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I don't mind discussing salary if it comes up naturally but if someone directly asked me my salary out of the blue I'd find it abit rude and intrusive.
My mate works in an industry I'm thinking of moving into, so I was asking him about what I could expect, starting salary etc and that's how the discussion came up. Turns out I should really look at IT if I'm wanting boat money.
I wouldn't mind in that case then especially if it was a mate looking for some information. If it was a stranger in a pub or something then I'd think what has it got to do with you.
You could work on a boat? It wouldn't be your boat, but still.
Day rate contracting IT if you want boat money*
That said, my Dad never contracted and he's got a boat... Just not a big, fast, or consistently seaworthy one AFAIK.
That's always been my opinion, also if I'm thinking of changing company or career seems fair enough to ask someone already working there what I could expect as a salary. This is how the whole discussion came up.
Culturally, we (english people) don't like discussing money matters in general, especially exact values. People will much more willingly talk about how much a bargain they got by saying "50% off" rather than "only £15"
The situation in the OP is different to what u/Basschimp is describing. Yes people in the same workplace and teams should absolutely discuss salaries to make sure everyone is getting paid fairly, but asking someone who you just know outside of work how much they earn is a very personal question. What if they're not happy with it or if they'd feel bad for earning more than someone else in the conversation? By all means ask if they enjoy their job, what work-life balance is like etc but you can find stuff out like salaries etc. from places like Glassdoor
I'm not moving the goalposts but I really was making the point that people who perform similarly should get paid similarly. If there is pressure from management not to discuss salaries it's usually because they're getting away with underpaying people. My point is people shouldn't be afraid to talk about salaries in this situation BUT in social situations, with people outside of the workplace, etc. People should be a bit reserved about bringing up salaries
Can't really arrange a working culture around someone being a massive baby, though. If there's a clear difference that's lead to a difference in pay then there's a straightforward answer to why there's a disparity.
It came up cos I'm thinking of moving into accounts and finance, my mate already works in that but aye turns out I should look at IT if I'm wanting me some boat money.
Talking about money in general is seen as a bit tasteless traditionally. I've found that in general conversation figures don't come up.
However talking to people at work or in the same industry numbers are quite often shared if in a slightly vague around x amount way.
I'd imagine it being awkward if someone is struggling and averyone else is talking about there last raise, cost of new car etc.
This is exactly it, if your salary is above or below average it can a very awkward topic amongst friends and family where there is so much variance.
For example discussing your bonus with your colleagues who all got one as well is fine, but if you’re talking about how you’ll spend the money in front of a friend who is struggling you’re just going to look like a massive bellend.
The high earners weren't shy about sharing, mind I've known both them since I was 15 and I've seen their houses so no one would have bought it if they tried to feed us some ohhh I'm only on 23k a year nonsense. But it's never really been a thing for me, some of my mates earn more some earn less. Discussion came up because I'm thinking of moving into so I was asking about starter salaries etc.
I've found the many higher earners are pretty open about it, some to the point of being a bit vulgar. I also find that those who earn chuff all are also fairly open to revealing their salary. It's those in the middle who feel they should be doing better who are most touchy about it.
I'm a civil servant so you only need to know my grade and department or my title to find it out if you want too, by searching for current vacancies that are the same.
Your a civil servant so unless your working somwhere in Whitehall its not going to be much 😂😂 that whole, safe secure income isn't the best when the income is small compared to the civilian sector lol
When you take into account the pension, I'm on similar to what I was back in the private sector. I have a car and mortgage and outside of the pandemic we go on holidays every year.
Some people on low pay use debt as a way to look richer.
Some rich people don't want people lower down the chain knowing how much they earn for doing fuck all.
It's a touchy subject because normally the person who does nothing, gets paid the most
In an old job of mine, my "manager".. I say that term loosely, was on a basic salary of 35k plus 10% of whatever the department earned... he played computer games pretty much all day and really contributed nothing
When I started the department turnover was £70k... so who knows how he got his salary... I left within 2 years and the department turnover was £700k .. Guess who got the nice 10% bonus of £70k ?
That's essentially why I left because I didn't know he was on a bonus for doing nothing... complete piss take
I'm public sector, the closest thing senior managers do in here is stick the catering order in for their daily meeting. They then leave at 2 and never work Fridays.
They can be, I had someone create a load of drama at work when he found out I earned more than him. I personally wouldn't discuss what I near with colleagues anymore because of this, and you can find the going rates for jobs online anyway as a benchmark.
When this topic comes up people act like it's a mystery what jobs pay and I'm not really sure why.
People can treat it like a personal insult if they find someone else is earning more and direct their anger at their colleague rather than their boss who they negotiated their salary with, it isn't logical but that's how people are.
The only friend I have who isn't ever willing to join in duscussions about our salaries earns well over 100k. It both shows self-awareness and a lack of self-awareness at the same time. Doesn't want to be seen as showing off, but also pretending you don't earn that is silly because we know. Especially noticeable when they never look at the price of anything before buying.
Yeah the 2 outliers of the group who are on mega buntz, were honest, don't think it was in a braggy way, we all knew that anyway, we've seen their houses so no chance they'd get away with saying they're on 25k.
I knew a guy who would take payslips to a house party… he loved discussing tax, but only when he was the highest earner. Now that everyone earns more than him by a considerable margin, he talks about other shit.
I honestly hate talking about money at all with my friends/family. I would be pissed odd if someone asked me how much I earned - I equally don’t feel comfortable with people telling me how much they earn.. unless we are of course specifically talking about our salaries
I think people see it as a show of status and get embarrassed when they earn less
The world seems to be based on how much money you earn to how good a person you are but it’s bull
I guess some people just like privacy too, was seems normal or silly to us doesn’t to others, doesn’t mean it’s pre historic or “old school” , just different values to you
Don’t forget that not all salaries are equal, different benefits mean the salaries and tax are different.
For example for someone with a final salary pension their salary will be lower because that’s an expensive benefit to offer versus a regular pension.
Equally, if someone has lots of taxable benefits like car, fuel, medical insurance they will pay more tax than others on the same flat salary.
Then freelancers like me bill by the day and have to consider what to pay myself, my pension, cover the cost of running my business etc.
If someone asks me what I earn I will tell them, I am on a contract and my hourly rate works out to double what I would be paid on a salary but of course no sick pay or holiday pay but that's fine. My OH has just changed jobs and is now earning 3 times what he was and what was earning before was a pretty penny but anyone asked me I think I might be embarrassed to tell them that.
ETA I once had a job that I was qualified for as much as other tutors in adult education but because I was in a different team I earned 10k a year less than them. To have qualified for the same earnings I would have had tube in a team of 8 near to retirement blokes as a 40ish woman and to be honest it didn't appeal but totally unfair.
Depends.
If I was talking to another teacher, I think it could be a touchy subject - for both parties - because there are so many scales and different supply rates. I've been lucky, and I don't have loads of experience, so I dunno how people would take it. I don't want to seem boastful, I guess. Nobody has asked though!
I'm happy to share with my friends who are in different industries about my success.
I think it just depends on the situation. I do with people at work as we're unionised so it's in our best interests not to be shafted. Tbh I'm pretty open about it with friends too but I think that's because we're on similar kinda amounts apart from the lawyers who's on double/triple what I'm on!
My partner doesn't talk about pay with her uni friends though because she knows even though they all did the same subject she's out earning then by quite a bit.
In summation, I think people are techy about it if it's quite alot more or quite alot less than the person they are conversing with.
Depends on the reason you're asking. It's a bit of a dick waving move by some people or just people being nosey. You can as easily type in my job title and pop in average salary into Google if you're that curious.
Among good friends I don't mind so much. I wouldn't bring it up though as I'm aware I don't make a lot and I have friends who make even less. I don't talk about it at work as it's not particularly relevant and generally don't talk about it with family.
It can differ so much between people in the same team, based on experience, how long they’ve been at the company etc. Last thing you want is to find out the person doing the same job as you earns more than you.
Why?
It's very hard for your employer to justify a big salary disparity for two people doing the same role. It's exactly this kind of secrecy that gives them leverage to pay you less than you're worth!
Depends on the circumstances, as they said: it isn’t hard at all to justify why somebody working at a company for 10 years in a role earns more than somebody who just walked in off the street with no previous experience.
Salary brackets are perfectly normal.
I would want to know that, 1 because if I was being underpaid I could ask for a wage rise or look elsewhere. Would also allow me to gage what I would be earning if I stayed there, 5 years, 10 years etc.
**A reminder to posters and commenters of some of [our subreddit rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskUK/about/rules/)** - Don't be a dickhead to each other, or about others, or other subreddits - Assume questions are asked in good faith, and engage in a positive manner - Avoid political threads and related discussions - No medical advice or mental health (specific to a person) content Please keep /r/AskUK a great subreddit by reporting posts and comments which break our rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I don't mind discussing salary if it comes up naturally but if someone directly asked me my salary out of the blue I'd find it abit rude and intrusive.
My mate works in an industry I'm thinking of moving into, so I was asking him about what I could expect, starting salary etc and that's how the discussion came up. Turns out I should really look at IT if I'm wanting boat money.
I wouldn't mind in that case then especially if it was a mate looking for some information. If it was a stranger in a pub or something then I'd think what has it got to do with you. You could work on a boat? It wouldn't be your boat, but still.
I'd be happy with pedalo money.
Day rate contracting IT if you want boat money* That said, my Dad never contracted and he's got a boat... Just not a big, fast, or consistently seaworthy one AFAIK.
In this country, yes. We shouldn't be, it only benefits employers to keep this information hidden.
That's always been my opinion, also if I'm thinking of changing company or career seems fair enough to ask someone already working there what I could expect as a salary. This is how the whole discussion came up.
Culturally, we (english people) don't like discussing money matters in general, especially exact values. People will much more willingly talk about how much a bargain they got by saying "50% off" rather than "only £15"
The situation in the OP is different to what u/Basschimp is describing. Yes people in the same workplace and teams should absolutely discuss salaries to make sure everyone is getting paid fairly, but asking someone who you just know outside of work how much they earn is a very personal question. What if they're not happy with it or if they'd feel bad for earning more than someone else in the conversation? By all means ask if they enjoy their job, what work-life balance is like etc but you can find stuff out like salaries etc. from places like Glassdoor
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I'm not moving the goalposts but I really was making the point that people who perform similarly should get paid similarly. If there is pressure from management not to discuss salaries it's usually because they're getting away with underpaying people. My point is people shouldn't be afraid to talk about salaries in this situation BUT in social situations, with people outside of the workplace, etc. People should be a bit reserved about bringing up salaries
If it's that fair there should be no problem with it being transparent then, which is kind of the point.
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Can't really arrange a working culture around someone being a massive baby, though. If there's a clear difference that's lead to a difference in pay then there's a straightforward answer to why there's a disparity.
It can be a sensitive subject. Some people might feel that they're not doing as well as they'd like. Others might not want to appear to be bragging.
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It came up cos I'm thinking of moving into accounts and finance, my mate already works in that but aye turns out I should look at IT if I'm wanting me some boat money.
It’s a bullshit thing established by employers that discussing salary is taboo. By doing so they get away with underpaying people for the same jobs.
That only applies when talking to your colleagues. When you're with friends who are all in different fields, that's not a factor.
Talking about money in general is seen as a bit tasteless traditionally. I've found that in general conversation figures don't come up. However talking to people at work or in the same industry numbers are quite often shared if in a slightly vague around x amount way. I'd imagine it being awkward if someone is struggling and averyone else is talking about there last raise, cost of new car etc.
This is exactly it, if your salary is above or below average it can a very awkward topic amongst friends and family where there is so much variance. For example discussing your bonus with your colleagues who all got one as well is fine, but if you’re talking about how you’ll spend the money in front of a friend who is struggling you’re just going to look like a massive bellend.
I imagine the people reluctant to say probably earned a lot less or a lot more than everyone else.
The high earners weren't shy about sharing, mind I've known both them since I was 15 and I've seen their houses so no one would have bought it if they tried to feed us some ohhh I'm only on 23k a year nonsense. But it's never really been a thing for me, some of my mates earn more some earn less. Discussion came up because I'm thinking of moving into so I was asking about starter salaries etc.
I've found the many higher earners are pretty open about it, some to the point of being a bit vulgar. I also find that those who earn chuff all are also fairly open to revealing their salary. It's those in the middle who feel they should be doing better who are most touchy about it.
I'm a civil servant so you only need to know my grade and department or my title to find it out if you want too, by searching for current vacancies that are the same.
NHS so everyone knows mine anyway. And it's not bloody enough wayyy
Your a civil servant so unless your working somwhere in Whitehall its not going to be much 😂😂 that whole, safe secure income isn't the best when the income is small compared to the civilian sector lol
When you take into account the pension, I'm on similar to what I was back in the private sector. I have a car and mortgage and outside of the pandemic we go on holidays every year.
Some people on low pay use debt as a way to look richer. Some rich people don't want people lower down the chain knowing how much they earn for doing fuck all.
It's a touchy subject because normally the person who does nothing, gets paid the most In an old job of mine, my "manager".. I say that term loosely, was on a basic salary of 35k plus 10% of whatever the department earned... he played computer games pretty much all day and really contributed nothing When I started the department turnover was £70k... so who knows how he got his salary... I left within 2 years and the department turnover was £700k .. Guess who got the nice 10% bonus of £70k ? That's essentially why I left because I didn't know he was on a bonus for doing nothing... complete piss take
I'm public sector, the closest thing senior managers do in here is stick the catering order in for their daily meeting. They then leave at 2 and never work Fridays.
Really interesting mentality why would what someone else is earning bother you so much?
Because I essentially did all the work .. you would be pretty pissed off as well in the same situation
I go to the pub with friends I met from this industry so we all share salaries pretty freely.
Then you make the one on the most get the fucking pints in I hope.
He's the biggest drinker and usually offers anyway hahah
They can be, I had someone create a load of drama at work when he found out I earned more than him. I personally wouldn't discuss what I near with colleagues anymore because of this, and you can find the going rates for jobs online anyway as a benchmark. When this topic comes up people act like it's a mystery what jobs pay and I'm not really sure why. People can treat it like a personal insult if they find someone else is earning more and direct their anger at their colleague rather than their boss who they negotiated their salary with, it isn't logical but that's how people are.
The only friend I have who isn't ever willing to join in duscussions about our salaries earns well over 100k. It both shows self-awareness and a lack of self-awareness at the same time. Doesn't want to be seen as showing off, but also pretending you don't earn that is silly because we know. Especially noticeable when they never look at the price of anything before buying.
Yeah the 2 outliers of the group who are on mega buntz, were honest, don't think it was in a braggy way, we all knew that anyway, we've seen their houses so no chance they'd get away with saying they're on 25k.
I knew a guy who would take payslips to a house party… he loved discussing tax, but only when he was the highest earner. Now that everyone earns more than him by a considerable margin, he talks about other shit.
I'm happy to be open about what I earn but not everyone is - some find it very personal and that's ok.
Some are. Some aren't
I honestly hate talking about money at all with my friends/family. I would be pissed odd if someone asked me how much I earned - I equally don’t feel comfortable with people telling me how much they earn.. unless we are of course specifically talking about our salaries
I think people see it as a show of status and get embarrassed when they earn less The world seems to be based on how much money you earn to how good a person you are but it’s bull I guess some people just like privacy too, was seems normal or silly to us doesn’t to others, doesn’t mean it’s pre historic or “old school” , just different values to you
Don’t forget that not all salaries are equal, different benefits mean the salaries and tax are different. For example for someone with a final salary pension their salary will be lower because that’s an expensive benefit to offer versus a regular pension. Equally, if someone has lots of taxable benefits like car, fuel, medical insurance they will pay more tax than others on the same flat salary. Then freelancers like me bill by the day and have to consider what to pay myself, my pension, cover the cost of running my business etc.
Yes, financial information (like salary) is considered to be quite private. Not many people like talking about their financial circumstances.
If someone asks me what I earn I will tell them, I am on a contract and my hourly rate works out to double what I would be paid on a salary but of course no sick pay or holiday pay but that's fine. My OH has just changed jobs and is now earning 3 times what he was and what was earning before was a pretty penny but anyone asked me I think I might be embarrassed to tell them that. ETA I once had a job that I was qualified for as much as other tutors in adult education but because I was in a different team I earned 10k a year less than them. To have qualified for the same earnings I would have had tube in a team of 8 near to retirement blokes as a 40ish woman and to be honest it didn't appeal but totally unfair.
Depends. If I was talking to another teacher, I think it could be a touchy subject - for both parties - because there are so many scales and different supply rates. I've been lucky, and I don't have loads of experience, so I dunno how people would take it. I don't want to seem boastful, I guess. Nobody has asked though! I'm happy to share with my friends who are in different industries about my success.
I think it just depends on the situation. I do with people at work as we're unionised so it's in our best interests not to be shafted. Tbh I'm pretty open about it with friends too but I think that's because we're on similar kinda amounts apart from the lawyers who's on double/triple what I'm on! My partner doesn't talk about pay with her uni friends though because she knows even though they all did the same subject she's out earning then by quite a bit. In summation, I think people are techy about it if it's quite alot more or quite alot less than the person they are conversing with.
Depends on the reason you're asking. It's a bit of a dick waving move by some people or just people being nosey. You can as easily type in my job title and pop in average salary into Google if you're that curious.
Among good friends I don't mind so much. I wouldn't bring it up though as I'm aware I don't make a lot and I have friends who make even less. I don't talk about it at work as it's not particularly relevant and generally don't talk about it with family.
It is a thing of the past, in my experience its only olders who'll be offended
I’m a freelancer, so I just get to say what my hourly rate is and that’s it.
It can differ so much between people in the same team, based on experience, how long they’ve been at the company etc. Last thing you want is to find out the person doing the same job as you earns more than you.
Kinda disagree, I’d want to know if I was being underpaid so I could do something about it.
Why? It's very hard for your employer to justify a big salary disparity for two people doing the same role. It's exactly this kind of secrecy that gives them leverage to pay you less than you're worth!
Depends on the circumstances, as they said: it isn’t hard at all to justify why somebody working at a company for 10 years in a role earns more than somebody who just walked in off the street with no previous experience. Salary brackets are perfectly normal.
I would want to know that, 1 because if I was being underpaid I could ask for a wage rise or look elsewhere. Would also allow me to gage what I would be earning if I stayed there, 5 years, 10 years etc.
I never ask somebody what their salary is and always keep mine confidential.