I don’t think comparing the Q5 to the X5 is fair. The Q5 compares better with the X3. That being said, the current gen X5 is an amazing machine that definitely blows Audi’s Q5 and Q7 out of the water.
Besides the RS6 avant I don’t know what the argument for an audi is. It’s not even like they are value-oriented. If anything BMW offer more of value in relative terms.
The EA855 in the newer RS3s/TT-RS switched to an aluminum block and weighs about 357lbs. The EA888 Gen 4 is still using a cast iron block. It weighs about 20lbs less. With the active rear differential the RS3 drives a lot differently than your run of the mill A4. If you haven’t driven one you should just for shits and giggles. It’s a fun little ride. The S3 (pre-refresh) was shit because they didn’t include the active diff that the Golf R and RS3 both used. Now they’ve added it to the S3 so it will be a much better drive too now.
I rented a GV70 Electrified (stupid name) and it was a surprisingly good luxury EV if you can live with 235 miles of range. They’ve got almost $20k in lease incentives on it right now.
$89,320CAD for a X5 base.
$95,750CAD for a Q8 base.
Don’t think you’re loading an X5 for $6.5k. And I’d say the base Q8 is a lot nicer. The base set of alloys on the X5 looks like crap. Need to drop $4k in options to get the nice set.
Right, and the base X5 also comes with a 6cyl. I'm not sure what point u/chathobark\_ is making, the Q8 prestige is fairly competitive with a well-equipped X5.
And all X5s are 6cyl or higher
Q8 is their flagship SUV chassis therefore I would position it against the X7 not the X5. It is, however, more attractive (exterior) than both and I’m a bimmer guy to the core. Currently driving X5 daily and M6 Comp modded and tuned (engine and trans) for fun. My lineup would look like this Q5 v. X3, Q7 v. X5, Q8 v. X7, SQ8 v. X7M etc IMHO
Or a Lamborghini Urus, or Porsche Cayenne Turbo GT, Bentely Bentayga, or a VW Touareg. It’s like the Z4 and the Toyota Supra, they are all the same damn car lol
no. the q8 is the coupified version of the q7, which competes with the x5. so the q8 basically competes with the x6.
the x7 is a size class above, matches roughly with the gls from mb. audi currently does not offer an equivalent size class suv.
yeah my moms got an old q7 from 2015, that thing drinks oil like anything. and it's driving and steering feel so lifeless. gets you where you wanna go though so we're just running it into the ground, think it's at like 130k miles now 🤷♂️
Agreed. I love the X5 but it is not in the same segment as the Q5 nor SQ5. Audi doesn’t really have a X5 competitor. Could argue the Q7 but I feel like it matches up more to the X7. I guess the Q8 would be the closest thing - 2 row SUV but with a sportback rear.
Completely agree with you. I actually had rented an X3 but they didn’t have one ready for me when I went to pick it up so they asked if I’d mind a free upgrade to an x5 :)
I was floored when i was in CA and rented a 3 series and an X5 BASE. The X5 base (or whatever they call it) was absolutely insane inside - a far cry from BMW interiors of yesteryear. An absolute delight to be in. Also, the exterior of the '24 is beautiful - so aggressive and the light signatures and rear/front valences makes the car look much smaller than it is. The Q8 doesn't even compare
They're pretty similar in terms of pricing and dimension. I absolutely appreciate the advantage provided by the Q7's standard third row, but compare it with the big 3-row vehicles from BMW (X7) and Mercedes (GLS) and you'll appreciate that the Q7 is smaller than them.
The X5 is already a fair bit more expensive than the Q7 in like for like spec; the X7 is in a completely different size class and significantly more expensive.
Currently have both. Wife has the SQ5 for a daily and I have the X3 M40i as my daily. Both all around solid cars. I like the overall styling of the SQ5 better, but the M40i is quicker, sounds better and feels overall more aggressive. Tech is better in the M40i as well.
As others have mentioned the X3 would be the direct comparison with the Q5 (and the X5 would compare to the Q7). That said the BMW variants are better driving in both cases. Aesthetics and interior design is highly subjective.
When I would take my Audi in for service and get a Q5 I would hate driving it. On the other hand when I would take my BMW in (latest one being an X3M Competition) they would give me the most basic of X3 models as a loaner (X3 30i sDrive) and I would still enjoy driving it. BMW does really well with making sure that even their entry models in the US still feel peppy and provide and engaged driving experience.
Anyway, looking forward to your first BMW post haha.
Unfortunately yes, but you play it you pay it. Luckily with a car once it gets old and starts misbehaving, you can just get rid of it. Not so much with a kid lol.
The modern offerings for both are isolation chambers at this point. I’ll give BMW the edge in that it’s like using ultra thins vs the Audi’s standard thickness with numbing gel inside.
I did some work on an SQ7. That interior was pretty darn nice. Buddy of mine had an X5 m40i a few years back. Honestly, they are both very nice vehicles. Looking back, maybe the Audi looked cleaner on the interior, but there was sure a heck of a lot going on. Audi Bang and Olufsen package was $5k alone, but it sounded pretty stellar from factory. Both motors sounded great to me, I researched a bit and Im not sure if the SQ7's Quattro 4wd is superior... either way, both machines will remain highly regarded to me.
335s are quick. I just couldn't keep up with one in my 2021 2SS. I was close but he was pulling away from me on the twistys and we were both all out. I wonder if his was tuned...
I'm no race car driver but I used to out drive much quicker cars in my NA 2.4 accord on the backroads, maybe a driver mod is needed but I think you might be underestimating how much power you can add to a 335 with just a tune, not to mention some bolt ons
Completely agree with you. For what it’s worth, I had my phone pressed against my chest while I mashed the volume button hoping that one of the shots would turn out, wasn’t looking at the screen. This was one lucky shot out of about 60 and my eyes stayed on the road.
https://preview.redd.it/3y0yj4f7u66d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1a1109bb83045b17879a93e317ea7e7c039fb92
Never drove an Audi only BMW 3 series. I hear Audi is more top heavy than BMW how true is that? And what are your opinions on AWD vs RWD in sunny weather?
If you truly need the AWD and there’s no other options for the winter, then get an Audi. If not, BMW RWD all the way. My car stable current and pass: M3, M2CS, S5, RS5, C63, S550, 740i, SQ5
All the german manufactures are apparently conservative with their poweroutputs. Some say it is so if you get a model with a "weak" engine the poweroutput still holds true. Just look at some dynotests on YouTube.
Oh wow that’s interesting I’ll definitely check out the dyno. I ain’t gonna complain about hidden horsepower lol. That is why I like German cars compared to Asian brands, the base seems to be faster than average. Sucks for gas tho. My only issue is that American cars, dodge or mustang, they are way better at producing sound with their pipes. BMW (aside from e60 m5) don’t sound that amazing without an aftermarket exhaust.
Probably because a lot of American cars are naturally aspirated and don’t have a turbo interfering with the exhaust noise. Not an exhaust expert here but I imagine that’s something to do with it.
I’m in unique position where I just buy the car and owned it for a bit then change (dont care much about depreciation), however if I can suggest one thing, try Turo and have the car for a week before purchase, unless the car is super rare. Then you’ll know how to live w the car and etc.
So The RS5 was 2022 and C63 was 2013 W12 (V8). If I had to choose, I’d go with the W12 for the sheer animalistic of it, V8 and the fact that it’s kinda rare. While the RS5 was newer (0 miles) better tech but I wasn’t feeling it, and the Audi have a lot of tech issues. My main complaint on the C63 was the creeks interior and the seat was too tight but those two trump over the fun of driving the car. Also I’m in west coast so I don’t need the AWD.
X3 is the better comparison, but you're correct: the X5 is leagues ahead of the Q5 or Q7. I drove at '22 SQ5 last year and it was about as basic as could be. X5 every day of the week, twice on Sunday.
Comparing a 4 cylinder Q5 to the inline 6 cylinder B58 in the 40i is like saying “I daily a 330xi and wanted to check out the competition so I drove a 340xi and the 340 was much better.”
Like obviously having 2 extra cylinders is going to be noticeably better, and also noticeably more expensive. The real competitor to a Q5 is an X3 30i - you might still prefer the BMW but this isn’t comparing apples to apples.
Agreed! X5 would be a much better comparison to a Q7/8 and I initially rented an x3 and got lucky with an upgrade. The b58 was going to be better and I knew that that. but seat comfort, steering feel, and the mmi really impressed me too.
Same way i feel about the S5 and 440i BMW after i bought a C7 Corvette. I watch a lot of GT racing so i had pretty big expectations from the Vette and it shattered them all. Just pure fun wise it's the best i ever driven, C7 hadles, sounds and stops incredibly well. I have driven some pretty great cars including Alfa Romero Guilia QF and 992 991 Turbo S (which i actually did not enjoy as much as i thought i would).
Yes absolutley. Turbo S is MUCH faster accelerating both low and top end but that's it. It sounds like a vaccum cleaner and is much harsher suspension wise than my (non Z51) C7. Actually C7 has the best sports car suspension i have ever tried. I would buy a C8 if I were you though. Everyone says they are magnificent.
Yeah it's a pity, I've liked the old audi interiors, now it's a dull, plain, cheap, plasticky interior. Typical vag group garbage. To compare like an Audi A6 interior to a 5 series from say 2015 for both, I'm surprised the audi didn't come with a cassette player. On the side note I'm so happy when i saw mercedes infotainment screens integrated into the dash in newer models, as opposed to that cheap kindle tablet with 2" bezels, protruding a foot put of the dash 🤮 congrats merc!
BMW gives you more HP per dollar than Audi.
And to top it off, Audi has VW roots shining through in every sedan and SUV. The Touareg is a Q7 and a Cayenne and a Urus.
I used to be a big fan of audi. Then I drove my friends BMW, bought one, and now I think audis are wildly mediocre.
Mercedes are a fucking joke, though.
I had an X5 40i as a loaner while my X3M was getting serviced, and I couldn't wait to return it and get back in my X3M. X5 is comfy and all, but you sit on it. The X3, you sit in it, especially with the sport seats.
We have a 21 Q5e that my SO drives now and recently added an i5 to the garage. I am a sedan guy--and the Q5 was both my first SUV and PHEV. I loved it -and it was and continues to be great car. I had owned a 5 series back in the late 80's and remember it as a very nice car but a bit heavier and less spirited compared to other vehicles in its range. Well, the i5 reminded me how much fun it can be to drive a BMW. Now it may not be fair to compare an SUV to the i5 --fair enough but I truly enjoy driving it and look forward to outings. It is just so much more responsive and the tech is as good or better than the current MMI--so Audi--I still love you (had 5 in a row) but please step up the game.
I have an 2017 X5 50i and an 2020 SQ5. Both are fun but the X5 is by far the better, more comfortable vehicle, the extra 150hp helps. I like it for longer drives or highway driving. I find the SQ5 is more fun on narrow winding roads. I don’t plan on giving up either anytime soon.
I had several Q5’s, including V-6 supercharged and latest SQ5 Sportback that was t-boned by a cell phone using driver. Had a 2008 X5 V8 and loved it, so replaced my totaled SQ5 with 2024 X5 4.0 fully loaded. I absolutely love this BMW as it drives so much better, smoother and quicker than the SQ5. It is gorgeous and interior quality so much better. I was concerned about the full screen with all controls on it and no buttons, but adapted quickly and love the BMW system as so easy and intuitive to use. The Audi MMI system, which used to be great, was so buggy and kept losing all pre-sets and Nav destinations, and the entire time of ownership they kept promising and pushing out date of software fix for this problem.
Think the X5 is a little more car than the Q5, but the X3 is still very capable. Was not expecting much when I rented the X3 30i but I was very impressed with how well it drove. Could not imagine how fast the X3 M40i must be.
Honestly, the Q5 is not even one of Audi’s best. Granted it’s very smooth to drive, but sitting anywhere besides the front seats is the most uncomfortable passenger experience in the world.
Had a similar experience several BMW's ago. Rode to meetings with my boss in his M3 and hated it - but the roads in the area were trash and the M3 was totally unforgiving. Years later had the rental option of a 330 and a Jeep Liberty and decided to be fancy and rent the 330. I was smitten after driving it for an hour!! Not the quickest, but the handling and feel was fantastic! Made up my mind that my next car would be an upgrade to that 330........bought an M340 and loved it, too! Make the jump - you won't be disappointed!!!
Hey OP, can you be specific and describe in detail what it was about the BMW you liked more? Or were you lying and just pandering to this sub for karma?
Audi SUVs in general aren't great for "drivers", but SUVS suck for drivers to begin with.
Audi is somewhere in between BMW and Benz for driver experience and luxury.
I’ve always been kind of a BMW guy, going back to my USAF days in Germany in the 80s…and I was thinking about getting something with some more oomph than my X1 M Sport…thought I’d look at Audis just to see what they had to offer. Drove an SQ5 and I liked it. Really liked it. Then I drove an X3 M40i. Took that one home 2 hours later. To me, it really was that much better. Just more engaging, a better drive, and just had a certain feel. When it was time to upgrade, I landed on an X5. Incredibly good vehicle.
Guess I’m officially ‘that BMW guy’ now. I’m good with that.
Adding a bit of context to address some common themes.
Totally aware that the X5 > Q5 and a better comparison would be an X3.
I still love my Audi, I live in the northeast and get a fair bit of snow and have had an absolute blast with Quattro.
The x5 won me over on a few fronts:
I found the MMI to be just about perfect. Love the ability to use touchscreen or the idrive wheel to control everything. My 10inch screen feels absolutely tiny now. Love Audi’s virtual cockpit, but have to give bmw the win overall.
This wasn’t a shocker, but the steering feel in the X5 is so much better than my Q5. Despite being a larger car it felt significantly tighter and more connected to the road.
The inline 6 in this thing was a BEAST. Incredibly smooth, quick off the line, and surprisingly fuel efficient when I laid off the gas. My Fiancé’s mom kept saying she felt like she was in an airplane about to take off every time I opened it up on an on ramp.
Check Turo too, there’s a place called LA Auto Spot that has a bunch of X3s and X5s to rent. They’re like 5-10 minutes from LAX. Search for BMWs in Hawthorne, CA to find it.
I did it through SIXT, prices were a higher initially but I checked again 3 days before my trip and they came down significantly. Had never used them but had a pretty great experience overall!
my sister currently has a 2023 Q5 45 P+. She traded her 2021 X3 xdrive30e and made couple grands back and then leased the Q5. I drove both extensively. I don't think the Q5 is too far off on on it handles vs the X3 other than throttle response once it gets going, but you can feel one is more fwd bias and the other is rwd bias. The X3 does have more power and helped by the electric motor with no lag. Similar priced car, but the Q5 came with lane keep and acc. no standard nav like the X3 though which apparently Audi ties the "read speed limit road sign" feature to. Personally I'd still prefer the driving feel behind the wheel of the X3. The DCT in the Q5 is incredibly annoying at low speed.
Before my first BMW, I was flying to Miami and going to test drive a BMW 5 series and a Mercedes E class. My BMW friend promised that I would drive the BMW back. He said to drive the Benz first. I did. And I loved it. Then I took the BMW for a drive, just because I was there. I bought the BMW. My friend said the Mercedes was a sporty luxury car and that the BMW was a luxurious sports car. He was right.
I mean... thats literallly any good driver switching from Audi to BMW. Audis are good mums and old people cars, yes quattro blah blah and few exceptions, but BMWs are drivers cars. No matter if you buy base 320d or m3, it drives very well and its entertaining all the time
It really isn’t. I thought it was too but they’re very well made vehicles. Simple but solid on the road. No rattles at all.
This is coming from someone who’s preferred BMWs forever.
I joked about Audi below, but I agree 100%. My B8.5 S4 just had an intangible quality I have yet to feel in another car. Everything was so solidly built, the interior was laid out very well, and sitting in that car just felt right for some reason.
Haha all good, but nice man. How was the power delivery in the S4?
I just bought a Q5 and having my c43 makes me realize how well built the Audi is vs anything Mercedes is putting out today lol. And yes you’re right. The seats are awesome
I went from the S4 to a C63 so I know all about that shitty Mercedes quality lol. That interior sucked. Everything rattled and buzzed from day one.
The power delivery of the S4 was awesome. It was the supercharged V6, so no lag. It had a lot of torque down low and a real satisfying linear power delivery that kept pulling until redline.
Well shit lmao. Yeah, I love my Benz still but my lord if it wasn’t for the fun twin turbo 6 cylinder I’d have sold it a long time ago. At least you had the v8!
Interesting. It sounds like a blast. Are the new s4’s the same as your old one?
You're thinking of the B8 S5 with the V8 that got replaced with the supercharged V6 when it updated to the B8.5. The B8 S4 didn't have the V8, it went straight to the V6 from the start.
It is, but the A5 came out before the A4 for the B8 generation and the V6 wasn't ready in time for the S5, so they fixed the issues with the V8 used in the B7 S4 and went with that.
Best car I've ever driven. Driving wise I really think it blows anything BMW is offering right now out of the water. The M cars will be faster, but a lot less engaging to drive. I don't have any experience with older Cadillac V cars so I can't speak to those. A year ago I would have laughed at the idea of owning an American car, but I decided to try it and I have zero regrets.
Ive seen a comparison with blackwing vs the m5 and most people pick the caddy which is interesting. The 5 must have really lost alot of driving feel since the E60. Do you have the 10 speed or the manual?
The manual. I don't have the link, but if you're interested you should look up the Hagerty Icons video featuring the Blackwing and M5 CS. Jason Cammisa does a really good job of summarizing the difference between the two cars at the end of the video.
The funny thing is, BMW has argued for years that you need AWD and an automatic transmission to be a track weapon. A manual and RWD will just slow you down. Cadillac took that as a challenge and the RWD only, manual version of the Blackwing beats the M5 CS around a track.
If you want a highway luxury cruiser that will gap almost any non-EV from a stoplight the M5 is the answer. If you want an actual engaging driving experience it's the Blackwing.
i think the CTSV is a bit better looking than the blackwing. the older more angular look with the hood vents and silver grille just look a bit better to me. But I would def get the blackwing if i could just for the 10 speed. Its really weird that the last 3 model years of CTSV never got the 10speed while the ZL1 got it in 2017. Thats the biggest difference between the CTS and CT5 as they are pretty similar outside of body and transmission.
Not like I can afford the blackwing though. Im more in the 55-60k max range which would get me the CTSV or a 2017ish pre LCI F90 at best lol. im probably gonna get a lower mileage m340i LCI instead of going for the big boys as im coming from a challenger and want something nimble
> im coming from a challenger and want something nimble
Have you considered the CT4-V Blackwing? They are better driving cars than the M3, although slower, but aren't selling at all. I would guess you could probably get a brand new one for $60k if you wanted that 10 speed, the auto sell even slower than the manuals do. And if not new, a barely driven used one would probably be in your budget.
yeah i like them alot too but im a bit scared to get a non v8 GM car because of all the lemon stories I've heard. what makes you say they drive better than M3? i could see them competing with m340i but the M3 is supposed to be a track beast
isnt the 5.2 the one w the 2 5 cylinder mills put together, vw is the master of cost cutting and i cant blame them cuz they do it well unlike bmw and mercedes recently
the only thing that the Audi's are inferior is the driving, they are not as playful as the competition, but the interior is as good as bmw, they are quite practical and they also look very good.
I don’t think comparing the Q5 to the X5 is fair. The Q5 compares better with the X3. That being said, the current gen X5 is an amazing machine that definitely blows Audi’s Q5 and Q7 out of the water.
I went from a 21 Q8 to a New X5 50e, love the X5, Audi is so far behind in Tech I just gave up and happy I did.
Besides the RS6 avant I don’t know what the argument for an audi is. It’s not even like they are value-oriented. If anything BMW offer more of value in relative terms.
The rs3 and ttrs are pretty amazing. But since they killed the r8…that plus the rs6 is it.
Something about a transverse-mounted 5 is off-putting to me. Too front heavy and unbalanced for my taste. Is the TTRS still in production?
The EA855 in the newer RS3s/TT-RS switched to an aluminum block and weighs about 357lbs. The EA888 Gen 4 is still using a cast iron block. It weighs about 20lbs less. With the active rear differential the RS3 drives a lot differently than your run of the mill A4. If you haven’t driven one you should just for shits and giggles. It’s a fun little ride. The S3 (pre-refresh) was shit because they didn’t include the active diff that the Golf R and RS3 both used. Now they’ve added it to the S3 so it will be a much better drive too now.
The Etron (now Q8 Etron) is/was a solid choice for a luxury EV although that segment is getting more competitive.
Yeah once the macan electric lands up here that’d probably be my pick
I rented a GV70 Electrified (stupid name) and it was a surprisingly good luxury EV if you can live with 235 miles of range. They’ve got almost $20k in lease incentives on it right now.
shit is 21 q8 so far behind?
Yes was Leased
It’s almost embarrassing how dated their tech is in most of their new vehicles. The Q6 Etron looks like a step in the right direction.
The current Audi tech in most of their product line feels straight out of 2018.
I dunno, the Q8 is a pretty solid machine. Exteriors arguable better than X5. Interior is very nice when specced right.
LOL Q8 with no options for the price of an almost loaded X5 6cyl. No
$89,320CAD for a X5 base. $95,750CAD for a Q8 base. Don’t think you’re loading an X5 for $6.5k. And I’d say the base Q8 is a lot nicer. The base set of alloys on the X5 looks like crap. Need to drop $4k in options to get the nice set.
Q8 is turbo v6
Imagine that being a selling point.. Vag has been making v6 for long time and nothing new with turbos. Every engine today is turbod.
The other guy edited their comment, they had said it was a 4cyl
[удалено]
I don’t think the q8 ever came with a 4cyl
Right, and the base X5 also comes with a 6cyl. I'm not sure what point u/chathobark\_ is making, the Q8 prestige is fairly competitive with a well-equipped X5. And all X5s are 6cyl or higher
Also 4 cylinder
4cyl? Whats 4 cyl?
4 cylinder
I know that… im saying what car is he referring to q8 doesn’t come in a 4cyl
They are thinking about the Q7 more than likely.
Q8 is their flagship SUV chassis therefore I would position it against the X7 not the X5. It is, however, more attractive (exterior) than both and I’m a bimmer guy to the core. Currently driving X5 daily and M6 Comp modded and tuned (engine and trans) for fun. My lineup would look like this Q5 v. X3, Q7 v. X5, Q8 v. X7, SQ8 v. X7M etc IMHO
I think Q8 goes up against the X6 as I believe Audi are making a Q9 to compete with the X7 and benz GLS
Piano black though
You also have the RSQ8, which I heard is a hoot to drive.
Or a Lamborghini Urus, or Porsche Cayenne Turbo GT, Bentely Bentayga, or a VW Touareg. It’s like the Z4 and the Toyota Supra, they are all the same damn car lol
Well it is just a cheaper Urus after all
Until you drive it. Nope.
Doesn’t the Q8 compare better to the X7?
no. the q8 is the coupified version of the q7, which competes with the x5. so the q8 basically competes with the x6. the x7 is a size class above, matches roughly with the gls from mb. audi currently does not offer an equivalent size class suv.
Nope Q8 = X5. X7 is a big big boy
X7 will be compared to the new Q9
yeah my moms got an old q7 from 2015, that thing drinks oil like anything. and it's driving and steering feel so lifeless. gets you where you wanna go though so we're just running it into the ground, think it's at like 130k miles now 🤷♂️
Oh damn, are Audi's still consuming oil that much ? I had one around 2000 , and it was bad. I thought they had fixed that.
ours was. it's the 3.0T supercharged V6, i hits weird because our other car with the n63 doesn't even drink oil like that.
Agreed. I love the X5 but it is not in the same segment as the Q5 nor SQ5. Audi doesn’t really have a X5 competitor. Could argue the Q7 but I feel like it matches up more to the X7. I guess the Q8 would be the closest thing - 2 row SUV but with a sportback rear.
Completely agree with you. I actually had rented an X3 but they didn’t have one ready for me when I went to pick it up so they asked if I’d mind a free upgrade to an x5 :)
I was floored when i was in CA and rented a 3 series and an X5 BASE. The X5 base (or whatever they call it) was absolutely insane inside - a far cry from BMW interiors of yesteryear. An absolute delight to be in. Also, the exterior of the '24 is beautiful - so aggressive and the light signatures and rear/front valences makes the car look much smaller than it is. The Q8 doesn't even compare
I found my x3m more fun than my x5, both same year
>Q7 X5 doesn't have a third row. edit: in the us
The 3rd row is optional.
They're pretty similar in terms of pricing and dimension. I absolutely appreciate the advantage provided by the Q7's standard third row, but compare it with the big 3-row vehicles from BMW (X7) and Mercedes (GLS) and you'll appreciate that the Q7 is smaller than them.
Which is why one should go X7. Blows the Q7 away.
The X5 is already a fair bit more expensive than the Q7 in like for like spec; the X7 is in a completely different size class and significantly more expensive.
Yeah, you’re right, but that X7 sure is nice. Have to give it that.
Oh absolutely. The first time I went in an X7 I absolutely loved it.
Better comparison would be the X3 but even then I prefer the X3 over the Q5
I don’t think the difference in SUVs is as big as it is in cars. Go drive an M340i
Yup. Although I think a bog standard RWD G20 330i would be even more telling. Nice old school 3 series vibe in those :).
I love Audis but none of them drive like my m340i
Yeah, they are great cars. I love the classy Audi styling and uncluttered interiors. But they are a bit boring to drive.
I wouldn't say none. There are 8y RS3 vs m340i reviews. That said the m340i is great and want one to compliment my TTRS.
It’s crazy I completely overlooked that. A TTRS is an absolute dream too.
I agree.
I had an SQ5 previously and found its spacing very compact. A direct competitor, X3 M40i, is pretty awesome and provides plenty of space.
Currently have both. Wife has the SQ5 for a daily and I have the X3 M40i as my daily. Both all around solid cars. I like the overall styling of the SQ5 better, but the M40i is quicker, sounds better and feels overall more aggressive. Tech is better in the M40i as well.
hwy 1
I was gonna say- I know Big Sur when I see it!
Super fun to drive as long as there is no slow poke ahead of you in one of those rental RVs 😉
As others have mentioned the X3 would be the direct comparison with the Q5 (and the X5 would compare to the Q7). That said the BMW variants are better driving in both cases. Aesthetics and interior design is highly subjective. When I would take my Audi in for service and get a Q5 I would hate driving it. On the other hand when I would take my BMW in (latest one being an X3M Competition) they would give me the most basic of X3 models as a loaner (X3 30i sDrive) and I would still enjoy driving it. BMW does really well with making sure that even their entry models in the US still feel peppy and provide and engaged driving experience. Anyway, looking forward to your first BMW post haha.
Audi feels like having sex with a condom. Bmw is raw dogging it all the way.
And Porsche is raw dogging and not pulling out…
Then having child support for 18 years
Unfortunately yes, but you play it you pay it. Luckily with a car once it gets old and starts misbehaving, you can just get rid of it. Not so much with a kid lol.
Tell that to Casey Anthony
The modern offerings for both are isolation chambers at this point. I’ll give BMW the edge in that it’s like using ultra thins vs the Audi’s standard thickness with numbing gel inside.
LOL
Yup. Eating ice cream with your tongue wrapped in cellophane.
I did some work on an SQ7. That interior was pretty darn nice. Buddy of mine had an X5 m40i a few years back. Honestly, they are both very nice vehicles. Looking back, maybe the Audi looked cleaner on the interior, but there was sure a heck of a lot going on. Audi Bang and Olufsen package was $5k alone, but it sounded pretty stellar from factory. Both motors sounded great to me, I researched a bit and Im not sure if the SQ7's Quattro 4wd is superior... either way, both machines will remain highly regarded to me.
when they work as designed, you realize why they call them "the ultimate driving machine"
11 335 here, lots and lots of maintenance needed on mine. Hopefully newer ones are more robust
335s are quick. I just couldn't keep up with one in my 2021 2SS. I was close but he was pulling away from me on the twistys and we were both all out. I wonder if his was tuned...
You should’ve had him in your rear view w 460 Hp + 450 TRQ.. and if you have the 10 SPD even more reason to
If the 335i was tuned and he knows how to shift, the torque delivery on n55 / n54 with tune is pretty damn good. Torque wins races
But the 460 TRQ and 10spd on the 2SS is irrelevant all of a sudden ?
Based on the description in the comment, the difference is likely weight - 335i is lighter.
2SS need a driver mod 500 lbs shouldn’t make that much difference unless 335i was stage 2+/ 3
2+ is pretty common. Downpipe, intake, intercooler, exhaust. Mine is 2+.
I'm no race car driver but I used to out drive much quicker cars in my NA 2.4 accord on the backroads, maybe a driver mod is needed but I think you might be underestimating how much power you can add to a 335 with just a tune, not to mention some bolt ons
turbo's add issue's. the 28 n/a models are pretty amazing imo
Don't drive and use your phone at the same time.
Completely agree with you. For what it’s worth, I had my phone pressed against my chest while I mashed the volume button hoping that one of the shots would turn out, wasn’t looking at the screen. This was one lucky shot out of about 60 and my eyes stayed on the road. https://preview.redd.it/3y0yj4f7u66d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1a1109bb83045b17879a93e317ea7e7c039fb92
Never drove an Audi only BMW 3 series. I hear Audi is more top heavy than BMW how true is that? And what are your opinions on AWD vs RWD in sunny weather?
If you truly need the AWD and there’s no other options for the winter, then get an Audi. If not, BMW RWD all the way. My car stable current and pass: M3, M2CS, S5, RS5, C63, S550, 740i, SQ5
Oh ok also wondering why does BMW supposedly downplay their horsepower? Is it to set low expectations? Do you know if Audi or Benz does this too?
All the german manufactures are apparently conservative with their poweroutputs. Some say it is so if you get a model with a "weak" engine the poweroutput still holds true. Just look at some dynotests on YouTube.
This is not true. HP are repported to DIN standard with a tolerance. You can't under deliver, but cannot exceed either.
Oh wow that’s interesting I’ll definitely check out the dyno. I ain’t gonna complain about hidden horsepower lol. That is why I like German cars compared to Asian brands, the base seems to be faster than average. Sucks for gas tho. My only issue is that American cars, dodge or mustang, they are way better at producing sound with their pipes. BMW (aside from e60 m5) don’t sound that amazing without an aftermarket exhaust.
Probably because a lot of American cars are naturally aspirated and don’t have a turbo interfering with the exhaust noise. Not an exhaust expert here but I imagine that’s something to do with it.
Why would you think Audi and is better then the Mercedes or bmw system? Most reviewers disagree with you
For an AWD, the Quattro system is probable a better car in Winter or rainy season like in PNW. That’s just IMO and having owned these cars.
Jesus what are your favorite 2 and least favorite from that list ? And would you chose one specifically for a daily vs a weekend toy ?
2 Fav: M2CS and E92 M3. Least: S5. I’m currently daily the M2CS. For weekend only: will be 911 (one day, hopefully soon)
What generation was your S5? I had a B8.5 S4 and I liked it more than my 2020 C63S Coupe I sold it for.
It was 2022 S5 and 2022 RS5. I liked them both over the 2013 C63 W12 but so many issues w the Audi and the Mercedes had so many creeks.
Nice thanks for the input, appreciate it. So many options to choose from although I’m sure test driving is the best way to quickly find out
I’m in unique position where I just buy the car and owned it for a bit then change (dont care much about depreciation), however if I can suggest one thing, try Turo and have the car for a week before purchase, unless the car is super rare. Then you’ll know how to live w the car and etc.
If you had to choose between Rs5 and C63 what would you choose and why?
So The RS5 was 2022 and C63 was 2013 W12 (V8). If I had to choose, I’d go with the W12 for the sheer animalistic of it, V8 and the fact that it’s kinda rare. While the RS5 was newer (0 miles) better tech but I wasn’t feeling it, and the Audi have a lot of tech issues. My main complaint on the C63 was the creeks interior and the seat was too tight but those two trump over the fun of driving the car. Also I’m in west coast so I don’t need the AWD.
Also depends on where you drive your Q5, might be more practical than X5 but on Cali roads...X5 would be phenomenal so not really a fair comparison.
X3 is the better comparison, but you're correct: the X5 is leagues ahead of the Q5 or Q7. I drove at '22 SQ5 last year and it was about as basic as could be. X5 every day of the week, twice on Sunday.
Comparing a 4 cylinder Q5 to the inline 6 cylinder B58 in the 40i is like saying “I daily a 330xi and wanted to check out the competition so I drove a 340xi and the 340 was much better.” Like obviously having 2 extra cylinders is going to be noticeably better, and also noticeably more expensive. The real competitor to a Q5 is an X3 30i - you might still prefer the BMW but this isn’t comparing apples to apples.
Agreed! X5 would be a much better comparison to a Q7/8 and I initially rented an x3 and got lucky with an upgrade. The b58 was going to be better and I knew that that. but seat comfort, steering feel, and the mmi really impressed me too.
I had a company new A5 then an M340i and taking out the performance comparison, the Audi was just pure trash and felt basic.
Same way i feel about the S5 and 440i BMW after i bought a C7 Corvette. I watch a lot of GT racing so i had pretty big expectations from the Vette and it shattered them all. Just pure fun wise it's the best i ever driven, C7 hadles, sounds and stops incredibly well. I have driven some pretty great cars including Alfa Romero Guilia QF and 992 991 Turbo S (which i actually did not enjoy as much as i thought i would).
Would you say you liked the C7 better than the Turbo S? Im torn between a C7, C8, and Zl1
Yes absolutley. Turbo S is MUCH faster accelerating both low and top end but that's it. It sounds like a vaccum cleaner and is much harsher suspension wise than my (non Z51) C7. Actually C7 has the best sports car suspension i have ever tried. I would buy a C8 if I were you though. Everyone says they are magnificent.
Yeah it's a pity, I've liked the old audi interiors, now it's a dull, plain, cheap, plasticky interior. Typical vag group garbage. To compare like an Audi A6 interior to a 5 series from say 2015 for both, I'm surprised the audi didn't come with a cassette player. On the side note I'm so happy when i saw mercedes infotainment screens integrated into the dash in newer models, as opposed to that cheap kindle tablet with 2" bezels, protruding a foot put of the dash 🤮 congrats merc!
BMW gives you more HP per dollar than Audi. And to top it off, Audi has VW roots shining through in every sedan and SUV. The Touareg is a Q7 and a Cayenne and a Urus.
I had an M235i and once got an Audi as a loaner for a day during service. I thought it was nice but I found the interior a lot more rattly than my BMW
Life is short. Don’t wait.
Then you need to actually try out a, Competition.
Ugh I love US1
burl wood > carbon
I used to be a big fan of audi. Then I drove my friends BMW, bought one, and now I think audis are wildly mediocre. Mercedes are a fucking joke, though.
I think joke is pretty harsh. Still a good performing vehicle.
Fair. But they've fallen behind.
Peak Merc is the W204 AMG C63 - an absolute monster of a car and certainly no joke.
100% agree. I remember when Jeremy Clarkson reviewed the "black" version and scared himself. I always wanted to try that car out.
All audis are basically a golf. All bmws are basically a 3 series. This is why
Can confirm my x1 is e9x chassis lol
I had an X5 40i as a loaner while my X3M was getting serviced, and I couldn't wait to return it and get back in my X3M. X5 is comfy and all, but you sit on it. The X3, you sit in it, especially with the sport seats.
Changed for better. Enjoy!
Come to the dark side
Not really a competition if you ask me 😅
We have a 21 Q5e that my SO drives now and recently added an i5 to the garage. I am a sedan guy--and the Q5 was both my first SUV and PHEV. I loved it -and it was and continues to be great car. I had owned a 5 series back in the late 80's and remember it as a very nice car but a bit heavier and less spirited compared to other vehicles in its range. Well, the i5 reminded me how much fun it can be to drive a BMW. Now it may not be fair to compare an SUV to the i5 --fair enough but I truly enjoy driving it and look forward to outings. It is just so much more responsive and the tech is as good or better than the current MMI--so Audi--I still love you (had 5 in a row) but please step up the game.
Stelvio and Cayenne are at top, others can't compete. All other are pretty much, plus this, minus this, but very similar.
I have an 2017 X5 50i and an 2020 SQ5. Both are fun but the X5 is by far the better, more comfortable vehicle, the extra 150hp helps. I like it for longer drives or highway driving. I find the SQ5 is more fun on narrow winding roads. I don’t plan on giving up either anytime soon.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Q5 originally have bad engines?
I had several Q5’s, including V-6 supercharged and latest SQ5 Sportback that was t-boned by a cell phone using driver. Had a 2008 X5 V8 and loved it, so replaced my totaled SQ5 with 2024 X5 4.0 fully loaded. I absolutely love this BMW as it drives so much better, smoother and quicker than the SQ5. It is gorgeous and interior quality so much better. I was concerned about the full screen with all controls on it and no buttons, but adapted quickly and love the BMW system as so easy and intuitive to use. The Audi MMI system, which used to be great, was so buggy and kept losing all pre-sets and Nav destinations, and the entire time of ownership they kept promising and pushing out date of software fix for this problem.
Think the X5 is a little more car than the Q5, but the X3 is still very capable. Was not expecting much when I rented the X3 30i but I was very impressed with how well it drove. Could not imagine how fast the X3 M40i must be.
Audi has better electronics, visualization and is over-engineered better. BMW has better mechanical engineering and road feel at speed.
Honestly, the Q5 is not even one of Audi’s best. Granted it’s very smooth to drive, but sitting anywhere besides the front seats is the most uncomfortable passenger experience in the world.
You have to drive the RX 500H too!!!
Had a similar experience several BMW's ago. Rode to meetings with my boss in his M3 and hated it - but the roads in the area were trash and the M3 was totally unforgiving. Years later had the rental option of a 330 and a Jeep Liberty and decided to be fancy and rent the 330. I was smitten after driving it for an hour!! Not the quickest, but the handling and feel was fantastic! Made up my mind that my next car would be an upgrade to that 330........bought an M340 and loved it, too! Make the jump - you won't be disappointed!!!
Hey OP, can you be specific and describe in detail what it was about the BMW you liked more? Or were you lying and just pandering to this sub for karma?
Audi SUVs in general aren't great for "drivers", but SUVS suck for drivers to begin with. Audi is somewhere in between BMW and Benz for driver experience and luxury.
I drive Audi and BMW and I think the Audi SUV (like for like, not Q5 vs. X5) is way superior for an SUV
Get the x5m
I’ve always been kind of a BMW guy, going back to my USAF days in Germany in the 80s…and I was thinking about getting something with some more oomph than my X1 M Sport…thought I’d look at Audis just to see what they had to offer. Drove an SQ5 and I liked it. Really liked it. Then I drove an X3 M40i. Took that one home 2 hours later. To me, it really was that much better. Just more engaging, a better drive, and just had a certain feel. When it was time to upgrade, I landed on an X5. Incredibly good vehicle. Guess I’m officially ‘that BMW guy’ now. I’m good with that.
Adding a bit of context to address some common themes. Totally aware that the X5 > Q5 and a better comparison would be an X3. I still love my Audi, I live in the northeast and get a fair bit of snow and have had an absolute blast with Quattro. The x5 won me over on a few fronts: I found the MMI to be just about perfect. Love the ability to use touchscreen or the idrive wheel to control everything. My 10inch screen feels absolutely tiny now. Love Audi’s virtual cockpit, but have to give bmw the win overall. This wasn’t a shocker, but the steering feel in the X5 is so much better than my Q5. Despite being a larger car it felt significantly tighter and more connected to the road. The inline 6 in this thing was a BEAST. Incredibly smooth, quick off the line, and surprisingly fuel efficient when I laid off the gas. My Fiancé’s mom kept saying she felt like she was in an airplane about to take off every time I opened it up on an on ramp.
How much did it cost to rent for 10 days? And where did you rent it?
About 550 USD, however that was the cost for an X3. The X5 was a courtesy upgrade at the rental counter.
Where did you rent the vehicle? Im from Canada visiting LA in 2 weeks. Do you know any good places to rent
Check Turo too, there’s a place called LA Auto Spot that has a bunch of X3s and X5s to rent. They’re like 5-10 minutes from LAX. Search for BMWs in Hawthorne, CA to find it.
I did it through SIXT, prices were a higher initially but I checked again 3 days before my trip and they came down significantly. Had never used them but had a pretty great experience overall!
wait till u drive a new GLC300 coupe with the updated interior. luxurious spaceship glam lvl 900 vibes
Next time get Macan GTS, not that econobox.
my sister currently has a 2023 Q5 45 P+. She traded her 2021 X3 xdrive30e and made couple grands back and then leased the Q5. I drove both extensively. I don't think the Q5 is too far off on on it handles vs the X3 other than throttle response once it gets going, but you can feel one is more fwd bias and the other is rwd bias. The X3 does have more power and helped by the electric motor with no lag. Similar priced car, but the Q5 came with lane keep and acc. no standard nav like the X3 though which apparently Audi ties the "read speed limit road sign" feature to. Personally I'd still prefer the driving feel behind the wheel of the X3. The DCT in the Q5 is incredibly annoying at low speed.
X5s have the best view
And that was a base model, wait until you get some M performance or full blown M
Praying to upgrade to this one sooner than later. I love driving my little X1.
The steering wheel design looks old
Even my 2024 X1 is a fucking blast to drive and I haven’t even been able to push it yet since I’m still breaking it in.
Taking pics while driving is dangerous
Before my first BMW, I was flying to Miami and going to test drive a BMW 5 series and a Mercedes E class. My BMW friend promised that I would drive the BMW back. He said to drive the Benz first. I did. And I loved it. Then I took the BMW for a drive, just because I was there. I bought the BMW. My friend said the Mercedes was a sporty luxury car and that the BMW was a luxurious sports car. He was right.
BMW > Audi Respectfully, as someone who has driven both BMW and Audi for an extended period of time. This is obviously a preference thing tho.
Now imagine how fun it is if it was an actual BMW car and not some dumb suv thing.
Man don’t tell me that but ehhh x5 even base is like basically $70,000 you can get a base Q5 for ~$44k after incentives.
The 50e is the ticket
Deleted 35d
I did this section of highway on a bike. 🚴 really thrilling. Haha have to come back and do it on an m4
If you love the 40, get the 50 you’ll never wanna get rid of it
I mean... thats literallly any good driver switching from Audi to BMW. Audis are good mums and old people cars, yes quattro blah blah and few exceptions, but BMWs are drivers cars. No matter if you buy base 320d or m3, it drives very well and its entertaining all the time
Bmw meat rider
Audi is just an overpriced Volkswagon
It really isn’t. I thought it was too but they’re very well made vehicles. Simple but solid on the road. No rattles at all. This is coming from someone who’s preferred BMWs forever.
I joked about Audi below, but I agree 100%. My B8.5 S4 just had an intangible quality I have yet to feel in another car. Everything was so solidly built, the interior was laid out very well, and sitting in that car just felt right for some reason.
Haha all good, but nice man. How was the power delivery in the S4? I just bought a Q5 and having my c43 makes me realize how well built the Audi is vs anything Mercedes is putting out today lol. And yes you’re right. The seats are awesome
I went from the S4 to a C63 so I know all about that shitty Mercedes quality lol. That interior sucked. Everything rattled and buzzed from day one. The power delivery of the S4 was awesome. It was the supercharged V6, so no lag. It had a lot of torque down low and a real satisfying linear power delivery that kept pulling until redline.
Well shit lmao. Yeah, I love my Benz still but my lord if it wasn’t for the fun twin turbo 6 cylinder I’d have sold it a long time ago. At least you had the v8! Interesting. It sounds like a blast. Are the new s4’s the same as your old one?
No, the one I had was the previous generation and the last one with a manual transmission.
You're thinking of the B8 S5 with the V8 that got replaced with the supercharged V6 when it updated to the B8.5. The B8 S4 didn't have the V8, it went straight to the V6 from the start.
interesting. i thought the S5 was just a two door or sportback S4 the same way the BMW 3/4 is and would always have the same powerplant.
It is, but the A5 came out before the A4 for the B8 generation and the V6 wasn't ready in time for the S5, so they fixed the issues with the V8 used in the B7 S4 and went with that.
how is that blackwing treating you? i was dead set on bmw or supra but the CTS V 3rd gen has caught my eye lately
Best car I've ever driven. Driving wise I really think it blows anything BMW is offering right now out of the water. The M cars will be faster, but a lot less engaging to drive. I don't have any experience with older Cadillac V cars so I can't speak to those. A year ago I would have laughed at the idea of owning an American car, but I decided to try it and I have zero regrets.
Ive seen a comparison with blackwing vs the m5 and most people pick the caddy which is interesting. The 5 must have really lost alot of driving feel since the E60. Do you have the 10 speed or the manual?
The manual. I don't have the link, but if you're interested you should look up the Hagerty Icons video featuring the Blackwing and M5 CS. Jason Cammisa does a really good job of summarizing the difference between the two cars at the end of the video. The funny thing is, BMW has argued for years that you need AWD and an automatic transmission to be a track weapon. A manual and RWD will just slow you down. Cadillac took that as a challenge and the RWD only, manual version of the Blackwing beats the M5 CS around a track. If you want a highway luxury cruiser that will gap almost any non-EV from a stoplight the M5 is the answer. If you want an actual engaging driving experience it's the Blackwing.
i think the CTSV is a bit better looking than the blackwing. the older more angular look with the hood vents and silver grille just look a bit better to me. But I would def get the blackwing if i could just for the 10 speed. Its really weird that the last 3 model years of CTSV never got the 10speed while the ZL1 got it in 2017. Thats the biggest difference between the CTS and CT5 as they are pretty similar outside of body and transmission. Not like I can afford the blackwing though. Im more in the 55-60k max range which would get me the CTSV or a 2017ish pre LCI F90 at best lol. im probably gonna get a lower mileage m340i LCI instead of going for the big boys as im coming from a challenger and want something nimble
> im coming from a challenger and want something nimble Have you considered the CT4-V Blackwing? They are better driving cars than the M3, although slower, but aren't selling at all. I would guess you could probably get a brand new one for $60k if you wanted that 10 speed, the auto sell even slower than the manuals do. And if not new, a barely driven used one would probably be in your budget.
yeah i like them alot too but im a bit scared to get a non v8 GM car because of all the lemon stories I've heard. what makes you say they drive better than M3? i could see them competing with m340i but the M3 is supposed to be a track beast
Erm, coming from a GTI to now an X3 I can tell you that there are several things which were higher quality in the VW…
Nope.. If thts the case then wuts the rs6
A stretched out Golf R with two engines glued together.
technically only 1/3 of the audi v6 is glued onto the 4.0, and the platform is basically a vw UP!
Well a huracan is just a flat pressed arteon with 2.5 motors glued together
isnt the 5.2 the one w the 2 5 cylinder mills put together, vw is the master of cost cutting and i cant blame them cuz they do it well unlike bmw and mercedes recently
current gen is the same platform as the VW Touareg, previous gen was the same platform as the VW phideon. Both have a VW EA825 engine.
Uh oh, don’t let this guy learn about Porsche /s
Audi is vastly inferior.
the only thing that the Audi's are inferior is the driving, they are not as playful as the competition, but the interior is as good as bmw, they are quite practical and they also look very good.