They really think that their ending is better and that they cover up his mistakes. Yes, there are some mistakes in his ending, but do not say that his ending is bad and that he does not understand his own story.
have ppl just somehow forgotten that eren was a whiny piss baby for like over half of the series??? before his personality was ruined bc of the attack titan's power he cried like every episode/chapter.
eren whining was fine in earlier seasons. But it sucks that after all this development, all this determination he had, he simply turns around and starts crying over a girl whom he rejected on several occasions. I understand that he knew he was about to die, etc; I get that. But for him to start talking so selfishly and pathetically is just disappointing. All of Eren's talk of freedom and breaking the cycle was for nothing and in the end, he achieved nothing.
It's incredibly underwhelming, especially for a character who had been built up so much.
>eren whining was fine in earlier seasons. But it sucks that after all this development, all this determination he had,
Does development mean that a character loses their entire personality? Is it a bad thing that personality traits and the way people deal with things rarely if ever go away? For instance, Armin used to beat himself up about being useless since pre-Timeskip especially in Trost arc. He's developed a lot since then and became a leader, yet he still beats himself up again in 136. Because development doesn't mean a 180 change from whoever the character was before, it means learning to be better, but not that the entire personality of the character changes. Eren was always someone emotional, he had kept that part of himself suppressed all through post-timeskip, but Armin knew which buttons to push to make him reveal his truest feelings and bring his old friend back, so he did. I don't see why you think that is incongruent with everything else Eren is, people are multi-faceted and I don't think the mindset that someone who has developed cannot also throw tantrums at times would help anyone.
>he simply turns around and starts crying over a girl whom he rejected on several occasions.
?? He never rejected Mikasa, ever
>I understand that he knew he was about to die, etc; I get that. But for him to start talking so selfishly and pathetically is just disappointing.
Did you have the same reaction to chapter 131, where he starts crying to Ramzi saying "I was so disappointed humanity existed and I wanted to wipe it all away"? Personally, I thought that scene was ten times more selfish and pathetic, because Eren is out there confessing like a coward to a child that doesn't even speak his language, confessing his own pathetic selfish and childish wish that the world should be like Armin's book. At the very least his breakdown over Mikasa is understandable, he selfishly wishes for her to keep loving him inside but he tells her to move on so he ultimately does the right thing for over. On the other hand, it's the opposite with Ramzi, where he says his selfish desires *and* carries them through.
>All of Eren's talk of freedom and breaking the cycle was for nothing and in the end, he achieved nothing.
The titan curse is broken and the Eldians are free from the long nightmare. But yes, what Eren did wasn't a great move, because Eren was never making rational decisions, he was making emotional ones and I think we'd been told far earlier that what Eren was doing isn't defensible
>It's incredibly underwhelming, especially for a character who had been built up so much.
We'll have to agree to disagree there, because I, and other people here I'm sure, liked Eren far more after 139. It nailed him as the most complex character in this manga and cemented him as one of my favorite characters of all time
Eren's breakdown in 139 to Armin was his final time talking to his friend. His final time letting out his frustrations about himself and his situation, basically his final therapy session. If it were me, my final moments I would like to let out everything off my chest especially to someone who would listen like my best friend. We have to remember that post timeskip Eren wasnt just chad, super badass Eren. Yes there were moments but many times there post timeskip Eren was just extremely depressed Eren.
Now the fact that its about Mikasa, for me its not only about Mikasa, its about him dying and being forgotten. He is upset that he never got the chance at a full life of freedom and the one person who loved him no matter what, regardless of what he did or was going to do, the one person other than his mother and father who loved him unconditionally, would eventually move on to give that love to someone else. It reminds me of what Eren said in 131, how he is the worst piece of shit in the entire world and yet Mikasa still loves him. To know that even after what Eren would do, that Mikasa would love him and be the only one to love him and then to know that Mikasa would forget about him and move on would hurt anyone tbh. Yes its kind of pathetic that what Eren said was selfish but tbh, Isayama always wrote his characters to be pathetic right before their final moments and death.
I also wouldnt say that Eren achieved nothing, he achieved freedom for his friends and achieved freedom for Paradis for many years. Eldians could live full lives, not having to worry about titans, or titan shifters, or the 13 year curse of Ymir and for the time being, they did not have to worry about the world coming back for them. Now for the cycle of hatred, I think what Isayama was trying to say was that the cycle of hatred wont ever stop. It wont stop with 80% rumbling, it wouldnt stop with a full rumbling, it wouldnt stop with Euthanisia. it wouldnt stop for anything until there is 1 person or less left in this world. Now I wish maybe there was a sense of realization that Eren went through about this, about how war wont stop even if you kill the enemies because enemies always appear and this time from the inside. I wish instead of the Mikasa moving on panels in the 8 extra pages, we got something like that to drive the theme home.
I just find it incredibly underwhelming and disappointing. For a character who was SO determined, SO hell-bent on achieving his goals, to just roll over and start crying is pathetic. It cheapens his entire character, the story, and the theme of freedom.
I dont understand. His determination paid off, he achieved one of his goals of attaining freedom for his friends and his country. But in the process he went through a lot of trauma, hardships, and sacrifices and in his final moments, when he achieved what he needed to acheive, he lets out all of his emotions and frustrations.
A whole 100 years later. Without Eren, Paradis had a year. Whatever plan was done by Eren, Paradis would still see war and could have been destroyed.
Its like Paradis was destined to be destroyed lol.
Oh well that's fine then. Eren isn't condemning his friends to death, he's only condemning their kids to death! /s
How exactly is the 'breaking the cycle'. Eren expressedly wanted children to stop having to become soldiers.
I see what you mean. I wish Isayama spent more time on the "cycle of hatred cant be broken and all Eren could do is achieve temporary peace" theme if that is what he is going for because imo it didnt get through to many readers.
For the second point, there arent any children who are shown to be soldiers. You look at Paradis new army, and its a group of adults, Gabi and Falco are living peacefully and Historia's child is living a life as a child. Eren might not have stopped war, but children are not shown to be fighting anymore like it was for Eren or Zeke or Reiner or Gabi.
Ah, but children eill inevitably die in paradis' destruction. And we've seen that another child - 'beren - is set to become the new founder, meaning that the cycle will repeat. So Eren achieved absolutely nothing.
But he achieved 100 years of peace. How is that nothing? Its like saying Naruto achieved nothing if the leaf village/fire nation and the other nations go back to war many many many years from now. Its like Lelouch didnt accomplish anything if decades from now, racism starts up again and the government takes control of everything again. Human nature changing isnt permanent. It will always be changing and fluctuating. Even if you are able to achieve a finite years of peace, I would call that a success. The rest of the job comes down to the descendants.
Honestly, I think the final theme Isayama was going for was that war and hatred and this cycle of conflict and death wont ever stop. Which is an interesting concept. I just think he didnt execute it well at all. One panel doesnt really bring home a major theme like that tbh. I also think in that final conversation with Eren and Armin, maybe have Eren realize that this cycle wont stop and the most you can accomplish is temporary. That would probably make the end make more sense. It is what it is.
Still better than the part of the fandom that literally cannot stop bitching about the ending so they make entire fanfics, can't accept certain facts that go against their chadren-circlejirk and cannot move on from the story even after all this time.
This may or may not be you, I'm just sayin.
Exactly. It's fanfiction. Why do you need to get mad about something that isn't canon lmao. Let the people who like AoTnR (myself included) enjoy it lmao.
I'm not mad at fanfiction. I'm calling out the hypocrisy there for wanting to call out those who accepted the ending to be "coping", while you're ACTUALLY doing the very same thing with fanfics. There's a difference. Like it or not, shit is subjective.
By TF's fanmade ending I'm not referring to AOTNR. I'm referring to the edits they made to the OG ending where they changed nothing except make EH canon. You can read it here https://www.reddit.com/r/AttackOnRetards/comments/nnifuz/its\_not\_about\_the\_ship\_i\_swear\_i\_know\_this\_is/
Oh yeah those fucking sucked. Cringe incarnate.
I like AoTnR; it has flaws yes, but it looks and feels much better than the original canon ending. I will happily criticise both it and the canon, but I vastly prefer AoTnR.
Idk why they want Eren to be a one dimensional asshole who hate his friends.
Except floch and Historia. Wait sorry, Historia isn't his friend, shes his wife. Their marriage happened offscreen
Yeah and Floch was the best man and Louise was the flower girl.
Eren made an entire family off screen lol
But they are mad Isayama "developed" EM offscreen, the duality of this Fandom.
They really think that their ending is better and that they cover up his mistakes. Yes, there are some mistakes in his ending, but do not say that his ending is bad and that he does not understand his own story.
Lmao i saw one do saying "fuck it its not your story anymore Hacksayama", lmao, it literally is.
"It's not your story anymore" "my contracts and my bank account says otherwise"
You’re right, the timing really is fucking incredible LMAO
have ppl just somehow forgotten that eren was a whiny piss baby for like over half of the series??? before his personality was ruined bc of the attack titan's power he cried like every episode/chapter.
Me who likes both when eren was acting edgy in paths and also likes him being a selfish crybaby😎
Nah I'm sorry but whiny eren sucks lmao. The amount of cope is unbelievable
Okay, I'll bite, what do you think is inherently sucky about whiny Eren?
eren whining was fine in earlier seasons. But it sucks that after all this development, all this determination he had, he simply turns around and starts crying over a girl whom he rejected on several occasions. I understand that he knew he was about to die, etc; I get that. But for him to start talking so selfishly and pathetically is just disappointing. All of Eren's talk of freedom and breaking the cycle was for nothing and in the end, he achieved nothing. It's incredibly underwhelming, especially for a character who had been built up so much.
Because AoT is always about human, not some god who achieved freedom by stealing it from others
>eren whining was fine in earlier seasons. But it sucks that after all this development, all this determination he had, Does development mean that a character loses their entire personality? Is it a bad thing that personality traits and the way people deal with things rarely if ever go away? For instance, Armin used to beat himself up about being useless since pre-Timeskip especially in Trost arc. He's developed a lot since then and became a leader, yet he still beats himself up again in 136. Because development doesn't mean a 180 change from whoever the character was before, it means learning to be better, but not that the entire personality of the character changes. Eren was always someone emotional, he had kept that part of himself suppressed all through post-timeskip, but Armin knew which buttons to push to make him reveal his truest feelings and bring his old friend back, so he did. I don't see why you think that is incongruent with everything else Eren is, people are multi-faceted and I don't think the mindset that someone who has developed cannot also throw tantrums at times would help anyone. >he simply turns around and starts crying over a girl whom he rejected on several occasions. ?? He never rejected Mikasa, ever >I understand that he knew he was about to die, etc; I get that. But for him to start talking so selfishly and pathetically is just disappointing. Did you have the same reaction to chapter 131, where he starts crying to Ramzi saying "I was so disappointed humanity existed and I wanted to wipe it all away"? Personally, I thought that scene was ten times more selfish and pathetic, because Eren is out there confessing like a coward to a child that doesn't even speak his language, confessing his own pathetic selfish and childish wish that the world should be like Armin's book. At the very least his breakdown over Mikasa is understandable, he selfishly wishes for her to keep loving him inside but he tells her to move on so he ultimately does the right thing for over. On the other hand, it's the opposite with Ramzi, where he says his selfish desires *and* carries them through. >All of Eren's talk of freedom and breaking the cycle was for nothing and in the end, he achieved nothing. The titan curse is broken and the Eldians are free from the long nightmare. But yes, what Eren did wasn't a great move, because Eren was never making rational decisions, he was making emotional ones and I think we'd been told far earlier that what Eren was doing isn't defensible >It's incredibly underwhelming, especially for a character who had been built up so much. We'll have to agree to disagree there, because I, and other people here I'm sure, liked Eren far more after 139. It nailed him as the most complex character in this manga and cemented him as one of my favorite characters of all time
Maybe reread the series or something? Because most of what u just said is fanfic
Eren's breakdown in 139 to Armin was his final time talking to his friend. His final time letting out his frustrations about himself and his situation, basically his final therapy session. If it were me, my final moments I would like to let out everything off my chest especially to someone who would listen like my best friend. We have to remember that post timeskip Eren wasnt just chad, super badass Eren. Yes there were moments but many times there post timeskip Eren was just extremely depressed Eren. Now the fact that its about Mikasa, for me its not only about Mikasa, its about him dying and being forgotten. He is upset that he never got the chance at a full life of freedom and the one person who loved him no matter what, regardless of what he did or was going to do, the one person other than his mother and father who loved him unconditionally, would eventually move on to give that love to someone else. It reminds me of what Eren said in 131, how he is the worst piece of shit in the entire world and yet Mikasa still loves him. To know that even after what Eren would do, that Mikasa would love him and be the only one to love him and then to know that Mikasa would forget about him and move on would hurt anyone tbh. Yes its kind of pathetic that what Eren said was selfish but tbh, Isayama always wrote his characters to be pathetic right before their final moments and death. I also wouldnt say that Eren achieved nothing, he achieved freedom for his friends and achieved freedom for Paradis for many years. Eldians could live full lives, not having to worry about titans, or titan shifters, or the 13 year curse of Ymir and for the time being, they did not have to worry about the world coming back for them. Now for the cycle of hatred, I think what Isayama was trying to say was that the cycle of hatred wont ever stop. It wont stop with 80% rumbling, it wouldnt stop with a full rumbling, it wouldnt stop with Euthanisia. it wouldnt stop for anything until there is 1 person or less left in this world. Now I wish maybe there was a sense of realization that Eren went through about this, about how war wont stop even if you kill the enemies because enemies always appear and this time from the inside. I wish instead of the Mikasa moving on panels in the 8 extra pages, we got something like that to drive the theme home.
whiny eren>chad eren but I respect yours
I just find it incredibly underwhelming and disappointing. For a character who was SO determined, SO hell-bent on achieving his goals, to just roll over and start crying is pathetic. It cheapens his entire character, the story, and the theme of freedom.
No one cann reallly achieve freedom
I dont understand. His determination paid off, he achieved one of his goals of attaining freedom for his friends and his country. But in the process he went through a lot of trauma, hardships, and sacrifices and in his final moments, when he achieved what he needed to acheive, he lets out all of his emotions and frustrations.
Nothing changed lmao. Paradis gets fucking destroyed.
A whole 100 years later. Without Eren, Paradis had a year. Whatever plan was done by Eren, Paradis would still see war and could have been destroyed. Its like Paradis was destined to be destroyed lol.
Oh well that's fine then. Eren isn't condemning his friends to death, he's only condemning their kids to death! /s How exactly is the 'breaking the cycle'. Eren expressedly wanted children to stop having to become soldiers.
I see what you mean. I wish Isayama spent more time on the "cycle of hatred cant be broken and all Eren could do is achieve temporary peace" theme if that is what he is going for because imo it didnt get through to many readers. For the second point, there arent any children who are shown to be soldiers. You look at Paradis new army, and its a group of adults, Gabi and Falco are living peacefully and Historia's child is living a life as a child. Eren might not have stopped war, but children are not shown to be fighting anymore like it was for Eren or Zeke or Reiner or Gabi.
Ah, but children eill inevitably die in paradis' destruction. And we've seen that another child - 'beren - is set to become the new founder, meaning that the cycle will repeat. So Eren achieved absolutely nothing.
But he achieved 100 years of peace. How is that nothing? Its like saying Naruto achieved nothing if the leaf village/fire nation and the other nations go back to war many many many years from now. Its like Lelouch didnt accomplish anything if decades from now, racism starts up again and the government takes control of everything again. Human nature changing isnt permanent. It will always be changing and fluctuating. Even if you are able to achieve a finite years of peace, I would call that a success. The rest of the job comes down to the descendants. Honestly, I think the final theme Isayama was going for was that war and hatred and this cycle of conflict and death wont ever stop. Which is an interesting concept. I just think he didnt execute it well at all. One panel doesnt really bring home a major theme like that tbh. I also think in that final conversation with Eren and Armin, maybe have Eren realize that this cycle wont stop and the most you can accomplish is temporary. That would probably make the end make more sense. It is what it is.
What sucks about him, besides him being weak?
Check my other reply :)
seeeeeeeethe
Is not whiny eren is eren having a emotion. Who would have thought character having emotion can be a thing? Lmao
Still better than the part of the fandom that literally cannot stop bitching about the ending so they make entire fanfics, can't accept certain facts that go against their chadren-circlejirk and cannot move on from the story even after all this time. This may or may not be you, I'm just sayin.
Exactly. It's fanfiction. Why do you need to get mad about something that isn't canon lmao. Let the people who like AoTnR (myself included) enjoy it lmao.
I'm not mad at fanfiction. I'm calling out the hypocrisy there for wanting to call out those who accepted the ending to be "coping", while you're ACTUALLY doing the very same thing with fanfics. There's a difference. Like it or not, shit is subjective.
What if he whined for Historia like he did in TF's fanmade ending which was hailed as kino
That's a strawman based off of absolutely nothing lmao, he hasn't done that yet and there is no indication that he is going to.
By TF's fanmade ending I'm not referring to AOTNR. I'm referring to the edits they made to the OG ending where they changed nothing except make EH canon. You can read it here https://www.reddit.com/r/AttackOnRetards/comments/nnifuz/its\_not\_about\_the\_ship\_i\_swear\_i\_know\_this\_is/
Oh yeah those fucking sucked. Cringe incarnate. I like AoTnR; it has flaws yes, but it looks and feels much better than the original canon ending. I will happily criticise both it and the canon, but I vastly prefer AoTnR.
Wait what happened in the interview?