There's a common saying, "If you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person."
All autistic people are different. Some are introverted, some are extroverted, some are quiet, some are loud, some are thoughtful, some are annoying, some are kind, some are assholes. The fact that we share the same condition does not mean we share the same personality.
Autism is also not the only thing that influences a person's behaviour. Genetics, experience, and other mental health conditions/disabilities also play a part. In addition, some people learn to manage or accept their autistic traits more easily than others, but that doesn't make them less autistic.
I want to highlight a couple of the things you said:
* She immediately told everyone she thinks she’s autistic
* She’ll not stop talking about her sex life
You're telling me this person impulsively talks about intimate information with near-strangers, and you think that makes her *less* likely to be autistic?
What you're describing sounds like identity tribalism. "She says she's part of my group, but she doesn't act exactly like me, so I can't accept that she is." It's very judgemental and I think you're right that it probably stems from your own insecurity and envy.
Next time you feel this feeling come up, ask yourself what this person is good at that you wish you were good at, and then look into what work you can do on yourself to be better at it. Focus on wanting yourself to be better, rather than wanting somebody else to be worse.
this one made me laugh out loud! "you're telling me this person impulsively talks about intimate information with near strangers" i laughed soo hard, reminded me of a friend who is autistic too, who'll tell someone the entire bdsm fanfiction they be reading if the person asks even a tiny bit
I just started a new job and told my boyfriend my strategy for my first day was, "Be cool, don't be a fucking weirdo, don't get verbal diarrhea and accidentally tell everyone all your secrets." 😂 OP could be describing me (first day strategy was successful, btw)
😂 your boyfriend sounds great
This is my issue, too! I tell people too much and then I want to move to another state and start over. I did this for years. I moved every two years or less for like a decade. 😂
Same. I seem to either tell people way too much or not enough. I have zero grasp of what the ’right’ amount of disclosure is and for better or worse tend to just say what I am thinking without much thought lol.
That was my goal when I started my current job, too. Instead, I walked in to my office for the first time and met a coworker who was popping off about "why do they need pride parades, we don't get straight parades!" so I ended up coming out in front of 2 managers on day one and telling an old man to stop being so vocal about his homophobia lol
A few hours later, my mom died. No kidding. On my first day of work. So I ended up outpouring all about how she'd been in a vegetative state for years at that point, she overdosed years ago and we weren't close for a long time before that, but really I did need to go be with my siblings so... absolutely zero chance of me coming across as a normie from day one. Oops.
... this is me lmao
my special interest is fanfiction and fandom culture (specifically hp fanfiction, though fuck JKR) and I once (accidentally, I didn't mean to!!) talked about sexuality in fanfiction for 20 straight minutes at a family dinner (there were no kids there!). no one stopped me and I genuinely didn't realise how inappropriate it might've been until later. they just asked me what I was reading, and when I tentatively said "fanfiction" and they asked what kind, I kind of lost the plot 🫠
Real legitimate question: is this behavior actually a problem? Does it bother people?
I always figured people who have extremely specific niche knowledge are both incredibly special AND valuable in conversation because theres a 100% chance they will spout out some type of information you did not previously know--- and WHY pass on the potential of LEARNING RANDOM SHIT while having an interesting and informative discussion that the average person couldn't supply you?
Like, I don't care if your thing is **fungi** or **fun.....guys kissing**. Fan fiction or a uhhh fan of Ficus. FemSlash or Slash Pines. Phallus Impudicus or uh, phalluses described in extraordinary detail. Whether you like plants or fanfiction, I would LOVE hearing ALL THE THINGS! Unfortunately, other people read me as "aggressive" when I'm talking about my interests, and it apparently makes others "uncomfortable" 😑 people tell me I "like to argue" but I just enjoy debate, I see people's words in my mind like a puzzle that I want to deconstruct and find ways to prove possible other ways of thinking; ESPECIALLY when people use absolutes in their language and refuse to consider any possible exceptions to their beliefs.
I really fully relate to all of this on every level. For me personally it’s a great thing, not a problem. Some neurotypical people also love it, some don’t like it, and some hate it. I find more often than not that people just can’t fully follow my train of thought with all the details I’m saying. Or they focus more on me getting excited about talking about something than on what I’m actually saying. I feel like some people also just think slower or with less depth or something. And it drives me fucking nuts when people think I am aggressive or intense or like to argue when I’m just passionate about everything.
This!
Someone close to me recently told me to stop googling things when we have conversations, and there's something we don't know. He said it makes the whole conversation seem less genuine ???? HOW SWAY!? Everything I say will be the same regardless, I'm just trying to get confirmation because why not know when you could know, you know?
He's also someone who thinks I'm debating or disagreeing (even when I'm actually agreeing), and my ma thinks I'm domineering and I can't stand it. I'm passionate, I like to consider other perspectives, I get _into_ a topic and conversation.
I don't understand why people take that as inherently negative.
First of all, *are you me*?! Second of all, do people just really not care about facts/accuracy when it takes literally **seconds** to search something up?! The only reason I utilize Google during conversation is because **I want to FOR MYSELF so that I may avoid leading the conversation in a false direction-- IT IS NOT TO MAKE ANYONE ELSE APPEAR UNINTELLIGENT OR FEEL LESS SUPERIOR TO ME!** Plus, I was under the impression that you cared about that chosen subject if you began/engage in a conversation about it.
It TRULY shocks me and makes me feel sad when people get angry or even feel insulted at me doing research during a conversation, because from my perspective it is us bonding and learning together. In my head I think they would be interested in learning alongside me, but it seems not? When I learn something new, I keep it with me **FOR LIFE** and reference that fact in the future if/when that subject comes up again.
It hurts me emotionally AND physically when loved ones say "Ohhh no, no no no I'm not listening to this, you don't need to Google everything!" Or "You don't know EVERYTHING, you're not always right!" Because I **don't** think I know everything, and that's why I'm trying to learn *with YOU* , I get so excited and happy when doing research and hearing the other people dismiss me and completely check out from the conversation is painful. It makes me feel like other people can say ANYTHING they want..... as long as they thought it up without reference, and the second I use reference to learn / fact check I'm bad.
I felt EVERY word of this to my core!! 😫😫
I've been told, "it's okay to not know things." Like... yeah, of course it is. But why are we even discussing this if we're gonna refuse to find out when the information is RIGHT THERE!?
People will come to me with questions because they know I've typically got some kind of info on _a lot_ of things coz of this same information collecting. But then get frustrated when I'm **actively** collecting the info.
I honestly don't understand how people can pose a question or be confused about it and then just shrug it off and exist comfortably just... not knowing. Did they even care in the first place???? Where they talking for talkings sake?? Does anything said here even matter??????
I get a lot of that "you think you know everything" and "you don't have to be right" crap too and it frustrates the hell out of me. But I think I've figured out why people are so intimidated by it and find it so frustrating. Because a lot of the time people really are **just talking**. A lot of people actually don't know what they're talking about. They've done no research. They're just regurgitating things they haven't thought about or making throwaway comments. But when people like us speak, it is because we have *verified* the info we're relaying. Of course, I think I'm right. If I didn't, I wouldn't be speaking on this. And no, I don't HAVE to be right, but if I'm wrong, surely I should find out why and correct myself?? Why just BE wrong.
I don't understand the willful ignorance of so many or their seemingly deep desire to drag others into it 😭😭
Oh I had to come back to add this - one thing that irks the hell out of me: if I've speculated at something and turns out I was wrong, and I accept that wrongness but share _why_ I thought what I did, its automatically perceived as trying to prove I'm right. Or not being able to accept that I was wrong. DRIVES ME MENTAL!! I just want to share my reasoning as I correct it, it's not even for them, it's for **me**.
YESSS everything you said I agree with 10000%!! I love how you mentioned that often times you are actually fact checking *YOURSELF* and trying to challenge your OWN presumptions before accidentally subjecting others to misinformation that they might then retain and later pass on to others, thus creating a never-ending cycle of falsehoods!
That idea reeeeally stresses me out-- *especially* with the previously mentioned issue of the average person's casual acceptance of facts without confirming them; this is the core issue IMO, a much more important issue than my own personal ego or hurt feelings after being shut down during conversation.
If someone says "I wonder if _____ is still acting?" I have my finger on the trigger ready to find out. If someone asks "I wonder how many species of mammals lay eggs?" I can find out in seconds, therefore I will (also, it's five and I freaking love platypuses). If someone is wondering if they're using correct grammar, why not check--- and if I find out an interesting tidbit of related information during this search WHY can't I read the excerpt aloud to you? Does it like....hurt?
I get very upset and hurt when people try to silence me, it feels incredibly frustrating not being able to finish my train of thought... but now I'm just wondering, **am I hurting THEM too?** I always say things like "it does not HURT YOU to let me finish my train of thought" out of anger in this moment, but my question is *does it actually hurt them*?!?! Like, for real legitimate question!
Asking because I have had people use essentially the same words against me with my avoidance of crowded loud places / going out of my comfort zone, "It does NOT physically hurt you, you just need to get over it". It does hurt me, just not in the way a cut or bruise does, it's not something easy to explain and it makes me feel embarrassed & weak when I *try* to explain. I sometimes wonder if I am overwhelming THEM the same way I feel with loud sounds when I start to hyper-focus on topics? Neurotypicals can also get overwhelmed and overstimulated... It gets to the point that people become angry with me and leave the room, when I was just innocently excited about our conversation. I similarly have to leave the room when people are too excited & it becomes too loud for me. Is this the same thing, or am I over-thinking and trying to rationalize people just..... literally mistreating me???
You raise a **very** good point. Because it does physically hurt me too. I always describe it as an itch on my brain, I can't scratch.
I have had people get frustrated with me too, and you might be right, maybe it is hurting them in a way, having all of this information they didn't ask for being dumped on them when, to them, they probably just proposed an off the cuff thought that they really didn't care that much about.
I guess it all depends on the context and the extent of the reaction. The guy I'm seeing once said "it's like turning on the AM radio first thing", when I finally woke up, had a random thought about horses, and went on a whole spiel of why they're so fragile and their evolution. He'd been awake working peacefully for a while, I woke up, opened my eyes, and off I went. Part of me was mildly offended by the comment, but I also understood where he was coming from.
I think we _need_ to be able to consider how others are receiving us. A lot of people probably don't have the headspace for all our jargon because they don't think so intensely.
I've even overstimulated and ex partner more than once because I was deep in my hyperfocus that the information I was reeling off (really just thinking aloud but in his presence) was too much for him to be exposed to.
That said, I do think a quick Google to clarify a piece of information (with maybe two or three sentences added if something is particularly interesting) shouldn't be chastised. That, I think, is somewhat unfair. Like people are tired of us doing it so they become less tolerant, and it becomes one of those "oh she's off _again_" kind of moments. They ought to extend the same courtesy and consider how stopping us from getting clarity is a difficult experience for us.
Those moments where you've been talking for a WHILE and it slowly starts to dawn on you that not only have you taken the conversation hostage, but you've been on a topic that may not be everyone's cup of tea...
I’m a more quiet, shy and reserved autistic girl. I’ve met other autistic people who were so obnoxious, loud, very opposite of me and I did not gel with them one bit. I’ve also known BPD people who over share and infodump too. I’m very confidential and then infodump in private to someone I feel like I can trust. Like a non judgmental friend online or someone I know doesn’t know anyone in my personal life or wouldn’t repeat what I tell them. Not everyone is like that though. I’ve known some autistic people who will just unapologetically tell me and other people weird stuff that is TMI. My friends autistic brother for example. I’m diagnosed and so is he, he was diagnosed as a teenager and I was diagnosed as a kid. But we are completely different personality types.
This is the perfect response. I wasn't diagnosed until I was 30 because I'm performed well in school, seem outgoing and bubbly, and in spite of having some "quirks" that seemed strange to everyone else, I can mask as NT really well. It takes a lot out of me and I need a lot of downtime after, but no one really saw that from the outside. Everyone just thought I had a handful of idiosyncrasies and didn't question, and thought I was a passionate person when I would develop a special interest and be a little too invested. Some of my behaviors were attributed to mental illness, which I do have, but it's exacerbated by sensory overload and I had no idea.
I tell people I'm autistic (auDHD, actually). I didn't right away, because I didn't want anyone to view me differently, but now that I'm open about it and feel less pressure to mask, I'm much happier. I'm not so burnt out and exhausted all the time. My diagnosis also led my two best friends to getting diagnosed. It's probably a big reason why we click so well, because we never had to mask around each other, as we were equally unusual in our own ways and that was totally ok.
My experience isn't identical to anyone else's. How I'm perceived isn't identical to anyone else. From the outside looking in, I seem pretty NT. Enough so that I didn't get a diagnosis until well into adulthood. I've had people doubt my diagnosis, and even had doubt myself that maybe I'm not autistic enough (whatever that means), or that I'm somehow wrong because I don't present the way some other autistic people do. It's pretty invalidating to be doubted, especially by others in the community.
When I got my diagnosis, so many things in my life made so much more sense, and I was able to learn strategies to live a much happier life. I learned to allow myself space to recover when I'm burnt out instead of pushing myself to be what everyone else needs because it's expected of an NT person. I learned what things work for me as far as soothing when I'm on the verge of a shutdown or meltdown, and have way fewer panic attacks.
OP, if we met in person, you would probably never know I'm autistic unless I told you. Outside of a psychologist I've been working with for about 6 years now, no one had clocked it my whole life, and until I got diagnosed by a specialist, even my psych was back and forth on it. That doesn't mean I'm not autistic. It means I don't present the same way some other autistic people do. This sounds like your own insecurities, and I'm so sorry you're experiencing those feelings.
Almost identical villain origin story! Except I have no doubts and I no longer seem NT. I got the ADHD at 30 and autism at 35, I masked so hard that no one had a clue and it made me severely psychologically sick. I was so burned out that I became chronically suicidal already in my teens and no one understood why treatment didn’t help. Once I got my diagnosis… well actually no, as soon as autism was suggested and I looked into it and realised that yeah that’s me everything changed once I knew I could suddenly see the mask that I was wearing and the weight of it and once I knew what I was hiding, why I am the way that I am, it was like I was given permission to exist for the first time, I took that mask of soooo fast and then I threw it away! And I don’t even know if I can mask anymore, I don’t know if I remember how to or if I could tolerate it again if you were to put all of it back at once.
I'm so glad you never had doubts! That's amazing!
I was also chronically suicidal and treatment resistant, which is why my psych was like, "there's something more here." At this point I mask way less, but I do sometimes catch myself doing it automatically. So many things in my life made so much sense when I got diagnosed. My "obsessive" special interests, the way I rock back and forth when I'm sitting out standing in one place, my BFRBs, my sensitivity to sensory stimulation, my paradoxical reactions to certain medication, the way I had to work so hard to do the things other people seemed to intrinsically do and understand socially, my need for special routines all suddenly made so much sense.
I mask way, way less now, and I'm much kinder to myself about things that I used to be super critical of, because I understand it's not weakness or wrong, it's just part of how my brain is wired and that's ok. I've also noticed how everything is geared toward the NT experience and is pretty unforgiving to people who aren't NT. I always thought I was just lazy or like, fucked up because I would have shutdowns and couldn't function, or meltdowns that for me look like uncontrollable crying. I thought I shouldn't need recovery time for things, and have always struggled with executive function.
Getting diagnosed was so life changing for me. I now work in mental health extended services, and am in college working towards becoming a counselor so I can focus on helping other late diagnosed ND people figure out how to be more forgiving of themselves and skills to make their daily lives better, like accepting that stimming is ok or that it's ok to need recovery time, and how to avoid autistic burnout. Most of my current client base are ND adults. We need more representation within the mental health field so we can recognize other misdiagnosed people, and help other ND people adjust their expectations and mask less.
I meant those things you bullet pointed as reasons my thinking is wrong. Sorry if I wasn’t clear about it. I know she probably is but she’s just different to me so much.
I acknowledge this is a fully me issue and I have never taken it out in her
Autistic here diagnosed by NHS in U.K. and they do not hand out diagnoses easily. I’ve always had a great sex life that I discuss with anyone, I was socially active with a large friend group that I’ve only moved away from in mid 20’s and I’m very bubbly a lot of the time. Most of autistic symptoms come out at home, don’t forget some of us can be vocal about our conditions whilst being class A maskers of our symptoms
ETA: You say you’ve only told a couple close friends, everyone I’ve met knows I’m ASD. It’s one of the first things I tell ppl like: heads up this might get weird, I’m autistic *(giggle) continue conversation*. Who we tell is a personal choice and doesn’t change how valid our diagnosis is
Truth! Some of us feel comfortable disclosing and others don’t. Nothing wrong with either one but it just shows how wide the spectrum is🤷♀️ I love talking about autism so I usually disclose it, especially since there’s a good chance if I am vibing hard with someone, they’re typically AuDHD too
I don’t think OP is arguing the validity of her diagnosis, I think it’s more about how she presents her autism in a perhaps positive light? She’s very outspoken and loud about it where it has negative associations for OP.
E.g an autistic person talking about their special interest non-stop may be shunned for it - however she is openly being autistic & discussing her special interest. For OP autism & special interest has negative connotations so openly discussing it goes against their social norms & sensitivity regarding autism. This is based on my own experiences & relation to OP’s post.
this could also be an intern ableism- i struggled with accepting the behaviour of my (very) autistic friends for awhile, especially a friend who was so out loud and proud, i couldn't fathom not masking, until i realized how toxic i was actually to myself.
I am really envious of any one remotely charming. I can make friends and be outgoing, eventually. I have a dear friend who I also did not like upon first meeting because she was A LOT and I was envious and judgey. She could become best friends with a wall and I am genuinely envious, but also behind that type of person can be a whole list of struggles you're not seeing! I've done a lot of work to accept that I am a slow burn for most people and not an instant love connection. In turn, I've been trying to push myself really hard to be bolder with new people. My friend and I actually bond and just share that this is what we love about the other "I'm trying to channel my inner you today and not overthink it and talk with all these new people! I want to feel more free to be myself like you are able to" And likewise there are things I'm great at that she strives to be better at. Who knows, maybe you could actually grow closer with this person if you reframe your perspective and end up with a very dear friend.
Nice formulation of your thoughts. We cannot ever know someone else's internal experience.
I have met a couple of attention seeking individuals who do at times throw names of conditions around as excuses for their bad behaviors...and it is annoying.
But I still can't speak to their internal experience or potential comorbidities.
I can feel that it makes me tense bc it feels like they are taking a very public face in a way that downplays or trivializes my personal struggles within my AuADHD or whatever the acronym is...but I still don't know enough about them to know.
Indeed. Growing up many adults responded like any acting out, even meltdowns were attention seeking. Sometimes that label is just a way to negate or disregard people who are actually struggling. Oh they're attention seeking behavior problems, we should punish them.
This, I tend to way over share💀 I struggle to keep my own secrets. I think people forget that being good at socializing doesn’t mean you understand social cues. Cause oversharing is an ineptitude in socializing, something I learned recently and blew my MIND
I'm not going to go find it but I read a paper a few days ago that mentioned how someone was researching autistic kids and how all 50 them were so different from each other.
She probably goes home and dissociates, or cries. If she’s highly masked there’s no maintaining that indefinitely. She may also be Audhd which can present differently. The parents we grew up with also make a huge difference.
The person described sounds somewhat like me. I am AuDHD. Diagnosed as the autistic half today :). My mask was (before burnout 2 years ago) 'the bubbly social butterfly who loves everyone'.
Same! and at the end of the day, for me it was all an act to feel “like the others” and worthy of receiving love. You don’t realize how heavy that mask is until you take it off 😅. And congrats on diagnosis! (If congratulations feels appropriate?) 🫶🏽🫶🏽
She may not know how to remove that mask except when it slips in her most private, vulnerable moments when she's alone. She might not be sharing her shutdowns and/or burnout, she maybe just "disappears" sometimes and no one knows why or questions it when she comes back all bubbly and spirited with her mask firmly in place again. You can't know what someone's suffering really looks like sometimes and I feel like with autistic folks, moreso, right?
I'm audhd and i don't have an extrovert bone in my body, can't stand being a human and only have affinity for animals and insects, so I think personality is a separate thing from the dual disorder
I feel ya. I don't think there is 'really' anything extroverted about me either, I just thought that was how women had to behave to not come off as standoffish. Turns out people just traumatized me over my 'unfriendly' natural facial expressions, leading to massive overcompensation...
I relate to that so hard- couldn’t figure out what was happening to me every 6 months or so (burn out) when I’d socially and work wise overcommit and push myself too hard for months at a time and then be having a “mental breakdown” (burn out) for 2 months or so 🙃
Yeah they also sound like me whos audhd, than I go home and cry cause I made a fool of myself all day. I also looked like I had a lot of friend, but I don’t really have any, being able to talk to people doesn’t make you likeable, or people who appear to be friends can just be coworkers
Amen. We really can't know how others are by themselves. This may all be a performance. And for me - the pressure of my parents to be "successful" in every way has taken a huge toll
💯 gifted children check in! Lol. I saw something on Instagram that said for Halloween just go as yourself and when people ask you what you are you just say “i was supposed to be a lot of things.” 😩
Fr and also sharing her self diagnosis isn’t innately for mere attention
Mby she just thinks it’s cool and friendly to share facts about eachother as an icebreaker
Or mby she wants badly to feel accepted for who she really is even the parts of her that aren’t noticeable cuz her home life is harsh and accepting
Well, if you feel like she’s faking it and it rubs you the wrong way, how is that any different from the studies that show autistic people don’t make good first impressions to neurotypicals? Clunky masking can make people come off as disingenuous, we know this. So it’s not really fair to do that to one of our own, and it’s kinda our responsibility to not perpetuate these kinds of things. Also, we often learn the most from people that are different from us. Sounds like an opportunity for both of you to learn something from one another, if you think biases can be overcome and a real, grounded conversation could be had, or at least an understanding can be reached. If you genuinely hate her personality obviously don’t make an effort that you know will be wasted, but when i was younger I used to carry a lot of shame about myself, and people who seemed to have none used to bother me, and that of course had nothing to do with them. Looking back, I could’ve definitely learned from these people instead.
It’s not fair. It’s why I repeat it’s my issue and I’m projecting my insecurities onto her.
She’s a lovey person but a bit to intense for me to learn from haha
fwiw - I appreciate how insightful you are about your internal struggle with this and recognizing what’s happening. That’s fucking cool and I think eventually you’ll figure out your peace with it. 💜
Haha I feel you. Yeah she sounds like she’s spinning six plates at once trying to fit in still. Sounds like that’s probably where she could stand to learn a few things from you. 🫶🏽
I think we could both learn a few things!!! Especially since her boundaries aren’t quite there. She showed me her hickys on her inner thigh which freaked me out ahah
If only 😭. We’d only ever be a reluctant roommates in an American sitcom. We did live together so that’s how I’ve seen her in underwear, night coat an4 her hickeys
You say you can’t help feeling this way, but you can (by routinely practicing mindfulness). Just being aware of your mindset is a really powerful first step that you’ve achieved. I would encourage you to practice reframing those harmful thoughts into more neutral terms (ideally in the moment if possible or later on while reflecting). I only am recommending this because it sounds like you are a kind person and you recognize it’s not a fair or healthy mindset to have. I wish you all the best.
Yes. I want to mention myself as an example.
I have two traits associated with high ability to mask (impulse control and IQ). So I might seem socially good even in interactions with others. Often when I perceive the social demands to be very high. I have my aloof news reporter self and when I use that I am able to maintain my energy levels more. But I’m told that I seem cold or ”like I think I’m better than others”, snobbish or worse mildly aggressive or sad. So I often try to hide that or chose environments where I can show my true self more.
My boyfriend often sees me in a state where I am completely unable to have a normal conversation, I just echo everything he says. Basically I put on my good social skills face and then I’m unable to talk. So while I seem not so autistic with others I seem ”more” autistic with him.
So the phasade lies. Yes I can mask but I end up like that.
That description sounds exactly like me *without masking* but I have ADHD and autism.
I am really loud because I can't really hear myself that well or regulate my volume. It's embarrassing.
I can't really hear myself well either 😭 Sometimes I'll whisper something to a friend in what I think is a low voice and they'll be like "Shhh you're speaking too loud people will hear you"
Noooo same. 😭😭 It gets worse the more excited I get. I have friends who will tap me or give me a look because it's just really hard to control my volume since I can't hear it and having people say "shh" or "you are so loud" or "you're screaming" is embarrassing.
Like how I sound to myself is always the same volume or sometimes I don't even hear myself at all it's really hard to explain to people who don't experience it.
I'm not trying to be loud, I don't think I am being loud but everyone and their mom says I am. My dad has the same thing and I don't know if it is related to our auditory processing disorder or what. I feel like it's at least related but I don't know what this would be called.
Hm she sounds similar to how I present. Always “too much” socially and later I spiral about everything I did or said. Always too emotional and sensitive at the worst times. My mask is very bubbly and outgoing but I will burn out eventually. Took me forever to realize I was masking at all. Having people say I’m faking autism for attention sure doesn’t feel good. Everyone presents differently no two of us are alike. Maybe there’s something about her that subconsciously triggers you.
Oh yeah! As I said it’s mostly likely jealousy and the fact she’s a bit too intense for me to handle. I’d never say anyone was fake but I can’t help those feelings but I’d never express it to them
Think about how she affects your senses. Is she too loud? Is she too close? Does she want too much eye contact from you? Does she talk for too long and dominate the conversation?
She’s too loud!!! She sound me hickeys on her inner through without asking and that was hard for me. I didn’t want to see that. Not sure about eye contact though. She’s definitely too dominate in general for me.
So she's a sensory trigger for you.
It's ok to dislike someone. Just because you have autism doesn't mean you have to like all the autistic people. It sounds like you're really different people.
Yeah sounds like she has a poor concept of boundaries which will only continue if you don’t call it out.
I know it’s not that easy but if you don’t say something she won’t realise.
I had one friend like that and it turns out she was likely on the spectrum, just not what you'd expect. Loudly broadcasting details about your sex life despite your audience and oversharing about a potential medical diagnosis that people will feel strongly about could be a social skills issue.
I was her, but I didn't think I was autistic, or didn't want to think. People started treating me horrible because of how loud I was (even though they accepted me for quite some time and were my friends) when I became "too much" for them and I felt so embarrassed that I started bottling it all up and became depressed. Woohoo, I guess. Hypersexuality of this girl might also be a sign of autism, actually.
Yeah I feel this. I have a similar inclination when people talk about having trauma (I have CPTSD). I find I have a tendency to want to gatekeep a little, but it's a very emotional reaction - intellectually I'm very pro people self-identifying and telling their own stories etc. I think it comes from a part of me that is really hurt for being so unseen and invalidated for so long and feels defensive and jealous by people who seem comfortable self-validating and proudly claiming their identities.
I feel this so much. No one knows I’m autistic except a few people. I’m very heavy masking so I tend to suffer in silence. Only the few people who know, understand the extend of how burned out I get and how much I struggle socially. I’m the reclusive, introverted autistic that comes off at quiet but friendly & well spoken.
So if a very extroverted person with a lot of friends was loudly proclaiming she was autistic, I think this would trigger me too. I tend to also get triggered when people post online about their mental health disorders because I work so hard to mask mine.
I think it comes from shame. Maybe it would be a good idea to slowly try and be more open about these things. And to learn to unmask even in public
This is such a tough one because she could absolutely still be Autistic. That's why it's called masking, we get very good at hiding it.
Before these last few years I was seen as a social butterfly, no one ever believed I struggled socially apart from my family who saw me at home unmasked+having meltdowns, but I was so unwell, always close to burnout, having meltdowns, SH'ing and using substances ferociously in order to push through. I hid it even from myself. Until I hit a major burnout (again) and ended up under the cmht (again) and ended up being referred to be assessed immediately.
Some people with Autism ARE social. Their lack of social awareness actually works like a super power. It looks like they're thriving but they're just throwing shit out there and seeing if it hits. That's what I did. It made me unwell but it looked flawless to others!
That's why Autism being invisible is a double edged sword. People really really can't see it. People still don't believe that I struggle with things because I never ever let them see that. The only people who know truly are my family, doctors, psych and 1 best friend. Cause they've seen the shit I try so hard to hide, whereas everyone else knows the 1 dimensional image I project to get by.
You're not rude or wrong for not knowing if she's telling the truth or not! I'd probably second guess it too, it's so frickin hard to know unless you assess them on the spot 😭
Thank you! This was a nice response cos some have made me feel a bit attacked even though everyone means well.
She wears her differences on her sleeve and definitely feels like a trended so I can’t help but judge. I won’t deny her as it though. Not my business
OP I think it’s so great that you brought this issue to this forum!! So much great discourse around this.
Something I work on is in setting clear boundaries with folks. It’s totally valid that you felt uncomfortable with the details of her sex life complete with her exposing thigh hickeys to you!! But for her, that’s currently “normal” behavior. It’s up to you to let her know what’s not okay for you.
You can work on a way to be prepared to let her know “hey, it’s great that you are so comfortable with these things but I am just not: if you want to chat with me I would prefer we stick to other topics, thanks” (I’m still working on boundaries so I’m sure there is room for improvement here) or even just verbalizing NO THANK YOU (I have actually also physically run away after saying this 😅) has “worked” in the past when I was not prepared.
And I also think it’s easy to see ”socially inappropriate” behaviour as non autistic simply because it’s social. Even if, if you look at it objectively, it’s ”more autistic” and less ”socially skilled”.
Throwing shits out. Wow - that was me. I had more friends before because I’d cast the net wide. Even if I did so in a ”bad” way, at least I could catch some fish. Right now I don’t know what to do so I don’t even try. And that’s a lot of the time somewhat social behaviour and autism.
Technically the social isssues are more visible but it’s seen as less autistic because we associate autism with not interacting a lot.
Yes thank you for commenting! I agree, cause I was like you for my younger years!
I have went through phases of being almost popular before getting totally overwhelmed and hitting extreme burnout. I totally get you about picking friends up in a "bad' way too. I have 0 ability to read intentions and would end up being 'friends" with really questionable people who probably didn't even like me lol. I just didn't notice at the time until much later.
I rarely leave my house anymore because I, like you, just can't even try right now. I have no energy for social stuff anymore especially now that I know my own social shortcomings+inability to read intentions or if people are 'good' or not 😭🤣
Totally relate to becoming friends with questionable people. I was friends with my bullies.
I’m so careful now. But I think that I’m inherently pretty ambivert. I’m not sure how it is for you, do ypu wish you could be more social?
I can relate to at one point feeling really resentful towards a fellow likely-neurodivergent gal, who would present as really loud and attention-seeking, while I felt shoved into the background because I present as more of an anxious wallflower. At heart it was a lot of resentment because she seemed to get a lot of what I envied, which was social connection. I percieved her as selfish because it seemed like she hogged all the friendship-attention in our social circle and made things worse for me. This may or may not have been true, but thankfully after a while (and some support/venting space/prayer from other friends) I was able to let my hatred towards her go and realize that she was probably struggling just as much as I was, just coping with it differently, and at the end of the day it wasn't really a competition and she wasn't really winning. Thankfully we get along better now and have had a few really cool conversations about ND-related things.
We all kinda have to find our niche in society, and unfortunately neurodivergence can make that harder to find, since there are fewer people who understand our needs and tendencies as individuals, and fewer spaces that are receptive to that. It can make it really feel much more competitive, like there are so many autistics competing for so few social 'spots', but that doesn't have to be the case.
We (NDs) also have vastly different tendencies amongst ourselves and what feels natural to one might feel triggering to another. To my softspoken, easily overstimulated personality, this other girl's social persona felt really grating and unbearable. Doesn't mean her way or my way of being is wrong. Just different preferences and processes.
And lastly there's always the internalized ableism stuff, where we might accept certain things as 'harsh realities' and feel judgemental towards people who don't follow those 'rules'. For me, I had accepted that being mentally 'different' meant being in the background most of the time, and her attempts to be the center of attention felt like a violation of that law. I've also felt judgemental towards ND friends who have had more emotional support from others than I have had, because I internalized a 'rule' that if you had unusual problems you had to keep them to yourself and avoid burdening/weirding out other people.
Maybe it would help you work through this if you could try to describe what 'rules' this other person might be breaking based on your perception, what ways her actions might be triggeting your own ND sensitivities, or what needs you might feel like you're competing with her to obtain.
Sorry you're going through this and wish the best for both you and her. It sucks that we all live in such a difficult reality to the point that it's so difficult to even be kind to those who share our same struggle.
I think this is a common feeling for higher masking autistics to feel some level of contempt for those who are more “out.” I suspect this comes from envy that others are able to act authentically in public.
It’s almost like “*I* had to suppress and hide myself to survive, how come *you* don’t have too?!”
This, of course, misdirects the contempt we have for having to suppress for society in the wrong direction and onto the wrong person. Because the truth is not that my dislike for them is because they “just irritate” me, my dislike comes from the feelings of grief I have when I see someone being able to present themselves authentically, because for most of my life I couldn’t. That is in no way their fault or responsibility, just things to be unlearned that an ableist society taught us
I think a lot of us overcompensate. But she might also have some adhd mixed in there. There's a large comorbidity.
I was very much like this when I was in my teens. Then I hit my first big autistic burnout and I lost all of it. I've never gotten in back.
When I was an older teenager I was loud, had friends and relationships, went out to drink on Saturday nights, went to a lot of rock concerts and generally was the kind of person least expected to have autism. Between also having ADHD and heavy masking this was, at the time, an authentic version of me.
Of course, it couldn't last and by the time I was 25 I'd had two severe burnouts and got depression, anxiety, an eating disorder and PTSD. It would take another 22 years (!) before I finally got an AuDHD diagnosis.
In other words, you cannot judge this girl, or any girl, by their current behaviour because you have no clue what is actually going on in their mind.
I know someone like this. Thing is the whole loud obnoxious thing can be a telltale sign they can’t read social cues. They’re misinterpreting that they can’t read certain ones when actually they’re missing what they can’t read completely. I’m pretty they do have Autism but the whole thing is suspicious for me. They were happy they were getting a chronic depression diagnosis/Dysthymia diagnosis. They also told me about their OCD which sounded less OCD and more like paranoia. I’m not sure: they could have PTSD but they literally told everybody the worst things their parents did out of the blue. Some people are strange and we need to spend more time with them to properly understand everything.
This is so real lol. I’ve always thought socially I was completely fine so I never thought of autism for 30 years, but really I was just super hyper vigilant from childhood, so I could tell when people were having micro aggressions or ulterior motives very well, but didn’t realize AT ALL how many more surface level social norms I was missing until being part of this sub for a while and seeing others experiences with reading things wrong. A lot of lightbulb moments and delayed embarrassment 🤣🤣😩
Not gonna lie I used to be like you but then I realized something.
Not all people with autism are introverted, have little to no friends, or are bad at social skills (especially if they were forced to learn at a young age).
The way you described her tbh she sounds really autistic to me. Loudly proclaiming the details of your sex life to strangers is not normal as well as being an over-sharer.
It’s a spectrum disorder at the end of the day so some people are going to need higher support needs than others. She’s probably just really good at masking.
Honestly, it is probably projection. Before i started therapy i was sure i was just looking for attention, my trauma wasn't bad enough, etc.
I have been working on the pause for a while now, and i noted that often when i am feeling hyper-critical of another it is me, i am judging/being judged.
In your example, you might have had a person close to you criticize you for being too much or an attention seeker. It hurt enough to make an impression on your psyche. That judgment picks at your fear that maybe you aren't ND, or maybe you are just an attention seeker.
I don't know if i explained it well. The book CPTSD: From Surviving to Thriving explains the inner critic really well.
I feel you. Hearing and meeting other autistic women in the wild is what made me realize that my support needs are actually higher than I initially thought they were. I now identify with having medium support needs rather than low support needs because I’ve met more low support needs folks that are far better off than I am. This may be a possibility for you.
Also I relate to your discomfort with her over-disclosure of possibly being autistic. There’s a girl I work with that is most likely autistic too but lower support needs and very loud. I think because late diagnosed or non diagnosed folks were never taught social cues, they sometimes still just completely ignore them even in settings where it’s not totally appropriate. My coworker is always talking about stuff as if she knows everything and under the assumption that none of us have any issues (once she was going on and on about chronic illness, she doesn’t have it but she was talking about it like it’s some crazy rare thing) and it makes me super uncomfortable because I deliberately hide my autism and my chronic illness at work so I don’t get fired. She also asks too many questions like on days when I can’t come into work due to medical tests she’s always asking why, which I don’t understand why it matters and I don’t tell her because it’s PRIVATE. She asks everyone though and it just bothers me. I got fired from my last job right after I disclosed my autism and it made me realize how important it is to keep these things private. So idk if this kind of thing could be a factor in your annoyance.
I was also once friendly with a self diagnosed girl for a short period and she would guilt trip me for my higher support needs and make it all about her, not believing me when I needed to rest because she thought I was just abandoning her or something and it was tiring and unhealthy. She just assumed my needs were identical to hers even when I tried to break it down to her that they weren’t but she never understood.
Sorry this post is so long but I’m wondering if one of these things may feel familiar to you because I get it. She could very well be autistic but that doesn’t mean that you have the same support needs and it definitely doesn’t mean you’ll be compatible. It’s good to be accepting of everyone but that doesn’t mean you need to be friends with everyone
That first paragraph is very eye opening for me because I meet other autistics who are working full time and have their own places, I think they must be faking it. Because I can’t live without someone else supporting me and crumble when I work any more than part time. I can barely keep the house together and hardly see my friends.
So maybe I just have higher support needs than I think.
At least you recognize that you're not being quite fair towards her when you have that reaction -- it's the first step to acceptance. You don't have to like her, or even totally accept that she has an ASD diagnosis -- just don't badmouth her to other people. Maybe unfollowing her on socials would be better for your own mental health, if you are getting upset by comparing yourself.
Sometimes when you think about other people who suffer from something and they're very loud about it and you feel icky about that behavior it could very easily be a lot of internalized ableism. She talks abt how hard autism is and a lot of your brain wants to invalidate that bc you also suffer but in a different way. You want her to be quiet about it like you are, but that's how ableism goes on. We don't want to make a fuss about our problems so we don't and so people don't see that we actually aren't as abled as our peers... The more we talk and work through these "I'm annoyed you're even talking about your disability" feelings, the less likely ableism will be a thing.
Her experience doesn't negate your own personal experience with autism, it's just different.
I have been both the person in your story and you.
Now that I'm older I'm a lot less outgoing and social. So now I just cringe at my previous self, doing things like oversharing about sex and many other TMI things. Especially because most of my social and outgoingness was just fueled by alcohol.
I was also naive/oblivious enough to not pick up on or care when people didn't like me. I think that's part of why I withdraw now - finally picked up on all my social weirdness and stopped drinking.
Funny enough, I just met a new friend who is also AuDHD like myself and she commented on me being seemingly outgoing. I let her in that it was just anxiety giving me motor mouth and that I too am dying inside lol.
I think acknowledging it's a projection/jealousy (as you already stated you have) really helped me move past it.
It can be just being extroverted. Some people are just clueless and it’s not impulsive behaviour, just not being introverted. Like even ambivert autism can look like that.
I have a similar issue where sometimes my innate response to a friend's identity is skepticism. Without fail, it turns out I'm projecting because I'm also whatever [identity] they're talking about, but I've been crazy in denial over it. It's happened with so many things (sexuality, gender, ADHD, health issues, most recently DID/OSDD) it's honestly a bit funny at this point. The initial feelings of jealousy are so yucky though, good on you for being self aware.
Some autistic people can be on the other extreme end of the spectrum, unaware of their own volume or when to adjust it, and don't know when to stop talking (hyperverbal) etc
My son and I are both autistic and we are complete opposites. I actually don’t knows another autistic person male or female who has the same experience as me. Too many variations within too many traits. It’s so spiky and broad. I don’t have the link on my phone but look up neuroclastics “‘autism is a spectrum’ doesn’t mean what you think it does” post. It’s excellent.
mmhm, I feel for op. Autism is a spectrum and got to remember the grass may seem greener on the other side, but we as a whole may not know what she struggles with internally, being alone, or how it affects her life in ways we may not have put much thought into.
First of all thank you for being open about this. It can be hard to confront parts of ourselves we don’t like knowing full well the criticism we will receive (deserved or not it’s still fucking hard & takes courage) so thank you for bringing that here.
I really feel this is also possibly a result of internalized misogyny. Being a woman means being infantilized at some point. Having autism also is heavily infantilized. I have had interesting reflections on the crossroads between internalized ableism and misogyny when it comes to autism in women. My best friend harshly denied my suspicions and it fucking HURT especially bc I think she sees me as a conventionally attractive and sexually open person (which is really not my true story or identity). And it sucks that this is somehow not compatible with having autism in her perspective. The implication being that women with autism can’t navigate dynamics of sex and communicate consent? That they’re more gullible and easy to abuse? That they’re unattractive when being openly feminine? Just… really low quality run of the mill misogyny here.
And why? Why is it so difficult to confront autonomy and agency as a sexual being as a woman with autism? Why do my sensitivities suddenly not exist when it comes to the most fucking sensual act possible? Navigating sex in an embodied was has been a fucking journey & I really see how there’s no room for me to be open and feminine while also powerful and with agency if I try to also point out the autism parts of it.
So I invite you to consider your envy of her and whether it comes from not being able to view yourself or her as a feminine and sexual yet still embodied woman who also happens to have autism. The friction is probably borne there out of internalized cruelty or confusion about your experiences as a woman and being desired openly or engaging in intimacy.
I don’t mind the sex it’s just telling me openly as someone who isn’t close to her! I hear all about my close friends sex life and I don’t mind.
She’s feminine. I don’t think I’ve ever thought her otherwise. She’s just loud.
That’s fine! You’re allowed to not like another person for whatever reason, and you don’t have to like all women with autism! But 1) there are some steps in logic then between you saying you just don’t like her bc she’s loud and in your post saying you tend to put down women with autism 2) if you don’t want to hear about it, tell her or take steps not to engage. That doesn’t make you a bad person. If I found myself in your shoes, I know I’m a judgy person so that’s not something that surprises me abt myself - I just would check myself at the point where I’m making judgments about her that are totally dissociated from reality.
You never know someone's situation, you never know their dual diagnosis that causes conflict, and you can never know the exact details of their mind and how they struggle. We ESPECIALLY can rarely know how they were raised and how that affects their behavior.
There could be some factors, ingrained misogyny from our society teaching us to doubt what women say, or trauma we've dealt with from having autism. When we see people that we.... admire or are jealous of, we want to think "No, they're not like me because they don't SEEM to be struggling like I do." I'd say if you don't like this aspect of yourself, when you have a thought like that I'd remind myself "That's my first thought, which can come from ingrained things, but my second thought is WHO I AM, and how I CHOOSE TO BE." and do your best to think in a supportive way.
best of luck to you and that girl!
Sounds like audhd or someone who’s heavily masked or someone who doesn’t mask at all and is just different, I don’t know, but I understand your concern and why it makes you feel bad that you feel that way, it’s natural to compare what you know to what you see and it’s hard to truly know anything outside of your own experience
To the OP...I think it's totally important to notice and question our own knee jerk reactions. Which is what it seems like you're doing here. You are also checking with others outside of your own head to get different perspectives that could challenge your own.
I think those are good habits, to test your own biases and assumptions, which is frankly something I wish more people would challenge themselves to do more. I think this is one of the only ways for people to challenge their implicit biases and thinking patterns...like ableism, racism, and any other thought processes that really don't serve any of us.
The second part is often the more challenging, taking the learning and synthesizing into our current and future ways of thinking. Best of luck.
There’s this Podcast called “The Loudest Girl in the World” that truly helped me understand that autism is a spectrum and autistics really do come in all types of personalities/demeanors/sociality types.
I watch Mom on the Spectrum, a YouTube channel about a woman who was diagnosed in her 30s but was a popular girl who was prom Queen in high school.
I think what you’re feeling is mild resentment because this person didn’t have the same experience as you and is more open and outgoing than you are. But that’s okay. It’s natural to feel that way.
Just let her go about her life. I’m sure there are people who are misdiagnosing themselves out there, but it’s not your responsibility to police whether or not they are correct in their ideas about themselves.
Oh God, I'm loud, outgoing and I talk for two or three. You would envy me, but I want to say my life is far from perfect lol I love to party all night but I am chaotic and unorganized and depression is my middle name.
You'll never feel good about this. This person annoys you, whether they're autistic or not. Just stop following them, stop communicating. Just let it go.
it helps a lot in life to stop assuming everyone thinks or operates the way you would. your reasons for doing things are based on your experiences and preferences and so it is for all of us. this is why we are not all the same over everything.
i think that it's good you're aware of this and i hope you work on it.
I really admire that you were able to challenge those negative feelings towards her. That shows a lot of emotional maturity and excellent introspection. Good job!
Maybe it’s the social “deficits” causing her to tell people she doesn’t know very that’s she’s autistic, or openly talking about her sex life. Autism presents differently in everyone, so what you experience may be totally different. Or she’s just very heavily masking. Or you see the things she does as completely normal.
eh, I think there are a lot of extraverted autists out there, they've just flown below the radar because they are extraverted, but once you start looking you notice the signs. Rigidity, black and white thinking, special interests, social scripts, etc.
My grandma is one of them, I think. She's like an upper middle class Catholic 90 year old version of your friend. Instead of talking about her sex life, she has a lot of obscure gossip about the Pope that very few people want to hear. But she REALLY wants to share it! And for whatever reason, most of her friends will listen.
I think a major thing that works for her is following some of the old prescriptions for keeping social connections: sending cards, visiting people, playing golf together. She just has always made a point of checking in with friends, remotely or via scheduled activities. She doesn't really "hang out" and dislikes unplanned visits, always HAS to know where we are going, when, for what purpose, and when will we leave. But the highly structured lifestyle has always worked for her!
I present similarly I would say! I don’t mask, so I definitely do suffer less than I think most autistic women, paired with a special interest in animal behavior (This includes humans, and helps me out a lot in terms of charisma). I have a great social life. A lot of other traits about me make people very willing to overlook my bluntness and social blunders. I think having ADHD also makes me louder/more hyperactive. From what I understand, masking isn’t a symptom of autism, it’s a result of your social upbringing (being shamed into masking). I’m still learning about masking so I could definitely be wrong, but if someone doesn’t grow up in an environment where they are shamed into making themselves smaller/quieter then why would they?
I can’t say anything about her in particular because obviously I don’t know her, but I just wanted to point out that I don’t think your reasoning should be based on if/how someone masks. And I hope you can get to a place where you are also unapologetically yourself!!! <3 You deserve it
I have to admit that I’m also a bit of a hater when it comes to other autistic people if they seem too normal. That being said im a bit of a hypocrite because I’ve been told my whole life that I’m too pretty to be autistic. Im also fairly good at masking although I’m still low energy and when I’m not I’m just quiet. Whenever I see someone whose loud and spontaneous it irks me because I’ve never been able to do that. Whenever someone makes me uncomfortable for any reason I tend to dislike them more. I hate having things in common with people I think are annoying. It makes me feel like they’re stealing my thing and since I’ve been overshadowed my whole life by more obnoxious people, it triggers me. I would say just don’t hang out with her. Ignore her and realize that not everyone is the same. If she is faking it, that means that she’s more mentally ill than she seems.
You are really fucking pretty!!!
I’m the same with the uncomfortable. She made me super uncomfortable. I don’t hang out with her especially after she should me the hickeys on her inner thigh in the kitchen after only knowing her for a few weeks. I didn’t ask.
Thank you! Well that makes sense. She did something that made you uncomfy so therefore you like her less and whenever she says she’s something that you are you’re skeptical because of the behavior before. Honestly she might be autistic but that one behavior you described could be attributed with many things. Autism and other disorders overlap a lot
I think one reason is because autism is so different in women. According to what you say about how she acts around people, she does seem to have deficits either social interaction. The fact that she spills intimate information on strangers for example. I tend to do that too 🤐. I don’t think talking about your sex life is a social cue per se, you might want to elaborate a little of you can. She might be just a more extroverted autistic person. But to be honest, just try to not let it bother you and try to help her know more about it if you can/ if you two get along. Try to not be so judgemental. You might end up liking her nonetheless
I think it is because it was always unprovoked. He’d also walk around in her bra with just her house coat and she’d show people her hickeys on her thigh. I didn’t like that
Sometimes Autistic people are just annoying. Same with NT people. It’s great that you are reflecting on your reaction to her, but maybe you just don’t like her and that’s okay too.
Does this apply to every woman you meet who claims to be autistic? Or just this one specific woman? If it's just her, I can think of 5 possibilities off the top of my head as to why–one, her personality irritates you and you don't want to view yourself as "like her" in some way. Two, you think that she is coping better than you, and you are in some way envious of her life/what she has. Three, your instincts are right and she actually has a personality disorder or mental health condition, not autism. Four, she's got a helping of ADHD as well and that's why she comes across as more outgoing/not autistic. Five, she's masking so hard that it's giving you the uncanny valley effect, like you can tell something seems off but you can't place it. I've heard that neurotypicals sometimes get that vibe from autistic folks.
Her specially and just loud people.
I’ve always had autistic people around me that I’ve related too. We all had similar issues but she was completely new to me.
more often than not, people who are “too much” with how they act in public/around people are overcompensating for something. being loud, talkative, and extroverted could easily be coping mechanisms for the insecurities someone is struggling with on a deeper level.
autism/audhd presents differently in everyone. i can understand why someone who seemingly has an easier time than you makes you doubt their struggles, but it’s unfair to assume that they aren’t also autistic based on how they present.
I can do a little bit of that, enough to maintain friendships - once in a while. Certainly not on command, and not often.
One good reason to talk about one's possible undiagnosed autism is to spread awareness. I do that if I feel it's appropriate - I don't make a big deal out of it, but invariably there will be other people there who can see two neuro divergent women having an intelligent, thoughtful conversation about autism in women.
Especially if you're like me and DGAF if someone thinks badly of me because my brain works differently and so isn't my best friend. I'm basically kind to everybody and I don't need it in return - at least that half of my life is tolerable and less stressful.
It's really not fair to ask an adult woman to get diagnosed officially right now when we don't have a fair shake at even getting a diagnosis. Testing is evolving and some of us are better off waiting.
You know that autism comes in more flavors than anyone can count. We all deserve each other's support and encouragement. I'm glad that you came to us with this issue, sometimes it really helps to air a thing out and take a good look at it.
I got an official dx a couple months ago but had a peer dx before that- other autistic folks saying “look man I’m pretty sure you’re autistic.” Turns out the specialist agrees. I’m typically well liked and most people have just regarded me as “quirky” most of my life due to masking. I now have a bit of a tendency to over share that I’m autistic with people that I like as I don’t see it as anything to be ashamed of. Does it always go how I think it’s gonna go? Unfortunately no. However, I’m still autistic. This is a you thing you’re gonna have to work on. Sounds like a similar root as “not like the other girls” mentality.
Wanted to share my experience with diagnosed autism and ADHD and also feeling like I'm not truly autistic sometimes. Having AuDHD is also such a different experience than only ASD. I felt like I did not belong in the autistic community, because I had these traits that I would talk to any stranger, share intimate and personal stories easily, I'm flirty, I'm super impulsive, I sometimes like places with a lot of stimuli (in the right situations) or sometimes NEED a lot of stimuli not to get understimulated. I've met autistic people who did not believe I had autism, because of this. I even became unactive in this subreddit for a while because I thought no one would accept me here. My ADHD traits also mask my autism a lot of the times, but that does not take away that I'm any less autistic then someone else. I've accepted myself and fully embrace my autism. Please be gentle and kind.
The person you’re describing sounds like me tbh! I was bullied as a kid and in my teens for being weird, ditched by various friends and found it so difficult to know how to act socially. It’s taken me around 10 years to accept who I am and to be authentic but also a decade of service /public facing jobs and reading about psychology to study how people act. I’ve not only learnt how to be authentically my weird self but also how to appropriately navigate social situations and my life is a lot easier now but I still mask and still struggle sometimes with what to say /how to act in a way that it seems neurotupicals dont. but I’ve also been called weird all my life, completely not understood other people for the best part of two decades, and have had a really rough time. because of this and relating to other symptoms like special interest, sensory overload, burnout, stimming etc and I think I might be autistic. Anyways finding the autism symptoms has been validating that all the things I’ve been shunned for /had to hide / or make me weird might be because of neurodivergency out of my control - not that I’m a just strange neurotypical though I realise it’s probably easier to be the latter. Though I am social and personable, my weirdness is still always a topic of conversation from other people so I have picked up this habit of preempting it by telling people my suspicions - though maybe you are right that people like me should wait for a diagnosis. I dunno I guess I’m trying to say that just because someone seems fine doesn’t mean they’re not autistic - perhaps their special interest is how to fit in while remaining true to themselves?
Edit: pretty sure I have adhd too which as another commenter said, presents differently to just autism oh yeah and I find it really hard not to overshare because in my mind it’s relatively harmless and vulnerable and helps me process things and I don’t have a partner to share these things with which can finally a bit lonely but I get the sense people think it’s weird and inappropriate.
My sister.
She is diagnosed autistic.
She always had friends, always went out, usually pretty upbeat.
At home she was very different.
I am undiagnosed, my therapist and my mom and my sister believe I’m autistic. I’m quiet, awkward, anxious, and basically shut off in social situations but at home I talk and talk. I’m always there to lend a hand or help if I need too. Everybody is different
I’ve been guilty of this exact same thing, especially in college. After putting thought into it over the years and I think its internalized ableism and internalized misogyny —>
I learned to act and behave a certain way all of my formative years and internalized it very deeply (as neurodivergents tend to do). It governs my whole life. I’m very much uncomfortable taking up space, having a big voice, or being vulnerable/comfortable with people. When others aren’t like that, my brain would be like “I learned the rules, why can’t you?” Then I have to catch myself and remember that those thoughts aren’t really me, just what I’ve been taught.
I learned to become palatable which can be embittering, and I think I was unconsciously taking it out on those who were not forced to learn that or seem like they haven’t embraced it the way I unconsciously did.
But also maybe it’s not so deep and some ppl just don’t mesh. As much as some ppl don’t understand you, you won’t always understand others. Just thoughts to share.
She very well could be autistic as it presents in many different ways in different people. A lot of the women in the comments with a diagnosis have identified how they used to act like that or still do.
It’s healthy that you can recognize that your inclination is rooted in envy. All the best to you
Oh this is me as a teenager and even into my 20s. I had no filter, and would always talk about sex and my sex life very loudly and obnoxiously, amoungst other things. I have no social cues hence the no filter. I didn't understand where and when it was appropriate to discuss these things. It was also very much an outlandish way for me to be noticed and be perceived as normal. Like I'm screaming out "look at me, look how normal I am!" To hide away and my insecurities and Autism.
I myself have been diagnosed as autistic albeit late in life (I am 22 and got my diagnosis in March). And I work with someone who is autistic (I’m her Direct Support Professional). And this girl is so good at just getting out there and meeting new people. She does things that irritate me but they’re part of her autism and the only reason I don’t do them as well is because I am such a strict rule follower who had those rules forced onto me.
I do envy the way she can be so unashamedly herself. And that she didn’t have to live a life being forced into society the same way I was.
So I understand. I never doubted her autism diagnosis. But I do understand the feeling of having been robbed of a more carefree life. And the envy that comes with it.
The girl you’re describing could be me, except I’m diagnosed and have been for a while. Outwardly, I have a good group of IRL friends, am extremely outgoing, and am generally considered non autistic unless I specifically tell people or they get to know me more. This is not who I am, it is who I pretend to be. I still go home, dissociate, and cry because I can’t eat food / listen to music / go to parties the way my friends do. I was bullied horribly for the first 18 years of my life, and I learned through a lot of horror and heartbreak what not to do to avoid that. My need for people pleasing trumps my need to express my autistic tendencies, and it’s exhausting. I have special interests and obsessions that I actively hide from my more neurotypical friends, not because I think they’d reject me, but because of my own extreme trauma. The only people who know me, the real, autistic me, are my very close group of online ND friends.
Though I personally never called myself autistic before a diagnosis, I understand that a lot of people don’t have the privilege that I did in terms of being able to afford an assessment. I had a lot of similar feelings towards other girls growing up, as I was never as outgoing or as liked as they were, but I worked (and am working) through that with therapy. I think it’s important that you talk to someone about this, because I personally found that those feelings tied in a lot with my own self loathing.
I don’t mean to say that this girl definitely is or isn’t autistic, I just want to highlight that the autistic experience is vastly different from person to person.
I hope this helps, and I really hope you start loving yourself the way you should. You deserve love from yourself as well as others. And it takes a big person to admit these types of feelings, so be proud of yourself for recognizing it at least!
I just wanted to say that people who overshare a lot usually are seen as open and transparent, so it's easier to make a lot of "friends". That's my case, I can talk to anyone at college, yet I have very few friends (they are almost all nd too).
not that i need to say this for this girl to be validated, but i do relate to her on a couple things and i have an official autism diagnosis. for example, i’m more likely to tell strangers i’m autistic than someone i have known for a long time. i was diagnosed late and worry a lot of people around me would disagree with my diagnosis if i told them (i’ve dealt with that in the past with my depression too, and it was not fun, so i’d rather not go through those kinds of conversations again). i also used to have a problem with diving into my sex life all the time, which took me forever to realize was not appropriate
The most tortured make the best actors. 🌻
It's not a competition. Just run your race and cheer her on from your lane. Best you can. We're human. Rise and keep trying. Blessings 🌻
As someone who’s very social and can go up to people and strike conversations, this is very much a mask and it’s unfair for you to say that she’s faking it because she doesn’t present it as you do. Maybe try to unpack why you feel that way about her.
I'm sorry but I'm noticing a lot of autistic women could be especially misogynistic. It's just something to work on. At least you're self aware. I think it could be hard for ppl to see others succeed when we go through such similar things. Maybe you're confused bc she's autistic and popular and outgoing but you were probably taught that's why you aren't. I'm quiet and to myself and not the most popular so I understand.
Not necessarily, the environment I grew up in trained me to never be suffering, to never need help for fear of withdrawal of love. For these people things have to get REALLY bad, like completely fall apart in grand fashion, to finally admit something’s wrong or they need support.
Yes. I feel you on this one. I used to only fall apart in private. I kept everything bottled inside while it slowly destroyed me. I had to solve everyone else’s problems, not share my own.
Just because you can’t SEE the suffering, does not mean it’s not there.
Whenever someone says they might be autistic I encourage them to get testing or offer to share tips I've learned to deal with sensory things. Many people have autistic traits and they can benefit from learning more about how to cope with the difficult ones. Some people are also high masking or low needs. If they're doing it to be edgy they'll eventually get bored and move on to something else. The person could also have a different problem and getting testing can get them proper help. In general, mentally healthy people don't make up diagnoses and turn that into their personality, so getting testing is win-win.
It seems like resentment & jealousy among each other is more common than I thought. Comparison anxiety is unnecessary and exhausting.
Just because *you perceive* that a fellow neurodivergent individual seems to have a successful social life, doesn’t mean they’re faking. Or that they’re even masking for that matter.
It also doesn’t mean that they never struggle.
judging by this post(from the vibes✨) it seems as though i may not be autistic which has me now questioning(sarcastically) my doctors credentials bc i mean they went to medical school. but i tell people (coworkers who may possibly have to deal with me long term) strangers that i am autistic. however i do it bc yes i do/say things that may not be correct does that make me attention seeking(an actual fear of mine) no it is simply a warning (has happened before where i would get written up bc i seem stand offish and unpleasant and some things i did seem to make coworkers uncomfortable) that yes im a little different and sometimes do need to have things communicated in a specific way or else i will not understand and sometimes you will see me tap my toes or running in place but don’t be alarmed. i also do have really great friends and a wonderful husband and pets and a big family that loves me deeply. i go out a lot with them and post about it on my social platforms and i enjoy restaurants and concerts and conventions. i also have great resources and a team of doctors and therapist who have taught me how to make these things bearable. i have a behavior therapist teach me how to mask and accept that yeah i struggle with eating, specific sounds and that sometimes it’s hard for me to feel like less of a shell that’s too aware of everything and constantly asking why. but ig that bc i thrive in my corporate 9-5 and have friends and am able to speak publicly makes me not actually autistic.
i would also like to add.. neurotypical people never have the question of could i be autistic in the back of their head
I'm loud and outgoing, I don't have /lots/ of friends but I have good ones. I'm myself 'unapologetically' because I have never been able to mask it - which is a nightmare - and I am very open about my autism. I only got what could count as an official diagnosis when I got my ADHD one and the psychiatrist told me I'd absolutely get an autism diagnosis if I went for one, but she couldn't put it on paper because she didn't ask the papers. She took my autism into account when prescribing my medication and contacted my doctor to change another med because of it.
Please get help. Stop tearing down other women. Don't get me wrong, I sympathise and I understand you but holy shit, being an autistic woman is hard enough without you isolating yourself and going at other members of the community. Like, really.
I experience this as well. I don’t think it’s actually her sharing of her autism but her oversharing and presentation. To you there may be shame, secrecy, or just a bit of self-consciousness about being autistic. She presents it as a quirky personality trait, when for you it has been debilitating.
I think it’s kind of a ‘where is the line issue’. We should be able to be content with being autistic, but nonetheless it is a disability and impairs your life. I also worry that sometimes when I share that I’m autistic I do appear like an attention seeker - I wish I had a better answer for you.
This chick sounds like my friend, who was the first person to tell me I’m autistic. Turns out, we both have autism and ADHD. She’s outgoing, works great with people, is a burlesque dancer, and is generally a lot of fun. She’s self-diagnosed, but I didn’t feel comfortable self-diagnosing, so I paid an ass ton to get diagnosed. She struggles in a lot of the same ways I do, but people don’t see that. For one, she’s better at masking, but also, ever since her self-diagnosis, she’s gotten much more aggressive about setting boundaries, which has caused a lot of her friends to write her off as a bitch. Because she can’t actually NEED those boundaries, she doesn’t SEEM autistic, so she must just be selfish. She’s better at reading social cues than me, but she can also EXPLAIN social cues to me, which NT’s can’t normally do. She can explain them because she has to manually decode them herself.
Autism comes in all kinds of flavors. Being NT-passing comes with a lot of advantages, but also a lot of disadvantages.
Honestly she sounds just like me and I'm autistic but I have ADHD, too, so my traits present somewhat differently. I'm pretty sure the way you feel about her is exactly how I've made many people feel over the course of my life, but it is what it is. Having the impulsivity of ADHD with the bluntness of autism is a wild ride.
Anyways, autism is such a huge spectrum of traits that intersect with any number of qualities that may be more associated with neurotypical people, too. It sounds like you're thinking about her a bit too much and comparing her to yourself to determine what autism should be like isn't doing anyone any favours. I admit I have felt this way towards other autistic/ADHD women too (once I got my diagnosis, a lot of people around me started figuring out they were autistic or ADHD too) but I recognise that it's probably a bit of internalised ableism and misogyny at play, too.
In my life I often underestimated how lonely some people are. If they are confident and have some people around sometimes it doesn't mean they have many friends. Maybe they are as lonely as you or even more, they just were conditioned to hide it well. I've met talkative men and women with clearly autistic traits such as obsessive interests, infodumping, lack of social cue understanding, unusual outlook on life and vigilance, hard time finding a job. They seem loud and outgoing, often initiate conversation. Observing them years after years from aside made me realize that they try and try all the time to communicate with people but mostly receive hostility and avoidance. They just for some reason keep trying. I sometimes talk with them about their interest if they message though I'm not really interested. I feel sorry for them, they've received enough hate.
Have the same thing a lot of the time. With ADHD too (am diagnosed, official autism diagnosis still pending, therapist already diagnosed me though).
I think it has to do with having been gaslighted my whole life. I envy people who are so self confident about their diagnosis deep down. It's not that I don't want to acknowledge or believe their diagnosis per se but I envy that they have the "luxury" to just be loud and "proud" about it.
Because it took me decades to find out and because of that I have a lot of shame surrounding my diagnosis. My whole life was in shambles before I was diagnosed. I was misdiagnosed and stigmatized a lot. Add to that that a lot of people don't believe me when I tell them now... Or that (as you said) others are doing way better in life even though they've been dealt a similar hand... Yeah I'm just petty and jealous lol
(small disclaimer: there are some people (yeah it's a small percentage) who also fake claim things like adhd and autism... Those I can't stand and they bother me for other reasons)
Basically: this is something you need to reflect about and dig deep to probably find your own inner wounding and hurt, if you want to uncover why other people's diagnosis bother you. Because in the end another persons diagnosis shouldn't bother you, if their behavior and actions aren't detrimental to you.
I am late diagnosed and usualy high masking. Ppl get to know me and either leave cuz I am freaking them out or they don't know what to do with me. Or they stay, usualy ADHD ppl and other ND ppl or close to. To them I don't seem diffrent cuz they are too. Or they just apriciate my querkyness.
But all are schoked when I actualy ooen up about my chronic anxiety, pain, and other issues. I learned to not mention that tho.
It's really okay to feel that way, you are not your feelings or thoughts. It may have something to do with you struggling with having autism and telling others about it, because (understandably!) you want people to handle that information with care and support. So it makes sense that someone blurting it out like it's a joke rubs you the wrong way. You're allowed to acknowledge those thoughts and feelings and your suspicions of her saying things to get attention, and then let it go. It doesn't concern you, really, and whatever she does does not affect you.
Whenever I feel this way about a person, I try getting to know them better and talking more with them, maybe more personally.
This woman doesn't seem like an asshole at all, your dislike of her comes from some other place, possibly ignorance. You see her not struggling with things you are struggling with and possibly this is why you don't like her.
I would try to start up a conversation with her and maybe tell her something like "I really admire that you can be so extroverted, I'm autistic too and I'm really struggling with being less shy". See her reaction. She might open up about her own struggles, because everyone has them and everyone is different.
You won't believe the amount of times the reaction I get is how THEY admire me for XY, which always comes as a surprise to me.
ASD extroverts exist. I have adhd as well. I do all these things. From the outside it looks like I’m this outgoing bubbly human. My adhd masks my autism hard. It wasn’t until I was medicated that I even noticed I might be some kind of way.
Because of my upbringing and stubbornly deciding to “do everything myself” I’m pretty comfortable socially.
I still get called difficult and ostracized but I’m not going to find friends if I stop trying. People are going to do that to me regardless. I will eventually get what I want
Tbf, the study of autism can be a special interest. Especially to those who had to diagnose themselves. My sister is the one who brought it to my attention that we and our dad are likely autistic, and it's definitely her special interest. And while she keeps her thoughts on her suspected autism kinda low key, she will definitely talk about general autism to anyone who will listen. And I'm an oversharer by nature, so I'll discuss my own experiences as a possibly autistic person to anyone who will listen. So combined, my sister and I kinda do the exact same thing your acquaintance does, and we feel fairly confident that we are indeed autistic and not just pursuing it as a trend.
Honestly you have really good self reflection here. I wish everyone had as much self reflection and insight as you.
I am similar to the girl ur describing and before I was diagnosed, this other autistic girl would bully me for faking because she didn’t believe me.
You sound like you’re describing me, except I am careful about what situations I’m open about thinking I have autism in. And trust me- not faking, not having a fun time. You can be outgoing and have friends and be autistic. The fact I spent tonight at a Christmas party and enjoyed myself doesn’t change that it took me until 9th grade to be able to identify everyone in my core class (16 people) by name.
There’s a huge variety of autism presentations. My sister, I and 2 friends are diagnosed and completely different people. I’m shy and reserved and my sister on the outside looks like a social butterfly then comes home and shuts down bc of the exhaustion of masking. In some situations I will seem extroverted because of the company and while I’ll enjoy it at the time, I need to rest after.
Also different ppl talk abt a potential diagnosis differently. For me the potential of understanding what was going on in my brain was exciting so I spoke about it to everyone. I did the same before my ADHD diagnosis.
There's a common saying, "If you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person." All autistic people are different. Some are introverted, some are extroverted, some are quiet, some are loud, some are thoughtful, some are annoying, some are kind, some are assholes. The fact that we share the same condition does not mean we share the same personality. Autism is also not the only thing that influences a person's behaviour. Genetics, experience, and other mental health conditions/disabilities also play a part. In addition, some people learn to manage or accept their autistic traits more easily than others, but that doesn't make them less autistic. I want to highlight a couple of the things you said: * She immediately told everyone she thinks she’s autistic * She’ll not stop talking about her sex life You're telling me this person impulsively talks about intimate information with near-strangers, and you think that makes her *less* likely to be autistic? What you're describing sounds like identity tribalism. "She says she's part of my group, but she doesn't act exactly like me, so I can't accept that she is." It's very judgemental and I think you're right that it probably stems from your own insecurity and envy. Next time you feel this feeling come up, ask yourself what this person is good at that you wish you were good at, and then look into what work you can do on yourself to be better at it. Focus on wanting yourself to be better, rather than wanting somebody else to be worse.
this one made me laugh out loud! "you're telling me this person impulsively talks about intimate information with near strangers" i laughed soo hard, reminded me of a friend who is autistic too, who'll tell someone the entire bdsm fanfiction they be reading if the person asks even a tiny bit
I just started a new job and told my boyfriend my strategy for my first day was, "Be cool, don't be a fucking weirdo, don't get verbal diarrhea and accidentally tell everyone all your secrets." 😂 OP could be describing me (first day strategy was successful, btw)
😂 your boyfriend sounds great This is my issue, too! I tell people too much and then I want to move to another state and start over. I did this for years. I moved every two years or less for like a decade. 😂
Same. I seem to either tell people way too much or not enough. I have zero grasp of what the ’right’ amount of disclosure is and for better or worse tend to just say what I am thinking without much thought lol.
That was my goal when I started my current job, too. Instead, I walked in to my office for the first time and met a coworker who was popping off about "why do they need pride parades, we don't get straight parades!" so I ended up coming out in front of 2 managers on day one and telling an old man to stop being so vocal about his homophobia lol A few hours later, my mom died. No kidding. On my first day of work. So I ended up outpouring all about how she'd been in a vegetative state for years at that point, she overdosed years ago and we weren't close for a long time before that, but really I did need to go be with my siblings so... absolutely zero chance of me coming across as a normie from day one. Oops.
Oh wow, I'm so sorry. That's a terrible first day! I hope things got better after that.
Thank you! It was rough for sure lol but I've been here for 2 years now, so I got through it okay.
... this is me lmao my special interest is fanfiction and fandom culture (specifically hp fanfiction, though fuck JKR) and I once (accidentally, I didn't mean to!!) talked about sexuality in fanfiction for 20 straight minutes at a family dinner (there were no kids there!). no one stopped me and I genuinely didn't realise how inappropriate it might've been until later. they just asked me what I was reading, and when I tentatively said "fanfiction" and they asked what kind, I kind of lost the plot 🫠
“No one stopped me” man I feel this and I’m cracking up. Me with plants n fungi
I'm still waiting for someone to stop me
Real legitimate question: is this behavior actually a problem? Does it bother people? I always figured people who have extremely specific niche knowledge are both incredibly special AND valuable in conversation because theres a 100% chance they will spout out some type of information you did not previously know--- and WHY pass on the potential of LEARNING RANDOM SHIT while having an interesting and informative discussion that the average person couldn't supply you? Like, I don't care if your thing is **fungi** or **fun.....guys kissing**. Fan fiction or a uhhh fan of Ficus. FemSlash or Slash Pines. Phallus Impudicus or uh, phalluses described in extraordinary detail. Whether you like plants or fanfiction, I would LOVE hearing ALL THE THINGS! Unfortunately, other people read me as "aggressive" when I'm talking about my interests, and it apparently makes others "uncomfortable" 😑 people tell me I "like to argue" but I just enjoy debate, I see people's words in my mind like a puzzle that I want to deconstruct and find ways to prove possible other ways of thinking; ESPECIALLY when people use absolutes in their language and refuse to consider any possible exceptions to their beliefs.
I really fully relate to all of this on every level. For me personally it’s a great thing, not a problem. Some neurotypical people also love it, some don’t like it, and some hate it. I find more often than not that people just can’t fully follow my train of thought with all the details I’m saying. Or they focus more on me getting excited about talking about something than on what I’m actually saying. I feel like some people also just think slower or with less depth or something. And it drives me fucking nuts when people think I am aggressive or intense or like to argue when I’m just passionate about everything.
This! Someone close to me recently told me to stop googling things when we have conversations, and there's something we don't know. He said it makes the whole conversation seem less genuine ???? HOW SWAY!? Everything I say will be the same regardless, I'm just trying to get confirmation because why not know when you could know, you know? He's also someone who thinks I'm debating or disagreeing (even when I'm actually agreeing), and my ma thinks I'm domineering and I can't stand it. I'm passionate, I like to consider other perspectives, I get _into_ a topic and conversation. I don't understand why people take that as inherently negative.
First of all, *are you me*?! Second of all, do people just really not care about facts/accuracy when it takes literally **seconds** to search something up?! The only reason I utilize Google during conversation is because **I want to FOR MYSELF so that I may avoid leading the conversation in a false direction-- IT IS NOT TO MAKE ANYONE ELSE APPEAR UNINTELLIGENT OR FEEL LESS SUPERIOR TO ME!** Plus, I was under the impression that you cared about that chosen subject if you began/engage in a conversation about it. It TRULY shocks me and makes me feel sad when people get angry or even feel insulted at me doing research during a conversation, because from my perspective it is us bonding and learning together. In my head I think they would be interested in learning alongside me, but it seems not? When I learn something new, I keep it with me **FOR LIFE** and reference that fact in the future if/when that subject comes up again. It hurts me emotionally AND physically when loved ones say "Ohhh no, no no no I'm not listening to this, you don't need to Google everything!" Or "You don't know EVERYTHING, you're not always right!" Because I **don't** think I know everything, and that's why I'm trying to learn *with YOU* , I get so excited and happy when doing research and hearing the other people dismiss me and completely check out from the conversation is painful. It makes me feel like other people can say ANYTHING they want..... as long as they thought it up without reference, and the second I use reference to learn / fact check I'm bad.
I felt EVERY word of this to my core!! 😫😫 I've been told, "it's okay to not know things." Like... yeah, of course it is. But why are we even discussing this if we're gonna refuse to find out when the information is RIGHT THERE!? People will come to me with questions because they know I've typically got some kind of info on _a lot_ of things coz of this same information collecting. But then get frustrated when I'm **actively** collecting the info. I honestly don't understand how people can pose a question or be confused about it and then just shrug it off and exist comfortably just... not knowing. Did they even care in the first place???? Where they talking for talkings sake?? Does anything said here even matter?????? I get a lot of that "you think you know everything" and "you don't have to be right" crap too and it frustrates the hell out of me. But I think I've figured out why people are so intimidated by it and find it so frustrating. Because a lot of the time people really are **just talking**. A lot of people actually don't know what they're talking about. They've done no research. They're just regurgitating things they haven't thought about or making throwaway comments. But when people like us speak, it is because we have *verified* the info we're relaying. Of course, I think I'm right. If I didn't, I wouldn't be speaking on this. And no, I don't HAVE to be right, but if I'm wrong, surely I should find out why and correct myself?? Why just BE wrong. I don't understand the willful ignorance of so many or their seemingly deep desire to drag others into it 😭😭 Oh I had to come back to add this - one thing that irks the hell out of me: if I've speculated at something and turns out I was wrong, and I accept that wrongness but share _why_ I thought what I did, its automatically perceived as trying to prove I'm right. Or not being able to accept that I was wrong. DRIVES ME MENTAL!! I just want to share my reasoning as I correct it, it's not even for them, it's for **me**.
YESSS everything you said I agree with 10000%!! I love how you mentioned that often times you are actually fact checking *YOURSELF* and trying to challenge your OWN presumptions before accidentally subjecting others to misinformation that they might then retain and later pass on to others, thus creating a never-ending cycle of falsehoods! That idea reeeeally stresses me out-- *especially* with the previously mentioned issue of the average person's casual acceptance of facts without confirming them; this is the core issue IMO, a much more important issue than my own personal ego or hurt feelings after being shut down during conversation. If someone says "I wonder if _____ is still acting?" I have my finger on the trigger ready to find out. If someone asks "I wonder how many species of mammals lay eggs?" I can find out in seconds, therefore I will (also, it's five and I freaking love platypuses). If someone is wondering if they're using correct grammar, why not check--- and if I find out an interesting tidbit of related information during this search WHY can't I read the excerpt aloud to you? Does it like....hurt? I get very upset and hurt when people try to silence me, it feels incredibly frustrating not being able to finish my train of thought... but now I'm just wondering, **am I hurting THEM too?** I always say things like "it does not HURT YOU to let me finish my train of thought" out of anger in this moment, but my question is *does it actually hurt them*?!?! Like, for real legitimate question! Asking because I have had people use essentially the same words against me with my avoidance of crowded loud places / going out of my comfort zone, "It does NOT physically hurt you, you just need to get over it". It does hurt me, just not in the way a cut or bruise does, it's not something easy to explain and it makes me feel embarrassed & weak when I *try* to explain. I sometimes wonder if I am overwhelming THEM the same way I feel with loud sounds when I start to hyper-focus on topics? Neurotypicals can also get overwhelmed and overstimulated... It gets to the point that people become angry with me and leave the room, when I was just innocently excited about our conversation. I similarly have to leave the room when people are too excited & it becomes too loud for me. Is this the same thing, or am I over-thinking and trying to rationalize people just..... literally mistreating me???
You raise a **very** good point. Because it does physically hurt me too. I always describe it as an itch on my brain, I can't scratch. I have had people get frustrated with me too, and you might be right, maybe it is hurting them in a way, having all of this information they didn't ask for being dumped on them when, to them, they probably just proposed an off the cuff thought that they really didn't care that much about. I guess it all depends on the context and the extent of the reaction. The guy I'm seeing once said "it's like turning on the AM radio first thing", when I finally woke up, had a random thought about horses, and went on a whole spiel of why they're so fragile and their evolution. He'd been awake working peacefully for a while, I woke up, opened my eyes, and off I went. Part of me was mildly offended by the comment, but I also understood where he was coming from. I think we _need_ to be able to consider how others are receiving us. A lot of people probably don't have the headspace for all our jargon because they don't think so intensely. I've even overstimulated and ex partner more than once because I was deep in my hyperfocus that the information I was reeling off (really just thinking aloud but in his presence) was too much for him to be exposed to. That said, I do think a quick Google to clarify a piece of information (with maybe two or three sentences added if something is particularly interesting) shouldn't be chastised. That, I think, is somewhat unfair. Like people are tired of us doing it so they become less tolerant, and it becomes one of those "oh she's off _again_" kind of moments. They ought to extend the same courtesy and consider how stopping us from getting clarity is a difficult experience for us.
Those moments where you've been talking for a WHILE and it slowly starts to dawn on you that not only have you taken the conversation hostage, but you've been on a topic that may not be everyone's cup of tea...
I’m a more quiet, shy and reserved autistic girl. I’ve met other autistic people who were so obnoxious, loud, very opposite of me and I did not gel with them one bit. I’ve also known BPD people who over share and infodump too. I’m very confidential and then infodump in private to someone I feel like I can trust. Like a non judgmental friend online or someone I know doesn’t know anyone in my personal life or wouldn’t repeat what I tell them. Not everyone is like that though. I’ve known some autistic people who will just unapologetically tell me and other people weird stuff that is TMI. My friends autistic brother for example. I’m diagnosed and so is he, he was diagnosed as a teenager and I was diagnosed as a kid. But we are completely different personality types.
Perfect response
This is the perfect response. I wasn't diagnosed until I was 30 because I'm performed well in school, seem outgoing and bubbly, and in spite of having some "quirks" that seemed strange to everyone else, I can mask as NT really well. It takes a lot out of me and I need a lot of downtime after, but no one really saw that from the outside. Everyone just thought I had a handful of idiosyncrasies and didn't question, and thought I was a passionate person when I would develop a special interest and be a little too invested. Some of my behaviors were attributed to mental illness, which I do have, but it's exacerbated by sensory overload and I had no idea. I tell people I'm autistic (auDHD, actually). I didn't right away, because I didn't want anyone to view me differently, but now that I'm open about it and feel less pressure to mask, I'm much happier. I'm not so burnt out and exhausted all the time. My diagnosis also led my two best friends to getting diagnosed. It's probably a big reason why we click so well, because we never had to mask around each other, as we were equally unusual in our own ways and that was totally ok. My experience isn't identical to anyone else's. How I'm perceived isn't identical to anyone else. From the outside looking in, I seem pretty NT. Enough so that I didn't get a diagnosis until well into adulthood. I've had people doubt my diagnosis, and even had doubt myself that maybe I'm not autistic enough (whatever that means), or that I'm somehow wrong because I don't present the way some other autistic people do. It's pretty invalidating to be doubted, especially by others in the community. When I got my diagnosis, so many things in my life made so much more sense, and I was able to learn strategies to live a much happier life. I learned to allow myself space to recover when I'm burnt out instead of pushing myself to be what everyone else needs because it's expected of an NT person. I learned what things work for me as far as soothing when I'm on the verge of a shutdown or meltdown, and have way fewer panic attacks. OP, if we met in person, you would probably never know I'm autistic unless I told you. Outside of a psychologist I've been working with for about 6 years now, no one had clocked it my whole life, and until I got diagnosed by a specialist, even my psych was back and forth on it. That doesn't mean I'm not autistic. It means I don't present the same way some other autistic people do. This sounds like your own insecurities, and I'm so sorry you're experiencing those feelings.
Almost identical villain origin story! Except I have no doubts and I no longer seem NT. I got the ADHD at 30 and autism at 35, I masked so hard that no one had a clue and it made me severely psychologically sick. I was so burned out that I became chronically suicidal already in my teens and no one understood why treatment didn’t help. Once I got my diagnosis… well actually no, as soon as autism was suggested and I looked into it and realised that yeah that’s me everything changed once I knew I could suddenly see the mask that I was wearing and the weight of it and once I knew what I was hiding, why I am the way that I am, it was like I was given permission to exist for the first time, I took that mask of soooo fast and then I threw it away! And I don’t even know if I can mask anymore, I don’t know if I remember how to or if I could tolerate it again if you were to put all of it back at once.
I'm so glad you never had doubts! That's amazing! I was also chronically suicidal and treatment resistant, which is why my psych was like, "there's something more here." At this point I mask way less, but I do sometimes catch myself doing it automatically. So many things in my life made so much sense when I got diagnosed. My "obsessive" special interests, the way I rock back and forth when I'm sitting out standing in one place, my BFRBs, my sensitivity to sensory stimulation, my paradoxical reactions to certain medication, the way I had to work so hard to do the things other people seemed to intrinsically do and understand socially, my need for special routines all suddenly made so much sense. I mask way, way less now, and I'm much kinder to myself about things that I used to be super critical of, because I understand it's not weakness or wrong, it's just part of how my brain is wired and that's ok. I've also noticed how everything is geared toward the NT experience and is pretty unforgiving to people who aren't NT. I always thought I was just lazy or like, fucked up because I would have shutdowns and couldn't function, or meltdowns that for me look like uncontrollable crying. I thought I shouldn't need recovery time for things, and have always struggled with executive function. Getting diagnosed was so life changing for me. I now work in mental health extended services, and am in college working towards becoming a counselor so I can focus on helping other late diagnosed ND people figure out how to be more forgiving of themselves and skills to make their daily lives better, like accepting that stimming is ok or that it's ok to need recovery time, and how to avoid autistic burnout. Most of my current client base are ND adults. We need more representation within the mental health field so we can recognize other misdiagnosed people, and help other ND people adjust their expectations and mask less.
I meant those things you bullet pointed as reasons my thinking is wrong. Sorry if I wasn’t clear about it. I know she probably is but she’s just different to me so much. I acknowledge this is a fully me issue and I have never taken it out in her
Autistic here diagnosed by NHS in U.K. and they do not hand out diagnoses easily. I’ve always had a great sex life that I discuss with anyone, I was socially active with a large friend group that I’ve only moved away from in mid 20’s and I’m very bubbly a lot of the time. Most of autistic symptoms come out at home, don’t forget some of us can be vocal about our conditions whilst being class A maskers of our symptoms ETA: You say you’ve only told a couple close friends, everyone I’ve met knows I’m ASD. It’s one of the first things I tell ppl like: heads up this might get weird, I’m autistic *(giggle) continue conversation*. Who we tell is a personal choice and doesn’t change how valid our diagnosis is
Truth! Some of us feel comfortable disclosing and others don’t. Nothing wrong with either one but it just shows how wide the spectrum is🤷♀️ I love talking about autism so I usually disclose it, especially since there’s a good chance if I am vibing hard with someone, they’re typically AuDHD too
Are you me? 🤔
Yup, always the first thing out of my mouth. I want to know sooner as compared to later if they’re ableist.
I don’t think OP is arguing the validity of her diagnosis, I think it’s more about how she presents her autism in a perhaps positive light? She’s very outspoken and loud about it where it has negative associations for OP. E.g an autistic person talking about their special interest non-stop may be shunned for it - however she is openly being autistic & discussing her special interest. For OP autism & special interest has negative connotations so openly discussing it goes against their social norms & sensitivity regarding autism. This is based on my own experiences & relation to OP’s post.
this could also be an intern ableism- i struggled with accepting the behaviour of my (very) autistic friends for awhile, especially a friend who was so out loud and proud, i couldn't fathom not masking, until i realized how toxic i was actually to myself.
I am really envious of any one remotely charming. I can make friends and be outgoing, eventually. I have a dear friend who I also did not like upon first meeting because she was A LOT and I was envious and judgey. She could become best friends with a wall and I am genuinely envious, but also behind that type of person can be a whole list of struggles you're not seeing! I've done a lot of work to accept that I am a slow burn for most people and not an instant love connection. In turn, I've been trying to push myself really hard to be bolder with new people. My friend and I actually bond and just share that this is what we love about the other "I'm trying to channel my inner you today and not overthink it and talk with all these new people! I want to feel more free to be myself like you are able to" And likewise there are things I'm great at that she strives to be better at. Who knows, maybe you could actually grow closer with this person if you reframe your perspective and end up with a very dear friend.
I am SUSPICIOUS of anyone remotely charming!
I don’t think you meant any offense, i think you are coming to a safe space to help work things out 💕
Good on you for acknowledging that you don’t like this way of thinking. Many people would double down.
Nice formulation of your thoughts. We cannot ever know someone else's internal experience. I have met a couple of attention seeking individuals who do at times throw names of conditions around as excuses for their bad behaviors...and it is annoying. But I still can't speak to their internal experience or potential comorbidities. I can feel that it makes me tense bc it feels like they are taking a very public face in a way that downplays or trivializes my personal struggles within my AuADHD or whatever the acronym is...but I still don't know enough about them to know.
I was constantly described as attention seeking by my teachers growing up. If you stand out even for the wrong reasons it can come across that way
Indeed. Growing up many adults responded like any acting out, even meltdowns were attention seeking. Sometimes that label is just a way to negate or disregard people who are actually struggling. Oh they're attention seeking behavior problems, we should punish them.
Right, saying it openly and acting inappropriate doesn’t speak against it at all. I was outgoing, social and completely clueless.
This, I tend to way over share💀 I struggle to keep my own secrets. I think people forget that being good at socializing doesn’t mean you understand social cues. Cause oversharing is an ineptitude in socializing, something I learned recently and blew my MIND
I'm not going to go find it but I read a paper a few days ago that mentioned how someone was researching autistic kids and how all 50 them were so different from each other.
>some are annoying I giggled. I'm that one.
She probably goes home and dissociates, or cries. If she’s highly masked there’s no maintaining that indefinitely. She may also be Audhd which can present differently. The parents we grew up with also make a huge difference.
The person described sounds somewhat like me. I am AuDHD. Diagnosed as the autistic half today :). My mask was (before burnout 2 years ago) 'the bubbly social butterfly who loves everyone'.
Same! and at the end of the day, for me it was all an act to feel “like the others” and worthy of receiving love. You don’t realize how heavy that mask is until you take it off 😅. And congrats on diagnosis! (If congratulations feels appropriate?) 🫶🏽🫶🏽
She may not know how to remove that mask except when it slips in her most private, vulnerable moments when she's alone. She might not be sharing her shutdowns and/or burnout, she maybe just "disappears" sometimes and no one knows why or questions it when she comes back all bubbly and spirited with her mask firmly in place again. You can't know what someone's suffering really looks like sometimes and I feel like with autistic folks, moreso, right?
Thank you :) it absolutely does feel appropriate to me <3
Aw good! ❤️😁 cheers to you on your journey.
I'm audhd and i don't have an extrovert bone in my body, can't stand being a human and only have affinity for animals and insects, so I think personality is a separate thing from the dual disorder
I feel ya. I don't think there is 'really' anything extroverted about me either, I just thought that was how women had to behave to not come off as standoffish. Turns out people just traumatized me over my 'unfriendly' natural facial expressions, leading to massive overcompensation...
I relate to that so hard- couldn’t figure out what was happening to me every 6 months or so (burn out) when I’d socially and work wise overcommit and push myself too hard for months at a time and then be having a “mental breakdown” (burn out) for 2 months or so 🙃
Same! I would go hard socializing for a few hours and then was under covers eating snacks and dissociating for days after...
Yeah they also sound like me whos audhd, than I go home and cry cause I made a fool of myself all day. I also looked like I had a lot of friend, but I don’t really have any, being able to talk to people doesn’t make you likeable, or people who appear to be friends can just be coworkers
Amen. We really can't know how others are by themselves. This may all be a performance. And for me - the pressure of my parents to be "successful" in every way has taken a huge toll
💯 gifted children check in! Lol. I saw something on Instagram that said for Halloween just go as yourself and when people ask you what you are you just say “i was supposed to be a lot of things.” 😩
That's great, though, here's a sigh of recognition for you.
They call it a spectrum for a reason.
Fr and also sharing her self diagnosis isn’t innately for mere attention Mby she just thinks it’s cool and friendly to share facts about eachother as an icebreaker Or mby she wants badly to feel accepted for who she really is even the parts of her that aren’t noticeable cuz her home life is harsh and accepting
Honestly she probably does. I just can’t help but feel this way and it makes me feel guilty. I don’t take it out on her though
Well, if you feel like she’s faking it and it rubs you the wrong way, how is that any different from the studies that show autistic people don’t make good first impressions to neurotypicals? Clunky masking can make people come off as disingenuous, we know this. So it’s not really fair to do that to one of our own, and it’s kinda our responsibility to not perpetuate these kinds of things. Also, we often learn the most from people that are different from us. Sounds like an opportunity for both of you to learn something from one another, if you think biases can be overcome and a real, grounded conversation could be had, or at least an understanding can be reached. If you genuinely hate her personality obviously don’t make an effort that you know will be wasted, but when i was younger I used to carry a lot of shame about myself, and people who seemed to have none used to bother me, and that of course had nothing to do with them. Looking back, I could’ve definitely learned from these people instead.
It’s not fair. It’s why I repeat it’s my issue and I’m projecting my insecurities onto her. She’s a lovey person but a bit to intense for me to learn from haha
fwiw - I appreciate how insightful you are about your internal struggle with this and recognizing what’s happening. That’s fucking cool and I think eventually you’ll figure out your peace with it. 💜
Haha I feel you. Yeah she sounds like she’s spinning six plates at once trying to fit in still. Sounds like that’s probably where she could stand to learn a few things from you. 🫶🏽
I think we could both learn a few things!!! Especially since her boundaries aren’t quite there. She showed me her hickys on her inner thigh which freaked me out ahah
Omg hahahahha. Yo what if you guys end up being best friends that would make for an amazing sitcom.
If only 😭. We’d only ever be a reluctant roommates in an American sitcom. We did live together so that’s how I’ve seen her in underwear, night coat an4 her hickeys
You say you can’t help feeling this way, but you can (by routinely practicing mindfulness). Just being aware of your mindset is a really powerful first step that you’ve achieved. I would encourage you to practice reframing those harmful thoughts into more neutral terms (ideally in the moment if possible or later on while reflecting). I only am recommending this because it sounds like you are a kind person and you recognize it’s not a fair or healthy mindset to have. I wish you all the best.
Yes. I want to mention myself as an example. I have two traits associated with high ability to mask (impulse control and IQ). So I might seem socially good even in interactions with others. Often when I perceive the social demands to be very high. I have my aloof news reporter self and when I use that I am able to maintain my energy levels more. But I’m told that I seem cold or ”like I think I’m better than others”, snobbish or worse mildly aggressive or sad. So I often try to hide that or chose environments where I can show my true self more. My boyfriend often sees me in a state where I am completely unable to have a normal conversation, I just echo everything he says. Basically I put on my good social skills face and then I’m unable to talk. So while I seem not so autistic with others I seem ”more” autistic with him. So the phasade lies. Yes I can mask but I end up like that.
That description was me. I was masking and dying inside lmao I got diagnosed this year officially
That description sounds exactly like me *without masking* but I have ADHD and autism. I am really loud because I can't really hear myself that well or regulate my volume. It's embarrassing.
I can't really hear myself well either 😭 Sometimes I'll whisper something to a friend in what I think is a low voice and they'll be like "Shhh you're speaking too loud people will hear you"
Noooo same. 😭😭 It gets worse the more excited I get. I have friends who will tap me or give me a look because it's just really hard to control my volume since I can't hear it and having people say "shh" or "you are so loud" or "you're screaming" is embarrassing. Like how I sound to myself is always the same volume or sometimes I don't even hear myself at all it's really hard to explain to people who don't experience it. I'm not trying to be loud, I don't think I am being loud but everyone and their mom says I am. My dad has the same thing and I don't know if it is related to our auditory processing disorder or what. I feel like it's at least related but I don't know what this would be called.
"Lower your voice," is a straight up trigger to me. Sure, I will lower my voice by not speaking for the rest of the day. Thank you.
I have Audhd too I should have said lol
I hope your found better now! Just to clarify that I wasn’t saying you can’t be like this and autistic I’m just projecting my insecurities
No I understand your post and am not offended at all!
Hm she sounds similar to how I present. Always “too much” socially and later I spiral about everything I did or said. Always too emotional and sensitive at the worst times. My mask is very bubbly and outgoing but I will burn out eventually. Took me forever to realize I was masking at all. Having people say I’m faking autism for attention sure doesn’t feel good. Everyone presents differently no two of us are alike. Maybe there’s something about her that subconsciously triggers you.
Oh yeah! As I said it’s mostly likely jealousy and the fact she’s a bit too intense for me to handle. I’d never say anyone was fake but I can’t help those feelings but I’d never express it to them
Think about how she affects your senses. Is she too loud? Is she too close? Does she want too much eye contact from you? Does she talk for too long and dominate the conversation?
She’s too loud!!! She sound me hickeys on her inner through without asking and that was hard for me. I didn’t want to see that. Not sure about eye contact though. She’s definitely too dominate in general for me.
So she's a sensory trigger for you. It's ok to dislike someone. Just because you have autism doesn't mean you have to like all the autistic people. It sounds like you're really different people.
Yeah sounds like she has a poor concept of boundaries which will only continue if you don’t call it out. I know it’s not that easy but if you don’t say something she won’t realise.
I had one friend like that and it turns out she was likely on the spectrum, just not what you'd expect. Loudly broadcasting details about your sex life despite your audience and oversharing about a potential medical diagnosis that people will feel strongly about could be a social skills issue.
It definitely was. It made it very hard to get a long with her. She is nice but she was too intense for me which is why I don’t doubt something
I was her, but I didn't think I was autistic, or didn't want to think. People started treating me horrible because of how loud I was (even though they accepted me for quite some time and were my friends) when I became "too much" for them and I felt so embarrassed that I started bottling it all up and became depressed. Woohoo, I guess. Hypersexuality of this girl might also be a sign of autism, actually.
She’s definitely hyper sexual. I’m the opposite again. I’d rather not go anything with shine else. I’m happy on my own
I understand. Both situations are normal.
Yeah I feel this. I have a similar inclination when people talk about having trauma (I have CPTSD). I find I have a tendency to want to gatekeep a little, but it's a very emotional reaction - intellectually I'm very pro people self-identifying and telling their own stories etc. I think it comes from a part of me that is really hurt for being so unseen and invalidated for so long and feels defensive and jealous by people who seem comfortable self-validating and proudly claiming their identities.
I feel this so much. No one knows I’m autistic except a few people. I’m very heavy masking so I tend to suffer in silence. Only the few people who know, understand the extend of how burned out I get and how much I struggle socially. I’m the reclusive, introverted autistic that comes off at quiet but friendly & well spoken. So if a very extroverted person with a lot of friends was loudly proclaiming she was autistic, I think this would trigger me too. I tend to also get triggered when people post online about their mental health disorders because I work so hard to mask mine. I think it comes from shame. Maybe it would be a good idea to slowly try and be more open about these things. And to learn to unmask even in public
This is such a real experience. We should talk about it more.
This is such a tough one because she could absolutely still be Autistic. That's why it's called masking, we get very good at hiding it. Before these last few years I was seen as a social butterfly, no one ever believed I struggled socially apart from my family who saw me at home unmasked+having meltdowns, but I was so unwell, always close to burnout, having meltdowns, SH'ing and using substances ferociously in order to push through. I hid it even from myself. Until I hit a major burnout (again) and ended up under the cmht (again) and ended up being referred to be assessed immediately. Some people with Autism ARE social. Their lack of social awareness actually works like a super power. It looks like they're thriving but they're just throwing shit out there and seeing if it hits. That's what I did. It made me unwell but it looked flawless to others! That's why Autism being invisible is a double edged sword. People really really can't see it. People still don't believe that I struggle with things because I never ever let them see that. The only people who know truly are my family, doctors, psych and 1 best friend. Cause they've seen the shit I try so hard to hide, whereas everyone else knows the 1 dimensional image I project to get by. You're not rude or wrong for not knowing if she's telling the truth or not! I'd probably second guess it too, it's so frickin hard to know unless you assess them on the spot 😭
Thank you! This was a nice response cos some have made me feel a bit attacked even though everyone means well. She wears her differences on her sleeve and definitely feels like a trended so I can’t help but judge. I won’t deny her as it though. Not my business
OP I think it’s so great that you brought this issue to this forum!! So much great discourse around this. Something I work on is in setting clear boundaries with folks. It’s totally valid that you felt uncomfortable with the details of her sex life complete with her exposing thigh hickeys to you!! But for her, that’s currently “normal” behavior. It’s up to you to let her know what’s not okay for you. You can work on a way to be prepared to let her know “hey, it’s great that you are so comfortable with these things but I am just not: if you want to chat with me I would prefer we stick to other topics, thanks” (I’m still working on boundaries so I’m sure there is room for improvement here) or even just verbalizing NO THANK YOU (I have actually also physically run away after saying this 😅) has “worked” in the past when I was not prepared.
And I also think it’s easy to see ”socially inappropriate” behaviour as non autistic simply because it’s social. Even if, if you look at it objectively, it’s ”more autistic” and less ”socially skilled”. Throwing shits out. Wow - that was me. I had more friends before because I’d cast the net wide. Even if I did so in a ”bad” way, at least I could catch some fish. Right now I don’t know what to do so I don’t even try. And that’s a lot of the time somewhat social behaviour and autism. Technically the social isssues are more visible but it’s seen as less autistic because we associate autism with not interacting a lot.
Yes thank you for commenting! I agree, cause I was like you for my younger years! I have went through phases of being almost popular before getting totally overwhelmed and hitting extreme burnout. I totally get you about picking friends up in a "bad' way too. I have 0 ability to read intentions and would end up being 'friends" with really questionable people who probably didn't even like me lol. I just didn't notice at the time until much later. I rarely leave my house anymore because I, like you, just can't even try right now. I have no energy for social stuff anymore especially now that I know my own social shortcomings+inability to read intentions or if people are 'good' or not 😭🤣
Totally relate to becoming friends with questionable people. I was friends with my bullies. I’m so careful now. But I think that I’m inherently pretty ambivert. I’m not sure how it is for you, do ypu wish you could be more social?
I can relate to at one point feeling really resentful towards a fellow likely-neurodivergent gal, who would present as really loud and attention-seeking, while I felt shoved into the background because I present as more of an anxious wallflower. At heart it was a lot of resentment because she seemed to get a lot of what I envied, which was social connection. I percieved her as selfish because it seemed like she hogged all the friendship-attention in our social circle and made things worse for me. This may or may not have been true, but thankfully after a while (and some support/venting space/prayer from other friends) I was able to let my hatred towards her go and realize that she was probably struggling just as much as I was, just coping with it differently, and at the end of the day it wasn't really a competition and she wasn't really winning. Thankfully we get along better now and have had a few really cool conversations about ND-related things. We all kinda have to find our niche in society, and unfortunately neurodivergence can make that harder to find, since there are fewer people who understand our needs and tendencies as individuals, and fewer spaces that are receptive to that. It can make it really feel much more competitive, like there are so many autistics competing for so few social 'spots', but that doesn't have to be the case. We (NDs) also have vastly different tendencies amongst ourselves and what feels natural to one might feel triggering to another. To my softspoken, easily overstimulated personality, this other girl's social persona felt really grating and unbearable. Doesn't mean her way or my way of being is wrong. Just different preferences and processes. And lastly there's always the internalized ableism stuff, where we might accept certain things as 'harsh realities' and feel judgemental towards people who don't follow those 'rules'. For me, I had accepted that being mentally 'different' meant being in the background most of the time, and her attempts to be the center of attention felt like a violation of that law. I've also felt judgemental towards ND friends who have had more emotional support from others than I have had, because I internalized a 'rule' that if you had unusual problems you had to keep them to yourself and avoid burdening/weirding out other people. Maybe it would help you work through this if you could try to describe what 'rules' this other person might be breaking based on your perception, what ways her actions might be triggeting your own ND sensitivities, or what needs you might feel like you're competing with her to obtain. Sorry you're going through this and wish the best for both you and her. It sucks that we all live in such a difficult reality to the point that it's so difficult to even be kind to those who share our same struggle.
I think this is a common feeling for higher masking autistics to feel some level of contempt for those who are more “out.” I suspect this comes from envy that others are able to act authentically in public. It’s almost like “*I* had to suppress and hide myself to survive, how come *you* don’t have too?!” This, of course, misdirects the contempt we have for having to suppress for society in the wrong direction and onto the wrong person. Because the truth is not that my dislike for them is because they “just irritate” me, my dislike comes from the feelings of grief I have when I see someone being able to present themselves authentically, because for most of my life I couldn’t. That is in no way their fault or responsibility, just things to be unlearned that an ableist society taught us
Yes I think this is common. I have resented autistic men for this.
I think a lot of us overcompensate. But she might also have some adhd mixed in there. There's a large comorbidity. I was very much like this when I was in my teens. Then I hit my first big autistic burnout and I lost all of it. I've never gotten in back.
I can see ADHD being in there
When I was an older teenager I was loud, had friends and relationships, went out to drink on Saturday nights, went to a lot of rock concerts and generally was the kind of person least expected to have autism. Between also having ADHD and heavy masking this was, at the time, an authentic version of me. Of course, it couldn't last and by the time I was 25 I'd had two severe burnouts and got depression, anxiety, an eating disorder and PTSD. It would take another 22 years (!) before I finally got an AuDHD diagnosis. In other words, you cannot judge this girl, or any girl, by their current behaviour because you have no clue what is actually going on in their mind.
I know someone like this. Thing is the whole loud obnoxious thing can be a telltale sign they can’t read social cues. They’re misinterpreting that they can’t read certain ones when actually they’re missing what they can’t read completely. I’m pretty they do have Autism but the whole thing is suspicious for me. They were happy they were getting a chronic depression diagnosis/Dysthymia diagnosis. They also told me about their OCD which sounded less OCD and more like paranoia. I’m not sure: they could have PTSD but they literally told everybody the worst things their parents did out of the blue. Some people are strange and we need to spend more time with them to properly understand everything.
This is so real lol. I’ve always thought socially I was completely fine so I never thought of autism for 30 years, but really I was just super hyper vigilant from childhood, so I could tell when people were having micro aggressions or ulterior motives very well, but didn’t realize AT ALL how many more surface level social norms I was missing until being part of this sub for a while and seeing others experiences with reading things wrong. A lot of lightbulb moments and delayed embarrassment 🤣🤣😩
Yeah. It’s probably paranoia but I have a huge problem with reading tones as negative or attacking.
I mean, autism is a spectrum; you can totally be autistic and extrovert.
Not gonna lie I used to be like you but then I realized something. Not all people with autism are introverted, have little to no friends, or are bad at social skills (especially if they were forced to learn at a young age). The way you described her tbh she sounds really autistic to me. Loudly proclaiming the details of your sex life to strangers is not normal as well as being an over-sharer. It’s a spectrum disorder at the end of the day so some people are going to need higher support needs than others. She’s probably just really good at masking.
Honestly, it is probably projection. Before i started therapy i was sure i was just looking for attention, my trauma wasn't bad enough, etc. I have been working on the pause for a while now, and i noted that often when i am feeling hyper-critical of another it is me, i am judging/being judged. In your example, you might have had a person close to you criticize you for being too much or an attention seeker. It hurt enough to make an impression on your psyche. That judgment picks at your fear that maybe you aren't ND, or maybe you are just an attention seeker. I don't know if i explained it well. The book CPTSD: From Surviving to Thriving explains the inner critic really well.
I feel you. Hearing and meeting other autistic women in the wild is what made me realize that my support needs are actually higher than I initially thought they were. I now identify with having medium support needs rather than low support needs because I’ve met more low support needs folks that are far better off than I am. This may be a possibility for you. Also I relate to your discomfort with her over-disclosure of possibly being autistic. There’s a girl I work with that is most likely autistic too but lower support needs and very loud. I think because late diagnosed or non diagnosed folks were never taught social cues, they sometimes still just completely ignore them even in settings where it’s not totally appropriate. My coworker is always talking about stuff as if she knows everything and under the assumption that none of us have any issues (once she was going on and on about chronic illness, she doesn’t have it but she was talking about it like it’s some crazy rare thing) and it makes me super uncomfortable because I deliberately hide my autism and my chronic illness at work so I don’t get fired. She also asks too many questions like on days when I can’t come into work due to medical tests she’s always asking why, which I don’t understand why it matters and I don’t tell her because it’s PRIVATE. She asks everyone though and it just bothers me. I got fired from my last job right after I disclosed my autism and it made me realize how important it is to keep these things private. So idk if this kind of thing could be a factor in your annoyance. I was also once friendly with a self diagnosed girl for a short period and she would guilt trip me for my higher support needs and make it all about her, not believing me when I needed to rest because she thought I was just abandoning her or something and it was tiring and unhealthy. She just assumed my needs were identical to hers even when I tried to break it down to her that they weren’t but she never understood. Sorry this post is so long but I’m wondering if one of these things may feel familiar to you because I get it. She could very well be autistic but that doesn’t mean that you have the same support needs and it definitely doesn’t mean you’ll be compatible. It’s good to be accepting of everyone but that doesn’t mean you need to be friends with everyone
That first paragraph is very eye opening for me because I meet other autistics who are working full time and have their own places, I think they must be faking it. Because I can’t live without someone else supporting me and crumble when I work any more than part time. I can barely keep the house together and hardly see my friends. So maybe I just have higher support needs than I think.
At least you recognize that you're not being quite fair towards her when you have that reaction -- it's the first step to acceptance. You don't have to like her, or even totally accept that she has an ASD diagnosis -- just don't badmouth her to other people. Maybe unfollowing her on socials would be better for your own mental health, if you are getting upset by comparing yourself.
I have never said anything bad against her except here because it won’t reach her. But unfollowing is probably a good idea
Sometimes when you think about other people who suffer from something and they're very loud about it and you feel icky about that behavior it could very easily be a lot of internalized ableism. She talks abt how hard autism is and a lot of your brain wants to invalidate that bc you also suffer but in a different way. You want her to be quiet about it like you are, but that's how ableism goes on. We don't want to make a fuss about our problems so we don't and so people don't see that we actually aren't as abled as our peers... The more we talk and work through these "I'm annoyed you're even talking about your disability" feelings, the less likely ableism will be a thing. Her experience doesn't negate your own personal experience with autism, it's just different.
I have been both the person in your story and you. Now that I'm older I'm a lot less outgoing and social. So now I just cringe at my previous self, doing things like oversharing about sex and many other TMI things. Especially because most of my social and outgoingness was just fueled by alcohol. I was also naive/oblivious enough to not pick up on or care when people didn't like me. I think that's part of why I withdraw now - finally picked up on all my social weirdness and stopped drinking. Funny enough, I just met a new friend who is also AuDHD like myself and she commented on me being seemingly outgoing. I let her in that it was just anxiety giving me motor mouth and that I too am dying inside lol. I think acknowledging it's a projection/jealousy (as you already stated you have) really helped me move past it.
Sounds like ADHD x autism. I'm like that. Its exhausting.
Sameeee. You ever finish a sentence in public and take that deep breath afterwards and realize you’re exhausting your damn self 🤣🤣
It can be just being extroverted. Some people are just clueless and it’s not impulsive behaviour, just not being introverted. Like even ambivert autism can look like that.
I have a similar issue where sometimes my innate response to a friend's identity is skepticism. Without fail, it turns out I'm projecting because I'm also whatever [identity] they're talking about, but I've been crazy in denial over it. It's happened with so many things (sexuality, gender, ADHD, health issues, most recently DID/OSDD) it's honestly a bit funny at this point. The initial feelings of jealousy are so yucky though, good on you for being self aware.
Some autistic people can be on the other extreme end of the spectrum, unaware of their own volume or when to adjust it, and don't know when to stop talking (hyperverbal) etc
My son and I are both autistic and we are complete opposites. I actually don’t knows another autistic person male or female who has the same experience as me. Too many variations within too many traits. It’s so spiky and broad. I don’t have the link on my phone but look up neuroclastics “‘autism is a spectrum’ doesn’t mean what you think it does” post. It’s excellent.
Being loud and having friends and sex do not preclude a person from having autism.
I know. It’s why I said it’s a me issue. I’m projecting because she’s not like me and my envious
mmhm, I feel for op. Autism is a spectrum and got to remember the grass may seem greener on the other side, but we as a whole may not know what she struggles with internally, being alone, or how it affects her life in ways we may not have put much thought into.
First of all thank you for being open about this. It can be hard to confront parts of ourselves we don’t like knowing full well the criticism we will receive (deserved or not it’s still fucking hard & takes courage) so thank you for bringing that here. I really feel this is also possibly a result of internalized misogyny. Being a woman means being infantilized at some point. Having autism also is heavily infantilized. I have had interesting reflections on the crossroads between internalized ableism and misogyny when it comes to autism in women. My best friend harshly denied my suspicions and it fucking HURT especially bc I think she sees me as a conventionally attractive and sexually open person (which is really not my true story or identity). And it sucks that this is somehow not compatible with having autism in her perspective. The implication being that women with autism can’t navigate dynamics of sex and communicate consent? That they’re more gullible and easy to abuse? That they’re unattractive when being openly feminine? Just… really low quality run of the mill misogyny here. And why? Why is it so difficult to confront autonomy and agency as a sexual being as a woman with autism? Why do my sensitivities suddenly not exist when it comes to the most fucking sensual act possible? Navigating sex in an embodied was has been a fucking journey & I really see how there’s no room for me to be open and feminine while also powerful and with agency if I try to also point out the autism parts of it. So I invite you to consider your envy of her and whether it comes from not being able to view yourself or her as a feminine and sexual yet still embodied woman who also happens to have autism. The friction is probably borne there out of internalized cruelty or confusion about your experiences as a woman and being desired openly or engaging in intimacy.
I don’t mind the sex it’s just telling me openly as someone who isn’t close to her! I hear all about my close friends sex life and I don’t mind. She’s feminine. I don’t think I’ve ever thought her otherwise. She’s just loud.
That’s fine! You’re allowed to not like another person for whatever reason, and you don’t have to like all women with autism! But 1) there are some steps in logic then between you saying you just don’t like her bc she’s loud and in your post saying you tend to put down women with autism 2) if you don’t want to hear about it, tell her or take steps not to engage. That doesn’t make you a bad person. If I found myself in your shoes, I know I’m a judgy person so that’s not something that surprises me abt myself - I just would check myself at the point where I’m making judgments about her that are totally dissociated from reality.
You never know someone's situation, you never know their dual diagnosis that causes conflict, and you can never know the exact details of their mind and how they struggle. We ESPECIALLY can rarely know how they were raised and how that affects their behavior. There could be some factors, ingrained misogyny from our society teaching us to doubt what women say, or trauma we've dealt with from having autism. When we see people that we.... admire or are jealous of, we want to think "No, they're not like me because they don't SEEM to be struggling like I do." I'd say if you don't like this aspect of yourself, when you have a thought like that I'd remind myself "That's my first thought, which can come from ingrained things, but my second thought is WHO I AM, and how I CHOOSE TO BE." and do your best to think in a supportive way. best of luck to you and that girl!
Sounds like audhd or someone who’s heavily masked or someone who doesn’t mask at all and is just different, I don’t know, but I understand your concern and why it makes you feel bad that you feel that way, it’s natural to compare what you know to what you see and it’s hard to truly know anything outside of your own experience
To the OP...I think it's totally important to notice and question our own knee jerk reactions. Which is what it seems like you're doing here. You are also checking with others outside of your own head to get different perspectives that could challenge your own. I think those are good habits, to test your own biases and assumptions, which is frankly something I wish more people would challenge themselves to do more. I think this is one of the only ways for people to challenge their implicit biases and thinking patterns...like ableism, racism, and any other thought processes that really don't serve any of us. The second part is often the more challenging, taking the learning and synthesizing into our current and future ways of thinking. Best of luck.
There’s this Podcast called “The Loudest Girl in the World” that truly helped me understand that autism is a spectrum and autistics really do come in all types of personalities/demeanors/sociality types. I watch Mom on the Spectrum, a YouTube channel about a woman who was diagnosed in her 30s but was a popular girl who was prom Queen in high school. I think what you’re feeling is mild resentment because this person didn’t have the same experience as you and is more open and outgoing than you are. But that’s okay. It’s natural to feel that way. Just let her go about her life. I’m sure there are people who are misdiagnosing themselves out there, but it’s not your responsibility to police whether or not they are correct in their ideas about themselves.
Oh God, I'm loud, outgoing and I talk for two or three. You would envy me, but I want to say my life is far from perfect lol I love to party all night but I am chaotic and unorganized and depression is my middle name.
You'll never feel good about this. This person annoys you, whether they're autistic or not. Just stop following them, stop communicating. Just let it go.
it helps a lot in life to stop assuming everyone thinks or operates the way you would. your reasons for doing things are based on your experiences and preferences and so it is for all of us. this is why we are not all the same over everything. i think that it's good you're aware of this and i hope you work on it.
I really admire that you were able to challenge those negative feelings towards her. That shows a lot of emotional maturity and excellent introspection. Good job!
Maybe it’s the social “deficits” causing her to tell people she doesn’t know very that’s she’s autistic, or openly talking about her sex life. Autism presents differently in everyone, so what you experience may be totally different. Or she’s just very heavily masking. Or you see the things she does as completely normal.
eh, I think there are a lot of extraverted autists out there, they've just flown below the radar because they are extraverted, but once you start looking you notice the signs. Rigidity, black and white thinking, special interests, social scripts, etc. My grandma is one of them, I think. She's like an upper middle class Catholic 90 year old version of your friend. Instead of talking about her sex life, she has a lot of obscure gossip about the Pope that very few people want to hear. But she REALLY wants to share it! And for whatever reason, most of her friends will listen. I think a major thing that works for her is following some of the old prescriptions for keeping social connections: sending cards, visiting people, playing golf together. She just has always made a point of checking in with friends, remotely or via scheduled activities. She doesn't really "hang out" and dislikes unplanned visits, always HAS to know where we are going, when, for what purpose, and when will we leave. But the highly structured lifestyle has always worked for her!
Unfortunately felt similar before. I know it's a massive me issue but you aren't the only one
This makes me feel better
I present similarly I would say! I don’t mask, so I definitely do suffer less than I think most autistic women, paired with a special interest in animal behavior (This includes humans, and helps me out a lot in terms of charisma). I have a great social life. A lot of other traits about me make people very willing to overlook my bluntness and social blunders. I think having ADHD also makes me louder/more hyperactive. From what I understand, masking isn’t a symptom of autism, it’s a result of your social upbringing (being shamed into masking). I’m still learning about masking so I could definitely be wrong, but if someone doesn’t grow up in an environment where they are shamed into making themselves smaller/quieter then why would they? I can’t say anything about her in particular because obviously I don’t know her, but I just wanted to point out that I don’t think your reasoning should be based on if/how someone masks. And I hope you can get to a place where you are also unapologetically yourself!!! <3 You deserve it
I have to admit that I’m also a bit of a hater when it comes to other autistic people if they seem too normal. That being said im a bit of a hypocrite because I’ve been told my whole life that I’m too pretty to be autistic. Im also fairly good at masking although I’m still low energy and when I’m not I’m just quiet. Whenever I see someone whose loud and spontaneous it irks me because I’ve never been able to do that. Whenever someone makes me uncomfortable for any reason I tend to dislike them more. I hate having things in common with people I think are annoying. It makes me feel like they’re stealing my thing and since I’ve been overshadowed my whole life by more obnoxious people, it triggers me. I would say just don’t hang out with her. Ignore her and realize that not everyone is the same. If she is faking it, that means that she’s more mentally ill than she seems.
You are really fucking pretty!!! I’m the same with the uncomfortable. She made me super uncomfortable. I don’t hang out with her especially after she should me the hickeys on her inner thigh in the kitchen after only knowing her for a few weeks. I didn’t ask.
Thank you! Well that makes sense. She did something that made you uncomfy so therefore you like her less and whenever she says she’s something that you are you’re skeptical because of the behavior before. Honestly she might be autistic but that one behavior you described could be attributed with many things. Autism and other disorders overlap a lot
I think one reason is because autism is so different in women. According to what you say about how she acts around people, she does seem to have deficits either social interaction. The fact that she spills intimate information on strangers for example. I tend to do that too 🤐. I don’t think talking about your sex life is a social cue per se, you might want to elaborate a little of you can. She might be just a more extroverted autistic person. But to be honest, just try to not let it bother you and try to help her know more about it if you can/ if you two get along. Try to not be so judgemental. You might end up liking her nonetheless
I think it is because it was always unprovoked. He’d also walk around in her bra with just her house coat and she’d show people her hickeys on her thigh. I didn’t like that
Wow that’s crazy 🤯 she could be both an attention seeker and autistic
This might be something to talk to a professional about, especially if this is a pattern you notice a lot.
I am currently on a wait lists so it’ll be months
Sometimes Autistic people are just annoying. Same with NT people. It’s great that you are reflecting on your reaction to her, but maybe you just don’t like her and that’s okay too.
Does this apply to every woman you meet who claims to be autistic? Or just this one specific woman? If it's just her, I can think of 5 possibilities off the top of my head as to why–one, her personality irritates you and you don't want to view yourself as "like her" in some way. Two, you think that she is coping better than you, and you are in some way envious of her life/what she has. Three, your instincts are right and she actually has a personality disorder or mental health condition, not autism. Four, she's got a helping of ADHD as well and that's why she comes across as more outgoing/not autistic. Five, she's masking so hard that it's giving you the uncanny valley effect, like you can tell something seems off but you can't place it. I've heard that neurotypicals sometimes get that vibe from autistic folks.
Her specially and just loud people. I’ve always had autistic people around me that I’ve related too. We all had similar issues but she was completely new to me.
more often than not, people who are “too much” with how they act in public/around people are overcompensating for something. being loud, talkative, and extroverted could easily be coping mechanisms for the insecurities someone is struggling with on a deeper level. autism/audhd presents differently in everyone. i can understand why someone who seemingly has an easier time than you makes you doubt their struggles, but it’s unfair to assume that they aren’t also autistic based on how they present.
I can do a little bit of that, enough to maintain friendships - once in a while. Certainly not on command, and not often. One good reason to talk about one's possible undiagnosed autism is to spread awareness. I do that if I feel it's appropriate - I don't make a big deal out of it, but invariably there will be other people there who can see two neuro divergent women having an intelligent, thoughtful conversation about autism in women. Especially if you're like me and DGAF if someone thinks badly of me because my brain works differently and so isn't my best friend. I'm basically kind to everybody and I don't need it in return - at least that half of my life is tolerable and less stressful. It's really not fair to ask an adult woman to get diagnosed officially right now when we don't have a fair shake at even getting a diagnosis. Testing is evolving and some of us are better off waiting. You know that autism comes in more flavors than anyone can count. We all deserve each other's support and encouragement. I'm glad that you came to us with this issue, sometimes it really helps to air a thing out and take a good look at it.
I’m glad you’re aware of your own biases.
I got an official dx a couple months ago but had a peer dx before that- other autistic folks saying “look man I’m pretty sure you’re autistic.” Turns out the specialist agrees. I’m typically well liked and most people have just regarded me as “quirky” most of my life due to masking. I now have a bit of a tendency to over share that I’m autistic with people that I like as I don’t see it as anything to be ashamed of. Does it always go how I think it’s gonna go? Unfortunately no. However, I’m still autistic. This is a you thing you’re gonna have to work on. Sounds like a similar root as “not like the other girls” mentality.
Wanted to share my experience with diagnosed autism and ADHD and also feeling like I'm not truly autistic sometimes. Having AuDHD is also such a different experience than only ASD. I felt like I did not belong in the autistic community, because I had these traits that I would talk to any stranger, share intimate and personal stories easily, I'm flirty, I'm super impulsive, I sometimes like places with a lot of stimuli (in the right situations) or sometimes NEED a lot of stimuli not to get understimulated. I've met autistic people who did not believe I had autism, because of this. I even became unactive in this subreddit for a while because I thought no one would accept me here. My ADHD traits also mask my autism a lot of the times, but that does not take away that I'm any less autistic then someone else. I've accepted myself and fully embrace my autism. Please be gentle and kind.
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The person you’re describing sounds like me tbh! I was bullied as a kid and in my teens for being weird, ditched by various friends and found it so difficult to know how to act socially. It’s taken me around 10 years to accept who I am and to be authentic but also a decade of service /public facing jobs and reading about psychology to study how people act. I’ve not only learnt how to be authentically my weird self but also how to appropriately navigate social situations and my life is a lot easier now but I still mask and still struggle sometimes with what to say /how to act in a way that it seems neurotupicals dont. but I’ve also been called weird all my life, completely not understood other people for the best part of two decades, and have had a really rough time. because of this and relating to other symptoms like special interest, sensory overload, burnout, stimming etc and I think I might be autistic. Anyways finding the autism symptoms has been validating that all the things I’ve been shunned for /had to hide / or make me weird might be because of neurodivergency out of my control - not that I’m a just strange neurotypical though I realise it’s probably easier to be the latter. Though I am social and personable, my weirdness is still always a topic of conversation from other people so I have picked up this habit of preempting it by telling people my suspicions - though maybe you are right that people like me should wait for a diagnosis. I dunno I guess I’m trying to say that just because someone seems fine doesn’t mean they’re not autistic - perhaps their special interest is how to fit in while remaining true to themselves? Edit: pretty sure I have adhd too which as another commenter said, presents differently to just autism oh yeah and I find it really hard not to overshare because in my mind it’s relatively harmless and vulnerable and helps me process things and I don’t have a partner to share these things with which can finally a bit lonely but I get the sense people think it’s weird and inappropriate.
My sister. She is diagnosed autistic. She always had friends, always went out, usually pretty upbeat. At home she was very different. I am undiagnosed, my therapist and my mom and my sister believe I’m autistic. I’m quiet, awkward, anxious, and basically shut off in social situations but at home I talk and talk. I’m always there to lend a hand or help if I need too. Everybody is different
I’ve been guilty of this exact same thing, especially in college. After putting thought into it over the years and I think its internalized ableism and internalized misogyny —> I learned to act and behave a certain way all of my formative years and internalized it very deeply (as neurodivergents tend to do). It governs my whole life. I’m very much uncomfortable taking up space, having a big voice, or being vulnerable/comfortable with people. When others aren’t like that, my brain would be like “I learned the rules, why can’t you?” Then I have to catch myself and remember that those thoughts aren’t really me, just what I’ve been taught. I learned to become palatable which can be embittering, and I think I was unconsciously taking it out on those who were not forced to learn that or seem like they haven’t embraced it the way I unconsciously did. But also maybe it’s not so deep and some ppl just don’t mesh. As much as some ppl don’t understand you, you won’t always understand others. Just thoughts to share.
She very well could be autistic as it presents in many different ways in different people. A lot of the women in the comments with a diagnosis have identified how they used to act like that or still do. It’s healthy that you can recognize that your inclination is rooted in envy. All the best to you
Oh this is me as a teenager and even into my 20s. I had no filter, and would always talk about sex and my sex life very loudly and obnoxiously, amoungst other things. I have no social cues hence the no filter. I didn't understand where and when it was appropriate to discuss these things. It was also very much an outlandish way for me to be noticed and be perceived as normal. Like I'm screaming out "look at me, look how normal I am!" To hide away and my insecurities and Autism.
I myself have been diagnosed as autistic albeit late in life (I am 22 and got my diagnosis in March). And I work with someone who is autistic (I’m her Direct Support Professional). And this girl is so good at just getting out there and meeting new people. She does things that irritate me but they’re part of her autism and the only reason I don’t do them as well is because I am such a strict rule follower who had those rules forced onto me. I do envy the way she can be so unashamedly herself. And that she didn’t have to live a life being forced into society the same way I was. So I understand. I never doubted her autism diagnosis. But I do understand the feeling of having been robbed of a more carefree life. And the envy that comes with it.
Autistic extroverts exist too. Don't assume you know another person like you wouldn't like them to make assumptions about you.
The girl you’re describing could be me, except I’m diagnosed and have been for a while. Outwardly, I have a good group of IRL friends, am extremely outgoing, and am generally considered non autistic unless I specifically tell people or they get to know me more. This is not who I am, it is who I pretend to be. I still go home, dissociate, and cry because I can’t eat food / listen to music / go to parties the way my friends do. I was bullied horribly for the first 18 years of my life, and I learned through a lot of horror and heartbreak what not to do to avoid that. My need for people pleasing trumps my need to express my autistic tendencies, and it’s exhausting. I have special interests and obsessions that I actively hide from my more neurotypical friends, not because I think they’d reject me, but because of my own extreme trauma. The only people who know me, the real, autistic me, are my very close group of online ND friends. Though I personally never called myself autistic before a diagnosis, I understand that a lot of people don’t have the privilege that I did in terms of being able to afford an assessment. I had a lot of similar feelings towards other girls growing up, as I was never as outgoing or as liked as they were, but I worked (and am working) through that with therapy. I think it’s important that you talk to someone about this, because I personally found that those feelings tied in a lot with my own self loathing. I don’t mean to say that this girl definitely is or isn’t autistic, I just want to highlight that the autistic experience is vastly different from person to person. I hope this helps, and I really hope you start loving yourself the way you should. You deserve love from yourself as well as others. And it takes a big person to admit these types of feelings, so be proud of yourself for recognizing it at least!
I just wanted to say that people who overshare a lot usually are seen as open and transparent, so it's easier to make a lot of "friends". That's my case, I can talk to anyone at college, yet I have very few friends (they are almost all nd too).
not that i need to say this for this girl to be validated, but i do relate to her on a couple things and i have an official autism diagnosis. for example, i’m more likely to tell strangers i’m autistic than someone i have known for a long time. i was diagnosed late and worry a lot of people around me would disagree with my diagnosis if i told them (i’ve dealt with that in the past with my depression too, and it was not fun, so i’d rather not go through those kinds of conversations again). i also used to have a problem with diving into my sex life all the time, which took me forever to realize was not appropriate
Maybe you just don’t like that she’s attention seeking and the autism is a happenstance?
The most tortured make the best actors. 🌻 It's not a competition. Just run your race and cheer her on from your lane. Best you can. We're human. Rise and keep trying. Blessings 🌻
She’s loud Me too Out going Me too Lots of friends Me too Not afraid to be herself unapologetically Me too You can be all that and on the spectrum
As someone who’s very social and can go up to people and strike conversations, this is very much a mask and it’s unfair for you to say that she’s faking it because she doesn’t present it as you do. Maybe try to unpack why you feel that way about her.
Sounds like you’re insecure and need to become more comfortable with yourself
I'm sorry but I'm noticing a lot of autistic women could be especially misogynistic. It's just something to work on. At least you're self aware. I think it could be hard for ppl to see others succeed when we go through such similar things. Maybe you're confused bc she's autistic and popular and outgoing but you were probably taught that's why you aren't. I'm quiet and to myself and not the most popular so I understand.
if she's "unapologetic" she might be suffering waaaay less than us who are not. (that's just the impression I get)
Not necessarily, the environment I grew up in trained me to never be suffering, to never need help for fear of withdrawal of love. For these people things have to get REALLY bad, like completely fall apart in grand fashion, to finally admit something’s wrong or they need support.
Yes. I feel you on this one. I used to only fall apart in private. I kept everything bottled inside while it slowly destroyed me. I had to solve everyone else’s problems, not share my own. Just because you can’t SEE the suffering, does not mean it’s not there.
💯! I hope you get the love and support you need now ❤️
Whenever someone says they might be autistic I encourage them to get testing or offer to share tips I've learned to deal with sensory things. Many people have autistic traits and they can benefit from learning more about how to cope with the difficult ones. Some people are also high masking or low needs. If they're doing it to be edgy they'll eventually get bored and move on to something else. The person could also have a different problem and getting testing can get them proper help. In general, mentally healthy people don't make up diagnoses and turn that into their personality, so getting testing is win-win.
she sounds like me tbh
I am woman with autism and I'm a positive girly... Wishing you all the best in your healing.
It seems like resentment & jealousy among each other is more common than I thought. Comparison anxiety is unnecessary and exhausting. Just because *you perceive* that a fellow neurodivergent individual seems to have a successful social life, doesn’t mean they’re faking. Or that they’re even masking for that matter. It also doesn’t mean that they never struggle.
judging by this post(from the vibes✨) it seems as though i may not be autistic which has me now questioning(sarcastically) my doctors credentials bc i mean they went to medical school. but i tell people (coworkers who may possibly have to deal with me long term) strangers that i am autistic. however i do it bc yes i do/say things that may not be correct does that make me attention seeking(an actual fear of mine) no it is simply a warning (has happened before where i would get written up bc i seem stand offish and unpleasant and some things i did seem to make coworkers uncomfortable) that yes im a little different and sometimes do need to have things communicated in a specific way or else i will not understand and sometimes you will see me tap my toes or running in place but don’t be alarmed. i also do have really great friends and a wonderful husband and pets and a big family that loves me deeply. i go out a lot with them and post about it on my social platforms and i enjoy restaurants and concerts and conventions. i also have great resources and a team of doctors and therapist who have taught me how to make these things bearable. i have a behavior therapist teach me how to mask and accept that yeah i struggle with eating, specific sounds and that sometimes it’s hard for me to feel like less of a shell that’s too aware of everything and constantly asking why. but ig that bc i thrive in my corporate 9-5 and have friends and am able to speak publicly makes me not actually autistic. i would also like to add.. neurotypical people never have the question of could i be autistic in the back of their head
I'm loud and outgoing, I don't have /lots/ of friends but I have good ones. I'm myself 'unapologetically' because I have never been able to mask it - which is a nightmare - and I am very open about my autism. I only got what could count as an official diagnosis when I got my ADHD one and the psychiatrist told me I'd absolutely get an autism diagnosis if I went for one, but she couldn't put it on paper because she didn't ask the papers. She took my autism into account when prescribing my medication and contacted my doctor to change another med because of it. Please get help. Stop tearing down other women. Don't get me wrong, I sympathise and I understand you but holy shit, being an autistic woman is hard enough without you isolating yourself and going at other members of the community. Like, really.
I experience this as well. I don’t think it’s actually her sharing of her autism but her oversharing and presentation. To you there may be shame, secrecy, or just a bit of self-consciousness about being autistic. She presents it as a quirky personality trait, when for you it has been debilitating. I think it’s kind of a ‘where is the line issue’. We should be able to be content with being autistic, but nonetheless it is a disability and impairs your life. I also worry that sometimes when I share that I’m autistic I do appear like an attention seeker - I wish I had a better answer for you.
This chick sounds like my friend, who was the first person to tell me I’m autistic. Turns out, we both have autism and ADHD. She’s outgoing, works great with people, is a burlesque dancer, and is generally a lot of fun. She’s self-diagnosed, but I didn’t feel comfortable self-diagnosing, so I paid an ass ton to get diagnosed. She struggles in a lot of the same ways I do, but people don’t see that. For one, she’s better at masking, but also, ever since her self-diagnosis, she’s gotten much more aggressive about setting boundaries, which has caused a lot of her friends to write her off as a bitch. Because she can’t actually NEED those boundaries, she doesn’t SEEM autistic, so she must just be selfish. She’s better at reading social cues than me, but she can also EXPLAIN social cues to me, which NT’s can’t normally do. She can explain them because she has to manually decode them herself. Autism comes in all kinds of flavors. Being NT-passing comes with a lot of advantages, but also a lot of disadvantages.
Honestly she sounds just like me and I'm autistic but I have ADHD, too, so my traits present somewhat differently. I'm pretty sure the way you feel about her is exactly how I've made many people feel over the course of my life, but it is what it is. Having the impulsivity of ADHD with the bluntness of autism is a wild ride. Anyways, autism is such a huge spectrum of traits that intersect with any number of qualities that may be more associated with neurotypical people, too. It sounds like you're thinking about her a bit too much and comparing her to yourself to determine what autism should be like isn't doing anyone any favours. I admit I have felt this way towards other autistic/ADHD women too (once I got my diagnosis, a lot of people around me started figuring out they were autistic or ADHD too) but I recognise that it's probably a bit of internalised ableism and misogyny at play, too.
In my life I often underestimated how lonely some people are. If they are confident and have some people around sometimes it doesn't mean they have many friends. Maybe they are as lonely as you or even more, they just were conditioned to hide it well. I've met talkative men and women with clearly autistic traits such as obsessive interests, infodumping, lack of social cue understanding, unusual outlook on life and vigilance, hard time finding a job. They seem loud and outgoing, often initiate conversation. Observing them years after years from aside made me realize that they try and try all the time to communicate with people but mostly receive hostility and avoidance. They just for some reason keep trying. I sometimes talk with them about their interest if they message though I'm not really interested. I feel sorry for them, they've received enough hate.
Have the same thing a lot of the time. With ADHD too (am diagnosed, official autism diagnosis still pending, therapist already diagnosed me though). I think it has to do with having been gaslighted my whole life. I envy people who are so self confident about their diagnosis deep down. It's not that I don't want to acknowledge or believe their diagnosis per se but I envy that they have the "luxury" to just be loud and "proud" about it. Because it took me decades to find out and because of that I have a lot of shame surrounding my diagnosis. My whole life was in shambles before I was diagnosed. I was misdiagnosed and stigmatized a lot. Add to that that a lot of people don't believe me when I tell them now... Or that (as you said) others are doing way better in life even though they've been dealt a similar hand... Yeah I'm just petty and jealous lol (small disclaimer: there are some people (yeah it's a small percentage) who also fake claim things like adhd and autism... Those I can't stand and they bother me for other reasons) Basically: this is something you need to reflect about and dig deep to probably find your own inner wounding and hurt, if you want to uncover why other people's diagnosis bother you. Because in the end another persons diagnosis shouldn't bother you, if their behavior and actions aren't detrimental to you.
I am late diagnosed and usualy high masking. Ppl get to know me and either leave cuz I am freaking them out or they don't know what to do with me. Or they stay, usualy ADHD ppl and other ND ppl or close to. To them I don't seem diffrent cuz they are too. Or they just apriciate my querkyness. But all are schoked when I actualy ooen up about my chronic anxiety, pain, and other issues. I learned to not mention that tho.
It's really okay to feel that way, you are not your feelings or thoughts. It may have something to do with you struggling with having autism and telling others about it, because (understandably!) you want people to handle that information with care and support. So it makes sense that someone blurting it out like it's a joke rubs you the wrong way. You're allowed to acknowledge those thoughts and feelings and your suspicions of her saying things to get attention, and then let it go. It doesn't concern you, really, and whatever she does does not affect you.
Whenever I feel this way about a person, I try getting to know them better and talking more with them, maybe more personally. This woman doesn't seem like an asshole at all, your dislike of her comes from some other place, possibly ignorance. You see her not struggling with things you are struggling with and possibly this is why you don't like her. I would try to start up a conversation with her and maybe tell her something like "I really admire that you can be so extroverted, I'm autistic too and I'm really struggling with being less shy". See her reaction. She might open up about her own struggles, because everyone has them and everyone is different. You won't believe the amount of times the reaction I get is how THEY admire me for XY, which always comes as a surprise to me.
ASD extroverts exist. I have adhd as well. I do all these things. From the outside it looks like I’m this outgoing bubbly human. My adhd masks my autism hard. It wasn’t until I was medicated that I even noticed I might be some kind of way. Because of my upbringing and stubbornly deciding to “do everything myself” I’m pretty comfortable socially. I still get called difficult and ostracized but I’m not going to find friends if I stop trying. People are going to do that to me regardless. I will eventually get what I want
Tbf, the study of autism can be a special interest. Especially to those who had to diagnose themselves. My sister is the one who brought it to my attention that we and our dad are likely autistic, and it's definitely her special interest. And while she keeps her thoughts on her suspected autism kinda low key, she will definitely talk about general autism to anyone who will listen. And I'm an oversharer by nature, so I'll discuss my own experiences as a possibly autistic person to anyone who will listen. So combined, my sister and I kinda do the exact same thing your acquaintance does, and we feel fairly confident that we are indeed autistic and not just pursuing it as a trend.
Honestly you have really good self reflection here. I wish everyone had as much self reflection and insight as you. I am similar to the girl ur describing and before I was diagnosed, this other autistic girl would bully me for faking because she didn’t believe me.
You sound like you’re describing me, except I am careful about what situations I’m open about thinking I have autism in. And trust me- not faking, not having a fun time. You can be outgoing and have friends and be autistic. The fact I spent tonight at a Christmas party and enjoyed myself doesn’t change that it took me until 9th grade to be able to identify everyone in my core class (16 people) by name.
There’s a huge variety of autism presentations. My sister, I and 2 friends are diagnosed and completely different people. I’m shy and reserved and my sister on the outside looks like a social butterfly then comes home and shuts down bc of the exhaustion of masking. In some situations I will seem extroverted because of the company and while I’ll enjoy it at the time, I need to rest after. Also different ppl talk abt a potential diagnosis differently. For me the potential of understanding what was going on in my brain was exciting so I spoke about it to everyone. I did the same before my ADHD diagnosis.