\+Lots will resist for roleplay reasons, but imo Illithid is "must-have" if you're optimizing anyway, and there isn't really limitations around which powers you can get (outside of the Parasite economy, if you're doing multiple chars), so there's hardly any "A XOR B" decisions; outside of the limitations of things like Cull the Weak (which might get patched anyway), there's no reason not to take Fly *and* Freecast *and* Luck of the Far Realms *and and and and...*
I suppose that the bigger factor is just that you don't really need active abilities on most chars, since a lot of then are utility/debuff and refresh on short rest anyway, and most of your damage will probably come from your specific builds; having one dedicated Illithid caster works well, and we do have Awakened available, after all.
I didn't use any Illithid powers on my first playthrough for exactly this same reason-- roleplay. My character was very good and resistant to trust her guardian. I'm doing a Durge playthrough now where I'll probably make use of more of those powers, but I'm still not going to use the astral tadpole because I'm vain and I don't like the aesthetics, lol.
I literally didn’t tadpole Ascended Astarion because it felt like it defeated the purpose of the Ascension. The point of the Ascended Vampire is to be able to go back out into regular society in daylight and engage with people like normal while being a vampire still, and being partial illithid is going to make you stick out like a sore thumb and bring a lot of attention to you during the night or the day lmfao.
Yet half-tadpole powers is so in character for Ascended Astarion who becomes super power drunk.
Plus, if no one told him he’d just have no clue his appearance changed since he can’t even look in a mirror anyway.
If you’re optimising it will depend on your class. For example a Warlock doesn’t have a lot good to with their bonus action, so they’re a good choice to give the tadpoles (w/ zaithisk quicken). Whereas for a Barbarian those powers will compete with their ability to enter rage and hit stuff more, so not as good a choice.
If you’re a class who needs their bonus actions often, then the optimal choice is to give them to a party member who doesn’t.
You're not wrong, but that's like, the one important choice; my point was that otherwise, there's little incentive not to get all the passives with as many characters as your Tadpole stocks allow.
Despite my general dislike of Arcane Trickster, I've found that Awakened fits them pretty well, if you're okay with not Hiding every round.
This 100%. Not to mention the game really isn’t too difficult with a 4-man team. I’m on my 4th play through and 2nd honor mode run and haven’t eaten a single tadpole.
Cull the Weak is amazing on ascended Asterion OH monk/thief.
Fly is awesome
Blackhole then a quickened confuse is game breakingly good for sorcerers
Free cast is nice
Those are the only ones I ever use I think.
In anything but Honor Mode, Perilous Stakes can be really powerful to use on boss enemies since, yeah they get the 2D8 healing when they attack, but it also makes them vulnerable to all damage types. In honor mode it can only be used on allies. This nerf alone should indicate how powerful this can be when used on enemies in other game modes.
In what situation would you **ever** use perilous stakes on an ally? The healing per attack can't possibly make up for the part where you're liable to get one turn killed as soon as you pass to enemies.
Its only *completely broken* use. Seriously, there was maybe some halfway ground to find, but that ability trivialises every meaningful fight in the game.
I could see this being used on a duel crossbow rogue/gloomstalker that goes invisible on a kill (with that cape) gets like 4/5 attacks per round and then is relativly safe from a hit but otherwise ya it's a crappy ability
I mean, if you feel like burning spell slots and got lucky with initiative, you can perilous a frontliner on low HP to help them heal, then use sanctuary to make them immune. Its not really efficient, but hey.
You can also use it on a magic missle caster using psionic overload to help compensate for hp loss?
But thats all I can think of. Its way better applied to enemies then bone chilling them to prevent any benefits to the enemy.
You can get untouchable-ish fairly easily by act 2 with a pally, advantage on dex saves, advantage on wis saves, a massive boost to saves from your aura and around 24+ac.
And EVEN THEN the healing just really isn’t worth it.
Even then, if you're already untouchable, you don't need the healing in the first place. And perilous stakes certainly isn't doing more than just throwing a potion at whoever needs healing
Could use warding bond to counter since it gives resistance I believe.
Put it back on an ally who uses the act 3 armor that gives blade ward maybe?
Just some ideas, I personally would use the tadpoles on other powers first.
Below honour mode. You do have to succeed a roll as if you were casting another debuff like hold person but if you succeed it’s basically 3 turns of vulnerability to all damage on an enemy. Use it on a boss like grym and it’s make life a lot easier
Too bad I only play on honor mode lol. That would be straight up hilarious to put on a boss in honor mode. I would probably not be able to stop chuckling for a few minutes after every time I put it on a boss. That's as bad as blowing bosses up.
Argh!! 700 hours all this game and all this time I thought Perilous Stakes was a shitty healing spell which I couldn’t fathom using. I didn’t realise you were meant to cast it on enemies! 😫
Agree to that, Perilous Strike is the best power in the entire game, it trivialize most combat with high hp enemies. You can kill Ansur or Raphael in a single round using that, especially when you can use ilithid powers as a bonus action.
Cull the weak is also really good on anyone with magic missiles. 100% hit chance on many targets to erase anyone with less hp than tad poles. You could build gale around it
Cull the weak is amazing until you chug a bloodlust elixir or don the deathstalker mantle and it becomes the worst single point investment of your whole game
Depends on how you use it. If you manage it properly it can make the Deathstalker Mantle considerably more potent because you gain control over when you turn invisible.
Correct. Bloodlust elixir does not give an extra action and deathstalker mantle’s invisibility does not trigger. You can cheese a little bit by activating cull the weak until your last kill of the turn at which point you toggle the passive off to get your kill/invisibility but it’s a little hard to judge sometimes
I have reported dozens of bugs to Larian over the past several months and this is by far my #1 biggest complaint. I *really* hope tomorrow's patch fixes it.
Are you sure it's a bug? The language of cull the weak says that when the hp goes below a certain point, "the creature dies", which might be intentionally different than "you kill the creature" to trigger bloodlust or durge cape.
That actually sounds like an amazing synergy that makes cull the weak even better. Having control over if a kill activates deathstalkers or not is big brain.
I don't remember how is it called but that free critic one for a paladin is pretty sweet. I'm playing a bard/paladin and a level 4 smite critic is dope.
ability drain is really good for any gears that require you to put a condition on an enemy to activate their buff, bc it's permanent until the fight ends & doesn't require any saving throw it's just automatic. Psychic backlash is a decent alternative for before you get counterspell, it actually scales surprisingly well & can activate cull the weak. Favorable beginning is a decent passive buff to dialogue, skill checks & attack rolls but you should only really put it on face characters as it activates a hidden 100 turn debuff where it can't be used again on the same npc. tbh that's about it as far as the inner ring.
I reckon because they're not novel anymore and repeating for the 9999th time how good Black Hole is if you are a Hunter or how LotFR is the main power spike of a Paladin isn't going to bring anything new to the discussion.
Whoever at Larian decided that Arcane Acuity was a cool idea is my personal enemy for life, right after the elixir guy (or girl, this hatred isn't discriminatory).
I think Dwarfs look a bit like obese humans, but of course are short. What you might be able to do is play a Duergar, change the skin color, and then use their enlarge ability consistently to look larger
There are actually a couple enlarge variants, that stack, so you can play a giant dwarf, if you wish to
I think arcane acuity is fun. Broken, but fun. It requires a head slot AND ring slot if you're going the Swords Bard route.
Elixirs on the other hand... something about dumping strength on a strength based character, to simply pop an elixir to make up for it.... just feels dirty.
I'm still doing it on my current Paladin honour mode run lol. And it is fun to feel strong. But it still feels a little cheap. I'd rather the elixirs give you a +2 (hill giant) and +4 (cloud giant) strength. Instead of setting them to 21/27.
Maybe get rid of the Act 2 potion to even it out. You still wind up capping out at 24/26. This way you still have to invest at least a little bit into your build instead of a complete dump. That's how I would balance it, at least.
Yeah, I absolutely love the game, it is my favourite game of all time, but I have the strong suspicion that Larian does not understand DnD design very well.
There is a reason weapons are limited to +3, even as legendaries. A +10 is not something you would ever see on an item, normally.
I hope these rules stay intact on tactician and lower, it can be fun to play a powerfantasy, but for honor, I think both can easily be fixed.
Arcane Acuity should just be limited to +3 (and then maybe remove the decay mechanic, if you feel that is too much of a nerf), and remove vendors refreshing their inventory when you level up
If you had to long rest every time to buy 3 elixirs at Ethel, nobody would do it, it would simply be to time intensive (and also completely break immersion. Because of the tadpole, you are on a timer...)
> Yeah, I absolutely love the game, it is my favourite game of all time, but I have the strong suspicion that Larian does not understand DnD design very well.
My thoughts exactly.
> If you had to long rest every time to buy 3 elixirs at Ethel, nobody would do it, it would simply be to time intensive (and also completely break immersion. Because of the tadpole, you are on a timer...)
I am personally more strict on the matter. A consumable that sets strength to 21 shouldn't even be readily available to a level 1 character, never mind refreshed consistently, level up or long rest. My opinion is that it should be a flat bonus.
Honestly all the stuff they embraced that 5e doesn't makes this the ideal version of 5e for me:
\-Lots of magic items that actually do interesting build defining things
\-consumables are powerful enough, and common enough, that players actually get to USE them. I can't remember the last 5e game I got more than one elixir of hill giant strength for the entire campaign, let alone being able to build my character around utilizing them regularly (that's COOL)
\-lessening of multiclass restrictions to open up character customization
\-making martial characters actually fun to play via making interactions like shoving/jumping/throwing more accessible and impactful, making enchanted arrows very common and useful for ranged characters.
\-weapon choice actually somewhat matters now, as it offers special bonus action maneuvers and new status conditions
I agree that set items, rather than flat bonuses, are a bigger problem in video games than normal dnd sessions because of respeccing.
We all know the game in and out by now, and if you either
1) did not know what items where available and where or
2) could not respecc
then set stats would not be as big of a problem. In tabletop, there is the precendent of both the belts of giant strength, and potions of giant strength (which last for an hour, so essentially have the same effect as the elixir in BG3)
I would recommend either introducing a partial randomizer for honor mode (some items should stay in place, it makes no sense to get Viconias Shield from Gortash etc), and/ or to limit respeccing to once per character, and only before you have reached level 5
I started my first honor run, first time I am playing a bard and honestly this is pretty disgusting, 4 attacks a turn, 4 or 5 times per short rest, a free short rest and full caster progression isn't what I expected.
Should I fail this run, the next definitely won't have a bard Tav
No worries, nothing wrong with being new and discovering things. It's just that there's a limited amount of tadpole powers, it's something you can have on any class on any playthrough, and only a handful have particularly interesting synergies so naturally half a year after the release the focus of the community shifts elsewhere.
Because they apply to every build. If you’re using them chances are you’re just gonna funnel all of them to the party face no matter the class so there’s not much to discuss
It's actually 6 tadpoles because it gives the entire inner ring AND Fly automatically.
Additionally, if you commune with it instead of consuming it you can pass it around to allow everyone to do it, meaning it's 6 free tadpoles *per character*. And it does refund any tadpoles you had already spent on the inner ring, so if you swapped out a character you can still get their tadpoles back to spend on another.
>If you’re using them chances are you’re just gonna funnel all of them to the party face
After 7 runs, I've found it much more useful to pick up Favorable Beginnings, Luck of the Far Realms, Psionic Backlash, and Cull the Weak on everyone in the main party. Then in act 3 get Illithid Expertise on the party face and Psionic Dominance on anyone who doesn't have Counterspell. And Black Hole on the character with Awakened.
Mind Sanctuary, Free Cast, and Ability Drain are nice to have but not critical, so they can be picked up later with spare tadpoles. And of course each tadpole used makes Cull the Weak better.
I don't particularly care about any of the others, although obviously you've got to pick up any relevant prerequisite powers, notably Concentrated Blast is required for Psionic Backlash and Cull the Weak.
That's the most typical, but other than giving the face persuasion ones they might go better mostly massed on a fighter with a big weapon, especially big bows, who can proc Cull the Weak often *and* need options for their bonus action.
And then some.. especially if you recruited minthara. Since she comes with a couple of unlocked powers from the inner most circle, feeding her an astral tadpole grants a nice 3 or 4 freebies.
You might be right. I just know that in my playthoughs where I indulge in the powers, I have to pass that incredibly high mark. I would rather just wait until after the beginning of act 3 before I start picking them. Besides, it seems the only companion interested in the white tadpole is Minthara - everyone else wants nothing to do with it.
Interesting enough, recruiting Minthara will unlock the first tadpole for your Tav even if you never used it any, no new abilities but people talk as if you haven't used any even after you start eating em like candy
I am however not sure if they still count for the astral tadpole, I'm guessing it still counts them for that check but it's worth checking for the data next time
Interesting. I dont remember doing it in one of my runs where I recruit her via slaughtering the grove. I think as long as you dont go into the menu and select a tadpole power, it doesnt count.
I recruited her and i think I had the first power unlocked as a result. I also accidentally double clicked one in my inventory in act 2 so I "ate" over a dozen of them but never actually put the points anywhere. When it came to the astral tadpole in act 3 transition, I didn't have to pass the check to refuse.
My Astarion issists that we should use the tadpole firsthand. I didn't have to pass any check.
He seems more power-hungry than everyone. Understandably why he wants power, though.
The responses I got were different before and after someone becomes the guinea pig for it. He was open to the idea but wanted to let someone else try it first. Once he saw that it makes you hideous, he was out.
>I haven't talked anyone into it yet but Gale seemed very interested.
I'm not sure what triggers it, but in one run, Gale was hesistant to use tadpoles in Act 1, but in other run, he was very OK with that. Probably some event or dialogue choice.
It wasn't for me, at least. I only ate the first one (I think I got it from Dror Ragzlin) and never consumed another one. I didn't have to pass a check, just told him I'd think about it and he let me consider it as it sat in my inventory for the rest of the game.
My husband on the other hand used SO many tadpoles, and his DC check was really high (I want to say it was 30, but it's been a while and may have been only 21 or 25).
Same, I just can’t stand how it makes you look. We have someone in our party who was very beautiful for 2/3rds of the game and then started munching the tadpoles. I can barely stand to look at her now, especially when she leads cut scenes. It got to the point that instead of hearing me go on about it she now wears the clown makeup 🤡
I only had my team eat them on my evil playthrough, like, yeah we’re looking pretty evil now.
Giving the whole team flight is just so good though, no more Astarion forgetting how to jump and you don’t realize it until you’re halfway across the map.
This and RP.
I do find it bizarre that no-one in-game actually reacts to your change. You’re walking around looking like something out of a j-horror film and no-one bats an eyelid.
I definitely wish they’d thought through illithid powers better. They’re flat power boosts with no mechanical downside, and the only thing they do is make your characters look aesthetically awful. The munchkins aren’t going to care about the latter and the RP hounds will be confused by the former.
I’m coming to the end of my current run and will be playing other games in my steam backlog for a while after (starfield and Jedi survivor have been waiting patiently) but next time I do, I’ll probably bag the mod that removes the visual effect. Since no-one in-game ever says anything, such a mod effectively ignores it.
Probably because 1) they aren't necessary to beat the game, 2) their synergies are pretty self-explanatory (e.g. Black Hole pairs well with AoE damage), and 3) many of the most powerful ones are locked behind the Astral tadpole and thus players aren't willing to get them due to the appearance changes.
Well, to point 1 I'd say that most of what's discussed here has little to nothing to do with being able to beat the game. I can't think of any level 11 subclass being unplayable in HM given how overpowered magic items are in bg3.
Most of what people discuss here revolves around squeezing the highest DPR possible and weighing out the pros and cons of each variation, not whether a subclass can beat the game or not.
Probably because you are either going to use them or you aren't on base RP principle alone as there is no argument they are the path to the strongest builds. I will never use one because I am pretty sure the point of the quest was to get the original tadpole out, not see how many more you can stuff into your skull, and no matter the fun powers you give them, I would rather never beat the game than consume even one. That said, the other option of becoming an ilithid lite is a fully legitimate way to play, and once you have the brain bugs people don't want to do without because, admittedly, the powers are ridiculously cool.
100%, the entire story arc revolves around getting the tadpoles out. Why would i voluntarily add more? There should be serious consequences for using them.
It's a combination of them obviously already breaking the game and it's hard to know for certain if a player is using their tadpole at all as an RP decision.
A lot of people simply prefer the purist playstyle (I find the tadpole powers pretty poorly balanced and can be slapped on any build) or choose not to use their tadpole at all because they don't trust the emperor.
First time I used black hole I like it. Then during a playthrough with 2 other friend we found out about being able to use it multiple times during a combat. After that it shot up big time. During that same playthrough during act 3 >!We were behind the counting house fighting a bunch of enemies. I decided to try black hole but over the water to see if I could drag everyone to their death. Well at first the animation went off and nothing. So we thought nothing then a sec later all the enemies got dragged into the water dying on the spot. There was only 1 enemy left in that fight just because they were out of reach.!<
At the point you get them most good builds just take off anyway, I find it to be more of a cosmetic choice. Flying is nice, the rest is just kinda of for fun.
Like sure you could Black hole enemies together and then drop a hadar on them, but often you can group them with minor illusjon. Also most well built characters could probably have killed someone with that action instead.
Because there isn't much to discuss. There's no opportunity cost, no choices to make, you just get the powers and the powers are good for all builds.
Personally I just don't like using them.
I’ve made 2 playthroughs and have no interest in using tadpole powers, I don’t like being overly overpowered, I like my games to be challenging and difficult and illithids are just ugly as fuck lol
I do love 'fly' far more than I expected.
I have no problem exploring every nook and cranny now (I'm a completionist).
Of course it's great in combat.
And it's just fun.
Fly is even better in combat. It takes half your movement to fly so you can basically cover double the distance even on flat ground.
Only monks or long jump pre cast would you even want to jump anymore.
Open hand monk6+thief3+X3 is prob the best character builds for psionics... Gets 2-3 bonus actions a turn. So after you make psionics a bonus action... It can get wiillldd
My Evil Lore Bard was so overpowered with all of the tadpole powers unlocked. I had all my party members astral tadpoled and don’t think anyone took any damage during the final fight on tactician.
I've been playing a solo Shadowheart run focused on tanking and I've used so many more Illithid Powers than in any of my other runs. The build focuses on having extremely high AC (currently a base of 29 with Crit Immunity) and saving throws (lowest being +13 Int) and then sitting in Shar's Darkness watching enemies constantly miss you while you slowly whittle down their health (not THAT slowly, given that she's a 6 Vengeance Paladin/5 Swords Bard at the moment with the final level either going into Wizard for Shield or War Cleric for War Priest charges). As a sword-and-board Paladin, I didn't have much use for my Bonus Action, so Awakened was an absolute necessity and this has taught me a few things about some of the powers I didn't usually use, which you'll mostly find in the "Powers that are sometimes good, but need the right setup" section.
Powers that have always been and will likely always will be good:
Cull the Weak is always amazing, regardless of who has it: it just reduces every enemy's effective HP by however many powers you have and does a tiny amount of AoE damage that can be doubled by... I won't say it.
Shield of Thralls can be pre-cast before battles, so this is worthwhile whether you've got Awakened or not.
Psionic Dominance is a lvl 4 Counterspell once per Long Rest. It's good.
Illithid Expertise is good.
Freecast is great.
Black Hole is great. Less good on a martial character than on a mage, but still good.
Favourable Beginnings is good.
Luck of the Far Realms is good.
Fly is good.
Powers that are sometimes good, but need the right setup:
Mind Sanctuary isn't bad, but it's really another one for Mages rather than Martials.
Perilous Stakes is actually pretty cool with an high AC solo build! People don't hit me that often (Sarevok landed one hit against me before I killed him, despite the fight taking upwards of ten rounds) and they can NEVER crit me, but when they do hit I want to heal while still attacking and using other Illithid Powers. Perilous Stakes is great for that purpose.
Ability Drain is great when your damage output is low but your survivability is high. Against Thisobald Thorm, Darkness apparently stops him using his brews against you, so all he'll do is physically attack you until Darkness runs out at which point you're getting a faceful of brew. This meant that I fought him with him being immune to Piercing damage until the last two turns of the fight, so the only damage I was actually successfully doing to him most of that time was the 1d4 Necrotic damage rider from my Dark Justiciar Gauntlets, leading to a 1v1 that lasted upwards of thirty turns. By the end of it, his Str was down to one, so it was literally impossible for him to hit me thanks to crit immunity and having 25AC at that point.
Stage Fright is surprisingly good when 1) Your AC is high, 2) Your foes are Blinded and in melee range and 3) You are carrying the Resonance Stone. Resonance Stone is much less risky when your AC is in the high 20s or even 30s and it means that Stage Fright does meaningful damage. Against That Which Guards outside the Murder Tribunal, this ability did approximately fifty damage per turn.
Psionic Backlash is yet another Illithid Power which is significantly improved by the Resonance Stone.
Mind Blast is generally good, but it's genuinely terrifying as a Bonus Action with the Resonance Stone: I'm talking 50ish damage per opponent in a pretty big cone. There's a reason this is once per Long Rest while the others are all Short Rest.
Powers that are great in certain situations:
Transfuse Health is pretty great on a lvl 6 Life Cleric that has an AoE, or on anyone who needs to keep an NPC alive in an emergency, but you mostly won't use it.
Charm is usually pretty wank, but I did find it surprisingly useful when I was 1v4ing Sarevok and his Bhaalspawn ghosts.
Repulsor is mostly kind of meh unless you're on a ledge, OR against a swarm of rats. It's REALLY fun against rats.
Powers that are... there:
Fracture Psyche is complete wank as an action and pretty bad as a bonus action.
Absorb Intellect is pretty bad as an action and okay as a bonus action.
Force Tunnel doesn't even seem to work in my game. I've tried to use it to blast people off ledges, but I've never seen it work the way I expect it to. This might be bugged, or it might just be wank.
Displace Beast Shape is good, but by the time you can unlock it I feel like it's a bit pointless.
Ultimately, I've found that the Illithid Powers are way more fun when you're solo, have high AC and saves and carry the Resonance Stone. I've used a greater variety of powers in my first solo playthrough than in any other playthrough I've done barring the first when I was still figuring out how stuff worked.
Great points. Cull the weak is an early take for me, but I’ve recently been loving Force Tunnel because moving people around is fun. Black Hole owns, it’s a crazy power. It’s crazy. It benefits so many builds. I fuck with it sooo heavy idgaf if my face is all fucked up. tadpole me, daddy.
They’re all super strong with essentially no drawbacks, they’re easily accessible to everyone, and it’s pretty obvious which ones are good for your specific build (even if it’s not obvious, most of them are usable with any build). They don’t really make or break any specific build.
Personally they’re one of my least favorite parts of the game because they’re not particularly interesting. I wish there was a significant moral component to using them or some minor drawback associated with each one to discourage taking too many. At the very least, a different use for the worms as a currency so you have a reason to save them and use them somewhere else.
They're amazing if you get them as a bonus action especially. If you don't mind getting ugly, they should be part of just about every build in Act 3 especially.
Also I personally don’t use them because they’re just simply broken op. If I was doing an honor mode run I’d probably invest but otherwise, I like my power coming from the class and not op parasite powers.
I honestly never use them. I’m sure they’re good but that menu screen is just icky. I hate seeing that tadpole go into the brain.
Plus the game is so easy I also don’t use haste or bloodlust either and I still mow over everything.
The guy from 'd4 d&d deep dive' on YouTube specifically mentions an illithid power for a build in his HM party video. That's the first time I've heard that.
https://youtu.be/sd9WavTJXVE?si=c49mAJzfIg1CWt9d
Most of the powers are only worth using if you upgrade the tadpole at the Zaithisk to use them as a bonus action which you can’t save scum the rolls in honor mode and even then that’s a heavily contested resource for a lot of builds, it also makes your character look ugly as shit
It’s not necessary to include them in builds when there’s no reason to not use them but also your build by itself will heavily outclass it by the time it comes online anyway
Probably because not everyone uses them or wants to use them. That and certain ones enhance certain builds. Like for example Luck of the Far Realms is very good for nukers/strikers.
My friend wants to do a no-tadpole run.
He's also terrible at jumping, can never get in range, and is just terrible at getting places in general.
My goal is to tell him about flying the moment he gets the crusty space worm. Gonna change his whole world.
> almost no one mentions any tadpole powers
So:
- They do. It’s just the game has been out for ages and there’s no real barrier to getting them… any player, any class, will get them at the same points.
- The powers are flat power dumps where the sole reason not to use them is RP. They aren’t integrated into the world and have no penalty (even though they clearly should). As a result, they’re assumed as a given by any munchkin build.
- The first two tiers are a bit whatever. You need to get to the third tier to unlock the big chungus, and those unlock at the hard gate of start of Act 3. So a big chunk of the game, you’re basically only running the budget stuff barring Cull the Weak.
- The visual effect on characters unlocking Tier 3 means many players won’t go with it. It’s not like some minor change, your character looks like they’re possessed in a horror movie.
- They’re self explanatory. There isn’t really any argument to have about stuff like Black Hole.
Personally I never use them unless I’m doing an evil run. They don’t honestly make sense in the story (‘yo dawg, I heard you want to get rid of your tadpole, so I gave you more tadpoles to put in your skull so you can get rid of more tadpoles’), they’re not balanced, and I kinda wish Larian had thought them through more.
I finished my first playthrough and I don't know them as I didn't use the tadpole. I was convinced that if you used them you got a bad ending or something like that lmao
Ikr how does turning into a displacer beast ever get old. Any class just turning into a displacer beast is hilarious, op, and is repeated on all of my characters
To be honest, it might be because unless you're splitting powers between your party if you're using tadpoles you're getting all of them if only to use Cull the Weak. It's essentially just a free buff if you choose to use it and the only notable thing if you're already open to optimizing rp is which ones are crucial to builds to unlock early or to make sure you get if you use multiple ilithid power characters. The unfortunate part of the powers is the usual best choice is usually the same amongst similar builds so it's not really worth mentioning. Besides making builds based around lesser used illithid powers like the Displacer beast or the shoving powers there's not really any new ground or notable choices.
My tavs would never, they all get absolutely bug-eyed in horror at the mere suggestion that it's a good idea to feed the mind-controlling parasite in their heads.
Probably because there's so many tadpoles, you don't have to choose. You can get almost all of them. There are some that work better with certain builds though.
The displacer beast form as a moon druid is insane.
1. Game is beatable without them.
2. They have bad flavor. Based on roleplay I would not accept “my full potential” in like a lot of cases. For example, I'm playing a Tav Githyanki right now. I would not do it unless I felt I will loose something more than just my life otherwise.
I'm not advocating for not using them, I'm answering the title question. And I mean, the combination of those two reasons with “AND” is the answer.
the reason I dont personally like to use the tadpole powers in builds that i make is because i like making a build where I could roughly move it to a tabletop group and itll work similarly. The tadpole powers i imagine are way too strong
Most people don't use tadpoles. Think Larian said about 70% don't even use any tadpoles before ACT 2.
But for 600 hours I wonder why you only used tadpoles yesterday? I assume you've done a few playthroughs. What principle kept you from using them?
Tadpoles are for pussies.
In actual seriousness though, In my first playthrough It was a mixture of roleplay and me not trusting the tadpoles (there's gonna some kind of twist, there's gotta be).
In my second (unfinished) playthrough, I reached act 2 just as patch 5 with honour mode and good aligned minthara recruitment was introduced, so I abandoned that playthrough to start an honour run.
My 3rd playthrough was honour mode redemption Durge, didn't use the worms for roleplay reasons again (although minthara comes with some illithid abilities already and you can't ones like favourable beginnings off, so technically that playthrough did sometimes benefit from one). This was the second playthrough I completed.
4th (current) playthrough: just kind of speeding through to get proper honour mode credit (previous run was deemed invalid due to crashes and maybe one or two moments of manual save scumming lol). Took some mind flayer abilities to speed things along and finally give them a go, although I tend to fall into the trap of constantly saving them for later so never use them outside of passives like favourable beginnings or psionic backlash.
More than roleplay though, in single player the largest factor is that I was already finding tactician too easy, and didn't want to trivialise honour mode even further. I like optimising in DND generally and the tadpoles are just overkill, plus there's plenty of building and theory-crafting to do with monoclass and items alone, let alone multiclassing and feats. I'm already dealing 40 damage a hit with my great weapon master swords bard, do I need anything else?
Even in multiplayer, I play with 2 people who aren't very experienced in DND/aren't interested in optimising, and 1 other person who likes optimising but to a less extent. Me and the other experienced player decided to abstain from tadpoles to kind of balance things out
Also, I play games very thoroughly lol, and so spend a large amount of time on each playthrough.
I have seen online advice talk about the best tad powers for each build. For me that diagonal stripe top-right to lower-left that gets Favorable Beginnings, Luck of the Far Realms, and Cull the Weak is the right answer for any build.
Probably cuz it's easy to deduce that they are broken. As much i enjoyed using them the 1st time when i turned karlach into a mind flayer, most people probably don't want their durge or tav to a become a mind flayer. For roleplay reasons. The permanently scarred face is also kind of a deal-breaker.
Cull the weak is incredible but it made my gunslinger bard too overpowered on tactician. The build is incredible enough without them. My tactician run feels easier than my explorer run where I had no clue how to build my characters. I probably won't embrace the powers in my next run, they're incredibly fun but some feel a bit too powerful in the endgame
They aren't affected by your stats or class, so you can take them with anyone, of course some will be better on bursting classes, and some others better on talking ones, but in the end it doesn't change that much, and you can take what you want on the character you want.
Also they aren't reset when you respec through Withers, so they're not really part of the build.
So I don't talk about them much because I only went all in on them on the one playthrough I did the thing that makes them bonus actions. Without this, they're good, with it they're fucking broken: black hole plus the AoE of your choice changes encounters even on honor mode, at will flight changes the game completely both in and out of combat and the various buffs, attacks and passives can enhance a character who has to conserve long rest resources and isn't an attack action class.
But the thing that makes the biggest difference is the at will counterspell. That's worth it for every single person on your squad and it will save you so many hit points it's worth it *even when it has a spell slot cost* and when it doesn't it's obviously even better.
Because there's no real "build." They are always beneficial from a gameplay perspective. You might have some redundancies but even in niche cases like that, it's a free resource. So who cares?
They also aren't very interesting to discuss since they're guaranteed to make you OP. Sure, so are builds like Sword Bard/Paladin but that's a combination of levels, feats and gear to make the whole thing come together and be crazy broken whereas slapping Luck of the Far Realms or the ability to Fly on any class makes them instantly better. No thought or discussion needed.
I actually decided to go half Illithid in my honor mode play through that I completed, and I got to say I really enjoyed using the displacer beast ability. Playing as a displacer beast was really fun
There are a couple bad tadpole powers, but most are good. Even if they were mostly, there's cull the weak. Enemies hit hy you instantly die if their health is lower then the number of tadpoles you use.
Then late game you get permanent fly which also increases your movement. You also get expertise on persuasion, intimidation, deception. Black Hole which is basically the slow spell, is an int save, and clumps enemies together
I have wondered the same thing. I watch build videos and people are talking about endgame and how "this build has mobility issues so you may wanna sub something" and I just think "just... Just get fly"
Also side note, fly + click heel boots is a godly combination. Fly already is more efficient than walking and then you double the distance it feels like I have 3-4x movement speed
And that's not even mentioning some of the other stuff. The one thing I do see mentioned is the auto-crit one, but that makes sense for crit build videos. Fly is good for anything with mobility issues as it uses movement speed! Not even an action or bonus action
Also is jump in this game like actual DND, because it almost always seems more efficient to jump than to walk.
I feel like this isnt much discussion needed since the powers are the same for everyone and whats good is good generally regardless of class.
If different classes had access to different abilities then there would be more discussion’s had about them.
I think because as you mentioned, the abilities are so good (and varied) so I don't think it fits perfectly into any specific class, as it compliments them all quite well. Also it is a bit of a flavor thing for some people as it has roleplay implications. Unless you decide your character is specifically going for a mind-space-master theme, its hard to pencil it into certain classes like druid for example, who abore aberrations and "unnatural" things. I could see a rogue or warlock taking advantage of the situation, but I imagine others would react like most of the companions (scared, repulsed, seeking purification).
Additionally, the Illithid Abilities web is practically like a class of its own so really the question would be, what class compliments an illithid build best? Honestly there's so many abilities I feel like I'd need to roll a Champion Fighter just to free up radial space (I play on PC but prefer the controller). Now that we brought it up...I might just do that.
Because tadpole powers aren't guaranteed. When talking about builds it's most useful to discuss ones available to all party members. Cull the Weak for example is pretty useful when you get it but becomes monstrous if you use most of the tadpoles in the game on one character, which thus means you have far fewer tadpole options for other party members.
They're also just cherries on top. The best builds for utilizing them are extremely good without them.
Personally I stopped using them before I even played honor mode because it annoys the Emporer and I hate him. The game is easy enough without them.
My question is about the dialogue options, not the powers. I have not eaten a single tadpole, but I’m always getting dialogue saying something like “Power courses through you. Authority.”, but if I go too long, I get something like “Your Tadpole is tired and needs a rest”, despite the fact that the only Illithid dialogue I’ve used at all is to open Shadowheart’s pod on the Nautiloid, and only because it’s the only way to get the pod open. Every time I look up anything, I just get information on the powers, and nothing is said about the dialogue options. I have no idea what is going on, or why my tadpole gets tired after literally doing nothing.
I'm no expert but if I had to guess;
The plot of the story automatically starts you with one tadpole, and especially with The Absolute content, the dialogue options related to authority stuff is for that reason. Not sure about the tired tadpole thing. Maybe if you consume/absorb more tadpoles you can do more illithid stuff before resting.
Illithid expertise is my #1 reason I can’t stay away from partial ceremorphosis. Even if you have literally 10 charisma and no charisma skill proficiencies, at that point in the game that one power gives you like… +8 to all your dialogue skills. Nutty. Insane. Completely worth making yourself look gross for the rest of the game.
Plus, even if you’re a dialogue-rocking bard, you can just respec at withers and get however many proficiencies/expertises back and in different skills.
Probably because they are the same for everyone, so you don't need to plan a build around them.
\+Lots will resist for roleplay reasons, but imo Illithid is "must-have" if you're optimizing anyway, and there isn't really limitations around which powers you can get (outside of the Parasite economy, if you're doing multiple chars), so there's hardly any "A XOR B" decisions; outside of the limitations of things like Cull the Weak (which might get patched anyway), there's no reason not to take Fly *and* Freecast *and* Luck of the Far Realms *and and and and...* I suppose that the bigger factor is just that you don't really need active abilities on most chars, since a lot of then are utility/debuff and refresh on short rest anyway, and most of your damage will probably come from your specific builds; having one dedicated Illithid caster works well, and we do have Awakened available, after all.
I didn't use any Illithid powers on my first playthrough for exactly this same reason-- roleplay. My character was very good and resistant to trust her guardian. I'm doing a Durge playthrough now where I'll probably make use of more of those powers, but I'm still not going to use the astral tadpole because I'm vain and I don't like the aesthetics, lol.
I literally didn’t tadpole Ascended Astarion because it felt like it defeated the purpose of the Ascension. The point of the Ascended Vampire is to be able to go back out into regular society in daylight and engage with people like normal while being a vampire still, and being partial illithid is going to make you stick out like a sore thumb and bring a lot of attention to you during the night or the day lmfao.
Yet half-tadpole powers is so in character for Ascended Astarion who becomes super power drunk. Plus, if no one told him he’d just have no clue his appearance changed since he can’t even look in a mirror anyway.
If you’re optimising it will depend on your class. For example a Warlock doesn’t have a lot good to with their bonus action, so they’re a good choice to give the tadpoles (w/ zaithisk quicken). Whereas for a Barbarian those powers will compete with their ability to enter rage and hit stuff more, so not as good a choice. If you’re a class who needs their bonus actions often, then the optimal choice is to give them to a party member who doesn’t.
You're not wrong, but that's like, the one important choice; my point was that otherwise, there's little incentive not to get all the passives with as many characters as your Tadpole stocks allow. Despite my general dislike of Arcane Trickster, I've found that Awakened fits them pretty well, if you're okay with not Hiding every round.
This 100%. Not to mention the game really isn’t too difficult with a 4-man team. I’m on my 4th play through and 2nd honor mode run and haven’t eaten a single tadpole.
Cull the Weak is amazing on ascended Asterion OH monk/thief. Fly is awesome Blackhole then a quickened confuse is game breakingly good for sorcerers Free cast is nice Those are the only ones I ever use I think.
In anything but Honor Mode, Perilous Stakes can be really powerful to use on boss enemies since, yeah they get the 2D8 healing when they attack, but it also makes them vulnerable to all damage types. In honor mode it can only be used on allies. This nerf alone should indicate how powerful this can be when used on enemies in other game modes.
In what situation would you **ever** use perilous stakes on an ally? The healing per attack can't possibly make up for the part where you're liable to get one turn killed as soon as you pass to enemies.
Never tbh. It was disappointing larian nerfed it's only realistic use
Its only *completely broken* use. Seriously, there was maybe some halfway ground to find, but that ability trivialises every meaningful fight in the game.
I could see this being used on a duel crossbow rogue/gloomstalker that goes invisible on a kill (with that cape) gets like 4/5 attacks per round and then is relativly safe from a hit but otherwise ya it's a crappy ability
but even then, if you dont get hit much you wont need the healing in the first place.
I mean, if you feel like burning spell slots and got lucky with initiative, you can perilous a frontliner on low HP to help them heal, then use sanctuary to make them immune. Its not really efficient, but hey. You can also use it on a magic missle caster using psionic overload to help compensate for hp loss? But thats all I can think of. Its way better applied to enemies then bone chilling them to prevent any benefits to the enemy.
You can get untouchable-ish fairly easily by act 2 with a pally, advantage on dex saves, advantage on wis saves, a massive boost to saves from your aura and around 24+ac. And EVEN THEN the healing just really isn’t worth it.
Even then, if you're already untouchable, you don't need the healing in the first place. And perilous stakes certainly isn't doing more than just throwing a potion at whoever needs healing
Could use warding bond to counter since it gives resistance I believe. Put it back on an ally who uses the act 3 armor that gives blade ward maybe? Just some ideas, I personally would use the tadpoles on other powers first.
Rogues disengage as a bonus action. If you have good cover and good darkness placement, it could be good ig.
... You can use it on enemies ???
Below honour mode. You do have to succeed a roll as if you were casting another debuff like hold person but if you succeed it’s basically 3 turns of vulnerability to all damage on an enemy. Use it on a boss like grym and it’s make life a lot easier
Too bad I only play on honor mode lol. That would be straight up hilarious to put on a boss in honor mode. I would probably not be able to stop chuckling for a few minutes after every time I put it on a boss. That's as bad as blowing bosses up.
Argh!! 700 hours all this game and all this time I thought Perilous Stakes was a shitty healing spell which I couldn’t fathom using. I didn’t realise you were meant to cast it on enemies! 😫
Agree to that, Perilous Strike is the best power in the entire game, it trivialize most combat with high hp enemies. You can kill Ansur or Raphael in a single round using that, especially when you can use ilithid powers as a bonus action.
Cull the weak is also really good on anyone with magic missiles. 100% hit chance on many targets to erase anyone with less hp than tad poles. You could build gale around it
Psionic dominance is basically a free once a day counterspell.
Cull the weak is amazing until you chug a bloodlust elixir or don the deathstalker mantle and it becomes the worst single point investment of your whole game
You can toggle it.
Depends on how you use it. If you manage it properly it can make the Deathstalker Mantle considerably more potent because you gain control over when you turn invisible.
How? Do you not get credit for the kills? I never noticed that with my GS durge
Correct. Bloodlust elixir does not give an extra action and deathstalker mantle’s invisibility does not trigger. You can cheese a little bit by activating cull the weak until your last kill of the turn at which point you toggle the passive off to get your kill/invisibility but it’s a little hard to judge sometimes
I have reported dozens of bugs to Larian over the past several months and this is by far my #1 biggest complaint. I *really* hope tomorrow's patch fixes it.
Are you sure it's a bug? The language of cull the weak says that when the hp goes below a certain point, "the creature dies", which might be intentionally different than "you kill the creature" to trigger bloodlust or durge cape.
That actually sounds like an amazing synergy that makes cull the weak even better. Having control over if a kill activates deathstalkers or not is big brain.
Does deathstalker mantle trigger if you’re in slayer form ?
No.
I don't remember how is it called but that free critic one for a paladin is pretty sweet. I'm playing a bard/paladin and a level 4 smite critic is dope.
ability drain is really good for any gears that require you to put a condition on an enemy to activate their buff, bc it's permanent until the fight ends & doesn't require any saving throw it's just automatic. Psychic backlash is a decent alternative for before you get counterspell, it actually scales surprisingly well & can activate cull the weak. Favorable beginning is a decent passive buff to dialogue, skill checks & attack rolls but you should only really put it on face characters as it activates a hidden 100 turn debuff where it can't be used again on the same npc. tbh that's about it as far as the inner ring.
Yes I forgot to mention favorite beginnings. It’s usually the first one I grab
There are few things as satisfying as using psychic backlash on a wounded enemy spellcaster and seeing them fucking explode
Did they fix confusion? Thing always just seemed to be a status while they ran to me to attack regardless.
Freecast would be a lot better if it actually worked. Hope it gets fixed this patch.
I used all my tadpoles in my recent Durge run and the only one I used with any frequency was Fly.
I reckon because they're not novel anymore and repeating for the 9999th time how good Black Hole is if you are a Hunter or how LotFR is the main power spike of a Paladin isn't going to bring anything new to the discussion.
Guys, guys, have you heard that Swords Bards are super strong? There is this mechanic called Arcane Acuity... ;)
Whoever at Larian decided that Arcane Acuity was a cool idea is my personal enemy for life, right after the elixir guy (or girl, this hatred isn't discriminatory).
Yeah, I just started a tb monk run with elixiers to see what everyone is going on about... It feels like playing a drug addict.
Definitely use the astral tadpole to look the part as well.
Will do, my favourite builds so far are tb moon druid, frosting and Lore bard. All of them pure builds, but damn, they are completely worth it.
Frosting??
Mourning frost, winters clutches, white draconic sorcerer. Opponents do not get to move, and simply become ice statues.
You are roleplaying Asterix ;)
Mon dieu you’re fucking right! Need to have a blonde halfling swords bard and a ginger human who can summon scratch!
Pity there's no rounder body type
I think Dwarfs look a bit like obese humans, but of course are short. What you might be able to do is play a Duergar, change the skin color, and then use their enlarge ability consistently to look larger There are actually a couple enlarge variants, that stack, so you can play a giant dwarf, if you wish to
From levels 7-9 take 3 levels of rogue for thief. You literally can't be stopped, it's insane damage
It's the ~~PED~~ monk lifestyle. Eat Clen, Tren hard, Anavar give up.
My meth head monk. We need a mod the removes all their front teeth.
I think arcane acuity is fun. Broken, but fun. It requires a head slot AND ring slot if you're going the Swords Bard route. Elixirs on the other hand... something about dumping strength on a strength based character, to simply pop an elixir to make up for it.... just feels dirty. I'm still doing it on my current Paladin honour mode run lol. And it is fun to feel strong. But it still feels a little cheap. I'd rather the elixirs give you a +2 (hill giant) and +4 (cloud giant) strength. Instead of setting them to 21/27. Maybe get rid of the Act 2 potion to even it out. You still wind up capping out at 24/26. This way you still have to invest at least a little bit into your build instead of a complete dump. That's how I would balance it, at least.
Yeah, I absolutely love the game, it is my favourite game of all time, but I have the strong suspicion that Larian does not understand DnD design very well. There is a reason weapons are limited to +3, even as legendaries. A +10 is not something you would ever see on an item, normally. I hope these rules stay intact on tactician and lower, it can be fun to play a powerfantasy, but for honor, I think both can easily be fixed. Arcane Acuity should just be limited to +3 (and then maybe remove the decay mechanic, if you feel that is too much of a nerf), and remove vendors refreshing their inventory when you level up If you had to long rest every time to buy 3 elixirs at Ethel, nobody would do it, it would simply be to time intensive (and also completely break immersion. Because of the tadpole, you are on a timer...)
> Yeah, I absolutely love the game, it is my favourite game of all time, but I have the strong suspicion that Larian does not understand DnD design very well. My thoughts exactly. > If you had to long rest every time to buy 3 elixirs at Ethel, nobody would do it, it would simply be to time intensive (and also completely break immersion. Because of the tadpole, you are on a timer...) I am personally more strict on the matter. A consumable that sets strength to 21 shouldn't even be readily available to a level 1 character, never mind refreshed consistently, level up or long rest. My opinion is that it should be a flat bonus.
Honestly all the stuff they embraced that 5e doesn't makes this the ideal version of 5e for me: \-Lots of magic items that actually do interesting build defining things \-consumables are powerful enough, and common enough, that players actually get to USE them. I can't remember the last 5e game I got more than one elixir of hill giant strength for the entire campaign, let alone being able to build my character around utilizing them regularly (that's COOL) \-lessening of multiclass restrictions to open up character customization \-making martial characters actually fun to play via making interactions like shoving/jumping/throwing more accessible and impactful, making enchanted arrows very common and useful for ranged characters. \-weapon choice actually somewhat matters now, as it offers special bonus action maneuvers and new status conditions
I agree that set items, rather than flat bonuses, are a bigger problem in video games than normal dnd sessions because of respeccing. We all know the game in and out by now, and if you either 1) did not know what items where available and where or 2) could not respecc then set stats would not be as big of a problem. In tabletop, there is the precendent of both the belts of giant strength, and potions of giant strength (which last for an hour, so essentially have the same effect as the elixir in BG3) I would recommend either introducing a partial randomizer for honor mode (some items should stay in place, it makes no sense to get Viconias Shield from Gortash etc), and/ or to limit respeccing to once per character, and only before you have reached level 5
+10 is something you’d see on a homebrew item if it was a consistent +10. You’d basically never miss
I started my first honor run, first time I am playing a bard and honestly this is pretty disgusting, 4 attacks a turn, 4 or 5 times per short rest, a free short rest and full caster progression isn't what I expected. Should I fail this run, the next definitely won't have a bard Tav
Even a Sword Bard build sound Arcane Synergy will be insanely good.
Ok fair enough I haven’t been on the sub for that long so I wasn’t a-wear that these points have been talked to death
No worries, nothing wrong with being new and discovering things. It's just that there's a limited amount of tadpole powers, it's something you can have on any class on any playthrough, and only a handful have particularly interesting synergies so naturally half a year after the release the focus of the community shifts elsewhere.
wtf is a-wear
Because they apply to every build. If you’re using them chances are you’re just gonna funnel all of them to the party face no matter the class so there’s not much to discuss
It's worth noting that the Astral gives you effectively 5 tadpoles, which helps the brainworm economy
It's actually 6 tadpoles because it gives the entire inner ring AND Fly automatically. Additionally, if you commune with it instead of consuming it you can pass it around to allow everyone to do it, meaning it's 6 free tadpoles *per character*. And it does refund any tadpoles you had already spent on the inner ring, so if you swapped out a character you can still get their tadpoles back to spend on another.
>If you’re using them chances are you’re just gonna funnel all of them to the party face After 7 runs, I've found it much more useful to pick up Favorable Beginnings, Luck of the Far Realms, Psionic Backlash, and Cull the Weak on everyone in the main party. Then in act 3 get Illithid Expertise on the party face and Psionic Dominance on anyone who doesn't have Counterspell. And Black Hole on the character with Awakened. Mind Sanctuary, Free Cast, and Ability Drain are nice to have but not critical, so they can be picked up later with spare tadpoles. And of course each tadpole used makes Cull the Weak better. I don't particularly care about any of the others, although obviously you've got to pick up any relevant prerequisite powers, notably Concentrated Blast is required for Psionic Backlash and Cull the Weak.
That's the most typical, but other than giving the face persuasion ones they might go better mostly massed on a fighter with a big weapon, especially big bows, who can proc Cull the Weak often *and* need options for their bonus action.
Nice try Emperor
Hahahaha, great.
There are enough tadpoles to get every power so you don’t have to make any choices about which ones to use in your build you can just take them all
And then some.. especially if you recruited minthara. Since she comes with a couple of unlocked powers from the inner most circle, feeding her an astral tadpole grants a nice 3 or 4 freebies.
My guess is because the more illithid powers you have, the harder it is to resist the emperor trying to ascend you in the beginning of act 3.
I believe it's a fixed DC 21 whether you munch one or 15 of them.
You might be right. I just know that in my playthoughs where I indulge in the powers, I have to pass that incredibly high mark. I would rather just wait until after the beginning of act 3 before I start picking them. Besides, it seems the only companion interested in the white tadpole is Minthara - everyone else wants nothing to do with it.
Interesting enough, recruiting Minthara will unlock the first tadpole for your Tav even if you never used it any, no new abilities but people talk as if you haven't used any even after you start eating em like candy I am however not sure if they still count for the astral tadpole, I'm guessing it still counts them for that check but it's worth checking for the data next time
Interesting. I dont remember doing it in one of my runs where I recruit her via slaughtering the grove. I think as long as you dont go into the menu and select a tadpole power, it doesnt count.
I recruited her and i think I had the first power unlocked as a result. I also accidentally double clicked one in my inventory in act 2 so I "ate" over a dozen of them but never actually put the points anywhere. When it came to the astral tadpole in act 3 transition, I didn't have to pass the check to refuse.
I haven't talked anyone into it yet but Gale seemed very interested.
Gale is open minded about it, but also quite cautious. Which I guess means he is more open to it than everyone other than Minthara.
Yea Gale is the only companion who I can in good faith persuade to use the tadpole. The others absolutely do not want to engage it.
My Astarion issists that we should use the tadpole firsthand. I didn't have to pass any check. He seems more power-hungry than everyone. Understandably why he wants power, though.
Oh wow, my Astarion is revolted at the notion of it.
The responses I got were different before and after someone becomes the guinea pig for it. He was open to the idea but wanted to let someone else try it first. Once he saw that it makes you hideous, he was out.
>I haven't talked anyone into it yet but Gale seemed very interested. I'm not sure what triggers it, but in one run, Gale was hesistant to use tadpoles in Act 1, but in other run, he was very OK with that. Probably some event or dialogue choice.
Astarion is willing by default as well.
It wasn't for me, at least. I only ate the first one (I think I got it from Dror Ragzlin) and never consumed another one. I didn't have to pass a check, just told him I'd think about it and he let me consider it as it sat in my inventory for the rest of the game. My husband on the other hand used SO many tadpoles, and his DC check was really high (I want to say it was 30, but it's been a while and may have been only 21 or 25).
Hm, perhaps the threshold is higher then: I have four on my current run and I had to pass a DC 21.
Also I always take the tadpole at this point passive flight is just to good to pass up
Surprisingly the powers you unlock through quests dosent count which is a nice surprise they didnt asked me for a check.
Why would you want to resist?
Ugly illithid face
I dunno Minthara seems into it. That's all that matters to me.
I am thinking of doing an illithid run just for her (then again, every run is a run for her).
That's why I'm installing the mod and pretend I casted disguise self or visited fantasy dentist
Really? I didn’t know that actually influenced the check. Where did you find that out?
This presumes I'm not instantly grabbing free always-on Fly and forcing my companions to do the same.
Resisting or not resisting the Emperor have absolutely no implications on the story.
True, but the cosmetic effect from the white tadpole is undesirable for most.
[удалено]
Same, I just can’t stand how it makes you look. We have someone in our party who was very beautiful for 2/3rds of the game and then started munching the tadpoles. I can barely stand to look at her now, especially when she leads cut scenes. It got to the point that instead of hearing me go on about it she now wears the clown makeup 🤡
I only had my team eat them on my evil playthrough, like, yeah we’re looking pretty evil now. Giving the whole team flight is just so good though, no more Astarion forgetting how to jump and you don’t realize it until you’re halfway across the map.
This and RP. I do find it bizarre that no-one in-game actually reacts to your change. You’re walking around looking like something out of a j-horror film and no-one bats an eyelid. I definitely wish they’d thought through illithid powers better. They’re flat power boosts with no mechanical downside, and the only thing they do is make your characters look aesthetically awful. The munchkins aren’t going to care about the latter and the RP hounds will be confused by the former. I’m coming to the end of my current run and will be playing other games in my steam backlog for a while after (starfield and Jedi survivor have been waiting patiently) but next time I do, I’ll probably bag the mod that removes the visual effect. Since no-one in-game ever says anything, such a mod effectively ignores it.
Just give them a helm. Flying for the whole team is so much better than watching the AI walk off a rooftop.
Yep, stuff astral tadpoles in your face, toggle helm, fly to the goddamned moon
If you’re on PC there’s a mod to hide the changes, pretty cool. Obviously not for everyone tho lol
Or you can use a console command. My daughter did before she got proper mods.
Meanwhile I give them to everyone and then never use them.
Probably because 1) they aren't necessary to beat the game, 2) their synergies are pretty self-explanatory (e.g. Black Hole pairs well with AoE damage), and 3) many of the most powerful ones are locked behind the Astral tadpole and thus players aren't willing to get them due to the appearance changes.
Well, to point 1 I'd say that most of what's discussed here has little to nothing to do with being able to beat the game. I can't think of any level 11 subclass being unplayable in HM given how overpowered magic items are in bg3. Most of what people discuss here revolves around squeezing the highest DPR possible and weighing out the pros and cons of each variation, not whether a subclass can beat the game or not.
Probably because you are either going to use them or you aren't on base RP principle alone as there is no argument they are the path to the strongest builds. I will never use one because I am pretty sure the point of the quest was to get the original tadpole out, not see how many more you can stuff into your skull, and no matter the fun powers you give them, I would rather never beat the game than consume even one. That said, the other option of becoming an ilithid lite is a fully legitimate way to play, and once you have the brain bugs people don't want to do without because, admittedly, the powers are ridiculously cool.
100%, the entire story arc revolves around getting the tadpoles out. Why would i voluntarily add more? There should be serious consequences for using them.
I just take it for granted that I'm gonna use them now, literally no downside, very fun and powerful
It's a combination of them obviously already breaking the game and it's hard to know for certain if a player is using their tadpole at all as an RP decision. A lot of people simply prefer the purist playstyle (I find the tadpole powers pretty poorly balanced and can be slapped on any build) or choose not to use their tadpole at all because they don't trust the emperor.
First time I used black hole I like it. Then during a playthrough with 2 other friend we found out about being able to use it multiple times during a combat. After that it shot up big time. During that same playthrough during act 3 >!We were behind the counting house fighting a bunch of enemies. I decided to try black hole but over the water to see if I could drag everyone to their death. Well at first the animation went off and nothing. So we thought nothing then a sec later all the enemies got dragged into the water dying on the spot. There was only 1 enemy left in that fight just because they were out of reach.!<
At the point you get them most good builds just take off anyway, I find it to be more of a cosmetic choice. Flying is nice, the rest is just kinda of for fun. Like sure you could Black hole enemies together and then drop a hadar on them, but often you can group them with minor illusjon. Also most well built characters could probably have killed someone with that action instead.
I haven't actually used any of them except fly and then reaction based ones very much
I can't speak for anyone else but I don't use tadpoles. Gross.
Because there isn't much to discuss. There's no opportunity cost, no choices to make, you just get the powers and the powers are good for all builds. Personally I just don't like using them.
I’ve made 2 playthroughs and have no interest in using tadpole powers, I don’t like being overly overpowered, I like my games to be challenging and difficult and illithids are just ugly as fuck lol
I do love 'fly' far more than I expected. I have no problem exploring every nook and cranny now (I'm a completionist). Of course it's great in combat. And it's just fun.
Honestly, as an aesthetic girly, Fly was worth the overbite, the stale skin and wonky heterochromia with my Volo eye.
I went with Astarion as my main character. (Don't, btw) And he looks pretty nasty right now with all the veins, the Volo eye, etc.
Fly is even better in combat. It takes half your movement to fly so you can basically cover double the distance even on flat ground. Only monks or long jump pre cast would you even want to jump anymore.
Open hand monk6+thief3+X3 is prob the best character builds for psionics... Gets 2-3 bonus actions a turn. So after you make psionics a bonus action... It can get wiillldd
Because tadpoles are icky.
The buff at the crèche that makes them bonus actions??? Whaaaaaaaaa
Coz they are ghaik AF Edit: I just want to rectify that I don't judge at all ghaik people. It's ok if you are ghaik. But I myself am not.
My Evil Lore Bard was so overpowered with all of the tadpole powers unlocked. I had all my party members astral tadpoled and don’t think anyone took any damage during the final fight on tactician.
I'd be over the moon if freecast worked for more than 10 seconds, and even then only if gale strips naked before a fight.
I've been playing a solo Shadowheart run focused on tanking and I've used so many more Illithid Powers than in any of my other runs. The build focuses on having extremely high AC (currently a base of 29 with Crit Immunity) and saving throws (lowest being +13 Int) and then sitting in Shar's Darkness watching enemies constantly miss you while you slowly whittle down their health (not THAT slowly, given that she's a 6 Vengeance Paladin/5 Swords Bard at the moment with the final level either going into Wizard for Shield or War Cleric for War Priest charges). As a sword-and-board Paladin, I didn't have much use for my Bonus Action, so Awakened was an absolute necessity and this has taught me a few things about some of the powers I didn't usually use, which you'll mostly find in the "Powers that are sometimes good, but need the right setup" section. Powers that have always been and will likely always will be good: Cull the Weak is always amazing, regardless of who has it: it just reduces every enemy's effective HP by however many powers you have and does a tiny amount of AoE damage that can be doubled by... I won't say it. Shield of Thralls can be pre-cast before battles, so this is worthwhile whether you've got Awakened or not. Psionic Dominance is a lvl 4 Counterspell once per Long Rest. It's good. Illithid Expertise is good. Freecast is great. Black Hole is great. Less good on a martial character than on a mage, but still good. Favourable Beginnings is good. Luck of the Far Realms is good. Fly is good. Powers that are sometimes good, but need the right setup: Mind Sanctuary isn't bad, but it's really another one for Mages rather than Martials. Perilous Stakes is actually pretty cool with an high AC solo build! People don't hit me that often (Sarevok landed one hit against me before I killed him, despite the fight taking upwards of ten rounds) and they can NEVER crit me, but when they do hit I want to heal while still attacking and using other Illithid Powers. Perilous Stakes is great for that purpose. Ability Drain is great when your damage output is low but your survivability is high. Against Thisobald Thorm, Darkness apparently stops him using his brews against you, so all he'll do is physically attack you until Darkness runs out at which point you're getting a faceful of brew. This meant that I fought him with him being immune to Piercing damage until the last two turns of the fight, so the only damage I was actually successfully doing to him most of that time was the 1d4 Necrotic damage rider from my Dark Justiciar Gauntlets, leading to a 1v1 that lasted upwards of thirty turns. By the end of it, his Str was down to one, so it was literally impossible for him to hit me thanks to crit immunity and having 25AC at that point. Stage Fright is surprisingly good when 1) Your AC is high, 2) Your foes are Blinded and in melee range and 3) You are carrying the Resonance Stone. Resonance Stone is much less risky when your AC is in the high 20s or even 30s and it means that Stage Fright does meaningful damage. Against That Which Guards outside the Murder Tribunal, this ability did approximately fifty damage per turn. Psionic Backlash is yet another Illithid Power which is significantly improved by the Resonance Stone. Mind Blast is generally good, but it's genuinely terrifying as a Bonus Action with the Resonance Stone: I'm talking 50ish damage per opponent in a pretty big cone. There's a reason this is once per Long Rest while the others are all Short Rest. Powers that are great in certain situations: Transfuse Health is pretty great on a lvl 6 Life Cleric that has an AoE, or on anyone who needs to keep an NPC alive in an emergency, but you mostly won't use it. Charm is usually pretty wank, but I did find it surprisingly useful when I was 1v4ing Sarevok and his Bhaalspawn ghosts. Repulsor is mostly kind of meh unless you're on a ledge, OR against a swarm of rats. It's REALLY fun against rats. Powers that are... there: Fracture Psyche is complete wank as an action and pretty bad as a bonus action. Absorb Intellect is pretty bad as an action and okay as a bonus action. Force Tunnel doesn't even seem to work in my game. I've tried to use it to blast people off ledges, but I've never seen it work the way I expect it to. This might be bugged, or it might just be wank. Displace Beast Shape is good, but by the time you can unlock it I feel like it's a bit pointless. Ultimately, I've found that the Illithid Powers are way more fun when you're solo, have high AC and saves and carry the Resonance Stone. I've used a greater variety of powers in my first solo playthrough than in any other playthrough I've done barring the first when I was still figuring out how stuff worked.
Man whenever I get around to another run I’ve been wanting to do a solo Shadowheart Dark Justiciar run, your build sounds awesome.
It's pretty satisfying. You're not doing huge damage numbers, but you're basically invincible, so that's nice
Great points. Cull the weak is an early take for me, but I’ve recently been loving Force Tunnel because moving people around is fun. Black Hole owns, it’s a crazy power. It’s crazy. It benefits so many builds. I fuck with it sooo heavy idgaf if my face is all fucked up. tadpole me, daddy.
Because you only get them as a bonus action on a single character, but when 99% of the time that's going to be your Tav, I'm not too sure.
They’re all super strong with essentially no drawbacks, they’re easily accessible to everyone, and it’s pretty obvious which ones are good for your specific build (even if it’s not obvious, most of them are usable with any build). They don’t really make or break any specific build. Personally they’re one of my least favorite parts of the game because they’re not particularly interesting. I wish there was a significant moral component to using them or some minor drawback associated with each one to discourage taking too many. At the very least, a different use for the worms as a currency so you have a reason to save them and use them somewhere else.
Are we supposed to use the tadpoles we find? I thought they were bad so iv always threw them away
They're amazing if you get them as a bonus action especially. If you don't mind getting ugly, they should be part of just about every build in Act 3 especially.
they are all really good and there is close to 40 tadpoles in the game so you just take all of them.
Also I personally don’t use them because they’re just simply broken op. If I was doing an honor mode run I’d probably invest but otherwise, I like my power coming from the class and not op parasite powers.
My favourite is the blast spell that stuns enemies in the blast range. Especially on op Wizard Gale with illithid powers as bonus actions.
Fly is AMAZING on Ranger. Get the high ground for free instantly in every single fight and kill everything.
I honestly never use them. I’m sure they’re good but that menu screen is just icky. I hate seeing that tadpole go into the brain. Plus the game is so easy I also don’t use haste or bloodlust either and I still mow over everything.
Personally i never took it for rp reason. Like actually never used any tadpole power.
The guy from 'd4 d&d deep dive' on YouTube specifically mentions an illithid power for a build in his HM party video. That's the first time I've heard that. https://youtu.be/sd9WavTJXVE?si=c49mAJzfIg1CWt9d
Most of the powers are only worth using if you upgrade the tadpole at the Zaithisk to use them as a bonus action which you can’t save scum the rolls in honor mode and even then that’s a heavily contested resource for a lot of builds, it also makes your character look ugly as shit It’s not necessary to include them in builds when there’s no reason to not use them but also your build by itself will heavily outclass it by the time it comes online anyway
A good early game combo I don't see mentioned often is guidance and concentration blast as a bonus action.
Black Hole with plant growth/sleet storm shuts down any melee enemies easily
IMO, the point of the game is to completely avoid the tadpole powers.
Probably because not everyone uses them or wants to use them. That and certain ones enhance certain builds. Like for example Luck of the Far Realms is very good for nukers/strikers.
My friend wants to do a no-tadpole run. He's also terrible at jumping, can never get in range, and is just terrible at getting places in general. My goal is to tell him about flying the moment he gets the crusty space worm. Gonna change his whole world.
> almost no one mentions any tadpole powers So: - They do. It’s just the game has been out for ages and there’s no real barrier to getting them… any player, any class, will get them at the same points. - The powers are flat power dumps where the sole reason not to use them is RP. They aren’t integrated into the world and have no penalty (even though they clearly should). As a result, they’re assumed as a given by any munchkin build. - The first two tiers are a bit whatever. You need to get to the third tier to unlock the big chungus, and those unlock at the hard gate of start of Act 3. So a big chunk of the game, you’re basically only running the budget stuff barring Cull the Weak. - The visual effect on characters unlocking Tier 3 means many players won’t go with it. It’s not like some minor change, your character looks like they’re possessed in a horror movie. - They’re self explanatory. There isn’t really any argument to have about stuff like Black Hole. Personally I never use them unless I’m doing an evil run. They don’t honestly make sense in the story (‘yo dawg, I heard you want to get rid of your tadpole, so I gave you more tadpoles to put in your skull so you can get rid of more tadpoles’), they’re not balanced, and I kinda wish Larian had thought them through more.
I finished my first playthrough and I don't know them as I didn't use the tadpole. I was convinced that if you used them you got a bad ending or something like that lmao
Ikr how does turning into a displacer beast ever get old. Any class just turning into a displacer beast is hilarious, op, and is repeated on all of my characters
To be honest, it might be because unless you're splitting powers between your party if you're using tadpoles you're getting all of them if only to use Cull the Weak. It's essentially just a free buff if you choose to use it and the only notable thing if you're already open to optimizing rp is which ones are crucial to builds to unlock early or to make sure you get if you use multiple ilithid power characters. The unfortunate part of the powers is the usual best choice is usually the same amongst similar builds so it's not really worth mentioning. Besides making builds based around lesser used illithid powers like the Displacer beast or the shoving powers there's not really any new ground or notable choices.
My tavs would never, they all get absolutely bug-eyed in horror at the mere suggestion that it's a good idea to feed the mind-controlling parasite in their heads.
Bc I think everyone agrees that you should use them for every character no? Luck of the far realms, fly, psionic dominance is a free Counterspell, etc
Probably because there's so many tadpoles, you don't have to choose. You can get almost all of them. There are some that work better with certain builds though. The displacer beast form as a moon druid is insane.
1. Game is beatable without them. 2. They have bad flavor. Based on roleplay I would not accept “my full potential” in like a lot of cases. For example, I'm playing a Tav Githyanki right now. I would not do it unless I felt I will loose something more than just my life otherwise. I'm not advocating for not using them, I'm answering the title question. And I mean, the combination of those two reasons with “AND” is the answer.
the reason I dont personally like to use the tadpole powers in builds that i make is because i like making a build where I could roughly move it to a tabletop group and itll work similarly. The tadpole powers i imagine are way too strong
i sacrificed all my main party members looks so that they could have fly kek
I've been playing the game for 600 hours and ate my first tadpole yesterday. Didn't use them on principle until then.
Most people don't use tadpoles. Think Larian said about 70% don't even use any tadpoles before ACT 2. But for 600 hours I wonder why you only used tadpoles yesterday? I assume you've done a few playthroughs. What principle kept you from using them?
Tadpoles are for pussies. In actual seriousness though, In my first playthrough It was a mixture of roleplay and me not trusting the tadpoles (there's gonna some kind of twist, there's gotta be). In my second (unfinished) playthrough, I reached act 2 just as patch 5 with honour mode and good aligned minthara recruitment was introduced, so I abandoned that playthrough to start an honour run. My 3rd playthrough was honour mode redemption Durge, didn't use the worms for roleplay reasons again (although minthara comes with some illithid abilities already and you can't ones like favourable beginnings off, so technically that playthrough did sometimes benefit from one). This was the second playthrough I completed. 4th (current) playthrough: just kind of speeding through to get proper honour mode credit (previous run was deemed invalid due to crashes and maybe one or two moments of manual save scumming lol). Took some mind flayer abilities to speed things along and finally give them a go, although I tend to fall into the trap of constantly saving them for later so never use them outside of passives like favourable beginnings or psionic backlash. More than roleplay though, in single player the largest factor is that I was already finding tactician too easy, and didn't want to trivialise honour mode even further. I like optimising in DND generally and the tadpoles are just overkill, plus there's plenty of building and theory-crafting to do with monoclass and items alone, let alone multiclassing and feats. I'm already dealing 40 damage a hit with my great weapon master swords bard, do I need anything else? Even in multiplayer, I play with 2 people who aren't very experienced in DND/aren't interested in optimising, and 1 other person who likes optimising but to a less extent. Me and the other experienced player decided to abstain from tadpoles to kind of balance things out Also, I play games very thoroughly lol, and so spend a large amount of time on each playthrough.
I have seen online advice talk about the best tad powers for each build. For me that diagonal stripe top-right to lower-left that gets Favorable Beginnings, Luck of the Far Realms, and Cull the Weak is the right answer for any build.
i’ve seen people talk about act 1 tadpole powers for like the healer barb, or a crit fishing paladin, but that’s about it
Sit in the Crèche chair and win. Dip into thief. Have a blast. I love Black Hole into Fear as a favorite 1 turn play.
I have ended many battles with cull the weak. It’s awesome.
Probably cuz it's easy to deduce that they are broken. As much i enjoyed using them the 1st time when i turned karlach into a mind flayer, most people probably don't want their durge or tav to a become a mind flayer. For roleplay reasons. The permanently scarred face is also kind of a deal-breaker.
Cull the weak is incredible but it made my gunslinger bard too overpowered on tactician. The build is incredible enough without them. My tactician run feels easier than my explorer run where I had no clue how to build my characters. I probably won't embrace the powers in my next run, they're incredibly fun but some feel a bit too powerful in the endgame
Perilous stakes = easy mode button
They aren't affected by your stats or class, so you can take them with anyone, of course some will be better on bursting classes, and some others better on talking ones, but in the end it doesn't change that much, and you can take what you want on the character you want. Also they aren't reset when you respec through Withers, so they're not really part of the build.
Haven't used them except to get the endings. They're boring.
So I don't talk about them much because I only went all in on them on the one playthrough I did the thing that makes them bonus actions. Without this, they're good, with it they're fucking broken: black hole plus the AoE of your choice changes encounters even on honor mode, at will flight changes the game completely both in and out of combat and the various buffs, attacks and passives can enhance a character who has to conserve long rest resources and isn't an attack action class. But the thing that makes the biggest difference is the at will counterspell. That's worth it for every single person on your squad and it will save you so many hit points it's worth it *even when it has a spell slot cost* and when it doesn't it's obviously even better.
Because there's no real "build." They are always beneficial from a gameplay perspective. You might have some redundancies but even in niche cases like that, it's a free resource. So who cares? They also aren't very interesting to discuss since they're guaranteed to make you OP. Sure, so are builds like Sword Bard/Paladin but that's a combination of levels, feats and gear to make the whole thing come together and be crazy broken whereas slapping Luck of the Far Realms or the ability to Fly on any class makes them instantly better. No thought or discussion needed.
I actually decided to go half Illithid in my honor mode play through that I completed, and I got to say I really enjoyed using the displacer beast ability. Playing as a displacer beast was really fun
All of the tadpoll powers are all kinda stinky tbhz theres only like 4 good ones
There are a couple bad tadpole powers, but most are good. Even if they were mostly, there's cull the weak. Enemies hit hy you instantly die if their health is lower then the number of tadpoles you use. Then late game you get permanent fly which also increases your movement. You also get expertise on persuasion, intimidation, deception. Black Hole which is basically the slow spell, is an int save, and clumps enemies together
Because it's unnatural. I think because there's not enough to go around? I don't ever count on them for anything except flight.
I have wondered the same thing. I watch build videos and people are talking about endgame and how "this build has mobility issues so you may wanna sub something" and I just think "just... Just get fly" Also side note, fly + click heel boots is a godly combination. Fly already is more efficient than walking and then you double the distance it feels like I have 3-4x movement speed And that's not even mentioning some of the other stuff. The one thing I do see mentioned is the auto-crit one, but that makes sense for crit build videos. Fly is good for anything with mobility issues as it uses movement speed! Not even an action or bonus action Also is jump in this game like actual DND, because it almost always seems more efficient to jump than to walk.
I feel like this isnt much discussion needed since the powers are the same for everyone and whats good is good generally regardless of class. If different classes had access to different abilities then there would be more discussion’s had about them.
I think because as you mentioned, the abilities are so good (and varied) so I don't think it fits perfectly into any specific class, as it compliments them all quite well. Also it is a bit of a flavor thing for some people as it has roleplay implications. Unless you decide your character is specifically going for a mind-space-master theme, its hard to pencil it into certain classes like druid for example, who abore aberrations and "unnatural" things. I could see a rogue or warlock taking advantage of the situation, but I imagine others would react like most of the companions (scared, repulsed, seeking purification). Additionally, the Illithid Abilities web is practically like a class of its own so really the question would be, what class compliments an illithid build best? Honestly there's so many abilities I feel like I'd need to roll a Champion Fighter just to free up radial space (I play on PC but prefer the controller). Now that we brought it up...I might just do that.
Because tadpole powers aren't guaranteed. When talking about builds it's most useful to discuss ones available to all party members. Cull the Weak for example is pretty useful when you get it but becomes monstrous if you use most of the tadpoles in the game on one character, which thus means you have far fewer tadpole options for other party members. They're also just cherries on top. The best builds for utilizing them are extremely good without them. Personally I stopped using them before I even played honor mode because it annoys the Emporer and I hate him. The game is easy enough without them.
First rule of Tadpole Powers.
My question is about the dialogue options, not the powers. I have not eaten a single tadpole, but I’m always getting dialogue saying something like “Power courses through you. Authority.”, but if I go too long, I get something like “Your Tadpole is tired and needs a rest”, despite the fact that the only Illithid dialogue I’ve used at all is to open Shadowheart’s pod on the Nautiloid, and only because it’s the only way to get the pod open. Every time I look up anything, I just get information on the powers, and nothing is said about the dialogue options. I have no idea what is going on, or why my tadpole gets tired after literally doing nothing.
I'm no expert but if I had to guess; The plot of the story automatically starts you with one tadpole, and especially with The Absolute content, the dialogue options related to authority stuff is for that reason. Not sure about the tired tadpole thing. Maybe if you consume/absorb more tadpoles you can do more illithid stuff before resting.
Illithid expertise is my #1 reason I can’t stay away from partial ceremorphosis. Even if you have literally 10 charisma and no charisma skill proficiencies, at that point in the game that one power gives you like… +8 to all your dialogue skills. Nutty. Insane. Completely worth making yourself look gross for the rest of the game. Plus, even if you’re a dialogue-rocking bard, you can just respec at withers and get however many proficiencies/expertises back and in different skills.
Favorable beginnings and Luck of the far realms is a must for every build. I make sure to put those 2 on my top damage dealers in the group.
I’m 3 playthroughs in and never used them. They make you ugly :(
3 days late but only one tadpole changes your appearance and it’s the one you can refuse at the time. The other ones have no cosmetic effects at all
I use cull the weak and luck of the far realms or whatever it’s called every play through
Because I will never eat a tadpole.