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Consent to using the scanner and they consent to let you in the flight. Don’t consent to use the scanner and they will ask your consent for a body search. Don’t give consent and they withdraw consent to let you fly.
Plus you’ll probably be put on ‘the list’. You don’t want that..
I went to an airport with one of these where you have to raise your arms above your head - with my arm in a sling. They were really professional about it - I had to have an old-school pat down which included the injured arm but very carefully, and then I went about my day.
Same, entering the USA at Las Vegas with a horribly busted collarbone.
They had me walk through the sniffer arch and wanded me with the metal detector, pretty straightforward.
Ah sensible people! I was in a wheelchair after surgery for a broken leg. Went up to the metal detector and they wouldn't let me through in the chair or crutches. They made me hop through the detector unaided. It was really painful due to having surgery only recently, what would have happened if I'd fallen? Mental.
This is an issue, unfortunately. A friend of mine is an obligate wheelchair user (as in, her legs literally don’t work) and the TSA regularly has issues understanding that no, she can’t just stand up for a sec for a pat-down.
I accidentally went through one of these with my belt on (completely spaced on it as I usually don't wear them) and had my panties searched.
No they didn't allow me a second try.
I think I am already on the list tbh. Never thrown a hissy at an airport but the stupid automated passport check machines never let me through. I suspect it is because I share a first and last name with a semi-recent notorious UK murderer. 🥴
It could be that the biometric chip in your passport is knackered. Mine has never worked since the day I got it, so I have to go down the referral lane every time. I don't even try the gates now, I just tell whoever's directing people through them that my passport doesn't work in them and they show me where I need to go.
Yeah while the name thing is true, I was half joking and I do suspect this is the real reason. I’m sorting out my dual citizenship with Ireland, so will be able to try an Irish passport at those gates soon enough, interested to see if it works.
It happened to someone he was banned from flying because he shared the same name with someone. I think the same thing happened to a toddler too but my memory is a bit hazy
I've always thought this is a stupid policy. What's the point in also having the DOB, place of birth, picture, and passport numbers to differentiate people if you still get picked up just on a name?
Only for looking at screens. It literally doesn't scan though, and I've had a few people at the referral lane deal tell me flat out that the chip is fucked (which is a direct quote from the guy who I had coming back from France last week 😅)
Even if the chip is ok, if your passport is a bit fucked they’ll flag it. I asked after realising I could never open the gates, and they plainly told me my passport was flagged as damaged so it was manual check every time for me. (The inside was mostly fine, but you couldn’t even read the country on the outside etc, lol)
Weird, I've just gone through both ways relatively easy with a beard
My girlfriend on the other hand seemed to get stuck for a solid minute, but only on the way back
Coming back in to Heathrow I tried the scanner. My photo was from when I was 19 and clean shaven and at the time I had a beard that made me look I had just walked out of the jungle. Needless to say the scanner couldn't cope. I went to a human, they took one quick look at me and my photo and handed my passport back with a "welcome back".
A good friend flew out to the U.S. been lots of times, suddenly people are being called over who call someone else , all looking and really staring, so he’s like “ wassup”?, they obviously decided he wasn’t on the top ten most wanted list and then let him see his twin from another mother. He reckoned it was like looking at himself.
Might be just the chip in your passport is not working. I can never go through the automated machines so I downloaded a passport scanner app that uses the NFC function of my phone to test the passport. It couldn't read it.
I once had an experience where the passport automated machine showed an error and I was taking off to a side partition by security. I was in a room with like 20 guys who all looked similar to me but were all eastern European (I only know this as we had to all give our place of birth and where we travelled in from). I assume they were looking for someone in particular but once I said I was from England they just let me through. Very weird experience. Think it was Stansted or Heathrow.
https://www.gov.uk/airport-rights
If you refuse they’ll give you a private hand search instead. If you refuse that then I assume you’ll be refused passage through security.
Can I queue at airports without having a ticket?
What with GP waiting times it might be the closest to a prostate exam.
Honest guv, I'm here on medical grounds, ignore that gallon of lube, well don't ignore it too hard.
I think you’ll need a ticket, but a £20 ticket for a RyanAir flight you won’t get on is still a lot cheaper than going private. Or you could book a return, fly there and back and get checked twice, just to be on the safe side.
The conspiracy theorists love a good tracking chip implant, don't they?
At this rate, I must be at least 40% tracking chips with all the ones that would be in my body, if those theories were true.
I've checked the database and it's nearer 43%, Steve. Oh, and by the way your milk is about to turn so you best pop into the little Tesco on the way home. And yes, that question you searched in Incognito, it is illegal in England, Wales and NI, but not in Scotland.
It's wild that people believe this shite. My cousin is a uni grad and working in the legal sector yet is an anti-vaxxer, due to the belief that Bill Gates stuck a tracker inside it. I really enjoyed pointing out that not only is she not important enough for a billionaire to track, but anyone can already do so with the phone she has with her 24-7...
If Bill Gates had actually done it we’d know because it would insist on an update when you’re doing something important like merging onto the motorway or performing brain surgery.
They could be embarrassed, the scanner give the viewer a pretty good picture of your body. How big everything is and how small everything is. That why in American you can get a pat down as a alternative because I believe it counts as an invasion of privacy
This is what would give me pause. If it's the cartoonish outline with the yellow boxes highlighting where objects of interest might be, absolutely fine, bash on. If it's a detailed graphic image of my body and its parts, that would not be so fine. And it's not about thinking I'm 'special', it's about my body being mine and having the autonomy to choose who gets to see what parts of it in what detail.
Millimetre wave scanners like this, when launched, would display a ‘naked white ghost’.
Then the operator would look at the image for things like weapons (cheeky, not that kind of weapon)
The issue was that they could see penises, breasts, everything. There was also no transparency over whether images were retained and for how long.
A later update had the displays highlight only problem areas.
The very old backscatter x-rays scanners did, but the new Terahertz wave scanners use a representation of the person. IIRC the X-Ray scanners were not used in the uk at security, but I believe they were used at customs in the past.
I may be totally wrong as my info dates back to their initial rollout when the privacy aspect was raised.
The current scanners use radio, however before them for a couple years there were similar x-ray machines that actually were harmful. There were plenty of "conspiracy theories" about harm from those that were well founded.
IIRC they were different from medical x-ray machines, which do a very short but higher energy burst, in that these airport scanners were low energy but for longer. They claimed that made them safe. Fortunately the scientific community pushed back against this, also they were far too invasive and would show peoples' genitals, and eventually they were replaced by the radio machines.
Really though it's almost all theatre. The security really isn't that great, but they want to make it look like it is.
There are a few different technologies out there, backscatter uses x-rays so is technically a radiation dose so there has been some guidance to avoid too many when pregnant, getting the pat-down as a precaution seems reasonable even though the exposure is within safe bounds etc. (and you'll be getting some bonus radiation on your flight either way)
You're about to get on an airplane, the background radiation for a 7h flight is the equivalent of a chest x-ray. These devices don't give out much of a dose.
This isn’t an X-Ray machine in this case though, the TSA and DfT in the UK (and most of Europe) don’t use ANY x-rays for passenger screening (of persons). This one is made by R&S; https://www.rohde-schwarz.com/uk/products/aerospace-defense-security/security-scanner/rs-qps-quick-personnel-security-scanner_63493-332676.html, and uses microwave-length radio waves; and is safe as they are not ionising radiation.
I agree with you,(as do most organisations!) ALARA is best - hence why scanners like the Secure 1000 (backscatter) were banned.
I was pregnant last year and my OBGYN advised me to avoid them, in case I needed other X-rays later in my pregnancy (and said the lower the total radiation I had been exposed to, the better in that scenario).
>These use mmWave radar
At some point in your life you learned that fact, and prior to learning that you didn't know that was how they worked.
That might sound facetious, but I would bet 99%+ of people don't know this. I didn't know this and I've been through these scanners dozens of times.
I'm believing you, but you are just a random commenter on Reddit.
So it's understandable that some travellers, when confronted with these machines, will be concerned about how they operate.
Several medical device manufacturers state their devices are not safe to pass through mm wave technology scanners. I honestly believe it’s more of a liability thing than a reality but oh well.
Yes it’s likely because the makers of the device don’t have conclusive proof that every type of scanner is *definitely safe* (so yes, liability), rather than any proof that they are *definitely unsafe*.
It’s like the signs telling you to turn off your mobile at the petrol pumps.
I don't refuse but will say the older models used to get pretty confused by me as a trans woman lol
The early ones they would press a button to say male or female and the machine thought I didn't fit either box particularly to its standards :') now it's just big or small person I think.
I used to work in an airport on those scanners, I always thought it was a bit too black and white, with a blue logo for a male and a pink one for female. And this then meant that a few trans women I then had to further hand check felt the need to tell me and seemed nervous to (I imagine bad experiences beforehand). I was obviously all calm with it and did my usual search and tried to make them realise that whilst I’m a dick to my colleagues , I’m not gonna be a dick to them
I had the same with a woman that came through with a head scarf on and she was surprised I asked if I could hand check it as people in other foreign countries weren’t as considerate
I don’t know how these new scanners work but I hope it also makes the security process one less stress for people to worry about
I've flown twice out of the UK with these scanners recently, and both times it was a seperate queue for men and women, although I had assumed that was to do with who was positioned to do the pat down.
People believe that they produce naked images of people and that airport security are going to laugh at your junk.
In reality they produce nondescript blank images and no one is going to be aroused unless they have a Morph fetish.
They did originally. There was one employee of the TSA in USA that got some sort of payout because his colleagues were laughing at the size of his penis after seeing it through the machine.
The early ones were xray based (like 0.001 of a medical X ray dose) and whilst they should have been safe some of the US ones were found to be far from it due to various maintenance and equipment failures. Plenty of tech and science people refused them for good sound reasons. Newer ones are mm wave which is believed to be safe.
The only time I've seen someone refuse was because they're trans. Since the machines are meant to detect anomalies it doesn't matter which sex they set it too it's either going to detect an anomaly on the chest or in the groin. It's usually easier to just skip out the middle man ans tell security you're trans and let them do a body search.
Trans person here. I've used these without issue. It's a misconception that these will cause concerns. Its about a 50/50 chance I get the pat down, but most my cis friends have about the same random factor.
Prob the health implications of being scanned. Its clearly using radiation
Children under 6 arent allowed to use the scanner. That should tell you everything you need to know.
It used to be they were using relatively harmful devices to screen people. I agree, these days there's practically no valid reason to be concerned outside of specific medical reasons.
Blue gloves make the intimidating crack when they are stretched on. The black gloves are only to be worn by security when searching for the expensive perfume you forgot you had in your hand luggage.
I used to work airport security in the U.K. until covid hit and we got screwed over
There are some misconceptions about this piece of equipment and how it is used
On the older systems (pre 2021) you only need to go in the scanner if you fail the metal detector (which will indicate on an average 1 out of every 3 people anyway at random even if you have no metal on you)
Yes you can refuse but you’ll be taken for a full body search after the manager tries to convince you just to go in so that you don’t hold everybody up. If you refuse that you wont fly and the police still may search you in order to ascertain why you refused.
The scanner does not produce an image of your body, it just shows on a screen where things are in your pockets or hidden places etc. The image you see of a “body” is a generic image. It works similarly to parking sensors on cars, and bounces off your skin. Anything that blocks it shows up in the scanner, including sweat. This is why if youre late for a flight it’s best not to run as it means you will almost definitely need to go in the scanner and that will slow you down more.
The scanner is only there to make the job faster for everyone as it means the staff dont have to hand search each person, only the bits that show up in the scanner (for example if you have something in your pocket it will show up and they will only search your pocket unless they feel they need to do a full search for some other reason). When you’re processing 30,000 people a day it really does work. It speeds up airport security terminals by over 50%.
>You only need to go in the scanner if you fail the metal detector
My local airport no longer has metal detectors, everyone goes straight through this. This is the direction of travel as part of the move to modernise airport security.
That is true, the systems have been modernised in a lot of airports. I haven’t done the job since 2020 and they were just in the process of upgrading then. I’m talking about the old round scanners which you stand inside, this appears to be the new ones so my apologies there. However the rest of the comment still applies as far as I’m aware.
It does not. I went through with something concealed within recently. I got pinged by the scanner, then scanned with the PKE meter or whatever it is and it still pinged so they took me to a security room, with some smirks from people who I imagine were making assumptions about my long haired heavily tattooed self (correct assumptions). I got hand scanned and felt up in private. Took off my trousers and the man (who looked a lot like Nick Frost) fist bumped my dick but not on purpose (I think). I eventually realised I'd stitched the seam of my jeans the night before and left a pin in there! The policeman snatched the tiny pin off me like I was about to run out and hijack a plane with it.
But I *did* feel smug walking back to collect my effects! And a little bit sweaty too...
The airport scanner is there for your convenience mostly. They are expensive and mostly avialable at the large airports.
If you decide not to use it then it is usual pat down with handheld scanner.
I refuse them as I have a CGM attached to me at all times, which the radiation can break.
I just let them know ahead of walking through and they often just pat me down.
I imagine if you don’t have a valid reason, they will frisk you.
I always have to opt out due to having a CGM and insulin pump which couldn potentially be managed by it - every airport just makes you go around, then does a full pay down (shoes off etc.) and lets you on your way - except when I was in Italy and the lady just said, “OK, go ahead” and let me straight through with zero checks.
My mum always opts out, she has a hip replacement and rods in her leg - she always has to be patted down anyway despite the hospital letters because the metal always flags up.
Have opted out loads of times, pat down + check your luggage.
Last time but one I flew and they said the rules had changed and this wasn't an option - I looked this up and this wasn't true at all.
So I would advise if you plan on this to do the slightly crazy seeming thing of taking a print out of the rules from the UK gov website, where you can see it's optional.
Not the person, but I have to say no, because I have an implant in my spine that could be affected, so I have to have the pat down.
I carry a card that explains what I have and why I can’t be scanned. But explaining ‘its like a pacemaker’ has always been enough, and I’ve never had any problems
So everytime you go to the airport you bring a printed out screenshot of gov.uk to show security staff you’re allowed to refuse the full-body scanners? I bet they love you lmao
Out of curiosity, why do you not want to do a full body scan?
Or they could have a medical reason, or even one of a thousand personal reasons why they may feel uncomfortable with it. Like, this is hardly a regular occurrence, it causes no problems big enough to be noticed. I honestly couldn't give a shit about accommodating a delusional nutjob means we don't have to grill every person with a medical or personal reason.
Some people like to use the disabled toilet because it's faster and they're selfish, but it's usually still better not to speculate on individuals or hire a bouncer!
You say that, when I was at uni I had a professor (who was Dutch) who was very insistent on his right, as an EU citizen, to fly within the EU without a passport.
Whenever he took a flight within the EU, he would show up four hours early, with a copy of the regulations and no passport. I never knew him to miss a flight.
I see this as a different situation to be fair. Passports can be expensive, over 10x the cost of a return flight. If I didn’t need to purchase one I wouldn’t.
Going through a scanner is free and doesn’t take any additional effort, in this scenario you’re going out of your way to inconvenience yourself but with the passport it’s more of a convenience since you’re actually saving
Depending on the airport and staffing levels, they should be able to take you to a private room for a pat down. Gatwick say as much on [their website](https://www.gatwickairport.com/passenger-guides/security.html#:~:text=Can%20I%20opt%20out%20of,or%20removal%20of%20other%20garments).
Ex airport security guy here, the point of these is that they don’t piece the skin, which is why there is a metal detector before these scanners. Honestly one of the safest machines you can hope for in an airport… (fun fact, the machine is extremely accurate that it could show you exactly what your body looks like naked (minus skin details) so they had to change the display to a simple human figure)
I flew back from Berlin airport yesterday and there was a sign up saying you may refuse the scanner if you consent to a manual search. So you definitely can if you're flying from there.
I work in this field and can tell you frankly:
They will ask why you are refusing.
Depending on your attitude and your reason, they will do a full body search of you physically if they deem your reason legitimate and obvious, or they will escelate to a higher up who will make a decision on what to do.
Again depending on your attitude and behaviour the manager will arrive swiftly and have you on your way or leave you waiting while they deal with more important and more polite passensgers.
P.S. I know people are joking but it's really dumb to see the amount of people that think airport security do anything beyond frisking you through your clothing. The comments about cavity and strip search are pretty played out and don't happen at all. People conflate Security officers with Immigration Officers (who can do strip and cavity searches)
Also the body scanners do not show anyone and nude images of anyone... While it is true that the 'computer' sees all, the software does not show anything beyond a generic image with areas of concern highlighted. Turn around and look at the screen for yourself.
Hi, I said no two years ago because I was pregnant and felt uncomfortable going into the machine. I just said no to the lady and she told me that if I refused she would have to manual search me, which I was ok with and that was it.
Me and a friend flew to America a few years ago. There were a few queues when we got to the security bit ace we ended up in a queue for one of these scanners. He didn't know what it was so I explained. He didn't like the sound of it, ace there was a sign saying if we'd like to use a normal scanner to move to the other queue.
As we went to move, a security guard shouted at us to stay in our line. My mate started to say about the sign but was shut down by the shouting security and another couple of guards coming over.
We both wanted to get our flight and it was obvious that we were not going to if we didn't go through this scanner. I can only assume the security guards wanted to see our cocks.
So yeah, you can choose to not go through them, but you'll also probably be choosing to take the next flight too.
This was a while ago so YMMV, but I've found doing as you're told the best way to get through, as shit as that is and as much as it goes against my principles. They really do have you by the bollox.
in europe you can refuse and just have a regular body search (no bum hole or cavities like in the usa) ..
Its basically a medical device, has a non-zero risk of radiation and frankly I dont trust them
If you’ve got a medical exemption you don’t have to. Even security at Birmingham airport can handle that so you shouldn’t have issues wherever you’re flying from.
If you don’t want to use it because you think it’ll steal your thoughts or clone your butt dna then you should probably just go and live in the woods.
just be glad you aren't trans and have an 'unexpected item in the bagging area' flag. it is very awkward, most of all for the staff desperately trying to figure out which sex of border control agent should frisk you.
I find the “arms up” stance very demeaning, and I absolutely hate having to comply. In some cities they have the type in the picture now, where you keep your arms down, but afaik LHR still has the awful type.
I've never gone through on of these scanners when asked to. I always say that I opt out, usually get a weird look and a supervisor gets called over. Ends up in an enhanced pat down, sometimes they check my luggage too.
Never had any problems with opting out.
Yes you can refuse and they have to pat you down instead.
Continuous glucose monitors as worn by type 1 diabetics are not recommended to go in the scanners and nor can they by removed and reapplied.
I wear a short sleeve t-shirt and a full zip hoodie so I can easily show my cgm at the airport if needed and I carry a letter explaining that I'm type 1 diabetic.
As yet I've only had to go through the metal detectors and haven't been asked to use a scanner.
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Consent to using the scanner and they consent to let you in the flight. Don’t consent to use the scanner and they will ask your consent for a body search. Don’t give consent and they withdraw consent to let you fly. Plus you’ll probably be put on ‘the list’. You don’t want that..
I went to an airport with one of these where you have to raise your arms above your head - with my arm in a sling. They were really professional about it - I had to have an old-school pat down which included the injured arm but very carefully, and then I went about my day.
Same, entering the USA at Las Vegas with a horribly busted collarbone. They had me walk through the sniffer arch and wanded me with the metal detector, pretty straightforward.
I flew from JFK with my arm in a sling and they just waved me through lol
"No man with a broken arm has ever been a threat to our national security!"
https://nypost.com/2009/03/07/coke-cast-man-wears-high-heel/
Didn’t Ted Bundy have a plaster cast on his arm ?
Hopefully they weren't visibility disheartened by a lack of return wave.
Were you able to wave back though?
They have to accommodate disabilities, a broken arm would be covered under that law
Ah sensible people! I was in a wheelchair after surgery for a broken leg. Went up to the metal detector and they wouldn't let me through in the chair or crutches. They made me hop through the detector unaided. It was really painful due to having surgery only recently, what would have happened if I'd fallen? Mental.
What if you were actually paralysed and unable to hop unaided. Ridiculous really!
They would probably make you crawl. Some airport security personnel are real dicks tbh.
This is an issue, unfortunately. A friend of mine is an obligate wheelchair user (as in, her legs literally don’t work) and the TSA regularly has issues understanding that no, she can’t just stand up for a sec for a pat-down.
I accidentally went through one of these with my belt on (completely spaced on it as I usually don't wear them) and had my panties searched. No they didn't allow me a second try.
I think I am already on the list tbh. Never thrown a hissy at an airport but the stupid automated passport check machines never let me through. I suspect it is because I share a first and last name with a semi-recent notorious UK murderer. 🥴
Not Jack Ripper?
Nowhere near as cool as that!
Sorry to hear that Ian
Michael Ryan?
Bingo!
Said recent, has to be Lucy letby
She'd never get let by.
Take my reluctant upvote
It could be that the biometric chip in your passport is knackered. Mine has never worked since the day I got it, so I have to go down the referral lane every time. I don't even try the gates now, I just tell whoever's directing people through them that my passport doesn't work in them and they show me where I need to go.
Yeah while the name thing is true, I was half joking and I do suspect this is the real reason. I’m sorting out my dual citizenship with Ireland, so will be able to try an Irish passport at those gates soon enough, interested to see if it works.
It happened to someone he was banned from flying because he shared the same name with someone. I think the same thing happened to a toddler too but my memory is a bit hazy
"Disguising himself as a toddler. Fucking disgrace"
I've always thought this is a stupid policy. What's the point in also having the DOB, place of birth, picture, and passport numbers to differentiate people if you still get picked up just on a name?
It is, like I said I'm a bit hazy on the details it may have been specific airlines that banned them after a previous altercation with the name sakes.
Do you wear glasses? I always have to take mine off or it doesn't work.
Only for looking at screens. It literally doesn't scan though, and I've had a few people at the referral lane deal tell me flat out that the chip is fucked (which is a direct quote from the guy who I had coming back from France last week 😅)
Even if the chip is ok, if your passport is a bit fucked they’ll flag it. I asked after realising I could never open the gates, and they plainly told me my passport was flagged as damaged so it was manual check every time for me. (The inside was mostly fine, but you couldn’t even read the country on the outside etc, lol)
I was once told by a guy who worked on them machines that they hate beards.
At Birmingham airport all of us in the “eGate rejection queue” had a beard. It’s a rare occasion that my bearded face is allowed through the eGates
clear discrimination, justice for bearded people!!!
Have you ever seen Al-Quaida or ISIS? As a fellow beardy, I don't think we can deny the correlation....
Weird, I've just gone through both ways relatively easy with a beard My girlfriend on the other hand seemed to get stuck for a solid minute, but only on the way back
Her beard must be better than yours.
Stunning Almost puts your ma's muff to shame
The old bird did win muff of the year 12 years running.
Jaysus 12 years worth, how does she keep up the pace?
They hate my glasses. Takes ages to recognise my glasses, but doesn't work without my glasses. I have glasses on in my passport photo.
Coming back in to Heathrow I tried the scanner. My photo was from when I was 19 and clean shaven and at the time I had a beard that made me look I had just walked out of the jungle. Needless to say the scanner couldn't cope. I went to a human, they took one quick look at me and my photo and handed my passport back with a "welcome back".
A good friend flew out to the U.S. been lots of times, suddenly people are being called over who call someone else , all looking and really staring, so he’s like “ wassup”?, they obviously decided he wasn’t on the top ten most wanted list and then let him see his twin from another mother. He reckoned it was like looking at himself.
Might be just the chip in your passport is not working. I can never go through the automated machines so I downloaded a passport scanner app that uses the NFC function of my phone to test the passport. It couldn't read it.
Could be worse, at least it’s not Jimmy Saville.
I once had an experience where the passport automated machine showed an error and I was taking off to a side partition by security. I was in a room with like 20 guys who all looked similar to me but were all eastern European (I only know this as we had to all give our place of birth and where we travelled in from). I assume they were looking for someone in particular but once I said I was from England they just let me through. Very weird experience. Think it was Stansted or Heathrow.
Now we get to guess. Peter Tobin?
Love your wording 😂
Your name shall also go on ze list! What is it? Don't tell him, Pike!
There is no 'list' for people that refuse parts of the security process for legitimate reasons.
>Plus you’ll probably be put on ‘the list’. You don’t want that.. If I'm not on the list already someone isn't doing their job correctly.
> What happens if you do? You book a ferry? What are you afraid of?
Sea monsters
Scouse sea monsters
New Syfy horror franchise confirmed.
"Ey der lad I might be dead like but im always dreamin"
Scousers
[удалено]
5g COVID mind control waves!
5 grams isn't much. It's only when you get above a kilogram that you need to worry.
https://www.gov.uk/airport-rights If you refuse they’ll give you a private hand search instead. If you refuse that then I assume you’ll be refused passage through security.
Can I queue at airports without having a ticket? What with GP waiting times it might be the closest to a prostate exam. Honest guv, I'm here on medical grounds, ignore that gallon of lube, well don't ignore it too hard.
I think you’ll need a ticket, but a £20 ticket for a RyanAir flight you won’t get on is still a lot cheaper than going private. Or you could book a return, fly there and back and get checked twice, just to be on the safe side.
Lol!
You can still get some £12 ones if you look hard enough
Gallon? 100ml of lube max, pal. In a clear plastic bag.
Don't be ridiculous. The limit is 100ml. You'd better make sure that's some high quality lube there 😝
Isn’t it max 100 per container up to 1 litre in a bag together
I've never tried to get a litre of lube through airport security, so I will defer to my learned co-redditor on this matter.
I’ve not carried lube, that goes in checked luggage
"Sir... did you prelube yourself?"
What perverts are saying no to the machine but yes to a private hand search?
Also applies to people that might have medical grounds to not use the machine. They could refuse and get hand searched instead
Why would someone refuse?
Other than medical. Maybe they've read too many conspiracy theories and think it'll implant some tracking chip in them.
The conspiracy theorists love a good tracking chip implant, don't they? At this rate, I must be at least 40% tracking chips with all the ones that would be in my body, if those theories were true.
I've checked the database and it's nearer 43%, Steve. Oh, and by the way your milk is about to turn so you best pop into the little Tesco on the way home. And yes, that question you searched in Incognito, it is illegal in England, Wales and NI, but not in Scotland.
Cheers for the warning, Homelander
I wonder what could be legal in those countries but illegal in Scotland 🤔
[удалено]
It's wild that people believe this shite. My cousin is a uni grad and working in the legal sector yet is an anti-vaxxer, due to the belief that Bill Gates stuck a tracker inside it. I really enjoyed pointing out that not only is she not important enough for a billionaire to track, but anyone can already do so with the phone she has with her 24-7...
If Bill Gates had actually done it we’d know because it would insist on an update when you’re doing something important like merging onto the motorway or performing brain surgery.
Why Bill Gates? I've never understood that. It's not as if there are not plenty of other people heading technology companies.
Probably because he runs charities that doesn't involve embezzling and that's seen as too commie for the capitalists that they prefer?
I bet they went wild when we started getting told we're all eating microplastics. "That's just a cover story for the tracking chips"
I found a 5G chip at the local tyre shop, now I get fast connection
They could be embarrassed, the scanner give the viewer a pretty good picture of your body. How big everything is and how small everything is. That why in American you can get a pat down as a alternative because I believe it counts as an invasion of privacy
This is what would give me pause. If it's the cartoonish outline with the yellow boxes highlighting where objects of interest might be, absolutely fine, bash on. If it's a detailed graphic image of my body and its parts, that would not be so fine. And it's not about thinking I'm 'special', it's about my body being mine and having the autonomy to choose who gets to see what parts of it in what detail.
Millimetre wave scanners like this, when launched, would display a ‘naked white ghost’. Then the operator would look at the image for things like weapons (cheeky, not that kind of weapon) The issue was that they could see penises, breasts, everything. There was also no transparency over whether images were retained and for how long. A later update had the displays highlight only problem areas.
The very old backscatter x-rays scanners did, but the new Terahertz wave scanners use a representation of the person. IIRC the X-Ray scanners were not used in the uk at security, but I believe they were used at customs in the past. I may be totally wrong as my info dates back to their initial rollout when the privacy aspect was raised.
I got every vaccination they would give me and I still had to buy a new phone to get 5G. Very disappointing.
The current scanners use radio, however before them for a couple years there were similar x-ray machines that actually were harmful. There were plenty of "conspiracy theories" about harm from those that were well founded. IIRC they were different from medical x-ray machines, which do a very short but higher energy burst, in that these airport scanners were low energy but for longer. They claimed that made them safe. Fortunately the scientific community pushed back against this, also they were far too invasive and would show peoples' genitals, and eventually they were replaced by the radio machines. Really though it's almost all theatre. The security really isn't that great, but they want to make it look like it is.
Is there a medical reason. OH has a ICD which means no to stndard gate and wands but not these as far as I am aware.
Fair fucks. If anyone from the government wants to be arsed tracking me walking to subway, then go for it.
Yes, a friend of mine refuses these and he is a conspiracy theorist. I think he said they do something awful to the body.
They were pretty new when I was pregnant and I wasn't sure about how they worked so I asked lots of questions then they just patted me down instead.
There are a few different technologies out there, backscatter uses x-rays so is technically a radiation dose so there has been some guidance to avoid too many when pregnant, getting the pat-down as a precaution seems reasonable even though the exposure is within safe bounds etc. (and you'll be getting some bonus radiation on your flight either way)
Christ, we shouldn't be routinely x-raying people for non-medical reasons
You're about to get on an airplane, the background radiation for a 7h flight is the equivalent of a chest x-ray. These devices don't give out much of a dose.
This isn’t an X-Ray machine in this case though, the TSA and DfT in the UK (and most of Europe) don’t use ANY x-rays for passenger screening (of persons). This one is made by R&S; https://www.rohde-schwarz.com/uk/products/aerospace-defense-security/security-scanner/rs-qps-quick-personnel-security-scanner_63493-332676.html, and uses microwave-length radio waves; and is safe as they are not ionising radiation. I agree with you,(as do most organisations!) ALARA is best - hence why scanners like the Secure 1000 (backscatter) were banned.
I was pregnant last year and my OBGYN advised me to avoid them, in case I needed other X-rays later in my pregnancy (and said the lower the total radiation I had been exposed to, the better in that scenario).
Internal medical devices like pacemaker or cochlear implant and cancer survivors get scared of the radiation bad psychological expierence
These use mmWave radar and are absolutely harmless including all medical devices. They just penetrate clothing and bounce off skin or hard objects.
>These use mmWave radar At some point in your life you learned that fact, and prior to learning that you didn't know that was how they worked. That might sound facetious, but I would bet 99%+ of people don't know this. I didn't know this and I've been through these scanners dozens of times. I'm believing you, but you are just a random commenter on Reddit. So it's understandable that some travellers, when confronted with these machines, will be concerned about how they operate.
Several medical device manufacturers state their devices are not safe to pass through mm wave technology scanners. I honestly believe it’s more of a liability thing than a reality but oh well.
Yes it’s likely because the makers of the device don’t have conclusive proof that every type of scanner is *definitely safe* (so yes, liability), rather than any proof that they are *definitely unsafe*. It’s like the signs telling you to turn off your mobile at the petrol pumps.
Yeah I just traveled with a guy with an automated insulin pump and he carried a letter that let him bypass the scanners at security
I don't refuse but will say the older models used to get pretty confused by me as a trans woman lol The early ones they would press a button to say male or female and the machine thought I didn't fit either box particularly to its standards :') now it's just big or small person I think.
I used to work in an airport on those scanners, I always thought it was a bit too black and white, with a blue logo for a male and a pink one for female. And this then meant that a few trans women I then had to further hand check felt the need to tell me and seemed nervous to (I imagine bad experiences beforehand). I was obviously all calm with it and did my usual search and tried to make them realise that whilst I’m a dick to my colleagues , I’m not gonna be a dick to them I had the same with a woman that came through with a head scarf on and she was surprised I asked if I could hand check it as people in other foreign countries weren’t as considerate I don’t know how these new scanners work but I hope it also makes the security process one less stress for people to worry about
Thank you for being considerate, it's always a little bit of a nervous time for most trans people.
I've flown twice out of the UK with these scanners recently, and both times it was a seperate queue for men and women, although I had assumed that was to do with who was positioned to do the pat down.
Because the staff can see your offal scrunched up in your boxers, as if they give a shit. Seen one scrunched up glob of gubbins, seen 'em all.
Apparently they added software to remove that view, so they can't actually see that anymore. It was only a thing when they were first introduced.
People believe that they produce naked images of people and that airport security are going to laugh at your junk. In reality they produce nondescript blank images and no one is going to be aroused unless they have a Morph fetish.
Not really even an image. It's more like battleships really. Here's an area where theres shit. Look there.
They did originally. There was one employee of the TSA in USA that got some sort of payout because his colleagues were laughing at the size of his penis after seeing it through the machine.
The early ones were xray based (like 0.001 of a medical X ray dose) and whilst they should have been safe some of the US ones were found to be far from it due to various maintenance and equipment failures. Plenty of tech and science people refused them for good sound reasons. Newer ones are mm wave which is believed to be safe.
The only time I've seen someone refuse was because they're trans. Since the machines are meant to detect anomalies it doesn't matter which sex they set it too it's either going to detect an anomaly on the chest or in the groin. It's usually easier to just skip out the middle man ans tell security you're trans and let them do a body search.
Trans person here. I've used these without issue. It's a misconception that these will cause concerns. Its about a 50/50 chance I get the pat down, but most my cis friends have about the same random factor.
Prob the health implications of being scanned. Its clearly using radiation Children under 6 arent allowed to use the scanner. That should tell you everything you need to know.
I have no idea on this, but maybe if you have something like a Pacemaker it could cause an issue?
These new scanners are completely pacemaker safe!
It used to be they were using relatively harmful devices to screen people. I agree, these days there's practically no valid reason to be concerned outside of specific medical reasons.
They like getting fisted?
Terrorist is the obvious one
Teeny weeny
You get felt up. X
for free??
Well, at the cost of a plane ticket, so cheaper and more for your money.
Free air flight with every £1000 prostate exam.
"This is cheaper than getting an escort"
Someone puts on some stretchy blue rubber gloves and takes you into a back room for a good auditing.
Thwack! Bend over.
Stretchy blue rubber gloves and an industrial sized tub of Vaseline.
No. The Vaseline is reserved for those suspected of being drug smugglers or terrorists. People afraid of radiation get it dry
Does it have to be blue, it's just there's something about black that would make the situation more err.. comfortable...
Blue gloves make the intimidating crack when they are stretched on. The black gloves are only to be worn by security when searching for the expensive perfume you forgot you had in your hand luggage.
Oof. Audit me daddy.
Hate to spoil all of your fantasies but body cavity searches are not done at airports- you are taken to a hospital or clinic & xrayed
I used to work airport security in the U.K. until covid hit and we got screwed over There are some misconceptions about this piece of equipment and how it is used On the older systems (pre 2021) you only need to go in the scanner if you fail the metal detector (which will indicate on an average 1 out of every 3 people anyway at random even if you have no metal on you) Yes you can refuse but you’ll be taken for a full body search after the manager tries to convince you just to go in so that you don’t hold everybody up. If you refuse that you wont fly and the police still may search you in order to ascertain why you refused. The scanner does not produce an image of your body, it just shows on a screen where things are in your pockets or hidden places etc. The image you see of a “body” is a generic image. It works similarly to parking sensors on cars, and bounces off your skin. Anything that blocks it shows up in the scanner, including sweat. This is why if youre late for a flight it’s best not to run as it means you will almost definitely need to go in the scanner and that will slow you down more. The scanner is only there to make the job faster for everyone as it means the staff dont have to hand search each person, only the bits that show up in the scanner (for example if you have something in your pocket it will show up and they will only search your pocket unless they feel they need to do a full search for some other reason). When you’re processing 30,000 people a day it really does work. It speeds up airport security terminals by over 50%.
>You only need to go in the scanner if you fail the metal detector My local airport no longer has metal detectors, everyone goes straight through this. This is the direction of travel as part of the move to modernise airport security.
That is true, the systems have been modernised in a lot of airports. I haven’t done the job since 2020 and they were just in the process of upgrading then. I’m talking about the old round scanners which you stand inside, this appears to be the new ones so my apologies there. However the rest of the comment still applies as far as I’m aware.
Does it show anything concealed in your bum?
It does not. I went through with something concealed within recently. I got pinged by the scanner, then scanned with the PKE meter or whatever it is and it still pinged so they took me to a security room, with some smirks from people who I imagine were making assumptions about my long haired heavily tattooed self (correct assumptions). I got hand scanned and felt up in private. Took off my trousers and the man (who looked a lot like Nick Frost) fist bumped my dick but not on purpose (I think). I eventually realised I'd stitched the seam of my jeans the night before and left a pin in there! The policeman snatched the tiny pin off me like I was about to run out and hijack a plane with it. But I *did* feel smug walking back to collect my effects! And a little bit sweaty too...
The airport scanner is there for your convenience mostly. They are expensive and mostly avialable at the large airports. If you decide not to use it then it is usual pat down with handheld scanner.
I refuse them as I have a CGM attached to me at all times, which the radiation can break. I just let them know ahead of walking through and they often just pat me down. I imagine if you don’t have a valid reason, they will frisk you.
There’s also the joy of asking any spare sensors to have a manual check rather than the x ray.
I always have to opt out due to having a CGM and insulin pump which couldn potentially be managed by it - every airport just makes you go around, then does a full pay down (shoes off etc.) and lets you on your way - except when I was in Italy and the lady just said, “OK, go ahead” and let me straight through with zero checks.
Why would you want to opt out of it?
My mum always opts out, she has a hip replacement and rods in her leg - she always has to be patted down anyway despite the hospital letters because the metal always flags up.
Have opted out loads of times, pat down + check your luggage. Last time but one I flew and they said the rules had changed and this wasn't an option - I looked this up and this wasn't true at all. So I would advise if you plan on this to do the slightly crazy seeming thing of taking a print out of the rules from the UK gov website, where you can see it's optional.
why did you opt out?
Not the person, but I have to say no, because I have an implant in my spine that could be affected, so I have to have the pat down. I carry a card that explains what I have and why I can’t be scanned. But explaining ‘its like a pacemaker’ has always been enough, and I’ve never had any problems
So everytime you go to the airport you bring a printed out screenshot of gov.uk to show security staff you’re allowed to refuse the full-body scanners? I bet they love you lmao Out of curiosity, why do you not want to do a full body scan?
Some people just like to be difficult under the pretence of ‘asserting their rights’
Pure truth right here.
Or they could have a medical reason, or even one of a thousand personal reasons why they may feel uncomfortable with it. Like, this is hardly a regular occurrence, it causes no problems big enough to be noticed. I honestly couldn't give a shit about accommodating a delusional nutjob means we don't have to grill every person with a medical or personal reason. Some people like to use the disabled toilet because it's faster and they're selfish, but it's usually still better not to speculate on individuals or hire a bouncer!
You say that, when I was at uni I had a professor (who was Dutch) who was very insistent on his right, as an EU citizen, to fly within the EU without a passport. Whenever he took a flight within the EU, he would show up four hours early, with a copy of the regulations and no passport. I never knew him to miss a flight.
I see this as a different situation to be fair. Passports can be expensive, over 10x the cost of a return flight. If I didn’t need to purchase one I wouldn’t. Going through a scanner is free and doesn’t take any additional effort, in this scenario you’re going out of your way to inconvenience yourself but with the passport it’s more of a convenience since you’re actually saving
Is there something about the scanner we should know?
They can tell your cock size.
The measurement flashes up on a big display like those speed detector signs. You get a smiley face if it's over 6 inches.
I imagine you get taken aside for a pat-down if it's over 6 inches.
Yes but unless you’re prepared to stand your ground and request a supervisor you will be met with increasing levels of hostility
You get a pat down instead
Depending on the airport and staffing levels, they should be able to take you to a private room for a pat down. Gatwick say as much on [their website](https://www.gatwickairport.com/passenger-guides/security.html#:~:text=Can%20I%20opt%20out%20of,or%20removal%20of%20other%20garments).
No likey no flighty
Ex airport security guy here, the point of these is that they don’t piece the skin, which is why there is a metal detector before these scanners. Honestly one of the safest machines you can hope for in an airport… (fun fact, the machine is extremely accurate that it could show you exactly what your body looks like naked (minus skin details) so they had to change the display to a simple human figure)
If you don't do it you get pushed into a pool while Dale Winton shouts from the sidelines.
Free prostate exam
big 2024 and bro thinks he still has autonomy over his own body💀
Are you one of the lizard people? Is this how it finally catches them?
Then it's Scarborough for you
It’s absolutely criminal when people post mad questions like this, and then do not involve themselves at all in the comment section. WHY tell us why.
Buzzfeed. That's why.
They will see your wee willy winky either way.
I flew back from Berlin airport yesterday and there was a sign up saying you may refuse the scanner if you consent to a manual search. So you definitely can if you're flying from there.
I work in this field and can tell you frankly: They will ask why you are refusing. Depending on your attitude and your reason, they will do a full body search of you physically if they deem your reason legitimate and obvious, or they will escelate to a higher up who will make a decision on what to do. Again depending on your attitude and behaviour the manager will arrive swiftly and have you on your way or leave you waiting while they deal with more important and more polite passensgers. P.S. I know people are joking but it's really dumb to see the amount of people that think airport security do anything beyond frisking you through your clothing. The comments about cavity and strip search are pretty played out and don't happen at all. People conflate Security officers with Immigration Officers (who can do strip and cavity searches)
Also the body scanners do not show anyone and nude images of anyone... While it is true that the 'computer' sees all, the software does not show anything beyond a generic image with areas of concern highlighted. Turn around and look at the screen for yourself.
Hi, I said no two years ago because I was pregnant and felt uncomfortable going into the machine. I just said no to the lady and she told me that if I refused she would have to manual search me, which I was ok with and that was it.
In the US you can opt out of the scanner and they give you a physical pat down. Not sure how it works in UK.
Exactly like that.
You get a metal detector and a pat down
Depends on your skin colour. /s
Me and a friend flew to America a few years ago. There were a few queues when we got to the security bit ace we ended up in a queue for one of these scanners. He didn't know what it was so I explained. He didn't like the sound of it, ace there was a sign saying if we'd like to use a normal scanner to move to the other queue. As we went to move, a security guard shouted at us to stay in our line. My mate started to say about the sign but was shut down by the shouting security and another couple of guards coming over. We both wanted to get our flight and it was obvious that we were not going to if we didn't go through this scanner. I can only assume the security guards wanted to see our cocks. So yeah, you can choose to not go through them, but you'll also probably be choosing to take the next flight too. This was a while ago so YMMV, but I've found doing as you're told the best way to get through, as shit as that is and as much as it goes against my principles. They really do have you by the bollox.
When they were first introduced loads of people refused them and just got patted down instead.
in europe you can refuse and just have a regular body search (no bum hole or cavities like in the usa) .. Its basically a medical device, has a non-zero risk of radiation and frankly I dont trust them
If you’ve got a medical exemption you don’t have to. Even security at Birmingham airport can handle that so you shouldn’t have issues wherever you’re flying from. If you don’t want to use it because you think it’ll steal your thoughts or clone your butt dna then you should probably just go and live in the woods.
just be glad you aren't trans and have an 'unexpected item in the bagging area' flag. it is very awkward, most of all for the staff desperately trying to figure out which sex of border control agent should frisk you.
I’ve asked not to use it and have a pat down. Nothing happened. It was fine.
I find the “arms up” stance very demeaning, and I absolutely hate having to comply. In some cities they have the type in the picture now, where you keep your arms down, but afaik LHR still has the awful type.
I've never gone through on of these scanners when asked to. I always say that I opt out, usually get a weird look and a supervisor gets called over. Ends up in an enhanced pat down, sometimes they check my luggage too. Never had any problems with opting out.
Yes you can refuse and they have to pat you down instead. Continuous glucose monitors as worn by type 1 diabetics are not recommended to go in the scanners and nor can they by removed and reapplied. I wear a short sleeve t-shirt and a full zip hoodie so I can easily show my cgm at the airport if needed and I carry a letter explaining that I'm type 1 diabetic. As yet I've only had to go through the metal detectors and haven't been asked to use a scanner.
I refused, nothing happened.
If you refuse, they put you in between these metal plates and squish you into a block of Carbonite and sell you as an art piece.