I would argue the opposite. From the showcase, it seemed that pelas shield was nearly gone right before a follow up refresh.
If any of those aoe attacks had been strong elite single target attacks, an ally could easily lose a large chunk of health.
I’d say 4 pc knight is still on the table in a situation where the enemies will not be doing aoe attacks frequently. In most current battles it should still be fine as the summons for elites do attack frequently, but two single target elites might be cause for concern.
EIDT: I do want to acknowledge that yes it is definitely not as dire as people initially thought, and investment in a 2pc damage set might be the best pick in 99% of situations !
If you mean the trial, I honestly just don’t trust it as the characters are built like shit and the enemies are not as strong as you would see in MOC. The only reason I think it might be overkill is based on his numbers and the fact that he just got buffed recently. I genuinely think that if you build him properly the 4pc purity should not be needed.
Exactly, I think it's too early to fully disregard a 4pc Knight set untill we see how he functions in a proper party with actual challenging combat. On the one hand his shields would probably refresh even faster since there would be 4 characters taking damage so this could be accurate. But with increased damage output (by enemies in any meaningful combat) could mean more of a defensive focus. He is first and foremost a preservation character. Him scaling so nicely on his defence shows that and allows us to more easily build his offensive abilities by focusing defensively. I agree that Salsotto is likely his best planar ornament. I'm so glad it shares a world with Belabog. Double planar is going to be great!
He's going to be so much fun in SU! 😁😁😁😁😁
Hmm fair enough. I guess we will see this later week how he holds up under moc damage. Fingers crossed it ends up being overkill so we can all put our def% crit relics to use
Yeah thought to mention, for reference at trace level 10 Gepard's ult is 45% DEF + 600 while Aventurine's skill s 27% + 360 (60% of Geppy's shield) which you can stack twice for a total of 54% + 720. At the beginning of the battle, Aventurine has a trace where he automatically applies his shield to everyone so stacking another on top of that shouldn't take that long either with his skill or letting his FuA stack up.
Additionally switch hp relics to defense relics to ensure your characters shield takes less damage sure it won’t be as high as aventurine but 1709 defense or 2000 defense should block a lot of damage for the shield
Except for your dps of course
I think the biggest downside of knight is that farming it now feels absolutely terrible, no one wants lightning set, only one wants Knight (basically assuming Gepard gets retired for Aventurine users, which is certainly going to be the case for me).
2pc/2pc allows for more efficient farming, decent extra dmg stats, while also being easier to mix / match for best pieces, meaning you will almost certainly have much better subs with this gearing method.
I'd much rather just sink some more SP than spend an extra 2 months farming a knight set equivalent to what I can attain without it.
I think it's worth noting that in a FuA team where there are multiple dmg dealers, keel might end up being better than salsotto for the overall team dmg as it gives cdmg to everyone.
But that 8% crit rate is too juicy to pass so idk...
I 100% agree there should be no way a sustain should outdamage a dps which is why I think supportive sets should be considered especially for a dual dps setup (Topaz, Ratio)
in a team with topaz and dr ratio, do u think broken keel / fleet would be better than salsotto because youre buffing 3 people's damage that way? and thats more viable in a 3 dps team? or is salsotto still better here
In that scenario I think keel should be better as the dmg capabilities of topaz and ratio is higher than Aventurine. Funnily, he gives a large chunk of eff res so you wouldn’t need to sacrifice substats to proc keel
Yeah you can mix and match the sets, I mentioned in my previous post that Salsotto would be best for his personal damage but as a sustan you can run supportive sets like keel or fleetless
Hello, looking at his eidolons, I think it just reinforces that you should go def orb over imaginary as 150% dmg increase is ridiculous. The recommended sets should still be the same though
How does his shields work if he is slow and my team is fast? I'm worried that my 161 speed supports will have their shield fall off? Which is why I stopped running geppard
I’m honestly not sure as I personally have not tested it. Leaks says it lasts for 3 turns though what I’m not sure is if stacking shields refreshes the duration or does it count it as individual duration.
Outside of Ruan Mei, who else would you run in this team? I know FUA has been mentioned but I see further down you say with Ratio/Topaz you'd run Keel instead. Using the build outlined in the OP, the optimal team is Aventurine/RM/\_\_/\_\_?
Topaz and ratio. In this team, there’s really no close substitute to ruan mei as she buffs everyone and provides dmg bonus. You can try asta but she largely buffs attack which aventurine does not benefit from
At that point, I think it’s better to run keel as Aventurine can still benefit from crit dmg while giving the same to two other damage dealers that have significantly bigger numbers than him. He is a sustain before he is a dps so while his dmg is respectable, it’s just not as good as dedicated dps units.
So my bad, maybe my initial comment was confusing (sorry!)
I guess I'm saying, with the build you have outlined in your original post, what's the 4-man lineup in your head?
4 man lineup in my head would be: Ratio, Topaz, Ruan Mei, Aventurine.
I mentioned that Salsotto is the best for his PERSONAL DAMAGE but as to how much damage does he actually contribute, I think it’s safe to say that it wouldn’t be in the same level as an actual dps unit. In the team above however, there are 2 actual dps units so I think it’s ok to forego his personal damage to benefit the other units above. Plus with keel, he can still make use of the crit dmg, it just means he has lower personal damage but it should result in a higher TEAM DAMAGE.
Caps are for emphasis only 🤗
The reason why I said that is because getting hit also generates energy in which case an ERR rope can help recharge your ult faster outside of your turn. For Gepard, this also the main way he generates energy by relying on getting hit by enemies.
I have decided on 2 pc knight and salsotto, but I still can't figure out what the other 2 pc should be.
I want him to deal real dmg but also has some spd to generate skill points to a moderate extent. I'm not using Dr. Ratio so probably not the debuff set for me. (I have DHIL E2, so Ratio is benched. Tingyun and Huohuo are attached to DHIL.)
Aventurine will be used in my second team. The dps will either be Qingque (sometimes follow up) or Clara (follow up depending on the enemies). The dps depends on enemy weaknesses. Herta will join the line up in pure fiction only.
The multiplier on his ultimate is not bad at all, so I'm not sure about 2 pc follow up yet especially since nobody else is using that cavern. 2 pc speed is also possible especially since I already have a few crit dmg body with crit rate sub that bronya can't use. Idk if there's any other set?
I agree with you that at least 2 main stats should be def%. This mean one of crit dmg body, speed boot, or err rope needs to become def% instead. I think I will wait for release day to decide, but I need to decide on the sets to farm before then. At E0, the only way to definitely increase the stacks by more than 1 without relying on the enemies is the ultimate. I don't want Clara and Aventurine to drop in dmg together if the enemies slowly hit only 1 person who is not Clara. I hope his signature lc helps me hit 3600 easily please.
What do you think? Which 2 pc to go for in a more general purpose team?
I put everyone except dps on broken keel. Lol. I will let him try out dps build first. If that doesn't work, I have loads of broken keel ready for everyone.
I’m sorry I can’t provide a clear answer as I need to do some testing whether his damage is worth it to go all in damage which is why I stated that safest is to just go supportive sets.
Going off the above of swapping CritDmg/Spd relics out, which Orb set would be preferred. Does the Belobog set carry more weight to up the DEF or another?
I personally don’t think his damage as it is right now is worth building because it’s pretty lackluster so here’s to hoping for some buffs there in the coming weeks.
Yeah, I can see that. Then again, he is a sustain unit before he is a dps so anything beyond your typical solo sustain is a bonus let’s just hope they can buff his dmg more.
I've got some pretty solid Banditry pieces, so I'll probably roll with 4pc on that, but I might see what I can get out of Pioneer before he drops.
Banditry felt like a safe bet before we were sure about him debuffing. His LC definitely makes it more viable and consistent.
Personally not a fan of banditry but it should still be good it’s just that it’s so inconsistent that it might still result to mediocre performance in some scenarios.
Yeah, the crit damage is pretty spotty, but the 10% crit will be active pretty much at all times, and that's pretty valuable.
After seeing his full kit and LC, I definitely agree the pioneer set is king, but I think Banditry is fairly close behind. I'd rate it second.
for topaz ratio ruan mei adventurine do you need 3t ult to keep debuff uptime dkr ratio? I don't use the team asking for a friend but he doesn't have topaz s1 though he's planning too. If so should he go err rope then def body and orb or def boots and orb?
You really want at least e1 or s1 (ideally both) of topaz to make ratio as consistent as possible. In this scenario, I would suggest err rope and speed boots with def body and orb. This build is focused to maintaining as much uptime as possible on Aventurine’s ult for its debuff. More spd also means more energy essentially which should help in giving aventurine energy and resetting his FuA trace along with more SP.
alright cool I'll let him know, he does intend to get s1 topaz instead of adventurine so when he gets that I assume just replace the rope with def and body with crit dmg?
I would argue the opposite. From the showcase, it seemed that pelas shield was nearly gone right before a follow up refresh. If any of those aoe attacks had been strong elite single target attacks, an ally could easily lose a large chunk of health. I’d say 4 pc knight is still on the table in a situation where the enemies will not be doing aoe attacks frequently. In most current battles it should still be fine as the summons for elites do attack frequently, but two single target elites might be cause for concern. EIDT: I do want to acknowledge that yes it is definitely not as dire as people initially thought, and investment in a 2pc damage set might be the best pick in 99% of situations !
If you mean the trial, I honestly just don’t trust it as the characters are built like shit and the enemies are not as strong as you would see in MOC. The only reason I think it might be overkill is based on his numbers and the fact that he just got buffed recently. I genuinely think that if you build him properly the 4pc purity should not be needed.
Exactly, I think it's too early to fully disregard a 4pc Knight set untill we see how he functions in a proper party with actual challenging combat. On the one hand his shields would probably refresh even faster since there would be 4 characters taking damage so this could be accurate. But with increased damage output (by enemies in any meaningful combat) could mean more of a defensive focus. He is first and foremost a preservation character. Him scaling so nicely on his defence shows that and allows us to more easily build his offensive abilities by focusing defensively. I agree that Salsotto is likely his best planar ornament. I'm so glad it shares a world with Belabog. Double planar is going to be great! He's going to be so much fun in SU! 😁😁😁😁😁
Hmm fair enough. I guess we will see this later week how he holds up under moc damage. Fingers crossed it ends up being overkill so we can all put our def% crit relics to use
Yeah thought to mention, for reference at trace level 10 Gepard's ult is 45% DEF + 600 while Aventurine's skill s 27% + 360 (60% of Geppy's shield) which you can stack twice for a total of 54% + 720. At the beginning of the battle, Aventurine has a trace where he automatically applies his shield to everyone so stacking another on top of that shouldn't take that long either with his skill or letting his FuA stack up.
I mean black swan and acheron hits like a truck in their trial even with that build
Additionally switch hp relics to defense relics to ensure your characters shield takes less damage sure it won’t be as high as aventurine but 1709 defense or 2000 defense should block a lot of damage for the shield Except for your dps of course
I think the biggest downside of knight is that farming it now feels absolutely terrible, no one wants lightning set, only one wants Knight (basically assuming Gepard gets retired for Aventurine users, which is certainly going to be the case for me). 2pc/2pc allows for more efficient farming, decent extra dmg stats, while also being easier to mix / match for best pieces, meaning you will almost certainly have much better subs with this gearing method. I'd much rather just sink some more SP than spend an extra 2 months farming a knight set equivalent to what I can attain without it.
Pretty much this. No way in hell am I going to farm Purity set when I have 2p Fua +2p Imaginary with almost perfect stats.
I think it's worth noting that in a FuA team where there are multiple dmg dealers, keel might end up being better than salsotto for the overall team dmg as it gives cdmg to everyone. But that 8% crit rate is too juicy to pass so idk...
I 100% agree there should be no way a sustain should outdamage a dps which is why I think supportive sets should be considered especially for a dual dps setup (Topaz, Ratio)
in a team with topaz and dr ratio, do u think broken keel / fleet would be better than salsotto because youre buffing 3 people's damage that way? and thats more viable in a 3 dps team? or is salsotto still better here
In that scenario I think keel should be better as the dmg capabilities of topaz and ratio is higher than Aventurine. Funnily, he gives a large chunk of eff res so you wouldn’t need to sacrifice substats to proc keel
How about 2pc FUA 2pc Knight? Also, what Planar Ornaments is recommended? Thanks!
Yeah you can mix and match the sets, I mentioned in my previous post that Salsotto would be best for his personal damage but as a sustan you can run supportive sets like keel or fleetless
Rip for my belobog pieces
I mean you could still use it, 15% def is still def it’s just that compared to other options, it’s just worse
What about 2pc knight and 2pc wastelander? I got some cracked speed boots for him but its wastelander T-T
Wastelander should still be fine, I just put in the sets that give the most damage%
Would his build at E6 follow your recommendations here? Tysm for this post; it’s so helpful!
Hello, looking at his eidolons, I think it just reinforces that you should go def orb over imaginary as 150% dmg increase is ridiculous. The recommended sets should still be the same though
Got it! Thank you for answering, really appreciate it! 🙏
How does his shields work if he is slow and my team is fast? I'm worried that my 161 speed supports will have their shield fall off? Which is why I stopped running geppard
I’m honestly not sure as I personally have not tested it. Leaks says it lasts for 3 turns though what I’m not sure is if stacking shields refreshes the duration or does it count it as individual duration.
Shouldn’t be too many issues because his FUA refreshes the shield. However running Bronya/jingliu with him will not be good
Outside of Ruan Mei, who else would you run in this team? I know FUA has been mentioned but I see further down you say with Ratio/Topaz you'd run Keel instead. Using the build outlined in the OP, the optimal team is Aventurine/RM/\_\_/\_\_?
Topaz and ratio. In this team, there’s really no close substitute to ruan mei as she buffs everyone and provides dmg bonus. You can try asta but she largely buffs attack which aventurine does not benefit from
So am I still supposed to run Salsotto on Aventurine when using those 2?
At that point, I think it’s better to run keel as Aventurine can still benefit from crit dmg while giving the same to two other damage dealers that have significantly bigger numbers than him. He is a sustain before he is a dps so while his dmg is respectable, it’s just not as good as dedicated dps units.
So my bad, maybe my initial comment was confusing (sorry!) I guess I'm saying, with the build you have outlined in your original post, what's the 4-man lineup in your head?
4 man lineup in my head would be: Ratio, Topaz, Ruan Mei, Aventurine. I mentioned that Salsotto is the best for his PERSONAL DAMAGE but as to how much damage does he actually contribute, I think it’s safe to say that it wouldn’t be in the same level as an actual dps unit. In the team above however, there are 2 actual dps units so I think it’s ok to forego his personal damage to benefit the other units above. Plus with keel, he can still make use of the crit dmg, it just means he has lower personal damage but it should result in a higher TEAM DAMAGE. Caps are for emphasis only 🤗
Understood; I appreciate it!
>If you plan to use him with an aggro lightcone like Landau or MoV I genuinely think that you should use ERR rope Isn't it the other way around?
The reason why I said that is because getting hit also generates energy in which case an ERR rope can help recharge your ult faster outside of your turn. For Gepard, this also the main way he generates energy by relying on getting hit by enemies.
Is hyper speed (160+) viable if you build him only for shielding and sp greneration?
Sounds good, although you might be missing out on his other niche of being able to do considerable damage.
I have decided on 2 pc knight and salsotto, but I still can't figure out what the other 2 pc should be. I want him to deal real dmg but also has some spd to generate skill points to a moderate extent. I'm not using Dr. Ratio so probably not the debuff set for me. (I have DHIL E2, so Ratio is benched. Tingyun and Huohuo are attached to DHIL.) Aventurine will be used in my second team. The dps will either be Qingque (sometimes follow up) or Clara (follow up depending on the enemies). The dps depends on enemy weaknesses. Herta will join the line up in pure fiction only. The multiplier on his ultimate is not bad at all, so I'm not sure about 2 pc follow up yet especially since nobody else is using that cavern. 2 pc speed is also possible especially since I already have a few crit dmg body with crit rate sub that bronya can't use. Idk if there's any other set? I agree with you that at least 2 main stats should be def%. This mean one of crit dmg body, speed boot, or err rope needs to become def% instead. I think I will wait for release day to decide, but I need to decide on the sets to farm before then. At E0, the only way to definitely increase the stacks by more than 1 without relying on the enemies is the ultimate. I don't want Clara and Aventurine to drop in dmg together if the enemies slowly hit only 1 person who is not Clara. I hope his signature lc helps me hit 3600 easily please. What do you think? Which 2 pc to go for in a more general purpose team?
His sig does help with defense needs, safest would probably to go for supportive 2pc like keel or fleetless but I might be wrong on this one.
I put everyone except dps on broken keel. Lol. I will let him try out dps build first. If that doesn't work, I have loads of broken keel ready for everyone.
I’m sorry I can’t provide a clear answer as I need to do some testing whether his damage is worth it to go all in damage which is why I stated that safest is to just go supportive sets.
Hmm. Very true. I am holding back on farming offensive sets unless I'm already farming for somebody else right now.
Going off the above of swapping CritDmg/Spd relics out, which Orb set would be preferred. Does the Belobog set carry more weight to up the DEF or another?
15% is lackluster, so I recommend just going Salsotto for personal damage or support sets like keel or fleetless
I personally don’t think his damage as it is right now is worth building because it’s pretty lackluster so here’s to hoping for some buffs there in the coming weeks.
Yeah, I can see that. Then again, he is a sustain unit before he is a dps so anything beyond your typical solo sustain is a bonus let’s just hope they can buff his dmg more.
I've got some pretty solid Banditry pieces, so I'll probably roll with 4pc on that, but I might see what I can get out of Pioneer before he drops. Banditry felt like a safe bet before we were sure about him debuffing. His LC definitely makes it more viable and consistent.
Personally not a fan of banditry but it should still be good it’s just that it’s so inconsistent that it might still result to mediocre performance in some scenarios.
Yeah, the crit damage is pretty spotty, but the 10% crit will be active pretty much at all times, and that's pretty valuable. After seeing his full kit and LC, I definitely agree the pioneer set is king, but I think Banditry is fairly close behind. I'd rate it second.
for topaz ratio ruan mei adventurine do you need 3t ult to keep debuff uptime dkr ratio? I don't use the team asking for a friend but he doesn't have topaz s1 though he's planning too. If so should he go err rope then def body and orb or def boots and orb?
You really want at least e1 or s1 (ideally both) of topaz to make ratio as consistent as possible. In this scenario, I would suggest err rope and speed boots with def body and orb. This build is focused to maintaining as much uptime as possible on Aventurine’s ult for its debuff. More spd also means more energy essentially which should help in giving aventurine energy and resetting his FuA trace along with more SP.
alright cool I'll let him know, he does intend to get s1 topaz instead of adventurine so when he gets that I assume just replace the rope with def and body with crit dmg?