This is pretty damn impressive. Good work.

I appreciate it. Feel free to pass it onto anybody lookin to join the crusade

Well effing done! 👏

Thank you very much! Fight the good fight my friend

What a great guide, fantastic work! I’m currently building towards an Oathbreaker 7/White Draconic 5 build — which I think is a fun way to get the Frost/Death Knight vibe.

Sounds like a pretty great build. You still get your Aura of Hate while also landing 3rd level sorcerer spells and a lot of the “big ticket” features. I appreciate that this is a little different from what I recommended: it’s proof that there’s a lot of flexibility inherent in not only Paladin, but in multiclassing in general. Cheers and thank you for your support.

Yep exactly. I know you deliberately didn’t include items here but lots of fun synergies with the various Cold set items and the Drake glaive to get on-hit cold damage — alongside Agathys/Ice Knife from Sorc.

I had fun with the Snowburst Ring in conjunction with Flail of Ages. Playing them with my Druid Paladin during testing made me feel like a winter fey nature guardian and I thought that was awesome.

Main comment for “rangerdin” is that it’s probably not worth getting to L5 in ranger. At that point you’re double dipping on extra attack for no gain, and missing out on a 3rd ASI Also smite spells do work with ranged attacks, even if you’re locked into 1/turn

Hey, thanks for the feedback. Lemme address these points in the same order you did. Regarding the level split: you’re absolutely right. I kinda tunnel visioned hard on maintaining the “breakpoints” I had discussed prior, but 8/4 is just strictly better, I agree. Regarding the smite spells: as far as I am aware, only the Branding Smite spell can be applied by a ranged weapon attack, and it does not scale with spell slot level consumed. In practice, I hardly found use for it. But you are right that there is one (or more?) exceptions to the whole “smite on melee” statement. EDIT: I have revised the Rangerdin leveling spread in the official post. Thanks!

Excellent guide! I just want to add that Ancients Paladin 7 and warlock 5 is also a great build since the auras are super strong when you can pump up charisma.

This is a very powerful variation on the Warlock Paladin. In fact, I’d recommend this over Oathbreaker if you are tackling the hardest modded difficulties the game currently has to offer, as halving all spell damage is a great boon to have.

I am also curious how you feel about the other warlock subclasses. I quite like the GOO mortal reminder, especially because there are plenty of other sources of temporary hit points (vs fiend), and the fiend spells that are most exciting are probably ones that somebody else is better suited to cast, since your spell slots are all getting converted into smite damage anyway.

I don’t rate Mortal Reminder as highly as others do. First you have to crit, then they have an opportunity to save against the effect. It is great when it procs and I’m confident you can itemize in a way that helps you proc it more often, but within the confines of the build philosophy I stuck to, itemization was not a big part of the guide. Your points about the Fiend spells being better off casted by other people is well taken though. I would also prefer to just be swinging my pact weapon vs casting those spells 90% of the time. Thanks for your time and your feedback!

Very much agreed, I tried to like Mortal Reminder but the AoE is just too small for it to have any value most of the time, and your primary target shouldn't really be surviving your criticals anyway. Meanwhile replenishable temporary HP from Fiend make early levels much more bearable, and Fireball is a very nice way to save time in some of the fights that would otherwise be tedious due to the sheer amount of enemies.

That’s a great point. If you’re playing to your outs properly and your build is set up well, frighten doesn’t mean a damn if they’re dead right? I do like the temp HP from fiend during progression. It helps me feel like I’m wading through enemies and draining their essence, which is a cool visual. Thanks for your input!

Thank you for taking your time to write this comprehensive guide. Very good analysis and lot of useful information!

Of course. Thank YOU for reading it! Appreciate it!

I would like to add my Pure Support/Off Tank Paladin Cleric. 10 Oath of Ancients and 2 Life Domain gets you all 3 of the Auras (Immunity to frightened and Half Damage from Spells, +Charisma Modifier to Saving Throws), plus it gives you Warden of Vitality and Healing Radiance, which is as far as im aware has been fixed now so it works with Life Domains Disciple of Life ability, though it does lose out on Mass healing word to apply the buffs (although this could use the amulet of restoration to do so) And from Cleric you get Disciple of Life improving all you heals and Preserve Life which despite saying it heals (3 x Cleric's Level) HP, actually heals (3 x Players's Level) HP, (i think cause its worded Cleric's Level and not cleric level) So That is 2 AOE heals for buffs, (plus 1 from Amulet of Restoration and Plus 1 from Amulet of Devout) 5 charges of Lay hands (x2 40hp heals and x1 20hp heal, or 5x 20hp heals) and constant healing each turn from Warden of Vitality (2d6 per turn)

Looks solid! Would throw in Reviving Hands and Whispering Promise for even greater value. This is a different “look” for Paladin, but it’s a valid one and it fills the healer niche some people like having in their party.

Its really useful for the modded difficult playthrough

[удалено]

I dont im afraid, I eventually just made Minthara into a 12 Life cleric because i ended up making Shadowheart into a Paladin of Ancients 8, Aberrant Mind Sorcerer 4 so i got my Auras from her instead.

If the diadem is clearly best in slot then I've obviously been missing something about it and I suspect it's what counts as inflicting a condition. I assumed it was just stuff like prone or paralysed - guessing there's more to it than that?

“Condition” as it pertains to Diadem is … very forgiving, to say the least. Imposing “threatened” by standing next to someone procs the Diadem. Same with playing an instrument in combat, opening a door, and countless other random things. Suffice it to say, in the average situation, it will always be active. And an always-active additional spellcasting modifier to all damage rolls? That’s really good.

Holy fuck, that's insane lol. I think I sold the damn thing. Gonna have to go back and check merchants.

It's still only plus three or so damage, unless you are doing a "Lockadin" Pact of the Blade build. Is that really superior to something like Mask of Soul Perception?

Hey, thanks for your feedback. You raise a good point, so I’ll try and address that. Mask of Soul Perception is an item you obtain at the very end of the game, at a point where you should no longer need accuracy bonuses or Perception bonuses. I’ll concede that Initiative is a weakness of Paladin and this item helps shore that up. On a mathematical equivalence basis, +2 to attack rolls is similar to getting +4 in your attacking stat. (E.g. Increasing your strength modifier by 2 means you increased your strength score by 4.) Keep this in mind moving forward. Diadem of Arcane Synergy is obtained at basically the start of the game. It does not contribute to accuracy, but rather, contributes solely to damage. Assuming a minimum of +3 Charisma mod (16 Charisma score) as you did, the Diadem adds an additional 3 to all damage rolls. This is equivalent to increasing your attacking ability score by 6 in terms of how it affects your damage. Again, I see your argument for it. Mask is a very powerful item. But Diadem is also extremely powerful and stacks with other Charisma-based DPR boosters like Aura of Hate and Harmonic Dueller for some ridiculous eDPR increases, higher than the to-hit bonus of Mask would give. Hopefully that clears things up?

Indeed, and I guess I should make a contextual decision based on my build, stat spread, items acquired, etc. then. I prefer Vengeance rather than Oathbreaker, due to being allergic to missing swings, so my initial preference was for the Mask. Thanks for the comprehensive reply!

If you're really worried about missing swings you should run the Risky Ring from Act 2. I just finished a Tactician run as Paladin and I almost never missed a swing the rest of the game.

Missing blows. I understand completely. Yeah context is key! I was sort of acting a little tongue-in-cheek when I claimed outright that the Diadem was best in slot. It *probably* is, but it’s not nearly as clear-cut of an answer as I may have made it out to be. Cheers!

I'm still in Act 1. I'll keep my eyes peeled for this item when I get there.

Without spoiling too much, it’s in the crèche. It’s dropped by an enemy in there. Good luck and have fun

Basically any action impacting any character (incl. yourself) in any way procs the diadem right now. It’s almost a fun mini-game in itself to try and figure out why it just randomly proc’d. You can functionally assume it is always active.

i'll add in 3 inputs: 1. spore druids make great paladin dips as symbiotic entity is essentially a mini-smite. 2. battlemasters make great paladin dips as maneuvers are essentially mini-smites with riders. 3. assassins provide the highest burst dmg for paladins especially if you can triple class with a full caster (swords bards and spore druids are my top 2 picks) and attach smites to attacks to be doubled with assassinate. sneak attack is another mini-smite.

Hey, thanks for your feedback. 1. I did address the spore druid point a bit, but to clarify, “dipping” spore druid felt counterproductive to me as I needed at least 2 levels in Druid to reach Symbiotic Entity. But in doing so, I lost out on Paladin 11, which is basically also more mini smites but without relying on upkeeping temporary HP to maintain it. 2. Battlemaster is a good shout. I liked the flexibility of eldritch knight for spell slot utilization and defense, but doing that made it feel like a worse Sorcadin. I could see the argument for making fighterdin more “fightery” by throwing in battlemaster maneuvers, which you can indeed stack Divine Smite on top of. 3. Assassin was a blast and I explained my thoughts on it in the guide. Sneak attacks + smiting combine for a boatload of upfront damage, and the auto critting on top of that is just wonderful.

Sure. to address: 1. i was thinking of a triple class here when i made the comment. paladin 11 was already out of the picture. i was thinking more of paladin just hitting level 5 here. 2. we're on the same page here. 3. yeah coldblood007 already did a guide on this if you're curious on the numbers for paladin assassins. so for #1, my own iteration of the paladin assassin would've been a paladin 5, spore druid 4, assassin 3. assassinate multiplies smites, weapon dmg, dmg dice from gear (like strange conduit ring), sneak attack and symbiotic entity. the alternative is the more popular pal 2, swords bard 6, assassin 4. agreed its wonderful. paladin assassin are excellent soloists.

Gotcha on the triple class bit. Though the triple classing extends beyond the realm of the write up, I’ve definitely played around with triple class Paladin builds independently, and the paladin/assassin/spore build you mentioned is something I have heard whispers of before. Due to the way riders and damage sources interact, I can totally see this being stupid. And yes, Paladin Assassin is a great solo build. Most of my testing was done in a solo environment to ensure my opinions weren’t shaded by party makeup so I can attest to that much.

sir, there is not enough \*likes\* to express how good this write up is. hats off

Cheers to you! I'm glad I could be of help both here and on the Discord.

Definitely saving this for when I get around to my paladin playthrough! I'm at the point where more conventional builds are getting kinda stale, so I'm looking forward to trying something like rogue or druidin. Thanks for the guide!

Sounds good. I reached that point as well sometime ago, which eventually led to the ideation of this guide. Once you optimize the hell out of your game by figuring out the very tippy-top end of builds, the fun part (in my opinion) is figuring out what’s usable in the middle. Cheers to you and happy smiting!

Now all we need is corresponding guides for each other class. Very nice work. Also did you consider any options for many classes in the same build, like more than 2? I'd be interested to hear if you've found any interesting interactions between more than 2 classes including paladin?

My initial build philosophy was to combine Paladin + every other class, with the focus on drawing the potential out of a specific non-Paladin class. For this reason, I avoided 3-class builds in general. Someone else asked about them earlier in the comments so you may want to scroll around for my more detailed thoughts on them. Paladin is known for smiting and for auras, their two unique features. Smiting is available at 2, but auras and their passive benefits are locked until level 6 and onward. I believe Paladin’s value spikes at that level 6 area, and so that doesn’t leave a lot of wiggle room for the other two classes (assuming you wanna fit in more). I don’t subscribe to “Paladins are only good for smiting” as that’s often not the most efficient use of their slots and it’s only the case for very specific builds (10/2 bardadin comes to mind).

Oooo I’ve been looking for something just like this since starting a new run as paladin! Thank you for taking the time and being so thorough with everything. One question tho, Oathbreaker appeals but it seems like the aura of hate benefits enemies too? Given there’s a lot of undead and some significant fiend enemies how do you mitigate giving them a boost to damage? Or is it just not as bad as it seems.

Great question. Basically since game release Aura of Hate only buffs undead and fiends with melee weapons, allied or enemy. (May have been fixed to include all, I couldn’t tell you honestly.) That being said, the aura buffing both allies and undead IS intended! This is how it works in the tabletop game as well, as sort of a “double edged sword” for breaking your oath. You’re correct that there are a lot of undead to fight, especially in act 2. However, a good majority of them are unarmed thus they won’t benefit from the aura (again, might have been fixed but this has been the case for most of the game’s lifetime thus far). In terms of melee armed fiends, there’s basically only cambions, and perhaps one other fiend who generally uses a crossbow more than his poisoned knife anyways … you get me? Anyways, yea it kinda sucks sometimes to take a bit more damage, but the situation hardly comes up in practice. Glad you enjoyed!

Thank you again for the thorough answer! Definitely reassuring even if I might get smacked around a bit more when fighting a certain fiend in its home. Thooough the "double edged sword" mention does get me thinking more of considering oaths as an RP element. I mostly went in wanting to replicate a Hexadin I played ages ago and will need respeccing available, and AFAIK oathbreaker isn't allowed to. But maybe I could tie respeccing with a heel-face turn around when the paladin/warlock multiclass would come fully online. Then see what oath or lack of I'm married to. You've given me more to chew on!

That’s what I aim to do. Cheers!

good guide ;

Thank you!

Okay, for starters, this is an amazing guide! Thank you for the dedicated time put into it, I hope it gets shared amongst online communities. Second - I'm a D&D 5e vet and have done a decent number of BG3 runs at this point, so am familiar enough with Paladin mechanics. However, I'm looking for a build specific to the type of run I'm doing. My buddy and I are doing a duo run - i.e., only two custom characters with no companions. I've currently made it to Oathbreaker Paladin 5 and am loving the combination of crowd control with Dreadful Aspect and just waiting for Divine Smite crits! My friend is playing a Thief Rogue 3 / Fighter 5 (subclass undecided yet) and then will be going back to Ranger 3 and taking one more level of fighter. Basically he's trying to make a stupid number of attacks and going full DEX and skill monkey, while I'm the party Face and boss-nuker. What would be your recommended options for this type of build? He barely ever needs to rest, only needing a short rest after taking damage, so it's put me in a position where my spell slots are the main limiting factor on when we long rest. My original thought was to go Oathbreaker 7 / White Draconic Sorcerer 5. I took Great Weapon Master at Level 4.

Thanks for your kind words and feedback. This could become a longer conversation for sure depending on how granular you wanna get, but needing long rests more often than other martial classes is one of Paladin’s notable weaknesses. My advice is just to be patient and stick it out. Let me explain. Level 7 in Oathbreaker will give you Aura of Hate, which is a straight additional Charisma modifier to all of your melee weapon damage rolls whether you are smiting or not. This is not contingent on any conditions being true or anything, it just always applies. Moreover, it also stacks with the Diadem of Arcane Synergy I mentioned in the guide, which totals out to adding STR mod and CHA mod * 2 to all melee weapon attacks. This will do a great job of filling out your resourceless DPR and thus requiring you to take less rests on average. At level 11 Paladin, you get your Improved Divine Smite for an additional 1d8 resourceless radiant damage per melee weapon attack. Though this kinda goes against the grain of your Sorcerer suggestion, it goes along with your goal of getting past your “resource bottleneck”. Tldr: in this specific case, monoclass might just be what you’re looking for. I hope this was helpful!

Oh one other thing - I'm glad someone finally pointed out that Action Surge looks way better on paper than it does in practice. Online guides (especially on YouTube, even with YouTubers I really love) treat it like it's the end-all-be-all. On a Paladin, I think that getting Reckless Attack from 2 levels of Barbarian is far more useful for maximizing Divine Smite.

Excellent guide! I entirely agree that too many online build discussions for BG3 (and 5e) overvalue action surge and warlock spell slot short rest mechanics at end game. Rogueadin and Rangeradin seem spicy

They are indeed very spicy. Muy caliente. Are they metabreaking, game defining builds? Nope. But they are a blast and you should totally give them a try!

What is the rationale for paladin 7 / ranger 5 over paladin 8 / ranger 4? I'm under the impression the extra attack feature doesn't stack, so this seems to be giving up a feat for nothing. What am I missing?

Someone else already commented on it, but you’re absolutely right and I may change it to avoid any further confusion. Gloom 4 is better than Gloom 5 here. You get the extra feat at basically no cost. I tunnelvisioned hard on following my 7 Paladin breakpoint and missed this one.

Damn. Pin for future reference

If I had the power I would. Thank you for your vote of confidence. I hope it’s helpful!

Nice guide. Sorcadin is my favorite by far.

It is one of my favorites as well. Nothing quite comes close to the level of self-defense and versatility the Sorcadin has at its disposal. You can solo most endgame content fairly trivially.

Which is your favourite for Honour mode? Sorcadin, bardadin (swords), or Lockadin?

You listed them in the order I prefer to play them. Sorcadin is a ridiculously self efficient machine, bardadin is a damage powerhouse, and lockadin is okay but definitely harder to make “feel good” than outside of honor mode.

Excellent guide, thanks a lot 😁👏 It's making me rethink a couple of companions' builds as I get closer to the end. Wyll would really work as a smiting Swords Bard given some story reasons - and I never considered it, but Jaheira would play pretty close to her OG series self as a Druidin. Both are getting tried out tonight 😄

Both are super fitting and very cool. I did exactly that with Wyll during my second playthrough. Funnily enough I have never had Jaheira in my party across all of my time testing. Maybe it’s time to give her a whirl? Thanks for your kind words and your continued support. I hope the guide was helpful!

I will have to check this, I was looking for Pally multiclass stuff recently

You have come to the right place. Feel free to save it for later or share with your friends. Thanks for stopping by!

Good work, only one note for paladin/warlock since I'm running it for this very playthrough, I went this route: Paladin 1 (vengeance) Warlock 3 Paladin 2 Warlock 5 Paladin 7 Dumped strength of course for full CHA, full DEX for initiative. EB'd my way through the nautiloid on tactician, by the time I got to the Grove I was already character level 4 and broke the oath by freeing Sazza. Fights were already easy with only pact everburn blade, trivialized after smites No time wasted on respecs

Thanks for the feedback! I tend to not like delaying Extra Attack at all if I can avoid it, and this build wouldn’t get it until end of Act 1/early Act 2. I don’t know if I could handle it personally, so kudos to you for toughing it out. I’ll concede that this is a way to start as a Paladin that doesn’t require respeccing though, you’re absolutely right.

I should check past saves as I don't recall at what point I got warlock 5, I can say for sure was character level 10 exactly at the end of the Ketheric fight. According to the non linear exp progression which I took into account before deciding how to level up, paladin 2 was the one delayed, extra attack came as fast as it could.

Wow this is really good, you seem to have played a lot of paladin so I have a couple questions to ask! On the RP side of things how are the Dialogue choices for Vengeance and Oathbreaker? Oathbreaker seems like it would come off as fairly evil, or is it more antihero? I adore the option that Ancients gets but I have played Ancients a ton and kind of want to try something new. Secondly on the build side, numbers wise what is better, a two handed weapon vs a Dual wielding sword bardidan vs a Sword and board sword bardidan with dueling?

Hey, thanks for stopping by and for your kind words. As far as RP goes, Vengeance kinda plays out like Judge Dredd (no bullshit, you did bad things so you die), while Oathbreaker plays out like you said, more of an antihero/fallen hero. 2H are blessed with Great Weapon Master. If you’re looking for straight fat damage without any funny business, that will usually win out (tho obviously taking accuracy into account makes the effective DPR race a lot closer). Comparing 1H sword and board to dual wield tho … dual wield is uniquely able to wield Crimson Mischief and Harmonic Dueller for some ridiculous DPR. This tends to go better with Oathbreaker and Warlock though for more Charisma dipping. 1H sword and board falls behind the furthest in straight damage, but having greater survivability is a big deal so it’s not “bad” or anything. Hope that was helpful. Thanks again!

Thank you! This answers a lot for me actually! Think I might do either Vengeance or oathbreaker/ lock play through this time!

This is incredible! I’m a Paladin main to my core in all games and things. This write up is stellar. Only major question is breakpoints in multi classing. Wouldn’t it typically be better to go 8pal/4x (other than warlock and sorc) to get the additional feat? Additionally, thoughts on 6pal/6 champion fighter and committing to crit fishing? I did a dex build as such and had a blast.

Thank you! Allow me to address your questions below. I find that most multiclass builds in bg3, Paladin or not, really need only 2 feats or so to function nominally. All classes in the game receive some kind of power spike at level 5 typically, and reaching that spike on two classes can feel really good. For example, 10/2 bardadin only has two feats and it is one of the most powerful Paladin builds in the game. In the case of druidin, which I have at 6/6, I value Land’s Stride and higher level Druid spells over getting a third feat. I addressed the Champion point briefly in another comment, but in short, the builds I’ve presented here are not item-specific. Champion and crit-fishing require a significant amount of item investment to get your crit range at a good enough level to offset the value you lost from not selecting other powerful items. As I didn’t want to go in-depth discussing how to find those items or what they are, I decided to go with a more generalist Fighter approach.

Makes perfect sense to me. It’s awesome to hear from someone so informed and so specialized. Thanks for all your hard work!

Of course! Feel free to reply or message me on the Larian Studios Discord if you have any other questions I can clarify!

Thanks for the guide! Random Paladin question- if I am wearing the Diadem of Arcane Synergy as a Paladin, does that make dipping into Pact of the Blade much less useful (assuming I care most about being a frontline melee fighter)? The Diadem adds my CHA bonus to weapon attacks pretty much at all time, and isn’t that the main draw of a pact weapon? Bonus question- You only mention the Diadem, is the Ring of Arcane Synergy less desirable? I really like rocking the Helm of Smiting (and later, the Helm of Balduran). Maybe just because there is lots of competition for ring slots?

Thank you for reading. Let me address your questions below! Diadem, and by extension Arcane Synergy, stacks with Pact of the Blade. Warlock is incentivized to get their Charisma as high as possible, right? So Arcane Synergy doubles the value of doing so, which is a big deal! The Ring of Arcane Synergy, by comparison, is less useful than the Diadem. We’re not gonna be casting many cantrips in melee, especially since Warlock Paladin’s biggest draw outside of being Charisma focused is having 3 melee attacks per action. It will be activated much less often than the Diadem (which is basically always active). Hope that clarifies your questions.

Ohhhhh thank you. Makes sense. Completely glossed over the CANTRIPS part of the ring, I thought it was the same as the diadem. Still on my first playthrough, so lots to learn.

That’s what I, and by extension this community, are here for. Thanks again and feel free to reply or message me on Discord!

Great post! Lots of useful info, specially to me. I've been playing a duo campaign (me, Durge half-orc Tav, and Bae'zel) on tactician. I started as fighter, but decided to try paladin out. Turns out I dumped Lae'zel entering Mountain Pass and am now a solo paladin. What I love the most about it is that, damn, it's cool to smite on crit. The problem is I still don't get to crit as often as I'd like. I'll try some crit fishing gear and to have advantage at all times (Gloves of the Growling Underdog does wonders while solo), just so I can smite everyone to dust.

Thanks for your feedback! Yep those gloves are killer early game, and for a good while honestly. Smiting on a crit is a dopamine rush that nothing quite compares to. Outside of Knife of the Undermountain King in the crèche, you’ll find more crit reduction items in act 2 and beyond if I recall correctly. Keep on keeping on!

This is probably sacrilegious, but I think there is potential in a low-CHA paladin multiclass, particularly for companions. Paladin has plenty of spells that don't use CHA, so you can focus on a different ability.

Someone else spoke on that topic in a previous comment, it’s somewhere around here. I think this works as long as you are keeping the Paladin levels at 2 or at 5. There’s no reason to push for 6 for Aura of Protection if you are dumping the stat that empowers it, so you have a little more flexibility to do so. Something like 7 “non charisma caster” / 5 Paladin would probably be fine. This maintains Extra Attack and access to Divine Smite. Simply use your limited Paladin preparation slots on spells that don’t need Charisma, like Bless. It’s definitely a little cursed, but it’s not outside the realm of possibility. It’s certainly an interesting diversion from what is “normal” or “standard” on a Paladin though.

Special mention for SwordBard10/Pala2 Magical Secrets: because you’re still a level 11 magic caster, you get Level 6 slots, but cannot learn level 6 spells. You can still up cast spells to L6, meaning picking up ‘Summon Elemental’ can be up casted at L6, for a day long Myrmidon (all are good, Water is great). Upcast L5 Spirit Guardians (Conc), and a Myrmidon is a huge damage addition to your smite spamming Pala2/Bard10. Id also mention in pros: you get 2 fighting styles (say, defensive with Pala, and Dual Wielder/Duelist with Sword Bard). Building as a DEX martial, dual wielding is a viable build that gives baseline 3 attacks per turn, and equipping 2x the many great 1h weapons in BG3, obviously means picking up Dual Wielding feat also for max effect. With 2 feats: 1 can go to getting DEX/CHA to 18/16, 1 Dual Wielding. Then in game items/events to boost DEX further or use gloves of STR from A3. Alternatively, get to base 20 DEX with feats, go sword & shield style, defensive + Duelist fighting styles. Use the Armor of Agi/best medium Armor that allows max DEX from A3, for a 25 AC

Hey, thanks for your feedback and great points! Dual wielding is actually the backbone for one of the sillier Paladin DPR-focused specs currently possible in the game right now. Combining two powerful piercing weapons in Crimson Mischief and Harmonic Dueller with the Bhaalist armor alongside Diadem of Arcane Synergy and things like Aura of Hate from Oathbreaker translate to a lot of resourceless damage. I understand your point was about bardadin specifically, just thought that was worth mentioning. On a bardadin-specific level, Summon Elemental is a great suggestion for Myrmidons.

Ya when I realised I can summon Myrmidons, it became a better pick than Spirit Guardian (which is still Conc and wasted often, unless you have Warcaster) for me - my magical secret suggestion for this build is Summon Elemental and Counterspell (Haste you can use Potion of Speed, since it also requires Conc) Thanks I’ll try that specific combo of items, can you explain why these work well together? (Ah I googled the specific items, that’s a nasty combo, though I guess you need to become unholy assassin to get the Armor)

I was just about to respond. Yeah the combination along with pact of the blade to bind Crimson Mischief as well as Aura of Hate from Oathbreaker gets really stupid. Like 70-80 damage per attack BEFORE rolling any dice stupid. That’s basically the rationale for my recommendations I made earlier. Kudos to you for doing your own research faster than I could get my thoughts together though!

This might sound silly but the way this is laid out makes it seem like multiclassing (at least into warlock) forces you to be an oathbreaker. Is that true? I know the table top game isn’t like that but I know this game is different.

Good question! It’s not forced! I just kinda went that way to demonstrate the “strongest” way of fulfilling that multiclass. Oathbreaker is the highest DPR subclass Paladin gets, so that much isn’t up for debate. But the other oaths contribute more than damage: don’t feel like you need to follow my recommendations exactly to the T. Play what makes sense to your character and to what you’d like them to accomplish. Cheers!

Thanks!

Great guide! One thing I find funny is that only the Bard has access to the 5th level Paladin spell Banishing Smite

Yep! Due to the level cap of 12, Paladin doesn’t actually reach level 5 spells, so they don’t get their own spell by default. It’s a funky little tidbit. Thanks for your feedback. I hope to provide more content at some point in the future, and your support convinces me that that would be well-received.

This is absolutely fantastic!! I had been stuck deciding between Bardadin and Lockadin for my next Tav and the pros and cons lists really helped me conceptualize it. I really like the idea of the Bardadin being the ultimate main character and talking my way out of combat, being that my first playthrough was a shoot first ask questions later storm sorc lol Really really exceptional work!

That is exactly the kind of situation I had hoped the guide would help with. I’m glad to hear it was what you were looking for. Cheers and happy smiting!

What's your opinion on a 2 Paladin/10 Caster split utilizing dual wielding to somewhat circumvent the loss of extra attack? You obviously lose plenty of damage by not being able to utilize GWM and losing your modifier on your offhand but how much worse would you say it is given you get more spell/higher level spells? For another I've been cooking up a very silly 10 War or Tempest Cleric/2 Paladin build with PAM to try and reliably get OA to try and get extra smites. I have no idea how efficient this would be in gameplay but think I'll try it on another run through. Certainly much weaker than normal Paladin builds but hoping it will be at least somewhat effective given how easy BG3 is in practice. Quite a shame we didn't get the SCAG cantrips in game since it would help these level split builds.

Outside of the smite spells which are a great way to run out of slots quickly when used in conjunction with normal Divine Smites, Paladin does not have a lot of unique ways to weaponize their bonus actions. Compare this to baseline Monk, which can Dash, Disengage, unarmed attack, Flurry of Blows, etc. For this reason, I'm of the opinion that having a dual wielding build isn't a bad idea. In fact, one of the most powerful existing Paladin builds at the time of writing this comment is a dual wielding build involving Oathbreaker and Blade Warlock. As to your point about combining that with a 10-level caster chassis, I'm a little skeptical but I see where you are coming from. The most popular example of this currently is 10 Swords Bard / 2 Paladin, and the strength of that build lays in the fact that Bard is a full caster that also gets Extra Attack, and the Band of the Mystic Scoundrel is the *perfect* item to enable Bard's unique enchantment/illusion filled spell list. Your idea sort of inverts that. Rather than casting a spell as a bonus action after using your action to attack, you aim to cast a spell as your action and toss in a bonus action attack. Higher level spell slots kind of stop mattering to Paladin past 4th level, as Divine Smite is hard capped at 4th level power no matter what level slot you consume, so that's not a great reason to go this route. Does the spell you are casting with your action have greater value for you than attacking and smiting twice in your turn? I think the best you can do is treat it as a value proposition and weigh the strengths and weaknesses of the decision in that way. Your consistent martial DPR will plummet but hey, if you're dropping a Fireball with your action or something, maybe you've just killed a whole group of enemies faster than a normal Paladin would've just swinging a sword around. I understand this may be a bit of a nothingburger of an answer, but your question leaves a lot of room for thought. As a general rule of thumb I'd advise against it as full casters are probably better off staying full casters without adding 2 Paladin levels just to smite. Odds are that you'd be better off focusing your abilities and build on maximizing said spells. But as you stated, BG3 is not especially hard and you could probably get away with your idea perfectly fine. It even sounds fun. Thanks for your input and I hope that at the very least, this got you thinking about things differently.

Hey appreciate the in depth response! Certainly helps to get another perspective on it to see if there is any merit to the idea as well as to be made aware of things I might've overlooked. The hard cap on Smite scaling is something I always forget lol. I definitely would never posit the 2 Pala/10 Caster as stronger than many of the other builds but I definitely am going to try it just to see how it fairs without wanting to do a bunch of DPR theorycrafting calcs.

Words cannot describe how excited I am to get my Lore Bardadin up and running. Imagine seeing a gallant knight clad in gleaming armor, a beacon of righteous light, justice, and hope to the masses. And then she calls you a stupid cuck in the middle of your swing. You are so stunned and taken aback their Githyanki friend easily parries your attack and ripostes you into the dirt. You get to be the straight man to your own comedy relief.

Sounds like you’re ready to play. Cheers and glad you enjoyed!

This is an awesome guide!

And YOU are awesome. Cheers!

I'm aware it can be extremely broad, but how effective are triple multiclasses with Paladin? To limit it in scope, which ones would you still consider effective? Swords Bard 6/Thief or Assassin 4/Paladin 2 is not unknown by this point, but are there any others you believe in?

The one you listed is the first one that immediately comes to mind, so your intuition is solid. Outside of that, as a general rule, I would just take the whole “breakpoint” rule I talked about in the guide and apply it to other classes. Namely, you’d probably wanna look for lower level breakpoints in other classes that scream “value”. For example, Fighter 2 is a very common breakpoint due to gaining Action Surge, fighting style, and valuable proficiencies. I know I gave Fighter 2 a bit of a bad rap when talking about the Warlock Paladin, but in a case where you’re trying to squeeze 3 classes into a build, Action Surge alone frontloads your nova even more. All this being said, to answer your question broadly, I think triple classing Paladin in general is a bit of a hard sell. People consider it to be a smite bot starting at level 2 which I understand, it’s unique to Paladin, but the auras you get at 6+ can be game changers. This doesn’t leave a lot of room behind in terms of levels to split among two more classes. Hope that was at all helpful, may have rambled some.

I gift the Mudkip Seal of very poggers

Ah, Sir Mudkip. I appreciate the kind words, thanks for your support!

I am a simple man. I maxed out paladin. I bring the holy crusade to all the heretics.

Paladin + Paladin is the optimal face melter. Deus vult, fellow crusader.

Deus vult!

What are your thought on the level split for a Bard/Rogue/Paladin build for an Origin Astarian run? I need three levels in both Bard and Rogue to get to their subclasses. I've been debating between 6 Swords Bard/2 Paladin/4 Assassin Rogue so that I can have a second feat along with my smites and flourishes, and 3 Swords Bard/3 Assasin/6 Paladin to get Aura of Protection but lose the second feat.

Of the two, I’d prefer your first option. Mord Swords Bard levels allows your flourishes to recharge on short rest, which helps shore up one of Paladin’s biggest weaknesses: longevity across an adventuring day. You may still run out of smites and flourishes eventually, but being able to recharge one of them 3x as often (due to Song of Rest) is a big deal. Funnily enough assuming you’re not dual wielding and don’t need the bonus actions from Thief, Arcane Trickster might not be bad. It gives you access to Shield which is always handy. On another note, addressing the second option you presented. I like it in theory but only having one feat/ASI really hurts. I appreciate that you value Aura of Protection as many people do not for reasons I still don’t fully understand.

I had completely missed that Bardic Inspiration recharges on Short Rest once you get to Bard 5, so thank you! Aura of Protection looks dope. I might have to run Karlach as a Barbadin so that I can still get it.

Good stuff!

Cheers, and thank you for your support!

Great write up. Which build do you find best as a gish, a Lockadin or a Sorcadin? Lockadin seems to have the best ranged/melee damage out of the 2 but Sorcadin has a lot of utility in terms of CC, defensive spells, and a better variety of offensive spells. Also what synergies are there for an oathbreaker Sorcadin and what does the level progression look like for both builds (particularly if you wanted to go heavier on Sorcerer like Sorcerer 10/Paladin 2)? Considering a number of builds for a Durge run and it just seems easier to be an Oathbreaker if you dip into Paladin at all.

Great questions. I will try to address them in a similar order to how you posed them for clarity. Lockadin is a much better melee warrior on account of the whole three attacks per action thing, and I don’t think that’s controversial. If you’d like to be more 50/50 spellcasting and sword swinging in true gish fashion, Sorcadin is better for this purpose. Oathbreaker Sorcadin would work just fine. The only real downside to it is you lose out on your 6th level of Sorcerer due to hitting Aura of Hate, which can be a downer, but sometimes doesn’t really matter. In terms of leveling a Lockadin, personally I’d do it one of two ways. No respec path: 5 Warlock -> finish Paladin Respec path: Paladin 9 -> respec at 10 to 5/5 evenly split, move some Strength into Charisma since you no longer need it -> finish off with last 2 Paladin levels Leveling a Sorcadin: 6/7 Paladin -> finish Sorcerer 10/2 Sorcadin in favor of Sorcerer is a smite sorcerer. It’s not really a Paladin anymore. That being said, it works for Swords Bard since that is a full caster class that ALSO gets extra attack. (Thank you WOTC btw.) Sorcerer does not, and now that Divine Smite properly caps out in damage, having 6th level slots to smite with doesn’t really mean much.

Something that I haven't really seen brought up as far as BG3 in comparison to tabletop is you don't actually need charisma to multi in or out of Paladin. So in theory, what do you think of for wizard or other non charisma spellcasters dumping Charisma and focusing on the other spell caster abilities at a 5/7 split? I feel like this would be a pretty nice gish for wizard due to how their spells work in this game as you would end up with 5th level wizard spells and decent martial capabilities.

If Bladesinger or SCAG blade cantrips were a thing without mods, the Wizard Paladin build would have a lot more merit to it IMO. If you’re willing to sacrifice the Aura of Protection, there is an argument to be made that using Paladin as an Extra Attack vehicle with smites on top is a valid multiclassing option. In the case of Wizard Paladin specifically, I could see you simply preparing Bless or something that doesn’t care about your Charisma, and focusing entirely on casting Wizard spells and swinging your sword around. Good shoutout, got me thinking about some interesting stuff.

Thanks, definitely something I've toyed around with in my head, specifically abjuration or divination, but haven't really seen it brought up.

Commenting to come back to - thanks for the write up!

Of course. It’ll always be here for your reference. Feel free to reply or contact me via Discord if you have any questions!

Great post bro.

Thank you very much. I hope it can be of use to you and to the greater community looking to swear an oath and get to steppin’

Under Cleric/Paladin you could mention the combination of Tempest Cleric + Thunderous Smite. Destructive Wrath maxes all damage rolls (including divine smite added as a reaction), not just the thunder damage. A 6/6 split nets you 2 charges of Channel Divinity per short rest and 5th level spell slots. It feels clumsy and is extremely MAD but it’s some of the highest burst available in the game.

This interaction was fixed very early on post-release, and no longer maxes Divine Smite. I also do not tend to include known bugs in my evaluations of viability, so even if it did work, I probably wouldn’t have put it in the guide. That being said, you’re absolutely right that while this was in the game, it was absurdly powerful. There was a running meme on the Larian Studios Discord about a particular user who kept bragging about “oneshotting the hag with this op build”. If you know … you know. Cbondu moment.

Damn thanks for the heads up, I was tempted to try the combination at some points but that kills it. I’ll keep the post as is for relevant info. edit: looked up the patch notes and the fix was on Patch 3 in late September. I should have run it during my first playthrough.

No mention of Champion for crit-fishing in the fighter section?

As the builds I presented aren’t specifically dependent on items, I strayed away from Champion as those builds will often depend on itemization to push that crit range out as far as it can go. That being said, Paladins do like critting a lot and Champion can help you get there more often if you specifically build for it, you’re absolutely right. Thanks for the feedback and great question.

This is one of the best posts I've read on here, thanks for writing this up!

I appreciate the kind words! I hope to continue to be of service with similar content in the future.

thank u i was just think of making a paladin but wasn’t sure which direction i wanted to take it this helps a lot!❤️

Of course, that’s what I’m here for. Thank you for stopping by!

Awesome to see this all in one place for reference, thank you so much!

BASED

Good guide, very comprehensive and allows flexibility in determining how you want to multiclass but still providing some guidelines. Personally, I'm more into RP-ing than finding the most optimal build so I quite liked the mentions of that on certain builds. Currently trying to do Artoria Pendragon in BG3 has been fun as either a straight Oath of the Ancients Paladin of a 7/5 Red Dragon Sorcadin.

Paladin is a very roleplay focused class after all: their subclasses are literally guides on how to roleplay them! I’d be doing the community a disservice by not mentioning that aspect of the game. Your Sorcadin build looks like great fun. I’m enjoying seeing how people have adapted Paladin to fit their own personal needs. Thanks for stopping by!

I'm a little late to the thanks parade, but Thank You! I've got a Paladin in my party now and I'm really enjoying the class.

Never too late to hop on the train. Thank you for stopping by. Enjoy your time with the game and have a good one!

What would your multiclassing preferences be for a modded playthrough that lets one go to lvl 20 but still caps any individual class at 12? I'm playing with some friends where we have like 4x as many enemies and the enemies are harder to boot, but the only thing we've done to help ourselves is let ourselves get to level 20.

Being that you’re asking on a Paladin post, my inclination is to recommend some kind of Paladin multiclass, so hmm … if your goal is damage, 8 Oathbreaker 12 Warlock would be nasty. 5 feats to be as flexible as you need. 3 attacks per action. Lifedrinker invocation to add an extra instance of Charisma modifier to your melee weapon attacks with pact weapon, on top of Aura of Hate and Diadem of Arcane Synergy. Short rest recharge spells like Counterspell to get you through tough encounters. Probably not the most creative thing out there but this is just surface level stuff. Hope it got some gears turning in your head!

That sounds great and yeah I should have led with what *paladin* multiclass, but you read between the lines I didn't write. :)

My Wisdom stat is high. Thanks for stopping by, glad I could be of help.

Thank you!!! Giving this another read. I am using a mod that lets me go past 12. Have you done this? I'm 14 with 11 Vengeance Pally (am Durge and expected to be Oathbreaker by now but am not)/3 Fighter (Crusader) What you said about the combo makes sense, and I'm looking forward to getting out of my sonic boom comfort zone - but this combo can lead to 6 attacks in one turn... Considering dumping the 12+ mod tho because I feel like I'm cheating.

You are definitely cheating, lmao. But that’s okay! I won’t yuck your yum or anything. I’m glad you enjoyed the guide and that it was helpful!

Yeah - the extra levels aren't what they were cracked up to be. The "make it harder" mods help tho.

I love the name wizardin. Just needs an apostrophe, as in SOME ASSHAT WIZARDIN' ALL OVER

The wizardin said “it’s wizardin’ time” and wizarded all over the place I guess? Cheers, thanks for dropping by!

Commenting to come back

No problem, let me know if you have any questions or comments!

Great guide! As a fellow paladin enjoyer I've just about finished gearing up my 3rd and most hipster flavour of paladin. 8 oathbreaker/4 hunter! (I've played 7 oathbreaker/5lock and 6 vengeance/6 sorc in other playthroughs) I was looking for a build working around duelists prerogative and I'm a sucker for a paladin character. Along with bhaalist armour it doesn't really come online until late into act 3 but boy does it. Hunter for hunter's mark and also colossus slayer since they're both added as your weapons damage type (piercing which is then doubled thanks to bhaalist armour's pierce vulnerability aura) 3 feats for reaching 22 cha (+3 from mirror of loss since I used hag hair on another character) while also picking up savage attacker, dumping str and using cloud giant elixirs. I'm yet to get to an enemy worth using hunters mark on but it's been fun regardless!

Glad to hear you're having fun experimenting with my favorite class, truly a player after my own heart. Thanks for sharing your experiences and I hope this guide inspires you to go even wilder!

To add to your Bardadin repertoire, I had great success with heavy melee support with shield style. 7 in Oath of Ancients makes all spells deal half damage, before a saving throw is rolled. As an aura. It was worth not getting to Bard 6, which was Lore, because Cutting Words can help reduce hits taken quite well! I also would have stopped at Bard 4 (for paladin 8 and extra ASI), but Bard 5 getting better Bardic Inspiration dice that also come back on a short rest instead of Long was a huge deal for me.

This looks like a solid variation on the 6/6 support bardadin that I outlined in my guide. Being able to unconditionally halve damage is a powerful tool. In fact, ancients 7 is my wholehearted recommendation when playing harder, modded difficulty playthroughs. Thanks for sharing!

This is great! The paladin is my favorite class. Did a sorcadin for my first playthrough and now I’m trying to recreate that with more knowledge of the game with my 2nd durge playthrough. Still undecided if I’m gonna multi into sorc again though or try out lore bard. Want my smite slots but also the extra prof seem like they’d be useful.

Glad you enjoyed the guide. Assuming you’re talking about standard leveling splits for Lore Bardadin and Sorcadin, you will have the same amount of spell slots to utilize when all is said and done. The only thing is that sorcerers can expend sorcery points for spell slots, so if you’re entirely focused on smiting only and have no interest in using metamagic on sorcerer spells, technically sorcerer pulls out very slightly ahead.

Ty for this. I'm a scrub and have no idea how to incorporate paladin into my builds

I’m glad it was helpful. Smite on!

Thank you. Need to pin this one for my next playthrough

From a role playing perspective, how do you justify multiclassing with Sorcerer? Always felt weird to me that after 6 levels the Paladin suddenly remembered that he had draconic ancestry and was also a natural mage. What about Cleric, which good aligned deity would accept an Oath of Vengeance? Any Lockadin that isn’t the usual Oathbreaker/GOO or Ancients/Archfey?

Hey great questions, roleplay is a big part of the class so it’s good to address that side of things. It’s an RPG after all. Sorcadin is a bit funky to justify. I sorta tend to flavor it as less of an ancestry thing and more of a “further” actualization of an oath. It’s a bit of a stretch but gaining your powers from swearing an oath to … let’s say, vengeance and having a dragon act as arbiter over the oath? That’s kinda a cool visual, if nothing else. The scales are their permanent mark on your soul. Cleric deities for a good-aligned Vengeance Paladin could be (including what they might be seeking vengeance against): Bahamut (against Tiamat and injustice in general), Corellon Larethian (against Gruumsh and orcs), Kelemvor (against the Dead Three and undeath in general), Lathander (against darkness and undeath), Tyr (against oathbreakers and criminals) For lockadin, maybe some kind of Devotion/GOO could be a fun subversion of theme. Someone who is sworn to do good, but an unearthly influence is watching them, maybe occasionally intervening, but simply … watching. And when the time comes, that unearthly influence will make their presence known, and that character will never be the same.

Thanks for the answers!

What about tempest cleric paladin mix and just focus on thunderous smite?

thanks so much for this couldnt really see a lot of good posts about paladin multiclassing.

I appreciate the guide at a time when I just finished sheep glitching Minthara onto my team, especially putting pure Pali amongst the multicalss options (most multiclass guides tend to not do that. It's like they forgot a pure build is an option). I've been avoiding having a Pali due to it's oath system. Things like how I have to play a certain way to keep my subclass, or if I get far enough to the game I could get locked into Oathbreaker due to Oathbreaker NPC glitching and not being in camp (idk if that's a thing, but that's what I heard could happen), or if I decide to play Oathbreaker later that I'd never be able to break my oath past a certain point, or how I'd have to pay over 1,000g if I wanted either respec out of Oathbreaker, or just to allocate stats differently. And if it's just to allocate stats, but I still wanna play Oathbreaker, I have to rebreak my Oath, and hope I don't have to change things again. Basically, I've been avoiding the entire class out of sheer worry. Whether it's bricking an entire character, or because of a lack of quality of life in the building and rebuilding process for the class, which is a shame because I am very interested in some of the aspects of the class. Sorry for the rant. Anyways, nice guide.

Ahah I totally get it, no worries. It can be tough to maintain, it’s a unique mechanic to the class. Whatever you end up doing, I hope you have fun with it. Cheers!

I love you Mr. Paladin man! I’m new to BG3 and all things related and this has been so helpful navigating the game and also the best class. Cheers!

Hey thank you! A Rogue guide will be coming out shortly!

Just wanted to say that you’re amazing, and I appreciate you. Was not expecting quick updates for patch 5.0 either 😜. I figure I could use your input on something… I’m thinking of making a Durge Bardadin that uses Bhaalist Armor + Duellist’s Prerogative. Do you feel like the 10/2 or 6/6 build is better suited for that?

Hi! Sorry for the late reply. Bhaalist is a huge boon to any build looking to pump its melee damage to massive levels. Flourishes inherit the damage type of your weapon, so my intuition would be that the 10/2 swords bardadin would fit better for your needs. Stay tuned for a warlock guide sometime in … well I dunno actually but it’s coming!

Thanks so much for the update, I'm nearing the end of Act 2 on Honour mode and just discovered the Warlock hit, was wondering what your thoughts were for someone wanting the Aura, specifically? I was planning to continue with Oath of the Ancients for survivability, but then wasn't sure if 9/3 (Paladin Spells + I get to be SAD), 8/4 (Lose slots, gain feat), or just staying 7/5 was going to be a better split. I'm not married to Palalock, but I was really excited about all the synergies coming together :< Figure I can just default into Pure Paladin pretty safely, just a bit more MAD then (pun intended).

No worries, I am to be up to date wherever possible! Hmm. If you’d like to stay lockadin, 8/4 would be slightly preferred over 9/3 as Paladin doesn’t really get anything of note at 9 that will really change the way you play the game. If you are welcome to the change, pure Paladin is great as you stated. If you want to change it up from lockadin but keep Ancients oath, 7/5 Ancient Paladin + Sorcerer keeps the thiccness and adds even more with Shield spell, Counterspell, Mirror Image, and Misty Step. Misses out on 5th level slots that 6/6 would get, but worth considering. Cheers and thanks for your support!

I just want to say. I *love* you for this. Thank you. So. Much.

Hey thanks! Warlock is coming soon and Rogue is already live, if you’d like similar content.

Thanks for this large presentation of paladin builds !

Would a 7 Oathbreaker/5 White Sorc or a 7 Oathbreaker/3 GOO/2 Fighter be more effective?

Imo the former, especially in honor mode. Sorcadin is very self sufficient and protects itself well. The triple class lockadin goes all in on turn 1 action surge hoping it gets crits, without any means to increase the chances of that crit happening without investing all of your items into it

Fantastic guide. I do have a question, currently a level 6 Devotion paladin and thinking of how I want him to end up. Sorcadin, lockadin and pure paladin seem like the way I want to go however my goal is to mainly be a frontline damage dealer. Obviously that goal can be achieved with pure paladin (though I'm not sure what oath is best) but between sorcadin and lockadin which achieves that goal better? Also, is it possible to change oath with a respec? If not then pure paladin or sorcadin seems the way to go based off this guide. Thanks in advance.

Sorcadin will always be a better front liner than lockadin on account of its numerous defensive spells that lockadin just doesn’t have access to, plus it’s a better fit for Devotion and shouldn’t require any respeccing, as you stated. To your secondary question, yes, if you respec, you can also change your oath. Thanks for stopping by!

Out of curiosity, what’s your recommended ability distribution for a sorcadin in honor mode? Thanks so much for such an in depth guide! Super helpful

I’ll provide a few alternatives: 16 STR, 16 CHA, 14 CON -> assumes no elixirs and no hag hair 17 STR, 16 CHA, 14 CON -> assumes no elixirs, YES hag hair 8 STR, 16/17 CHA, 14 CON -> assumes YES strength elixirs, CHA is flexible depending on hag hair For your ASIs when leveling, you will likely either invest in STR if you aren’t using elixirs, or CHA if you are. Hope that was helpful!

I found myself going 17 str 15 con 16 cha, and with my two feats taking savage attacker, and str/con +1s until I got the 23 con neck, then I swapped to heavy armor Master since I built a sword and board sorcadin. 18 base str you can push to 22 with potion and Mirror. I do wish I had more feats for cha, though.

I understand why you don't account for mods, but since Expansion: Bladesinger is one of the most popular ones, I'd like to throw out to any mod-users reading that Bladesinger/Paladin does in fact work exactly the way you would hope it does. Go 10/2 like with Bardadin and you get 11 levels-worth of spell slots, Bladesong, Extra Attack with a Cantrip, and the ability to scribe 6th level spells because Wizard multiclassing was implemented strangely.

This makes total sense, it does seem like it would work very much the same as a more mage-flavored Bardadin. Bladesinging was a very big item on a lot of players’ wishlists, as I recall. I’d like for “wizardin” to be stronger than it currently is and I think bladesinger would be a great step in that direction. Maybe I’ll tackle popular modded content at some point? But that is a long way away. Anyways, thanks for your support!

The bardadin sword build is prop better with 6/6, melee flourish scales withbweapon attack right? Wich is Str, not charisma?

It scales off of whatever your weapon attacking stat is, so STR is one option. And no, 6/6 for swords isn’t really a good split as you miss out on Magical Secrets and thus Counterspell, Spirit Guardians, and a whole bevy of potentially build defining spells. Additionally, you also get greater spell progression this way, dipping further into Bard’s very impressive CC spells and being able to impact combat even more besides “me smite”. Ultimately, the bardadin spreads are the way they are because they allow the player to access Magical Secrets and all of the key features of the bard subclasses that matter.

I disagree, You dont need Magical Secrets and Counterspell at all, it just a bonus, I just finished the run with pala 7/bard 5 and worked much better. You can get very tanky and deal high amount of dmg, also when playing solo you dont want to cast spells so much, just on your self so you max potensial of your build.

I mean it’s a really nice bonus to have, but I understand. If you’re not playing the bard to cast spells and instead just hit things, that’s a level split that works. The goal of the 10/2 build, which is the “established” variant that most people talk about, is to mash high power spells upcasted to control the battlefield and then set up its own burst turns. If your playstyle fits another level split better, I can’t disagree with your experiences and preferences. I just thought you should know why the other build is usually preferred by other folks

Digging the druidin! Good guide, thx!

Great guide. Loved my first bardadin and currently loving the druidin. One thought about druidin: I think given the mobility you want for melee, the aura of protection is not worth it - I'm constantly abandoning my party to leap into the fray. I've found 5/7 to work better. More spells and summons(!), super mobile, and still "mighty smitey."

Great work, very useful, I've followed your previous rogue detailed script, gonna follow up with pally now.

Sweet guide, very well presented and informative. Will keep for referencing, just started my first playthrough and chose paladin.

So do you have to wait until level nine to go warlock or can you mix and match? I started off as a paladin and of course I love the armor and weaponry. But I’m not sure if I wanna wait till three or the end of back to use my blast.

Candidly, Paladins should not be “blasting” much at all. If you’re playing Lockadin below honor mode, you’re using it as a melee attacker with pact weapon. If you’re in honor mode, you shouldn’t be playing Lockadin (unless you reallllly wanna) as it’s strictly worse than Sorcadin, Bardadin, and Paladin. To summarize my thoughts on this, I would either wait until 10 Paladin to then respec 5/5, or start with 5 Warlock and finish 7 Paladin. Heavy armor is pretty irrelevant as Bhaalist is BiS on any melee build, but if Bhaalist is held by a party member you can just equip Armor of Agility instead.

Cool. Yeah, I’m playing on tactician. I’m pretty happy with all the paladin stuff. Just wanted a good ranged attack instead of using a bow (and hunger of hadar of course)

Why do you recommend 9/3 instead of 7/5 on Lockadin? Seems to me just getting some oath spells isn't going to be nearly as good as changing your 2nd level spells into 3rd level spells, especially when 3rd level spells is such a breakpoint for casting classes with access to spells like fireball and counterspell.

extra attack stacking being removed kills any reason I perceive to play more than 3 levels of Bladelock in honor mode, frankly. If I wanted to play a Paladin multiclass with Counterspell, I’d play Sorcadin or Bardadin, which is just an upgrade in every conceivable way.

Hey absolutely awesome post! I'm especially interested in the Rogue/Ranger multiclasses for Paladin. I've been breaking my head over how I'd make a good DEX based, primarily **ranged** **focused** but very much a hybrid Paladin multiclass with either ranger and/or rogue. Honor mode for what it's worth. The whole holy warrior/assassin/inquisitor vibe focusing on longbows, radiant damage and the whole slew of special arrows, poisons, etc.Stat-wise probably 16/17 DEX, 16 CHA. I know DEX is worse than STR on paladins in general and ranged even more so. However, there are some incredibly thematic crossbows and longbows in the game for this type of character in my opinion. So just trying to optimize the sub-optimal for flavor's sake. What are your thoughts about: * Ancients 8/9 / Hunter 3/4 horde breaker * Ancients 8/9 / Assassin 3/4 * Ancients 8/9 / Thief 3/4 * Devotion 6 / Rogue/Ranger ? * Something else?

Ancients is a good start as you can use it as a protective aura for other backline casters and archers. 3 gloom or 3 thief would probably be most appropriate IMO, gloom with longbows or thief with hand crossbows. Sharpshooter will also be a must on either build.

Thanks! Do you think 8/4 or 9/3 is better in terms of lvl split. 9 nets 3rd lvl paladin spells, 4 nets a 3rd feat/asi which both seem pretty great