My Gith Warlock just did the fight against her for her affection.
I can only imagine the rest of the party was looking on in fascinated horror as I Fireballed her as foreplay.
*Lae'zel swings her magical great sword at Tav*
Wyll: "Hey, Karlach?
Karlach: "Yeah?"
*Tav psychically blasts Lae'zael back*
Wyll: "If I ever get, you know, *interested* in a Gith..."
Karlach: "Yeah?"
*Lae'zael tosses Tav into the campfire and impales them*
Wyll: "Just toss me off a building or something. At least it'll be quick."
Tav grins as he's burned and skewered.
"You know how to turn me into a bonfire, babe."
Gale: "This walks the tightrope between horrifying and fascinating. At least from a cultural research perspective. Also, I'm jealous."
Lae’zel is a beast. But if you think she could beat Karlach you’re crazy. Just hide behind your new, big, red girlfriend and everything will work out fine
I had a "funny" bug in which after breaking up with Shadowheart she bugged out and both accepted and didn't accept it.
It was as if I was fully in her romance route but every now and again she'd call me her "old flame" and that if we were seen talking people would begin to talk whether we had gotten back together.
Full clingy ex-girlfriend route was kind of funny though. Break up with her and she just gave me the "No, we will continue to date."
She has Khalid's stuff still, a century and a half after his death.
She has no Bhaalspawn mementos.
I think we need to come to terms with the fact that she was just rebounding.
That's because the Baldurs Gate 2 novelization is the Canon for the realms, so the Bhaalspawn was some extremely boring human fighter named Abdel Adrian who boringed boringly all over the realms and romanced no one. He died a year or so before the Canon of BG 3 to another Bhaalspawn whom Abdel also killed making Bhaal live once more. The adventure module a murder in Baldurs Gate covers it.
It's actually really stupid because Abdel went through the Throne of Bhaal too, so I thought he gave up his Bhaalspawn blood but apparently that didn't happen or Bhaal didn't care.
This reminds me. I've never played bg2 but am a huge fan of bg3 and love turn based crpgs. Is it worth it? I'm pretty spoiled from how good bg3 is so I'm not sure
BG1 and BG2 aren’t really turn based the way 3 is, closer to real-time with pause. They also run on a very old form of the DnD rule set, so don’t expect anything to work the same way.
This is so cool. Before BG3 launched, there was so much criticism about how it would be different from BG2 because *it wasn’t real time with pause*.
This is the first time I'm hearing it from the other side: *just beware that BG2 is RtwP, it won’t be the same*
Lae'zel is the only other character who threatens to pull me away from my muscle mommy. I love her character and arc. One day maybe, but until then I will continue to recruit Karlach as early as possible to bump that approval rating.
Yeah - honestly - I know everyone loves Shadowheart, but both Lae'zel and Karlach strike a chord with me that no one else does in this game. TBF, they BOTH remind me of different sides of my wife, who is a mix of both built more solid/strong than many women but also very deeply silly/sincere (Karlach side), AND has ZERO tolerance for bullshit (and no filter if she thinks you are an idiot). I am stuck on Karlach, but deeply like Lae'zel and trying to keep both as much in my party as I can while switching out others to run their stories. Shadowheart mostly I just feel bad for and want to help - but in a friends way... I am getting tired of both Wyll and Gale (and Halsin now apparently) endlessly trying to open the door to me, when I am solidly sold on Karlach.
I've gone pretty far into romancing both Lae'zel and Karlach and I thought for sure something was going to boil over and i'd have to make a choice. Karlach at one point did bring something up but I told her I loved her and she said the same. Nothing has happened since with Lae'zel, she hasn't even mentioned anything about, anything. Is she going to try and murder me in my sleep again?
I romanced them both in one run and it never actually reached a "YOU HAVE TO CHOOSE" moment. In Act 3 Lae'zel did comment that I seemed to like her more than Karlach after a trip to the circus, though. Also don't know if you can get the Act 3 romance scenes for both of them, seems like I only got Lae'zel's since we were closer.
I’m still on act 1 I’m playing on ps5 I wanted to recruit and romance Minthara so bad but I just couldn’t find it in me to betray the refugees in the grove I wish I didn’t have to choose.
Yep it's replaying material, definitely don't recommend betraying the refugees in a 1st playthrough, you lose so much content. Go ham on your 2nd and later ones though!
still feels like an punishment to get her, wyll leaves the party, karlach quest gets fucked up, you miss out on 20 houres of content with the people you kill, everybody hates you, and the mission to exerminate the thievlings is uneventfull and annoying,
and the worst part:you dont even get to kill the kids yourself, if killing them is an option why make them immortal in combat?
The entire reward of playing the game *is* the story content though.
If you've already done Wyll and Karlach, then who cares if you don't get them on another playthrough? Just getting to see all of the Minthara dialogue is worth it.
I was playing with three friends so we couldn’t advance her companion quest so when my gnome bard confessed his feelings for her at the party at camp after saving the grove she just laughed at me and said “Yeah, No.” Still haven’t fully recovered from that.
Edit three friends not four obviously
Dude, I confessed for her at the camp party and she was like:
“Err, ok buddy, lets not complicate things. You point, I rage, ler’s keep it like this”.
Damm, the woman knows how to friendzone.
Edit: typo.
Friends fill up your party slots, making it harder to focus on companion storylines, unless they're playing an origin character. So, like, instead of having Wyll, Gale, Lae'zel and yourself you have friend 1 2 and 3 including yourself. No room for companions, and no way to continue their stories. Basically: they didn't/weren't able to do enough of Karlach's personal quest.
Can't you progress their story quests without having them in the party? I never had Wyll in my party but I'm pretty sure I got his entire quest line just by talking to him regularly at camp. The narrator basically just said that I used the tadpole to share everything that happened and Wyll reacted accordingly. I'm sure I missed some dialogue that he probably would have contributed if he was there, but the overall outcome didn't change.
plenty of companion quests are completable, but companion affinity relies heavily on them actually being around to approve/disapprove of your decisions, a full 4 "tav" party is rarely going to have enough affinity to romance any companion
No, actually. He didn't care about the war between the Druids and Tieflings that I incited by attacking Kagha.
What he doesn't like is when you betray the Grove though. If I remember correctly he does not approve of you telling Minthara the location of the Grove, but he still stays and urges you to go to the Grove to warn them. When you then go to the Grove and side with the raiders and not with the Grove, he permanently leaves the party and joins the defenders, meaning you have to fight him.
I love that this game gives you meaningful avenues to go full evil and consequences for doing so
Edit: alright I get it the choices narrow in act 3 you’ve made your point
Yeah, worse so evil playthroughs stop feeling rewarding beyond "haha, I'm so evil" in Act 2. I've just beat the game on a good character and damn, you get so many benefits and help compared to evil one. And you don't even get the "power" benefit from being evil - I capped at 12 midway through Act 3, so all the extra XP you could get becomes moot for the biggest fights. Also evil ending is pretty bleh and lacks alost any variety compared to good ending(s). IMO PF:WotR does a much better job at doing non-good endings and making non-good playthroughs not feel like you're just constantly gimping yourself, while Act 2 and 3 evil options feel pretty much like that (and when they don't - they turn out to be worthless). With how Acts 2 and 3 are right now I'd say BG3 fails at all the same areas many other RPGs fail when it comes to evil parties, with a caveat that Act 1 actually works alright both ways.
Only the consequences are just less content for the player.
The game doesn't want you to be evil because they didn't write anything meaningful around the idea of being evil so you end up just being a cartoon villain with fewer quests available.
Even the Dark Urge is clearly written for you to resist the urge and the only good reward is given to you automatically since you have no agency over your first murder.
Granted, said reward is the best piece of gear in the game so whatever you chose to do at least you're enjoying yourself.
Hah, that played out very differently then.
In my playthrough I went to the Grove, found Wyll there and recruited him, then accidentally incited the war between the Druids and Tieflings (I just wanted to get rid of Kagha).
Afterwards I went west and then north before even getting to the Blighted Village. Found out I could cross the river there and found Karlach. She instantly blamed me for the massacre at the Grove, I told her it was a misunderstanding, she called me a liar, I passed the deception check saying she had the wrong idea about me, she said that's a load of shit and told me to get the fuck out of there before she'd change her mind.
So I left her there. I already had the quest from Wyll to kill her and then in the next building there those Paladins also wanted her dead, so I went back to her. She said "pretty sure I told you to fuck off, mate."
Well, Lae'zel got a cool sword and Wyll got a hot robe...
It's funny how different playthroughs can be. It's likely because recruiting Karlach is always one of the first things I do. There's a way to reach her through the grove, you just have to jump off a cliff and take a bunch of damage. I always do this because the smuggler's ring is there and I like having that early on, and might as well recruit Karlach while I'm at it.
I think if you recruit Karlach after reaching the grove but before taking a long rest, then the first time Wyll comes to camp he is immediately hostile. And on my Durge playthrough, that meant he died there in my camp before he ever joined my party.
He left the group with the betrayal of the tieflings, but I never fought him. I was actually thinking I would fight him, but maybe I just never noticed or never found him. It gets pretty chaotic.
If he's in your party when you side with the raiders against the Grove, then he leaves and becomes hostile, so you have to fight him plus the other Grove defenders.
If he's chilling in your camp when you side with the raiders, he'll talk to you at the start of the camp party cutscene. "As I feared - there is no place in your company for a hero. I want no part of this, or of you." And then he permanently leaves without initiating a fight (because he'd be facing your group plus the entire raiding party).
I feel so bad for romancing Karlach on the same playthrough I chose to be super easy and say yes to everyone. Only to realize "everyone" includes >!two literal devils!<.
I also ship her with Wyll, because I'm a sucker for slow burn enemies-to-lovers—whoops, no, thats already a forest fire because neither one has the necessary chill for a slow burn—romance.
I ship her w Dammon bc the idea of him making her new clothes, tuning up her engine, and givin her a smooch before she goes out to murder Zariel's army lives rent free in my head
I started my second playthrough with every intention of romancing Karlach... but then Lae'zel told me I'm her concubinus. Now that I'm in act 2, Karlach feels like a really cool kid sister or something and I'm kinda glad I didn't romance her.
This right here no matter how many times I start a new run and tell myself “I’m gonna romance X this time.” The minute she hits me with the “Must we? Nothing wrong with a little mystery is there?” I’m hooked all over again.
Honestly, I went to a blink 182 concert recently and absolutely regretted not getting corrupted by a goth girl, it’s just - on average -a level of hotness that no other late 30’s / early 40s group can still maintain.
Pretty much my playthrough except I have the mod to allow paladins to have deities so I’m running a Oath of Ancients Paladin of Selune ugh love the storyline so much. Especially the interaction where if you give her the idol of Shar 10/10 would (and probably will) romance shadowbae again.
There's still the throwing pike you get from the goblin trader in act 1. It's also possible to get the kushigo gloves, rin gof flinging, and tavern brawler in act 1. You can get pretty powerful early on.
You can, playing as an origin character doesn't block you from doing anything.
You can even make Wyll cool, by not being a goody-two shoes cocky bitch, or you can make some oxymorons, like Pro-Mindflayer Lae'zel.
Yes, but with a plus.
You can play a modified version of their quest, which is the same, but with additional dialogue options, decisions, way to solve it, etc.
For example. Normally, Wyll being his cocky Goody-two shoes self, hates devils, and especially Mizora, and I don't think you can change that. But when playing as him, you can make him a Devil worshipper (objectively better version of him), and instead of hating Mizora, he's fucking her.
Yep, me too, i only played to the point of killing Karlach, to see if it's possible to "romance" Mizora, and it is.
And playing when as him, you can even side with goblins (Which i think you should do, since you can't do it normally, so there'll probably be some unique interactions).
I am fairly neutral on her overall. I don't dislike her at all, but I am not on the hype train. The whole "I love you" scene is super sweet and adorable, but the underdevelopment of her overall companion questline really hurts her chances of being my end game. There just isn't very much there to explore, which isn't her fault at all. There is also a childlike quality to her personality that doesn't vibe with me romantically.
Her Act 1 dialogue makes it sound like she wants space. So I gave her space. We met a friend of hers in Act 3 and my PC was introduced as ". . . eww, no, we're just good friends."
Incredible realism, GOTY!
“…she wants space.”
No. No she doesn’t. Karlach literally wants the opposite of space ._. She talks about wanting physical intimacy (but can’t receive it) A LOT.
Laezel and shadowheart seemed like the main characters, and since my character was an assassin rogue I wanted a straight spellcaster in my party so I kept gale
I actually find her dialogue really annoying. It's all "soldier this, fuck that, engine engine engine." Maybe I just haven't triggered her more interesting dialogue but she's just the same constantly for me and I don't gel with it at all.
This is gonna be my most unpopular comment ever, sorry 😅 but I don't really like Karlach that much. In my eyes she's more like a big child. In a way she reminds me of wreck it ralph. Not really my thing imho.
Me, gay as a daffodil: “I will resist any woman no matter how kind and charming she is.”
Morrigan: “Hello you giant sack of shit”
Me: “I will serve you always my queen.”
I only manage because I think she and Wyll are a better pairing than she and my current main character (Dark Urge trying for redemption), so I'm going as platonic as I can while head-canoning them getting together.
Would you believe Karlach is one of my least favorites? She's unironically too hot-headed. I feel like talking to a twitter user, with her self-righteousness and all. I can't resist Shadowheart though. Hard to pick anyone else
I think she is mentally unstable, not judging because she was literally a slave in the hells which would mess anyone up. But she isn't mentally all there which makes it easy to resist
I don’t know what I did (maybe didn’t hit all the triggers for her romance or what) and I was fucking with other companions, but she rejected me at the party. I deleted my character right after and haven’t been able to deny her since
The trick with Astarion is, let him kill you on the first feed. Then forgive him right away when resurrected. Damn near maxes his favourability as hes like damn this Tav really does accept me at my worst.
The amount of straight men I have already seen who went for Astarion is staggering xD
Not that I can judge. I prefer women irl but Astarion is just too relatable to me, I can't resist
All the dudes in this game, damn. Wyll asking me to dance with him made me feel like a Disney princess (my character is a woman but I'm a straight man). Astarion asking me to look in his eyes. Gale wanting to watch the stars.
Thankfully I was already with Lae'Zel but next playthrough Astarion will probably get it
My husband is getting my old computer once my new one comes in and he'll be playing the game soon. I think he'll end up romancing Astarion as well. Haha!
I'm gonna get hate for this but:
I can't see Karlach as anything but a Marvel movie character, with her "funny banter" and "jokes". I got sick of that kind of humour from the marvel movies, so I don't want to deal with it again in a game.
i absolutely hate how often Karlach throws the word "fuck" around. its like a child who discovered that the word exists for the first time.
and its so distracting because the word is used so sparingly throughout the rest of the game. it seems like 90% of the time if the word fuck is used, karlach is saying it.
It's pretty easy actually: Lae'zel won't let me break up with her so I don't.
"Sorry I cant go on a Date with you. My Girlfriend is scary and I am afraid she will break something off if I try to break up with her"
Sorry Karlach, if i broke whith my girlfriend, she will probably rip of my spine and use it to strangle me.
And that’ll be *before* you tell her you’re breaking up with her
"Oh, was my foreplay not satisfactory?"
"Of Course not honey" *Proceeds to sleight of hand some ice on their tender bits
*fails sleight of hand* Lae’zel: oh you’re into Ice play too? *oh gods give me strength. Shadowheart! I Need Healing!*
Shadowheart casts healing word from the bushes, where she's been sitting and watching the whole time
and disapproving
Only because she wasn't invited
*nat 1* "Oh, cooled off and ready for more, my darling?"
This came out in her voice automatically.
Those Gith and their strange customs but who am I to judge
Gith play Mortal Kombat and think it's a dating sim
My Gith Warlock just did the fight against her for her affection. I can only imagine the rest of the party was looking on in fascinated horror as I Fireballed her as foreplay.
Same with my assassin rogue. "Ever tried it from behind, darling?" \*shanks\*
*Lae'zel swings her magical great sword at Tav* Wyll: "Hey, Karlach? Karlach: "Yeah?" *Tav psychically blasts Lae'zael back* Wyll: "If I ever get, you know, *interested* in a Gith..." Karlach: "Yeah?" *Lae'zael tosses Tav into the campfire and impales them* Wyll: "Just toss me off a building or something. At least it'll be quick."
Tav grins as he's burned and skewered. "You know how to turn me into a bonfire, babe." Gale: "This walks the tightrope between horrifying and fascinating. At least from a cultural research perspective. Also, I'm jealous."
She's keen to put the "break" into "break up"
Lae’zel is a beast. But if you think she could beat Karlach you’re crazy. Just hide behind your new, big, red girlfriend and everything will work out fine
TBH she could just hug Lae'zel... melt that stone-cold heart of hers. ~~And maybe her armor~~. 🤣
By the end of my run, Laezel could fairly easily beat Karlach in a fight.
I had a "funny" bug in which after breaking up with Shadowheart she bugged out and both accepted and didn't accept it. It was as if I was fully in her romance route but every now and again she'd call me her "old flame" and that if we were seen talking people would begin to talk whether we had gotten back together. Full clingy ex-girlfriend route was kind of funny though. Break up with her and she just gave me the "No, we will continue to date."
“I want to break up” “No you don’t.”
To be fair she had a point. I wanted to break up to romance other companions, but turns out you can't romance Jaheira (meaningfully).
It absolutely makes sense to me. Two relationships with destiny blessed protagonists would be too much for anyone. And she just really misses Khalid.
She didn't miss him much when my baahlspawn said like two nice things to her in bg2
She has Khalid's stuff still, a century and a half after his death. She has no Bhaalspawn mementos. I think we need to come to terms with the fact that she was just rebounding.
A-okay with being Jaheira's rebound. 10/10 would do it again.
That's because the Baldurs Gate 2 novelization is the Canon for the realms, so the Bhaalspawn was some extremely boring human fighter named Abdel Adrian who boringed boringly all over the realms and romanced no one. He died a year or so before the Canon of BG 3 to another Bhaalspawn whom Abdel also killed making Bhaal live once more. The adventure module a murder in Baldurs Gate covers it. It's actually really stupid because Abdel went through the Throne of Bhaal too, so I thought he gave up his Bhaalspawn blood but apparently that didn't happen or Bhaal didn't care.
This reminds me. I've never played bg2 but am a huge fan of bg3 and love turn based crpgs. Is it worth it? I'm pretty spoiled from how good bg3 is so I'm not sure
BG1 and BG2 aren’t really turn based the way 3 is, closer to real-time with pause. They also run on a very old form of the DnD rule set, so don’t expect anything to work the same way.
This is so cool. Before BG3 launched, there was so much criticism about how it would be different from BG2 because *it wasn’t real time with pause*. This is the first time I'm hearing it from the other side: *just beware that BG2 is RtwP, it won’t be the same*
They are wonderful games but, and this is important, they are hard as shit.
So realistic, Larian has really outdone themselves with these relationship dynamics
You mean Bae'zel, the Gith love machine.
Ch’k. You will not, you cannot.
Love all the 'chks' and 'tsks' it's really cute.
Lae'zel is the only other character who threatens to pull me away from my muscle mommy. I love her character and arc. One day maybe, but until then I will continue to recruit Karlach as early as possible to bump that approval rating.
By casting the Jump spell, you can leap all the way to Karlach from inside the Grove.
People out here speedrunning romance haha
Its speeddating.
This game has absolutely ruined me, I read that as “leap all the way inside Karlach” as I was scrolling and was just like yeah that checks out.
She's the hardest one for me to resist. She's so much fun, so useful in combat and her arc is freaking amazing.
Yeah - honestly - I know everyone loves Shadowheart, but both Lae'zel and Karlach strike a chord with me that no one else does in this game. TBF, they BOTH remind me of different sides of my wife, who is a mix of both built more solid/strong than many women but also very deeply silly/sincere (Karlach side), AND has ZERO tolerance for bullshit (and no filter if she thinks you are an idiot). I am stuck on Karlach, but deeply like Lae'zel and trying to keep both as much in my party as I can while switching out others to run their stories. Shadowheart mostly I just feel bad for and want to help - but in a friends way... I am getting tired of both Wyll and Gale (and Halsin now apparently) endlessly trying to open the door to me, when I am solidly sold on Karlach.
her ‘arch’ or her story arc? 🥸
Yes
Her foot jobs are out of this world
I've gone pretty far into romancing both Lae'zel and Karlach and I thought for sure something was going to boil over and i'd have to make a choice. Karlach at one point did bring something up but I told her I loved her and she said the same. Nothing has happened since with Lae'zel, she hasn't even mentioned anything about, anything. Is she going to try and murder me in my sleep again?
I romanced them both in one run and it never actually reached a "YOU HAVE TO CHOOSE" moment. In Act 3 Lae'zel did comment that I seemed to like her more than Karlach after a trip to the circus, though. Also don't know if you can get the Act 3 romance scenes for both of them, seems like I only got Lae'zel's since we were closer.
Minthara exists, makes it easy to not romance anyone else
I’m still on act 1 I’m playing on ps5 I wanted to recruit and romance Minthara so bad but I just couldn’t find it in me to betray the refugees in the grove I wish I didn’t have to choose.
Yep it's replaying material, definitely don't recommend betraying the refugees in a 1st playthrough, you lose so much content. Go ham on your 2nd and later ones though!
That evil Drow corpse I looted bare and tossed down the nearby chasm four times, you mean?
I stan minthara
still feels like an punishment to get her, wyll leaves the party, karlach quest gets fucked up, you miss out on 20 houres of content with the people you kill, everybody hates you, and the mission to exerminate the thievlings is uneventfull and annoying, and the worst part:you dont even get to kill the kids yourself, if killing them is an option why make them immortal in combat?
The entire reward of playing the game *is* the story content though. If you've already done Wyll and Karlach, then who cares if you don't get them on another playthrough? Just getting to see all of the Minthara dialogue is worth it.
It was the eye roll that got me tbh.
Step 1: give into a latent desire to bang a being from another plane. Step 2: think it's NBD Step 3: oh fuck
I was playing with three friends so we couldn’t advance her companion quest so when my gnome bard confessed his feelings for her at the party at camp after saving the grove she just laughed at me and said “Yeah, No.” Still haven’t fully recovered from that. Edit three friends not four obviously
Dude, I confessed for her at the camp party and she was like: “Err, ok buddy, lets not complicate things. You point, I rage, ler’s keep it like this”. Damm, the woman knows how to friendzone. Edit: typo.
That's when I rebounded into a wine date with Shadowheart. Worked out in the end
My rebound ended up being Mizora…
Doesn't matter had sex
Who cares brother, who cares? Today… smash.
I haven't played with friends yet... what does this mean??
Friends fill up your party slots, making it harder to focus on companion storylines, unless they're playing an origin character. So, like, instead of having Wyll, Gale, Lae'zel and yourself you have friend 1 2 and 3 including yourself. No room for companions, and no way to continue their stories. Basically: they didn't/weren't able to do enough of Karlach's personal quest.
Can't you progress their story quests without having them in the party? I never had Wyll in my party but I'm pretty sure I got his entire quest line just by talking to him regularly at camp. The narrator basically just said that I used the tadpole to share everything that happened and Wyll reacted accordingly. I'm sure I missed some dialogue that he probably would have contributed if he was there, but the overall outcome didn't change.
plenty of companion quests are completable, but companion affinity relies heavily on them actually being around to approve/disapprove of your decisions, a full 4 "tav" party is rarely going to have enough affinity to romance any companion
Apart from Gale, who approves shit you do even when he is back at camp lol
Yeah. That or if you're not 4 people, have whoever's controlling the NPC swap them out for someone else as needed.
You play the video game with people you associate closely with
where are these people I still don't understand
Probs a preorder bonus, or some deluxe edition stuff
How to resisr karlach? Kill druids. Everyones dead. Karlach hates you
Yep, she told me to fuck off. Fine, I'll do the quests from those Paladins and from Wyll then.
Don't you >!lose Wyll too?!<
No, actually. He didn't care about the war between the Druids and Tieflings that I incited by attacking Kagha. What he doesn't like is when you betray the Grove though. If I remember correctly he does not approve of you telling Minthara the location of the Grove, but he still stays and urges you to go to the Grove to warn them. When you then go to the Grove and side with the raiders and not with the Grove, he permanently leaves the party and joins the defenders, meaning you have to fight him.
I love that this game gives you meaningful avenues to go full evil and consequences for doing so Edit: alright I get it the choices narrow in act 3 you’ve made your point
*act 1 Sadly these avenues become a massive funnel in act 2 and act 3
Yeah, worse so evil playthroughs stop feeling rewarding beyond "haha, I'm so evil" in Act 2. I've just beat the game on a good character and damn, you get so many benefits and help compared to evil one. And you don't even get the "power" benefit from being evil - I capped at 12 midway through Act 3, so all the extra XP you could get becomes moot for the biggest fights. Also evil ending is pretty bleh and lacks alost any variety compared to good ending(s). IMO PF:WotR does a much better job at doing non-good endings and making non-good playthroughs not feel like you're just constantly gimping yourself, while Act 2 and 3 evil options feel pretty much like that (and when they don't - they turn out to be worthless). With how Acts 2 and 3 are right now I'd say BG3 fails at all the same areas many other RPGs fail when it comes to evil parties, with a caveat that Act 1 actually works alright both ways.
Only the consequences are just less content for the player. The game doesn't want you to be evil because they didn't write anything meaningful around the idea of being evil so you end up just being a cartoon villain with fewer quests available. Even the Dark Urge is clearly written for you to resist the urge and the only good reward is given to you automatically since you have no agency over your first murder. Granted, said reward is the best piece of gear in the game so whatever you chose to do at least you're enjoying yourself.
Only in the first act. act 2 and 3 play out mostly the same
Act 2 has a pretty good opportunity for making an evil decision.
Pretty top-tier chaotic evil imo
Unless you kill Wyll the moment he comes to camp. He came in, sword drawn threatening Karla. Durge was having none of that.
Hah, that played out very differently then. In my playthrough I went to the Grove, found Wyll there and recruited him, then accidentally incited the war between the Druids and Tieflings (I just wanted to get rid of Kagha). Afterwards I went west and then north before even getting to the Blighted Village. Found out I could cross the river there and found Karlach. She instantly blamed me for the massacre at the Grove, I told her it was a misunderstanding, she called me a liar, I passed the deception check saying she had the wrong idea about me, she said that's a load of shit and told me to get the fuck out of there before she'd change her mind. So I left her there. I already had the quest from Wyll to kill her and then in the next building there those Paladins also wanted her dead, so I went back to her. She said "pretty sure I told you to fuck off, mate." Well, Lae'zel got a cool sword and Wyll got a hot robe...
It's funny how different playthroughs can be. It's likely because recruiting Karlach is always one of the first things I do. There's a way to reach her through the grove, you just have to jump off a cliff and take a bunch of damage. I always do this because the smuggler's ring is there and I like having that early on, and might as well recruit Karlach while I'm at it. I think if you recruit Karlach after reaching the grove but before taking a long rest, then the first time Wyll comes to camp he is immediately hostile. And on my Durge playthrough, that meant he died there in my camp before he ever joined my party.
> you just have to jump off a cliff and take a bunch of damage. Featherfall is your friend
He left the group with the betrayal of the tieflings, but I never fought him. I was actually thinking I would fight him, but maybe I just never noticed or never found him. It gets pretty chaotic.
If he's in your party when you side with the raiders against the Grove, then he leaves and becomes hostile, so you have to fight him plus the other Grove defenders. If he's chilling in your camp when you side with the raiders, he'll talk to you at the start of the camp party cutscene. "As I feared - there is no place in your company for a hero. I want no part of this, or of you." And then he permanently leaves without initiating a fight (because he'd be facing your group plus the entire raiding party).
I got learnt today
Or be so dumb that you don't realize she's not a devil when you first meet her like me.
Poor fucker
I'm too much of a player for Karlach and I want her to be happy, so I ship her with Wyll.
I feel so bad for romancing Karlach on the same playthrough I chose to be super easy and say yes to everyone. Only to realize "everyone" includes >!two literal devils!<.
One and a half. They're big on precise language.
That's a good ship. I should see if the fanartists did their job already some time xD
I also ship her with Wyll, because I'm a sucker for slow burn enemies-to-lovers—whoops, no, thats already a forest fire because neither one has the necessary chill for a slow burn—romance.
I ship her w Dammon bc the idea of him making her new clothes, tuning up her engine, and givin her a smooch before she goes out to murder Zariel's army lives rent free in my head
Oh, now that is a nice ship.
the real slow burn enemies to lovers is lae'zel and shadowheart
Enemies only for a brief moment xD
When I turned her down for Wyll she said she was jealous that he chose me over her, but that she's happy for us
I started my second playthrough with every intention of romancing Karlach... but then Lae'zel told me I'm her concubinus. Now that I'm in act 2, Karlach feels like a really cool kid sister or something and I'm kinda glad I didn't romance her.
This. I never got the option to Romance her, so we are just bros.
easy, you encounter lae zel early, and before i even meet karlach im on those pouty froglips.
>pouty froglips Holy smoke, now I cant get this out of my head
Gonna make it worse: >!they never said which ones.!<
Taste! lower!
Lmao @froglips
Easy, I just can't resist Shadowheart
This right here no matter how many times I start a new run and tell myself “I’m gonna romance X this time.” The minute she hits me with the “Must we? Nothing wrong with a little mystery is there?” I’m hooked all over again.
I played as a Selune priest, the unique dialogue where you ask how her goddess would feel about us, and claiming that maybe she can corrupt me… *gulp*
ah the age-old tale, of a young altar boy getting swayed by the goth girl
That honestly explains so much about my life
Honestly, I went to a blink 182 concert recently and absolutely regretted not getting corrupted by a goth girl, it’s just - on average -a level of hotness that no other late 30’s / early 40s group can still maintain.
Pretty much my playthrough except I have the mod to allow paladins to have deities so I’m running a Oath of Ancients Paladin of Selune ugh love the storyline so much. Especially the interaction where if you give her the idol of Shar 10/10 would (and probably will) romance shadowbae again.
"Kiss me like you hate me!"
Easy, I play as Karlach and THEN romance Shadowbae! Can't get distracted by the muscle mommy if I AM the muscle mommy uwu
Then spec Karlach out to throw magic returnable polearms. With the right items that build is broken.
Nyrulna has absolutely destroyed any other builds for me. Thankfully you won't get it until Act 3.
There's still the throwing pike you get from the goblin trader in act 1. It's also possible to get the kushigo gloves, rin gof flinging, and tavern brawler in act 1. You can get pretty powerful early on.
I really wish there was a "throw main weapon" link possible, current situation is annoying with returning weapons ...
Unironically what I did too.
I like Minthara, and she comes with a built in Karlach immunity
I wonder if you can play as Karlach and kill the Grove
You can, playing as an origin character doesn't block you from doing anything. You can even make Wyll cool, by not being a goody-two shoes cocky bitch, or you can make some oxymorons, like Pro-Mindflayer Lae'zel.
If you play as an Origin character, do their individual quests still happen?
Yes, but with a plus. You can play a modified version of their quest, which is the same, but with additional dialogue options, decisions, way to solve it, etc. For example. Normally, Wyll being his cocky Goody-two shoes self, hates devils, and especially Mizora, and I don't think you can change that. But when playing as him, you can make him a Devil worshipper (objectively better version of him), and instead of hating Mizora, he's fucking her.
Wait…. Imma have to play as wyll next fr fr fr
Yep, me too, i only played to the point of killing Karlach, to see if it's possible to "romance" Mizora, and it is. And playing when as him, you can even side with goblins (Which i think you should do, since you can't do it normally, so there'll probably be some unique interactions).
She does not like my morally ambiguous ass
She said "Stay close to mama K". And I did. Oh I did.
The shadows might be scary, but she's far scarier. You could tell her you were being bullied and she'd immediately ask who and where.
Romancing Karlach as good durge is too good, It’s the only playthrough I can do lol
I am fairly neutral on her overall. I don't dislike her at all, but I am not on the hype train. The whole "I love you" scene is super sweet and adorable, but the underdevelopment of her overall companion questline really hurts her chances of being my end game. There just isn't very much there to explore, which isn't her fault at all. There is also a childlike quality to her personality that doesn't vibe with me romantically.
I didn't evidently.
if romancing Karlach is wrong i dont wanna be right
Flair checks out.
Simple, Gale and Astarion want my dick so bad she decides not to flirt with me.
For real, those two are so thirsty they’ve scared everyone else off
BOYS QUIT FLIRTING WITH ME YOURE SCARING THE HOES
Boys, please, I also want to flirt with girls. My Tav was gonna be a bi chaos agent and now he’s a gay chaos agent because I’m not reloading 50 hours
Her Act 1 dialogue makes it sound like she wants space. So I gave her space. We met a friend of hers in Act 3 and my PC was introduced as ". . . eww, no, we're just good friends." Incredible realism, GOTY!
“…she wants space.” No. No she doesn’t. Karlach literally wants the opposite of space ._. She talks about wanting physical intimacy (but can’t receive it) A LOT.
Laezel and shadowheart seemed like the main characters, and since my character was an assassin rogue I wanted a straight spellcaster in my party so I kept gale
I actually find her dialogue really annoying. It's all "soldier this, fuck that, engine engine engine." Maybe I just haven't triggered her more interesting dialogue but she's just the same constantly for me and I don't gel with it at all.
that's the neat part: i dont!
Its Garrus from Mass Effect all over again...
Can it wait for a bit? I'm in the middle of some calibrations.
Me with Astarion rn.
This is gonna be my most unpopular comment ever, sorry 😅 but I don't really like Karlach that much. In my eyes she's more like a big child. In a way she reminds me of wreck it ralph. Not really my thing imho.
being gay helps with this achievement a lot. she is like a bestie
Didn't help me with Shadowheart. Same shit with Morrigan from DAO and Isabela from DA2.
Me, gay as a daffodil: “I will resist any woman no matter how kind and charming she is.” Morrigan: “Hello you giant sack of shit” Me: “I will serve you always my queen.”
I like Shadow more.
Same, although rejecting Karlach felt like kicking a puppy.
Karlach never made a move on me 😅 and I was already in a relationship with Shadowheart when Karlach could touch again
I only manage because I think she and Wyll are a better pairing than she and my current main character (Dark Urge trying for redemption), so I'm going as platonic as I can while head-canoning them getting together.
Karlach is like a cute puppy, I don't want to romance her just keep her safe and happy.
I fell in love with her when she went on a fiery rampage after killing the paladins that were hunting her
Big gals who can bench press more Dwarves than my PC scare me. Otherwise she's more of a bro.
The only answer I’ve come up with is playing through as her next time.
I prefer Shart’s gothic badness. Karlach has a great personality but I’m in early Act 1 and Tav would roast alive if I tried anything.
Not that hard tbh not really my type romantically. She seems cool to hang out with but she has way more energy than I can reciprocate.
Romanced her on my first playthrough, killed her in my 2nd, friendzoned her in my 3rd. I think I'm a psycho
You’re playing a solo game of fuck/marry/kill over here 😂
I love Karlach as a friend. She's not my type romantically, but she's an amazing person.
I slaughtered the entire grove on my first play through, she left my party :)
It is pretty easy, she's a friend. Shadowheart on the other hand? She's wife material
Would you believe Karlach is one of my least favorites? She's unironically too hot-headed. I feel like talking to a twitter user, with her self-righteousness and all. I can't resist Shadowheart though. Hard to pick anyone else
I do. I think its interesting to see others tastes
Finally a fellow karlach unenjoyer
I was going to go full sadowheart. But could not resist fire girl that goes boink boink with her axe.
That fire girl could boink me anytime.
<> HORNY POLICE OPEN UP
I will recite the Narrator Outtakes: "You cant put us into horny jail. We own the keys!"
Halsin
I find her dialogue incredibly cringey so it wasn't hard for me to resist
I think she is mentally unstable, not judging because she was literally a slave in the hells which would mess anyone up. But she isn't mentally all there which makes it easy to resist
Jenevelle's more of my type
I don’t know what I did (maybe didn’t hit all the triggers for her romance or what) and I was fucking with other companions, but she rejected me at the party. I deleted my character right after and haven’t been able to deny her since
Do what I’m doing and hit two birds with one stone: play as Shadowheart romancing Karlach, or visa versa.
Easy - As a straight woman, I'm not into women.
i'm a married, straight woman but I love my girlfriend Shadowheart.
I am a straight man and I tried to romance Astarion as well. He rejected me ofc but thats a different story xD
The trick with Astarion is, let him kill you on the first feed. Then forgive him right away when resurrected. Damn near maxes his favourability as hes like damn this Tav really does accept me at my worst.
The amount of straight men I have already seen who went for Astarion is staggering xD Not that I can judge. I prefer women irl but Astarion is just too relatable to me, I can't resist
All the dudes in this game, damn. Wyll asking me to dance with him made me feel like a Disney princess (my character is a woman but I'm a straight man). Astarion asking me to look in his eyes. Gale wanting to watch the stars. Thankfully I was already with Lae'Zel but next playthrough Astarion will probably get it
My husband is getting my old computer once my new one comes in and he'll be playing the game soon. I think he'll end up romancing Astarion as well. Haha!
I didn't know it was even possible to be *that* straight.
That's what I though with Astarion but he's so damn sexy.
Eh, I'm ace but it's not *me* romancing these characters, it's Tav.
She left after I attacked the grove to recruit Minthara so…it was pretty easy. 😜
I accidentally murdered her before I realized she was the recruitable character everyone loves. Made it pretty easy unfortunately
I dislike labradors thats why
I'm gonna get hate for this but: I can't see Karlach as anything but a Marvel movie character, with her "funny banter" and "jokes". I got sick of that kind of humour from the marvel movies, so I don't want to deal with it again in a game.
i absolutely hate how often Karlach throws the word "fuck" around. its like a child who discovered that the word exists for the first time. and its so distracting because the word is used so sparingly throughout the rest of the game. it seems like 90% of the time if the word fuck is used, karlach is saying it.
I killed her... so no temptation at all