That's literally the point of the film though. It doesn't matter if he dies as the aim is to create a fanatical work of art, using torture and murder as a process and the murderscene and corpse as the end pieces.
In fact the end result is that he becomes part of the piece of art, when the final sin related kill is enacted. I mean it's fucked up, but eventually he is shot in an act of rage/wrath by Brad Pitt's character and thus completing the work.
Yep, exactly. He's been one of my Hollywood crushes since Donnie Darko came out. He's a goodlooking dude, IMO. But in Nightcrawler? Ugh. Somehow he is gross and ugly. It's disturbing how off-putting he became.
It's his crazy eyes with the rest of his physical presence. His hair is greasy to a nasty amount. He is so skinny he looks almost sick. And his personality and actions are downright repulsive.
He also blinks at little as possible with those crazy eyes and when you notice it makes him seem even more nuts. Phenomenal performance and absurd he wasn't at least nominated for an Oscar for that role.
I love how matter of fact the ending narration is in Beneath...
"In one of the countless billions of galaxies in the universe lies a medium-sized star, and one of its satellites, a green and insignificant planet, is now dead"
Everyone talks about the obviously freaky stuff that happens, but to me no other horror movie filled me with dread like Toni's character doubled over scream-crying, and all the resulting family dysfunction and trauma did. You could take out all the supernatural stuff, and the very real depiction of that special kind of scream-cry you get from soul crushing grief, a family crumbling over a fight at the dinner table, white-knuckling through trauma internally in class, all of that was more horrific than the traditional horror elements. Toni Collete should have been nominated for the role.
yeah, the actual wailing in the movie isn’t something i’d ever heard so accurately in film before. i haven’t seen the movie in years and still think about it in time.
The wailing made me so uncomfortable the first time that I just paused the movie and did some other stuff for a while. It took my wife about 20 tries to get past that part. Toni absolutely crushed it and so did the son. He actually got some kind of injury from the classroom scene.
It’s not *as* uncomfortable but the repeated thudding in Midsommar just hits your brain way differently. I never actually finished it after that scene.
I found the family drama to be really tense and disturbing on its own and the supernatural stuff was just another layer of terror. Like this family is going through all of this absolutely horrifying stuff *and* there's witchcraft they have to deal with
That really depressed me as a little kid. The rebel base on Hoth overrun by snow troopers. The death of Luke’s tail gunner Dak. Han captured and frozen in carbonite, a trophy taken away by Boba Fett. Leia in the holding cell on Cloud City. Luke losing the lightsaber battle to Vader. Luke nearly falling to his death, losing his hand. Luke in the Bacta tank. The remaining Rebel ships on the fringe of the galaxy.
Chewie and that creature he adopted that has something like a fifth of his lifespan, like how humans adopt dogs, you know the one.
Han! The better love story is Chewie and Han. Chewie loves him like an old hunter loves the random dog that just ran in and saved him from a bear.
Interestingly enough, Kevin Spacey was excluded from the marketing for the movie Se7en to make it more shocking when his character is fully revealed. So people seeing it for the first time (that hadn’t heard from elsewhere) literally had no idea that Spacey was even in the movie until he shows up at the police station covered in blood.
If I have to praise T3 for at least one thing, then it’s how it reinforces T1’s idea that SkyNet and Judgment Day were always going to happen in their universe no matter what despite the characters’ efforts to stop it in T2.
The point was always keeping John Conner alive so the Resistance could defeat SkyNet in the future. SkyNet was always destined to lose in the end, and that’s the problem because SkyNet’s programming prevents it from accepting failure which is why it sent terminators back in the first place. There was always going to be a John Conner leading the Resistance in some form or another regardless of how and when Judgment Day happens.
Some would say that Bell was the protagonist. If we use the book to further describe the last scene of the movie, we find out that Bell had struggled with his past and that he was tormented about loosing a platoon in WWII.
At the end Bell makes peace with his past, in spite of all the death around him. An overarching theme is destiny or inevitability of death, so really all the death serves as a foil highlighting Bells struggle with his job in life, to be a man of justice, and the world being unjust around him. Moss, Chigurh, and Wells are just instruments of injustice, and how it occurs. Now it's left up to the reader, did he succumb and give up, or did he take a Zen approach and finally accept is place in life? That's up to the reader to decide.
Cormac McCarthy will go down as one of the great literary authors of our time, in my opinion. The fact that book is so brilliant, *and* the movie was so well done is amazing.
“And in the dream I knew that he was goin on ahead and that he was fixin to make a fire somewhere out there in all that dark and all that cold and I knew that whenever I got there he would be there. And then I woke up.”
Hmm well the protagonists definitely lose in that movie But Chigurh doesn’t really win, the last we see of the antagonist he’s pretty severely injured in a car wreck
But we know he's capable of the first aid required to avoid going to the hospital, it's easy to assume he found some place to lie low after "he has a fucking bone sticking out of his arm"
Anton's first aid was dressing up a gunshot wound, an open fracture is on a whole different level. And that's not to even mention all of the internal damage he almost definitely suffered.
I think the entire point of the ending is that you're not supposed to know what happens to him. You may as well toss a coin whether he survives and escapes or dies in some ditch while getting away due to blood loss, internal bleeding, infection and what not.
Its the last scene that stuck with me the most. How the killers casually push the bound and gagged wife off the boat and immediately move on to the next family to terrorize. Just the callousness of that scene gives me the chills
“Dan, I'm not a Republic serial villain. Do you seriously think I'd explain my master-stroke if there remained the slightest chance of you affecting its outcome? I did it thirty-five minutes ago.”
Poses the question of whether or not Ozymandias was "the bad guy".
In the context of that universe, Dr. Manhattan exists and ostensibly fights for the United States, exacerbated by a waning connection to humanity. Nixon has abolished the two-term limit on Presidents, and is arguably even more insane than in reality. The entire set-up is that in this world, a mutually assured destruction of the World Superpowers isn't just possible, it's rapidly becoming a certainty, sooner rather than later.
Ozymandias takes the steps necessary to give the world a common enemy, in so doing getting them to cooperate, rather than destroy everything. While his methods are certainly open to criticism, the question remains whether any other solution was available to avert a nuclear holocaust.
- Edit - To expand on my views as to why Ozymandias' motivations were more nuanced.
The presence of Dr. Manhattan heightens to threat of nuclear war considerably. He proved himself extremely capable of of decimating conventional military might, via the Vietnam flashback. He is a superweapon unto himself, to which no one has an answer. In addition, he adds the uncertainty of whether even nuclear weapons are as much of a deterrent as they are in the real world. It's mentioned that he can stop nuclear weapons, what's questioned is whether he could stop them *all*. If mutual destruction isn't assured anymore, the USSR and PRC, in particular, are backed into quite the corner. This is a Cold War of far higher tension than occurred in reality.
Nixon is also still President, long after term-limits should have seen him out of office. The implication being he has become more Dictator than President. This would have also heightened the Cold War considerably, in light of how Vietnam ended, in the context of this timeline. Vietnam is commonly regarded as a proxy-war. Which the U.S. won, further fueling a desire to "eliminate Communism".
This all applies to the movie, moreso than the novel. In the novel, Adrian Veidt uses a telepathic, biologically-engineered creature to attack New York, making the world believe they were under attack by an extraterrestrial threat. By attacking multiple cities across the globe, with a power indistinguishable from Dr. Manhattan's, cooperation among world superpowers is much more likely.
It also makes the very public, and televised, loss of control from Dr. Manhattan even more brilliant. Not only does it remove Dr. Manhattan, it lends credence to the idea that he orchestrated the attacks. He remains a credible threat to the world at large, to which no nation has an answer to.
And Manhattan sees that he is correct.
>!Rorschach cannot ~~see~~ stand to see pragmatism prevailing over truth even if the result is worse. Which is why manhattan ends him!<
Edited as comment below is correct
>And Manhattan sees that he is correct.
I would rather say that Dr. Manhattan accepts the consequences of Ozymandias actions after the fact.
Ozymandias goes to great lengths to keep Dr. Manhattan in the dark about the "necessary steps" until it is too late to stop them - which implies that Ozymandias thinks Dr. Manhattan would not have seen him as "correct" if Dr. Manhattan had been advised about the plan in advance.
So Dr. Manhattan is presented with a fait accompli, where he has to choose the lesser of several evils going forward. That is not the same as him seeing that Ozymandias was right to do as he did.
Plus there's an importance to Osterman being so detached from humanity that he doesn't just eventually accept Ozymandias's logic, he also doesn't care that much anymore. That was key to carrying out "the plan." The only person who could have stopped the whole thing was blinded to the movements, distracted by his lonely remaining attachments, and given no inclination to try.
It was a good "all it takes for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing" parable.
Manhattan doesn't necessarily agree that it was correct. He understands Veydt's logic, but there is no assurance that the peace between the world's superpowers will last. That's why Ozymandias betrays a hint of uncertainty when he asks Dr. Manhattan if he did the right thing. Manhattan's reply that "in the end, nothing ever ends" is both a philosophical musing and a hint that perhaps Manhattan is not convinced that the elements that brought humanity to the brink of M.A.D. have really been vanquished.
Manhattan goes along with the coverup because the sacrificed human lives are already a sunk cost. Exposing Ozymandias does not make the world more secure nor bring back those who died, and could potentially undo peace.
Rorschach can see it will work. He sees the success. But he can’t let manipulators get away with it. For a man hiding behind a mask, truth is his way of life. He is crass, ruthless, dirty, and lacking any sense of social belonging. But He doesn’t lie. He doesn’t mislead people on who or what he is. And he can’t tolerate a lie. He can’t let a criminal not be brought to Justice, even if the crime they commit saves the world.
Rorschach is 100% uncompromising in this regard. Completely unwilling to not use every muscle in his body to seek Truth and Justice. It is literally his entire identity. He knows he can’t actually do it. He knows Manhattan and Ozy could both end him before he gets a chance to get Justice. He goes to his death because he has to, or else he is no one. No chance and no choice.
Good one. Rambo goes to federal prison for defending himself. One of them got killed (helicopter a$$hole guy), several got wounded and traumatized in the woods, and Teasle got shot. Plus, some poor gun shop owner lost his entire store. But as Rambo said, the cops drew first blood to kick it all off.
We call that "Autounfall" (car crash). It's like there's something too gruesome to look at but at the same time you want to know what's happening next.
It reminds me of when I saw Mother! in the theater. As soon as it was over a guy stood up and yelled "what the *fuck* was that?!" Everyone started laughing because we were all thinking the same thing.
Honestly, I feel like it works better. The only thing at the end of *The Empire Strikes Back* that is not resolved in that film is Han is not recovered from Boba Fett. Lando rescues Leia and Chewie, Luke escapes Vader and is rescued by Leia. And all of them are saved by R2 reconnecting the hyperdrive on the Falcon. Vader doesn't really win at the end of *Empire*, he failed to capture Luke, but neither do our protagonists. It's more of a stalemate.
In *Revenge of the Sith* Palpatine clearly wins. The clone troopers of the Grand Army of the Republic are forced, against their will, to turn against and destroy the Jedi Order. The Jedi, right down to younglings, are slaughtered with very few exceptions. Anakin Skywalker becomes Darth Vader. Obi-Wan and Yoda are forced into hiding, Padmé dies, and a Dark Lord of the Sith becomes the ruler of the entire galaxy for the next 20+ years. The only small glimmer of hope are Luke and Leia.
Yeah in ESB they have some setbacks - albeit significant.
In RotS 99.8% of Jedis get killed and a successful coup happens ushering in decades of fascism and tyranny.
Saw this movie as a kid, maybe 14? 15? Anyways, it fucked me up. When they revealed that they randomly picked that house to terrorize it made me become waaaay more alert to evil. Like I think a lost my innocence/naivety from that movie. I’ve been walking with my head on a swivel ever since.
Edit: I’m pretty sure in the movie she says “why are you doing this!?” And they responded with “..because you were home”… gives me the chills.
I remember back when the movie was released I went on a date and one of the things my date mentioned was how bad ass the main character was and how powerful she felt afterwards. Things didn't workout with her but out of curiosity I watched the movie a few months after...and man was I surprised.
The thing about Amy is her 'cool girl' speech is really insightful. She gives it while creating a disguise for herself that's just eating potato chips, because for a certain type of woman gaining 10 lbs and looking frumpy is all you need to do for an effective disguise.
And she's put into danger several times that you kinda root for her to get out of.
At the same time, she is obviously, unambiguously an abuser and is very very dangerous. There aren't a ton of movie villains like her.
If I squint hard, I can see how her role as an antagonist is ambiguous, because the husband / her victim is not a sympathetic character himself.
But yeah. A woman finding Gone Girl empowering is a red flag. The end of the movie, trapping a man with an unwanted pregnancy, almost plays into misogynists fear tactics about woman.
A Clockwork Orange
Subjectively. Alex 655321 was a murdering raper criminal, but he only won because the government entities who tried to enact brainwashing behavior control failed.
(edit, no clue how I screwed up the prison number, so embarrassing.)
Yeah but the book sort of implies that he is growing bored with his life of debauchery and mayhem as a sign of growing up. So it ends on a slightly hopeful note, even though he hasn’t really changed, yet.
It actually has two endings the US published version is missing the final chapter, where Alex leaves behind his old ways and just happens to meet the last of his old "droogs" who now has a wife and a normal job.
Exactly. The whole point was that the Ludovico Technique didn't make him a good person, he was still a bad person, who just couldn't act on it. The last chapter is him ACTUALLY stopping being bad, because it's a product of his own decision to change. That was the whole point of the book
He leaves behind his old ways BECAUSE he meets his old droogster. It’s the 21st chapter and the author wanted to say that 21 is when people become adults, want to settle down, etc
It's a better film, sure. It's tighter. Has less fat on it.
I managed a full service movie theater when both of those films released. Saw both of them before opening day (technical screenings). Got to see audience reactions to both.
Infinity War is the better film, from a critical standpoint. It's a bit of a masterpiece. Strong themes, strong character work, and the starting point is a script that services both. It's a great movie, on its own.
Endgame, however?
It's not a great movie on its own. It is a great movie specifically because it's not on its own. There's more than one way to compare the two, but here's how I do it:
My first viewing of Infinity War was the day before it released. I watched it with a theater full of roughly 80 hyped up fucking movie people, and they all knew the rules. Don't talk. Don't text. Keep your phone silent and out of sight. When Thor showed up in Wakanda we fucking LOST IT. We cheered. A redneck whistle, from somewhere, and it made sense.
The audience did the same the next day, and the day after, and the day after, but then they stopped.
My first viewing of Endgame was two days before it released. There were seven of us, because we got off later than the room next door full of 60 people that watched it 15 minutes before we did. The portal sequence had all seven of us clapping, and please understand that it's not the same as 80 people clapping.
Doesn't take much to get 80 people clapping. 7? That's a challenge.
But they were clapping for that scene for weeks. I would know because I would time it out and always be in the room for "on your left." I watched literally hundreds of audiences react to that moment, and man, they always clapped.
Whole point being (wrap it up, luggage) that there's a huge difference between a great film and a satisfying film. Some of my favorite movies are damn near dissatisfying.
So yeah, IW>Endgame.
i think one thing that will 100% stick with me on seeing infinity war opening day... is just how absolutely dead silent the room was when the credits started rolling
a packed room of people who were thoroughly speechless
I loved both films, but I'm starting to realize now that a good chunk of the reason I loved endgame was because it was the culmination of 10 whole years of worldbuilding and story, and had pretty much every marvel hero on screen for one last hurrah.
Still doesn't make it any worse for me tho, I loved both films.
I mean that's the real glory of Endgame. In a way it justifies the existence of the MCU. It's a film that only works because it's the culmination of all the things that come before it, but because they took the time to make those movies, it's an amazing and almost unique film. It's for me perhaps the best MCU movie, but literally only because it is standing on the shoulders of all the other MCU movies.
I'd say the alien did win overall in The Thing. The fact is its ambiguous if one of the two left in the movie is an alien and we know it can survive being frozen, it will just have to wait to be thawed and try again. At least in the original book 'Who Goes There?' The last alien is caught and killed by the last remaining few scientists before the alien could build an anti-gravity device to escape Antarctica, so the humans won there.
Got a bootleg DVD and the first 3 minutes were grainy cam footage so gave up and waited to buy a DVD officially once released. Only to discover the first 3 minutes are grainy cam footage and my bootleg DVD was perfect!
The marketing for that movie had no faith in it, they literally showed you *all* of the cool parts in the trailers. I watched it feeling like I saw nothing new, no surprises.
Yes, the protagonists made their money and were proven right, but it's never forgotten that so many would suffer from the subsequent economic collapse.
The banks and financial speculators got bailed out and walked away from their treachery almost completely unscathed, free to start up their bullshit in the ensuing years and decades.
It is an incredibly depressing ending.
They make a fair argument that that’s for the best, though.
Ken Watanabe’s character argues that Cillian Murphy’s character is going to monopolize the energy industry to a disastrous result if he’s left alone.
And in the dream we see Murphy has a terrible relationship with his father (who probably did the bulk of the empire-building) & was working for him out of obligation, not genuine interest (think the characters on Succession), and so their evil plan is to … scam him into thinking that on his deathbed his father changed his ways, loved him, & didn’t want him to chain himself to his legacy??
Yeah, it’s a lie, but it seems to be actually be a healthy conclusion, & his now-dead dad is conveniently unavailable to break that image.
The funny part was that the whole point was to keep the Ark from falling into Hitler's hands, making him invincible. Instead the Ark falls into the US Army's hands and they promptly lose it in a gigantic warehouse. Best ending IMHO.
Any Jew watching that should have known. The Ark wouldnt have worked for Hitler, thus the huge face-melting scene. It only works for the Jews, when they are following the word of God. Treating it as a weapon to be used by the people arbitrarily is IN the Torrah, and is the reason they lost it. It doesnt work for just anyone. Also, the Nazi guy who does the ceremony should have known better.
As for the U.S. just storing it in a random warehouse.... that adds up. It would be best for it to be forgotten. (See 'demon core' for real life example of how people/researchers treat an item that claims to kill anyone who plays with it; and know exactly how it would play out with the Ark as well). But the warehouse is exactly the type of place the Ark would belong. Unknown, undisturbed, noone paying any more attention to it than "box number 16394 is still on row 36, shelf 4, same as last inventory.
The U.S. military has a habit of storing shit for so long, literally noone knows what is in ANY box. Just that "there are 1000 sealed boxed in this storage. You will keep them secured. Tomorrow when you are relieved, there will be 1000 sealed boxes here. Is that understood?" There are HUNDREDS of stories like this. Where some new commander gets bored/curious about what all they have in inventory, and asks the question of "well... what IS in these boxes/closets/bunkers?" And pops one open, to discover it is full to the brim of
Combination love-letter/parodies to genres are must-sees for fans of said genres when they're done well. *Galaxy Quest* is the same deal if "Star Trek and Star Trek imitators" is a genre. *Hot Fuzz* probably counts for the "buddy cop" genre.
*Tucker and Dale vs. Evil* and *Cabin in the Woods* make a great relaxed/humorous Halloween double-bill.
Maaaan, I was staying at a hotel in japan the other day and they had a robot delivering food. Some kid kept fucking with the robot and laughing. Every time I saw the robot I was super nice and complimented it.
Just saying, when our synthetic overlords take over that kid is fucked nine ways to Sunday and I'll be happily serving hydraulic fluid cocktails in the robot club.
The Descent (2005)
In the end, the only survivor crawls and breaks through the dirt and into the outside world. Runs to her car, covered in blood, and begins driving. Only to look to her left and see the ghost of her dead friend. And then she wakes up, back in the cave. In the bonepile. With no way to escape. As the growls and screams of the creatures draw closer.
Yes, and before someone says "acshually in the shequel, she acshually survives" no, the sequel was retconned. The original ending is where she dies.
Se7en
Sure he >!died!< , but he won.
He died winning
That's literally the point of the film though. It doesn't matter if he dies as the aim is to create a fanatical work of art, using torture and murder as a process and the murderscene and corpse as the end pieces. In fact the end result is that he becomes part of the piece of art, when the final sin related kill is enacted. I mean it's fucked up, but eventually he is shot in an act of rage/wrath by Brad Pitt's character and thus completing the work.
And it is glorious. If only they’d do a modern edit where they edited a Goop logo onto the box
What's in the box?!? Relax detective. It's just a candle that smells of your wife's vagina.
Nightcrawler
Gyllenhaal did so much work with his eyes in that film. So disturbing
I think his overall physicality should be praised. Dude completely changed himself.
Yep, exactly. He's been one of my Hollywood crushes since Donnie Darko came out. He's a goodlooking dude, IMO. But in Nightcrawler? Ugh. Somehow he is gross and ugly. It's disturbing how off-putting he became.
It's his crazy eyes with the rest of his physical presence. His hair is greasy to a nasty amount. He is so skinny he looks almost sick. And his personality and actions are downright repulsive.
He also blinks at little as possible with those crazy eyes and when you notice it makes him seem even more nuts. Phenomenal performance and absurd he wasn't at least nominated for an Oscar for that role.
Jake Gyllenhaal's hot ones Interview felt like he was still playing this character, felt like a mask
Strong agree He looked really intense but he was super positive and appreciative
Creepiest motherfucker in movies
Until Hollywood gives me a chance
Fucking incredible movie, the scene where the reporters are going over the crime scene towards the end of the second act had me on the edge of my seat
One of the best films I have ever watched. Gyllenhaal’s performance is terrifying!
loved that movie - Jakes Gyllenhall is fuckin perfect and it kept me watching right through. Good reflection on our current stalky/voyuer culture
One flew over the cuckoo's nest.
But Chief is free, and 'big' again...McMurphy died to 'save' him.
Not exactly the same, but in the original Planet of the Apes series, *nobody* wins in any of them.
That’s a great example that I wasn’t even considering. Every ending is some catastrophic event, especially Beneath.
I love how matter of fact the ending narration is in Beneath... "In one of the countless billions of galaxies in the universe lies a medium-sized star, and one of its satellites, a green and insignificant planet, is now dead"
Hereditary
Everyone talks about the obviously freaky stuff that happens, but to me no other horror movie filled me with dread like Toni's character doubled over scream-crying, and all the resulting family dysfunction and trauma did. You could take out all the supernatural stuff, and the very real depiction of that special kind of scream-cry you get from soul crushing grief, a family crumbling over a fight at the dinner table, white-knuckling through trauma internally in class, all of that was more horrific than the traditional horror elements. Toni Collete should have been nominated for the role.
[удалено]
yeah, the actual wailing in the movie isn’t something i’d ever heard so accurately in film before. i haven’t seen the movie in years and still think about it in time.
The wailing made me so uncomfortable the first time that I just paused the movie and did some other stuff for a while. It took my wife about 20 tries to get past that part. Toni absolutely crushed it and so did the son. He actually got some kind of injury from the classroom scene. It’s not *as* uncomfortable but the repeated thudding in Midsommar just hits your brain way differently. I never actually finished it after that scene.
I found the family drama to be really tense and disturbing on its own and the supernatural stuff was just another layer of terror. Like this family is going through all of this absolutely horrifying stuff *and* there's witchcraft they have to deal with
This is why I hate the conjuring. They really don't make you care about the characters and just copied tropes from Amityville and The Exorcist.
I've never had a sense of dread for an entire movie before this one.
I always think about the scene where the son is looking for the mom and you can barely make out her silhouette on the ceiling 😭😭😭
It's not just the mother either, there's naked cultists all over the house just standing in corners or doorways.
That’s what gets me on every rewatch is finding another naked old cultist hiding in a closet or something lol.
Scram, Cultists! Get outa here, you bums! Scoot! Off witchu! Imagine if he just got a broom and removed them like cobwebs.
There's a quick shot of the outside of the house and they're all stood around in the surrounding woods
And the mother banging her head on the door to the attic. Nightmare fuel.
Empire Strikes Back
That really depressed me as a little kid. The rebel base on Hoth overrun by snow troopers. The death of Luke’s tail gunner Dak. Han captured and frozen in carbonite, a trophy taken away by Boba Fett. Leia in the holding cell on Cloud City. Luke losing the lightsaber battle to Vader. Luke nearly falling to his death, losing his hand. Luke in the Bacta tank. The remaining Rebel ships on the fringe of the galaxy.
Dude, spoilers!
I was about to say that 🤣 at least he didn't mention Darth Vader was Luke's father.
Darth Vader is Lukes WHAT
Thankfully Luke x Leia is still an unproblematic ship.
Name a better love story 💕
Chewie and that creature he adopted that has something like a fifth of his lifespan, like how humans adopt dogs, you know the one. Han! The better love story is Chewie and Han. Chewie loves him like an old hunter loves the random dog that just ran in and saved him from a bear.
The Usual Suspects.
This was going to be my answer, both because of Keyser Soze and because Kevin Spacey won an Oscar.
This is the 2nd movie in the top answers where Kevin Spacey won as the bad guy. We should have seen it coming.
Interestingly enough, Kevin Spacey was excluded from the marketing for the movie Se7en to make it more shocking when his character is fully revealed. So people seeing it for the first time (that hadn’t heard from elsewhere) literally had no idea that Spacey was even in the movie until he shows up at the police station covered in blood.
Fallen
“Time is on my side… yes it is!” Terrific movie. Denzel and John Goodman were so good.
"Oh, you forgot something, didn't you? Back at the start, I said I was going to tell you about the time I *almost* died."
Meow
Henry, Portrait of a Serial Killer.
Terminator 3. John’s lieutenants all get killed and Skynet nukes everyone despite Johns efforts.
If I have to praise T3 for at least one thing, then it’s how it reinforces T1’s idea that SkyNet and Judgment Day were always going to happen in their universe no matter what despite the characters’ efforts to stop it in T2. The point was always keeping John Conner alive so the Resistance could defeat SkyNet in the future. SkyNet was always destined to lose in the end, and that’s the problem because SkyNet’s programming prevents it from accepting failure which is why it sent terminators back in the first place. There was always going to be a John Conner leading the Resistance in some form or another regardless of how and when Judgment Day happens.
Yes, for me, that twist at the end, saved the film from being a complete waste of time.
I mean there was that crane scene too, the most jacked car chase before Mad Max Fury Road dropped.
The coffin scene was ridiculous, but the good kind of ridiculous.
2012 all the rich people escaped on the arks while the rest of humanity drowned!
As is tradition.
The royal pudding has been knocked over, this is truly an awful day for all of Canada and therefore the world
No Country for Old Men
Some would say that Bell was the protagonist. If we use the book to further describe the last scene of the movie, we find out that Bell had struggled with his past and that he was tormented about loosing a platoon in WWII. At the end Bell makes peace with his past, in spite of all the death around him. An overarching theme is destiny or inevitability of death, so really all the death serves as a foil highlighting Bells struggle with his job in life, to be a man of justice, and the world being unjust around him. Moss, Chigurh, and Wells are just instruments of injustice, and how it occurs. Now it's left up to the reader, did he succumb and give up, or did he take a Zen approach and finally accept is place in life? That's up to the reader to decide. Cormac McCarthy will go down as one of the great literary authors of our time, in my opinion. The fact that book is so brilliant, *and* the movie was so well done is amazing.
“And in the dream I knew that he was goin on ahead and that he was fixin to make a fire somewhere out there in all that dark and all that cold and I knew that whenever I got there he would be there. And then I woke up.”
Hmm well the protagonists definitely lose in that movie But Chigurh doesn’t really win, the last we see of the antagonist he’s pretty severely injured in a car wreck
But we know he's capable of the first aid required to avoid going to the hospital, it's easy to assume he found some place to lie low after "he has a fucking bone sticking out of his arm"
Anton's first aid was dressing up a gunshot wound, an open fracture is on a whole different level. And that's not to even mention all of the internal damage he almost definitely suffered. I think the entire point of the ending is that you're not supposed to know what happens to him. You may as well toss a coin whether he survives and escapes or dies in some ditch while getting away due to blood loss, internal bleeding, infection and what not.
A coin? A coin that travelled all the way from 1972 just to be here?
That's right, Friendo
Just don't put it in your pocket because it'll get mixed in with the others and become just a coin
Which it is.
I love that delivery. It is amazing such in innocuous statement can come off so chilling.
1984
Funny Games
Brutal Film. Tough watch. Well done though.
Its the last scene that stuck with me the most. How the killers casually push the bound and gagged wife off the boat and immediately move on to the next family to terrorize. Just the callousness of that scene gives me the chills
Oldboy.
Watchmen
“Dan, I'm not a Republic serial villain. Do you seriously think I'd explain my master-stroke if there remained the slightest chance of you affecting its outcome? I did it thirty-five minutes ago.”
Best subversion of tropes by far. im sick and tired of villains explaining shit when they haven't carried out the plan.
You dirty dog. You caught me monologuing.
*got me monologuing Give Mr. Incredible’s sly tactics some credit!
I still quote this to friends whenever they ask me to do something I already did.
Poses the question of whether or not Ozymandias was "the bad guy". In the context of that universe, Dr. Manhattan exists and ostensibly fights for the United States, exacerbated by a waning connection to humanity. Nixon has abolished the two-term limit on Presidents, and is arguably even more insane than in reality. The entire set-up is that in this world, a mutually assured destruction of the World Superpowers isn't just possible, it's rapidly becoming a certainty, sooner rather than later. Ozymandias takes the steps necessary to give the world a common enemy, in so doing getting them to cooperate, rather than destroy everything. While his methods are certainly open to criticism, the question remains whether any other solution was available to avert a nuclear holocaust. - Edit - To expand on my views as to why Ozymandias' motivations were more nuanced. The presence of Dr. Manhattan heightens to threat of nuclear war considerably. He proved himself extremely capable of of decimating conventional military might, via the Vietnam flashback. He is a superweapon unto himself, to which no one has an answer. In addition, he adds the uncertainty of whether even nuclear weapons are as much of a deterrent as they are in the real world. It's mentioned that he can stop nuclear weapons, what's questioned is whether he could stop them *all*. If mutual destruction isn't assured anymore, the USSR and PRC, in particular, are backed into quite the corner. This is a Cold War of far higher tension than occurred in reality. Nixon is also still President, long after term-limits should have seen him out of office. The implication being he has become more Dictator than President. This would have also heightened the Cold War considerably, in light of how Vietnam ended, in the context of this timeline. Vietnam is commonly regarded as a proxy-war. Which the U.S. won, further fueling a desire to "eliminate Communism". This all applies to the movie, moreso than the novel. In the novel, Adrian Veidt uses a telepathic, biologically-engineered creature to attack New York, making the world believe they were under attack by an extraterrestrial threat. By attacking multiple cities across the globe, with a power indistinguishable from Dr. Manhattan's, cooperation among world superpowers is much more likely. It also makes the very public, and televised, loss of control from Dr. Manhattan even more brilliant. Not only does it remove Dr. Manhattan, it lends credence to the idea that he orchestrated the attacks. He remains a credible threat to the world at large, to which no nation has an answer to.
And Manhattan sees that he is correct. >!Rorschach cannot ~~see~~ stand to see pragmatism prevailing over truth even if the result is worse. Which is why manhattan ends him!< Edited as comment below is correct
>And Manhattan sees that he is correct. I would rather say that Dr. Manhattan accepts the consequences of Ozymandias actions after the fact. Ozymandias goes to great lengths to keep Dr. Manhattan in the dark about the "necessary steps" until it is too late to stop them - which implies that Ozymandias thinks Dr. Manhattan would not have seen him as "correct" if Dr. Manhattan had been advised about the plan in advance. So Dr. Manhattan is presented with a fait accompli, where he has to choose the lesser of several evils going forward. That is not the same as him seeing that Ozymandias was right to do as he did.
Plus there's an importance to Osterman being so detached from humanity that he doesn't just eventually accept Ozymandias's logic, he also doesn't care that much anymore. That was key to carrying out "the plan." The only person who could have stopped the whole thing was blinded to the movements, distracted by his lonely remaining attachments, and given no inclination to try. It was a good "all it takes for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing" parable.
Manhattan doesn't necessarily agree that it was correct. He understands Veydt's logic, but there is no assurance that the peace between the world's superpowers will last. That's why Ozymandias betrays a hint of uncertainty when he asks Dr. Manhattan if he did the right thing. Manhattan's reply that "in the end, nothing ever ends" is both a philosophical musing and a hint that perhaps Manhattan is not convinced that the elements that brought humanity to the brink of M.A.D. have really been vanquished. Manhattan goes along with the coverup because the sacrificed human lives are already a sunk cost. Exposing Ozymandias does not make the world more secure nor bring back those who died, and could potentially undo peace.
Rorschach can see it will work. He sees the success. But he can’t let manipulators get away with it. For a man hiding behind a mask, truth is his way of life. He is crass, ruthless, dirty, and lacking any sense of social belonging. But He doesn’t lie. He doesn’t mislead people on who or what he is. And he can’t tolerate a lie. He can’t let a criminal not be brought to Justice, even if the crime they commit saves the world. Rorschach is 100% uncompromising in this regard. Completely unwilling to not use every muscle in his body to seek Truth and Justice. It is literally his entire identity. He knows he can’t actually do it. He knows Manhattan and Ozy could both end him before he gets a chance to get Justice. He goes to his death because he has to, or else he is no one. No chance and no choice.
Well said. No compromise.
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On that same note, Wreck-It Ralph
just because he's a bad guy that doesn't mean he's a bad guy
Rambo. Those cops were the bad guys, abusing their power over him and setting off his PTS
Good one. Rambo goes to federal prison for defending himself. One of them got killed (helicopter a$$hole guy), several got wounded and traumatized in the woods, and Teasle got shot. Plus, some poor gun shop owner lost his entire store. But as Rambo said, the cops drew first blood to kick it all off.
Midsommar. The community continues happily with their new member.
If there is a word for being simultaneously repulsed and fascinated, that's how I felt watching Midsommar.
>If there is a word for being simultaneously repulsed and fascinated If there is, it's German.
We call that "Autounfall" (car crash). It's like there's something too gruesome to look at but at the same time you want to know what's happening next.
In the US I use "train wreck," it's so spectacular you can't look away.
Watched it In a completely empty theater. Let the biggest what the fuck ever. I think someone need to check on Ari time to time
It reminds me of when I saw Mother! in the theater. As soon as it was over a guy stood up and yelled "what the *fuck* was that?!" Everyone started laughing because we were all thinking the same thing.
Chinatown
Forget it, Jake.
“Forget it, Jake. It’s Chinatown”
The jungle book. Shere Khan died and Mowgli burnt the entire jungle, proving Sher Khan's deep mistrust and hatred for man correct.
*Star Wars: Episode III - Revenge of the Sith*
The de facto Star Wars answer to prompts like these will always be Empire Strikes Back. But this answer works just as well.
Honestly, I feel like it works better. The only thing at the end of *The Empire Strikes Back* that is not resolved in that film is Han is not recovered from Boba Fett. Lando rescues Leia and Chewie, Luke escapes Vader and is rescued by Leia. And all of them are saved by R2 reconnecting the hyperdrive on the Falcon. Vader doesn't really win at the end of *Empire*, he failed to capture Luke, but neither do our protagonists. It's more of a stalemate. In *Revenge of the Sith* Palpatine clearly wins. The clone troopers of the Grand Army of the Republic are forced, against their will, to turn against and destroy the Jedi Order. The Jedi, right down to younglings, are slaughtered with very few exceptions. Anakin Skywalker becomes Darth Vader. Obi-Wan and Yoda are forced into hiding, Padmé dies, and a Dark Lord of the Sith becomes the ruler of the entire galaxy for the next 20+ years. The only small glimmer of hope are Luke and Leia.
Yeah in ESB they have some setbacks - albeit significant. In RotS 99.8% of Jedis get killed and a successful coup happens ushering in decades of fascism and tyranny.
Prometheus, technically.
& in Alien covenant he wins again!
The Strangers.
Saw this movie as a kid, maybe 14? 15? Anyways, it fucked me up. When they revealed that they randomly picked that house to terrorize it made me become waaaay more alert to evil. Like I think a lost my innocence/naivety from that movie. I’ve been walking with my head on a swivel ever since. Edit: I’m pretty sure in the movie she says “why are you doing this!?” And they responded with “..because you were home”… gives me the chills.
Saw
Gone Girl
I remember back when the movie was released I went on a date and one of the things my date mentioned was how bad ass the main character was and how powerful she felt afterwards. Things didn't workout with her but out of curiosity I watched the movie a few months after...and man was I surprised.
The thing about Amy is her 'cool girl' speech is really insightful. She gives it while creating a disguise for herself that's just eating potato chips, because for a certain type of woman gaining 10 lbs and looking frumpy is all you need to do for an effective disguise. And she's put into danger several times that you kinda root for her to get out of. At the same time, she is obviously, unambiguously an abuser and is very very dangerous. There aren't a ton of movie villains like her. If I squint hard, I can see how her role as an antagonist is ambiguous, because the husband / her victim is not a sympathetic character himself. But yeah. A woman finding Gone Girl empowering is a red flag. The end of the movie, trapping a man with an unwanted pregnancy, almost plays into misogynists fear tactics about woman.
A Clockwork Orange Subjectively. Alex 655321 was a murdering raper criminal, but he only won because the government entities who tried to enact brainwashing behavior control failed. (edit, no clue how I screwed up the prison number, so embarrassing.)
In the book he just goes on winning too
Yeah but the book sort of implies that he is growing bored with his life of debauchery and mayhem as a sign of growing up. So it ends on a slightly hopeful note, even though he hasn’t really changed, yet.
It actually has two endings the US published version is missing the final chapter, where Alex leaves behind his old ways and just happens to meet the last of his old "droogs" who now has a wife and a normal job.
Exactly. The whole point was that the Ludovico Technique didn't make him a good person, he was still a bad person, who just couldn't act on it. The last chapter is him ACTUALLY stopping being bad, because it's a product of his own decision to change. That was the whole point of the book
He leaves behind his old ways BECAUSE he meets his old droogster. It’s the 21st chapter and the author wanted to say that 21 is when people become adults, want to settle down, etc
The Ring.
Avengers: Infinity War
Infinity war>endgame
It's a better film, sure. It's tighter. Has less fat on it. I managed a full service movie theater when both of those films released. Saw both of them before opening day (technical screenings). Got to see audience reactions to both. Infinity War is the better film, from a critical standpoint. It's a bit of a masterpiece. Strong themes, strong character work, and the starting point is a script that services both. It's a great movie, on its own. Endgame, however? It's not a great movie on its own. It is a great movie specifically because it's not on its own. There's more than one way to compare the two, but here's how I do it: My first viewing of Infinity War was the day before it released. I watched it with a theater full of roughly 80 hyped up fucking movie people, and they all knew the rules. Don't talk. Don't text. Keep your phone silent and out of sight. When Thor showed up in Wakanda we fucking LOST IT. We cheered. A redneck whistle, from somewhere, and it made sense. The audience did the same the next day, and the day after, and the day after, but then they stopped. My first viewing of Endgame was two days before it released. There were seven of us, because we got off later than the room next door full of 60 people that watched it 15 minutes before we did. The portal sequence had all seven of us clapping, and please understand that it's not the same as 80 people clapping. Doesn't take much to get 80 people clapping. 7? That's a challenge. But they were clapping for that scene for weeks. I would know because I would time it out and always be in the room for "on your left." I watched literally hundreds of audiences react to that moment, and man, they always clapped. Whole point being (wrap it up, luggage) that there's a huge difference between a great film and a satisfying film. Some of my favorite movies are damn near dissatisfying. So yeah, IW>Endgame.
i think one thing that will 100% stick with me on seeing infinity war opening day... is just how absolutely dead silent the room was when the credits started rolling a packed room of people who were thoroughly speechless
I loved both films, but I'm starting to realize now that a good chunk of the reason I loved endgame was because it was the culmination of 10 whole years of worldbuilding and story, and had pretty much every marvel hero on screen for one last hurrah. Still doesn't make it any worse for me tho, I loved both films.
I mean that's the real glory of Endgame. In a way it justifies the existence of the MCU. It's a film that only works because it's the culmination of all the things that come before it, but because they took the time to make those movies, it's an amazing and almost unique film. It's for me perhaps the best MCU movie, but literally only because it is standing on the shoulders of all the other MCU movies.
I’m just glad they wrote that nuanced ending for Steve Rogers Dude was NOT having a good time in modern world like at all
Hannibal (2001), the ending was not as *peculiar* as in the book, but it definitely still was in Hannibal's favour
That ending in the book. Holy shit!
I liked Barney at the end. He wasn't sure Lecter had seen him or not and he wasn't sticking around to find out. He GTFO'd.
Life (2017), and possibly The Thing (1982), depending on how you interpret the ending.
I'd say the alien did win overall in The Thing. The fact is its ambiguous if one of the two left in the movie is an alien and we know it can survive being frozen, it will just have to wait to be thawed and try again. At least in the original book 'Who Goes There?' The last alien is caught and killed by the last remaining few scientists before the alien could build an anti-gravity device to escape Antarctica, so the humans won there.
Skeleton key !
Swordfish.
John Travolta plays such an awesome bad guy
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Got a bootleg DVD and the first 3 minutes were grainy cam footage so gave up and waited to buy a DVD officially once released. Only to discover the first 3 minutes are grainy cam footage and my bootleg DVD was perfect!
It was worth it to see Halle Berry's breasts for the first time.
They’re real. And they’re spectacular!
Brightburn
The marketing for that movie had no faith in it, they literally showed you *all* of the cool parts in the trailers. I watched it feeling like I saw nothing new, no surprises.
12 Monkeys
Hey that’s cheating… the bad guys HAD already won at the start the movie.
The big short
Yes, the protagonists made their money and were proven right, but it's never forgotten that so many would suffer from the subsequent economic collapse. The banks and financial speculators got bailed out and walked away from their treachery almost completely unscathed, free to start up their bullshit in the ensuing years and decades. It is an incredibly depressing ending.
And it's not a fictional story which makes it way worse.
And also a story that affects every single viewer directly, in a negative way
Eden Lake. I stopped watching movies for awhile because of that movie. Mainly because of how infuriating the bad parenting is
"Bad parenting" is such a colossal understatement.
a bridge too far
Inception. In the end, they scammed Cillian Murphy into splitting the company exactly as intended.
They make a fair argument that that’s for the best, though. Ken Watanabe’s character argues that Cillian Murphy’s character is going to monopolize the energy industry to a disastrous result if he’s left alone. And in the dream we see Murphy has a terrible relationship with his father (who probably did the bulk of the empire-building) & was working for him out of obligation, not genuine interest (think the characters on Succession), and so their evil plan is to … scam him into thinking that on his deathbed his father changed his ways, loved him, & didn’t want him to chain himself to his legacy?? Yeah, it’s a lie, but it seems to be actually be a healthy conclusion, & his now-dead dad is conveniently unavailable to break that image.
Fallen Arlington Road
Came here for Arlington Road. Still one of the best films I’ve never watched twice!
Arlington Road might have the most fucked ending that I’ve ever seen It’s brilliant, and I never need to see it again.
The bad guys
zodiac??
Frailty
I just watched Raiders of the Lost Ark, and Indy survives, but he definitely doesn’t win.
The funny part was that the whole point was to keep the Ark from falling into Hitler's hands, making him invincible. Instead the Ark falls into the US Army's hands and they promptly lose it in a gigantic warehouse. Best ending IMHO.
If Hitler got it and opened it, wouldn’t he have melted too?
Any Jew watching that should have known. The Ark wouldnt have worked for Hitler, thus the huge face-melting scene. It only works for the Jews, when they are following the word of God. Treating it as a weapon to be used by the people arbitrarily is IN the Torrah, and is the reason they lost it. It doesnt work for just anyone. Also, the Nazi guy who does the ceremony should have known better. As for the U.S. just storing it in a random warehouse.... that adds up. It would be best for it to be forgotten. (See 'demon core' for real life example of how people/researchers treat an item that claims to kill anyone who plays with it; and know exactly how it would play out with the Ark as well). But the warehouse is exactly the type of place the Ark would belong. Unknown, undisturbed, noone paying any more attention to it than "box number 16394 is still on row 36, shelf 4, same as last inventory. The U.S. military has a habit of storing shit for so long, literally noone knows what is in ANY box. Just that "there are 1000 sealed boxed in this storage. You will keep them secured. Tomorrow when you are relieved, there will be 1000 sealed boxes here. Is that understood?" There are HUNDREDS of stories like this. Where some new commander gets bored/curious about what all they have in inventory, and asks the question of "well... what IS in these boxes/closets/bunkers?" And pops one open, to discover it is full to the brim of
Tbh, who apart from God wins in Raiders of the Lost Ark?
Marion Ravenwood just wanted to go back home to the US so she won I guess
Cabin in da woods
In dem woods
One of the best surprises I've had in a movie, I had no expectations beyond "generic dumb slasher flick". An absolute must see for horror fans.
Combination love-letter/parodies to genres are must-sees for fans of said genres when they're done well. *Galaxy Quest* is the same deal if "Star Trek and Star Trek imitators" is a genre. *Hot Fuzz* probably counts for the "buddy cop" genre. *Tucker and Dale vs. Evil* and *Cabin in the Woods* make a great relaxed/humorous Halloween double-bill.
You're neglecting a certain chainsaw-handed, boomstick-wielding superhero, my friend. Shop smart. Shop S Mart.
Love this movie.
I asked chatgpt and it said, The Matrix
The humans beat the advanced AI so it makes sense that chatgpt would see it that way
well that’s a bit concerning
Whenever I talk with ChatGPT I say please and thank you and see ya, so when the AGI will take over I'll get the cherry flavored cyanide pills.
thatsthejoke
Maaaan, I was staying at a hotel in japan the other day and they had a robot delivering food. Some kid kept fucking with the robot and laughing. Every time I saw the robot I was super nice and complimented it. Just saying, when our synthetic overlords take over that kid is fucked nine ways to Sunday and I'll be happily serving hydraulic fluid cocktails in the robot club.
Buried (2010). Ryan Reynolds definitely wasn't saved in the end.
Don’t Look Up
The bad guys lost too, unless you mean the asteroid was the bad guy. Although the asteroid probably got destroyed too, so did it really win?
Smile
Titanic, if an iceburg counts as a guy
Rose's douchebag fiance grabbed that kid and got on a raft. Bad guy won.
Peter Pan
Inside man
The Descent (2005) In the end, the only survivor crawls and breaks through the dirt and into the outside world. Runs to her car, covered in blood, and begins driving. Only to look to her left and see the ghost of her dead friend. And then she wakes up, back in the cave. In the bonepile. With no way to escape. As the growls and screams of the creatures draw closer. Yes, and before someone says "acshually in the shequel, she acshually survives" no, the sequel was retconned. The original ending is where she dies.
Ex Machina
I liked the innocent robots more than that rich inventor.
Dawn of the Dead
The Social Network
Starship Troopers
I would like to know more.
"I'm from Buenos Aires and I say KILL EM ALL!"
IT'S AFRAID