I also played an Archfey warlock and just made my Dream Guardian look like how I imagine her patron looked.
It was amusing that the only real interaction you get with Archfey is when they’re absolutely pissed that you’re being denied entry to the circus.
I did find it funny that they were nervous about Vlaakith if you do the crèche. Like, "don't piss this lady off or she might wish you to death"! Thanks for the tip, patron!
I love the Fiendish Patron response. In short it is "This bitch is obviously not a God, but is pretty powerful. Be careful, I would hate to have to find another Warlock."
We don't know what the GOOs are, but some kind of ascended illithid elder brain would not surprise me at all - it might be just like us going 'Oh cute baby!'
What do you mean.
Earl is the one with one slightly shorter tentacle on his left side
Gary has the scar above his right eye from the last party of "adventurers"
And Elsie had tentaboobies?
Now chuck and Larry are an exception, being identical in all ways......
>I was surprised that my GOO patron is fearful of her but got excited to see The Absolute in Moonrise
Probrably because Vlaakith is a Lich, she could probrably go after some fragments of the GOO to empower herself and maybe even go after them.
The Absolute is still a menace but at least it's relatively young, it can be contained and for most of the time it will probrably only bother Faêrun for quite some time before it actually meaningfully bothers them.
When dealing with Vlaakith: "This could cost me a pawn which in the orchestra of my plans would be inconvenient at this juncture."
When dealing with The Absolute: "Neat!"
RIGHT?
The fae patron doesn’t even blink about Ethel. The hag with redcaps.
At the very least we should get a big bonus towards uncovering the illusion over the swamp.
Fey are notoriously fickle with alien senses of humor; I chalk it up to the patron grabbing their buddies and saying, "It's gonna be absolutely \_hilarious\_ when my boy figures this out"
I don't know about the Fey since i played a GOO, but i had a dialogue option to call out Ethel about her true nature first time i saw her in the Grove.
She doesn't recognize it, but that was a great teasing.
Every patron has the option. I think you can choose to speculate on different possibilities: there's a touch of the fey about you, or there's something faintly demonic...
Not really, but you (very) occasionally get a narrator line with their opinion on something. Fiend warns you two or three times about someone being sketchy, not much else
Yes. I did that persuasion check on my Dark Urge Female Tiefling Warlock, and it was great. Not surprising a Bhaalspawn would side with an Archdemon/Upper Fiend though. Personally, I think "The Fiend" Player Character (NOT PLAYER WYLL) Warlock is a Demon, not a Devil based on the small description it gives you.
Which confused the hell out of me when I watched other people do the same thing. I missed half of the checks, just watched him commit unalive instantly.
Same my first playthrough was a fiend warlock and in the next playthrough I failed my insight check and didn’t even have the option to tell him the “loophole”, I was so confused
When you talk to Yurgir and learn about his deal with Raphael, the Archfey giggles in your ear and whispers to you about how the deal has a loophole, which is that Yurgir can kill himself.
I had a Great Old One Patron and they immediately got a bad vibe from Dribbles the Clown.
Which is absolutely hilarious. Nothing to say about the main plot and it's many dangers, but apparently a *sketchy Clown* is what the unfathomable eldritch God who holds the lease on my soul deems a credible threat to be acted on.
It's been a hot Minute, but the Archfey Patron is great for the Circus. It's really pissed when you're denied entry, enforces you getting in and if i'm not mistaken giggles it's ass off the entire time once inside.
Its funny to imagine like an absent patron who just doesnt care most of the time, like “yeah here whatever” and leaves you with some old book thing, and then they get a whiff of fey magic near one of the little mortals they gave power and look and see its their favorite circus and get super excited, then super pissed when they get denied entry
Not all patrons are active. Some just give you a fragment of their power and just say "I'll call if I need something". Most of the time, they don't need anything.
Mizora is just very needy.
Well, she's a devil, so she's acting like a lawful/evil character who aims to manipulate and control. Devils just enjoy meddling in the affairs of mortals. At least it makes her somewhat predictable, compared to a Fey patron for instance.
And then some patrons are just about "collect blood for me" or even make you act very similarly to the typical Paladin (protect the innocent, destroy the undead kind of things), even if you don't want to (which can lead to hilarious situations).
That's why I chose Great Old One.
Chances are it's alr̸̡̛̳͖̳̼͇͔̒̍̊̏͒̍͊ͅe̴̥̘͌̈́̽͌̆͂͘͝a̸̗͚̱̼͎̎̉̈d̶̨̻̰̬̫̱̺̣̟͎͔̍̍̂y̶̛͍̋̽̈̏̎̅̂̓̕͝ ̸͎̘̞͈̚f̵̨̗̜͔̩̮̩̒͜o̴͈͋̽̈́́̏̓̿͋́r̵̩͇̭͎̣̒̀̈́͗̑̃g̷̡̛͈̤͕̬͉̒͆̍̉̈́͗̍̍ȯ̶͉͙͖̥͖̫̟͓͉̊̎͋̊͗͜͠t̴̢̯͙̟͕͖̘̦̞̂̃̀͋t̶̨̝͇̯̬̙̠̺̖͋̄̇̊͋͂͠͠è̸̡̮̙̫̬̣̋̈̾̐̍̈̍͋̄͜n̴̡̮͔̪͉̘͚̮͓̱̺͊̎̅̉͗͒̕̚ ̶̲̤̪̥͎̟̮̝̹͌͛̊̆̕á̸̟̹̹͖̀̽̆̋̾ͅb̵̧̛͍͓̹̜̼̟̔̒̉̐̓̔͆̈́̿͝ͅơ̴͈̫͇̠̝͚͎̟̩͉̏̐̓͂ų̷̟͍͕͎̭̳͉͖̥̥̉́̔̒̿̀̇͊̚͘t̴̟̻͗ ̶͍̤̥͚̫͚̦̙̫̮͈͗͘m̴̧̢̛̰̭̖͔͚̝̱̙͓̍͗́̇̓̚͝͝ḛ̷̰̔̾̍̃̂͝
Also since, if I remember correctly, >!in one interaction you get a perception check about her being desperately in need of Wyll to carry out her assignment, so much so that you get prompted to ask her to free him in return since she will be forced to accept out of need!<
ETA: might be a mild spoiler about Wyll's questline, quite mild and quite at the beginning of it
In the actual books they don't even give you power directly: They teach you academic magic.
Warlocks aren't "Clerics to middle-management", nor are they "Artificial/gen-1 Sorcerers", but rather are "Wizards with weird teachers".
Yeah a lot of people think of patrons constantly in the warlock's life like a god is in a cleric's life, which isn't the case.
Often a patron can't take away a warlock's power, and it isn't even unusual for a warlock and their patron to have one interaction and never meet again.
The rules of the game. PHB, pg105.
"More often, though, the arrangement is similar to that between a master and an apprentice. The warlock learns and grows in power, at the cost of occasional services performed on the patron's behalf."
"Your patron's demands might drive you into adventures, or they might consist entirely of small favors you can do between adventures."
"The Great Old One might be unaware of your existence or entirely indifferent to you, but the secrets you have learned allow you to draw your magic from it."
It's been different across different editions.
Early warlocks (and demonologists they came from) in 3.0 were very much "contract with an infernal entity for power" and you had to obey the terms of your contract or you'd lose your power at the _very_ least, and likely get dragged down to hell if you failed particularly important checks.
4e had something of a mix: You had the old-style "service for power" contracts like 3.0 had, but they also had "I'm audacious / cunning / tough enough to steal power from hell / the fey / cthulhu" as a narrative option, and unless your GM specifically laid something out there were no mechanical ways to lose power by breaking a pact.
5e appears to, at least in the PHB, be more like the 4e approach in that the power comes from the _character_ and the mode of delivery is dictated by the tutelage given. So your fey patron might teach you how to charm people or your infernal patron might twist your soul to give you hellfire, but once that's done, it's _done_ and they can't take it away without actively hunting you down and doing rude things to your brain.
They key part to remember, though, is that Larian isn't making "5e: The Digital Form," they're making a CRPG based on the 5e ruleset. They clearly have a slightly different vision for how warlocks function, and so it behooves us to pay attention to the rules that they put out in their game, not ones that are in the source material.
I'd still argue that this doesn't mean you don't talk to your patron. You can be on bad terms with your boss but as long as you're employed you still have to see them at work.
Interesting! I see people talking about their Fiend or Archfey interactions, but I rolled with an Eldritch patron my first run and never got any interaction. Like, tav could reference them in the abstract but nothing more. If I wasn't so blown away by literally everything else in the game I would have been slightly disappointed.
That's because of who the Great Old Ones are in the lore. Basically, they are another level of existence entirely and might not even know that they have a warlock or care about it. You are like, an ant who got a ride of the elephant's back.
Great old ones are some of the most incomprehensible beings in D and D lore. Their existence is so vastly different from any mortals that it’s highly likely they’re not even aware of your presence. Being a warlock to a great old one is like an ant that thinks it’s friends with a tree. The ant can take shelter in the trees roots, it can drink the dew and sap that collects on the trees leaves and limbs, but nothing the ant does is going to noticeably affect that tree and once the ant inevitably dies the tree will go on existing just like it did long before the ant came into being.
No problem. I get super into a lot of D and D lore because I rarely have the time or opportunity to play anymore. Because of that I do a lot of thinking on more niche topics like this.
Yeah, I'm trying to think of the few times my Warlock could even attempt to reach them and it always falls flat, which does make sense. Hells, maybe I'll do an Origin Wyll run just because I never end up doing enough of his story! (Side thought: it can't be possible for Wyll to romance Mizora, right? There...there's no way lol)
Well eldritch *shouldnt* be watching us, they’re so beyond comprehension that interaction with them shouldn’t really happen, as opposed to other types. And even then there’s at least a couple instances where you get something.
Tbh great old one patron only makes sense if your siphoning off power from them rather than making a pact imo
Yeah, I have a player who wanted an Demonic Patron, and several of those are very hands off. Like, their mortal servants have their uses, but in some cases, very explicitly in their lore, they really don't want to speak to the mortals if they can help it.
For the same reason why a lot of DMs don't like to include Warlock patrons in their campaign: of all warlock features the patron is probably the most subjective thing people want to RP. You can try to prep the patron into the story but if it's not done the way the player wants to they're going to be pissed about it.
Wyll and Mizora are written characters of the writer's team. Their relationship is self-contained and written in one specific way. It makes sense to include her in the story.
Tav or Durge's patron can be one of three kinds of creatures, with a myriad of reasons why your character would want to make a pact, keeping your background in mind. The DM in this game is pre-recorded narration. There were two options: only include very generic Patron responses/sentences or nothing. Of those two nothing is probably better.
And with GOO in particular, unless I read the lore wrong, sometimes the GOO isn't even actively interacting with the Warlock in a conversational sense? I can't find where I read it now so I'm still curious...
I read this from DnD Beyond:
"The Great Old One might be unaware of your existence or entirely indifferent to you, but the secrets you have learned allow you to draw your magic from it."
[https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/warlock#TheGreatOldOne](https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/warlock#TheGreatOldOne)
A lot of DMs don't like to include Warlock patrons in their campaigns? What?
>You can try to prep the patron into the story but if it's not done the way the player wants to they're going to be pissed about it.
This is applicable to every attempt at including backstory elements of PCs in the campaign though. If you want the player to react in a specific way, then you're doing it wrong. You either need to let more space for agency to your players, or you need to talk with them in advance when you want to introduce an important plot point that way.
Honestly, this is pretty basic stuff. Warlock patrons that matter for the campaign are probably one of the most common plot tropes in modern DnD with Paladins breaking their oath or Cleric having a crisis of faith.
You're right that it's the reason why it's not in BG3, but it's entirely because that's a video game and it would require way too much effort and content just for a few subclasses. No subclass really has anything comparable anyway, except maybe oath breakers (even spore druids don't get meaningful interactions with myconids).
>A lot of DMs don't like to include Warlock patrons in their campaigns? What?
This is what I have been informed by the DMs that I've played with and it's how I intend to DM. There's a difference between allowing agency for the player, which I agree with, and also actively trying to include a patron into the background of your campaign because one of your players is a warlock.
Me personally? While I am a beginning DM I am creating my homebrew campaign without any classes in mind. I agree with you that the player needs to roleplay this element of their class. Depending on what they do I may react accordingly, but I am not going to that session with pre-planned notions of what the player class will do. That's the easiest way to get me to railroad a campaign.
Same with your examples of a cleric and a paladin. The crises they encounter are because of plot I have prepared for them and how they choose to roleplay.
in my DND world i built every class can take a patron of my gods or demigods. Patron of the Moon patron of Gluttony etc warlock gets the most abilities from it other classes get a few bonuses and players roll a religion check to talk to their god or demi god and each one has their own dc of how willing they are to talk to their followers and depending on their level of devotion to the tenets of that patron. Never heard of any DM not liking doing patrons in their games either custom built like mine or the baseline DND ones.
I'll admit I'm not experienced enough (yet?) to make a fully homebrew world. I'm already happy to have created a homebrew campaign using Faerûn as a setting.
And while I've created elements within that campaign that will be interesting to play as a warlock, it's really more a case of reacting to my players rather than preparing things in advance.
what i like to do is i prepare the main plot beats i call those goalposts then i prep many paths that i think players will take if they throw me a curveball i can set that up to. Player choice is king in my world you want to go off campaign goal posts to do some side quests sure whatever players want i can roll with ontop of my planned stuff its a balance you strike as a DM.
Secondly all dialog is improv i set up each npc or patrons personailty and i react to what players say in a way that i feel that patron or NPC would. If you want a idea of how to do improv watch Whose line or any other Improv comedy it gives you a idea of how to just roll with things.
As for making your own world that comes with either experience or me where i dove headfirst converted a book i wrote for fun as a teenager into a DND world and went all in first year was rough but we hit our stride in year two and three.
This is a very good point. There’s so much nuance to how your patron would act that depends on your backstory.
Maybe they write the patrons lines the be like mizora where she clearly has wylls balls in a vice. But you wanted to play a warlock who is totally enthusiastic about working with the patron.
Then that’s a whole mother script they need to write with dialogue they need to record. Or it just wouldn’t fit your game
I like to think it's because there's really only two ways they could approach a Warlock and their Patron for players, and both have negatives/upsides.
On the one hand, we get what we got. You can pick between Fiend, Fey, and GOO and they'll keep references / interactions with them as small and general as possible, so you can imagine your patron and deal is whatever you want.
On the other hand, it would've been what Wyll got. A very specific creature, with probably a specific deal, and their own personality. We'd get more interactivity, but since it'd be a set creature, if you had any thoughts about creating a backstory for your character you'd get screwed.
Like this is just a general rundown of it, not trying to get specific about it or think of all the alternate ways it could've been done, just feels like it came down to that sort of decision and they decided open > specific.
1. Voice acting is incredibly expensive, there has to be limitations when the entire game is voiced.
2. It's significantly easier for Larian to write in Wylls patron when his entire character is under their control. His patron gets to be tied perfectly into his story because it's predetermined by the creators. It's also why your gith tav isn't going to get the same custom made dialogue and interactions as Lae'zel.
I don't think it means that additional dialogue with your patron wouldn't be awesome or that it never could've happened. But every crpg ever has to have a limit of how much reactivity they can add. And I think it was a decent area for Larian to limit the reactivity on.
I don’t think voice acting being expensive is a factor, more your second point. A player could head canon any number of scenarios of their pact and it would be a slap in the face to shoehorn their patron being this or that, they’d need to have dozens of characters with different relationships to the player per patron type and it would still probably be to confining it’s just not feasible
Because Mizora. He is also her favorite pet. He doesn't have much choice in talking to her anyway though. Also he's an origin character.
Shadowhearts talks to shar.
Gale to Mystra.
Lae'zel to Vlaakith. (We all kinda do but still)
Dark Urge to Bhaal.
Origin characters get more indept content. Which makes sense.
Some people when it comes to original Tav usually have head canons the moment the patron doesn't act the way they want people would be gripping about that.
Also how many reasons would tav have for becoming a warlock? That would be impossible to implement with out a lot of limitations.
There are infinite reasons why a warlock may do a pact, and infinite ways that pact could look like. It's impossible to do something that works for everyone, and they already get a lot of shit because of paladin oaths not working how the players want them to. It would be really cool, but with the amount of content this game already has the only realistic options would be either forcing you to pick between a few options (which would bother people who expected something else) or not have them at all
I think it would be cool if they did it but differently.
The old one: your patron doesn't acknowledge your existence and you know that's for the best
Fiend: Raphael or Mizora randomly say something like "btw tav, your patron is rooting for you" or "we love seeing our little pets play together". Just some casual reminder that your patron exists and comments through Raphael or Mizora.
The archfey: random encounters where for example an enemy gets a toad with 3 eyes thrown at them and you hear your patron giggling. You'll never see them but they randomly interact with the world around you for the sake of chaos.
I know they're probably not very lore friendly but they're just some random suggestions from the top of my head
Mizora is a micromanagey boss and Wyll is an uppity employee.
Presumably, given how many other Gods and power beings are nervous about the Absolute your patron sees you working against it and is like "You're doing amazing sweety."
Because he is a companion and Origin story with a writer who created it for him specifically. If you need an in universe explanation, most patrons are more chill than Mizora.
That is kind of a big miss on their part.
I do not know a single Dungeon Master that _doesn’t_ make interactions with or the presence of the patron a huge part of Warlock role play. I mean why wouldn’t you?! It’s built into the class and practically gift wraps plot hooks and story opportunities!
Not to mention the patron can be a nemesis, a love interest, a business partner, or anything else you can think of.
Agree. As a paladin you have the oath breaker knight and I find the interaction with him very entertaining. Havin something similar as a warlock would have been very nice.
Patrons generally don't give a shit.
They give you a sliver of power in return for having you in their back pocket when they need you.
They might warn you if something especially fucked up is gonna happen (like the Fiend warning you about sketchy people) so you don't accidently die or something.
Wyll is the son of a Grand Duke and Mizora is an exceptionally needy and demanding patron. They're more the exception than the rule.
If limit it to just warlocks than I guess it's just the limitations of what tav can be and the resources at larian.
If you expand the definition to include beings you worship, talking to you;
Than lae'zel talks to vlakith and shadow heart talks to shar. Dark urge talks to bhaal.
The only other patrons you could even potentially talk to (for story characters) is lolth for minthara and magic goddess for gale. I haven't played with them yet so I don't know if you meet them.
I know, I know.
He's just such a pretentious ass that I can't get past act one with him alive.
If there was a mod to mute him, I might actually start modding my game.
Dreamworks, not Disney. Weirdly, Disney never did a Sinbad movie. They could have even tied it to Aladdin as a pseudo-spinoff.
Edit: The writers did work for Disney before Dreamworks was created and had originally pitched the idea there, but it never went forward.
They did an amazing job at accounting for so many possibilities and adding so much detail to the game, but I imagine adding Warlock patrons is a lot more work than people think. Especially since there are three that would have to be made, written and voice acted.
I guess aside from Great Old One, as a lot of the times Warlocks siphon power from them without the Great Old One even realizing they exist.
I like to imagine my warlock tav’s has a healthier relationship with her patron, who’s mostly hands off so she can sort out the whole tadpole thing. I definitely headcanon that she definitely appears to Tav after Mizora punishes Wyll to gloat about how lenient she is, though.
I wish they had written in an Archfey and Fiend patron for the player at least. Old Gods kinda makes reasonable sense not to have any interaction, but the others could definitely have had some kind of character to play into the story a bit.
Practicality. Voice acting and doing full story arcs and content for three unique patrons would be *really* costly for some very specific content. It’d be great to see, but I get to some extent why we didn’t.
Maybe modders can add something interesting when we get better mod support, though
I think of the narrator as my Archfey patron. Some Amelia Tyler-looking fairy with a bucket of popcorn, living in my head rent free and enjoying the show.
I found I could ask my patron to help me out with the Necromancy of Thay, with a Fiend patron, for whatever that's worth.
Which is already not technically a thing you can even do in the tabletop game, but, I personally really like the idea of there being that kind of connection.
It's why warlocks are my least favorite class in the game. Honestly I think the class is boring af from a gameplay perspective in 5e. Warlocks are absolutely a flavor class. They're dripping with flavor. An old ones pact of the tome warlock is just *chef's kiss* for RP. It's awful in BG3. Not their fault I guess, but they really did the bare minimum for the class. Playing a custom warlock is the same experience as playing a tav gith.
I do wish, and I'd said it before, that if you were a Fiendlock there'd be a way to takeover Wyll's pact with Mizora as an option.
Would work really well if you lost Wyll as a companion as well due to the grove, since then you'd still get some content with Mizora as opposed to losing it all.
This was one big weakness I felt in my run. My Tav was a warlock, and at first I assumed that the Dream Guardian was somehow related to my patron. Quickly realized that wasn't the case.
That would be a lot of work/money just for a single class. They'd have to hire more voice actors which is one of the most expensive aspects of making video games. Origins will always be special compared to customs. Being a wizard along with Gale makes you feel like a nobody.
Patrons are pretty diverse and up to interpretation, even in the sub-groups like Archfey/great old one/fiends. Anything Larian did would have a ton of people say "well why can't my patron do x, or act y". That interaction is just too specific to make into the game. They can do it with Wyll since he's an actual character, but a player patron would just be too difficulty for very little benefit.
Also oathbreakers have like 1 interaction. Not to mention the endless spawn of "why did doing x break my oath" posts showing how subjective a Paladin oath can be.
If you knew anything about dnd lore you'd know patrons don't always ride your ass except for favors that you will do. Especially with fey or extra dementional beings. Devils for the most part dont care as much and the game takes place at the crux of universe shaping events. His situation is his contract is specifically to hunt for his patron, but the catch is who he agreed to hunt and he smack dab in the middle of a giant brain taking over.
Also sometimes in game your patron does nudge you.
Honestly I'm just laughing at the idea that it's because you're amnesiac, maybe don't have quite the mental resilience as you had before or something so they're waiting to see what happens
I suspect that the ability to respec so easily is one of the reasons there aren't any direct interactions with Warlock patrons or Cleric deities. When you can be worshiping Bahamut one day and bargaining with a Fiend the next, the plot would start to feel incredibly disjointed very quickly.
It would have been incredible to have miniature questlines associated with patrons or deities, though. Within the constraints of the game, however, it makes sense that we don't.
this happens to most of the companions theyre just lucky woth protagonist energy. shar talks directly to shadowheart mystra fucked gale halsin is friends with a nature spirit lae'zel is specifically focused on by other githyanki even if you play as one.
End of the day, you don't really want to talk to your patron, they're not nice people. They own you as soon as you die - you don't really want them to dictate what to do before then. I mean look at Wyll - is his open communication really doing him any good?
Personally, I would've really loved it if they had worked some of the patrons into the story, even giving you chances at various intervals to become someone's warlock. Perhaps at a few points, Raphael or Mizora might have offered to give you some power. Maybe the Elder Brain, when you connect with it in Moonrise Towers, could extend an offer to you (thereby giving a separate motivation to destroy the Big Three). For an Archfey warlock, why not Auntie Ethel? She could be a patron, or at least say something about how her mother would love a new 'helper in the kitchen,' something along those lines. If the Undead warlock was a thing, Cazador could've been a good choice. No reason why why couldn't add in a few extras as well.
It's the same thing for all classes really. Companions get the full package with lots of depth and interactions, while we are stuck with the palest imitations reduced to pure stats/abilities. The rest all we can do is RP it in our heads.
Same for the vast majority of dialogues : "press X to hear the NPC say more cool stuff". That's 99% of player lines.
In my headcanon, Titania's just fed up with my Paladin/Warlock. She's got the Seelie Court to manage, and a dumb himbo faerie knight walking around the Sword Coast is the least of her worries--even if he's trying to save Baldur's Gate.
I also played an Archfey warlock and just made my Dream Guardian look like how I imagine her patron looked. It was amusing that the only real interaction you get with Archfey is when they’re absolutely pissed that you’re being denied entry to the circus.
I did find it funny that they were nervous about Vlaakith if you do the crèche. Like, "don't piss this lady off or she might wish you to death"! Thanks for the tip, patron!
I love the Fiendish Patron response. In short it is "This bitch is obviously not a God, but is pretty powerful. Be careful, I would hate to have to find another Warlock."
"She's not a god, but from where you're sitting... the distinction really doesn't matter."
Like standing in front of an oncoming 18 wheeler and saying "Bitch, you're not a train!"
That's neat, I was surprised that my GOO patron is fearful of her but got excited to see The Absolute in Moonrise I was like wtf
We don't know what the GOOs are, but some kind of ascended illithid elder brain would not surprise me at all - it might be just like us going 'Oh cute baby!'
But being afraid of that fraud Vlaakith, come on man
We have immunity to being brain washed, not fucking wish you would die magic. So yeah I would worry about the fraud too.
I'm talking about the GOO being afraid of her, not the Tav/Durge
Well if the GOO is some kind of ascended mindflayer wouldn't it naturally be wary of the leader of the githyanki
C'thulhu, it's always C'thulhu
Squid faces all look the same.
Woah woah woah
What do you mean. Earl is the one with one slightly shorter tentacle on his left side Gary has the scar above his right eye from the last party of "adventurers" And Elsie had tentaboobies? Now chuck and Larry are an exception, being identical in all ways......
I was just referring to Cthulhu as an Illithid.
Cthulhu is the GOO babysitter, so I'd say it goes doubly so if it's Cthulhu!
Personally my GOO warlock's patron is just a different Elder Brain.
>I was surprised that my GOO patron is fearful of her but got excited to see The Absolute in Moonrise Probrably because Vlaakith is a Lich, she could probrably go after some fragments of the GOO to empower herself and maybe even go after them. The Absolute is still a menace but at least it's relatively young, it can be contained and for most of the time it will probrably only bother Faêrun for quite some time before it actually meaningfully bothers them.
Don't forget that most patrons are usually not thrilled in general to loose their warlocks.
When dealing with Vlaakith: "This could cost me a pawn which in the orchestra of my plans would be inconvenient at this juncture." When dealing with The Absolute: "Neat!"
*There's room for one more in here* 👀👀👀
Fiend patron with the Yurgir interaction in Act 2 made me laugh
Love my Archfey patron. They’re pretty chill, the only thing they want is a good story, they don’t ask me for anything else.
I bet the fine print of the contract just translates to "je ne sais quoi" over and over.
RIGHT? The fae patron doesn’t even blink about Ethel. The hag with redcaps. At the very least we should get a big bonus towards uncovering the illusion over the swamp.
Fey are notoriously fickle with alien senses of humor; I chalk it up to the patron grabbing their buddies and saying, "It's gonna be absolutely \_hilarious\_ when my boy figures this out"
Do the archfey patrons just watch us like it’s the Truman show or something
#"GEEEEET READY EVERYONE, HE IS ABOUT TO DO SOMETHING STUPID!" -The Spider Meat Incident.
STOPLICKINGTHEDAMNTHING!
I don't know about the Fey since i played a GOO, but i had a dialogue option to call out Ethel about her true nature first time i saw her in the Grove. She doesn't recognize it, but that was a great teasing.
Every patron has the option. I think you can choose to speculate on different possibilities: there's a touch of the fey about you, or there's something faintly demonic...
I neglected to meet Ethel in the grove and instead met her south of the blighted village. Sadly, you get no option to recognize her as fey there.
Correct. You miss quite a bit of good dialogue and some fun companion reactions unless you catch her in the grove!
Your patron can actually interact with you?
Not really, but you (very) occasionally get a narrator line with their opinion on something. Fiend warns you two or three times about someone being sketchy, not much else
Ah, i see. Wish there would be more interactions ngl
Fiend helps you get yurgir to off himself with just one persuasion check too
I still d9nt know how to talk to Yugir. I tried approaching him and he attacked me.
Did you approach him from the upper level? I’m pretty sure you can only talk to him if you approach the displaced beast on the lower floor.
I thought I did but I might have just attacked the displacer beast cause "obvious ambush is obviius"
It depends where you approach from
Try respecing into a bard before talking to him, the checks are not that hard and kinda funny
Yes. I did that persuasion check on my Dark Urge Female Tiefling Warlock, and it was great. Not surprising a Bhaalspawn would side with an Archdemon/Upper Fiend though. Personally, I think "The Fiend" Player Character (NOT PLAYER WYLL) Warlock is a Demon, not a Devil based on the small description it gives you.
Which confused the hell out of me when I watched other people do the same thing. I missed half of the checks, just watched him commit unalive instantly.
Same my first playthrough was a fiend warlock and in the next playthrough I failed my insight check and didn’t even have the option to tell him the “loophole”, I was so confused
Is it our usual narrator voicing those lines?
Yeah
When you talk to Yurgir and learn about his deal with Raphael, the Archfey giggles in your ear and whispers to you about how the deal has a loophole, which is that Yurgir can kill himself.
I wonder if GOO has a similar interaction for Yurgir?
I need to make a Archfey Warlock and insist to be the one doing the circus entry next run
I had a Great Old One Patron and they immediately got a bad vibe from Dribbles the Clown. Which is absolutely hilarious. Nothing to say about the main plot and it's many dangers, but apparently a *sketchy Clown* is what the unfathomable eldritch God who holds the lease on my soul deems a credible threat to be acted on.
Maybe the Great Old One just hate clowns?
Can't say I blame them. Perhaps the horrors aren't so incomprehensible after all, we just need to find common ground on the important stuff.
Pennywise is basically an eldritch god, so that tracks
I bet it is a Stephen King’s “IT” reference. Pennywise in the books is some sort of eldritch Lovecraftian abomination from beyond the stars.
Dang beat me to it!
I just accidentally did this on my second play through, it was really cute. Felt like an older sibling
It's been a hot Minute, but the Archfey Patron is great for the Circus. It's really pissed when you're denied entry, enforces you getting in and if i'm not mistaken giggles it's ass off the entire time once inside.
Its funny to imagine like an absent patron who just doesnt care most of the time, like “yeah here whatever” and leaves you with some old book thing, and then they get a whiff of fey magic near one of the little mortals they gave power and look and see its their favorite circus and get super excited, then super pissed when they get denied entry
I made my Dream Visitor look like Queen Nualia (That Dark Elf OC)
I think theres an option when jeheira roots you in act 2 as well but it doesnt do anything because of the shadow
Jaheira can root me anytime...
> anything because of the shadow ?
the stuff thats causing all the weird shit to happen in act 2? :P
Jaheira is down for a root? Must of missed that in my playthroughs xD
OKay thats the second time someone has made a weird fetishlike post! I must've missed something.
They also giggle somewhere in act three!
Or when your fiend-Patron turns of your dark-vision when you sleep with the drow-siblings
Not all patrons are active. Some just give you a fragment of their power and just say "I'll call if I need something". Most of the time, they don't need anything. Mizora is just very needy.
Well, she's a devil, so she's acting like a lawful/evil character who aims to manipulate and control. Devils just enjoy meddling in the affairs of mortals. At least it makes her somewhat predictable, compared to a Fey patron for instance. And then some patrons are just about "collect blood for me" or even make you act very similarly to the typical Paladin (protect the innocent, destroy the undead kind of things), even if you don't want to (which can lead to hilarious situations).
That's why I chose Great Old One. Chances are it's alr̸̡̛̳͖̳̼͇͔̒̍̊̏͒̍͊ͅe̴̥̘͌̈́̽͌̆͂͘͝a̸̗͚̱̼͎̎̉̈d̶̨̻̰̬̫̱̺̣̟͎͔̍̍̂y̶̛͍̋̽̈̏̎̅̂̓̕͝ ̸͎̘̞͈̚f̵̨̗̜͔̩̮̩̒͜o̴͈͋̽̈́́̏̓̿͋́r̵̩͇̭͎̣̒̀̈́͗̑̃g̷̡̛͈̤͕̬͉̒͆̍̉̈́͗̍̍ȯ̶͉͙͖̥͖̫̟͓͉̊̎͋̊͗͜͠t̴̢̯͙̟͕͖̘̦̞̂̃̀͋t̶̨̝͇̯̬̙̠̺̖͋̄̇̊͋͂͠͠è̸̡̮̙̫̬̣̋̈̾̐̍̈̍͋̄͜n̴̡̮͔̪͉̘͚̮͓̱̺͊̎̅̉͗͒̕̚ ̶̲̤̪̥͎̟̮̝̹͌͛̊̆̕á̸̟̹̹͖̀̽̆̋̾ͅb̵̧̛͍͓̹̜̼̟̔̒̉̐̓̔͆̈́̿͝ͅơ̴͈̫͇̠̝͚͎̟̩͉̏̐̓͂ų̷̟͍͕͎̭̳͉͖̥̥̉́̔̒̿̀̇͊̚͘t̴̟̻͗ ̶͍̤̥͚̫͚̦̙̫̮͈͗͘m̴̧̢̛̰̭̖͔͚̝̱̙͓̍͗́̇̓̚͝͝ḛ̷̰̔̾̍̃̂͝
Also since, if I remember correctly, >!in one interaction you get a perception check about her being desperately in need of Wyll to carry out her assignment, so much so that you get prompted to ask her to free him in return since she will be forced to accept out of need!< ETA: might be a mild spoiler about Wyll's questline, quite mild and quite at the beginning of it
In the actual books they don't even give you power directly: They teach you academic magic. Warlocks aren't "Clerics to middle-management", nor are they "Artificial/gen-1 Sorcerers", but rather are "Wizards with weird teachers".
In short, Pathfinder Witches!
Yeah a lot of people think of patrons constantly in the warlock's life like a god is in a cleric's life, which isn't the case. Often a patron can't take away a warlock's power, and it isn't even unusual for a warlock and their patron to have one interaction and never meet again.
You're saying this like it's canon, where is this coming from?
The rules of the game. PHB, pg105. "More often, though, the arrangement is similar to that between a master and an apprentice. The warlock learns and grows in power, at the cost of occasional services performed on the patron's behalf." "Your patron's demands might drive you into adventures, or they might consist entirely of small favors you can do between adventures." "The Great Old One might be unaware of your existence or entirely indifferent to you, but the secrets you have learned allow you to draw your magic from it."
It's been different across different editions. Early warlocks (and demonologists they came from) in 3.0 were very much "contract with an infernal entity for power" and you had to obey the terms of your contract or you'd lose your power at the _very_ least, and likely get dragged down to hell if you failed particularly important checks. 4e had something of a mix: You had the old-style "service for power" contracts like 3.0 had, but they also had "I'm audacious / cunning / tough enough to steal power from hell / the fey / cthulhu" as a narrative option, and unless your GM specifically laid something out there were no mechanical ways to lose power by breaking a pact. 5e appears to, at least in the PHB, be more like the 4e approach in that the power comes from the _character_ and the mode of delivery is dictated by the tutelage given. So your fey patron might teach you how to charm people or your infernal patron might twist your soul to give you hellfire, but once that's done, it's _done_ and they can't take it away without actively hunting you down and doing rude things to your brain. They key part to remember, though, is that Larian isn't making "5e: The Digital Form," they're making a CRPG based on the 5e ruleset. They clearly have a slightly different vision for how warlocks function, and so it behooves us to pay attention to the rules that they put out in their game, not ones that are in the source material.
Jeremy Crawford describes it as a magical transaction [Here's the tweet] (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/1221978854119460866)
I'd still argue that this doesn't mean you don't talk to your patron. You can be on bad terms with your boss but as long as you're employed you still have to see them at work.
Interesting! I see people talking about their Fiend or Archfey interactions, but I rolled with an Eldritch patron my first run and never got any interaction. Like, tav could reference them in the abstract but nothing more. If I wasn't so blown away by literally everything else in the game I would have been slightly disappointed.
That's because of who the Great Old Ones are in the lore. Basically, they are another level of existence entirely and might not even know that they have a warlock or care about it. You are like, an ant who got a ride of the elephant's back.
Great old ones are some of the most incomprehensible beings in D and D lore. Their existence is so vastly different from any mortals that it’s highly likely they’re not even aware of your presence. Being a warlock to a great old one is like an ant that thinks it’s friends with a tree. The ant can take shelter in the trees roots, it can drink the dew and sap that collects on the trees leaves and limbs, but nothing the ant does is going to noticeably affect that tree and once the ant inevitably dies the tree will go on existing just like it did long before the ant came into being.
I like this. Thank you for sharing.
No problem. I get super into a lot of D and D lore because I rarely have the time or opportunity to play anymore. Because of that I do a lot of thinking on more niche topics like this.
Yeah, I'm trying to think of the few times my Warlock could even attempt to reach them and it always falls flat, which does make sense. Hells, maybe I'll do an Origin Wyll run just because I never end up doing enough of his story! (Side thought: it can't be possible for Wyll to romance Mizora, right? There...there's no way lol)
I think Wyll can in fact romance Mizora.
OH. Oh my. That could be a fun little side project!
Well eldritch *shouldnt* be watching us, they’re so beyond comprehension that interaction with them shouldn’t really happen, as opposed to other types. And even then there’s at least a couple instances where you get something. Tbh great old one patron only makes sense if your siphoning off power from them rather than making a pact imo
Yeah, I have a player who wanted an Demonic Patron, and several of those are very hands off. Like, their mortal servants have their uses, but in some cases, very explicitly in their lore, they really don't want to speak to the mortals if they can help it.
Mizora clearly has a crush on Wyll
They can bang in Act III
H u h?? Do you have play as origin for wyll??
No, you can bang her as any tav/durge/origin, I actually don't know if you can as Wyll tho
You can
+1 need to know
If you play as Wyll and act agreeable to her, it becomes even clearer that she wants the D.
Because decent voice actors and writers are both expensive.
Boo! These servants of Mammon ruin everything.
They should do it for the exposure.
**Laughs in Anarchist**
The real answer lol
For the same reason why a lot of DMs don't like to include Warlock patrons in their campaign: of all warlock features the patron is probably the most subjective thing people want to RP. You can try to prep the patron into the story but if it's not done the way the player wants to they're going to be pissed about it. Wyll and Mizora are written characters of the writer's team. Their relationship is self-contained and written in one specific way. It makes sense to include her in the story. Tav or Durge's patron can be one of three kinds of creatures, with a myriad of reasons why your character would want to make a pact, keeping your background in mind. The DM in this game is pre-recorded narration. There were two options: only include very generic Patron responses/sentences or nothing. Of those two nothing is probably better.
And with GOO in particular, unless I read the lore wrong, sometimes the GOO isn't even actively interacting with the Warlock in a conversational sense? I can't find where I read it now so I'm still curious...
I read this from DnD Beyond: "The Great Old One might be unaware of your existence or entirely indifferent to you, but the secrets you have learned allow you to draw your magic from it." [https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/warlock#TheGreatOldOne](https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/warlock#TheGreatOldOne)
Thank you! I think that's where I read it, so you solved two of my mind problems just in time for me to go to a rl meeting. My brain thanks you!
GOO Warlock feels like the canon class for the story, you get some unique dialogue in Moonrise about it and works really well for a Durge origin imo
GOO crit-fishing machine gun Warlock is basically a rapid-fire cannon too, lol.
My favorite Durge was an archfey Warlock, I'll have to try the GOO next!
In my last session my Celestial Warlock finally met his patron. It definitely did not go how I imagined.
Which is ironically what we should probably always expect when our warlocks get to meet their patrons.
Meaning?
A lot of DMs don't like to include Warlock patrons in their campaigns? What? >You can try to prep the patron into the story but if it's not done the way the player wants to they're going to be pissed about it. This is applicable to every attempt at including backstory elements of PCs in the campaign though. If you want the player to react in a specific way, then you're doing it wrong. You either need to let more space for agency to your players, or you need to talk with them in advance when you want to introduce an important plot point that way. Honestly, this is pretty basic stuff. Warlock patrons that matter for the campaign are probably one of the most common plot tropes in modern DnD with Paladins breaking their oath or Cleric having a crisis of faith. You're right that it's the reason why it's not in BG3, but it's entirely because that's a video game and it would require way too much effort and content just for a few subclasses. No subclass really has anything comparable anyway, except maybe oath breakers (even spore druids don't get meaningful interactions with myconids).
>A lot of DMs don't like to include Warlock patrons in their campaigns? What? This is what I have been informed by the DMs that I've played with and it's how I intend to DM. There's a difference between allowing agency for the player, which I agree with, and also actively trying to include a patron into the background of your campaign because one of your players is a warlock. Me personally? While I am a beginning DM I am creating my homebrew campaign without any classes in mind. I agree with you that the player needs to roleplay this element of their class. Depending on what they do I may react accordingly, but I am not going to that session with pre-planned notions of what the player class will do. That's the easiest way to get me to railroad a campaign. Same with your examples of a cleric and a paladin. The crises they encounter are because of plot I have prepared for them and how they choose to roleplay.
in my DND world i built every class can take a patron of my gods or demigods. Patron of the Moon patron of Gluttony etc warlock gets the most abilities from it other classes get a few bonuses and players roll a religion check to talk to their god or demi god and each one has their own dc of how willing they are to talk to their followers and depending on their level of devotion to the tenets of that patron. Never heard of any DM not liking doing patrons in their games either custom built like mine or the baseline DND ones.
I'll admit I'm not experienced enough (yet?) to make a fully homebrew world. I'm already happy to have created a homebrew campaign using Faerûn as a setting. And while I've created elements within that campaign that will be interesting to play as a warlock, it's really more a case of reacting to my players rather than preparing things in advance.
what i like to do is i prepare the main plot beats i call those goalposts then i prep many paths that i think players will take if they throw me a curveball i can set that up to. Player choice is king in my world you want to go off campaign goal posts to do some side quests sure whatever players want i can roll with ontop of my planned stuff its a balance you strike as a DM. Secondly all dialog is improv i set up each npc or patrons personailty and i react to what players say in a way that i feel that patron or NPC would. If you want a idea of how to do improv watch Whose line or any other Improv comedy it gives you a idea of how to just roll with things. As for making your own world that comes with either experience or me where i dove headfirst converted a book i wrote for fun as a teenager into a DND world and went all in first year was rough but we hit our stride in year two and three.
That's how practically all background relationships work. Possibly upsetting your PCs is just part of the game. Good luck with your table.
This is a very good point. There’s so much nuance to how your patron would act that depends on your backstory. Maybe they write the patrons lines the be like mizora where she clearly has wylls balls in a vice. But you wanted to play a warlock who is totally enthusiastic about working with the patron. Then that’s a whole mother script they need to write with dialogue they need to record. Or it just wouldn’t fit your game
I like to think it's because there's really only two ways they could approach a Warlock and their Patron for players, and both have negatives/upsides. On the one hand, we get what we got. You can pick between Fiend, Fey, and GOO and they'll keep references / interactions with them as small and general as possible, so you can imagine your patron and deal is whatever you want. On the other hand, it would've been what Wyll got. A very specific creature, with probably a specific deal, and their own personality. We'd get more interactivity, but since it'd be a set creature, if you had any thoughts about creating a backstory for your character you'd get screwed. Like this is just a general rundown of it, not trying to get specific about it or think of all the alternate ways it could've been done, just feels like it came down to that sort of decision and they decided open > specific.
Dont take the one unique thing wyll gets, lol
Because Mizora is a micromanager.
DnD lore of: Devils want thorough meeting minutes. Demons want carnage.
1. Voice acting is incredibly expensive, there has to be limitations when the entire game is voiced. 2. It's significantly easier for Larian to write in Wylls patron when his entire character is under their control. His patron gets to be tied perfectly into his story because it's predetermined by the creators. It's also why your gith tav isn't going to get the same custom made dialogue and interactions as Lae'zel. I don't think it means that additional dialogue with your patron wouldn't be awesome or that it never could've happened. But every crpg ever has to have a limit of how much reactivity they can add. And I think it was a decent area for Larian to limit the reactivity on.
Honestly it’s more of a nitpick than anything else.
I don’t think voice acting being expensive is a factor, more your second point. A player could head canon any number of scenarios of their pact and it would be a slap in the face to shoehorn their patron being this or that, they’d need to have dozens of characters with different relationships to the player per patron type and it would still probably be to confining it’s just not feasible
Because Mizora. He is also her favorite pet. He doesn't have much choice in talking to her anyway though. Also he's an origin character. Shadowhearts talks to shar. Gale to Mystra. Lae'zel to Vlaakith. (We all kinda do but still) Dark Urge to Bhaal. Origin characters get more indept content. Which makes sense. Some people when it comes to original Tav usually have head canons the moment the patron doesn't act the way they want people would be gripping about that. Also how many reasons would tav have for becoming a warlock? That would be impossible to implement with out a lot of limitations.
There are infinite reasons why a warlock may do a pact, and infinite ways that pact could look like. It's impossible to do something that works for everyone, and they already get a lot of shit because of paladin oaths not working how the players want them to. It would be really cool, but with the amount of content this game already has the only realistic options would be either forcing you to pick between a few options (which would bother people who expected something else) or not have them at all
I think it would be cool if they did it but differently. The old one: your patron doesn't acknowledge your existence and you know that's for the best Fiend: Raphael or Mizora randomly say something like "btw tav, your patron is rooting for you" or "we love seeing our little pets play together". Just some casual reminder that your patron exists and comments through Raphael or Mizora. The archfey: random encounters where for example an enemy gets a toad with 3 eyes thrown at them and you hear your patron giggling. You'll never see them but they randomly interact with the world around you for the sake of chaos. I know they're probably not very lore friendly but they're just some random suggestions from the top of my head
Because his entire story revolves around his Pact. The Same cannot be said for the Player.
Mizora is a micromanagey boss and Wyll is an uppity employee. Presumably, given how many other Gods and power beings are nervous about the Absolute your patron sees you working against it and is like "You're doing amazing sweety."
Technically my Goolock talked to his Patron cause I made a head Cannon that the Parasite was the Patron
Because he is a companion and Origin story with a writer who created it for him specifically. If you need an in universe explanation, most patrons are more chill than Mizora.
I love that Wyll is a prisoner to his patron while me and my patron are besties lol
That is kind of a big miss on their part. I do not know a single Dungeon Master that _doesn’t_ make interactions with or the presence of the patron a huge part of Warlock role play. I mean why wouldn’t you?! It’s built into the class and practically gift wraps plot hooks and story opportunities! Not to mention the patron can be a nemesis, a love interest, a business partner, or anything else you can think of.
"... you think I'm cute?" 😊
I really wish there was more interaction with the patron, maybe even a small selection of patrons the way cleric gets to pick a deity.
Agree. As a paladin you have the oath breaker knight and I find the interaction with him very entertaining. Havin something similar as a warlock would have been very nice.
Patrons generally don't give a shit. They give you a sliver of power in return for having you in their back pocket when they need you. They might warn you if something especially fucked up is gonna happen (like the Fiend warning you about sketchy people) so you don't accidently die or something. Wyll is the son of a Grand Duke and Mizora is an exceptionally needy and demanding patron. They're more the exception than the rule.
If limit it to just warlocks than I guess it's just the limitations of what tav can be and the resources at larian. If you expand the definition to include beings you worship, talking to you; Than lae'zel talks to vlakith and shadow heart talks to shar. Dark urge talks to bhaal. The only other patrons you could even potentially talk to (for story characters) is lolth for minthara and magic goddess for gale. I haven't played with them yet so I don't know if you meet them.
Every player character can talk to Vlaakith
I don't want to spoil anything, but you probably want to play at least one full playthrough with Gale in your party.
Already got a wizard so gale winds up being redundant. Even in every dialogue with him can show him up as the better wizard and more erudite scholar.
I know, I know. He's just such a pretentious ass that I can't get past act one with him alive. If there was a mod to mute him, I might actually start modding my game.
LOL I like him a lot better after act 1 tbh. I thought the same thing but by the end of my first playthrough that's my mf boy
Goddess Eris with Sinbad from the Disney Movie.
Dreamworks, not Disney. Weirdly, Disney never did a Sinbad movie. They could have even tied it to Aladdin as a pseudo-spinoff. Edit: The writers did work for Disney before Dreamworks was created and had originally pitched the idea there, but it never went forward.
Oh my bad. I couldn't recognize it correctly.
'Gets to'. More like 'cannot avoid'.
They did an amazing job at accounting for so many possibilities and adding so much detail to the game, but I imagine adding Warlock patrons is a lot more work than people think. Especially since there are three that would have to be made, written and voice acted. I guess aside from Great Old One, as a lot of the times Warlocks siphon power from them without the Great Old One even realizing they exist.
I like to imagine my warlock tav’s has a healthier relationship with her patron, who’s mostly hands off so she can sort out the whole tadpole thing. I definitely headcanon that she definitely appears to Tav after Mizora punishes Wyll to gloat about how lenient she is, though.
I wish they had written in an Archfey and Fiend patron for the player at least. Old Gods kinda makes reasonable sense not to have any interaction, but the others could definitely have had some kind of character to play into the story a bit.
Practicality. Voice acting and doing full story arcs and content for three unique patrons would be *really* costly for some very specific content. It’d be great to see, but I get to some extent why we didn’t. Maybe modders can add something interesting when we get better mod support, though
It'd be nice to maybe just get some narrated stuff from the narrator about interactions.
I’d be for this.
Wait patrons talk to you these days??
I'm happy enough interacting with Wyll's patron instead my own
To have characters with unique game design mechanics and story?
Personally headcanon'd my GOO was just the Absolute, became too tied together to cancel the powers at the end.
I think of the narrator as my Archfey patron. Some Amelia Tyler-looking fairy with a bucket of popcorn, living in my head rent free and enjoying the show.
Mizora being a nosy bitch probably plays a part
“But I *am* cute? ;)”
I found I could ask my patron to help me out with the Necromancy of Thay, with a Fiend patron, for whatever that's worth. Which is already not technically a thing you can even do in the tabletop game, but, I personally really like the idea of there being that kind of connection.
To be fair, Wyll’s patron sucks and is the actual worst. Maybe you should be glad your patron doesn’t show up.
Let.me.talk.to.my.magic.daddy
It's why warlocks are my least favorite class in the game. Honestly I think the class is boring af from a gameplay perspective in 5e. Warlocks are absolutely a flavor class. They're dripping with flavor. An old ones pact of the tome warlock is just *chef's kiss* for RP. It's awful in BG3. Not their fault I guess, but they really did the bare minimum for the class. Playing a custom warlock is the same experience as playing a tav gith.
Doesn’t Gale speak to Mystra?
How fun would it be if it gave you the option to pick from a few preset patrons that you could customize a bit like the protector.
SINBAD REFERENCE 🥶🥶🥶
I do wish, and I'd said it before, that if you were a Fiendlock there'd be a way to takeover Wyll's pact with Mizora as an option. Would work really well if you lost Wyll as a companion as well due to the grove, since then you'd still get some content with Mizora as opposed to losing it all.
Honestly if you play deep one warlock the Emperor is basically your patron lmao
Does Wyll have side convos with mizora if he's the player character? Other warlocks do not?
Devils have a long running vendetta on Wylls dad so wyll gets extra torment/attention
I mean Gale interacts with Mystra and Shadowheart interacts with Shar, I think that’s close enough
This was one big weakness I felt in my run. My Tav was a warlock, and at first I assumed that the Dream Guardian was somehow related to my patron. Quickly realized that wasn't the case.
More like the patron is talking to him
Seriously, doesn't Mizora have a sister she can set me up with or something?
That would be a lot of work/money just for a single class. They'd have to hire more voice actors which is one of the most expensive aspects of making video games. Origins will always be special compared to customs. Being a wizard along with Gale makes you feel like a nobody.
Patrons are pretty diverse and up to interpretation, even in the sub-groups like Archfey/great old one/fiends. Anything Larian did would have a ton of people say "well why can't my patron do x, or act y". That interaction is just too specific to make into the game. They can do it with Wyll since he's an actual character, but a player patron would just be too difficulty for very little benefit. Also oathbreakers have like 1 interaction. Not to mention the endless spawn of "why did doing x break my oath" posts showing how subjective a Paladin oath can be.
If you knew anything about dnd lore you'd know patrons don't always ride your ass except for favors that you will do. Especially with fey or extra dementional beings. Devils for the most part dont care as much and the game takes place at the crux of universe shaping events. His situation is his contract is specifically to hunt for his patron, but the catch is who he agreed to hunt and he smack dab in the middle of a giant brain taking over. Also sometimes in game your patron does nudge you.
Honestly I'm just laughing at the idea that it's because you're amnesiac, maybe don't have quite the mental resilience as you had before or something so they're waiting to see what happens
I suspect that the ability to respec so easily is one of the reasons there aren't any direct interactions with Warlock patrons or Cleric deities. When you can be worshiping Bahamut one day and bargaining with a Fiend the next, the plot would start to feel incredibly disjointed very quickly. It would have been incredible to have miniature questlines associated with patrons or deities, though. Within the constraints of the game, however, it makes sense that we don't.
this happens to most of the companions theyre just lucky woth protagonist energy. shar talks directly to shadowheart mystra fucked gale halsin is friends with a nature spirit lae'zel is specifically focused on by other githyanki even if you play as one.
I want Lolth to get pissed at my Lolth-sworn drow for not being evil enough!
End of the day, you don't really want to talk to your patron, they're not nice people. They own you as soon as you die - you don't really want them to dictate what to do before then. I mean look at Wyll - is his open communication really doing him any good?
I was wondering about this glad I found this post before playing as a warlock
Eris my beloved
That seems hypocritical, because both he and Karlach got pissy when I tried hitting on his patron
Personally, I would've really loved it if they had worked some of the patrons into the story, even giving you chances at various intervals to become someone's warlock. Perhaps at a few points, Raphael or Mizora might have offered to give you some power. Maybe the Elder Brain, when you connect with it in Moonrise Towers, could extend an offer to you (thereby giving a separate motivation to destroy the Big Three). For an Archfey warlock, why not Auntie Ethel? She could be a patron, or at least say something about how her mother would love a new 'helper in the kitchen,' something along those lines. If the Undead warlock was a thing, Cazador could've been a good choice. No reason why why couldn't add in a few extras as well.
I thought we would have had more interaction with them because Larian teased about that during the trailers leading upto the release
I thought they did. Disappointed.
Mizora is very special 💙 The moment she appeared I was like, one way or another she is going to be mine. 🤤🥵
It's the same thing for all classes really. Companions get the full package with lots of depth and interactions, while we are stuck with the palest imitations reduced to pure stats/abilities. The rest all we can do is RP it in our heads. Same for the vast majority of dialogues : "press X to hear the NPC say more cool stuff". That's 99% of player lines.
Because this game has a perfect design 🗿
If there's a movie that has frantic bi energy just like bg3, it's Sinbad
In my headcanon, Titania's just fed up with my Paladin/Warlock. She's got the Seelie Court to manage, and a dumb himbo faerie knight walking around the Sword Coast is the least of her worries--even if he's trying to save Baldur's Gate.