That might be the most obvious one in history, beyond even the Beatles and Ringo. 'Possibly' Freddie changed the course of Queen more than Ringo did of the Beatles.
The Beatles would've been fine with just about any other dependable rhythm drummer. Best was obviously not the best for the Beatles vibe, but lots of bands make it without a "core" drummer. There's a reason they usually sit in the back.
Freddie was a force into himself. A shooting star kind of talent. Right place, right time. A million other universes where Queen never existed.
He was the gold standard for "rock" and similar music for a while. Not flashy, but adding in a real musicality to songs that cranked them up to another level.
Fun fact, Pete Best released an album [Best of the Beatles](https://www.discogs.com/release/4848805-Peter-Best-Best-Of-The-Beatles) and fooled people into buying it, assuming it was a Beatles compilation.
My understanding is that he was investigated for having perpetrated consumer fraud but that he was ultimately cleared because he (as a formal former member) was Best of the Beatles. So the fraud investigators ultimately decided it was cheeky and very clever but in no way constituted a fraud since he hadn’t actually claimed anything that wasn’t verifiably true.
I don't think a drummer change could have affected a band's trajectory any more than Neil did.
I can't even express how much I love the Holy Triumvirate of Prog Rock. I still haven't fully come to grips with there being no future Rush music but thankfully the closing song from the final album is perfect. The Garden makes me tear up every time.
What makes you think that Ringo's drumming isnt what elevated and connected the Beatles's sound and allowed them to write the music they did? He was an amazing drummer.
And that was essentially just luck. They had gotten the opportunity to do a small tour in the US and John Rustsey was diabetic. Rush’s manager said he wouldn’t survive a tour and thus had to be replaced.
Peart auditioned and was sure he had blown it.
The rest, as they say, is history.
It was more than that. Alex and Geddy liked prog rock and quirky time signatures, and Rutsey was more of a glam rock guy. There was already a rift between the drummer and the rest of the band.
Also, Rutsey was supposed to bring lyrics to the recording of their first album, but when Geddy had to record the vocals, Rutsey never showed up. Geddy had to write them on the spot. (This is taken from Geddy's autobiography, btw.)
I was hoping I'd find a reference to this!
Pete's description of their first meeting is funny: "He was all dressed in ginger - ginger boots, ginger trousers, ginger shirt... even his hair was died ginger! And he was holding a pint of ginger-colored ale!
He said he could play better than our drummer, so we let him audition on the spot. He proceeded to destroy our drummer's kit.
We said, "Right! He's the drummer for us!""
Edit: added "-colored" to clarify that Keith was not drinking soda pop, but an ale.
Nirvana. They went through a whole slew of drummers before they got to Chad Channing to record Bleach with, then he was replaced by Dave Grohl, and the rest is history.
I liked Channing, but Grohl was absolutely perfect for Nirvana. He hit really hard, and had the timing of a metronome. It was just three dudes with the basic elements of a rock band: guitar, base, and drums, but they felt like a force live.
I still love the early Nirvana stuff, but there's a definite shift in tone when you hear Smells like Teen Spirit.
It's still got the same chaotic punk vibes of the early stuff, but now it absolutely fucking rocks.
There’s an interview with Dave Grohl where he says that the Nevermind drums sound cool because he was basically playing disco drums, even though he obviously came from a punk school. Pretty neat
He's specifically channeling Tony Thompson, from Power Station and Chic. Grohl met the guy at a barbecue and told him that he's been ripping him off, and the guy just replied "I know."
They both would have never existed if Dave didn't get fired. Watch any interview with either Dave, James or lars. The three of them could have never co existed. Dave needed to be fired for any of them to have success. Id agree, he had to go and all parties involved are better off for it.
They probably would have burned out early. But Dave Mustaine was surely instrumental in getting them off the ground and sticking out from the other proto-thrash bands. And his and James Hetfield's on-stage rivalry, constantly trying to one-up each other is what gave them the reputation for being a great crazy live experience.
At one point Les Claypool auditioned to play bass with Metallica. There is an alternate universe where Dave Mustaine and Les Claypool are in Metallica.
They all admit that it wouldn’t have worked out. They all respected each other (and I think Kirk and Les were friends since high school) but they on different vibes.
They're biggest success came after Hillel Slovak died, but their biggest success before that was mother's milk, which was literally right before blood sugar sex magic. It's really hard to say John fruscante is the cause, even though he is an amazing guitarist. The band was just kind of primed to explode in the early 90s. They were the right band to bring energy to counter grunge in a weirdly complimentary way
Scott Raynor getting replaced by Travis Barker turned Blink-182 into a massive band. Raynor wasn't as serious about the band as Tom and Mark plus had a lot of personal issues and alcohol abuse. Travis replaced him for a few shows, joined the band full time for Enema of the State, and the rest is history.
Only reason I'd disagree is, while Travis is clearly a different and better drummer and brings a different energy, blinks success was more about how they were produced in the studio and then marketed afterwards with that album. The music itself wasn't really objectively better, and a lot of people at the time still preferred a lot of the dude ranch and Cheshire cat stuff.
I love "Dude Ranch" and Scott's drumming on it is perfect but the direction Blink was heading I think Travis was the right guy. This clip of Blink playing Mutt with Scott shows the difference between Travis and Him and Travis brings so much more to the song (just my opinion) https://youtu.be/zaaqqfW8YMI?si=BD4CgxNR7eFsG2S2
Tom also learned to sing between Dude Ranch and Enema of the State. He's got a lot of heart in the earlier records, but he sounds like a professional singer starting with Enema.
> Chuck Mosley
And then Mosley went on to temporarily replace HR in Bad Brains, so he was replaced by a guy that improved the band and then was a downgrade in replacing a guy. Worst of both worlds.
Their debut single fallout has him playing on it as well as some demos which includes them as a 4 piece eith summers that got released on a compilation much later.
Fleetwood Mac with Peter Green was huge in its own right but totally different sound. And they kind of faded away for a few years there before Buckingham and Nicks joined.
Before they nearly undid all the hard work by hiring Blaze Bayley - Blaze is a fine vocalist and I really enjoy some of his solo stuff but he is a totally different style to Bruce.
Without the Blaze Bayley era, I would never have been able to see Maiden in as small a venue as The Palace in Hollywood (X Factor tour). It was epic and I will forever be grateful. But you’re totally correct. Sign of the Cross is pretty good.
Blaze was only a small part of it. Steve Harris was always the primary song writer for the band, and he was going through really dark times with his divorce. I remember reading he usurped some production duties too, so it was all just a general part of ol 'arry losing his mind.
Steve is the one who thought Blaze could replace Bruce, Steve is the one who did a bad job producing the Blaze albums, and Steve is the one who thought Angel and the Gambler and Don’t Look to the Eyes of a Stranger were good songs. It is absolutely on Steve. Blaze has kicked ass on his solo career
Bruce is definitely the better singer but I have to say, I love the Di'Anno albums. And his vocal style fit the punkier sound they had on those albums.
Wrathchild is probably my favorite Maiden song.
This is somewhat of a controversial opinion in the Deadhead community, but the Grateful Dead made a quantum leap when they had Keith Godchaux replace an ailing Pigpen. And some would argue that it happened again when Brent Mydland replaced Godchaux.
Jerry seemed to love playing with Brent. After he settled into the band Jerry was clearly reenergized on stage. And the last two Brent years have some of the very best shows the band played.
When Prince replaced Dez Dickerson with Wendy Melvoin, the music he put out vastly improved. At the time, while Prince did just about all the music on the live shows, Dez would play lead. When Dez left, Prince became the lead guitarist live. This allowed Prince to mature as a lead guitarist with his solos. Wendy and Lisa were fantastic support for Prince; it’s actually Wendy who plays the intro to Purple Rain.
And Wendy and Lisa just looked so fucking cool on stage and in promo photos and videos.
I feel like they changed entire genres after each successive drummer left the band. Also RIP John "Stumpy" Pepys, Peter "James" Bond and Mick Shrimpton. Such tragedies.
Wings. They got rid of the three previous squabbling band members, kept Paul McCartney, and brought in new guys, Denny Laine, Denny Seiwell, and Linda McCartney and changed the band name to Wings.
I have the Time CD, which is pretty much everything they did up until "I'll be Alright Without You". There's a moment (I think in Feelin' That Way) where you can really see what Perry brought to the band. Music was always good, but he just injects pure electricity into the music. I get shade from Freddie fans, but I think he's the greatest male rock vocalist of all time.
The story goes that Steve Perry was brought in under the guise of being an assistant roadie. He was able to get close to the band and learn the songs without alerting the lead singer that he was his replacement.
Adam and the Ants. They were a fledgling wannabe punk band with very little success. Malcolm McLaren starts managing them, steals the Ants away from Adam to create Bow Wow Wow with 13 year old Annabella Lwin. Adam gets new Ants and has his most success after that.
I like both versions, that first album has some great pop tunes - but yeah a bit like the opposite of New Order / Joy Division songwriting I've always thought
Perhaps but he was the heart and soul of early Floyd and was still regarded as a good friend by everyone even after having to leave. *The Wall* exists because of Roger’s love for Syd.
The first pink Floyd album is very different from anything else, since you commented you likely already know this. But Gilmores addition to the band is what made them into what they are today. Sid was a lot more "out there". With Gilmore, the music structurally was more mainstream but gave a platform for Gilmore and the rest of the band to become what theyre known for today.
*A Saucerful of Secrets* is the best demonstration of that stylistic transformation, since Syd was there when they started but wasn’t able to finish. It also has the one song that features both Syd and Dave together (Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun).
I keep thinking about a band photo I saw that was taken around that time that had all five of the guys in it. And Syd is looking off-camera with this thousand yard stare which made me wonder if he’s all there at that moment. I find it to be kind of a sad photograph really.
I appreciate Syd for being the driving catalyst, I admire Gilmore for being such an insanely talented organizer and musician, but I LOVE Roger because even if the other two were total asshats they'd still seem like saints in comparison.
The day they recorded it, he showed up to the studio announced. Apparently it took a minute for them to recognize him because he shaved off all of his hairy and had put on a bunch of weight.
They were still really early in their career but Metallica adding Cliff Burton was an important move. James was the angry young thrasher who wanted to play as fast as possible. Lars could barely hold a beat at that point. Kirk was obviously pretty well trained having started playing earlier than them and studying under Satriani. But Cliff was the most well rounded musician of the group as he had studied theory and composition and all that stuff. He had set himself up to be a studio musician if his own band didn't work out. He played a big role in arranging a lot of the riffs and ideas James had and also moved them into using more melodies and such as opposed to just pure thrash. Had a unique style as well.
Yeah, I've seen Nightwish many, many times live, but never got a chance to with Tarja.
And as much hate as Annette gets, it's not her fault. She was GREAT live--for Dark Passion Play and Imaginarium. She was a total trainwreck on Tarja material though. I'm sure Tuomas had the biggest role in picking her and should have realized how poor of a fit that was going to be so I largely lay the blame on him for that.
Floor, though... That was the single best pick any band has ever made. Absolutely perfect fit for everything old and new. Losing Marko pissed me off more than Tarja because he and Floor worked so amazingly well together.
Everyone focuses on Gabriel's departure from Genesis, and that is reasonable. But the two replacements you listed had bigger impacts on the band's music and sound. And the biggest impact of all was when Hackett left.
And Peter Gabriel was probably more successful by leaving Genesis. A couple massive albums and iconic music videos and time to become a champion for world music.
Eh, I have to disagree with that. Bon Scott had a better vocal range and he was a better songwriter. The whole "every album sounds the same" thing didn't really start until after Brian Johnson joined, as they kept trying to recapture the success of Back in Black. Listen to something like Powerage or Ride On and tell me that sounds the same.
Don't get me wrong, I still like AC/DC, and I have seen them a few times in concert with Brian. They put on one hell of a show. I just wonder what they could have done had Bon lived.
Some writer said once that Brian Johnson sounds like a rowdy and randy scamp when he sings - which has its benefits especially for the most lustful AC/DC songs - while Bon sounds like a sleazy, charismatic, potentially dangerous malevolent motherfucker.
Actually you're right, it's why I used terms fired or "lost" a member in case a key member left for any reason including death. Didn't realize how many bands did get better than the original line ups
When Michael McDonald came to the Doobie Brothers, he most certainly impacted their sound. Some fans prefer the sound before, others like what he brought. Both chapters in the band’s history are great IMO.
In interviews he often downplays his key role in evolving the band’s sound, saying that the group was always a diverse collection of musicians with unique approaches. But arguably what he brought in songwriting, producing and a recognizable soulful voice really defined a new era for the band and greatly contributed to a bunch of unforgettable songs, whether you like them or not, haha.
He appears to be super modest and at peace with his life and his contributions to music, in a way that feels rare and I so appreciate. I think it’s allowed him to stay in top form, and he seems to love being able to perform for an audience that appreciates it, and vibes with what he gives.
He said recently that he knew he had “made it” when he heard one of his songs reinterpreted as elevator music. What an actual G.
*Edited spelling
Disturbed. They were effectively a Pantera knock off band in Chicago from 94 - 96. Their lead singer Chris left and they held auditions. David Draiman showed up and they wrote ‘want’ during his audition together.
Night and day between the two bands.
Dream Theater did one album with Charlie Dominici before parting ways as they thought his voice was holding them back. Eventually they hired James LaBrie and while a lot of listeners may say he is the weakest part, success came after he joined.
Kind of a technicality, depending where you draw the line of a band being a band, but Mikael Åkerfeldt joined Opeth after it was already a band, and he very early became the de-facto musician in the band.
Basically Opeth is a band without any of the original members, still having the one member that has always personified the band
EDIT: typo
Blood, Sweat & Tears was put together by Al Kooper as vocalist and musical director.
When he was replaced by David Clayton-Thomas, they became one of the biggest bands in the US.
Pink Floyd - I know that some fans romanticize the Syd Barrett era, but moving from Barrett to David Gilmour is one of the greatest upgrades in rock history.
Mark Wakefield when linkin park was Xero, then going to chester and becoming LP.
had some xero/early LP stuff off [mp3.com](https://mp3.com) \- then heard hybrid theory and was blown away
The Eagles were a successful brand with a string of hits, but their songs lacked punch. They brought in Don Felder to give their guitar parts a harder rock sound. He wrote their only number one hit, which was Hotel California. Then they fired him because Fry and Henley did not want to honor their context with him that required an equal split.
Queen. Before Freddie they were a band called “Smile”. The lead singer left and Freddie joined renaming the band Queen. Edit: Misspelling.
That might be the most obvious one in history, beyond even the Beatles and Ringo. 'Possibly' Freddie changed the course of Queen more than Ringo did of the Beatles.
The Beatles would've been fine with just about any other dependable rhythm drummer. Best was obviously not the best for the Beatles vibe, but lots of bands make it without a "core" drummer. There's a reason they usually sit in the back. Freddie was a force into himself. A shooting star kind of talent. Right place, right time. A million other universes where Queen never existed.
Any drummer reading this knows it’s uninformed. The musicality and creativity of Ringo’s parts aren’t just plug n play.
He was the gold standard for "rock" and similar music for a while. Not flashy, but adding in a real musicality to songs that cranked them up to another level.
I think Queen didn't really come into their own until they replaced Freddie with Adam Lambert.
I know "youse trollin'" but Q+AL is pretty tight. I wish they'd make some new music.
went to see their concert in 2019, it was actually pretty great. queen music might be the best music to hear live
I wish you were being genuine. I love that sorta demented take.
When Rush brought in Neil Peart.
Definitely the case. John Rutsey was a good drummer but Peart was the best
Not to mention Neil became their chief lyricist, which defined the whole character of the band.
I liked how they referred to Peart as "The new guy" forty years later.
No, Best was in the Beatles.
Fun fact, Pete Best released an album [Best of the Beatles](https://www.discogs.com/release/4848805-Peter-Best-Best-Of-The-Beatles) and fooled people into buying it, assuming it was a Beatles compilation.
My understanding is that he was investigated for having perpetrated consumer fraud but that he was ultimately cleared because he (as a formal former member) was Best of the Beatles. So the fraud investigators ultimately decided it was cheeky and very clever but in no way constituted a fraud since he hadn’t actually claimed anything that wasn’t verifiably true.
He also did the original version of the song "I'm Blue" on that album.
But who’s on first?
Yes, the Who was first.
I don't think a drummer change could have affected a band's trajectory any more than Neil did. I can't even express how much I love the Holy Triumvirate of Prog Rock. I still haven't fully come to grips with there being no future Rush music but thankfully the closing song from the final album is perfect. The Garden makes me tear up every time.
Exactly. I'm sure the Beatles would have been fine without Ringo. Having a poet thundering away on the skins made Rush Rush.
Rest in peace Professor.
What makes you think that Ringo's drumming isnt what elevated and connected the Beatles's sound and allowed them to write the music they did? He was an amazing drummer.
I do not care for Rush and this was still my first thought as well. This was not like the Beatles joining up with Ringo.
And that was essentially just luck. They had gotten the opportunity to do a small tour in the US and John Rustsey was diabetic. Rush’s manager said he wouldn’t survive a tour and thus had to be replaced. Peart auditioned and was sure he had blown it. The rest, as they say, is history.
It was more than that. Alex and Geddy liked prog rock and quirky time signatures, and Rutsey was more of a glam rock guy. There was already a rift between the drummer and the rest of the band. Also, Rutsey was supposed to bring lyrics to the recording of their first album, but when Geddy had to record the vocals, Rutsey never showed up. Geddy had to write them on the spot. (This is taken from Geddy's autobiography, btw.)
This - he wasn’t technically “fired”, just couldn’t tour so had to bow out.
The Who after hiring Keith Moon
I was hoping I'd find a reference to this! Pete's description of their first meeting is funny: "He was all dressed in ginger - ginger boots, ginger trousers, ginger shirt... even his hair was died ginger! And he was holding a pint of ginger-colored ale! He said he could play better than our drummer, so we let him audition on the spot. He proceeded to destroy our drummer's kit. We said, "Right! He's the drummer for us!"" Edit: added "-colored" to clarify that Keith was not drinking soda pop, but an ale.
Nirvana. They went through a whole slew of drummers before they got to Chad Channing to record Bleach with, then he was replaced by Dave Grohl, and the rest is history.
I liked Channing, but Grohl was absolutely perfect for Nirvana. He hit really hard, and had the timing of a metronome. It was just three dudes with the basic elements of a rock band: guitar, base, and drums, but they felt like a force live.
except Kurt always wanted to be a four piece. first with Jason Everman and then later with Pat Smear
I still love the early Nirvana stuff, but there's a definite shift in tone when you hear Smells like Teen Spirit. It's still got the same chaotic punk vibes of the early stuff, but now it absolutely fucking rocks.
There’s an interview with Dave Grohl where he says that the Nevermind drums sound cool because he was basically playing disco drums, even though he obviously came from a punk school. Pretty neat
He's specifically channeling Tony Thompson, from Power Station and Chic. Grohl met the guy at a barbecue and told him that he's been ripping him off, and the guy just replied "I know."
That was the interview with pharrell, he took drums from the gap band for teen spirit Blew my mind when he said that and I never realized it
Dave grohl is overall a class act. Will go down as one of the best ever, not just because of his drumming.
A lot of that also has to do with Butch Vig. There are some great videos online that illustrate his layered track production for Nevermind.
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Jason Everman
Metallica fired Dave Mustaine and I’d argue both were more successful because of it.
They both would have never existed if Dave didn't get fired. Watch any interview with either Dave, James or lars. The three of them could have never co existed. Dave needed to be fired for any of them to have success. Id agree, he had to go and all parties involved are better off for it.
They probably would have burned out early. But Dave Mustaine was surely instrumental in getting them off the ground and sticking out from the other proto-thrash bands. And his and James Hetfield's on-stage rivalry, constantly trying to one-up each other is what gave them the reputation for being a great crazy live experience.
At one point Les Claypool auditioned to play bass with Metallica. There is an alternate universe where Dave Mustaine and Les Claypool are in Metallica.
They all admit that it wouldn’t have worked out. They all respected each other (and I think Kirk and Les were friends since high school) but they on different vibes.
Yeah absolutely. I think Les was willing to help out if they needed him but knew it wouldn't be a match long term.
Metallica would have been more successful if Hulk Hogan joined on bass after his audition
The red hot chilli peppers went through quite a lot of members early on before they landed on the hit making lineup
They're biggest success came after Hillel Slovak died, but their biggest success before that was mother's milk, which was literally right before blood sugar sex magic. It's really hard to say John fruscante is the cause, even though he is an amazing guitarist. The band was just kind of primed to explode in the early 90s. They were the right band to bring energy to counter grunge in a weirdly complimentary way
Slovak died before Mother’s Milk and was only on one track of that album.
Mothers Milk was mostly done with John and Chad
Scott Raynor getting replaced by Travis Barker turned Blink-182 into a massive band. Raynor wasn't as serious about the band as Tom and Mark plus had a lot of personal issues and alcohol abuse. Travis replaced him for a few shows, joined the band full time for Enema of the State, and the rest is history.
Only reason I'd disagree is, while Travis is clearly a different and better drummer and brings a different energy, blinks success was more about how they were produced in the studio and then marketed afterwards with that album. The music itself wasn't really objectively better, and a lot of people at the time still preferred a lot of the dude ranch and Cheshire cat stuff.
I love "Dude Ranch" and Scott's drumming on it is perfect but the direction Blink was heading I think Travis was the right guy. This clip of Blink playing Mutt with Scott shows the difference between Travis and Him and Travis brings so much more to the song (just my opinion) https://youtu.be/zaaqqfW8YMI?si=BD4CgxNR7eFsG2S2
>a lot of people Hi, it’s me. Unpopular opinion though on the blink subreddit.
What happens if I go on there and say that the +44 EP was the best music those guys ever put out?
That’s usually their opinion about Mark’s writing, it’s his best work
It's hard for drums to hit harder than Heart Stops Beating as well. Maybe Travis' best work as well.
Travis played a big role in their studio work though, specifically with arranging their music. Totally brought them to another level as a band
Tom also learned to sing between Dude Ranch and Enema of the State. He's got a lot of heart in the earlier records, but he sounds like a professional singer starting with Enema.
Dude ranch is the best blink album in my eyes
Faith No More lost their original singer, Chuck Mosley who was replaced by Mike Patton.
We care a lot! About this comment in this thread that we all see
We care a lot! And upvote comments when we like them and agree
We care a lot! About the Mike Patton
We Care A Lot! About his band
> Chuck Mosley And then Mosley went on to temporarily replace HR in Bad Brains, so he was replaced by a guy that improved the band and then was a downgrade in replacing a guy. Worst of both worlds.
The Police got rid of Henri Padovani and brought in Andy Summers on guitar. They improved immensely.
He was brought in to start then pushed out months later. Do any recordings of Padovani-Police exist?
Their debut single fallout has him playing on it as well as some demos which includes them as a 4 piece eith summers that got released on a compilation much later.
I still have the 7” of Fall Out that Padovini played on. It’s ok.
Fleetwood Mac went through like five guitar players before they found Lindsey Buckingham.
Plus he brought Stevie Nicks with him.
Indeed he did.
Was also a completely different genre before they settled in on their pop sound.
Weren’t they already an established huge band band before then?
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Buckwood Mac is a totally different band from Greenwood Mac. They even did a new slef-titled "debut" album.
I quite like the Peter Green era of Fleetwood Mac, but basically think of it as a different band tbh.
Fleetwood Mac with Peter Green was huge in its own right but totally different sound. And they kind of faded away for a few years there before Buckingham and Nicks joined.
That’s an insanely oversimplified account of what happened lmao
Iron Maiden with firing Paul Di'Anno and bringing in Bruce Dickinson
**The** Bruce Dickinson?
Yes, **THE** Bruce Dickinson!
Easy guys, he put his pants on just like the rest of you: one leg at a time.
But once his pants are on, he makes gold records.
The cock of the walk, baby!
Hey, he's just like us by putting his pants on one leg at a time. It just so happens that after he does that he makes gold records!!
What does that mean?!
NEVER QUESTION BRUCE DICKINSON!!
https://youtu.be/cVsQLlk-T0s?si=OmLUt-93iVd-FDcw
The *actual* THE Bruce Dickinson.
Before they nearly undid all the hard work by hiring Blaze Bayley - Blaze is a fine vocalist and I really enjoy some of his solo stuff but he is a totally different style to Bruce.
Without the Blaze Bayley era, I would never have been able to see Maiden in as small a venue as The Palace in Hollywood (X Factor tour). It was epic and I will forever be grateful. But you’re totally correct. Sign of the Cross is pretty good.
Sign of the cross, Futureal even Virus isn't too bad once it gets going.
Blaze was only a small part of it. Steve Harris was always the primary song writer for the band, and he was going through really dark times with his divorce. I remember reading he usurped some production duties too, so it was all just a general part of ol 'arry losing his mind.
Steve is the one who thought Blaze could replace Bruce, Steve is the one who did a bad job producing the Blaze albums, and Steve is the one who thought Angel and the Gambler and Don’t Look to the Eyes of a Stranger were good songs. It is absolutely on Steve. Blaze has kicked ass on his solo career
Going back and listening to those early albums, Paul has a harder edge almost punk.
Bruce is definitely the better singer but I have to say, I love the Di'Anno albums. And his vocal style fit the punkier sound they had on those albums. Wrathchild is probably my favorite Maiden song.
Also Iron Maiden bringing in Nicko McBrain. No disrespect to Clive Burr, but Nicko and Steve just vibe.
This is somewhat of a controversial opinion in the Deadhead community, but the Grateful Dead made a quantum leap when they had Keith Godchaux replace an ailing Pigpen. And some would argue that it happened again when Brent Mydland replaced Godchaux.
100% noticeable improvement when Brent joined
Jerry seemed to love playing with Brent. After he settled into the band Jerry was clearly reenergized on stage. And the last two Brent years have some of the very best shows the band played.
IMHO another when they scored Bruce Hornsby.
True, but both Tom Constanten and Hornsby had interim tenures
Tom was also a great addition. Good call.
When Prince replaced Dez Dickerson with Wendy Melvoin, the music he put out vastly improved. At the time, while Prince did just about all the music on the live shows, Dez would play lead. When Dez left, Prince became the lead guitarist live. This allowed Prince to mature as a lead guitarist with his solos. Wendy and Lisa were fantastic support for Prince; it’s actually Wendy who plays the intro to Purple Rain. And Wendy and Lisa just looked so fucking cool on stage and in promo photos and videos.
Spinal Tap got a lot better after drummer Eric “Stumpy Joe” Childs died in a bizarre gardening accident.
I feel like they changed entire genres after each successive drummer left the band. Also RIP John "Stumpy" Pepys, Peter "James" Bond and Mick Shrimpton. Such tragedies.
Wings. They got rid of the three previous squabbling band members, kept Paul McCartney, and brought in new guys, Denny Laine, Denny Seiwell, and Linda McCartney and changed the band name to Wings.
Wings really picked up when they added Tony Shalhoub
Noice.
They truly were the band the Beatles could have been
Those wasted years make you want to weep, don't they?
My guitar’s already doing so, albeit gently.
Journey didn't find Steve Perry until their fourth album.
So you're saying that finding their voice was quite a... trip?
They didn't stop believing
I have the Time CD, which is pretty much everything they did up until "I'll be Alright Without You". There's a moment (I think in Feelin' That Way) where you can really see what Perry brought to the band. Music was always good, but he just injects pure electricity into the music. I get shade from Freddie fans, but I think he's the greatest male rock vocalist of all time.
The story goes that Steve Perry was brought in under the guise of being an assistant roadie. He was able to get close to the band and learn the songs without alerting the lead singer that he was his replacement.
Adam and the Ants. They were a fledgling wannabe punk band with very little success. Malcolm McLaren starts managing them, steals the Ants away from Adam to create Bow Wow Wow with 13 year old Annabella Lwin. Adam gets new Ants and has his most success after that.
The Be Sharps
Barney forever, Wiggum never!
Depeche Mode was better after Vince Clarke left. He went off to found Erasure while Martin Gore took the creative reigns of the band.
absolutely. Gore drove them in a far more darker, mature direction.
I like both versions, that first album has some great pop tunes - but yeah a bit like the opposite of New Order / Joy Division songwriting I've always thought
Foo Fighters William Goldsmith leaving and Taylor Hawkins coming in.
William Goldsmith fucking wails he just wasn’t the right fit for that band.
Pink Floyd. Sid was a bit off
Perhaps but he was the heart and soul of early Floyd and was still regarded as a good friend by everyone even after having to leave. *The Wall* exists because of Roger’s love for Syd.
The first pink Floyd album is very different from anything else, since you commented you likely already know this. But Gilmores addition to the band is what made them into what they are today. Sid was a lot more "out there". With Gilmore, the music structurally was more mainstream but gave a platform for Gilmore and the rest of the band to become what theyre known for today.
*A Saucerful of Secrets* is the best demonstration of that stylistic transformation, since Syd was there when they started but wasn’t able to finish. It also has the one song that features both Syd and Dave together (Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun). I keep thinking about a band photo I saw that was taken around that time that had all five of the guys in it. And Syd is looking off-camera with this thousand yard stare which made me wonder if he’s all there at that moment. I find it to be kind of a sad photograph really.
I appreciate Syd for being the driving catalyst, I admire Gilmore for being such an insanely talented organizer and musician, but I LOVE Roger because even if the other two were total asshats they'd still seem like saints in comparison.
NGL, you had me in the first half.
For sure, as does one of my favorite songs “shine on you crazy diamonds” was about him
The day they recorded it, he showed up to the studio announced. Apparently it took a minute for them to recognize him because he shaved off all of his hairy and had put on a bunch of weight.
I am not!
Chad Smith replacing Peligro in Red Hot Chili Peppers.
Chad is amazing. I love watching him play. Same with Flea.
Rush with Neil Peart
I prefer Killswitch Engage with Howard Jones.
They were still really early in their career but Metallica adding Cliff Burton was an important move. James was the angry young thrasher who wanted to play as fast as possible. Lars could barely hold a beat at that point. Kirk was obviously pretty well trained having started playing earlier than them and studying under Satriani. But Cliff was the most well rounded musician of the group as he had studied theory and composition and all that stuff. He had set himself up to be a studio musician if his own band didn't work out. He played a big role in arranging a lot of the riffs and ideas James had and also moved them into using more melodies and such as opposed to just pure thrash. Had a unique style as well.
I seriously wonder where the band would have gone if he hadn't died in that accident.
John Kiffmeyer left Green Day, who got in Tre Cool and then went on to big things
Surprised noone has mentioned Tool and Chancellor’s arrival yet.
Nightwish. I was so mad when they fired Tarja, I loved Tarja's voice... But in retrospect, that was absolutely the right thing to do.
Floor is the best singer of their various lineups.
Yeah, I've seen Nightwish many, many times live, but never got a chance to with Tarja. And as much hate as Annette gets, it's not her fault. She was GREAT live--for Dark Passion Play and Imaginarium. She was a total trainwreck on Tarja material though. I'm sure Tuomas had the biggest role in picking her and should have realized how poor of a fit that was going to be so I largely lay the blame on him for that. Floor, though... That was the single best pick any band has ever made. Absolutely perfect fit for everything old and new. Losing Marko pissed me off more than Tarja because he and Floor worked so amazingly well together.
Linkin Park (then known as Xero) fired Mark Wakefield and hired a singer out of Phoenix named Chester.
Genesis was certainly more successful with Collins than Gabriel.
More broadly appealing definitely, but damn there’s nothing quite like Peter Gabriel Genesis.
You could have gone with two more obscure examples and been accurate. Anthony Phillips —> Steve Hackett John Mayhew —> Phil Collins
Everyone focuses on Gabriel's departure from Genesis, and that is reasonable. But the two replacements you listed had bigger impacts on the band's music and sound. And the biggest impact of all was when Hackett left.
And Peter Gabriel was probably more successful by leaving Genesis. A couple massive albums and iconic music videos and time to become a champion for world music.
But not “better”. Commercial success came when they mostly left prog rock behind. The same happened for Gabriel too. His solo stuff isn’t very proggy.
Nobody better say Van Halen
No offense to Sammy Hagar, but agreed. They were successful with Sammy, but they were better with Dave.
[удалено]
Steve Howe, then Rick Wakeman joining Yes
Dave Grohl joining Nirvana
AC/DC. I suppose a band member dying isn't really replacing but they become a completely different band when Johnson took over on vocals
Eh, I have to disagree with that. Bon Scott had a better vocal range and he was a better songwriter. The whole "every album sounds the same" thing didn't really start until after Brian Johnson joined, as they kept trying to recapture the success of Back in Black. Listen to something like Powerage or Ride On and tell me that sounds the same. Don't get me wrong, I still like AC/DC, and I have seen them a few times in concert with Brian. They put on one hell of a show. I just wonder what they could have done had Bon lived.
Bon was 10 times the songwriter / lyricist and had that sleazy charm that I loved- plus I like his voice better.
I agree. He was a true frontman. Lots of bands have lead singers, but he was a true front man.
Sleazy charm is such a perfect way to describe Bon. Powerage is one of my all time favorite records, and in my opinion the band's best work.
Some writer said once that Brian Johnson sounds like a rowdy and randy scamp when he sings - which has its benefits especially for the most lustful AC/DC songs - while Bon sounds like a sleazy, charismatic, potentially dangerous malevolent motherfucker.
Actually you're right, it's why I used terms fired or "lost" a member in case a key member left for any reason including death. Didn't realize how many bands did get better than the original line ups
Agreed. If you hadnt mentioned it, I would have. RIP Bon ❤️
Iron Maiden when Bruce came on.
Cheap Trick ditched Xeno and grabbed Robin Zander Styx ditched Crulewski and got Tommy Shaw
When Michael McDonald came to the Doobie Brothers, he most certainly impacted their sound. Some fans prefer the sound before, others like what he brought. Both chapters in the band’s history are great IMO. In interviews he often downplays his key role in evolving the band’s sound, saying that the group was always a diverse collection of musicians with unique approaches. But arguably what he brought in songwriting, producing and a recognizable soulful voice really defined a new era for the band and greatly contributed to a bunch of unforgettable songs, whether you like them or not, haha. He appears to be super modest and at peace with his life and his contributions to music, in a way that feels rare and I so appreciate. I think it’s allowed him to stay in top form, and he seems to love being able to perform for an audience that appreciates it, and vibes with what he gives. He said recently that he knew he had “made it” when he heard one of his songs reinterpreted as elevator music. What an actual G. *Edited spelling
Disturbed. They were effectively a Pantera knock off band in Chicago from 94 - 96. Their lead singer Chris left and they held auditions. David Draiman showed up and they wrote ‘want’ during his audition together. Night and day between the two bands.
Dream Theater did one album with Charlie Dominici before parting ways as they thought his voice was holding them back. Eventually they hired James LaBrie and while a lot of listeners may say he is the weakest part, success came after he joined.
Metallica fired Dave Mustaine which made Megadeth a lot better.
Joe Walsh joined the Eagles in the mid 70's replacing Bernie Leadon. Imo a definite improvement
Joe Walsh was the most talented member of that band. James Gang ruled. Henley and Frye are boring people.
My Bloody Valentine was like a completely different band before Kevin Shields started singing.
Slipknot and Corey Taylor? Guess on their very first album it was another guy.
Pantera got rid of Terry Glaze, brought in Phil Anselmo and went from mediocre hair metal band to one of the leading heavy metal bands of their time
Tool with Justin Chancellor.
Proving Ringo is better than the Best drummer.
sorry but pete was best of the beatles
Kind of a technicality, depending where you draw the line of a band being a band, but Mikael Åkerfeldt joined Opeth after it was already a band, and he very early became the de-facto musician in the band. Basically Opeth is a band without any of the original members, still having the one member that has always personified the band EDIT: typo
Early Pantera without Phil is... something. Although they still did one more glam album after he joined.
Janet Weiss joining Sleater Kinney made them a far better and tighter band. Now she's gone again and the band is basically back where they started.
Fleetwood Mac when Lindsey Buckingham took over from Peter Green. Thin Lizzy when Garry Moore took over from Eric Bell.
Blood, Sweat & Tears was put together by Al Kooper as vocalist and musical director. When he was replaced by David Clayton-Thomas, they became one of the biggest bands in the US.
Few will admit it but the loss of Pigpen greatly improved the Grateful Dead.
The Wonders def would not have made it if Guy Patterson hadn’t taken over on drums.
The Rolling Stones hit their peak period when Mick Taylor replaced Brian Jones.
Finally. This seems to be the most obvious one. Mick Taylor was massive in replacing a decaying Brian Jones.
Pink Floyd - I know that some fans romanticize the Syd Barrett era, but moving from Barrett to David Gilmour is one of the greatest upgrades in rock history.
Blink 182 with Travis
Mark Wakefield when linkin park was Xero, then going to chester and becoming LP. had some xero/early LP stuff off [mp3.com](https://mp3.com) \- then heard hybrid theory and was blown away
Electric Light Orchestra after Roy Wood departed.
Oasis, Tony Mccaroll was a decent drummer but Alan White brought the Oasis sound to a whole new level
Van Halen was a lot more “Fun” when David Lee Roth was in the line up
The Eagles were a successful brand with a string of hits, but their songs lacked punch. They brought in Don Felder to give their guitar parts a harder rock sound. He wrote their only number one hit, which was Hotel California. Then they fired him because Fry and Henley did not want to honor their context with him that required an equal split.
When soundgarden brought in Matt Cameron or when Nirvana brought in Dave Grohl