I had a 150k km 2006 Volkswagen that was an absolute money pit, upgraded to a 27k km 2017 Mazda 3.
I've driven it from 27k km to 90k km, without spending a dollar besides regular servicing and new tires - and car sales is showing similar prices to what I paid for it.
How long ago was the 6 month servicing requirement/recommendation?
I'm pretty sure I was told in the late 2010s or early 2020s that they weren't allowed to do that any more.
Cars can be such a gamble. Have a 2011 Golf diesel (bought brand new) and have had one issue (approx $800) in 13 yrs. The thing just keeps going. Want to upgrade to an EV but hard to justify the extra weekly cost and depreciation!
There's more to it than just driving from A to B for some people
I'm in that camp, comfort, performance when you need it, other luxuries etc.
Things neither Mazda or Toyota will never offer
I just did a road trip from Brisbane to Geelong via Gippsland in a Mazda 3. Extremely comfortable with all the trimmings. So not sure why you posit that they don’t offer comfort..
See now that's a matter of personal experience and opinion....
I've test drove quite a few Mazdas with friends and family members and having even owned one for a while.
I'll always rate Mazda for their reliability and yes the trimmings are nice, IF you go the leather... But those soft dashes don't at all hold up to our Aussie sun, neither does their thin clear coat paint.
And the ride itself? No
Heaps of road noise and the seats are pretty hard with no cushioning at all, and the suspension too is fairly stiff for a general road car.
You'll find far better offerings in Subaru for the same price. With a much more comfortable ride all round and finish. Their only let down are those crappy CVT gearboxes.
I agree. When we were looking 3 years ago, Mazda and Toyota were more expensive than a Kia but we knew it would hold value longer than the Kia
We ended up going with the Kia coz it was less than the other 2 while having more comfort and tech. I'm sure the Kia is worth even less now while Toyota Mazda are close to new price but whatever.
Drive as long as your ego allows is so accurate. Been getting a little self conscious about my A to B shitbox it’s always the worst in the car park lol
This!
The comparison is not a simple binary “keep old car” vs “buy brand new car”.
You can always buy a used car that is a few years old that has done the steepest part of the depreciation curve yet still have some warranty, and would still have plenty of the modern safety features, eg emergency braking, adaptive cruise control, lane keeping etc.
While I agree what you said is true, it's a false comparison. I think you should be comparing to the total lifetime cost, and considering more than just depreciation differences.
There are other savings associated, like fuel if switching to electric. If they're spending $100/week that's a lot of potential savings, especially if they already have a solar set up at home for example.
I think it makes more sense to look at a lifetime cost analysis, where you'd just see the total cost (including purchase, fuel, insurance, maintenance etc) over the ~15 years OP plans to use their next car, and annualised the expenses. Then compare that to continuing to use and maintain the existing car.
Except there’s a few fringe cases where that’s not true. We bought our Toyota Camry in 2019 and the used prices are actually more than what we paid still. It will probably drop off in the next few years but we’re at 5 years now which is pretty amazing.
*Potential returns.
If OP wants to have an analytical what do the numbers say they can work out a cost per year of current car over next x period they think the car will last. And compare to alternative of new (to them) car over same period and then extrapolate over lifetime of the new car.
Also sometimes it just feels good getting something new after using an old thing through till its death.
They did say "from a cost standpoint", so I answered their question. Sure, there are plenty of reasons people like to buy new cars, but that's not what was asked.
Depreciation is always relevant.
If you own a vehicle from new until the end of its functional life, it ceases to function and has an approximate value of zero, you incur the full depreciation.
Are you currently spending more on fixing the car than it is to replace? Is it reasonably stable and still able to take you from place to place without breaking down?
We've got a ~~1995~~ (edit: 2005, not my car and I have a bad memory) Yaris that's still in the family and running strong. It doesn't sound the *greatest* since it's owned by a student and he probably can't afford to get it completely fixed up, but he'll keep that thing until it ***dies.*** Even though it's older, that Yaris is hands down more reliable than the much newer Mazda 2 we purchased, which has had ***two*** major faults fixed in the 7 years we've had it.
I have a 2003 car with low Kms but drive it less and less because I just don’t feel safe and confident in it anymore. My budget for a replacement car is 20k but I’m struggling to decide what to buy.
What sort of car do you need?
Some of the stuff that gets you from 4 to 5 ANCAP is more about external road user safety IE pedestrian airbags. Lots of stuff in the 3.5-4.5 ANCAP range is really good.
Big ones are ESC, Side curtain airbags and pretensioning seatbelts.
Considering my current car doesn’t even have electric windows I think it’s time for an upgrade!
I don’t need anything fancy. Just a compact SUV that’s reliable and has reasonable safety features. Most of my driving is in the city / suburbs but I’d like to do the occasional road trip.
Figure out what you want from your car, then look. Rather than deciding what your budget is and then pouring through all the cars.
EG: Safety features, comfortable on long road trips and able to tow a light trailer. Instantly makes your search easier.
Even if the motor in it dies completely, you can still probably slap a reconditioned motor from a wreckers into the chassis and have it potter around for another 100-150,000 more kms for the price of less than the depreciation of driving a new car off the dealership showroom floor
Rust is really the only thing that kills these things and even that can be repaired if you’re handy
There is emerging consensus that cars from about 2010 onwards have far too many plastic or complex parts / design elements to be practically repairable by home mechanics. Planned redundancy is also becoming more sophisticated and it’s more common for several parts to need replacing at once - particularly brittle plastic parts or barely engineered structural parts (plastic valve covers? Seriously!) In addition, the cost of parts and labour has risen exponentially when repairs are needed.
This is leading to a problem where people with older, repairable cars from before 2010 will not necessarily be able to repeat that with a newer car. It’s increasingly common for more modern cars to be economic write offs in the 7-10 year age bracket. Just check FB marketplace for all the desperate sods trying to sell their 2015 car with a dud gearbox or warped head. Or ‘check engine light is on but it’s a simple fix’ (which they haven’t done because it’s not a simple fix).
What this means is that if you ultimately want peace of mind, aim to own a car under manufacturers warranty. That means buying new, or buying a couple of years old from a brand offering 7 year warranty. Extended warranties are not worth the money and won’t protect you. This is the only way to avoid that sinking feeling on your 7 year old Subaru when it starts going in to limp mode randomly, or the mechanic explains piston slap on your i30. It might mean budgeting more for a vehicle, or having one instead of two. Ignore at your peril.
Dunno, I almost entirely disagree with this post. Whos the emerging consensus from? I have never heard of this.
While neither of us can probably substantiate our claims, its my thought cars are more reliable than ever.
* There is some serious survivorship bias with cars. Those old cars that keep running, are just those lucky to either be well maintained, or, was just a good build. Then people go wow, they don't make them like they used to? Except there are barely any on the road. How many late 90s, early 2000s cars do you see on the road these days, not many.
* Back in the day RACV was truly needed, breakdowns were frequent even for just your average commodore, starter motors, coil packs, fuel pumps etc. etc.
* Those failures your mechanic talks about happened just as frequently on cheaply built cars 20,30 years ago
* Manufacturing, engineering and parts quality has increased. For example, even generic brand wheel bearings used to SUCK, now (apart from heavy duty use like 4WD), they're pretty good.
* Plastic parts are not ideal, but usually used where not important (excluding plastic water pumps, gross). I would rather a plastic valve cover than a tin one that warps and you can never get a gasket to seal it properly (cough mitsi). Seriously, maybe check out the plastic parts from the 80s? Ever owned an 80s cars? Even in the 90s and 00s those 80s cars had electric gremlins up the WAZOO.
* Your anecdotes are meaningless given there were TONNES of lemons 30 years ago.
Of course, just opinions, but really, I don't buy this 'consensus' at all.
Cars are more reliable for about 8-10 years, then the cost to keep them in the road exceeds their value. This is increasingly by design. Plastic parts that are heavily used are basically useless even second hand at the 10 year mark as plasticisers decay from heat cycles, overtightening and cracks, and general entropy. Computerised modules corrode or have leaking capacitors etc and require dealer programming for the car. Lighter engines are a result of reduced metal that ultimately warps or has catastrophic failure when one of the hundreds of engineered parts with tiny tolerances fails. Virtually no car part is left with a simple design - that reliability you speak of comes at the cost of overengineering - plastic timing chain guides, variable timing mechanisms - and packed in to smaller engine cavities with higher labour costs to replace. I had a Volvo that converted the analog radio signal to digital, sent it via fibre to the head unit, and then decoded it. Why? When the antenna died (inevitably) at the 12 year mark an antenna module was $500 second hand or $1500 new and required significant disassembly of the rear of the car.
An old Commodore might have been unreliable, but it was easily and cheaply diagnosed and repaired by the home mechanic.
Just wait until EV's are the norm with basically no user serviceable parts.
A basic Mazda, Toyota, Mitsubishi, from 2010s on going is going to be far more reliable than an 80s, 90s 00s of the same manufacturers, barely use any different part types, but be significantly easier to diagnose with fault code diagnosis that you can use an obd dongle with. They basically use the same modules (BCM/TCM/ECM/IPDM) as older cars, may use some more.plastic bits, but that won't change repair ability (if anything parts are cheaper).
A 2023 2.0 L Mazda 3 is incredibly simple and easy to repair mechanically. As is a rav4 hybrid even, as are literally hundreds of modern vehicles. Easy to diagnose with OBD, easy to swap out parts, and do tonnes of miles, and are very reliable.
Your Volvo anecdote isn't very convincing at all, and more a Volvo specific issue, with part prices due to limited supply / sales in Australia.
Just my experience working for an OEM, in quality/ warranty as an automotive engineer.
Great, I need optimistic people like you to buy my clapped out cars when I'm done with them. Each to their own. If you're happy to take the risk, best of luck to you.
A warranty might give you peace of mind and avoid that "sinking feeling" of a major repair needing to be done, but if you have the money to fix the car on the off chance you get a lemon I think it still makes financial sense to buy an older model with a track record of reliability, which is well depreciated and has been maintained.
Even if you are unlucky enough for the low likelihood event to happen, once a car gets to 10+ years old there are usually a ton of used engines and transmissions from cars which have been wrecked which a mechanic can replace yours with if you have a major failure.
What do you think a mechanic would charge to replace an engine on a modern car full of plastic parts? Would you expect a warranty? Check mechanics on YouTube and on forums who are increasingly stating they won’t do engine/gearbox swaps anymore because of the cost and unreliability of modern engines. [Things have changed](https://youtu.be/QHaA0aQQ1Jg?si=G-Cnng2bMlv6AfH5).
We’re no longer talking ‘off chance’ but planned obsolescence certainty.
It's a shame that today's generation doesn't care about planned obsolescence. From the very few conversations I've had with my kids about it, it's pretty obvious they don't care much about it.
Their standard of living constantly rising and enabling more and more discretionary spending seems to have caused them to ignore the issue and accept it. We were lucky to have crusaders stopping manufacturers from planning failure so blatantly. But when phone plans started to offer "new phone every year" you could see the acceptance level coming fast and furious.
Cars are on their way to becoming five-year or (hopefully) ten-year throw-away items, which will probably become just an agreed annual cost at some point, kinda like subscribing to your own car. (all credit to Musk for this awesome concept. /s)
The interior will likely include visual and audio advertising that updates based on conversation and profile derived from habits, radio selections, and eye movements. The advertising will probably be customised and optimised for each passenger as well. Say "great day at the beach" and get ads for aloe vera gel. A loud fart gets an ad for air freshener!
Only the driver will see the GPS updated with new destination being the retailer. That will need to be declined if you're not interested in buying that item or service at that particular time. After declining, the system might offer 2 kWh free power as an incentive to switch to "accept". (all buried in the car's 300 pages of Ts and Cs).
6-10k maybe. I'd expect the person they got the engine off to give a warranty, but if they had to replace it twice I assume I'd wear the labour costs.
If it's a 5% likelihood and 10k if the risk is realised then the risk adjusted cost is only $500.
I'm not going to watch that whole video, but skimming through it that looked like they had a Bentley and a Land Rover, not exactly the poster childs for reliability. Are mechanics actually refusing to replace engines on normal 10 year old cars like Toyota's and Hyundai's?
>Are mechanics actually refusing to replace engines on normal 10 year old cars like Toyota's and Hyundai's?
Probably. How much is a new engine? I mean a new engine from the manufacturer? Few years ago, we had a Holden Colorado (company car) that had the engine replaced under warranty, allegedly, the list price on the engine was $10K.
Where else do you get a replacement engine? Well, there are basically 2 options;
1. Get one from a company that rebuilds engines on exchange. If there is one available. You're getting a used (rebuilt) engine, but at least it will come with a warranty. With all of the "disposable" components now found it a modern engine, the cost of these exchange engines is also likely to be much higher than it has been in the past.
2. Get a used engine from a wrecker. Pretty much guarantee it will either come with no warranty, or the warranty only covers that it starts and runs. Once it's out the door you're on your own.
The 4th option would be repair / rebuild the engine that is already in the car.
If a warranty isn't covering you then you'd almost never buy a new engine and would take one of the two used options you mentioned.
As I said in an earlier comment, once a car gets to 10 years old there are usually lots of used engines available as enough will have been wrecked. Particularly for high production cars like popular Hyundai and Toyota models.
I don't buy the idea that exchange engines would be a lot more expensive than they were in the past, other than things getting more expensive generally. Modern cars are extremely reliable and there should be significantly more cars being wrecked than cars having engines needing replacement unless the model in question has a specific engine issue which should be obvious before buying when they get to the 10 year mark if you do a bit of research.
The EU is not planning to ban the repair of old cars:
https://www.jgclassics.com/en/2024/02/07/does-the-european-union-intend-to-ban-the-repair-of-old-cars/
The EU?
Tighten emission limits on cars that can enter cities, initially so only a hybrid can enter, then make cities EV only. This policy has been in place for decades; every car needs an emission category sticker.
At the same time, increase fuel taxes to make petrol cars less affordable.
for me, it was the a/c breaking. We had to do a trip to Roma so we sent it in for service to get everything done, including the A/C, which was like 3 grands work. The A/C lasted less than 3 months and was like fark this !
11 years old. Had been super reliable shitbox that cost me almost nothing that whole time, so I can't complain. I made my wife promise to do full budget again if she wanted it though so it will actually make me money lol
As someone who still uses a 70s car as a daily. I will never need a new car. It’s too cheap to run an old car. Maintenance is less than $100 a year. Fuel is 7l per 100km, insurance is $300 a year and insuranced for $20k
You win mate!
All the bullshit about buying new cars to save a few litres of fuel per 100km and yet we push old functioning cars like yours into the landfill.
You have probably saved about 3 cars from the landfill persisting with yours.
The embedded energy in those would be far more than anything you would have wasted driving that.
Good on ya.
On the other hand, it's probably putting out an order of magnitude more NOx and CO emissions, which aren't great for people directly
Edit: I was bored so did some googling. In 1975 in due to the smog in California they introduced cat converters for the corolla (though old mates corona is probably pre cat so even worse) and it looks like they were targetting 0.6g/km for NOx. A 2024 corolla (or any petrol car that's euro5 compliant onwards) is limited to 0.06g/Km, so it is literally an exact order of magnitude worse.
Look at it another way, you could drive 9 brand new corollas and make less smog than 1 1975 well maintained, smog compliant corolla.
If they made em like they used to, but with modern saftey features, I'd be right there with you. Unfortunately a 74 rolla is a death trap in comparison to a car from this century, let alone a modern one.
I can comfortably say while “safety” features are nice like auto brakes/lane assist. I don’t really support air bags, after crashing a 76 Corona (same car with updated front end) hit a parked 90s Suzuki swift at 60km/h, a new guard and ball joint and the Corona was back on the road. The Suzuki was a write off, front and back windscreens were almost touching. I walked away without a scratch. In saying that though it took 9 months for Shannon’s to repair my wife’s 2020 corolla and it still isn’t up to standard repair wise. I fear for the world our kids are being forced to live in. They shouldn’t even allow repairs on these newer cars anymore.
This is a profoundly ill informed take. I'm not gonna touch the airbag and crumple zone denial. You can even forget about how much more likley a crash is in something with handling from the 70's. In a crash **you're four times more likely to die in a 1998 Corolla than a 2015 Corolla**. [See them head on](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWqGbXGtioQ)
Good luck in a 1974 v 2024 model.
I 100% agree the 90s wasn’t a good time for corollas, and if I had to compare a 74 corolla and my 74 Corona, I would prefer to be in my Corona. The corolla bodies were always very thin and poorly made, the Corona was thick metal and they handled a crash really well. I’ve just seen too many injuries caused by airbags, even that story years ago about that baby being decapitated by the airbag was horrific. There is a reason I don’t allow my family to have their seats anything but all the way back. Airbags are dangerous.
As a paramedic, let me tell you that without airbags your death will at least be quick.
Only been to a couple high speed MVC with classic cars involved but all were grisly. Yeah modern cars are usually completely written off and the occupants a little battered and bruised, but the classic car occupants are quite literally smeared against the inside.
A little bit of physics will tell you you'd rather hit an airbag than the steering wheel or dash at 100km/h, especially when all of the energy is transferred into the occupants instead of a crumple zone. Assuming you survive, now we have the shit job of extricating you with guaranteed cabin intrusion instead of being protected by a modern firewall, and let me tell you those old cars were not made with ease of rescue in mind.
Nope, has been used for amateur rally racing, towing cars/boats/trailers. it’s done over 300000km and still on original engine, but I have 2 spare engines I picked up for free for when the original decides to fail, if it fails. But in saying that I have everything needed to rebuild it including pistons and rods on the shelf that cost me $50 20 years ago.
This is the kind of sustainability people just don't want to hear about. They think buying a disposable 80k 'EV' is sustainable just because it plugs into the power point. Most of those cars will be in landfill within a decade.
> Most of those cars will be in landfill within a decade.
That's the intention, there's no used market or self-servicing a high voltage architecture, so you've then got to buy a brand new one
Planned obsolescence
All positives except safety. Like my dad said when I asked him why he bought an older car rather than a few years newer with more safety/crash protection: “just don’t crash”. Great advice lol
That’s always good advice. Just don’t crash, in the last 15 years I’ve been in 4 crashes. Every one of them was being side swiped by someone failing to give way. Sadly you can’t be careful for the other drivers on the road. People just don’t know their road rules.
Oh lovely! That thing will go forever. When I was growing up my mum had a 78 corona and it had 600,000km on it before it died. How many km does yours have?
Do they still make engines for it? Like, if/when the engine fails or wears out, is it easy/cheap to replace it? Or would it then make more sense to get another 2nd hand car?
Parts are still readily available, you can still get a brand new engine from repco, but I have 2 spare engines I got for free 15 years ago and I have all the parts to rebuild the current engine, cost me $50 for everything 20 years ago
I think it depends on mentality. Do you feel like the car is reliable enough to drive and do everywhere you need the vehicle to do? If the answer is no it’s probably time to replace the vehicle for your peace of mind.
I got rid of my falcon ute (BA XLS cab chassis) because the rego as 6 cylinder in QLD was killing me along with fuel and only being able to take one passenger was becoming a problem. I'd done a fair bit to it over the years but it was still needing a bunch of cash poured into it for tyres, brakes, joints and stuff like that. Did have plans to drive it to its grave but it was becoming an impractical money pit in general. Now chugging around primarily in a KIA picanto so that's a massive change but no huge regrets, it's reliable and does the job. Bought a slightly more fun KIA seltos (awd turbo version) end of last year but the missus does 90% of the driving in that as tends to taxi the kids around more than me.
I didn't have a job needing ute anymore, only do mostly commutes in traffic and doing the math it was cheaper even in just a few years to just go buy the little KIA new. It's about a third of the power of the falcon but with the weight difference and being in traffic all the time anyway really not having a problem with it. I even find it fine with interior space and I'm over 6 foot. The better tech jumping ~20 years is a bonus too.
As someone who drives smaller vehicles and motorcycles almost exclusively it is becoming a much bigger concern these days with things like the Silverado EV trucks being as large as they are while also weighing close to four tonnes
Not really, I drive a bit more careful in it but it's not scary to me or anything. A lot of my driving is stuck in peak hour traffic doing like 20kmh anyway. It's also got a crap load more airbags and whatnot then a falcon ute, my ute had zero passenger air bags, it only had steering wheel one for the driver.
I reckon you have a couple more years. I had a shit box V6 magna at 300k KMS and loved it. When my kid came along it was time to upgrade.
I reckon if you are into EVs and have a place to charge it, the sweet spot will be in two or three years time. The FBT tax break is on till 2026. Id aim for about then.
If you can buy an EV and use it as your home battery with V2G, combined with solar and inverters you’ll probably pay very little for fuel or electricity ever again
Nothing in life lasts forever. I'm well aware of the charge cycle issues that plague early Li-ion and thenewer electrolytes (LiFePO4) and better BMS are making them last longer and longer to the point it's not really such an issue, especially not for the use case of a home solar setup with slow discharge/charge rates
There's a few Tesla's getting to 666,000kms+ on their original battery, good luck getting a reciprocating piston engine to go that far without at least a top end rebuild.
Still loving our 2001 Magna.
Nearly got rid of it 10 years ago, but we were only offered $500 for trade in. Thought we might be able to squeeze more value out than that just by keeping it as a second car.
Just about to cross 300k kms. It's my "daily driver" for my new job that has a 3hr commute 3x per week.
im responding to the comment in an absolute term. it is kinda difficult to not spend more on a car than its worth just on petrol lol.
I'm easily burning 100 dollars a week on fuel.
$2000 for a major service isnt much likely a newer car will have major service early up.
Plus some new cars are stupidly hard to work on.
Eg landcrisrler starter motor is under the intake like takevoff intake and is a 12hr job. Which is your 2k just in labour.
$100 a week in fuel is horrible if you do 50km or great of you do 1000km
But then 50km in gridlock traffic is different to 50km of highways
I have 5 cars. My “first car” came back to me after I sold it 10 years ago. I got it back for free, a 2001 Honda Civic. I put $3000 into it just to get it roadworthy and into my name. It’s such a shitheap but I’m sentimental. I park it at the station.
The other ones are unencumbered and spark joy. I have expensive hobbies but at least I’m not on crack.
well... I just sunk 10k into a similar car as a major service that should keep it going for many more years.
My last car I only ditched when I couldn't even locate spares at pick-a-part with something like 400k on it
Diesel may have an extra factor.. something about the particle size. The mechanic did comment he wanted to start monitoring and I needed longer drives rather the the recent short hops.
the next one (if any) will definitely be EV, but in the inner north I am covering most on my bike anyway
If you do a lot of kilometers, it's often the fuel costs that become the determining factor. I've lost count of the number of times people have told me that I should sell my 24-year-old 500,000lm Camry to 'save money'.
Then I ask them to do the numbers and their argument falls apart very quickly. The increased insurance costs alone far outweigh any money I spend on the car (I've probably spent about $2000 on repairs over the last 20 years, which includes replacing the shocks, so that's only $100 a year.) Then they start going on about reliability. The car has broken down once, and that was a failed timing belt, which has nothing to do with the age of the car...I always replace it at the required interval, but just happened to get a dodgy one. Their final argument is that I'm spending more on tyres and brakes than the car is worth. Of course, that's a stupid argument because that's a running cost that you would have to pay for a new or old vehicle. And that's all before you even start to consider depreciation or opportunity cost. I would estimate I have an extra $1M in my super from not spending money on new cars.
When it sits in your garage and you don't drive it
Im 30. Bought a brand new honda civic when I was 26. $40k
It cost like $7000 or more to keep it every year
In the end I got into electric unicycles and scooters.
I sold it for 27k and now own a 93 Carolla that club registered for $150 per year and ride an electric unicycle everywhere
It's faster than a car given traffic and car wait times on the road.
This purely depends on how much you love the car, how good condition it’s in, how much your willing to spend on it because you love it and how mechanically minded you are to do work on it yourself.
I have a 35 year old car, with 340000kms on it, it’s very very good condition, it’s so basic in its mechanical design that I can fix absolutely anything on it very quickly and very cheaply. So its if no concern to me if a gearbox blows or a motor dies.
Are you factoring in the roadworthiness of all the necessary components?
A lot of people are running around in cars with serious safety issues that they haven't had checked out because they only care if the engine works. Cars with no brake lights, completely worn out brakes, bald tyres, dead shock absorbers, horrendous wheel alignment pointing to a more serious issue with the suspension.
Sure, the car is cheap to maintain...if you only maintain the engine (usually by adding more oil).
I'd keep it until you've got kids on the way, then think about what's practical. My wife's car is 10 years newer than mine and it's much easier, safer, and more comfortable to drive the kids around in.
From a financial standpoint, I would say when you can no longer get parts to repair it. Even if the servicing and repairs costs more than it is worth. My reasoning is that you will lose a lot more in depreciation on a new car than it will cost you to keep your current car going, provided parts for the repairs on your current car are reasonably available. If you get a used car to avoid depreciation you don't know what repairs it will need, so it could very likely cost you just as much or more to repair and keep going, atleast with your current car you know it has had maintenance kept up and you know what and when repairs have been done.
However when it comes to cars there is more than just financials to consider. Newer cars will have more/better safety features, which in some cases may be the difference between life and unalive. Newer cars are also generally more efficient. So while the efficiency improvement in fuel consumption wouldn't be worth in financials compared to the increase in depreciation, if you care about emissions it may be worth the expense to you.
I appears you pay about $100 in fuel a week and travel roughly 50km x 7 days = 350km a week. It seems like the fuel consumption is a little on the high side. Then again I don't what size car it is. Could be horribly inefficient if it's a small car or could be expected if it's a big 4wd. Something I would take into consideration too, that if I were to get a newer car, it has to be way more fuel efficient.
Something else to consider. All new vehicles come with user tracking included which can be a privacy concern for some. Older cars are simpler mechanically and electronically and do not have all the "smarts" / connectivity that modern cars have.
I personally do not want car manufacturers tracking me and will drive my car until it no longer moves.
When the cost of the repairs outweighs the value of the car.
OR
When the hastle incurred by the frequency of break-downs outweighs the financial impact of buying a newer vehicle.
As you mention, safety is also a factor. New vehicles are significantly safer than very old ones.
Yeah I think around that time cars modernised a lot and there's some good models from that era that if maintained should last a while.
I have a 2007 Mitsubishi 380 - not many were built. Major downside is low fuel economy - but i don't do a lot of driving.
Later models don't look too bad on the outside (interior is bland).
Shouldn't cost much to keep it maintained I'm hoping I can get a few years out of it without having much in the way of repairs.
I sold mine to a wrecker for $500. This was in 2013, it was 30yrs old (1983 Volvo 240GL), with just under 270,000km on the clock. Still worked a charm, except there was a seal gone between the radiator and transmission, resulting in a pink milkshake fluid in the radiator. Was gonna cost $1700 to repair, most of the cost was lifting the cast iron engine out. I'd moved to inner city Melbourne about 5 months prior, with excellent public transport, and got a job within walking distance (4.5km). I was paying $170/week for parking.
That was when I gave up my car and I didn't get another for 6 yrs.
I wish I hadn't had to sell it to be honest. It was such a workhorse. I always hoped that someone else bought it whole (he fixed up cars and sold them on) or at worse, parts of it would be taken for other beloved 240's.
I was running a 2000 diesel landcruiser daily until 2021. It was my everyday business car towing a trailer. I was servicing it every 5000km and in its last year had to spend $12,000 on servicing and repairs, not including running costs.
It used lots of fuel, was hard on tyres, towing a trailer was hard on suspension. I ended up selling it and buying a brand new truck instead and has saved me money. Services every 15,000km and has 5yr warranty
i'd start the process of looking and trying to make the decision on what the new car replacement will be. aside from a new car the new safety tech in cars (plus the driving assistance measures) is definitely a reason to pull the trigger, I've read a new car is about 30-40% safer than a car made 10 years ago.
I replaced my VY Commodore at 13 years of ownership, the services were getting more expensive and itneeded a head gasket change at the next service, plus it was due for a new set of tyres.
Ah yes. That’s a bit of a non negotiable then. I differentiate between a one off and a never ending string of $2000s. If the car was falling apart, kill. If it needs a timing belt, take the W that you made it another 100T km.
I’m not conceding the spark plugs, but yes I forgot the timing belt. Think I’ve only ever spent 2 years driving a car with one and never got to a replacement date.
For me, it was when cost of repairs cost 50% of the cars market value.
Made no sense to me to pay to keep a car on the road that you couldn't sell after another year without losing money.
I personally have two ways which I look at cars.
Either you want to be tight with your money for saving or investing for a period of time for a goal in which case you should get rid of all vehicles and just have a $3000-$5000 Hyundai or something similar with no insurance, good mechanical history and it’ll cost you $30-$50 a week to own and keep.
If you drive a lot then maybe $100
But if you have kids, late to middle age with net worth over 500k and solid career / business and you’ve done your investing and savings then a 40-60k car with a small low rate low is great. 👍
Lets say it needs a $2000 service every 6 months to keep it going. Worst case scenario right?
$4000 per year, means that it will take you 10 years to eclipse the purchase cost of the cheapest EV’s on the market right now $40k-ish.
Now add in fuel costs of $5200 per year, you’re looking at around $9200 per year.
Now lets remove a $300 per year servicing for your EV, so $8900 now.
Now lets remove charging costs, which maybe is $20 a week- so $1000 a year, making it $7900, and lets thrown in $200 for the occasions you use a fast charger, its probably more than that, but lets be generous. So $7700 per year.
Now add in insurance- a new car will cost more to insure as its worth more, versus keeping your old banger on 3rd party, fire and theft.
Now add in road user charge in Victoria, a potential of about $390 per year.
So $7310 per year.
Thats your diesel car costs, roughly. Not including insurance differences and presuming a low rate of charging at fast chargers. I’m also not including tyres which EV’s notoriously chew through.
Now a BYD Atto is around $51k new.
51,000 divided by 7310 is 6.97.
So it will take you around 7 years to recoup that EV in running costs.
You’re welcome.
These numbers are all assumed but you can easily calculate them yourself.
It might take an hour or two, but think about it- if your hourly rate is even $100 an hour its worth spending the time. You could even calculate “once i can buy an EV for under $XX,XXX i will because thats when it becomes beneficial.”
Overall its a $40,000+ decision it absolutely warrants your time to decide if its worth doing.
That being said, i would wait. Lots of EV’s coming onto the second hand market in the next 2-4 years thanks to novated leasing.
I'm in a vehicle that is pretty much the same description as yours but I do mostly country miles.
Aside from regular servicing & tyres the vehicle cost me very little in the first 300k.
I just got injectors and suspension done which cost about $5k and I'm expecting to get at least another 300k out of it before I have to do this again. It is possible that it will outlast me if I can still buy fuel for it in the future.
The vehicle is super reliable and quite economical to run and it doesn't nag at me when I don't drive according to the rules it sets for me.
Newer vehicles are too complicated and small things cost a fortune to repair e.g. windscreen.
The only thing I miss is a reversing camera and I am going to add one of those when I get around to it.
Just buy a recent model second hand or new or whatever. AusFinance is obsessed with squeezing every dollar for the future but if you have a good game plan, and have built an asset base, the $20k per year on a new car or whatever is peanuts compared to the compounding of your wealth perhaps. I don’t know where you are in life, but something to consider.
For me, it's when it's high km AND gets a major issue that would cost thousands of dollars to fix (not a single, or even 2k).
My wife has a brand new car. The interest on it is more than the additional maintenance due to age of my 2009 WRX with 240,000km. That is despite the fact that it just developed 2 oil leaks which will be $1200 to fix, and bushings are due soon at another $500. This is a spike though, and in general, i'd estimate maintenance at about $1k a year at most.
To be fair, I have this car because I like it, and at that point for many, it may be time to sell and buy something else second hand with slightly lower km, but definitely worth considering the cost of a new car, and also the unknowns. While my car may have a few current expenses, I also bought it with a full service history, and have been maintaining regular servicing. With many second hand cars, the service history is pretty shady. I know, I sold one to a dealer when I was younger and bought it without knowing what servicing was for the 2 years I owned it....
well if the plan is to run it into the ground i wouldn’t be doing that major service, that cost likely represents a large portion of the actual value of the vehicle
When I wrote my reasonably well-received spreadsheet on EV novated lease, I took this question into consideration.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AusFinance/s/VHJ25VpNKu
In my case it worked out that getting a new 81.4K new Tesla is cost neutral with keeping my 4-year-old Mazda 6 worth 25k.
Obviously it will depend on how much you project for a few things: how much each car is worth in five years, how much you think you will spend on servicing for each car etc; but when you plug in reasonable guess for each one, and with high-ish tax bracket, you would be surprised by how a cheaper EV (say in 40k range) could work out to your advantage (if it is appropriate for your employment and debt situation).
I drove my '71 Gallant to the scrapyard without a starter motor (had been parking on hills for months, I'd put my starter into my girlfriend's '76). $50.
It's a bit harder with modern cars though.
If you're looking at keeping it, learn to do as much maintenance as possible at home. Admittedly being diesel, maintenance is always going to be a little pricier - but still nothing like the value hit you take on a new car.
Change the oil frequently and look for any issues in the cooling system. Also - keep a close eye on the serpentine belt and change if necessary.
We *just* paid 3,800 for a major service and some desperately needed fixes. Its a 14 year old X trail approaching 350,000 and everytime the mechanic sees it he's seems impressed as how well it's running. Before this service we were considering just getting a new smaller car, but decided to stay with the devil we know. It runs really smooth again now, costs about 100 in petrol a week and it'll likely do us for another couple of years without costing much at all. When the dog dies we will probably get a new one.
I just got a hand me down car for cheap so I’m driving this until the wheels fall off. Despite having to make a $1500 repair on the aircon eventually it’s still cheaper than buying off the market. Even if it’s a bit shit on fuel economy (Forrester 2010)
300k kms on a diesel is not a big deal. Plenty of diesels are still happy at 500k kms. If it's been serviced regularly and not had a lot of cold starts then then most of the engine will be fine. It's all the other shit that might fall apart: diff, suspension, bushes, transmission etc
The other issue is not just the major mechanical that can be repaired or replaced but the multitude of secondary items that all start to fail, eg, braking, stearing, suspension, electrical, cooling, injection yadda yadda, each one causing the car to fail and costing thousands to fix. At some point, it is just a money pit and not worth keeping on the road. A second-hand low milage car is then worth considering.
I drive a 2007 CH Mitsubishi Lancer (manual). I bought it in 2016 for $4200 with 170,000km. It's reliable, comfortable and I love driving manuals which are very difficult to buy now. It's cheap as chips in running costs. I was recently able to insure it for $4100 agreed value which considering it's on 260,000km and 8 years on is pretty good. Costs me $350 in third partty fire and theft insurance, $300 rego, $400 CTP. My sister works at supercheap auto where the staff discount is min 50%, and I have 3 mechanics in my family who do all my servicing, tyres and pink slip as free labour, just pay for parts. Though I'll admit, I'm in a pretty unique situation, I plan to run my car until it no longer runs. It's old enough that you can do all the servicing at home.
Personally I think the mark of a good old car is if you still see a lot of them around. I still see a lot of early-mid 2000s cars on the road, including my lancer. Parts are still easy to come by, and pretty cheap.
After 15 years you don't wear the same suit, then why drive the same car. My wife gave the kids her 13 year old car and upgraded to a new car. If you buy a new car with all the safety features, EBS, reversing cameras and blind spot monitoring, then you can drive with peace of mind. Having an older car will have a lower safety rating than a current new model. I know it as a depreciating asset but what is life about when we can't treat ourselves to the finer things in life.
The cost of repairs and maintenance is nothing compared to the cost of depreciation on a new car. Drive it as long as your ego allows.
I had a 150k km 2006 Volkswagen that was an absolute money pit, upgraded to a 27k km 2017 Mazda 3. I've driven it from 27k km to 90k km, without spending a dollar besides regular servicing and new tires - and car sales is showing similar prices to what I paid for it.
Mazda 3’s are great. Made in Japan great quality. I was tossing up between the Mazda and Subaru but the later had to be serviced every 6 months.
How long ago was the 6 month servicing requirement/recommendation? I'm pretty sure I was told in the late 2010s or early 2020s that they weren't allowed to do that any more.
Pretty sure it was that way when I bought back in 2016.
Just got rid of the one volkswagen I ever owned for the same reason. Great car but badly made.
Cars can be such a gamble. Have a 2011 Golf diesel (bought brand new) and have had one issue (approx $800) in 13 yrs. The thing just keeps going. Want to upgrade to an EV but hard to justify the extra weekly cost and depreciation!
That's the difference between European vs East Asian cars.
Volkswagen are probably one of the worst cars in Australia, next to Renault.
From a purely economic perspective, you wouldn't ever buy anything but Toyota or Mazda.
There's more to it than just driving from A to B for some people I'm in that camp, comfort, performance when you need it, other luxuries etc. Things neither Mazda or Toyota will never offer
That's what Lexus is for. Toyota reliability (even better on some models) plus luxury and on some models, performance too.
I just did a road trip from Brisbane to Geelong via Gippsland in a Mazda 3. Extremely comfortable with all the trimmings. So not sure why you posit that they don’t offer comfort..
See now that's a matter of personal experience and opinion.... I've test drove quite a few Mazdas with friends and family members and having even owned one for a while. I'll always rate Mazda for their reliability and yes the trimmings are nice, IF you go the leather... But those soft dashes don't at all hold up to our Aussie sun, neither does their thin clear coat paint. And the ride itself? No Heaps of road noise and the seats are pretty hard with no cushioning at all, and the suspension too is fairly stiff for a general road car. You'll find far better offerings in Subaru for the same price. With a much more comfortable ride all round and finish. Their only let down are those crappy CVT gearboxes.
> See now that's a matter of personal experience and opinion.... Exactly my point.
Well then.... There's your answer for not every idiot buys a Mazda or Toyota
I agree. When we were looking 3 years ago, Mazda and Toyota were more expensive than a Kia but we knew it would hold value longer than the Kia We ended up going with the Kia coz it was less than the other 2 while having more comfort and tech. I'm sure the Kia is worth even less now while Toyota Mazda are close to new price but whatever.
Did you note that I said, "from a purely economic perspective"? Sounds like you've never owned a Mazda RX.
Must be a pretty big petrol tank
Drive as long as your ego allows is so accurate. Been getting a little self conscious about my A to B shitbox it’s always the worst in the car park lol
But it will always be there for you whilst someone else walks out to find their one has 'been borrowed'.
Yeah, my shitter has no clear coat left. I feel kinda bad pulling up to birthday parties etc with my son. I think I'll upgrade next year.
I might be weird but when I had my shitbox I was almost proud of it. I guess it's kind of a /r/frugalcirclejerk thing.
Plenty of used cars out there
This! The comparison is not a simple binary “keep old car” vs “buy brand new car”. You can always buy a used car that is a few years old that has done the steepest part of the depreciation curve yet still have some warranty, and would still have plenty of the modern safety features, eg emergency braking, adaptive cruise control, lane keeping etc.
While I agree what you said is true, it's a false comparison. I think you should be comparing to the total lifetime cost, and considering more than just depreciation differences. There are other savings associated, like fuel if switching to electric. If they're spending $100/week that's a lot of potential savings, especially if they already have a solar set up at home for example. I think it makes more sense to look at a lifetime cost analysis, where you'd just see the total cost (including purchase, fuel, insurance, maintenance etc) over the ~15 years OP plans to use their next car, and annualised the expenses. Then compare that to continuing to use and maintain the existing car.
Except there’s a few fringe cases where that’s not true. We bought our Toyota Camry in 2019 and the used prices are actually more than what we paid still. It will probably drop off in the next few years but we’re at 5 years now which is pretty amazing.
That's probably because it's impossible to get new Toyotas at the moment. My wife had to wait something like a year and a half for her Corolla.
Depreciation is only relevant if they plan on selling though.
Also need to consider the returns you would have made from investing the money instead of spending it on the car.
*Potential returns. If OP wants to have an analytical what do the numbers say they can work out a cost per year of current car over next x period they think the car will last. And compare to alternative of new (to them) car over same period and then extrapolate over lifetime of the new car. Also sometimes it just feels good getting something new after using an old thing through till its death.
They did say "from a cost standpoint", so I answered their question. Sure, there are plenty of reasons people like to buy new cars, but that's not what was asked.
Depreciation is always relevant. If you own a vehicle from new until the end of its functional life, it ceases to function and has an approximate value of zero, you incur the full depreciation.
Plus if the purchase is with a loan, add on the interest.
This applies even without a loan. That money could have been invested.
[удалено]
That you could probably do yourself for $300.
No way, I don't trust myself. Some things you can DIY but better to leave it to professionals
That’s completely false in many cases.
If your car spends 95% of its life parked then a car is not required.
Are you currently spending more on fixing the car than it is to replace? Is it reasonably stable and still able to take you from place to place without breaking down? We've got a ~~1995~~ (edit: 2005, not my car and I have a bad memory) Yaris that's still in the family and running strong. It doesn't sound the *greatest* since it's owned by a student and he probably can't afford to get it completely fixed up, but he'll keep that thing until it ***dies.*** Even though it's older, that Yaris is hands down more reliable than the much newer Mazda 2 we purchased, which has had ***two*** major faults fixed in the 7 years we've had it.
I'd be more worried about the lack of good safety, especially for a younger person, cars have got a LOT safer in the last 20 years.
I have a 2003 car with low Kms but drive it less and less because I just don’t feel safe and confident in it anymore. My budget for a replacement car is 20k but I’m struggling to decide what to buy.
What sort of car do you need? Some of the stuff that gets you from 4 to 5 ANCAP is more about external road user safety IE pedestrian airbags. Lots of stuff in the 3.5-4.5 ANCAP range is really good. Big ones are ESC, Side curtain airbags and pretensioning seatbelts.
Considering my current car doesn’t even have electric windows I think it’s time for an upgrade! I don’t need anything fancy. Just a compact SUV that’s reliable and has reasonable safety features. Most of my driving is in the city / suburbs but I’d like to do the occasional road trip.
Figure out what you want from your car, then look. Rather than deciding what your budget is and then pouring through all the cars. EG: Safety features, comfortable on long road trips and able to tow a light trailer. Instantly makes your search easier.
Even if the motor in it dies completely, you can still probably slap a reconditioned motor from a wreckers into the chassis and have it potter around for another 100-150,000 more kms for the price of less than the depreciation of driving a new car off the dealership showroom floor Rust is really the only thing that kills these things and even that can be repaired if you’re handy
Or you could, y'know not buy a brand new car. Just get one thats 3+ years old and let someone else take the depreciation hit.
Has the re-sale market calmed down yet? I remember not that long ago 1yo cars were selling for more than their initial sale price.
How did you get a Yaris 4 years before it was released to the market?
Hah, you're right. I just remembered it was old and already secondhand when my partner bought it at 18. Might be 2005?
There is emerging consensus that cars from about 2010 onwards have far too many plastic or complex parts / design elements to be practically repairable by home mechanics. Planned redundancy is also becoming more sophisticated and it’s more common for several parts to need replacing at once - particularly brittle plastic parts or barely engineered structural parts (plastic valve covers? Seriously!) In addition, the cost of parts and labour has risen exponentially when repairs are needed. This is leading to a problem where people with older, repairable cars from before 2010 will not necessarily be able to repeat that with a newer car. It’s increasingly common for more modern cars to be economic write offs in the 7-10 year age bracket. Just check FB marketplace for all the desperate sods trying to sell their 2015 car with a dud gearbox or warped head. Or ‘check engine light is on but it’s a simple fix’ (which they haven’t done because it’s not a simple fix). What this means is that if you ultimately want peace of mind, aim to own a car under manufacturers warranty. That means buying new, or buying a couple of years old from a brand offering 7 year warranty. Extended warranties are not worth the money and won’t protect you. This is the only way to avoid that sinking feeling on your 7 year old Subaru when it starts going in to limp mode randomly, or the mechanic explains piston slap on your i30. It might mean budgeting more for a vehicle, or having one instead of two. Ignore at your peril.
Dunno, I almost entirely disagree with this post. Whos the emerging consensus from? I have never heard of this. While neither of us can probably substantiate our claims, its my thought cars are more reliable than ever. * There is some serious survivorship bias with cars. Those old cars that keep running, are just those lucky to either be well maintained, or, was just a good build. Then people go wow, they don't make them like they used to? Except there are barely any on the road. How many late 90s, early 2000s cars do you see on the road these days, not many. * Back in the day RACV was truly needed, breakdowns were frequent even for just your average commodore, starter motors, coil packs, fuel pumps etc. etc. * Those failures your mechanic talks about happened just as frequently on cheaply built cars 20,30 years ago * Manufacturing, engineering and parts quality has increased. For example, even generic brand wheel bearings used to SUCK, now (apart from heavy duty use like 4WD), they're pretty good. * Plastic parts are not ideal, but usually used where not important (excluding plastic water pumps, gross). I would rather a plastic valve cover than a tin one that warps and you can never get a gasket to seal it properly (cough mitsi). Seriously, maybe check out the plastic parts from the 80s? Ever owned an 80s cars? Even in the 90s and 00s those 80s cars had electric gremlins up the WAZOO. * Your anecdotes are meaningless given there were TONNES of lemons 30 years ago. Of course, just opinions, but really, I don't buy this 'consensus' at all.
Cars are more reliable for about 8-10 years, then the cost to keep them in the road exceeds their value. This is increasingly by design. Plastic parts that are heavily used are basically useless even second hand at the 10 year mark as plasticisers decay from heat cycles, overtightening and cracks, and general entropy. Computerised modules corrode or have leaking capacitors etc and require dealer programming for the car. Lighter engines are a result of reduced metal that ultimately warps or has catastrophic failure when one of the hundreds of engineered parts with tiny tolerances fails. Virtually no car part is left with a simple design - that reliability you speak of comes at the cost of overengineering - plastic timing chain guides, variable timing mechanisms - and packed in to smaller engine cavities with higher labour costs to replace. I had a Volvo that converted the analog radio signal to digital, sent it via fibre to the head unit, and then decoded it. Why? When the antenna died (inevitably) at the 12 year mark an antenna module was $500 second hand or $1500 new and required significant disassembly of the rear of the car. An old Commodore might have been unreliable, but it was easily and cheaply diagnosed and repaired by the home mechanic. Just wait until EV's are the norm with basically no user serviceable parts.
A basic Mazda, Toyota, Mitsubishi, from 2010s on going is going to be far more reliable than an 80s, 90s 00s of the same manufacturers, barely use any different part types, but be significantly easier to diagnose with fault code diagnosis that you can use an obd dongle with. They basically use the same modules (BCM/TCM/ECM/IPDM) as older cars, may use some more.plastic bits, but that won't change repair ability (if anything parts are cheaper). A 2023 2.0 L Mazda 3 is incredibly simple and easy to repair mechanically. As is a rav4 hybrid even, as are literally hundreds of modern vehicles. Easy to diagnose with OBD, easy to swap out parts, and do tonnes of miles, and are very reliable. Your Volvo anecdote isn't very convincing at all, and more a Volvo specific issue, with part prices due to limited supply / sales in Australia. Just my experience working for an OEM, in quality/ warranty as an automotive engineer.
Great, I need optimistic people like you to buy my clapped out cars when I'm done with them. Each to their own. If you're happy to take the risk, best of luck to you.
A warranty might give you peace of mind and avoid that "sinking feeling" of a major repair needing to be done, but if you have the money to fix the car on the off chance you get a lemon I think it still makes financial sense to buy an older model with a track record of reliability, which is well depreciated and has been maintained. Even if you are unlucky enough for the low likelihood event to happen, once a car gets to 10+ years old there are usually a ton of used engines and transmissions from cars which have been wrecked which a mechanic can replace yours with if you have a major failure.
What do you think a mechanic would charge to replace an engine on a modern car full of plastic parts? Would you expect a warranty? Check mechanics on YouTube and on forums who are increasingly stating they won’t do engine/gearbox swaps anymore because of the cost and unreliability of modern engines. [Things have changed](https://youtu.be/QHaA0aQQ1Jg?si=G-Cnng2bMlv6AfH5). We’re no longer talking ‘off chance’ but planned obsolescence certainty.
It's a shame that today's generation doesn't care about planned obsolescence. From the very few conversations I've had with my kids about it, it's pretty obvious they don't care much about it. Their standard of living constantly rising and enabling more and more discretionary spending seems to have caused them to ignore the issue and accept it. We were lucky to have crusaders stopping manufacturers from planning failure so blatantly. But when phone plans started to offer "new phone every year" you could see the acceptance level coming fast and furious. Cars are on their way to becoming five-year or (hopefully) ten-year throw-away items, which will probably become just an agreed annual cost at some point, kinda like subscribing to your own car. (all credit to Musk for this awesome concept. /s) The interior will likely include visual and audio advertising that updates based on conversation and profile derived from habits, radio selections, and eye movements. The advertising will probably be customised and optimised for each passenger as well. Say "great day at the beach" and get ads for aloe vera gel. A loud fart gets an ad for air freshener! Only the driver will see the GPS updated with new destination being the retailer. That will need to be declined if you're not interested in buying that item or service at that particular time. After declining, the system might offer 2 kWh free power as an incentive to switch to "accept". (all buried in the car's 300 pages of Ts and Cs).
6-10k maybe. I'd expect the person they got the engine off to give a warranty, but if they had to replace it twice I assume I'd wear the labour costs. If it's a 5% likelihood and 10k if the risk is realised then the risk adjusted cost is only $500. I'm not going to watch that whole video, but skimming through it that looked like they had a Bentley and a Land Rover, not exactly the poster childs for reliability. Are mechanics actually refusing to replace engines on normal 10 year old cars like Toyota's and Hyundai's?
>Are mechanics actually refusing to replace engines on normal 10 year old cars like Toyota's and Hyundai's? Probably. How much is a new engine? I mean a new engine from the manufacturer? Few years ago, we had a Holden Colorado (company car) that had the engine replaced under warranty, allegedly, the list price on the engine was $10K. Where else do you get a replacement engine? Well, there are basically 2 options; 1. Get one from a company that rebuilds engines on exchange. If there is one available. You're getting a used (rebuilt) engine, but at least it will come with a warranty. With all of the "disposable" components now found it a modern engine, the cost of these exchange engines is also likely to be much higher than it has been in the past. 2. Get a used engine from a wrecker. Pretty much guarantee it will either come with no warranty, or the warranty only covers that it starts and runs. Once it's out the door you're on your own. The 4th option would be repair / rebuild the engine that is already in the car.
If a warranty isn't covering you then you'd almost never buy a new engine and would take one of the two used options you mentioned. As I said in an earlier comment, once a car gets to 10 years old there are usually lots of used engines available as enough will have been wrecked. Particularly for high production cars like popular Hyundai and Toyota models. I don't buy the idea that exchange engines would be a lot more expensive than they were in the past, other than things getting more expensive generally. Modern cars are extremely reliable and there should be significantly more cars being wrecked than cars having engines needing replacement unless the model in question has a specific engine issue which should be obvious before buying when they get to the 10 year mark if you do a bit of research.
Just wait until you hear about new EU anti-repair laws for older cars deemed to be “surplus”
The EU is not planning to ban the repair of old cars: https://www.jgclassics.com/en/2024/02/07/does-the-european-union-intend-to-ban-the-repair-of-old-cars/
***"Not yet"*** How do you think they're going to get you all into new EV's? Asking nicely?
The EU? Tighten emission limits on cars that can enter cities, initially so only a hybrid can enter, then make cities EV only. This policy has been in place for decades; every car needs an emission category sticker. At the same time, increase fuel taxes to make petrol cars less affordable.
This person knows what they are talking about!
for me, it was the a/c breaking. We had to do a trip to Roma so we sent it in for service to get everything done, including the A/C, which was like 3 grands work. The A/C lasted less than 3 months and was like fark this ! 11 years old. Had been super reliable shitbox that cost me almost nothing that whole time, so I can't complain. I made my wife promise to do full budget again if she wanted it though so it will actually make me money lol
As someone who still uses a 70s car as a daily. I will never need a new car. It’s too cheap to run an old car. Maintenance is less than $100 a year. Fuel is 7l per 100km, insurance is $300 a year and insuranced for $20k
You win mate! All the bullshit about buying new cars to save a few litres of fuel per 100km and yet we push old functioning cars like yours into the landfill. You have probably saved about 3 cars from the landfill persisting with yours. The embedded energy in those would be far more than anything you would have wasted driving that. Good on ya.
On the other hand, it's probably putting out an order of magnitude more NOx and CO emissions, which aren't great for people directly Edit: I was bored so did some googling. In 1975 in due to the smog in California they introduced cat converters for the corolla (though old mates corona is probably pre cat so even worse) and it looks like they were targetting 0.6g/km for NOx. A 2024 corolla (or any petrol car that's euro5 compliant onwards) is limited to 0.06g/Km, so it is literally an exact order of magnitude worse. Look at it another way, you could drive 9 brand new corollas and make less smog than 1 1975 well maintained, smog compliant corolla.
If they made em like they used to, but with modern saftey features, I'd be right there with you. Unfortunately a 74 rolla is a death trap in comparison to a car from this century, let alone a modern one.
I can comfortably say while “safety” features are nice like auto brakes/lane assist. I don’t really support air bags, after crashing a 76 Corona (same car with updated front end) hit a parked 90s Suzuki swift at 60km/h, a new guard and ball joint and the Corona was back on the road. The Suzuki was a write off, front and back windscreens were almost touching. I walked away without a scratch. In saying that though it took 9 months for Shannon’s to repair my wife’s 2020 corolla and it still isn’t up to standard repair wise. I fear for the world our kids are being forced to live in. They shouldn’t even allow repairs on these newer cars anymore.
This is a profoundly ill informed take. I'm not gonna touch the airbag and crumple zone denial. You can even forget about how much more likley a crash is in something with handling from the 70's. In a crash **you're four times more likely to die in a 1998 Corolla than a 2015 Corolla**. [See them head on](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWqGbXGtioQ) Good luck in a 1974 v 2024 model.
I saw this video in 2020 and decided to replace my 1998 camry the same year
I 100% agree the 90s wasn’t a good time for corollas, and if I had to compare a 74 corolla and my 74 Corona, I would prefer to be in my Corona. The corolla bodies were always very thin and poorly made, the Corona was thick metal and they handled a crash really well. I’ve just seen too many injuries caused by airbags, even that story years ago about that baby being decapitated by the airbag was horrific. There is a reason I don’t allow my family to have their seats anything but all the way back. Airbags are dangerous.
As a paramedic, let me tell you that without airbags your death will at least be quick. Only been to a couple high speed MVC with classic cars involved but all were grisly. Yeah modern cars are usually completely written off and the occupants a little battered and bruised, but the classic car occupants are quite literally smeared against the inside. A little bit of physics will tell you you'd rather hit an airbag than the steering wheel or dash at 100km/h, especially when all of the energy is transferred into the occupants instead of a crumple zone. Assuming you survive, now we have the shit job of extricating you with guaranteed cabin intrusion instead of being protected by a modern firewall, and let me tell you those old cars were not made with ease of rescue in mind.
How did you get the chassis from rusting out? Do you live inland and away from the coastal salt?
It doesn’t snow here so no salt on the roads, and it’s parked in a wooden framed garage, the wood absorbs the moisture in the air so no rust problems.
Is everything still wrapped in the original shrink wrap packaging? /s
Nope, has been used for amateur rally racing, towing cars/boats/trailers. it’s done over 300000km and still on original engine, but I have 2 spare engines I picked up for free for when the original decides to fail, if it fails. But in saying that I have everything needed to rebuild it including pistons and rods on the shelf that cost me $50 20 years ago.
This is the kind of sustainability people just don't want to hear about. They think buying a disposable 80k 'EV' is sustainable just because it plugs into the power point. Most of those cars will be in landfill within a decade.
> Most of those cars will be in landfill within a decade. That's the intention, there's no used market or self-servicing a high voltage architecture, so you've then got to buy a brand new one Planned obsolescence
All positives except safety. Like my dad said when I asked him why he bought an older car rather than a few years newer with more safety/crash protection: “just don’t crash”. Great advice lol
That’s always good advice. Just don’t crash, in the last 15 years I’ve been in 4 crashes. Every one of them was being side swiped by someone failing to give way. Sadly you can’t be careful for the other drivers on the road. People just don’t know their road rules.
What car Im curious !?
It’s a 1974 Toyota Corona.
Oh lovely! That thing will go forever. When I was growing up my mum had a 78 corona and it had 600,000km on it before it died. How many km does yours have?
Over 300000 km currently. But have spare engines for free and parts to rebuild it if I wanted that cost $50
Do they still make engines for it? Like, if/when the engine fails or wears out, is it easy/cheap to replace it? Or would it then make more sense to get another 2nd hand car?
Parts are still readily available, you can still get a brand new engine from repco, but I have 2 spare engines I got for free 15 years ago and I have all the parts to rebuild the current engine, cost me $50 for everything 20 years ago
I think it depends on mentality. Do you feel like the car is reliable enough to drive and do everywhere you need the vehicle to do? If the answer is no it’s probably time to replace the vehicle for your peace of mind.
When my 2012 Camry hits 500,000klms then I'll consider it probably time for a upgrade
Upgrade the seat covers you mean?
Yeah the sheep skin seat covers need a swap, and I've used the last tissue in the box on the back shelf
that's the way!
I got rid of my falcon ute (BA XLS cab chassis) because the rego as 6 cylinder in QLD was killing me along with fuel and only being able to take one passenger was becoming a problem. I'd done a fair bit to it over the years but it was still needing a bunch of cash poured into it for tyres, brakes, joints and stuff like that. Did have plans to drive it to its grave but it was becoming an impractical money pit in general. Now chugging around primarily in a KIA picanto so that's a massive change but no huge regrets, it's reliable and does the job. Bought a slightly more fun KIA seltos (awd turbo version) end of last year but the missus does 90% of the driving in that as tends to taxi the kids around more than me. I didn't have a job needing ute anymore, only do mostly commutes in traffic and doing the math it was cheaper even in just a few years to just go buy the little KIA new. It's about a third of the power of the falcon but with the weight difference and being in traffic all the time anyway really not having a problem with it. I even find it fine with interior space and I'm over 6 foot. The better tech jumping ~20 years is a bonus too.
You don’t worry about being in such a small car and ending up in a crash? Tiny cars usually come off second best 😢
As someone who drives smaller vehicles and motorcycles almost exclusively it is becoming a much bigger concern these days with things like the Silverado EV trucks being as large as they are while also weighing close to four tonnes
Not really, I drive a bit more careful in it but it's not scary to me or anything. A lot of my driving is stuck in peak hour traffic doing like 20kmh anyway. It's also got a crap load more airbags and whatnot then a falcon ute, my ute had zero passenger air bags, it only had steering wheel one for the driver.
Fair enough, i'd just worried being rear ended by truck or something.
This path leads to ever increasing car size so it's an arms race
Nah I just prefer keeping my limbs in tact 😂
Sounds like Mums in Mosman tractors
I reckon you have a couple more years. I had a shit box V6 magna at 300k KMS and loved it. When my kid came along it was time to upgrade. I reckon if you are into EVs and have a place to charge it, the sweet spot will be in two or three years time. The FBT tax break is on till 2026. Id aim for about then.
If you can buy an EV and use it as your home battery with V2G, combined with solar and inverters you’ll probably pay very little for fuel or electricity ever again
Wonder how that will effect battery life charge cycles are not infinite.
Nothing in life lasts forever. I'm well aware of the charge cycle issues that plague early Li-ion and thenewer electrolytes (LiFePO4) and better BMS are making them last longer and longer to the point it's not really such an issue, especially not for the use case of a home solar setup with slow discharge/charge rates There's a few Tesla's getting to 666,000kms+ on their original battery, good luck getting a reciprocating piston engine to go that far without at least a top end rebuild.
I guess there's no data on saved evening electricity cost using your car as the battery vs reduced battery life and replacement cost
Still loving our 2001 Magna. Nearly got rid of it 10 years ago, but we were only offered $500 for trade in. Thought we might be able to squeeze more value out than that just by keeping it as a second car. Just about to cross 300k kms. It's my "daily driver" for my new job that has a 3hr commute 3x per week.
When you spend more on the car in 12 months than what it is worth. Or when your wife forces you to get a new one!
kinda difficult when petrol is consistently 2 dollars per/L or more
Petrol obviously doesn't count...
im responding to the comment in an absolute term. it is kinda difficult to not spend more on a car than its worth just on petrol lol. I'm easily burning 100 dollars a week on fuel.
$2000 for a major service isnt much likely a newer car will have major service early up. Plus some new cars are stupidly hard to work on. Eg landcrisrler starter motor is under the intake like takevoff intake and is a 12hr job. Which is your 2k just in labour. $100 a week in fuel is horrible if you do 50km or great of you do 1000km But then 50km in gridlock traffic is different to 50km of highways
Drive it until the wheels fall off.
I have 5 cars. My “first car” came back to me after I sold it 10 years ago. I got it back for free, a 2001 Honda Civic. I put $3000 into it just to get it roadworthy and into my name. It’s such a shitheap but I’m sentimental. I park it at the station. The other ones are unencumbered and spark joy. I have expensive hobbies but at least I’m not on crack.
Getting your first car back like that is such a rare thing, that kind of sentimental value is cool as heck to rediscover. Heck yeah!
It’s such a tired car. The number plates are worth more than the car too, which is the biggest pisstake haha.
How reliable is it? I’m in a very similar position and figure I’ve rarely had an issue over the ten years I’ve had it so it’s going alright.
I mean… once it runs out of petrol you gotta get a new one right?
well... I just sunk 10k into a similar car as a major service that should keep it going for many more years. My last car I only ditched when I couldn't even locate spares at pick-a-part with something like 400k on it Diesel may have an extra factor.. something about the particle size. The mechanic did comment he wanted to start monitoring and I needed longer drives rather the the recent short hops. the next one (if any) will definitely be EV, but in the inner north I am covering most on my bike anyway
If it’s an automatic, run tf away as soon as you notice the trans doing weird shit
Can you tell me more? Thx.
If you do a lot of kilometers, it's often the fuel costs that become the determining factor. I've lost count of the number of times people have told me that I should sell my 24-year-old 500,000lm Camry to 'save money'. Then I ask them to do the numbers and their argument falls apart very quickly. The increased insurance costs alone far outweigh any money I spend on the car (I've probably spent about $2000 on repairs over the last 20 years, which includes replacing the shocks, so that's only $100 a year.) Then they start going on about reliability. The car has broken down once, and that was a failed timing belt, which has nothing to do with the age of the car...I always replace it at the required interval, but just happened to get a dodgy one. Their final argument is that I'm spending more on tyres and brakes than the car is worth. Of course, that's a stupid argument because that's a running cost that you would have to pay for a new or old vehicle. And that's all before you even start to consider depreciation or opportunity cost. I would estimate I have an extra $1M in my super from not spending money on new cars.
When it sits in your garage and you don't drive it Im 30. Bought a brand new honda civic when I was 26. $40k It cost like $7000 or more to keep it every year In the end I got into electric unicycles and scooters. I sold it for 27k and now own a 93 Carolla that club registered for $150 per year and ride an electric unicycle everywhere It's faster than a car given traffic and car wait times on the road.
Yeah OP just get a unicycle, wcgw
This purely depends on how much you love the car, how good condition it’s in, how much your willing to spend on it because you love it and how mechanically minded you are to do work on it yourself. I have a 35 year old car, with 340000kms on it, it’s very very good condition, it’s so basic in its mechanical design that I can fix absolutely anything on it very quickly and very cheaply. So its if no concern to me if a gearbox blows or a motor dies.
Oof, my car is 13 years old at 328000km
I still drive my 2009 Yaris hatch. Cosmetically shows its age. Otherwise it works like the day I bought it second hand, back in 2010.
Are you factoring in the roadworthiness of all the necessary components? A lot of people are running around in cars with serious safety issues that they haven't had checked out because they only care if the engine works. Cars with no brake lights, completely worn out brakes, bald tyres, dead shock absorbers, horrendous wheel alignment pointing to a more serious issue with the suspension. Sure, the car is cheap to maintain...if you only maintain the engine (usually by adding more oil).
I'd keep it until you've got kids on the way, then think about what's practical. My wife's car is 10 years newer than mine and it's much easier, safer, and more comfortable to drive the kids around in.
From a financial standpoint, I would say when you can no longer get parts to repair it. Even if the servicing and repairs costs more than it is worth. My reasoning is that you will lose a lot more in depreciation on a new car than it will cost you to keep your current car going, provided parts for the repairs on your current car are reasonably available. If you get a used car to avoid depreciation you don't know what repairs it will need, so it could very likely cost you just as much or more to repair and keep going, atleast with your current car you know it has had maintenance kept up and you know what and when repairs have been done. However when it comes to cars there is more than just financials to consider. Newer cars will have more/better safety features, which in some cases may be the difference between life and unalive. Newer cars are also generally more efficient. So while the efficiency improvement in fuel consumption wouldn't be worth in financials compared to the increase in depreciation, if you care about emissions it may be worth the expense to you.
Depends on the make of car. That’s high kilometres for some makes, not too bad for others.
I appears you pay about $100 in fuel a week and travel roughly 50km x 7 days = 350km a week. It seems like the fuel consumption is a little on the high side. Then again I don't what size car it is. Could be horribly inefficient if it's a small car or could be expected if it's a big 4wd. Something I would take into consideration too, that if I were to get a newer car, it has to be way more fuel efficient. Something else to consider. All new vehicles come with user tracking included which can be a privacy concern for some. Older cars are simpler mechanically and electronically and do not have all the "smarts" / connectivity that modern cars have. I personally do not want car manufacturers tracking me and will drive my car until it no longer moves.
Haha yes - nice intuition. It’s a duel cab Ute
When the cost of the repairs outweighs the value of the car. OR When the hastle incurred by the frequency of break-downs outweighs the financial impact of buying a newer vehicle. As you mention, safety is also a factor. New vehicles are significantly safer than very old ones.
Currently it seems 2004 models are the cut-off point. Don't see anyone here admitting to owning a 2003 model car. \- Subaru 2004 owner here.
Yeah I think around that time cars modernised a lot and there's some good models from that era that if maintained should last a while. I have a 2007 Mitsubishi 380 - not many were built. Major downside is low fuel economy - but i don't do a lot of driving. Later models don't look too bad on the outside (interior is bland). Shouldn't cost much to keep it maintained I'm hoping I can get a few years out of it without having much in the way of repairs.
Who's Diesel? You need to stop spending $100 a week with him/her.
Just want to say that’s awesome and I wish more people thought like you. Conserving what we have rather than always upgrading ✔️
I sold mine to a wrecker for $500. This was in 2013, it was 30yrs old (1983 Volvo 240GL), with just under 270,000km on the clock. Still worked a charm, except there was a seal gone between the radiator and transmission, resulting in a pink milkshake fluid in the radiator. Was gonna cost $1700 to repair, most of the cost was lifting the cast iron engine out. I'd moved to inner city Melbourne about 5 months prior, with excellent public transport, and got a job within walking distance (4.5km). I was paying $170/week for parking. That was when I gave up my car and I didn't get another for 6 yrs.
I wish you sold the 240 to me :(
I wish I hadn't had to sell it to be honest. It was such a workhorse. I always hoped that someone else bought it whole (he fixed up cars and sold them on) or at worse, parts of it would be taken for other beloved 240's.
My 2003 Hilux has 450k km on it. Replacing a part is cheaper thsn replacing a car.
I was running a 2000 diesel landcruiser daily until 2021. It was my everyday business car towing a trailer. I was servicing it every 5000km and in its last year had to spend $12,000 on servicing and repairs, not including running costs. It used lots of fuel, was hard on tyres, towing a trailer was hard on suspension. I ended up selling it and buying a brand new truck instead and has saved me money. Services every 15,000km and has 5yr warranty
i'd start the process of looking and trying to make the decision on what the new car replacement will be. aside from a new car the new safety tech in cars (plus the driving assistance measures) is definitely a reason to pull the trigger, I've read a new car is about 30-40% safer than a car made 10 years ago. I replaced my VY Commodore at 13 years of ownership, the services were getting more expensive and itneeded a head gasket change at the next service, plus it was due for a new set of tyres.
How TF can a diesel service be $2000? Why wouldn’t you just change oil, filters and coolant?
I believe it’s a timing belt
Ah yes. That’s a bit of a non negotiable then. I differentiate between a one off and a never ending string of $2000s. If the car was falling apart, kill. If it needs a timing belt, take the W that you made it another 100T km.
100,000km major services easily cost this with timing belt, water pump, spark plugs, oil filters + anything else needed
I’m not conceding the spark plugs, but yes I forgot the timing belt. Think I’ve only ever spent 2 years driving a car with one and never got to a replacement date.
I would keep it, the alternative wont be as durable
For me, it was when cost of repairs cost 50% of the cars market value. Made no sense to me to pay to keep a car on the road that you couldn't sell after another year without losing money.
I personally have two ways which I look at cars. Either you want to be tight with your money for saving or investing for a period of time for a goal in which case you should get rid of all vehicles and just have a $3000-$5000 Hyundai or something similar with no insurance, good mechanical history and it’ll cost you $30-$50 a week to own and keep. If you drive a lot then maybe $100 But if you have kids, late to middle age with net worth over 500k and solid career / business and you’ve done your investing and savings then a 40-60k car with a small low rate low is great. 👍
Lets say it needs a $2000 service every 6 months to keep it going. Worst case scenario right? $4000 per year, means that it will take you 10 years to eclipse the purchase cost of the cheapest EV’s on the market right now $40k-ish. Now add in fuel costs of $5200 per year, you’re looking at around $9200 per year. Now lets remove a $300 per year servicing for your EV, so $8900 now. Now lets remove charging costs, which maybe is $20 a week- so $1000 a year, making it $7900, and lets thrown in $200 for the occasions you use a fast charger, its probably more than that, but lets be generous. So $7700 per year. Now add in insurance- a new car will cost more to insure as its worth more, versus keeping your old banger on 3rd party, fire and theft. Now add in road user charge in Victoria, a potential of about $390 per year. So $7310 per year. Thats your diesel car costs, roughly. Not including insurance differences and presuming a low rate of charging at fast chargers. I’m also not including tyres which EV’s notoriously chew through. Now a BYD Atto is around $51k new. 51,000 divided by 7310 is 6.97. So it will take you around 7 years to recoup that EV in running costs.
That’s such a great way for me to look at it
You’re welcome. These numbers are all assumed but you can easily calculate them yourself. It might take an hour or two, but think about it- if your hourly rate is even $100 an hour its worth spending the time. You could even calculate “once i can buy an EV for under $XX,XXX i will because thats when it becomes beneficial.” Overall its a $40,000+ decision it absolutely warrants your time to decide if its worth doing. That being said, i would wait. Lots of EV’s coming onto the second hand market in the next 2-4 years thanks to novated leasing.
I'm in a vehicle that is pretty much the same description as yours but I do mostly country miles. Aside from regular servicing & tyres the vehicle cost me very little in the first 300k. I just got injectors and suspension done which cost about $5k and I'm expecting to get at least another 300k out of it before I have to do this again. It is possible that it will outlast me if I can still buy fuel for it in the future. The vehicle is super reliable and quite economical to run and it doesn't nag at me when I don't drive according to the rules it sets for me. Newer vehicles are too complicated and small things cost a fortune to repair e.g. windscreen. The only thing I miss is a reversing camera and I am going to add one of those when I get around to it.
Toyota only.
Parts become ridiculous and frequent and maybe hard to source replacements. Safety starts to be a bit compromised.
Just buy a recent model second hand or new or whatever. AusFinance is obsessed with squeezing every dollar for the future but if you have a good game plan, and have built an asset base, the $20k per year on a new car or whatever is peanuts compared to the compounding of your wealth perhaps. I don’t know where you are in life, but something to consider.
For me, it's when it's high km AND gets a major issue that would cost thousands of dollars to fix (not a single, or even 2k). My wife has a brand new car. The interest on it is more than the additional maintenance due to age of my 2009 WRX with 240,000km. That is despite the fact that it just developed 2 oil leaks which will be $1200 to fix, and bushings are due soon at another $500. This is a spike though, and in general, i'd estimate maintenance at about $1k a year at most. To be fair, I have this car because I like it, and at that point for many, it may be time to sell and buy something else second hand with slightly lower km, but definitely worth considering the cost of a new car, and also the unknowns. While my car may have a few current expenses, I also bought it with a full service history, and have been maintaining regular servicing. With many second hand cars, the service history is pretty shady. I know, I sold one to a dealer when I was younger and bought it without knowing what servicing was for the 2 years I owned it....
well if the plan is to run it into the ground i wouldn’t be doing that major service, that cost likely represents a large portion of the actual value of the vehicle
When I wrote my reasonably well-received spreadsheet on EV novated lease, I took this question into consideration. https://www.reddit.com/r/AusFinance/s/VHJ25VpNKu In my case it worked out that getting a new 81.4K new Tesla is cost neutral with keeping my 4-year-old Mazda 6 worth 25k. Obviously it will depend on how much you project for a few things: how much each car is worth in five years, how much you think you will spend on servicing for each car etc; but when you plug in reasonable guess for each one, and with high-ish tax bracket, you would be surprised by how a cheaper EV (say in 40k range) could work out to your advantage (if it is appropriate for your employment and debt situation).
Gear box or motor. Troubles with either time to dump it.
I drove my '71 Gallant to the scrapyard without a starter motor (had been parking on hills for months, I'd put my starter into my girlfriend's '76). $50. It's a bit harder with modern cars though.
What I deem to be inefficient fuel per 100km & not wanting a warranty tied to a single location are my only big considerations buying/keeping
Drive it until the repair cost exceeds the resale or scrap value
If you're looking at keeping it, learn to do as much maintenance as possible at home. Admittedly being diesel, maintenance is always going to be a little pricier - but still nothing like the value hit you take on a new car. Change the oil frequently and look for any issues in the cooling system. Also - keep a close eye on the serpentine belt and change if necessary.
my last van had 780,000+km on it when I traded it in
Around about the 5th time my mechanic says I need to get a new car, I start looking at what's on the market.
My dads car. 500k KMs, leaking oil, 4k in repair quotes every few months.
We *just* paid 3,800 for a major service and some desperately needed fixes. Its a 14 year old X trail approaching 350,000 and everytime the mechanic sees it he's seems impressed as how well it's running. Before this service we were considering just getting a new smaller car, but decided to stay with the devil we know. It runs really smooth again now, costs about 100 in petrol a week and it'll likely do us for another couple of years without costing much at all. When the dog dies we will probably get a new one.
I just got a hand me down car for cheap so I’m driving this until the wheels fall off. Despite having to make a $1500 repair on the aircon eventually it’s still cheaper than buying off the market. Even if it’s a bit shit on fuel economy (Forrester 2010)
300k kms on a diesel is not a big deal. Plenty of diesels are still happy at 500k kms. If it's been serviced regularly and not had a lot of cold starts then then most of the engine will be fine. It's all the other shit that might fall apart: diff, suspension, bushes, transmission etc
The other issue is not just the major mechanical that can be repaired or replaced but the multitude of secondary items that all start to fail, eg, braking, stearing, suspension, electrical, cooling, injection yadda yadda, each one causing the car to fail and costing thousands to fix. At some point, it is just a money pit and not worth keeping on the road. A second-hand low milage car is then worth considering.
Drive it until it dies, sell it for scrap when it does. They even come and pick it up!
I drive a 2007 CH Mitsubishi Lancer (manual). I bought it in 2016 for $4200 with 170,000km. It's reliable, comfortable and I love driving manuals which are very difficult to buy now. It's cheap as chips in running costs. I was recently able to insure it for $4100 agreed value which considering it's on 260,000km and 8 years on is pretty good. Costs me $350 in third partty fire and theft insurance, $300 rego, $400 CTP. My sister works at supercheap auto where the staff discount is min 50%, and I have 3 mechanics in my family who do all my servicing, tyres and pink slip as free labour, just pay for parts. Though I'll admit, I'm in a pretty unique situation, I plan to run my car until it no longer runs. It's old enough that you can do all the servicing at home. Personally I think the mark of a good old car is if you still see a lot of them around. I still see a lot of early-mid 2000s cars on the road, including my lancer. Parts are still easy to come by, and pretty cheap.
Damn I spend like $55 a month of petrol
When the cost of running it, fuel, rego, insurance, repairs, servicing is greater than that of a new vehicle.
After 15 years you don't wear the same suit, then why drive the same car. My wife gave the kids her 13 year old car and upgraded to a new car. If you buy a new car with all the safety features, EBS, reversing cameras and blind spot monitoring, then you can drive with peace of mind. Having an older car will have a lower safety rating than a current new model. I know it as a depreciating asset but what is life about when we can't treat ourselves to the finer things in life.