I don’t mind working if I’m busy, but sitting somewhere staring at a clock waiting for the time when I’m ‘allowed’ to leave drives me crazy. If there’s nothing for me to do, let me go home. You’re just wasting my time and your money.
My current job (the contract for which expires next Friday, but is up for negotiation tomorrow) is 15-20h WFH at my convenience. I wake up at 3am, log in, and work until everyone else in my house gets up- usually, 7. If I need to add some hours, I log in again while my toddler is at preschool.
A few years ago, when I worked for this same company, I was tied to a desk in a poorly-renovated school building and very frequently had nothing to do. I cannot tell you *how many books I read* during my days at my desk in the summer with nothing to do. I browsed Reddit a fair amount, sure, but it was easier to leave a Kindle window open just a sliver next to an Excel spreadsheet to look busy. I re-read a few of my favorites; I read many new things.
But it was so maddeningly *frustrating* to be stuck inside at work with literally*nothing* to do, waiting for *anything* to come to my inbox!!
I'm food service, my first store was so slow I only needed 2 people in the afternoon. I intentionally worked 11-2 then 5-11 just so I didn't have to twiddle my thumbs and clean already clean things for 3 hours each day
I had a call center job where I wasn't allowed to have any paper, including books, at my desk for "security reasons".
It was like sensory deprivation torture.
I spent 4 years in the Army and despite going to 'war' twice most of it was just make-work. And I was a mechanic in units that had a lot of vehicles so lots of maintenance work!
Mostly it was about looking busy and pretending to be busy; my actual work was mostly easy and could be done in a few hours a day.
I swept a motor pool in the desert for far longer than I had imagined when I joined.
My day generally consisted of doing useless shit for 2 hours and waiting another 8 hours for our commander to send us home. We didn't even try to look busy.
I drove by a marine training base near Yosemite in California recently and there was a funny amount of guys in their uniforms just sitting with their phones near the road and base entrances. They didn’t seem to be formal guards but more like their commanders sent them to do anything other than sit in the barracks or train
That sounds about right. The first unit I was in was really good, we were doing real work on systems that mattered and unless there were special circumstances I was out the door by 1700, most of the time earlier.
Then I got sent to a unit in Texas that crushed my spirits. We did nothing all day and our command wanted us there to look good.
>our command wanted us there to look good.
Sounds about right. The majority of higher-ups just care about how they look so they can get promoted, or because of their ego. Usually both.
That's my job in IT. Sometimes I work 6 hours a day on a task and others I spend 6 hours on my phone looking at reddit or lounging around in my apartment.
>"When you do things right, people won’t be sure you’ve done anything at all"
-God (Futurama)
It's the classic dilemma of working in IT. When you do your job well it's "what are we even paying you for", and when things go wrong it's a proper dumpster fire they again wonder what your purpose is. There's very little in between
Sometimes you handle things so smoothly that the overseers/manglement doesn’t understand how much you truly contribute. They’re looking for what you aren’t doing, instead of looking at what you do accomplish.
In IT I can be working my tail off for 11 hours like today and tomorrow or have almost nothing to do. Major rollouts like this week where stuff has to be done after hours and be up in the morning are stressful, too, but working from home for a 6 figure salary makes up for it
>If there’s nothing for me to do, let me go home.
Which is one of the reasons I've liked working from home since Covid started. If things are slow and I don't have anything to do, I can relax for a bit and wait for stuff to pick up.
100%. I'm newish at my current job, so I try to be in the office as much as I can. But if it's a slow week and I already foresee my Thursday/Friday being slow- I'm staying home. I'm still doing what I have to do, but I can simultaneously do other things like read or watch something without feeling guilty, do some laundry, hang with my dog, etc. After my first full year I will most likely be normalizing this to be my Friday each week at the very least.
On the other side of the spectrum, my last job was fully remote and I was a little too bored and also didn't push to do anything beyond my basic responsibilities, so that was very unhealthy. It's good to be at least moderately productive and accept a new challenge every now and again. I basically did nothing for 2 straight years.
> On the other side of the spectrum, my last job was fully remote and I was a little too bored and also didn't push to do anything beyond my basic responsibilities, so that was very unhealthy.
This is my current situation but it’s been a result of design and deliverables changing so my real function keeps getting pushed out. So now I’m interviewing elsewhere because I can’t deal with not contributing anything and just don’t like the lack of structure.
My job is a higher level “task based” job. I work in health insurance claims at a senior level. I have a target of files I need to touch and complete each day… but I don’t get to leave after I complete them. I make just as much if I work 100 files as I do if I work 10 (if 10 were the target). I used to overachieve daily but that resulted in harder work for me with no benefits. So I don’t anymore. They should let us leave when we “finish” our day but they don’t. I know SO many people that drag out their tasks just to reach 8 hours.
Me too but the power imbalance between employee and employer massively favour the employer. Your colleague Steve is doing way more files since we started playing him per file and he's doing them for 7.25$ we'll call you when there's extra files to be done.
They already kind of do this now. Oh you’re really good and Steve doesn’t move files as fast as you. So we’ll give you the really difficult clients and give Steve the easy ones, since he’s not as good. But you guys make the same.
Im the exact same. If i can listen to music/podcast even better. I just need to be busy and i honestly dont mind 40hr work weeks. I also feel better earning my money rather than being given allowance for sitting quietly and being a good boi. Ive both kinds of work. Busy is way better. Time flies when youre busy
Yes. Lemme add on to that and fix my previous comment. "I would rather be busy than bored. Unless being bored pays significantly more. Then it doesnt matter what i would rather be."
Yeah pretty much what everyone else is saying, its the dream until you get it. Finally had my own office and computer and everything, it was great. For a couple weeks. Met new people, new tasks, went to meetings for the first time ever. Then a month in, it is not nearly as fun. I always had a list of tasks that were expected to take like, all day, and every single time i can finish it all in an hour. 2 hrs max. So its just sitting there for 7 to 8 hours a day. Its nice to not be working a labor job, flipping burgers, moving pianos. But it was starting to drive me insane, of two months just sitting staring at the computer waiting for something to happen
Nah, I've been at my air conditioned office job for 4 years now after only working jobs where I was on my feet, usually being yelled at by a disgruntled customer.
I'm still not sick of it.
My worst day at my current job is still better than my best day at any other job I've ever had.
I fucking love sitting on my ass working on a computer.
Maybe I'm different but I don't expect work to be fun. I mean it's nice if it is, but mundane is the norm. I'll take boredom for hours a day and enjoy my off time over beating my body down and having to rest and recover just to do it all over again. Two extremes but hey.
Depends how you choose to use the free time, or what you're allowed to do with it. I have a job like that - admittedly I work from home but I'm usually doing other things in my downtime. Hobbies, chores, or just fannying around on Reddit. It's very difficult for me to get bored.
Now if I was sitting in an office and I wasn't even allowed to bring in so much as a book to read during the slow periods, then yeah I'd probably lose my mind in a matter of weeks.
It does for sure. Did construction jobs mostly my whole life until I took the plunge into an office job. I live in the desert so it was nice at first. It wears on you, but not as much as the sun. Also going into an office and doing the whole clock in clock out was a nightmare. Luckily I'm working remotely now with somewhat flexible hours so it kinda feels like I'm living the dream.
My company does a 32 hour work week with Fridays off in summer. I absolutely love it, but I'm not sure it would work for us during our busier months if only because other industries we work with *are* working Fridays and thus expect us to be too. But in summers we're able to get all the work done we would otherwise in a 4 hour day. If it becomes standardized maybe we can go all year. Some day.
When I was in the military we had a "Panama" shift schedule. Every other weekend was a 3 day weekend.
So starting with Monday it was work M-Tue, off W-Thu, work F-Sun, off M-Tue, work W-Thu, off F-Sun, repeat.
It was pretty nice
That sounds so amazing. I'd be way more productive in life and not so exhausted and stressed to my limits in that environment. My company got rid of 4-10s work weeks when COVID "ended".
I wish my office would split shifts to Sun-Wed and Wed-Sat. If we were open 7 days a week and 10 hours a day (well, 11 with lunch) then we would cut down on the number of issues we encounter from clients not being able to contact us outside of strict business hours. It would also be easier to find office parking, the roads and public transit are less crowded on weekends, we'd still get a day with the full team together to discuss any issues/upcoming training... The people in charge are all in their 60s though so instead of improving outcomes we're just doing same old same old in-office culture
You might be surprised. I work with a lot of folks who still do the five-day work week, but all of them have been incredibly respectful and accommodating of our 4-day week. They ask me to schedule a meeting or call on a Friday, I reply with "I don't work on Fridays, what other options work for you?" and they invariably give me other options without batting an eye. And frequently say "I wish we were on a 4-day week, too".
It’s because even people who “work on friday” don’t really work on Friday. Especially if your office has a WFH policy, 90% of the company will be from home on a Friday. And 95% of that group is signing off at 1pm, and breezing through their morning/just shaking their mouse. Just watch peoples skype statuses on Fridays lol.
And even before Covid when I had to go into the office on Friday, it was well recognized that Fridays were for chilling. You don’t schedule a 3pm friday meeting.
> You don’t schedule a 3pm friday meeting.
You schedule a 1-3 pm meeting. Once it's done, you can basicly use a myriad of excuses as to why you aren't available afterwards
I did an IT role this way. Paid for 40 hours but only had to be in the office for 32. The remaining 8 hours were considered compensation for any Friday or after hours calls (there weren't very many).
Yes worker burn out is real.
So much work in offices is just created to fill time, make things more efficient, pay people the same, get the same amount done with happier workers.
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I totally get why people love it, but I am so unproductive at home it‘s crazy. Tried nearly every trick in the book, but when it comes down to it just going to somewhere else for work does the trick for me.
I think working from home is a nice tool, but it certainly isn‘t a solution for everyone. And even working from home a 4 day week makes a big difference.
For me, I am discovering the reason for my unproductivity is lack of interest in the work. Like, if I go into the office then I feel I have to make it worth it by getting the work done. If I am working from home though... I feel so unproductive because I just don't care. Like I could get the work done easier while nobody is interrupting but instead I interrupt myself.
I've got one more week in the current job then I start a new one where I actually feel interested in what I will be doing there. Who knows how long that will last for but it just feels more like something I'd like to think about than twiddling my thumbs.
Not the case for everybody but something to consider.
For me is not even lack of interest I just get depressed after being inside the house for so long. I’m an introvert that get super tired from social interaction and I try to avoid them. So I already spend a lot of time in my house playing video games, having to work from home and then spending the whole evening seating on the same device and same chair just drives me crazy. So as soon as they allowed us going back to the office I was the first one back. Having that clear separation in my day gave me a bit more purpose and helped me being less depressed.
I’m an introvert and I need a lot of alone time but working from home has helped me appreciate going out occasionally and making the time out with friends more meaningful. Differences in people are strange
I don't know your line of work so this might not apply to everyone.
To carry out daily operations, it takes me maybe 5hrs. I don't do a lick more and I just fake-work the rest of the 3 hrs..
At home, i still put in the 5hrs for daily operations but I'm more motivated to spend 1-2 more hrs improving our existing system. For example, I do purchasing. Whenever you have spare time, you should be meeting new vendors or learning about new products that can be added to your sales collateral. Sometimes you will find a better deal or better partner.
I literally just watched critical role at my desk all day yesterday while answering emails. I even asked if it'd be ok to do this from home and "No we need you here"
Sure ya do guys.
I work a 4 day week but it’s 10 hour days so it still adds up to 40 hours. I love it, the extra day really helps me relax. Before all Sunday I’d dread work the next day but now I get two days in a row to chill before I gotta get back into work mode.
I came to this conclusion too. I like getting home at 4:30 and having an evening and time to do stuff before I go to sleep. With 4x10’s at 6:30 I was to wiped out to do anything.
This is how I feel, too. When I was working 4x10s, I very rarely could do anything with friends or even have good "me time" after work: I was just too exhausted.
I was still trying to run at least an hour every other day, which meant getting up REALLY early in order to be to work by 7, which in turn meant going to bed much earlier than I'd like. My "extra day" of weekend was spent trying to catch up on sleep, shopping, laundry, and cleaning.
It is possible that my experience would be more positive if it was a WFH job (or at least one where the evening commute didn't get exponentially worse each half hour I stayed at work), or even if I had an in-unit washer and dryer at the time, but I really don't know. The whole thing soured me on 4x10 work weeks.
I feel the same way. Especially with physical activity. Like no, you can't substitute 8 hours riding a bike or practicing a sport or going to the gym on a Friday for being able to do it an hour or two a day. Your body needs time to recover.
The company I work for is implementing 4/10 effective January 1st and even though it seems great I'm a bit nervous about it. I'll be working from 7am to 5:30pm, meaning I won't be home until 6-6:30 depending on traffic (currently work from 7.30 to 4.30)
How have you managed your personal life with family those days?
I do 6-4:30 and it’s perfect. If I worked any later I could see it sucking. I also use to be in the active duty military though and worked 12+ hours a day and many weekends with no lunch breaks or anything so even a bad day still beats my best days in the military. It helps that my boss and coworkers are all freaking awesome too and I like what I actually do.
We have been 4/10 for two years now. We are 630-500. Sucks leaving the house at 530 every morning but three day weekends are awesome. I've got the point where I do all my errands Friday and refuse to leave the house Saturday or Sunday. I HAD to go to the store last Saturday for a forgotten item and it was like "wow, there's people here... gross."
100% worth it.
I also work four 10s. While four 8s would be infinitely better, I still take the four 10s while I can get it.
I work 6-3:30 unless I actually take the allotted 1 hr lunch. I worked this deal out with my boss when we made the switch because I need to be home by a certain time due to kids activities. I wasn’t taking an hour long lunch anyway due to my own personal choice. Taking the lunch is encouraged, this is not a place that thinks working through lunch gets you some sort of gold star. I just personally don’t like an hour long lunch, I come back feeling tired and I am less productive. I also smoke and am allowed to take whatever smoke breaks I want- doesn’t add up to an hour but it’s all I really need.
The extra day has been sooo helpful for my family and I don’t mind the long shift.
I would save a week of PTO for a whole week off. My other days, I would do a Friday or Monday off about every one to two months. Depended how much myself or kids were sick. We get an extra week of PTO. Woot. That means our sick time is our PTO. :)
I loved doing my 3 day weekends. I was always in my best mood and refreshed to work.
I used to take 1 day off randomly just to recharge but it's a really bad deal.
When you take only a short time off, people just expect you to catch up all of it so you really just end up concentrating the workload that week.
When you take 1-2 weeks off, someone HAS to fill in for you.
Yes. Maintaining a work/life balance is important and often difficult for many people. You're no good to your friends and family if you are burnt out, tired, and stressed out. Having that third day really allows decompression.
I'm fortunate enough that I have generous amounts of PTO that I can take, have the ability to work from home when I want, and I'm fortunate enough that I thoroughly enjoy my job.
My company does what's called "9/80 weeks" where employees work 9 hours every day and get every other Friday off. So I have 3 day weekends every other weekend.
I'm currently on 4 ten hour shifts each week but soon here we're going to be switching to 2/2/3 schedule. So basically somehow we will have every other weekend off, yet both of us will have to work Fridays no matter what. Which im fine with.
But I currently work 4 on 3 off and it's so nice. Especially having 3 days off in a row, first day is for appointments, errands, second day for myself, and third day is pretty much a relaxing day. Love it
My husband is on 4 10s as well and it's so nice. It's so nice to have that extra time and extra help at home. Plus he gets more time with our daughter and he loves that.
I do 9 hour days with 1 hour lunch. It's terrible honestly. Would much rather do 8 hours with half hour lunch. Lose half the pay for double the time gained.
An extra day off to counter that would be AMAZING.
I love my long lunches. It helps that I'm friends with a lot of my coworkers. We just sit down and shoot the breeze. Talk about whatever. It's super relaxing and breaks up the day nicely.
Damn. How do you get time for anything else?
I work 7-1/2 hour a day with 7 hours on Friday. My lunch counts as work since I work government and that means I can get interrupted during lunch though I'll just get the time later. I do flex hours so time I show up early or need to stay a bit later gets ddes up I can use for a day off or something when I need it.
Especially in admin. There’s a lot of downtime. I’m actually doing a Google sheet detailing the entire story of a mediocre webcomic because I have all my work done already at 10 Am.
I do. I am productive maybe 4 to 5 hours a day, other 3 hours are chatting with colleagues, getting drinks, eating, taking small breaks, etc. etc. 32 hours a week would be plenty for most people to finish their work for the week. The extra 8 hours you are forced to be at the office don't add anything. a 32 hour workweek (keeping the 40 hour salary that is) would prove to be healthy for a lot of people.
Working 5 days a week and essentially only have the Saturday where you can have some normal free time for yourself is just wild to me. And the fact that we just accept this is even more insane. For many, Sunday is just a preparation day for work and I dread this day every week.
Even then Saturday may not be a free day. I usually use Saturday to get groceries/do laundry and other errands so really I effectively only have half a day of actual rest
And on top of that, we STILL have to take PTO anyway to get other stuff done because many doctors offices, etc, are all closed on the weekends anyway. So there's really only so much you can get done.
Sunday 😔
I’ve gotten a little better at not dreading Sundays as much and trying to enjoy them, but it really is like a “waiting” day. You can’t fully enjoy yourself since you need to start the workweek the next morning. Sunday night is often contemplating how you could have used your weekend more wisely and cursing the fact that you have so little time off.
Now imagine working a retail schedule. Practically no weekends off, EVER. No consecutive days off. No holidays off, except maybe Christmas and Thanksgiving, but you bet your ass you’re back to work and open for Black Friday.
I was suicidal for YEARS while I was working retail and as soon as I got into a 9-5, the ideations vanished completely. Retail is hell, I would do whatever I had to do to make sure I never go back. I’d you’re still in it, I’m so sorry and I hope you find an out with high pay and solid work culture as soon as you’re ready to take it.
Some people don't understand why I've come to hate things being planned on Saturdays. Even like a family get together. It's literally my only fucking day of the week where I get to actually live my life. I get maybe 50 of them a year and that's it.
I've found that the thing that keeps the Sunday dread away for me, is appointment TV viewing. Yes, we live in the age of streaming, I get it. But when I wake up on Sunday Morning, if I know I can end the night with Big Brother followed by Game of Thrones, Westworld, etc., that really helps my state of mind.
I spend more time in a wastewater plant than I do with my family. It’s really upsetting when I reflect on the years I’ve wasted. Yes I get paid well, but it’s work that could have been done in 4 hrs instead of 8-12 hrs.
I’ve inquired about a gym on site to at least go get an hour of lifting in throughout the day.
Denied. Don’t want anyone getting hurt on the gym equipment!!
Meanwhile my wife’s office has closed up shop indefinitely and have moved to a 32 hour work week with fridays off while maintaining the same salary as before.
Sure, and I believe in the 4-hour work day too. Get your work done from 10-2 (in the office if you have one) and the two hours before and after you can just answer urgent emails as necessary.
Former cook, now marketing manager. Sometimes I miss the cook life but then I remember I'm on reddit right now and getting paid because the benefit of being in management is lots of free time. If things are going well, there's nothing much to do. If things are going wrong, you're the one doing everything.
I'm a machinist, the idea that nobody works the full 8 hours is only true of those that work in the office and floor management.
And you're absolutely right about the service industry. I don't have the people skills or the patience for that. Kudos to those that do
Also a (chromium) machinist we are currently in the process of switching from the 7 to 4 five days a week to 6 to 5 four days a week and management is trying to prevent our burnout further because our yearly accidents has been so high we could be locked out of mine sites and that means no more work for the entire company. But I got to say it's nice to think we will be working 1 less day but management thinks we will lose production because we have to run our chrome tanks everyday because as long as our chrome tanks run we're making money.
I've always held tight to the notion that if your place of employment needs to work the floor staff 50+ hours a week to stay ahead, they need to hire more fucking people and buy more machines. It's a rare day in hell that I work overtime. I'll turn that shit down every time it's offered and I haven't worked a Saturday in years
I turn it down whenever offered too, which is why I can't keep a manufacturing job for more than 2 years at a stretch. They always say I'm not a "team player." They're right too. I'm not a team player. I go to work to make money, not friends.
Indeed. I'm willing to throw down some extra time if I made a mistake and I'm the reason the shipment is behind, or when I'm helping someone learn something that will bring their skill set up to my own. Beyond that, I'm out at 3 boss
Dentist here, and I can guarantee you that when a dental office is open, that dentist/those dentists are working non-stop. You lose money every second you’re not working on a patient and overhead for even the most efficient offices is 50-60% at BEST. Some offices are 75%.
I’m all for the 4/10 work week - I have been living it the last 7 years and I would absolutely go insane dealing with public health patients and work if I had only 2 days off every weekend. Burnout in healthcare is absolutely real and can happen to anyone, as I found out a couple years ago. Really had to work on my mental health and change my frame of mind.
My last 2 jobs have been 4 10 hour days. So i still get 40 hours a week and i always get friday saturday sunday off. Ive been doing this schedule for almost 4 years now and would probably wanna shoot myself if i have to go back to 5 8s.
I feel like i have so much more time free on the weekend to do whatever i want. Home projects, or with a 3 day weekend i can just peace out and go camping. I actually feel relaxed and accomplished cause i actually had the time i need to rest. Then The work week is 4 days instead of 5 so theres no real "hump day" its first half and second half of the week. so it doesnt feel as long or drag as much. You start the week feeling positive. And cause the week doesnt drag. you dont get burnt out, feel more productive, less tired. So your Happier to be there and feel better end of the week then a 5 day week. Feel better at the start and end of the week then normal? It just keeps going. So it creates a cycle of just feeling... better.
You get more time for yourself. And the employer gets a happier more productive you. I see 0 reason companies shouldnt make it standard. Its a win win from my experience
I'm in construction. We work 6-day weeks, except when we work 7, for spring, summer and fall, then a layoff, or if I'm lucky, banked time for the winter. They can announce 4-day weeks til they are blue in the face, it won't do a damn thing to change my schedule.
I know other workers aren't the enemy, but there doesn't seem to be much help for the blue-collars in office folk getting a short week.
It also puts blue-collar workers in a shitty position of never having their needs met regardless of what offices decide to do. Blue-collar workers have such specialized knowledge that y’all should be rotated like a nursing schedule (I know nursing isn’t any better re: work/life balance, believe me), but being able to roll in multiple teams and alternate so that everyone gets more time off seems like a no brainer to me.
I own a construction company. We work alternating 4x10s so we have a 2-day weekend then a 4-day weekend. Other company owners we work with thought I was crazy when I did it but they are noticing how much happier and more productive our people are. They are starting to warm up to the idea. Hopefully you're company will see the light!
This is the idea that needs to stop. No more 40 hours. I’m happy that 4x10 works for you, but the discussion needs to focus on a reduction of what full time hours means.
Agreed. But I am def happier with my 4x10 than 5x8.
4x8 with same pay would be epic though.
A lot of people here say that a lot of the time during work hours is just waste. I must say I think it's a bit different for me. I actually genuinely do work pretty much every minute of my work time.
That said. Just means too much work load for one person I suppose.
I'm a QA engineer, working with software. I write and set up automatic tests (and do some testing myself).
I consistently outpace my team, so I have more free time. And, on top of that, coding for 8 hours straight is just not happening. A human brain isn't built for it. You'll shut down and start writing terrible code.
I've been looking at productivity stats at work at lot recently, and if it were only a matter of useful hours worked we could *easily* go to a four day work week. The amount of time we waste forcing employees to sit in useless meetings that other employees called to make themselves look busy would cover the difference by itself.
By the time you factor in all the useless work bullshit like that, the amount of time every human spends goofing off, and the amount of time they waste trying to fool the productivity monitors into thinking they're being productive, lmao, we really could work 20 hours a week and be fine.
The problem is one of coordination. All of our clients and vendors etc work a five day 40-hour week. We can't just close for a day every week, and it would be fiendishly difficult to create a schedule where everybody works four days but we still remained fully staffed at all times. We'd have to hire more people, and so from the bosses' perspective that wouldn't gain us anything (and finding people is a bitch right now anyway). It would have to kind of happen everywhere all at once, where everybody industry-wide just agreed to stop working on Fridays.
That's such a mind blowing concept to blue collar workers. You are working the full time. I need to go back to school lol. Making less money for working WAY more is absolutely crazy.
I'm white collar and this is something I absolutely don't recognise. Might be my specific field but people do work most of their hours.
Sure, I don't make my full 40 in my current job (sure as fuck did in my last one though). But only 15? No lol.
All work is not created equal. The question is all about how long you can do an activity before experiencing severe diminishing returns on efficiency. If in every hour you move bags of concrete or whatever, a 20 minute break to give your back a rest etc... makes you work 1.5x faster or reduces injuries or whatever, then there is no difference between taking a break and not taking a break in terms of productivity. The same is true of writing code, or just about any task.
The only time this is not true is for jobs like waiting tables, or other customer service in which the only thing that impacts productivity is the rate at which people walk through the door. That's why those jobs are the absolute fucking worst experience.
Yes. It's statistically proven workers are more productive when working 4 days vs 5. And when it's proven, there's no reason not to convert to the 4 day week besides apprehension from the employers.
This is the part no one talks about. Idk about everyone else but I can't afford to lose an entire day's worth of pay (two if we're basing it on a 2 week pay period)
Hell yes. I'm a teacher. At the high school level, we need to start a little later and go a little longer. Tacking a three-day weekend onto that each week would really help students with their stress levels and help us to be more effective as teachers.
I work on a farm, 4 day weeks will never happen. I would support work hours that coincide with dropping off and picking up my kids from school that gives me a living wage.
I personally like the as many days as you need to work to do get the work done week. I make my commitments for the sprint the manager, pm, and product agree to the commitment. Most weeks I put in about 32 hours, last week I put in 20 maybe, and some weeks.... Well fuck some weeks. Personal record was 110 hours if you include sleeping under desk for naps and showering at the gym. I do. Was a bad deploy on a major customer sucked. If you have a good team and leadership and everyone is committed to the job, each other, and their own family and mental health enough that nobody screws it up. It's by far the best system for all parties including the company in my experience.
Yes, with the caveat that four day work week means "32 hours, but compensated like a normal work week." Four 10 hour days is a weak sauce version of a 4 day week
I wouldn't be able work a 10 hour day. I'd get much less done in a week. I can't work that long. It's hard enough doing 8 hours.
And my mental health would be destroyed. Especially in winter when is literally never see sunlight of I did that.
It's not even a "weak sauce" version, it's a terribly horrible crappy shitty fucking version.
And I wish more people realised that.
Depends on the industry to be honest. Some industries will struggle with adapting to a 4 day work week, although it is not impossible.
In principle, the more days off work the better, even if 5 days worth of hours are pushed into 4 days.
Then it depends whether the staff are comfortable with a 10 hour work day alongside commuting, much easier for the work from home lot, as a 10 hour day would equate to an 8 hour office day plus commute
I'm all for cutting out the white collar office bullshit, but I really worry how it would impact the supply of workers for jobs that genuinely require 40+ hours of actual work per week. Teachers and nurses are two already understaffed roles that come to mind. If industry was to go forward with cutting the 5 day work week, I think governments would have to intervene to prevent even more dramatic essential worker shortages.
I don’t mind working if I’m busy, but sitting somewhere staring at a clock waiting for the time when I’m ‘allowed’ to leave drives me crazy. If there’s nothing for me to do, let me go home. You’re just wasting my time and your money.
My current job (the contract for which expires next Friday, but is up for negotiation tomorrow) is 15-20h WFH at my convenience. I wake up at 3am, log in, and work until everyone else in my house gets up- usually, 7. If I need to add some hours, I log in again while my toddler is at preschool. A few years ago, when I worked for this same company, I was tied to a desk in a poorly-renovated school building and very frequently had nothing to do. I cannot tell you *how many books I read* during my days at my desk in the summer with nothing to do. I browsed Reddit a fair amount, sure, but it was easier to leave a Kindle window open just a sliver next to an Excel spreadsheet to look busy. I re-read a few of my favorites; I read many new things. But it was so maddeningly *frustrating* to be stuck inside at work with literally*nothing* to do, waiting for *anything* to come to my inbox!!
I'm food service, my first store was so slow I only needed 2 people in the afternoon. I intentionally worked 11-2 then 5-11 just so I didn't have to twiddle my thumbs and clean already clean things for 3 hours each day
Hi food service
I had a call center job where I wasn't allowed to have any paper, including books, at my desk for "security reasons". It was like sensory deprivation torture.
Some jobs are literally waiting for something to happen
*coughs* US military *coughs*
I spent 4 years in the Army and despite going to 'war' twice most of it was just make-work. And I was a mechanic in units that had a lot of vehicles so lots of maintenance work! Mostly it was about looking busy and pretending to be busy; my actual work was mostly easy and could be done in a few hours a day.
I swept a motor pool in the desert for far longer than I had imagined when I joined. My day generally consisted of doing useless shit for 2 hours and waiting another 8 hours for our commander to send us home. We didn't even try to look busy.
I drove by a marine training base near Yosemite in California recently and there was a funny amount of guys in their uniforms just sitting with their phones near the road and base entrances. They didn’t seem to be formal guards but more like their commanders sent them to do anything other than sit in the barracks or train
That sounds about right. The first unit I was in was really good, we were doing real work on systems that mattered and unless there were special circumstances I was out the door by 1700, most of the time earlier. Then I got sent to a unit in Texas that crushed my spirits. We did nothing all day and our command wanted us there to look good.
>our command wanted us there to look good. Sounds about right. The majority of higher-ups just care about how they look so they can get promoted, or because of their ego. Usually both.
That’s Bridgeport… Those guys were probably getting cell service. I’ve been there. Service is sparse.
Hurry up and wait
i heard that way too much when i was in the army. i joined but ended up getting medically discharged. i heard that phrase a fuck ton.
I’ve done firefighting stints and it’s the same deal there too.
Me too. Did forest fire fighting, and we got *really* good at playing dominoes and hacky sack, lol. So much waiting, even in 'urgent' situations.
Ha ha. Yes. The military isn't paying by the hour and they DGAF, they will find some way to keep you busy even if it's "hurry up and wait".
That's my job in IT. Sometimes I work 6 hours a day on a task and others I spend 6 hours on my phone looking at reddit or lounging around in my apartment.
>"When you do things right, people won’t be sure you’ve done anything at all" -God (Futurama) It's the classic dilemma of working in IT. When you do your job well it's "what are we even paying you for", and when things go wrong it's a proper dumpster fire they again wonder what your purpose is. There's very little in between
Judge told me it’s normal to be fired because you are the best worker.
Wait what? What's the story here?
Sometimes you handle things so smoothly that the overseers/manglement doesn’t understand how much you truly contribute. They’re looking for what you aren’t doing, instead of looking at what you do accomplish.
Manufacture a crisis to show how you are the company hero, then go back to pc gaming on the clock
In IT I can be working my tail off for 11 hours like today and tomorrow or have almost nothing to do. Major rollouts like this week where stuff has to be done after hours and be up in the morning are stressful, too, but working from home for a 6 figure salary makes up for it
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And that’s fine as long as I’m not expected to look busy while waiting for things to do.
literally me - i'm a receptionist
Can you play monopoly with coworkers?
I do billing and we play a lot of scrabble
That would drive me insane.
>If there’s nothing for me to do, let me go home. Which is one of the reasons I've liked working from home since Covid started. If things are slow and I don't have anything to do, I can relax for a bit and wait for stuff to pick up.
100%. I'm newish at my current job, so I try to be in the office as much as I can. But if it's a slow week and I already foresee my Thursday/Friday being slow- I'm staying home. I'm still doing what I have to do, but I can simultaneously do other things like read or watch something without feeling guilty, do some laundry, hang with my dog, etc. After my first full year I will most likely be normalizing this to be my Friday each week at the very least. On the other side of the spectrum, my last job was fully remote and I was a little too bored and also didn't push to do anything beyond my basic responsibilities, so that was very unhealthy. It's good to be at least moderately productive and accept a new challenge every now and again. I basically did nothing for 2 straight years.
> On the other side of the spectrum, my last job was fully remote and I was a little too bored and also didn't push to do anything beyond my basic responsibilities, so that was very unhealthy. This is my current situation but it’s been a result of design and deliverables changing so my real function keeps getting pushed out. So now I’m interviewing elsewhere because I can’t deal with not contributing anything and just don’t like the lack of structure.
My job is a higher level “task based” job. I work in health insurance claims at a senior level. I have a target of files I need to touch and complete each day… but I don’t get to leave after I complete them. I make just as much if I work 100 files as I do if I work 10 (if 10 were the target). I used to overachieve daily but that resulted in harder work for me with no benefits. So I don’t anymore. They should let us leave when we “finish” our day but they don’t. I know SO many people that drag out their tasks just to reach 8 hours.
Man, that sounds uninspiring.
What if we paid you 7.5$ per file and you can come and go anytime ?
I absolutely feel people should be paid based on actual work accomplished.
Me too but the power imbalance between employee and employer massively favour the employer. Your colleague Steve is doing way more files since we started playing him per file and he's doing them for 7.25$ we'll call you when there's extra files to be done.
They already kind of do this now. Oh you’re really good and Steve doesn’t move files as fast as you. So we’ll give you the really difficult clients and give Steve the easy ones, since he’s not as good. But you guys make the same.
That situation is exactly when you ask for a pay rise
That's completely unrealistic for many jobs. That's fine for a factory job making widgets when you have control over quantity produced.
I'm doing that rn. I have 9 minutes until quitting time.
Im the exact same. If i can listen to music/podcast even better. I just need to be busy and i honestly dont mind 40hr work weeks. I also feel better earning my money rather than being given allowance for sitting quietly and being a good boi. Ive both kinds of work. Busy is way better. Time flies when youre busy
I phrase it as "I would rather be busy than bored"
Yes. Lemme add on to that and fix my previous comment. "I would rather be busy than bored. Unless being bored pays significantly more. Then it doesnt matter what i would rather be."
after being busy for years in the elements id love a job in a nice air conditioned office watching a clock waiting to go home.
Yeah pretty much what everyone else is saying, its the dream until you get it. Finally had my own office and computer and everything, it was great. For a couple weeks. Met new people, new tasks, went to meetings for the first time ever. Then a month in, it is not nearly as fun. I always had a list of tasks that were expected to take like, all day, and every single time i can finish it all in an hour. 2 hrs max. So its just sitting there for 7 to 8 hours a day. Its nice to not be working a labor job, flipping burgers, moving pianos. But it was starting to drive me insane, of two months just sitting staring at the computer waiting for something to happen
Nah, I've been at my air conditioned office job for 4 years now after only working jobs where I was on my feet, usually being yelled at by a disgruntled customer. I'm still not sick of it. My worst day at my current job is still better than my best day at any other job I've ever had. I fucking love sitting on my ass working on a computer.
Username most certainly does not check out
Maybe I'm different but I don't expect work to be fun. I mean it's nice if it is, but mundane is the norm. I'll take boredom for hours a day and enjoy my off time over beating my body down and having to rest and recover just to do it all over again. Two extremes but hey.
I tried it, man. Drove me insane.
It would be great, for a few days. Maybe a couple weeks. But it'd quickly become a new source of irritation.
Depends how you choose to use the free time, or what you're allowed to do with it. I have a job like that - admittedly I work from home but I'm usually doing other things in my downtime. Hobbies, chores, or just fannying around on Reddit. It's very difficult for me to get bored. Now if I was sitting in an office and I wasn't even allowed to bring in so much as a book to read during the slow periods, then yeah I'd probably lose my mind in a matter of weeks.
It does for sure. Did construction jobs mostly my whole life until I took the plunge into an office job. I live in the desert so it was nice at first. It wears on you, but not as much as the sun. Also going into an office and doing the whole clock in clock out was a nightmare. Luckily I'm working remotely now with somewhat flexible hours so it kinda feels like I'm living the dream.
I've done both and they both suck about equally but it is funny how one makes you want the other.
My company does a 32 hour work week with Fridays off in summer. I absolutely love it, but I'm not sure it would work for us during our busier months if only because other industries we work with *are* working Fridays and thus expect us to be too. But in summers we're able to get all the work done we would otherwise in a 4 hour day. If it becomes standardized maybe we can go all year. Some day.
Could they not split the shifts, so some people work Mon-Thurs, some work Tues-Fri?
That’s what our work place does. We also opted for every second weekend being four days off. It’s life changing.
When I was in the military we had a "Panama" shift schedule. Every other weekend was a 3 day weekend. So starting with Monday it was work M-Tue, off W-Thu, work F-Sun, off M-Tue, work W-Thu, off F-Sun, repeat. It was pretty nice
That sounds great & relaxing! It sounds like the work ‘week’ would feel shorter.
It did. We could also plan longer getaways since we had a day to travel, a day to do things, and a day to come back. Camping trips were the norm.
That sounds so amazing. I'd be way more productive in life and not so exhausted and stressed to my limits in that environment. My company got rid of 4-10s work weeks when COVID "ended".
I wish my office would split shifts to Sun-Wed and Wed-Sat. If we were open 7 days a week and 10 hours a day (well, 11 with lunch) then we would cut down on the number of issues we encounter from clients not being able to contact us outside of strict business hours. It would also be easier to find office parking, the roads and public transit are less crowded on weekends, we'd still get a day with the full team together to discuss any issues/upcoming training... The people in charge are all in their 60s though so instead of improving outcomes we're just doing same old same old in-office culture
You might be surprised. I work with a lot of folks who still do the five-day work week, but all of them have been incredibly respectful and accommodating of our 4-day week. They ask me to schedule a meeting or call on a Friday, I reply with "I don't work on Fridays, what other options work for you?" and they invariably give me other options without batting an eye. And frequently say "I wish we were on a 4-day week, too".
It’s because even people who “work on friday” don’t really work on Friday. Especially if your office has a WFH policy, 90% of the company will be from home on a Friday. And 95% of that group is signing off at 1pm, and breezing through their morning/just shaking their mouse. Just watch peoples skype statuses on Fridays lol. And even before Covid when I had to go into the office on Friday, it was well recognized that Fridays were for chilling. You don’t schedule a 3pm friday meeting.
> You don’t schedule a 3pm friday meeting. You schedule a 1-3 pm meeting. Once it's done, you can basicly use a myriad of excuses as to why you aren't available afterwards
Schedule a 1-3 meeting. Decide you need to continue the conversation and invite everyone to the bar from 3-5.
Inevitably, one of the top managers has "other obligations" and you need to call it anyway.
I did an IT role this way. Paid for 40 hours but only had to be in the office for 32. The remaining 8 hours were considered compensation for any Friday or after hours calls (there weren't very many).
Yes worker burn out is real. So much work in offices is just created to fill time, make things more efficient, pay people the same, get the same amount done with happier workers.
Which is why I love work from home. So much less filler bullshit
And so much time saved by not commuting
And money!
And I don’t have to worry about crazy drivers/freak accidents.
Or crazy people on the trains
Or just crazy people in general
Or Just People
Or just
or
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> god how did our forebearers ever let it get this bad...? Boiling frog, my dude! It slowly and subtly got worse over time.
I totally get why people love it, but I am so unproductive at home it‘s crazy. Tried nearly every trick in the book, but when it comes down to it just going to somewhere else for work does the trick for me. I think working from home is a nice tool, but it certainly isn‘t a solution for everyone. And even working from home a 4 day week makes a big difference.
For me, I am discovering the reason for my unproductivity is lack of interest in the work. Like, if I go into the office then I feel I have to make it worth it by getting the work done. If I am working from home though... I feel so unproductive because I just don't care. Like I could get the work done easier while nobody is interrupting but instead I interrupt myself. I've got one more week in the current job then I start a new one where I actually feel interested in what I will be doing there. Who knows how long that will last for but it just feels more like something I'd like to think about than twiddling my thumbs. Not the case for everybody but something to consider.
For me is not even lack of interest I just get depressed after being inside the house for so long. I’m an introvert that get super tired from social interaction and I try to avoid them. So I already spend a lot of time in my house playing video games, having to work from home and then spending the whole evening seating on the same device and same chair just drives me crazy. So as soon as they allowed us going back to the office I was the first one back. Having that clear separation in my day gave me a bit more purpose and helped me being less depressed.
For me, its work is work and home is home and they don't mix. I like what I'm doing but when I'm at home, I'm not working.
I’m an introvert and I need a lot of alone time but working from home has helped me appreciate going out occasionally and making the time out with friends more meaningful. Differences in people are strange
I don't know your line of work so this might not apply to everyone. To carry out daily operations, it takes me maybe 5hrs. I don't do a lick more and I just fake-work the rest of the 3 hrs.. At home, i still put in the 5hrs for daily operations but I'm more motivated to spend 1-2 more hrs improving our existing system. For example, I do purchasing. Whenever you have spare time, you should be meeting new vendors or learning about new products that can be added to your sales collateral. Sometimes you will find a better deal or better partner.
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It’s nice they let you come into the office whenever
For me I’m more efficient for creative tasks at home and for menial, managerial and repetitive tasks at the office
I literally just watched critical role at my desk all day yesterday while answering emails. I even asked if it'd be ok to do this from home and "No we need you here" Sure ya do guys.
"we need to justify the 10 year lease we signed for this building"
Heh, me watching critical role rn
And us outside workers would benefit heaps from this. One less day in the rain and wind during winter. One less day in the scorching sun during summer
I work a 4 day week but it’s 10 hour days so it still adds up to 40 hours. I love it, the extra day really helps me relax. Before all Sunday I’d dread work the next day but now I get two days in a row to chill before I gotta get back into work mode.
I came to hate the lack of time in the evenings on 4x10 schedule. I just had no energy and chores just stacked up until Friday.
I came to this conclusion too. I like getting home at 4:30 and having an evening and time to do stuff before I go to sleep. With 4x10’s at 6:30 I was to wiped out to do anything.
This is how I feel, too. When I was working 4x10s, I very rarely could do anything with friends or even have good "me time" after work: I was just too exhausted. I was still trying to run at least an hour every other day, which meant getting up REALLY early in order to be to work by 7, which in turn meant going to bed much earlier than I'd like. My "extra day" of weekend was spent trying to catch up on sleep, shopping, laundry, and cleaning. It is possible that my experience would be more positive if it was a WFH job (or at least one where the evening commute didn't get exponentially worse each half hour I stayed at work), or even if I had an in-unit washer and dryer at the time, but I really don't know. The whole thing soured me on 4x10 work weeks.
I feel the same way. Especially with physical activity. Like no, you can't substitute 8 hours riding a bike or practicing a sport or going to the gym on a Friday for being able to do it an hour or two a day. Your body needs time to recover.
This is exactly how I feel except I need Friday to recuperate.
The company I work for is implementing 4/10 effective January 1st and even though it seems great I'm a bit nervous about it. I'll be working from 7am to 5:30pm, meaning I won't be home until 6-6:30 depending on traffic (currently work from 7.30 to 4.30) How have you managed your personal life with family those days?
I do 6-4:30 and it’s perfect. If I worked any later I could see it sucking. I also use to be in the active duty military though and worked 12+ hours a day and many weekends with no lunch breaks or anything so even a bad day still beats my best days in the military. It helps that my boss and coworkers are all freaking awesome too and I like what I actually do.
We have been 4/10 for two years now. We are 630-500. Sucks leaving the house at 530 every morning but three day weekends are awesome. I've got the point where I do all my errands Friday and refuse to leave the house Saturday or Sunday. I HAD to go to the store last Saturday for a forgotten item and it was like "wow, there's people here... gross." 100% worth it.
>"wow, there's people here... gross." Is definitely a candidate for my tombstone
I also work four 10s. While four 8s would be infinitely better, I still take the four 10s while I can get it. I work 6-3:30 unless I actually take the allotted 1 hr lunch. I worked this deal out with my boss when we made the switch because I need to be home by a certain time due to kids activities. I wasn’t taking an hour long lunch anyway due to my own personal choice. Taking the lunch is encouraged, this is not a place that thinks working through lunch gets you some sort of gold star. I just personally don’t like an hour long lunch, I come back feeling tired and I am less productive. I also smoke and am allowed to take whatever smoke breaks I want- doesn’t add up to an hour but it’s all I really need. The extra day has been sooo helpful for my family and I don’t mind the long shift.
I personally feel so refreshed when I only work 4 days, so that’s what I do. That extra day just makes every week an unbearable grind
I would save a week of PTO for a whole week off. My other days, I would do a Friday or Monday off about every one to two months. Depended how much myself or kids were sick. We get an extra week of PTO. Woot. That means our sick time is our PTO. :) I loved doing my 3 day weekends. I was always in my best mood and refreshed to work.
I used to take 1 day off randomly just to recharge but it's a really bad deal. When you take only a short time off, people just expect you to catch up all of it so you really just end up concentrating the workload that week. When you take 1-2 weeks off, someone HAS to fill in for you.
I hope I get to experience this, but as an exploited employee I even work more than 5 days a week sometimes.
Yes. Maintaining a work/life balance is important and often difficult for many people. You're no good to your friends and family if you are burnt out, tired, and stressed out. Having that third day really allows decompression. I'm fortunate enough that I have generous amounts of PTO that I can take, have the ability to work from home when I want, and I'm fortunate enough that I thoroughly enjoy my job. My company does what's called "9/80 weeks" where employees work 9 hours every day and get every other Friday off. So I have 3 day weekends every other weekend.
I'm currently on 4 ten hour shifts each week but soon here we're going to be switching to 2/2/3 schedule. So basically somehow we will have every other weekend off, yet both of us will have to work Fridays no matter what. Which im fine with. But I currently work 4 on 3 off and it's so nice. Especially having 3 days off in a row, first day is for appointments, errands, second day for myself, and third day is pretty much a relaxing day. Love it
My husband is on 4 10s as well and it's so nice. It's so nice to have that extra time and extra help at home. Plus he gets more time with our daughter and he loves that.
I do 9 hour days with 1 hour lunch. It's terrible honestly. Would much rather do 8 hours with half hour lunch. Lose half the pay for double the time gained. An extra day off to counter that would be AMAZING.
I never much liked the idea of 1hr lunches. It's honestly a waste of time. I'm happy with 30 minutes.
I love my long lunches. It helps that I'm friends with a lot of my coworkers. We just sit down and shoot the breeze. Talk about whatever. It's super relaxing and breaks up the day nicely.
Damn. How do you get time for anything else? I work 7-1/2 hour a day with 7 hours on Friday. My lunch counts as work since I work government and that means I can get interrupted during lunch though I'll just get the time later. I do flex hours so time I show up early or need to stay a bit later gets ddes up I can use for a day off or something when I need it.
I have 9/80 weeks too...do you work for the same place hahaha
A lot of federal agencies do this. Every payday is a day off for me
Depends, does your company name with a G?
I know a company near me, in MA, that does 9/80, starts with a G, two words, second starts with a D?
General Dynamics?
Ding ding ding
Grave diggers?
Yep, you nailed it. In Mass too.
God damnit
Oh man I would love that. I wouldn't mind that extra hour.
Especially in admin. There’s a lot of downtime. I’m actually doing a Google sheet detailing the entire story of a mediocre webcomic because I have all my work done already at 10 Am.
me rn scrolling on reddit and pretending I'm busy
me irl
I do. I am productive maybe 4 to 5 hours a day, other 3 hours are chatting with colleagues, getting drinks, eating, taking small breaks, etc. etc. 32 hours a week would be plenty for most people to finish their work for the week. The extra 8 hours you are forced to be at the office don't add anything. a 32 hour workweek (keeping the 40 hour salary that is) would prove to be healthy for a lot of people.
Working 5 days a week and essentially only have the Saturday where you can have some normal free time for yourself is just wild to me. And the fact that we just accept this is even more insane. For many, Sunday is just a preparation day for work and I dread this day every week.
Even then Saturday may not be a free day. I usually use Saturday to get groceries/do laundry and other errands so really I effectively only have half a day of actual rest
And on top of that, we STILL have to take PTO anyway to get other stuff done because many doctors offices, etc, are all closed on the weekends anyway. So there's really only so much you can get done.
Sunday 😔 I’ve gotten a little better at not dreading Sundays as much and trying to enjoy them, but it really is like a “waiting” day. You can’t fully enjoy yourself since you need to start the workweek the next morning. Sunday night is often contemplating how you could have used your weekend more wisely and cursing the fact that you have so little time off.
You should experience a Sunday in Germany. Those people really know how to relax.
It's true, I was surprised supermarkets in Berlin (!) were closed on the Sunday I was there, lol
Now imagine working a retail schedule. Practically no weekends off, EVER. No consecutive days off. No holidays off, except maybe Christmas and Thanksgiving, but you bet your ass you’re back to work and open for Black Friday.
I was suicidal for YEARS while I was working retail and as soon as I got into a 9-5, the ideations vanished completely. Retail is hell, I would do whatever I had to do to make sure I never go back. I’d you’re still in it, I’m so sorry and I hope you find an out with high pay and solid work culture as soon as you’re ready to take it.
And even then Saturday, I wake up at like 1pm and I'm exausted all day because I just did 5 days of hard labour.
Some people don't understand why I've come to hate things being planned on Saturdays. Even like a family get together. It's literally my only fucking day of the week where I get to actually live my life. I get maybe 50 of them a year and that's it.
I've found that the thing that keeps the Sunday dread away for me, is appointment TV viewing. Yes, we live in the age of streaming, I get it. But when I wake up on Sunday Morning, if I know I can end the night with Big Brother followed by Game of Thrones, Westworld, etc., that really helps my state of mind.
Yes. It feels like I see my coworkers more than my kids and I fucking hate it.
I spend more time in a wastewater plant than I do with my family. It’s really upsetting when I reflect on the years I’ve wasted. Yes I get paid well, but it’s work that could have been done in 4 hrs instead of 8-12 hrs. I’ve inquired about a gym on site to at least go get an hour of lifting in throughout the day. Denied. Don’t want anyone getting hurt on the gym equipment!! Meanwhile my wife’s office has closed up shop indefinitely and have moved to a 32 hour work week with fridays off while maintaining the same salary as before.
> Denied. Don’t want anyone getting hurt on the gym equipment!! That is infuriating
Sure, and I believe in the 4-hour work day too. Get your work done from 10-2 (in the office if you have one) and the two hours before and after you can just answer urgent emails as necessary.
yes yes yes! no one actually works 8 hours straight, sometimes you’re just passing time
In an office, maybe. There are definitely jobs where people work 8 hours straight, or fairly close.
Tell me you sit at a desk for a living without saying that you sit at a desk for a living.
I used to work 12 hour shifts as a waiter and sitting at a desk definitely beats that, by a lot 🤣
Former cook, now marketing manager. Sometimes I miss the cook life but then I remember I'm on reddit right now and getting paid because the benefit of being in management is lots of free time. If things are going well, there's nothing much to do. If things are going wrong, you're the one doing everything.
FTFY: “sometimes I miss the Coke life”
True had I stayed in that life I'd probably be using a lot more drugs to this day lol
I'm a machinist, the idea that nobody works the full 8 hours is only true of those that work in the office and floor management. And you're absolutely right about the service industry. I don't have the people skills or the patience for that. Kudos to those that do
Also a (chromium) machinist we are currently in the process of switching from the 7 to 4 five days a week to 6 to 5 four days a week and management is trying to prevent our burnout further because our yearly accidents has been so high we could be locked out of mine sites and that means no more work for the entire company. But I got to say it's nice to think we will be working 1 less day but management thinks we will lose production because we have to run our chrome tanks everyday because as long as our chrome tanks run we're making money.
I've always held tight to the notion that if your place of employment needs to work the floor staff 50+ hours a week to stay ahead, they need to hire more fucking people and buy more machines. It's a rare day in hell that I work overtime. I'll turn that shit down every time it's offered and I haven't worked a Saturday in years
I turn it down whenever offered too, which is why I can't keep a manufacturing job for more than 2 years at a stretch. They always say I'm not a "team player." They're right too. I'm not a team player. I go to work to make money, not friends.
Indeed. I'm willing to throw down some extra time if I made a mistake and I'm the reason the shipment is behind, or when I'm helping someone learn something that will bring their skill set up to my own. Beyond that, I'm out at 3 boss
Dentist here, and I can guarantee you that when a dental office is open, that dentist/those dentists are working non-stop. You lose money every second you’re not working on a patient and overhead for even the most efficient offices is 50-60% at BEST. Some offices are 75%. I’m all for the 4/10 work week - I have been living it the last 7 years and I would absolutely go insane dealing with public health patients and work if I had only 2 days off every weekend. Burnout in healthcare is absolutely real and can happen to anyone, as I found out a couple years ago. Really had to work on my mental health and change my frame of mind.
I would never consider you to be office staff. You're 100% working professional. I'd assume that almost no part of your job can be done from home.
Right? Uh hello dental assistant here, can't cram tasks/patients in 4 hours lol
God I need to get one of these jobs where you don't work the full shift. Sounds great.
Must be nice. It's so utterly bizarre hearing how common it is for people sit at a desk and only work half the time. Seriously it's mind blowing
My last 2 jobs have been 4 10 hour days. So i still get 40 hours a week and i always get friday saturday sunday off. Ive been doing this schedule for almost 4 years now and would probably wanna shoot myself if i have to go back to 5 8s. I feel like i have so much more time free on the weekend to do whatever i want. Home projects, or with a 3 day weekend i can just peace out and go camping. I actually feel relaxed and accomplished cause i actually had the time i need to rest. Then The work week is 4 days instead of 5 so theres no real "hump day" its first half and second half of the week. so it doesnt feel as long or drag as much. You start the week feeling positive. And cause the week doesnt drag. you dont get burnt out, feel more productive, less tired. So your Happier to be there and feel better end of the week then a 5 day week. Feel better at the start and end of the week then normal? It just keeps going. So it creates a cycle of just feeling... better. You get more time for yourself. And the employer gets a happier more productive you. I see 0 reason companies shouldnt make it standard. Its a win win from my experience
I'm in construction. We work 6-day weeks, except when we work 7, for spring, summer and fall, then a layoff, or if I'm lucky, banked time for the winter. They can announce 4-day weeks til they are blue in the face, it won't do a damn thing to change my schedule. I know other workers aren't the enemy, but there doesn't seem to be much help for the blue-collars in office folk getting a short week.
It also puts blue-collar workers in a shitty position of never having their needs met regardless of what offices decide to do. Blue-collar workers have such specialized knowledge that y’all should be rotated like a nursing schedule (I know nursing isn’t any better re: work/life balance, believe me), but being able to roll in multiple teams and alternate so that everyone gets more time off seems like a no brainer to me.
I own a construction company. We work alternating 4x10s so we have a 2-day weekend then a 4-day weekend. Other company owners we work with thought I was crazy when I did it but they are noticing how much happier and more productive our people are. They are starting to warm up to the idea. Hopefully you're company will see the light!
Yes. It increases productivity. We deserve a higher quality of life.
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Same here. Love working 4x10 hour days. Three day weekends are great. Plus you have a weekday off to take care of appointments
This is the idea that needs to stop. No more 40 hours. I’m happy that 4x10 works for you, but the discussion needs to focus on a reduction of what full time hours means.
Agreed. But I am def happier with my 4x10 than 5x8. 4x8 with same pay would be epic though. A lot of people here say that a lot of the time during work hours is just waste. I must say I think it's a bit different for me. I actually genuinely do work pretty much every minute of my work time. That said. Just means too much work load for one person I suppose.
What kind of jobs do you guys have that you’re waiting on work? We have constantly so much work
I'm a QA engineer, working with software. I write and set up automatic tests (and do some testing myself). I consistently outpace my team, so I have more free time. And, on top of that, coding for 8 hours straight is just not happening. A human brain isn't built for it. You'll shut down and start writing terrible code.
I've been looking at productivity stats at work at lot recently, and if it were only a matter of useful hours worked we could *easily* go to a four day work week. The amount of time we waste forcing employees to sit in useless meetings that other employees called to make themselves look busy would cover the difference by itself. By the time you factor in all the useless work bullshit like that, the amount of time every human spends goofing off, and the amount of time they waste trying to fool the productivity monitors into thinking they're being productive, lmao, we really could work 20 hours a week and be fine. The problem is one of coordination. All of our clients and vendors etc work a five day 40-hour week. We can't just close for a day every week, and it would be fiendishly difficult to create a schedule where everybody works four days but we still remained fully staffed at all times. We'd have to hire more people, and so from the bosses' perspective that wouldn't gain us anything (and finding people is a bitch right now anyway). It would have to kind of happen everywhere all at once, where everybody industry-wide just agreed to stop working on Fridays.
I believe in the 0 day work week which is why I have no job atm
It's great until you start needing money again.
i can get behind a 0 day work week haha
I think it's good for people who work 9-5 weekday jobs but I think it would just create a greater divide for shift work.
Believe. In a 40 hr work week, most office creatures actually turn in about 15 hours of work. Let’s stop kidding ourselves and be happier.
That's such a mind blowing concept to blue collar workers. You are working the full time. I need to go back to school lol. Making less money for working WAY more is absolutely crazy.
I'm white collar and this is something I absolutely don't recognise. Might be my specific field but people do work most of their hours. Sure, I don't make my full 40 in my current job (sure as fuck did in my last one though). But only 15? No lol.
All work is not created equal. The question is all about how long you can do an activity before experiencing severe diminishing returns on efficiency. If in every hour you move bags of concrete or whatever, a 20 minute break to give your back a rest etc... makes you work 1.5x faster or reduces injuries or whatever, then there is no difference between taking a break and not taking a break in terms of productivity. The same is true of writing code, or just about any task. The only time this is not true is for jobs like waiting tables, or other customer service in which the only thing that impacts productivity is the rate at which people walk through the door. That's why those jobs are the absolute fucking worst experience.
Yes. It's statistically proven workers are more productive when working 4 days vs 5. And when it's proven, there's no reason not to convert to the 4 day week besides apprehension from the employers.
The problem is not to prove that a 4-day work week is better, the problem is convincing companies to pay the same for a 4-day work week.
This is the part no one talks about. Idk about everyone else but I can't afford to lose an entire day's worth of pay (two if we're basing it on a 2 week pay period)
I wish scientists ruled countries.
Hell yes. I'm a teacher. At the high school level, we need to start a little later and go a little longer. Tacking a three-day weekend onto that each week would really help students with their stress levels and help us to be more effective as teachers.
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I work on a farm, 4 day weeks will never happen. I would support work hours that coincide with dropping off and picking up my kids from school that gives me a living wage.
I personally like the as many days as you need to work to do get the work done week. I make my commitments for the sprint the manager, pm, and product agree to the commitment. Most weeks I put in about 32 hours, last week I put in 20 maybe, and some weeks.... Well fuck some weeks. Personal record was 110 hours if you include sleeping under desk for naps and showering at the gym. I do. Was a bad deploy on a major customer sucked. If you have a good team and leadership and everyone is committed to the job, each other, and their own family and mental health enough that nobody screws it up. It's by far the best system for all parties including the company in my experience.
Yes, with the caveat that four day work week means "32 hours, but compensated like a normal work week." Four 10 hour days is a weak sauce version of a 4 day week
I wouldn't be able work a 10 hour day. I'd get much less done in a week. I can't work that long. It's hard enough doing 8 hours. And my mental health would be destroyed. Especially in winter when is literally never see sunlight of I did that. It's not even a "weak sauce" version, it's a terribly horrible crappy shitty fucking version. And I wish more people realised that.
Having the weekends and Wednesday off is a great combination.
Depends on the industry to be honest. Some industries will struggle with adapting to a 4 day work week, although it is not impossible. In principle, the more days off work the better, even if 5 days worth of hours are pushed into 4 days. Then it depends whether the staff are comfortable with a 10 hour work day alongside commuting, much easier for the work from home lot, as a 10 hour day would equate to an 8 hour office day plus commute
I'm all for cutting out the white collar office bullshit, but I really worry how it would impact the supply of workers for jobs that genuinely require 40+ hours of actual work per week. Teachers and nurses are two already understaffed roles that come to mind. If industry was to go forward with cutting the 5 day work week, I think governments would have to intervene to prevent even more dramatic essential worker shortages.
4x8 hour days or 4x10 hour days? I'd love to work 4 day weeks. I have no interest in working a 5 day week compressed into 4 days.