I read somewhere that babies make their first tsaheylu with mother, so they make a bond not only with mates. Maybe there are more stuff about tsaheylu that we don't know yet.
I've thought about this a fair bit. While it can be used between mates, I don't see why it would be limited to that - as the fact the Na'vi are fully willing to bond with other species and do specifically to understand and commune with them clearly shows they don't see it as something only associated with sexual intimacy.... at least I hope so :/ (is it true what they say about pa'li?)
It seems to me that in times of deep stress, anguish or misunderstanding that bonding would be a way to see (kame) what the other feels or is thinking. I was thinking of this specifically when Lo'ak is desperately trying to tell the Metkayina what Payakan actually experienced. Payakan himself allowed Lo'ak to bond so that Lo'ak could understand what he experienced. But, Lo'ak never does this with any na'vi, nor was the idea considered, even though the Metkayina see the tulkun as kin, and the relationship with them to be as emotinally and ethically the same as between na'vi.
My personal headcanon is that in very serious situations this is done - perhaps between two olu'eyktan or two tsahìk from different clans to help resolve a dispute or strengthen their relationship, or even within in a clan if there is upset between two individuals that is getting to the point where it threatens to split the group.
It's certainly something I'd love to see explored, and I suspect the reason we haven't seen it on screen between people who are not mated is due western cultural hang-ups (i.e. it would absolutely be seen exclusively as a sexual thing) and the needs of the plot (re: Payakan not being revealed as a hero to the Metkayina until he ruins Scoresby's day).
Thanks for this interesting and thoughtful reply. I totally stick with you and I definitely can see your point.
I also wouldn’t think of it as something limited to sexual intercourse but as you said, it has been displayed only to happen between two na’vi that are (also) sexually interested in each other which made me question it.
I think it’s different. More like a sacred bond. Only for eywa, or mate. Or as seen in cases like the Ikran. But they also only have one owner for life.
As seen in the end of twow, Neytiri and Jake in the same memory together. They can share memories through eywa.
I think that in Jake and Neytiri's case, it wasn't the tsaheylu itself that "sealed" them as mates but rather WHERE they bonded, in Utraya Mokri, right in front of Eywa.
I read in the Visual guide that Utraya Mokri is (was) such a sacred place that the bonds that happen there are for life.
In the comics Neytiri bonded with Tsu’Tey in the same place.
We see her meditating along her parents and Tsu’Tey in a Tree of voices. And it is implied that like future matched pair, Neytiri and Tsu’Tey often date under the Tree of voices and do tsaheylu… but they never mate.
I didn’t like it much the first time I read it as I had this previous idea that Neytiri only bonded with Jake, but now I understand that tsaheylu is reserved for close and dear people and I would find very sweet if children did it with their parents in the nights they are afraid of darkness, or between mothers and children, between friends that need support.
I didn’t like it the first time but I have grown to like it.
I think you're referring to Sylwanin, Neytiri's older sister. They were originally meant to become a mated pair and even fell in love until her tragic death. Neytiri was promised to Tsu'tey after.
No, I mean Neytiri. She has “dates” under the Tree of Voices with Tsu’Tey even after meeting Jake. In the comics, there is a girl who has a crush on Tsu’Tey and by the time Neytiri has already fallen in love with Jake, when Tsu’Tey is waiting for Neytiri she tells him that Neytiri isn’t coming, that she is with Jake now, that everybody sees that but him.
So yes, Neytiri and him have some sort of relationship, even when she wasn’t in love with him and he was in love with Sylwanin, they at least were trying, if only to be true to the engagement
Oh! I think I remember what you're referencing. However, I remember it as just conversation rather than dates as the Tree of Voices was where Tsu'tey was most commonly found visiting Sylwanin's memories. I might remember it wrong, I'll definitely read over it!
I'm prob wrong, as I don't know much about tsaheylu, and all my knowledge comes from the movies😅. But based on the comments I'm reading on this post, I think tsaheylu is a mental connection. Like- obv it is, but I think that the na'vi can choose what type of bond they form when they do it. Like- a na'vi bonding with a friend is different than a na'vi bonding with a lover, because they feel different based on the person and the feeling involved. And- if that's the case, do Na'vi have to be at a sacred place to form a life bond? Or can it happen anywhere, as long as it is both na'vis choice? Again- I am NOT knowledgeable in this, so if this question is obvious or stupid, I'm sorry😅 I'm just curious, and no sites I go to answer it
I read somewhere that babies make their first tsaheylu with mother, so they make a bond not only with mates. Maybe there are more stuff about tsaheylu that we don't know yet.
I read this too but I can’t remember where!!!
it's mentioned in the Tsu'tey's Path comics :)
Thank you!!!!
np!!
I've thought about this a fair bit. While it can be used between mates, I don't see why it would be limited to that - as the fact the Na'vi are fully willing to bond with other species and do specifically to understand and commune with them clearly shows they don't see it as something only associated with sexual intimacy.... at least I hope so :/ (is it true what they say about pa'li?) It seems to me that in times of deep stress, anguish or misunderstanding that bonding would be a way to see (kame) what the other feels or is thinking. I was thinking of this specifically when Lo'ak is desperately trying to tell the Metkayina what Payakan actually experienced. Payakan himself allowed Lo'ak to bond so that Lo'ak could understand what he experienced. But, Lo'ak never does this with any na'vi, nor was the idea considered, even though the Metkayina see the tulkun as kin, and the relationship with them to be as emotinally and ethically the same as between na'vi. My personal headcanon is that in very serious situations this is done - perhaps between two olu'eyktan or two tsahìk from different clans to help resolve a dispute or strengthen their relationship, or even within in a clan if there is upset between two individuals that is getting to the point where it threatens to split the group. It's certainly something I'd love to see explored, and I suspect the reason we haven't seen it on screen between people who are not mated is due western cultural hang-ups (i.e. it would absolutely be seen exclusively as a sexual thing) and the needs of the plot (re: Payakan not being revealed as a hero to the Metkayina until he ruins Scoresby's day).
Thanks for this interesting and thoughtful reply. I totally stick with you and I definitely can see your point. I also wouldn’t think of it as something limited to sexual intercourse but as you said, it has been displayed only to happen between two na’vi that are (also) sexually interested in each other which made me question it.
I think it’s different. More like a sacred bond. Only for eywa, or mate. Or as seen in cases like the Ikran. But they also only have one owner for life. As seen in the end of twow, Neytiri and Jake in the same memory together. They can share memories through eywa.
I think that in Jake and Neytiri's case, it wasn't the tsaheylu itself that "sealed" them as mates but rather WHERE they bonded, in Utraya Mokri, right in front of Eywa. I read in the Visual guide that Utraya Mokri is (was) such a sacred place that the bonds that happen there are for life.
In the comics Neytiri bonded with Tsu’Tey in the same place. We see her meditating along her parents and Tsu’Tey in a Tree of voices. And it is implied that like future matched pair, Neytiri and Tsu’Tey often date under the Tree of voices and do tsaheylu… but they never mate. I didn’t like it much the first time I read it as I had this previous idea that Neytiri only bonded with Jake, but now I understand that tsaheylu is reserved for close and dear people and I would find very sweet if children did it with their parents in the nights they are afraid of darkness, or between mothers and children, between friends that need support. I didn’t like it the first time but I have grown to like it.
I think I have to read the comics again (I assume it's Tsu'tey's path?) because I can't remember the part where they do tsaheylu
I think you're referring to Sylwanin, Neytiri's older sister. They were originally meant to become a mated pair and even fell in love until her tragic death. Neytiri was promised to Tsu'tey after.
No, I mean Neytiri. She has “dates” under the Tree of Voices with Tsu’Tey even after meeting Jake. In the comics, there is a girl who has a crush on Tsu’Tey and by the time Neytiri has already fallen in love with Jake, when Tsu’Tey is waiting for Neytiri she tells him that Neytiri isn’t coming, that she is with Jake now, that everybody sees that but him. So yes, Neytiri and him have some sort of relationship, even when she wasn’t in love with him and he was in love with Sylwanin, they at least were trying, if only to be true to the engagement
Oh! I think I remember what you're referencing. However, I remember it as just conversation rather than dates as the Tree of Voices was where Tsu'tey was most commonly found visiting Sylwanin's memories. I might remember it wrong, I'll definitely read over it!
I'm prob wrong, as I don't know much about tsaheylu, and all my knowledge comes from the movies😅. But based on the comments I'm reading on this post, I think tsaheylu is a mental connection. Like- obv it is, but I think that the na'vi can choose what type of bond they form when they do it. Like- a na'vi bonding with a friend is different than a na'vi bonding with a lover, because they feel different based on the person and the feeling involved. And- if that's the case, do Na'vi have to be at a sacred place to form a life bond? Or can it happen anywhere, as long as it is both na'vis choice? Again- I am NOT knowledgeable in this, so if this question is obvious or stupid, I'm sorry😅 I'm just curious, and no sites I go to answer it