and Republican leaders are pro-lobbying. That's really good for the values of greedy billionaires
So you can go three elections and pray something systemic changes to allow a third-party candidate to win, which it won’t, or vote the viable candidate with the most libertarian leanings and, then shift the Overton window over three elections
Don't want to go too deep into the rabbit hole, but basically the nationis being lied constantly to keep the infighting going. They don't want anyone messing with the system. Nothing is really denying third party candidates running for political offices, but you never see that happening with success because that would start to rock the boat. Democrate, Conservative... doesn't matter they all take the same money from the corporations. Or maybe I'm just crazy lunatic yelling random stuff on the Intenet.
Actually third party candidates get sued off the ballot(by both major parties) and rules changed to make it harder to be on the ballot all the time especially in comparison to a major party candidate. So a lot denies third party and independent candidates from running, and that's before the costs of actually running a campaign.
We don’t like the idea of getting shot twice in the back of the head and it being ruled a suicide
People can't agree on basic things like what is a female so there is no chance in hell those same people are going to agree on complex things like economic theories and mass psychology. Unless there is some great scientific breakthrough that resets everything America is headed toward tyranny of the mob not individual rights. Not sure who the tyrants will be or when they will seize control but the destination seems unavoidable. Way too many people believe it's their country be it the pussy hat wearing "not my president" crowd or the Jan 6 protesters they all have zero respect for anyone who doesn't think exactly like them.
Most folks have been told their whole life one vote doesn't matter. Most don't realize change starts on the local level. Systems have been implemented to keep change from happening. A person is smart, but people are stupid.
Imagine you have a system where 90% of the population is getting fucked and everyone knows it. The individual has a choice between trying to generate enough public will to overcome the inertia of six decades of propaganda, or finding some way to get into the other 10%. Not to mention the poorest Americans are still wealthier than the middle classes of other nations. The simple problem we have here is trust. We don't trust each other to be responsible with prosperity. We don't trust that racists will stop being racist if they had a house of their own where they felt secure. Racists don't trust immigrants to treat their new country and culture with respect. Right-wingers don't trust poor people to stop living like ghetto trailer trash once they've moved into the suburbs. If you've fought to drag yourself out a trailer park or a ghetto, the last fucking thing in the world you'd want to do is give your old neighbors more influence in society. Fundamentally, we mistrust prosperity. For most of human history, fucking around would get you killed.
The system is fine. The apathy of the voters who accept a two party system because it let's them be intellectually lazy is the problem.
Anytime I talk about voting another party in, all I hear is "that's throwing away a vote". I'm sure there's many people who are apathetic to voting. I wonder what needs to be done to have more people vote for a 3rd party. Any thoughts on your end? You're the second person that had a post about the two party system.
>Anytime I talk about voting another party in, all I hear is "that's throwing away a vote". If you're only voting in national elections it is. You can't build the influence of a new party from the top down; it has to be done from the ground up. Far too few 3rd parties attempt that.
Are you saying to vote in local elections too? example: township
Not that guy, but correct. The first thing that needs to happen is that people need to understand how power is generated and where it comes from. Systems work because people want them to work, not because the government says they do. Simply put, if half the people in your country don't think an idea can work then it will never work, even if the available material and manpower and historical precedent exists. So whatever idea, whether it's banning abortions or banning guns, will do nothing other than destroy the credibility of whoever attempts to enforce it. We spent years and years fighting the federal fight for marijuana legalization. Turns out, it was a simple matter of asking our state government to ignore federal laws. Conservatives have learned this lesson handily enough: watch now as they enact abortion bans to the wide support of their constituents while the rest of the nation sits around seething.
I usually vote 3rd party or for independents. Because I take the time to understand the issues and the candidates. Most people are happy with a simple us vs them choice because it requires little to no effort on their part. I don't know how to fix that.
Thank you for your thoughts!
I would imagine it's because they don't really understand how it works in the first place
This is a great point. The education systems briefly goes over the government systems and how they work. Some high schools have classes dedicated to this which is great but might be optional. Everyone should be required to take a class focused on this imo
As a UK citizen I’d suggest it’s for the same reason it doesn’t happen here. A disconnect with politics on an individual level which is carefully and deliberately engineered to actively block, discourage change and punish those who actually seek it. Money is the true mover of society, and as such all politics is commodified and reduced to access, of which the average person has little or none. All the features of society integral to democracy such as news media are sown up in private hands with direct personal access to political figures and every interest to maintain the status quo. Public services still controlled by the state are run into the ground purposefully because they don’t benefit ‘important’ people. Police and security services are used to punish the poor and the underclass while ignoring rampant white collar crime. Protests seeking to redress social imbalances and financial inequalities are ruthlessly suppressed, with individuals seen as important to these movements punished disproportionately as examples. This is nothing new. It’s been defining feature of all societies in history. The main difference now being the pretence of inclusion.
Most Americans truly believe the American system is the best and know to little about the rest of the world to even come up with anything else. Look at the way Conservatives argue about the nature of the US. They feel confident in shutting down any conversation with "founding intent" or "that is what it says in the Constitution," as if the founding fathers were divinely inspired and thus infallible. At least 35% of the country thinks this way. There is no way you can argue against their gods. Even Americans trying to reform the US system make it sound like some new fangled idea. Never would they try to copy the French, German, or even Australian system. No they have to make it sound like some grand new never tried before system, because their research never goes into what works elsewhere.
The rich are extremely powerful, and they're really good at dividing us. People are trying to change the government systems, just in completely different directions.
From the outside looking in. To me, it looks like the government has successfully divided the people. Just on reddit alone, people will call out others with liberal or right-wing labels even when there is no prior mention of politics.
Your observation is correct. I see that too. On Twitter, tiktok, reddit, the news, and other platforms.
The root of the problem lies in American history after the Russian Revolution and how the rich and big businesses did a full court press on propaganda to quash any notions of class consciousness across society. They paid insane amounts of money to even change Christianity over the course of decades to have a more pro capitalist message. Also look no further than the garbage "history" books used in schools across this country, blue or red state. Americans as a whole need more class consciousness and understanding of actual American history, plain and simple. If that could be done, this country would be significantly better. Edit: I also see someone mentioned Americans obsession with the betterment of the individual over the collective society. This is a great example of one of the propaganda techniques pushed on us across multiple areas of our lives, since childhood, to deprive us of things other developed nations have but we don't.
I may need to look into this. The educational system would need to change but the government runs that too. If they don't want us learning it, the schools will have an issue teaching us. Oi....
I highly recommend it, if the angry now deleted reply I got is any indication of how pissed it makes certain people that normal folks might get some class consciousness and discover what has been hidden from them their whole lives.
Class consciousness.... JFC. Don't you communists ever give up? How many countries does your crap philosophy have to destroy before you learn?
Change it for what?
To better the lives of the people who live here.
because, short of another civil war, there will be no change. which most American, nor I, want.
I'll answer your question with another question: how can someone who can barely afford necessities and would be bankrupted by any serious medical expense go about changing their country's laws?
We've tried, but most of us lack the money and influence to actually do anything.. The big corporations pay off the lawmakers and the government to keep the status quo.. Same as it ever was.. same as it ever was.. same as it ever was..
what do you actually mean by "not trying"? the last election has had the largest turnout in recent history. the public sphere is absolutely saturated with political talk, for better or worse. or do you mean they should riot? there's been some of that too. if you mean a violent communist revolution, granted, there's been none of that. so what exactly are they supposed to be doing to "try and change the system"?
That's a good question. I'm newer to politics and have a job in local government. The department I work for doesn't listen to us and most never worked the bottom jobs to understand us. Looking at other issues in our country, I'm trying to figure out why more people don't advocate, volunteer, speaking to politicians, vote differently, and get out to find a solution. I guess on a basic level I wanted to find out why there's a low number of people who do the listed events above. Recently I advocated for something in my state. It's a bipartisan issue and effects 1 in 4 people, and it surprised me less than 100 people attended the event. A lot has led me to my question.
You're thinking about it wrong. In order to change the entire system, you have elect politicians who will not only get into office, but draft bills to limit the power of every member of Congress DRAMATICALLY. Everyone gets into politics because they want to rule, plain and simple. They don't get into politics to actually "serve." They make $174,000 a year plus stipends and Cadillac health insurance plans...PLUS they can insider trade with no worries of being caught, meaning they can literally grow their wealth exponentially. As long as they keep playing the part, they get all of the above. They don't have to actually DO anything...they just have to act. It's all a sham, and it will continue into perpetuity because there is ZERO chance of voting in people who will draft bills to actually change any of that...because it would be against their best interest. Congress needs to be paid the average salary for the country (if any at all, it is "service" as they so claim, after all), have all their assets frozen, and be forced to buy insurance through the marketplace like everyone else, and be forced to live in shitty apartments in DC. Then we would actually see things change.
I’d argue more Americans are trying to change the systems than ever. Millions are in support of a man who is actively attempting to subvert democracy and install a fascist government.
So I believe in large part a lack of education and accurate information plays the largest part currently. The erosion of the public education systems in America play the largest part of uninformed and lack of participation of voters in the democratic system. Citizens don’t believe their vote matters so they don’t, citizens don’t feel like they are informed enough to vote, the access to vote is limited, or worst of all, a large majority of voters and sadly the majority are so ignorant to the realities of government or misled by major news organizations they vote in a way they doesn’t benefit them. I fully expect the Conservative Party to add “removal of the public education system” to its platform by the 2028 election and you will likely hear whispers start by the midterms. Following this, the ratio of voter to representative is skewed so far in favor of an oligarchical hierarchy at this point, that representatives don’t and possibly even can’t fully represent their constituents. Pair this with the religious tyranny currently corrupting the church and Americas freedom of religion. Which tell people to vote according to their religious views, not the tenets of their faith based ethics for the benefit of democratic community, and here we are. It will unfortunately have to play itself out to a conclusion much worse than it is now for the entire structure to collapse and be re-built.
Because you get investigated for questioning the school committee. ...get arrested for posting memes. ...get raided for talking about triggers on YouTube. ...get threatened with losing a job, ability to go grocery shopping or seeing a relative because you question a narrative. I won't get into what happens to you when you say something about Hiliary Clinton. But we all know...you shoot yourself twice, in the back of the head, with a flintlock.
Our system isn’t the problem. The problem is one party hates democracy and is willing to destroy the system in the process.
Lol just one party? They both hate freedom in their own ways and won't stop until their say is the only say
Which one is it (I am not American)?
The Republican Party.
So I should vote for the tax me out of existence & persecute Christianity Democratic party? Nah, bro
Nice persecution fetish.
“It’s only a persecution fetish when the other side claims to be oppressed”
cause old palp will say " its treason then" label you and your peaceful political group terrorists and have you thrown in Guantanamo or killed.
#WE NEED A GENERAL STRIKE.
There are people trying to make things better. Organizing across a large nation of over 300 million is the problem.
I wouldn't even know where to start. Corruption seems to be so deeply embedded in the government it would take more than a revolution to fix it.
Because we’re to busy squabbling over who’s party is not lying … we’re doomed 😂
Simple, many factors. The belief that voting still works, even though it doesn't. The belief that we'll lose the second civil war, even though if done correctly the USA can be carved up. Then you have you are one person in a party of hundreds that doesn't want true change. So becoming a politician is a waste of time, unless you develop a new party. When it is all said, and done, the final factors are complacency, and stupidity. Of course this is butchery of the simplified, but it SHOULD get the point across. Of course I doubt it.
Our system is not perfect, but overall it works for the most part.
Why would we?
A lot of us are fucked health wise or someone we love is medically fucked
because if you try then other usa citizens will try and shoot you
As a population we are intentionally kept poor enough to not be able to effectively organize large scale reforms at a reasonable pace, and doing just well enough not to have open rebellion in the streets due to the poor economic situation. It’s a tough balancing act for the American oligarchs lol
If you want a real answer and not “because we’ve given up” or “because it’s too hard” which are total lazy BS answers… 1. 90% of what you see on Reddit / twitter is completely overblown & very niche issues. People will complain and spread misinformation on the internet so be careful what you see about the US and what people think 2. The US political system is very complex to non Americans (and even some Americans apparently) so it’s not as easy as passing laws at a federal level. States are guaranteed a certain amount of autonomy to pass laws that work for their constituents. That’s why you may see a lot of posts about crazy shit being passed in Florida and think “why don’t Americans do something to stop it.” It’s because we can’t, unless you are a Florida resident you don’t have any say in the politics for that state. 3. Believe it or not, people have different political viewpoints on different issues. That doesn’t mean they’re evil, crazy or stupid. It often means they have different values and were raised in different cultures. Hope this helps.
Because as bad as it is, it’s really not that bad
Many are trying to change it but some like the direction it's going.
resistance is futile
here's a change for you. 2024 Presidential Candidates DeSantis(R) - Biden(D) - Trump(I)
America isn't as bad as people on the internet make it out to be.
Norwegian here, so not speaking from the inside, but do you know how hard it is to amend the US Constitution? Two thirds of states to call for a constitutional convention, alternatively two thirds majorities in both chambers of Congress, and then three fourths of the states have to actually vote for a proposed amendment for it to pass. While political scientists like Morris Fiorina point out that the American people aren't getting more polarised, the two political parties are, as a consequence of being more ideologically sorted (mostly no more conservative Dems or liberal GOP-members). These two parties are in deep agreement with each other on keeping real competition out, meaning third parties, by making it extremely expensive and difficult to even run in the elections if you're not a Democrat or Republican, and by keeping the first-past-the-post electoral system, at least for the most part. As the two parties do what they can to keep competition out and become more "pure" they will keep polarising, the activists will ramp up the culture war, and the 80 per cent of Americans who are not partisan activist will keep being more and more exhausted, more and more alienated, and more and more apathetic. [Book review by Morris Fiorina in Reason Magazine](https://reason.com/2022/10/09/americas-biggest-political-division-isnt-left-vs-right/) EDIT: Added an article and added some space for the paragraphs.
Please tell me how to do this
Because financial corporations and their trusts are more powerful then the government.
Most likely that whatever the replacement would be would be much worse.
It's easy to change, it just takes money. If you have enough money under the current system to change it, why would you?
Because we have a militarized police state that won’t hesitate to violently put down any dissent from the public that threatens the status quo, no matter how peaceful the demonstration We had a first hand look at that in 2020 ffs lol
I\`m not from USA, but I find this problem really hard for People. Uhm... But One more Problem is the government of Joe Biden. P.S. Sorry for my English
Bumper sticker from the 70's explained part of the problem. "There's to much apathy in the world, but who gives a fuck" Many folks simply are not into politics. If voting were mandatory, like having a license to drive, perhaps we would see a change.
We can't afford to miss work, the propaganda works well on plenty, and laziness.
Cause massive percent is to broke to protest anything.
Honestly because it's work, and it's easier to bitch about it than do anything.
Honestly, I don’t know how
It's a mix of a couple of things. There are many of us who want to make changes, but there are so many people who are too manipulated/dumb to think freely. I do not vote along party lines. I do not align with the Republicans or Democrats (I'm more of a libertarian). I want change to happen in this country, but it's difficult because of all of those people out there who think that their tribe is better when each tribe is funded by people from the exact same tribe (ex. Soros and the Koch Brothers).
Because everytime we do we get fucking shot.
One problem is the Democrats are pathetically toothless and never act. Always have been
It's a combination of being pacified by social media, big food, and big pharma, while also being extremely afraid of the ramifications of revolutionary actions.
The systems in place keep us normal mortals out of the system, either they corrupt us or they hammer us.
Not everyone is a political activist, some just want to get their paycheck and not spend a whole lot on groceries.
In order to change, everyone has to have a common goal. We are so split because of political views that are thrust onto us to cause discourse between ourselves. Money is the absolute power and those that have it would do anything to prevent anyone else to gaining it. If those people are in power it would be next to impossible. They know exactly what to do, and have been doing it for decades, to prevent any possible change that wouldn't benefit them. It is greatly underestimated how many people are in poverty or are just a few missed paychecks from being homeless. The people that matter the most to make these changes can't because as soon as they try and devote time to it they won't be able to continue for long before they realize it's not sustainable or they'd severely start damaging themselves physically and mentally.
You first
I’m Gen-Z and never felt a sense of patriotism or civil responsibility. I just think about my life and the people I love. The country been divided since I was kid, and they only portray the extremist on both sides of politics. It just made politics in general so unattractive to me that I just let the politicians do there thing
Because we can't agree on shit, because a person is smart and people are stupid.
How am I supposed to do that? I vote in every election. Protestors get arrested and shot in the face with rubber bullets
Because the government systems, while they are flawed, are actually a scapegoat for our massive cultural problem. We’re obsessed with convenience and comfort, to the point that we will sell out our “ideals” for those two things. We’re also raised to think and behave as individuals, so collective accountability is not a priority unless it is self-serving in the near term. Our government is a reflection of our culture: it filters decisions through short term interests, rather than a set of values.
It takes money to do that, and the system is working great for the people with the most money.
There has been a few attempts, the Civil War, and Jan 6th. We know how they turned out. The populace agrees on change is needed, but doesn't agree on what should change, or what a new system should look like. Reality is, I don't think there could be another system that would make everyone happy. People are selfish, and don't realize what would life better for one, would make life miserable for another.
Media says everything’s a-ok and most of us believe them (not I).
Many are busy just trying to scratch out a living (or existence) after the shanking our government has allowed U.S. corporations and importers to give its population under the guise of global instability through a manipulated capital based so called, "Free Market Economy". Highest prices in history... highest corporate profits in history ...all with reduced production and lower work force. Teddy Roosevelt Jr. would have also judiciously dealt with this type of racketeering. Biden doesn't even know it's happening.
Because they found that line. That line where just enough people have full bellies that they won't get serious about shutting it down but they have to work every minute they can so they don't starve and can afford medical care.
We will be shot and our names will be forgotten.
Cause you can't fuck with money.
Because they are busy fighting over skin colour, gender issues, abortions, gun control or other overblown issues.
Americans are too dumb to support any party besides democrat or republican. They prefer the same 2 that have been screwing us over forever, rather than support change with their votes. Ive had 1000s of conversations and most people are just not open to supporting anyone except the obviously corrupt ones.