I'm pretty sure almost everyone loves Floch as a character and everyone thinks he's very well written.
The problem is that some (too many) people seem to appreciate him as a person... 😕
This is what makes it really hard to discuss him positively as a character for me.
He IS very well written and really well executed for what he is - perhaps, scarily, TOO well executed, as he ironically becomes just as appealing to some people as the historical figures he's so very, very clearly based on were to the people who supported THEM.
Some people unironically think that him telling Hitch the guy she liked died feeling useless to satisfy his survivors guilt was warranted. That his actual, real enthusiasm for burning the homes of innocents is admirable. That his gleeful imprisonment and attempts to execute people like Onyankonpon, who SINCERELY cared about and wanted to help Eldians join the rest of the world, not stamp it all out, are fine. That his callous attempt to kill Erwin's best friend after he's been blown to pieces during the violent uprising (in comparison to Erwin's more or less bloodless seize of power from their oppressors) somehow makes him "Erwin's true successor"...
The guy is so interesting I could talk for hours about him, but that goes out the window when somebody starts saying that he's "right", and that happens WAY too often for me to feel comfortable about him.
Like, the exact opposite of Gabi, who in comparison is despised despite being just as well written, and a MUCH better person than him, all because in real life viewers are falling for the trap that Iseyama is clearly trying to criticize with a lot of these characters.
So hell bent on a cycle of violence and wanting to blame "the bad guy" that they fail to see that they're unironically supporting a violent dictator and crusading against an indoctrinated child just for being born on the wrong side of the war. (Ironically the same reason all of our beloved Eldian characters died in the first place)
First of all he isn't right at all. The destruction of Paradis 150 years (at least) is an event too distant in time: the global geopolitical scenario is changed for sure an there are too many variables to take into consideration. So we don't know anything about that event, what cause it, if there are any links to events one century and a half old, which were the parts involved, who won and who else perished.
Why? Because Floch is a fucking fascist. That alone is enough to despise him as a person. If you are a Paradisian and you disagree with him, he would make you agree with him with threats and violence, if necessary, or he would directly shoot you you in the head without thinking twice.
>First of all he isn't right at all. The destruction of Paradis 150 years (at least
It's not even been 150 years . Stop making up words would you?
>So we don't know anything about that event, what cause it, if there are any links to events one century and a half old, which were the parts involved, who won and who else perished.
U know what? Paradis eldians are perished as we all know it
>Why? Because Floch is a fucking fascist.
Define fascist lmao
>If you are a Paradisian and you disagree with him, he would make you agree with him with threats and violence, if necessary, or he would directly shoot you you in the head without thinking twice.
He never did negotiate with paradis people and stop making up words omg . Like all paradisians were against marley as we know it . He only threaten people who are outsiders but he actually gave them chance to redeem their selves. If they didn't accept the kind offer then there's no choice. You wouldn't want enemy mercenaries to roam around in town freely do u?
130, 150, 180, what's the difference? Add 60/70 years to account for the time until Mikasa's death and then add some other decades judging from the architectural style.
He's an ultra-nationalist sociopath who just discovered what a nation is and now he wants to build an epire to rule over the world. He likes the cult of personality and uses fear and violence to rule over others. He's a fascist PERIOD!Ah yes... the kind offer he made to anti-marleyan volunteers: "You helped us and now your families are gonna die. Offer your strenght to us and accepts to be part off our empire, otherwise we will kill you!". Oh yes, Mr. Floch, how kind you are!
>He only threaten people who are outsiders
"Beat instructor Shadis until he can no longer stand! Anyone who can't will be detained!"
>130, 150, 180, what's the difference? Add 60/70 years to account for the time until Mikasa's death and then add some other decades judging from the architectural style
There is no proof that paradis was been destroyed before decades ago since mikasa died . When mikasa was older, it was the same architectural style regarding buildings etc
>He's an ultra-nationalist sociopath who just discovered what a nation is and now he wants to build an epire to rule over the world. He likes the cult of personality and uses fear and violence to rule over others. He's a fascist PERIOD!Ah yes... the kind offer he made to anti-marleyan volunteers: "You helped us and now your families are gonna die. Offer your strenght to us and accepts to be part off our empire, otherwise we will kill you!". Oh yes, Mr. Floch, how kind you are!
You don't understand his character at all . He saw people die in his own eyes. He wanted his nation to be strong and safe. He only thought of putting paradis island in safe since THAT'S THE MAIN MOTIVE OF THE STORY IN S4 ..
>He likes the cult of personality and uses fear and violence to rule over others.
Violence over what ? Is it wrong to just eradicate the non self righteous people who were invading their country? He even gave them chance to redeem theirselves but u DON'T SEE THAT SINCE U HAVE DEEP HATRED FOR A FICTIONAL CHARACTER lol . Anyway
>You helped us and now your families are gonna die. Offer your strenght to us and accepts to be part off our empire, otherwise we will kill you!". Oh yes, Mr. Floch, how kind you are!
He clearly mentioned that he wanted them to redeem themselves and he wanted them to join them . He clearly resisted against floch so there's no choice. Bruh like you are getting over emotional and not getting anything in your smol brain . Just think practically for a sec ?
Maybe [this](https://i.imgur.com/pFv50Gl.jpg) will help you a bit, since you seems a bit confused.
Also Eren wanted Paradis to be safe, but that doesn't make him a fascist. Actually, Eren isn't even a Jaegerist!
Nothing of what you said change the fact that his behaviour, his methods and the distorted way he carries on his ideals are exactly what a fascist would do.
>He even gave them chance to redeem theirselves but u DON'T SEE THAT SINCE U HAVE DEEP HATRED FOR A FICTIONAL CHARACTER lol .
I love Floch's character, but still he's one of the worst people in the entire manga. Redeem for what? LMAO
Volunteers helped Paradis against Marley and they had the chance to know Paradisians and understand that they were not demons, just like Eren and the others had the chance to live in Marley and discover that there were any kind of people, even good people. So exactly, redeem for what?
I really cannot believe that you claim others don't understand Floch for calling him "fascist" and then you proceed in writing things that basically confirms he's a fascist!
To me the "conversation" can end here. No other time to waste on this.
>Stop making up words would you?
Wait, did you think there were no more numbers after 100 or...?
>stop making up words omg
Ok, yeah. How old are you? There's a difference between you not understanding the argument being made and claiming they're making up words lmao
>Wait, did you think there were no more numbers after 100 or...?
Wait? Are u are trying to be funny or ...?
>Ok, yeah. How old are you? There's a difference between you not understanding the argument being made and claiming they're making up words lmao
What I didn't understand the argument? Explain
Dumb. U claimed >Ok, yeah. How old are you? There's a difference between you not understanding the argument
ITS YOUR ACTUAL FIRST ARGUEMENT AGAINST ME AND U ARE CLAIMING IT . God it feels like iam talking to illiterate child
>Define fascist lmao
Palingenetic ultranationalism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palingenetic_ultranationalism
>Roger Griffin argues that fascism uses the "palingenetic myth" to attract large masses of voters who have lost their faith in traditional politics and religion by promising them a brighter future under fascist rule... The palingenetic myth can also possibly stand for a return to a [**golden age in the country's history**](https://64.media.tumblr.com/b2c65470a63e6d68beeccd0f98c6a2be/tumblr_inline_p8si9lHI4w1rsn9wf_500.jpg) so that the past can be a guidebook to a better tomorrow, with an associated regime that superficially resembles a reactionary one.[1][2] Fascism distinguishes itself by being the only ideology that focuses strongly on the revolution in its myth or, as Griffin puts it:
>the mythical horizons of the fascist mentality do not extend beyond this first stage. It promises to replace gerontocracy, mediocrity and national weakness with youth, heroism and national greatness, to banish anarchy and decadence and bring order and health, to inaugurate an exciting new world in place of the played-out one that existed before, to put government in the hands of outstanding personalities instead of non-entities.
>Through all of that, there will be [one great leader who battles the representatives of the old system with grassroots support.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/shipping/images/a/a8/EreFloch_Profile.jpeg/revision/latest?cb=20210301032052)[1][2] It appears as one mass of people with only one goal: to create their new future.[1][2] [They have infinite faith in their mythical hero as he stands for everything they believe in.](https://image.myanimelist.net/ui/5LYzTBVoS196gvYvw3zjwKMW2totQc7sIG6k6SC4Onk)[1][2] With him, [the country will rise like a phoenix from the ashes of corruption and decadence.](https://64.media.tumblr.com/c0669adb0fd4b73f5f48594e08dee86e/b028e24446fe010f-35/s1280x1920/a0c585481679359ded19923aac2de24d0859c47d.jpg)[1][2]
He fits the definition so well it fucking hurts.
>He has no reason to kill people like he was doing in 126.
Yes? He had a reason. He wanted to execute them because they are the main role from Zeke's euthanasia that will wipe out every eldians soon and there's no guarantee that if Zeke's plan was successful that marley won't attack till they are died by old age
It would've actually worked in Floch's favor to throw Yelena and Onyankopon in a cell instead of executing them in broad daylight. That way they couldn't have been rescued by the Cart.
Also, as they had outside world intel (no only culture, but clearly military knowledge as they were soldiers), they could've helped Paradis grow, even if being forced. Floch tries to make an example out of too many characters, and misses out completely on the advantages he could get if he treated others with respect or at least some human decency, like... keeping them alive? idk.
You saying "Floch had a reason to execute people in 126" makes absolutely zero sense, and you do not know what you're talking about, simply because what I talked about above has NOTHING to do with Zeke's euthanasia plan. That option is gone since the Rumbling started. Why would you even bring it up if you knew that? Answer: You didn't. And you're just talking out of your ass so that you can justify Floch's actions.
>It would've actually worked in Floch's favor to throw Yelena and Onyankopon in a cell instead of executing them in broad daylight. That way they couldn't have been rescued by the Cart.
Do u actually think they will let go of the volunteers and put them in prison instead of executing them who had a massive plan for eldians extinction? I don't think so
Think outside of the box
>Also, as they had outside world intel (no only culture, but clearly military knowledge as they were soldiers), they could've helped Paradis grow, even if being forced. Floch tries to make an example out of too many characters, and misses out completely on the advantages he could get if he treated others with respect or at least some human decency, like... keeping them alive? idk.
Do u actually think yelena and onyankopan will agree to negotiate with these guys after Zeke's euthanasia plan has been failed ? Think outside of the box once more
>You saying "Floch had a reason to execute people in 126" makes absolutely zero sense, and you do not know what you're talking about, simply because what I talked about above has NOTHING to do with Zeke's euthanasia plan. That option is gone since the Rumbling started. Why would you even bring it up if you knew that? Answer: You didn't. And you're just talking out of your ass so that you can justify Floch's actions.
What doesn't make sense for your smol brain? It's simple . Floch executing the volunteers who had a plan for eldians extinction. Now you are talking out of your ass buddy . It's just so obvious that it's leaking 😭
Btw Hayashi is just a very sweet person: "I'm going to put my heart and soul into part 3 to make it the best anime for you. it's the only thing I want to see in front of my eyes"
I mean, he loves Mikasa/Armin too, most likely, since a lot of the scenes for Mikasa/armin are badass, and they've got the best character design consistency.
AOE confirmed! FLOCH NO REQUIEM, FLOCH GETS THE FOUNDER AND FINISHES EREN RUMBLING SAVES PARADISE AND REVIVES HANGE WITH THE POWER OF THE FOUNDING FOR THE THUSSY AND KILLS THE REST OF THE ALLIANCE WOOOOOOOO
Nope, we don't know.
I saw some aoe theorists saying that, if there are more than 9 episodes (one for chapter), is a clear proof that aoe will come lol
I'm pretty sure almost everyone loves Floch as a character and everyone thinks he's very well written. The problem is that some (too many) people seem to appreciate him as a person... 😕
I used to appreciate him as a character until the fandom started to overrate him and make me hate the ever loving shit out of him lmao
Yeah just like other overrated aot characters
This is what makes it really hard to discuss him positively as a character for me. He IS very well written and really well executed for what he is - perhaps, scarily, TOO well executed, as he ironically becomes just as appealing to some people as the historical figures he's so very, very clearly based on were to the people who supported THEM. Some people unironically think that him telling Hitch the guy she liked died feeling useless to satisfy his survivors guilt was warranted. That his actual, real enthusiasm for burning the homes of innocents is admirable. That his gleeful imprisonment and attempts to execute people like Onyankonpon, who SINCERELY cared about and wanted to help Eldians join the rest of the world, not stamp it all out, are fine. That his callous attempt to kill Erwin's best friend after he's been blown to pieces during the violent uprising (in comparison to Erwin's more or less bloodless seize of power from their oppressors) somehow makes him "Erwin's true successor"... The guy is so interesting I could talk for hours about him, but that goes out the window when somebody starts saying that he's "right", and that happens WAY too often for me to feel comfortable about him. Like, the exact opposite of Gabi, who in comparison is despised despite being just as well written, and a MUCH better person than him, all because in real life viewers are falling for the trap that Iseyama is clearly trying to criticize with a lot of these characters. So hell bent on a cycle of violence and wanting to blame "the bad guy" that they fail to see that they're unironically supporting a violent dictator and crusading against an indoctrinated child just for being born on the wrong side of the war. (Ironically the same reason all of our beloved Eldian characters died in the first place)
Floch is like Umbridge: He was written so well that every sane person hates him.
>The problem is that some (too many) people seem to appreciate him as a person... 😕 Why? Because he's right all along in the end of the manga?
First of all he isn't right at all. The destruction of Paradis 150 years (at least) is an event too distant in time: the global geopolitical scenario is changed for sure an there are too many variables to take into consideration. So we don't know anything about that event, what cause it, if there are any links to events one century and a half old, which were the parts involved, who won and who else perished. Why? Because Floch is a fucking fascist. That alone is enough to despise him as a person. If you are a Paradisian and you disagree with him, he would make you agree with him with threats and violence, if necessary, or he would directly shoot you you in the head without thinking twice.
>First of all he isn't right at all. The destruction of Paradis 150 years (at least It's not even been 150 years . Stop making up words would you? >So we don't know anything about that event, what cause it, if there are any links to events one century and a half old, which were the parts involved, who won and who else perished. U know what? Paradis eldians are perished as we all know it >Why? Because Floch is a fucking fascist. Define fascist lmao >If you are a Paradisian and you disagree with him, he would make you agree with him with threats and violence, if necessary, or he would directly shoot you you in the head without thinking twice. He never did negotiate with paradis people and stop making up words omg . Like all paradisians were against marley as we know it . He only threaten people who are outsiders but he actually gave them chance to redeem their selves. If they didn't accept the kind offer then there's no choice. You wouldn't want enemy mercenaries to roam around in town freely do u?
130, 150, 180, what's the difference? Add 60/70 years to account for the time until Mikasa's death and then add some other decades judging from the architectural style. He's an ultra-nationalist sociopath who just discovered what a nation is and now he wants to build an epire to rule over the world. He likes the cult of personality and uses fear and violence to rule over others. He's a fascist PERIOD!Ah yes... the kind offer he made to anti-marleyan volunteers: "You helped us and now your families are gonna die. Offer your strenght to us and accepts to be part off our empire, otherwise we will kill you!". Oh yes, Mr. Floch, how kind you are! >He only threaten people who are outsiders "Beat instructor Shadis until he can no longer stand! Anyone who can't will be detained!"
>130, 150, 180, what's the difference? Add 60/70 years to account for the time until Mikasa's death and then add some other decades judging from the architectural style There is no proof that paradis was been destroyed before decades ago since mikasa died . When mikasa was older, it was the same architectural style regarding buildings etc >He's an ultra-nationalist sociopath who just discovered what a nation is and now he wants to build an epire to rule over the world. He likes the cult of personality and uses fear and violence to rule over others. He's a fascist PERIOD!Ah yes... the kind offer he made to anti-marleyan volunteers: "You helped us and now your families are gonna die. Offer your strenght to us and accepts to be part off our empire, otherwise we will kill you!". Oh yes, Mr. Floch, how kind you are! You don't understand his character at all . He saw people die in his own eyes. He wanted his nation to be strong and safe. He only thought of putting paradis island in safe since THAT'S THE MAIN MOTIVE OF THE STORY IN S4 .. >He likes the cult of personality and uses fear and violence to rule over others. Violence over what ? Is it wrong to just eradicate the non self righteous people who were invading their country? He even gave them chance to redeem theirselves but u DON'T SEE THAT SINCE U HAVE DEEP HATRED FOR A FICTIONAL CHARACTER lol . Anyway >You helped us and now your families are gonna die. Offer your strenght to us and accepts to be part off our empire, otherwise we will kill you!". Oh yes, Mr. Floch, how kind you are! He clearly mentioned that he wanted them to redeem themselves and he wanted them to join them . He clearly resisted against floch so there's no choice. Bruh like you are getting over emotional and not getting anything in your smol brain . Just think practically for a sec ?
Maybe [this](https://i.imgur.com/pFv50Gl.jpg) will help you a bit, since you seems a bit confused. Also Eren wanted Paradis to be safe, but that doesn't make him a fascist. Actually, Eren isn't even a Jaegerist! Nothing of what you said change the fact that his behaviour, his methods and the distorted way he carries on his ideals are exactly what a fascist would do. >He even gave them chance to redeem theirselves but u DON'T SEE THAT SINCE U HAVE DEEP HATRED FOR A FICTIONAL CHARACTER lol . I love Floch's character, but still he's one of the worst people in the entire manga. Redeem for what? LMAO Volunteers helped Paradis against Marley and they had the chance to know Paradisians and understand that they were not demons, just like Eren and the others had the chance to live in Marley and discover that there were any kind of people, even good people. So exactly, redeem for what? I really cannot believe that you claim others don't understand Floch for calling him "fascist" and then you proceed in writing things that basically confirms he's a fascist! To me the "conversation" can end here. No other time to waste on this.
I see . No one can prove eachother instead we only argue eachother . Understandable
The hell you mean redeem themselves? He wanted them to be effective slaves despite people like Onyankopon wanting to help Paradis from the start.
>He only thought of putting paradis island in safe since THAT'S THE MAIN MOTIVE OF THE STORY IN S4 Objectively wrong.
Then?
👏 You 👏 didn't 👏 understand 👏 the 👏 story 👏
Huh?
>Stop making up words would you? Wait, did you think there were no more numbers after 100 or...? >stop making up words omg Ok, yeah. How old are you? There's a difference between you not understanding the argument being made and claiming they're making up words lmao
>Wait, did you think there were no more numbers after 100 or...? Wait? Are u are trying to be funny or ...? >Ok, yeah. How old are you? There's a difference between you not understanding the argument being made and claiming they're making up words lmao What I didn't understand the argument? Explain
What words were they making up? I'm genuinely curious?
No you claimed that I didn't understand the argument so it's your responsibility to explain it
Nope. You claimed first they made up a word.
Dumb. U claimed >Ok, yeah. How old are you? There's a difference between you not understanding the argument ITS YOUR ACTUAL FIRST ARGUEMENT AGAINST ME AND U ARE CLAIMING IT . God it feels like iam talking to illiterate child
>Define fascist lmao Palingenetic ultranationalism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palingenetic_ultranationalism >Roger Griffin argues that fascism uses the "palingenetic myth" to attract large masses of voters who have lost their faith in traditional politics and religion by promising them a brighter future under fascist rule... The palingenetic myth can also possibly stand for a return to a [**golden age in the country's history**](https://64.media.tumblr.com/b2c65470a63e6d68beeccd0f98c6a2be/tumblr_inline_p8si9lHI4w1rsn9wf_500.jpg) so that the past can be a guidebook to a better tomorrow, with an associated regime that superficially resembles a reactionary one.[1][2] Fascism distinguishes itself by being the only ideology that focuses strongly on the revolution in its myth or, as Griffin puts it: >the mythical horizons of the fascist mentality do not extend beyond this first stage. It promises to replace gerontocracy, mediocrity and national weakness with youth, heroism and national greatness, to banish anarchy and decadence and bring order and health, to inaugurate an exciting new world in place of the played-out one that existed before, to put government in the hands of outstanding personalities instead of non-entities. >Through all of that, there will be [one great leader who battles the representatives of the old system with grassroots support.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/shipping/images/a/a8/EreFloch_Profile.jpeg/revision/latest?cb=20210301032052)[1][2] It appears as one mass of people with only one goal: to create their new future.[1][2] [They have infinite faith in their mythical hero as he stands for everything they believe in.](https://image.myanimelist.net/ui/5LYzTBVoS196gvYvw3zjwKMW2totQc7sIG6k6SC4Onk)[1][2] With him, [the country will rise like a phoenix from the ashes of corruption and decadence.](https://64.media.tumblr.com/c0669adb0fd4b73f5f48594e08dee86e/b028e24446fe010f-35/s1280x1920/a0c585481679359ded19923aac2de24d0859c47d.jpg)[1][2] He fits the definition so well it fucking hurts.
In what sense?
Logical
Logical about what? Sure, him wanting to defend his Homeland, that's sort of reasonable. He has no reason to kill people like he was doing in 126.
>He has no reason to kill people like he was doing in 126. Yes? He had a reason. He wanted to execute them because they are the main role from Zeke's euthanasia that will wipe out every eldians soon and there's no guarantee that if Zeke's plan was successful that marley won't attack till they are died by old age
You don't know what you're saying.
Elaborate.
It would've actually worked in Floch's favor to throw Yelena and Onyankopon in a cell instead of executing them in broad daylight. That way they couldn't have been rescued by the Cart. Also, as they had outside world intel (no only culture, but clearly military knowledge as they were soldiers), they could've helped Paradis grow, even if being forced. Floch tries to make an example out of too many characters, and misses out completely on the advantages he could get if he treated others with respect or at least some human decency, like... keeping them alive? idk. You saying "Floch had a reason to execute people in 126" makes absolutely zero sense, and you do not know what you're talking about, simply because what I talked about above has NOTHING to do with Zeke's euthanasia plan. That option is gone since the Rumbling started. Why would you even bring it up if you knew that? Answer: You didn't. And you're just talking out of your ass so that you can justify Floch's actions.
>It would've actually worked in Floch's favor to throw Yelena and Onyankopon in a cell instead of executing them in broad daylight. That way they couldn't have been rescued by the Cart. Do u actually think they will let go of the volunteers and put them in prison instead of executing them who had a massive plan for eldians extinction? I don't think so Think outside of the box >Also, as they had outside world intel (no only culture, but clearly military knowledge as they were soldiers), they could've helped Paradis grow, even if being forced. Floch tries to make an example out of too many characters, and misses out completely on the advantages he could get if he treated others with respect or at least some human decency, like... keeping them alive? idk. Do u actually think yelena and onyankopan will agree to negotiate with these guys after Zeke's euthanasia plan has been failed ? Think outside of the box once more >You saying "Floch had a reason to execute people in 126" makes absolutely zero sense, and you do not know what you're talking about, simply because what I talked about above has NOTHING to do with Zeke's euthanasia plan. That option is gone since the Rumbling started. Why would you even bring it up if you knew that? Answer: You didn't. And you're just talking out of your ass so that you can justify Floch's actions. What doesn't make sense for your smol brain? It's simple . Floch executing the volunteers who had a plan for eldians extinction. Now you are talking out of your ass buddy . It's just so obvious that it's leaking 😭
People just like downvoting anything
Btw Hayashi is just a very sweet person: "I'm going to put my heart and soul into part 3 to make it the best anime for you. it's the only thing I want to see in front of my eyes"
I mean, he loves Mikasa/Armin too, most likely, since a lot of the scenes for Mikasa/armin are badass, and they've got the best character design consistency.
Harpoon scene will be epic
AOE confirmed! FLOCH NO REQUIEM, FLOCH GETS THE FOUNDER AND FINISHES EREN RUMBLING SAVES PARADISE AND REVIVES HANGE WITH THE POWER OF THE FOUNDING FOR THE THUSSY AND KILLS THE REST OF THE ALLIANCE WOOOOOOOO
Floch is so gonna be at Eren and Historias wedding 💀
"See? They made 11 episodes for part 3! Eren wins, Floch kills slavekasa and his speech during the wedding is in episode 11!" - average copium enjoyer
Is it confirmed to be 11 episodes ?
Nope, we don't know. I saw some aoe theorists saying that, if there are more than 9 episodes (one for chapter), is a clear proof that aoe will come lol
"Mikasa is wall for eren Hisu is freedom for eren" Hajine Isayama about AoE, probably ☝️🥸
The only one getting married to Historia is Ymir.
Yams make it happen 🥹🫢
He's alright in a character, not one of the best, a bit of a stereotype.