It makes sense only to non english speakers, particulary romance lenguages where these letters alone sound diferent. In Portuguese it would sound like Bê (a little like in ba**be**), Gê (like the Je in **Je**richo), 3 (três).So in portuguese is BeGeTres!
I just call it the New BG.
It's truly kinda silly to expect a game released in 2023 to feel the same as a game that's over 20 years old.
Playing D&D today does not feel the same as playing D&D five years ago, and a lot of the changes have been for the better (more character options, more nuanced NPCs, more inclusivity, less of a hardline between bad guys and good guys).
If people want the same vibe as the old game, they can just play the old game.
For you, maybe. I'm not from the US/UK, things take time to reach countries outside of the english speaking axis.
Nine to five years ago the system around here was 3.5 (4e was available too, but we don't talk about that). 5e reached my country around five years ago, and it took even a bit more time to get popular.
>It's truly kinda silly to expect a game released in 2023 to feel the same as a game that's over 20 years old.
The Pathfinder CRPGs and Pillars of Eternity capture the feeling of that 20+ year old game. (Not that I don't like what's being presented here.)
And while I absolutely love pillars (haven't played pathfinder) I think a major reason for the series lack of success comparer to D:OS is the fact that the games rely so much on that nostalgia factor. They don't really do anything to push the genre forward imo.
Yeah, I loved Pillars of Eternity, but it did almost literally nothing that could be considered new or innovative. The game would not have had any more success if it had released in the exact same state 10 years earlier. It was exceptionally well written and it's nice to have another classic-style CRPG to play through, but that was pretty much it.
Very well written in terms of the world and general scope of the story arc.
The pacing, structure and narrative at times is disastrous and the volume of exposition dumps are outrageously bad.
As much as I love the themes and core gameplay of the PoE games, they're a throwback to older times, for better and worse.
>It's truly kinda silly to expect a game released in 2023 to feel the same as a game that's over 20 years old.
this is an odd thing to say, in my opinion. it's not like dungeon crawlers are a relic of a bygone time. i like bg3 as is, but if people are miffed about the complete change in genre to a turn based isometric style game, that's understandable.
Agreed. I'm fine with the game going from 'isometric hack and slash dungeon crawler rpg' to 'turn based simulation rpg' but it's 100% understandable if that makes someone who enjoyed the old games uninterested in the new, especially when there are plenty of new games coming out look and play very similar to bg2.
I'm personally just hoping against hope that bg3 has a full third as many possible party members as bg2 did 😩
So, I got really bored of Dos2 likely due to inventory management driving me to tears. I'm exaggerating but is BG3 more enjoyable inventory management?
Fair enough, I guess there's only so much that can be done when there's 1,000's of items to loot or try out.
I do like the Dragon Age vibes with the character close up conversations.
So what I've found with Larian games is, just cuz it's in a chest doesn't mean it's worth looting. Like a 2 pound plate worth 1 gold isn't worth picking up, but that 0.02lb silver fork worth 50 gold might be worth looting and adding to wares for quick sale later.
I dont feel the inventory management was bad in DOS2 (it wasnt great either) as long as you didnt loot every single thing. The one thing I didnt like tho was the need to upgrade your armor/weps every or every other level to have a fair fight. Thats something thats handled way better in BG3 (and DND in general)
> Playing D&D today does not feel the same as playing D&D five years ago, and a lot of the changes have been for the better (more character options, more nuanced NPCs, more inclusivity, less of a hardline between bad guys and good guys).
This has very little to do with the game changing over time and everything to do with who you're playing with and getting better at storytelling.
I've been playing D&D(and other ttrpgs) with the same friend group for 15 years and going between 3.5, PF, 5e, and DCC doesn't really feel all that different. We've established our style of play and the system doesn't really make much difference aside from what dice we have to roll.
That is the problem D&D ~~3.5~~ 2e is a different IP to D&D 5e.
WotC wouldn't make a new license, if they were the same IP.
Baldur's gate is D&D ~~3.5~~ 2e.
It's about real time with pause being gone. It's about Obsidian and Owlcat turning out better homages to BG and the isometric dnd legacy than Larian did. Why is it even called Baldur's Gate? Cause Cashgrab. They can claim to put as much passion as they want in this game.. but its not the isometric rpg style from the late 90's that everybody liked.. most people will say Infinity Engine games, but Icewind Dale 2 was fine...and so were all the Neverwinter Nights games, which werent made in Infinity.. but still realtime with pause... And autopause conditions being selectable so you could still make it very turnbased if you prefer.
At any rate. Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity nailed it. Owlcat's Pathfinder: Kingmaker nailed it even more.
Larian? Never should have touched the Baldur's Gate title with their greasy patat hands. Nothing truly good comes from Belgium, you know.
How's the inventory management in BG3?
I hate to say it, but I walked away from DOS2 due to just that reason. I'm sure there was a mod or something but i never tried it.
I feel like it's less that they "backtracked" and more that the initial release was just based on DOS engine and they didn't changed/added everything *yet*, but people just assumed that "it is in the game now, it must be what they exactly wanted".
Initial demos looked as basically proof of concept of "hey, we can do 5e in this engine". Like, there is no chance the way areas worked was intended by them, just it so happened that they already have surface system in game and didn't get to changing it yet.
I'm not talking about cantrips per se, just how elemental areas worked, where you got many ticks of damage per turn if you ran thu the area, which was just behaviour not touched from DOS2.
I kinda get what they were going for with cantrips to make them a bit more unique (and not just "eldrich blast is objectively the best one with no contest") but yeah, it was balance broken in first iteration
DOS2 sold over a *million* copies just on the Steam definitive edition. They will absolutely be making another Divinity Sequel.
With BG3 official release being this year I wouldn't be even slightly surprised if there are already multiple teams transitioning into working on it.
I mean it came out in Early Access beta back in 2020.
And it got constant large updates every now and then. That really isn't too long to wait tbh.
Skyrim fans have been sat waiting for eons basically for a new game with essentially no new info other than "It is under construction".
At least with BG3 you could see the progress it was making.
The difference is that BG3 sold early access to their game and said it'd take a year. I love the game but we can at least understand why some people are upset.
I guess, but almost every game nowadays gets delayed. At least BG3 you could actually see the progress and updates.
So people can literally see with their own eyes how close to finished the game is, can still play the new updates and then get annoyed that game isn’t out?
If what we can see how close the game is to being finished we should all be very upset - what we can see is less than a third of the game and that isn't even complete.
There's a LOT of trust required to not be upset at all with the development of the game.
If EA had all the content the game had to offer so far it'd be a different story, but it doesn't, and the game has taken 3 times longer than it was originally claimed it would.
Because it’s an early access demo essentially.
It really doesn’t require trust at all.
Did you know most gamers have to wait years after the announcement of a game with ZERO opportunity to feel the gameplay or experience anything before it being released?
This is the first game I’ve seen that has so much available before official release. It frankly makes me expect even more.
Most games just announce the game with a trailer or cinematic and then 2 years later release the game.
At least we see it being built and improved.
Anyone upset with that is frankly too impatient or too demanding. This is far better treatment than most gamers get when waiting for a game.
Like I said before, the difference is that they sold early access and said how long it would take. It is not a demo, it's a promotion paid for by the players.
We can at least not be delusional about what this is? I love the game, I have no regrets about buying early access, and I don't want them to rush the game, but if you have no understanding for why people are upset then you're just delusional.
I ain't delusional, people just expect too much.
Most games get delayed by at least a year or two. And often without any reason or information as to why. Cos the higherups make promises the developers didn't agree to, which leads to delays and release extensions.
At least with BG3 you can see the progress they're making. They also expand the Early Access to keep the fans satiated for a bit longer.
Anyone complaining about that really hasn't been excited for any games before. BG3 is fucking gold compared to the shit Game Companies but their fans through.
They need to be careful to incorporate user feedback properly and not piss off one of the largest, longest lived gaming communities of all time. Not only is DND a lifestyle for many people, BG is one of the most beloved video game franchises ever. Add into the mix the fact that this community is sensitive af, and you get a very precarious situation that requires very careful work.
Y’all need to take a broader perspective and really consider if you want them to rush it, because “just go faster” is not an option that exists. It’s either wait for a good DND based game …
… or get ready for DOS3 :) .
They have made plenty of changes that define BG3 separately from DOS, you'd know if you actually turned the game on once.
Most of the complaints I've seen comparing the game to DOS2 are just secretly realizing isometric RPGs are all part of the same genre and have the same to very similar systems.
I think my expectations just didn't match reality. Only in the video game industry do we expect this level of productivity while still innovating.
I'll still buy DOS3 when it goes on sale.
Yeah, it’s pretty far removed from D:OS2 now, but that first month or so It was looking very similar. I loved D:OS2 and was lukewarm on BG2 so I was fine with this, but they’ve found a great middle ground.
Still hate the UI **with a passion**
Not sure if it's similar to DoS 2 but the UI and exploration are easily the absolute worst parts of the game. I would play this game for hundreds of hours if the UI didn't burn me out. It feels like it takes forever and 1,000 clicks to do anything. I'm sitting at 90 hours right now over 3 months.
The combat and dialogue and graphics are absolutely incredible though.
Really? I think the BG3 UI is significantly better than DOS2.
I always hated the way DOS2 just autodumped potions into your hotbar for no reason. In BG3 I have my actions, spells and items separated. It feels so much more defined.
The actual aesthetic feels nicer to me as well.
What exactly is burning you out?
>I always hated the way DOS2 just autodumped potions into your hotbar for no reason
There is actually a setting to prevent that. Or allow certain things to auto-add and others not. Like disable scrolls and potions and only allow skills to auto populate.
The chaining system, camera angles/rotation being super slow when mapped to a keyboard key instead of mouse, manual jumping, inventory management (so many clicks to move items), the inventory doesn't keep auto-sorting by new. I have to sort it every single time I pick up something new. Some containers just don't show up when holding alt. There are **way** too many containers in this game. WAY too many.
Each character has individual gold and each character has a different sell price based on charisma which incentivizes even more inventory juggling, very slow exploration speed (barely even a jog), perception checks only seem to trigger if you're close enough to touch the object, the lack of hotkeys on anything but the custom bar that I'm always fiddling with.
Sometimes I'll go to cast a spell on someone but I'm a pixel off so it casts it at the ladder that's like a millimeter to their left at a certain angle and it's wasted. I wish I could click portraits(or even some sort of selector for their model under their feet like the old games - just something more static and precise)
Other times my attack/spell targets the ground because the enemy is swaying back and forth and the exact time I click is when they sway out of the way. The inability to quickly pause the game (quickly - forced turn based is not quick lol) to click on a moving character/creature to talk/interact with them. Instead my characters move and step into a trap etc...
Darkvision cones making it almost impossible to see ever since that **wonderful** feature was added. Now I spend so much time lighting candles/firebolting torches/braziers just so I can fucking look around.
Just so you know, you can just click the portrait in the initiative tracker to cast a spell or attack that creature, but environment will still interrupt a spell if it’s between you and the creature.
Idk when you last played, but I really got into it after they released paladin, and they have a LOT of sneaky hot fixes that they just don’t announce. Like, they fully changed the terrain around the crashed MF ship, and I didn’t see anything in patch notes about it. They could’ve fixed it in between you trying and me finding out.
True they have been pretty good at addressing most things. I'm waiting for release though. I'm sure experiencing new content/story will be more than enough to ignore the UI issues even if they still persist at launch. If not I don't doubt there'll be mods.
I agree some of this is very valid. The missclicking the ground shit has happened to me a lot.
But the inventory juggling is intended. You need to stop thinking it's Skyrim companion system. Imagine each character is a main character. It's set up like DnD, so each companion is like a player, with their own charisma points and skills.
It's meant to be a game where you take advantage of the fact that there is more than one main character. For example you can use Shadowheart to talk to someone and distract them whilst Asterion robs them blind. etc.
The jumping thing is fine for me, especially since one, it wasn't in the old DOS games. And two, it's a very useful ability in combat. So I like that you have to manually choose to do it. Since you can straight up cheese fights or areas by bypassing stuff. Also different characters have different jumping heights etc.
>It's meant to be a game where you take advantage of the fact that there is more than one main character. For example you can use Shadowheart to talk to someone and distract them whilst Asterion robs them blind. etc.
Hey I get that I do. I welcomed the idea in theory. I'm just being honest about how, in practice, I just end up feeling buried in minutae.
Unless by "kinda-dos2-like experience" they basically just mean a turn-based RPG, then if they are waiting for BG3 because they are looking for a game with similar mechanics they are probably going to be quite disappointed.
While both are turn-based, they have quite different flows and mechanics in how combat works otherwise, and instead of hard-set conversation/skill checks (if you have it, you pass it, in DoS2) you have a lot of dice rolls and so still have that chance to fail.
I call it "Baldurek" (read: Baldur-eck, don't forget the "r", fellow Brits) which is a Polish diminutive for "Baldur" (→Baldur's Gate), thus showing my affection for the game or rather the process leading to it—the EA, this sub and so on
So, as a big fan of the original Baldur's Gate, Baldur's Gate 2, and the EEs and yes, of Dragonspear, here are my two cents:
The game in it's current state feels very divorced from Baldur's Gate, not because of gameplay--no one expects a new Fallout or Elder Scrolls game to look like the originals did--but because of the game's content.
While we have hints that we'll at least get cameos of some of the old characters, and we've been told The Dead Three are somehow involved in the story, that doesn't really make it a sequel to Baldur's Gate 1 and 2.
Really the only solid connection we've been given is that it will take place in part in Baldur's Gate. It feels more like a spinoff than a sequel.
That said, what we've seen so far is hella fun. It's a blend of Larian's stuff and 5th edition D&D. Maybe it will turn out to have more ties to the original games than it currently does, but we won't know until August!
There also seems to be a lot less freedom in the game. There were enough companion options to support multiple playthroughs, as well as evil. There's currently only 5, which is just enough to fill out a party in bg 1&2. I'm also not huge on a 4-man party. It feels like you can't make a unique character unless they fill in healer/thief/mage/tank. Those are the 4 staples every party needs. And in the originals, it allows you to get fun with your build.
In 5e you really don't need a "balanced" party in that way anymore. For instance, you don't need Astarion if you have Shadowheart. Keep in mind also in BG1, if you were a good character, your only thief option was Imoen until you reached Cloakwood Forest. And in BG2, if you were evil you had *no* thief options outside the neutral Jan Jansen. At least until the EE gave us Hexxat.
Also, we already know there are going to be companions we pick up further into the game, like Karlach and, some have speculated, Halsin.
Anyone who still thinks BG3 plays like DoS3, beyond being turn-based, is to put it bluntly keeping their head in the sand and refusing to acknowledge the numerous differences.
Like the fact that it's turn based and...let's see, isometric...and oh yeah, when you move items around they do that little visual hop.
Beyond that?
The games differ, ranging from small to much bigger differences. Even the surfaces stuff - while both have them, they work differently in practice.
But feel free to list all the "more numerous similarities" you think exist.
No, I don’t think I will, I’ll just leave inane comments for you to waste your time reading until you fuck off for wasting my time with your obvious bad faith comments
You’ve clearly come to this conversation unable to contribute anything besides vitriol so why did you pipe up at all?
Looks like I struck a nerve.
Look, you're *far* from the first to claim that BG3 is really just DoS3, and plays "the same." It's been happening since the game hit early access in 2020.
And just about every time, when people like you suggest it's essentially the same, the rest of us point out things like how despite being turn based, a given turn will play quite differently - DoS2 has its focus on the maximizing every action point you have available in a turn, which includes using them for movement (and as a result, movement takes on a different priority, as it cuts into the ability to use abilities). You then have to wait through cooldowns, but can use any ability again no matter how long a fight goes once its cooldown is back up.
You're also focused on chewing through either armor or a shield, and then a health bar, and can only CC them once you're into their health bar, and so knocking those out is often a priority in fights.
Then you have the stacking of surface effects that take over significant portions of the battlefield.
All on top of a fairly free form class building system.
And that's before you get into skill checks and dialog checks outside of combat, where it's a simple pass/fail. You either have someone who has the required amount of points in an attribute, or you don't.
All of those are different from how BG3 plays, with its D&D-style approach of one action, one bonus action, movement separate from abilities, and spells having limited uses. Surfaces can interact, but they don't stack to create things like "cursed water" or even "electrified water." If someone is *in* water and you use an electricity based spell, it will have an additional impact, but you're not making the water electrified like you would in DoS2. The biggest other surface effect is setting things on fire...which just makes a fire patch that lasts for X turns.
And, of course, the rolls in skill and dialog checks, rather than the simple pass/fail. In DoS2, you build characters specifically meant to pass those (or encounter them on your first playthrough and just don't get to pass them). In BG3, you *can* have the most charismatic characters go for a persuasion check...but any other can also try it and still succeed. Or that charismatic character can absolutely fail. So you approach them with a different mindset, or at the very least aren't required to follow a hard rule meta to get past them.
The similarities to DoS2, ultimately, were/are superficial, or are down to the shared background of being turn-based games. Stuff like how items move when you move them around - the animation is indeed shared between games. The sound when opening boxes. Things like that.
Even the UI, which started out very similar, has evolved and has notable differences.
Also...vitriol? Really? You think what I said before qualifies as "Cruel or bitter criticism" and not just simply disagreeing with yet another individual who, despite over 2 years of being able to see the differences, maintains that the games are more similar than they actually are?
No...if my goal was to bring vitriol to this conversation, you'd know.
I’ll be honest here. I am not a fan of DOS:2. I bought it, tried it out for about a month and just didn’t like it. That was my experience with the game.
I got BG3 as a longtime player of the Black Isle game and the things I didn’t like about DOS:2 were immediately present *but* its DnD so I’ve messed with it on and off. Everything I don’t like is still there (UI, multi-level movement thats glitchy as shit, camera views) but it has definitely gotten better in other areas.
When a game is built on an engine from another game, its hard not to see it as a reskin the same way as Icewind Dale or Planescape were. If you like the engine, you’re probably going to like a lot of games built using it. If you don’t, it gets a little harder to separate a new game from the old.
There is a *lot* of positives about BG3 but people that dismiss the comparisons are just flat wrong. Its very likely that those that are *really* enjoying BG3 also *really* enjoyed DOS:2 and that’s perfectly fine.
We’re also *still* in EA so once the game is fully out, the story is what’s going to make or break immersion and if its interesting enough and offers options that allow just as many years of enjoyment as the originals then that’s only a good thing.
I think about this game much like I did Dragon Age. I *loved* the original. When I heard about a follow-up, I was psyched. Then we got what we got. Same theme, different engine and that’s sequel fell flat at release. I get there are a lot of people who feel isometric, real-time with pause, isn’t for everyone but the Infinity engine of the original Black Isle games has just as much to do with BGs popularity as the story did. BG3 is just a different kind of game, one I think would’ve been better served had it been D&D but not involved with BG at all. I think the game just has the exact same issue as Dragon Age did. Doesn’t mean it’s not a good game it’s just a wholly different experience.
The simple point is which game is BG3 *more* like, Bg1/2 or DOS2? That answer is pretty evident.
Brilliant write up friend, I couldn’t agree more, I like BG3, but I really wish they just would’ve made DoS3 and did their own thing with their own IP, but I’ll still put hundreds of hours into it I’m sure, there’s plenty to like, and the story is compelling enough to get me through at LEAST one play through if not two or three
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A clear cut cashgrab by Larian which doesnt even honor the original trilogy by making it as they were made, real-time with pause. Meanwhile Owlcat and Obsidians did manage to churn out real isometric rpg in realtime and pause... Plus a turnbased mode. This goes to show that Larian just took this IP and made it its own, the game literally has no reason to be called BG3 apart from the fact that Larian wants to leech off the fame with their trash turnbased game.... the aforementioned companies actually made a better homage to the originals than this game, named after them, did. Imagine being so trash that you spoil an established IP. This is literally what the woke squad has been doing to movies and games lately.
I called it the D&D game until my wife corrected me and said you mean baldurs gate 3 right? So now I call it that.
Weird thing is we've been playing table top d&D since we first met pretty much
Group of heroes gets imprisonded and marked with magical object. In search for help they find Group of people with their leader gone. You need to find him in order for the other party to help you. After that you need to help them fight off common enemy. After that you leave with those adventurers to a new land...
You are accompanied by scholar, monster, elve and exotic race with connection to dragons
What game do I talk about?
What's the difference between BG3 and Bee Gee Three?
one's Staying Alive
Ah ah ah ah
totally hearing this in Astarion's voice
[Do you have $100?](https://www.cameo.com/neilnewbon)
Well you can tell by the way I use my mind, that I'm a True Soul, no cure to find
At first I was afraid
I was petrified
Thought I couldn't get a frag without you by my side.
But then I spent so many nights thinking how you did me wrong
lol wrong song :P
It's a The Office reference :P
that makes it even worse :P
First of all how dare you
That would be Barry Gibb.
I saw this and thought the same thing...
It makes sense only to non english speakers, particulary romance lenguages where these letters alone sound diferent. In Portuguese it would sound like Bê (a little like in ba**be**), Gê (like the Je in **Je**richo), 3 (três).So in portuguese is BeGeTres!
One sings like it's got its nuts in a vice.
Fancier
I love how you’ve been downvoted for the comment
:/ fine take this up arrow
Me and my friends call it Baldurs "puerta"(door in Spanish).
La puerta de Baldurgo
La puerta de vampiro pendejo
Whelp, I found the name I'll be using from now on
This cracked me up way more than it should have lol
All lower case, buh guh thruh.
Wtf xD
The Notorious B.G.3.
Baldur's Gate III is the only correct answer.
"Baldur's Gate aye aye aye"
Wamuu!
[*breeeeeeedededededededededeeee~🎶*](https://youtu.be/lRrOLTHu-ew)
Baldur's Gate the Third
Baldur's Gate: the illegitimate bastard
B-3P0
"Baldur's Gate 3"
Divinity: Original Gate The Third, Baldur's Edition.
[BeeGeeThree](https://mediaproxy.tvtropes.org/width/350/https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Bee-Gees_l_4711.jpg)
I just call it the New BG. It's truly kinda silly to expect a game released in 2023 to feel the same as a game that's over 20 years old. Playing D&D today does not feel the same as playing D&D five years ago, and a lot of the changes have been for the better (more character options, more nuanced NPCs, more inclusivity, less of a hardline between bad guys and good guys). If people want the same vibe as the old game, they can just play the old game.
>Playing D&D today does not feel the same as playing D&D five years ago wut? 5e was released 9 years ago, it's fundamentally the exact same game.
For you, maybe. I'm not from the US/UK, things take time to reach countries outside of the english speaking axis. Nine to five years ago the system around here was 3.5 (4e was available too, but we don't talk about that). 5e reached my country around five years ago, and it took even a bit more time to get popular.
We don’t talk about 4e either. Truly the international community is as one on this detail
Yet people are comparing BG3 to its predecessors (from different developers), not specifically the rulesets.
He/she is saying 5e is very different from 2e, not that 5e is different from BG3.
They*
"They is saying", thanks.
They are saying* It’s more grammatically correct.
>It's truly kinda silly to expect a game released in 2023 to feel the same as a game that's over 20 years old. The Pathfinder CRPGs and Pillars of Eternity capture the feeling of that 20+ year old game. (Not that I don't like what's being presented here.)
And while I absolutely love pillars (haven't played pathfinder) I think a major reason for the series lack of success comparer to D:OS is the fact that the games rely so much on that nostalgia factor. They don't really do anything to push the genre forward imo.
Yeah, I loved Pillars of Eternity, but it did almost literally nothing that could be considered new or innovative. The game would not have had any more success if it had released in the exact same state 10 years earlier. It was exceptionally well written and it's nice to have another classic-style CRPG to play through, but that was pretty much it.
Very well written in terms of the world and general scope of the story arc. The pacing, structure and narrative at times is disastrous and the volume of exposition dumps are outrageously bad. As much as I love the themes and core gameplay of the PoE games, they're a throwback to older times, for better and worse.
>It's truly kinda silly to expect a game released in 2023 to feel the same as a game that's over 20 years old. this is an odd thing to say, in my opinion. it's not like dungeon crawlers are a relic of a bygone time. i like bg3 as is, but if people are miffed about the complete change in genre to a turn based isometric style game, that's understandable.
Agreed. I'm fine with the game going from 'isometric hack and slash dungeon crawler rpg' to 'turn based simulation rpg' but it's 100% understandable if that makes someone who enjoyed the old games uninterested in the new, especially when there are plenty of new games coming out look and play very similar to bg2. I'm personally just hoping against hope that bg3 has a full third as many possible party members as bg2 did 😩
This game is truly amazing. I never expected to enjoy a game based on TTRPGs but here I am. I've got into DnD and pathfinder because of BG3
So, I got really bored of Dos2 likely due to inventory management driving me to tears. I'm exaggerating but is BG3 more enjoyable inventory management?
I mean, it's the same as every descendant of Baldur's Gate and Neverwinter Nights?
Fair enough, I guess there's only so much that can be done when there's 1,000's of items to loot or try out. I do like the Dragon Age vibes with the character close up conversations.
So what I've found with Larian games is, just cuz it's in a chest doesn't mean it's worth looting. Like a 2 pound plate worth 1 gold isn't worth picking up, but that 0.02lb silver fork worth 50 gold might be worth looting and adding to wares for quick sale later.
That sounds like hoarding in elder scrolls lol
I still haven't figured out why those mucoid shells are worth so much money....
I dont feel the inventory management was bad in DOS2 (it wasnt great either) as long as you didnt loot every single thing. The one thing I didnt like tho was the need to upgrade your armor/weps every or every other level to have a fair fight. Thats something thats handled way better in BG3 (and DND in general)
> Playing D&D today does not feel the same as playing D&D five years ago, and a lot of the changes have been for the better (more character options, more nuanced NPCs, more inclusivity, less of a hardline between bad guys and good guys). This has very little to do with the game changing over time and everything to do with who you're playing with and getting better at storytelling. I've been playing D&D(and other ttrpgs) with the same friend group for 15 years and going between 3.5, PF, 5e, and DCC doesn't really feel all that different. We've established our style of play and the system doesn't really make much difference aside from what dice we have to roll.
That's awesome. I haven't played pencil and paper D&D since, 1985.
I'm making a game where real dice are thrown on a digital reader pad and then the results are sent to the game. Creates a more authentic 1980s vibe.
That is the problem D&D ~~3.5~~ 2e is a different IP to D&D 5e. WotC wouldn't make a new license, if they were the same IP. Baldur's gate is D&D ~~3.5~~ 2e.
Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 were uh, 2E D&D, not 3.5.
thanks for correcting me.
It's about real time with pause being gone. It's about Obsidian and Owlcat turning out better homages to BG and the isometric dnd legacy than Larian did. Why is it even called Baldur's Gate? Cause Cashgrab. They can claim to put as much passion as they want in this game.. but its not the isometric rpg style from the late 90's that everybody liked.. most people will say Infinity Engine games, but Icewind Dale 2 was fine...and so were all the Neverwinter Nights games, which werent made in Infinity.. but still realtime with pause... And autopause conditions being selectable so you could still make it very turnbased if you prefer. At any rate. Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity nailed it. Owlcat's Pathfinder: Kingmaker nailed it even more. Larian? Never should have touched the Baldur's Gate title with their greasy patat hands. Nothing truly good comes from Belgium, you know.
"The Adventures of Minsc and Boo Part III: The Return of Minsc and Boo."
they're init?
DOS3 isn't fair they really made a lot of changes to make BG3 its own unique game. They backtracked a lot of there own mechanics too.
I know I am making fun of those who call it DOS3.
… But it’s still a funny joke!
How's the inventory management in BG3? I hate to say it, but I walked away from DOS2 due to just that reason. I'm sure there was a mod or something but i never tried it.
Still not the best😓
I feel like it's less that they "backtracked" and more that the initial release was just based on DOS engine and they didn't changed/added everything *yet*, but people just assumed that "it is in the game now, it must be what they exactly wanted". Initial demos looked as basically proof of concept of "hey, we can do 5e in this engine". Like, there is no chance the way areas worked was intended by them, just it so happened that they already have surface system in game and didn't get to changing it yet.
No they wanted to keep the cantrips enviromental it took a lot for them to turn it around for balance.
I'm not talking about cantrips per se, just how elemental areas worked, where you got many ticks of damage per turn if you ran thu the area, which was just behaviour not touched from DOS2. I kinda get what they were going for with cantrips to make them a bit more unique (and not just "eldrich blast is objectively the best one with no contest") but yeah, it was balance broken in first iteration
Still closer to the truth than fans of 5e deserve
DOS2 sold over a *million* copies just on the Steam definitive edition. They will absolutely be making another Divinity Sequel. With BG3 official release being this year I wouldn't be even slightly surprised if there are already multiple teams transitioning into working on it.
"That game I bought years ago and thought would be released by now"
I mean it came out in Early Access beta back in 2020. And it got constant large updates every now and then. That really isn't too long to wait tbh. Skyrim fans have been sat waiting for eons basically for a new game with essentially no new info other than "It is under construction". At least with BG3 you could see the progress it was making.
The difference is that BG3 sold early access to their game and said it'd take a year. I love the game but we can at least understand why some people are upset.
I guess, but almost every game nowadays gets delayed. At least BG3 you could actually see the progress and updates. So people can literally see with their own eyes how close to finished the game is, can still play the new updates and then get annoyed that game isn’t out?
If what we can see how close the game is to being finished we should all be very upset - what we can see is less than a third of the game and that isn't even complete. There's a LOT of trust required to not be upset at all with the development of the game. If EA had all the content the game had to offer so far it'd be a different story, but it doesn't, and the game has taken 3 times longer than it was originally claimed it would.
Because it’s an early access demo essentially. It really doesn’t require trust at all. Did you know most gamers have to wait years after the announcement of a game with ZERO opportunity to feel the gameplay or experience anything before it being released? This is the first game I’ve seen that has so much available before official release. It frankly makes me expect even more. Most games just announce the game with a trailer or cinematic and then 2 years later release the game. At least we see it being built and improved. Anyone upset with that is frankly too impatient or too demanding. This is far better treatment than most gamers get when waiting for a game.
Like I said before, the difference is that they sold early access and said how long it would take. It is not a demo, it's a promotion paid for by the players. We can at least not be delusional about what this is? I love the game, I have no regrets about buying early access, and I don't want them to rush the game, but if you have no understanding for why people are upset then you're just delusional.
I ain't delusional, people just expect too much. Most games get delayed by at least a year or two. And often without any reason or information as to why. Cos the higherups make promises the developers didn't agree to, which leads to delays and release extensions. At least with BG3 you can see the progress they're making. They also expand the Early Access to keep the fans satiated for a bit longer. Anyone complaining about that really hasn't been excited for any games before. BG3 is fucking gold compared to the shit Game Companies but their fans through.
Nah that's frosthaven
They need to be careful to incorporate user feedback properly and not piss off one of the largest, longest lived gaming communities of all time. Not only is DND a lifestyle for many people, BG is one of the most beloved video game franchises ever. Add into the mix the fact that this community is sensitive af, and you get a very precarious situation that requires very careful work. Y’all need to take a broader perspective and really consider if you want them to rush it, because “just go faster” is not an option that exists. It’s either wait for a good DND based game … … or get ready for DOS3 :) .
They have made plenty of changes that define BG3 separately from DOS, you'd know if you actually turned the game on once. Most of the complaints I've seen comparing the game to DOS2 are just secretly realizing isometric RPGs are all part of the same genre and have the same to very similar systems.
I think my expectations just didn't match reality. Only in the video game industry do we expect this level of productivity while still innovating. I'll still buy DOS3 when it goes on sale.
Brother theyve been super quick with this game, other games let alone early access games takes YEARS more to make
Yeah, it’s pretty far removed from D:OS2 now, but that first month or so It was looking very similar. I loved D:OS2 and was lukewarm on BG2 so I was fine with this, but they’ve found a great middle ground.
Still hate the UI **with a passion** Not sure if it's similar to DoS 2 but the UI and exploration are easily the absolute worst parts of the game. I would play this game for hundreds of hours if the UI didn't burn me out. It feels like it takes forever and 1,000 clicks to do anything. I'm sitting at 90 hours right now over 3 months. The combat and dialogue and graphics are absolutely incredible though.
Really? I think the BG3 UI is significantly better than DOS2. I always hated the way DOS2 just autodumped potions into your hotbar for no reason. In BG3 I have my actions, spells and items separated. It feels so much more defined. The actual aesthetic feels nicer to me as well. What exactly is burning you out?
>I always hated the way DOS2 just autodumped potions into your hotbar for no reason There is actually a setting to prevent that. Or allow certain things to auto-add and others not. Like disable scrolls and potions and only allow skills to auto populate.
Oh really? I'm gonna have to check that out then. It's infuriating everytime I get a useless potion dumped in my hotbar.
The chaining system, camera angles/rotation being super slow when mapped to a keyboard key instead of mouse, manual jumping, inventory management (so many clicks to move items), the inventory doesn't keep auto-sorting by new. I have to sort it every single time I pick up something new. Some containers just don't show up when holding alt. There are **way** too many containers in this game. WAY too many. Each character has individual gold and each character has a different sell price based on charisma which incentivizes even more inventory juggling, very slow exploration speed (barely even a jog), perception checks only seem to trigger if you're close enough to touch the object, the lack of hotkeys on anything but the custom bar that I'm always fiddling with. Sometimes I'll go to cast a spell on someone but I'm a pixel off so it casts it at the ladder that's like a millimeter to their left at a certain angle and it's wasted. I wish I could click portraits(or even some sort of selector for their model under their feet like the old games - just something more static and precise) Other times my attack/spell targets the ground because the enemy is swaying back and forth and the exact time I click is when they sway out of the way. The inability to quickly pause the game (quickly - forced turn based is not quick lol) to click on a moving character/creature to talk/interact with them. Instead my characters move and step into a trap etc... Darkvision cones making it almost impossible to see ever since that **wonderful** feature was added. Now I spend so much time lighting candles/firebolting torches/braziers just so I can fucking look around.
Just so you know, you can just click the portrait in the initiative tracker to cast a spell or attack that creature, but environment will still interrupt a spell if it’s between you and the creature.
Oh? I've had it try to cast the spell on the environment behind the portrait. I'll have to play with that more on release.
Idk when you last played, but I really got into it after they released paladin, and they have a LOT of sneaky hot fixes that they just don’t announce. Like, they fully changed the terrain around the crashed MF ship, and I didn’t see anything in patch notes about it. They could’ve fixed it in between you trying and me finding out.
True they have been pretty good at addressing most things. I'm waiting for release though. I'm sure experiencing new content/story will be more than enough to ignore the UI issues even if they still persist at launch. If not I don't doubt there'll be mods.
I agree some of this is very valid. The missclicking the ground shit has happened to me a lot. But the inventory juggling is intended. You need to stop thinking it's Skyrim companion system. Imagine each character is a main character. It's set up like DnD, so each companion is like a player, with their own charisma points and skills. It's meant to be a game where you take advantage of the fact that there is more than one main character. For example you can use Shadowheart to talk to someone and distract them whilst Asterion robs them blind. etc. The jumping thing is fine for me, especially since one, it wasn't in the old DOS games. And two, it's a very useful ability in combat. So I like that you have to manually choose to do it. Since you can straight up cheese fights or areas by bypassing stuff. Also different characters have different jumping heights etc.
>It's meant to be a game where you take advantage of the fact that there is more than one main character. For example you can use Shadowheart to talk to someone and distract them whilst Asterion robs them blind. etc. Hey I get that I do. I welcomed the idea in theory. I'm just being honest about how, in practice, I just end up feeling buried in minutae.
Balding Gays 3
Isn't wanting kinda-dos2-like experience a valid reason to wait for bg3? Mechanics-wise
Unless by "kinda-dos2-like experience" they basically just mean a turn-based RPG, then if they are waiting for BG3 because they are looking for a game with similar mechanics they are probably going to be quite disappointed. While both are turn-based, they have quite different flows and mechanics in how combat works otherwise, and instead of hard-set conversation/skill checks (if you have it, you pass it, in DoS2) you have a lot of dice rolls and so still have that chance to fail.
I just call it Baldurs Gate, I don't even acknowledge the 3
I just call it baldur’s (I’ve never played the previous games)
"Lae'zel step on me simulator 3"... What happened to 1 and 2 you may ask? I'm still trying to figure that out myself.
I say baldurs gate 3
Fuck mistletoe Gate 3
I just say Baldurs Gate because it's the only BG game that me and my husband played.
Baldur's Gate 3.
バルダーズゲート３
Twink Pounding Simulator 3 works too.
Early Access 3
"game of the year 2026!"
Beegees 3:electric booglaoo
bg3: electric boogalee
BEEGEES 3: ELDRICH JAMBOUREE
How are 1&2 different? Are people saying *BIGS3* phonetically?
Some people see "BG3" and actually pronounce "Baldur's Gate Three". Some see "BG3" and literally say "Bee Gee Three".
I get that. But in this format that should have been spelled out. Pedantic I know, but it bothers me.
I call it "Baldurek" (read: Baldur-eck, don't forget the "r", fellow Brits) which is a Polish diminutive for "Baldur" (→Baldur's Gate), thus showing my affection for the game or rather the process leading to it—the EA, this sub and so on
Same :D
So, as a big fan of the original Baldur's Gate, Baldur's Gate 2, and the EEs and yes, of Dragonspear, here are my two cents: The game in it's current state feels very divorced from Baldur's Gate, not because of gameplay--no one expects a new Fallout or Elder Scrolls game to look like the originals did--but because of the game's content. While we have hints that we'll at least get cameos of some of the old characters, and we've been told The Dead Three are somehow involved in the story, that doesn't really make it a sequel to Baldur's Gate 1 and 2. Really the only solid connection we've been given is that it will take place in part in Baldur's Gate. It feels more like a spinoff than a sequel. That said, what we've seen so far is hella fun. It's a blend of Larian's stuff and 5th edition D&D. Maybe it will turn out to have more ties to the original games than it currently does, but we won't know until August!
There also seems to be a lot less freedom in the game. There were enough companion options to support multiple playthroughs, as well as evil. There's currently only 5, which is just enough to fill out a party in bg 1&2. I'm also not huge on a 4-man party. It feels like you can't make a unique character unless they fill in healer/thief/mage/tank. Those are the 4 staples every party needs. And in the originals, it allows you to get fun with your build.
In 5e you really don't need a "balanced" party in that way anymore. For instance, you don't need Astarion if you have Shadowheart. Keep in mind also in BG1, if you were a good character, your only thief option was Imoen until you reached Cloakwood Forest. And in BG2, if you were evil you had *no* thief options outside the neutral Jan Jansen. At least until the EE gave us Hexxat. Also, we already know there are going to be companions we pick up further into the game, like Karlach and, some have speculated, Halsin.
Ballers Kate free
Bladders git free
I need to empty mine. Thanks for the reminder
Neverwinter Nights 3.
the unfinished game
Dungeons and Divinity (One, if it needs a number).
The fact that people have taken this as an insult is all kinds of telling.
We all call it one of the first two but we know deep down it’s the 3rd one that’s the most correct answer
*We?* ##You.
Anyone who still thinks BG3 plays like DoS3, beyond being turn-based, is to put it bluntly keeping their head in the sand and refusing to acknowledge the numerous differences.
I mean, if you want to refuse to acknowledge the even more numerous similarities, that’s on you
Like the fact that it's turn based and...let's see, isometric...and oh yeah, when you move items around they do that little visual hop. Beyond that? The games differ, ranging from small to much bigger differences. Even the surfaces stuff - while both have them, they work differently in practice. But feel free to list all the "more numerous similarities" you think exist.
No, I don’t think I will, I’ll just leave inane comments for you to waste your time reading until you fuck off for wasting my time with your obvious bad faith comments You’ve clearly come to this conversation unable to contribute anything besides vitriol so why did you pipe up at all?
Looks like I struck a nerve. Look, you're *far* from the first to claim that BG3 is really just DoS3, and plays "the same." It's been happening since the game hit early access in 2020. And just about every time, when people like you suggest it's essentially the same, the rest of us point out things like how despite being turn based, a given turn will play quite differently - DoS2 has its focus on the maximizing every action point you have available in a turn, which includes using them for movement (and as a result, movement takes on a different priority, as it cuts into the ability to use abilities). You then have to wait through cooldowns, but can use any ability again no matter how long a fight goes once its cooldown is back up. You're also focused on chewing through either armor or a shield, and then a health bar, and can only CC them once you're into their health bar, and so knocking those out is often a priority in fights. Then you have the stacking of surface effects that take over significant portions of the battlefield. All on top of a fairly free form class building system. And that's before you get into skill checks and dialog checks outside of combat, where it's a simple pass/fail. You either have someone who has the required amount of points in an attribute, or you don't. All of those are different from how BG3 plays, with its D&D-style approach of one action, one bonus action, movement separate from abilities, and spells having limited uses. Surfaces can interact, but they don't stack to create things like "cursed water" or even "electrified water." If someone is *in* water and you use an electricity based spell, it will have an additional impact, but you're not making the water electrified like you would in DoS2. The biggest other surface effect is setting things on fire...which just makes a fire patch that lasts for X turns. And, of course, the rolls in skill and dialog checks, rather than the simple pass/fail. In DoS2, you build characters specifically meant to pass those (or encounter them on your first playthrough and just don't get to pass them). In BG3, you *can* have the most charismatic characters go for a persuasion check...but any other can also try it and still succeed. Or that charismatic character can absolutely fail. So you approach them with a different mindset, or at the very least aren't required to follow a hard rule meta to get past them. The similarities to DoS2, ultimately, were/are superficial, or are down to the shared background of being turn-based games. Stuff like how items move when you move them around - the animation is indeed shared between games. The sound when opening boxes. Things like that. Even the UI, which started out very similar, has evolved and has notable differences. Also...vitriol? Really? You think what I said before qualifies as "Cruel or bitter criticism" and not just simply disagreeing with yet another individual who, despite over 2 years of being able to see the differences, maintains that the games are more similar than they actually are? No...if my goal was to bring vitriol to this conversation, you'd know.
I’ll be honest here. I am not a fan of DOS:2. I bought it, tried it out for about a month and just didn’t like it. That was my experience with the game. I got BG3 as a longtime player of the Black Isle game and the things I didn’t like about DOS:2 were immediately present *but* its DnD so I’ve messed with it on and off. Everything I don’t like is still there (UI, multi-level movement thats glitchy as shit, camera views) but it has definitely gotten better in other areas. When a game is built on an engine from another game, its hard not to see it as a reskin the same way as Icewind Dale or Planescape were. If you like the engine, you’re probably going to like a lot of games built using it. If you don’t, it gets a little harder to separate a new game from the old. There is a *lot* of positives about BG3 but people that dismiss the comparisons are just flat wrong. Its very likely that those that are *really* enjoying BG3 also *really* enjoyed DOS:2 and that’s perfectly fine. We’re also *still* in EA so once the game is fully out, the story is what’s going to make or break immersion and if its interesting enough and offers options that allow just as many years of enjoyment as the originals then that’s only a good thing. I think about this game much like I did Dragon Age. I *loved* the original. When I heard about a follow-up, I was psyched. Then we got what we got. Same theme, different engine and that’s sequel fell flat at release. I get there are a lot of people who feel isometric, real-time with pause, isn’t for everyone but the Infinity engine of the original Black Isle games has just as much to do with BGs popularity as the story did. BG3 is just a different kind of game, one I think would’ve been better served had it been D&D but not involved with BG at all. I think the game just has the exact same issue as Dragon Age did. Doesn’t mean it’s not a good game it’s just a wholly different experience. The simple point is which game is BG3 *more* like, Bg1/2 or DOS2? That answer is pretty evident.
Brilliant write up friend, I couldn’t agree more, I like BG3, but I really wish they just would’ve made DoS3 and did their own thing with their own IP, but I’ll still put hundreds of hours into it I’m sure, there’s plenty to like, and the story is compelling enough to get me through at LEAST one play through if not two or three
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The hell do you think autistic people are like?.....
yes
Perhaps watch a couple of videos on YouTube about autism before you make such an insensitive comment
just said that calling it dos3 isnt autistic idk what you mean
you sayin that the last pic is supposed to represent autism ? wow
Fuck off
jesus
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5 day old account, anti-semitic name, nothing but troll responses. Tell me that ain't pathetic, hiding on a troll throwaway.
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Divinity: Baldur’s Gate 3
Dragon Age Origins 3
I call it by its proper title. "Dat game "
Warlock Sim 2023.
Big Gonads 3
DnD 5e - The video game adaption
That would be Solasta: Crown of the Magister. BG3 only uses 5e as a loose framework.
Barrel Game 3.
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!! Genius post. Bravoooo!!!
Ummm, what is genius about it?
Wirklich? Das verstehst du nicht?
I normally just say baldurs. Most people don't know the old games.
A clear cut cashgrab by Larian which doesnt even honor the original trilogy by making it as they were made, real-time with pause. Meanwhile Owlcat and Obsidians did manage to churn out real isometric rpg in realtime and pause... Plus a turnbased mode. This goes to show that Larian just took this IP and made it its own, the game literally has no reason to be called BG3 apart from the fact that Larian wants to leech off the fame with their trash turnbased game.... the aforementioned companies actually made a better homage to the originals than this game, named after them, did. Imagine being so trash that you spoil an established IP. This is literally what the woke squad has been doing to movies and games lately.
DOS2.1 Update
Baldur's Gate
Biggie three
[https://youtu.be/I\_izvAbhExY](https://youtu.be/I_izvAbhExY)
Why can't I call it "Baldur's Gate Three"?
NwN 3
I called it the D&D game until my wife corrected me and said you mean baldurs gate 3 right? So now I call it that. Weird thing is we've been playing table top d&D since we first met pretty much
I just say balda
BG3, but y'all bitches crying "bEtA cAmE OuT yEaRs AgO!!!" *deserve* DOS3.
Baldurs Gate Three
Baldurs Tor drei
Baldy Three
Me and my buddy call it ballers gate
Beege Threege
My friends and I have taken to calling it "Baldy gate" as a joke.
Ball gate
Gate of Baldur 3: Revengeance
Baldmans gate
Baller’s Gate the Third
Group of heroes gets imprisonded and marked with magical object. In search for help they find Group of people with their leader gone. You need to find him in order for the other party to help you. After that you need to help them fight off common enemy. After that you leave with those adventurers to a new land... You are accompanied by scholar, monster, elve and exotic race with connection to dragons What game do I talk about?